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[Bobby5280]

They'd have the money if they weren't pissing it away on unnecessary freeway expansion.

What freeway expansion?? The only new miles of super highway getting built in Oklahoma lately have been modest additions to turnpikes. That involves OTA, not ODOT. IIRC, the last piece of newly constructed freeway in Oklahoma was the I-40 re-alignment in Downtown OKC. And that was an extremely necessary project.

Appropriate built and maintained transportation infrastructure doesn't necessitate thousands of lane-miles of freeway in the urban context.  Treating Tulsa, Tahlequah, Oklahoma City, Bartlesville, Muskogee, McAlester and Lawton like they're Fort Supply is a catastrophically stupid waste of money.

Lawton sure isn't a city equipped for any more than bus service. There isn't exactly a hell of a lot of people using our existing bus service. It has to be pretty heavily subsidized by the government. There is no novelty or sense of convenience in standing at a bus stop out in the weather for however long it takes for the bus to arrive. Been there, done that. I did 5 years of commuting in NYC, riding the bus, the Staten Island Ferry and the subways. Waiting on the bus is the thing I miss the very least. That totally sucked.

OkDOT should be preserving ROW for new freeways in Lawton in the future if growth ever warrants. Lawton has potential if they market themselves right.

Lawton has the potential to be double its size in population and development. But various local and state powers can't get out of the way. Plus there's so much land that is off limits for new development because it is owned either by tribes or by the Army. The main directions where Lawton can grow is farther West and Southwest, both of which conveniently fall outside of city limits. The nation's brick and mortar retail apocalypse as well as Lawton's very outdated overlay district rules for downtown are keeping a suffocating lid on downtown re-development.

There is plenty of open space on the North side of Rogers Lane to turn that glorified street into a 4-lane or 6-lane freeway flanked by frontage roads. Along Rogers Lane between the Fort Sill Blvd and Sheridan Rd exits there used to be a housing area on Fort Sill called Artillery Village. Almost all that housing was torn down years ago. There's all kinds of wide open space on the other side of the sound walls.

I'm kind of surprised the US Army hasn't pushed to have both Rogers Lane and I-44 improved. Rogers Lane runs along the South edge of Fort Sill. I-44 runs North-South through Fort Sill. The design of I-44 in the area of the Key Gate exit is badly obsolete. The reason I'm surprised the Army hasn't pushed for improvements (or maybe they did unsuccessfully) is that various other major military installations around the country have substantial super highways running along their borders and even entering their posts in some cases. If Rogers Lane and I-44 were properly improved along and thru Fort Sill the interchange between Rogers Lane and I-44 would be a signature design opportunity to show off some kind of military tribute theme. For instance the I-110 interchange with I-10 in Pensacola has models of Blue Angels F-18 Hornet jets installed on flyover bridge piers. It's pretty cool. They could do something visual for the Field Artillery and Air Defense Artillery here.

One nearer term goal with Rogers Lane actually in the works is extending Rogers Lane from its current West end at US-62 and down to Goodyear Blvd to give traffic in the industrial park an alternative outlet to I-44. Right now much of that industrial park traffic uses Lee Blvd and 82nd Street to either go East or South to get to I-44. 82nd Street in particular South of Lee Blvd down to OK-36 is just completely beat to shit from all the truck traffic. The road is bad enough that it is damaging trucks. Big companies like Goodyear are now complaining loudly about it. It's a county maintained road; it's barely a step from being a gravel road.

So really, Lawton not only needs Rogers Lane improved to Interstate standards, the city needs an outlet South out of the Industrial park over to I-44. They could start that out as a Super-2 like the Duncan Bypass with or without limited access exits and just upgrade as needed. Getting the ROW secured is what matters.

[rte66man]

OkDOT should be preserving ROW for new freeways in Lawton in the future if growth ever warrants. Lawton has potential if they market themselves right.

The US-81 bypass has been delayed a few years.

That is criminal. The intersection with Elk is a black spot for fatal accidents. They could find that $6 million easily enough.

[In_Correct]

Bartlesville

That town has a dozen rail lines going through it, all of them with only at grade crossings. They badly need grade separations.

[Bobby5280]

That is criminal. The intersection with Elk is a black spot for fatal accidents. They could find that $6 million easily enough.

ODOT should have, at bare minimum, installed some street lights and warning signals along the Duncan bypass at the intersections like Elk Avenue and Plato Rd. They should have done that when they built the first phase of the bypass almost 20 years ago. I really dislike the intersection with Osage Rd. The bypass goes around a broad curve as it approaches that intersection. Visibility is not so good.

The Northern extension of the Duncan Bypass, which would dove-tail back into US-81 on the South side of Marlow, looks like it has been taken off the books.

That town has a dozen rail lines going through it, all of them with only at grade crossings.

Bartlesville? That town has one active rail line running North-South through it. All the railroad crossings are at-grade, but that's a single track route that isn't super busy. At least it's not busy on the order of the Southern Transcon line which runs through Woodward off to the West.

[Plutonic Panda]

It looks like ODOT is FINALLY going to embrace zipper merging though I wonder how well it is going to work in Oklahoma given all the road warriors here.

https://oklahoma.gov/odot/citizen/newsroom/2021/march/oklahoma-s-first-zipper-merge-coming-to-i-35-in-pauls-valley-thi.html

[kphoger]

But, but, but, but........

STATE LAW ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! !

[Plutonic Panda]

So I’m guessing OKDOT can choose where that is at that law applies to all merging zones and was changed?

[Plutonic Panda]

It looks Oklahoma will get about 5 billion dollars as part of the hard infrastructure package being debated on in the senate right now. A majority of it will go to roads and bridges giving OkDOT a 30 percent increase in funding.

https://www.oklahoman.com/story/news/local/oklahoma-city/2021/08/05/infrastructure-bill-would-increase-highway-bridge-funding-oklahoma/5488268001/

I am personally excited for the next update to the 5 year plan. It should really have some projects moved up with some new ones in the pipeline and I don’t think it will reflect the infrastructure package either. That will be in next years update I’d guess.

[Plutonic Panda]

The new 8yr plan is out

https://oklahoma.gov/odot/programs-and-projects/8-year-construction-work-plan.html

[I-35]

The new 8yr plan is out

https://oklahoma.gov/odot/programs-and-projects/8-year-construction-work-plan.html

Interesting that six-laning I-35 up to almost Marietta from the Red River is on the plan, albeit a few years out.

[bugo]

At least the US 59/OK 9 overlap west of Spiro is in the program.

[Bobby5280]

I didn't see much to be excited about in that 8 year plan, particularly in District 7. The US-81 bypass for Chickasha is by far the biggest project in the region. 

It looks like the biggest project for Lawton, proposed for the 2025 time frame is a new exit on the US-62 freeway West of Lawton. This $16M project is supposed to be a connection to a Northern extension of Goodyear Blvd. This would allow traffic from the big industrial park on Lawton's West side an alternative outlet to I-44, via Rogers Lane. For many years that commercial traffic has been using 82nd Street to get down to OK-36 and then over to I-44. 82nd Street going South of Lawton is in horrible condition from all the wear and tear due to truck traffic. I haven't seen any designs of this exit on US-62. For all I know it could end up being an at-grade intersection with a traffic light.

With the extra traffic burden that will be put onto Rogers Lane ODOT appears to have $5.5M in "safety improvements" planned between 82nd Street and I-44. That cost spread across 6 miles of road probably isn't going to amount to much. I don't think $5.5M would cover the cost of adding shoulders (which Rogers Lane currently lacks).

[Plutonic Panda]

Yeah it wasn’t too exciting. I guess the biggest take away for me on it was it was a massive improvement over last year‘s plan basically cut tons of projects as a result of reduce funding in this one restored most of those and added a bunch of new rural projects which those areas are important to obviously.

It’s kind of hard to get excited about OKC’s Area Projects when almost everything is 2027-2029. I’m hoping if an infrastructure bill passes next year’s 8 year update will be more exciting.

The biggest projects of note:

I-40 expansion/reconstruction in the eastern section of the metro continuing next year at Douglas Boulevard and continuing with various projects being awarded until 2028. It will be probably be 2030 until that corridor is overhauled.

I-240/I-35 interchange which has been pushed back and forward so many times I’m not really sure if it technically expedited but ODOT has the entire thing be letted in FY 23.

Not many details but it looks like the I-44/I-40 interchange reconstruction will be gearing up in 2029.

I-35 will be expanded to six lanes from I-44 to I-40 in the later part of the decade.

The next phase of the I-35/I-44 interchange reconstruction/redesign by Remington starts next year.

US-281 realignment basically building a new freeway bypass with a full cloverleaf interchange(blah) at I-44 starts in a year or two with some smaller projects and a full build out later on in the decade.

ODOT seems to be eying I-35 with an eventual expansion of six lanes at least from Dallas to OKC with the first part of that starting in south Oklahoma as another poster here pointed out.

[okc1]

Asked via Twitter if turnpike plans could be on the ODOT plan. Nope. "@stevencreynolds Hi Steve, the Oklahoma Turnpike Authority oversees the states' turnpike system. You can visit their page at @OKTurnpike for more information. Thank you!"

[Scott5114]

Yeah, the ODOT plan is the result of allocating funding they get from the Legislature. OTA is funded by bonds and toll revenue and therefore their schedule looks a lot different. Merging the two into one schedule would be rather difficult since they're on different timelines as far as updates go.

[Plutonic Panda]

This is their project status update which they just updated today:

https://oklahoma.gov/content/dam/ok/en/ota/documents/other/Project%20Status%20Update.pdf

This is their 5 yr plan which should be updated soon:

https://oklahoma.gov/content/dam/ok/en/ota/documents/other/5%20Year%20Capital%20Plan.pdf

[rte66man]

This is their project status update which they just updated today:

https://oklahoma.gov/content/dam/ok/en/ota/documents/other/Project%20Status%20Update.pdf

Would love to see what they have planned for the SB US77 to EB JKT movement as one doesn't exist and there really isn't room for a decent loop ramp. Although I expect that is what they will do given the paltry price tag, that will cause serious weaving issues.

[Plutonic Panda]

^^^^ I hope it’s a flyover but I’m getting excited after seeing plans to complete the SH-74 interchange with flyovers only to see it go from being let(in 2019/2020 IIRC) to being shelved to it no longer being on the list of projects. I assume either it was too expensive or perhaps the OTA just felt they had bigger priorities. Either way I was not happy about that.

[rte66man]

^^^^ I hope it’s a flyover but I’m getting excited after seeing plans to complete the SH-74 interchange with flyovers only to see it go from being let(in 2019/2020 IIRC) to being shelved to it no longer being on the list of projects. I assume either it was too expensive or perhaps the OTA just felt they had bigger priorities. Either way I was not happy about that.

The amount shown isn't enough for a flyover. They would have to buy the RoW along the west side to have room for a flyover ramp.. Some pretty substantial businesses there to buy out.

[Plutonic Panda]

This isn’t ODOT but since the OTA is more intertwined with ODOT now I don’t want to make a new thread for this.

I was browsing around and discovered an OTA website that looks different from the Pikepass website. I found a section going into detail about modernization efforts and the new districts they will have. Currently they have 7 districts and will consolidate them into a NW, SE, SW, Central, and NE setup making 5 districts. I’ll link the report in below.

What’s weird is they chose Duncan over Lawton for the SW Regional office with Clinton and Altus having smaller offices. Not sure a turnpike near Clinton and Lawton would make more sense as it’s right on I-44. It makes no sense.

Here’s a link. Scroll to the bottom and click on “draft final recommendations report.” It’s a 127 pages with the regions and office locations on page 96: https://oklahoma.gov/odot/about/transportation-modernization0.html

[Bobby5280]

At my local AMBUCS civic club meeting last Monday we had the City Manager of Lawton as our guest speaker. Afterward I was talking with him about the city's various needs on street improvements. I half-jokingly told him ODOT regards Lawton as a red-headed step child compared to other cities around the state. It's kind of telling Lawton has a very undesirable status with ODOT and state lawmakers since they would build a regional office in Duncan instead of 25 miles West in a much bigger city on a more important highway junction.

Lawton has a bunch of street and highway improvement needs the local tax base can't cover all on its own. ODOT has its own obligations to corridors in this area, like I-44 and US-62. ODOT built a Super 2 bypass in Duncan that can be eventually upgraded into an Interstate quality freeway. They're going to do the same thing in Chickasha. Meanwhile Lawton has its fake Interstate, Rogers Lane, which now carries the US-62 designation. The road has some dangerous design flaws. Those flaws are going to be magnified after the extension of Goodyear Blvd to US-62 is completed. A lot more trucks will be using Rogers Lane to get to I-44. Lawton has plans to improve Lee Blvd between Goodyear Blvd and I-44. But it's just going to be a higher grade of asphalt. It will take just a little longer for semi trucks to beat the surface to hell. Rogers Lane needs to be upgraded into a real freeway. And Lawton needs a South bypass to route truck traffic from I-44 out to the industrial park on Lawton's West side.

[Plutonic Panda]

ODOT needs to start planning some major projects around Lawton soon. If the state would properly invest in the area and market it they could make a trendy spot to move to. It already has some industry and natural landscape going for it. It’s just held back by severe neglect.

[rte66man]

This isn’t ODOT but since the OTA is more intertwined with ODOT now I don’t want to make a new thread for this.

I was browsing around and discovered an OTA website that looks different from the Pikepass website. I found a section going into detail about modernization efforts and the new districts they will have. Currently they have 7 districts and will consolidate them into a NW, SE, SW, Central, and NE setup making 5 districts. I’ll link the report in below.

What’s weird is they chose Duncan over Lawton for the SW Regional office with Clinton and Altus having smaller offices. Not sure a turnpike near Clinton and Lawton would make more sense as it’s right on I-44. It makes no sense.

Here’s a link. Scroll to the bottom and click on “draft final recommendations report.” It’s a 127 pages with the regions and office locations on page 96: https://oklahoma.gov/odot/about/transportation-modernization0.html

Since ODOT District 7 is already in Duncan, it makes me wonder if they will office together

[Plutonic Panda]

This isn’t ODOT but since the OTA is more intertwined with ODOT now I don’t want to make a new thread for this.

I was browsing around and discovered an OTA website that looks different from the Pikepass website. I found a section going into detail about modernization efforts and the new districts they will have. Currently they have 7 districts and will consolidate them into a NW, SE, SW, Central, and NE setup making 5 districts. I’ll link the report in below.

What’s weird is they chose Duncan over Lawton for the SW Regional office with Clinton and Altus having smaller offices. Not sure a turnpike near Clinton and Lawton would make more sense as it’s right on I-44. It makes no sense.

Here’s a link. Scroll to the bottom and click on “draft final recommendations report.” It’s a 127 pages with the regions and office locations on page 96: https://oklahoma.gov/odot/about/transportation-modernization0.html

Since ODOT District 7 is already in Duncan, it makes me wonder if they will office together

Ah, didn’t know that. That’s probably what they’ll do.

[Bobby5280]

ODOT needs to start planning some major projects around Lawton soon. If the state would properly invest in the area and market it they could make a trendy spot to move to. It already has some industry and natural landscape going for it. It’s just held back by severe neglect.

The Medicine Park area next to Lake Lawtonka and the Wichita Mountains is already very trendy. Property prices there have shot up big time, partly due to buyers from the OKC and Tulsa areas "discovering" the place. Medicine Park has some serious growing pains. Its very rudimentary patchwork of streets and lack of adequate parking can't handle the growth in visitor demand.

Meanwhile, Goodyear is one of the biggest employers in the Lawton area. That factory out West of Lawton is freaking huge. It's one of the biggest tire production factories in the world and was at least at one time the biggest tire factory in the world (if it isn't still the biggest). Goodyear management and shipping companies that deal with Goodyear have been pretty disgusted lately about the degradation of highway infrastructure surrounding the plant. The $16 million project to extend Goodyear Blvd up to US-62 is one attempt to deal with the anger. Still, Rogers Lane isn't a very truck-safe route due to its design flaws and amount of local stop-and-go traffic. 82nd Street is the main route South from the plant down to OK-36 and I-44. Drive that stretch just once and your vehicle will need a wheel realignment due to all the road damage. The situation is bad enough that Goodyear has made noises about relocating future expansion efforts to other plants and even reducing operations at the Lawton plant. Damage to trucks is that bad.

But ODOT is fixated on Duncan and Chickasha as well as the US-81 corridor for some odd reason. Lawton can basically go f*** itself as far as they're concerned.