The Times of Northwest Indiana reports that an East Chicago, Indiana, P3 project will deliver the new Cline Avenue Bridge by 2019, according to remarks by the Figg Bridge Group's CEO, Linda Figg. "The bridge will have two lanes of traffic when it opens," and "expand to four lanes if and when traffic on the toll bridge warrants it," the newspaper says. Figg said tolls will be collected electronically, and the rate for cars will be in the range of $2.25 to $2.50.
New Cline Avenue Bridge set to open in 2019
http://www.nwitimes.com/business/local/new-cline-avenue-bridge-set-to-open-in/article_c8f3fa64-6f4d-503f-8edd-efe292aa64d5.html
It's about time! The approaches have been sitting for several years now. Any word on if the approaches are going to be rebuilt for just 2 lanes or just redecked?
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/619/22756419913_4d95d60316_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/AEUAPt) (https://flic.kr/p/AEUAPt) (https://www.flickr.com/photos/133197723@N05/)
For what it's worth, here's the approach in late 2015 on the east side of the bridge.
Still subject to change - because INDOT.
Quote from: Beltway on June 17, 2017, 11:21:49 PM
The Times of Northwest Indiana reports that an East Chicago, Indiana, P3 project will deliver the new Cline Avenue Bridge by 2019, according to remarks by the Figg Bridge Group's CEO, Linda Figg. "The bridge will have two lanes of traffic when it opens," and "expand to four lanes if and when traffic on the toll bridge warrants it," the newspaper says. Figg said tolls will be collected electronically, and the rate for cars will be in the range of $2.25 to $2.50.
New Cline Avenue Bridge set to open in 2019
http://www.nwitimes.com/business/local/new-cline-avenue-bridge-set-to-open-in/article_c8f3fa64-6f4d-503f-8edd-efe292aa64d5.html
will they change I-pass users that % added fee like the IN-toll road does.
Quote from: Joe The Dragon on June 18, 2017, 07:07:57 PM
Quote from: Beltway on June 17, 2017, 11:21:49 PM
The Times of Northwest Indiana reports that an East Chicago, Indiana, P3 project will deliver the new Cline Avenue Bridge by 2019, according to remarks by the Figg Bridge Group's CEO, Linda Figg. "The bridge will have two lanes of traffic when it opens," and "expand to four lanes if and when traffic on the toll bridge warrants it," the newspaper says. Figg said tolls will be collected electronically, and the rate for cars will be in the range of $2.25 to $2.50.
New Cline Avenue Bridge set to open in 2019
http://www.nwitimes.com/business/local/new-cline-avenue-bridge-set-to-open-in/article_c8f3fa64-6f4d-503f-8edd-efe292aa64d5.html
will they change I-pass users that % added fee like the IN-toll road does.
They have no control over it - ISHTA charges that fee for all plazas except their own.
Quote from: SSOWorld on June 19, 2017, 09:47:32 PM
They have no control over it - ISHTA charges that fee for all plazas except their own.
I went back and checked my old transactions, and for the West Virginia Turnpike I paid the same as the non-WV E-ZPass rate listed on the website with no added fees.
INDOT clearly gave no fucks about this road, if they did, it would have been fixed years ago. Surprised this was never an 3 digit route, this is the only true limited access SR in Indiana up until 641.
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 20, 2017, 02:14:26 PM
INDOT clearly gave no fucks about this road, if they did, it would have been fixed years ago. Surprised this was never an 3 digit route, this is the only true limited access SR in Indiana up until 641.
Um, IN-265 east of I-65 and west of the Ohio River? (Even if this route is most certainly destined to be signed I-265 with the completion of the East End Bridge, it is not yet)
Quote from: ilpt4u on June 20, 2017, 10:21:59 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 20, 2017, 02:14:26 PM
INDOT clearly gave no fucks about this road, if they did, it would have been fixed years ago. Surprised this was never an 3 digit route, this is the only true limited access SR in Indiana up until 641.
Um, IN-265 east of I-65 and west of the Ohio River? (Even if this route is most certainly destined to be signed I-265 with the completion of the East End Bridge, it is not yet)
that route was cosigned with 62 the whole time, never needed to exist in the first place, and it won't exist for much longer.
At present, it is not cosigned with IN-62 the whole route. The older part was. But the whole designation probably has its days numbered
I would assume IN, KY, and whatever Local Metro Planning Commission the Louisville area has will apply for an official I-265 designation, eventually, and close that interstate gap on paper, to match that is has been closed with pavement, bridge, and tunnel
I say hurry up and finish the damn thing already!
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 20, 2017, 10:36:42 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on June 20, 2017, 10:21:59 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 20, 2017, 02:14:26 PM
INDOT clearly gave no fucks about this road, if they did, it would have been fixed years ago. Surprised this was never an 3 digit route, this is the only true limited access SR in Indiana up until 641.
Um, IN-265 east of I-65 and west of the Ohio River? (Even if this route is most certainly destined to be signed I-265 with the completion of the East End Bridge, it is not yet)
that route was cosigned with 62 the whole time, never needed to exist in the first place, and it won't exist for much longer.
IN 62 was routed onto I-265/IN 265 several years after it was built. There was quite a while where IN 265 was the only designation of that highway.
So the bridge will be designed as a Super 2 but built to support four lanes when demand allows it. Understandable.
There are a couple of questions that come to mind (in my opinion) when this bridge is finally said and done.
For one, how many locals are willing to use the new Cline Avenue bridge? Unless it's a desperation move, I don't think many drivers would be willing to part with $2 and change just to jump from Chicago Avenue to Calumet Avenue in a short time span (or vice versa).
Also, how much of an impact will the increased Toll Road rates have on traffic? The only reason that comes to mind is because of the fact the north terminus is at the (Chicago bound) Toll Road, so drivers may ask themselves how much they're willing to pay to shave a considerable number of miles off of the trip.
We'll see what happens. The damn thing just needs to get built.
Looking on Google Maps this evening, I noticed that the section of Riley Road near the westbound onramp to Cline Avenue has been updated as of October 2017. In the Street View image (can be accessed at https://www.google.com/maps/@41.654146,-87.4708195,3a,75y,147.58h,93.05t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s_RAF7gRBCYUym0kTd-T58w!2e0!7i13312!8i6656), it appears the Maintenance and Operations building is complete and two construction trailers are on-site. Behind the Maintenance and Operations build there is a large crane that appears to be driving piles for what I suspect would be the pier footings for the new bridge. Anyone have any recent updates, as I haven't seen any recent news articles discussing progress on the new Cline Avenue Bridge.
Quote from: abqtraveler on February 16, 2018, 12:21:39 AM
Looking on Google Maps this evening, I noticed that the section of Riley Road near the westbound onramp to Cline Avenue has been updated as of October 2017. In the Street View image (can be accessed at https://www.google.com/maps/@41.654146,-87.4708195,3a,75y,147.58h,93.05t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s_RAF7gRBCYUym0kTd-T58w!2e0!7i13312!8i6656), it appears the Maintenance and Operations building is complete and two construction trailers are on-site. Behind the Maintenance and Operations build there is a large crane that appears to be driving piles for what I suspect would be the pier footings for the new bridge. Anyone have any recent updates, as I haven't seen any recent news articles discussing progress on the new Cline Avenue Bridge.
I drove thru there a few weeks ago and I didn't see any significant amount of construction, such as any piers built.
Quote from: abqtraveler on February 16, 2018, 12:21:39 AM
Looking on Google Maps this evening, I noticed that the section of Riley Road near the westbound onramp to Cline Avenue has been updated as of October 2017. In the Street View image (can be accessed at https://www.google.com/maps/@41.654146,-87.4708195,3a,75y,147.58h,93.05t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s_RAF7gRBCYUym0kTd-T58w!2e0!7i13312!8i6656), it appears the Maintenance and Operations building is complete and two construction trailers are on-site. Behind the Maintenance and Operations build there is a large crane that appears to be driving piles for what I suspect would be the pier footings for the new bridge. Anyone have any recent updates, as I haven't seen any recent news articles discussing progress on the new Cline Avenue Bridge.
If the weather isn't bad Monday, I'll drive up there and check it out.
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 20, 2017, 06:23:00 PM
Quote from: tribar on June 20, 2017, 06:17:56 PM
Quote from: NE2 on June 20, 2017, 06:08:48 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 20, 2017, 02:14:26 PM
Surprised this was never an 3 digit route,
912?
I think he meant a 3di interstate.
i did
It was, for a brief year, as I-294.
Quote from: Interstate 69 Fan on February 16, 2018, 10:40:36 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 20, 2017, 06:23:00 PM
Quote from: tribar on June 20, 2017, 06:17:56 PM
Quote from: NE2 on June 20, 2017, 06:08:48 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 20, 2017, 02:14:26 PM
Surprised this was never an 3 digit route,
912?
I think he meant a 3di interstate.
i did
It was, for a brief year, as I-294.
When? I've never seen a map with "I-294" on Cline Avenue, nor was it ever posted at the Borman (I-80/94).
Quote from: Brandon on February 16, 2018, 01:53:13 PM
Quote from: Interstate 69 Fan on February 16, 2018, 10:40:36 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 20, 2017, 06:23:00 PM
Quote from: tribar on June 20, 2017, 06:17:56 PM
Quote from: NE2 on June 20, 2017, 06:08:48 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 20, 2017, 02:14:26 PM
Surprised this was never an 3 digit route,
912?
I think he meant a 3di interstate.
i did
It was, for a brief year, as I-294.
When? I've never seen a map with "I-294" on Cline Avenue, nor was it ever posted at the Borman (I-80/94).
According to I-294 on Wikipedia...
QuoteIndiana later proposed to extend I-294 east on the current Borman Expressway to Indiana State Route 912, before having it turn north at that point, west at U.S. Route 12, and then back to I-94, most likely somewhere on the Bishop Ford Freeway near 130th Street. The request was denied.[citation needed]
QuoteThe request was denied.[citation needed]
QuoteThe request was denied.[citation needed]
What the fuck is wrong with you?
Quote from: Interstate 69 Fan on February 16, 2018, 02:18:34 PM
Quote from: Brandon on February 16, 2018, 01:53:13 PM
Quote from: Interstate 69 Fan on February 16, 2018, 10:40:36 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 20, 2017, 06:23:00 PM
Quote from: tribar on June 20, 2017, 06:17:56 PM
Quote from: NE2 on June 20, 2017, 06:08:48 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 20, 2017, 02:14:26 PM
Surprised this was never an 3 digit route,
912?
I think he meant a 3di interstate.
i did
It was, for a brief year, as I-294.
When? I've never seen a map with "I-294" on Cline Avenue, nor was it ever posted at the Borman (I-80/94).
According to I-294 on Wikipedia...
I-294 used to extend into Indiana, along the Borman (present-day I-80/94) when the Borman was also I-80/90 and I-94 took the Skyway in to Chicago. After the switch (in the 1960s), I-294 was truncated to it's current south end.
Combine the Chicago Skyway and the Cline Ave. Bridge into an interstate tollway.
Yeah, pipe dream with obvious problems, but my thinking is that if you combine both somehow, it may keep more people on Cline, as well as most likely be a better value for the motorist. I've been known to be wrong, and I feel I'm wrong on this, but one can dream..
Quote from: inkyatari on February 21, 2018, 11:27:56 AM
Combine the Chicago Skyway and the Cline Ave. Bridge into an interstate tollway.
Yeah, pipe dream with obvious problems, but my thinking is that if you combine both somehow, it may keep more people on Cline, as well as most likely be a better value for the motorist. I've been known to be wrong, and I feel I'm wrong on this, but one can dream..
The old Cline Ave freeway, and the new one if/when it is ever finished, connects to the Toll Road at both ends, with the northwestern end 2-3 miles from the Skyway. It's never been intended for, nor has it really been used for thru traffic. It's for people heading to the Steel Mills and casinos from other points in Indiana or from Chicago.
So basically, Indiana has decided to do some Re-Cline-ing. Nice.
Quote from: NE2 on February 16, 2018, 03:11:45 PM
QuoteIndiana later proposed to extend I-294 east on the current Borman Expressway to Indiana State Route 912, before having it turn north at that point, west at U.S. Route 12, and then back to I-94, most likely somewhere on the Bishop Ford Freeway near 130th Street. The request was denied.[citation needed]
QuoteThe request was denied.[citation needed]
QuoteThe request was denied.[citation needed]
What the fuck is wrong with you?
I'm glad this request was denied. I-294 would be really confusing if it traveled along the Borman away from the city and then doubled back and headed back into the city.
(For an example of something similar, refer to proposed I-295 in NJ/PA which will happen when the Delaware Expy and the Penn Turnpike interchange is completed.)
It looks like the bridge that collapsed in FL used the same engineer as the currently under construction Cline Ave. Bridge.
http://abc7chicago.com/engineers-behind-collapsed-fla-bridge-involved-in-east-chicago-project/3223988/
Quote from: cabiness42 on February 21, 2018, 11:41:03 AM
Quote from: inkyatari on February 21, 2018, 11:27:56 AM
Combine the Chicago Skyway and the Cline Ave. Bridge into an interstate tollway.
Yeah, pipe dream with obvious problems, but my thinking is that if you combine both somehow, it may keep more people on Cline, as well as most likely be a better value for the motorist. I've been known to be wrong, and I feel I'm wrong on this, but one can dream..
The old Cline Ave freeway, and the new one if/when it is ever finished, connects to the Toll Road at both ends, with the northwestern end 2-3 miles from the Skyway. It's never been intended for, nor has it really been used for thru traffic. It's for people heading to the Steel Mills and casinos from other points in Indiana or from Chicago.
The 1971 Interim Chicago Area Transportation Study plan (can accessed from this site (http://www.cmap.illinois.gov/programs/publications-and-archive/prior-plans)) did include an extension west to I-57.
Quote from: Revive 755 on April 05, 2018, 09:07:40 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on February 21, 2018, 11:41:03 AM
Quote from: inkyatari on February 21, 2018, 11:27:56 AM
Combine the Chicago Skyway and the Cline Ave. Bridge into an interstate tollway.
Yeah, pipe dream with obvious problems, but my thinking is that if you combine both somehow, it may keep more people on Cline, as well as most likely be a better value for the motorist. I've been known to be wrong, and I feel I'm wrong on this, but one can dream..
The old Cline Ave freeway, and the new one if/when it is ever finished, connects to the Toll Road at both ends, with the northwestern end 2-3 miles from the Skyway. It's never been intended for, nor has it really been used for thru traffic. It's for people heading to the Steel Mills and casinos from other points in Indiana or from Chicago.
The 1971 Interim Chicago Area Transportation Study plan (can accessed from this site (http://www.cmap.illinois.gov/programs/publications-and-archive/prior-plans)) did include an extension west to I-57.
This is a great link with historical perspectives on greater Chicago transportation planning. The CATS-1960 planning document estimating requirements until 1980 was great stuff. I am going to pass this on to some urban planning gurus who didn't grow up in this era.
The new bridge is scheduled to open in 2020 (haven't seen anything more specific than this). Since the new bridge will be privately owned and not owned by INDOT, I wonder what's going to happen with IN 912. INDOT does not sign routes on roads that it does not own and maintain, but I wonder if this might be a candidate for an exception. Otherwise it will be a two mile unsigned segment connecting two separate segments of the same route.
I viewed the project 2 weeks ago.
Most of the spans have been placed, but some have not.
They have a lot of work to do if they want to open it in 2020.
CLINE AVENUE BRIDGE IN INDIANA MORE THAN HALFWAY COMPLETE
The 343rd concrete segment out of 685 segments has been secured in its place within the bridge
MARCH 06, 2020
(https://www.roadsbridges.com/sites/rb/files/styles/content_image/public/Cline%20Avenue%20Bridge.webp?itok=39FvSZmL)
The builders of the Cline Avenue Bridge in East Chicago, Indiana, recently announced that the bridge construction project is more than halfway finished and steadily advancing towards completion.
Work on the bridge–which is owned and operated by United Bridge Partners–just marked another milestone by securing the 343rd concrete segment in its place within the bridge. With the erection of this segment–one of 685–the bridge is now intact from the west end up to the Indiana Harbor and Ship Canal.
When finished, the bridge will carry two lanes of traffic in and out of East Chicago over railroad tracks and the Indiana Harbor Canal. A four-lane bridge previously served as a connector for over 30 years, but in 2008 it was demolished. When complete, the new Cline Avenue Bridge will be 6,236 ft long with 170- to 300-ft spans. The main span over the Indiana Harbor Canal will be about 316 ft.
While segment erection progresses from the west end of the mile-long new construction to the east, finishing touches are being added to the driving deck, including the addition of lighting structures, fabrication of barrier walls, and installation of the tolling system.
Since Cline Avenue Bridge construction began in June 2017, the foundations and support columns have been constructed, existing steel bridge preservation work is complete, all the segments have been fabricated, and now superstructure erection has surpassed the halfway point.
When the bridge opens to the public later this year, it will serve as the Gateway of Lake County and help reduce congestion and emissions, spur economic growth, and provide local first responders with a more efficient route while making Lake County, Indiana, more accessible to all.
I give them until 2022 to complete construction.
will the old exits come back?
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 18, 2020, 06:49:40 PM
will the old exits come back?
The parts of the road that have the exits are still there. The southern leg between I-80/94 and Michigan Ave is still there and open in both directions. The western leg between Calumet Ave and Riley Road is still there but only open westbound. All that's missing is the bridge that connect the two legs.
the riley road exit was demolished. looks like 912 is signed along riley and dickey roads like indot originally proposed right now.
Work on the new Cline Avenue Bridge ground to a halt in April.
https://www.nwitimes.com/business/local/cline-avenue-bridge-project-shut-down-workers-laid-off-union-official-says/article_dc1b82d0-ea7d-598c-be92-914ff7650b53.html
Apparently, the primary contractor was out of compliance and was fired. The owners are suing their insurer to get them to pay to get the project finished.
https://www.nwitimes.com/business/local/insurer-hit-with-105m-lawsuit-over-cline-avenue-bridge/article_3a84a6ae-0733-5979-bc55-c542b5e06849.html
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 09, 2020, 09:22:27 AM
Work on the new Cline Avenue Bridge ground to a halt in April.
https://www.nwitimes.com/business/local/cline-avenue-bridge-project-shut-down-workers-laid-off-union-official-says/article_dc1b82d0-ea7d-598c-be92-914ff7650b53.html
Apparently, the primary contractor was out of compliance and was fired. The owners are suing their insurer to get them to pay to get the project finished.
https://www.nwitimes.com/business/local/insurer-hit-with-105m-lawsuit-over-cline-avenue-bridge/article_3a84a6ae-0733-5979-bc55-c542b5e06849.html
I am seeing missteps here on both sides. What's sad is that the people living in this region who would really depend on this connection are now stuck another year+ without this. I know public/private partnerships are a trend, but I think issues we have seen in Indiana (Toll Road condition being another) should give some notable pause to this, especially with ongoing rumblings of going that route here in Illinois.
i think it's embarrassing that INDOT didn't just do this project and keep their road. they basically did an inspection, said o we need to close this, but we dont feel like actually fixing it.
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 09, 2020, 01:17:42 PM
i think it's embarrassing that INDOT didn't just do this project and keep their road. they basically did an inspection, said o we need to close this, but we dont feel like actually fixing it.
It's rather disgraceful. Only on Cline Ave. would this be acceptable. Anywhere else, a decade plus without a bridge would be completely intolerable.
Quote from: JoePCool14 on September 09, 2020, 10:30:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 09, 2020, 01:17:42 PM
i think it's embarrassing that INDOT didn't just do this project and keep their road. they basically did an inspection, said o we need to close this, but we dont feel like actually fixing it.
It's rather disgraceful. Only on Cline Ave. would this be acceptable. Anywhere else, a decade plus without a bridge would be completely intolerable.
INDOT should do a Pier review on this project.
Quote from: JoePCool14 on September 09, 2020, 10:30:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 09, 2020, 01:17:42 PM
i think it's embarrassing that INDOT didn't just do this project and keep their road. they basically did an inspection, said o we need to close this, but we dont feel like actually fixing it.
It's rather disgraceful. Only on Cline Ave. would this be acceptable. Anywhere else, a decade plus without a bridge would be completely intolerable.
It really is, and it's not like NW Indiana doesn't have a decent amount of people in it. Not to mention this is in Chicagoland! Sadly, this gets quite looked over from the region as a whole...
Quote from: JoePCool14 on September 09, 2020, 10:30:22 PM
Anywhere else, a decade plus without a bridge would be completely intolerable.
Didn't St. Louis, Missouri go 10 years without the Eads Bridge, and also have a multi-year closure of the McKinley Bridge partially overlapping?
Quote from: Revive 755 on September 10, 2020, 10:33:29 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on September 09, 2020, 10:30:22 PM
Anywhere else, a decade plus without a bridge would be completely intolerable.
Didn't St. Louis, Missouri go 10 years without the Eads Bridge, and also have a multi-year closure of the McKinley Bridge partially overlapping?
The big difference here is that Cline Ave is a full freeway and a primary connector in that part of the region. The Eads/McKinley are more secondary and are not freeways.
Quote from: ChiMilNet on September 11, 2020, 12:15:42 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on September 10, 2020, 10:33:29 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on September 09, 2020, 10:30:22 PM
Anywhere else, a decade plus without a bridge would be completely intolerable.
Didn't St. Louis, Missouri go 10 years without the Eads Bridge, and also have a multi-year closure of the McKinley Bridge partially overlapping?
The big difference here is that Cline Ave is a full freeway and a primary connector in that part of the region. The Eads/McKinley are more secondary and are not freeways.
One thing I will say about the Cline Ave is that it isn't really a "through route". It's used to get somewhere, namely the steel plants and casinos, but it isn't a route that's used on the way from one route to another. That makes it a little bit lower priority than your average freeway. It still needs to get done, but I understand why the state didn't prioritize it over adding a 3rd travel lane to I-65, among other things.
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 11, 2020, 07:27:28 AM
Quote from: ChiMilNet on September 11, 2020, 12:15:42 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on September 10, 2020, 10:33:29 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on September 09, 2020, 10:30:22 PM
Anywhere else, a decade plus without a bridge would be completely intolerable.
Didn't St. Louis, Missouri go 10 years without the Eads Bridge, and also have a multi-year closure of the McKinley Bridge partially overlapping?
The big difference here is that Cline Ave is a full freeway and a primary connector in that part of the region. The Eads/McKinley are more secondary and are not freeways.
One thing I will say about the Cline Ave is that it isn't really a "through route". It's used to get somewhere, namely the steel plants and casinos, but it isn't a route that's used on the way from one route to another. That makes it a little bit lower priority than your average freeway. It still needs to get done, but I understand why the state didn't prioritize it over adding a 3rd travel lane to I-65, among other things.
If coming into Chicago from anywhere in NW Indiana, it is a nice alternate and less congested route from 80/94 to the Toll Road/Skyway. Agreed that the 3rd lane on I-65 was a much higher need, but still amazing that Indiana just allowed a full freeway bridge to sit 11 years and counting closed to any trough traffic.
Quote from: ChiMilNet on September 11, 2020, 09:44:25 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 11, 2020, 07:27:28 AM
Quote from: ChiMilNet on September 11, 2020, 12:15:42 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on September 10, 2020, 10:33:29 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on September 09, 2020, 10:30:22 PM
Anywhere else, a decade plus without a bridge would be completely intolerable.
Didn't St. Louis, Missouri go 10 years without the Eads Bridge, and also have a multi-year closure of the McKinley Bridge partially overlapping?
The big difference here is that Cline Ave is a full freeway and a primary connector in that part of the region. The Eads/McKinley are more secondary and are not freeways.
One thing I will say about the Cline Ave is that it isn't really a "through route". It's used to get somewhere, namely the steel plants and casinos, but it isn't a route that's used on the way from one route to another. That makes it a little bit lower priority than your average freeway. It still needs to get done, but I understand why the state didn't prioritize it over adding a 3rd travel lane to I-65, among other things.
If coming into Chicago from anywhere in NW Indiana, it is a nice alternate and less congested route from 80/94 to the Toll Road/Skyway. Agreed that the 3rd lane on I-65 was a much higher need, but still amazing that Indiana just allowed a full freeway bridge to sit 11 years and counting closed to any trough traffic.
The section from I-80/94 to the southeastern of the two Toll Road interchanges is still open, so you can still get between the two.
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 11, 2020, 09:52:39 AM
Quote from: ChiMilNet on September 11, 2020, 09:44:25 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 11, 2020, 07:27:28 AM
Quote from: ChiMilNet on September 11, 2020, 12:15:42 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on September 10, 2020, 10:33:29 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on September 09, 2020, 10:30:22 PM
Anywhere else, a decade plus without a bridge would be completely intolerable.
Didn't St. Louis, Missouri go 10 years without the Eads Bridge, and also have a multi-year closure of the McKinley Bridge partially overlapping?
The big difference here is that Cline Ave is a full freeway and a primary connector in that part of the region. The Eads/McKinley are more secondary and are not freeways.
One thing I will say about the Cline Ave is that it isn't really a "through route". It's used to get somewhere, namely the steel plants and casinos, but it isn't a route that's used on the way from one route to another. That makes it a little bit lower priority than your average freeway. It still needs to get done, but I understand why the state didn't prioritize it over adding a 3rd travel lane to I-65, among other things.
If coming into Chicago from anywhere in NW Indiana, it is a nice alternate and less congested route from 80/94 to the Toll Road/Skyway. Agreed that the 3rd lane on I-65 was a much higher need, but still amazing that Indiana just allowed a full freeway bridge to sit 11 years and counting closed to any trough traffic.
The section from I-80/94 to the southeastern of the two Toll Road interchanges is still open, so you can still get between the two.
True, although you have a classic Breezewood situation at the currently open Tollroad Interchange.
If there's enough interest in this topic, it can be split off into a separate thread, but for now I'll leave it here:
http://cdm16066.contentdm.oclc.org/cdm/ref/collection/p15078coll8/id/3458
When I moved to Lake County 3 years ago, I became curious about decommissioned roads and pre-freeway alignments of current roads. I found this map from 1958. It's a bit hard to read, but this is what I see:
US 6: Instead of turning north at/with IN 51 and then following I-80/94 into Illinois, it continued west on Ridge Road to Hohman Ave in Munster, north on Hohman to 165th St in Hammond, and then west on 165th into Illinois
US 12: Routing remained as it was in 1958 until not too long ago, when it got rerouted off Airport Rd onto IN 912 and US 20.
US 20: Routing appears to be the same now as in 1958
US 41: At the far southern end of the county, the smoothing out of the jog at Schneider was not yet built. Farther north, before the existence of I-80/94, US 41 turned west at Ridge to Calumet and then north on Calumet.
US 231 didn't yet exist
IN 2: Routing appears to be the same now as in 1958
IN 8: Took the route of what is now US 231
IN 51: Used to end at what was then IN 330 but now continues south to US 30
IN 53: Continued southeast beyond its current end along then-IN 8 (now US 231)
IN 55: Routing appears to be the same now as in 1958
IN 73: Now decommissioned, was Broad St between Ridge Rd (US 6) and IN 330. I believe at a later point it went down to US 30.
IN 130: Routing appears to be the same now as in 1958
IN 141: Now decommissioned, was Calumet Ave between Ridge Rd and Columbia Ave, and Columbia Ave down to US 30
IN 152: Southern end got truncated from Ridge Rd to I-80/94 when US 41 got rerouted, northern end got truncated from Chicago Ave to Carroll because it was unnecessary to begin with
IN 312: West end truncated from state line to White Oak Ave (just recently), east end truncated from Airport Rd to Cline Ave
IN 330: Now decommissioned, followed old alignment of Lincoln Hwy
IN 912: Originally started at Kennedy/Ridge, going north on Kennedy, east on Carroll, north on Cline, northwest on Guthrie, southwest on Waitling, northwest on Dickey and west on 129th to Indianapolis.
is this still on hold due to the company behind it being terrible?
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 27, 2020, 12:28:21 PM
is this still on hold due to the company behind it being terrible?
I haven't seen anything about it since the story in August about the company suing their insurer. Haven't been over that way recently to check things out but I assume there's no more progress.
https://www.nwitimes.com/business/local/last-segment-of-cline-avenue-bridge-in-place/article_2e63fe7f-4365-5386-b024-051f7295714e.html#tracking-source=home-trending
QuoteThe final segment of the new Cline Avenue Bridge was lifted into place recently, putting all 685 segments that form the driving deck in place. Bridge officials plan to open the bridge to traffic this winter.
wonderful news!
https://www.facebook.com/WJOB.1230/videos/388978092313206/
Bridge discussion from 10:00 to 22:00 of this video. Didn't give an exact date but sounds like it will open in January.
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 07, 2020, 07:40:00 PM
https://www.facebook.com/WJOB.1230/videos/388978092313206/
Bridge discussion from 10:00 to 22:00 of this video. Didn't give an exact date but sounds like it will open in January.
Which century?
so what will the official routing of 912 be after this opens?
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 07, 2020, 09:05:33 PM
so what will the official routing of 912 be after this opens?
That is still unclear. INDOT does not sign roads that they don't own, so by that rule the bridge would be an unsigned road connecting two separate segments of 912.
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 07, 2020, 10:07:31 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 07, 2020, 09:05:33 PM
so what will the official routing of 912 be after this opens?
That is still unclear. INDOT does not sign roads that they don't own, so by that rule the bridge would be an unsigned road connecting two separate segments of 912.
They might make an exception to provide continuity.
Quote from: abqtraveler on December 08, 2020, 05:54:00 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 07, 2020, 10:07:31 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 07, 2020, 09:05:33 PM
so what will the official routing of 912 be after this opens?
That is still unclear. INDOT does not sign roads that they don't own, so by that rule the bridge would be an unsigned road connecting two separate segments of 912.
They might make an exception to provide continuity.
Because the Indiana State Road sign is so similar to the non-pentagonal county/local road marker, there are a number of options INDOT could use to sign the non-State maintained section of SR 912 to provide continuity for the driver while indicating the roadway is owned or maintained by another jurisdiction for legal reasons. I'd suggest where the State portion ends, placement of one of the examples below (or similar) with the "State Maintenance Ends" sign underneath and then an Indiana 912 sign with "State Maintenance Begins" on the other side of the bridge where State control resumes. This takes away any real need for END Indiana 912 signage around the gap which becomes additional "noise" to the typical driver. We may care about such jurisdictional changes, but most do not.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50699648116_bb8c7c1bc4_z.jpg)
This approach could also be used in situations like SR 22 in Kokomo where it just ends at the western city limit and then picks up again on the other side of town at the US-31 interchange (actually, I'd just eliminate SR 22 between US-31 and I-69 since it is dual with US-35 the entire way, but that is a different discussion). For continuity, one of the "local" markers could be used to mark "Local 22" through Kokomo to US-31.
they could at least do "TO" SR 912 with a directional arrow below
The problem with any of those alternatives is that they would imply local or county control of the roadway when there isn't. What I think we're most likely to get is just a lack of signage of any kind on the bridge
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 09, 2020, 02:28:51 PM
The problem with any of those alternatives is that they would imply local or county control of the roadway when there isn't. What I think we're most likely to get is just a lack of signage of any kind on the bridge
I didn't know who owns the new bridge so made the examples with local jurisdictions. If it is a private operator, then TO 912 would suffice if the section is long enough to warrant reassurance markers.
Quote from: hockeyjohn on December 09, 2020, 02:48:54 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 09, 2020, 02:28:51 PM
The problem with any of those alternatives is that they would imply local or county control of the roadway when there isn't. What I think we're most likely to get is just a lack of signage of any kind on the bridge
I didn't know who owns the new bridge so made the examples with local jurisdictions. If it is a private operator, then TO 912 would suffice if the section is long enough to warrant reassurance markers.
It's a privately owned bridge. I think the problem with "TO 912" markers is that you're already on 912 to get to the bridge, and at that point telling people they are going TO 912 is going to be confusing.
It would be nice if INDOT would just sign the bridge as 912 and deal with the fact that it will cause them to get come calls from the public that they'll have to redirect.
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 09, 2020, 03:33:17 PM
Quote from: hockeyjohn on December 09, 2020, 02:48:54 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 09, 2020, 02:28:51 PM
The problem with any of those alternatives is that they would imply local or county control of the roadway when there isn't. What I think we're most likely to get is just a lack of signage of any kind on the bridge
I didn't know who owns the new bridge so made the examples with local jurisdictions. If it is a private operator, then TO 912 would suffice if the section is long enough to warrant reassurance markers.
It's a privately owned bridge. I think the problem with "TO 912" markers is that you're already on 912 to get to the bridge, and at that point telling people they are going TO 912 is going to be confusing.
It would be nice if INDOT would just sign the bridge as 912 and deal with the fact that it will cause them to get come calls from the public that they'll have to redirect.
It wouldn't be too far of a reach if they just simply signed it as "WEST Cline Ave, TO US 41/I-90, Chicago," with a yellow "TOLL" tab on top of it. In the other direction, simply set the controls as Hammond and East Chicago.
Makes things easier since Riley Road won't be restored as an exit (Riley Road traffic can only access westbound Cline Avenue).
any maps of what the new exits will look like?
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 14, 2020, 08:53:39 PM
any maps of what the new exits will look like?
Edit: Link removed because of misdirection.Nothing’s really changed. The current ramps on the southeast end of the bridge will maintain their original footprints. The main difference is that Riley Road traffic will only have access to westbound Cline Avenue, toward Calumet Avenue and the Toll Road. No other exits or entrances.
The other big news just announced on their Facebook page: the bridge opens December 23! Quite the Christmas present along with the first month being toll-free!
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 14, 2020, 09:18:24 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 14, 2020, 08:53:39 PM
any maps of what the new exits will look like?
Edit: Link removed because of misdirection.
Nothing's really changed. The current ramps on the southeast end of the bridge will maintain their original footprints. The main difference is that Riley Road traffic will only have access to westbound Cline Avenue, toward Calumet Avenue and the Toll Road. No other exits or entrances.
The other big news just announced on their Facebook page: the bridge opens December 23! Quite the Christmas present along with the first month being toll-free!
Will they change I-pass users that added fee that IN-toll has
Quote from: Joe The Dragon on December 15, 2020, 09:59:26 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 14, 2020, 09:18:24 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 14, 2020, 08:53:39 PM
any maps of what the new exits will look like?
Edit: Link removed because of misdirection.
Nothing's really changed. The current ramps on the southeast end of the bridge will maintain their original footprints. The main difference is that Riley Road traffic will only have access to westbound Cline Avenue, toward Calumet Avenue and the Toll Road. No other exits or entrances.
The other big news just announced on their Facebook page: the bridge opens December 23! Quite the Christmas present along with the first month being toll-free!
Will they change I-pass users that added fee that IN-toll has
I highly doubt it. Indiana Toll Road charges more for Illinois transponders because they want you to buy theirs. The bridge isn't going to have their own transponders so which state you use won't matter to them.
I just got back from the ribbon-cutting ceremony and first drive across the bridge. Bridge will be free the first month, $1 the next month, and then the permanent tolls will be $2.50 with a transponder and $5.50 without.
I was told by a representative from the bridge operator and someone from INDOT that the bridge is considered part of IN 912, though the signage is still on Dickey Rd, Michigan Ave and Riley Road and not on the bridge yet.
I drove on it as well (both directions during the ceremony and when it opened to traffic about 30 minutes after 1 pm)... Not a lot of traffic on it when I was recording it right after they opened.
The videos of the bridge and the ceremony will go up sometime within the next couple of days.
EDIT: Here is a video of the NEW Cline Avenue Bridge heading northbound:
How was the drive overall?
Quote from: ET21 on December 23, 2020, 04:55:43 PM
How was the drive overall?
It's a bridge with a view the lakefront oil tanks and steel mills, so it's not a drive you take for scenery. It's really more for trucks and employees going to/from the mills, or if you're going to the casinos. It's only one lane each way on the new section.
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 23, 2020, 06:12:46 PM
Quote from: ET21 on December 23, 2020, 04:55:43 PM
How was the drive overall?
It's a bridge with a view the lakefront oil tanks and steel mills, so it's not a drive you take for scenery. It's really more for trucks and employees going to/from the mills, or if you're going to the casinos. It's only one lane each way on the new section.
Any plans by the bridge operators to add two more lanes?
Quote from: Brandon on December 24, 2020, 08:09:08 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 23, 2020, 06:12:46 PM
Quote from: ET21 on December 23, 2020, 04:55:43 PM
How was the drive overall?
It's a bridge with a view the lakefront oil tanks and steel mills, so it's not a drive you take for scenery. It's really more for trucks and employees going to/from the mills, or if you're going to the casinos. It's only one lane each way on the new section.
Any plans by the bridge operators to add two more lanes?
Sounds like it's going to depend on how much revenue they take in. The stubs of the old sections of road have been left on each end in case they do it.
With the bridge now open, will crews take advantage of the free trial period to update the signage within the immediate area with "TOLL BRIDGE" tabs? I know they'll be needed along both Toll Road ramps, Calumet Avenue, and the remaining entrance ramps between the Toll Road junctions. I'm sure they updated (or plan to update) signage along Cline itself too.
https://www.nwitimes.com/opinion/letters/letter-to-the-editor-cline-avenue-bridge-shouldnt-be-a-toll-road/article_44645b35-5efb-5b45-88d2-00311cad392e.html
News article on why there shouldn't be a toll bridge on Cline Avenue :-/
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 28, 2020, 12:54:02 AM
https://www.nwitimes.com/opinion/letters/letter-to-the-editor-cline-avenue-bridge-shouldnt-be-a-toll-road/article_44645b35-5efb-5b45-88d2-00311cad392e.html
News article on why there shouldn't be a toll bridge on Cline Avenue :-/
Well, it's a letter to the editor and not a news article. Also, once INDOT decided not to replace the bridge, a free bridge was never an option, only a toll bridge or no bridge at all.
there's been rumors for years that 65 and 70 will be tolled throughout the whole state.
I just drove this thing this afternoon.
What a waste of money - the bridge is quite a cookie cut and to that end - its like someone forgot to put the second buck tooth back into the socket when they rebuilt it.
Interestingly Google Maps added the new section of the Greensboro Urban Loop almost immediately after it opened, and has done similar with the Fayetteville Outer Loop and the Kickapoo Turnpike - but for some reason has not yet added the new Cline Avenue Bridge. Maybe there's a delay with getting a Google Maps listing for private infrastructure?
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 28, 2020, 11:55:44 AM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 28, 2020, 12:54:02 AM
https://www.nwitimes.com/opinion/letters/letter-to-the-editor-cline-avenue-bridge-shouldnt-be-a-toll-road/article_44645b35-5efb-5b45-88d2-00311cad392e.html
News article on why there shouldn't be a toll bridge on Cline Avenue :-/
Well, it's a letter to the editor and not a news article. Also, once INDOT decided not to replace the bridge, a free bridge was never an option, only a toll bridge or no bridge at all.
I can't say I disagree with the author's sentiment. Not having connectivity to Riley Rd seems like a mistake.
Quote from: JREwing78 on December 29, 2020, 11:27:50 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 28, 2020, 11:55:44 AM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 28, 2020, 12:54:02 AM
https://www.nwitimes.com/opinion/letters/letter-to-the-editor-cline-avenue-bridge-shouldnt-be-a-toll-road/article_44645b35-5efb-5b45-88d2-00311cad392e.html
News article on why there shouldn't be a toll bridge on Cline Avenue :-/
Well, it's a letter to the editor and not a news article. Also, once INDOT decided not to replace the bridge, a free bridge was never an option, only a toll bridge or no bridge at all.
I can't say I disagree with the author's sentiment. Not having connectivity to Riley Rd seems like a mistake.
With the incoming Sec. of Transportation being from nearby, it's possible that if they'd waited they could have gotten federal funding and done it right and with no tolls.
Saw an ad on WGN 9 for the new bridge - 'try it for free'.
THAT is what they put back!? Admittedly, I haven't been home in years, but if that's what they've done, there's no reason for me to take Cline Ave. over the Toll Road in that instance.
Admittedly, last time I went that route I would take it and get off on old US 12 (Airport Road now), to go through Gary and likely make a stop at an old rib joint on the way back to my folks house -- but that'll tell you how long it's been for me. I moved out of Miller in 94, and my family left Gary a few years later. They live out east of Crown Point now.
I took it a month after it opened and though it is two lanes, it's still a decent route. This is new bridge functions more like a Super-2; the route is still limited access. The rest of IN-912 on either end of the new bridge is largely unchanged. But, the route is designed so that a second bridge can be constructed next to the existing completed route.
Quote from: JREwing78 on December 29, 2020, 11:27:50 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 28, 2020, 11:55:44 AM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 28, 2020, 12:54:02 AM
https://www.nwitimes.com/opinion/letters/letter-to-the-editor-cline-avenue-bridge-shouldnt-be-a-toll-road/article_44645b35-5efb-5b45-88d2-00311cad392e.html
News article on why there shouldn't be a toll bridge on Cline Avenue :-/
Well, it's a letter to the editor and not a news article. Also, once INDOT decided not to replace the bridge, a free bridge was never an option, only a toll bridge or no bridge at all.
I can't say I disagree with the author's sentiment. Not having connectivity to Riley Rd seems like a mistake.
I believe the WB onramp from Riley Road remains.
Quote from: dvferyance on March 04, 2021, 07:13:43 PM
Quote from: JREwing78 on December 29, 2020, 11:27:50 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 28, 2020, 11:55:44 AM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 28, 2020, 12:54:02 AM
https://www.nwitimes.com/opinion/letters/letter-to-the-editor-cline-avenue-bridge-shouldnt-be-a-toll-road/article_44645b35-5efb-5b45-88d2-00311cad392e.html
News article on why there shouldn't be a toll bridge on Cline Avenue :-/
Well, it's a letter to the editor and not a news article. Also, once INDOT decided not to replace the bridge, a free bridge was never an option, only a toll bridge or no bridge at all.
I can't say I disagree with the author's sentiment. Not having connectivity to Riley Rd seems like a mistake.
I believe the WB onramp from Riley Road remains.
Yes, it does. There is no EB off ramp, but it looks like if they ever build the other two lanes, it would get added then.