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[1]

So, are we suggesting the forum host user photos?

I can already put photos in the forum gallery.

[traffic light guy]

So, are we suggesting the forum host user photos?

Yes, since they're requested, and It's gonna be eons before I get a chance to be in Lower Merion again, by the time that time rolls around, all the goodies will be replaced by McCains

[traffic light guy]

If you guys do get these said photos, will you allow me to post them on my flickr page? I'll give you guys credit

[jakeroot]

So, are we suggesting the forum host user photos?

Yes, since they're requested, and It's gonna be eons before I get a chance to be in Lower Merion again, by the time that time rolls around, all the goodies will be replaced by McCains

Unless you know for a fact that the road will be upgraded shortly, or the signals are due for replacement, I wouldn't worry about them being replaced shortly. If they've lasted as long as they have, there's no reason to believe they'd be replaced within the next few months or years.

What I'd do, assuming it'd be affordable, is just take a taxi. As long as you have the cash up-front for a ride, I've never heard of a cab driver denying a ride based on age.

Alternatively (assuming you are in fact 16), get your drivers licence, commandeer a parents vehicle, and just drive there.

[traffic light guy]

So, are we suggesting the forum host user photos?

Yes, since they're requested, and It's gonna be eons before I get a chance to be in Lower Merion again, by the time that time rolls around, all the goodies will be replaced by McCains

Unless you know for a fact that the road will be upgraded shortly, or the signals are due for replacement, I wouldn't worry about them being replaced shortly. If they've lasted as long as they have, there's no reason to believe they'd be replaced within the next few months or years.

What I'd do, assuming it'd be affordable, is just take a taxi. As long as you have the cash up-front for a ride, I've never heard of a cab driver denying a ride based on age.

Alternatively (assuming you are in fact 16), get your drivers licence, commandeer a parents vehicle, and just drive there.

Pennsylvania usually replaces signals without warning, whenever they don't give a warning they usually replace the signal heads, not the mast-arms. Which is just as bad as a full-on upgrade. Thankfully, these old signals are not on the warrant list, but you never know what could happen. But I better get up and move my ass, just to be safe.

I'll try and work something out with my folks, with the transportation, and whatnot, but it won't be easy.

[traffic light guy]

In fact, I'll give an example of how sneaky PennDOT can be:

This, right here I shot in 2016, look at the old school montotube and the old eagles on the right:
A set of Peek signals overhead, with old Eagle flatbacks on the side by Traffic Light Guy, on Flickr

The signals are now gone and were replaced by Econolites in 2017, and they were nowhere to be found on the warrant list:

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.097765,-75.1461625,3a,75y,2.43h,87.88t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sCJbxZzpK3XirYuu7rh1LDg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656


There were another set of goodies in the tokanay creek parkway (I was planning to get a picture of those too, but now they're gone, the old signal heads were replaced, but the old monotube is still up)

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0549837,-75.1028249,3a,75y,11.19h,86.97t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sJP9FpNGezvyfmr2i6A7aNQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Now you know why McCain is my least favorite signal brand. PA abuses them to death, they're at every other intersection


My point is, neither of these were on the warrant list, goes to show how slick PennDOT really is when it comes to their signal enthusiasts. Granted I did get shots of old signals on Spring Garden Street, but the ones in Lower Merion have doghouses, the oldest doghouses ever, 12" flatbacks. When those are gone there will be no more old Vietnam-era doghouse signals left in the entire state. Bristol Township has a few Vietnam War era 12" Flatback doghouses, but those are on the signal upgrade warrant list.

[formulanone]

My point is, neither of these were on the warrant list, goes to show how slick PennDOT really is when it comes to their signal enthusiasts.

With all due respect, you can't give hobbyists that much credit...a DOT's job is not preservation of an item that costs about $1000, it's to replace a potentially faulty item that might lead to a lawsuit due to failure, or eliminate one that doesn't meet the latest safety criteria. DOTs just contract-buy a few thousand assemblies, and replace them as the old ones near their serviceable end-of-life according to some spreadsheet.

There's no conspiracy to bother a few hundred enthusiasts, and they also have no obligation to notify the public beforehand, unless it's going to involve a major detour for a long period of time.

Yes, this all means we sometimes go out of our way to visit a road that's under construction, can't clinch a route because of an accident / detour, miss that old sign that's been replaced / damaged / stolen, or an attraction is closed down or not operational that day. Not everything runs on schedule, not all changes require fanfare, and sometimes an anagram of "THIS HAPPENS" is the order of the day.

Welcome to the (or any) hobby...there's upsides and downsides, and that's the way it goes.

[traffic light guy]

My point is, neither of these were on the warrant list, goes to show how slick PennDOT really is when it comes to their signal enthusiasts.

With all due respect, you can't give hobbyists that much credit...a DOT's job is not preservation of an item that costs about $1000, it's to replace a potentially faulty item that might lead to a lawsuit due to failure, or eliminate one that doesn't meet the latest safety criteria. DOTs just contract-buy a few thousand assemblies, and replace them as the old ones near their serviceable end-of-life according to some spreadsheet.

There's no conspiracy to bother a few hundred enthusiasts, and they also have no obligation to notify the public beforehand, unless it's going to involve a major detour for a long period of time.

I hate being a young signal enthusiast, PA once had old signals everywhere a decade ago, now that my friend is the reason why I'm so worried about those 12" 1970s-era flatback doghouse signals being replaced.

All I want is a few good pictures before they're gone

[chays]

Is is possible to contact the appropriate DOT to see what they do with the old signals?  Maybe you could snag one when they do replace them...I'm not sure how these things work though.  I imagine if you approach them respectfully and earnestly, they might go out of their way to accommodate.

[traffic light guy]

Is is possible to contact the appropriate DOT to see what they do with the old signals?  Maybe you could snag one when they do replace them...I'm not sure how these things work though.  I imagine if you approach them respectfully and earnestly, they might go out of their way to accommodate.

Snagging this signals would mean budget problems. But I'll do what I can

[TheArkansasRoadgeek]

Is is possible to contact the appropriate DOT to see what they do with the old signals?  Maybe you could snag one when they do replace them...I'm not sure how these things work though.  I imagine if you approach them respectfully and earnestly, they might go out of their way to accommodate.

Snagging this signals would mean budget problems. But I'll do what I can

Rob a bank? Launder some money? Embezzlement of funds? Y'know.

[jeffandnicole]

Is is possible to contact the appropriate DOT to see what they do with the old signals?  Maybe you could snag one when they do replace them...I'm not sure how these things work though.  I imagine if you approach them respectfully and earnestly, they might go out of their way to accommodate.

If you keep an eye on projects and contracts and such, often times an independent contractor replaces the signal. Find out what they do with them. If the DOT allows them to get rid of the lights in any manner they want, you can possibly get some from them.

[traffic light guy]

Is is possible to contact the appropriate DOT to see what they do with the old signals?  Maybe you could snag one when they do replace them...I'm not sure how these things work though.  I imagine if you approach them respectfully and earnestly, they might go out of their way to accommodate.

If you keep an eye on projects and contracts and such, often times an independent contractor replaces the signal. Find out what they do with them. If the DOT allows them to get rid of the lights in any manner they want, you can possibly get some from them.

It's not that I want the lights, I want photos of the signals before they get replaced, with all the mast arms in tact. Getting just the signal head isn't the same as seeing the full package.

[Scott5114]

So, are we suggesting the forum host user photos?

Yes, since they're requested, and It's gonna be eons before I get a chance to be in Lower Merion again, by the time that time rolls around, all the goodies will be replaced by McCains

I hate it when that happens.

[traffic light guy]

So, are we suggesting the forum host user photos?

Yes, since they're requested, and It's gonna be eons before I get a chance to be in Lower Merion again, by the time that time rolls around, all the goodies will be replaced by McCains

I hate it when that happens.

Not John McCain, I'm talking about the traffic signal company "McCain traffic supply"

[Scott5114]

You mean to tell me Senators from Arizona aren't a valid traffic control device?

[jakeroot]

Is is possible to contact the appropriate DOT to see what they do with the old signals?  Maybe you could snag one when they do replace them...I'm not sure how these things work though.  I imagine if you approach them respectfully and earnestly, they might go out of their way to accommodate.

If you keep an eye on projects and contracts and such, often times an independent contractor replaces the signal. Find out what they do with them. If the DOT allows them to get rid of the lights in any manner they want, you can possibly get some from them.

It's not that I want the lights, I want photos of the signals before they get replaced, with all the mast arms in tact. Getting just the signal head isn't the same as seeing the full package.

While some might call that attitude selfish, I would actually agree. Seeing something old, where it originally was, especially still being used by the general public, is easily ten times cooler than seeing that same thing in someone's garage or museum. It's still wise to collect old signals if you can, however, due to the increasing number of jurisdictions that require anything that can be recycled, to be so. Here in Washington, it's virtually impossible to find old highway signs, since (I believe) WSDOT requires contractors to recycle the old sign. I'm not sure old signals can be recycled per se, but they can be scrapped (nearly the same thing, IIRC).

Not John McCain, I'm talking about the traffic signal company "McCain traffic supply"

You mean to tell me Senators from Arizona aren't a valid traffic control device?

If he was standing in the middle of the road, he might have that power.

[21stCenturyRoad]

So, are we suggesting the forum host user photos?

Yes, since they're requested, and It's gonna be eons before I get a chance to be in Lower Merion again, by the time that time rolls around, all the goodies will be replaced by McCains

I hate it when that happens.

Not John McCain, I'm talking about the traffic signal company "McCain traffic supply"

The Joke
                                       
       
          Your Head

[Scott5114]

You mean to tell me Senators from Arizona aren't a valid traffic control device?

If he was standing in the middle of the road, he might have that power.

Probably not, actually, due to separation of powers (John McCain being part of the legislative branch, and traffic control authority being vested in the executive branch). Even if not for that, he probably wouldn't have any authority due to the 10th Amendment, since there's nothing in the Constitution assigning enforcement of traffic control to the federal level, and thus it falls on the state to enforce.

Now we can all say we learned something today: Senator John McCain is not a valid traffic control device. Isn't Constitutional Law fun?

[jakeroot]

You mean to tell me Senators from Arizona aren't a valid traffic control device?

If he was standing in the middle of the road, he might have that power.

Probably not, actually, due to separation of powers (John McCain being part of the legislative branch, and traffic control authority being vested in the executive branch). Even if not for that, he probably wouldn't have any authority due to the 10th Amendment, since there's nothing in the Constitution assigning enforcement of traffic control to the federal level, and thus it falls on the state to enforce.

Now we can all say we learned something today: Senator John McCain is not a valid traffic control device. Isn't Constitutional Law fun?

[davewiecking]

I've taken traffic direction from any number of people without looking at their faces-I suppose mostly leaving major sporting events. If someone's got a whistle, or an orange-tipped flashlight, or a reflective vest, I wouldn't stop to analyze whether the individual was a legislator or not. However, due to his mistreatment at the hands of the North Vietnamese, the heroic and Distinguished Senior Senator from Arizona does have an affliction that would make him rather ill-suited to this task: his inability to raise his arms above his shoulders.

[Max Rockatansky]

Well this thread took an upward swing pretty quickly in a day.  Interestingly the last time the Federal Government tried to really force it's hand was with the National Maximum Speed Limit of 55 MPH.  Essentially there was nothing the Feds could do legally to force states to comply with the 55 MPH speed limits but they could withhold Federal Highway Funds.  If I recall correctly there was supposed to be a speed limit compliance rating where half the traffic had to be traveling at 55 MPH or less?  It essentially would be impossible to pull the same thing today but there has to be away for the Feds to force the States to start posting McCain traffic control devices.

[MNHighwayMan]

Jesus, dude, take a Xanax and chill. This thread is kind of ridiculous.

It's not the level of interest (I can hear people I know saying to me "they're just signs! Who cares?!"), but rather the level of helplessness and insecurity this thread poses. I can understand if you're not physically able to drive, but otherwise, be resourceful and find a way, and not complain about it on an Internet forum.

[Max Rockatansky]

Jesus, dude, take a Xanax and chill. This thread is kind of ridiculous.

It's not the level of interest (I can hear people I know saying to me "they're just signs! Who cares?!"), but rather the level of helplessness and insecurity this thread poses. I can understand if you're not physically able to drive, but instead, be resourceful and find a way, and not complain about it on an Internet forum.

Branching off from John McCain signs for a moment towards your point.  One of the best ways I've found to take pictures of local signs and other items of interest isn't in my car but out when I'm running or riding a distance bike.  For a 16 year old it might be a great way to get out there to document what you're looking for and build some confidence at the same time.  I believe Hurricane Rex is around the same age and he's posted pictures of signs he's gotten while out on foot running.

[DaBigE]

Jesus, dude, take a Xanax and chill. This thread is kind of ridiculous.

It's not the level of interest (I can hear people I know saying to me "they're just signs! Who cares?!"), but rather the level of helplessness and insecurity this thread poses. I can understand if you're not physically able to drive, but instead, be resourceful and find a way, and not complain about it on an Internet forum.

One of the best ways I've found to take pictures of local signs and other items of interest isn't in my car but out when I'm running or riding a distance bike.  For a 16 year old it might be a great way to get out there to document what you're looking for and build some confidence at the same time.  I believe Hurricane Rex is around the same age and he's posted pictures of signs he's gotten while out on foot running.

That, and on-foot was the way I used to do it, and still do it that way today. Sure, you need a car to get to certain further-away places, but to some extent, grabbing photos with a car is more of a hassle (finding a place to park, having pristine windows, accounting for glare, hanging out the window. etc.). On-foot and by bike offers so much more flexibility. Stop, point, aim, click. Rinse, repeat.

To more of the original topic, it may be time to take a step back and reassess. There's nothing you can do about what signals get replaced and when. it's time to accept they're going to change. Very similar situation to railroad wig-wag signals.