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New York

Started by Alex, August 18, 2009, 12:34:57 AM

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Alps

Quote from: SignBridge on December 25, 2019, 10:19:56 PM
I always thought it was unusual that the MTA's Verrazzano Bridge collected the toll westbound while all of the Port Authority's Hudson River crossings were tolled eastbound. It kind of defeated the purpose for one facility to be the opposite of all the others.
The idea was that you weren't soaking people as hard to head from NJ into NY that way - if it's the same cost as every other way, maybe some people will go through the island, buy coffee and a bagel on the way in, pizza on the way out, do some shopping? You won't have that now. This will lighten some of the load on the SIE at least. The open question is what Port Authority will do once they go cashless - it's assumed they'll keep it one way tolling, but will they consider two way? Will they talk to the NYSTA? What about NYSBA?


lstone19

Quote from: SignBridge on December 25, 2019, 10:19:56 PM
I always thought it was unusual that the MTA's Verrazzano Bridge collected the toll westbound while all of the Port Authority's Hudson River crossings were tolled eastbound. It kind of defeated the purpose for one facility to be the opposite of all the others.

But the Verrazano Bridge can toll independently of the PA crossings as you still need to cross a PA bridge to get on Staten Island from New Jersey. The Verrazano Bridge is an additional crossing, not one that can be used instead of a PA crossing.

As the article implies, the Verrazano's "competitors" are the East River crossings (including the Brooklyn-Battery Tunnel which the article didn't mention). And I saw this in action a few years ago when a cruise line's shuttles between Newark Airport and the Brooklyn Cruise Terminal operated EB via the Goethals and Verrazano bridges but WB via the Brooklyn-Battery and Holland tunnels.

SignBridge

You're right Istone19. I had not thought it out completely. Good points.

And Alps, I'm guessing that when the PA goes cashless, they will toll in both directions again, as it will be relatively simple to erect overhead antennas in both directions, right?

cl94

Quote from: SignBridge on December 26, 2019, 04:09:58 PM
And Alps, I'm guessing that when the PA goes cashless, they will toll in both directions again, as it will be relatively simple to erect overhead antennas in both directions, right?

Bidirectional tolling may be a nightmare from a load management perspective. As it stands, people heading EB will detour to Tappan Zee or Bear Mountain to pay a smaller toll, even if it adds time. Reinstating WB tolls will make that happen heading the other way. It's not like TZB or the roads leading to it have much in the way of extra capacity for shunpiking traffic.

Since New York has a controlling interest in all three Hudson River bridge authorities, it's probably going to be an "all or nothing" thing. Either everything over the Hudson will go bidirectional or nothing will (minus the Castleton-On-Hudson Bridge, which is bidirectional but hidden in the ticket system).
Please note: All posts represent my personal opinions and do not represent those of my employer or any of its partner agencies.

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sbeaver44

I drive from Harrisburg to Smithtown in Suffolk County a few times a year to visit friends. 

Because of the Verrazano, and the MTA making me pay Cash rate despite having an EZPass (PA Turnpike issued), I usually take 78 to either 287-440-Outerbridge Cr or 78-440-Bayonne Br Eastbound.  Then over the Verrazano to the Belt Pkwy.  Depending on traffic, I'll either take Southern Pkwy to Sagtikos to Sunken Meadow, or Cross Island Pkwy right to Northern Pkwy. 

WB, I'm using Northern Pkwy (or rarely 495) to CIP/295 and the Throgs Neck, then 95 to 80 to 287 to 78.

The last few times I've sucked it up and paid the $19 to use the Verrazano WB because I like the southern 287 approach way better than any part of 95.

I wish MTA would stop the transponder discrimination, but I'll probably start using the Verrazano both ways now every time.

roadman65

I think the article is stating that MTA is getting after WB Shunpikers.   Even myself in 1998, used the Gowanus to the Brooklyn Bridge to FDR SB though the underpass to West Street and through the tunnel to NJ to avoid the tolls coming back from Coney Island.  The article said others were doing that as well.
Every day is a winding road, you just got to get used to it.

Sheryl Crowe

D-Dey65

Quote from: roadman65 on December 26, 2019, 10:26:13 PM
I think the article is stating that MTA is getting after WB Shunpikers.   Even myself in 1998, used the Gowanus to the Brooklyn Bridge to FDR SB though the underpass to West Street and through the tunnel to NJ to avoid the tolls coming back from Coney Island.  The article said others were doing that as well.
I just take the George Washington Bridge early in the morning. I don't avoid tolls coming from Queens, but at least I don't have to look at the never-built Todt Hill Interchange while driving on the SIE. And I don't have to put up with the shitty Manhattan and Brooklyn traffic either.


roadman65

Quote from: D-Dey65 on December 26, 2019, 11:08:52 PM
Quote from: roadman65 on December 26, 2019, 10:26:13 PM
I think the article is stating that MTA is getting after WB Shunpikers.   Even myself in 1998, used the Gowanus to the Brooklyn Bridge to FDR SB though the underpass to West Street and through the tunnel to NJ to avoid the tolls coming back from Coney Island.  The article said others were doing that as well.
I just take the George Washington Bridge early in the morning. I don't avoid tolls coming from Queens, but at least I don't have to look at the never-built Todt Hill Interchange while driving on the SIE. And I don't have to put up with the shitty Manhattan and Brooklyn traffic either.


Yeah the never built Richmond Parkway extension that is a shame it never got done.  It would make getting from Brooklyn to the Jersey Shore much easier if it had been completed.
Every day is a winding road, you just got to get used to it.

Sheryl Crowe

D-Dey65

New Question; Is Region 10 turning more of Montauk Highway over to Suffolk County, or was that a signage error I saw at the east end of Suffolk CR 50?



PHLBOS

Quote from: SignBridge on December 26, 2019, 04:09:58 PMI'm guessing that when the PA goes cashless, they will toll in both directions again, as it will be relatively simple to erect overhead antennas in both directions, right?
It's possible that the P.A. could do similar to what MassDOT did when it first implemented AET for the Tobin Bridge several years ago.  Convert the existing in/citybound toll plaza into an AET gantry than convert such to 2-way tolling (add outbound gantry) later on... when all the remaining tolled-harbor crossings were converted to AET.
GPS does NOT equal GOD

lstone19

Quote from: cl94 on December 26, 2019, 05:33:31 PM
Since New York has a controlling interest in all three Hudson River bridge authorities, it's probably going to be an "all or nothing" thing. Either everything over the Hudson will go bidirectional or nothing will (minus the Castleton-On-Hudson Bridge, which is bidirectional but hidden in the ticket system).

Those of us old enough to remember when they went to eastbound tolls may remember that all three (PA, NYTA, and NYBA) changed at the same time. It's been almost 50 years since then.

cl94

Quote from: D-Dey65 on January 02, 2020, 12:37:16 PM
New Question; Is Region 10 turning more of Montauk Highway over to Suffolk County, or was that a signage error I saw at the east end of Suffolk CR 50?

Possible (been a while since the last highway inventory came out and I don't have the patience to sort through legislation), but this may just be a case of them disregarding NY 27A EB because it ends less than a mile to the east. 27A dies at Exit 46A.
Please note: All posts represent my personal opinions and do not represent those of my employer or any of its partner agencies.

Travel Mapping (updated weekly)

SGwithADD

Quote from: Rothman on November 02, 2019, 10:02:38 PM
Quote from: kalvado on November 02, 2019, 01:42:59 PM
Quote from: Rothman on October 31, 2019, 10:42:18 PM
On Tuesday I learned that some portable VMSes in NY have cameras.
given the proliferation of cameras all over the place, I still have two questions:
1. Why only some of them?
2. Where can I view those feeds?
1) Don't know.
2) You can't.

Seems like the cameras are visible at 511 NY?

I also believe I saw a new, rather small permanent VMS replacing the portable VMS on I-81 at the NY-PA border.  It was dark and there were strong snow squalls, so I'm not 100% positive...

cl94

Quote from: SGwithADD on January 04, 2020, 10:11:33 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 02, 2019, 10:02:38 PM
Quote from: kalvado on November 02, 2019, 01:42:59 PM
Quote from: Rothman on October 31, 2019, 10:42:18 PM
On Tuesday I learned that some portable VMSes in NY have cameras.
given the proliferation of cameras all over the place, I still have two questions:
1. Why only some of them?
2. Where can I view those feeds?
1) Don't know.
2) You can't.

Seems like the cameras are visible at 511 NY?

I also believe I saw a new, rather small permanent VMS replacing the portable VMS on I-81 at the NY-PA border.  It was dark and there were strong snow squalls, so I'm not 100% positive...

The cameras shown there are not the VMS cameras. All of the cameras here are high-mounted cameras, usually at interchanges.
Please note: All posts represent my personal opinions and do not represent those of my employer or any of its partner agencies.

Travel Mapping (updated weekly)

SGwithADD

Quote from: cl94 on January 04, 2020, 10:17:18 PM
Quote from: SGwithADD on January 04, 2020, 10:11:33 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 02, 2019, 10:02:38 PM
Quote from: kalvado on November 02, 2019, 01:42:59 PM
Quote from: Rothman on October 31, 2019, 10:42:18 PM
On Tuesday I learned that some portable VMSes in NY have cameras.
given the proliferation of cameras all over the place, I still have two questions:
1. Why only some of them?
2. Where can I view those feeds?
1) Don't know.
2) You can't.

Seems like the cameras are visible at 511 NY?

I also believe I saw a new, rather small permanent VMS replacing the portable VMS on I-81 at the NY-PA border.  It was dark and there were strong snow squalls, so I'm not 100% positive...

The cameras shown there are not the VMS cameras. All of the cameras here are high-mounted cameras, usually at interchanges.

Oh my mistake.  There are a number of VMS-mounted cameras that are up (check out the Binghamton area for some of them), but they're all feeds from permanent VMSes mounted on a truss.

Rothman

Quote from: SGwithADD on January 05, 2020, 10:06:41 AM
Quote from: cl94 on January 04, 2020, 10:17:18 PM
Quote from: SGwithADD on January 04, 2020, 10:11:33 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 02, 2019, 10:02:38 PM
Quote from: kalvado on November 02, 2019, 01:42:59 PM
Quote from: Rothman on October 31, 2019, 10:42:18 PM
On Tuesday I learned that some portable VMSes in NY have cameras.
given the proliferation of cameras all over the place, I still have two questions:
1. Why only some of them?
2. Where can I view those feeds?
1) Don't know.
2) You can't.

Seems like the cameras are visible at 511 NY?

I also believe I saw a new, rather small permanent VMS replacing the portable VMS on I-81 at the NY-PA border.  It was dark and there were strong snow squalls, so I'm not 100% positive...

The cameras shown there are not the VMS cameras. All of the cameras here are high-mounted cameras, usually at interchanges.

Oh my mistake.  There are a number of VMS-mounted cameras that are up (check out the Binghamton area for some of them), but they're all feeds from permanent VMSes mounted on a truss.
Right.  I was talking about portables.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

D-Dey65

I was just doing a Google Maps/Street View scan of the Hudson Valley Rail Trail, and I discovered a stub between the northbound and southbound ramps from US 44-NY 55 @ US 9W in Highland.
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.7077048,-73.9648123,3a,75y,229.16h,84.82t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sgoj3brK_3E47pHBDlQzqKw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en
Any chance this might've been a formerly proposed spur to Vineyard Avenue?

roadwaywiz95

QuoteAny chance this might've been a formerly proposed spur to Vineyard Avenue?

This is the only surviving remnant of a temporary access road between 9W and the bridge due to a reconstruction project at this  interchange ca. 2010. When the flyover was closed/redone about 10 years ago, a temp roadway was constructed to bring the intersection to a 'T' with a temp signal. When the flyover reopened, the temp roadways were removed; this gore area is all that remains of that.
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empirestate

Quote from: roadwaywiz95 on January 12, 2020, 08:44:42 AM
QuoteAny chance this might've been a formerly proposed spur to Vineyard Avenue?

This is the only surviving remnant of a temporary access road between 9W and the bridge due to a reconstruction project at this  interchange ca. 2010. When the flyover was closed/redone about 10 years ago, a temp roadway was constructed to bring the intersection to a 'T' with a temp signal. When the flyover reopened, the temp roadways were removed; this gore area is all that remains of that.

While we're in the area, any idea why NYSBA felt the need to shave its name into the grass just west of there? (Step forward a bit in Street View, or just switch to aerial mode to see it.)

D-Dey65

Slightly OT, since I mentioned the research on the Hudson Valley Rail Trail, can anyone confirm that this caboose was a former New York, New Haven and Hartford Railroad Caboose?
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Hudson_Valley_Rail_Trail_depot.jpg

And can anybody see that sign for the HVRT on the southeast corner of NY 299 and Ulster CR 22?
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.7378821,-74.0367109,3a,15y,152.37h,90.44t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1smZsYqQfVyLyMyntWncx4XQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en


roadman

#4595
Quote from: D-Dey65 on January 14, 2020, 11:46:01 PM
Slightly OT, since I mentioned the research on the Hudson Valley Rail Trail, can anyone confirm that this caboose was a former New York, New Haven and Hartford Railroad Caboose?
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Hudson_Valley_Rail_Trail_depot.jp

I can't say with absolute certainty, but it is highly likely that this is a former New Haven Railroad NE-2 class caboose.  The Pennsylvania's N5 N6 class cabooses were similar, but not identical, in design.  If it is a N5 N6, and not a NE-2,  the roof should have evidence of mounting points for the PRR induction train antennas originally affixed to the N5s N6s.

corrected PRR caboose class - thanks Roadgeek Adam for the clarification. 
"And ninety-five is the route you were on.  It was not the speed limit sign."  - Jim Croce (from Speedball Tucker)

"My life has been a tapestry
Of years of roads and highway signs" (with apologies to Carole King and Tom Rush)

Roadgeek Adam

Quote from: roadman on January 15, 2020, 12:20:21 PM
Quote from: D-Dey65 on January 14, 2020, 11:46:01 PM
Slightly OT, since I mentioned the research on the Hudson Valley Rail Trail, can anyone confirm that this caboose was a former New York, New Haven and Hartford Railroad Caboose?
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Hudson_Valley_Rail_Trail_depot.jp

I can't say with absolute certainty, but it is highly likely that this is a former New Haven Railroad NE-2 class caboose.  The Pennsylvania's N5 class cabooses were similar, but not identical, in design.  If it is a N5, and not a NE-2,  the roof should have evidence of mounting points for the PRR induction train antennas originally affixed to the N5s.

That's a 1915 N6C Pennsy caboose. N5s had round windows, N6s had the square windows like that one does.
Adam Seth Moss
M.A. History, Western Illinois University 2015-17
B.A. History, Montclair State University 2013-15
A.A. History & Education - Middlesex (County) College 2009-13

dgolub

Quote from: cl94 on January 02, 2020, 06:38:56 PM
Quote from: D-Dey65 on January 02, 2020, 12:37:16 PM
New Question; Is Region 10 turning more of Montauk Highway over to Suffolk County, or was that a signage error I saw at the east end of Suffolk CR 50?

Possible (been a while since the last highway inventory came out and I don't have the patience to sort through legislation), but this may just be a case of them disregarding NY 27A EB because it ends less than a mile to the east. 27A dies at Exit 46A.

What did the signage say?  My guess is that it's probably a sign goof.  I was past the eastern terminus of NY 27A a few months ago, and at least of then the signage hadn't changed.

D-Dey65

Quote from: dgolub on January 18, 2020, 08:43:08 AM
Quote from: cl94 on January 02, 2020, 06:38:56 PM
Quote from: D-Dey65 on January 02, 2020, 12:37:16 PM
New Question; Is Region 10 turning more of Montauk Highway over to Suffolk County, or was that a signage error I saw at the east end of Suffolk CR 50?

Possible (been a while since the last highway inventory came out and I don't have the patience to sort through legislation), but this may just be a case of them disregarding NY 27A EB because it ends less than a mile to the east. 27A dies at Exit 46A.

What did the signage say?  My guess is that it's probably a sign goof.  I was past the eastern terminus of NY 27A a few months ago, and at least of then the signage hadn't changed.
It said "JCT CR 27A Suffolk."

cl94

Quote from: D-Dey65 on January 19, 2020, 12:40:30 AM
It said "JCT CR 27A Suffolk."

Yeah, that's definitely an error. The county section of Montauk Highway is CR 85.
Please note: All posts represent my personal opinions and do not represent those of my employer or any of its partner agencies.

Travel Mapping (updated weekly)



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