News:

Thanks to everyone for the feedback on what errors you encountered from the forum database changes made in Fall 2023. Let us know if you discover anymore.

Main Menu

Infrastructure Bill 2021

Started by ITB, August 02, 2021, 05:01:59 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

kphoger

Quote from: 1 on August 13, 2021, 12:44:55 PM
  • Poor people are more likely to be overweight because healthier food costs more. That's also why they're buying junk food.

Yes, thank you!  As a general rule, fit and trim people tend to be eating healthier food than fat people, and eating healthy costs more.




As for the poverty line, I agree that it is artificially high in this country.  (Note that there are countless "poverty lines", depending on which agency is making the definitions.)  As for fast food workers, wages around here average about $8.50 per hour–which isn't super low for a starting position at an unskilled job.  However, considering that almost everyone would answer "fast food" if you asked them what one job they would never take, it does seem a shame they don't make more money than that.

Yes, some people are not looking for work because they've gotten a bunch of cash from Uncle Sam this year.  People who don't believe that either (1) need to meet more poor people or (2) need to get some common sense.  Of course, that's always been the case with unemployment benefits too.  But making it so nobody takes advantage of the system would take a much higher level of precision than government agencies can afford to have.  Better to have a decent benefit system that some people take advantage of than an insufficient one that prevents such from happening.

What does this have to do with the infrastructure bill, again?  Oh, yeah, that's right:

1.  (Rothman) The government gives a big wad of cash to the DOTs.
2.  (Rothman) The DOTs now have more money than they have projects ready to spend it on.
3.  (triplemultiplex) The DOTs should hire more staff and contractors to get through projects faster.
4.  (hbelkins) The DOTs are having a hard time hiring people because people are still living off Uncle Sam's fun-checks.

Well, that does seem like a bit of a dilemma (if true), but how much longer will the situation remain as it is?
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.


Avalanchez71

So how many contractors are lined up with their hands out?

Scott5114

Quote from: kphoger on August 13, 2021, 02:36:11 PM
1.  (Rothman) The government gives a big wad of cash to the DOTs.
2.  (Rothman) The DOTs now have more money than they have projects ready to spend it on.
3.  (triplemultiplex) The DOTs should hire more staff and contractors to get through projects faster.
4.  (hbelkins) The DOTs are having a hard time hiring people because people are still living off Uncle Sam's fun-checks.

Well, that does seem like a bit of a dilemma (if true), but how much longer will the situation remain as it is?

Where the "people are still living off Uncle Sam's fun-checks" line of reasoning breaks down, though, is that I would expect someone with the credentials necessary to get a DOT job could probably use those credentials to make way more money actually working, either for the DOT or in the private sector, than they would sitting at home on benefits.

Which means that either the DOT is really competing with the private sector and losing, or people aren't motivated by money anymore. The former means that public sector jobs need to boost their salary and benefits to compete on a more equal level. The latter means that capitalism as a whole is breaking down, which is something that can't be fixed by an infrastructure bill, no matter how many trillions of dollars you put in it.

Quote from: Avalanchez71 on August 13, 2021, 02:42:42 PM
So how many contractors are lined up with their hands out?

4d12 + 2.
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

Rothman

Right, it's not Uncle Sam's fun money that is causing the lack of recruitment into the public sector for CDLs and PEs.  Public sector wages and benefits are no longer competitive with the private sector.  Has nothing to do with minimum wage earners.

That said, contractors and consultants are having a hard time keeping up with their contract work.  Seems to be a shortage of competent managers (NYSDOT has been DQ-ing a lot of bids lately, it seems) and qualified candidates. 

Could be very interesting if States decide to dump more work on consultants to get preliminary engineering done.  Might slow down the work due to the procurement processes in place.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

JoePCool14

#104
Quote from: 1 on August 13, 2021, 12:44:55 PM

       
  • Poor people are more likely to be overweight because healthier food costs more. That's also why they're buying junk food.

Uh, what? You're telling me that poor people have no choice but to eat McDonald's all day long?

You know what's cheaper than drinking juice, soda, or beer? Drinking water. You do not have to drink sugary drinks. Even if you do go to a fast food joint and you get a cup with a meal. Just ask for water.

You're also implying that all fruits and vegetables are prohibitably expensive and that's just flat-out false. You can get half a dozen bananas for a buck or two. Even when it comes to meat, there are cheaper options that aren't as expensive. You don't have to go and buy a t-bone or filet mignon steak. You could buy a package of frozen burgers or chicken. Eggs are also fairly cheap and easy to cook. You can get a dozen for a couple dollars there too.

There's also the idea of simply... eating less which will automatically help lose weight and help save money. I shouldn't have to explain this one.

The problem is that some (key word here) people are just chronically poor. They are unable to hold jobs, unable to learn good financial practices, and unable to control themselves when it comes to their diet and other habits. In these cases, there's a reason they are poor, and it's their own fault (or the fault of some sort of disability), and it's likely they will never, ever change. Others will recognize their poverty, make changes to their lifestyle, save up money, and try to move themselves up out of poverty.

:) Needs more... :sombrero: Not quite... :bigass: Perfect.
JDOT: We make the world a better place to drive.
Travel Mapping | 60+ Clinches | 260+ Traveled | 8000+ Miles Logged

Flint1979

Quote from: JoePCool14 on August 14, 2021, 08:43:48 AM
Quote from: 1 on August 13, 2021, 12:44:55 PM

       
  • Poor people are more likely to be overweight because healthier food costs more. That's also why they're buying junk food.

Uh, what? You're telling me that poor people have no choice but to eat McDonald's all day long?

You know what's cheaper than drinking juice, soda, or beer? Drinking water. You do not have to drink sugary drinks. Even if you do go to a fast food joint and you get a cup with a meal. Just ask for water.

You're also implying that all fruits and vegetables are prohibitably expensive and that's just flat-out false. You can get half a dozen bananas for a buck or two. Even when it comes to meat, there are cheaper options that aren't as expensive. You don't have to go and buy a t-bone or filet mignon steak. You could buy a package of frozen burgers or chicken. Eggs are also fairly cheap and easy to cook. You can get a dozen for a couple dollars there too.

There's also the idea of simply... eating less which will automatically help lose weight and help save money. I shouldn't have to explain this one.

The problem is that some (key word here) people are just chronically poor. They are unable to hold jobs, unable to learn good financial practices, and unable to control themselves when it comes to their diet and other habits. In these cases, there's a reason they are poor, and it's their own fault (or the fault of some sort of disability), and it's likely they will never, ever change. Others will recognize their poverty, make changes to their lifestyle, save up money, and try to move themselves up out of poverty.
I drink pop because I like it but man I love drinking water more often. Last night I wanted a pop but got water instead. It's healthier.

Rothman

Quote from: JoePCool14 on August 14, 2021, 08:43:48 AM
Quote from: 1 on August 13, 2021, 12:44:55 PM

  • Poor people are more likely to be overweight because healthier food costs more. That's also why they're buying junk food.

Uh, what? You're telling me that poor people have no choice but to eat McDonald's all day long?

You know what's cheaper than drinking juice, soda, or beer? Drinking water. You do not have to drink sugary drinks. Even if you do go to a fast food joint and you get a cup with a meal. Just ask for water.

You're also implying that all fruits and vegetables are prohibitably expensive and that's just flat-out false. You can get half a dozen bananas for a buck or two. Even when it comes to meat, there are cheaper options that aren't as expensive. You don't have to go and buy a t-bone or filet mignon steak. You could buy a package of frozen burgers or chicken. Eggs are also fairly cheap and easy to cook. You can get a dozen for a couple dollars there too.

There's also the idea of simply... eating less which will automatically help lose weight and help save money. I shouldn't have to explain this one.

The problem is that some (key word here) people are just chronically poor. They are unable to hold jobs, unable to learn good financial practices, and unable to control themselves when it comes to their diet and other habits. In these cases, there's a reason they are poor, and it's their own fault (or the fault of some sort of disability), and it's likely they will never, ever change. Others will recognize their poverty, make changes to their lifestyle, save up money, and try to move themselves up out of poverty.
Eating McDonald's isn't the only way of getting fat. 

Eating healthy can not only be expensive, but time-consuming.  When you're working two jobs, spending an hour cooking just isn't going to happen.  So, you go the convenient route and end up eating more processed, somewhat ready to go meals -- stuff that takes minutes that is less healthy.

And that is why obesity is not only a poor people's problem and a third of Americans are prediabetic.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

Flint1979

Quote from: Rothman on August 14, 2021, 09:11:02 AM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on August 14, 2021, 08:43:48 AM
Quote from: 1 on August 13, 2021, 12:44:55 PM

  • Poor people are more likely to be overweight because healthier food costs more. That's also why they're buying junk food.

Uh, what? You're telling me that poor people have no choice but to eat McDonald's all day long?

You know what's cheaper than drinking juice, soda, or beer? Drinking water. You do not have to drink sugary drinks. Even if you do go to a fast food joint and you get a cup with a meal. Just ask for water.

You're also implying that all fruits and vegetables are prohibitably expensive and that's just flat-out false. You can get half a dozen bananas for a buck or two. Even when it comes to meat, there are cheaper options that aren't as expensive. You don't have to go and buy a t-bone or filet mignon steak. You could buy a package of frozen burgers or chicken. Eggs are also fairly cheap and easy to cook. You can get a dozen for a couple dollars there too.

There's also the idea of simply... eating less which will automatically help lose weight and help save money. I shouldn't have to explain this one.

The problem is that some (key word here) people are just chronically poor. They are unable to hold jobs, unable to learn good financial practices, and unable to control themselves when it comes to their diet and other habits. In these cases, there's a reason they are poor, and it's their own fault (or the fault of some sort of disability), and it's likely they will never, ever change. Others will recognize their poverty, make changes to their lifestyle, save up money, and try to move themselves up out of poverty.
Eating McDonald's isn't the only way of getting fat. 

Eating healthy can not only be expensive, but time-consuming.  When you're working two jobs, spending an hour cooking just isn't going to happen.  So, you go the convenient route and end up eating more processed, somewhat ready to go meals -- stuff that takes minutes that is less healthy.

And that is why obesity is not only a poor people's problem and a third of Americans are prediabetic.
Yeah like my families restaurant here in Saginaw. It's not the best food for you but it tastes good and that's what people go for I think is how it tastes and everything. And then having probably the most popular restaurant in Saginaw helps too but that don't have nothing to do with healthy eating it's not healthy I'll say that but I'll never discourage anyone from eating there.

Rothman

Quote from: Flint1979 on August 14, 2021, 09:19:21 AM
Quote from: Rothman on August 14, 2021, 09:11:02 AM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on August 14, 2021, 08:43:48 AM
Quote from: 1 on August 13, 2021, 12:44:55 PM

  • Poor people are more likely to be overweight because healthier food costs more. That's also why they're buying junk food.

Uh, what? You're telling me that poor people have no choice but to eat McDonald's all day long?

You know what's cheaper than drinking juice, soda, or beer? Drinking water. You do not have to drink sugary drinks. Even if you do go to a fast food joint and you get a cup with a meal. Just ask for water.

You're also implying that all fruits and vegetables are prohibitably expensive and that's just flat-out false. You can get half a dozen bananas for a buck or two. Even when it comes to meat, there are cheaper options that aren't as expensive. You don't have to go and buy a t-bone or filet mignon steak. You could buy a package of frozen burgers or chicken. Eggs are also fairly cheap and easy to cook. You can get a dozen for a couple dollars there too.

There's also the idea of simply... eating less which will automatically help lose weight and help save money. I shouldn't have to explain this one.

The problem is that some (key word here) people are just chronically poor. They are unable to hold jobs, unable to learn good financial practices, and unable to control themselves when it comes to their diet and other habits. In these cases, there's a reason they are poor, and it's their own fault (or the fault of some sort of disability), and it's likely they will never, ever change. Others will recognize their poverty, make changes to their lifestyle, save up money, and try to move themselves up out of poverty.
Eating McDonald's isn't the only way of getting fat. 

Eating healthy can not only be expensive, but time-consuming.  When you're working two jobs, spending an hour cooking just isn't going to happen.  So, you go the convenient route and end up eating more processed, somewhat ready to go meals -- stuff that takes minutes that is less healthy.

And that is why obesity is not only a poor people's problem and a third of Americans are prediabetic.
Yeah like my families restaurant here in Saginaw. It's not the best food for you but it tastes good and that's what people go for I think is how it tastes and everything. And then having probably the most popular restaurant in Saginaw helps too but that don't have nothing to do with healthy eating it's not healthy I'll say that but I'll never discourage anyone from eating there.
Heh.  That's a fun conflict of interest. :D
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

JoePCool14

Quote from: Rothman on August 14, 2021, 09:11:02 AM
Eating McDonald's isn't the only way of getting fat. 

Eating healthy can not only be expensive, but time-consuming.  When you're working two jobs, spending an hour cooking just isn't going to happen.  So, you go the convenient route and end up eating more processed, somewhat ready to go meals -- stuff that takes minutes that is less healthy.

And that is why obesity is not only a poor people's problem and a third of Americans are prediabetic.

I knew someone was going to bring up time to cook! I didn't feel like addressing it in my last reply (I'm lazy too sometimes). It's a valid point. There are things that take less cook time - or no cook time in the case of fruit or a simple sandwich - but again, that can take some know-how and more importantly the will to go that route.

So at the end of the day, it's the same problem. You have to have the will to eat better but still within your means of time and money.

:) Needs more... :sombrero: Not quite... :bigass: Perfect.
JDOT: We make the world a better place to drive.
Travel Mapping | 60+ Clinches | 260+ Traveled | 8000+ Miles Logged

Rothman

Quote from: JoePCool14 on August 14, 2021, 09:25:01 AM
Quote from: Rothman on August 14, 2021, 09:11:02 AM
Eating McDonald's isn't the only way of getting fat. 

Eating healthy can not only be expensive, but time-consuming.  When you're working two jobs, spending an hour cooking just isn't going to happen.  So, you go the convenient route and end up eating more processed, somewhat ready to go meals -- stuff that takes minutes that is less healthy.

And that is why obesity is not only a poor people's problem and a third of Americans are prediabetic.

I knew someone was going to bring up time to cook! I didn't feel like addressing it in my last reply (I'm lazy too sometimes). It's a valid point. There are things that take less cook time - or no cook time in the case of fruit or a simple sandwich - but again, that can take some know-how and more importantly the will to go that route.

So at the end of the day, it's the same problem. You have to have the will to eat better but still within your means of time and money.
This kind of preaching smells of someome who needs some expsoure to the other side of life.  I've been poor and have tried to help a decent number of poor people through church service.  Life and diet just isn't this simple for a whole lot of people.  The pressures and circumstances are just too nuanced.

The only answer is to control the supply rather than the demand. :D
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

Mapmikey

Quote from: JoePCool14 on August 14, 2021, 09:25:01 AM
Quote from: Rothman on August 14, 2021, 09:11:02 AM
Eating McDonald's isn't the only way of getting fat. 

Eating healthy can not only be expensive, but time-consuming.  When you're working two jobs, spending an hour cooking just isn't going to happen.  So, you go the convenient route and end up eating more processed, somewhat ready to go meals -- stuff that takes minutes that is less healthy.

And that is why obesity is not only a poor people's problem and a third of Americans are prediabetic.

I knew someone was going to bring up time to cook! I didn't feel like addressing it in my last reply (I'm lazy too sometimes). It's a valid point. There are things that take less cook time - or no cook time in the case of fruit or a simple sandwich - but again, that can take some know-how and more importantly the will to go that route.

So at the end of the day, it's the same problem. You have to have the will to eat better but still within your means of time and money.

Hoping as you age you will learn both nuance and empathy.

Next time you're in an impoverished area, rural or urban, try to find a large grocery store that sells fruits and vegetables at the prices you indicate are available.  Then go to the convenience store or rural market that actually does exist and see how much more expensive everything is.  The local fast food eatery is often cheaper.  Google the term 'food desert' sometime.

So maybe they should just travel to where the cheaper groceries exist?  Sure.  Ever done grocery shopping on a bus (assuming there is one) for a family of 4?  How often would you have to go shopping to make that work?

Save money so you won't be poor anymore.  Why didn't they think of that?  When you are near the bottom of the economic ladder, the amount you can put away is pretty small.  So that strategy can only work at all if (and it would still take quite a while):  nobody in your family EVER needs to visit a doctor and you definitely can't need an ambulance; if you happen to have a car (as you would have to in a rural area) it can't ever need repair and you can't ever be involved in an accident (your fault or not); none of your appliances ever go bad; nothing bad ever happens to whatever structure you live in; you never lose the job(s) you have out of the blue.  These things are even true for people who make good money but live in a large city because housing eats up everything they make.

Yes, when talking about any sociological standard there will be some people at the bottom of that through their own choices and given we are a very large country there are enough of them to be visible.  However, there are enough people born into their economic status that it is necessary to try to be more understanding and help where possible.




Occidental Tourist

Quote from: Mapmikey on August 14, 2021, 10:00:10 AM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on August 14, 2021, 09:25:01 AM
Quote from: Rothman on August 14, 2021, 09:11:02 AM
Eating McDonald's isn't the only way of getting fat. 

Eating healthy can not only be expensive, but time-consuming.  When you're working two jobs, spending an hour cooking just isn't going to happen.  So, you go the convenient route and end up eating more processed, somewhat ready to go meals -- stuff that takes minutes that is less healthy.

And that is why obesity is not only a poor people's problem and a third of Americans are prediabetic.

I knew someone was going to bring up time to cook! I didn't feel like addressing it in my last reply (I'm lazy too sometimes). It's a valid point. There are things that take less cook time - or no cook time in the case of fruit or a simple sandwich - but again, that can take some know-how and more importantly the will to go that route.

So at the end of the day, it's the same problem. You have to have the will to eat better but still within your means of time and money.

Hoping as you age you will learn both nuance and empathy.

Next time you're in an impoverished area, rural or urban, try to find a large grocery store that sells fruits and vegetables at the prices you indicate are available.  Then go to the convenience store or rural market that actually does exist and see how much more expensive everything is.  The local fast food eatery is often cheaper.  Google the term 'food desert' sometime.

So maybe they should just travel to where the cheaper groceries exist?  Sure.  Ever done grocery shopping on a bus (assuming there is one) for a family of 4?  How often would you have to go shopping to make that work?

Save money so you won't be poor anymore.  Why didn't they think of that?  When you are near the bottom of the economic ladder, the amount you can put away is pretty small.  So that strategy can only work at all if (and it would still take quite a while):  nobody in your family EVER needs to visit a doctor and you definitely can't need an ambulance; if you happen to have a car (as you would have to in a rural area) it can't ever need repair and you can't ever be involved in an accident (your fault or not); none of your appliances ever go bad; nothing bad ever happens to whatever structure you live in; you never lose the job(s) you have out of the blue.  These things are even true for people who make good money but live in a large city because housing eats up everything they make.

Yes, when talking about any sociological standard there will be some people at the bottom of that through their own choices and given we are a very large country there are enough of them to be visible.  However, there are enough people born into their economic status that it is necessary to try to be more understanding and help where possible.




Thank you for the lecture on empathy and nuance.  You are clearly better than all of us.  As to "food deserts"  being the cause of obesity among poorer populations, not everyone accepts the premise.
https://www.npr.org/2010/12/15/132076786/the-root-the-myth-of-the-food-desert
https://www.annualreviews.org/doi/abs/10.1146/annurev-resource-101620-080307

Scott5114

Not to mention–fresh fruits and vegetables have a tendency to go bad if you don't get around to eating them. Cheap, high-calorie processed foods like frozen dinners don't. It's reasonable for someone with only a few dollars to choose to spend them on food that is less likely to be wasted.
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

Mapmikey

The definition of a food desert includes the word "affordable"

The NPR article talks about getting healthier foods into these smaller stores that are common in big cities (which my response about bananas clearly indicates I think they are available).  Nowhere in the article does it say these items were at prices poorer people can afford.

The second article (an abstract) closes with this sentence (emphasis mine) - Therefore, from the public health perspective, policies that lower the relative price of healthy food or change the "deep parameters"  of preferences in favor of healthy food would be more appealing than eliminating food deserts.

The whole point of my response is that poor people by and large don't choose to be poor and they have more obstacles to eating healthy.  People (excluding those with medical conditions) who are OK financially are much more likely to be making intentional choices that result in being fatter than poorer people are.

Correlation does not necessarily mean causation, but of the 10 poorest states (2019 data), 9 are also the most obese (2019 data).

MS, WV, AR, OK, KY, TN, AL, MI, LA and SC are all in the 10 worst for both.

Outliers were:
49th in poverty is NM but they are mid-pack for obesity.
8th worst in obesity is MI but they are 34th in poverty.

I grew up in South Carolina...I get that if everyone deep fries everything, regardless of how healthy the food started out, that is a recipe for getting fat.

Scott5114

Speaking for rural Oklahoma...the two things that every small Oklahoma town has are a Sonic and a Dollar General, neither of which have much in the way of healthy options (Sonic's grilled chicken is good but not good enough to want to eat every single day). If you want something healthier, you may well have to drive to another county to get to a full-service grocery store Walmart. If you're poor, using the gas and time to make the drive to the grocery store may seem like a bad deal when you can just pick up some stuff at the Dollar General.
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

ilpt4u

Um...off topic much? Food/Diet habits have very little to do with the Infrastructure Bill

Bruce

Quote from: Scott5114 on August 14, 2021, 02:22:44 PM
Speaking for rural Oklahoma...the two things that every small Oklahoma town has are a Sonic and a Dollar General, neither of which have much in the way of healthy options (Sonic's grilled chicken is good but not good enough to want to eat every single day). If you want something healthier, you may well have to drive to another county to get to a full-service grocery store Walmart. If you're poor, using the gas and time to make the drive to the grocery store may seem like a bad deal when you can just pick up some stuff at the Dollar General.

The food deserts worsened by dollar chains are also becoming a huge issue in the rural Northwest. Lots of towns have lost their actual grocers, and these stores aren't mandated to provide any fresh food.

TheHighwayMan3561

Quote from: Bruce on August 14, 2021, 07:47:36 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on August 14, 2021, 02:22:44 PM
Speaking for rural Oklahoma...the two things that every small Oklahoma town has are a Sonic and a Dollar General, neither of which have much in the way of healthy options (Sonic's grilled chicken is good but not good enough to want to eat every single day). If you want something healthier, you may well have to drive to another county to get to a full-service grocery store Walmart. If you're poor, using the gas and time to make the drive to the grocery store may seem like a bad deal when you can just pick up some stuff at the Dollar General.

The food deserts worsened by dollar chains are also becoming a huge issue in the rural Northwest. Lots of towns have lost their actual grocers, and these stores aren't mandated to provide any fresh food.

That's largely become a nationwide issue in general. I've heard all kinds of horror stories of DG contributing to rural grocery stores going out of business and I see them in far too many places. Two North Shore towns in MN chased DG out when they wanted to build there.
self-certified as the dumbest person on this board for 5 years running

hbelkins

Back to the "staffing up" comment ... there was legitimate concern at KYTC that we didn't have enough inspectors to cover the regular projects we had going when the Mountain Parkway widening began. They've borrowed personnel from some of the other section offices to cover (we have people assigned to the Estill-Powell county section working in Morgan and Magoffin, which is an entirely different section office) but have also started using contracted inspectors, frequently referred to as "rent-a-techs."


Government would be tolerable if not for politicians and bureaucrats.

Rothman

Quote from: hbelkins on August 15, 2021, 11:41:35 PM
Back to the "staffing up" comment ... there was legitimate concern at KYTC that we didn't have enough inspectors to cover the regular projects we had going when the Mountain Parkway widening began. They've borrowed personnel from some of the other section offices to cover (we have people assigned to the Estill-Powell county section working in Morgan and Magoffin, which is an entirely different section office) but have also started using contracted inspectors, frequently referred to as "rent-a-techs."
Inspectors for construction?  NYSDOT is probably way ahead of KYTC in contracting that out, for better or for worse.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

Flint1979

Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on August 14, 2021, 07:56:02 PM
Quote from: Bruce on August 14, 2021, 07:47:36 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on August 14, 2021, 02:22:44 PM
Speaking for rural Oklahoma...the two things that every small Oklahoma town has are a Sonic and a Dollar General, neither of which have much in the way of healthy options (Sonic's grilled chicken is good but not good enough to want to eat every single day). If you want something healthier, you may well have to drive to another county to get to a full-service grocery store Walmart. If you're poor, using the gas and time to make the drive to the grocery store may seem like a bad deal when you can just pick up some stuff at the Dollar General.

The food deserts worsened by dollar chains are also becoming a huge issue in the rural Northwest. Lots of towns have lost their actual grocers, and these stores aren't mandated to provide any fresh food.

That's largely become a nationwide issue in general. I've heard all kinds of horror stories of DG contributing to rural grocery stores going out of business and I see them in far too many places. Two North Shore towns in MN chased DG out when they wanted to build there.
Yeah Dollar General's are EVERYWHERE. I mean you could be driving along and thinking man I'm really in the middle of nowhere and bam there's a Dollar General.

hotdogPi

Clinched, minus I-93 (I'm missing a few miles and my file is incorrect)

Traveled, plus US 13, 44, and 50, and several state routes

I will be in Burlington VT for the eclipse.

Avalanchez71

Quote from: ilpt4u on August 14, 2021, 02:38:01 PM
Um...off topic much? Food/Diet habits have very little to do with the Infrastructure Bill

The heavier folks are equates to more weight on roads and bridges.

hotdogPi

Wear is proportional to the fourth power of the weight.

An average car weighs 2,871 pounds.
(2871+250×4)⁴ / (2871+100×4)⁴ = 1.96: not insignificant, but that's for four people at 250 lb vs. 100 lb, which is the maximum reasonable case.

However, compare this to pickup truck vs. regular car.

6000⁴ / 2871⁴ = 19 times as much wear, and unlike semis, pickup trucks aren't limited in which roads or lanes they can use.
Clinched, minus I-93 (I'm missing a few miles and my file is incorrect)

Traveled, plus US 13, 44, and 50, and several state routes

I will be in Burlington VT for the eclipse.



Opinions expressed here on belong solely to the poster and do not represent or reflect the opinions or beliefs of AARoads, its creators and/or associates.