The Verazzano Narrows Bridge Tolls issue

[Roadgeek Adam]

As many New Yorkers and New Jerseyans know, the absolutely nuts toll at the Verrazanno is $11.00, basically double fare for the 1-way tolling. There recently has been in the grapevine even MORE toll hikes. The first source, straight from the MTA, goes for $12.00 toll, basically a $1 raise. However today I came about of http://tarrytown.patch.com/articles/mta-hears-more-objections-to-fare-hike-plan , which considers the fact that there would be a possible $17.00 toll. I mean, even now, crossing would be easier if they had tried reinstating the closed toll booths they are now tearing down. Those haven't been used in 23 years, if you can believe it. This is also becoming a serious political issue, because basically we're slamming Staten Island residents with a $12-17 crossover. Thoughts?

http://www.silive.com/news/index.ssf/2010/09/gop_gubernatorial_hopeful_call.html

The last time I've heard of tolls this high for a bridge was the proposed Rye-Oyster Bay Tunnel, which would have been $25.00, which in itself is nuts.

[oscar]

The last time I've heard of tolls this high for a bridge was the proposed Rye-Oyster Bay Tunnel, which would have been $25.00, which in itself is nuts.

The Confederation Bridge, between New Brunswick and Prince Edward Island, has a much higher toll (currently C$42.50 for cars).  It's charged only westbound, as if to say you really should hang around a little longer on PEI.

[exit322]

Well, a C$42.50 stick guarantees that if we ever go there, we're staying on PEI until we leave...

[agentsteel53]

Well, a C$42.50 stick guarantees that if we ever go there, we're staying on PEI until we leave...

actually, the laws of mathematics guarantee that.  you will leave PEI at the precise moment that you leave, and not before then.  until that time, you will have stayed.

[dfilpus]

The Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel charges $12 each way, with a discounted $5 return within twenty four hours.

[myosh_tino]

$12 to cross a bridge! 

...and people out here are whining about bridge tolls in the San Francisco Bay Area which recently were increased to $5 or $6 depending on which bridge you cross.  Kinda puts things in perspective.

This is also becoming a serious political issue, because basically we're slamming Staten Island residents with a $12-17 crossover.

The Golden Gate Bridge in San Francisco is facing the same issue every time they raise the tolls (currently at $6) with the main complaint being "it penalizes those commuting in from Marin County".

[papaT10932]

The thing that most outsiders don't realize about the NY crossings is that they are primarily used by commuters to get from borough to borough. Most crossings connect one borough of the city to another, so crossing the Verrazano Bridge to get from Staten Island to Brooklyn should not be considered the same as crossing the ENTIRE Chesapeake Bay!
Hypothetically, imagine living in New Jersey and having a job in Brooklyn. Add the Goethals's or the Bayonne's 8 dollar toll and the Verrazano's 11 dollar toll. That's 19 dollars a day, 95 dollars a week, and about 4,940 dollars a year!! JUST TO CROSS THE NECESSARY BRIDGES!
P.S. I didn't include the NJ Turnpike's tolls or the cost of gas).

[myosh_tino]

The thing that most outsiders don't realize about the NY crossings is that they are primarily used by commuters to get from borough to borough. Most crossings connect one borough of the city to another, so crossing the Verrazano Bridge to get from Staten Island to Brooklyn should not be considered the same as crossing the ENTIRE Chesapeake Bay!

So can it be safe to say that the bridges in the San Francisco Bay Area are akin to the bridges in the New York/New Jersey area?  If so, then the difference in tolls is pretty startling ($12-19 vs $5-6).  Although I have never been to the New York/New Jersey area, it is my understanding that the use of mass transit during commute hours is very high.  Is that the result of the high bridge tolls? heavy traffic? lack of parking?

[TheStranger]

The thing that most outsiders don't realize about the NY crossings is that they are primarily used by commuters to get from borough to borough. Most crossings connect one borough of the city to another, so crossing the Verrazano Bridge to get from Staten Island to Brooklyn should not be considered the same as crossing the ENTIRE Chesapeake Bay!

So can it be safe to say that the bridges in the San Francisco Bay Area are akin to the bridges in the New York/New Jersey area?  If so, then the difference in tolls is pretty startling ($12-19 vs $5-6).  Although I have never been to the New York/New Jersey area, it is my understanding that the use of mass transit during commute hours is very high.  Is that the result of the high bridge tolls? heavy traffic? lack of parking?

In the specific case of Staten Island, there are literally only four ways to get in/out of the island by car (Bayonne Bridge, Verazzano Narrows, Goethals Bridge, Outerbridge Crossing), and only one way out via mass transit (Staten Island Ferry).  To compare to SF, there are only two bridges outward (one to Marin, one to the East Bay) but there are many passages to Daly City and Brisbane on the south side.

[Roadgeek Adam]

The Goethals, Outerbridge and Bayonne are $8 a piece and run by the Port Authority of NY-NJ. The Verazanno is $11. The Triborough (not the RFK) Bridge is $5.50, along with the Whitestone Bridge, and Throgs Neck, which are run by the MTA Bridges and Tunnels. The Henry Hudson Bridge is $4.00 - although I am not sure who maintains it

[papaT10932]

The Goethals, Outerbridge and Bayonne are $8 a piece and run by the Port Authority of NY-NJ. The Verazanno is $11. The Triborough (not the RFK) Bridge is $5.50, along with the Whitestone Bridge, and Throgs Neck, which are run by the MTA Bridges and Tunnels. The Henry Hudson Bridge is $4.00 - although I am not sure who maintains it

The Triborough, Whitestone, Throgs Neck, and Henry Hudson etc are maintained by the MTA/TBTA. Keep in mind, however, that the 5.50 tolls that you mentioned are for each direction. For a round trip on the Whitestone, Triborough etc., the final cost is 11 dollars.

[Duke87]

The Verazanno was switched years ago from being $5.50 each way to being $11.00 both ways (although, if you have a New York EZPass, you only pay $9.14 off-peak) in order to be consistent with the Bayonne, Goethals, and Outerbridge: toll is payed entering the island, not leaving. $11 to cross a bridge seem steep? Yeah, well, welcome to New York. Cost of living is high around here.

Besides, $11 a day (or $12 a day) of tolls associated with commuting isn't something I'd sneeze at. A monthly pass on Metro-North from Noroton Heights to Grand Central sets me back $264, parking at the station is $3 a day. That works out to about $16.20 per day. Which is peanuts compared to the difference in the price of real estate between the city and the suburbs. Remember, we're talking about the city that the UN decided to investigate for human rights violations on account of the lack of affordable housing.

[Revive 755]

There's not a chart out there showing the costs of tolls versus the cost of actually building the bridges?

Where is the Verazzano toll money going anyway, mass transit on Manhattan?  I could see another toll increase - or the currently high toll - if the Verazzano was going to get a major rehab, replacement, or a companion/reliever span, but right now this just sounds like extortion to me.

[Duke87]

Where is the Verazzano toll money going anyway, mass transit on Manhattan? 

Pretty much. The Bridges and Tunnels division is the only MTA division that actually turns a profit. That profit is in turn used to help subsidize their other divisions (NYC Subway, NYC Bus, Long Island Bus, (Express) Bus, Metro-North Railroad, Long Island Railroad) which all operate at a considerable loss.

[froggie]

To be fair, it's hard to imagine the traffic mess into the city that would exist if the LIRR and Metro-North didn't exist.

[Roadgeek Adam]

Metro-North and the LIRR are pretty good, albeit rail never makes a profit. - The buses drive me nuts, but the situation even the 80s, eh was horrible. Buses catching fire, losing parts, etc. The bridge, which I was on ironically today, is only 46 years old. Its got years. Also its the only bridge where people don't want people with cameras. Also, 8 of the 11 tollbooths are gone btw, (the ones unused for 23 years). Its really an annoyance. I hate to ask what EZ Pass would be with $17 tolls for cash.

[Michael in Philly]

Both my parents grew up on Staten Island, and I still have relatives there for whom the Verrazano in particular is (as you can imagine) a major, major grievance.

That said, I thought Staten Islanders got a steep discount for the Verrazano?

[Scott5114]

Well, a C$42.50 stick guarantees that if we ever go there, we're staying on PEI until we leave...

actually, the laws of mathematics guarantee that.  you will leave PEI at the precise moment that you leave, and not before then.  until that time, you will have stayed.

The tautology club is going to take a field trip to Prince Edward Island. They intend to arrive when they arrive and will stay until they leave.

[SteveG1988]

The bay bridge tunnel is actually a fairly reasonable price for what it is, a large shortcut around DC for travelers on the delmarva penisula. 23 miles, for 12 bucks is reasonable. Supposedly the most expensive toll road, in cost per mile is I-95 in delaware. the "delaware turnpike" costs 3.00 to go 11 miles on I-95. 26.8 cents per mile, Compared to the NJ turnpike's 9.05 to drive 113 miles (8 cents per mile) Or the PA turnpikes 29.35 to go 358 miles (8 cents per mile as well). to go through delaware southbound costs six bucks if you come from new jersey, 3 bucks for the bridge, 3 bucks for the turnpike. This fares better than northbound I-95 from MD where you pay five dollars for the JFK memorial highway, and the three dollar DE turnpike toll.

[Michael in Philly]

The bay bridge tunnel is actually a fairly reasonable price for what it is, a large shortcut around DC for travelers on the delmarva penisula. 23 miles, for 12 bucks is reasonable. Supposedly the most expensive toll road, in cost per mile is I-95 in delaware. the "delaware turnpike" costs 3.00 to go 11 miles on I-95. 26.8 cents per mile, Compared to the NJ turnpike's 9.05 to drive 113 miles (8 cents per mile) Or the PA turnpikes 29.35 to go 358 miles (8 cents per mile as well). to go through delaware southbound costs six bucks if you come from new jersey, 3 bucks for the bridge, 3 bucks for the turnpike. This fares better than northbound I-95 from MD where you pay five dollars for the JFK memorial highway, and the three dollar DE turnpike toll.

That Delaware toll's easy to avoid; I only pay it if I'm in a hurry.  Maybe not even then, since the toll plaza's chronically under construction.  I believe it's $4.00 now, though.

[SteveG1988]

I think the easiest toll to avoid in NJ is the US-1 Trenton bridge, just get off and take the Business US-1 Bridge, or get on 29 North to the calhoun street bridge, and rejoin US-1 in Morrisville. it is funny how the toll bridge is right next to a free bridge, that is not hard to get to. That being said i have accidentally gone on the toll bridge when searching for US-1 North in trenton, one wrong turn after the bridge sent me there.

[froggie]

The bay bridge tunnel is actually a fairly reasonable price for what it is, a large shortcut around DC for travelers on the delmarva penisula.

Indeed, but also for travelers in Hampton Roads.  When I was living in Virginia Beach and making regular trips to Syracuse, the CBBT on average saved me 45 minutes and 80 miles over taking I-64 and I-95.  And that was WITHOUT factoring in DC/Baltimore traffic delays.

My only complaint about the CBBT is that they didn't install EZPass until after I had transferred out of Norfolk.

[SteveG1988]

Driving the CBBT can sometimes pay for itself, using the 80 miles Froggie gave me, a car that does 32mpg will use 2.5 Gallons of gas in theory, at 2.69 a gallon it will save you nearly 6 dollars.