On my Youtube channel as the secondary type of video I upload. It is videos of roads that are similar to those of FWJ and others.All in 4K. Here's one of my latest videos and I will be uploading a video of US Route 41 or one of an unmarked state road later in the week.
https://youtu.be/srZ7mq0Jh5E
Didn't you already post this? I seem to recall there was a closing comparison with how flat Illinois is compared to lewd acts at Denny's.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on October 25, 2021, 01:03:53 AM
Didn't you already post this? I seem to recall there was a closing comparison with how flat Illinois is compared to lewd acts at Denny's.
In a bumpy world, Illinois is a AA cup.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on October 25, 2021, 01:03:53 AM
Didn’t you already post this? I seem to recall there was a closing comparison with how flat Illinois is compared to lewd acts at Denny’s.
I posted it because the last thread I had was unfairly closed. In this one, I'm going to post road videos as I make them and no longer post the other dashcam videos I make.
Today at 1pm is the premiere of my video of US Route 41. A Super Four highway in Lake County commonly used as an alternative to the tristate tollway. Will it ever be built to a full freeway? Only time will tell.
https://youtu.be/ilBnTkuOCSc
Forgot to post this.... Here's a unique unmarked state highway
https://youtu.be/FJdpOquIOHo
Beautiful
The world's most beautiful drive
https://youtu.be/S5Pu7dRTDGs
Quote from: Crash_It on November 16, 2021, 06:17:32 PM
The world's most beautiful drive
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Illinois' most beautiful drive? Maybe. But I can be on 30 more beautiful drives within an hour of my house.
Quote from: jayhawkco on November 16, 2021, 06:41:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 16, 2021, 06:17:32 PM
The world's most beautiful drive
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Illinois' most beautiful drive? Maybe. But I can be on 30 more beautiful drives within an hour of my house.
Psst. This is Crash_It. Some form of this complaint has been made over and over again and he doesn't care.
Better to ignore his videos altogether.
Quote from: Rothman on November 16, 2021, 10:25:46 PM
Quote from: jayhawkco on November 16, 2021, 06:41:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 16, 2021, 06:17:32 PM
The world's most beautiful drive
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Illinois' most beautiful drive? Maybe. But I can be on 30 more beautiful drives within an hour of my house.
Psst. This is Crash_It. Some form of this complaint has been made over and over again and he doesn't care.
Better to ignore his videos altogether.
Or give it a quick thumbs down, many do.
From what I've heard about the latest episode the video is taken basically at sundown and has a heavy amount of glare. The huge ball of ionized gas coupled with massive windshield glare can be seen in the thumbnail for the video beforehand. Clearly we are not dealing with the elite of driving tour videos.
Quote from: jayhawkco on November 16, 2021, 06:41:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 16, 2021, 06:17:32 PM
The world's most beautiful drive
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Illinois' most beautiful drive? Maybe. But I can be on 30 more beautiful drives within an hour of my house.
It's what Teddy Roosevelt said
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grandview_Drive?wprov=sfla1
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 16, 2021, 10:30:04 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 16, 2021, 10:25:46 PM
Quote from: jayhawkco on November 16, 2021, 06:41:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 16, 2021, 06:17:32 PM
The world's most beautiful drive
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Illinois' most beautiful drive? Maybe. But I can be on 30 more beautiful drives within an hour of my house.
Psst. This is Crash_It. Some form of this complaint has been made over and over again and he doesn't care.
Better to ignore his videos altogether.
Or give it a quick thumbs down, many do.
From what I've heard about the latest episode the video is taken basically at sundown and has a heavy amount of glare. The huge ball of ionized gas coupled with massive windshield glare can be seen in the thumbnail for the video beforehand. Clearly we are not dealing with the elite of driving tour videos.
1) that's called a filter that I put on the freeze frame as I was making the thumbnail.
2) I wanted to capture the sunset look and see how it would blend with the fall colors.
3) you obviously didn't get too far into the video because all those issues clear up.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 16, 2021, 10:30:04 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 16, 2021, 10:25:46 PM
Quote from: jayhawkco on November 16, 2021, 06:41:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 16, 2021, 06:17:32 PM
The world's most beautiful drive
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Illinois' most beautiful drive? Maybe. But I can be on 30 more beautiful drives within an hour of my house.
Psst. This is Crash_It. Some form of this complaint has been made over and over again and he doesn't care.
Better to ignore his videos altogether.
Or give it a quick thumbs down, many do.
From what I've heard about the latest episode the video is taken basically at sundown and has a heavy amount of glare. The huge ball of ionized gas coupled with massive windshield glare can be seen in the thumbnail for the video beforehand. Clearly we are not dealing with the elite of driving tour videos.
Ah, so Crash_It is the reason YouTube is hiding dislikes!
Emphasis mine.
Quote from: JoePCool14 on November 17, 2021, 12:43:13 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 16, 2021, 10:30:04 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 16, 2021, 10:25:46 PM
Quote from: jayhawkco on November 16, 2021, 06:41:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 16, 2021, 06:17:32 PM
The world's most beautiful drive
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Illinois' most beautiful drive? Maybe. But I can be on 30 more beautiful drives within an hour of my house.
Psst. This is Crash_It. Some form of this complaint has been made over and over again and he doesn't care.
Better to ignore his videos altogether.
Or give it a quick thumbs down, many do.
From what I've heard about the latest episode the video is taken basically at sundown and has a heavy amount of glare. The huge ball of ionized gas coupled with massive windshield glare can be seen in the thumbnail for the video beforehand. Clearly we are not dealing with the elite of driving tour videos.
Ah, so Crash_It is the reason YouTube is hiding dislikes!
Emphasis mine.
To cut down on dislike attacks. My videos are no different from others in this field.
Quote from: Crash_It on November 17, 2021, 04:24:32 AM
Quote from: jayhawkco on November 16, 2021, 06:41:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 16, 2021, 06:17:32 PM
The world's most beautiful drive
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Illinois' most beautiful drive? Maybe. But I can be on 30 more beautiful drives within an hour of my house.
It's what Teddy Roosevelt said
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grandview_Drive?wprov=sfla1
I'll be the one this time to say I will let your opinion be your opinion on this and if you really think that, you do you, but I'll also state that in my own opinion, it is absolutely not the most beautiful drive, or even one I would consider adding to my own list.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on November 17, 2021, 05:36:20 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 17, 2021, 04:24:32 AM
Quote from: jayhawkco on November 16, 2021, 06:41:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 16, 2021, 06:17:32 PM
The world's most beautiful drive
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Illinois' most beautiful drive? Maybe. But I can be on 30 more beautiful drives within an hour of my house.
It's what Teddy Roosevelt said
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grandview_Drive?wprov=sfla1
I'll be the one this time to say I will let your opinion be your opinion on this and if you really think that, you do you, but I'll also state that in my own opinion, it is absolutely not the most beautiful drive, or even one I would consider adding to my own list.
It's not my opinion, I'm riding off of what Teddy Roosevelt said and
It's similar to several stretches of road in your state.
^^^
And yet the typical response you'll get is why your opinion is objectively wrong.
Quote from: Crash_It on November 17, 2021, 02:36:03 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on November 17, 2021, 12:43:13 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 16, 2021, 10:30:04 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 16, 2021, 10:25:46 PM
Quote from: jayhawkco on November 16, 2021, 06:41:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 16, 2021, 06:17:32 PM
The world's most beautiful drive
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Illinois' most beautiful drive? Maybe. But I can be on 30 more beautiful drives within an hour of my house.
Psst. This is Crash_It. Some form of this complaint has been made over and over again and he doesn't care.
Better to ignore his videos altogether.
Or give it a quick thumbs down, many do.
From what I've heard about the latest episode the video is taken basically at sundown and has a heavy amount of glare. The huge ball of ionized gas coupled with massive windshield glare can be seen in the thumbnail for the video beforehand. Clearly we are not dealing with the elite of driving tour videos.
Ah, so Crash_It is the reason YouTube is hiding dislikes!
Emphasis mine.
To cut down on dislike attacks. My videos are no different from others in this field.
Could it not be you just dug yourself an insurmountable hole in terms of having no credibility in the road world? You brought all this negative attention onto yourself by your actions and attitude towards anyone who questions the things you do.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 17, 2021, 06:04:10 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 17, 2021, 02:36:03 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on November 17, 2021, 12:43:13 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 16, 2021, 10:30:04 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 16, 2021, 10:25:46 PM
Quote from: jayhawkco on November 16, 2021, 06:41:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 16, 2021, 06:17:32 PM
The world's most beautiful drive
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Illinois' most beautiful drive? Maybe. But I can be on 30 more beautiful drives within an hour of my house.
Psst. This is Crash_It. Some form of this complaint has been made over and over again and he doesn't care.
Better to ignore his videos altogether.
Or give it a quick thumbs down, many do.
From what I've heard about the latest episode the video is taken basically at sundown and has a heavy amount of glare. The huge ball of ionized gas coupled with massive windshield glare can be seen in the thumbnail for the video beforehand. Clearly we are not dealing with the elite of driving tour videos.
Ah, so Crash_It is the reason YouTube is hiding dislikes!
Emphasis mine.
To cut down on dislike attacks. My videos are no different from others in this field.
Could it not be you just dug yourself an insurmountable hole in terms of having no credibility in the road world? You brought all this negative attention onto yourself by your actions and attitude towards anyone who questions the things you do.
We can all agree to disagree. Just because I explain and defend my actions doesn't make it a crime. I get falsely accused of things all the time. I mistook this forum as one where all dashcam videos can be shared and that was my mistake.
Quote from: Crash_It on November 17, 2021, 06:07:53 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 17, 2021, 06:04:10 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 17, 2021, 02:36:03 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on November 17, 2021, 12:43:13 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 16, 2021, 10:30:04 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 16, 2021, 10:25:46 PM
Quote from: jayhawkco on November 16, 2021, 06:41:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 16, 2021, 06:17:32 PM
The world's most beautiful drive
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Illinois' most beautiful drive? Maybe. But I can be on 30 more beautiful drives within an hour of my house.
Psst. This is Crash_It. Some form of this complaint has been made over and over again and he doesn't care.
Better to ignore his videos altogether.
Or give it a quick thumbs down, many do.
From what I've heard about the latest episode the video is taken basically at sundown and has a heavy amount of glare. The huge ball of ionized gas coupled with massive windshield glare can be seen in the thumbnail for the video beforehand. Clearly we are not dealing with the elite of driving tour videos.
Ah, so Crash_It is the reason YouTube is hiding dislikes!
Emphasis mine.
To cut down on dislike attacks. My videos are no different from others in this field.
Could it not be you just dug yourself an insurmountable hole in terms of having no credibility in the road world? You brought all this negative attention onto yourself by your actions and attitude towards anyone who questions the things you do.
We can all agree to disagree. Just because I explain and defend my actions doesn't make it a crime. I get falsely accused of things all the time. I mistook this forum as one where all dashcam videos can be shared and that was my mistake.
Just because someone "can" post videos and have "unique" opinions doesn't merit automatic prestige nor absolve of critique.
Quote from: Crash_It on November 17, 2021, 05:50:03 PM
It's not my opinion, I'm riding off of what Teddy Roosevelt said and
It's similar to several stretches of road in your state.
Uh, that's still an opinion, and I don't really care that it belongs to Teddy Roosevelt, because that makes it no more valid.
You keep missing that I have never said Minnesota is scenic. You keep coming with this attitude that I'm saying "Illinois bad, Minnesota good" because it's how you approach your own arguments. Minnesota is boring. It has two or three drives I actually enjoy, and the rest is boring. Most people would think MN 61 is boring compared to other stuff in the country.
Quote from: Crash_It on November 17, 2021, 04:24:32 AM
Quote from: jayhawkco on November 16, 2021, 06:41:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 16, 2021, 06:17:32 PM
The world's most beautiful drive
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Illinois' most beautiful drive? Maybe. But I can be on 30 more beautiful drives within an hour of my house.
It's what Teddy Roosevelt said
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grandview_Drive?wprov=sfla1
To be fair, there's a lot more scenic drives today than there were in 1910 when Teddy Roosevelt made that comment.
:sombrero:
Quote from: dlsterner on November 17, 2021, 07:58:01 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 17, 2021, 04:24:32 AM
Quote from: jayhawkco on November 16, 2021, 06:41:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 16, 2021, 06:17:32 PM
The world's most beautiful drive
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Illinois' most beautiful drive? Maybe. But I can be on 30 more beautiful drives within an hour of my house.
It's what Teddy Roosevelt said
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grandview_Drive?wprov=sfla1
To be fair, there's a lot more scenic drives today than there were in 1910 when Teddy Roosevelt made that comment.
Especially considering how much Teddy Roosevelt enjoyed hanging out in what is now National Park lands out west. I would assume those park road networks would be high on his list for scenery.
Quote from: Crash_It on November 17, 2021, 06:07:53 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 17, 2021, 06:04:10 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 17, 2021, 02:36:03 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on November 17, 2021, 12:43:13 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 16, 2021, 10:30:04 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 16, 2021, 10:25:46 PM
Quote from: jayhawkco on November 16, 2021, 06:41:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 16, 2021, 06:17:32 PM
The world's most beautiful drive
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Illinois' most beautiful drive? Maybe. But I can be on 30 more beautiful drives within an hour of my house.
Psst. This is Crash_It. Some form of this complaint has been made over and over again and he doesn't care.
Better to ignore his videos altogether.
Or give it a quick thumbs down, many do.
From what I've heard about the latest episode the video is taken basically at sundown and has a heavy amount of glare. The huge ball of ionized gas coupled with massive windshield glare can be seen in the thumbnail for the video beforehand. Clearly we are not dealing with the elite of driving tour videos.
Ah, so Crash_It is the reason YouTube is hiding dislikes!
Emphasis mine.
To cut down on dislike attacks. My videos are no different from others in this field.
Could it not be you just dug yourself an insurmountable hole in terms of having no credibility in the road world? You brought all this negative attention onto yourself by your actions and attitude towards anyone who questions the things you do.
We can all agree to disagree. Just because I explain and defend my actions doesn't make it a crime. I get falsely accused of things all the time. I mistook this forum as one where all dashcam videos can be shared and that was my mistake.
You didn't mistake it. AFAIK you are free to share any videos you like. But if you are showing videos criticizing the actions of others, it's reasonable to expect criticism of your own statements and actions.
Unless the moderators have contacted you privately and asked/told you not to share your "bad driving" videos; which, if so, is information to which the rest of us aren't privy.
Quote from: hbelkins on November 18, 2021, 08:53:49 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 17, 2021, 06:07:53 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 17, 2021, 06:04:10 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 17, 2021, 02:36:03 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on November 17, 2021, 12:43:13 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 16, 2021, 10:30:04 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 16, 2021, 10:25:46 PM
Quote from: jayhawkco on November 16, 2021, 06:41:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 16, 2021, 06:17:32 PM
The world's most beautiful drive
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Illinois' most beautiful drive? Maybe. But I can be on 30 more beautiful drives within an hour of my house.
Psst. This is Crash_It. Some form of this complaint has been made over and over again and he doesn't care.
Better to ignore his videos altogether.
Or give it a quick thumbs down, many do.
From what I've heard about the latest episode the video is taken basically at sundown and has a heavy amount of glare. The huge ball of ionized gas coupled with massive windshield glare can be seen in the thumbnail for the video beforehand. Clearly we are not dealing with the elite of driving tour videos.
Ah, so Crash_It is the reason YouTube is hiding dislikes!
Emphasis mine.
To cut down on dislike attacks. My videos are no different from others in this field.
Could it not be you just dug yourself an insurmountable hole in terms of having no credibility in the road world? You brought all this negative attention onto yourself by your actions and attitude towards anyone who questions the things you do.
We can all agree to disagree. Just because I explain and defend my actions doesn't make it a crime. I get falsely accused of things all the time. I mistook this forum as one where all dashcam videos can be shared and that was my mistake.
You didn't mistake it. AFAIK you are free to share any videos you like. But if you are showing videos criticizing the actions of others, it's reasonable to expect criticism of your own statements and actions.
Unless the moderators have contacted you privately and asked/told you not to share your "bad driving" videos; which, if so, is information to which the rest of us aren't privy.
Also, having a clear illogical disdain for out of state drivers (particularly Wisconsin) doesn't exactly lend itself well towards having people take the OP seriously. Example; your latest video title clearly shows a dislike for Michigan drivers.
I'll stay out of this one. Have at him.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 18, 2021, 10:24:45 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on November 18, 2021, 08:53:49 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 17, 2021, 06:07:53 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 17, 2021, 06:04:10 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 17, 2021, 02:36:03 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on November 17, 2021, 12:43:13 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 16, 2021, 10:30:04 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 16, 2021, 10:25:46 PM
Quote from: jayhawkco on November 16, 2021, 06:41:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 16, 2021, 06:17:32 PM
The world's most beautiful drive
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Illinois' most beautiful drive? Maybe. But I can be on 30 more beautiful drives within an hour of my house.
Psst. This is Crash_It. Some form of this complaint has been made over and over again and he doesn't care.
Better to ignore his videos altogether.
Or give it a quick thumbs down, many do.
From what I've heard about the latest episode the video is taken basically at sundown and has a heavy amount of glare. The huge ball of ionized gas coupled with massive windshield glare can be seen in the thumbnail for the video beforehand. Clearly we are not dealing with the elite of driving tour videos.
Ah, so Crash_It is the reason YouTube is hiding dislikes!
Emphasis mine.
To cut down on dislike attacks. My videos are no different from others in this field.
Could it not be you just dug yourself an insurmountable hole in terms of having no credibility in the road world? You brought all this negative attention onto yourself by your actions and attitude towards anyone who questions the things you do.
We can all agree to disagree. Just because I explain and defend my actions doesn't make it a crime. I get falsely accused of things all the time. I mistook this forum as one where all dashcam videos can be shared and that was my mistake.
You didn't mistake it. AFAIK you are free to share any videos you like. But if you are showing videos criticizing the actions of others, it's reasonable to expect criticism of your own statements and actions.
Unless the moderators have contacted you privately and asked/told you not to share your "bad driving" videos; which, if so, is information to which the rest of us aren't privy.
Also, having a clear illogical disdain for out of state drivers (particularly Wisconsin) doesn't exactly lend itself well towards having people take the OP seriously. Example; your latest video title clearly shows a dislike for Michigan drivers.
It's not really a dislike. I welcome drivers from all states. It's the ones that come here and be aggressive or don't own up to their shortcomings that I have problems with. When you come to a different state, you are a visitor and are expected to treat the residents with respect. That's what I do when I'm in Indiana visiting my ex girlfriend. If someone in Indiana came from behind me like I did with that Michigan driver.. I would speed up and move out of their way. Of course then the problem is telling a native Indiana driver apart from a Michigan driver because neither of them have front plates.
You treat other drivers differently based on their license plates? Why? It's gonna hurt just as much if you get in an accident with a Michigander as if you hit a car from any other state.
I sigh and roll my eyes when a Texan pulls a boneheaded maneuver, and might yell something about staying on their side of the river, but I don't drive any different around them because they have Texas plates.
It's not like your average Illinois driver is going to be anymore skilled behind the wheel or less so than their counterparts from neighboring states. So why the illogical Illinois tribalism? Does it actually help promote the brand with some other crowd?
Quote from: Crash_It on November 18, 2021, 12:58:56 PM
When you come to a different state, you are a visitor and are expected to treat the residents with respect. That's what I do when I'm in Indiana visiting my ex girlfriend.
Are we going to talk about this or just let this one go? :D
Quote from: Rothman on November 18, 2021, 04:22:45 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 18, 2021, 12:58:56 PM
When you come to a different state, you are a visitor and are expected to treat the residents with respect. That's what I do when I'm in Indiana visiting my ex girlfriend.
Are we going to talk about this or just let this one go? :D
I kind of did the whole, "If you don't have anything nice to say..." thing. I'm trying to be a kinder, gentler, AARoads poster.
Quote from: Rothman on November 18, 2021, 04:22:45 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 18, 2021, 12:58:56 PM
When you come to a different state, you are a visitor and are expected to treat the residents with respect. That's what I do when I'm in Indiana visiting my ex girlfriend.
Are we going to talk about this or just let this one go? :D
The ex girlfriend thing or visitors cowering to the locals ("respect" ) thing? If it's the latter I'm kind of amused that the concept of "FIBs" seems to be totally lost on the OP.
Quote from: Scott5114 on November 18, 2021, 03:05:55 PM
You treat other drivers differently based on their license plates? Why? It's gonna hurt just as much if you get in an accident with a Michigander as if you hit a car from any other state.
I sigh and roll my eyes when a Texan pulls a boneheaded maneuver, and might yell something about staying on their side of the river, but I don't drive any different around them because they have Texas plates.
If that driver was an Illinois driver doing the same I would've flashed the brights too. It's nothing different, no one should react the way that Michigan driver did but obviously it's especially worse because he's not from the area yet acted that way.In fact, earlier in the week I flashed an IL driver for going slow and they just moved out of the way. But, I would like for this thread to remain about my regular driving videos. Discussion about the road rage or regular bad driver compilations should remain in the thread about that.
Quote from: Crash_It on November 18, 2021, 05:00:51 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on November 18, 2021, 03:05:55 PM
You treat other drivers differently based on their license plates? Why? It's gonna hurt just as much if you get in an accident with a Michigander as if you hit a car from any other state.
I sigh and roll my eyes when a Texan pulls a boneheaded maneuver, and might yell something about staying on their side of the river, but I don't drive any different around them because they have Texas plates.
If that driver was an Illinois driver doing the same I would've flashed the brights too. It's nothing different, no one should react the way that Michigan driver did but obviously it's especially worse because he's not from the area yet acted that way.In fact, earlier in the week I flashed an IL driver for going slow and they just moved out of the way. But, I would like for this thread to remain about my regular driving videos. Discussion about the road rage or regular bad driver compilations should remain in the thread about that.
Then what was the point of emphasizing it was a Michigan driver in the video title? There certainly is causality to believe there is some sort out of state bias when you look at the totality of what you post. How does the place of origin have anything to do with how a person acts?
For what it's worth, Michigan drivers are even worse than Illinois drivers in my experiences.
Quote from: thspfc on November 18, 2021, 06:46:56 PM
For what it's worth, Michigan drivers are even worse than Illinois drivers in my experiences.
Personally I've found virtually no variance in the average drivers from any given state. Certainly not to the degree where I would rank a overall particular state population as exceptional or unique.
It could still be useful for determining which direction they'll go. Also which drivers can and can't drive in snow.
I also think there's a "low speed limit" effect from Quebec, Vermont, and the North Country of New York where they drive slowly even in other areas.
The low speed limit effect is real. If you see someone going 50mph on the freeway in Salt Lake City, chances are probably better than 50/50 that they have Oregon plates.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 18, 2021, 06:51:23 PM
Quote from: thspfc on November 18, 2021, 06:46:56 PM
For what it's worth, Michigan drivers are even worse than Illinois drivers in my experiences.
Personally I've found virtually no variance in the average drivers from any given state. Certainly not to the degree where I would rank a overall particular state population as exceptional or unique.
Except Ohio. I've learned that if you encounter a LLB in either Kentucky or West Virginia, even the average non-roadgeek citizen will acknowledge in the affirmative if you indicate that they're probably from Ohio.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 18, 2021, 06:51:23 PM
Quote from: thspfc on November 18, 2021, 06:46:56 PM
For what it's worth, Michigan drivers are even worse than Illinois drivers in my experiences.
Personally I've found virtually no variance in the average drivers from any given state. Certainly not to the degree where I would rank a overall particular state population as exceptional or unique.
I'm a firm believer that we have more accidents in Colorado just because it's such a melting pot. Since everyone has been (and still is) moving here from other states, we have Texas driving culture, California driving culture, Mountain driving culture, etc. all mixed up into one. It's pretty common to have someone whiz by you at 95 while you're in the middle lane passing someone going 55 in a 65. (Maybe they're just high.)
When I was last driving through NYC, I had people getting over in front of me with inches, not feet to spare, but it just seemed like that's what everyone does since it's so congested. Maybe less accidents per capita because everyone knows what to expect and acts accordingly.
Quote from: jayhawkco on November 19, 2021, 10:08:16 AM
I'm a firm believer that we have more accidents in Colorado just because it's such a melting pot. Since everyone has been (and still is) moving here from other states, we have Texas driving culture, California driving culture, Mountain driving culture, etc. all mixed up into one. It's pretty common to have someone whiz by you at 95 while you're in the middle lane passing someone going 55 in a 65. (Maybe they're just high.)
agentsteel53 said back when he was still active that after driving around the entire country, the worst place to drive regarding bad drivers was Miami for the same reason (so many different cultures).
Quote from: 1 on November 19, 2021, 10:10:57 AM
Quote from: jayhawkco on November 19, 2021, 10:08:16 AM
I'm a firm believer that we have more accidents in Colorado just because it's such a melting pot. Since everyone has been (and still is) moving here from other states, we have Texas driving culture, California driving culture, Mountain driving culture, etc. all mixed up into one. It's pretty common to have someone whiz by you at 95 while you're in the middle lane passing someone going 55 in a 65. (Maybe they're just high.)
agentsteel53 said back when he was still active that after driving around the entire country, the worst place to drive regarding bad drivers was Miami for the same reason (so many different cultures).
Yeah, it's been probably 10 years since I was driving myself in Miami, but I would tend to agree that it's up there on the list of worst drivers, especially on the highways. City streets I didn't notice as much.
Forgot to drop this in... released yesterday. Interstate 74 in Peoria.
https://youtu.be/FHhyadQ4Rmk
Boo...not enough Entenmann's delivery trucks... X-(
I guess antagonizing the Facebook truck groups wasn't such a hot idea after all:
https://fb.watch/cA3yVhf_Xh/
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on April 23, 2022, 03:34:58 PM
I guess antagonizing the Facebook truck groups wasn't such a hot idea after all:
https://fb.watch/cA3yVhf_Xh/
Crash won't be happy until he is the only one on the road.
But even then he wouldn't be happy. He wouldn't have anyone to honk at and make videos of.
Quote from: JoePCool14 on April 23, 2022, 03:43:18 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on April 23, 2022, 03:34:58 PM
I guess antagonizing the Facebook truck groups wasn't such a hot idea after all:
https://fb.watch/cA3yVhf_Xh/
Crash won't be happy until he is the only one on the road.
But even then he wouldn't be happy. He wouldn't have anyone to honk at and make videos of.
With all that flatness I'm just shocked that the trucker (probably from the evil state of Wisconsin) couldn't see him from several blocks away.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 18, 2021, 06:51:23 PM
Quote from: thspfc on November 18, 2021, 06:46:56 PM
For what it's worth, Michigan drivers are even worse than Illinois drivers in my experiences.
Personally I've found virtually no variance in the average drivers from any given state. Certainly not to the degree where I would rank a overall particular state population as exceptional or unique.
There's definitely a rural/urban split, but most large cities' driving practices are limited to a small handful in almost all cases. There's arrogant and inept drivers nearly everywhere, I figure that there's going to be more where there's obviously more drivers, and attitudes getting more inflamed when speeds and conditions are not steady.
After a while, I just know where and when I have to "flip the switch" and change driving habits somewhat, unless conditions tell me otherwise.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on April 23, 2022, 03:45:19 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on April 23, 2022, 03:43:18 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on April 23, 2022, 03:34:58 PM
I guess antagonizing the Facebook truck groups wasn't such a hot idea after all:
https://fb.watch/cA3yVhf_Xh/
Crash won't be happy until he is the only one on the road.
But even then he wouldn't be happy. He wouldn't have anyone to honk at and make videos of.
With all that flatness I'm just shocked that the trucker (probably from the evil state of Wisconsin) couldn't see him from several blocks away.
Trucker probably also working for Entenmann's ...
Quote from: dlsterner on April 23, 2022, 07:08:23 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on April 23, 2022, 03:45:19 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on April 23, 2022, 03:43:18 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on April 23, 2022, 03:34:58 PM
I guess antagonizing the Facebook truck groups wasn't such a hot idea after all:
https://fb.watch/cA3yVhf_Xh/
Crash won't be happy until he is the only one on the road.
But even then he wouldn't be happy. He wouldn't have anyone to honk at and make videos of.
With all that flatness I'm just shocked that the trucker (probably from the evil state of Wisconsin) couldn't see him from several blocks away.
Trucker probably also working for Entenmann's ...
Revenge is best served when it was filmed a year ago.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on April 23, 2022, 07:12:12 PM
Quote from: dlsterner on April 23, 2022, 07:08:23 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on April 23, 2022, 03:45:19 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on April 23, 2022, 03:43:18 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on April 23, 2022, 03:34:58 PM
I guess antagonizing the Facebook truck groups wasn't such a hot idea after all:
https://fb.watch/cA3yVhf_Xh/
Crash won't be happy until he is the only one on the road.
But even then he wouldn't be happy. He wouldn't have anyone to honk at and make videos of.
With all that flatness I'm just shocked that the trucker (probably from the evil state of Wisconsin) couldn't see him from several blocks away.
Trucker probably also working for Entenmann's ...
Revenge is best served when it was filmed a year ago.
Where do you get the idea that was filmed a year ago? I filmed that Friday morning on my way to work
Quote from: Crash_It on April 24, 2022, 03:38:56 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on April 23, 2022, 07:12:12 PM
Quote from: dlsterner on April 23, 2022, 07:08:23 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on April 23, 2022, 03:45:19 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on April 23, 2022, 03:43:18 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on April 23, 2022, 03:34:58 PM
I guess antagonizing the Facebook truck groups wasn't such a hot idea after all:
https://fb.watch/cA3yVhf_Xh/
Crash won't be happy until he is the only one on the road.
But even then he wouldn't be happy. He wouldn't have anyone to honk at and make videos of.
With all that flatness I'm just shocked that the trucker (probably from the evil state of Wisconsin) couldn't see him from several blocks away.
Trucker probably also working for Entenmann's ...
Revenge is best served when it was filmed a year ago.
Where do you get the idea that was filmed a year ago? I filmed that Friday morning on my way to work
You sure did think that the Entenmann's driver had it in for you three years after the fact.
Quote from: Rothman on November 18, 2021, 04:22:45 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 18, 2021, 12:58:56 PM
When you come to a different state, you are a visitor and are expected to treat the residents with respect. That's what I do when I'm in Indiana visiting my ex girlfriend.
Are we going to talk about this or just let this one go? :D
Yes, because dealing with psychological issues in a professional manner is well above my pay grade and expertise.
However, my unprofessional manner is free of charge.
Quote from: formulanone on April 24, 2022, 10:31:40 AM
Quote from: Rothman on November 18, 2021, 04:22:45 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 18, 2021, 12:58:56 PM
When you come to a different state, you are a visitor and are expected to treat the residents with respect. That's what I do when I'm in Indiana visiting my ex girlfriend.
Are we going to talk about this or just let this one go? :D
Yes, because dealing with psychological issues in a professional manner is well above my pay grade and expertise.
However, my unprofessional manner is free of charge.
My understanding is, if you aren't from Illinois you are default mentally ill or potentially worse. The world is out to get Illinois, how do you guys not understand this?
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on April 24, 2022, 10:38:10 AM
Quote from: formulanone on April 24, 2022, 10:31:40 AM
Quote from: Rothman on November 18, 2021, 04:22:45 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 18, 2021, 12:58:56 PM
When you come to a different state, you are a visitor and are expected to treat the residents with respect. That's what I do when I'm in Indiana visiting my ex girlfriend.
Are we going to talk about this or just let this one go? :D
Yes, because dealing with psychological issues in a professional manner is well above my pay grade and expertise.
However, my unprofessional manner is free of charge.
My understanding is, if you aren't from Illinois you are default mentally ill or potentially worse. The world is out to get Illinois, how do you guys not understand this?
Butbutbut...visiting the ex...
Quote from: Rothman on April 24, 2022, 10:43:07 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on April 24, 2022, 10:38:10 AM
Quote from: formulanone on April 24, 2022, 10:31:40 AM
Quote from: Rothman on November 18, 2021, 04:22:45 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 18, 2021, 12:58:56 PM
When you come to a different state, you are a visitor and are expected to treat the residents with respect. That's what I do when I'm in Indiana visiting my ex girlfriend.
Are we going to talk about this or just let this one go? :D
Yes, because dealing with psychological issues in a professional manner is well above my pay grade and expertise.
However, my unprofessional manner is free of charge.
My understanding is, if you aren't from Illinois you are default mentally ill or potentially worse. The world is out to get Illinois, how do you guys not understand this?
Butbutbut...visiting the ex...
Sometimes an ex is just an X.
Quote from: Rothman on April 24, 2022, 10:43:07 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on April 24, 2022, 10:38:10 AM
Quote from: formulanone on April 24, 2022, 10:31:40 AM
Quote from: Rothman on November 18, 2021, 04:22:45 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on November 18, 2021, 12:58:56 PM
When you come to a different state, you are a visitor and are expected to treat the residents with respect. That's what I do when I'm in Indiana visiting my ex girlfriend.
Are we going to talk about this or just let this one go? :D
Yes, because dealing with psychological issues in a professional manner is well above my pay grade and expertise.
However, my unprofessional manner is free of charge.
My understanding is, if you aren't from Illinois you are default mentally ill or potentially worse. The world is out to get Illinois, how do you guys not understand this?
Butbutbut...visiting the ex...
Wasn't the ex from Indiana or something?...scandalous...
Beautiful flat scenery and the satisfaction that you turned the entire trucking industry against you:
https://fb.watch/cRd04DNYh7/
I would imagine Crash is somewhere right now all like:
Illinois is the second flattest state in the nation.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 06, 2022, 10:20:21 PM
Illinois is the second flattest state in the nation.
But first on hating truckers and Wisconsinites.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 06, 2022, 03:46:53 PM
Beautiful flat scenery and the satisfaction that you turned the entire trucking industry against you:
https://fb.watch/cRd04DNYh7/
I would imagine Crash is somewhere right now all like:
It's 2 possibly 3 forms of discrimination I'm facing there.
1) they don't like it when 4 wheelers highlight their own wrongdoings knowing that if it happened to them by another one of their own, they would be pissed
2) not Republican like they are
3) I'm also a POC which is proven by the music playing on my car radio. They always love to argue and point out flaws with a POC.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 06, 2022, 10:20:21 PM
Illinois is the second flattest state in the nation.
Completely false, that would be Louisiana or Mississippi. They don't have much variance between the lowest and highest points.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 07, 2022, 08:34:07 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 06, 2022, 10:20:21 PM
Illinois is the second flattest state in the nation.
Completely false, that would be Louisiana or Mississippi. They don't have much variance between the lowest and highest points.
Not according to University of Kansas (https://news.ku.edu/2014/02/06/research-if-you-think-kansas-flattest-us-state-youre-plain-wrong#:~:text=By%20any%20measure%2C%20Florida%20takes,merely%20ranks%20seventh%20in%20flatness.)
Quote from: Crash_It on May 07, 2022, 08:32:29 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 06, 2022, 03:46:53 PM
Beautiful flat scenery and the satisfaction that you turned the entire trucking industry against you:
https://fb.watch/cRd04DNYh7/
I would imagine Crash is somewhere right now all like:
It's 2 possibly 3 forms of discrimination I'm facing there.
1) they don't like it when 4 wheelers highlight their own wrongdoings knowing that if it happened to them by another one of their own, they would be pissed
2) not Republican like they are
3) I'm also a POC which is proven by the music playing on my car radio. They always love to argue and point out flaws with a POC.
And yet you persist posting to their truck pages on your own volition, do you expect a different result? How do you know the political leanings of the people responding to you, are you implying you believe al truckers are Republicans? Also, how does listening to any particular genre of music denote a person's ethnicity?
Just a reminder - pick you words wisely. Politics is not allowed - unless it is related directly to roads
https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=992.msg24507#msg24507
Quote from: Crash_It on May 07, 2022, 08:32:29 AM
3) I'm also a POC which is proven by the music playing on my car radio. They always love to argue and point out flaws with a POC.
Congrats on expecting everyone to be a walking stereotype. I guess acts like Jimi Hendrix, Living Colour, and Fear Factory must be filled with the whitest people on the planet...
Quote from: Crash_It on May 07, 2022, 08:34:07 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 06, 2022, 10:20:21 PM
Illinois is the second flattest state in the nation.
Completely false, that would be Louisiana or Mississippi. They don't have much variance between the lowest and highest points.
Prove that it's false.
You know what's funny is that the part of Michigan I live in is flat as a pancake. Saginaw County is very flat as is the thumb of Michigan.
Southern Michigan is hilly, Oakland County is hilly, northern Michigan is hilly, the western U.P. is hilly but in no way am I going to say that Michigan is hilly overall as a state that would be silly. You are taking slight elevation change because of a small hill or something and claiming that Illinois is not flat because of that.
Saginaw County also lacks a natural inland lake which is rare for a Michigan county especially one as large in area as Saginaw County. Michigan boosts thousands of lakes but I'm not going to go telling people that Saginaw County has lakes because it doesn't. And all you are doing is trying to prove your right by showing GSV's that don't show any elevation change.
I have been through Illinois and have not seen these hills you keep talking about. Illinois has a lot of farm land and that farm land is there because of the flatness. Saginaw County and the thumb area in Michigan also has a lot of farm land because of the flatness. There is no need to keep trying to prove to anyone that Illinois isn't flat, it is flat and so is Saginaw County, Michigan but you don't see me trying to say it isn't.
Also amusing is that Cra_shit gets bent out of shape with Illinois being described as "flat", as if being flat is inherently a bad thing. It's just a description - it's not meant to be positive or negative.
Sounds like he just wants to argue against anybody else's opinion.
I know the whole "Illinois is flat" thing is a meme, but how is this question still being seriously debated?
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 07, 2022, 05:22:27 PM
I know the whole "Illinois is flat" thing is a meme, but how is this question still being seriously debated?
Maybe one day they'll make a movie about all this?
Trailer intro for Illinois is Flat:
"In a world where is everything has geographic variation, one State stands alone..."
Quote from: Crash_It on May 07, 2022, 08:32:29 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 06, 2022, 03:46:53 PM
Beautiful flat scenery and the satisfaction that you turned the entire trucking industry against you:
https://fb.watch/cRd04DNYh7/
I would imagine Crash is somewhere right now all like:
It's 2 possibly 3 forms of discrimination I'm facing there.
1) they don't like it when 4 wheelers highlight their own wrongdoings knowing that if it happened to them by another one of their own, they would be pissed
2) not Republican like they are
3) I'm also a POC which is proven by the music playing on my car radio. They always love to argue and point out flaws with a POC.
You did not just play the race card 😂
I just noticed that the music one listens to determines their race. Egads.
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 07, 2022, 05:22:27 PM
I know the whole "Illinois is flat" thing is a meme, but how is this question still being seriously debated?
Because Cra_shit keeps arguing about it.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 07, 2022, 03:39:04 PM
You know what's funny is that the part of Michigan I live in is flat as a pancake. Saginaw County is very flat as is the thumb of Michigan.
Southern Michigan is hilly, Oakland County is hilly, northern Michigan is hilly, the western U.P. is hilly but in no way am I going to say that Michigan is hilly overall as a state that would be silly. You are taking slight elevation change because of a small hill or something and claiming that Illinois is not flat because of that.
Saginaw County also lacks a natural inland lake which is rare for a Michigan county especially one as large in area as Saginaw County. Michigan boosts thousands of lakes but I'm not going to go telling people that Saginaw County has lakes because it doesn't. And all you are doing is trying to prove your right by showing GSV's that don't show any elevation change.
I have been through Illinois and have not seen these hills you keep talking about. Illinois has a lot of farm land and that farm land is there because of the flatness. Saginaw County and the thumb area in Michigan also has a lot of farm land because of the flatness. There is no need to keep trying to prove to anyone that Illinois isn't flat, it is flat and so is Saginaw County, Michigan but you don't see me trying to say it isn't.
You can actually look at a map and see that about Saginaw County. Only a few Illinois counties actually look like Saginaw County on a map. Get off of I55 and you'll see that Illinois isn't flat. For example I used to think Montgomery County was flat until I drove IL127.
All you are going do to reply to another "Illinois is flat" quip? Weak, but totally on brand.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 08, 2022, 01:43:46 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 07, 2022, 03:39:04 PM
You know what's funny is that the part of Michigan I live in is flat as a pancake. Saginaw County is very flat as is the thumb of Michigan.
Southern Michigan is hilly, Oakland County is hilly, northern Michigan is hilly, the western U.P. is hilly but in no way am I going to say that Michigan is hilly overall as a state that would be silly. You are taking slight elevation change because of a small hill or something and claiming that Illinois is not flat because of that.
Saginaw County also lacks a natural inland lake which is rare for a Michigan county especially one as large in area as Saginaw County. Michigan boosts thousands of lakes but I'm not going to go telling people that Saginaw County has lakes because it doesn't. And all you are doing is trying to prove your right by showing GSV's that don't show any elevation change.
I have been through Illinois and have not seen these hills you keep talking about. Illinois has a lot of farm land and that farm land is there because of the flatness. Saginaw County and the thumb area in Michigan also has a lot of farm land because of the flatness. There is no need to keep trying to prove to anyone that Illinois isn't flat, it is flat and so is Saginaw County, Michigan but you don't see me trying to say it isn't.
You can actually look at a map and see that about Saginaw County. Only a few Illinois counties actually look like Saginaw County on a map. Get off of I55 and you'll see that Illinois isn't flat. For example I used to think Montgomery County was flat until I drove IL127.
I've been off I-55 and still think that Illinois is flat. The only county in Illinois that isn't flat is Jo Daviess County which I have commented on before. I still don't know why you are debating on if the second flattest state in the nation is indeed flat or not. Why do you think Illinois has so much farm land? It isn't because it's hilly.
Quote from: SSOWorld on May 07, 2022, 10:02:47 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 07, 2022, 08:34:07 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 06, 2022, 10:20:21 PM
Illinois is the second flattest state in the nation.
Completely false, that would be Louisiana or Mississippi. They don't have much variance between the lowest and highest points.
Not according to University of Kansas (https://news.ku.edu/2014/02/06/research-if-you-think-kansas-flattest-us-state-youre-plain-wrong#:~:text=By%20any%20measure%2C%20Florida%20takes,merely%20ranks%20seventh%20in%20flatness.)
Kansas is flat.
Quote from: hbelkins on May 09, 2022, 10:57:43 AM
Quote from: SSOWorld on May 07, 2022, 10:02:47 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 07, 2022, 08:34:07 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 06, 2022, 10:20:21 PM
Illinois is the second flattest state in the nation.
Completely false, that would be Louisiana or Mississippi. They don't have much variance between the lowest and highest points.
Not according to University of Kansas (https://news.ku.edu/2014/02/06/research-if-you-think-kansas-flattest-us-state-youre-plain-wrong#:~:text=By%20any%20measure%2C%20Florida%20takes,merely%20ranks%20seventh%20in%20flatness.)
Kansas is flat.
"RESEARCH: IF YOU THINK KANSAS IS THE FLATTEST U.S. STATE, YOU'RE PLAIN WRONG"
Seriously, what is with people being offended when someone says their state is flat? Why does it matter? Who cares? How does the flatness of your state impact you as a person? Why do you even care what outsiders think of the state you live in?
Maybe people have some uniquely American state pride syndrome, and feel the need to express how great their state is, even when they know it's boring?
Flat is boring. No one wants to be boring.
If you want to get into really weird American pride, you have arguments over whose weather is worse (e.g., "We get more snow!" or "You don't know what heat is!").
Quote from: Rothman on May 09, 2022, 12:44:34 PM
Flat is boring. No one wants to be boring.
If you want to get into really weird American pride, you have arguments over whose weather is worse (e.g., "We get more snow!" or "You don't know what heat is!").
That also. Meanwhile Floridians sit quietly and smirk.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 07, 2022, 08:32:29 AM
1) they don't like it when 4 wheelers highlight their own wrongdoings knowing that if it happened to them by another one of their own, they would be pissed
2) not Republican like they are
3) I'm also a POC which is proven by the music playing on my car radio. They always love to argue and point out flaws with a POC.
I'm not a trucker. Until I read this post of yours, I didn't know you were neither Republican nor white. But I still think your videos are trash.
Quote from: kphoger on May 09, 2022, 03:04:34 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 07, 2022, 08:32:29 AM
1) they don't like it when 4 wheelers highlight their own wrongdoings knowing that if it happened to them by another one of their own, they would be pissed
2) not Republican like they are
3) I'm also a POC which is proven by the music playing on my car radio. They always love to argue and point out flaws with a POC.
I'm not a trucker. Until I read this post of yours, I didn't know you were neither Republican nor white. But I still think your videos are trash.
I feel as though we are owed explanation from the OP for items two and three, that's some pretty toxic stuff to put out there. But then again, the OP tends to get himself backed into corners of logic and resorts to low blows to scare people off from asking questions.
I'd counter the videos are more than trash, they are often examples of the OP staging scenarios he thinks will be sensational enough to create a buzz. The fact that OP deliberately is trying to poke at the trucker sites on Facebook is pretty telling that it is all about views off a garbage brand product.
I sincerely doubt the OP has the actual courage to come back and lend explanation for the things he's said. I would be willing to bet though that he'll certainly chime in about the terrain variation of Illinois since that for whatever reason is his brand to stand by.
Quote from: kphoger on May 09, 2022, 03:04:34 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 07, 2022, 08:32:29 AM
1) they don't like it when 4 wheelers highlight their own wrongdoings knowing that if it happened to them by another one of their own, they would be pissed
2) not Republican like they are
3) I'm also a POC which is proven by the music playing on my car radio. They always love to argue and point out flaws with a POC.
I'm not a trucker. Until I read this post of yours, I didn't know you were neither Republican nor white. But I still think your videos are trash.
I don't know why this particular post made my day, but it did, and for that, I am grateful.
Quote from: thspfc on May 09, 2022, 12:30:08 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on May 09, 2022, 10:57:43 AM
Quote from: SSOWorld on May 07, 2022, 10:02:47 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 07, 2022, 08:34:07 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 06, 2022, 10:20:21 PM
Illinois is the second flattest state in the nation.
Completely false, that would be Louisiana or Mississippi. They don't have much variance between the lowest and highest points.
Not according to University of Kansas (https://news.ku.edu/2014/02/06/research-if-you-think-kansas-flattest-us-state-youre-plain-wrong#:~:text=By%20any%20measure%2C%20Florida%20takes,merely%20ranks%20seventh%20in%20flatness.)
Kansas is flat.
"RESEARCH: IF YOU THINK KANSAS IS THE FLATTEST U.S. STATE, YOU'RE PLAIN WRONG"
Seriously, what is with people being offended when someone says their state is flat? Why does it matter? Who cares? How does the flatness of your state impact you as a person? Why do you even care what outsiders think of the state you live in?
Maybe people have some uniquely American state pride syndrome, and feel the need to express how great their state is, even when they know it's boring?
I didn't say that Kansas is the flattest state. I just pointed out the irony of a university from a flat state confirming the flatness of Illinois. (And I also didn't click the link or notice the title of the research paper until I saw the HTML link and text revealed in this reply.
Some might say North Dakota is flat, but I thoroughly enjoyed riding across it on US 2.
And as far as Kansas goes, the Flint Hills aren't quite the central Appalachians, but they're scenic in their own right. But they aren't exactly tall peaks.
Quote from: hbelkins on May 09, 2022, 03:56:02 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 09, 2022, 12:30:08 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on May 09, 2022, 10:57:43 AM
Quote from: SSOWorld on May 07, 2022, 10:02:47 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 07, 2022, 08:34:07 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 06, 2022, 10:20:21 PM
Illinois is the second flattest state in the nation.
Completely false, that would be Louisiana or Mississippi. They don't have much variance between the lowest and highest points.
Not according to University of Kansas (https://news.ku.edu/2014/02/06/research-if-you-think-kansas-flattest-us-state-youre-plain-wrong#:~:text=By%20any%20measure%2C%20Florida%20takes,merely%20ranks%20seventh%20in%20flatness.)
Kansas is flat.
"RESEARCH: IF YOU THINK KANSAS IS THE FLATTEST U.S. STATE, YOU'RE PLAIN WRONG"
Seriously, what is with people being offended when someone says their state is flat? Why does it matter? Who cares? How does the flatness of your state impact you as a person? Why do you even care what outsiders think of the state you live in?
Maybe people have some uniquely American state pride syndrome, and feel the need to express how great their state is, even when they know it's boring?
I didn't say that Kansas is the flattest state. I just pointed out the irony of a university from a flat state confirming the flatness of Illinois. (And I also didn't click the link or notice the title of the research paper until I saw the HTML link and text revealed in this reply.
Some might say North Dakota is flat, but I thoroughly enjoyed riding across it on US 2.
And as far as Kansas goes, the Flint Hills aren't quite the central Appalachians, but they're scenic in their own right. But they aren't exactly tall peaks.
Wasn't about you.
Quote from: hbelkins on May 09, 2022, 10:57:43 AM
Quote from: SSOWorld on May 07, 2022, 10:02:47 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 07, 2022, 08:34:07 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 06, 2022, 10:20:21 PM
Illinois is the second flattest state in the nation.
Completely false, that would be Louisiana or Mississippi. They don't have much variance between the lowest and highest points.
Not according to University of Kansas (https://news.ku.edu/2014/02/06/research-if-you-think-kansas-flattest-us-state-youre-plain-wrong#:~:text=By%20any%20measure%2C%20Florida%20takes,merely%20ranks%20seventh%20in%20flatness.)
Kansas is flat.
For the most part but their highest elevation is quite high 4,039 feet above sea level. I can't help it that this is very near the Colorado border though, the highest point in Illinois is very near the Wisconsin border.
A pancake is flat.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 09, 2022, 04:41:27 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on May 09, 2022, 10:57:43 AM
Quote from: SSOWorld on May 07, 2022, 10:02:47 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 07, 2022, 08:34:07 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 06, 2022, 10:20:21 PM
Illinois is the second flattest state in the nation.
Completely false, that would be Louisiana or Mississippi. They don't have much variance between the lowest and highest points.
Not according to University of Kansas (https://news.ku.edu/2014/02/06/research-if-you-think-kansas-flattest-us-state-youre-plain-wrong#:~:text=By%20any%20measure%2C%20Florida%20takes,merely%20ranks%20seventh%20in%20flatness.)
Kansas is flat.
For the most part but their highest elevation is quite high 4,039 feet above sea level. I can't help it that this is very near the Colorado border though, the highest point in Illinois is very near the Wisconsin border.
Flat but not level. It's a pretty constant elevation increase as you move west.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 08, 2022, 01:43:46 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 07, 2022, 03:39:04 PM
You know what's funny is that the part of Michigan I live in is flat as a pancake. Saginaw County is very flat as is the thumb of Michigan.
Southern Michigan is hilly, Oakland County is hilly, northern Michigan is hilly, the western U.P. is hilly but in no way am I going to say that Michigan is hilly overall as a state that would be silly. You are taking slight elevation change because of a small hill or something and claiming that Illinois is not flat because of that.
Saginaw County also lacks a natural inland lake which is rare for a Michigan county especially one as large in area as Saginaw County. Michigan boosts thousands of lakes but I'm not going to go telling people that Saginaw County has lakes because it doesn't. And all you are doing is trying to prove your right by showing GSV's that don't show any elevation change.
I have been through Illinois and have not seen these hills you keep talking about. Illinois has a lot of farm land and that farm land is there because of the flatness. Saginaw County and the thumb area in Michigan also has a lot of farm land because of the flatness. There is no need to keep trying to prove to anyone that Illinois isn't flat, it is flat and so is Saginaw County, Michigan but you don't see me trying to say it isn't.
You can actually look at a map and see that about Saginaw County. Only a few Illinois counties actually look like Saginaw County on a map. Get off of I55 and you'll see that Illinois isn't flat. For example I used to think Montgomery County was flat until I drove IL127.
Please address why "people of color" (explain it for those of us in the "clear/invisible" category like we're five) should only be listening to a certain subset of music.
Quote from: kphoger on May 09, 2022, 04:11:27 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 09, 2022, 04:02:58 PM
Wasn't about you.
hbelkins is flat
I wish. I've gained back every pound I lost a couple of years ago, and then some on top of it.
And how do you know what Saginaw County, Michigan looks like when you've never been here? I mean I seriously am not positively that you have never been here but I doubt you have.
I'm amused that Crash has been online today but has elected to continue to dodge all questions regarding his latest rant.
Wait a minute. I know for a fact he's never been to Saginaw County because I remember awhile back when we were arguing with him another time he stated that the furthest he's been in Michigan was to like Niles or somewhere in SW Michigan that is barely in Michigan. So I go back to the question that he will most likely dodge, how do you know what Saginaw County looks like?
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 10, 2022, 05:44:05 PM
Wait a minute. I know for a fact he's never been to Saginaw County because I remember awhile back when we were arguing with him another time he stated that the furthest he's been in Michigan was to like Niles or somewhere in SW Michigan that is barely in Michigan. So I go back to the question that he will most likely dodge, how do you know what Saginaw County looks like?
It's 2 possibly 3 forms of discrimination I'm facing there.
1) they don't like it when 4 wheelers highlight their own wrongdoings knowing that if it happened to them by another one of their own, they would be pissed
2) not Republican like they are
3) I'm also a POC which is proven by the music playing on my car radio. They always love to argue and point out flaws with a POC.
It hit me, Left Lane Prius on Facebook is what Crash_It (or whatever the page is called now) would be if it had actually had quality content.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 10, 2022, 05:44:05 PM
Wait a minute. I know for a fact he's never been to Saginaw County because I remember awhile back when we were arguing with him another time he stated that the furthest he's been in Michigan was to like Niles or somewhere in SW Michigan that is barely in Michigan. So I go back to the question that he will most likely dodge, how do you know what Saginaw County looks like?
It's 2 possibly 3 forms of discrimination you're facing there.
1) he doesn't like it when other 4 wheelers highlight his own wrongdoings knowing that if it happened to him by another one of his own, he would be pissed
2) not admitting that political affiliation has nothing to do with it
3) You're not a POC which is proven by the state you live in. He always loves to bring race into every argument instead of pointing out flaws.
Only Crash would have the audacity to illegally rage-pass a dude on the right and then doxx that car's license plates.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 10, 2022, 05:44:05 PM
Wait a minute. I know for a fact he's never been to Saginaw County because I remember awhile back when we were arguing with him another time he stated that the furthest he's been in Michigan was to like Niles or somewhere in SW Michigan that is barely in Michigan. So I go back to the question that he will most likely dodge, how do you know what Saginaw County looks like?
I looked on Google maps with the terrain feature selected. I've said that already in a previous reply. If you look at it with the terrain feature selected, you see no bumps or muscles of any kind which would indicate hills. Not many Illinois counties (if at all) look like that on the map
https://imgur.com/a/zOCRI7e
Quote from: Crash_It on May 11, 2022, 07:10:28 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 10, 2022, 05:44:05 PM
Wait a minute. I know for a fact he's never been to Saginaw County because I remember awhile back when we were arguing with him another time he stated that the furthest he's been in Michigan was to like Niles or somewhere in SW Michigan that is barely in Michigan. So I go back to the question that he will most likely dodge, how do you know what Saginaw County looks like?
I looked on Google maps with the terrain feature selected. I've said that already in a previous reply. If you look at it with the terrain feature selected, you see no bumps or muscles of any kind which would indicate hills. Not many Illinois counties (if at all) look like that on the map
https://imgur.com/a/zOCRI7e
Google Maps isn't really the best source for this sort of thing–their coverage of physical features is spotty at best. You should probably check an actual topographical map, like a DeLorme atlas or, even better, the USGS topos.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 11, 2022, 07:10:28 AM
Not many Illinois counties (if at all) look like that on the map
Most Illinois counties
do look like that except where bodies of water are involved. There are a few exceptions near the western boundary of the state.
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 11, 2022, 07:46:17 AM
Google Maps isn't really the best source for this sort of thing–their coverage of physical features is spotty at best. You should probably check an actual topographical map, like a DeLorme atlas or, even better, the USGS topos.
There's a "terrain" layer that shows contour lines.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 11, 2022, 07:10:28 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 10, 2022, 05:44:05 PM
Wait a minute. I know for a fact he's never been to Saginaw County because I remember awhile back when we were arguing with him another time he stated that the furthest he's been in Michigan was to like Niles or somewhere in SW Michigan that is barely in Michigan. So I go back to the question that he will most likely dodge, how do you know what Saginaw County looks like?
I looked on Google maps with the terrain feature selected. I've said that already in a previous reply. If you look at it with the terrain feature selected, you see no bumps or muscles of any kind which would indicate hills. Not many Illinois counties (if at all) look like that on the map
https://imgur.com/a/zOCRI7e
Still ducking the actual difficult questions I see.
Also, saying you looked on Google Maps is about amateur hour as you can get with terrain maps. There are sites out there you can pull USGS Maps of almost every vintage from. Then again, you are the guy who convinced himself he saw everything worthwhile in Wisconsin from I-90 and I-94.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 11, 2022, 03:38:52 AM
Only Crash would have the audacity to illegally rage-pass a dude on the right and then doxx that car's license plates.
And yet is fearful of the same happening to him. I'm amused how the irony of that goes over his head completely, or he ignores it in his replies. Everyone has the right to their privacy, but fair is fair if you are throw figurative rocks at other drivers from a sniping position of a very public YouTube channel.
Quote from: 1 on May 11, 2022, 07:49:25 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 11, 2022, 07:10:28 AM
Not many Illinois counties (if at all) look like that on the map
Most Illinois counties do look like that except where bodies of water are involved. There are a few exceptions near the western boundary of the state.
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 11, 2022, 07:46:17 AM
Google Maps isn't really the best source for this sort of thing–their coverage of physical features is spotty at best. You should probably check an actual topographical map, like a DeLorme atlas or, even better, the USGS topos.
There's a "terrain" layer that shows contour lines.
False... Here's a road in Lake County that I drive on every single day.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/AAV3oeHaeaC8E4JTA
You can see the sign warning of a hill blocking the view.
Here's the Google maps topographic representation of that area
https://imgur.com/a/o3Nt0EY
Not really a significant body of water nearby that would cause that.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 11, 2022, 08:07:38 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 11, 2022, 07:10:28 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 10, 2022, 05:44:05 PM
Wait a minute. I know for a fact he's never been to Saginaw County because I remember awhile back when we were arguing with him another time he stated that the furthest he's been in Michigan was to like Niles or somewhere in SW Michigan that is barely in Michigan. So I go back to the question that he will most likely dodge, how do you know what Saginaw County looks like?
I looked on Google maps with the terrain feature selected. I've said that already in a previous reply. If you look at it with the terrain feature selected, you see no bumps or muscles of any kind which would indicate hills. Not many Illinois counties (if at all) look like that on the map
https://imgur.com/a/zOCRI7e
Still ducking the actual difficult questions I see.
Also, saying you looked on Google Maps is about amateur hour as you can get with terrain maps. There are sites out there you can pull USGS Maps of almost every vintage from. Then again, you are the guy who convinced himself he saw everything worthwhile in Wisconsin from I-90 and I-94.
I've answered the POC question already a few posts back.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 11, 2022, 08:07:38 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 11, 2022, 03:38:52 AM
Only Crash would have the audacity to illegally rage-pass a dude on the right and then doxx that car's license plates.
And yet is fearful of the same happening to him. I'm amused how the irony of that goes over his head completely, or he ignores it in his replies. Everyone has the right to their privacy, but fair is fair if you are throw figurative rocks at other drivers from a sniping position of a very public YouTube channel.
I probably wouldn't care too much of another driver doing that to me unless he slowed down afterwards, one thing I wouldn't do is react the way that guy did. That's why he got doxxed. Otherwise,if he had just gotten over it, I probably wouldn't have posted that video at all.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 11, 2022, 07:10:28 AM
I looked on Google maps with the terrain feature selected. I've said that already in a previous reply. If you look at it with the terrain feature selected, you see no bumps or muscles of any kind which would indicate hills. Not many Illinois counties (if at all) look like that on the map
https://imgur.com/a/zOCRI7e
not flat! (https://goo.gl/maps/Tm672cUHnMrSKkee8)
practically a roller coaster! (https://goo.gl/maps/4f2Z7agxSsUJsaQK8)
wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeee! (https://goo.gl/maps/dqhBpPrTq4DmFoUT9)
^^^
Lies, it has been long established that is flat everywhere but Illinois.
Layup question, whatever happened to trying to emulate Freewayjim as described in the original post?
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 11, 2022, 10:11:15 AM
^^^
Lies, it has been long established that is flat everywhere but Illinois.
Layup question, whatever happened to trying to emulate Freewayjim as described in the original post?
I'm working on a video of me driving to Horseshoe Lake State Park, should be out over this week. After that, will be a video of Illinois 127. In between that will probably be the next bad drivers compilation.
Speaking of doxing license plates, apparently Lord Carhorn has opinions about the potential removal front plates in Illinois:
https://www.facebook.com/471696313008593/posts/2092451134266428/?d=n
It just blows me away that someone who posts a video of "road rage" three times in two weeks can't get it through his head that either one or both of the following two things is true:
(1) What he's calling "road rage" is actually just everyday driving behavior;
(2) He is contributing, himself, to the road rage.
Quote from: kphoger on May 11, 2022, 09:58:58 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 11, 2022, 07:10:28 AM
I looked on Google maps with the terrain feature selected. I've said that already in a previous reply. If you look at it with the terrain feature selected, you see no bumps or muscles of any kind which would indicate hills. Not many Illinois counties (if at all) look like that on the map
https://imgur.com/a/zOCRI7e
not flat! (https://goo.gl/maps/Tm672cUHnMrSKkee8)
practically a roller coaster! (https://goo.gl/maps/4f2Z7agxSsUJsaQK8)
wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeee! (https://goo.gl/maps/dqhBpPrTq4DmFoUT9)
I know all three of those areas well. I was about 8 miles east of the first one on Burt Road about 45 minutes ago. Saginaw County is huge though it's 800 square miles which is above average for a Michigan county. It's about 60 miles from the SW corner to the NE corner to drive it so it covers some area too.
Man, the Facebook comments section is a gold mine for this guy. Here is a sample from
just one video alone:
Quote
You drive like a douchebag. You are the problem.
Quote
You're are an entitled asshole. Clearly you missed the day in drivers education when they brought up defensive driving.
Quote
Seems like you're the road rage master here, blowing that horn for nothing
Quote
The car driver does this for the power trip. Loves feeling superior but in reality they are the true problem.
Quote
Perfect example of I'm an inpatient asshole honking my horn in Chicago land because I don't know how to "share" the road.
Defense driving classes would go a long ways in your life.
Your the problem.
Quote
You're an idiot.
Quote
The driver of the car is a self entitled jackass
Quote
What a little baby you are
Quote
You're just crying because you had to apply light brake pressure
Quote
What an absolute cry baby driver in the car.
There is some gold nuggets hiding in the shared post comments too.
Quote from: 1 on May 11, 2022, 07:49:25 AM
There's a "terrain" layer that shows contour lines.
I know. It sucks.
Quote from: kphoger on May 11, 2022, 09:58:58 AM
not flat! (https://goo.gl/maps/Tm672cUHnMrSKkee8)
practically a roller coaster! (https://goo.gl/maps/4f2Z7agxSsUJsaQK8)
wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeee! (https://goo.gl/maps/dqhBpPrTq4DmFoUT9)
I mean, those three I would consider "not flat". I have a pretty high bar for flat (https://www.google.com/maps/@35.4703934,-101.0983113,3a,75y,338.9h,93.7t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1s4ZMunrJq3nhY_0n2lf1lzQ!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3D4ZMunrJq3nhY_0n2lf1lzQ%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D331.44455%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192).
I tortured myself watching several of his videos. Some general observations:
*He really gets angry when some of his own acts, such as high-beaming or horn-honking, get used on him.
*In several instances, he was driving in the lane that runs out and got angry because a driver didn't yield to him.
*It's impossible to judge the accuracy of most of his "tailgating" claims because he speeds the view up to the point that you can't determine if the vehicle behind him is maintaining the recommended two-second interval.
*His car snobbery is astounding. He must drive a Platinummobile Deluxe with gold-plated tires, because everything else is "unreliable" or "old" or something else.
*No one driving ahead of him is under any obligation to speed up just to accommodate him.
I thought Crash was rocking a Chevy Cruze? Usually his typical answer to the sight line issues in his videos is to blame it on wide angle dash cam distortion.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 11, 2022, 06:34:51 PM
I thought Crash was rocking a Chevy Cruze? Usually his typical answer to the sight line issues in his videos is to blame it on wide angle dash cam distortion.
Yes, he drives a black 2016 Chevy Cruze.
Quote from: kphoger on May 11, 2022, 06:51:21 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 11, 2022, 06:34:51 PM
I thought Crash was rocking a Chevy Cruze? Usually his typical answer to the sight line issues in his videos is to blame it on wide angle dash cam distortion.
Yes, he drives a black 2016 Chevy Cruze.
Not anymore
Quote from: hbelkins on May 11, 2022, 06:29:50 PM
I tortured myself watching several of his videos. Some general observations:
*He really gets angry when some of his own acts, such as high-beaming or horn-honking, get used on him.
*In several instances, he was driving in the lane that runs out and got angry because a driver didn't yield to him.
*It's impossible to judge the accuracy of most of his "tailgating" claims because he speeds the view up to the point that you can't determine if the vehicle behind him is maintaining the recommended two-second interval.
*His car snobbery is astounding. He must drive a Platinummobile Deluxe with gold-plated tires, because everything else is "unreliable" or "old" or something else.
*No one driving ahead of him is under any obligation to speed up just to accommodate him.
Are you sure you were watching the correct channel because those scenarios didn't happen except for the roasting of cars.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 11, 2022, 07:45:55 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 11, 2022, 06:51:21 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 11, 2022, 06:34:51 PM
I thought Crash was rocking a Chevy Cruze? Usually his typical answer to the sight line issues in his videos is to blame it on wide angle dash cam distortion.
Yes, he drives a black 2016 Chevy Cruze.
Not anymore
You are the living definition of an unreliable narrator.
^^^
The first rule about Crash_It is that you do not talk about Crash_It. In death members of Project Let's Ride Illinois have a name.
Also, amusing how the two harder questions asked by a lot of posters on the two previous pages were ducked by Crash again.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 11, 2022, 10:57:14 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 11, 2022, 10:11:15 AM
^^^
Lies, it has been long established that is flat everywhere but Illinois.
Layup question, whatever happened to trying to emulate Freewayjim as described in the original post?
I'm working on a video of me driving to Horseshoe Lake State Park, should be out over this week. After that, will be a video of Illinois 127. In between that will probably be the next bad drivers compilation.
Leaving this here for you to draw quotes from:
https://www.goodreads.com/author/quotes/44567.Theodore_Roosevelt
https://succeedfeed.com/theodore-roosevelt-quotes/
https://www.nps.gov/thro/learn/historyculture/theodore-roosevelt-quotes.htm
I'm a particular interesting in seeing "It was here that the romance of my life began" into IL 127 somehow.
Here's where Saginaw County gets real hilly LMAO.
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.4783396,-83.9065023,3a,31.8y,297.04h,94.42t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1skIjQo4Y3Uj-S8A5zo9B_1Q!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
Quote from: Crash_It on May 11, 2022, 07:45:55 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 11, 2022, 06:51:21 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 11, 2022, 06:34:51 PM
I thought Crash was rocking a Chevy Cruze? Usually his typical answer to the sight line issues in his videos is to blame it on wide angle dash cam distortion.
Yes, he drives a black 2016 Chevy Cruze.
Not anymore
Did you crash it?
Because that would... not surprise me.
Quote from: kphoger on May 12, 2022, 02:23:07 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 11, 2022, 07:45:55 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 11, 2022, 06:51:21 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 11, 2022, 06:34:51 PM
I thought Crash was rocking a Chevy Cruze? Usually his typical answer to the sight line issues in his videos is to blame it on wide angle dash cam distortion.
Yes, he drives a black 2016 Chevy Cruze.
Not anymore
Did you Crash_It?
Because that would... not surprise me.
That's what happens when someone says "Let's Ride Illinois."
People from the MTR days may remember OSTT. "Operation Starve The Troll." This was a response to Calrog's constant cries for attention. Users made a conscious effort not to respond to him, not to taunt him or provoke him, or otherwise give him any attention.
Maybe it's time for OSTT 2.0?
Quote from: hbelkins on May 12, 2022, 03:31:58 PM
People from the MTR days may remember OSTT. "Operation Starve The Troll." This was a response to Calrog's constant cries for attention. Users made a conscious effort not to respond to him, not to taunt him or provoke him, or otherwise give him any attention.
Maybe it's time for OSTT 2.0?
Breaking my silence to say that after the last spat with this individual where posts were mass deleted, I decided to not get involved with it anymore. I suggest others do the same.
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 12, 2022, 03:45:57 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on May 12, 2022, 03:31:58 PM
People from the MTR days may remember OSTT. "Operation Starve The Troll." This was a response to Calrog's constant cries for attention. Users made a conscious effort not to respond to him, not to taunt him or provoke him, or otherwise give him any attention.
Maybe it's time for OSTT 2.0?
Breaking my silence to say that after the last spat with this individual where posts were mass deleted, I decided to not get involved with it anymore. I suggest others do the same.
Conversely it's not like anyone is making the OP come here. He could have just as easily ignored me posting some of his recent questionable Facebook/YouTube content. Clearly backing down isn't in the OP's character, he can't stand being wrong no matter how obvious it might be to the rest of the world. What's amusing to me is that OP is so blinded by a need to he right that he can't even recognize when he was being trolled. Personally I'm not exactly agreeable to the notion that people who deliberately try to profit off staging supposed "road incidents" should be ignored over being discredited.
Given everything I've been told and seen about Calrog I suspect he would be quite a bit of fun to get spun up.
I don't remember Calrog getting spun up. Just posting crap and more crap and people groaning at him.
Quote from: Rothman on May 12, 2022, 04:19:07 PM
I don't remember Calrog getting spun up. Just posting crap and more crap and people groaning at him.
Most of my frame of reference for the guy is that weird CA 140 NSFW video and the Little Green Shrub song.
Quote from: kphoger on May 12, 2022, 02:23:07 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 11, 2022, 07:45:55 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 11, 2022, 06:51:21 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 11, 2022, 06:34:51 PM
I thought Crash was rocking a Chevy Cruze? Usually his typical answer to the sight line issues in his videos is to blame it on wide angle dash cam distortion.
Yes, he drives a black 2016 Chevy Cruze.
Not anymore
Did you crash it?
Because that would... not surprise me.
Nope, powertrain just randomly failed and dropped from the frame of the car at 136k miles. Ended up costing more than what its worth to fix. So I junked it and got a Toyota.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 12, 2022, 08:03:35 AM
Here's where Saginaw County gets real hilly LMAO.
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.4783396,-83.9065023,3a,31.8y,297.04h,94.42t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1skIjQo4Y3Uj-S8A5zo9B_1Q!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
That's just a garbage dump
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 12, 2022, 03:59:05 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 12, 2022, 03:45:57 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on May 12, 2022, 03:31:58 PM
People from the MTR days may remember OSTT. "Operation Starve The Troll." This was a response to Calrog's constant cries for attention. Users made a conscious effort not to respond to him, not to taunt him or provoke him, or otherwise give him any attention.
Maybe it's time for OSTT 2.0?
Breaking my silence to say that after the last spat with this individual where posts were mass deleted, I decided to not get involved with it anymore. I suggest others do the same.
Conversely it's not like anyone is making the OP come here. He could have just as easily ignored me posting some of his recent questionable Facebook/YouTube content. Clearly backing down isn't in the OP's character, he can't stand being wrong no matter how obvious it might be to the rest of the world. What's amusing to me is that OP is so blinded by a need to he right that he can't even recognize when he was being trolled. Personally I'm not exactly agreeable to the notion that people who deliberately try to profit off staging supposed "road incidents" should be ignored over being discredited.
Given everything I've been told and seen about Calrog I suspect he would be quite a bit of fun to get spun up.
I don't know where you got that I stage things. That is very far from the truth.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 12, 2022, 07:56:31 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 12, 2022, 03:59:05 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 12, 2022, 03:45:57 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on May 12, 2022, 03:31:58 PM
People from the MTR days may remember OSTT. "Operation Starve The Troll." This was a response to Calrog's constant cries for attention. Users made a conscious effort not to respond to him, not to taunt him or provoke him, or otherwise give him any attention.
Maybe it's time for OSTT 2.0?
Breaking my silence to say that after the last spat with this individual where posts were mass deleted, I decided to not get involved with it anymore. I suggest others do the same.
Conversely it's not like anyone is making the OP come here. He could have just as easily ignored me posting some of his recent questionable Facebook/YouTube content. Clearly backing down isn't in the OP's character, he can't stand being wrong no matter how obvious it might be to the rest of the world. What's amusing to me is that OP is so blinded by a need to he right that he can't even recognize when he was being trolled. Personally I'm not exactly agreeable to the notion that people who deliberately try to profit off staging supposed "road incidents" should be ignored over being discredited.
Given everything I've been told and seen about Calrog I suspect he would be quite a bit of fun to get spun up.
I don't know where you got that I stage things. That is very far from the truth.
The totality of the evidence points to it being the only logical conclusion. Your counter arguments are weak, once the flaws in your logic/conclusions are pointed out you tend to shrink away groups that question you the most. I suspect you deliberately are choosing not to answer the more difficult questions posed to you in the last two/three pages given it would likely paint you in a worse light.
So yes, if you feel that I am implying that you are a opportunist fraud and/or spam peddler those would be accurate conclusions.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 12, 2022, 08:12:06 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 12, 2022, 07:56:31 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 12, 2022, 03:59:05 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 12, 2022, 03:45:57 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on May 12, 2022, 03:31:58 PM
People from the MTR days may remember OSTT. "Operation Starve The Troll." This was a response to Calrog's constant cries for attention. Users made a conscious effort not to respond to him, not to taunt him or provoke him, or otherwise give him any attention.
Maybe it's time for OSTT 2.0?
Breaking my silence to say that after the last spat with this individual where posts were mass deleted, I decided to not get involved with it anymore. I suggest others do the same.
Conversely it's not like anyone is making the OP come here. He could have just as easily ignored me posting some of his recent questionable Facebook/YouTube content. Clearly backing down isn't in the OP's character, he can't stand being wrong no matter how obvious it might be to the rest of the world. What's amusing to me is that OP is so blinded by a need to he right that he can't even recognize when he was being trolled. Personally I'm not exactly agreeable to the notion that people who deliberately try to profit off staging supposed "road incidents" should be ignored over being discredited.
Given everything I've been told and seen about Calrog I suspect he would be quite a bit of fun to get spun up.
I don't know where you got that I stage things. That is very far from the truth.
The totality of the evidence points to it being the only logical conclusion. Your counter arguments are weak, once the flaws in your logic/conclusions are pointed out you tend to shrink away groups that question you the most. I suspect you deliberately are choosing not to answer the more difficult questions posed to you in the last two/three pages given it would likely paint you in a worse light.
So yes, if you feel that I am implying that you are a opportunist fraud and/or spam peddler those would be accurate conclusions.
What reason would I have to stage anything, especially since I said numerous times that I wanted a reduction in road rage incidents when compared to last year? I'm just someone who wants to get where I'm going with minimal delay. Someone does something stupid then they get butthurt and angry about being called out on it then they lash out. I'm not the only one experiencing road rage incidents out here. If you look on my Facebook page you'll even see an article that I posted. As far as the other questions... I didn't realize they were, feel free to quote them or re ask them.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 12, 2022, 09:16:14 PM
I said numerous times that I wanted a reduction in road rage incidents when compared to last year
Then stop aggravating the drivers around you.
Quote from: kphoger on May 12, 2022, 09:52:48 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 12, 2022, 09:16:14 PM
I said numerous times that I wanted a reduction in road rage incidents when compared to last year
Then stop aggravating the drivers around you.
Or other drivers should just...
1) stop being so butthurt over being honked at or passed or
2) just stop doing dumb shit and obey the rules of the road.
The roads would be a much better place if either one of these two happened.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 13, 2022, 12:57:55 AM
Quote from: kphoger on May 12, 2022, 09:52:48 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 12, 2022, 09:16:14 PM
I said numerous times that I wanted a reduction in road rage incidents when compared to last year
Then stop aggravating the drivers around you.
Or other drivers should just...
1) stop being so butthurt over being honked at or passed or
2) just stop doing dumb shit and obey the rules of the road.
The roads would be a much better place if either one of these two happened.
Unless it's you, it's okay for you to be butt hurt and so dumb shit for dramatic effect. :rolleyes:
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 13, 2022, 08:30:07 AM
Unless it's you, it's okay for you to be butt hurt and so dumb shit for dramatic effect. :rolleyes:
Exactly. He claims to want less road rage. And yet, when he blares his horn at people, it's
their fault for getting upset.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 12, 2022, 09:16:14 PM
I said numerous times that I wanted a reduction in road rage incidents
When a driver does something risky or boneheaded or whatever, then a reasonable person simply adjusts his driving to accommodate it. A prudent driver gives that other driver a wide berth until he's sure the other driver isn't drunk or otherwise reckless. A conscientious driver might even tap the horn briefly to let the other driver know that the maneuver was a bad idea. No road rage.
But, when a driver does something like that
near you, you blare your horn at them for multiple seconds, glare at them out the window, do things to get
yourself pulled over by the police, and post videos and gripe about it on the internet.
→
YOU ARE THE ROAD RAGE. ←
Quote from: kphoger on May 13, 2022, 09:28:50 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 13, 2022, 08:30:07 AM
Unless it's you, it's okay for you to be butt hurt and so dumb shit for dramatic effect. :rolleyes:
Exactly. He claims to want less road rage. And yet, when he blares his horn at people, it's their fault for getting upset.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 12, 2022, 09:16:14 PM
I said numerous times that I wanted a reduction in road rage incidents
When a driver does something risky or boneheaded or whatever, then a reasonable person simply adjusts his driving to accommodate it. A prudent driver gives that other driver a wide berth until he's sure the other driver isn't drunk or otherwise reckless. A conscientious driver might even tap the horn briefly to let the other driver know that the maneuver was a bad idea. No road rage.
But, when a driver does something like that near you, you blare your horn at them for multiple seconds, glare at them out the window, do things to get yourself pulled over by the police, and post videos and gripe about it on the internet.
→ YOU ARE THE ROAD RAGE. ←
I haven't been pulled over in quite sometime and even then it wasn't a conviction. There's no law against honking the way I do. It all falls within the grounds of to ensure safe operation. However, there are laws against drivers reacting the way they have been. That's what makes it a road rage Incident.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 13, 2022, 03:58:27 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 13, 2022, 09:28:50 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 13, 2022, 08:30:07 AM
Unless it's you, it's okay for you to be butt hurt and so dumb shit for dramatic effect. :rolleyes:
Exactly. He claims to want less road rage. And yet, when he blares his horn at people, it's their fault for getting upset.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 12, 2022, 09:16:14 PM
I said numerous times that I wanted a reduction in road rage incidents
When a driver does something risky or boneheaded or whatever, then a reasonable person simply adjusts his driving to accommodate it. A prudent driver gives that other driver a wide berth until he's sure the other driver isn't drunk or otherwise reckless. A conscientious driver might even tap the horn briefly to let the other driver know that the maneuver was a bad idea. No road rage.
But, when a driver does something like that near you, you blare your horn at them for multiple seconds, glare at them out the window, do things to get yourself pulled over by the police, and post videos and gripe about it on the internet.
→ YOU ARE THE ROAD RAGE. ←
I haven't been pulled over in quite sometime and even then it wasn't a conviction. There's no law against honking the way I do. It all falls within the grounds of to ensure safe operation. However, there are laws against drivers reacting the way they have been. That's what makes it a road rage Incident.
Excessive horn honking can be considered noise pollution.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 13, 2022, 03:58:27 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 13, 2022, 09:28:50 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 13, 2022, 08:30:07 AM
Unless it's you, it's okay for you to be butt hurt and so dumb shit for dramatic effect. :rolleyes:
Exactly. He claims to want less road rage. And yet, when he blares his horn at people, it's their fault for getting upset.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 12, 2022, 09:16:14 PM
I said numerous times that I wanted a reduction in road rage incidents
When a driver does something risky or boneheaded or whatever, then a reasonable person simply adjusts his driving to accommodate it. A prudent driver gives that other driver a wide berth until he's sure the other driver isn't drunk or otherwise reckless. A conscientious driver might even tap the horn briefly to let the other driver know that the maneuver was a bad idea. No road rage.
But, when a driver does something like that near you, you blare your horn at them for multiple seconds, glare at them out the window, do things to get yourself pulled over by the police, and post videos and gripe about it on the internet.
→ YOU ARE THE ROAD RAGE. ←
I haven't been pulled over in quite sometime and even then it wasn't a conviction. There's no law against honking the way I do. It all falls within the grounds of to ensure safe operation. However, there are laws against drivers reacting the way they have been. That's what makes it a road rage Incident.
Who are you trying to convince?...perhaps yourself? Everyone in here who has seen your videos knows you lay on the horn purposely to elicit reactions or stage a more "harrowing" scenes for your YouTube channel. You aren't capable of putting together enough worthwhile road content, so you try to stage it instead. The fact that you can't seem to follow up on the rebranding of your channel into something more mainstream road content wise (hence the change from Crash_It to Let's Ride Illinois) speaks to the fact that you're just a hack. But it isn't like the entire mainstream road world hasn't been telling you this for quite some time now, so dispense with another broken record denial of reality.
A question for everyone else out there. Is there a single respectable road channel and/or page that features road rage videos as part of their primary content? I can't think of a single one of note.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 13, 2022, 03:58:27 PM
I haven't been pulled over in quite sometime and even then it wasn't a conviction. There's no law against honking the way I do. It all falls within the grounds of to ensure safe operation. However, there are laws against drivers reacting the way they have been. That's what makes it a road rage Incident.
I didn't say that honking your horn is against the law. I said that you are the road rage.
Let me explain this by way of analogy. Let's imagine that I'm riding a bicycle down the street, and you're a pedestrian. You start crossing the street in front of me (maybe you didn't see me, maybe you hate cyclists, who knows, doesn't matter), and I have to swerve up onto the sidewalk in order to avoid hitting you. That was a bonehead move on your part, but everyone is perfectly fine. And yet, instead of just letting it go, I start cussing you out, calling you dirty names, heaping insults upon your mother. Lots of f-bombs to go around, but nothing actually threatening, so it's legal. You get angry at my verbal assault, so you pick up a nearby tree branch and try to jab it in between the spokes of my wheel. This is getting ugly now. The question is this: whose fault is the fight? The answer is this: it's mine. In this scenario, I am the rage.
And that's the sort of behavior you exhibit on the road. Someone does something dumb. Instead of just letting it go like everyone else does, you
make yourself known. You aren't 'ensuring safe operation' at all by blaring your horn, because the maneuver has already been done or at least started by the time you do so. You aren't warning anyone, you're cussing them out with your car. You are the road rage.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 13, 2022, 03:58:27 PM
There's no law against honking the way I do. It all falls within the grounds of to ensure safe operation.
Answer me this question:
If a driver pulls out from a sideroad in front of you, such that the driver is already in your lane, then how exactly does honking your horn "insure safe operation" of your vehicle? Explain that to me.
It's already too late for the other driver to change course.
You can either avoid hitting the other vehicle, or you can't–regardless of horn honking.
Quote from: Illinois Compiled Statutes
VEHICLES
(625 ILCS 5/) Illinois Vehicle Code
CHAPTER 12. EQUIPMENT OF VEHICLES
ARTICLE VI. MISCELLANEOUS REQUIREMENTS
Sec. 12-601. Horns and warning devices
The driver of a motor vehicle shall when reasonably necessary to insure safe operation give audible warning with his horn but shall not otherwise use such horn when upon a highway.
Quote from: Illinois Compiled Statutes
VEHICLES
(625 ILCS 5/) Illinois Vehicle Code
CHAPTER 1. TITLE AND DEFINITIONS
Sec. 1-126. Highway.
The entire width between the boundary lines of every way publicly maintained when any part thereof is open to the use of the public for purposes of vehicular travel or located on public school property.
If my brakes go out, then I might need to use my horn to insure the safe operation of my vehicle.
If another driver appears to be drifting into my lane, such that a crash appears to be forthcoming, then I might need to use my horn to insure the safe operation of my vehicle.
If another driver has already cut me off in traffic, then it's too late for the use of my horn to do any good w/r/t safe operation of my vehicle.
Unless you can demonstrate that 'honking your horn the way you do' actually 'insures safe operation' of your vehicle, then you 'shall not otherwise use such horn' on any public road in the state of Illinois.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 13, 2022, 04:15:30 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 13, 2022, 03:58:27 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 13, 2022, 09:28:50 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 13, 2022, 08:30:07 AM
Unless it's you, it's okay for you to be butt hurt and so dumb shit for dramatic effect. :rolleyes:
Exactly. He claims to want less road rage. And yet, when he blares his horn at people, it's their fault for getting upset.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 12, 2022, 09:16:14 PM
I said numerous times that I wanted a reduction in road rage incidents
When a driver does something risky or boneheaded or whatever, then a reasonable person simply adjusts his driving to accommodate it. A prudent driver gives that other driver a wide berth until he's sure the other driver isn't drunk or otherwise reckless. A conscientious driver might even tap the horn briefly to let the other driver know that the maneuver was a bad idea. No road rage.
But, when a driver does something like that near you, you blare your horn at them for multiple seconds, glare at them out the window, do things to get yourself pulled over by the police, and post videos and gripe about it on the internet.
→ YOU ARE THE ROAD RAGE. ←
I haven't been pulled over in quite sometime and even then it wasn't a conviction. There's no law against honking the way I do. It all falls within the grounds of to ensure safe operation. However, there are laws against drivers reacting the way they have been. That's what makes it a road rage Incident.
Who are you trying to convince?...perhaps yourself? Everyone in here who has seen your videos knows you lay on the horn purposely to elicit reactions or stage a more "harrowing" scenes for your YouTube channel. You aren't capable of putting together enough worthwhile road content, so you try to stage it instead. The fact that you can't seem to follow up on the rebranding of your channel into something more mainstream road content wise (hence the change from Crash_It to Let's Ride Illinois) speaks to the fact that you're just a hack. But it isn't like the entire mainstream road world hasn't been telling you this for quite some time now, so dispense with another broken record denial of reality.
Once again with the staging accusations. Totally false. I do both kinds of content on that channel. I just released an I74 video a few weeks back
https://youtu.be/FHhyadQ4Rmk
I have a horseshoe lake video coming this weekend followed by an Illinois 127 video before memorial day. In between that is a new episode of bad driving in Chicagoland since it's been awhile since I released one of those as well. I'm doing both kinds of dashcam content on that channel and the rebranding to Let's Ride Illinois more accurately reflects that. The road rage videos are an unintended feature on that channel. Also, before the rebranding I've also done standard road videos as well but didn't put much emphasis on them. Here's one of the last one's I've made as Crash It
https://youtu.be/Me0XCJ5Bd-4
Sure seems like you weren't interested in "rebranding" until you started to hit up the major road pages with road rage/defensive driver videos. People pointed out to you very quickly (including here) that they didn't want to bad driver videos, especially what you were putting out. I also recall how defensive you got whenever some notable people in the hobby tried to give you pointers on how to take better videos. You really shot yourself in the foot with all the bad will you put out there with all these trash level bad driver videos which you topped off by trying to defend "geographic splendor" or Illinois.
If you you were interested in being a serious mainstream road channel and page you would do the following:
1. Totally drop the bad driver, road rage and cammer garbage nobody wants to see. This would include stopping trying to be a "legal expert" on driving laws and going all vigilante with your car horn. You might want exam your hatred of the truck crowd also, that hasn't done you any favors.
2. Up the frequency of your actual highway videos to several a month if not weekly. Add some actual neutral based historic research into the highways you feature instead of twisting Teddy Roosevelt quotes to fit a particular narrative. Also, you aren't impressing anyone by posting two videos here and one is a year old.
3. Stop being so offended every time someone is critical of something you put or tries to give you critique with video capture. Channel/page feedback can be a incredibly useful tool if you are willing to listen, you haven't thus far.
4. Be prepared to deal with "Illinois is flat" memes and not react to them. That all started because you got offended when you try to say the state wasn't.
5. Stop calling people racists because they are from another state or don't agree with your point of view. This would include not saying really stupid things like only certain ethnicities listen to certain music and insinuating truck drivers comprise a singular political view. Lobbing baseless accusations is stupid to begin with and unfathomably stupid if you are trying to build an actual brand identity.
Or you could just keep supplying us with new road memes. I kind of enjoyed the whole revenge of the Entenmann's truck driver thing myself personally.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 14, 2022, 11:01:56 AM
Sure seems like you weren't interested in "rebranding" until you started to hit up the major road pages with road rage/defensive driver videos. People pointed out to you very quickly (including here) that they didn't want to bad driver videos, especially what you were putting out. I also recall how defensive you got whenever some notable people in the hobby tried to give you pointers on how to take better videos. You really shot yourself in the foot with all the bad will you put out there with all these trash level bad driver videos which you topped off by trying to defend "geographic splendor" or Illinois.
If you you were interested in being a serious mainstream road channel and page you would do the following:
1. Totally drop the bad driver, road rage and cammer garbage nobody wants to see. This would include stopping trying to be a "legal expert" on driving laws and going all vigilante with your car horn. You might want exam your hatred of the truck crowd also, that hasn't done you any favors.
2. Up the frequency of your actual highway videos to several a month if not weekly. Add some actual neutral based historic research into the highways you feature instead of twisting Teddy Roosevelt quotes to fit a particular narrative. Also, you aren't impressing anyone by posting two videos here and one is a year old.
3. Stop being so offended every time someone is critical of something you put or tries to give you critique with video capture. Channel/page feedback can be a incredibly useful tool if you are willing to listen, you haven't thus far.
4. Be prepared to deal with "Illinois is flat" memes and not react to them. That all started because you got offended when you try to say the state wasn't.
5. Stop calling people racists because they are from another state or don't agree with your point of view. This would include not saying really stupid things like only certain ethnicities listen to certain music and insinuating truck drivers comprise a singular political view. Lobbing baseless accusations is stupid to begin with and unfathomably stupid if you are trying to build an actual brand identity.
Or you could just keep supplying us with new road memes. I kind of enjoyed the whole revenge of the Entenmann's truck driver thing myself personally.
I was considering rebranding long before those posts started. It was a little misguided on my behalf in sharing those bad drivers videos here. That's why I created this thread to only focus on the standard road videos that I make. It's going to be a 50/50 focus for now. I may eventually lower it to 75/25.
Make it a 100% focus on road videos and 0% on rage and hatred and we'll be happy.
Quote from: SSOWorld on May 14, 2022, 03:02:36 PM
Make it a 100% focus on road videos and 0% on rage and hatred and we'll be happy.
But he gets more views honking at people.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 14, 2022, 11:01:56 AM
4. Be prepared to deal with "Illinois is flat" memes and not react to them. That all started because you got offended when you try to say the state wasn't.
If I were you at this point, I would embrace the memes. Admit you were wrong (which you are - Illinois
IS flat) and we can all laugh about it together.
New video of an unmarked state highway as well as horseshoe lake state park is out now!
https://youtu.be/k39QrS4jVIE
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 14, 2022, 11:01:56 AM
1. Totally drop the bad driver, road rage and cammer garbage nobody wants to see. This would include stopping trying to be a "legal expert" on driving laws and going all vigilante with your car horn.
I'm curious to know how many of these Illinois traffic laws |Crash_It| chooses to disobey on occasion:
Quote from: Illinois Compiled Statutes
(625 ILCS 5/) Illinois Vehicle Code
Sec. 11-1005. Pedestrians to use right half of crosswalks
Pedestrians shall move, whenever practicable, upon the right half of crosswalks.
Quote from: Illinois Compiled Statutes
(625 ILCS 5/) Illinois Vehicle Code
Sec. 11-1511. Turn and stop signals
(b) A signal of intention to turn right or left when required shall be given during not less than the last 100 feet traveled by the bicycle before turning, and shall be given while the bicycle is stopped waiting to turn. A signal by hand and arm need not be given continuously if the hand is needed in the control or operation of the bicycle.
Quote from: Illinois Compiled Statutes
(625 ILCS 5/) Illinois Vehicle Code
Sec. 11-1409. Driving on mountain highways
The driver of a motor vehicle traveling through defiles or canyons or on mountain highways shall hold such motor vehicle under control and as near the right-hand edge of the roadway as reasonably possible and, except when driving entirely to the right of the center of the roadway, shall give audible warning with the horn of such motor vehicle upon approaching any curve where the view is obstructed within a distance of 200 feet along the highway.
Quote from: kphoger on May 16, 2022, 03:01:43 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 14, 2022, 11:01:56 AM
1. Totally drop the bad driver, road rage and cammer garbage nobody wants to see. This would include stopping trying to be a "legal expert" on driving laws and going all vigilante with your car horn.
I'm curious to know how many of these Illinois traffic laws |Crash_It| chooses to disobey on occasion:
Quote from: Illinois Compiled Statutes
(625 ILCS 5/) Illinois Vehicle Code
Sec. 11-1005. Pedestrians to use right half of crosswalks
Pedestrians shall move, whenever practicable, upon the right half of crosswalks.
Quote from: Illinois Compiled Statutes
(625 ILCS 5/) Illinois Vehicle Code
Sec. 11-1511. Turn and stop signals
(b) A signal of intention to turn right or left when required shall be given during not less than the last 100 feet traveled by the bicycle before turning, and shall be given while the bicycle is stopped waiting to turn. A signal by hand and arm need not be given continuously if the hand is needed in the control or operation of the bicycle.
Quote from: Illinois Compiled Statutes
(625 ILCS 5/) Illinois Vehicle Code
Sec. 11-1409. Driving on mountain highways
The driver of a motor vehicle traveling through defiles or canyons or on mountain highways shall hold such motor vehicle under control and as near the right-hand edge of the roadway as reasonably possible and, except when driving entirely to the right of the center of the roadway, shall give audible warning with the horn of such motor vehicle upon approaching any curve where the view is obstructed within a distance of 200 feet along the highway.
None
Quote from: Crash_It on May 16, 2022, 03:51:59 PM
None
So, without fail, you always make sure to use the right half of crosswalks. Wow, you're the first person I've ever mentioned that law to, who actually said they do. Shall I expect some upcoming videos from you about all those dangerous scofflaws who use the left half?
And you signal your turns when cycling from 100 feet in advance of your turn? (For the sake of visualization, this is more than half the distance between alley and street–or approximately the width of four narrow Chicago residential lots.
And you always honk your horn at blind curves when driving through Illinois canyons? I don't think I've ever encountered
anyone doing that!
Quote from: kphoger on May 16, 2022, 03:58:40 PM
And you always honk your horn at blind curves when driving through Illinois canyons? I don't think I've ever encountered anyone doing that!
No need, since there aren't any mountains, defiles or canyons in Flat Illinois.
Quote from: kphoger on May 16, 2022, 03:01:43 PM
Quote from: Illinois Compiled Statutes
(625 ILCS 5/) Illinois Vehicle Code
Sec. 11-1409. Driving on mountain highways
The driver of a motor vehicle traveling through defiles or canyons or on mountain highways shall hold such motor vehicle under control and as near the right-hand edge of the roadway as reasonably possible and, except when driving entirely to the right of the center of the roadway, shall give audible warning with the horn of such motor vehicle upon approaching any curve where the view is obstructed within a distance of 200 feet along the highway.
Oh the irony. :spin:
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 16, 2022, 06:31:46 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 16, 2022, 03:01:43 PM
Quote from: Illinois Compiled Statutes
(625 ILCS 5/) Illinois Vehicle Code
Sec. 11-1409. Driving on mountain highways
The driver of a motor vehicle traveling through defiles or canyons or on mountain highways shall hold such motor vehicle under control and as near the right-hand edge of the roadway as reasonably possible and, except when driving entirely to the right of the center of the roadway, shall give audible warning with the horn of such motor vehicle upon approaching any curve where the view is obstructed within a distance of 200 feet along the highway.
Oh the irony. :spin:
Most people aside from OHV types don't even do that in the western states where that kind of road is infinitely more likely to be a thing.
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 15, 2022, 09:40:49 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 14, 2022, 11:01:56 AM
4. Be prepared to deal with "Illinois is flat" memes and not react to them. That all started because you got offended when you try to say the state wasn't.
If I were you at this point, I would embrace the memes. Admit you were wrong (which you are - Illinois IS flat) and we can all laugh about it together.
At this point "Illinois is flat" is the modern community analog for Alanland or I-366.
I feel as though we aren't doing enough to make a meme out of Human Vision/DashCam:
https://fb.watch/d2DJftDWYl/
I particularly enjoy that an alleged family member who just happens to be a bus driver was supposedly petitioned for their expert analysis.
Quote from: GaryV on May 16, 2022, 04:48:05 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 16, 2022, 03:58:40 PM
And you always honk your horn at blind curves when driving through Illinois canyons? I don't think I've ever encountered anyone doing that!
No need, since there aren't any mountains, defiles or canyons in Flat Illinois.
False. Wouldn't be in the code if there wasn't such a feature. The roads around Starved Rock and Mississippi Palisades are like that. Possibly more.
Yeah, what legislative body would allow meaningless and/or antiquated traffic codes to remain on the books? It's not like there might be someone out there running amuck misinterpreting any of them.
By the way, does the four second rule also apply if you drop food on the floor?
I have never seen someone so butthurt over Illinois being called flat which is exactly what it is.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 16, 2022, 09:50:52 PM
I have never seen someone so butthurt over Illinois being called flat which is exactly what it is.
A strange "hill" to die upon, especially when said hill is so flat.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 16, 2022, 09:57:35 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 16, 2022, 09:50:52 PM
I have never seen someone so butthurt over Illinois being called flat which is exactly what it is.
A strange "hill" to die upon, especially when said hill is so flat.
I don't even think Michigan is that hilly. It is in certain areas but not overall as a state I wouldn't say.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 16, 2022, 10:01:54 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 16, 2022, 09:57:35 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 16, 2022, 09:50:52 PM
I have never seen someone so butthurt over Illinois being called flat which is exactly what it is.
A strange "hill" to die upon, especially when said hill is so flat.
I don't even think Michigan is that hilly. It is in certain areas but not overall as a state I wouldn't say.
Our family cabin up by Traverse City is just a couple miles from the Sleeping Bear Dunes. Those are some of the few actual substantial hilly features I can think of as being noteworthy in the entire Midwest. It certainly doesn't exempt Michigan from it's general flatness.
Thought of you today when this random "150 best places to live" article came across:
Peoria was the first Illinois city, not until #50 and underneath at least 10-15 other Midwestern cities. :bigass:
Quote from: Crash_It on May 16, 2022, 08:06:10 PM
Quote from: GaryV on May 16, 2022, 04:48:05 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 16, 2022, 03:58:40 PM
And you always honk your horn at blind curves when driving through Illinois canyons? I don't think I've ever encountered anyone doing that!
No need, since there aren't any mountains, defiles or canyons in Flat Illinois.
False. Wouldn't be in the code if there wasn't such a feature. The roads around Starved Rock and Mississippi Palisades are like that. Possibly more.
I have my doubts that you can identify a single road in Illinois that meets all of the following criteria, for that law to apply:
(1) is in a canyon or mountainous location;
(2) isn't already striped for two-way traffic, such that driving entirely to the right of the center is already required by Article VII;
(3) has curvature so tight that there's a blind curve with visibility less than 200 feet.
Maybe you can. Remember, I'm someone who thinks the scenery of Illinois's non-flat areas is underappreciated. There may well be a backroad like that somewhere in southern Illinois, and I'd be interested to know if that's actually the case. But, still, I have my doubts.
At least I can rest assured that, whenever you drive that road, you always honk your horn at the blind curve. At least I know you're not a reckless lawbreaker.
But, more to the point: that's not the reason such a law is on the books in Illinois anyway. The real reason is that it's in the UVC and, with only occasional exceptions, Illinois has adopted the UVC
verbatim. See below.
Quote from: Uniform Vehicle Code, Millennium Edition
Chapter 11 – Rules of the Road
Article XI – Miscellaneous Rules
Section 11-1107 – Driving on mountain highways
The driver of a motor vehicle traveling through defiles or canyons or on mountain highways shall hold such motor vehicle under control and as near the right-hand edge of the roadway as reasonably possible and, except when driving entirely to the right of the center of the roadway, shall give audible warning with the horn of such motor vehicle upon approaching any curve where the view is obstructed within a distance of 200 feet along the highway.
Quote from: Illinois Compiled Statutes
(625 ILCS 5/) Illinois Vehicle Code
Chapter 11 – Rules of the Road
Article XIV – Miscellaneous Laws
Sec. 11-1409 – Driving on mountain highways
The driver of a motor vehicle traveling through defiles or canyons or on mountain highways shall hold such motor vehicle under control and as near the right-hand edge of the roadway as reasonably possible and, except when driving entirely to the right of the center of the roadway, shall give audible warning with the horn of such motor vehicle upon approaching any curve where the view is obstructed within a distance of 200 feet along the highway.
Are there any tunnels on Illinois roads? I can't think of any. If there are, then please feel free to ignore the rest of this post. But, assuming there aren't any highway tunnels in Illinois, then consider the following.
Illinois has a law on the books about what to do at a blind approach to a tunnel ...
Quote from: Uniform Vehicle Code, Millennium Edition
Chapter 11 – Rules of the Road
Article III – Driving on Right Side of Roadway – Overtaking and Passing – Use of Roadway
Section 11-306 – Further limitations on driving on left of center of roadway
(a) No vehicle shall be driven on the left side of the roadway under the following conditions:
3. When the view is obstructed upon approaching within 100 feet of any bridge, viaduct or tunnel.
Quote from: Illinois Compiled Statutes
(625 ILCS 5/) Illinois Vehicle Code
Chapter 11 – Rules of the Road
Article VII – Driving on Right Side of Roadway; Overtaking and Passing, etc.
Sec. 11-706 – Further limitations on driving to the left of center of roadway
(a) No vehicle shall be driven on the left side of the roadway under the following conditions:
3. When the view is obstructed upon approaching within 100 feet of any bridge, viaduct or tunnel.
... and also prohibiting people from parking in tunnels.
Quote from: Uniform Vehicle Code, Millennium Edition
Chapter 11 – Rules of the Road
Article X – Stopping, Standing and Parking
Section 11-1003 – Stopping, standing, or parking prohibited in specified places
(a) Except when necessary to avoid conflict with other traffic, or in compliance with law or the directions of a police officer or official traffic-control device, no person shall:
1. Stop, stand, or park a vehicle:
G. Upon any bridge or other elevated structure upon a highway or within a highway tunnel;
Quote from: Illinois Compiled Statutes
(625 ILCS 5/) Illinois Vehicle Code
Chapter 11 – Rules of the Road
Article XIII – Stopping, Standing, and Parking
Sec. 11-1303 – Stopping, standing or parking prohibited in specified places
a) Except when necessary to avoid conflict with other traffic, or in compliance with law or the directions of a police officer or official traffic-control device, no person shall:
1. Stop, stand or park a vehicle:
g. Upon any bridge or other elevated structure upon a highway or within a highway tunnel;
Quote from: kphoger on May 17, 2022, 02:09:01 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 16, 2022, 08:06:10 PM
Quote from: GaryV on May 16, 2022, 04:48:05 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 16, 2022, 03:58:40 PM
And you always honk your horn at blind curves when driving through Illinois canyons? I don't think I've ever encountered anyone doing that!
No need, since there aren't any mountains, defiles or canyons in Flat Illinois.
False. Wouldn't be in the code if there wasn't such a feature. The roads around Starved Rock and Mississippi Palisades are like that. Possibly more.
I have my doubts that you can identify a single road in Illinois that meets all of the following criteria, for that law to apply:
(1) is in a canyon or mountainous location;
(2) isn't already striped for two-way traffic, such that driving entirely to the right of the center is already required by Article VII;
(3) has curvature so tight that there's a blind curve with visibility less than 200 feet.
Maybe you can. Remember, I'm someone who thinks the scenery of Illinois's non-flat areas is underappreciated. There may well be a backroad like that somewhere in southern Illinois, and I'd be interested to know if that's actually the case. But, still, I have my doubts.
At least I can rest assured that, whenever you drive that road, you always honk your horn at the blind curve. At least I know you're not a reckless lawbreaker.
But, more to the point: that's not the reason such a law is on the books in Illinois anyway. The real reason is that it's in the UVC and, with only occasional exceptions, Illinois has adopted the UVC verbatim. See below.
Quote from: Uniform Vehicle Code, Millennium Edition
Chapter 11 – Rules of the Road
Article XI – Miscellaneous Rules
Section 11-1107 – Driving on mountain highways
The driver of a motor vehicle traveling through defiles or canyons or on mountain highways shall hold such motor vehicle under control and as near the right-hand edge of the roadway as reasonably possible and, except when driving entirely to the right of the center of the roadway, shall give audible warning with the horn of such motor vehicle upon approaching any curve where the view is obstructed within a distance of 200 feet along the highway.
Quote from: Illinois Compiled Statutes
(625 ILCS 5/) Illinois Vehicle Code
Chapter 11 – Rules of the Road
Article XIV – Miscellaneous Laws
Sec. 11-1409 – Driving on mountain highways
The driver of a motor vehicle traveling through defiles or canyons or on mountain highways shall hold such motor vehicle under control and as near the right-hand edge of the roadway as reasonably possible and, except when driving entirely to the right of the center of the roadway, shall give audible warning with the horn of such motor vehicle upon approaching any curve where the view is obstructed within a distance of 200 feet along the highway.
Are there any tunnels on Illinois roads? I can't think of any. If there are, then please feel free to ignore the rest of this post. But, assuming there aren't any highway tunnels in Illinois, then consider the following.
Illinois has a law on the books about what to do at a blind approach to a tunnel ...
Quote from: Uniform Vehicle Code, Millennium Edition
Chapter 11 – Rules of the Road
Article III – Driving on Right Side of Roadway – Overtaking and Passing – Use of Roadway
Section 11-306 – Further limitations on driving on left of center of roadway
(a) No vehicle shall be driven on the left side of the roadway under the following conditions:
3. When the view is obstructed upon approaching within 100 feet of any bridge, viaduct or tunnel.
Quote from: Illinois Compiled Statutes
(625 ILCS 5/) Illinois Vehicle Code
Chapter 11 – Rules of the Road
Article VII – Driving on Right Side of Roadway; Overtaking and Passing, etc.
Sec. 11-706 – Further limitations on driving to the left of center of roadway
(a) No vehicle shall be driven on the left side of the roadway under the following conditions:
3. When the view is obstructed upon approaching within 100 feet of any bridge, viaduct or tunnel.
... and also prohibiting people from parking in tunnels.
Quote from: Uniform Vehicle Code, Millennium Edition
Chapter 11 – Rules of the Road
Article X – Stopping, Standing and Parking
Section 11-1003 – Stopping, standing, or parking prohibited in specified places
(a) Except when necessary to avoid conflict with other traffic, or in compliance with law or the directions of a police officer or official traffic-control device, no person shall:
1. Stop, stand, or park a vehicle:
G. Upon any bridge or other elevated structure upon a highway or within a highway tunnel;
Quote from: Illinois Compiled Statutes
(625 ILCS 5/) Illinois Vehicle Code
Chapter 11 – Rules of the Road
Article XIII – Stopping, Standing, and Parking
Sec. 11-1303 – Stopping, standing or parking prohibited in specified places
a) Except when necessary to avoid conflict with other traffic, or in compliance with law or the directions of a police officer or official traffic-control device, no person shall:
1. Stop, stand or park a vehicle:
g. Upon any bridge or other elevated structure upon a highway or within a highway tunnel;
I drove on a narrow,hilly and curvy road in Christian County probably a couple weeks ago.
Video or it didn't happen.
Quote from: kphoger on May 17, 2022, 02:09:01 PM
I have my doubts that you can identify a single road in Illinois that meets all of the following criteria, for that law to apply:
(1) is in a canyon or mountainous location;
(2) isn't already striped for two-way traffic, such that driving entirely to the right of the center is already required by Article VII;
(3) has curvature so tight that there's a blind curve with visibility less than 200 feet.
Maybe you can. Remember, I'm someone who thinks the scenery of Illinois's non-flat areas is underappreciated. There may well be a backroad like that somewhere in southern Illinois, and I'd be interested to know if that's actually the case. But, still, I have my doubts.
At least I can rest assured that, whenever you drive that road, you always honk your horn at the blind curve. At least I know you're not a reckless lawbreaker.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 17, 2022, 10:08:58 PM
I drove on a narrow,hilly and curvy road in Christian County probably a couple weeks ago.
(Seriously, dude, learn how to trim your quoted material. Don't quote an encyclopedic post like that, respond to a single point within it, and then expect everyone to figure it out.)
Anyway...
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 17, 2022, 10:16:53 PM
Video or it didn't happen.
I'll settle for knowing what
road he's talking about, because I can't find a single road in Christian County that even comes close to meeting all three criteria I laid out.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 16, 2022, 10:04:47 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 16, 2022, 10:01:54 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 16, 2022, 09:57:35 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 16, 2022, 09:50:52 PM
I have never seen someone so butthurt over Illinois being called flat which is exactly what it is.
A strange "hill" to die upon, especially when said hill is so flat.
I don't even think Michigan is that hilly. It is in certain areas but not overall as a state I wouldn't say.
Our family cabin up by Traverse City is just a couple miles from the Sleeping Bear Dunes. Those are some of the few actual substantial hilly features I can think of as being noteworthy in the entire Midwest. It certainly doesn't exempt Michigan from it's general flatness.
I was driving on I-75 between Saginaw and Flint today and thinking of the elevation difference between the two cities. Flint has an elevation about 150 feet higher than Saginaw but you wouldn't notice the difference. I was telling my buddy that you get better gas mileage going north because you are dropping in elevation. But I-75 really doesn't have any hills to speak of so you really don't notice the difference in elevation even driving it. A flat terrain with a few bumps in the ground here and there with just a little difference in elevation doesn't consist of hilly to me either.
The western U.P. is hilly in spots especially going through Hancock. The eastern U.P. seems to have about the same flatness as most of the Lower Peninsula.
I'm also interested to know what road in Christian County is like that. Taylorsville has an elevation of 630 feet, the average elevation for Illinois is 600 feet.
^^^
Pretty much most of the shore of Lake Superior has hilly terrain, but even that isn't "mountainous."
It's almost as though an apparently scenic back road would be something worth featuring as a driving video or something? Especially one that has canyons, mountains, a single lane and blind curves.
Two things I'm curious about:
- Why do you put TV content rating labels on your videos?
- Does the four second rule apply if you drop food on the floor?
When I was county clinching the rest of Michigan two years ago I went up to the tip of the Keweenaw at US-41's northern terminus. I remember that part of Michigan being very hilly. I drove up Scott Street in Hancock and it was like riding up the side of a cliff almost. You can kind of see it in this GSV image https://www.google.com/maps/@47.1265747,-88.591173,3a,28y,348.54h,92.94t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1suQhB9rNHbqu0AkzPGAcxmw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656 but if you go to the left to look up the street the GSV image changes from July 2018 to September 2008 for some reason so the image is rather blurry.
Then you have the Brockway Mountain's and I took the Brockway Mountain Drive just outside of Copper Harbor which was a pretty good climb. But Michigan is still overall a flat state and not known for being hilly or anything like that and Illinois is the same way. What puzzles me is that crash can't admit that Illinois is flat and for some reason goes out of his way to try to find the slightest elevation change and tries to sell that as being hilly. The only neighborhood in Chicago with any type of hills that can actually be considered hills and not just a little bump in the street is Beverly and the only county in Illinois with any type of hills that can actually be considered hills is the same county I've mentioned before (Jo Daviess).
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 18, 2022, 07:59:31 AM
Two things I'm curious about:
- Why do you put TV content rating labels on your videos?
Easy one. I also air my videos on this public access channel in my area.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 18, 2022, 11:07:59 AM
The only neighborhood in Chicago with any type of hills that can actually be considered hills and not just a little bump in the street is Beverly and the only county in Illinois with any type of hills that can actually be considered hills is the same county I've mentioned before (Jo Daviess).
Jo Daviess isn't the only county in Illinois that's hilly. I don't know how many times I have to say this.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 17, 2022, 10:08:58 PM
I drove on a narrow,hilly and curvy road in Christian County probably a couple weeks ago.
Quote from: kphoger on May 17, 2022, 10:29:29 PM
I'll settle for knowing what road he's talking about, because I can't find a single road in Christian County that even comes close to meeting all three criteria I laid out.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 17, 2022, 10:47:42 PM
I'm also interested to know what road in Christian County is like that. Taylorsville has an elevation of 630 feet, the average elevation for Illinois is 600 feet.
So...? What road was it? Inquiring minds want to know.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 18, 2022, 01:38:58 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 18, 2022, 11:07:59 AM
The only neighborhood in Chicago with any type of hills that can actually be considered hills and not just a little bump in the street is Beverly and the only county in Illinois with any type of hills that can actually be considered hills is the same county I've mentioned before (Jo Daviess).
Jo Daviess isn't the only county in Illinois that's hilly. I don't know how many times I have to say this.
I think it's more of that since you feel the need to defend your position is why people ask so frequently. I also think if you had used "hilly" as opposed to "not flat" on a certain past video it wouldn't have become a running meme.
Quote from: kphoger on May 18, 2022, 01:44:00 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 17, 2022, 10:08:58 PM
I drove on a narrow,hilly and curvy road in Christian County probably a couple weeks ago.
Quote from: kphoger on May 17, 2022, 10:29:29 PM
I'll settle for knowing what road he's talking about, because I can't find a single road in Christian County that even comes close to meeting all three criteria I laid out.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 17, 2022, 10:47:42 PM
I'm also interested to know what road in Christian County is like that. Taylorsville has an elevation of 630 feet, the average elevation for Illinois is 600 feet.
So...? What road was it? Inquiring minds want to know.
I believe it was this one.. or one of the roads around here
https://maps.app.goo.gl/TBCbusmdk2iUctt86
Quote from: Crash_It on May 18, 2022, 01:38:58 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 18, 2022, 11:07:59 AM
The only neighborhood in Chicago with any type of hills that can actually be considered hills and not just a little bump in the street is Beverly and the only county in Illinois with any type of hills that can actually be considered hills is the same county I've mentioned before (Jo Daviess).
Jo Daviess isn't the only county in Illinois that's hilly. I don't know how many times I have to say this.
Say it some more because yes it is. I mean seriously how is it so hard to just admit that Illinois is not hilly? Why is that so hard for you to admit? Obviously you are the one that doesn't know much about Illinois.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 18, 2022, 09:14:40 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 18, 2022, 01:38:58 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 18, 2022, 11:07:59 AM
The only neighborhood in Chicago with any type of hills that can actually be considered hills and not just a little bump in the street is Beverly and the only county in Illinois with any type of hills that can actually be considered hills is the same county I've mentioned before (Jo Daviess).
Jo Daviess isn't the only county in Illinois that's hilly. I don't know how many times I have to say this.
Say it some more because yes it is. I mean seriously how is it so hard to just admit that Illinois is not hilly? Why is that so hard for you to admit? Obviously you are the one that doesn't know much about Illinois.
I actually live here, how are you going to tell me? I've showed you plenty of areas in other counties that are hilly and you still don't get it. I'll show you again. Here's some hilly terrain in Lake County on a road that I drive on every single day. Alot more than you have
https://maps.app.goo.gl/tJyXBCnkPsuwmGnS6
Quote from: Crash_It on May 18, 2022, 08:29:56 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 18, 2022, 01:44:00 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 17, 2022, 10:08:58 PM
I drove on a narrow,hilly and curvy road in Christian County probably a couple weeks ago.
Quote from: kphoger on May 17, 2022, 10:29:29 PM
I'll settle for knowing what road he's talking about, because I can't find a single road in Christian County that even comes close to meeting all three criteria I laid out.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 17, 2022, 10:47:42 PM
I'm also interested to know what road in Christian County is like that. Taylorsville has an elevation of 630 feet, the average elevation for Illinois is 600 feet.
So...? What road was it? Inquiring minds want to know.
I believe it was this one.. or one of the roads around here
https://maps.app.goo.gl/TBCbusmdk2iUctt86
I don't see any part of that road that ...
" (1) is in a canyon or mountainous location;
(2) isn't already striped for two-way traffic, such that driving entirely to the right of the center is already required by Article VII;
(3) has curvature so tight that there's a blind curve with visibility less than 200 feet.
" ... so how is it relevant to what you quoted in bringing it up?
Quote from: Crash_It on May 18, 2022, 09:33:33 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 18, 2022, 09:14:40 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 18, 2022, 01:38:58 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 18, 2022, 11:07:59 AM
The only neighborhood in Chicago with any type of hills that can actually be considered hills and not just a little bump in the street is Beverly and the only county in Illinois with any type of hills that can actually be considered hills is the same county I've mentioned before (Jo Daviess).
Jo Daviess isn't the only county in Illinois that's hilly. I don't know how many times I have to say this.
Say it some more because yes it is. I mean seriously how is it so hard to just admit that Illinois is not hilly? Why is that so hard for you to admit? Obviously you are the one that doesn't know much about Illinois.
I actually live here, how are you going to tell me? I've showed you plenty of areas in other counties that are hilly and you still don't get it. I'll show you again. Here's some hilly terrain in Lake County on a road that I drive on every single day. Alot more than you have
https://maps.app.goo.gl/tJyXBCnkPsuwmGnS6
It's hard because it would be admitting that trying to describe Illinois as "not flat" wasn't worth defending. If anything the OP has really shown over all his posts on the internet is a unwillingness to admit or learn from mistakes (several are still being dodged in this very thread). Better to die upon the hill of flatness it seems.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 18, 2022, 09:14:40 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 18, 2022, 01:38:58 PM
Jo Daviess isn't the only county in Illinois that's hilly. I don't know how many times I have to say this.
Say it some more because yes it is. I mean seriously how is it so hard to just admit that Illinois is not hilly? Why is that so hard for you to admit? Obviously you are the one that doesn't know much about Illinois.
Say it some more because no it isn't. I mean seriously how is it so hard to just admit that
Pope County (https://goo.gl/maps/B2guqY3YqZt1f8tt7) and
Union County (https://goo.gl/maps/sncZPuKF9dRZzbMv7) are hilly? Why is that so hard for you to admit? Obviously you don't know much about Illinois.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 18, 2022, 09:33:33 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 18, 2022, 09:14:40 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 18, 2022, 01:38:58 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 18, 2022, 11:07:59 AM
The only neighborhood in Chicago with any type of hills that can actually be considered hills and not just a little bump in the street is Beverly and the only county in Illinois with any type of hills that can actually be considered hills is the same county I've mentioned before (Jo Daviess).
Jo Daviess isn't the only county in Illinois that's hilly. I don't know how many times I have to say this.
Say it some more because yes it is. I mean seriously how is it so hard to just admit that Illinois is not hilly? Why is that so hard for you to admit? Obviously you are the one that doesn't know much about Illinois.
I actually live here, how are you going to tell me? I've showed you plenty of areas in other counties that are hilly and you still don't get it. I'll show you again. Here's some hilly terrain in Lake County on a road that I drive on every single day. Alot more than you have
https://maps.app.goo.gl/tJyXBCnkPsuwmGnS6
I don't care where you live. I have lived in Illinois in my lifetime and know plenty about the state. How am I going to tell you? You tried telling me about the terrain of Saginaw County, Michigan a county which you have admitted that you have never been to so how are you going to tell me about Saginaw County? You haven't shown anything, you even tried to argue that Illinois isn't the second flattest state when indeed it's been studied that it is. And don't tell me that you've driven on a road a lot more than I have when you have no idea where I've been, when I've been there and how long I was there for. It's pretty obvious that you are on here just to argue with people that don't agree with things you say. Don't ever say you've been somewhere a lot more than I have when my travels dominate yours.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 18, 2022, 01:37:38 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 18, 2022, 07:59:31 AM
Two things I'm curious about:
- Why do you put TV content rating labels on your videos?
Easy one. I also air my videos on this public access channel in my area.
It is really mindboggling that you think people actually care about your videos.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 19, 2022, 09:46:33 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 18, 2022, 01:37:38 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 18, 2022, 07:59:31 AM
Two things I'm curious about:
- Why do you put TV content rating labels on your videos?
Easy one. I also air my videos on this public access channel in my area.
It is really mindboggling that you think people actually care about your videos.
Well...given the reaction on here, that's actually quite evident.
Like I've said before, best not to view them in the first place and not engage the guy.
Quote from: Rothman on May 19, 2022, 10:02:41 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 19, 2022, 09:46:33 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 18, 2022, 01:37:38 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 18, 2022, 07:59:31 AM
Two things I'm curious about:
- Why do you put TV content rating labels on your videos?
Easy one. I also air my videos on this public access channel in my area.
It is really mindboggling that you think people actually care about your videos.
Well...given the reaction on here, that's actually quite evident.
Like I've said before, best not to view them in the first place and not engage the guy.
That could be true but I don't see it as positive reaction.
I never view his videos but engaging the guy I'm guilty of that.
Quote from: Rothman on May 19, 2022, 10:02:41 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 19, 2022, 09:46:33 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 18, 2022, 01:37:38 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 18, 2022, 07:59:31 AM
Two things I'm curious about:
- Why do you put TV content rating labels on your videos?
Easy one. I also air my videos on this public access channel in my area.
It is really mindboggling that you think people actually care about your videos.
Well...given the reaction on here, that's actually quite evident.
Like I've said before, best not to view them in the first place and not engage the guy.
The entertainment value of the comments he gets regarding his videos and posts is quite high. A quick scroll through his Facebook page in particular is a good place to look for some quick chuckles.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 19, 2022, 09:44:53 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 18, 2022, 09:33:33 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 18, 2022, 09:14:40 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 18, 2022, 01:38:58 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 18, 2022, 11:07:59 AM
The only neighborhood in Chicago with any type of hills that can actually be considered hills and not just a little bump in the street is Beverly and the only county in Illinois with any type of hills that can actually be considered hills is the same county I've mentioned before (Jo Daviess).
Jo Daviess isn't the only county in Illinois that's hilly. I don't know how many times I have to say this.
Say it some more because yes it is. I mean seriously how is it so hard to just admit that Illinois is not hilly? Why is that so hard for you to admit? Obviously you are the one that doesn't know much about Illinois.
I actually live here, how are you going to tell me? I've showed you plenty of areas in other counties that are hilly and you still don't get it. I'll show you again. Here's some hilly terrain in Lake County on a road that I drive on every single day. Alot more than you have
https://maps.app.goo.gl/tJyXBCnkPsuwmGnS6
I don't care where you live. I have lived in Illinois in my lifetime and know plenty about the state. How am I going to tell you? You tried telling me about the terrain of Saginaw County, Michigan a county which you have admitted that you have never been to so how are you going to tell me about Saginaw County? You haven't shown anything, you even tried to argue that Illinois isn't the second flattest state when indeed it's been studied that it is. And don't tell me that you've driven on a road a lot more than I have when you have no idea where I've been, when I've been there and how long I was there for. It's pretty obvious that you are on here just to argue with people that don't agree with things you say. Don't ever say you've been somewhere a lot more than I have when my travels dominate yours.
If you lived here or even driven any kind of length here then you would know that there are more counties that aren't flat. I would go on a limb and say that there are at least 60 counties in this state that have some kind of hilly terrain. I think I've visited about 40 of them so far and of those 40, there are maybe only 3 that I can say are flat.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 21, 2022, 01:24:53 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 19, 2022, 09:44:53 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 18, 2022, 09:33:33 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 18, 2022, 09:14:40 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 18, 2022, 01:38:58 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 18, 2022, 11:07:59 AM
The only neighborhood in Chicago with any type of hills that can actually be considered hills and not just a little bump in the street is Beverly and the only county in Illinois with any type of hills that can actually be considered hills is the same county I've mentioned before (Jo Daviess).
Jo Daviess isn't the only county in Illinois that's hilly. I don't know how many times I have to say this.
Say it some more because yes it is. I mean seriously how is it so hard to just admit that Illinois is not hilly? Why is that so hard for you to admit? Obviously you are the one that doesn't know much about Illinois.
I actually live here, how are you going to tell me? I've showed you plenty of areas in other counties that are hilly and you still don't get it. I'll show you again. Here's some hilly terrain in Lake County on a road that I drive on every single day. Alot more than you have
https://maps.app.goo.gl/tJyXBCnkPsuwmGnS6
I don't care where you live. I have lived in Illinois in my lifetime and know plenty about the state. How am I going to tell you? You tried telling me about the terrain of Saginaw County, Michigan a county which you have admitted that you have never been to so how are you going to tell me about Saginaw County? You haven't shown anything, you even tried to argue that Illinois isn't the second flattest state when indeed it's been studied that it is. And don't tell me that you've driven on a road a lot more than I have when you have no idea where I've been, when I've been there and how long I was there for. It's pretty obvious that you are on here just to argue with people that don't agree with things you say. Don't ever say you've been somewhere a lot more than I have when my travels dominate yours.
If you lived here or even driven any kind of length here then you would know that there are more counties that aren't flat. I would go on a limb and say that there are at least 60 counties in this state that have some kind of hilly terrain. I think I've visited about 40 of them so far and of those 40, there are maybe only 3 that I can say are flat.
There might be some more counties that aren't as flat as I have said they are but there certainly aren't 60 of them, not even 40. Illinois barely has any difference between it's lowest elevation, highest elevation and average elevation. Flint has an elevation of 150 feet more than Saginaw does, I challenge you to find the difference in elevation along I-75. I'm not going to say that the area between Flint and Saginaw is hilly though because it's not.
Lowest elevation is 279 feet.
Highest elevation is 1,235 feet.
Average elevation is 600 feet.
So the highest point in the entire state is 635 feet above the average elevation and 956 feet above the lowest elevation. The county that the highest elevation is in though is Jo Daviess and is located very close to the Wisconsin border. Illinois most certainly is not known as a state that is hilly.
I am highly amused that this has somehow devolved into the "Illinois is flat 2.0" thread.
There are 2 signed Runaway Truck Ramps in Randolph County in Chester. Those usually aren't signed on "flat" land
One is on IL 3, south out of town, on the main Coal Truck route between the mine on the Randolph/Perry County Line and the River Terminal south of Chester: https://www.google.com/maps/@37.884919,-89.7858846,3a,75y,154.19h,84.68t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sc-aqBcVVgScXGxo8PFGNXA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
The other is on Randolph Street, coming down from the Mississippi River Bridge approach down to Kaskaskia Street/Truck Bypass on the banks of the river: https://www.google.com/maps/@37.9048745,-89.8329119,3a,75y,245.07h,86.22t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s9s3hsu9mSZ0J_-H_3RFWfw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Both of those "ramps" look a little untrustworthy. That would be a hell of a right hand turn to make that first one carrying a decent amount of speed. The second one I can see "in theory" how the connecting road would work allow gravity to do some work (if you didn't go straight into the river anyway).
Quote from: ilpt4u on May 22, 2022, 09:51:12 PM
There are 2 signed Runaway Truck Ramps in Randolph County in Chester. Those usually aren't signed on "flat" land
One is on IL 3, south out of town, on the main Coal Truck route between the mine on the Randolph/Perry County Line and the River Terminal south of Chester: https://www.google.com/maps/@37.884919,-89.7858846,3a,75y,154.19h,84.68t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sc-aqBcVVgScXGxo8PFGNXA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
The other is on Randolph Street, coming down from the Mississippi River Bridge approach down to Kaskaskia Street/Truck Bypass on the banks of the river: https://www.google.com/maps/@37.9048745,-89.8329119,3a,75y,245.07h,86.22t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s9s3hsu9mSZ0J_-H_3RFWfw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Oh no, does Carhorn have a friend here?
I've seen these before. How are they supposed to do anything? The Bridge Bypass Rd one would send a runaway truck through an electrical box, up a grass embankment, over railroad tracks, and into the river. The other disaster would be even worse. An F1 car going 25 MPH couldn't make that turn. How do they expect a semi going 70 to make it?
Using these
runaway truck ramps as justification for IL not being flat is about as nonsensical as anything Carhorn has posted in this thread.
Unless I just ate the sarcasm?
Quote from: ilpt4u on May 22, 2022, 09:51:12 PM
There are 2 signed Runaway Truck Ramps in Randolph County in Chester. Those usually aren't signed on "flat" land
One is on IL 3, south out of town, on the main Coal Truck route between the mine on the Randolph/Perry County Line and the River Terminal south of Chester: https://www.google.com/maps/@37.884919,-89.7858846,3a,75y,154.19h,84.68t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sc-aqBcVVgScXGxo8PFGNXA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
The other is on Randolph Street, coming down from the Mississippi River Bridge approach down to Kaskaskia Street/Truck Bypass on the banks of the river: https://www.google.com/maps/@37.9048745,-89.8329119,3a,75y,245.07h,86.22t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s9s3hsu9mSZ0J_-H_3RFWfw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
I'm lost on how these are even considered runaway truck ramps.
Quote from: ilpt4u on May 22, 2022, 09:51:12 PM
There are 2 signed Runaway Truck Ramps in Randolph County in Chester. Those usually aren't signed on "flat" land
One is on IL 3, south out of town, on the main Coal Truck route between the mine on the Randolph/Perry County Line and the River Terminal south of Chester: https://www.google.com/maps/@37.884919,-89.7858846,3a,75y,154.19h,84.68t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sc-aqBcVVgScXGxo8PFGNXA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
The other is on Randolph Street, coming down from the Mississippi River Bridge approach down to Kaskaskia Street/Truck Bypass on the banks of the river: https://www.google.com/maps/@37.9048745,-89.8329119,3a,75y,245.07h,86.22t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s9s3hsu9mSZ0J_-H_3RFWfw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Let's add some rolling terrain in McDonough County to the equation too.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/h5CPLquCShgDHVbd6
Quote from: Crash_It on May 23, 2022, 02:37:40 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on May 22, 2022, 09:51:12 PM
There are 2 signed Runaway Truck Ramps in Randolph County in Chester. Those usually aren't signed on "flat" land
One is on IL 3, south out of town, on the main Coal Truck route between the mine on the Randolph/Perry County Line and the River Terminal south of Chester: https://www.google.com/maps/@37.884919,-89.7858846,3a,75y,154.19h,84.68t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sc-aqBcVVgScXGxo8PFGNXA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
The other is on Randolph Street, coming down from the Mississippi River Bridge approach down to Kaskaskia Street/Truck Bypass on the banks of the river: https://www.google.com/maps/@37.9048745,-89.8329119,3a,75y,245.07h,86.22t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s9s3hsu9mSZ0J_-H_3RFWfw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Let's add some rolling terrain in McDonough County to the equation too.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/h5CPLquCShgDHVbd6
But no emergency truck escape ramp? This is straying too close to a real life version of Fury Road.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 23, 2022, 02:37:40 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on May 22, 2022, 09:51:12 PM
There are 2 signed Runaway Truck Ramps in Randolph County in Chester. Those usually aren't signed on "flat" land
One is on IL 3, south out of town, on the main Coal Truck route between the mine on the Randolph/Perry County Line and the River Terminal south of Chester: https://www.google.com/maps/@37.884919,-89.7858846,3a,75y,154.19h,84.68t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sc-aqBcVVgScXGxo8PFGNXA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
The other is on Randolph Street, coming down from the Mississippi River Bridge approach down to Kaskaskia Street/Truck Bypass on the banks of the river: https://www.google.com/maps/@37.9048745,-89.8329119,3a,75y,245.07h,86.22t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s9s3hsu9mSZ0J_-H_3RFWfw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Let's add some rolling terrain in McDonough County to the equation too.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/h5CPLquCShgDHVbd6
Give me 200 more of these links and I'll be ready to consider Illinois not being flat
Any hilly areas that Illinois has seem to be near a state border. Overall I don't know how anyone could think that Illinois is known as being hilly. The central parts of the state certain aren't hilly and neither are many of these links that are being shown. So the elevation shifts a few feet it doesn't mean that Illinois is known to be hilly.
And like I mentioned before the elevation difference between Saginaw and Flint is 150 feet. You'd be hard pressed to notice the difference driving along I-75 or Dixie Highway/Saginaw Road. Next I guess the thumb area of Michigan will be considered hilly, he's already claimed that Saginaw County is which I find funny.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 03:22:58 PM
Any hilly areas that Illinois has seem to be near a state border. Overall I don't know how anyone could think that Illinois is known as being hilly. The central parts of the state certain aren't hilly and neither are many of these links that are being shown. So the elevation shifts a few feet it doesn't mean that Illinois is known to be hilly.
Again, there's a lot more than that. I take it you've never been to the Metro East area.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 03:24:19 PM
And like I mentioned before the elevation difference between Saginaw and Flint is 150 feet. You'd be hard pressed to notice the difference driving along I-75 or Dixie Highway/Saginaw Road. Next I guess the thumb area of Michigan will be considered hilly, he's already claimed that Saginaw County is which I find funny.
And not once did I say Saginaw County was hilly. It's Michigan's equivalent of Douglas County in Illinois.
I learned everything I needed to about Michigan passing through on I-94 and I-69.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 23, 2022, 05:14:55 PM
I learned everything I needed to about Michigan passing through on I-94 and I-69.
Same except I-15 and Arizona.
Quote from: thspfc on May 23, 2022, 05:48:36 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 23, 2022, 05:14:55 PM
I learned everything I needed to about Michigan passing through on I-94 and I-69.
Same except I-15 and Arizona.
Rare example of an Interstate corridor exceeding the scenic value of the US Route before it.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 23, 2022, 05:05:52 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 03:24:19 PM
And like I mentioned before the elevation difference between Saginaw and Flint is 150 feet. You'd be hard pressed to notice the difference driving along I-75 or Dixie Highway/Saginaw Road. Next I guess the thumb area of Michigan will be considered hilly, he's already claimed that Saginaw County is which I find funny.
And not once did I say Saginaw County was hilly. It's Michigan's equivalent of Douglas County in Illinois.
Shows how little you know about Saginaw County,
Can we all just agree that Illinois is the new flesh already?
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 10:22:34 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 23, 2022, 05:05:52 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 03:24:19 PM
And like I mentioned before the elevation difference between Saginaw and Flint is 150 feet. You'd be hard pressed to notice the difference driving along I-75 or Dixie Highway/Saginaw Road. Next I guess the thumb area of Michigan will be considered hilly, he's already claimed that Saginaw County is which I find funny.
And not once did I say Saginaw County was hilly. It's Michigan's equivalent of Douglas County in Illinois.
Shows how little you know about Saginaw County,
It's the flattest county in Michigan just like Douglas County is the flattest county in Illinois.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 24, 2022, 08:02:28 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 10:22:34 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 23, 2022, 05:05:52 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 03:24:19 PM
And like I mentioned before the elevation difference between Saginaw and Flint is 150 feet. You'd be hard pressed to notice the difference driving along I-75 or Dixie Highway/Saginaw Road. Next I guess the thumb area of Michigan will be considered hilly, he's already claimed that Saginaw County is which I find funny.
And not once did I say Saginaw County was hilly. It's Michigan's equivalent of Douglas County in Illinois.
Shows how little you know about Saginaw County,
It's the flattest county in Michigan just like Douglas County is the flattest county in Illinois.
Now we are fighting over who has the flattest county?
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 24, 2022, 08:05:31 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 24, 2022, 08:02:28 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 10:22:34 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 23, 2022, 05:05:52 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 03:24:19 PM
And like I mentioned before the elevation difference between Saginaw and Flint is 150 feet. You'd be hard pressed to notice the difference driving along I-75 or Dixie Highway/Saginaw Road. Next I guess the thumb area of Michigan will be considered hilly, he's already claimed that Saginaw County is which I find funny.
And not once did I say Saginaw County was hilly. It's Michigan's equivalent of Douglas County in Illinois.
Shows how little you know about Saginaw County,
It's the flattest county in Michigan just like Douglas County is the flattest county in Illinois.
Now we are fighting over who has the flattest county?
Illinois counties are flatter.
Quote from: Rothman on May 24, 2022, 08:24:43 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 24, 2022, 08:05:31 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 24, 2022, 08:02:28 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 10:22:34 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 23, 2022, 05:05:52 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 03:24:19 PM
And like I mentioned before the elevation difference between Saginaw and Flint is 150 feet. You'd be hard pressed to notice the difference driving along I-75 or Dixie Highway/Saginaw Road. Next I guess the thumb area of Michigan will be considered hilly, he's already claimed that Saginaw County is which I find funny.
And not once did I say Saginaw County was hilly. It's Michigan's equivalent of Douglas County in Illinois.
Shows how little you know about Saginaw County,
It's the flattest county in Michigan just like Douglas County is the flattest county in Illinois.
Now we are fighting over who has the flattest county?
Illinois counties are flatter.
The dick measuring contest the OP wants to keep dragging on is quite entertaining.
Gotta love the flatness of Illinois.
https://www.google.com/maps/@37.6037167,-88.3866633,3a,75y,60.32h,77.36t/data=!3m8!1e1!3m6!1sAF1QipNVJn4grjOYDlW30V58TGAWtB8HWE1ytU-cqQSX!2e10!3e11!6shttps:%2F%2Flh5.googleusercontent.com%2Fp%2FAF1QipNVJn4grjOYDlW30V58TGAWtB8HWE1ytU-cqQSX%3Dw203-h100-k-no-pi-0-ya336.8595-ro-0-fo100!7i14000!8i7000
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 03:22:58 PM
Any hilly areas that Illinois has seem to be near a state border.
What are you calling "near" a state border? As the crow flies, Ferne Clyffe State Park–which has a waterfall–is 21 miles from the nearest state line, in a county that does not border another state.
(https://www.shawneeforest.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/ferne-clyffe-state-park-il-banner.jpg)
Your state is flatter than my state!
No your state is flatter!
I know you are but what am I?
It's third grade all over again...
Quote from: kphoger on May 24, 2022, 09:58:24 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 03:22:58 PM
Any hilly areas that Illinois has seem to be near a state border.
What are you calling "near" a state border? As the crow flies, Ferne Clyffe State Park–which has a waterfall–is 21 miles from the nearest state line, in a county that does not border another state.
(https://www.shawneeforest.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/ferne-clyffe-state-park-il-banner.jpg)
Here's DeWitt County, also not near a state border
16682 Co Rd 10
https://maps.app.goo.gl/ePXJhcZtUYCZ9UJ59
Quote from: MikeTheActuary on May 24, 2022, 09:47:21 AM
Gotta love the flatness of Illinois.
https://www.google.com/maps/@37.6037167,-88.3866633,3a,75y,60.32h,77.36t/data=!3m8!1e1!3m6!1sAF1QipNVJn4grjOYDlW30V58TGAWtB8HWE1ytU-cqQSX!2e10!3e11!6shttps:%2F%2Flh5.googleusercontent.com%2Fp%2FAF1QipNVJn4grjOYDlW30V58TGAWtB8HWE1ytU-cqQSX%3Dw203-h100-k-no-pi-0-ya336.8595-ro-0-fo100!7i14000!8i7000
Remaining valid nonflat GSV links needed to prove that Illinois isn't flat: 199
Quote from: Crash_It on May 24, 2022, 11:31:51 AM
Quote from: kphoger on May 24, 2022, 09:58:24 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 03:22:58 PM
Any hilly areas that Illinois has seem to be near a state border.
What are you calling "near" a state border? As the crow flies, Ferne Clyffe State Park–which has a waterfall–is 21 miles from the nearest state line, in a county that does not border another state.
(https://www.shawneeforest.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/ferne-clyffe-state-park-il-banner.jpg)
Here's DeWitt County, also not near a state border
16682 Co Rd 10
https://maps.app.goo.gl/ePXJhcZtUYCZ9UJ59
Make it 198
Quote from: thspfc on May 23, 2022, 03:17:00 PM
Give me 200 more of these links and I'll be ready to consider Illinois not being flat
Quote from: thspfc on May 24, 2022, 12:19:10 PM
Remaining valid nonflat GSV links needed to prove that Illinois isn't flat: 199
Quote from: thspfc on May 24, 2022, 12:19:40 PM
Make it 198
This is going to be a tough challenge! 200 is a big number. So I'll do it in chunks, and see how far I can get. My goal is to have only one GSV per road–no duplicates. Here are my first 25 GSV links, plus two bonus ones thrown in at the end.
https://goo.gl/maps/16tEosS5T3Xv9Yqo7 | Old US 51
https://goo.gl/maps/GPFW8H2UagmZEa8F7 | Skyline Dr
https://goo.gl/maps/adAqycaGZYBLFYE98 | IL 127
https://goo.gl/maps/WH4y4WCMgUpFnKTGA | Mountain Glen Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/iD13eWM3SXDYmiGn6 | Bell Hill Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/kPPxVZVJTQH8MU3s6 | US 51
https://goo.gl/maps/yDNRhahi2A4o6eF38 | Lick Creek Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/dRR8bwFtx1o1tE7i8 | I 57
https://goo.gl/maps/k4omzwYys77aia4dA | Goreville Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/cVP1GiXEUpMrtfRFA | IL 37
https://goo.gl/maps/ar2nbzkDTaCfuUdA8 | Tunnel Hill Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/BCt8f3TUci4SDPC8A | IL 186
https://goo.gl/maps/RGgY6rKyLAZ74fYC8 | Saraville Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/9NX8dZqp9GiqobU3A | US 45
https://goo.gl/maps/SPCoXdX3XXR4sYbr8 | IL 147
https://goo.gl/maps/AtFo9SM4pZYr1ZGC9 | IL 145
https://goo.gl/maps/uitbFcDotesUF1RJ7 | IL 146
https://goo.gl/maps/Tow5Qj8xw62MGzp79 | I 24
https://goo.gl/maps/prEH3mdQ2oVgxCSg8 | North Ave
https://goo.gl/maps/sVV4TBMdfUh1PBeH7 | Grapevine Trl
https://goo.gl/maps/GHwBnDZMFZTNisQZ8 | Mill Creek Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/NnbvcSgpQ8ZDUDYDA | Berryville Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/PZ6KHD6QuNJu39rp6 | Alto Water Works Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/GNwupckFsuZDcs6V9 | Makanda Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/TxPPR9Mm61iJpJVj8 | Stonefort Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/XfbKEmenQd9x5Q9Z8 | Bald Knob
https://goo.gl/maps/xiLQDgvckFRc6B4Y9 | Giant City State Park
Over/Under bets anyone on how long it will take to come up with 200 non-flat unique images of Illinois?
Quote from: tchafe1978 on May 24, 2022, 10:21:21 AM
Your state is flatter than my state!
No your state is flatter!
I know you are but what am I?
It's third grade all over again...
"My state can beat up your state!"
"Oh yeah?"
"Yeah!"
Quote from: dlsterner on May 24, 2022, 01:52:36 PM
Quote from: tchafe1978 on May 24, 2022, 10:21:21 AM
Your state is flatter than my state!
No your state is flatter!
I know you are but what am I?
It's third grade all over again...
"My state can beat up your state!"
"Oh yeah?"
"Yeah!"
When is the last time Illinois really had one over on Michigan? Was it when the Chicago Bulls finally surpassed the Detroit Pistons?
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 24, 2022, 01:55:31 PM
Quote from: dlsterner on May 24, 2022, 01:52:36 PM
Quote from: tchafe1978 on May 24, 2022, 10:21:21 AM
Your state is flatter than my state!
No your state is flatter!
I know you are but what am I?
It's third grade all over again...
"My state can beat up your state!"
"Oh yeah?"
"Yeah!"
When is the last time Illinois really had one over on Michigan? Was it when the Chicago Bulls finally surpassed the Detroit Pistons?
I mean, despite the Bears not being great, they've certainly been better than the Lions.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 24, 2022, 01:40:12 PM
Over/Under bets anyone on how long it will take to come up with 200 non-flat unique images of Illinois?
It would be a lot easier, if I weren't limiting myself to one GSV per road. Some state and county highways have multiple examples that would fit the challenge wonderfully.
For what it's worth, I don't expect to make it to 200, and I think it's an unreasonable target to hit. But it's still a fun challenge anyway.
^^^
Holding it to one entry per road makes for a better challenge IMO.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on May 24, 2022, 02:04:29 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 24, 2022, 01:55:31 PM
Quote from: dlsterner on May 24, 2022, 01:52:36 PM
Quote from: tchafe1978 on May 24, 2022, 10:21:21 AM
Your state is flatter than my state!
No your state is flatter!
I know you are but what am I?
It's third grade all over again...
"My state can beat up your state!"
"Oh yeah?"
"Yeah!"
When is the last time Illinois really had one over on Michigan? Was it when the Chicago Bulls finally surpassed the Detroit Pistons?
I mean, despite the Bears not being great, they've certainly been better than the Lions.
The Blackhawks had a good run fairly recently but weren't the Dynasty the Red Wings were. The Tigers had a good 2000s run but both Chicago teams had a World Series. Michigan and Michigan State I would say have faired substantially better in major (only counting Basketball and Football) college sports. The Pistons had the better run in the early 2000s than the Bulls and even got an NBA title.
Batch 26—50
https://goo.gl/maps/FndTXhoyv9SPKHXe9 | Greg Hollow Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/mQbQ8rnnfUwwfrXFA | IL 3
https://goo.gl/maps/yApU3rNmxocCQkaW7 | IL 169
https://goo.gl/maps/YKycpYmZp91tQNkH7 | Rosebud Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/8FsFr1dgZzmpfCqK6 | Clanahan Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/cnzP8rpHGYw1qLDu5 | New Harmony Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/bydAK6nZ5ZAHsNfe8 | IL 34
https://goo.gl/maps/WPghmZiLSjqTWVVL8 | Bassett Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/nXxUuZ2StHo4Eii47 | Tower Rock Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/GgZXhmVjEsL8kch38 | IL 1
https://goo.gl/maps/DepeBPDW5dLNAB3N7 | Karbers Ridge Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/CAatbyYqusxPR27U9 | Forest Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/xuAFqJBGJaKSrMDEA | IL 13
https://goo.gl/maps/pzzxncbxqysDrrfv9 | IL 142
https://goo.gl/maps/LeSCCjmCkQ4VNHBx6 | IL 141
https://goo.gl/maps/zXpwW9gV5JYRKWqK9 | Harco Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/YzN3qn8WayqB2V6v5 | Corinth Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/RLGFoTX7wfVxDgZ98 | Hamilton County Rd 875E
https://goo.gl/maps/zgBwwTFASE6T2DHQ6 | IL 14
https://goo.gl/maps/uRkXiGCkRLQhLGox5 | Town Creek Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/YQmQQBjVfibVpgEZ7 | IL 149
https://goo.gl/maps/Xz4a3rFFMt24bMAo6 | Old IL 13
https://goo.gl/maps/1d5aQZrMtMhGGUgw8 | Giant City Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/6Uj7iCAJqgZkDmex9 | Grassy Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/u8KycRuvWUqWFcta6 | Boskydell Rd
Bonus 3
https://goo.gl/maps/9dQYAzBjigLJRjZk7 | Pounds Escarpment
https://goo.gl/maps/e2LP2tgeSySQPxTf8 | Pounds Hollow
https://goo.gl/maps/YNwVW3nt8R41FqKH8 | Garden of the Gods
Quote from: Crash_It on May 24, 2022, 08:02:28 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 10:22:34 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 23, 2022, 05:05:52 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 03:24:19 PM
And like I mentioned before the elevation difference between Saginaw and Flint is 150 feet. You'd be hard pressed to notice the difference driving along I-75 or Dixie Highway/Saginaw Road. Next I guess the thumb area of Michigan will be considered hilly, he's already claimed that Saginaw County is which I find funny.
And not once did I say Saginaw County was hilly. It's Michigan's equivalent of Douglas County in Illinois.
Shows how little you know about Saginaw County,
It's the flattest county in Michigan just like Douglas County is the flattest county in Illinois.
Saginaw County is NOT the flattest county in Michigan and I'm not even being biased by saying that. Have you ever been in the thumb in like Huron County or Sanillac County? Or Tuscola County? Saginaw County has nothing in common with Douglas County, Illinois.
(This will get more challenging the farther north I move up the state. So far, I've posted links mainly from areas I'm familiar with: I've personally driven probably one-third of the roads so far. There are some other great ones I'm familiar with, but they don't have GSV. As I move farther north, however, I'll be moving into parts of the state I'm less familiar with.)
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 24, 2022, 03:18:08 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 24, 2022, 08:02:28 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 10:22:34 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 23, 2022, 05:05:52 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 03:24:19 PM
And like I mentioned before the elevation difference between Saginaw and Flint is 150 feet. You'd be hard pressed to notice the difference driving along I-75 or Dixie Highway/Saginaw Road. Next I guess the thumb area of Michigan will be considered hilly, he's already claimed that Saginaw County is which I find funny.
And not once did I say Saginaw County was hilly. It's Michigan's equivalent of Douglas County in Illinois.
Shows how little you know about Saginaw County,
It's the flattest county in Michigan just like Douglas County is the flattest county in Illinois.
Saginaw County is NOT the flattest county in Michigan and I'm not even being biased by saying that. Have you ever been in the thumb in like Huron County or Sanillac County? Or Tuscola County? Saginaw County has nothing in common with Douglas County, Illinois.
Amusingly my quip up thread about seeing all there is to see on I-94/I-69 would miss Saginaw County.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 24, 2022, 03:32:54 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 24, 2022, 03:18:08 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 24, 2022, 08:02:28 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 10:22:34 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 23, 2022, 05:05:52 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 23, 2022, 03:24:19 PM
And like I mentioned before the elevation difference between Saginaw and Flint is 150 feet. You'd be hard pressed to notice the difference driving along I-75 or Dixie Highway/Saginaw Road. Next I guess the thumb area of Michigan will be considered hilly, he's already claimed that Saginaw County is which I find funny.
And not once did I say Saginaw County was hilly. It's Michigan's equivalent of Douglas County in Illinois.
Shows how little you know about Saginaw County,
It's the flattest county in Michigan just like Douglas County is the flattest county in Illinois.
Saginaw County is NOT the flattest county in Michigan and I'm not even being biased by saying that. Have you ever been in the thumb in like Huron County or Sanillac County? Or Tuscola County? Saginaw County has nothing in common with Douglas County, Illinois.
Amusingly my quip up thread about seeing all there is to see on I-94/I-69 would miss Saginaw County.
But have you seen the Zilwaukee Bridge? Now that is a giant hill.
Quote from: kphoger on May 24, 2022, 02:14:19 PM
For what it's worth, I don't expect to make it to 200, and I think it's an unreasonable target to hit. But it's still a fun challenge anyway.
I think we can do it, the IL extension of the Ozark plateau has numerous examples alone. Here are some from the northern tier of the state which are outside of the Ozark plateau, some even outside of the driftless area.
https://goo.gl/maps/deVwGTfzTA6Bid1UA | 29th Street
https://goo.gl/maps/DgtZojWmESP1A3cRA | IL131
https://goo.gl/maps/s6AEa4984PBp2dAN8 | 9th Street
https://goo.gl/maps/nneAZB1mhdpLsZPQ9 | IL173 (Lake County)
https://goo.gl/maps/fK65QZwWLEce6rfi6 | Hunt Club Rd, Hills off to the sides
https://goo.gl/maps/Sm1iVUDtfmiv9wtS9 | I94
https://goo.gl/maps/WwcTfszj2Kt9pc2U9 | Dilley's Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/nMNT5ncrNdHSfz1K7 | Delany Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/d1zidah84WfivajF8 | Yorkhouse Rd (drivers tend to go slow and ride the brakes here)
https://goo.gl/maps/tLw7HL4ojWzEX2dQA | McAree Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/j5fCUrNKv6ttcxG66 | Jackson St
https://goo.gl/maps/JFjSBddi12iq8PUE8 | Roosevelt Park and nearby Washington St
https://goo.gl/maps/jTdam2mGquAXDc2D7 | South Ave
https://goo.gl/maps/UqKQU7HUrNwUhSsr6 | IL21
https://goo.gl/maps/1aHjFrU9aGAVjCvZA | Casey Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/wuR9qyUY6deAQMph9 |Almond Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/c8VNmaVHrZbeutKz5 | IL120
https://goo.gl/maps/ztzuuXkd9gGXc2Uj8 | IL137 (another brake rider for wimpy drivers)
https://goo.gl/maps/DALYihr5cE5TXTP5A | Midlothian Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/FqXoWHh9T7RTyP796 | Gilmer Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/UkyLfiUEfKtRLnYN6 | IL22
https://goo.gl/maps/rTKFNQseLW7XbZrB6 | Diamond Lake Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/DhNCG4kv1ariGSqo7 | Old McHenry Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/TJZQpxPZQrWwFapj6 | Cuba Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/5RtmrEABVjwrKCSC7 | Krueger Rd
This is just Lake County alone and stuff I drive on daily.
Yeah, call me when Illinois gets something like this, Crash.
https://www.google.com/maps/@37.87567,-107.7284563,3a,75y,243.86h,97.57t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sU2tbj4TH7AG-JzgfCwzLsw!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DU2tbj4TH7AG-JzgfCwzLsw%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D166.9137%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 24, 2022, 07:45:02 PM
Yeah, call me when Illinois gets something like this, Crash.
https://www.google.com/maps/@37.87567,-107.7284563,3a,75y,243.86h,97.57t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sU2tbj4TH7AG-JzgfCwzLsw!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DU2tbj4TH7AG-JzgfCwzLsw%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D166.9137%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192
Or even something like this, which is where I live. You can see significantly lower elevation in the distance along the power lines and some large hills even farther in the distance.
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.751141,-71.1399796,3a,66.6y,89.41h,79.81t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sLN7SzwRX0Q8qUBdlHvhZRQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
Quote from: 1 on May 24, 2022, 07:48:33 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 24, 2022, 07:45:02 PM
Yeah, call me when Illinois gets something like this, Crash.
https://www.google.com/maps/@37.87567,-107.7284563,3a,75y,243.86h,97.57t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sU2tbj4TH7AG-JzgfCwzLsw!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DU2tbj4TH7AG-JzgfCwzLsw%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D166.9137%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192
Or even something like this, which is where I live. You can see significantly lower elevation in the distance along the power lines and some large hills even farther in the distance.
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.751141,-71.1399796,3a,66.6y,89.41h,79.81t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sLN7SzwRX0Q8qUBdlHvhZRQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
That's easy, there's plenty of that in the state
https://goo.gl/maps/q8hQD9rERdfNX2uf6
https://goo.gl/maps/hANWcSgGVbRmtbMF7
https://goo.gl/maps/4ZqeAkXuUBQTygdC8
^ Where is this?
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 24, 2022, 07:45:02 PM
Yeah, call me when Illinois gets something like this, Crash.
https://www.google.com/maps/@37.87567,-107.7284563,3a,75y,243.86h,97.57t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sU2tbj4TH7AG-JzgfCwzLsw!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DU2tbj4TH7AG-JzgfCwzLsw%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D166.9137%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 24, 2022, 07:45:02 PM
Yeah, call me when Illinois gets something like this, Crash.
https://www.google.com/maps/@37.87567,-107.7284563,3a,75y,243.86h,97.57t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sU2tbj4TH7AG-JzgfCwzLsw!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DU2tbj4TH7AG-JzgfCwzLsw%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D166.9137%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192
That wasn't the challenge. The challenge was 200 photos of non-flatness in Illinois. The absence of snow-capped mountains does not equal flatness.
Quote from: 1 on May 24, 2022, 07:48:33 PM
Or even something like this, which is where I live. You can see significantly lower elevation in the distance along the power lines and some large hills even farther in the distance.
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.751141,-71.1399796,3a,66.6y,89.41h,79.81t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sLN7SzwRX0Q8qUBdlHvhZRQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
I already posted some terrain similar to that from Illinois. I could have posted quite a few more, except that those elevation changes are most often obscured from view on the road by trees.
Here, though, is a break in the trees for you. (https://goo.gl/maps/GkVxK9Axot1GzBdi7)
And here's another view nearby. (https://goo.gl/maps/VfDCicuGVFuEYyUt7)
Quote from: sprjus4 on May 24, 2022, 08:25:57 PM
^ Where is this?
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 24, 2022, 07:45:02 PM
Yeah, call me when Illinois gets something like this, Crash.
https://www.google.com/maps/@37.87567,-107.7284563,3a,75y,243.86h,97.57t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sU2tbj4TH7AG-JzgfCwzLsw!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DU2tbj4TH7AG-JzgfCwzLsw%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D166.9137%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192
It's near Red Mountain Pass in southwestern Colorado. An absolutely stunning drive, that highway is.
From the looks of it, I wouldn't disagree. It looks gorgeous.
But I should have clarified, I'm asking Crash where this type of terrain is located in Illinois, I cannot seem to find it.
Quote from: sprjus4 on May 24, 2022, 10:02:41 PM
From the looks of it, I wouldn't disagree. It looks gorgeous.
But I should have clarified, I'm asking Crash where this type of terrain is located in Illinois, I cannot seem to find it.
Have you checked the multiverse? I seem to recall some sort of alternate "Dark Illinois" that was on the bottom side of a flat Earth that had mountains being brought up in one of these threads.
Quote from: kphoger on May 24, 2022, 08:37:24 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 24, 2022, 07:45:02 PM
Yeah, call me when Illinois gets something like this, Crash.
https://www.google.com/maps/@37.87567,-107.7284563,3a,75y,243.86h,97.57t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sU2tbj4TH7AG-JzgfCwzLsw!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DU2tbj4TH7AG-JzgfCwzLsw%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D166.9137%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192
That wasn't the challenge. The challenge was 200 photos of non-flatness in Illinois. The absence of snow-capped mountains does not equal flatness.
Quote from: 1 on May 24, 2022, 07:48:33 PM
Or even something like this, which is where I live. You can see significantly lower elevation in the distance along the power lines and some large hills even farther in the distance.
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.751141,-71.1399796,3a,66.6y,89.41h,79.81t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sLN7SzwRX0Q8qUBdlHvhZRQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
I already posted some terrain similar to that from Illinois. I could have posted quite a few more, except that those elevation changes are most often obscured from view on the road by trees.
Here, though, is a break in the trees for you. (https://goo.gl/maps/GkVxK9Axot1GzBdi7)
And here's another view nearby. (https://goo.gl/maps/VfDCicuGVFuEYyUt7)
I can't find a comparable image via GSV, but on my regular commute along Ava Rd in Jackson County, top of the hill heading downhill thru some S-curves heading Southeast near Plesant Hill Church, I'll have to stop and take a picture. You can see for miles! Clear conditions, early evening/twilight, can probably count 10+ cell tower beacons, some that are 5-10 miles away. It is just that clear, and you are obviously "above" the rest - higher elevation that that you are overlooking
Maybe some trees have been cut or cleared since the GSV car went thru 8 years ago, but there are 2 or 3 spots it is pretty awesome, at least for Illinois standards.
One I love up in the Metro East: Along IL 15, outside the I-255 Beltway: https://www.google.com/maps/@38.5650202,-90.088469,3a,22.8y,305.71h,82.23t,0.02r/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sYOZguKJKl-JFngV0bPNJJQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 Nice hilltop view of the STL Skyline, at just under 7 miles SE of the Arch
Quote from: ilpt4u on May 24, 2022, 10:39:58 PM
I can't find a comparable image via GSV, but on my regular commute along Ava Rd in Jackson County, top of the hill heading downhill thru some S-curves heading Southeast near Plesant Hill Church, I'll have to stop and take a picture. You can see for miles! Clear conditions, early evening/twilight, can probably count 10+ cell tower beacons, some that are 5-10 miles away. It is just that clear, and you are obviously "above" the rest - higher elevation that that you are overlooking
Maybe some trees have been cut or cleared since the GSV car went thru 8 years ago, but there are 2 or 3 spots it is pretty awesome, at least for Illinois standards.
Here are some decent sight distances along that road:
https://goo.gl/maps/DaF5V4tX9JdiVMwk7
https://goo.gl/maps/975zGDBdT6S5nYdp8
When Illinois gets something like this than you can consider it not flat.
https://www.google.com/maps/@38.449666,-79.6547105,3a,75y,78.08h,101.21t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sl1hfmktWxcKtcehyBhCQeA!2e0!7i3328!8i1664
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 25, 2022, 10:02:37 AM
When Illinois gets something like this than you can consider it not flat.
https://www.google.com/maps/@38.449666,-79.6547105,3a,75y,78.08h,101.21t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sl1hfmktWxcKtcehyBhCQeA!2e0!7i3328!8i1664
The amusing thing for me is having lived on the West Coast half my life the East Coast ranges don't tend to feel all that impressive very often anymore. The first half of my life when I lived in the Midwest and East Coast they did.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 25, 2022, 10:02:37 AM
When Illinois gets something like this than you can consider it not flat.
https://www.google.com/maps/@38.449666,-79.6547105,3a,75y,78.08h,101.21t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sl1hfmktWxcKtcehyBhCQeA!2e0!7i3328!8i1664
Pretty sure we have that somewhere in the Ozark plateau or even the driftless zone. No flat road or state would have something like this posted on the side of the road:
https://goo.gl/maps/DaF5V4tX9JdiVMwk7
certainly not in Louisiana or Mississippi.
So far (this batch included), all of mine have been south of Route 15. As expected, it gets more difficult as I move north.
Batch 51—70
https://goo.gl/maps/XF9SbRTDDXnM3tBb8 | Randolph County Rd 5
https://goo.gl/maps/J3Kxa848zqLnqnr4A | County Farm Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/FJdhdJAsGwvAQWiG7 | IL 150
https://goo.gl/maps/uVZohUiD2grS7j2p7 | Palestine Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/QTuL5gM6Be2z9mhY9 | Wine Hill Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/Wpzvboobp7oEGeqd7 | IL 151
https://goo.gl/maps/d1ZMWJ6KZzcXLYaK8 | Ava Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/8VNTyvSfdZWCiLSM9 | IL 4
https://goo.gl/maps/kwHG15VDhkfN5Nra8 | Union School Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/sULvPkvrM6YpMuV98 | Bandyville Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/9MC8pZ2qeowbq7iR6 | Fowler School Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/TcvuzVTQ7eGveLsJ7 | Seymour Lake Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/8MJDvYsykEqwjcfj7 | Shawneetown Trl
https://goo.gl/maps/Eij3GZm4DFRwTSNQ9 | Rockcastle Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/HE3hmmDMzdzCNo6T9 | Galatia Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/hz1iniCKtnXGwyjd9 | Telephone Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/Va3kDoqfsLmsWUAL9 | Hamilton County Rd 700E
https://goo.gl/maps/p8sFiRZMxSo5rHy79 | White County Rd 650N
https://goo.gl/maps/YXnMumCUacyFYAE5A | White County Rd 800E
https://goo.gl/maps/AyCRR9hBLSj3gmpB9 | IL 130
Bonus 2
https://goo.gl/maps/1qzqrQ55mBYp4Yeo7 | Stoneface Research Natural Area
https://goo.gl/maps/BUcHcQ2mNYpiyQ2z6 | Piney Creek Ravine
Oh, so is this a game now? Posting image to prove that a state overall isn't flat?
I can probably find 200 images of level to slightly rolling terrain from West Virginia, but that wouldn't prove that West Virginia is flat.
Quote from: hbelkins on May 25, 2022, 05:54:13 PM
Oh, so is this a game now? Posting image to prove that a state overall isn't flat?
No, not a game. It's a specific challenge. I was interested to see if I could actually meet the challenge. And then, of course, if I do, I'm interested to see if he'll make good on his end of the deal. Of course, he's only actually promised to
consider...
The sly little devil.
Quote from: thspfc on May 23, 2022, 03:17:00 PM
Give me 200 more of these links and I'll be ready to consider Illinois not being flat
The great thing about being in a flat state is when litter makes it onto a roadway the slightest breeze carries it right into Wisconsin:
https://fb.watch/depfc-Qbjy/
I wonder what the trucking crowd has to say?
Quote from: kphoger on May 24, 2022, 01:35:06 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 23, 2022, 03:17:00 PM
Give me 200 more of these links and I'll be ready to consider Illinois not being flat
Quote from: thspfc on May 24, 2022, 12:19:10 PM
Remaining valid nonflat GSV links needed to prove that Illinois isn't flat: 199
Quote from: thspfc on May 24, 2022, 12:19:40 PM
Make it 198
This is going to be a tough challenge! 200 is a big number. So I'll do it in chunks, and see how far I can get. My goal is to have only one GSV per road–no duplicates. Here are my first 25 GSV links, plus two bonus ones thrown in at the end.
https://goo.gl/maps/16tEosS5T3Xv9Yqo7 | Old US 51
https://goo.gl/maps/GPFW8H2UagmZEa8F7 | Skyline Dr
https://goo.gl/maps/adAqycaGZYBLFYE98 | IL 127
https://goo.gl/maps/WH4y4WCMgUpFnKTGA | Mountain Glen Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/iD13eWM3SXDYmiGn6 | Bell Hill Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/kPPxVZVJTQH8MU3s6 | US 51
https://goo.gl/maps/yDNRhahi2A4o6eF38 | Lick Creek Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/dRR8bwFtx1o1tE7i8 | I 57
https://goo.gl/maps/k4omzwYys77aia4dA | Goreville Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/cVP1GiXEUpMrtfRFA | IL 37
https://goo.gl/maps/ar2nbzkDTaCfuUdA8 | Tunnel Hill Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/BCt8f3TUci4SDPC8A | IL 186
https://goo.gl/maps/RGgY6rKyLAZ74fYC8 | Saraville Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/9NX8dZqp9GiqobU3A | US 45
https://goo.gl/maps/SPCoXdX3XXR4sYbr8 | IL 147
https://goo.gl/maps/AtFo9SM4pZYr1ZGC9 | IL 145
https://goo.gl/maps/uitbFcDotesUF1RJ7 | IL 146
https://goo.gl/maps/Tow5Qj8xw62MGzp79 | I 24
https://goo.gl/maps/prEH3mdQ2oVgxCSg8 | North Ave
https://goo.gl/maps/sVV4TBMdfUh1PBeH7 | Grapevine Trl
https://goo.gl/maps/GHwBnDZMFZTNisQZ8 | Mill Creek Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/NnbvcSgpQ8ZDUDYDA | Berryville Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/PZ6KHD6QuNJu39rp6 | Alto Water Works Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/GNwupckFsuZDcs6V9 | Makanda Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/TxPPR9Mm61iJpJVj8 | Stonefort Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/XfbKEmenQd9x5Q9Z8 | Bald Knob
https://goo.gl/maps/xiLQDgvckFRc6B4Y9 | Giant City State Park
Oh, boy. I did not expect anyone to actually accept this challenge. But I suppose I'll go through these to weed out the flat ones.
1. is a small hill. The downhill truck sign is deceiving, that wouldn't be there in most states. I'll give half a point.
2. also a small hill. another half point.
3. Rolling terrain, full point.
4. full point
5. full point
6. half point, the road is flat but the hills in the distance are not.
7. half point
8. flat
9. full point
10. flat
11. half point
12. half point
13. flat
14. half point
15. full point
16. half
17. half
18. half
19. half to be nice
20. full
21. full
22. flat
23. flat
24. half
25. you think a big rock makes it not flat?
26. I'll give two points for this
27. full
So, 16 here, out of the necessary 200 nonflat links.
Quote from: kphoger on May 24, 2022, 03:07:08 PM
Batch 26—50
https://goo.gl/maps/FndTXhoyv9SPKHXe9 | Greg Hollow Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/mQbQ8rnnfUwwfrXFA | IL 3
https://goo.gl/maps/yApU3rNmxocCQkaW7 | IL 169
https://goo.gl/maps/YKycpYmZp91tQNkH7 | Rosebud Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/8FsFr1dgZzmpfCqK6 | Clanahan Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/cnzP8rpHGYw1qLDu5 | New Harmony Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/bydAK6nZ5ZAHsNfe8 | IL 34
https://goo.gl/maps/WPghmZiLSjqTWVVL8 | Bassett Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/nXxUuZ2StHo4Eii47 | Tower Rock Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/GgZXhmVjEsL8kch38 | IL 1
https://goo.gl/maps/DepeBPDW5dLNAB3N7 | Karbers Ridge Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/CAatbyYqusxPR27U9 | Forest Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/xuAFqJBGJaKSrMDEA | IL 13
https://goo.gl/maps/pzzxncbxqysDrrfv9 | IL 142
https://goo.gl/maps/LeSCCjmCkQ4VNHBx6 | IL 141
https://goo.gl/maps/zXpwW9gV5JYRKWqK9 | Harco Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/YzN3qn8WayqB2V6v5 | Corinth Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/RLGFoTX7wfVxDgZ98 | Hamilton County Rd 875E
https://goo.gl/maps/zgBwwTFASE6T2DHQ6 | IL 14
https://goo.gl/maps/uRkXiGCkRLQhLGox5 | Town Creek Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/YQmQQBjVfibVpgEZ7 | IL 149
https://goo.gl/maps/Xz4a3rFFMt24bMAo6 | Old IL 13
https://goo.gl/maps/1d5aQZrMtMhGGUgw8 | Giant City Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/6Uj7iCAJqgZkDmex9 | Grassy Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/u8KycRuvWUqWFcta6 | Boskydell Rd
Bonus 3
https://goo.gl/maps/9dQYAzBjigLJRjZk7 | Pounds Escarpment
https://goo.gl/maps/e2LP2tgeSySQPxTf8 | Pounds Hollow
https://goo.gl/maps/YNwVW3nt8R41FqKH8 | Garden of the Gods
26. half
27. :-D
28. really?
29. :-D :-D
30. full
31. flat
32. half
33. flat (was expecting more from that road name, which is becoming a theme)
34. the 7 pixels of GSV don't offer many clues, but I'll guess half?
35. flat
36. full
37. half for nonflatness and another half for the pretty GSV
38. half for hills in the distance
39. flat
40. half
41. half
42. pretty GSV
43. full
44. flat
45. flat
46. flat
47. half
48. full
49. full
50. Carhorn already contributed this
So, 2 from Carhorn, 16 from the first batch, and 10 from this batch gives us 28 so far.
Quote from: thspfc on May 25, 2022, 08:47:57 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 24, 2022, 01:35:06 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 23, 2022, 03:17:00 PM
Give me 200 more of these links and I'll be ready to consider Illinois not being flat
Quote from: thspfc on May 24, 2022, 12:19:10 PM
Remaining valid nonflat GSV links needed to prove that Illinois isn't flat: 199
Quote from: thspfc on May 24, 2022, 12:19:40 PM
Make it 198
This is going to be a tough challenge! 200 is a big number. So I'll do it in chunks, and see how far I can get. My goal is to have only one GSV per road–no duplicates. Here are my first 25 GSV links, plus two bonus ones thrown in at the end.
https://goo.gl/maps/16tEosS5T3Xv9Yqo7 | Old US 51
https://goo.gl/maps/GPFW8H2UagmZEa8F7 | Skyline Dr
https://goo.gl/maps/adAqycaGZYBLFYE98 | IL 127
https://goo.gl/maps/WH4y4WCMgUpFnKTGA | Mountain Glen Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/iD13eWM3SXDYmiGn6 | Bell Hill Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/kPPxVZVJTQH8MU3s6 | US 51
https://goo.gl/maps/yDNRhahi2A4o6eF38 | Lick Creek Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/dRR8bwFtx1o1tE7i8 | I 57
https://goo.gl/maps/k4omzwYys77aia4dA | Goreville Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/cVP1GiXEUpMrtfRFA | IL 37
https://goo.gl/maps/ar2nbzkDTaCfuUdA8 | Tunnel Hill Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/BCt8f3TUci4SDPC8A | IL 186
https://goo.gl/maps/RGgY6rKyLAZ74fYC8 | Saraville Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/9NX8dZqp9GiqobU3A | US 45
https://goo.gl/maps/SPCoXdX3XXR4sYbr8 | IL 147
https://goo.gl/maps/AtFo9SM4pZYr1ZGC9 | IL 145
https://goo.gl/maps/uitbFcDotesUF1RJ7 | IL 146
https://goo.gl/maps/Tow5Qj8xw62MGzp79 | I 24
https://goo.gl/maps/prEH3mdQ2oVgxCSg8 | North Ave
https://goo.gl/maps/sVV4TBMdfUh1PBeH7 | Grapevine Trl
https://goo.gl/maps/GHwBnDZMFZTNisQZ8 | Mill Creek Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/NnbvcSgpQ8ZDUDYDA | Berryville Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/PZ6KHD6QuNJu39rp6 | Alto Water Works Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/GNwupckFsuZDcs6V9 | Makanda Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/TxPPR9Mm61iJpJVj8 | Stonefort Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/XfbKEmenQd9x5Q9Z8 | Bald Knob
https://goo.gl/maps/xiLQDgvckFRc6B4Y9 | Giant City State Park
Oh, boy. I did not expect anyone to actually accept this challenge. But I suppose I'll go through these to weed out the flat ones.
1. is a small hill. The downhill truck sign is deceiving, that wouldn't be there in most states. I'll give half a point.
2. also a small hill. another half point.
3. Rolling terrain, full point.
4. full point
5. full point
6. half point, the road is flat but the hills in the distance are not.
7. half point
8. flat
9. full point
10. flat
11. half point
12. half point
13. flat
14. half point
15. full point
16. half
17. half
18. half
19. half to be nice
20. full
21. full
22. flat
23. flat
24. half
25. you think a big rock makes it not flat?
26. I'll give two points for this
27. full
So, 16 here, out of the necessary 200 nonflat links.
None of what you said that's flat is flat..
This is flat
https://maps.app.goo.gl/HYzoSJJ6rTas3VA18
Note how far you can see in all directions without an obstruction that's not a tree or building
Quote from: Crash_It on May 25, 2022, 02:13:00 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 25, 2022, 10:02:37 AM
When Illinois gets something like this than you can consider it not flat.
https://www.google.com/maps/@38.449666,-79.6547105,3a,75y,78.08h,101.21t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sl1hfmktWxcKtcehyBhCQeA!2e0!7i3328!8i1664
Pretty sure we have that somewhere in the Ozark plateau or even the driftless zone. No flat road or state would have something like this posted on the side of the road:
https://goo.gl/maps/DaF5V4tX9JdiVMwk7
certainly not in Louisiana or Mississippi.
The image that you showed is nowhere close to as hilly as the image I showed. Mine is from Highland County Virginia which has an average elevation of 2,832 feet above sea level. Good luck finding that anywhere in Illinois. One sign doesn't determine if Illinois is flat or not btw. Highland County has one of the highest average elevations east of the Mississippi and you are going to find something like that in the Ozark Plateau or the driftless zone? Yeah right.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 25, 2022, 02:07:25 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 25, 2022, 10:02:37 AM
When Illinois gets something like this than you can consider it not flat.
https://www.google.com/maps/@38.449666,-79.6547105,3a,75y,78.08h,101.21t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sl1hfmktWxcKtcehyBhCQeA!2e0!7i3328!8i1664
The amusing thing for me is having lived on the West Coast half my life the East Coast ranges don't tend to feel all that impressive very often anymore. The first half of my life when I lived in the Midwest and East Coast they did.
The western US is huge and their mountains are impressive. The eastern US not as much I agree.
Excited to analyze Carhorn's submissions, kphoger is at a success rate of just above 50%, so we'll see who the king of Illinois GSV is.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 24, 2022, 06:11:47 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 24, 2022, 02:14:19 PM
For what it's worth, I don't expect to make it to 200, and I think it's an unreasonable target to hit. But it's still a fun challenge anyway.
I think we can do it, the IL extension of the Ozark plateau has numerous examples alone. Here are some from the northern tier of the state which are outside of the Ozark plateau, some even outside of the driftless area.
https://goo.gl/maps/deVwGTfzTA6Bid1UA | 29th Street
https://goo.gl/maps/DgtZojWmESP1A3cRA | IL131
https://goo.gl/maps/s6AEa4984PBp2dAN8 | 9th Street
https://goo.gl/maps/nneAZB1mhdpLsZPQ9 | IL173 (Lake County)
https://goo.gl/maps/fK65QZwWLEce6rfi6 | Hunt Club Rd, Hills off to the sides
https://goo.gl/maps/Sm1iVUDtfmiv9wtS9 | I94
https://goo.gl/maps/WwcTfszj2Kt9pc2U9 | Dilley's Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/nMNT5ncrNdHSfz1K7 | Delany Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/d1zidah84WfivajF8 | Yorkhouse Rd (drivers tend to go slow and ride the brakes here)
https://goo.gl/maps/tLw7HL4ojWzEX2dQA | McAree Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/j5fCUrNKv6ttcxG66 | Jackson St
https://goo.gl/maps/JFjSBddi12iq8PUE8 | Roosevelt Park and nearby Washington St
https://goo.gl/maps/jTdam2mGquAXDc2D7 | South Ave
https://goo.gl/maps/UqKQU7HUrNwUhSsr6 | IL21
https://goo.gl/maps/1aHjFrU9aGAVjCvZA | Casey Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/wuR9qyUY6deAQMph9 |Almond Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/c8VNmaVHrZbeutKz5 | IL120
https://goo.gl/maps/ztzuuXkd9gGXc2Uj8 | IL137 (another brake rider for wimpy drivers)
https://goo.gl/maps/DALYihr5cE5TXTP5A | Midlothian Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/FqXoWHh9T7RTyP796 | Gilmer Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/UkyLfiUEfKtRLnYN6 | IL22
https://goo.gl/maps/rTKFNQseLW7XbZrB6 | Diamond Lake Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/DhNCG4kv1ariGSqo7 | Old McHenry Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/TJZQpxPZQrWwFapj6 | Cuba Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/5RtmrEABVjwrKCSC7 | Krueger Rd
This is just Lake County alone and stuff I drive on daily.
1. You can't be serious
2. better but still flat
3. flat
4. half
5. *trees off to the sides
6. flat
7. Wow! Trees!
8. flat
9. maybe that's because of the blind curve, rather than the nonexistent hill?
10. half
11. flat
12. A creekbed? Really?
13. half
14. flat
15. "hill" in "hill blocks view" is always used loosely
16. flat
17. flat
18. flat
19. flat
20. flat
21. half
22. cool road name, but half
23. flat
24. flat
25. flat
2.5 points. 30.5 is the total as of now.
A thousand points to Kyle because thspfc apparently has no idea what the word flat means.
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 04:59:54 AM
A thousand points to Kyle because thspfc apparently has no idea what the word flat means.
Many of us don't according to Crash_It
People who don't know flat aren't in my shoes of my neighborhood.
Quote from: thspfc on May 25, 2022, 09:22:08 PM
Excited to analyze Carhorn's submissions, kphoger is at a success rate of just above 50%, so we'll see who the king of Illinois GSV is.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 24, 2022, 06:11:47 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 24, 2022, 02:14:19 PM
For what it's worth, I don't expect to make it to 200, and I think it's an unreasonable target to hit. But it's still a fun challenge anyway.
I think we can do it, the IL extension of the Ozark plateau has numerous examples alone. Here are some from the northern tier of the state which are outside of the Ozark plateau, some even outside of the driftless area.
https://goo.gl/maps/deVwGTfzTA6Bid1UA | 29th Street
https://goo.gl/maps/DgtZojWmESP1A3cRA | IL131
https://goo.gl/maps/s6AEa4984PBp2dAN8 | 9th Street
https://goo.gl/maps/nneAZB1mhdpLsZPQ9 | IL173 (Lake County)
https://goo.gl/maps/fK65QZwWLEce6rfi6 | Hunt Club Rd, Hills off to the sides
https://goo.gl/maps/Sm1iVUDtfmiv9wtS9 | I94
https://goo.gl/maps/WwcTfszj2Kt9pc2U9 | Dilley's Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/nMNT5ncrNdHSfz1K7 | Delany Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/d1zidah84WfivajF8 | Yorkhouse Rd (drivers tend to go slow and ride the brakes here)
https://goo.gl/maps/tLw7HL4ojWzEX2dQA | McAree Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/j5fCUrNKv6ttcxG66 | Jackson St
https://goo.gl/maps/JFjSBddi12iq8PUE8 | Roosevelt Park and nearby Washington St
https://goo.gl/maps/jTdam2mGquAXDc2D7 | South Ave
https://goo.gl/maps/UqKQU7HUrNwUhSsr6 | IL21
https://goo.gl/maps/1aHjFrU9aGAVjCvZA | Casey Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/wuR9qyUY6deAQMph9 |Almond Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/c8VNmaVHrZbeutKz5 | IL120
https://goo.gl/maps/ztzuuXkd9gGXc2Uj8 | IL137 (another brake rider for wimpy drivers)
https://goo.gl/maps/DALYihr5cE5TXTP5A | Midlothian Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/FqXoWHh9T7RTyP796 | Gilmer Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/UkyLfiUEfKtRLnYN6 | IL22
https://goo.gl/maps/rTKFNQseLW7XbZrB6 | Diamond Lake Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/DhNCG4kv1ariGSqo7 | Old McHenry Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/TJZQpxPZQrWwFapj6 | Cuba Rd
https://goo.gl/maps/5RtmrEABVjwrKCSC7 | Krueger Rd
This is just Lake County alone and stuff I drive on daily.
1. You can't be serious
2. better but still flat
3. flat
4. half
5. *trees off to the sides
6. flat
7. Wow! Trees!
8. flat
9. maybe that's because of the blind curve, rather than the nonexistent hill?
10. half
11. flat
12. A creekbed? Really?
13. half
14. flat
15. "hill" in "hill blocks view" is always used loosely
16. flat
17. flat
18. flat
19. flat
20. flat
21. half
22. cool road name, but half
23. flat
24. flat
25. flat
2.5 points. 30.5 is the total as of now.
A hill blocks view sign would not be posted on flat land. Again, look at my post above for what an example of flat land is.
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 05:45:42 AM
People who don't know flat aren't in my shoes of my neighborhood.
Yours isn't flat, it's angled ;)
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 04:59:54 AM
A thousand points to Kyle because thspfc apparently has no idea what the word flat means.
Whose line is it anyway?
My favorite is that he responded with "flat" about a GSV shot on a road
with a climbing lane.
Quote from: kphoger on May 26, 2022, 10:00:00 AM
Quote from: thspfc on May 25, 2022, 08:58:54 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 24, 2022, 03:07:08 PM
[28 links]
[25 responses]
You're skipping some.
K, I'll give you 3 free points for skips, bringing your total to 33.5. Though I haven't looked at the most recent ones yet.
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 04:59:54 AM
A thousand points to Kyle because thspfc apparently has no idea what the word flat means.
So here's who thinks "flat" means put a leveling tool on the ground and have the bubble exactly in the middle to the millimeter:
- Illinois resident
- former Illinois and now Kansas resident
- Oklahoma resident
Can we get some diversity of sources on this?
Quote from: thspfc on May 26, 2022, 12:19:40 PM
K, I'll give you 3 free points for skips, bringing your total to 33.5. Though I haven't looked at the most recent ones yet.
It kind of doesn't matter, because you think hills are flat.
Quote from: kphoger on May 26, 2022, 12:23:15 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 26, 2022, 12:19:40 PM
K, I'll give you 3 free points for skips, bringing your total to 33.5. Though I haven't looked at the most recent ones yet.
It kind of doesn't matter, because you think hills are flat.
I think ditches are flat, yes. The ones with small hills get half a point. The ones with real hills get a full point.
Quote from: thspfc on May 26, 2022, 12:19:40 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 26, 2022, 10:00:00 AM
Quote from: thspfc on May 25, 2022, 08:58:54 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 24, 2022, 03:07:08 PM
[28 links]
[25 responses]
You're skipping some.
K, I'll give you 3 free points for skips, bringing your total to 33.5. Though I haven't looked at the most recent ones yet.
No, his total is 1033.5. I gave him a thousand points, remember?
Quote from: thspfc on May 26, 2022, 12:22:26 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 04:59:54 AM
A thousand points to Kyle because thspfc apparently has no idea what the word flat means.
So here's who thinks "flat" means put a leveling tool on the ground and have the bubble exactly in the middle to the millimeter:
- Illinois resident
- former Illinois and now Kansas resident
- Oklahoma resident
Can we get some diversity of sources on this?
Yes, I think it's very telling that those who are defending Carhorn on this are all from the Great Plains. Where one lives can certainly influence what one considers to be "flat". For instance, back when I was growing up, I thought this (https://www.google.com/maps/@43.1183895,-77.5700579,3a,75y,225.21h,74.21t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1st7JDtqFFVvSiAmhVRqFYQQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) was a hill. Now, not so much. This (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.7700288,-73.7739397,3a,75y,322.07h,79.56t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sTqQ9jpn7HJ1UaM6LGJeU5g!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DTqQ9jpn7HJ1UaM6LGJeU5g%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D72.31792%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192) is more of a hill. Still, "I can find a hill in Illinois" or even "this small piece of Illinois has hills" does not qualify Illinois from being flat (overall). Ironically, Carhorn's example of somewhere that he considers flat seems to be representative of the majority of the state per the terrain layer and some street view exploration. Yeah, the southern and northwest corners are hilly... but the vast majority of the state is grade A Flatlandia.
Quote from: thspfc on May 25, 2022, 08:47:57 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 24, 2022, 01:35:06 PM
https://goo.gl/maps/dRR8bwFtx1o1tE7i8 | I 57
8. flat
Quote from: thspfc on May 26, 2022, 12:27:31 PM
I think ditches are flat, yes. The ones with small hills get half a point. The ones with real hills get a full point.
You called a straight-on shot of a glacial boundary with a 350-foot elevation gain "flat". Are you saying that counts as a "ditch"?
Quote from: vdeane on May 26, 2022, 12:40:01 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 26, 2022, 12:22:26 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 04:59:54 AM
A thousand points to Kyle because thspfc apparently has no idea what the word flat means.
So here's who thinks "flat" means put a leveling tool on the ground and have the bubble exactly in the middle to the millimeter:
- Illinois resident
- former Illinois and now Kansas resident
- Oklahoma resident
Can we get some diversity of sources on this?
Yes, I think it's very telling that those who are defending Carhorn on this are all from the Great Plains. Where one lives can certainly influence what one considers to be "flat". For instance, back when I was growing up, I thought this (https://www.google.com/maps/@43.1183895,-77.5700579,3a,75y,225.21h,74.21t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1st7JDtqFFVvSiAmhVRqFYQQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) was a hill. Now, not so much. This (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.7700288,-73.7739397,3a,75y,322.07h,79.56t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sTqQ9jpn7HJ1UaM6LGJeU5g!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DTqQ9jpn7HJ1UaM6LGJeU5g%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D72.31792%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192) is more of a hill. Still, "I can find a hill in Illinois" or even "this small piece of Illinois has hills" does not qualify Illinois from being flat (overall). Ironically, Carhorn's example of somewhere that he considers flat seems to be representative of the majority of the state per the terrain layer and some street view exploration. Yeah, the southern and northwest corners are hilly... but the vast majority of the state is grade A Flatlandia.
Problem is, looking at the state with the terrain layer enabled shows that it's not all like that. The area I referenced in that example a few posts back was in Douglas County which is the flattest county in the state. There are no other counties in the state that look like Douglas County on the terrain layer for a significant amount of distance. This is the only area in Illinois that can be found to be truly flat. One can see this on I57 from just South of Champaign to Neoga. The terrain layer on Google maps verifies this. Around Neoga the landscape looks less like Douglas County and more like McHenry County.
Edit: Even Douglas County has some hilly terrain, granted it's on the edge of the county but hilly terrain nonetheless
https://maps.app.goo.gl/m7VUjy1XnXxXYgrJ6
Quote from: vdeane on May 26, 2022, 12:40:01 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 26, 2022, 12:22:26 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 04:59:54 AM
A thousand points to Kyle because thspfc apparently has no idea what the word flat means.
So here's who thinks "flat" means put a leveling tool on the ground and have the bubble exactly in the middle to the millimeter:
- Illinois resident
- former Illinois and now Kansas resident
- Oklahoma resident
Can we get some diversity of sources on this?
Yes, I think it's very telling that those who are defending Carhorn on this are all from the Great Plains. Where one lives can certainly influence what one considers to be "flat". For instance, back when I was growing up, I thought this (https://www.google.com/maps/@43.1183895,-77.5700579,3a,75y,225.21h,74.21t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1st7JDtqFFVvSiAmhVRqFYQQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) was a hill. Now, not so much. This (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.7700288,-73.7739397,3a,75y,322.07h,79.56t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sTqQ9jpn7HJ1UaM6LGJeU5g!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DTqQ9jpn7HJ1UaM6LGJeU5g%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D72.31792%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192) is more of a hill. Still, "I can find a hill in Illinois" or even "this small piece of Illinois has hills" does not qualify Illinois from being flat (overall). Ironically, Carhorn's example of somewhere that he considers flat seems to be representative of the majority of the state per the terrain layer and some street view exploration. Yeah, the southern and northwest corners are hilly... but the vast majority of the state is grade A Flatlandia.
Everyone can be wrong. Yeah, the majority of Illinois is flat. Yeah, a lot of the stuff Crash posts claiming to be hilly is not really hilly. But thspc's insisting that anything less than a 50% grade is flat is also really silly.
My yardstick for whether something is flat or not is whether I would notice the grade if I were to ride up it on a bicycle. If I would consider stopping and taking a breather before attempting to continue up it, it's not flat.
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 01:06:17 PM
Yeah, the majority of Illinois is flat.
Yeah, a lot of the stuff Crash posts claiming to be hilly is not really hilly.
For the record, I wholeheartedly agree with both of those statements.
Remember, after all, that I'm the one who started the "IL is mostly but not completely flat, but most of its hills are unexceptional" thread. The title sums up my honest opinion about Illinois's topography.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 12:59:29 PM
Re: Flat Wars: Episode I: The Illinois Menace
:popcorn:
If you can't sled down it if it was covered in snow, it's not a hill.
Quote from: GaryV on May 26, 2022, 01:41:50 PM
If you can't sled down it if it was covered in snow, it's not a hill.
I used to sled down this hill when I was coming up
https://maps.app.goo.gl/VhHykDtp7KcummK87
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 02:04:43 PM
Quote from: GaryV on May 26, 2022, 01:41:50 PM
If you can't sled down it if it was covered in snow, it's not a hill.
I used to sled down this hill when I was coming up
https://maps.app.goo.gl/VhHykDtp7KcummK87
This isn't my usual snark. I mean this seriously. What hill? It looks like there's about a 2° grade for about 10 feet.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on May 26, 2022, 02:08:32 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 02:04:43 PM
Quote from: GaryV on May 26, 2022, 01:41:50 PM
If you can't sled down it if it was covered in snow, it's not a hill.
I used to sled down this hill when I was coming up
https://maps.app.goo.gl/VhHykDtp7KcummK87
This isn't my usual snark. I mean this seriously. What hill? It looks like there's about a 2° grade for about 10 feet.
Meh. I see a sledding slope there.
But...Illinois is flat.
Quote from: Rothman on May 26, 2022, 02:13:47 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on May 26, 2022, 02:08:32 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 02:04:43 PM
Quote from: GaryV on May 26, 2022, 01:41:50 PM
If you can't sled down it if it was covered in snow, it's not a hill.
I used to sled down this hill when I was coming up
https://maps.app.goo.gl/VhHykDtp7KcummK87
This isn't my usual snark. I mean this seriously. What hill? It looks like there's about a 2° grade for about 10 feet.
Meh. I see a sledding slope there.
But...Illinois is flat.
If I don't travel for at least 50 feet, and I don't see that in that picture, I'm not sledding it. That's just walking around with a sled in your hands and occasionally sitting down.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 02:04:43 PM
Quote from: GaryV on May 26, 2022, 01:41:50 PM
If you can't sled down it if it was covered in snow, it's not a hill.
I used to sled down this hill when I was coming up
https://maps.app.goo.gl/VhHykDtp7KcummK87
When I was living in the area,
this hill (https://goo.gl/maps/aZiLXpwCfWEvaAKg9) was positively crawling with sleds in the winter. I see from GSV that they've since added a sign reading 'ALL SEASONAL SPORTING ACTIVITIES PROHIBITED'.
But that doesn't mean Wheaton isn't flat.
(
This does (https://goo.gl/maps/XgfK9oCRjE7Jubw19).) :-P
Quote from: kphoger on May 26, 2022, 02:23:17 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 02:04:43 PM
Quote from: GaryV on May 26, 2022, 01:41:50 PM
If you can't sled down it if it was covered in snow, it's not a hill.
I used to sled down this hill when I was coming up
https://maps.app.goo.gl/VhHykDtp7KcummK87
When I was living in the area, this hill (https://goo.gl/maps/aZiLXpwCfWEvaAKg9) was positively crawling with sleds in the winter. I see from GSV that they've since added a sign reading 'ALL SEASONAL SPORTING ACTIVITIES PROHIBITED'.
But that doesn't mean Wheaton isn't flat.
(This does (https://goo.gl/maps/XgfK9oCRjE7Jubw19).) :-P
That looks like you could at least go 50'. Not a grrreeeaaattt sledding hill, but at least reasonable.
Quote from: kphoger on May 26, 2022, 12:41:23 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 25, 2022, 08:47:57 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 24, 2022, 01:35:06 PM
https://goo.gl/maps/dRR8bwFtx1o1tE7i8 | I 57
8. flat
Quote from: thspfc on May 26, 2022, 12:27:31 PM
I think ditches are flat, yes. The ones with small hills get half a point. The ones with real hills get a full point.
You called a straight-on shot of a glacial boundary with a 350-foot elevation gain "flat". Are you saying that counts as a "ditch"?
I don't remember giving that no points. I think I gave it half, or at least I should have given it half, for elevation change. But it's not particularly steep, as evidenced by how an Interstate runs straight up it with no curves.
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 01:06:17 PM
Quote from: vdeane on May 26, 2022, 12:40:01 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 26, 2022, 12:22:26 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 04:59:54 AM
A thousand points to Kyle because thspfc apparently has no idea what the word flat means.
So here's who thinks "flat" means put a leveling tool on the ground and have the bubble exactly in the middle to the millimeter:
- Illinois resident
- former Illinois and now Kansas resident
- Oklahoma resident
Can we get some diversity of sources on this?
Yes, I think it's very telling that those who are defending Carhorn on this are all from the Great Plains. Where one lives can certainly influence what one considers to be "flat". For instance, back when I was growing up, I thought this (https://www.google.com/maps/@43.1183895,-77.5700579,3a,75y,225.21h,74.21t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1st7JDtqFFVvSiAmhVRqFYQQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) was a hill. Now, not so much. This (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.7700288,-73.7739397,3a,75y,322.07h,79.56t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sTqQ9jpn7HJ1UaM6LGJeU5g!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DTqQ9jpn7HJ1UaM6LGJeU5g%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D72.31792%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192) is more of a hill. Still, "I can find a hill in Illinois" or even "this small piece of Illinois has hills" does not qualify Illinois from being flat (overall). Ironically, Carhorn's example of somewhere that he considers flat seems to be representative of the majority of the state per the terrain layer and some street view exploration. Yeah, the southern and northwest corners are hilly... but the vast majority of the state is grade A Flatlandia.
Everyone can be wrong. Yeah, the majority of Illinois is flat. Yeah, a lot of the stuff Crash posts claiming to be hilly is not really hilly. But thspc's insisting that anything less than a 50% grade is flat is also really silly.
My yardstick for whether something is flat or not is whether I would notice the grade if I were to ride up it on a bicycle. If I would consider stopping and taking a breather before attempting to continue up it, it's not flat.
How often do you ride a bike? I ride often, am in very good physical shape compared to the average American, and I notice just about every grade on a bike. The street I live on looks flat as a pancake to the naked eye, but when I ride my bike up and down it, one direction is significantly easier.
Quote from: kphoger on May 26, 2022, 01:11:35 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 01:06:17 PM
Yeah, the majority of Illinois is flat.
Yeah, a lot of the stuff Crash posts claiming to be hilly is not really hilly.
For the record, I wholeheartedly agree with both of those statements.
Remember, after all, that I'm the one who started the "IL is mostly but not completely flat, but most of its hills are unexceptional" thread. The title sums up my honest opinion about Illinois's topography.
And I agree with that statement as well. But Illinois is flat enough that the "Illinois is flat" generalization can accurately be made IMO.
Quote from: thspfc on May 26, 2022, 02:45:42 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 01:06:17 PM
Quote from: vdeane on May 26, 2022, 12:40:01 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 26, 2022, 12:22:26 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 04:59:54 AM
A thousand points to Kyle because thspfc apparently has no idea what the word flat means.
So here's who thinks "flat" means put a leveling tool on the ground and have the bubble exactly in the middle to the millimeter:
- Illinois resident
- former Illinois and now Kansas resident
- Oklahoma resident
Can we get some diversity of sources on this?
Yes, I think it's very telling that those who are defending Carhorn on this are all from the Great Plains. Where one lives can certainly influence what one considers to be "flat". For instance, back when I was growing up, I thought this (https://www.google.com/maps/@43.1183895,-77.5700579,3a,75y,225.21h,74.21t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1st7JDtqFFVvSiAmhVRqFYQQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) was a hill. Now, not so much. This (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.7700288,-73.7739397,3a,75y,322.07h,79.56t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sTqQ9jpn7HJ1UaM6LGJeU5g!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DTqQ9jpn7HJ1UaM6LGJeU5g%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D72.31792%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192) is more of a hill. Still, "I can find a hill in Illinois" or even "this small piece of Illinois has hills" does not qualify Illinois from being flat (overall). Ironically, Carhorn's example of somewhere that he considers flat seems to be representative of the majority of the state per the terrain layer and some street view exploration. Yeah, the southern and northwest corners are hilly... but the vast majority of the state is grade A Flatlandia.
Everyone can be wrong. Yeah, the majority of Illinois is flat. Yeah, a lot of the stuff Crash posts claiming to be hilly is not really hilly. But thspc's insisting that anything less than a 50% grade is flat is also really silly.
My yardstick for whether something is flat or not is whether I would notice the grade if I were to ride up it on a bicycle. If I would consider stopping and taking a breather before attempting to continue up it, it's not flat.
How often do you ride a bike? I ride often, am in very good physical shape compared to the average American, and I notice just about every grade on a bike. The street I live on looks flat as a pancake to the naked eye, but when I ride my bike up and down it, one direction is significantly easier.
Your street isn't flat, then. Sorry.
Any state the size of Illinois is going to have some degree of hills here and there but that doesn't mean that overall Illinois is a hilly state. That is the whole point it's overall as a state Illinois is a flat state. Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
I'm currently in the process of planning a family vacation to southern Illinois, and I'm having trouble narrowing down the activities to stay within budget.
For now, I'm planning to camp in the Shawnee National Forest and do some hikes there, plus probably some hikes at a state park or two. Then we'll probably visit a couple of vineyards and do some wine tasting. The zipline in Grafton is out of our price range, but I might be able to talk one or two of the kids into
the aerial gondola ride (https://goo.gl/maps/eFBbNypjY55Gw5778) there. Still in the planning stages.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 03:03:12 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 26, 2022, 02:45:42 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 01:06:17 PM
Quote from: vdeane on May 26, 2022, 12:40:01 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 26, 2022, 12:22:26 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 04:59:54 AM
A thousand points to Kyle because thspfc apparently has no idea what the word flat means.
So here's who thinks "flat" means put a leveling tool on the ground and have the bubble exactly in the middle to the millimeter:
- Illinois resident
- former Illinois and now Kansas resident
- Oklahoma resident
Can we get some diversity of sources on this?
Yes, I think it's very telling that those who are defending Carhorn on this are all from the Great Plains. Where one lives can certainly influence what one considers to be "flat". For instance, back when I was growing up, I thought this (https://www.google.com/maps/@43.1183895,-77.5700579,3a,75y,225.21h,74.21t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1st7JDtqFFVvSiAmhVRqFYQQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) was a hill. Now, not so much. This (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.7700288,-73.7739397,3a,75y,322.07h,79.56t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sTqQ9jpn7HJ1UaM6LGJeU5g!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DTqQ9jpn7HJ1UaM6LGJeU5g%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D72.31792%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192) is more of a hill. Still, "I can find a hill in Illinois" or even "this small piece of Illinois has hills" does not qualify Illinois from being flat (overall). Ironically, Carhorn's example of somewhere that he considers flat seems to be representative of the majority of the state per the terrain layer and some street view exploration. Yeah, the southern and northwest corners are hilly... but the vast majority of the state is grade A Flatlandia.
Everyone can be wrong. Yeah, the majority of Illinois is flat. Yeah, a lot of the stuff Crash posts claiming to be hilly is not really hilly. But thspc's insisting that anything less than a 50% grade is flat is also really silly.
My yardstick for whether something is flat or not is whether I would notice the grade if I were to ride up it on a bicycle. If I would consider stopping and taking a breather before attempting to continue up it, it's not flat.
How often do you ride a bike? I ride often, am in very good physical shape compared to the average American, and I notice just about every grade on a bike. The street I live on looks flat as a pancake to the naked eye, but when I ride my bike up and down it, one direction is significantly easier.
Your street isn't flat, then. Sorry.
So then by this logic not even Florida is flat . . . lol
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
OK, now, come on. There's plenty to do in Michigan too. I would totally go to Michigan on vacation, if for no other reason than its state parks and national parks.
Quote from: thspfc on May 26, 2022, 05:04:10 PM
So then by this logic not even Florida is flat . . . lol
No... By that definition, a picture of a hill in Florida isn't a picture of flatness. That's the issue. You asked for GSV shots of non-flatness in Illinois. Then, when presented with scores of them, you dismiss half the hills as "flat".
Quote from: kphoger on May 26, 2022, 04:16:03 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
I'm currently in the process of planning a family vacation to southern Illinois, and I'm having trouble narrowing down the activities to stay within budget.
For now, I'm planning to camp in the Shawnee National Forest and do some hikes there, plus probably some hikes at a state park or two. Then we'll probably visit a couple of vineyards and do some wine tasting. The zipline in Grafton is out of our price range, but I might be able to talk one or two of the kids into the aerial gondola ride (https://goo.gl/maps/eFBbNypjY55Gw5778) there. Still in the planning stages.
" Rather boring" as in, boring compared to many states. Not completely boring or the most boring.
Quote from: kphoger on May 26, 2022, 05:05:56 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 26, 2022, 05:04:10 PM
So then by this logic not even Florida is flat . . . lol
No... By that definition, a picture of a hill in Florida isn't a picture of flatness. That's the issue. You asked for GSV shots of non-flatness in Illinois. Then, when presented with scores of them, you dismiss half the hills as "flat".
Because I thought you were going to give me hills instead of ditches.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
No dude it isn't and not even close. You think Illinois has more to offer than Michigan does? If that's the case then tell your state's residents to stop vacationing here, stop coming to our lakes, stop entering our state if Illinois has so much to do then you shouldn't be coming to Michigan to spend your vacations. But what you said is totally incorrect as usual. I don't know why anyone should consider you as a source of what Michigan has to offer when you yourself said that you haven't been any further into the state than Niles. Michigan is far from being a boring state. Just because I said that Illinois is boring your comeback is that Michigan is boring? Not a very good source there.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 05:12:21 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
No dude it isn't and not even close. You think Illinois has more to offer than Michigan does? If that's the case then tell your state's residents to stop vacationing here, stop coming to our lakes, stop entering our state if Illinois has so much to do then you shouldn't be coming to Michigan to spend your vacations. But what you said is totally incorrect as usual. I don't know why anyone should consider you as a source of what Michigan has to offer when you yourself said that you haven't been any further into the state than Niles. Michigan is far from being a boring state. Just because I said that Illinois is boring your comeback is that Michigan is boring? Not a very good source there.
Without Chicago, Michigan is the more fun state by far. But Illinois does have Chicago, while Michigan's big city is Detroit.
I'd still give a slight edge to Michigan but it's not a slam dunk.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
Took me less than two years to burn out on Illinois, it's slim pickings outside Chicago. I still find interesting things to do that I haven't seen in Michigan (even after living there 13 years). About the only state Illinois is going to beat consistently in the Midwest is Indiana. Even then, Indiana has the favored beach on Lake Michigan for Chicago area residents.
Quote from: thspfc on May 26, 2022, 05:20:25 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 05:12:21 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
No dude it isn't and not even close. You think Illinois has more to offer than Michigan does? If that's the case then tell your state's residents to stop vacationing here, stop coming to our lakes, stop entering our state if Illinois has so much to do then you shouldn't be coming to Michigan to spend your vacations. But what you said is totally incorrect as usual. I don't know why anyone should consider you as a source of what Michigan has to offer when you yourself said that you haven't been any further into the state than Niles. Michigan is far from being a boring state. Just because I said that Illinois is boring your comeback is that Michigan is boring? Not a very good source there.
Without Chicago, Michigan is the more fun state by far. But Illinois does have Chicago, while Michigan's big city is Detroit.
I'd still give a slight edge to Michigan but it's not a slam dunk.
That's true but Detroit and Chicago only take up a small percentage of each state. I'd argue that Detroit's suburbs rival Chicago's suburbs pretty closely. Chicago has a bigger downtown and a more built up urban fabric but outside of that the city isn't much different than Detroit.
If you take Detroit and Chicago away Michigan blows Illinois away.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Sorting that list by "Nightlife" places Illinois behind ... Wisconsin, of all places. I guess that makes Wisconsin better than Illinois.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
I'm sorry. Having Alaska be 33rd on that list rules out any slight hint of credibility it could have. Alaska is epic.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on May 26, 2022, 05:40:19 PM
I'm sorry. Having Alaska be 33rd on that list rules out any slight hint of credibility it could have. Alaska is epic.
He only cherry picks the lists and categories that paint Illinois as elite, and dismisses or ignores any that suggest it's not the best state in America in every metric.
There was the deleted discussion where he claimed Illinois's neighbors could only dream of having the lifestyle and quality of life they do in Illinois, when other neighboring states generally equaled or surpassed it in all his chosen metrics.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 05:12:21 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
No dude it isn't and not even close. You think Illinois has more to offer than Michigan does? If that's the case then tell your state's residents to stop vacationing here, stop coming to our lakes, stop entering our state if Illinois has so much to do then you shouldn't be coming to Michigan to spend your vacations. But what you said is totally incorrect as usual. I don't know why anyone should consider you as a source of what Michigan has to offer when you yourself said that you haven't been any further into the state than Niles. Michigan is far from being a boring state. Just because I said that Illinois is boring your comeback is that Michigan is boring? Not a very good source there.
If Michigan had more to offer than Illinois then Michigan would be higher on the list now wouldn't it? The only reason why people vacation there is because Illinois residents don't consider remaining in Illinois as a vacation. Not to mention that I can go just about anywhere in this state and get a good meal. Can't say the same for any other neighboring state. I did mention on my Facebook page that Illinois has 2,900 lakes within it's borders and that excludes the artificial ones.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 05:57:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 05:12:21 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
No dude it isn't and not even close. You think Illinois has more to offer than Michigan does? If that's the case then tell your state's residents to stop vacationing here, stop coming to our lakes, stop entering our state if Illinois has so much to do then you shouldn't be coming to Michigan to spend your vacations. But what you said is totally incorrect as usual. I don't know why anyone should consider you as a source of what Michigan has to offer when you yourself said that you haven't been any further into the state than Niles. Michigan is far from being a boring state. Just because I said that Illinois is boring your comeback is that Michigan is boring? Not a very good source there.
If Michigan had more to offer than Illinois then Michigan would be higher on the list now wouldn't it? The only reason why people vacation there is because Illinois residents don't consider remaining in Illinois as a vacation. Not to mention that I can go just about anywhere in this state and get a good meal. Can't say the same for any other neighboring state. I did mention on my Facebook page that Illinois has 2,900 lakes within it's borders and that excludes the artificial ones.
You do realize you're the guy who based an opinion off a state solely on what he saw on I-90 and I-94 right? So pardon me if I take your biased pro-Illinois opinion for what it is. Also, Wallethub is the best citation you go?
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 26, 2022, 05:22:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
Took me less than two years to burn out on Illinois, it's slim pickings outside Chicago. I still find interesting things to do that I haven't seen in Michigan (even after living there 13 years). About the only state Illinois is going to beat consistently in the Midwest is Indiana. Even then, Indiana has the favored beach on Lake Michigan for Chicago area residents.
You haven't been going to the right places then because there's tons even outside of Chicago. Here are 10 things to do around Springfield
https://www.sj-r.com/story/lifestyle/travel/2022/05/26/10-things-to-see-do-summer-within-100-miles-springfield/9907855002/
Another good resource to check is this site as well:
https://www.onlyinyourstate.com/states/illinois/
And then there's this one
https://www.illinoisouth.org/
And finally the flagship site for Illinois tourism:
https://www.enjoyillinois.com/
Even my own YouTube channel is a resource.. I also spotlight points of interest in any video I make outside of the videos of bad drivers.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 06:03:25 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 26, 2022, 05:22:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
Took me less than two years to burn out on Illinois, it's slim pickings outside Chicago. I still find interesting things to do that I haven't seen in Michigan (even after living there 13 years). About the only state Illinois is going to beat consistently in the Midwest is Indiana. Even then, Indiana has the favored beach on Lake Michigan for Chicago area residents.
You haven't been going to the right places then because there's tons even outside of Chicago. Here are 10 things to do around Springfield
https://www.sj-r.com/story/lifestyle/travel/2022/05/26/10-things-to-see-do-summer-within-100-miles-springfield/9907855002/
Another good resource to check is this site as well:
https://www.onlyinyourstate.com/states/illinois/
And then there's this one
https://www.illinoisouth.org/
And finally the flagship site for Illinois tourism:
https://www.enjoyillinois.com/
Even my own YouTube channel is a resource.. I also spotlight points of interest in any video I make outside of the videos of bad drivers.
You think that you are resource for anything? Especially after what you said on the trucker page yesterday? Why don't you show everyone the person they are actually dealing talking to in this thread?
https://fb.watch/dfJ7kbR8kb/
Pro tip, the internet never forgets the stupid shit people say and what you said was next level stupid. So yeah, when someone comes along with an opinion about Illinois that isn't making "HIV piss bottle" jokes maybe I'll consider what they have to say.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 05:57:56 PM
I did mention on my Facebook page that Illinois has 2,900 lakes within it's borders and that excludes the artificial ones.
Yeah...Wisconsin and Minnesota have over 11,000 each, and Michigan has 4 Great Lakes to Illinois' 1.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 05:57:56 PM
Not to mention that I can go just about anywhere in this state and get a good meal.
I really do cringe at 80% of what you say. But, credit where credit is due. Illinois does have good food at its restaurants. Especially in Chicagoland, pizza is consistently good, Mexican is nearly as consistent, and there are a LOT of hidden gem family diners. But the food I've had farther downstate has been great too.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 05:57:56 PM
If Michigan had more to offer than Illinois then Michigan would be higher on the list now wouldn't it? The only reason why people vacation there is because Illinois residents don't consider remaining in Illinois as a vacation.
Where are all the Michiganders vacationing in Illinois (other than Chicago)? Shouldn't it swing both ways? No, the reason it doesn't is that Illinoisans have an accurate view of things: Michigan is better vacation country than Illinois. The Michigan Dunes have been Chicagoans vacationland for many decades, with good reason. Michigan is one state I'd definitely be willing to explore more of.
The truth is that most states have plenty of opportunities to explore–but you have to go in looking for them with open eyes. It seems your eyes are taped wide open when it comes to Illinois, but you refuse to open them more than a squint when it comes to any bordering state. Get off your high horse.
I will point out that when discussing things to do and not flatness, it makes more sense to use population as a frame of reference, in which 2/3 of Illinois is Chicagoland. You would expect downstate not to have much. (That said, some states have points of interest in rural areas, such as scenery or major historical sites. Illinois doesn't.)
Quote from: 1 on May 26, 2022, 07:18:03 PM
(That said, some states have points of interest in rural areas, such as scenery or major historical sites. Illinois doesn't.)
False. There's plenty scenery and historical sites in Illinois outside of Chicago...
Cahokia mounds
Lowden State Park which is home to the Blackhawk Indian statue in Oregon Illinois
Fort Defiance near Cairo
Just to name a few. The fact that you would even type that just shows how misinformed you are about Illinois.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
I don't often laugh out loud when reading forum posts, but this one... this one did it.
What's your take on Wisconsin then? More or less interesting than Illinois?
^^^
He's already toured it fully on I-94 and I-90. :rolleyes:
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 07:38:31 PM
Quote from: 1 on May 26, 2022, 07:18:03 PM
(That said, some states have points of interest in rural areas, such as scenery or major historical sites. Illinois doesn't.)
False. There's plenty scenery and historical sites in Illinois outside of Chicago...
Cahokia mounds
Lowden State Park which is home to the Blackhawk Indian statue in Oregon Illinois
Fort Defiance near Cairo
Just to name a few. The fact that you would even type that just shows how misinformed you are about Illinois.
At least he doesn't throw out causal accusations of racism and makes jokes about HIV. Must be that wide angle dash cam view that's making you do things like that.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 05:25:27 PM
If you take Detroit and Chicago away Michigan blows Illinois away.
So you're saying skyscrapers make Illinois less flat?
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 26, 2022, 07:41:06 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
I don't often laugh out loud when reading forum posts, but this one... this one did it.
What's your take on Wisconsin then? More or less interesting than Illinois?
You do realize his disdain for WI.
Every state is interesting.*
*except maybe Iowa
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 08:43:23 PM
Every state is interesting.*
*except maybe Iowa
Hey, Iowa is great if you have a corn fetish.
Quote from: LilianaUwU on May 26, 2022, 08:46:32 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 08:43:23 PM
Every state is interesting.*
*except maybe Iowa
Hey, Iowa is great if you have a corn fetish.
no, just idiots out wandering around
Quote from: SSOWorld on May 26, 2022, 08:49:25 PM
Quote from: LilianaUwU on May 26, 2022, 08:46:32 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 08:43:23 PM
Every state is interesting.*
*except maybe Iowa
Hey, Iowa is great if you have a corn fetish.
no, just idiots out wandering around
Ooh! You know Iowa jokes! OK, here's one:
What's the best thing to come out of Iowa?
Quote from: kphoger on May 26, 2022, 09:02:23 PM
Quote from: SSOWorld on May 26, 2022, 08:49:25 PM
Quote from: LilianaUwU on May 26, 2022, 08:46:32 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 26, 2022, 08:43:23 PM
Every state is interesting.*
*except maybe Iowa
Hey, Iowa is great if you have a corn fetish.
no, just idiots out wandering around
Ooh! You know Iowa jokes! OK, here's one:
What's the best thing to come out of Iowa?
I-35?
Nope.
It's I-80.
Close, though.
Quote from: kphoger on May 26, 2022, 09:11:55 PM
Nope.
It's I-80.
Close, though.
More MLB games have been played in Iowa (1) than in many other states.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 05:57:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 05:12:21 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
No dude it isn't and not even close. You think Illinois has more to offer than Michigan does? If that's the case then tell your state's residents to stop vacationing here, stop coming to our lakes, stop entering our state if Illinois has so much to do then you shouldn't be coming to Michigan to spend your vacations. But what you said is totally incorrect as usual. I don't know why anyone should consider you as a source of what Michigan has to offer when you yourself said that you haven't been any further into the state than Niles. Michigan is far from being a boring state. Just because I said that Illinois is boring your comeback is that Michigan is boring? Not a very good source there.
If Michigan had more to offer than Illinois then Michigan would be higher on the list now wouldn't it? The only reason why people vacation there is because Illinois residents don't consider remaining in Illinois as a vacation. Not to mention that I can go just about anywhere in this state and get a good meal. Can't say the same for any other neighboring state. I did mention on my Facebook page that Illinois has 2,900 lakes within it's borders and that excludes the artificial ones.
Wow so some list on the internet is the tell all that Illinois is a fun state. This list doesn't do anything to prove your point. Lol @ your reasoning on why Illinois residents vacation in Michigan. So what? I can go anywhere in Michigan and get a good meal too doesn't make it less fun than Illinois. So your claim to, "Can't say the same for any other neighboring state" is totally incorrect, besides how would you know? You've only ventured as far as Niles in Michigan. Good for Illinois. Michigan has over 11,000 lakes of five acres or more and many more smaller lakes, them 2,900 lakes don't compare.
For the Great Outdoors Illinois doesn't even come close to Michigan.
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 26, 2022, 07:41:06 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
I don't often laugh out loud when reading forum posts, but this one... this one did it.
What's your take on Wisconsin then? More or less interesting than Illinois?
I absolutely can't stand that place and it's #15 on that list of funnest states. I guess the mistreatment of my grandmother who I was close with within the healthcare system there that led to her eventual death nearly 5 years ago is part of my disdain for that place.
And here's a new article that was just released and again good news for Illinois especially vs Wisconsin and Michigan
https://wallethub.com/edu/best-states-for-millennials/33371
Illinois is still flat.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 06:03:25 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 26, 2022, 05:22:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
Took me less than two years to burn out on Illinois, it's slim pickings outside Chicago. I still find interesting things to do that I haven't seen in Michigan (even after living there 13 years). About the only state Illinois is going to beat consistently in the Midwest is Indiana. Even then, Indiana has the favored beach on Lake Michigan for Chicago area residents.
You haven't been going to the right places then because there's tons even outside of Chicago. Here are 10 things to do around Springfield
https://www.sj-r.com/story/lifestyle/travel/2022/05/26/10-things-to-see-do-summer-within-100-miles-springfield/9907855002/
Another good resource to check is this site as well:
https://www.onlyinyourstate.com/states/illinois/
And then there's this one
https://www.illinoisouth.org/
And finally the flagship site for Illinois tourism:
https://www.enjoyillinois.com/
Even my own YouTube channel is a resource.. I also spotlight points of interest in any video I make outside of the videos of bad drivers.
So this proves it. You're 100% biased toward Illinois and can't at all admit that another state might be better than Illinois in certain categories. Also are you part of the Springfield tourism department now? I could find just as much in Lansing as Springfield and possibly more. I know I could find more in Grand Rapids than Springfield.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 09:56:58 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 26, 2022, 07:41:06 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
I don't often laugh out loud when reading forum posts, but this one... this one did it.
What's your take on Wisconsin then? More or less interesting than Illinois?
I absolutely can't stand that place and it's #15 on that list of funnest states. I guess the mistreatment of my grandmother who I was close with within the healthcare system there that led to her eventual death nearly 5 years ago is part of my disdain for that place.
And here's a new article that was just released and again good news for Illinois especially vs Wisconsin and Michigan
https://wallethub.com/edu/best-states-for-millennials/33371
Speaking of mistreating people, are you ducking out on answering for this? I thought you were all in on owning what you said on the trucker page?
https://fb.watch/dfWUwC25tF/
Quote from: SSOWorld on May 26, 2022, 07:59:35 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 05:25:27 PM
If you take Detroit and Chicago away Michigan blows Illinois away.
So you're saying skyscrapers make Illinois less flat?
I'm talking about Illinois being boring now. I'm saying that Michigan has more interesting things to do if you take Chicago and Detroit away. For example, I think that Michigan's State Parks blow the one's in Illinois away.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 09:56:58 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 26, 2022, 07:41:06 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
I don't often laugh out loud when reading forum posts, but this one... this one did it.
What's your take on Wisconsin then? More or less interesting than Illinois?
I absolutely can't stand that place and it's #15 on that list of funnest states. I guess the mistreatment of my grandmother who I was close with within the healthcare system there that led to her eventual death nearly 5 years ago is part of my disdain for that place.
And here's a new article that was just released and again good news for Illinois especially vs Wisconsin and Michigan
https://wallethub.com/edu/best-states-for-millennials/33371
Wallethub as your source again? LMAO.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 10:10:19 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 09:56:58 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 26, 2022, 07:41:06 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
I don't often laugh out loud when reading forum posts, but this one... this one did it.
What's your take on Wisconsin then? More or less interesting than Illinois?
I absolutely can't stand that place and it's #15 on that list of funnest states. I guess the mistreatment of my grandmother who I was close with within the healthcare system there that led to her eventual death nearly 5 years ago is part of my disdain for that place.
And here's a new article that was just released and again good news for Illinois especially vs Wisconsin and Michigan
https://wallethub.com/edu/best-states-for-millennials/33371
Wallethub as your source again? LMAO.
Ad hominem.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 10:00:03 PM
You're 100% biased toward Illinois and can't at all admit that another state might be better than Illinois in certain categories.
This, this, a thousand times this.
I'm not saying Michigan is a "slam dunk" or that it "blows away" Illinois–as some others have said–but it does seem a bit ridiculous to claim that Illinois is objectively a better vacation destination than Michigan. Personally, I think Michigan has it by a margin, just not a hugely wide margin. But you seem to be unable to even
consider that it might
possibly be true. That's a problem.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 10:08:09 PM
Quote from: SSOWorld on May 26, 2022, 07:59:35 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 05:25:27 PM
If you take Detroit and Chicago away Michigan blows Illinois away.
So you're saying skyscrapers make Illinois less flat?
I'm talking about Illinois being boring now. I'm saying that Michigan has more interesting things to do if you take Chicago and Detroit away. For example, I think that Michigan's State Parks blow the one's in Illinois away.
Even without Chicago Illinois still might blow Michigan away. They would probably be neck and neck in the worst scenario. You've probably never been to any Illinois state parks except for starved rock (I've seen plates from all over there btw so that alone should say something). Illinois state parks are also FREE vs Michigan, Indiana or even Wisconsin. Minnesota is the other state that has free state parks.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 10:00:03 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 06:03:25 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 26, 2022, 05:22:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
Took me less than two years to burn out on Illinois, it's slim pickings outside Chicago. I still find interesting things to do that I haven't seen in Michigan (even after living there 13 years). About the only state Illinois is going to beat consistently in the Midwest is Indiana. Even then, Indiana has the favored beach on Lake Michigan for Chicago area residents.
You haven't been going to the right places then because there's tons even outside of Chicago. Here are 10 things to do around Springfield
https://www.sj-r.com/story/lifestyle/travel/2022/05/26/10-things-to-see-do-summer-within-100-miles-springfield/9907855002/
Another good resource to check is this site as well:
https://www.onlyinyourstate.com/states/illinois/
And then there's this one
https://www.illinoisouth.org/
And finally the flagship site for Illinois tourism:
https://www.enjoyillinois.com/
Even my own YouTube channel is a resource.. I also spotlight points of interest in any video I make outside of the videos of bad drivers.
So this proves it. You're 100% biased toward Illinois and can't at all admit that another state might be better than Illinois in certain categories. Also are you part of the Springfield tourism department now? I could find just as much in Lansing as Springfield and possibly more. I know I could find more in Grand Rapids than Springfield.
I can almost guarantee that you'll have a much better meal in Springfield than in GR or Lansing. It's a mini version of Chicago. Same thing with Chambana and Blormal.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 10:23:04 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 10:08:09 PM
Quote from: SSOWorld on May 26, 2022, 07:59:35 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 05:25:27 PM
If you take Detroit and Chicago away Michigan blows Illinois away.
So you're saying skyscrapers make Illinois less flat?
I'm talking about Illinois being boring now. I'm saying that Michigan has more interesting things to do if you take Chicago and Detroit away. For example, I think that Michigan's State Parks blow the one's in Illinois away.
Even without Chicago Illinois still might blow Michigan away. They would probably be neck and neck in the worst scenario. You've probably never been to any Illinois state parks except for starved rock (I've seen plates from all over there btw so that alone should say something). Illinois state parks are also FREE vs Michigan, Indiana or even Wisconsin. Minnesota is the other state that has free state parks.
Yeah right. How many miles of Great Lakes shoreline does Illinois have? I've probably never been to any Illinois state parks, um yeah ok whatever you say there Mr. I've never been further into Michigan than Niles. What difference does it make if Illinois parks are free? What does that do to make it a better park?
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 10:25:13 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 10:00:03 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 06:03:25 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 26, 2022, 05:22:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 04:04:15 PM
Illinois is also a rather boring state outside of Chicago.
This is 1000% false, I strongly hope that you aren't serious. Illinois is one of those states where it would take a lifetime to burn out all there's to do. Unlike Michigan for example which doesn't even make the top 10
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Edit:
Wow, even Ohio is considered a funner state than Michigan. How could you be a more boring state than Ohio?
Took me less than two years to burn out on Illinois, it's slim pickings outside Chicago. I still find interesting things to do that I haven't seen in Michigan (even after living there 13 years). About the only state Illinois is going to beat consistently in the Midwest is Indiana. Even then, Indiana has the favored beach on Lake Michigan for Chicago area residents.
You haven't been going to the right places then because there's tons even outside of Chicago. Here are 10 things to do around Springfield
https://www.sj-r.com/story/lifestyle/travel/2022/05/26/10-things-to-see-do-summer-within-100-miles-springfield/9907855002/
Another good resource to check is this site as well:
https://www.onlyinyourstate.com/states/illinois/
And then there's this one
https://www.illinoisouth.org/
And finally the flagship site for Illinois tourism:
https://www.enjoyillinois.com/
Even my own YouTube channel is a resource.. I also spotlight points of interest in any video I make outside of the videos of bad drivers.
So this proves it. You're 100% biased toward Illinois and can't at all admit that another state might be better than Illinois in certain categories. Also are you part of the Springfield tourism department now? I could find just as much in Lansing as Springfield and possibly more. I know I could find more in Grand Rapids than Springfield.
I can almost guarantee that you'll have a much better meal in Springfield than in GR or Lansing. It's a mini version of Chicago. Same thing with Chambana and Blormal.
Well you can't guarantee any of that because you've never been to Grand Rapids or Lansing, remember you've only been as far as Niles? To think that you can get a better meal in Springfield than Grand Rapids or Lansing is ultimate homerism. You are the Hawk Harrelson for Illinois, I get it.
Quote from: kphoger on May 26, 2022, 10:18:57 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 10:00:03 PM
You're 100% biased toward Illinois and can't at all admit that another state might be better than Illinois in certain categories.
This, this, a thousand times this.
I'm not saying Michigan is a "slam dunk" or that it "blows away" Illinois–as some others have said–but it does seem a bit ridiculous to claim that Illinois is objectively a better vacation destination than Michigan. Personally, I think Michigan has it by a margin, just not a hugely wide margin. But you seem to be unable to even consider that it might possibly be true. That's a problem.
I've been vacationing around Michigan all my life and haven't ran out of lakes to visit yet. I'm still discovering new ones too.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 10:37:15 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 26, 2022, 10:18:57 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 10:00:03 PM
You're 100% biased toward Illinois and can't at all admit that another state might be better than Illinois in certain categories.
This, this, a thousand times this.
I'm not saying Michigan is a "slam dunk" or that it "blows away" Illinois–as some others have said–but it does seem a bit ridiculous to claim that Illinois is objectively a better vacation destination than Michigan. Personally, I think Michigan has it by a margin, just not a hugely wide margin. But you seem to be unable to even consider that it might possibly be true. That's a problem.
I've been vacationing around Michigan all my life and haven't ran out of lakes to visit yet. I'm still discovering new ones too.
Hell, we have a family cabin on Lake Michigan up by Traverse City. Is that even a thing that people have access to with Chicagoland shoved up along the entire Lake Michigan lakeshore of Illinois ?
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 26, 2022, 10:42:35 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 10:37:15 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 26, 2022, 10:18:57 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 10:00:03 PM
You're 100% biased toward Illinois and can't at all admit that another state might be better than Illinois in certain categories.
This, this, a thousand times this.
I'm not saying Michigan is a "slam dunk" or that it "blows away" Illinois–as some others have said–but it does seem a bit ridiculous to claim that Illinois is objectively a better vacation destination than Michigan. Personally, I think Michigan has it by a margin, just not a hugely wide margin. But you seem to be unable to even consider that it might possibly be true. That's a problem.
I've been vacationing around Michigan all my life and haven't ran out of lakes to visit yet. I'm still discovering new ones too.
Hell, we have a family cabin on Lake Michigan up by Traverse City. Is that even a thing that people have access to with Chicagoland shoved up along the entire Lake Michigan lakeshore of Illinois ?
My family has a cabin in Cedarville in the U.P. that is right on the shores of Lake Huron, there are a few islands in the way but it's basically Lake Huron out there. I know you can't have such a thing in Chicago since the entire lakeshore is taken up by parks for the most part. Just going up there is half the fun.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 26, 2022, 10:42:35 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 10:37:15 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 26, 2022, 10:18:57 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 10:00:03 PM
You're 100% biased toward Illinois and can't at all admit that another state might be better than Illinois in certain categories.
This, this, a thousand times this.
I'm not saying Michigan is a "slam dunk" or that it "blows away" Illinois–as some others have said–but it does seem a bit ridiculous to claim that Illinois is objectively a better vacation destination than Michigan. Personally, I think Michigan has it by a margin, just not a hugely wide margin. But you seem to be unable to even consider that it might possibly be true. That's a problem.
I've been vacationing around Michigan all my life and haven't ran out of lakes to visit yet. I'm still discovering new ones too.
Hell, we have a family cabin on Lake Michigan up by Traverse City. Is that even a thing that people have access to with Chicagoland shoved up along the entire Lake Michigan lakeshore of Illinois ?
Here's a lakeside cabin resort in Illinois and that's just one of a few
https://maps.app.goo.gl/8eFFn8BijoxCWeEd8
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 04:59:54 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 26, 2022, 10:42:35 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 10:37:15 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 26, 2022, 10:18:57 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 10:00:03 PM
You're 100% biased toward Illinois and can't at all admit that another state might be better than Illinois in certain categories.
This, this, a thousand times this.
I'm not saying Michigan is a "slam dunk" or that it "blows away" Illinois–as some others have said–but it does seem a bit ridiculous to claim that Illinois is objectively a better vacation destination than Michigan. Personally, I think Michigan has it by a margin, just not a hugely wide margin. But you seem to be unable to even consider that it might possibly be true. That's a problem.
I've been vacationing around Michigan all my life and haven't ran out of lakes to visit yet. I'm still discovering new ones too.
Hell, we have a family cabin on Lake Michigan up by Traverse City. Is that even a thing that people have access to with Chicagoland shoved up along the entire Lake Michigan lakeshore of Illinois ?
Here's a lakeside cabin resort in Illinois and that's just one of a few
https://maps.app.goo.gl/8eFFn8BijoxCWeEd8
That isn't Lake Michigan.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 27, 2022, 06:52:13 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 04:59:54 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 26, 2022, 10:42:35 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 10:37:15 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 26, 2022, 10:18:57 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 10:00:03 PM
You're 100% biased toward Illinois and can't at all admit that another state might be better than Illinois in certain categories.
This, this, a thousand times this.
I'm not saying Michigan is a "slam dunk" or that it "blows away" Illinois–as some others have said–but it does seem a bit ridiculous to claim that Illinois is objectively a better vacation destination than Michigan. Personally, I think Michigan has it by a margin, just not a hugely wide margin. But you seem to be unable to even consider that it might possibly be true. That's a problem.
I've been vacationing around Michigan all my life and haven't ran out of lakes to visit yet. I'm still discovering new ones too.
Hell, we have a family cabin on Lake Michigan up by Traverse City. Is that even a thing that people have access to with Chicagoland shoved up along the entire Lake Michigan lakeshore of Illinois ?
Here's a lakeside cabin resort in Illinois and that's just one of a few
https://maps.app.goo.gl/8eFFn8BijoxCWeEd8
That isn't Lake Michigan.
That lake he linked sure ain't great. :rolleyes:
Having a fully urbanized shore of Lake Michigan sure doesn't help sway the argument that Illinois is more scenic than the other Great Lake states. What good is Lake Michigan for scenic value if you have to go to the Indiana Dunes or someone's family cabin in Michigan to enjoy it?
Quote from: Crash_It on May 26, 2022, 10:23:04 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 10:08:09 PM
Quote from: SSOWorld on May 26, 2022, 07:59:35 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 26, 2022, 05:25:27 PM
If you take Detroit and Chicago away Michigan blows Illinois away.
So you're saying skyscrapers make Illinois less flat?
I'm talking about Illinois being boring now. I'm saying that Michigan has more interesting things to do if you take Chicago and Detroit away. For example, I think that Michigan's State Parks blow the one's in Illinois away.
Even without Chicago Illinois still might blow Michigan away. They would probably be neck and neck in the worst scenario. You've probably never been to any Illinois state parks except for starved rock (I've seen plates from all over there btw so that alone should say something). Illinois state parks are also FREE vs Michigan, Indiana or even Wisconsin. Minnesota is the other state that has free state parks.
🤡
Derailing this thread (hint: 11/8/2016) feels really tempting, but I don't know if everyone actually wants it locked or not. And if it does get locked, kphoger can't bring the non-flat road count to 200.
Quote from: 1 on May 27, 2022, 08:47:00 AM
Derailing this thread (hint: 11/8/2016) feels really tempting, but I don't know if everyone actually wants it locked or not. And if it does get locked, kphoger can't bring the non-flat road count to 200.
How much worse can it be? Crash in this very thread was touting how all truckers were racist Republicans. I even linked in some stuff from outside that Crash won't/hasn't acknowledge. He'll probably just ignore whatever happened on that day and carry on with this flat-centric furor.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 27, 2022, 08:01:19 AM
Having a fully urbanized shore of Lake Michigan sure doesn't help sway the argument that Illinois is more scenic than the other Great Lake states. What good is Lake Michigan for scenic value if you have to go to the Indiana Dunes or someone's family cabin in Michigan to enjoy it?
I enjoy the scenery of the downtown Chicago beaches, actually–especially Ohio Street, Oak Street, and North Avenue. But they're a very different experience compared to the Indiana Dunes.
I don't think there's such a thing as lakeside cabins on Lake Michigan in Illinois. But Indiana and Michigan have a long history of both vacation houses and mansions on the shore of Lake Michigan. My father's family, after my great-grandfather immigrated from Germany, comes from Chicago. I have a granduncle on that side who invented dual master brake cylinders and, when he sold his invention to ... um, whichever company that was, I don't remember offhand ... the money allowed him to have a huge lakeside house on the Michigan side. My dad has early childhood memories of going there and playing with his cousins and brothers, but he didn't appreciate at the time what it must have cost to own such a property. All that is to say that the Michigan side has been "the place to be" for decades and decades. Illinois just doesn't have that.
The lakes in southern Illinois are great for boating and fishing, but there's not a wealth of vacation cabins. However, take a look at Lake of Egypt for an example of one that does. It's a different type of lake experience than the Great Lakes, but it's worth looking at. Boating and fishing aren't really my thing, but I know that appeals to a lot of other people.
Whatever boating/fishing/watersports/camping/lakeside retreat options that are available in Illinois are outdone 20x each by Wisconsin, Michigan, and Minnesota. That's not up for debate.
Quote from: thspfc on May 27, 2022, 10:50:47 AM
Whatever boating/fishing/watersports/camping/lakeside retreat options are available in Illinois are outdone 20x each by Wisconsin, Michigan, and Minnesota. That's not up for debate.
Agreed. Well, maybe not camping, as there are plenty of camping opportunities in Illinois (they likely outdo Illinois but not by 20x). But definitely the others.
Quote from: thspfc on May 27, 2022, 10:50:47 AM
Whatever boating/fishing/watersports/camping/lakeside retreat options that are available in Illinois are outdone 20x each by Wisconsin, Michigan, and Minnesota. That's not up for debate.
Perhaps the greatness of Illinois rests on its proximity to so many other states with good recreational activities? :)
(Disclosure: I'm a native of downstate Illinois, and a UIUC grad. Love the state, if I can ignore the politics and Chicago, and would move back if circumstances permitted. I'm hard-pressed to say that it's "better" or "worse" than other states.)
(Disclosure 2: In a past life, I helped with recruiting for a Hartford-based insurer. One of my selling points for Hartford the easy access to NYC, Boston, and Vermont.)
Quote from: kphoger on May 27, 2022, 10:23:15 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 27, 2022, 08:01:19 AM
Having a fully urbanized shore of Lake Michigan sure doesn't help sway the argument that Illinois is more scenic than the other Great Lake states. What good is Lake Michigan for scenic value if you have to go to the Indiana Dunes or someone's family cabin in Michigan to enjoy it?
I enjoy the scenery of the downtown Chicago beaches, actually–especially Ohio Street, Oak Street, and North Avenue. But they're a very different experience compared to the Indiana Dunes.
I don't think there's such a thing as lakeside cabins on Lake Michigan in Illinois. But Indiana and Michigan have a long history of both vacation houses and mansions on the shore of Lake Michigan. My father's family, after my great-grandfather immigrated from Germany, comes from Chicago. I have a granduncle on that side who invented dual master brake cylinders and, when he sold his invention to ... um, whichever company that was, I don't remember offhand ... the money allowed him to have a huge lakeside house on the Michigan side. My dad has early childhood memories of going there and playing with his cousins and brothers, but he didn't appreciate at the time what it must have cost to own such a property. All that is to say that the Michigan side has been "the place to be" for decades and decades. Illinois just doesn't have that.
The lakes in southern Illinois are great for boating and fishing, but there's not a wealth of vacation cabins. However, take a look at Lake of Egypt for an example of one that does. It's a different type of lake experience than the Great Lakes, but it's worth looking at. Boating and fishing aren't really my thing, but I know that appeals to a lot of other people.
There definitely aren't any cabins along Lake Michigan in Illinois. But Wisconsin definitely has some nice properties along the lake, even south of Milwaukee. And of course, once you're north of Milwaukee there is a lot.
I haven't been through the submissions for the 200 example challenge yet, but in case these haven't already been shared:
https://www.google.com/maps/@37.4825839,-88.8924752,3a,75y,352.7h,90.35t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sf8zFcVwcUA-L5UW0iJxjVw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 (I-24 road cut)
https://www.google.com/maps/@37.772593,-89.4840707,3a,75y,293.4h,92.05t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sQ3lSaSLhFfuENnYNUVAFuA!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DQ3lSaSLhFfuENnYNUVAFuA%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D213.62134%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192!5m1!1e4 (IL3; streetview doesn't do the hills ending at the river plain justice; switch to terrain view for better impact)
https://www.google.com/maps/@37.5311699,-89.0655008,3a,75y,32.07h,78.32t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1svlePxGyyYGj1L-4pxVEPEw!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DvlePxGyyYGj1L-4pxVEPEw%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D116.63112%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i3328!8i1664!5m1!1e4 (minor road in Southern Illinois; couldn't get a good streetview image of a nearby bluff)
https://www.google.com/maps/@37.5802926,-88.436346,3a,75y,162.11h,82.28t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1s8Kqh-aPiM8NAMl4mDn4KDg!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3D8Kqh-aPiM8NAMl4mDn4KDg%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D39.533413%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192!5m1!1e4 (IL34)
https://www.google.com/maps/@37.9125809,-89.8302706,3a,75y,4.03h,74.46t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1szvfQzvXGaYiBoRf3z1EawA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192!5m1!1e4 (Bridge Bypass Rd, Chester)
https://www.google.com/maps/@38.4947344,-90.2018487,3a,75y,81.05h,77.05t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sYOsoPmJHFcP_iD1oEfD4xA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192!5m1!1e4 (County road near Dupo; again, Streetview doesn't d it justice, switch to terrain view for better effect)
https://www.google.com/maps/@38.6600783,-90.0619695,3a,75y,122.75h,70.06t/data=!3m8!1e1!3m6!1sAF1QipPjFuTHYyRpt1B9-TcCcr9b_u9XYm7Td9_EGnMb!2e10!3e11!6shttps:%2F%2Flh5.googleusercontent.com%2Fp%2FAF1QipPjFuTHYyRpt1B9-TcCcr9b_u9XYm7Td9_EGnMb%3Dw203-h100-k-no-pi-0-ya88.21312-ro-0-fo100!7i5376!8i2688!5m1!1e4 (Cahokia....although ancient man-made hills probably don't count :) )
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 27, 2022, 11:09:45 AM
Quote from: kphoger on May 27, 2022, 10:23:15 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 27, 2022, 08:01:19 AM
Having a fully urbanized shore of Lake Michigan sure doesn't help sway the argument that Illinois is more scenic than the other Great Lake states. What good is Lake Michigan for scenic value if you have to go to the Indiana Dunes or someone's family cabin in Michigan to enjoy it?
I enjoy the scenery of the downtown Chicago beaches, actually–especially Ohio Street, Oak Street, and North Avenue. But they're a very different experience compared to the Indiana Dunes.
I don't think there's such a thing as lakeside cabins on Lake Michigan in Illinois. But Indiana and Michigan have a long history of both vacation houses and mansions on the shore of Lake Michigan. My father's family, after my great-grandfather immigrated from Germany, comes from Chicago. I have a granduncle on that side who invented dual master brake cylinders and, when he sold his invention to ... um, whichever company that was, I don't remember offhand ... the money allowed him to have a huge lakeside house on the Michigan side. My dad has early childhood memories of going there and playing with his cousins and brothers, but he didn't appreciate at the time what it must have cost to own such a property. All that is to say that the Michigan side has been "the place to be" for decades and decades. Illinois just doesn't have that.
The lakes in southern Illinois are great for boating and fishing, but there's not a wealth of vacation cabins. However, take a look at Lake of Egypt for an example of one that does. It's a different type of lake experience than the Great Lakes, but it's worth looking at. Boating and fishing aren't really my thing, but I know that appeals to a lot of other people.
There definitely aren't any cabins along Lake Michigan in Illinois. But Wisconsin definitely has some nice properties along the lake, even south of Milwaukee. And of course, once you're north of Milwaukee there is a lot.
I was originally going to say "cabins in Wisconsin" but then I remember it is a trigger word for the OP.
Quote from: thspfc on May 27, 2022, 10:50:47 AM
Whatever boating/fishing/watersports/camping/lakeside retreat options that are available in Illinois are outdone 20x each by Wisconsin, Michigan, and Minnesota. That's not up for debate.
Now if that were true then those states would've been ranked higher than Illinois in the wallethub rankings I posted.. specifically in the entertainment and recreation categories. There's no shortage of either of those options here plus with better food to boot.
That webpage doesn't consider outdoors stuff at all. New Hampshire was listed as being in the bottom half.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 11:37:16 AM
the wallethub rankings I posted
Oh. Scientific proof. I guess there's no point in even disagreeing with you, then. Or else we're science-deniers.
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 27, 2022, 11:09:45 AM
Quote from: kphoger on May 27, 2022, 10:23:15 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 27, 2022, 08:01:19 AM
Having a fully urbanized shore of Lake Michigan sure doesn't help sway the argument that Illinois is more scenic than the other Great Lake states. What good is Lake Michigan for scenic value if you have to go to the Indiana Dunes or someone's family cabin in Michigan to enjoy it?
I enjoy the scenery of the downtown Chicago beaches, actually–especially Ohio Street, Oak Street, and North Avenue. But they're a very different experience compared to the Indiana Dunes.
I don't think there's such a thing as lakeside cabins on Lake Michigan in Illinois. But Indiana and Michigan have a long history of both vacation houses and mansions on the shore of Lake Michigan. My father's family, after my great-grandfather immigrated from Germany, comes from Chicago. I have a granduncle on that side who invented dual master brake cylinders and, when he sold his invention to ... um, whichever company that was, I don't remember offhand ... the money allowed him to have a huge lakeside house on the Michigan side. My dad has early childhood memories of going there and playing with his cousins and brothers, but he didn't appreciate at the time what it must have cost to own such a property. All that is to say that the Michigan side has been "the place to be" for decades and decades. Illinois just doesn't have that.
The lakes in southern Illinois are great for boating and fishing, but there's not a wealth of vacation cabins. However, take a look at Lake of Egypt for an example of one that does. It's a different type of lake experience than the Great Lakes, but it's worth looking at. Boating and fishing aren't really my thing, but I know that appeals to a lot of other people.
There definitely aren't any cabins along Lake Michigan in Illinois. But Wisconsin definitely has some nice properties along the lake, even south of Milwaukee. And of course, once you're north of Milwaukee there is a lot.
I definitely see a possibility for some Airbnbs to spring up along the IL shore of Lake Michigan. For example the City of Waukegan unveiled a plan about 2003ish for some luxury condos along the lakefront. Actually living there trumps vacationing. Chicago already provides such a commodity. I also see the possible of cabins being built within Illinois Beach State Park since the resort there has closed down in 2019. There's a plan in place to revitalize that park back to it's former glory.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 11:41:57 AM
I definitely see a possibility for some Airbnbs to spring up along the IL shore of Lake Michigan. ... I also see the possible of cabins being built within Illinois Beach State Park ...
So? Your imagination doesn't really count, does it?
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 11:37:16 AM
Quote from: thspfc on May 27, 2022, 10:50:47 AM
Whatever boating/fishing/watersports/camping/lakeside retreat options that are available in Illinois are outdone 20x each by Wisconsin, Michigan, and Minnesota. That's not up for debate.
Now if that were true then those states would've been ranked higher than Illinois in the wallethub rankings I posted.. specifically in the entertainment and recreation categories. There's no shortage of either of those options here plus with better food to boot.
🤡
Anyone else have the sudden urge to start a new thread called Wisconsin Road Videos?
Wallethub = Irrefutable Science
Wut?
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 27, 2022, 11:56:54 AM
Anyone else have the sudden urge to start a new thread called Wisconsin Road Videos?
Along with "Wisconsin Isn't Flat."
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on April 23, 2022, 03:34:58 PM
I guess antagonizing the Facebook truck groups wasn't such a hot idea after all:
https://fb.watch/cA3yVhf_Xh/
On my regular commute home from work, I pass through
this interchange (https://goo.gl/maps/zVLngNKyKFH4K7K3A). It's a standard diamond interchange with stop sign control for the off-ramps. The northbound off-ramp frequently backs up, because left-turning traffic has a hard time finding gaps.
As I was approaching the interchange, I was in the left lane, and there was a pickup just slightly ahead of me in the right lane. A trucker pulling an empty flatbed trailer saw a decent gap in nearside traffic, so he just gunned it and went. Both the pickup driver and I had to brake, because he pulled out in front of us.
You know what? Nobody honked their horn. The other driver didn't appear upset at all. I was certainly happy to slow down for him, because I know how hard it can be for truckers to make that turn.
And, of course, I thought of |Crash_It|. I imagine that he would have blared his horn for a good six seconds at least, then lead-footed the gas pedal as soon as possible, then posted a video of the event on Facebook with comments lamenting how terrible truck drivers are, then been flustered when everyone else replied that it was a totally understandable maneuver.
Quote from: kphoger on May 27, 2022, 01:19:53 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on April 23, 2022, 03:34:58 PM
I guess antagonizing the Facebook truck groups wasn't such a hot idea after all:
https://fb.watch/cA3yVhf_Xh/
On my regular commute home from work, I pass through this interchange (https://goo.gl/maps/zVLngNKyKFH4K7K3A). It's a standard diamond interchange with stop sign control for the off-ramps. The northbound off-ramp frequently backs up, because left-turning traffic has a hard time finding gaps.
As I was approaching the interchange, I was in the left lane, and there was a pickup just slightly ahead of me in the right lane. A trucker pulling an empty flatbed trailer saw a decent gap in nearside traffic, so he just gunned it and went. Both the pickup driver and I had to brake, because he pulled out in front of us.
You know what? Nobody honked their horn. The other driver didn't appear upset at all. I was certainly happy to slow down for him, because I know how hard it can be for truckers to make that turn.
And, of course, I thought of |Crash_It|. I imagine that he would have blared his horn for a good six seconds at least, then lead-footed the gas pedal as soon as possible, then posted a video of the event on Facebook with comments lamenting how terrible truck drivers are, then been flustered when everyone else replied that it was a totally understandable maneuver.
What got me was how tame Crash's example really is, it's not even noteworthy in the slightest. Of course, Crash's weird anti-trucker hate boner has shone through in some his comments since that video.
Quote from: kphoger on May 27, 2022, 11:39:42 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 11:37:16 AM
the wallethub rankings I posted
Oh. Scientific proof. I guess there's no point in even disagreeing with you, then. Or else we're science-deniers.
Like I said, he just ignores any rankings that aren't rosy (like #46 in financial health) and dismisses it as invalid/biased against IL when they're pointed out even though they're from the same article he's using to trumpet IL superiority.
Quote from: kphoger on May 27, 2022, 01:19:53 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on April 23, 2022, 03:34:58 PM
I guess antagonizing the Facebook truck groups wasn't such a hot idea after all:
https://fb.watch/cA3yVhf_Xh/
On my regular commute home from work, I pass through this interchange (https://goo.gl/maps/zVLngNKyKFH4K7K3A). It's a standard diamond interchange with stop sign control for the off-ramps. The northbound off-ramp frequently backs up, because left-turning traffic has a hard time finding gaps.
As I was approaching the interchange, I was in the left lane, and there was a pickup just slightly ahead of me in the right lane. A trucker pulling an empty flatbed trailer saw a decent gap in nearside traffic, so he just gunned it and went. Both the pickup driver and I had to brake, because he pulled out in front of us.
You know what? Nobody honked their horn. The other driver didn't appear upset at all. I was certainly happy to slow down for him, because I know how hard it can be for truckers to make that turn.
And, of course, I thought of |Crash_It|. I imagine that he would have blared his horn for a good six seconds at least, then lead-footed the gas pedal as soon as possible, then posted a video of the event on Facebook with comments lamenting how terrible truck drivers are, then been flustered when everyone else replied that it was a totally understandable maneuver.
On Tuesday there was a long semi trying to turn left here onto US-51 SB: https://www.google.com/maps/@43.1863426,-89.3236172,3a,75.1y,272.46h,88.05t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1siGUjSCWp65nahJZUnLtnfg!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DiGUjSCWp65nahJZUnLtnfg%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D308.47247%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192?hl=en
Looks like that's technically an illegal left turn, but it's not very well signed so whatever. Anyways, the giant thing had to take up both lanes on the turn, forcing me to slow to about 20 on a 45 road (after I had already slowed for the 55 to 45 drop just a little ways back). Admittedly I was unhappy for like 5 seconds, but then something crazy happened: I realized that literally nobody cares! And then I wasn't unhappy anymore!
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 11:37:16 AM
Now if that were true then those states would've been ranked higher than Illinois in the wallethub rankings I posted.. specifically in the entertainment and recreation categories.
Quote from: 1 on May 27, 2022, 11:38:57 AM
That webpage doesn't consider outdoors stuff at all. New Hampshire was listed as being in the bottom half.
Criteria don't matter. Only rankings.
Quote from: kphoger on May 27, 2022, 11:43:17 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 11:41:57 AM
I definitely see a possibility for some Airbnbs to spring up along the IL shore of Lake Michigan. ... I also see the possible of cabins being built within Illinois Beach State Park ...
So? Your imagination doesn't really count, does it?
It's not an imagination if it's something that could actually happen and you completely missed that it's already possible to live along the lakeshore as opposed to just vacationing. You can wake up every day to views of the lake and even have private access to the lake in Chicago.
It's also still missing the proven fact that Illinois is the funnest state in the Midwest and the whole central time zone followed by Minnesota in the runner up spot for the Midwest and time zone as well. As someone who has also visited Minnesota, I can agree with that placement.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 02:34:10 PM
proven fact
You keep using those words. I do not think they mean what you think they mean.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 02:34:10 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 27, 2022, 11:43:17 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 11:41:57 AM
I definitely see a possibility for some Airbnbs to spring up along the IL shore of Lake Michigan. ... I also see the possible of cabins being built within Illinois Beach State Park ...
So? Your imagination doesn't really count, does it?
It's not an imagination if it's something that could actually happen and you completely missed that it's already possible to live along the lakeshore as opposed to just vacationing. You can wake up every day to views of the lake and even have private access to the lake in Chicago.
It's also still missing the proven fact that Illinois is the funnest state in the Midwest and the whole central time zone followed by Minnesota in the runner up spot for the Midwest and time zone as well. As someone who has also visited Minnesota, I can agree with that placement.
Ohio's in the Midwest and has Cedar Point, Kings Island and ice cream everywhere. It's a lot more fun than Illinois...except left lane blocking is an Ohioan tradition.
I don't think Crash knows what a "subjective opinion" is.
Well, if adventure is your idea of "fun", then Illinois ranks wa-a-a-a-ay below Wisconsin and Michigan. That's a proven fact.
The Adventure Index:
#7 – Wisconsin
#8 – Michigan
#13 – Missouri
#20 – Ohio
#24 – Minnesota
#25 – Illinois
#33 – Indiana
#34 – Iowa
https://outforia.com/2021-adventure-index/
(https://outforia.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/2021-Adventure-Index.jpg)
Quote from: kphoger on May 27, 2022, 02:51:45 PM
Well, if adventure is your idea of "fun", then Illinois ranks wa-a-a-a-ay below Wisconsin and Michigan. That's a proven fact.
The Adventure Index:
#7 – Wisconsin
#8 – Michigan
#13 – Missouri
#20 – Ohio
#24 – Minnesota
#25 – Illinois
#33 – Indiana
#34 – Iowa
https://outforia.com/2021-adventure-index/
That list is biased toward larger states – just makes Illinois even worse when adjusted.
Quote from: kphoger on May 27, 2022, 02:51:45 PM
Well, if adventure is your idea of "fun", then Illinois ranks wa-a-a-a-ay below Wisconsin and Michigan. That's a proven fact.
The Adventure Index:
#7 – Wisconsin
#8 – Michigan
#13 – Missouri
#20 – Ohio
#24 – Minnesota
#25 – Illinois
#33 – Indiana
#34 – Iowa
https://outforia.com/2021-adventure-index/
Wisconsin shouldn't be above Minnesota, especially by that much. We do have far superior bike trails but that's about it.
Quote from: thspfc on May 27, 2022, 02:54:28 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 27, 2022, 02:51:45 PM
Well, if adventure is your idea of "fun", then Illinois ranks wa-a-a-a-ay below Wisconsin and Michigan. That's a proven fact.
The Adventure Index:
#7 – Wisconsin
#8 – Michigan
#13 – Missouri
#20 – Ohio
#24 – Minnesota
#25 – Illinois
#33 – Indiana
#34 – Iowa
https://outforia.com/2021-adventure-index/
Wisconsin shouldn't be above Minnesota, especially by that much. We do have far superior bike trails but that's about it.
The top two aren't a shock in the slightest.
Quote from: 1 on May 27, 2022, 02:53:44 PM
That list is biased toward larger states – just makes Illinois even worse when adjusted.
Quote from: thspfc on May 27, 2022, 02:54:28 PM
Wisconsin shouldn't be above Minnesota, especially by that much. We do have far superior bike trails but that's about it.
Adjusting the data to be overall score per total state area, Wisconsin nearly doubles Minneota's score, Ohio tops the list of those eight states, and Illinois moves up one spot and beats out Michigan.
Overall, I find the data less than useful that way.
Quote from: kphoger on May 27, 2022, 03:09:25 PM
Quote from: 1 on May 27, 2022, 02:53:44 PM
That list is biased toward larger states – just makes Illinois even worse when adjusted.
Quote from: thspfc on May 27, 2022, 02:54:28 PM
Wisconsin shouldn't be above Minnesota, especially by that much. We do have far superior bike trails but that's about it.
Adjusting the data to be overall score per total state area, Wisconsin nearly doubles Minneota's score, Ohio tops the list of those eight states, and Illinois moves up one spot and beats out Michigan.
Overall, I find the data less than useful that way.
I was looking more at population than land area. The top 11 states are all more populous than the bottom 17 states.
Really? I figured categories like Hiking Trails or Surfing Spots or Mountain Biking Trails would be influence more by area than by population size. Perhaps I'm mistaken there.
Quote from: 1 on May 27, 2022, 02:53:44 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 27, 2022, 02:51:45 PM
Well, if adventure is your idea of "fun", then Illinois ranks wa-a-a-a-ay below Wisconsin and Michigan. That's a proven fact.
The Adventure Index:
#7 – Wisconsin
#8 – Michigan
#13 – Missouri
#20 – Ohio
#24 – Minnesota
#25 – Illinois
#33 – Indiana
#34 – Iowa
https://outforia.com/2021-adventure-index/
That list is biased toward larger states – just makes Illinois even worse when adjusted.
Wallethub had adventure and everything already factored into it's calculations.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 03:57:50 PM
Quote from: 1 on May 27, 2022, 02:53:44 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 27, 2022, 02:51:45 PM
Well, if adventure is your idea of "fun", then Illinois ranks wa-a-a-a-ay below Wisconsin and Michigan. That's a proven fact.
The Adventure Index:
#7 – Wisconsin
#8 – Michigan
#13 – Missouri
#20 – Ohio
#24 – Minnesota
#25 – Illinois
#33 – Indiana
#34 – Iowa
https://outforia.com/2021-adventure-index/
That list is biased toward larger states – just makes Illinois even worse when adjusted.
Wallethub had adventure and everything already factored into it's calculations.
Wallethub = the one and true religion
Wut?
Quote from: 1 on May 27, 2022, 02:53:44 PM
That list is biased toward larger states – just makes Illinois even worse when adjusted.
I guess that explains why Alaska is 2 spots lower than even Illinois.
Quote from: 1 on May 27, 2022, 03:12:44 PM
The top 11 states are all more populous than the bottom 17 states.
Illinois is more populous than all but 5 of the states higher than it in the rankings.
I don't think you can say that Illinois was prejudiced against by either population or area.
Quote from: GaryV on May 27, 2022, 04:08:32 PM
Quote from: 1 on May 27, 2022, 02:53:44 PM
That list is biased toward larger states – just makes Illinois even worse when adjusted.
I guess that explains why Alaska is 2 spots lower than even Illinois.
Quote from: 1 on May 27, 2022, 03:12:44 PM
The top 11 states are all more populous than the bottom 17 states.
Illinois is more populous than all but 5 of the states higher than it in the rankings.
I don't think you can say that Illinois was prejudiced against by either population or area.
I'm not saying Illinois is ranked too low. I'm saying it's ranked too high and should be in the bottom half.
Also, there are only five states in the country that are more populous than Illinois. It would be impossible to have six larger states higher in the rankings no matter what those rankings are.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 27, 2022, 04:01:16 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 03:57:50 PM
Quote from: 1 on May 27, 2022, 02:53:44 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 27, 2022, 02:51:45 PM
Well, if adventure is your idea of "fun", then Illinois ranks wa-a-a-a-ay below Wisconsin and Michigan. That's a proven fact.
The Adventure Index:
#7 – Wisconsin
#8 – Michigan
#13 – Missouri
#20 – Ohio
#24 – Minnesota
#25 – Illinois
#33 – Indiana
#34 – Iowa
https://outforia.com/2021-adventure-index/
That list is biased toward larger states – just makes Illinois even worse when adjusted.
Wallethub had adventure and everything already factored into it's calculations.
Wallethub = the one and true religion
Wut?
All hail Wallethub!
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 03:57:50 PM
Quote from: 1 on May 27, 2022, 02:53:44 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 27, 2022, 02:51:45 PM
Well, if adventure is your idea of "fun", then Illinois ranks wa-a-a-a-ay below Wisconsin and Michigan. That's a proven fact.
The Adventure Index:
#7 – Wisconsin
#8 – Michigan
#13 – Missouri
#20 – Ohio
#24 – Minnesota
#25 – Illinois
#33 – Indiana
#34 – Iowa
https://outforia.com/2021-adventure-index/
That list is biased toward larger states – just makes Illinois even worse when adjusted.
Wallethub had adventure and everything already factored into it's calculations.
I said it's a proven fact. So stop trying to argue it.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 11:37:16 AM
Quote from: thspfc on May 27, 2022, 10:50:47 AM
Whatever boating/fishing/watersports/camping/lakeside retreat options that are available in Illinois are outdone 20x each by Wisconsin, Michigan, and Minnesota. That's not up for debate.
Now if that were true then those states would've been ranked higher than Illinois in the wallethub rankings I posted.. specifically in the entertainment and recreation categories. There's no shortage of either of those options here plus with better food to boot.
I find it flat out ridiculous that you think wallethub is the determining factor on this. It is true, Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota do outdo Illinois 20x each. Who cares what wallethub says? You are going to base your opinion on the internet? Really?
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 11:41:57 AM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 27, 2022, 11:09:45 AM
Quote from: kphoger on May 27, 2022, 10:23:15 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 27, 2022, 08:01:19 AM
Having a fully urbanized shore of Lake Michigan sure doesn't help sway the argument that Illinois is more scenic than the other Great Lake states. What good is Lake Michigan for scenic value if you have to go to the Indiana Dunes or someone's family cabin in Michigan to enjoy it?
I enjoy the scenery of the downtown Chicago beaches, actually–especially Ohio Street, Oak Street, and North Avenue. But they're a very different experience compared to the Indiana Dunes.
I don't think there's such a thing as lakeside cabins on Lake Michigan in Illinois. But Indiana and Michigan have a long history of both vacation houses and mansions on the shore of Lake Michigan. My father's family, after my great-grandfather immigrated from Germany, comes from Chicago. I have a granduncle on that side who invented dual master brake cylinders and, when he sold his invention to ... um, whichever company that was, I don't remember offhand ... the money allowed him to have a huge lakeside house on the Michigan side. My dad has early childhood memories of going there and playing with his cousins and brothers, but he didn't appreciate at the time what it must have cost to own such a property. All that is to say that the Michigan side has been "the place to be" for decades and decades. Illinois just doesn't have that.
The lakes in southern Illinois are great for boating and fishing, but there's not a wealth of vacation cabins. However, take a look at Lake of Egypt for an example of one that does. It's a different type of lake experience than the Great Lakes, but it's worth looking at. Boating and fishing aren't really my thing, but I know that appeals to a lot of other people.
There definitely aren't any cabins along Lake Michigan in Illinois. But Wisconsin definitely has some nice properties along the lake, even south of Milwaukee. And of course, once you're north of Milwaukee there is a lot.
I definitely see a possibility for some Airbnbs to spring up along the IL shore of Lake Michigan. For example the City of Waukegan unveiled a plan about 2003ish for some luxury condos along the lakefront. Actually living there trumps vacationing. Chicago already provides such a commodity. I also see the possible of cabins being built within Illinois Beach State Park since the resort there has closed down in 2019. There's a plan in place to revitalize that park back to it's former glory.
Just wow.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 27, 2022, 05:10:52 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 11:37:16 AM
Quote from: thspfc on May 27, 2022, 10:50:47 AM
Whatever boating/fishing/watersports/camping/lakeside retreat options that are available in Illinois are outdone 20x each by Wisconsin, Michigan, and Minnesota. That's not up for debate.
Now if that were true then those states would've been ranked higher than Illinois in the wallethub rankings I posted.. specifically in the entertainment and recreation categories. There's no shortage of either of those options here plus with better food to boot.
I find it flat out ridiculous that you think wallethub is the determining factor on this. It is true, Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota do outdo Illinois 20x each. Who cares what wallethub says? You are going to base your opinion on the internet? Really?
Wallethub is the new religion, proven fact.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 27, 2022, 05:22:33 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 27, 2022, 05:10:52 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 11:37:16 AM
Quote from: thspfc on May 27, 2022, 10:50:47 AM
Whatever boating/fishing/watersports/camping/lakeside retreat options that are available in Illinois are outdone 20x each by Wisconsin, Michigan, and Minnesota. That's not up for debate.
Now if that were true then those states would've been ranked higher than Illinois in the wallethub rankings I posted.. specifically in the entertainment and recreation categories. There's no shortage of either of those options here plus with better food to boot.
I find it flat out ridiculous that you think wallethub is the determining factor on this. It is true, Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota do outdo Illinois 20x each. Who cares what wallethub says? You are going to base your opinion on the internet? Really?
Wallethub is the new religion, proven fact.
I doubt he'd be obsessing over it if it ranked Illinois near the bottom in everything.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 27, 2022, 05:24:59 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 27, 2022, 05:22:33 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 27, 2022, 05:10:52 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 11:37:16 AM
Quote from: thspfc on May 27, 2022, 10:50:47 AM
Whatever boating/fishing/watersports/camping/lakeside retreat options that are available in Illinois are outdone 20x each by Wisconsin, Michigan, and Minnesota. That's not up for debate.
Now if that were true then those states would've been ranked higher than Illinois in the wallethub rankings I posted.. specifically in the entertainment and recreation categories. There's no shortage of either of those options here plus with better food to boot.
I find it flat out ridiculous that you think wallethub is the determining factor on this. It is true, Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota do outdo Illinois 20x each. Who cares what wallethub says? You are going to base your opinion on the internet? Really?
Wallethub is the new religion, proven fact.
I doubt he'd be obsessing over it if it ranked Illinois near the bottom in everything.
None of that matters, proven fact.
I think I can tell with one simple rule which states Crash_It likes and which ones he doesn't (note he likes Minnesota). However, there are two slight variations of the rule. There are two states that differ between the two rules: New Hampshire and Virginia. Crash_It, what are your opinions on those two states?
Quote from: 1 on May 27, 2022, 07:18:48 PM
I think I can tell with one simple rule which states Crash_It likes and which ones he doesn't (note he likes Minnesota). However, there are two slight variations of the rule. There are two states that differ between the two rules: New Hampshire and Virginia. Crash_It, what are your opinions on those two states?
Oh, are we playing Eleusis now?
Quote from: 1 on May 27, 2022, 07:18:48 PM
I think I can tell with one simple rule which states Crash_It likes and which ones he doesn't (note he likes Minnesota). However, there are two slight variations of the rule. There are two states that differ between the two rules: New Hampshire and Virginia. Crash_It, what are your opinions on those two states?
Wallethub still ranks them below IL but I don't have a problem with them. NH I'd imagine would have nice architect as does most of the Northeast and New England which is actually what the architecture in IL is based on.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 10:11:26 PM
Quote from: 1 on May 27, 2022, 07:18:48 PM
I think I can tell with one simple rule which states Crash_It likes and which ones he doesn't (note he likes Minnesota). However, there are two slight variations of the rule. There are two states that differ between the two rules: New Hampshire and Virginia. Crash_It, what are your opinions on those two states?
Wallethub still ranks them below IL but I don't have a problem with them. NH I'd imagine would have nice architect as does most of the Northeast and New England which is actually what the architecture in IL is based on.
Care to leave an opinion?
https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=31553.0
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 10:11:26 PM
Quote from: 1 on May 27, 2022, 07:18:48 PM
I think I can tell with one simple rule which states Crash_It likes and which ones he doesn't (note he likes Minnesota). However, there are two slight variations of the rule. There are two states that differ between the two rules: New Hampshire and Virginia. Crash_It, what are your opinions on those two states?
Wallethub still ranks them below IL but I don't have a problem with them. NH I'd imagine would have nice architect as does most of the Northeast and New England which is actually what the architecture in IL is based on.
Also let's see your proof that the architecture in Illinois is based on New England.
As for that one simple rule about which states Crash_It likes:
Yes – Illinois and Minnesota, all of New England, Virginia.
No – All of the Midwest except for the two states mentioned above.
This matches this map:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww-personal.umich.edu%2F%7Emejn%2Felection%2F2016%2Fstatemap1024.png&hash=206f4de57414d088012481c6e396ff03c73ed6ad)
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 11:37:16 AM
Quote from: thspfc on May 27, 2022, 10:50:47 AM
Whatever boating/fishing/watersports/camping/lakeside retreat options that are available in Illinois are outdone 20x each by Wisconsin, Michigan, and Minnesota. That's not up for debate.
Now if that were true then those states would've been ranked higher than Illinois in the wallethub rankings I posted.. specifically in the entertainment and recreation categories. There's no shortage of either of those options here plus with better food to boot.
Better food, but I don't think you understand that "no shortage" does not mean "better" - MN/WI/MI still have many more, and vastly superior outdoors options, and as said above, Illinois has no place to argue with that at all.
Or, in plain English, Minnesota, Wisconsin, and Michigan's outdoors are all better than Illinois, proven fact, and it's not even close.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 09:52:26 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 27, 2022, 11:37:16 AM
Quote from: thspfc on May 27, 2022, 10:50:47 AM
Whatever boating/fishing/watersports/camping/lakeside retreat options that are available in Illinois are outdone 20x each by Wisconsin, Michigan, and Minnesota. That's not up for debate.
Now if that were true then those states would've been ranked higher than Illinois in the wallethub rankings I posted.. specifically in the entertainment and recreation categories. There's no shortage of either of those options here plus with better food to boot.
Better food, but I don't think you understand that "no shortage" does not mean "better" - MN/WI/MI still have many more, and vastly superior outdoors options, and as said above, Illinois has no place to argue with that at all.
Or, in plain English, Minnesota, Wisconsin, and Michigan's outdoors are all better than Illinois, proven fact, and it's not even close.
But Wallethub said. How can Wallethub be wrong when it is literally the word of God?
I haven't opened this thread in a couple of weeks. So this is why that Wallethub thread is a thing. What the hell did I just read.
Basically Wallethub is the new religion, proven fact.
Quote from: 1 on May 28, 2022, 10:11:02 AM
This matches this map:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww-personal.umich.edu%2F%7Emejn%2Felection%2F2016%2Fstatemap1024.png&hash=206f4de57414d088012481c6e396ff03c73ed6ad)
He doesn't believe in Alaska and Hawaii?
Does Wallethub say Alaska and Hawaii are real?
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for it?
And Michigan. I see them all the time here. I drive in a lot of areas of Michigan and see Illinois plates all the time and almost every time they are driving like shit. I think this is all proof that Illinois really doesn't offer that much compared to Wisconsin and Michigan. I like Indiana better than I do Illinois.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
Members of the Church of Wallethub are known for being big on flagellation. Abstaining from Illinois shows how devout one is to the teachings of the Church.
I imagine a standard day in the life of Crash is something like this:
Just replace every instance of "Bison" with "flat" and you'll be on the right track.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 11:08:04 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for it?
And Michigan. I see them all the time here. I drive in a lot of areas of Michigan and see Illinois plates all the time and almost every time they are driving like shit. I think this is all proof that Illinois really doesn't offer that much compared to Wisconsin and Michigan. I like Indiana better than I do Illinois.
I also see a lot of Michigan or even Wisconsin plates at Starved Rock or just about any other Illinois state park or county forest preserve. Everytime I go to Illinois Beach State Park it's flooded with Wisconsin plates.
Don't know why you like Indiana better because Illinois had far more state parks and county forest preserves than Indiana could ever dream of and they're
FREE!
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
If your claim is true that a lot of IL residents leave Illinois when they can because they hate it . . . what does that say about Illinois?
Quote from: thspfc on May 29, 2022, 03:39:47 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
If your claim is true that a lot of IL residents leave Illinois when they can because they hate it . . . what does that say about Illinois?
I imagine it goes something like this when someone is exiled from Illinois:
Quote from: thspfc on May 29, 2022, 03:39:47 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
If your claim is true that a lot of IL residents leave Illinois when they can because they hate it . . . what does that say about Illinois?
It says nothing because that amount that's supposedly alot is tripled by the people remaining in here and having a good time enjoying everything the state has to offer.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 04:40:37 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 29, 2022, 03:39:47 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
If your claim is true that a lot of IL residents leave Illinois when they can because they hate it . . . what does that say about Illinois?
It says nothing because that amount that's supposedly alot is tripled by the people remaining in here and having a good time enjoying everything the state has to offer.
Chicago is nice. Well, usually . . . sometimes . . . in certain places.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 04:40:37 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 29, 2022, 03:39:47 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
If your claim is true that a lot of IL residents leave Illinois when they can because they hate it . . . what does that say about Illinois?
It says nothing because that amount that's supposedly alot is tripled by the people remaining in here and having a good time enjoying everything the state has to offer.
Sure looked as though the majority of Illinois posters didn't have positive opinions regarding the state. Do they just not follow the teachings of Wallethub?
https://www.facebook.com/groups/2378806179055204/permalink/3198444020424745/?fs=e&s=cl
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:27:13 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 11:08:04 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for it?
And Michigan. I see them all the time here. I drive in a lot of areas of Michigan and see Illinois plates all the time and almost every time they are driving like shit. I think this is all proof that Illinois really doesn't offer that much compared to Wisconsin and Michigan. I like Indiana better than I do Illinois.
I also see a lot of Michigan or even Wisconsin plates at Starved Rock or just about any other Illinois state park or county forest preserve. Everytime I go to Illinois Beach State Park it's flooded with Wisconsin plates.
Don't know why you like Indiana better because Illinois had far more state parks and county forest preserves than Indiana could ever dream of and they're FREE!
Good for you, it really doesn't mean much when you can be in Michigan in under two hours from Starved Rock. The areas of Michigan I see Illinois plates in are 4-5 hours from Chicago so do the math. Considering that Illinois Beach State Park is less than 5 minutes from the Wisconsin border have you ever put two and two together and even attempted to figure out why it would be flooded with Wisconsin plates?
I like Indiana better because I do, I don't care about what kind of state parks Illinois and Indiana have that has nothing to do with why I like Indiana better. Also I don't care if they're free, that also means nothing to me.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
Well that's kind of funny because I could go just about anywhere in any lake community in Michigan and feel like I'm on vacation. If Illinois is so much better than Michigan then how come you can't do that in Illinois?
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 04:40:37 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 29, 2022, 03:39:47 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
If your claim is true that a lot of IL residents leave Illinois when they can because they hate it . . . what does that say about Illinois?
It says nothing because that amount that's supposedly alot is tripled by the people remaining in here and having a good time enjoying everything the state has to offer.
It's pretty obvious that you don't get out of Illinois very often.
^ On the interstates only perhaps.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 28, 2022, 10:46:01 PM
Basically Wallethub is the new religion, proven fact.
false ;)
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 29, 2022, 05:30:49 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:27:13 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 11:08:04 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for it?
And Michigan. I see them all the time here. I drive in a lot of areas of Michigan and see Illinois plates all the time and almost every time they are driving like shit. I think this is all proof that Illinois really doesn't offer that much compared to Wisconsin and Michigan. I like Indiana better than I do Illinois.
I also see a lot of Michigan or even Wisconsin plates at Starved Rock or just about any other Illinois state park or county forest preserve. Everytime I go to Illinois Beach State Park it's flooded with Wisconsin plates.
Don't know why you like Indiana better because Illinois had far more state parks and county forest preserves than Indiana could ever dream of and they're FREE!
Good for you, it really doesn't mean much when you can be in Michigan in under two hours from Starved Rock. The areas of Michigan I see Illinois plates in are 4-5 hours from Chicago so do the math. Considering that Illinois Beach State Park is less than 5 minutes from the Wisconsin border have you ever put two and two together and even attempted to figure out why it would be flooded with Wisconsin plates?
I like Indiana better because I do, I don't care about what kind of state parks Illinois and Indiana have that has nothing to do with why I like Indiana better. Also I don't care if they're free, that also means nothing to me.
Why would they come to Illinois Beach State Park when they can just go to the Kenosha Lakefront?
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 29, 2022, 05:32:52 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
Well that's kind of funny because I could go just about anywhere in any lake community in Michigan and feel like I'm on vacation. If Illinois is so much better than Michigan then how come you can't do that in Illinois?
You can do that in Illinois.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 29, 2022, 05:33:54 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 04:40:37 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 29, 2022, 03:39:47 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
If your claim is true that a lot of IL residents leave Illinois when they can because they hate it . . . what does that say about Illinois?
It says nothing because that amount that's supposedly alot is tripled by the people remaining in here and having a good time enjoying everything the state has to offer.
It's pretty obvious that you don't get out of Illinois very often.
You have no clue where I've been.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 02:11:35 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 29, 2022, 05:33:54 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 04:40:37 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 29, 2022, 03:39:47 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
If your claim is true that a lot of IL residents leave Illinois when they can because they hate it . . . what does that say about Illinois?
It says nothing because that amount that's supposedly alot is tripled by the people remaining in here and having a good time enjoying everything the state has to offer.
It's pretty obvious that you don't get out of Illinois very often.
You have no clue where I've been.
Your words often speak clearly to your inexperience in travel.
Also, there isn't anything better to do at 1 AM then lob three separate weak retorts at people? Hell, if I wasn't bringing someone to the airport I would have called it a night at least an hour ago.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 30, 2022, 02:17:23 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 02:11:35 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 29, 2022, 05:33:54 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 04:40:37 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 29, 2022, 03:39:47 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
If your claim is true that a lot of IL residents leave Illinois when they can because they hate it . . . what does that say about Illinois?
It says nothing because that amount that's supposedly alot is tripled by the people remaining in here and having a good time enjoying everything the state has to offer.
It's pretty obvious that you don't get out of Illinois very often.
You have no clue where I've been.
Your words often speak clearly to your inexperience in travel.
Also, there isn't anything better to do at 1 AM then lob three separate weak retorts at people? Hell, if I wasn't bringing someone to the airport I would have called it a night at least an hour ago.
I had actually just gotten home at that time from some weekend adventuring. Since you follow me around on Facebook you should know.
I've traveled to a lot of places here are the states I've been in
Georgia
Illinois
Indiana
Iowa
Kentucky
Michigan
Minnesota
Missouri
Ohio
Tennessee
Granted, haven't been to the southern states since 2010 but all the Midwestern states I've been to quite recently. I'm even talking to a girl that lives well into Ohio.
Look at a map to the northwest of Illinois. Specifically, North Dakota, Minnesota, and Wisconsin. You haven't entered two of them (despite trashing Wisconsin all the time), and you find the one you have been to, Minnesota to be fine. Have you even considered that that entire region is as good as Illinois?
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 07:54:52 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 30, 2022, 02:17:23 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 02:11:35 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 29, 2022, 05:33:54 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 04:40:37 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 29, 2022, 03:39:47 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
If your claim is true that a lot of IL residents leave Illinois when they can because they hate it . . . what does that say about Illinois?
It says nothing because that amount that's supposedly alot is tripled by the people remaining in here and having a good time enjoying everything the state has to offer.
It's pretty obvious that you don't get out of Illinois very often.
You have no clue where I've been.
Your words often speak clearly to your inexperience in travel.
Also, there isn't anything better to do at 1 AM then lob three separate weak retorts at people? Hell, if I wasn't bringing someone to the airport I would have called it a night at least an hour ago.
I had actually just gotten home at that time from some weekend adventuring. Since you follow me around on Facebook you should know.
I've traveled to a lot of places here are the states I've been in
Georgia
Illinois
Indiana
Iowa
Kentucky
Michigan
Minnesota
Missouri
Ohio
Tennessee
Granted, haven't been to the southern states since 2010 but all the Midwestern states I've been to quite recently. I'm even talking to a girl that lives well into Ohio.
Basically you've barely been out of the Midwest and you are a beginner traveler. That list coupled with saying things like that you have seen all you need to see from Interstates in places like Wisconsin doesn't exactly impress.
You would be correct that I do view your page on occasion when I'm bored, some of the comments are worth a chuckle. I don't know how I would get that you were rolling home at 1 AM out of it though? Either way, responding to three separate posts with fast retorts at 1 AM kind of proves my point (although I didn't reference Wallethub) about not anything better to do.
Odd that you mention talking to someone in Ohio. I'm sure I can guess the implied context, but that's a strange argument point to make if I'm correct on what you meant.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 07:54:52 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 30, 2022, 02:17:23 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 02:11:35 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 29, 2022, 05:33:54 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 04:40:37 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 29, 2022, 03:39:47 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
If your claim is true that a lot of IL residents leave Illinois when they can because they hate it . . . what does that say about Illinois?
It says nothing because that amount that's supposedly alot is tripled by the people remaining in here and having a good time enjoying everything the state has to offer.
It's pretty obvious that you don't get out of Illinois very often.
You have no clue where I've been.
Your words often speak clearly to your inexperience in travel.
Also, there isn't anything better to do at 1 AM then lob three separate weak retorts at people? Hell, if I wasn't bringing someone to the airport I would have called it a night at least an hour ago.
I had actually just gotten home at that time from some weekend adventuring. Since you follow me around on Facebook you should know.
I've traveled to a lot of places here are the states I've been in
Georgia
Illinois
Indiana
Iowa
Kentucky
Michigan
Minnesota
Missouri
Ohio
Tennessee
Granted, haven't been to the southern states since 2010 but all the Midwestern states I've been to quite recently. I'm even talking to a girl that lives well into Ohio.
Your personal tidbits are like a fossil record that keeps confirming the same theory with each revelation.
Quote from: 1 on May 30, 2022, 08:10:27 AM
Look at a map to the northwest of Illinois. Specifically, North Dakota, Minnesota, and Wisconsin. You haven't entered two of them (despite trashing Wisconsin all the time), and you find the one you have been to, Minnesota to be fine. Have you even considered that that entire region is as good as Illinois?
Minnesota would be my preferred "up north" state rather than Wisconsin. Indiana is like a generic store brand version of Illinois. To that I say....why get a store brand when you can just have the real thing? Only thing Indiana has over Illinois is well something I can't mention but then again Minnesota also has that too but Indiana would be more advantageous in that fact since the winters there (at least in the central and southern portions of the state) are significantly less harsh than Minnesota.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 07:54:52 AM
I've traveled to a lot of places here are the states I've been in
Georgia
Illinois
Indiana
Iowa
Kentucky
Michigan
Minnesota
Missouri
Ohio
Tennessee
Granted, haven't been to the southern states since 2010 but all the Midwestern states I've been to quite recently. I'm even talking to a girl that lives well into Ohio.
Have you never been to Wisconsin? It's only 20 minutes away from Waukegan.
Quote from: 7/8 on May 30, 2022, 01:52:34 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 07:54:52 AM
I've traveled to a lot of places here are the states I've been in
Georgia
Illinois
Indiana
Iowa
Kentucky
Michigan
Minnesota
Missouri
Ohio
Tennessee
Granted, haven't been to the southern states since 2010 but all the Midwestern states I've been to quite recently. I'm even talking to a girl that lives well into Ohio.
Have you never been to Wisconsin? It's only 20 minutes away from Waukegan.
I think he forgot to list it, don't forget he saw all he needed to be in Wisconsin from I-90 and I-94. That or it was a Freudian Slip about not really experiencing Wisconsin.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 02:09:39 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 29, 2022, 05:30:49 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:27:13 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 11:08:04 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for it?
And Michigan. I see them all the time here. I drive in a lot of areas of Michigan and see Illinois plates all the time and almost every time they are driving like shit. I think this is all proof that Illinois really doesn't offer that much compared to Wisconsin and Michigan. I like Indiana better than I do Illinois.
I also see a lot of Michigan or even Wisconsin plates at Starved Rock or just about any other Illinois state park or county forest preserve. Everytime I go to Illinois Beach State Park it's flooded with Wisconsin plates.
Don't know why you like Indiana better because Illinois had far more state parks and county forest preserves than Indiana could ever dream of and they're FREE!
Good for you, it really doesn't mean much when you can be in Michigan in under two hours from Starved Rock. The areas of Michigan I see Illinois plates in are 4-5 hours from Chicago so do the math. Considering that Illinois Beach State Park is less than 5 minutes from the Wisconsin border have you ever put two and two together and even attempted to figure out why it would be flooded with Wisconsin plates?
I like Indiana better because I do, I don't care about what kind of state parks Illinois and Indiana have that has nothing to do with why I like Indiana better. Also I don't care if they're free, that also means nothing to me.
Why would they come to Illinois Beach State Park when they can just go to the Kenosha Lakefront?
Maybe because Illinois Beach State Park is within their range. You act like people coming from Wisconsin which is like 3 miles from Illinois Beach State Park to the border is something that is surprising. It's not.
Quote from: 7/8 on May 30, 2022, 01:52:34 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 07:54:52 AM
I've traveled to a lot of places here are the states I've been in
Georgia
Illinois
Indiana
Iowa
Kentucky
Michigan
Minnesota
Missouri
Ohio
Tennessee
Granted, haven't been to the southern states since 2010 but all the Midwestern states I've been to quite recently. I'm even talking to a girl that lives well into Ohio.
Have you never been to Wisconsin? It's only 20 minutes away from Waukegan.
I have but have no interest in spending any of my money experiencing there.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 02:10:57 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 29, 2022, 05:32:52 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
Well that's kind of funny because I could go just about anywhere in any lake community in Michigan and feel like I'm on vacation. If Illinois is so much better than Michigan then how come you can't do that in Illinois?
You can do that in Illinois.
Dude Illinois doesn't even come close to having the lake communities that Michigan does, don't even try to debate it.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 02:11:35 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 29, 2022, 05:33:54 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 04:40:37 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 29, 2022, 03:39:47 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
If your claim is true that a lot of IL residents leave Illinois when they can because they hate it . . . what does that say about Illinois?
It says nothing because that amount that's supposedly alot is tripled by the people remaining in here and having a good time enjoying everything the state has to offer.
It's pretty obvious that you don't get out of Illinois very often.
You have no clue where I've been.
Just like you not too long ago claiming that I have only been on I-55 in Illinois when you have no idea where I've been. It's obvious by the comments you make that you haven't been too far out of Illinois.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 07:54:52 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 30, 2022, 02:17:23 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 02:11:35 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 29, 2022, 05:33:54 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 04:40:37 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 29, 2022, 03:39:47 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
If your claim is true that a lot of IL residents leave Illinois when they can because they hate it . . . what does that say about Illinois?
It says nothing because that amount that's supposedly alot is tripled by the people remaining in here and having a good time enjoying everything the state has to offer.
It's pretty obvious that you don't get out of Illinois very often.
You have no clue where I've been.
Your words often speak clearly to your inexperience in travel.
Also, there isn't anything better to do at 1 AM then lob three separate weak retorts at people? Hell, if I wasn't bringing someone to the airport I would have called it a night at least an hour ago.
I had actually just gotten home at that time from some weekend adventuring. Since you follow me around on Facebook you should know.
I've traveled to a lot of places here are the states I've been in
Georgia
Illinois
Indiana
Iowa
Kentucky
Michigan
Minnesota
Missouri
Ohio
Tennessee
Granted, haven't been to the southern states since 2010 but all the Midwestern states I've been to quite recently. I'm even talking to a girl that lives well into Ohio.
That's nice. I've been to 31 states plus Washington, DC.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 30, 2022, 03:54:52 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 02:09:39 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 29, 2022, 05:30:49 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:27:13 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 11:08:04 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for it?
And Michigan. I see them all the time here. I drive in a lot of areas of Michigan and see Illinois plates all the time and almost every time they are driving like shit. I think this is all proof that Illinois really doesn't offer that much compared to Wisconsin and Michigan. I like Indiana better than I do Illinois.
I also see a lot of Michigan or even Wisconsin plates at Starved Rock or just about any other Illinois state park or county forest preserve. Everytime I go to Illinois Beach State Park it's flooded with Wisconsin plates.
Don't know why you like Indiana better because Illinois had far more state parks and county forest preserves than Indiana could ever dream of and they're FREE!
Good for you, it really doesn't mean much when you can be in Michigan in under two hours from Starved Rock. The areas of Michigan I see Illinois plates in are 4-5 hours from Chicago so do the math. Considering that Illinois Beach State Park is less than 5 minutes from the Wisconsin border have you ever put two and two together and even attempted to figure out why it would be flooded with Wisconsin plates?
I like Indiana better because I do, I don't care about what kind of state parks Illinois and Indiana have that has nothing to do with why I like Indiana better. Also I don't care if they're free, that also means nothing to me.
Why would they come to Illinois Beach State Park when they can just go to the Kenosha Lakefront?
Maybe because Illinois Beach State Park is within their range. You act like people coming from Wisconsin which is like 3 miles from Illinois Beach State Park to the border is something that is surprising. It's not.
Well you're the one who's trying to say that Wisconsin is a better vacation state than Illinois. This proves that it's not because otherwise they would just go to the Kenosha Lakefront or here
https://maps.app.goo.gl/fK9Wju3k8Pd2Vqt86
But nope, instead they're going to North Point Marina, Illinois Beach State Park and the Waukegan municipal beach.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 30, 2022, 03:56:28 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 02:11:35 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 29, 2022, 05:33:54 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 04:40:37 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 29, 2022, 03:39:47 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
If your claim is true that a lot of IL residents leave Illinois when they can because they hate it . . . what does that say about Illinois?
It says nothing because that amount that's supposedly alot is tripled by the people remaining in here and having a good time enjoying everything the state has to offer.
It's pretty obvious that you don't get out of Illinois very often.
You have no clue where I've been.
Just like you not too long ago claiming that I have only been on I-55 in Illinois when you have no idea where I've been. It's obvious by the comments you make that you haven't been too far out of Illinois.
Because you have an outlandish claim that all of Illinois is flat except for Jo Daviess county which is false.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 03:58:51 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 30, 2022, 03:54:52 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 02:09:39 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 29, 2022, 05:30:49 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:27:13 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 11:08:04 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for it?
And Michigan. I see them all the time here. I drive in a lot of areas of Michigan and see Illinois plates all the time and almost every time they are driving like shit. I think this is all proof that Illinois really doesn't offer that much compared to Wisconsin and Michigan. I like Indiana better than I do Illinois.
I also see a lot of Michigan or even Wisconsin plates at Starved Rock or just about any other Illinois state park or county forest preserve. Everytime I go to Illinois Beach State Park it's flooded with Wisconsin plates.
Don't know why you like Indiana better because Illinois had far more state parks and county forest preserves than Indiana could ever dream of and they're FREE!
Good for you, it really doesn't mean much when you can be in Michigan in under two hours from Starved Rock. The areas of Michigan I see Illinois plates in are 4-5 hours from Chicago so do the math. Considering that Illinois Beach State Park is less than 5 minutes from the Wisconsin border have you ever put two and two together and even attempted to figure out why it would be flooded with Wisconsin plates?
I like Indiana better because I do, I don't care about what kind of state parks Illinois and Indiana have that has nothing to do with why I like Indiana better. Also I don't care if they're free, that also means nothing to me.
Why would they come to Illinois Beach State Park when they can just go to the Kenosha Lakefront?
Maybe because Illinois Beach State Park is within their range. You act like people coming from Wisconsin which is like 3 miles from Illinois Beach State Park to the border is something that is surprising. It's not.
Well you're the one who's trying to say that Wisconsin is a better vacation state than Illinois. This proves that it's not because otherwise they would just go to the Kenosha Lakefront or here
https://maps.app.goo.gl/fK9Wju3k8Pd2Vqt86
But nope, instead they're going to North Point Marina, Illinois Beach State Park and the Waukegan municipal beach.
Wisconsin is a better vacation state than Illinois. No this doesn't prove anything, they cross the state line to go a few miles into Illinois to go to a beach so freaking what? That proves nothing. What about all the Illinois residents that flood Warren Dunes? I'm not sitting here complaining about them like you are. People go to beaches all along the Great Lakes you aren't making a point here at all.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 04:00:27 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 30, 2022, 03:56:28 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 02:11:35 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 29, 2022, 05:33:54 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 04:40:37 PM
Quote from: thspfc on May 29, 2022, 03:39:47 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for outdoors activities?
I answered that already. Because they don't see remaining in Illinois as being on vacation or they have self hate for their own state (see this alot on news articles and even on tourism blogs).
If your claim is true that a lot of IL residents leave Illinois when they can because they hate it . . . what does that say about Illinois?
It says nothing because that amount that's supposedly alot is tripled by the people remaining in here and having a good time enjoying everything the state has to offer.
It's pretty obvious that you don't get out of Illinois very often.
You have no clue where I've been.
Just like you not too long ago claiming that I have only been on I-55 in Illinois when you have no idea where I've been. It's obvious by the comments you make that you haven't been too far out of Illinois.
Because you have an outlandish claim that all of Illinois is flat except for Jo Daviess county which is false.
Illinois is fucking flat dude get the fuck over it for real. You really have no idea what you are even talking about and make bogus claims about other states all the time. You are not a valid source of information at all.
Wisconsin is a better vacation state than Illinois.
People from Wisconsin can go to Illinois Beach.
Both of these things can be true.
Seriously if someone was to say that my state is flat or something about my state that is true I wouldn't be sitting here arguing with them about it. I'd be like yep it is and move on. Illinois being flat means nothing, I have never seen someone so determined into arguing with someone about if a state is flat or not. You can barely provide any proof that Illinois isn't flat. Illinois most certainly is not a hilly state.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 30, 2022, 04:08:49 PM
Wisconsin is a better vacation state than Illinois.
People from Wisconsin can go to Illinois Beach.
Both of these things can be true.
I just want to see if he even knows where Warren Dunes is at.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 03:55:11 PM
Quote from: 7/8 on May 30, 2022, 01:52:34 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 07:54:52 AM
I've traveled to a lot of places here are the states I've been in
Georgia
Illinois
Indiana
Iowa
Kentucky
Michigan
Minnesota
Missouri
Ohio
Tennessee
Granted, haven't been to the southern states since 2010 but all the Midwestern states I've been to quite recently. I'm even talking to a girl that lives well into Ohio.
Have you never been to Wisconsin? It's only 20 minutes away from Waukegan.
I have but have no interest in spending any of my money experiencing there.
Freudian Slip it is.
People from Wisconsin go to Illinois Beach State Park because it's close to them. Just like I could go to Indiana Dunes if I wanted to, Or I could go to Illinois Beach State Park if I wanted to. It wouldn't make much sense though since I have many more options in Michigan.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 30, 2022, 02:05:01 PM
Quote from: 7/8 on May 30, 2022, 01:52:34 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 07:54:52 AM
I've traveled to a lot of places here are the states I've been in
Georgia
Illinois
Indiana
Iowa
Kentucky
Michigan
Minnesota
Missouri
Ohio
Tennessee
Granted, haven't been to the southern states since 2010 but all the Midwestern states I've been to quite recently. I'm even talking to a girl that lives well into Ohio.
Have you never been to Wisconsin? It's only 20 minutes away from Waukegan.
I think he forgot to list it, don't forget he saw all he needed to be in Wisconsin from I-90 and I-94. That or it was a Freudian Slip about not really experiencing Wisconsin.
The funny part is that I-90 and I-94 actually aren't bad ways to cross the state. Sure, they don't give you the full experience, but compared to most Midwestern Interstates, the WI segments of those two are nice.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 03:58:51 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 30, 2022, 03:54:52 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 02:09:39 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 29, 2022, 05:30:49 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:27:13 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 11:08:04 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for it?
And Michigan. I see them all the time here. I drive in a lot of areas of Michigan and see Illinois plates all the time and almost every time they are driving like shit. I think this is all proof that Illinois really doesn't offer that much compared to Wisconsin and Michigan. I like Indiana better than I do Illinois.
I also see a lot of Michigan or even Wisconsin plates at Starved Rock or just about any other Illinois state park or county forest preserve. Everytime I go to Illinois Beach State Park it's flooded with Wisconsin plates.
Don't know why you like Indiana better because Illinois had far more state parks and county forest preserves than Indiana could ever dream of and they're FREE!
Good for you, it really doesn't mean much when you can be in Michigan in under two hours from Starved Rock. The areas of Michigan I see Illinois plates in are 4-5 hours from Chicago so do the math. Considering that Illinois Beach State Park is less than 5 minutes from the Wisconsin border have you ever put two and two together and even attempted to figure out why it would be flooded with Wisconsin plates?
I like Indiana better because I do, I don't care about what kind of state parks Illinois and Indiana have that has nothing to do with why I like Indiana better. Also I don't care if they're free, that also means nothing to me.
Why would they come to Illinois Beach State Park when they can just go to the Kenosha Lakefront?
Maybe because Illinois Beach State Park is within their range. You act like people coming from Wisconsin which is like 3 miles from Illinois Beach State Park to the border is something that is surprising. It's not.
Well you're the one who's trying to say that Wisconsin is a better vacation state than Illinois. This proves that it's not because otherwise they would just go to the Kenosha Lakefront or here
https://maps.app.goo.gl/fK9Wju3k8Pd2Vqt86
But nope, instead they're going to North Point Marina, Illinois Beach State Park and the Waukegan municipal beach.
🤡
There's loads of Illinois residents who come to Wisconsin every summer, and, how many WI residents that go to Illinois for tourism? Barely any, and I'd bet near none of them venture south of I-80.
Quote from: thspfc on May 30, 2022, 04:44:09 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 03:58:51 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 30, 2022, 03:54:52 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 02:09:39 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 29, 2022, 05:30:49 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 29, 2022, 11:27:13 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 11:08:04 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 28, 2022, 11:04:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 28, 2022, 10:55:43 PM
How in the hell is wallethub a source for outdoor life? Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota are three states that are well known for outdoor life. Lots of lakes, summer vacations, hunting in all three states, cottages dotting the landscape. Up North Michigan is a thing and well known in the Great Lakes region. Ever hear of Traverse City, Houghton Lake, Holland, Ludington, Manistee, Torch Lake, Petoskey? Those areas blow anything Illinois has to offer away. You won't come close to touching the Sleeping Bear Dunes in Illinois. In fact if Illinois has more to offer for outdoor life and has their own beaches then how come Warren Dunes is constantly flooded by people from Illinois?
Also our state borders four Great Lakes, Illinois only borders one.
If Illinois's outdoor options are so great, why do all of them go to Wisconsin for it?
And Michigan. I see them all the time here. I drive in a lot of areas of Michigan and see Illinois plates all the time and almost every time they are driving like shit. I think this is all proof that Illinois really doesn't offer that much compared to Wisconsin and Michigan. I like Indiana better than I do Illinois.
I also see a lot of Michigan or even Wisconsin plates at Starved Rock or just about any other Illinois state park or county forest preserve. Everytime I go to Illinois Beach State Park it's flooded with Wisconsin plates.
Don't know why you like Indiana better because Illinois had far more state parks and county forest preserves than Indiana could ever dream of and they're FREE!
Good for you, it really doesn't mean much when you can be in Michigan in under two hours from Starved Rock. The areas of Michigan I see Illinois plates in are 4-5 hours from Chicago so do the math. Considering that Illinois Beach State Park is less than 5 minutes from the Wisconsin border have you ever put two and two together and even attempted to figure out why it would be flooded with Wisconsin plates?
I like Indiana better because I do, I don't care about what kind of state parks Illinois and Indiana have that has nothing to do with why I like Indiana better. Also I don't care if they're free, that also means nothing to me.
Why would they come to Illinois Beach State Park when they can just go to the Kenosha Lakefront?
Maybe because Illinois Beach State Park is within their range. You act like people coming from Wisconsin which is like 3 miles from Illinois Beach State Park to the border is something that is surprising. It's not.
Well you're the one who's trying to say that Wisconsin is a better vacation state than Illinois. This proves that it's not because otherwise they would just go to the Kenosha Lakefront or here
https://maps.app.goo.gl/fK9Wju3k8Pd2Vqt86
But nope, instead they're going to North Point Marina, Illinois Beach State Park and the Waukegan municipal beach.
🤡
There's loads of Illinois residents who come to Wisconsin every summer, and, how many WI residents that go to Illinois for tourism? Barely any, and I'd bet near none of them venture south of I-80.
I've seen WIS plates in Bloomington Normal, Chambana Springfield and in the Metro East. I've even seen them at the Garden of the Gods.
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 30, 2022, 04:09:49 PM
Seriously if someone was to say that my state is flat or something about my state that is true I wouldn't be sitting here arguing with them about it. I'd be like yep it is and move on. Illinois being flat means nothing, I have never seen someone so determined into arguing with someone about if a state is flat or not. You can barely provide any proof that Illinois isn't flat. Illinois most certainly is not a hilly state.
The problem is Illinois isn't flat and I have a few videos to prove it now. Sure there are some flat stretches but that's the same for other states I've been to as well. Most of Ohio along I70 is flat until around Springfield and especially after Columbus.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 07:41:10 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 30, 2022, 04:09:49 PM
Seriously if someone was to say that my state is flat or something about my state that is true I wouldn't be sitting here arguing with them about it. I'd be like yep it is and move on. Illinois being flat means nothing, I have never seen someone so determined into arguing with someone about if a state is flat or not. You can barely provide any proof that Illinois isn't flat. Illinois most certainly is not a hilly state.
The problem is Illinois isn't flat, Wallethub said.
FIFY
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 07:41:10 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 30, 2022, 04:09:49 PM
Seriously if someone was to say that my state is flat or something about my state that is true I wouldn't be sitting here arguing with them about it. I'd be like yep it is and move on. Illinois being flat means nothing, I have never seen someone so determined into arguing with someone about if a state is flat or not. You can barely provide any proof that Illinois isn't flat. Illinois most certainly is not a hilly state.
The problem is Illinois isn't flat and I have a few videos to prove it now. Sure there are some flat stretches but that's the same for other states I've been to as well. Most of Ohio along I70 is flat until around Springfield and especially after Columbus.
You would think, with Illinois' population increasing, more than a few people would know that Illinois has hills by simply looking out their window. Do we really need your videos to prove that?
Quote from: jeffandnicole on May 30, 2022, 08:38:38 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 07:41:10 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 30, 2022, 04:09:49 PM
Seriously if someone was to say that my state is flat or something about my state that is true I wouldn't be sitting here arguing with them about it. I'd be like yep it is and move on. Illinois being flat means nothing, I have never seen someone so determined into arguing with someone about if a state is flat or not. You can barely provide any proof that Illinois isn't flat. Illinois most certainly is not a hilly state.
The problem is Illinois isn't flat and I have a few videos to prove it now. Sure there are some flat stretches but that's the same for other states I've been to as well. Most of Ohio along I70 is flat until around Springfield and especially after Columbus.
You would think, with Illinois' population increasing, more than a few people would know that Illinois has hills by simply looking out their window. Do we really need your videos to prove that?
The only proof that matters is the proof provided by Wallethub. Nobody cares what the peons can and cannot see with their minuscule senses of perception.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on May 30, 2022, 08:38:38 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 07:41:10 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on May 30, 2022, 04:09:49 PM
Seriously if someone was to say that my state is flat or something about my state that is true I wouldn't be sitting here arguing with them about it. I'd be like yep it is and move on. Illinois being flat means nothing, I have never seen someone so determined into arguing with someone about if a state is flat or not. You can barely provide any proof that Illinois isn't flat. Illinois most certainly is not a hilly state.
The problem is Illinois isn't flat and I have a few videos to prove it now. Sure there are some flat stretches but that's the same for other states I've been to as well. Most of Ohio along I70 is flat until around Springfield and especially after Columbus.
You would think, with Illinois' population increasing, more than a few people would know that Illinois has hills by simply looking out their window. Do we really need your videos to prove that?
They do more than prove that.. They also have facts and trivia about the area such as in this video... It's similar to FWJ (who lacks in Illinois coverage) and thesolarcatcher (who has extensive Illinois coverage)
https://youtu.be/FHhyadQ4Rmk
FWJ is too focused on Buc-ee's to bother with Illinois centric videos these days.
Didn't FWJ give you the business about not cropping your windshield or having too much glare?
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 12:29:43 PM
FWJ is too focused on Buc-ee's to bother with Illinois centric videos these days.
Didn't FWJ give you the business about not cropping your windshield or having too much glare?
He told me to eliminate the dashboard which since has been done. Any other videos I filmed that are older but haven't yet produced with the dashboard will have it cropped out since I found that it doesn't impact the quality that much.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 31, 2022, 01:06:37 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 12:29:43 PM
FWJ is too focused on Buc-ee's to bother with Illinois centric videos these days.
Didn't FWJ give you the business about not cropping your windshield or having too much glare?
He told me to eliminate the dashboard which since has been done. Any other videos I filmed that are older but haven't yet produced with the dashboard will have it cropped out since I found that it doesn't impact the quality that much.
In your defense, I do find FWJ is way too anal about photo/video quality. Doubly so when they allow people to spam posts about things like Buc-ee's and other weird fandoms in the road world. The site is a little light on factoids and topics of historical relevance. All the same, I get it that FWJ is kind of a popcorn road page and doesn't really cater to much beyond that.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 01:11:05 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 31, 2022, 01:06:37 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 12:29:43 PM
FWJ is too focused on Buc-ee's to bother with Illinois centric videos these days.
Didn't FWJ give you the business about not cropping your windshield or having too much glare?
He told me to eliminate the dashboard which since has been done. Any other videos I filmed that are older but haven't yet produced with the dashboard will have it cropped out since I found that it doesn't impact the quality that much.
In your defense, I do find FWJ is way too anal about photo/video quality. Doubly so when they allow people to spam posts about things like Buc-ee's and other weird fandoms in the road world. The site is a little light on factoids and topics of historical relevance. All the same, I get it that FWJ is kind of a popcorn road page and doesn't really cater to much beyond that.
Not to mention he also hasn't uploaded a video in several months.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 31, 2022, 01:15:38 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 01:11:05 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 31, 2022, 01:06:37 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 12:29:43 PM
FWJ is too focused on Buc-ee's to bother with Illinois centric videos these days.
Didn't FWJ give you the business about not cropping your windshield or having too much glare?
He told me to eliminate the dashboard which since has been done. Any other videos I filmed that are older but haven't yet produced with the dashboard will have it cropped out since I found that it doesn't impact the quality that much.
In your defense, I do find FWJ is way too anal about photo/video quality. Doubly so when they allow people to spam posts about things like Buc-ee's and other weird fandoms in the road world. The site is a little light on factoids and topics of historical relevance. All the same, I get it that FWJ is kind of a popcorn road page and doesn't really cater to much beyond that.
Not to mention he also hasn't uploaded a video in several months.
I don't think Jim actually travels all that much. The gist I've always gotten is when he does travel it usually is for distance and he takes videos along the way. The FWJ Facebook page is far more about his other admins and group members posting their own stuff.
Summary recap, for those interested:
tl;dr
– Illinois is a better vacation spot than Wisconsin or Michigan.
– Then why does everyone from Illinois go on vacation to Wisconsin and Michigan?
– Because people in Illinois think they have to leave the state for it to be a good vacation.
– So either people in Illinois are all stupid, or else Illinois isn't actually a better vacation spot.
– Well, actually, a lot of people in Illinois do stay in Illinois for their vacations.
– Sure, but what about all the droves of people who don't?
– They're balanced out by all the people from Wisconsin and Michigan who come to Illinois.
– But they don't. There are way more people leaving Illinois on vacation than coming to it.
– Not true. I found this one spot right by the state line that has a lot of visitors from that other state.
– Of course. They live nearby. That doesn't prove anything.
– It obviously proves that it's better than this one other spot I found, right on the other side of the state line.
– But what about the dozens of places all over Wisconsin and Michigan that people from Illinois flock to?
– WalletHub agrees with me.
– Your experience of other states in the region must be limited.
– I'm talking to a girl in Ohio.
– Pics or it didn't happen.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 01:11:05 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 31, 2022, 01:06:37 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 12:29:43 PM
FWJ is too focused on Buc-ee's to bother with Illinois centric videos these days.
Didn't FWJ give you the business about not cropping your windshield or having too much glare?
He told me to eliminate the dashboard which since has been done. Any other videos I filmed that are older but haven't yet produced with the dashboard will have it cropped out since I found that it doesn't impact the quality that much.
In your defense, I do find FWJ is way too anal about photo/video quality. Doubly so when they allow people to spam posts about things like Buc-ee's and other weird fandoms in the road world. The site is a little light on factoids and topics of historical relevance. All the same, I get it that FWJ is kind of a popcorn road page and doesn't really cater to much beyond that.
Being anal about video quality is why FWJ is the best road youtuber (on the rare occasions when he uploads, anyways)
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 01:18:54 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 31, 2022, 01:15:38 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 01:11:05 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 31, 2022, 01:06:37 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 12:29:43 PM
FWJ is too focused on Buc-ee's to bother with Illinois centric videos these days.
Didn't FWJ give you the business about not cropping your windshield or having too much glare?
He told me to eliminate the dashboard which since has been done. Any other videos I filmed that are older but haven't yet produced with the dashboard will have it cropped out since I found that it doesn't impact the quality that much.
In your defense, I do find FWJ is way too anal about photo/video quality. Doubly so when they allow people to spam posts about things like Buc-ee's and other weird fandoms in the road world. The site is a little light on factoids and topics of historical relevance. All the same, I get it that FWJ is kind of a popcorn road page and doesn't really cater to much beyond that.
Not to mention he also hasn't uploaded a video in several months.
I don't think Jim actually travels all that much. The gist I've always gotten is when he does travel it usually is for distance and he takes videos along the way. The FWJ Facebook page is far more about his other admins and group members posting their own stuff.
He's really concerned about Covid it seems.
Quote from: kphoger on May 31, 2022, 04:09:33 PM
– I'm talking to a girl in Ohio.
– Pics or it didn't happen.
Quote from: thspfc on May 31, 2022, 05:04:57 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 01:11:05 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 31, 2022, 01:06:37 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 12:29:43 PM
FWJ is too focused on Buc-ee's to bother with Illinois centric videos these days.
Didn't FWJ give you the business about not cropping your windshield or having too much glare?
He told me to eliminate the dashboard which since has been done. Any other videos I filmed that are older but haven't yet produced with the dashboard will have it cropped out since I found that it doesn't impact the quality that much.
In your defense, I do find FWJ is way too anal about photo/video quality. Doubly so when they allow people to spam posts about things like Buc-ee's and other weird fandoms in the road world. The site is a little light on factoids and topics of historical relevance. All the same, I get it that FWJ is kind of a popcorn road page and doesn't really cater to much beyond that.
Being anal about video quality is why FWJ is the best road youtuber (on the rare occasions when he uploads, anyways)
The FWJ videos are fine, the video quality is really solid. The roads FWj tends to feature are a little mainstream for my tastes and is pretty lite on the history. That's why I tend to prefer Interstate Kyle since he goes for more stuff that is of interest to me for stand alone behind the wheel videos.
Regarding the photo quality on the FWJ group page, I don't know why they bother enforcing that with member posts. Some of the posting quality my members can be really low and IMO far worse than a photo with some dashboard or windshield glare. I stay because it's a mainstream page, but how many Cracker Barrel and Buc-ee's posts are really necessary?
Roadwaywiz is the only but channel that really hits historic context as a primary focus in the webinar series. Then again I'm trying to not sound biased given I've been part of the panel on several webinar episodes.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 06:26:51 PM
Regarding the photo quality on the FWJ group page, I don't know why they bother enforcing that with member posts. Some of the posting quality my members can be really low and IMO far worse than a photo with some dashboard or windshield glare.
It's not so much the rules, it's the overzealous enforcement like they're blowing up every photo to thoroughly check for the slightest hint of glare or dashboard vent so Jim can unload on you with his complete lack of tact.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on May 31, 2022, 07:00:53 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 06:26:51 PM
Regarding the photo quality on the FWJ group page, I don't know why they bother enforcing that with member posts. Some of the posting quality my members can be really low and IMO far worse than a photo with some dashboard or windshield glare.
It's not so much the rules, it's the overzealous enforcement like they're blowing up every photo to thoroughly check for the slightest hint of glare or dashboard vent so Jim can unload on you with his complete lack of tact.
But yet others can continually post about Buc-ee's opening somewhere every third user post. That seems like an odd set of priorities for what is supposed to be a road group. I would figure the admins would just mind their own photo quality and encourage road oriented discussion from the member base regardless of how well they may/may not take photos.
Amusingly I was totally indifferent to Buc-ee's until a bunch of fanboys tried to convince the world it was the best thing ever. Now I kind of dislike the brand because given how much users on that site have pushed it. There is a certain sense of irony I get from that regarding one of the topics of this thread.
Quote from: kphoger on May 31, 2022, 04:09:33 PM
Summary recap, for those interested:
tl;dr
– Illinois is a better vacation spot than Wisconsin or Michigan.
– Then why does everyone from Illinois go on vacation to Wisconsin and Michigan?
– Because people in Illinois think they have to leave the state for it to be a good vacation.
– So either people in Illinois are all stupid, or else Illinois isn't actually a better vacation spot.
– Well, actually, a lot of people in Illinois do stay in Illinois for their vacations.
– Sure, but what about all the droves of people who don't?
– They're balanced out by all the people from Wisconsin and Michigan who come to Illinois.
– But they don't. There are way more people leaving Illinois on vacation than coming to it.
– Not true. I found this one spot right by the state line that has a lot of visitors from that other state.
– Of course. They live nearby. That doesn't prove anything.
– It obviously proves that it's better than this one other spot I found, right on the other side of the state line.
– But what about the dozens of places all over Wisconsin and Michigan that people from Illinois flock to?
– WalletHub agrees with me.
– Your experience of other states in the region must be limited.
– I'm talking to a girl in Ohio.
– Pics or it didn't happen.
Does Wallethub have a dating app?
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 07:51:52 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 31, 2022, 04:09:33 PM
Summary recap, for those interested:
tl;dr
– Illinois is a better vacation spot than Wisconsin or Michigan.
– Then why does everyone from Illinois go on vacation to Wisconsin and Michigan?
– Because people in Illinois think they have to leave the state for it to be a good vacation.
– So either people in Illinois are all stupid, or else Illinois isn't actually a better vacation spot.
– Well, actually, a lot of people in Illinois do stay in Illinois for their vacations.
– Sure, but what about all the droves of people who don't?
– They're balanced out by all the people from Wisconsin and Michigan who come to Illinois.
– But they don't. There are way more people leaving Illinois on vacation than coming to it.
– Not true. I found this one spot right by the state line that has a lot of visitors from that other state.
– Of course. They live nearby. That doesn't prove anything.
– It obviously proves that it's better than this one other spot I found, right on the other side of the state line.
– But what about the dozens of places all over Wisconsin and Michigan that people from Illinois flock to?
– WalletHub agrees with me.
– Your experience of other states in the region must be limited.
– I'm talking to a girl in Ohio.
– Pics or it didn't happen.
Does Wallethub have a dating app?
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 28, 2022, 10:56:01 PM
I found my wife on Wallethub.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 07:54:52 AM
I've traveled to a lot of places here are the states I've been in
Georgia
Illinois
Indiana
Iowa
Kentucky
Michigan
Minnesota
Missouri
Ohio
Tennessee
Ten states. Well, that's a start.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 30, 2022, 07:54:52 AM
I'm even talking to a girl that lives well into Ohio.
Inquiring minds want to know ... is she flat?
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 31, 2022, 08:07:37 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 07:51:52 PM
Quote from: kphoger on May 31, 2022, 04:09:33 PM
Summary recap, for those interested:
tl;dr
– Illinois is a better vacation spot than Wisconsin or Michigan.
– Then why does everyone from Illinois go on vacation to Wisconsin and Michigan?
– Because people in Illinois think they have to leave the state for it to be a good vacation.
– So either people in Illinois are all stupid, or else Illinois isn't actually a better vacation spot.
– Well, actually, a lot of people in Illinois do stay in Illinois for their vacations.
– Sure, but what about all the droves of people who don't?
– They're balanced out by all the people from Wisconsin and Michigan who come to Illinois.
– But they don't. There are way more people leaving Illinois on vacation than coming to it.
– Not true. I found this one spot right by the state line that has a lot of visitors from that other state.
– Of course. They live nearby. That doesn't prove anything.
– It obviously proves that it's better than this one other spot I found, right on the other side of the state line.
– But what about the dozens of places all over Wisconsin and Michigan that people from Illinois flock to?
– WalletHub agrees with me.
– Your experience of other states in the region must be limited.
– I'm talking to a girl in Ohio.
– Pics or it didn't happen.
Does Wallethub have a dating app?
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 28, 2022, 10:56:01 PM
I found my wife on Wallethub.
Looking for Illinois minded singles who cherry pick data but eHarmony isn't working for you?
I met my wife online while I was living in Illinois. She says that what most attracted her to my profile was my honesty about Illinois's flatness.
Oops, that last part wasn't true. Had to scratch it out.
Quote from: kphoger on May 31, 2022, 09:02:58 PM
I met my wife online while I was living in Illinois. She says that what most attracted her to my profile was my honesty about Illinois's flatness.
Oops, that last part wasn't true. Had to scratch it out.
I met my wife online also. I was actually living in Hanford at the time and listed my eHarmony profile as Fresno so I could avoid the military base crowd. Considering our second date was to a National Park I think we hit some common ground (non flat) early on.
I dated a woman from Illinois. It didn't work out.
Quote from: Rothman on May 31, 2022, 11:47:55 PM
I dated a woman from Illinois. It didn't work out.
I would imagine your relationship had its ups and downs. Unlike most of Illinois.
Quote from: Crash_It on May 31, 2022, 01:15:38 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 01:11:05 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on May 31, 2022, 01:06:37 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on May 31, 2022, 12:29:43 PM
FWJ is too focused on Buc-ee's to bother with Illinois centric videos these days.
Didn't FWJ give you the business about not cropping your windshield or having too much glare?
He told me to eliminate the dashboard which since has been done. Any other videos I filmed that are older but haven't yet produced with the dashboard will have it cropped out since I found that it doesn't impact the quality that much.
In your defense, I do find FWJ is way too anal about photo/video quality. Doubly so when they allow people to spam posts about things like Buc-ee's and other weird fandoms in the road world. The site is a little light on factoids and topics of historical relevance. All the same, I get it that FWJ is kind of a popcorn road page and doesn't really cater to much beyond that.
Not to mention he also hasn't uploaded a video in several months.
That's because he hasn't gone anywhere in a long while. There's just so much one can document from their own home area, and I'd imagine he has Atlanta pretty well covered. He seems to be a fan of urban freeways.
He will occasionally post photos from the ATL area and from his journeys to visit his son in Nashville. (Time flies, I met Erik when he was just a young boy when he accompanied his dad to an ATL-area meet several years ago; hard to believe he's grown and on his own now).
BTW, Jim is thinking about relocating to Bowling Green, Ky., to be closer to his son but not have to pay the high cost of living of Nashville and its suburbs. I'm not sure what Jim does for a living; I've never thought to ask.
Never ride your brakes while descending the slopes of Mount Illinois:
https://www.facebook.com/471696313008593/posts/pfbid0joXHPdTqPRybdCHYupQ5ohrFzaRBX64XVqMzJk2f62dsDPJR8L19bbS1zwpTsZpyl/?d=n
The impact of 797 homicides is flattened significantly once you extrapolate the rate per 1,000 residents in Chicago:
https://www.facebook.com/471696313008593/posts/pfbid07UXpwZMxMMZouCkKaDim9q41XBwmABFReigq25Tfo57QWRn9Hg1puxnqexHSgXb5l/?d=n
I still think the answer is to stop driving traffic to his sites.
Quote from: Rothman on June 06, 2022, 03:21:11 PM
I still think the answer is to stop driving traffic to his sites.
Traffic can't stop in time, because the downhill is too steep.
^^^
One simply does not ride their brakes down from alpine peaks of Mount Illinois.
Quote from: Rothman on June 06, 2022, 03:21:11 PM
I still think the answer is to stop driving traffic to his sites.
The proliferation of Buc-ee's can only entertain me for so long...
Quote from: Rothman on June 06, 2022, 03:21:11 PM
I still think the answer is to stop driving traffic to his sites.
It's some valid findings. Been seeing people diss Chicago and suggest Milwaukee instead because ether crime. Well, what I did was find factual information that actually shows the crime as worse in Milwaukee than Chicago and by a significant margin.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 06, 2022, 07:57:56 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 06, 2022, 03:21:11 PM
I still think the answer is to stop driving traffic to his sites.
It's some valid findings. Been seeing people diss Chicago and suggest Milwaukee instead because ether crime. Well, what I did was find factual information that actually shows the crime as worse in Milwaukee than Chicago and by a significant margin.
While not downplaying crime (or downplaying that both Milwaukee and Chicago have significant issues), fear of it is overblown. It rarely finds people who aren't looking for trouble and most of it happens in places visitors aren't going to go. I would no more expect to be victimized in Milwaukee than I would in Chicago.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 06, 2022, 09:12:03 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 06, 2022, 07:57:56 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 06, 2022, 03:21:11 PM
I still think the answer is to stop driving traffic to his sites.
It's some valid findings. Been seeing people diss Chicago and suggest Milwaukee instead because ether crime. Well, what I did was find factual information that actually shows the crime as worse in Milwaukee than Chicago and by a significant margin.
While not downplaying crime (or downplaying that both Milwaukee and Chicago have significant issues), fear of it is overblown. It rarely finds people who aren't looking for trouble and most of it happens in places visitors aren't going to go. I would no more expect to be victimized in Milwaukee than I would in Chicago.
Or even Detroit. In all the years I lived in Detroit and all the times I've visited since I've never had anyone bother me for anything more than change. No different in Chicago or Milwaukee.
What I'm confused about is that Crash seems to think tourism to Chicago is at risk of being taken by Milwaukee? In what reality has that ever been a thing?
I've never had much of a problem in Detroit. Downtown is the safest part of the city and other than like Max said being asked for spare change is about the most you'll get bothered in downtown Detroit. Even in the most crime ridden parts of Detroit I've never really had much of a problem, places like 7 Mile and Gratiot which is just about the worst part of Detroit I've gone into stores in that area and never had a problem. Even going to Eastland Mall (which is now permanently closed) I never had a problem, likewise at the also now closed Northland Mall. Never have had a problem in any of Detroit's suburbs either and I'm trying to think of an incident but can't think of one. I've been going back and forth to Detroit for my entire life and am very familiar with the metro area. It's true that if you aren't looking for trouble you should be fine but if you are looking for trouble then you'll most likely find it.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:18:19 PM
What I'm confused about is that Crash seems to think tourism to Chicago is at risk of being taken by Milwaukee? In what reality has that ever been a thing?
He seems pretty terrified of losing anything to Wisconsin, even if his fears are unfounded that Milwaukee will ever be a more appealing destination.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 06, 2022, 09:26:23 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:18:19 PM
What I'm confused about is that Crash seems to think tourism to Chicago is at risk of being taken by Milwaukee? In what reality has that ever been a thing?
He seems pretty terrified of losing anything to Wisconsin, even if his fears are unfounded that Milwaukee will ever be a more appealing destination.
I think it can be argued that Wisconsin is more appealing than Illinois is though.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 06, 2022, 09:26:23 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:18:19 PM
What I'm confused about is that Crash seems to think tourism to Chicago is at risk of being taken by Milwaukee? In what reality has that ever been a thing?
He seems pretty terrified of losing anything to Wisconsin, even if his fears are unfounded that Milwaukee will ever be a more appealing destination.
They do have the museum with the wings on top. Milwaukee's a great place to visit.
Schlemiel, schlemazel...
Even as a White Sox fan I thought tailgating at Miller Park was awesome.
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:25:00 PM
I've never had much of a problem in Detroit. Downtown is the safest part of the city and other than like Max said being asked for spare change is about the most you'll get bothered in downtown Detroit. Even in the most crime ridden parts of Detroit I've never really had much of a problem, places like 7 Mile and Gratiot which is just about the worst part of Detroit I've gone into stores in that area and never had a problem. Even going to Eastland Mall (which is now permanently closed) I never had a problem, likewise at the also now closed Northland Mall. Never have had a problem in any of Detroit's suburbs either and I'm trying to think of an incident but can't think of one. I've been going back and forth to Detroit for my entire life and am very familiar with the metro area. It's true that if you aren't looking for trouble you should be fine but if you are looking for trouble then you'll most likely find it.
I like a good ruins hunt whenever I visit family around Detroit. Usually that means going to some of the statistically unsafe neighborhoods. I've never been bothered by anyone during those expeditions. But then again, if you aren't looking for trouble chances are you won't find it.
Quote from: Rothman on June 06, 2022, 09:27:44 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 06, 2022, 09:26:23 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:18:19 PM
What I'm confused about is that Crash seems to think tourism to Chicago is at risk of being taken by Milwaukee? In what reality has that ever been a thing?
He seems pretty terrified of losing anything to Wisconsin, even if his fears are unfounded that Milwaukee will ever be a more appealing destination.
They do have the museum with the wings on top. Milwaukee's a great place to visit.
Schlemiel, schlemazel...
Not disagreeing but Chicago certainly isn't at risk of losing many tourists to Milwaukee in the grand scheme of things. Crash seems to think otherwise for some reason.
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:27:08 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 06, 2022, 09:26:23 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:18:19 PM
What I'm confused about is that Crash seems to think tourism to Chicago is at risk of being taken by Milwaukee? In what reality has that ever been a thing?
He seems pretty terrified of losing anything to Wisconsin, even if his fears are unfounded that Milwaukee will ever be a more appealing destination.
I think it can be argued that Wisconsin is more appealing than Illinois is though.
I would pick Wisconsin over Illinois 10 of 10.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 06, 2022, 09:31:50 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:27:08 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 06, 2022, 09:26:23 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:18:19 PM
What I'm confused about is that Crash seems to think tourism to Chicago is at risk of being taken by Milwaukee? In what reality has that ever been a thing?
He seems pretty terrified of losing anything to Wisconsin, even if his fears are unfounded that Milwaukee will ever be a more appealing destination.
I think it can be argued that Wisconsin is more appealing than Illinois is though.
I would pick Wisconsin over Illinois 10 of 10.
As would I, Wisconsin generally is just the more appealing State to me.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:30:36 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 06, 2022, 09:27:44 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 06, 2022, 09:26:23 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:18:19 PM
What I'm confused about is that Crash seems to think tourism to Chicago is at risk of being taken by Milwaukee? In what reality has that ever been a thing?
He seems pretty terrified of losing anything to Wisconsin, even if his fears are unfounded that Milwaukee will ever be a more appealing destination.
They do have the museum with the wings on top. Milwaukee's a great place to visit.
Schlemiel, schlemazel...
Not disagreeing but Chicago certainly isn't at risk of losing many tourists to Milwaukee in the grand scheme of things. Crash seems to think otherwise for some reason.
Sure it is. Milwaukee is awesome.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:29:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:25:00 PM
I've never had much of a problem in Detroit. Downtown is the safest part of the city and other than like Max said being asked for spare change is about the most you'll get bothered in downtown Detroit. Even in the most crime ridden parts of Detroit I've never really had much of a problem, places like 7 Mile and Gratiot which is just about the worst part of Detroit I've gone into stores in that area and never had a problem. Even going to Eastland Mall (which is now permanently closed) I never had a problem, likewise at the also now closed Northland Mall. Never have had a problem in any of Detroit's suburbs either and I'm trying to think of an incident but can't think of one. I've been going back and forth to Detroit for my entire life and am very familiar with the metro area. It's true that if you aren't looking for trouble you should be fine but if you are looking for trouble then you'll most likely find it.
I like a good ruins hunt whenever I visit family around Detroit. Usually that means going to some of the statistically unsafe neighborhoods. I've never been bothered by anyone during those expeditions. But then again, if you aren't looking for trouble chances are you won't find it.
Come to think of it I've never been bothered in Flint either or really even Saginaw and I'm in Saginaw every single day. I'm not the type of person that goes looking for trouble though I just like to hang out and blend in. I like driving around Flint and Detroit and looking at all the ruins too it's kind of fun and creepy at times. Like I found this old abandoned school in Flint that had caught on fire and drove within a few blocks of it on Franklin Avenue and went and checked it out, there wasn't much to see but here's the GSV of it, at this point it's in the process of being demolished. https://www.google.com/maps/@43.0295226,-83.6630608,3a,48.9y,79.08h,89.6t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1smdgp9t7HBRupXENw7ktC7g!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3Dmdgp9t7HBRupXENw7ktC7g%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D228.58975%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:25:00 PM
I've never had much of a problem in Detroit. Downtown is the safest part of the city and other than like Max said being asked for spare change is about the most you'll get bothered in downtown Detroit. Even in the most crime ridden parts of Detroit I've never really had much of a problem, places like 7 Mile and Gratiot which is just about the worst part of Detroit I've gone into stores in that area and never had a problem. Even going to Eastland Mall (which is now permanently closed) I never had a problem, likewise at the also now closed Northland Mall.
Frankly, this kind of comment annoys me.
Crime around 7 Mile in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
Quote from: Rothman on June 06, 2022, 09:35:32 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:30:36 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 06, 2022, 09:27:44 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 06, 2022, 09:26:23 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:18:19 PM
What I'm confused about is that Crash seems to think tourism to Chicago is at risk of being taken by Milwaukee? In what reality has that ever been a thing?
He seems pretty terrified of losing anything to Wisconsin, even if his fears are unfounded that Milwaukee will ever be a more appealing destination.
They do have the museum with the wings on top. Milwaukee's a great place to visit.
Schlemiel, schlemazel...
Not disagreeing but Chicago certainly isn't at risk of losing many tourists to Milwaukee in the grand scheme of things. Crash seems to think otherwise for some reason.
Sure it is. Milwaukee is awesome.
It's mini-Chicago. But the real Chicago is more appealing to the majority of tourists.
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:37:37 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:25:00 PM
I've never had much of a problem in Detroit. Downtown is the safest part of the city and other than like Max said being asked for spare change is about the most you'll get bothered in downtown Detroit. Even in the most crime ridden parts of Detroit I've never really had much of a problem, places like 7 Mile and Gratiot which is just about the worst part of Detroit I've gone into stores in that area and never had a problem. Even going to Eastland Mall (which is now permanently closed) I never had a problem, likewise at the also now closed Northland Mall.
Frankly, this kind of comment annoys me.
Crime around 7 Mile in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
Never had a problem around 7 Mile myself either.
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:37:37 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:25:00 PM
I've never had much of a problem in Detroit. Downtown is the safest part of the city and other than like Max said being asked for spare change is about the most you'll get bothered in downtown Detroit. Even in the most crime ridden parts of Detroit I've never really had much of a problem, places like 7 Mile and Gratiot which is just about the worst part of Detroit I've gone into stores in that area and never had a problem. Even going to Eastland Mall (which is now permanently closed) I never had a problem, likewise at the also now closed Northland Mall.
Frankly, this kind of comment annoys me.
Crime around 7 Mile in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
7 Mile crosses the entire city it's a pretty long street. I certainly wouldn't feel unsafe around Palmer Park or Palmer Woods.
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:43:39 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:37:37 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:25:00 PM
I've never had much of a problem in Detroit. Downtown is the safest part of the city and other than like Max said being asked for spare change is about the most you'll get bothered in downtown Detroit. Even in the most crime ridden parts of Detroit I've never really had much of a problem, places like 7 Mile and Gratiot which is just about the worst part of Detroit I've gone into stores in that area and never had a problem. Even going to Eastland Mall (which is now permanently closed) I never had a problem, likewise at the also now closed Northland Mall.
Frankly, this kind of comment annoys me.
Crime around 7 Mile in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
7 Mile crosses the entire city it's a pretty long street. I certainly wouldn't feel unsafe around Palmer Park or Palmer Woods.
Ah, the old "pick at a technicality so as to avoid the point" maneuver.
How about I fix it for you:
Crime around 7 Mile between Kelly and I-75 in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area between Kelly and I-75 being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:43:32 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:37:37 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:25:00 PM
I've never had much of a problem in Detroit. Downtown is the safest part of the city and other than like Max said being asked for spare change is about the most you'll get bothered in downtown Detroit. Even in the most crime ridden parts of Detroit I've never really had much of a problem, places like 7 Mile and Gratiot which is just about the worst part of Detroit I've gone into stores in that area and never had a problem. Even going to Eastland Mall (which is now permanently closed) I never had a problem, likewise at the also now closed Northland Mall.
Frankly, this kind of comment annoys me.
Crime around 7 Mile in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
Never had a problem around 7 Mile myself either.
I don't care.
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:47:42 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:43:32 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:37:37 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:25:00 PM
I've never had much of a problem in Detroit. Downtown is the safest part of the city and other than like Max said being asked for spare change is about the most you'll get bothered in downtown Detroit. Even in the most crime ridden parts of Detroit I've never really had much of a problem, places like 7 Mile and Gratiot which is just about the worst part of Detroit I've gone into stores in that area and never had a problem. Even going to Eastland Mall (which is now permanently closed) I never had a problem, likewise at the also now closed Northland Mall.
Frankly, this kind of comment annoys me.
Crime around 7 Mile in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
Never had a problem around 7 Mile myself either.
I don't care.
Then why voice your opinion or respond to me if you are so resolute in it? Have you even been to some of these places we are discussing in Detroit? Do you thinking roving gangs are just sitting on standby waiting to strike? Detroit is the leader in a lot of bad categories domestically for crime, but it definitely is not stepping into a Robocop movie either.
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:37:37 PM
Crime around 7 Mile in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
No matter if it's an overall safe city or a dangerous city, there are going to be places that are safe, and that are dangerous. No matter what the crime rate is, most of that crime is targeted, and they're not seeking out the common person or tourist in downtown.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:52:32 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:47:42 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:43:32 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:37:37 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:25:00 PM
I've never had much of a problem in Detroit. Downtown is the safest part of the city and other than like Max said being asked for spare change is about the most you'll get bothered in downtown Detroit. Even in the most crime ridden parts of Detroit I've never really had much of a problem, places like 7 Mile and Gratiot which is just about the worst part of Detroit I've gone into stores in that area and never had a problem. Even going to Eastland Mall (which is now permanently closed) I never had a problem, likewise at the also now closed Northland Mall.
Frankly, this kind of comment annoys me.
Crime around 7 Mile in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
Never had a problem around 7 Mile myself either.
I don't care.
Then why voice your opinion or respond to me if you are so resolute in it? Have you even been to some of these places we are discussing in Detroit? Do you thinking roving gangs are just sitting on standby waiting to strike? Detroit is the leader in a lot of bad categories domestically for crime, but it definitely is not stepping into a Robocop movie either.
Ha, I knew you were going to ask me if I've been there. That question completely misses the conversation.
Personal anecdotes don't override decades' worth of closely tracked statistics. Full stop. It doesn't matter if I've been there or not (I haven't, and trying to use that against me would once again miss the point).
Do I think I'd be walking into a firing squad or anything? No. Chances are, nothing bad would happen if I were to go there. But bad things would be more likely to happen there than damn near anywhere else in the country.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 06, 2022, 09:53:59 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:37:37 PM
Crime around 7 Mile in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
No matter if it's an overall safe city or a dangerous city, there are going to be places that are safe, and that are dangerous. No matter what the crime rate is, most of that crime is targeted, and they're not seeking out the common person or tourist in downtown.
You can't just equalize crime in places that straight up have different amounts of crime. Detroit is more dangerous than almost any other city. Is it the only dangerous city? No. Is it the most dangerous city? Maybe not. Does it have nice neighborhoods? Absolutely.
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:59:36 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:52:32 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:47:42 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:43:32 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:37:37 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:25:00 PM
I've never had much of a problem in Detroit. Downtown is the safest part of the city and other than like Max said being asked for spare change is about the most you'll get bothered in downtown Detroit. Even in the most crime ridden parts of Detroit I've never really had much of a problem, places like 7 Mile and Gratiot which is just about the worst part of Detroit I've gone into stores in that area and never had a problem. Even going to Eastland Mall (which is now permanently closed) I never had a problem, likewise at the also now closed Northland Mall.
Frankly, this kind of comment annoys me.
Crime around 7 Mile in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
Never had a problem around 7 Mile myself either.
I don't care.
Then why voice your opinion or respond to me if you are so resolute in it? Have you even been to some of these places we are discussing in Detroit? Do you thinking roving gangs are just sitting on standby waiting to strike? Detroit is the leader in a lot of bad categories domestically for crime, but it definitely is not stepping into a Robocop movie either.
Ha, I knew you were going to ask me if I've been there. That question completely misses the conversation.
Personal anecdotes don't override decades' worth of closely tracked statistics. Full stop. It doesn't matter if I've been there or not (I haven't, and trying to use that against me would once again miss the point).
Do I think I'd be walking into a firing squad or anything? No. Chances are, nothing bad would happen if I were to go there. But bad things would be more likely to happen there than damn near anywhere else in the country.
So basically you have zero experience with the topic at hand (Detroit and the Uniform Crime Report) and you have a set perception in your mind based of UCR violent crime statistics. How does that sway the argument in your favor exactly? You seem to have the same problem Crash does, the UCR doesn't actually provide context for the crime statistics it cites. But if you want to live a sheltered existence based on what you read in UCR statistics that's cool, you do you.
Now you have me curious what your thoughts are on traveling to crime prone cities in places like Central America.
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:59:36 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:52:32 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:47:42 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:43:32 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:37:37 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:25:00 PM
I've never had much of a problem in Detroit. Downtown is the safest part of the city and other than like Max said being asked for spare change is about the most you'll get bothered in downtown Detroit. Even in the most crime ridden parts of Detroit I've never really had much of a problem, places like 7 Mile and Gratiot which is just about the worst part of Detroit I've gone into stores in that area and never had a problem. Even going to Eastland Mall (which is now permanently closed) I never had a problem, likewise at the also now closed Northland Mall.
Frankly, this kind of comment annoys me.
Crime around 7 Mile in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
Never had a problem around 7 Mile myself either.
I don't care.
Then why voice your opinion or respond to me if you are so resolute in it? Have you even been to some of these places we are discussing in Detroit? Do you thinking roving gangs are just sitting on standby waiting to strike? Detroit is the leader in a lot of bad categories domestically for crime, but it definitely is not stepping into a Robocop movie either.
Ha, I knew you were going to ask me if I've been there. That question completely misses the conversation.
Personal anecdotes don't override decades' worth of closely tracked statistics. Full stop. It doesn't matter if I've been there or not (I haven't, and trying to use that against me would once again miss the point).
Do I think I'd be walking into a firing squad or anything? No. Chances are, nothing bad would happen if I were to go there. But bad things would be more likely to happen there than damn near anywhere else in the country.
So, no, you haven't been there.
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:40:34 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 06, 2022, 09:35:32 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:30:36 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 06, 2022, 09:27:44 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 06, 2022, 09:26:23 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:18:19 PM
What I'm confused about is that Crash seems to think tourism to Chicago is at risk of being taken by Milwaukee? In what reality has that ever been a thing?
He seems pretty terrified of losing anything to Wisconsin, even if his fears are unfounded that Milwaukee will ever be a more appealing destination.
They do have the museum with the wings on top. Milwaukee's a great place to visit.
Schlemiel, schlemazel...
Not disagreeing but Chicago certainly isn't at risk of losing many tourists to Milwaukee in the grand scheme of things. Crash seems to think otherwise for some reason.
Sure it is. Milwaukee is awesome.
It's mini-Chicago. But the real Chicago is more appealing to the majority of tourists.
Not for long. Milwaukee's Riverwalk rivals anything along the Chicago River.
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:47:17 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:43:39 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:37:37 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:25:00 PM
I've never had much of a problem in Detroit. Downtown is the safest part of the city and other than like Max said being asked for spare change is about the most you'll get bothered in downtown Detroit. Even in the most crime ridden parts of Detroit I've never really had much of a problem, places like 7 Mile and Gratiot which is just about the worst part of Detroit I've gone into stores in that area and never had a problem. Even going to Eastland Mall (which is now permanently closed) I never had a problem, likewise at the also now closed Northland Mall.
Frankly, this kind of comment annoys me.
Crime around 7 Mile in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
7 Mile crosses the entire city it's a pretty long street. I certainly wouldn't feel unsafe around Palmer Park or Palmer Woods.
Ah, the old "pick at a technicality so as to avoid the point" maneuver.
How about I fix it for you:
Crime around 7 Mile between Kelly and I-75 in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area between Kelly and I-75 being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
Crime around 7 Mile between Kelly and I-75 is really really bad, no kidding it sounds as if you are trying to tell me something I don't know. And no I haven't had a problem there because I don't go looking for problems and know enough to go the other way when problems are happening. How is 7 Mile between Kelly and I-75 a neighborhood though?
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 10:09:14 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:59:36 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:52:32 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:47:42 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:43:32 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:37:37 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:25:00 PM
I've never had much of a problem in Detroit. Downtown is the safest part of the city and other than like Max said being asked for spare change is about the most you'll get bothered in downtown Detroit. Even in the most crime ridden parts of Detroit I've never really had much of a problem, places like 7 Mile and Gratiot which is just about the worst part of Detroit I've gone into stores in that area and never had a problem. Even going to Eastland Mall (which is now permanently closed) I never had a problem, likewise at the also now closed Northland Mall.
Frankly, this kind of comment annoys me.
Crime around 7 Mile in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
Never had a problem around 7 Mile myself either.
I don't care.
Then why voice your opinion or respond to me if you are so resolute in it? Have you even been to some of these places we are discussing in Detroit? Do you thinking roving gangs are just sitting on standby waiting to strike? Detroit is the leader in a lot of bad categories domestically for crime, but it definitely is not stepping into a Robocop movie either.
Ha, I knew you were going to ask me if I've been there. That question completely misses the conversation.
Personal anecdotes don't override decades' worth of closely tracked statistics. Full stop. It doesn't matter if I've been there or not (I haven't, and trying to use that against me would once again miss the point).
Do I think I'd be walking into a firing squad or anything? No. Chances are, nothing bad would happen if I were to go there. But bad things would be more likely to happen there than damn near anywhere else in the country.
So basically you have zero experience with the topic at hand (Detroit and the Uniform Crime Report) and you have a set perception in your mind based of UCR violent crime statistics. How does that sway the argument in your favor exactly? You seem to have the same problem Crash does, the UCR doesn't actually provide context for the crime statistics it cites. But if you want to live a sheltered existence based on what you read in UCR statistics that's cool, you do you.
Now you have me curious what your thoughts are on traveling to crime prone cities in places like Central America.
I'm not interested in going to Central America anytime soon. If I ever was to go there, I wouldn't go to the bad parts - exactly the same situation as when I go to Detroit, and I would think Detroit is safer than most of those cities. I have no interest in getting out of a car in the worst areas of Detroit (though I think driving through could be a valuable experience).
I understand that the vast majority of Detroit crime is not targeted towards visitors - that's the case in every city. However, I can't imagine that Detroit visitors are less likely to be the victim of property/violent crime during their stay than visitors to the host of safer cities are during their stays.
If there's evidence that says otherwise, then sure. But at least right now I have no reason to believe that Detroit is somehow safer for tourists than most cities. As a result I'm hesitant to go to dangerous Detroit neighborhoods.
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 10:18:57 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:47:17 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:43:39 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:37:37 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:25:00 PM
I've never had much of a problem in Detroit. Downtown is the safest part of the city and other than like Max said being asked for spare change is about the most you'll get bothered in downtown Detroit. Even in the most crime ridden parts of Detroit I've never really had much of a problem, places like 7 Mile and Gratiot which is just about the worst part of Detroit I've gone into stores in that area and never had a problem. Even going to Eastland Mall (which is now permanently closed) I never had a problem, likewise at the also now closed Northland Mall.
Frankly, this kind of comment annoys me.
Crime around 7 Mile in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
7 Mile crosses the entire city it's a pretty long street. I certainly wouldn't feel unsafe around Palmer Park or Palmer Woods.
Ah, the old "pick at a technicality so as to avoid the point" maneuver.
How about I fix it for you:
Crime around 7 Mile between Kelly and I-75 in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area between Kelly and I-75 being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
Crime around 7 Mile between Kelly and I-75 is really really bad, no kidding it sounds as if you are trying to tell me something I don't know. And no I haven't had a problem there because I don't go looking for problems and know enough to go the other way when problems are happening. How is 7 Mile between Kelly and I-75 a neighborhood though?
I think we're mostly on the same page, though I see you couldn't resist the urge to pick at another technicality, this time with semi-official neighborhoods.
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 10:25:51 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 10:18:57 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:47:17 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:43:39 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:37:37 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:25:00 PM
I've never had much of a problem in Detroit. Downtown is the safest part of the city and other than like Max said being asked for spare change is about the most you'll get bothered in downtown Detroit. Even in the most crime ridden parts of Detroit I've never really had much of a problem, places like 7 Mile and Gratiot which is just about the worst part of Detroit I've gone into stores in that area and never had a problem. Even going to Eastland Mall (which is now permanently closed) I never had a problem, likewise at the also now closed Northland Mall.
Frankly, this kind of comment annoys me.
Crime around 7 Mile in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
7 Mile crosses the entire city it's a pretty long street. I certainly wouldn't feel unsafe around Palmer Park or Palmer Woods.
Ah, the old "pick at a technicality so as to avoid the point" maneuver.
How about I fix it for you:
Crime around 7 Mile between Kelly and I-75 in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area between Kelly and I-75 being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
Crime around 7 Mile between Kelly and I-75 is really really bad, no kidding it sounds as if you are trying to tell me something I don't know. And no I haven't had a problem there because I don't go looking for problems and know enough to go the other way when problems are happening. How is 7 Mile between Kelly and I-75 a neighborhood though?
I think we're mostly on the same page, though I see you couldn't resist the urge to pick at another technicality, this time with semi-official neighborhoods.
I lived in the area in the 90's for a bit. It's certainly gone downhill more since then. I lived off of 7 Mile and Van Dyke on a street called Stockton I didn't have any problems when I was there though and I knew several people that lived around me too. The actual worst of it is east of Gratiot.
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 10:22:27 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 10:09:14 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:59:36 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:52:32 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:47:42 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:43:32 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:37:37 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:25:00 PM
I've never had much of a problem in Detroit. Downtown is the safest part of the city and other than like Max said being asked for spare change is about the most you'll get bothered in downtown Detroit. Even in the most crime ridden parts of Detroit I've never really had much of a problem, places like 7 Mile and Gratiot which is just about the worst part of Detroit I've gone into stores in that area and never had a problem. Even going to Eastland Mall (which is now permanently closed) I never had a problem, likewise at the also now closed Northland Mall.
Frankly, this kind of comment annoys me.
Crime around 7 Mile in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
Never had a problem around 7 Mile myself either.
I don't care.
Then why voice your opinion or respond to me if you are so resolute in it? Have you even been to some of these places we are discussing in Detroit? Do you thinking roving gangs are just sitting on standby waiting to strike? Detroit is the leader in a lot of bad categories domestically for crime, but it definitely is not stepping into a Robocop movie either.
Ha, I knew you were going to ask me if I've been there. That question completely misses the conversation.
Personal anecdotes don't override decades' worth of closely tracked statistics. Full stop. It doesn't matter if I've been there or not (I haven't, and trying to use that against me would once again miss the point).
Do I think I'd be walking into a firing squad or anything? No. Chances are, nothing bad would happen if I were to go there. But bad things would be more likely to happen there than damn near anywhere else in the country.
So basically you have zero experience with the topic at hand (Detroit and the Uniform Crime Report) and you have a set perception in your mind based of UCR violent crime statistics. How does that sway the argument in your favor exactly? You seem to have the same problem Crash does, the UCR doesn't actually provide context for the crime statistics it cites. But if you want to live a sheltered existence based on what you read in UCR statistics that's cool, you do you.
Now you have me curious what your thoughts are on traveling to crime prone cities in places like Central America.
I'm not interested in going to Central America anytime soon. If I ever was to go there, I wouldn't go to the bad parts - exactly the same situation as when I go to Detroit, and I would think Detroit is safer than most of those cities. I have no interest in getting out of a car in the worst areas of Detroit (though I think driving through could be a valuable experience).
I understand that the vast majority of Detroit crime is not targeted towards visitors - that's the case in every city. However, I can't imagine that Detroit visitors are less likely to be the victim of property/violent crime during their stay than visitors to the host of safer cities are during their stays.
If there's evidence that says otherwise, then sure. But at least right now I have no reason to believe that Detroit is somehow safer for tourists than most cities. As a result I'm hesitant to go to dangerous Detroit neighborhoods.
Okay, risk aversion it is. FWIW I did note above Detroit was near the top (if not traditionally the top) of a lot of UCR categories. I wasn't also throwing out a recommendation that Detroit is a city I think everyone should visit. There is a lot of poverty, crime and depression in Detroit, it can be an incredibly sad place.
I'm certainly not afraid to visit Detroit and other American cities like it. All the same I'm there is a lot obscure hobbies I'm into like taking photos of old infrastructure and buildings, that is something Detroit offers probably more than any other major American city. I never been accosted by violent crime engaging in those activities nor was I when I lived there (it is my home city).
Total aside, after my wife (a Californian) and I got married we went on our honeymoon trip to the Midwest. Said trip included stops in Detroit and Chicago. While we were in Detroit she told me that she really wanted to see 8 Mile Road. I ended up taking her from a Tigers Game via Grand River to 8 Mile where my Grandparents lived in Redford Township. From there we went west on 8 Mile Road to Haggerty Road past two offices my Dad worked at. We ended up eating lunch at the Big Boy at 8 Mile and Haggerty. I've never seen look my wife so disappointed by a place anywhere we have visited, she thought 8 Mile Road was going to be like how it was presented in the Marshall Mathers movie.
Later in the trip we visited the Pullman neighborhood in Chicago. That fit much more closely to the visual expectation my wife had for 8 Mile Road.
How about we throw some actual data into the conversation, people?
(I fully understand that Chicago violence has increased since 2019, but this is the best I could do.)
(https://i.imgur.com/X18EgUC.png)
For what it's worth, noted Michigander Ted Nugent was saying Detroit was "the murder capital of the world" back in the 1970s.
Quote from: Rothman on June 06, 2022, 10:09:27 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:59:36 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:52:32 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:47:42 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 06, 2022, 09:43:32 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 06, 2022, 09:37:37 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 06, 2022, 09:25:00 PM
I've never had much of a problem in Detroit. Downtown is the safest part of the city and other than like Max said being asked for spare change is about the most you'll get bothered in downtown Detroit. Even in the most crime ridden parts of Detroit I've never really had much of a problem, places like 7 Mile and Gratiot which is just about the worst part of Detroit I've gone into stores in that area and never had a problem. Even going to Eastland Mall (which is now permanently closed) I never had a problem, likewise at the also now closed Northland Mall.
Frankly, this kind of comment annoys me.
Crime around 7 Mile in Detroit is really, really bad. You've never had a problem there? Good for you. But that doesn't override, or even make a scratch on, the statistics that show that Detroit is no doubt one of the 5 most dangerous cities in the country, with the 7 Mile area being one of the worst neighborhoods in it.
Never had a problem around 7 Mile myself either.
I don't care.
Then why voice your opinion or respond to me if you are so resolute in it? Have you even been to some of these places we are discussing in Detroit? Do you thinking roving gangs are just sitting on standby waiting to strike? Detroit is the leader in a lot of bad categories domestically for crime, but it definitely is not stepping into a Robocop movie either.
Ha, I knew you were going to ask me if I've been there. That question completely misses the conversation.
Personal anecdotes don't override decades' worth of closely tracked statistics. Full stop. It doesn't matter if I've been there or not (I haven't, and trying to use that against me would once again miss the point).
Do I think I'd be walking into a firing squad or anything? No. Chances are, nothing bad would happen if I were to go there. But bad things would be more likely to happen there than damn near anywhere else in the country.
So, no, you haven't been there.
Troll 💀
Quote from: hbelkins on June 07, 2022, 01:49:24 PM
For what it's worth, noted Michigander Ted Nugent was saying Detroit was "the murder capital of the world" back in the 1970s.
The total homicide count for 1987-2016:
https://detroitmi.gov/sites/detroitmi.localhost/files/2018-06/2016%20DPD%20Homicides.pdf
1964-1975:
https://www.clickondetroit.com/features/2017/02/22/from-the-vault-1975-special-on-murder-in-detroit/
I'm missing the data for 1976-1986 but I believe there was at least one year in the late 1970s where recordable homicides did top 800.
Quote from: hbelkins on June 07, 2022, 01:49:24 PM
For what it's worth, noted Michigander Ted Nugent was saying Detroit was "the murder capital of the world" back in the 1970s.
It's not worth nothing, because noted Michigander Ted Nugent is a racist piece of garbage. He's the type who will base the favorability of a place on its whiteness, just like a large proportion of America's white population unfortunately would.
And this is the AARoads forum...nitpicking at technicalities is most of what we do here.
Went to Detroit a year ago, and I was amazed by the amount of decay. It's not concentrated into neighborhoods like what I've seen of Chicago--it's widespread. (I admit I haven't been to Chicago's South Side much--it might be more widespread there, too.) I like seeing the backdrops to where people live their lives, though, so it was really interesting to see, in a sad way.
Milwaukee might be a really nice place to visit, but its smaller size will simply make it less appealing to prospective tourists. I don't see Milwaukee getting the "world-class city" treatment like Chicago does, just because it's not as big of a business giant with not as high a population. Is that fair? Probably not. But Milwaukee isn't going to start garnering more attention than Chicago does anytime soon. I won't argue whether Milwaukee is more or less deserving of the attention, though; that's completely subjective.
I like Ted Nugent but he also called Michigan a California shithole. I like his music though.
Ted Nugent is a bad man.
Quote from: paulthemapguy on June 08, 2022, 09:25:01 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 07, 2022, 01:49:24 PM
For what it's worth, noted Michigander Ted Nugent was saying Detroit was "the murder capital of the world" back in the 1970s.
It's not worth nothing, because noted Michigander Ted Nugent is a racist piece of garbage. He's the type who will base the favorability of a place on its whiteness, just like a large proportion of America's white population unfortunately would.
And this is the AARoads forum...nitpicking at technicalities is most of what we do here.
Went to Detroit a year ago, and I was amazed by the amount of decay. It's not concentrated into neighborhoods like what I've seen of Chicago--it's widespread. (I admit I haven't been to Chicago's South Side much--it might be more widespread there, too.) I like seeing the backdrops to where people live their lives, though, so it was really interesting to see, in a sad way.
Milwaukee might be a really nice place to visit, but its smaller size will simply make it less appealing to prospective tourists. I don't see Milwaukee getting the "world-class city" treatment like Chicago does, just because it's not as big of a business giant with not as high a population. Is that fair? Probably not. But Milwaukee isn't going to start garnering more attention than Chicago does anytime soon. I won't argue whether Milwaukee is more or less deserving of the attention, though; that's completely subjective.
Well I've been to the Southside of Chicago and most of it is in decay just like Detroit. I've often said that if you want to see Detroit just visit the Southside of Chicago and that is what Detroit is like. Detroit is comparable to Chicago they both have the same Urban headaches.
I think it's safe to say that there was very likely several cities in the world during the 1970s exceeding the 700-800 homicides Detroit was having.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 08, 2022, 12:02:36 PM
I think it's safe to say that there was very likely several cities in the world during the 1970s exceeding the 700-800 homicides Detroit was having.
Total numbers don't mean much, because population sizes aren't necessarily comparable.
700 homicides in a city of 3 million isn't the same thing as 700 homicides in a city of 1½ million.
Quote from: kphoger on June 08, 2022, 12:16:07 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 08, 2022, 12:02:36 PM
I think it's safe to say that there was very likely several cities in the world during the 1970s exceeding the 700-800 homicides Detroit was having.
Total numbers don't mean much, because population sizes aren't necessarily comparable.
700 homicides in a city of 3 million isn't the same thing as 700 homicides in a city of 1½ million.
Right, but we are going by the notion that a city is the "murder capital of the world" I just don't think even 1970s American city is going to be in the running for that title.
But to your point, at the time Detroit was half the size population wise roughly of modern Chicago but had a similar overall number of murders. Suffice to say that murder rate was far higher than in Detroit than it is now in Chicago.
That's true Detroit seems worse than Chicago because it's much smaller than Chicago if Chicago and Detroit were the same size then maybe we could compare them.
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 08, 2022, 12:54:49 PM
That's true Detroit seems worse than Chicago because it's much smaller than Chicago if Chicago and Detroit were the same size then maybe we could compare them.
I did compare them. The data I plotted earlier is for
per 100,000 population. It's fairly easy to do the same for homicides, if you'd like.
Quote from: kphoger on June 08, 2022, 01:17:36 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 08, 2022, 12:54:49 PM
That's true Detroit seems worse than Chicago because it's much smaller than Chicago if Chicago and Detroit were the same size then maybe we could compare them.
I did compare them. The data I plotted earlier is for per 100,000 population. It's fairly easy to do the same for homicides, if you'd like.
Which is how the UCR rates violent crime statistics, per 100,000 residents. The UCR does rank the most violent crime prone cities per 100,000 versus sheer statistical volume such as "total homicides."
Here is a sample I ran for Fresno based off the 2020 UCR:
https://crime-data-explorer.app.cloud.gov/pages/explorer/crime/crime-trend
Quote from: kphoger on June 07, 2022, 10:20:07 AM
How about we throw some actual data into the conversation, people?
(I fully understand that Chicago violence has increased since 2019, but this is the best I could do.)
(https://i.imgur.com/X18EgUC.png)
As promised, here is the same chart, but for murder instead of assault.
For what it's worth, Chicago hit 765 murders in 2016, but Detroit's murder
rate was still more than 60% higher than Chicago's that year.
In 2020, Chicago had 784 murders. In 2021, it had 797. Even so, its homicide
rate was still well below Detroit's. And besides, why is nobody talking about Saint Louis?
(https://i.imgur.com/zaB10kd.jpg)
Where did Flint rank on the UCR last year? Typically that's also in the top five annually for violent crime along with Detroit.
I'm not using the UCR data, but Flint appears to be up there with Detroit from what I'm seeing.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 08, 2022, 01:22:57 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 08, 2022, 01:17:36 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 08, 2022, 12:54:49 PM
That's true Detroit seems worse than Chicago because it's much smaller than Chicago if Chicago and Detroit were the same size then maybe we could compare them.
I did compare them. The data I plotted earlier is for per 100,000 population. It's fairly easy to do the same for homicides, if you'd like.
Which is how the UCR rates violent crime statistics, per 100,000 residents. The UCR does rank the most violent crime prone cities per 100,000 versus sheer statistical volume such as "total homicides."
I have the same problem with determining crime rates based on a standard of "per 100,000 residents" as I did with the covid incidence rate being based on that figure.
It really skews the rate higher for small communities.
One or two murders -- or one of two covid cases -- in a community like mine with a population of 7,000 really skews the rate up, while it's statistically meaningless in a larger community. I always thought a better indicator would be the actual percentage of residents who had tested positive for covid. My county was one of the last ones in Kentucky to record a case, but it spent considerable time in the red zone, which alarmed a lot of people. When you did the math and realized how few cases that high "incidence rate" really was, it wasn't quite so panicky.
The Ted Nugent reference was from the way he introduced one of the songs on his "Double Live Gonzo" album released in the 1970s. He wasn't citing actual statistics, but was repeating a popular claim.
Quote from: hbelkins on June 08, 2022, 04:41:16 PM
I have the same problem with determining crime rates based on a standard of "per 100,000 residents" as I did with the covid incidence rate being based on that figure.
It really skews the rate higher for small communities.
One or two murders -- or one of two covid cases -- in a community like mine with a population of 7,000 really skews the rate up, while it's statistically meaningless in a larger community. I always thought a better indicator would be the actual percentage of residents who had tested positive for covid. My county was one of the last ones in Kentucky to record a case, but it spent considerable time in the red zone, which alarmed a lot of people. When you did the math and realized how few cases that high "incidence rate" really was, it wasn't quite so panicky.
The solution to that is to use larger units. I saw a map somewhere, probably on this forum, where it was your typical color by county except counties merged if they were too small so that every region had 100,000 or more people; I'm not sure where the groupings came from.
And your area
was hit hard by COVID-19, with the counties in Kentucky within three counties of Virginia having some of the highest overall case rates in the entire country, while the entire state has high overall death rates except for inside the triangle bounded by Louisville, Cincinnati, and Lexington.
Quote from: hbelkins on June 08, 2022, 04:41:16 PM
I have the same problem with determining crime rates based on a standard of "per 100,000 residents" as I did with the covid incidence rate being based on that figure.
It really skews the rate higher for small communities.
One or two murders -- or one of two covid cases -- in a community like mine with a population of 7,000 really skews the rate up, while it's statistically meaningless in a larger community. I always thought a better indicator would be the actual percentage of residents who had tested positive for covid. My county was one of the last ones in Kentucky to record a case, but it spent considerable time in the red zone, which alarmed a lot of people. When you did the math and realized how few cases that high "incidence rate" really was, it wasn't quite so panicky.
But assaults and homicides don't just float around in the air, waiting for someone to walk into them. They are an act committed against a certain person at a certain time. Therefore, in order to weigh the risk to you–as a certain person being in that place at a certain time–it is very meaningful to ask the question,
What are the chances that I might be the person it's done to? In order to answer that question, you have to take population size into account.
Hypothetical Town A
Population = 50,000
Annual homicides = 5
Hypothetical Town B
Population = 5 million
Annual homicides = 500
In either hypothetical town, the chance of a homicide targeting any given person is 1 in 10,000. And that's what you really want to know, isn't it?
Quote from: kphoger on June 08, 2022, 05:16:38 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 08, 2022, 04:41:16 PM
I have the same problem with determining crime rates based on a standard of "per 100,000 residents" as I did with the covid incidence rate being based on that figure.
It really skews the rate higher for small communities.
One or two murders -- or one of two covid cases -- in a community like mine with a population of 7,000 really skews the rate up, while it's statistically meaningless in a larger community. I always thought a better indicator would be the actual percentage of residents who had tested positive for covid. My county was one of the last ones in Kentucky to record a case, but it spent considerable time in the red zone, which alarmed a lot of people. When you did the math and realized how few cases that high "incidence rate" really was, it wasn't quite so panicky.
But assaults and homicides don't just float around in the air, waiting for someone to walk into them. They are an act committed against a certain person at a certain time. Therefore, in order to weigh the risk to you–as a certain person being in that place at a certain time–it is very meaningful to ask the question, What are the chances that I might be the person it's done to? In order to answer that question, you have to take population size into account.
Hypothetical Town A
Population = 50,000
Annual homicides = 5
Hypothetical Town B
Population = 5 million
Annual homicides = 500
In either hypothetical town, the chance of a homicide targeting any given person is 1 in 10,000. And that's what you really want to know, isn't it?
But as you stated, the statistics don't really tell the story about how victims are targeted. That might be a 1 in 10,000 chance for some but might more or less chance for others depending on circumstances and actions they take.
Granted I don't really know of a good way to make risk calculations based upon an individual, the city they are in and the actions they take. All the same, certain behaviors certainly do enhance the risk of being a victim of crime.
Absolutely. I was just talking averages.
Quote from: kphoger on May 31, 2022, 04:09:33 PM
– Pics or it didn't happen.
Challenge accepted.
(https://i.chzbgr.com/full/8373978112/h83E6E951/too-fast-for-slow-motion.gif)
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 08, 2022, 11:54:21 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on June 08, 2022, 09:25:01 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 07, 2022, 01:49:24 PM
For what it's worth, noted Michigander Ted Nugent was saying Detroit was "the murder capital of the world" back in the 1970s.
It's not worth nothing, because noted Michigander Ted Nugent is a racist piece of garbage. He's the type who will base the favorability of a place on its whiteness, just like a large proportion of America's white population unfortunately would.
And this is the AARoads forum...nitpicking at technicalities is most of what we do here.
Went to Detroit a year ago, and I was amazed by the amount of decay. It's not concentrated into neighborhoods like what I've seen of Chicago--it's widespread. (I admit I haven't been to Chicago's South Side much--it might be more widespread there, too.) I like seeing the backdrops to where people live their lives, though, so it was really interesting to see, in a sad way.
Milwaukee might be a really nice place to visit, but its smaller size will simply make it less appealing to prospective tourists. I don't see Milwaukee getting the "world-class city" treatment like Chicago does, just because it's not as big of a business giant with not as high a population. Is that fair? Probably not. But Milwaukee isn't going to start garnering more attention than Chicago does anytime soon. I won't argue whether Milwaukee is more or less deserving of the attention, though; that's completely subjective.
Well I've been to the Southside of Chicago and most of it is in decay just like Detroit. I've often said that if you want to see Detroit just visit the Southside of Chicago and that is what Detroit is like. Detroit is comparable to Chicago they both have the same Urban headaches.
You obviously haven't been to the Southside if you're making that statement.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 08, 2022, 11:41:51 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 08, 2022, 11:54:21 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on June 08, 2022, 09:25:01 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 07, 2022, 01:49:24 PM
For what it's worth, noted Michigander Ted Nugent was saying Detroit was "the murder capital of the world" back in the 1970s.
It's not worth nothing, because noted Michigander Ted Nugent is a racist piece of garbage. He's the type who will base the favorability of a place on its whiteness, just like a large proportion of America's white population unfortunately would.
And this is the AARoads forum...nitpicking at technicalities is most of what we do here.
Went to Detroit a year ago, and I was amazed by the amount of decay. It's not concentrated into neighborhoods like what I've seen of Chicago--it's widespread. (I admit I haven't been to Chicago's South Side much--it might be more widespread there, too.) I like seeing the backdrops to where people live their lives, though, so it was really interesting to see, in a sad way.
Milwaukee might be a really nice place to visit, but its smaller size will simply make it less appealing to prospective tourists. I don't see Milwaukee getting the "world-class city" treatment like Chicago does, just because it's not as big of a business giant with not as high a population. Is that fair? Probably not. But Milwaukee isn't going to start garnering more attention than Chicago does anytime soon. I won't argue whether Milwaukee is more or less deserving of the attention, though; that's completely subjective.
Well I've been to the Southside of Chicago and most of it is in decay just like Detroit. I've often said that if you want to see Detroit just visit the Southside of Chicago and that is what Detroit is like. Detroit is comparable to Chicago they both have the same Urban headaches.
You obviously haven't been to the Southside if you're making that statement.
Not directed at me but since I cited Pullman upthread and I've lived in Chicago I figured that would opine. Much of the Southside of Chicago is a blue collar industrial wreck and not too dissimilar to what one would expect in a stereotypical rust belt city.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 08, 2022, 11:53:34 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 08, 2022, 11:41:51 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 08, 2022, 11:54:21 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on June 08, 2022, 09:25:01 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 07, 2022, 01:49:24 PM
For what it's worth, noted Michigander Ted Nugent was saying Detroit was "the murder capital of the world" back in the 1970s.
It's not worth nothing, because noted Michigander Ted Nugent is a racist piece of garbage. He's the type who will base the favorability of a place on its whiteness, just like a large proportion of America's white population unfortunately would.
And this is the AARoads forum...nitpicking at technicalities is most of what we do here.
Went to Detroit a year ago, and I was amazed by the amount of decay. It's not concentrated into neighborhoods like what I've seen of Chicago--it's widespread. (I admit I haven't been to Chicago's South Side much--it might be more widespread there, too.) I like seeing the backdrops to where people live their lives, though, so it was really interesting to see, in a sad way.
Milwaukee might be a really nice place to visit, but its smaller size will simply make it less appealing to prospective tourists. I don't see Milwaukee getting the "world-class city" treatment like Chicago does, just because it's not as big of a business giant with not as high a population. Is that fair? Probably not. But Milwaukee isn't going to start garnering more attention than Chicago does anytime soon. I won't argue whether Milwaukee is more or less deserving of the attention, though; that's completely subjective.
Well I've been to the Southside of Chicago and most of it is in decay just like Detroit. I've often said that if you want to see Detroit just visit the Southside of Chicago and that is what Detroit is like. Detroit is comparable to Chicago they both have the same Urban headaches.
You obviously haven't been to the Southside if you're making that statement.
Not directed at me but since I cited Pullman upthread and I've lived in Chicago I figured that would opine. Much of the Southside of Chicago is a blue collar industrial wreck and not too dissimilar to what one would expect in a stereotypical rust belt city.
When I visited Pullman, I thought Southside was a rather strange mix of working class people scraping by and better and then burnt-out-dear-heavens-is-that-a-crackhouse horror shows. It was really socioeconomically complex.
I'd like to point out that the two people defending Detroit in this thread are both from Michigan. Granted, it's not Carhorn-level homerism. But clearly there's some American State Pride Syndrome in everyone.
Quote from: thspfc on June 09, 2022, 08:13:29 AM
I'd like to point out that the two people defending Detroit in this thread are both from Michigan. Granted, it's not Carhorn-level homerism. But clearly there's some American State Pride Syndrome in everyone.
Interesting assertion that you think I was defending Detroit. Being fearful of an American city, having an American-only centric perspective and fearing being a victim crime in unfamiliar places are very stereotypical American traits as well.
I've walked pretty much every non-residential street plus some residential ones in Lawrence, MA north of the river and east of MA 28, which is about 3-4 square miles. There is no place within this region where I haven't been within 750 feet except along the I-495 corridor. I would show a map, except it could reveal where I live.
While much of the city has abandoned buildings, I don't feel unsafe regarding crime (there have been a few close calls with being hit by cars, not unique to Lawrence; I'm not counting those as feeling unsafe). That said, I only walk during the daytime. Lawrence is also getting better over time, becoming its own Hispanic (mostly Dominican north of the river) community over the last few decades. The riots in 1994 don't seem anywhere near likely to happen again soon.
Even if you did walk around in the dark it isn't as though you would be engaging in the activities which would make someone generally a victim of crime. You are less and less likely to even encounter another person the longer the night time approaches sunrise.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 08, 2022, 11:41:51 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 08, 2022, 11:54:21 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on June 08, 2022, 09:25:01 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 07, 2022, 01:49:24 PM
For what it's worth, noted Michigander Ted Nugent was saying Detroit was "the murder capital of the world" back in the 1970s.
It's not worth nothing, because noted Michigander Ted Nugent is a racist piece of garbage. He's the type who will base the favorability of a place on its whiteness, just like a large proportion of America's white population unfortunately would.
And this is the AARoads forum...nitpicking at technicalities is most of what we do here.
Went to Detroit a year ago, and I was amazed by the amount of decay. It's not concentrated into neighborhoods like what I've seen of Chicago--it's widespread. (I admit I haven't been to Chicago's South Side much--it might be more widespread there, too.) I like seeing the backdrops to where people live their lives, though, so it was really interesting to see, in a sad way.
Milwaukee might be a really nice place to visit, but its smaller size will simply make it less appealing to prospective tourists. I don't see Milwaukee getting the "world-class city" treatment like Chicago does, just because it's not as big of a business giant with not as high a population. Is that fair? Probably not. But Milwaukee isn't going to start garnering more attention than Chicago does anytime soon. I won't argue whether Milwaukee is more or less deserving of the attention, though; that's completely subjective.
Well I've been to the Southside of Chicago and most of it is in decay just like Detroit. I've often said that if you want to see Detroit just visit the Southside of Chicago and that is what Detroit is like. Detroit is comparable to Chicago they both have the same Urban headaches.
You obviously haven't been to the Southside if you're making that statement.
You have never been to Detroit so you have no business making such a claim. You have no idea what Detroit is like compared to the Southside of Chicago so don't try telling me I haven't been somewhere.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 08, 2022, 11:53:34 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 08, 2022, 11:41:51 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 08, 2022, 11:54:21 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on June 08, 2022, 09:25:01 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 07, 2022, 01:49:24 PM
For what it's worth, noted Michigander Ted Nugent was saying Detroit was "the murder capital of the world" back in the 1970s.
It's not worth nothing, because noted Michigander Ted Nugent is a racist piece of garbage. He's the type who will base the favorability of a place on its whiteness, just like a large proportion of America's white population unfortunately would.
And this is the AARoads forum...nitpicking at technicalities is most of what we do here.
Went to Detroit a year ago, and I was amazed by the amount of decay. It's not concentrated into neighborhoods like what I've seen of Chicago--it's widespread. (I admit I haven't been to Chicago's South Side much--it might be more widespread there, too.) I like seeing the backdrops to where people live their lives, though, so it was really interesting to see, in a sad way.
Milwaukee might be a really nice place to visit, but its smaller size will simply make it less appealing to prospective tourists. I don't see Milwaukee getting the "world-class city" treatment like Chicago does, just because it's not as big of a business giant with not as high a population. Is that fair? Probably not. But Milwaukee isn't going to start garnering more attention than Chicago does anytime soon. I won't argue whether Milwaukee is more or less deserving of the attention, though; that's completely subjective.
Well I've been to the Southside of Chicago and most of it is in decay just like Detroit. I've often said that if you want to see Detroit just visit the Southside of Chicago and that is what Detroit is like. Detroit is comparable to Chicago they both have the same Urban headaches.
You obviously haven't been to the Southside if you're making that statement.
Not directed at me but since I cited Pullman upthread and I've lived in Chicago I figured that would opine. Much of the Southside of Chicago is a blue collar industrial wreck and not too dissimilar to what one would expect in a stereotypical rust belt city.
I have also lived in Chicago he seems to assume things before he even knows what he's talking about. And where I lived in Chicago was indeed on the Southside, I'm also a White Sox fan and have gone to plenty of games at Sox Park. I think he thinks just because I'm from Michigan and live in Michigan again that I don't know what I'm talking about but I most certainly do know what I'm talking about I lived in Chicago for 5 years I'd say that was long enough to know what the city around me was like.
I suppose he'll try to deny this somehow too but about 20 years ago I was on a trip to the Twin Cities and stopped in Milwaukee to watch a game, Miller Park was in it's first season so it was 2001 but anyway they were playing the Braves I remember and after the game I started to trek toward Chicago and traffic on I-94 was backed up for what seemed miles and this was before GPS systems so I tried my best to navigate down the shore of Lake Michigan for awhile on streets running near I-94. I ended up taking Green Bay, Sheridan, Lakeshore Drive and by the time I got to Chicago my destination was actually Detroit as I was headed back home I lived in Royal Oak at the time.
I got through downtown Chicago and that's where I should have got back on the Dan Ryan and just dealt with the traffic. It was a Sunday so traffic was slow go in the summer time with everyone heading back home. I stayed on Lakeshore for quite awhile going well into the Southside and I decided to move over and take Stony Island back to the Bishop Ford because I was tired of riding the city streets at that point and hadn't been on the Interstate at all in about 90 miles. I got on Stony Island and started to go south and as I approached 87th Street I noticed a person laying in the street, the light was red so I was stopped and right before the light turned green he shot up and then collapsed again. I thought to myself I'm getting the fuck outta here, the light turned green and I punched it. There was one more light at 95th and it was green I was doing about 55 mph and saw the sign that said I-94 East - Indiana and was never so happy to see that sign in my life.
There is more crime in Detroit on a per capita scale but since Chicago is so much bigger than Detroit they win the total number of crimes. I don't know which one I'd rather be in. Let's also keep in mind that Detroit is one of the only cities that didn't see riots during the summer of 2020, Chicago can't say the same thing.
I'm quite a bit more familiar with Chicago's west side than I am with the south side. But, from what I've seen and especially from talking to people who have been familiar with the south side for decades, my general impression is that a lot of the neighborhoods that weren't very bad 50 or 60 years ago have really slid downhill over the years. For example, I have a good friend at church who grew up near Garfield and Western, and she says that area has taken a turn for the worse since then. Closer in to the city, the neighborhood my great-grandparents immigrated to and where my grandparents lived until 1953 would be practically unrecognizable today.
Back when I was attending church in South Austin (in a fairly rough neighborhood on the west side near Central and Washington), the locals who lived there wouldn't even dare move to the south side. (Maybe the reverse is true, I don't know.)
Quote from: kphoger on June 09, 2022, 10:48:01 AM
I'm quite a bit more familiar with Chicago's west side than I am with the south side. But, from what I've seen and especially from talking to people who have been familiar with the south side for decades, my general impression is that a lot of the neighborhoods that weren't very bad 50 or 60 years ago have really slid downhill over the years. For example, I have a good friend at church who grew up near Garfield and Western, and she says that area has taken a turn for the worse since then. Closer in to the city, the neighborhood my great-grandparents immigrated to and where my grandparents lived until 1953 would be practically unrecognizable today.
Back when I was attending church in South Austin (in a fairly rough neighborhood on the west side near Central and Washington), the locals who lived there wouldn't even dare move to the south side. (Maybe the reverse is true, I don't know.)
Garfield and Western, that'd be like border line between West Englewood and Gage Park I had always thought that Gage Park was an ok neighborhood, nothing great but not the worst of the Southside. It seemed like going south from there toward Marquette Park it started to get bad, then West Englewood and Englewood itself are two of the worst neighborhoods in the city. The ultimate worst neighborhood I have always thought was Fuller Park, it's a narrow strip of land with the Dan Ryan running almost through the center of it but very abandoned and just run down as all hell. It's not too far south of Comiskey Park either which I would consider almost border line between good and bad. The Bridgeport neighborhood always seemed pretty nice, Armour Square which is the neighborhood the ballpark is in has a large Asian population and is an ok neighborhood too. I've parked on 39th Street and walked past Wentworth Gardens which of course is a housing project within the shadows of the ballpark and just heard a lot of shouting as I was walking by I remember no violence or anything as I was just walking to the ballpark.
I'm not too sure about Austin as I haven't spent any considerable amount of time there but I always had heard that it was one of Chicago's worst neighborhoods as far as crime goes.
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 11:07:42 AM
I'm not too sure about Austin as I haven't spent any considerable amount of time there but I always had heard that it was one of Chicago's worst neighborhoods as far as crime goes.
South Austin is the neighborhood where I had teenagers throwing rocks at me from across the street on a Sunday morning as I walked down the sidewalk from church to the L station. It's also the neighborhood where I was solicited by a prostitute with methed-out teeth while ordering a hamburger through a bulletproof window. And yeah, the church members from that neighborhood considered the south side "rough".
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 09:45:49 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 08, 2022, 11:41:51 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 08, 2022, 11:54:21 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on June 08, 2022, 09:25:01 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 07, 2022, 01:49:24 PM
For what it's worth, noted Michigander Ted Nugent was saying Detroit was "the murder capital of the world" back in the 1970s.
It's not worth nothing, because noted Michigander Ted Nugent is a racist piece of garbage. He's the type who will base the favorability of a place on its whiteness, just like a large proportion of America's white population unfortunately would.
And this is the AARoads forum...nitpicking at technicalities is most of what we do here.
Went to Detroit a year ago, and I was amazed by the amount of decay. It's not concentrated into neighborhoods like what I've seen of Chicago--it's widespread. (I admit I haven't been to Chicago's South Side much--it might be more widespread there, too.) I like seeing the backdrops to where people live their lives, though, so it was really interesting to see, in a sad way.
Milwaukee might be a really nice place to visit, but its smaller size will simply make it less appealing to prospective tourists. I don't see Milwaukee getting the "world-class city" treatment like Chicago does, just because it's not as big of a business giant with not as high a population. Is that fair? Probably not. But Milwaukee isn't going to start garnering more attention than Chicago does anytime soon. I won't argue whether Milwaukee is more or less deserving of the attention, though; that's completely subjective.
Well I've been to the Southside of Chicago and most of it is in decay just like Detroit. I've often said that if you want to see Detroit just visit the Southside of Chicago and that is what Detroit is like. Detroit is comparable to Chicago they both have the same Urban headaches.
You obviously haven't been to the Southside if you're making that statement.
You have never been to Detroit so you have no business making such a claim. You have no idea what Detroit is like compared to the Southside of Chicago so don't try telling me I haven't been somewhere.
Then you should know that they are plenty of community areas on the Southside that aren't in decay (Bridgeport,Douglas, Grand Boulevard, Hyde Park, Kenwood, Oakland are just a few examples). Now the west side is a different story...it only has 3 community areas that aren't in decay (Near West Side, Pilsen, and West Town). However there are some parts of Austin that are more upscale.. I went over it in this video
https://youtu.be/hmgtPNtjNlE
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 09, 2022, 08:22:08 AM
Quote from: thspfc on June 09, 2022, 08:13:29 AM
I'd like to point out that the two people defending Detroit in this thread are both from Michigan. Granted, it's not Carhorn-level homerism. But clearly there's some American State Pride Syndrome in everyone.
Interesting assertion that you think I was defending Detroit. Being fearful of an American city, having an American-only centric perspective and fearing being a victim crime in unfamiliar places are very stereotypical American traits as well.
I'm not fearful of any American city. I'm fearful of some American neighborhoods.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 09, 2022, 11:30:08 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 09:45:49 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 08, 2022, 11:41:51 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 08, 2022, 11:54:21 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on June 08, 2022, 09:25:01 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 07, 2022, 01:49:24 PM
For what it's worth, noted Michigander Ted Nugent was saying Detroit was "the murder capital of the world" back in the 1970s.
It's not worth nothing, because noted Michigander Ted Nugent is a racist piece of garbage. He's the type who will base the favorability of a place on its whiteness, just like a large proportion of America's white population unfortunately would.
And this is the AARoads forum...nitpicking at technicalities is most of what we do here.
Went to Detroit a year ago, and I was amazed by the amount of decay. It's not concentrated into neighborhoods like what I've seen of Chicago--it's widespread. (I admit I haven't been to Chicago's South Side much--it might be more widespread there, too.) I like seeing the backdrops to where people live their lives, though, so it was really interesting to see, in a sad way.
Milwaukee might be a really nice place to visit, but its smaller size will simply make it less appealing to prospective tourists. I don't see Milwaukee getting the "world-class city" treatment like Chicago does, just because it's not as big of a business giant with not as high a population. Is that fair? Probably not. But Milwaukee isn't going to start garnering more attention than Chicago does anytime soon. I won't argue whether Milwaukee is more or less deserving of the attention, though; that's completely subjective.
Well I've been to the Southside of Chicago and most of it is in decay just like Detroit. I've often said that if you want to see Detroit just visit the Southside of Chicago and that is what Detroit is like. Detroit is comparable to Chicago they both have the same Urban headaches.
You obviously haven't been to the Southside if you're making that statement.
You have never been to Detroit so you have no business making such a claim. You have no idea what Detroit is like compared to the Southside of Chicago so don't try telling me I haven't been somewhere.
Then you should know that they are plenty of community areas on the Southside that aren't in decay (Bridgeport,Douglas, Grand Boulevard, Hyde Park, Kenwood, Oakland are just a few examples). Now the west side is a different story...it only has 3 community areas that aren't in decay (Near West Side, Pilsen, and West Town). However there are some parts of Austin that are more upscale.. I went over it in this
A non sequitur just to plug his own video. The man has no shame.
Quote from: thspfc on June 09, 2022, 11:30:32 AM
I'm not fearful of any American city. I'm fearful of some American neighborhoods.
What about East Saint Louis? Does that count as a city or a neighborhood?
In 2019 there were 36 murders in East Saint Louis, a town with a population of just over 26,000. That's a murder rate of 137 per 100,000 population–more than twice that of nearby Saint Louis, and more than three times that of Detroit.
I used to make occasional deliveries there. I didn't usually feel unsafe there, but it's the only town I delivered to where I'd make sure to shut the truck off and put the keys in my pocket at every stop.
Quote from: Rothman on June 09, 2022, 11:37:50 AM
A non sequitur just to plug his own video. The man has no shame.
To be fair this thread is called Illinois road videos
Quote from: Crash_It on June 09, 2022, 12:14:52 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 09, 2022, 11:37:50 AM
A non sequitur just to plug his own video. The man has no shame.
To be fair this thread is called Illinois road videos
Which this thread largely lacks, from all sources. I tend to be of the opinion "bad driver videos" even if they are in Illinois don't really count towards the pool "Illinois road videos." More so when the original post in this thread is taken into consideration.
Quote from: kphoger on June 09, 2022, 11:22:05 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 11:07:42 AM
I'm not too sure about Austin as I haven't spent any considerable amount of time there but I always had heard that it was one of Chicago's worst neighborhoods as far as crime goes.
South Austin is the neighborhood where I had teenagers throwing rocks at me from across the street on a Sunday morning as I walked down the sidewalk from church to the L station. It's also the neighborhood where I was solicited by a prostitute with methed-out teeth while ordering a hamburger through a bulletproof window. And yeah, the church members from that neighborhood considered the south side "rough".
That doesn't surprise me since I know Austin is a bad neighborhood but even on a Sunday morning? It'd be like trying to touchdown on North Sentinel Island. That sounds rougher than anything I've experienced on the Southside.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 09, 2022, 11:30:08 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 09:45:49 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 08, 2022, 11:41:51 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 08, 2022, 11:54:21 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on June 08, 2022, 09:25:01 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 07, 2022, 01:49:24 PM
For what it's worth, noted Michigander Ted Nugent was saying Detroit was "the murder capital of the world" back in the 1970s.
It's not worth nothing, because noted Michigander Ted Nugent is a racist piece of garbage. He's the type who will base the favorability of a place on its whiteness, just like a large proportion of America's white population unfortunately would.
And this is the AARoads forum...nitpicking at technicalities is most of what we do here.
Went to Detroit a year ago, and I was amazed by the amount of decay. It's not concentrated into neighborhoods like what I've seen of Chicago--it's widespread. (I admit I haven't been to Chicago's South Side much--it might be more widespread there, too.) I like seeing the backdrops to where people live their lives, though, so it was really interesting to see, in a sad way.
Milwaukee might be a really nice place to visit, but its smaller size will simply make it less appealing to prospective tourists. I don't see Milwaukee getting the "world-class city" treatment like Chicago does, just because it's not as big of a business giant with not as high a population. Is that fair? Probably not. But Milwaukee isn't going to start garnering more attention than Chicago does anytime soon. I won't argue whether Milwaukee is more or less deserving of the attention, though; that's completely subjective.
Well I've been to the Southside of Chicago and most of it is in decay just like Detroit. I've often said that if you want to see Detroit just visit the Southside of Chicago and that is what Detroit is like. Detroit is comparable to Chicago they both have the same Urban headaches.
You obviously haven't been to the Southside if you're making that statement.
You have never been to Detroit so you have no business making such a claim. You have no idea what Detroit is like compared to the Southside of Chicago so don't try telling me I haven't been somewhere.
Then you should know that they are plenty of community areas on the Southside that aren't in decay (Bridgeport,Douglas, Grand Boulevard, Hyde Park, Kenwood, Oakland are just a few examples). Now the west side is a different story...it only has 3 community areas that aren't in decay (Near West Side, Pilsen, and West Town). However there are some parts of Austin that are more upscale.. I went over it in this video
https://youtu.be/hmgtPNtjNlE
Nice job nitpicking the neighborhoods that are nice on the Southside when overall the Southside is not a good part of town and does have decay.
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 12:30:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 09, 2022, 11:30:08 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 09:45:49 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 08, 2022, 11:41:51 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 08, 2022, 11:54:21 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on June 08, 2022, 09:25:01 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 07, 2022, 01:49:24 PM
For what it's worth, noted Michigander Ted Nugent was saying Detroit was "the murder capital of the world" back in the 1970s.
It's not worth nothing, because noted Michigander Ted Nugent is a racist piece of garbage. He's the type who will base the favorability of a place on its whiteness, just like a large proportion of America's white population unfortunately would.
And this is the AARoads forum...nitpicking at technicalities is most of what we do here.
Went to Detroit a year ago, and I was amazed by the amount of decay. It's not concentrated into neighborhoods like what I've seen of Chicago--it's widespread. (I admit I haven't been to Chicago's South Side much--it might be more widespread there, too.) I like seeing the backdrops to where people live their lives, though, so it was really interesting to see, in a sad way.
Milwaukee might be a really nice place to visit, but its smaller size will simply make it less appealing to prospective tourists. I don't see Milwaukee getting the "world-class city" treatment like Chicago does, just because it's not as big of a business giant with not as high a population. Is that fair? Probably not. But Milwaukee isn't going to start garnering more attention than Chicago does anytime soon. I won't argue whether Milwaukee is more or less deserving of the attention, though; that's completely subjective.
Well I've been to the Southside of Chicago and most of it is in decay just like Detroit. I've often said that if you want to see Detroit just visit the Southside of Chicago and that is what Detroit is like. Detroit is comparable to Chicago they both have the same Urban headaches.
You obviously haven't been to the Southside if you're making that statement.
You have never been to Detroit so you have no business making such a claim. You have no idea what Detroit is like compared to the Southside of Chicago so don't try telling me I haven't been somewhere.
Then you should know that they are plenty of community areas on the Southside that aren't in decay (Bridgeport,Douglas, Grand Boulevard, Hyde Park, Kenwood, Oakland are just a few examples). Now the west side is a different story...it only has 3 community areas that aren't in decay (Near West Side, Pilsen, and West Town). However there are some parts of Austin that are more upscale.. I went over it in this video
https://youtu.be/hmgtPNtjNlE
Nice job nitpicking the neighborhoods that are nice on the Southside when overall the Southside is not a good part of town and does have decay.
There are quite a bit more than that. Actually the only neighborhoods on what is really considered the south side that are bad are South Shore, Greater Grand Crossing and Fuller Park.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 09, 2022, 01:01:41 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 12:30:29 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 09, 2022, 11:30:08 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 09:45:49 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 08, 2022, 11:41:51 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 08, 2022, 11:54:21 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on June 08, 2022, 09:25:01 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 07, 2022, 01:49:24 PM
For what it's worth, noted Michigander Ted Nugent was saying Detroit was "the murder capital of the world" back in the 1970s.
It's not worth nothing, because noted Michigander Ted Nugent is a racist piece of garbage. He's the type who will base the favorability of a place on its whiteness, just like a large proportion of America's white population unfortunately would.
And this is the AARoads forum...nitpicking at technicalities is most of what we do here.
Went to Detroit a year ago, and I was amazed by the amount of decay. It's not concentrated into neighborhoods like what I've seen of Chicago--it's widespread. (I admit I haven't been to Chicago's South Side much--it might be more widespread there, too.) I like seeing the backdrops to where people live their lives, though, so it was really interesting to see, in a sad way.
Milwaukee might be a really nice place to visit, but its smaller size will simply make it less appealing to prospective tourists. I don't see Milwaukee getting the "world-class city" treatment like Chicago does, just because it's not as big of a business giant with not as high a population. Is that fair? Probably not. But Milwaukee isn't going to start garnering more attention than Chicago does anytime soon. I won't argue whether Milwaukee is more or less deserving of the attention, though; that's completely subjective.
Well I've been to the Southside of Chicago and most of it is in decay just like Detroit. I've often said that if you want to see Detroit just visit the Southside of Chicago and that is what Detroit is like. Detroit is comparable to Chicago they both have the same Urban headaches.
You obviously haven't been to the Southside if you're making that statement.
You have never been to Detroit so you have no business making such a claim. You have no idea what Detroit is like compared to the Southside of Chicago so don't try telling me I haven't been somewhere.
Then you should know that they are plenty of community areas on the Southside that aren't in decay (Bridgeport,Douglas, Grand Boulevard, Hyde Park, Kenwood, Oakland are just a few examples). Now the west side is a different story...it only has 3 community areas that aren't in decay (Near West Side, Pilsen, and West Town). However there are some parts of Austin that are more upscale.. I went over it in this video
https://youtu.be/hmgtPNtjNlE
Nice job nitpicking the neighborhoods that are nice on the Southside when overall the Southside is not a good part of town and does have decay.
There are quite a bit more than that. Actually the only neighborhoods on what is really considered the south side that are bad are South Shore, Greater Grand Crossing and Fuller Park.
And many more neighborhoods on top of that.
You can can it with the tourist guide of Chicago to me because I've lived there and I know what I'm talking about.
I think I see a trend here.
"There are a few good neighborhoods on the South Side, so the whole thing is not bad overall."
"There are a few hilly areas in extreme corners of Illinois, so the whole state is not flat overall."
Quote from: GaryV on June 09, 2022, 02:14:08 PM
I think I see a trend here.
"There are a few good neighborhoods on the South Side, so the whole thing is not bad overall."
"There are a few hilly areas in extreme corners of Illinois, so the whole state is not flat overall."
He's the kind of person that'll tell you that the worst neighborhood in Chicago isn't all that bad. Like it's just fine and dandy to take a midnight stroll along 79th Street on Chicago's Southside.
I'd kind of like to explore the south side, now that we're all talking about it. Archer Heights, Little Village (maybe that counts as west side), Hyde Park, ...
Just a listing off the top of my head of neighborhoods on the Southside that aren't very safe at all.
Washington Park, West Englewood, Englewood, Grand Crossing, Chatham, South Shore, Burnside, Pullman, South Chicago, Fuller Park, South Deering and that's just a start.
Quote from: kphoger on June 09, 2022, 03:31:03 PM
I'd kind of like to explore the south side, now that we're all talking about it. Archer Heights, Little Village (maybe that counts as west side), Hyde Park, ...
Little Village I thought at least was part of South Lawndale which in turn would be part of the Westside. I told a Mexican friend of mine about Little Village one time when he was visiting Chicago. It's not called the Mexico of the Midwest for nothing.
It's usually the "unsafe" neighborhoods that have the most interesting things to see, Chicago is no exception. Whether or not that is worth the apparent/supposed risk to visit those places is really up to discretion of the individual. My thoughts on urban exploration is already known, no big deal in my book.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 09, 2022, 03:35:37 PM
It's usually the "unsafe" neighborhoods that have the most interesting things to see, Chicago is no exception. Whether or not that is worth the apparent/supposed risk to visit those places is really up to discretion of the individual. My thoughts on urban exploration is already known, no big deal in my book.
For example, Cermak is a pretty cool drive between Ashland and Archer, but I'm not so sure I'd want to walk the same stretch.
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 03:23:46 PMLike it's just fine and dandy to take a midnight stroll along 79th Street on Chicago's Southside.
I smell a challenge...
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 03:31:30 PM
Just a listing off the top of my head of neighborhoods on the Southside that aren't very safe at all.
Washington Park, West Englewood, Englewood, Grand Crossing, Chatham, South Shore, Burnside, Pullman, South Chicago, Fuller Park, South Deering and that's just a start.
Some of those are the southwest and southeast sides.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 09, 2022, 04:23:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 03:31:30 PM
Just a listing off the top of my head of neighborhoods on the Southside that aren't very safe at all.
Washington Park, West Englewood, Englewood, Grand Crossing, Chatham, South Shore, Burnside, Pullman, South Chicago, Fuller Park, South Deering and that's just a start.
Some of those are the southwest and southeast sides.
So now we are specifically citing stuff that is only in a true southern direction? You read that everyone?...southeast and southwest aren't south enough!
Quote from: Crash_It on June 09, 2022, 04:23:56 PM
Some of those are the southwest and southeast sides.
*groan*
I think that I need clarification on the definition of "south." Are we going by the definition of "True South" or is this "Magnetic South?
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 09, 2022, 04:41:01 PM
I think that I need clarification on the definition of "south." Are we going by the definition of "True South" or is this "Magnetic South?
Theoretically, the south side has multiple sub-regions. However, most people don't talk that way, and I assumed we were talking about one of the three general sides of Chicago–north, west, south.
Quote from: kphoger on June 09, 2022, 04:44:43 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 09, 2022, 04:41:01 PM
I think that I need clarification on the definition of "south." Are we going by the definition of "True South" or is this "Magnetic South?
Theoretically, the south side has multiple sub-regions. However, most people don't talk that way, and I assumed we were talking about one of the three general sides of Chicago–north, west, south.
That's why Carhorn chimed in, we plebeians got off track and needed correction.
Quote from: kphoger on June 09, 2022, 11:40:08 AM
Quote from: thspfc on June 09, 2022, 11:30:32 AM
I'm not fearful of any American city. I'm fearful of some American neighborhoods.
What about East Saint Louis? Does that count as a city or a neighborhood?
In 2019 there were 36 murders in East Saint Louis, a town with a population of just over 26,000. That's a murder rate of 137 per 100,000 population–more than twice that of nearby Saint Louis, and more than three times that of Detroit.
I used to make occasional deliveries there. I didn't usually feel unsafe there, but it's the only town I delivered to where I'd make sure to shut the truck off and put the keys in my pocket at every stop.
There's plenty of regional and national traffic through there. Same can't be said of bad Detroit neighborhoods.
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 01:55:45 PM
You can can it with the tourist guide of Chicago to me because I've lived there and I know what I'm talking about.
Wow do I ever hate this type of comment.
Quote from: thspfc on June 09, 2022, 05:11:10 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 01:55:45 PM
You can can it with the tourist guide of Chicago to me because I've lived there and I know what I'm talking about.
Wow do I ever hate this type of comment.
You shouldn't hate that comment. He lived there. You haven't. I don't pretend to know more about Madison or Milwaukee than you.
A person cannot learn what a place is really like without living there. You just can't and it's stupid to pretend you can.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 09, 2022, 05:23:43 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 09, 2022, 05:11:10 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 01:55:45 PM
You can can it with the tourist guide of Chicago to me because I've lived there and I know what I'm talking about.
Wow do I ever hate this type of comment.
You shouldn't hate that comment. He lived there. You haven't. I don't pretend to know more about Madison or Milwaukee than you.
You cannot learn what a place is really like without living there. You just can't.
Don't forget the person you are talking to largely completely dismisses first hand experience in lieu of violent crime statistics. But that's basically the reason I started the "Risk Aversion" thread. What considers risky or dangerous tends to be a subjective measure to the individual. Individuals will weigh criteria very differently based on their subjective perspectives, this is why there is almost never a true consensus on crime or safety. I tend to believe first hand accounts can have a lot of value, but also do believe statistics hold value. Neither alone paints a full picture of a community or city.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 09, 2022, 04:23:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 03:31:30 PM
Just a listing off the top of my head of neighborhoods on the Southside that aren't very safe at all.
Washington Park, West Englewood, Englewood, Grand Crossing, Chatham, South Shore, Burnside, Pullman, South Chicago, Fuller Park, South Deering and that's just a start.
Some of those are the southwest and southeast sides.
Southeast, Southwest it's all the South side dude what are you talking about?
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 09, 2022, 05:35:18 PM
Don't forget the person you are talking to largely completely dismisses first hand experience in lieu of violent crime statistics.
To a large degree, so do I. Firsthand experience must be evaluated through the lens of statistics in order to make any sort of meaningful comparison.
Quote from: thspfc on June 09, 2022, 05:11:10 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 01:55:45 PM
You can can it with the tourist guide of Chicago to me because I've lived there and I know what I'm talking about.
Wow do I ever hate this type of comment.
Why? The stuff I'm saying I know what I'm talking about. It's stuff I've experienced and witnessed. I know what I saw and experienced. I've also lived in Detroit so I can compare the two because it's something I've experienced.
Quote from: kphoger on June 09, 2022, 05:43:21 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 09, 2022, 05:35:18 PM
Don't forget the person you are talking to largely completely dismisses first hand experience in lieu of violent crime statistics.
To a large degree, so do I. Firsthand experience must be evaluated through the lens of statistics in order to make any sort of meaningful comparison.
Right, the simplified version of what I was trying to say above is dismissing either evaluation doesn't give a truly accurate picture.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 09, 2022, 04:23:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 03:31:30 PM
Just a listing off the top of my head of neighborhoods on the Southside that aren't very safe at all.
Washington Park, West Englewood, Englewood, Grand Crossing, Chatham, South Shore, Burnside, Pullman, South Chicago, Fuller Park, South Deering and that's just a start.
Some of those are the southwest and southeast sides.
Again, shameless.
Quote from: Rothman on June 09, 2022, 08:44:07 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 09, 2022, 04:23:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 03:31:30 PM
Just a listing off the top of my head of neighborhoods on the Southside that aren't very safe at all.
Washington Park, West Englewood, Englewood, Grand Crossing, Chatham, South Shore, Burnside, Pullman, South Chicago, Fuller Park, South Deering and that's just a start.
Some of those are the southwest and southeast sides.
Again, shameless.
At least he didn't say this and to be southnorth or sorth side Chicago.
I almost feel like I'm on the south side of Chicago right now in the last 8 hours there's there's been 10 shootings and one stabbing in Saginaw.
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 05:41:49 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 09, 2022, 04:23:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 03:31:30 PM
Just a listing off the top of my head of neighborhoods on the Southside that aren't very safe at all.
Washington Park, West Englewood, Englewood, Grand Crossing, Chatham, South Shore, Burnside, Pullman, South Chicago, Fuller Park, South Deering and that's just a start.
Some of those are the southwest and southeast sides.
Southeast, Southwest it's all the South side dude what are you talking about?
If you watch Chicago area need they reference it this way too.
"18 year old man shot in the 6300 block of south Halsted in the Englewood neighborhood on the city's southwest side"
Let's just call it the Sorthside of Chicago from now on:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52134331177_c8f56d1682_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2nqW5jV)Sorth by Sorthwest (https://flic.kr/p/2nqW5jV) by Max Rockatansky (https://www.flickr.com/photos/151828809@N08/), on Flickr
Quote from: Crash_It on June 09, 2022, 11:50:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 05:41:49 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 09, 2022, 04:23:56 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 09, 2022, 03:31:30 PM
Just a listing off the top of my head of neighborhoods on the Southside that aren't very safe at all.
Washington Park, West Englewood, Englewood, Grand Crossing, Chatham, South Shore, Burnside, Pullman, South Chicago, Fuller Park, South Deering and that's just a start.
Some of those are the southwest and southeast sides.
Southeast, Southwest it's all the South side dude what are you talking about?
If you watch Chicago area need they reference it this way too.
"18 year old man shot in the 6300 block of south Halsted in the Englewood neighborhood on the city's southwest side"
Sinking to new lows.
Speaking of new lows, I want to see this in this next Crash_It feature:
https://www.facebook.com/reel/1011454152911176?fs=e&s=cl
Quote from: Crash_It on June 09, 2022, 11:50:49 PM
"18 year old man shot in the 6300 block of south Halsted in the Englewood neighborhood on the city's southwest side"
I'm not saying the southwest side isn't a thing. I'm saying it's a subset of the south side. So if a neighborhood is on the southwest side, then it is by definition also a southside neighborhood.
Quote from: kphoger on June 10, 2022, 09:40:19 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 09, 2022, 11:50:49 PM
"18 year old man shot in the 6300 block of south Halsted in the Englewood neighborhood on the city's southwest side"
I'm not saying the southwest side isn't a thing. I'm saying it's a subset of the south side. So if a neighborhood is on the southwest side, then it is by definition also a southside neighborhood.
Exactly. When someone says southwest or southeast it's still south.
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 10, 2022, 11:45:44 AM
Quote from: kphoger on June 10, 2022, 09:40:19 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 09, 2022, 11:50:49 PM
"18 year old man shot in the 6300 block of south Halsted in the Englewood neighborhood on the city's southwest side"
I'm not saying the southwest side isn't a thing. I'm saying it's a subset of the south side. So if a neighborhood is on the southwest side, then it is by definition also a southside neighborhood.
Exactly. When someone says southwest or southeast it's still south.
Seems to be obvious to everyone but one person...
In all honesty, given the moderation history of this forum, I'm surprised that this topic has been allowed to stray so far off its original subject and include as many personal comments as it has.
Quote from: hbelkins on June 10, 2022, 06:04:50 PM
In all honesty, given the moderation history of this forum, I'm surprised that this topic has been allowed to stray so far off its original subject and include as many personal comments as it has.
This forum isn't overmoderated.
The risk aversion thread also had some... risks that didn't cause the thread to be locked or even have a warning. (Not the coin discussion, that was fine)
Quote from: 1 on June 10, 2022, 06:08:23 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 10, 2022, 06:04:50 PM
In all honesty, given the moderation history of this forum, I'm surprised that this topic has been allowed to stray so far off its original subject and include as many personal comments as it has.
This forum isn't overmoderated.
The risk aversion thread also had some... risks that didn't cause the thread to be locked or even have a warning. (Not the coin discussion, that was fine)
I'm kind of surprised this thread didn't spin off a crime statistics thread. All the same, I don't think many are mistaking this thread to be anything actually serious or even close to what was envisioned in the original post. Even the latest COVID talk in the Risk Aversion thread has been very tame, no need for moderation on any of this IMO.
All the same this forum is not very heavily moderated, I'm fine with that.
Quote from: hbelkins on June 10, 2022, 06:04:50 PM
In all honesty, given the moderation history of this forum, I'm surprised that this topic has been allowed to stray so far off its original subject and include as many personal comments as it has.
Noticeable that it's okay when it's newer members being flamed, or members with whom the mods don't agree. To be fair it's difficult to agree with Carhorn.
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 10, 2022, 11:45:44 AM
Quote from: kphoger on June 10, 2022, 09:40:19 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 09, 2022, 11:50:49 PM
"18 year old man shot in the 6300 block of south Halsted in the Englewood neighborhood on the city's southwest side"
I'm not saying the southwest side isn't a thing. I'm saying it's a subset of the south side. So if a neighborhood is on the southwest side, then it is by definition also a southside neighborhood.
Exactly. When someone says southwest or southeast it's still south.
Ok throwing the southwest and southeast sides into the equation, still plenty of good or decent neighborhoods:
Archer Heights
Ashburn
Avalon Park
Beverly
Burnside
Clearing
East Side
Calumet Heights
Garfield Ridge
Hegwisch
McKinley Park
Morgan Park
Mt Greenwood
Pullman
South Deering
Washington Heights
West Elsdon
West Lawn
All of the above have averaged about 4 homicides YoY, same as the north side.
Really the only bad or questionable neighborhoods on the S quadrant as a whole are:
Auburn Gresham
Brighton ParkChathamChicago LawnEnglewood
Fuller ParkGage Park
Grand Crossing
New CityRiverdale
Roseland
South Chicago
South Shore
Washington Park
West Pullman One's that I've italicized.. nothing will happen to you if you are there during the daytime or stick to the commercial areas.
I nearly witnessed a shooting in Chatham
https://youtu.be/hcFRapTV8HQ
See, even Crash doesn't take this thread seriously.
Quote from: hbelkins on June 10, 2022, 06:04:50 PM
In all honesty, given the moderation history of this forum, I'm surprised that this topic has been allowed to stray so far off its original subject and include as many personal comments as it has.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 10, 2022, 06:24:30 PM
I'm kind of surprised this thread didn't spin off a crime statistics thread.
I'm siding with |Max Rockatansky| on this. A split would have been better than a lock or a mass post deletion.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 10, 2022, 06:24:30 PM
I don't think many are mistaking this thread to be anything actually serious ...
Yeah, I think a thread split would just lend undue credibility to this thread as a whole.
Quote from: 1 on June 10, 2022, 06:08:23 PM
This forum isn't overmoderated.
Quote from: thspfc on June 10, 2022, 06:24:34 PM
Noticeable that it's okay when it's newer members being flamed, or members with whom the mods don't agree. To be fair it's difficult to agree with Carhorn.
My opinion is somewhere in the middle of these two comments.
It does seem to be acceptable to flame newer users. But a good number of newer users, for reasons that seem to be somewhat unique to this odd interest of ours, do stick their own heads on the chopping block. Being charitable and kind is great, and it's something I really struggle with on here (as many of you know), but I don't necessarily think that an online forum should be expected to pretend that obnoxious and disruptive behavior is acceptable. Also, whether it's newer users or veteran users, flaming has been addressed when it reaches the point of profanity and all-caps and multiple exclamation points and stuff like that–but we really haven't had that sort of drama for several years now anyway.
As for 'members with whom the mods don't agree', that generally only becomes an issue when the topic of discussion gets heatedly political or when the argument starts reaching a point that seems like the gloves are about to come off. While I am generally a member 'with whom the mods don't agree' on a lot of issues, I've always been treated with respect by the mods–perhaps in part because I make an effort to write eloquently, I strive to understand the other side, and I rarely let my snark get to '____ is a xenophobic tushy jester' levels.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 10, 2022, 06:48:10 PM
https://youtu.be/hcFRapTV8HQ
Holy Betamax, Batman! Is that an Illinois road video?
Quote from: thspfc on June 10, 2022, 06:24:34 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 10, 2022, 06:04:50 PM
In all honesty, given the moderation history of this forum, I'm surprised that this topic has been allowed to stray so far off its original subject and include as many personal comments as it has.
Noticeable that it's okay when it's newer members being flamed, or members with whom the mods don't agree. To be fair it's difficult to agree with Carhorn.
I don't know which member of the moderating staff handed down my punishment several years ago, but it was probably a mod that I agree with.
On the other hand, stick around long enough and you're allowed to make as many personal attacks as you want without fear of repercussion.
The only points I've ever gotten on the forum was related to me being very direct with a certain member of the US 99 fandom. What I said was in line with that kphoger described and I knew that I was going to get something for it.
Quote from: kphoger on June 10, 2022, 06:57:28 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 10, 2022, 06:24:34 PM
Noticeable that it's okay when it's newer members being flamed, or members with whom the mods don't agree. To be fair it's difficult to agree with Carhorn.
My opinion is somewhere in the middle of these two comments.
It does seem to be acceptable to flame newer users. But a good number of newer users, for reasons that seem to be somewhat unique to this odd interest of ours, do stick their own heads on the chopping block. Being charitable and kind is great, and it's something I really struggle with on here (as many of you know), but I don't necessarily think that an online forum should be expected to pretend that obnoxious and disruptive behavior is acceptable. Also, whether it's newer users or veteran users, flaming has been addressed when it reaches the point of profanity and all-caps and multiple exclamation points and stuff like that–but we really haven't had that sort of drama for several years now anyway.
As for 'members with whom the mods don't agree', that generally only becomes an issue when the topic of discussion gets heatedly political or when the argument starts reaching a point that seems like the gloves are about to come off. While I am generally a member 'with whom the mods don't agree' on a lot of issues, I've always been treated with respect by the mods–perhaps in part because I make an effort to write eloquently, I strive to understand the other side, and I rarely let my snark get to '____ is a xenophobic tushy jester' levels.
Well, that was unfortunate timing.
12-JUN-2022 – |TheHighwayMan394| had
a post (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=31597.msg2746154#msg2746154) that included the jab "Hate-fil-A", in a thread in the Off-Topic board. This was obviously a sneer at Dan Cathy's publicly stated position on gay marriage. Of course, gay marriage is inherently a political and/or religious topic and the jab contributed nothing to the conversation other than posturing. No moderator action ensued. Why should I expect otherwise, when similar jabs are always tolerated?
15-JUN-2022 – |hbelkins| had
a post (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=31638.msg2747084#msg2747084) that included a title change to "Do people who wear masks while out in public look like clowns?", in a thread in the Off-Topid board. Mask mandates may be a political topic, but looking like a clown because of a face mask–the thing about them mentioned in the title change–is no more political than looking like a clown while wearing a bicycle helmet. This jab contributed nothing to the conversation other than posturing either. But, of course, that thread was summarily locked an hour later due to "pointless political posturing".
Now, I think HB "had it coming". And I'd bet money that HB knew he did, too. But other, leftist "political posturing", just as "pointless", doesn't even get a warning from a mod. (I suppose it's possible such warnings are sent via PM, but I'm guessing not. And, at any rate, that isn't what happened to HB.)
Quote from: kphoger on June 16, 2022, 02:27:25 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 10, 2022, 06:57:28 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 10, 2022, 06:24:34 PM
Noticeable that it's okay when it's newer members being flamed, or members with whom the mods don't agree. To be fair it's difficult to agree with Carhorn.
My opinion is somewhere in the middle of these two comments.
It does seem to be acceptable to flame newer users. But a good number of newer users, for reasons that seem to be somewhat unique to this odd interest of ours, do stick their own heads on the chopping block. Being charitable and kind is great, and it's something I really struggle with on here (as many of you know), but I don't necessarily think that an online forum should be expected to pretend that obnoxious and disruptive behavior is acceptable. Also, whether it's newer users or veteran users, flaming has been addressed when it reaches the point of profanity and all-caps and multiple exclamation points and stuff like that–but we really haven't had that sort of drama for several years now anyway.
As for 'members with whom the mods don't agree', that generally only becomes an issue when the topic of discussion gets heatedly political or when the argument starts reaching a point that seems like the gloves are about to come off. While I am generally a member 'with whom the mods don't agree' on a lot of issues, I've always been treated with respect by the mods–perhaps in part because I make an effort to write eloquently, I strive to understand the other side, and I rarely let my snark get to '____ is a xenophobic tushy jester' levels.
Well, that was unfortunate timing.
12-JUN-2022 – |TheHighwayMan394| had a post (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=31597.msg2746154#msg2746154) that included the jab "Hate-fil-A", in a thread in the Off-Topic board. This was obviously a sneer at Dan Cathy's publicly stated position on gay marriage. Of course, gay marriage is inherently a political and/or religious topic and the jab contributed nothing to the conversation other than posturing. No moderator action ensued. Why should I expect otherwise, when similar jabs are always tolerated?
15-JUN-2022 – |hbelkins| had a post (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=31638.msg2747084#msg2747084) that included a title change to "Do people who wear masks while out in public look like clowns?", in a thread in the Off-Topid board. Mask mandates may be a political topic, but looking like a clown because of a face mask–the thing about them mentioned in the title change–is no more political than looking like a clown while wearing a bicycle helmet. This jab contributed nothing to the conversation other than posturing either. But, of course, that thread was summarily locked an hour later due to "pointless political posturing".
Now, I think HB "had it coming". And I'd bet money that HB knew he did, too. But other, leftist "political posturing", just as "pointless", doesn't even get a warning from a mod. (I suppose it's possible such warnings are sent via PM, but I'm guessing not. And, at any rate, that isn't what happened to HB.)
We know how it is - rules are rules except for when they're not.
Quote from: kphoger on June 16, 2022, 02:27:25 PMMask mandates may be a political topic, but looking like a clown because of a face mask–the thing about them mentioned in the title change–is no more political than looking like a clown while wearing a bicycle helmet.
...disagree.
Of course, (a) the modmins are human and make mistakes from time to time and (b) complaining that the modmins are biased against you or your personal political tribe is as sad as complaining that the officials are biased against your favorite sports team.
It should be worth noting that a liberal is the one who made masks political by accusing me of making that thread political. I just was adding a further bit of levity to a silly thread -- or as I said, adding clarity and context. I didn't politicize the subject in any way.
Quote from: hbelkins on June 17, 2022, 07:51:31 PM
It should be worth noting that a liberal is the one who made masks political by accusing me of making that thread political. I just was adding a further bit of levity to a silly thread -- or as I said, adding clarity and context. I didn't politicize the subject in any way.
Meh. Phtbbt.
Quote from: hbelkins on June 17, 2022, 07:51:31 PM
It should be worth noting that a liberal is the one who made masks political by accusing me of making that thread political. I just was adding a further bit of levity to a silly thread -- or as I said, adding clarity and context. I didn't politicize the subject in any way.
Yes, the guy whose profile image politically shits on the largest city in his state, whose signature somehow both politically shits on trans people and politically shits on anyone trying to survive coronavirus by getting vaccinated, can't possibly be the one making things political. And as a sidenote, the need to put on a mask comes from science; the choice of whether we have the right to deny science is what makes things political. Acceptance of reality (read: science) isn't a political issue until a sect of people splinters off and decides they aren't willing to do so.
So yes, rules are rules, until they aren't. And like in many spheres unfortunately, extended tenure and deeper roots in a community will often excuse people from facing any consequences for breaking the rules.
For your information, the image came from a T-shirt being marketed to University of Kentucky sports fans.
Quote from: hbelkins on June 19, 2022, 01:43:04 AM
For your information, the image came from a T-shirt being marketed to University of Kentucky sports fans.
And you've loudly announced your disdain for present-day sports . . . I don't think you put that as your PFP for sports reasons.
Quote from: hbelkins on June 19, 2022, 01:43:04 AM
For your information, the image came from a T-shirt being marketed to University of Kentucky sports fans.
Sweetie, you're hearing false witness right now. On a Sunday, no less. I don't think your God is going to be very happy.
:bigass:
Another achievement for Illinois.
https://www.10best.com/awards/travel/best-small-town-for-adventure/
Nothing in Wisconsin or Michigan were even in the top 10!
I did a drive to this town in both 2019 and 2020 and filmed it.
https://youtu.be/5JfStEIkWZo
And here's the 2019 filming
https://youtu.be/TY8gomHWraE
Quote from: Crash_It on June 19, 2022, 05:54:50 PM
Another achievement for Illinois.
https://www.10best.com/awards/travel/best-small-town-for-adventure/
Nothing in Wisconsin or Michigan were even in the top 10!
Heh, these articles are a dime a dozen. Here's one with Traverse City, MI as #1, and Illinois nowhere to be found.
https://www.architecturaldigest.com/gallery/best-small-towns-america
Here's one with MN/WI/MI all represented, and again Illinois entries all failing to make the cut.
https://www.travelandleisure.com/trip-ideas/best-small-towns-in-america
What the fuck is 10best.com? Sounds like some sort of discount Wallethub...
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 19, 2022, 06:43:45 PM
What the fuck is 10best.com? Sounds like some sort of discount Wallethub...
Maybe Crash made it himself so he could make a list to put some random Illinois city on top of? :D
Quote from: Crash_It on June 19, 2022, 05:54:50 PM
Another achievement for Illinois.
https://www.10best.com/awards/travel/best-small-town-for-adventure/
Nothing in Wisconsin or Michigan were even in the top 10!
I did a drive to this town in both 2019 and 2020 and filmed it.
https://youtu.be/5JfStEIkWZo
And here's the 2019 filming
https://youtu.be/TY8gomHWraE
This is no achievement because you'll be hard pressed to find someone who actually cares. Once again Illinois doesn't even come close to comparing with Michigan, Wisconsin or Minnesota for outdoor life. You seem to comment an awful lot about a state that you admitted you have only been to a city that is less than 5 minutes from the border. So really how much of Michigan have you seen that you think you know so much about the state? A state that I travel around in frequently and have seen every corner of.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 19, 2022, 06:43:45 PM
What the fuck is 10best.com? Sounds like some sort of discount Wallethub...
Per the article, it is "A panel of experts", providing "users with original, unbiased and experiential travel coverage".
Who are the unbiased experts? 5 white women. Clearly a representative sample of travelers in the US.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 19, 2022, 05:54:50 PM
Another achievement for Illinois.
https://www.10best.com/awards/travel/best-small-town-for-adventure/
Nothing in Wisconsin or Michigan were even in the top 10!
Well, if it's a 'Top 10', it stands to reason that 40 states won't be represented.
And what is Savanna, IL famous for?
"Savanna, hugging the Mighty Mississippi and along the Bluffs of the Driftless area in Northwest Illinois, is the starting point for 60 miles of bike trails — the Great River Bike Trail — but it is also a favorite stop for motorcyclists..."
Apparently, it's claim to fame is nothing more than a meeting point for people to *leave* Savanna, and a Biker Bar called "Poopy's". Again, to simplify this for Crash_it: This town is important because it offers a parking lot to meet to go trail riding, and a bar, which also has a tattoo parlor. To its credit, it also offers free tent camping.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 19, 2022, 05:54:50 PM
And here's the 2019 filming
https://youtu.be/TY8gomHWraE
Can you explain, around the 6:30 mark, the tailgating that you did before you passed someone in a downtown area? Sure, it appears you did have a passing zone, but I doubt you were doing under 30 mph. There's a bit more tailgating just after that pass...the same tailgating you cry about in many of your other videos.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 19, 2022, 11:08:34 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 19, 2022, 06:43:45 PM
What the fuck is 10best.com? Sounds like some sort of discount Wallethub...
Per the article, it is "A panel of experts", providing "users with original, unbiased and experiential travel coverage".
Who are the unbiased experts? 5 white women. Clearly a representative sample of travelers in the US.
So basically the paragons of "basic" travel blogging. Jackson Hole in particular was probably ever only enjoyed by middle class white women.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 19, 2022, 11:08:34 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 19, 2022, 06:43:45 PM
What the fuck is 10best.com? Sounds like some sort of discount Wallethub...
Per the article, it is "A panel of experts", providing "users with original, unbiased and experiential travel coverage".
Who are the unbiased experts? 5 white women. Clearly a representative sample of travelers in the US.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 19, 2022, 05:54:50 PM
Another achievement for Illinois.
https://www.10best.com/awards/travel/best-small-town-for-adventure/
Nothing in Wisconsin or Michigan were even in the top 10!
Well, if it's a 'Top 10', it stands to reason that 40 states won't be represented.
And what is Savanna, IL famous for?
"Savanna, hugging the Mighty Mississippi and along the Bluffs of the Driftless area in Northwest Illinois, is the starting point for 60 miles of bike trails — the Great River Bike Trail — but it is also a favorite stop for motorcyclists..."
Apparently, it's claim to fame is nothing more than a meeting point for people to *leave* Savanna, and a Biker Bar called "Poopy's". Again, to simplify this for Crash_it: This town is important because it offers a parking lot to meet to go trail riding, and a bar, which also has a tattoo parlor. To its credit, it also offers free tent camping.
Oh it is much more than that, it's like a mini-Galena, you should actually visit sometime.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 19, 2022, 11:08:34 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 19, 2022, 05:54:50 PM
And here's the 2019 filming
https://youtu.be/TY8gomHWraE
Can you explain, around the 6:30 mark, the tailgating that you did before you passed someone in a downtown area? Sure, it appears you did have a passing zone, but I doubt you were doing under 30 mph. There's a bit more tailgating just after that pass...the same tailgating you cry about in many of your other videos.
They were drivers from Iowa that were doing half the speed limit, if that. I don't consider the distance I was following them at to be tailgating at such a slow speed. I was trying to hurry and finish the route as I was running out of daylight and the camera I had at the time was really bad at night. It's why I replaced it and had to refilm that whole video.
Quote from: hbelkins on June 17, 2022, 07:51:31 PM
It should be worth noting that a liberal is ...
A true liberal believes that everyone's voice should be heard, that everyone has a place at the table. Figures. In that sense, you may be one of the most liberal members on here, by virtue of resisting censorship and heavy moderation.
Quote from: hbelkins on June 17, 2022, 07:51:31 PM
I just was adding a further bit of levity to a silly thread -- or as I said, adding clarity and context. I didn't politicize the subject in any way.
Not explicitly political, as I said, but you were basically putting a bucket of paint up on top of the door, waiting for someone to walk through it–then exclaiming,
I wasn't even in the room when that happened!Quote from: paulthemapguy on June 18, 2022, 12:13:43 AM
And as a sidenote, the need to put on a mask comes from science; the choice of whether we have the right to deny science is what makes things political.
The scientific studies that have shown a strong correlation between masks and curbing the spread of the virus are those that were conducted in close-proximity environments: classrooms, prisons, an aircraft carrier, etc. The correlation is much weaker when it comes to broader, real-world environments. For example, the largest such real-world study done that I've looked through–the one conducted among 340,000 adults in 600 villages in Bangladesh–was hailed as proof that masks prevent the spread, but the reality is that it was only an 11% difference. Surgical masks provided slightly better numbers than that average, but non-surgical masks were only found to curb transmission by around 7%.
Of course, all these studies didn't exist yet back when mask mandates were being put into effect. All we really had to go on were things like water droplets and petri dishes, and we used them as a proxy for the spread of the disease itself. The two things that really prevent the spread are (1) staying away from other people and (2) vaccination. Assuming that (1) isn't sustainable and (2) has already been achieved by those who want it, it's fitting to reduce our emphasis on a measure that really does quite little to prevent the spread of the disease–widespread mask usage. I'd prefer that an emphasis be placed on specific types of situations: whipping out your surgical-grade face mask when you visit a family with a newborn or an elderly person with health concerns or seeing your brother in the hospital, encouraging their continued use in classroom settings and on crowded transit, etc.–but stopping the dream that wearing a mask to Wal-Mart does any good at all.
Quote from: kphoger on June 20, 2022, 11:11:02 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 17, 2022, 07:51:31 PM
It should be worth noting that a liberal is ...
A true liberal believes that everyone's voice should be heard, that everyone has a place at the table. Figures. In that sense, you may be one of the most liberal members on here, by virtue of resisting censorship and heavy moderation.
Quote from: hbelkins on June 17, 2022, 07:51:31 PM
I just was adding a further bit of levity to a silly thread -- or as I said, adding clarity and context. I didn't politicize the subject in any way.
Not explicitly political, as I said, but you were basically putting a bucket of paint up on top of the door, waiting for someone to walk through it–then exclaiming, I wasn't even in the room when that happened!
Quote from: paulthemapguy on June 18, 2022, 12:13:43 AM
And as a sidenote, the need to put on a mask comes from science; the choice of whether we have the right to deny science is what makes things political.
The scientific studies that have shown a strong correlation between masks and curbing the spread of the virus are those that were conducted in close-proximity environments: classrooms, prisons, an aircraft carrier, etc. The correlation is much weaker when it comes to broader, real-world environments. For example, the largest such real-world study done that I've looked through–the one conducted among 340,000 adults in 600 villages in Bangladesh–was hailed as proof that masks prevent the spread, but the reality is that it was only an 11% difference. Surgical masks provided slightly better numbers than that average, but non-surgical masks were only found to curb transmission by around 7%.
Of course, all these studies didn't exist yet back when mask mandates were being put into effect. All we really had to go on were things like water droplets and petri dishes, and we used them as a proxy for the spread of the disease itself. The two things that really prevent the spread are (1) staying away from other people and (2) vaccination. Assuming that (1) isn't sustainable and (2) has already been achieved by those who want it, it's fitting to reduce our emphasis on a measure that really does quite little to prevent the spread of the disease–widespread mask usage. I'd prefer that an emphasis be placed on specific types of situations: whipping out your surgical-grade face mask when you visit a family with a newborn or an elderly person with health concerns or seeing your brother in the hospital, encouraging their continued use in classroom settings and on crowded transit, etc.–but stopping the dream that wearing a mask to Wal-Mart does any good at all.
I don't consider you an expert on the state of the art and I instead rely upon those that actually are.
Quote from: Rothman on June 20, 2022, 06:57:19 PM
I don't consider you an expert on the state of the art and I instead rely upon those that actually are.
Of course. I'm just some guy on the Internet. Take a look at the studies yourself. The link below is straight from the CDC. Granted, it hasn't been updated since December, but I assume it's about as definitive of a list of scientific studies as you're going to find. Maybe there's a more up-to-date list of studies out there. If so, please let me know, and I'd be interested to look through them.
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-briefs/masking-science-sars-cov2.html#anchor_1619457332454
The Bangladesh study I mentioned is the only one listed that was a cluster-randomized trial. If you're looking for scientific studies that don't just rely on (1) self-reporting, (2) general trend lines without cause-and-effect certainty, or (3) very small population sizes, then the pickings are quite slim indeed.
The Bangkok study from April—May 2020 was a case-control study of more than 800 people showed strong correlation, but it was only studying known close contacts of infected individuals. (Not the type of contact one commonly encounters while shopping for colored pencils in Wal-Mart.)
Larger-scale studies from later in 2020 tend to show declines in transmission ranging from around 25% down into the single digits.
We aren't going to talk about this one?
https://www.facebook.com/471696313008593/posts/pfbid0nKDcBviJTmH6JexwA74mVXARgGFzsgVoyoCcn6zt7KoCCMUUaBpguFpG4JdEqf7gl/?d=n
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 01:44:40 PM
We aren't going to talk about this one?
https://www.facebook.com/471696313008593/posts/pfbid0nKDcBviJTmH6JexwA74mVXARgGFzsgVoyoCcn6zt7KoCCMUUaBpguFpG4JdEqf7gl/?d=n
Well, it isn't a video. He only claimed he was making a video.
But the comment is golden.
Quote from: kphoger on June 21, 2022, 02:10:20 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 01:44:40 PM
We aren't going to talk about this one?
https://www.facebook.com/471696313008593/posts/pfbid0nKDcBviJTmH6JexwA74mVXARgGFzsgVoyoCcn6zt7KoCCMUUaBpguFpG4JdEqf7gl/?d=n
Well, it isn't a video. He only claimed he was making a video.
But the comment is golden.
It's a video too. Premieres in 10 minutes
https://youtu.be/IMYaiKUrTjM
Quote from: kphoger on June 21, 2022, 02:10:20 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 01:44:40 PM
We aren't going to talk about this one?
https://www.facebook.com/471696313008593/posts/pfbid0nKDcBviJTmH6JexwA74mVXARgGFzsgVoyoCcn6zt7KoCCMUUaBpguFpG4JdEqf7gl/?d=n
Well, it isn't a video. He only claimed he was making a video.
But the comment is golden.
For what it's worth, here is a view looking back toward the precipitous, mountainous, dizzyingly steep hill: https://goo.gl/maps/EzcwPD5PfDEwW7iY9
Quote from: kphoger on June 21, 2022, 03:15:36 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 21, 2022, 02:10:20 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 01:44:40 PM
We aren't going to talk about this one?
https://www.facebook.com/471696313008593/posts/pfbid0nKDcBviJTmH6JexwA74mVXARgGFzsgVoyoCcn6zt7KoCCMUUaBpguFpG4JdEqf7gl/?d=n
Well, it isn't a video. He only claimed he was making a video.
But the comment is golden.
For what it's worth, here is a view looking back toward the precipitous, mountainous, dizzyingly steep hill: https://goo.gl/maps/EzcwPD5PfDEwW7iY9
I was unaware the force of friction on tires would actually scale such a massif without sliding down.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 21, 2022, 04:23:15 PM
I was unaware the force of friction on tires would actually scale such a massif without sliding down.
I've only peeled rubber by simply driving up a hill one time–on Mountain Street, heading north from Cliff Street (and Main Street), in Eureka Springs (AR).
https://goo.gl/maps/nxP1K8BR6yTNtfAy7
https://goo.gl/maps/XiVj4L8f5TVWWvWd6
Quote from: kphoger on June 21, 2022, 09:44:18 AM
Quote from: Rothman on June 20, 2022, 06:57:19 PM
I don't consider you an expert on the state of the art and I instead rely upon those that actually are.
Of course. I'm just some guy on the Internet. Take a look at the studies yourself. The link below is straight from the CDC. Granted, it hasn't been updated since December, but I assume it's about as definitive of a list of scientific studies as you're going to find. Maybe there's a more up-to-date list of studies out there. If so, please let me know, and I'd be interested to look through them.
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-briefs/masking-science-sars-cov2.html#anchor_1619457332454
The Bangladesh study I mentioned is the only one listed that was a cluster-randomized trial. If you're looking for scientific studies that don't just rely on (1) self-reporting, (2) general trend lines without cause-and-effect certainty, or (3) very small population sizes, then the pickings are quite slim indeed.
The Bangkok study from April—May 2020 was a case-control study of more than 800 people showed strong correlation, but it was only studying known close contacts of infected individuals. (Not the type of contact one commonly encounters while shopping for colored pencils in Wal-Mart.)
Larger-scale studies from later in 2020 tend to show declines in transmission ranging from around 25% down into the single digits.
It's not about cherrypicking studies, but listening to scientists that are reviewing the entire state of the art and not just Googling for what's publicly available.
CDC's mask recommendations are based on such. That's what I follow.
Quote from: Rothman on June 21, 2022, 04:51:32 PM
cherrypicking studies
Not what I've done.
It started when my best friend was insisting that anything less than an N95 mask is basically worthless against the spread of COVID, and that mask mandates have been implemented without scientific studies backing up their efficacy. It was really starting to irritate me, but then he moved out of the country shortly after that so I calmed down. Before that happened, he issued a challenge to show him a scientific study showing that regular old facemasks inhibit the spread of COVID–not the spread of water droplets in a controlled environment, but the spread of the actual disease in the real world. Several months ago, because I discovered he was still prepared to die on that hill, I decided to send him the links to as many studies as I could find. You know, to show him just how wrong he was.
And I couldn't find any. The CDC list I linked to is the most comprehensive list I've come across. I've already outlined my take on those studies. But, in the end, I ended up with nothing to send my friend. I have to agree with him now, as much as I didn't want to: there is apparently a lot less of of "the science" backing up the efficacy of face masks than we're led to believe.
Quote from: Rothman on June 21, 2022, 04:51:32 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 21, 2022, 09:44:18 AM
Quote from: Rothman on June 20, 2022, 06:57:19 PM
I don't consider you an expert on the state of the art and I instead rely upon those that actually are.
Of course. I'm just some guy on the Internet. Take a look at the studies yourself. The link below is straight from the CDC. Granted, it hasn't been updated since December, but I assume it's about as definitive of a list of scientific studies as you're going to find. Maybe there's a more up-to-date list of studies out there. If so, please let me know, and I'd be interested to look through them.
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-briefs/masking-science-sars-cov2.html#anchor_1619457332454
The Bangladesh study I mentioned is the only one listed that was a cluster-randomized trial. If you're looking for scientific studies that don't just rely on (1) self-reporting, (2) general trend lines without cause-and-effect certainty, or (3) very small population sizes, then the pickings are quite slim indeed.
The Bangkok study from April—May 2020 was a case-control study of more than 800 people showed strong correlation, but it was only studying known close contacts of infected individuals. (Not the type of contact one commonly encounters while shopping for colored pencils in Wal-Mart.)
Larger-scale studies from later in 2020 tend to show declines in transmission ranging from around 25% down into the single digits.
It's not about cherrypicking studies, but listening to scientists that are reviewing the entire state of the art and not just Googling for what's publicly available.
CDC's mask recommendations are based on such. That's what I follow.
Anyone remember when the CDC was actively not recommending cloth masks indoor or otherwise?
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/the-cdc-says-americans-dont-have-to-wear-facemasks-because-of-coronavirus-2020-01-30
I want to say that recommendation flipped during April/May 2020 after it became apparent the recommended N95s were going to be well short of anticipated supply demand.
Even now the CDC is way more about recommending N95s over anything else:
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/about-face-coverings.html
Quote from: kphoger on June 21, 2022, 05:12:09 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 21, 2022, 04:51:32 PM
cherrypicking studies
Not what I've done.
It started when my best friend was insisting that anything less than an N95 mask is basically worthless against the spread of COVID, and that mask mandates have been implemented without scientific studies backing up their efficacy. It was really starting to irritate me, but then he moved out of the country shortly after that so I calmed down. Before that happened, he issued a challenge to show him a scientific study showing that regular old facemasks inhibit the spread of COVID–not the spread of water droplets in a controlled environment, but the spread of the actual disease in the real world. Several months ago, because I discovered he was still prepared to die on that hill, I decided to send him the links to as many studies as I could find. You know, to show him just how wrong he was.
And I couldn't find any. The CDC list I linked to is the most comprehensive list I've come across. I've already outlined my take on those studies. But, in the end, I ended up with nothing to send my friend. I have to agree with him now, as much as I didn't want to: there is apparently a lot less of of "the science" backing up the efficacy of face masks than we're led to believe.
Because you couldn't Google studies up? That's a nonrepresentative sample, given how many studies are not available publicly. That's the definition of cherrypicking, however unintentional.
Instead of trying to be an expert, like an armchair quarterback, trust the experts.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 05:19:06 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 21, 2022, 04:51:32 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 21, 2022, 09:44:18 AM
Quote from: Rothman on June 20, 2022, 06:57:19 PM
I don't consider you an expert on the state of the art and I instead rely upon those that actually are.
Of course. I'm just some guy on the Internet. Take a look at the studies yourself. The link below is straight from the CDC. Granted, it hasn't been updated since December, but I assume it's about as definitive of a list of scientific studies as you're going to find. Maybe there's a more up-to-date list of studies out there. If so, please let me know, and I'd be interested to look through them.
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-briefs/masking-science-sars-cov2.html#anchor_1619457332454
The Bangladesh study I mentioned is the only one listed that was a cluster-randomized trial. If you're looking for scientific studies that don't just rely on (1) self-reporting, (2) general trend lines without cause-and-effect certainty, or (3) very small population sizes, then the pickings are quite slim indeed.
The Bangkok study from April—May 2020 was a case-control study of more than 800 people showed strong correlation, but it was only studying known close contacts of infected individuals. (Not the type of contact one commonly encounters while shopping for colored pencils in Wal-Mart.)
Larger-scale studies from later in 2020 tend to show declines in transmission ranging from around 25% down into the single digits.
It's not about cherrypicking studies, but listening to scientists that are reviewing the entire state of the art and not just Googling for what's publicly available.
CDC's mask recommendations are based on such. That's what I follow.
Anyone remember when the CDC was actively not recommending cloth masks indoor or otherwise?
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/the-cdc-says-americans-dont-have-to-wear-facemasks-because-of-coronavirus-2020-01-30
I want to say that recommendation flipped during April/May 2020 after it became apparent the recommended N95s were going to be well short of anticipated supply demand.
Even now the CDC is way more about recommending N95s over anything else:
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/about-face-coverings.html
As evidence is collected, science evolves.
Quote from: Rothman on June 21, 2022, 05:30:10 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 05:19:06 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 21, 2022, 04:51:32 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 21, 2022, 09:44:18 AM
Quote from: Rothman on June 20, 2022, 06:57:19 PM
I don't consider you an expert on the state of the art and I instead rely upon those that actually are.
Of course. I'm just some guy on the Internet. Take a look at the studies yourself. The link below is straight from the CDC. Granted, it hasn't been updated since December, but I assume it's about as definitive of a list of scientific studies as you're going to find. Maybe there's a more up-to-date list of studies out there. If so, please let me know, and I'd be interested to look through them.
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-briefs/masking-science-sars-cov2.html#anchor_1619457332454
The Bangladesh study I mentioned is the only one listed that was a cluster-randomized trial. If you're looking for scientific studies that don't just rely on (1) self-reporting, (2) general trend lines without cause-and-effect certainty, or (3) very small population sizes, then the pickings are quite slim indeed.
The Bangkok study from April—May 2020 was a case-control study of more than 800 people showed strong correlation, but it was only studying known close contacts of infected individuals. (Not the type of contact one commonly encounters while shopping for colored pencils in Wal-Mart.)
Larger-scale studies from later in 2020 tend to show declines in transmission ranging from around 25% down into the single digits.
It's not about cherrypicking studies, but listening to scientists that are reviewing the entire state of the art and not just Googling for what's publicly available.
CDC's mask recommendations are based on such. That's what I follow.
Anyone remember when the CDC was actively not recommending cloth masks indoor or otherwise?
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/the-cdc-says-americans-dont-have-to-wear-facemasks-because-of-coronavirus-2020-01-30
I want to say that recommendation flipped during April/May 2020 after it became apparent the recommended N95s were going to be well short of anticipated supply demand.
Even now the CDC is way more about recommending N95s over anything else:
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/about-face-coverings.html
As evidence is collected, science evolves.
I don't know, the military and the WHO were sure more willing to jump to those cloth masks early in the pandemic. Conversely the CDC was very slow to react and didn't do a whole lot to get ahead of the early pandemic.
Some of the recent actions and mandates by the CDC in late game COVID have almost be purposely slow as a counter to how they reacted early in the pandemic. Ending up in court over the airline mask mandate was one of worst possible outcomes for the CDC given it questions their authority to make broad health mandates. Suddenly dropping the COVID test for international flight feels to me like it was attempt to avoid another Federal court date that would probably end negatively.
Looking back at all of this, I think there is plenty of reason to question the credibility of the CDC as a body that is truly prepared to handle a national health/disease concern. There certainly is a lot at stake if the Appellate Courts pick up the CDC airline mask mandate for hearing.
Regarding the County Transmission status on the CDC webpage, is there a substantial point? Sure it might be valuable to individuals who have a health concern or want to follow the County Transmission guidelines. All the same, few local level authorities are willing to listen or institute mandates anymore based off what the CDC says.
Quote from: Rothman on June 21, 2022, 05:28:38 PM
That's the definition of cherrypicking, however unintentional.
(https://reveds.files.wordpress.com/2019/08/i-do-not-think-it-means-what-you-think-it-means.jpg)
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 05:50:53 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 21, 2022, 05:30:10 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 05:19:06 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 21, 2022, 04:51:32 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 21, 2022, 09:44:18 AM
Quote from: Rothman on June 20, 2022, 06:57:19 PM
I don't consider you an expert on the state of the art and I instead rely upon those that actually are.
Of course. I'm just some guy on the Internet. Take a look at the studies yourself. The link below is straight from the CDC. Granted, it hasn't been updated since December, but I assume it's about as definitive of a list of scientific studies as you're going to find. Maybe there's a more up-to-date list of studies out there. If so, please let me know, and I'd be interested to look through them.
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-briefs/masking-science-sars-cov2.html#anchor_1619457332454
The Bangladesh study I mentioned is the only one listed that was a cluster-randomized trial. If you're looking for scientific studies that don't just rely on (1) self-reporting, (2) general trend lines without cause-and-effect certainty, or (3) very small population sizes, then the pickings are quite slim indeed.
The Bangkok study from April—May 2020 was a case-control study of more than 800 people showed strong correlation, but it was only studying known close contacts of infected individuals. (Not the type of contact one commonly encounters while shopping for colored pencils in Wal-Mart.)
Larger-scale studies from later in 2020 tend to show declines in transmission ranging from around 25% down into the single digits.
It's not about cherrypicking studies, but listening to scientists that are reviewing the entire state of the art and not just Googling for what's publicly available.
CDC's mask recommendations are based on such. That's what I follow.
Anyone remember when the CDC was actively not recommending cloth masks indoor or otherwise?
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/the-cdc-says-americans-dont-have-to-wear-facemasks-because-of-coronavirus-2020-01-30
I want to say that recommendation flipped during April/May 2020 after it became apparent the recommended N95s were going to be well short of anticipated supply demand.
Even now the CDC is way more about recommending N95s over anything else:
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/about-face-coverings.html
As evidence is collected, science evolves.
I don't know, the military and the WHO were sure more willing to jump to those cloth masks early in the pandemic. Conversely the CDC was very slow to react and didn't do a whole lot to get ahead of the early pandemic.
Some of the recent actions and mandates by the CDC in late game COVID have almost be purposely slow as a counter to how they reacted early in the pandemic. Ending up in court over the airline mask mandate was one of worst possible outcomes for the CDC given it questions their authority to make broad health mandates. Suddenly dropping the COVID test for international flight feels to me like it was attempt to avoid another Federal court date that would probably end negatively.
Looking back at all of this, I think there is plenty of reason to question the credibility of the CDC as a body that is truly prepared to handle a national health/disease concern. There certainly is a lot at stake if the Appellate Courts pick up the CDC airline mask mandate for hearing.
Regarding the County Transmission status on the CDC webpage, is there a substantial point? Sure it might be valuable to individuals who have a health concern or want to follow the County Transmission guidelines. All the same, few local level authorities are willing to listen or institute mandates anymore based off what the CDC says.
If you're not listening to a group like the CDC, then who are you listening to instead?
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 05:50:53 PMEnding up in court over the airline mask mandate was one of worst possible outcomes for the CDC given it questions their authority to make broad health mandates
Given the fact that said ruling was issued by a 12-year-old Trump-appointed Federalist Society stooge rated "not qualified" to be a judge by the ABA, that's an interesting takeaway.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 05:50:53 PMLooking back at all of this, I think there is plenty of reason to question the credibility of the CDC as a body that is truly prepared to handle a national health/disease concern.
That's ludicrous.
Quote from: Rothman on June 21, 2022, 06:03:32 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 05:50:53 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 21, 2022, 05:30:10 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 05:19:06 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 21, 2022, 04:51:32 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 21, 2022, 09:44:18 AM
Quote from: Rothman on June 20, 2022, 06:57:19 PM
I don't consider you an expert on the state of the art and I instead rely upon those that actually are.
Of course. I'm just some guy on the Internet. Take a look at the studies yourself. The link below is straight from the CDC. Granted, it hasn't been updated since December, but I assume it's about as definitive of a list of scientific studies as you're going to find. Maybe there's a more up-to-date list of studies out there. If so, please let me know, and I'd be interested to look through them.
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-briefs/masking-science-sars-cov2.html#anchor_1619457332454
The Bangladesh study I mentioned is the only one listed that was a cluster-randomized trial. If you're looking for scientific studies that don't just rely on (1) self-reporting, (2) general trend lines without cause-and-effect certainty, or (3) very small population sizes, then the pickings are quite slim indeed.
The Bangkok study from April—May 2020 was a case-control study of more than 800 people showed strong correlation, but it was only studying known close contacts of infected individuals. (Not the type of contact one commonly encounters while shopping for colored pencils in Wal-Mart.)
Larger-scale studies from later in 2020 tend to show declines in transmission ranging from around 25% down into the single digits.
It's not about cherrypicking studies, but listening to scientists that are reviewing the entire state of the art and not just Googling for what's publicly available.
CDC's mask recommendations are based on such. That's what I follow.
Anyone remember when the CDC was actively not recommending cloth masks indoor or otherwise?
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/the-cdc-says-americans-dont-have-to-wear-facemasks-because-of-coronavirus-2020-01-30
I want to say that recommendation flipped during April/May 2020 after it became apparent the recommended N95s were going to be well short of anticipated supply demand.
Even now the CDC is way more about recommending N95s over anything else:
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/about-face-coverings.html
As evidence is collected, science evolves.
I don't know, the military and the WHO were sure more willing to jump to those cloth masks early in the pandemic. Conversely the CDC was very slow to react and didn't do a whole lot to get ahead of the early pandemic.
Some of the recent actions and mandates by the CDC in late game COVID have almost be purposely slow as a counter to how they reacted early in the pandemic. Ending up in court over the airline mask mandate was one of worst possible outcomes for the CDC given it questions their authority to make broad health mandates. Suddenly dropping the COVID test for international flight feels to me like it was attempt to avoid another Federal court date that would probably end negatively.
Looking back at all of this, I think there is plenty of reason to question the credibility of the CDC as a body that is truly prepared to handle a national health/disease concern. There certainly is a lot at stake if the Appellate Courts pick up the CDC airline mask mandate for hearing.
Regarding the County Transmission status on the CDC webpage, is there a substantial point? Sure it might be valuable to individuals who have a health concern or want to follow the County Transmission guidelines. All the same, few local level authorities are willing to listen or institute mandates anymore based off what the CDC says.
If you're not listening to a group like the CDC, then who are you listening to instead?
I listed a few in my reply. Given I'm a department safety manager on a base I'm tied more to what military experts say/mandate versus the CDC. If you're asking me for an opinion outside of my scope of work, I would prefer to get advice more from the WHO than the CDC.
Quote from: abefroman329 on June 21, 2022, 06:10:51 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 05:50:53 PMEnding up in court over the airline mask mandate was one of worst possible outcomes for the CDC given it questions their authority to make broad health mandates
Given the fact that said ruling was issued by a 12-year-old Trump-appointed Federalist Society stooge rated "not qualified" to be a judge by the ABA, that's an interesting takeaway.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 05:50:53 PMLooking back at all of this, I think there is plenty of reason to question the credibility of the CDC as a body that is truly prepared to handle a national health/disease concern.
That's ludicrous.
Say the order is reversed in the Court of Appeals does survive a Supreme Court challenge? At this point it probably a pretty fair chance the CDC would lose in a Supreme Court hearing (which ironically is also because of who is appointed). Where does that leave the CDC? Either way, getting to this point at all isn't optimistic.
I mean hey, if the CDC got on board with the rest of the world and recommended cloth masks early I would feel differently. We were wearing them as Federal body well before the CDC said to, so why the hesitancy on their end? Reacting slow is the exact opposite of what a body with the authority to make emergency recommendations is supposed to do.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 06:19:55 PMI mean hey, if the CDC got on board with the rest of the world and recommended cloth masks early I would feel differently. We were wearing them as Federal body well before the CDC said to, so why the hesitancy on their end? Reacting slow is the exact opposite of what a body with the authority to make emergency recommendations is supposed to do.
Why don't we wait until a public health crisis where POTUS and his drooling sycophants don't make it their full-time job to undermine the shit out of the CDC and then we can evaluate their performance.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 01:44:40 PM
We aren't going to talk about this one?
https://www.facebook.com/471696313008593/posts/pfbid0nKDcBviJTmH6JexwA74mVXARgGFzsgVoyoCcn6zt7KoCCMUUaBpguFpG4JdEqf7gl/?d=n
Minnesota has a few hill signs. It's still flat.
Quote from: abefroman329 on June 21, 2022, 06:25:10 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 06:19:55 PMI mean hey, if the CDC got on board with the rest of the world and recommended cloth masks early I would feel differently. We were wearing them as Federal body well before the CDC said to, so why the hesitancy on their end? Reacting slow is the exact opposite of what a body with the authority to make emergency recommendations is supposed to do.
Why don't we wait until a public health crisis where POTUS and his drooling sycophants don't make it their full-time job to undermine the shit out of the CDC and then we can evaluate their performance.
The military didn't wait, the individual branches were very much opposite the Trump administration on COVID measures (including mandating cloth masks) early on. To me that clearly conveyed Federal entities were perfectly capable acting upon their own whims in terms of implementing safety measures versus what the POTUS wanted. The CDC didn't act accordingly and lost a lot of public trust in the process. All these measures are supposed to be about public safety and not politics.
Yeah, when did the CDC become so political?
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 21, 2022, 06:32:42 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 01:44:40 PM
We aren't going to talk about this one?
https://www.facebook.com/471696313008593/posts/pfbid0nKDcBviJTmH6JexwA74mVXARgGFzsgVoyoCcn6zt7KoCCMUUaBpguFpG4JdEqf7gl/?d=n
Minnesota has a few hill signs. It's still flat.
Michigan does too, but I don't think anyone is arguing it isn't one of the flatter states either.
Quote from: kphoger on June 21, 2022, 06:39:21 PM
Yeah, when did the CDC become so political?
Is this a rhetorical question?
Quote from: abefroman329 on June 21, 2022, 06:48:22 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 21, 2022, 06:39:21 PM
Yeah, when did the CDC become so political?
Is this a rhetorical question?
No. I feel like they sometimes change their position based on the political climate rather than on actual scientific insight. Maybe I'm wrong about that...
POLITICAL
[If Rothman can just scream "FICTIONAL" on every thread that pisses him off that it's in the wrong place, I am starting this]
Quote from: SectorZ on June 21, 2022, 06:52:12 PM
POLITICAL
[If Rothman can just scream "FICTIONAL" on every thread that pisses him off that it's in the wrong place, I am starting this]
Right. Let's get back on track. How about that hill?
Quote from: kphoger on June 21, 2022, 03:15:36 PM
For what it's worth, here is a view looking back toward the precipitous, mountainous, dizzyingly steep hill: https://goo.gl/maps/EzcwPD5PfDEwW7iY9
Quote from: kphoger on June 21, 2022, 06:54:14 PM
Quote from: SectorZ on June 21, 2022, 06:52:12 PM
POLITICAL
[If Rothman can just scream "FICTIONAL" on every thread that pisses him off that it's in the wrong place, I am starting this]
Right. Let's get back on track. How about that hill?
Quote from: kphoger on June 21, 2022, 04:31:38 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 21, 2022, 04:23:15 PM
I was unaware the force of friction on tires would actually scale such a massif without sliding down.
I've only peeled rubber by simply driving up a hill one time–on Mountain Street, heading north from Cliff Street (and Main Street), in Eureka Springs (AR).
https://goo.gl/maps/nxP1K8BR6yTNtfAy7
https://goo.gl/maps/XiVj4L8f5TVWWvWd6
It ain't Illinois, but it doesn't look like Arkansas is flat.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 06:55:21 PM
It ain't Illinois, but it doesn't look like Arkansas is flat.
Sorry, I quoted the wrong post.
Check my post again for the correct link.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 06:45:55 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 21, 2022, 06:32:42 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 01:44:40 PM
We aren't going to talk about this one?
https://www.facebook.com/471696313008593/posts/pfbid0nKDcBviJTmH6JexwA74mVXARgGFzsgVoyoCcn6zt7KoCCMUUaBpguFpG4JdEqf7gl/?d=n
Minnesota has a few hill signs. It's still flat.
Michigan does too, but I don't think anyone is arguing it isn't one of the flatter states either.
Ehh the western U.P. is pretty hilly in several spots and there are some hills in the Lower Peninsula I'd say it's about middle of the pack for hilly to flat terrain. The Thumb area and Saginaw area are pretty flat and Flint is about 150 feet or so higher in elevation than Saginaw is but you'd really never notice the elevation change along I-75.
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 21, 2022, 08:22:07 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 06:45:55 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 21, 2022, 06:32:42 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 01:44:40 PM
We aren't going to talk about this one?
https://www.facebook.com/471696313008593/posts/pfbid0nKDcBviJTmH6JexwA74mVXARgGFzsgVoyoCcn6zt7KoCCMUUaBpguFpG4JdEqf7gl/?d=n
Minnesota has a few hill signs. It's still flat.
Michigan does too, but I don't think anyone is arguing it isn't one of the flatter states either.
Ehh the western U.P. is pretty hilly in several spots and there are some hills in the Lower Peninsula I'd say it's about middle of the pack for hilly to flat terrain. The Thumb area and Saginaw area are pretty flat and Flint is about 150 feet or so higher in elevation than Saginaw is but you'd really never notice the elevation change along I-75.
Less flat than Illinois and by Midwest standards sure.
Quote from: SectorZ on June 21, 2022, 06:52:12 PM
POLITICAL
[If Rothman can just scream "FICTIONAL" on every thread that pisses him off that it's in the wrong place, I am starting this]
Well looks like Rothman has been a member since 2009 so he can do whatever he wants. You on the other hand might be subject to moderation.
Did I miss something, was someone actually asking for moderation?
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 10:19:45 PM
Did I miss something, was someone actually asking for moderation?
I want excess. Heck with moderation.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 08:49:05 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 21, 2022, 08:22:07 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 06:45:55 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 21, 2022, 06:32:42 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 21, 2022, 01:44:40 PM
We aren't going to talk about this one?
https://www.facebook.com/471696313008593/posts/pfbid0nKDcBviJTmH6JexwA74mVXARgGFzsgVoyoCcn6zt7KoCCMUUaBpguFpG4JdEqf7gl/?d=n
Minnesota has a few hill signs. It's still flat.
Michigan does too, but I don't think anyone is arguing it isn't one of the flatter states either.
Ehh the western U.P. is pretty hilly in several spots and there are some hills in the Lower Peninsula I'd say it's about middle of the pack for hilly to flat terrain. The Thumb area and Saginaw area are pretty flat and Flint is about 150 feet or so higher in elevation than Saginaw is but you'd really never notice the elevation change along I-75.
Less flat than Illinois and by Midwest standards sure.
I agree. Michigan does have it's flat areas but it also has it's hilly areas too.
So the new standard is that unless a state is totally and completely without any elevation changes whatsoever, it's not flat?
A few hills here and there does not make a state un-flat.
Quote from: hbelkins on June 22, 2022, 02:20:43 PM
So the new standard is that unless a state is totally and completely without any elevation changes whatsoever, it's not flat?
A few hills here and there does not make a state un-flat.
We're nothing if not literal on this forum...
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate.
Even though it cannot be refuted, I must chuckle at the methodology for "Safety". It included factors such as population density and something called "Driving Laws Rating".
I'm also curious to know how "National Parks Recreation Visitors per Capita" is a meaningful metric. Is a high number better, or does that just mean the parks are crowded? Is a low number better, or does that just mean there aren't very many parks? And what does any of that have to do with the total population of the state?
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
There is a reason Wallethub was included on the list of most feared gods:
https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=31640.0
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 22, 2022, 03:30:54 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
There is a reason Wallethub was included on the list of most feared gods:
https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=31640.0
And actually if you widen it out to the entire Midwest, Illinois was second to last, barely beating out Indiana to avoid the cellar.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 04:46:36 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 22, 2022, 03:30:54 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
There is a reason Wallethub was included on the list of most feared gods:
https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=31640.0
And actually if you widen it out to the entire Midwest, Illinois was second to last, barely beating out Indiana to avoid the cellar.
Indiana is a top 50 state to drive through.
Quote from: thspfc on June 22, 2022, 05:49:49 PM
Indiana is a top 50 state to drive through.
Barely.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 22, 2022, 06:06:35 PM
Quote from: thspfc on June 22, 2022, 05:49:49 PM
Indiana is a top 50 state to drive through.
Barely.
Illinois ranks behind almost every Oblast of Alanland and most of those aren't even real.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 22, 2022, 06:13:20 PM
Illinois ranks behind almost every Oblast of Alanland and most of those aren't even real.
Only the fictional ones are real, as per Directive 309.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking. If you sort it by activities or even safety...IL beats those other states.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking. If you sort it by activities or even safety...IL beats those other states.
The gods at Wallethub in their omnipotent wisdom put them 32nd. Nothing else matters.
And if you go by safety, MN, IA, WI, ND, and NE all top Illinois.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking. If you sort it by activities or even safety...IL beats those other states.
What's this, you dare question the teachings of Wallethub? That's about the fastest way possible to declared a heretic by the Church of Wallethubism.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 12:44:08 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking. If you sort it by activities or even safety...IL beats those other states.
The gods at Wallethub in their omnipotent wisdom put them 32nd. Nothing else matters.
And if you go by safety, MN, IA, WI, ND, and NE all top Illinois.
Again activities... You know, places to go/things to look at.. IL is #5 in that metric which beats the other Midwestern states. This means that ignoring the cost factor, one will have the best experience in IL of any Midwestern state. This supports the other arguments I've been making too.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 02:51:13 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 12:44:08 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking. If you sort it by activities or even safety...IL beats those other states.
The gods at Wallethub in their omnipotent wisdom put them 32nd. Nothing else matters.
And if you go by safety, MN, IA, WI, ND, and NE all top Illinois.
Again activities... You know, places to go/things to look at.. IL is #5 in that metric which beats the other Midwestern states. This means that ignoring the cost factor, one will have the best experience in IL of any Midwestern state. This supports the other arguments I've been making too.
Chicago is great. The rest of Illinois is terrible.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 23, 2022, 08:27:51 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 02:51:13 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 12:44:08 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022’s Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking. If you sort it by activities or even safety...IL beats those other states.
The gods at Wallethub in their omnipotent wisdom put them 32nd. Nothing else matters.
And if you go by safety, MN, IA, WI, ND, and NE all top Illinois.
Again activities... You know, places to go/things to look at.. IL is #5 in that metric which beats the other Midwestern states. This means that ignoring the cost factor, one will have the best experience in IL of any Midwestern state. This supports the other arguments I've been making too.
Chicago is great. The rest of Illinois is terrible.
I disagree, the rest of Illinois is great too. One reason is I can get a good bite to eat pretty much anywhere in the state. Can't say the same for other states which usually have their good eats exclusively confined to the large cities. Indiana for example.. in Indianapolis and NW Indiana you have Illinois stables like Harold's Chicken, Portillos, Giordano's etc, they taste just as good as having it in Illinois. Start to venture away and the quality declines significantly. Although, this drive in type restaurant in Kokomo wasn't half bad.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 08:39:55 AM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 23, 2022, 08:27:51 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 02:51:13 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 12:44:08 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking. If you sort it by activities or even safety...IL beats those other states.
The gods at Wallethub in their omnipotent wisdom put them 32nd. Nothing else matters.
And if you go by safety, MN, IA, WI, ND, and NE all top Illinois.
Again activities... You know, places to go/things to look at.. IL is #5 in that metric which beats the other Midwestern states. This means that ignoring the cost factor, one will have the best experience in IL of any Midwestern state. This supports the other arguments I've been making too.
Chicago is great. The rest of Illinois is terrible.
I disagree, the rest of Illinois is great too. One reason is I can get a good bite to eat pretty much anywhere in the state. Can't say the same for other states which usually have their good eats exclusively confined to the large cities. Indiana for example.. in Indianapolis and NW Indiana you have Illinois stables like Harold's Chicken, Portillos, Giordano's etc, they taste just as good as having it in Illinois. Start to venture away and the quality declines significantly. Although, this drive in type restaurant in Kokomo wasn't half bad.
The nonsense just got kicked up a notch.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 23, 2022, 08:27:51 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 02:51:13 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 12:44:08 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking. If you sort it by activities or even safety...IL beats those other states.
The gods at Wallethub in their omnipotent wisdom put them 32nd. Nothing else matters.
And if you go by safety, MN, IA, WI, ND, and NE all top Illinois.
Again activities... You know, places to go/things to look at.. IL is #5 in that metric which beats the other Midwestern states. This means that ignoring the cost factor, one will have the best experience in IL of any Midwestern state. This supports the other arguments I've been making too.
Chicago is great. The rest of Illinois is terrible.
Depends on where in Chicago you're at. The rest of Illinois is pretty lame I agree.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 08:39:55 AM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 23, 2022, 08:27:51 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 02:51:13 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 12:44:08 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking. If you sort it by activities or even safety...IL beats those other states.
The gods at Wallethub in their omnipotent wisdom put them 32nd. Nothing else matters.
And if you go by safety, MN, IA, WI, ND, and NE all top Illinois.
Again activities... You know, places to go/things to look at.. IL is #5 in that metric which beats the other Midwestern states. This means that ignoring the cost factor, one will have the best experience in IL of any Midwestern state. This supports the other arguments I've been making too.
Chicago is great. The rest of Illinois is terrible.
I disagree, the rest of Illinois is great too. One reason is I can get a good bite to eat pretty much anywhere in the state. Can't say the same for other states which usually have their good eats exclusively confined to the large cities. Indiana for example.. in Indianapolis and NW Indiana you have Illinois stables like Harold's Chicken, Portillos, Giordano's etc, they taste just as good as having it in Illinois. Start to venture away and the quality declines significantly. Although, this drive in type restaurant in Kokomo wasn't half bad.
Of course you disagree. You are a very biased person and can't admit that Illinois just isn't a top destination state and is pretty boring outside of Chicago. What in the hell do you mean you can get a good bite to eat pretty much anywhere in the state? Do you seriously think other states are lacking good places to eat? Yes you can say that about other states. So what if you have Illinois businesses in Indiana? The state borders Illinois. Every time you post you make it obvious that you haven't traveled very far from Illinois. I can go anywhere in Michigan and find a good place to eat just because you don't think that's possible doesn't mean much.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 02:51:13 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 12:44:08 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking. If you sort it by activities or even safety...IL beats those other states.
The gods at Wallethub in their omnipotent wisdom put them 32nd. Nothing else matters.
And if you go by safety, MN, IA, WI, ND, and NE all top Illinois.
Again activities... You know, places to go/things to look at.. IL is #5 in that metric which beats the other Midwestern states. This means that ignoring the cost factor, one will have the best experience in IL of any Midwestern state. This supports the other arguments I've been making too.
LMFAO @ one will have the best experience in Illinois of any Midwestern state. What in the hell is there to experience? You've got Chicago and then the rest of the state. You'll find much more to experience in Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota than you will Illinois. For one thing Michigan is a much better place to be in the summer time and if you disagree with that than how come flocks of people from Illinois come to Michigan to vacation in the summer? I'd much rather be in Traverse City, Michigan in the summer than anywhere in Illinois.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 02:51:13 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 12:44:08 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking. If you sort it by activities or even safety...IL beats those other states.
The gods at Wallethub in their omnipotent wisdom put them 32nd. Nothing else matters.
And if you go by safety, MN, IA, WI, ND, and NE all top Illinois.
Again activities... You know, places to go/things to look at.. IL is #5 in that metric which beats the other Midwestern states. This means that ignoring the cost factor, one will have the best experience in IL of any Midwestern state. This supports the other arguments I've been making too.
It's heresy then, the Knights of Evolution Finance Incorporated has been dispatched to bring to you to the Grand Inquistor.
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 23, 2022, 09:05:55 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 02:51:13 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 12:44:08 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022’s Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking. If you sort it by activities or even safety...IL beats those other states.
The gods at Wallethub in their omnipotent wisdom put them 32nd. Nothing else matters.
And if you go by safety, MN, IA, WI, ND, and NE all top Illinois.
Again activities... You know, places to go/things to look at.. IL is #5 in that metric which beats the other Midwestern states. This means that ignoring the cost factor, one will have the best experience in IL of any Midwestern state. This supports the other arguments I've been making too.
LMFAO @ one will have the best experience in Illinois of any Midwestern state. What in the hell is there to experience? You've got Chicago and then the rest of the state. You'll find much more to experience in Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota than you will Illinois. For one thing Michigan is a much better place to be in the summer time and if you disagree with that than how come flocks of people from Illinois come to Michigan to vacation in the summer? I'd much rather be in Traverse City, Michigan in the summer than anywhere in Illinois.
Again there's plenty to experience outside of Chicago in Illinois. Here are just a few examples...
Galena
Starved Rock
Cave in Rock
The kickass BBQ scene in Murphysboro
Carbondale
Pretty much any college town will throw down
Springfield
And the Illinois portion of the Ozarks.
Those are just a few. There's a reason Illinois was declared the funnest state in the Midwest. It's obvious that you haven't experienced much of Illinois.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 08:39:55 AM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 23, 2022, 08:27:51 AM
Chicago is great. The rest of Illinois is terrible.
I disagree, the rest of Illinois is great too.
Chicago is great. There are a very few pockets of greatness in the rest of Illinois, but 95% of it is lame. Not necessarily terrible, but lame none the less. That 95% is flat farmland peppered with nondescript towns that could just as easily be in any other state as Illinois.
(I was born in Joliet, and I've lived in Illinois for a total of 20 years, both in the Chicago area and downstate. I've been from Cairo to Ingleside, from Metropolis to Rockford, from Macomb to Mount Carmel, from Chester to Dolton. I've been all over Illinois–by car, by truck, on Amtrak, on Greyhound, and hitchhiking. So don't you dare tell me I don't know what it's like.)
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking. If you sort it by activities or even safety...IL beats those other states.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 12:44:08 AM
And if you go by safety, MN, IA, WI, ND, and NE all top Illinois.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 02:51:13 AM
Again activities... You know, places to go/things to look at.. IL is #5 in that metric which beats the other Midwestern states. This means that ignoring the cost factor, one will have the best experience in IL of any Midwestern state. This supports the other arguments I've been making too.
So, in other words, WalletHub's rankings are accurate when they support your position, but they're off base when they don't support it. Gotcha.
Why are you surprised that WalletHub has an emphasis on the affordability of a vacation destination? It's a financial site. And they've determined that there are 31 states where your money is better spent on a summer road trip. Maybe you think the sights of Illinois are worth the extra cost, but that's not exactly the position I'd expect a site with "wallet" in its name to take.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 08:39:55 AM
I can get a good bite to eat pretty much anywhere in the state. Can't say the same for other states which usually have their good eats exclusively confined to the large cities. Indiana for example.. in Indianapolis and NW Indiana you have Illinois stables like Harold's Chicken, Portillos, Giordano's etc, they taste just as good as having it in Illinois. Start to venture away and the quality declines significantly. Although, this drive in type restaurant in Kokomo wasn't half bad.
My restaurant experience in Illinois is somewhat limited to Chicagoland and the area south of Route 149, but I agree that Illinois does seem to have consistently good food compared to other places I've been.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 10:19:11 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 23, 2022, 09:05:55 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 02:51:13 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 12:44:08 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking. If you sort it by activities or even safety...IL beats those other states.
The gods at Wallethub in their omnipotent wisdom put them 32nd. Nothing else matters.
And if you go by safety, MN, IA, WI, ND, and NE all top Illinois.
Again activities... You know, places to go/things to look at.. IL is #5 in that metric which beats the other Midwestern states. This means that ignoring the cost factor, one will have the best experience in IL of any Midwestern state. This supports the other arguments I've been making too.
LMFAO @ one will have the best experience in Illinois of any Midwestern state. What in the hell is there to experience? You've got Chicago and then the rest of the state. You'll find much more to experience in Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota than you will Illinois. For one thing Michigan is a much better place to be in the summer time and if you disagree with that than how come flocks of people from Illinois come to Michigan to vacation in the summer? I'd much rather be in Traverse City, Michigan in the summer than anywhere in Illinois.
Again there's plenty to experience outside of Chicago in Illinois. Here are just a few examples...
Galena
Starved Rock
Cave in Rock
The kickass BBQ scene in Murphysboro
Carbondale
Pretty much any college town will throw down
Springfield
And the Illinois portion of the Ozarks.
Those are just a few. There's a reason Illinois was declared the funnest state in the Midwest. It's obvious that you haven't experienced much of Illinois.
I don't think you've experienced all those places.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 10:19:11 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 23, 2022, 09:05:55 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 02:51:13 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 12:44:08 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking. If you sort it by activities or even safety...IL beats those other states.
The gods at Wallethub in their omnipotent wisdom put them 32nd. Nothing else matters.
And if you go by safety, MN, IA, WI, ND, and NE all top Illinois.
Again activities... You know, places to go/things to look at.. IL is #5 in that metric which beats the other Midwestern states. This means that ignoring the cost factor, one will have the best experience in IL of any Midwestern state. This supports the other arguments I've been making too.
LMFAO @ one will have the best experience in Illinois of any Midwestern state. What in the hell is there to experience? You've got Chicago and then the rest of the state. You'll find much more to experience in Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota than you will Illinois. For one thing Michigan is a much better place to be in the summer time and if you disagree with that than how come flocks of people from Illinois come to Michigan to vacation in the summer? I'd much rather be in Traverse City, Michigan in the summer than anywhere in Illinois.
Again there's plenty to experience outside of Chicago in Illinois. Here are just a few examples...
Galena
Starved Rock
Cave in Rock
The kickass BBQ scene in Murphysboro
Carbondale
Pretty much any college town will throw down
Springfield
And the Illinois portion of the Ozarks.
Those are just a few. There's a reason Illinois was declared the funnest state in the Midwest. It's obvious that you haven't experienced much of Illinois.
Illinois has never been declared the funnest state in the Midwest by any serious talking person. And what makes you think I can't find anything like that or better in Michigan?
Quote from: Rothman on June 23, 2022, 11:28:42 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 10:19:11 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 23, 2022, 09:05:55 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 02:51:13 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 12:44:08 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking. If you sort it by activities or even safety...IL beats those other states.
The gods at Wallethub in their omnipotent wisdom put them 32nd. Nothing else matters.
And if you go by safety, MN, IA, WI, ND, and NE all top Illinois.
Again activities... You know, places to go/things to look at.. IL is #5 in that metric which beats the other Midwestern states. This means that ignoring the cost factor, one will have the best experience in IL of any Midwestern state. This supports the other arguments I've been making too.
LMFAO @ one will have the best experience in Illinois of any Midwestern state. What in the hell is there to experience? You've got Chicago and then the rest of the state. You'll find much more to experience in Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota than you will Illinois. For one thing Michigan is a much better place to be in the summer time and if you disagree with that than how come flocks of people from Illinois come to Michigan to vacation in the summer? I'd much rather be in Traverse City, Michigan in the summer than anywhere in Illinois.
Again there's plenty to experience outside of Chicago in Illinois. Here are just a few examples...
Galena
Starved Rock
Cave in Rock
The kickass BBQ scene in Murphysboro
Carbondale
Pretty much any college town will throw down
Springfield
And the Illinois portion of the Ozarks.
Those are just a few. There's a reason Illinois was declared the funnest state in the Midwest. It's obvious that you haven't experienced much of Illinois.
I don't think you've experienced all those places.
Right. I think he's just looking at a map and picking things based on that.
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 23, 2022, 11:34:21 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 10:19:11 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 23, 2022, 09:05:55 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 02:51:13 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 12:44:08 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking. If you sort it by activities or even safety...IL beats those other states.
The gods at Wallethub in their omnipotent wisdom put them 32nd. Nothing else matters.
And if you go by safety, MN, IA, WI, ND, and NE all top Illinois.
Again activities... You know, places to go/things to look at.. IL is #5 in that metric which beats the other Midwestern states. This means that ignoring the cost factor, one will have the best experience in IL of any Midwestern state. This supports the other arguments I've been making too.
LMFAO @ one will have the best experience in Illinois of any Midwestern state. What in the hell is there to experience? You've got Chicago and then the rest of the state. You'll find much more to experience in Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota than you will Illinois. For one thing Michigan is a much better place to be in the summer time and if you disagree with that than how come flocks of people from Illinois come to Michigan to vacation in the summer? I'd much rather be in Traverse City, Michigan in the summer than anywhere in Illinois.
Again there's plenty to experience outside of Chicago in Illinois. Here are just a few examples...
Galena
Starved Rock
Cave in Rock
The kickass BBQ scene in Murphysboro
Carbondale
Pretty much any college town will throw down
Springfield
And the Illinois portion of the Ozarks.
Those are just a few. There's a reason Illinois was declared the funnest state in the Midwest. It's obvious that you haven't experienced much of Illinois.
Illinois has never been declared the funnest state in the Midwest by any serious talking person. And what makes you think I can't find anything like that or better in Michigan?
It's been declared the funnest state by again... wallethub
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
"The kickass BBQ scene in Murphysboro" is a three-day cookoff that takes place there in September. I'm not sure I'd call that a "scene". I think there may only be two barbecue restaurants in the whole town.
A visit to Cave-in-Rock takes, what? an hour? Then you're done.
Illinois is hardly unique in having college towns.
Galen and Starved Rock are definitely worth visiting. The Ozarks/Shawnee National Forest area is as well, though perhaps less so.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 11:43:00 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 23, 2022, 11:34:21 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 10:19:11 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 23, 2022, 09:05:55 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 02:51:13 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 12:44:08 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 22, 2022, 03:13:03 PM
Since Wallethub is irrefutable, this is not up for debate. 2022's Best & Worst States for Summer Road Trips (https://wallethub.com/edu/best-worst-states-for-summer-road-trips/4648)
2. Minnesota
15. Iowa
16. Michigan
18. Wisconsin
32. Illinois
Sorry. Wallethub has spoken. Illinois is not a premier road trip destination, and Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa are all better. And Illinois is still flat too.
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking. If you sort it by activities or even safety...IL beats those other states.
The gods at Wallethub in their omnipotent wisdom put them 32nd. Nothing else matters.
And if you go by safety, MN, IA, WI, ND, and NE all top Illinois.
Again activities... You know, places to go/things to look at.. IL is #5 in that metric which beats the other Midwestern states. This means that ignoring the cost factor, one will have the best experience in IL of any Midwestern state. This supports the other arguments I've been making too.
LMFAO @ one will have the best experience in Illinois of any Midwestern state. What in the hell is there to experience? You've got Chicago and then the rest of the state. You'll find much more to experience in Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota than you will Illinois. For one thing Michigan is a much better place to be in the summer time and if you disagree with that than how come flocks of people from Illinois come to Michigan to vacation in the summer? I'd much rather be in Traverse City, Michigan in the summer than anywhere in Illinois.
Again there's plenty to experience outside of Chicago in Illinois. Here are just a few examples...
Galena
Starved Rock
Cave in Rock
The kickass BBQ scene in Murphysboro
Carbondale
Pretty much any college town will throw down
Springfield
And the Illinois portion of the Ozarks.
Those are just a few. There's a reason Illinois was declared the funnest state in the Midwest. It's obvious that you haven't experienced much of Illinois.
Illinois has never been declared the funnest state in the Midwest by any serious talking person. And what makes you think I can't find anything like that or better in Michigan?
It's been declared the funnest state by again... wallethub
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
The fact Florida is number two immediately invalidates the list even before getting to Illinois.
But then again I'm not a follower of Wallethubism...
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 11:43:00 AM
It's been declared the funnest state by again... wallethub
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
I thought we were supposed to dismiss rankings that include criteria like "Movie Costs", "Personal Spending on Recreation Services per Capita", and "Average Beer & Wine Price". I mean, the costs metric probably impacted the overall ranking.
Also, apparently "Fitness Centers per Capita" is a meaningful metric when it comes to a state's fun-ness. Seriously? How often have I been on a fun family vacation and suggested that we all head to Planet Fitness? Zero.
Chicago is less great than it would otherwise be because it's in Illinois.
Quote from: kphoger on June 23, 2022, 11:51:55 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 11:43:00 AM
It's been declared the funnest state by again... wallethub
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
I thought we were supposed to dismiss rankings that include criteria like "Movie Costs", "Personal Spending on Recreation Services per Capita", and "Average Beer & Wine Price". I mean, the costs metric probably impacted the overall ranking.
Also, apparently "Fitness Centers per Capita" is a meaningful metric when it comes to a state's fun-ness. Seriously? How often have I been on a fun family vacation and suggested that we all head to Planet Fitness? Zero.
I tend to find cities and states more attractive the more they have things like outdoor running opportunities available. Certainly downtown Chicago has running opportunities, but there aren't many other areas that I can think of that would be worthwhile.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 23, 2022, 12:05:33 PM
Chicago is less great than it would otherwise be because it's in Illinois.
What state do you think it should be in? You know, instead?
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 23, 2022, 12:13:10 PM
I tend to find cities and states more attractive the more they have things like outdoor running opportunities available. Certainly downtown Chicago has running opportunities, but there aren't many other areas that I can think of that would be worthwhile.
You are out of alignment with Lord WalletHub's worldview. You need to make yourself right with him.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 23, 2022, 11:50:17 AM
The fact Florida is number two immediately invalidates the list even before getting to Illinois.
But then again I'm not a follower of Wallethubism...
Hell, Nevada at 3. If you're not into the nightlife scene in Vegas (or on a much smaller scale in Reno), how exciting is it? My partly educated guess would be "not very".
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 01:06:17 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 23, 2022, 11:50:17 AM
The fact Florida is number two immediately invalidates the list even before getting to Illinois.
But then again I'm not a follower of Wallethubism...
Hell, Nevada at 3. If you're not into the nightlife scene in Vegas (or on a much smaller scale in Reno), how exciting is it? My partly educated guess would be "not very".
Depends, if you are into rugged outdoors stuff Nevada can be really nice. Even then I don't know if I would rate it as one of my top ten given much of the Great Basin Desert feels the same character wise. Either way all of that is clearly not the demographic of Wallethub, so they are obviously referring to luxury/casino experiences around Las Vegas and Reno.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 23, 2022, 01:14:20 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 01:06:17 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 23, 2022, 11:50:17 AM
The fact Florida is number two immediately invalidates the list even before getting to Illinois.
But then again I'm not a follower of Wallethubism...
Hell, Nevada at 3. If you're not into the nightlife scene in Vegas (or on a much smaller scale in Reno), how exciting is it? My partly educated guess would be "not very".
Depends, if you are into rugged outdoors stuff Nevada can be really nice. Even then I don't know if I would rate it as one of my top ten given much of the Great Basin Desert feels the same character wise. Either way all of that is clearly not the demographic of Wallethub, so they are obviously referring to luxury/casino experiences around Las Vegas and Reno.
Right, but Nevada is quite empty.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 23, 2022, 01:14:20 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 01:06:17 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 23, 2022, 11:50:17 AM
The fact Florida is number two immediately invalidates the list even before getting to Illinois.
But then again I'm not a follower of Wallethubism...
Hell, Nevada at 3. If you're not into the nightlife scene in Vegas (or on a much smaller scale in Reno), how exciting is it? My partly educated guess would be "not very".
Depends, if you are into rugged outdoors stuff Nevada can be really nice. Even then I don't know if I would rate it as one of my top ten given much of the Great Basin Desert feels the same character wise. Either way all of that is clearly not the demographic of Wallethub, so they are obviously referring to luxury/casino experiences around Las Vegas and Reno.
I think that demonstrates that point that Chicago is why Illinois is where it is on the list. Outside of Chicago, everything Illinois has can be found better elsewhere.
Quote from: kphoger on June 23, 2022, 01:00:46 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 23, 2022, 12:05:33 PM
Chicago is less great than it would otherwise be because it's in Illinois.
What state do you think it should be in? You know, instead?
Any state that doesn't have so little to do as the rest of Illinois.
Quote from: Rothman on June 23, 2022, 01:25:34 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 23, 2022, 01:14:20 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 01:06:17 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 23, 2022, 11:50:17 AM
The fact Florida is number two immediately invalidates the list even before getting to Illinois.
But then again I'm not a follower of Wallethubism...
Hell, Nevada at 3. If you're not into the nightlife scene in Vegas (or on a much smaller scale in Reno), how exciting is it? My partly educated guess would be "not very".
Depends, if you are into rugged outdoors stuff Nevada can be really nice. Even then I don't know if I would rate it as one of my top ten given much of the Great Basin Desert feels the same character wise. Either way all of that is clearly not the demographic of Wallethub, so they are obviously referring to luxury/casino experiences around Las Vegas and Reno.
Right, but Nevada is quite empty.
Right, most of the state is well past it's mining heyday. To that end there is a lot of older mining districts, ghost towns and OHV roads that are fun to explore. The old Lincoln Highway corridor along US 50 has a lot to offer but requires high clearance and probably four wheel drive. Nevada has similar huge barriers to fun to be fully unlocked, I don't think most people have the vehicle or self reliance to take advantage. Nevada does have a couple really top notch state Parks, the problem is that they are being discovered by the Vegas crowd.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 01:27:06 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 23, 2022, 01:14:20 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 01:06:17 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 23, 2022, 11:50:17 AM
The fact Florida is number two immediately invalidates the list even before getting to Illinois.
But then again I'm not a follower of Wallethubism...
Hell, Nevada at 3. If you're not into the nightlife scene in Vegas (or on a much smaller scale in Reno), how exciting is it? My partly educated guess would be "not very".
Depends, if you are into rugged outdoors stuff Nevada can be really nice. Even then I don't know if I would rate it as one of my top ten given much of the Great Basin Desert feels the same character wise. Either way all of that is clearly not the demographic of Wallethub, so they are obviously referring to luxury/casino experiences around Las Vegas and Reno.
I think that demonstrates that point that Chicago is why Illinois is where it is on the list. Outside of Chicago, everything Illinois has can be found better elsewhere.
And that's the trouble, it is slim pickings in outside Chicago and it takes some effort to get to the things worth seeing. Most other states do similar things better and don't require a massive deviation from desirable paths of travel to get to them.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 23, 2022, 01:29:17 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 23, 2022, 01:00:46 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 23, 2022, 12:05:33 PM
Chicago is less great than it would otherwise be because it's in Illinois.
What state do you think it should be in? You know, instead?
Any state that doesn't have so little to do as the rest of Illinois.
How about making it part of New York?
Imagine the arguments...
Quote from: kphoger on June 23, 2022, 01:40:40 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 23, 2022, 01:29:17 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 23, 2022, 01:00:46 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 23, 2022, 12:05:33 PM
Chicago is less great than it would otherwise be because it's in Illinois.
What state do you think it should be in? You know, instead?
Any state that doesn't have so little to do as the rest of Illinois.
How about making it part of New York?
Imagine the arguments...
Maybe move it to Orleans County.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 23, 2022, 01:52:57 PM
Maybe move it to Orleans County.
That would give Orleans County a few beaches, of which it currently has none.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 23, 2022, 12:13:10 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 23, 2022, 11:51:55 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 11:43:00 AM
It's been declared the funnest state by again... wallethub
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
I thought we were supposed to dismiss rankings that include criteria like "Movie Costs", "Personal Spending on Recreation Services per Capita", and "Average Beer & Wine Price". I mean, the costs metric probably impacted the overall ranking.
Also, apparently "Fitness Centers per Capita" is a meaningful metric when it comes to a state's fun-ness. Seriously? How often have I been on a fun family vacation and suggested that we all head to Planet Fitness? Zero.
I tend to find cities and states more attractive the more they have things like outdoor running opportunities available. Certainly downtown Chicago has running opportunities, but there aren't many other areas that I can think of that would be worthwhile.
In the county I live in there's a nature preserve within every 5 miles. That presents plenty of running opportunities. Even outside of the county there are an abundance of hiking trails in the state. And all are
free especially when compared to the neighboring states.
"Within every five miles." The mind boggles.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 04:23:41 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 23, 2022, 12:13:10 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 23, 2022, 11:51:55 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
Looks like the costs metric really impacted the overall ranking.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 11:43:00 AM
It's been declared the funnest state by again... wallethub
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
I thought we were supposed to dismiss rankings that include criteria like "Movie Costs", "Personal Spending on Recreation Services per Capita", and "Average Beer & Wine Price". I mean, the costs metric probably impacted the overall ranking.
Also, apparently "Fitness Centers per Capita" is a meaningful metric when it comes to a state's fun-ness. Seriously? How often have I been on a fun family vacation and suggested that we all head to Planet Fitness? Zero.
I tend to find cities and states more attractive the more they have things like outdoor running opportunities available. Certainly downtown Chicago has running opportunities, but there aren't many other areas that I can think of that would be worthwhile.
In the county I live in there's a nature preserve within every 5 miles. That presents plenty of running opportunities. Even outside of the county there are an abundance of hiking trails in the state. And all are free especially when compared to the neighboring states.
And how is they actually attracting people who distance run to the Wisconsin/Illinois State Line area? Is there an actual can't miss item to see or those preserves just intended largely for locals to enjoy? I run by the local Metro Park near my Cousin in Detroit, but that's only because it's near her house. I would never go seek out that Metro Park as a destination run.
Funny, there is a local nature trail in the town I'm at in Mexico too. I've never seen anyone but locals running on it. The reason being because it's flat and has nothing really to offer a tourist passing through.
I think you're overhyping the "free" part of it. Just because state parks themselves may not be free in most other states doesn't mean many other parks or nature areas aren't. I don't know how much of the Illinois state budget goes to state parks to keep admission waived, but I did note the Starved Rock visitor center was subpar compared to the visitor centers at paid state parks I've been to in other states. Free can be underwhelming.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 05:55:33 PM
I think you're overhyping the "free" part of it. Just because state parks themselves may not be free in most other states doesn't mean many other parks or nature areas aren't. I don't know how much of the Illinois state budget goes to state parks to keep admission waived, but I did note the Starved Rock visitor center was subpar compared to the visitor centers at paid state parks I've been to in other states. Free can be underwhelming.
How many state parks in general even exceed $15 dollars for day use? Free doesn't have a ton of value when the price of entry typically runs extremely cheap to begin with.
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 09:21:30 AM
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Or parts of Pennsylvania in the Midwest?
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 24, 2022, 09:41:25 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 09:21:30 AM
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Or parts of Pennsylvania in the Midwest?
A long time ago someone tried telling me that Michigan is part of the Northeast, I said no it's not it's part of the Midwest and they tried telling me I'm wrong lol.
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 09:21:30 AM
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Yup it's official
https://www.illinoisozarks.com/ozark-tour/
There's also a debate as to whether the Knobstone escarpment in Indiana is actually part of the Appalachians.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 10:44:38 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 09:21:30 AM
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Yup it's official
https://www.illinoisozarks.com/ozark-tour/
There's also a debate as to whether the Knobstone escarpment in Indiana is actually part of the Appalachians.
Did Wallethub put that site together? You sure like to throw out "official" a lot for things that certainly aren't USGS related content.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 10:44:38 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 09:21:30 AM
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Yup it's official
https://www.illinoisozarks.com/ozark-tour/
There's also a debate as to whether the Knobstone escarpment in Indiana is actually part of the Appalachians.
Wikipedia officially says you're wrong. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozarks)
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 10:44:38 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 09:21:30 AM
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Yup it's official
https://www.illinoisozarks.com/ozark-tour/
There's also a debate as to whether the Knobstone escarpment in Indiana is actually part of the Appalachians.
That site doesn't prove anything. The Ozarks are in Arkansas, Kansas, Missouri and Oklahoma. It'd be real nice if you'd stop being so biased toward Illinois and actually open your eyes and realize that there is much more to this country than just Illinois.
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 24, 2022, 11:08:38 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 10:44:38 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 09:21:30 AM
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Yup it's official
https://www.illinoisozarks.com/ozark-tour/
There's also a debate as to whether the Knobstone escarpment in Indiana is actually part of the Appalachians.
That site doesn't prove anything. The Ozarks are in Arkansas, Kansas, Missouri and Oklahoma. It'd be real nice if you'd stop being so biased toward Illinois and actually open your eyes and realize that there is much more to this country than just Illinois.
And thank god for it.
And the news knows the "Illinois Ozarks" is just a tourism designation:
https://fox2now.com/news/illinois/do-you-know-about-the-illinois-ozarks-its-not-just-in-missouri-arkansas/
Direct quote:
"Well, the area may not technically be a part of the Ozarks. But, they are a part of the Shawnee Hills. The region is geologically similar to the Ozarks west of the Mississippi River. There is also an unincorporated community in Johnson County at the very southern tip of Illinois named, Ozark."
I think that I was onto something making up the "Illinois Alps" as a range the other day. Why don't designate a Illinois Sierra Nevada Mountains and Illinois Rocky Mountains to aim a little "higher."
^ or the "Illayaya", capped by Mount Ever Rest.
Come join me and ponder a non-flat Illinois road network:
https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=31690.0
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 24, 2022, 10:55:17 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 10:44:38 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 09:21:30 AM
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Yup it's official
https://www.illinoisozarks.com/ozark-tour/
There's also a debate as to whether the Knobstone escarpment in Indiana is actually part of the Appalachians.
Wikipedia officially says you're wrong. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozarks)
Remember that Crash_It hasn't been anywhere. Arguing with the ignorant just generates pity for the ignorant.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 24, 2022, 09:41:25 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 09:21:30 AM
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Or parts of Pennsylvania in the Midwest?
Probably the same people arguing that Pittsburgh and Buffalo are culturally Midwest while claiming Bismarck and Sioux Falls are not.
Quote from: Rothman on June 24, 2022, 01:16:07 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 24, 2022, 10:55:17 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 10:44:38 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 09:21:30 AM
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Yup it's official
https://www.illinoisozarks.com/ozark-tour/
There's also a debate as to whether the Knobstone escarpment in Indiana is actually part of the Appalachians.
Wikipedia officially says you're wrong. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozarks)
Remember that Crash_It hasn't been anywhere. Arguing with the ignorant just generates pity for the ignorant.
Does someone actually pity Crash_It though?
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 24, 2022, 11:08:38 AM
That site doesn't prove anything. The Ozarks are in Arkansas, Kansas, Missouri and Oklahoma. It'd be real nice if you'd stop being so biased toward Illinois and actually open your eyes and realize that there is much more to this country than just Illinois.
Wait .. the Ozarks extend into Kansas? News to me, unless they're stretching the Ozarks to include the Flint Hills.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 24, 2022, 10:55:17 AM
Wikipedia officially says you're wrong. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozarks)
Wikipedia isn't an official source of anything.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 24, 2022, 11:14:32 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 24, 2022, 11:08:38 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 10:44:38 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 09:21:30 AM
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Yup it's official
https://www.illinoisozarks.com/ozark-tour/
There's also a debate as to whether the Knobstone escarpment in Indiana is actually part of the Appalachians.
That site doesn't prove anything. The Ozarks are in Arkansas, Kansas, Missouri and Oklahoma. It'd be real nice if you'd stop being so biased toward Illinois and actually open your eyes and realize that there is much more to this country than just Illinois.
And thank god for it.
I know right? I couldn't imagine every single inch of this country being like Illinois.
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 02:11:09 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 24, 2022, 11:08:38 AM
That site doesn't prove anything. The Ozarks are in Arkansas, Kansas, Missouri and Oklahoma. It'd be real nice if you'd stop being so biased toward Illinois and actually open your eyes and realize that there is much more to this country than just Illinois.
Wait .. the Ozarks extend into Kansas? News to me, unless they're stretching the Ozarks to include the Flint Hills.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 24, 2022, 10:55:17 AM
Wikipedia officially says you're wrong. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozarks)
Wikipedia isn't an official source of anything.
But the article in question does have 85 references, including the USGS.
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 02:11:09 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 24, 2022, 11:08:38 AM
That site doesn't prove anything. The Ozarks are in Arkansas, Kansas, Missouri and Oklahoma. It'd be real nice if you'd stop being so biased toward Illinois and actually open your eyes and realize that there is much more to this country than just Illinois.
Wait .. the Ozarks extend into Kansas? News to me, unless they're stretching the Ozarks to include the Flint Hills.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 24, 2022, 10:55:17 AM
Wikipedia officially says you're wrong. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozarks)
Wikipedia isn't an official source of anything.
The map that is on the wikipedia page shows extreme SE Kansas being part of the Ozarks. Most of the Ozarks are of course in Missouri.
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 02:11:09 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 24, 2022, 10:55:17 AM
Wikipedia officially says you're wrong. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozarks)
Wikipedia isn't an official source of anything.
And neither is the bullshit Crash_It was sourcing. That was the point.
Quote from: Rothman on June 24, 2022, 01:16:07 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 24, 2022, 10:55:17 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 10:44:38 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 09:21:30 AM
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Yup it's official
https://www.illinoisozarks.com/ozark-tour/
There's also a debate as to whether the Knobstone escarpment in Indiana is actually part of the Appalachians.
Wikipedia officially says you're wrong. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozarks)
Remember that Crash_It hasn't been anywhere. Arguing with the ignorant just generates pity for the ignorant.
What do you mean I haven't been anywhere? I've been to Georgia, Indiana,Iowa, Kentucky, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri,Ohio, Tennessee and Wisconsin.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 07:25:48 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 24, 2022, 01:16:07 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 24, 2022, 10:55:17 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 10:44:38 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 09:21:30 AM
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Yup it's official
https://www.illinoisozarks.com/ozark-tour/
There's also a debate as to whether the Knobstone escarpment in Indiana is actually part of the Appalachians.
Wikipedia officially says you're wrong. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozarks)
Remember that Crash_It hasn't been anywhere. Arguing with the ignorant just generates pity for the ignorant.
What do you mean I haven't been anywhere? I've been to Georgia, Indiana,Iowa, Kentucky, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri,Ohio, Tennessee and Wisconsin.
You're also the guy who said that he saw everything he needed to see in Wisconsin on I-90 and I-94. Statements of the like coupled with a small states visited list tend scream "novice traveler."
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 07:25:48 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 24, 2022, 01:16:07 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 24, 2022, 10:55:17 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 10:44:38 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 09:21:30 AM
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Yup it's official
https://www.illinoisozarks.com/ozark-tour/
There's also a debate as to whether the Knobstone escarpment in Indiana is actually part of the Appalachians.
Wikipedia officially says you're wrong. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozarks)
Remember that Crash_It hasn't been anywhere. Arguing with the ignorant just generates pity for the ignorant.
What do you mean I haven't been anywhere? I've been to Georgia, Indiana,Iowa, Kentucky, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri,Ohio, Tennessee and Wisconsin.
A promising amateur?
Your statements exceed your actual experience.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 07:25:48 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 24, 2022, 01:16:07 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 24, 2022, 10:55:17 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 10:44:38 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 09:21:30 AM
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Yup it's official
https://www.illinoisozarks.com/ozark-tour/
There's also a debate as to whether the Knobstone escarpment in Indiana is actually part of the Appalachians.
Wikipedia officially says you're wrong. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozarks)
Remember that Crash_It hasn't been anywhere. Arguing with the ignorant just generates pity for the ignorant.
What do you mean I haven't been anywhere? I've been to Georgia, Indiana,Iowa, Kentucky, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri,Ohio, Tennessee and Wisconsin.
Why do you travel IL so extensively rather than going, oh I don't know, west of the Mississippi or east of Kentucky or south of Tennessee?
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 07:25:48 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 24, 2022, 01:16:07 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 24, 2022, 10:55:17 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 10:44:38 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 09:21:30 AM
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Yup it's official
https://www.illinoisozarks.com/ozark-tour/
There's also a debate as to whether the Knobstone escarpment in Indiana is actually part of the Appalachians.
Wikipedia officially says you're wrong. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozarks)
Remember that Crash_It hasn't been anywhere. Arguing with the ignorant just generates pity for the ignorant.
What do you mean I haven't been anywhere? I've been to Georgia, Indiana,Iowa, Kentucky, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri,Ohio, Tennessee and Wisconsin.
It's a start. Maybe not a whole lot compared to the average AARoads member, but a start nevertheless.
Quote from: dlsterner on June 24, 2022, 10:37:40 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 07:25:48 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 24, 2022, 01:16:07 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 24, 2022, 10:55:17 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 10:44:38 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 09:21:30 AM
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Yup it's official
https://www.illinoisozarks.com/ozark-tour/
There's also a debate as to whether the Knobstone escarpment in Indiana is actually part of the Appalachians.
Wikipedia officially says you're wrong. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozarks)
Remember that Crash_It hasn't been anywhere. Arguing with the ignorant just generates pity for the ignorant.
What do you mean I haven't been anywhere? I've been to Georgia, Indiana,Iowa, Kentucky, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri,Ohio, Tennessee and Wisconsin.
It's a start. Maybe not a whole lot compared to the average AARoads member, but a start nevertheless.
The issue isn't that Crash is starting to travel or a novice at it. The real problem is how he expects to be treated as an expert by default with no real credibility. Crash also seems to have convinced himself he can somehow convince others that he is an expert on road/travel-something. This is only worsened when Crash tries to distort information and opinions into what he touts as "fact."
So the question at hand is are we facing someone with a giant ego, someone who believes their own hype or someone just trying to fake it til he makes it? I doubt you'll get a serious answer from Crash though on whatever it might be. One thing is clear, this whole holy-Illinois/dash cam-bad driver shenanigans just isn't going to get him the mainstream acceptance he wants.
I haven't entered any new states in over 8 years now but I'm still at 31 states covered plus Washington, DC. With Indiana holding the title of most counties visited.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 24, 2022, 10:56:48 PM
Quote from: dlsterner on June 24, 2022, 10:37:40 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 07:25:48 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 24, 2022, 01:16:07 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on June 24, 2022, 10:55:17 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 10:44:38 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 24, 2022, 09:21:30 AM
Wait ... part of Illinois is considered to be in the Ozarks?
Is that some silly government definition like the one that puts Edmonson County, Ky., in Appalachia?
Yup it's official
https://www.illinoisozarks.com/ozark-tour/
There's also a debate as to whether the Knobstone escarpment in Indiana is actually part of the Appalachians.
Wikipedia officially says you're wrong. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozarks)
Remember that Crash_It hasn't been anywhere. Arguing with the ignorant just generates pity for the ignorant.
What do you mean I haven't been anywhere? I've been to Georgia, Indiana,Iowa, Kentucky, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri,Ohio, Tennessee and Wisconsin.
It's a start. Maybe not a whole lot compared to the average AARoads member, but a start nevertheless.
The issue isn't that Crash is starting to travel or a novice at it. The real problem is how he expects to be treated as an expert by default with no real credibility. Crash also seems to have convinced himself he can somehow convince others that he is an expert on road/travel-something. This is only worsened when Crash tries to distort information and opinions into what he touts as "fact."
So the question at hand is are we facing someone with a giant ego, someone who believes their own hype or someone just trying to fake it til he makes it? I doubt you'll get a serious answer from Crash though on whatever it might be. One thing is clear, this whole holy-Illinois/dash cam-bad driver shenanigans just isn't going to get him the mainstream acceptance he wants.
Like I said, his statements exceed his experience. Same thing.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 07:25:48 PM
What do you mean I haven't been anywhere? I've been to Georgia, Indiana,Iowa, Kentucky, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri,Ohio, Tennessee and Wisconsin.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ov4epAJRPMw
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 02:51:13 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 12:44:08 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
There's a reason Illinois was declared the funnest state in the Midwest. It's obvious that you haven't experienced much of Illinois.
Illinois has never been declared the funnest state in the Midwest by any serious talking person. And what makes you think I can't find anything like that or better in Michigan?
It's been declared the funnest state by again... wallethub
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Declaring Illinois to be "the funnest state in the Midwest" reminds me of that guy I worked with at Burger King who declared himself to be "the biggest gangsta in Purcell, Oklahoma" (pop. 5,884 at the time).
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 07:25:48 PM
What do you mean I haven't been anywhere? I've been to Georgia, Indiana,Iowa, Kentucky, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri,Ohio, Tennessee and Wisconsin.
Oh, he hasn't actually been to Illinois. That explains a lot, honestly.
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 30, 2022, 06:32:12 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 07:25:48 PM
What do you mean I haven't been anywhere? I've been to Georgia, Indiana,Iowa, Kentucky, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri,Ohio, Tennessee and Wisconsin.
Oh, he hasn't actually been to Illinois. That explains a lot, honestly.
:-D
Nice catch!
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 30, 2022, 06:32:12 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 02:51:13 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 12:44:08 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
There's a reason Illinois was declared the funnest state in the Midwest. It's obvious that you haven't experienced much of Illinois.
Illinois has never been declared the funnest state in the Midwest by any serious talking person. And what makes you think I can't find anything like that or better in Michigan?
It's been declared the funnest state by again... wallethub
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Declaring Illinois to be "the funnest state in the Midwest" reminds me of that guy I worked with at Burger King who declared himself to be "the biggest gangsta in Purcell, Oklahoma" (pop. 5,884 at the time).
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 07:25:48 PM
What do you mean I haven't been anywhere? I've been to Georgia, Indiana,Iowa, Kentucky, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri,Ohio, Tennessee and Wisconsin.
Oh, he hasn't actually been to Illinois. That explains a lot, honestly.
Those are states I've been to other than Illinois.
Quote from: Crash_It on June 30, 2022, 04:38:50 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 30, 2022, 06:32:12 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 02:51:13 AM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on June 23, 2022, 12:44:08 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 23, 2022, 12:39:01 AM
There's a reason Illinois was declared the funnest state in the Midwest. It's obvious that you haven't experienced much of Illinois.
Illinois has never been declared the funnest state in the Midwest by any serious talking person. And what makes you think I can't find anything like that or better in Michigan?
It's been declared the funnest state by again... wallethub
https://wallethub.com/edu/most-fun-states/34665
Declaring Illinois to be "the funnest state in the Midwest" reminds me of that guy I worked with at Burger King who declared himself to be "the biggest gangsta in Purcell, Oklahoma" (pop. 5,884 at the time).
Quote from: Crash_It on June 24, 2022, 07:25:48 PM
What do you mean I haven't been anywhere? I've been to Georgia, Indiana,Iowa, Kentucky, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri,Ohio, Tennessee and Wisconsin.
Oh, he hasn't actually been to Illinois. That explains a lot, honestly.
Those are states I've been to other than Illinois.
What's amusing to me is that you will go out of your way to retort to obviously harmless jokes like that. All the same, you won't answer some of the more difficult questions posed about some choice things you've said.