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Author Topic: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel  (Read 43326 times)

RoadPelican

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #75 on: April 25, 2019, 02:17:24 PM »

I remember getting a coupon for a free Pepsi at the tollbooth to use at the Pier Restaurant back in the 90's and Early 2000's, I think they stopped doing that 10-15 years ago.
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tolbs17

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #76 on: July 25, 2019, 02:37:19 AM »

So they are planning Chesapeake Channel as a tunnel and not a bridge which I thought might be in the alternatives analysis.  No longer a major Navy channel.

Hopefully they will find the needed funding long before 2035. 

But very welcome that they are now building Thimble Shoals.  Any word on whether this project includes a full rebab of the existing tunnel?
From everything I've seen, no word on rehabilitation of the current tunnel. It seems all the focus is on simply getting the new tunnel built.

I did notice an interesting design feature of the new tunnel. It wouldn't expand the existing islands, but rather shrink to a narrow footprint to retain the existing, then widen back out, then shrink again at the other island, then expand back out to the current bridges. This was done supposedly to reduce environmental impact from having to expand the island. It retains the current pier, which is to be renovated, but demolished the restaurant.

Here were some other proposals in the past which would have widened the island, and retained or constructed a new welcome center / restaurant. Notice the newer they are, the smaller footprint they have.

2015 proposal -


2016 proposal -


Current design -



Would that work for an I-97 or I-99? Because I was kinda hoping that it would get a second tunnel. Which is needed. I never go that way because I'm afraid to do so. I hate driving on long bridges.
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froggie

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #77 on: July 25, 2019, 06:25:02 AM »

^ Nobody is seriously considering an Interstate on the Eastern Shore, so your question is a bit moot.

There are long term plans for a second tunnel at the Chesapeake Channel, but that is not part of this project.  This project, if you read upthread, is just for a second tunnel at the Thimble Shoals Channel.
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tolbs17

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #78 on: July 25, 2019, 04:56:31 PM »

^ Nobody is seriously considering an Interstate on the Eastern Shore, so your question is a bit moot.

There are long term plans for a second tunnel at the Chesapeake Channel, but that is not part of this project.  This project, if you read upthread, is just for a second tunnel at the Thimble Shoals Channel.

Ah I see now. A second tunnel would become handy. Even though, i've hardly been on that highway before. I personally think it's scary to drive on, and a second tunnel would be ideal to eliminate two way traffic.
« Last Edit: July 26, 2019, 12:38:17 AM by mrhappy1261 »
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Alps

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #79 on: July 26, 2019, 12:26:49 AM »

^ Nobody is seriously considering an Interstate on the Eastern Shore, so your question is a bit moot.

There are long term plans for a second tunnel at the Chesapeake Channel, but that is not part of this project.  This project, if you read upthread, is just for a second tunnel at the Thimble Shoals Channel.

What? I thought it was clear that the two I-87s will be connected...

sprjus4

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #80 on: July 26, 2019, 12:34:34 AM »

^ Nobody is seriously considering an Interstate on the Eastern Shore, so your question is a bit moot.

There are long term plans for a second tunnel at the Chesapeake Channel, but that is not part of this project.  This project, if you read upthread, is just for a second tunnel at the Thimble Shoals Channel.

What? I thought it was clear that the two I-87s will be connected...
I can’t tell if you’re being sarcastic or not, but they’re not planned to be.
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Alps

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #81 on: July 26, 2019, 12:46:57 AM »

^ Nobody is seriously considering an Interstate on the Eastern Shore, so your question is a bit moot.

There are long term plans for a second tunnel at the Chesapeake Channel, but that is not part of this project.  This project, if you read upthread, is just for a second tunnel at the Thimble Shoals Channel.

What? I thought it was clear that the two I-87s will be connected...
I can’t tell if you’re being sarcastic or not, but they’re not planned to be.
I can't tell if I'm being sarcastic anymore. I just assume it's the base condition. But with I-87 going to Norfolk, it's a short connection to the CBBT, and then the other I-87 has an easy trip along I-278 and I-95 to NJ Turnpike, Del Mem Br, I-95, DE 1... and look how close they are!

tolbs17

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #82 on: July 26, 2019, 12:49:15 AM »

^ Nobody is seriously considering an Interstate on the Eastern Shore, so your question is a bit moot.

There are long term plans for a second tunnel at the Chesapeake Channel, but that is not part of this project.  This project, if you read upthread, is just for a second tunnel at the Thimble Shoals Channel.

What? I thought it was clear that the two I-87s will be connected...
I can’t tell if you’re being sarcastic or not, but they’re not planned to be.
I can't tell if I'm being sarcastic anymore. I just assume it's the base condition. But with I-87 going to Norfolk, it's a short connection to the CBBT, and then the other I-87 has an easy trip along I-278 and I-95 to NJ Turnpike, Del Mem Br, I-95, DE 1... and look how close they are!

If you hate driving on highways, then that's the route to go! Take US 17 and US 13!
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plain

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #83 on: July 26, 2019, 06:44:31 PM »

^ Nobody is seriously considering an Interstate on the Eastern Shore, so your question is a bit moot.

There are long term plans for a second tunnel at the Chesapeake Channel, but that is not part of this project.  This project, if you read upthread, is just for a second tunnel at the Thimble Shoals Channel.

What? I thought it was clear that the two I-87s will be connected...
I can’t tell if you’re being sarcastic or not, but they’re not planned to be.
I can't tell if I'm being sarcastic anymore. I just assume it's the base condition. But with I-87 going to Norfolk, it's a short connection to the CBBT, and then the other I-87 has an easy trip along I-278 and I-95 to NJ Turnpike, Del Mem Br, I-95, DE 1... and look how close they are!

The problem in this case would be VA. The routing will have to zigzag almost the entire length of Virginia's Eastern Shore, then once past the CBBT it would have to be really fancy to I-64.

Sarcasm would be your best bet here.
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sprjus4

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #84 on: July 26, 2019, 07:16:43 PM »

The problem in this case would be VA. The routing will have to zigzag almost the entire length of Virginia's Eastern Shore, then once past the CBBT it would have to be really fancy to I-64.

Sarcasm would be your best bet here.
US-13 in Virginia Beach would be relatively easy to upgrade, it's all limited-access, a few intersections, and two interchanges - until you reach Diamond Springs Rd. Good luck from there.
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vdeane

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #85 on: July 26, 2019, 09:02:37 PM »

Tight half diamond interchange at Diamond Springs Road leading to the existing road underneath an elevated viaduct.  Flyovers for the through traffic from the viaduct onto an overlap with I-64, utilize a modified form of the existing interchange for the rest.
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sprjus4

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #86 on: July 26, 2019, 09:17:04 PM »

Tight half diamond interchange at Diamond Springs Road leading to the existing road underneath an elevated viaduct.  Flyovers for the through traffic from the viaduct onto an overlap with I-64, utilize a modified form of the existing interchange for the rest.
Like I said, good luck!

There would likely also be a spike in traffic on I-64 due to the I-87 thru route, so you have to factor in how to deal with that added traffic. An expansion is needed at the I-64 / I-464 / US-17 (or would be I-87 South) / VA-168 interchange, though an expansion would be needed anyways with the current I-87 proposal, if it is to be the interstate highway from Hampton Roads to the south.
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Alps

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #87 on: July 26, 2019, 10:59:43 PM »

^ Nobody is seriously considering an Interstate on the Eastern Shore, so your question is a bit moot.

There are long term plans for a second tunnel at the Chesapeake Channel, but that is not part of this project.  This project, if you read upthread, is just for a second tunnel at the Thimble Shoals Channel.

What? I thought it was clear that the two I-87s will be connected...
I can’t tell if you’re being sarcastic or not, but they’re not planned to be.
I can't tell if I'm being sarcastic anymore. I just assume it's the base condition. But with I-87 going to Norfolk, it's a short connection to the CBBT, and then the other I-87 has an easy trip along I-278 and I-95 to NJ Turnpike, Del Mem Br, I-95, DE 1... and look how close they are!

The problem in this case would be VA. The routing will have to zigzag almost the entire length of Virginia's Eastern Shore, then once past the CBBT it would have to be really fancy to I-64.

Sarcasm would be your best bet here.
Indeed, the eastern shore is the hard part. I've come up with a relatively unobtrusive route but it does zag a lot and would have to take a few properties. It would take a lot more traffic wanting to use the shore route and clogging up existing 13 before this enters the realm of possibility.

sprjus4

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #88 on: July 26, 2019, 11:05:35 PM »

I've come up with a relatively unobtrusive route
What's the route?
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Alps

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #89 on: July 27, 2019, 12:09:54 AM »

I've come up with a relatively unobtrusive route
What's the route?
I drew it up. Come on over and I'll show it to you. But you could do it yourself - take an aerial and try to avoid anything that looks like a building.

J3ebrules

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #90 on: July 27, 2019, 12:18:45 AM »

Interesting to read this today after literally just arriving in VA beach after doing the NJ Delaware Memorial Bridge to DE 1 to US 113 to US 13 to the CBBT and wanting to scream the entire way through Delaware. Can someone explain why they won't run an interstate down the length of Delaware through all that nothing???
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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #91 on: July 27, 2019, 12:28:33 AM »

Interesting to read this today after literally just arriving in VA beach after doing the NJ Delaware Memorial Bridge to DE 1 to US 113 to US 13 to the CBBT and wanting to scream the entire way through Delaware. Can someone explain why they won't run an interstate down the length of Delaware through all that nothing???

The existing routing of US 13 takes up the straightest alignment as far as VA goes. A railroad and various towns and inlets make it difficult for an interstate highway to be routed through here.
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J3ebrules

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #92 on: July 27, 2019, 12:41:14 AM »

Interesting to read this today after literally just arriving in VA beach after doing the NJ Delaware Memorial Bridge to DE 1 to US 113 to US 13 to the CBBT and wanting to scream the entire way through Delaware. Can someone explain why they won't run an interstate down the length of Delaware through all that nothing???

The existing routing of US 13 takes up the straightest alignment as far as VA goes. A railroad and various towns and inlets make it difficult for an interstate highway to be routed through here.

Is that railroad still active? I saw the tracks but I couldn't tell.
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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #93 on: July 27, 2019, 12:56:54 AM »

Interesting to read this today after literally just arriving in VA beach after doing the NJ Delaware Memorial Bridge to DE 1 to US 113 to US 13 to the CBBT and wanting to scream the entire way through Delaware. Can someone explain why they won't run an interstate down the length of Delaware through all that nothing???

The existing routing of US 13 takes up the straightest alignment as far as VA goes. A railroad and various towns and inlets make it difficult for an interstate highway to be routed through here.

Is that railroad still active? I saw the tracks but I couldn't tell.

Yes and the southern end connects to a barge to Hampton Roads. Even if the railroad becomes abandoned there's still the towns and inlets along the way. There are a lot of small businesses and some homes along the way still.
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sprjus4

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #94 on: July 27, 2019, 01:04:38 AM »

IMO, the speed limit could easily be 60 mph for most of the stretch, a lot of parts even 65 mph. That would help a lot.
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tolbs17

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #95 on: July 27, 2019, 01:05:50 AM »

IMO, the speed limit could easily be 60 mph for most of the stretch, a lot of parts even 65 mph. That would help a lot.

I'm fine with southbound since the bridge is bigger. But northbound, is more scary IMO. i wish it was widened.
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Beltway

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #96 on: July 27, 2019, 01:06:44 AM »

Yes and the southern end connects to a barge to Hampton Roads. Even if the railroad becomes abandoned there's still the towns and inlets along the way. There are a lot of small businesses and some homes along the way still.

The Delmarva railroad will not be abandoned.  Virginia in particular spent a lot of public funding to keep it in operation.
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Alps

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #97 on: July 27, 2019, 01:11:52 AM »

Interesting to read this today after literally just arriving in VA beach after doing the NJ Delaware Memorial Bridge to DE 1 to US 113 to US 13 to the CBBT and wanting to scream the entire way through Delaware. Can someone explain why they won't run an interstate down the length of Delaware through all that nothing???

The existing routing of US 13 takes up the straightest alignment as far as VA goes. A railroad and various towns and inlets make it difficult for an interstate highway to be routed through here.
From the end of DE 1 freeway, there's a lot of open space down the middle of the state - some farms but a lot of forest. That routing would avoid disturbing the towns or inlets but would require a lot of new construction and ROW, environmental impacts, money. Upgrading 13 or 113 on the spot would be much cheaper but would impact towns much more and require a lot of frontage roads for farm access. I would favor a separate freeway alignment myself for those reasons. However, 13 and 113 are generally able to handle all the through traffic. It's 1 that gets clogged, and that's not really the way to route a through freeway.

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #98 on: July 27, 2019, 01:17:50 AM »

Interesting to read this today after literally just arriving in VA beach after doing the NJ Delaware Memorial Bridge to DE 1 to US 113 to US 13 to the CBBT and wanting to scream the entire way through Delaware. Can someone explain why they won't run an interstate down the length of Delaware through all that nothing???

The existing routing of US 13 takes up the straightest alignment as far as VA goes. A railroad and various towns and inlets make it difficult for an interstate highway to be routed through here.
From the end of DE 1 freeway, there's a lot of open space down the middle of the state - some farms but a lot of forest. That routing would avoid disturbing the towns or inlets but would require a lot of new construction and ROW, environmental impacts, money. Upgrading 13 or 113 on the spot would be much cheaper but would impact towns much more and require a lot of frontage roads for farm access. I would favor a separate freeway alignment myself for those reasons. However, 13 and 113 are generally able to handle all the through traffic. It's 1 that gets clogged, and that's not really the way to route a through freeway.

Agreed, but I was talking about the Virginia segment.
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sprjus4

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Re: Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel
« Reply #99 on: July 27, 2019, 01:18:06 AM »

IMO, the speed limit could easily be 60 mph for most of the stretch, a lot of parts even 65 mph. That would help a lot.

I'm fine with southbound since the bridge is bigger. But northbound, is more scary IMO. i wish it was widened.
I was referring to the surface sections of US-13 and US-113, not the bridge-tunnel.

The bridge-tunnel southbound span could reasonably have 60 mph, but there's no way they would change it in regards to safety reasons. 55 mph is appropriate on the northbound span until they widen the shoulders.
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