If you were to tier US holidays, how would you align them?
Here is how I would tier them:
Tier 1 (very few places open)
Christmas
Thanksgiving
Tier 2 (many/most service industry and retail places open; offices mostly closed)
New Year's Day
Memorial Day
Independence Day
Labor Day
Tier 3 (schools and government-related offices mostly closed; private sector offices tend to be open; retail universally open)
Martin Luther King Jr. Day - could be tier 2 in the near future
Presidents Day/Washington's Birthday
Tier 4 (schools generally open unless required to close by state law; most if not all private sector offices open; retail universally open)
Veterans Day
Columbus Day - not a state holiday in several states
Non-federal holidays and special events
Christmas Eve - tier 3 (tier 1 after 6pm)
New Year's Eve - tier 3 (tier 2 after 6pm)
Black Friday - tier 2/3
Good Friday - tier 3
Easter - tier 2 if it wasn't already on Sunday
Funeral of former president - tier 4
Funeral of sitting president - tier 2
Veterans Day is more tier 3, as there is no mail delivery on that day. I would also include the day after Christmas on the non-federal list as tier 4, especially when Christmas falls on a Thursday or Sunday.
Personally Columbus Day is one of my favorites because it isn't largely recognized as the others and people generally don't like to celebrate it. That gives me a chance to go do something outdoorsy while there is an early fall-to-winter transition relatively unabated by crowds.
Halloween – Tier 4
Valentine's Day – Tier 4
Election Day – Tier 4; Tier 2 if HR 1 passes
April Fool's Day – Tier 5
Thanksgiving should be in a tier 1.5. Last year, many of the big retail chain places around here didn't close for Thanksgiving, while a lot of smaller/local places did.
Christmas Day is the only true tier 1 holiday anymore.
Tier 1
Christmas
Easter
Thanksgiving
Independence Day
Tier 2
New Year
Labor Day
Memorial Day
Election Day
Tier 3
Veterans Day
MLK Jr Day
Presidents Day
Tier 4
Christmas Eve
New Year's Eve
Good Friday
Barely a holiday to begin with
Columbus Day
Halloween
Mothers Day
Fathers Day
Valentine's Day
Saint Patrick's Day
Quote from: jp the roadgeek on January 21, 2019, 11:16:01 AM
Veterans Day is more tier 3, as there is no mail delivery on that day. I would also include the day after Christmas on the non-federal list as tier 4, especially when Christmas falls on a Thursday or Sunday.
There is no mail delivery on any federal holiday.
Quote from: ftballfan on January 21, 2019, 11:04:48 AM
Tier 4 (schools generally open unless required to close by state law; most if not all private sector offices open; retail universally open)
Veterans Day
Columbus Day - not a state holiday in several states
I always got off for those (through high school - not for college). Still do, since I work for the state, and we get all the federal holidays plus floaters on Lincoln's Birthday and Election Day (we can take the holiday any work day from when the holiday happens to when it happens again the following year). At my last job, Columbus Day and Veterans Day were a floating holiday of a different variety - you could take one or the other, but not both (that job had off all the other federal holidays plus Black Friday).
Quote from: ftballfan on January 21, 2019, 11:04:48 AM
If you were to tier US holidays, how would you align them?
Here is how I would tier them:
Tier 1 (very few places open)
Christmas
Thanksgiving
Tier 2 (many/most service industry and retail places open; offices mostly closed)
New Year's Day
Memorial Day
Independence Day
Labor Day
Tier 3 (schools and government-related offices mostly closed; private sector offices tend to be open; retail universally open)
Martin Luther King Jr. Day - could be tier 2 in the near future
Presidents Day/Washington's Birthday
Tier 4 (schools generally open unless required to close by state law; most if not all private sector offices open; retail universally open)
Veterans Day
Columbus Day - not a state holiday in several states
Non-federal holidays and special events
Christmas Eve - tier 3 (tier 1 after 6pm)
New Year's Eve - tier 3 (tier 2 after 6pm)
Black Friday - tier 2/3
Good Friday - tier 3
Easter - tier 2 if it wasn't already on Sunday
Funeral of former president - tier 4
Funeral of sitting president - tier 2
I never have school on Veterans or Columbus day.
Columbus Day is pretty much irrelevant outside of the Northeast Corridor and possibly Chicago (another city with a large concentration of Italian-Americans; not everyone realizes that Italian heritage celebration is the main purpose of the day).
In Illinois, there is Casimir Pulaski Day celebrated as a state holiday.
In Massachusetts, Patriots Day is a state holiday, on the 3rd Monday in April. This has two purposes:
1. To celebrate the Patriots in the offseason Paul Revere's ride and the battles that followed.
2. In some years, it pushes Tax Day later.
Several State Governments has off on Election Day.
Good Friday is another confusing issue. Some Governments and Offices are closed, but many are open.
Black Friday is mainly an off day for offices, however some government offices are open, the opposite of what normally happens.
Quote from: MNHighwayMan on January 21, 2019, 12:01:38 PM
Thanksgiving should be in a tier 1.5. Last year, many of the big retail chain places around here didn't close for Thanksgiving, while a lot of smaller/local places did.
Around 'here'? This has been a national issue for about 5 years now.
We always had school on Veterans' Day, but most of us figured the day after Thanksgiving was a fair trade. We did get Columbus Day. The day we got that most people don't was Inauguration Day every four years. Led to a really short week when it fell in the same week as what was then called Lee-Jackson-King Day. (Lee-Jackson Day is still a state holiday, but it's now the Friday before King Day. Schools are open. Courts and government offices are closed.)
Quote from: 1995hoo on January 22, 2019, 07:36:15 AM
We always had school on Veterans' Day, but most of us figured the day after Thanksgiving was a fair trade. We did get Columbus Day. The day we got that most people don't was Inauguration Day every four years. Led to a really short week when it fell in the same week as what was then called Lee-Jackson-King Day. (Lee-Jackson Day is still a state holiday, but it's now the Friday before King Day. Schools are open. Courts and government offices are closed.)
Some schools don't have black friday off? That would make traveling a bitch.
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on January 22, 2019, 08:05:59 AM
Quote from: 1995hoo on January 22, 2019, 07:36:15 AM
We always had school on Veterans’ Day, but most of us figured the day after Thanksgiving was a fair trade. We did get Columbus Day. The day we got that most people don’t was Inauguration Day every four years. Led to a really short week when it fell in the same week as what was then called Lee-Jackson-King Day. (Lee-Jackson Day is still a state holiday, but it’s now the Friday before King Day. Schools are open. Courts and government offices are closed.)
Some schools don't have black friday off? That would make traveling a bitch.
I've never heard of a school not having Black Friday off.
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on January 22, 2019, 08:05:59 AM
Quote from: 1995hoo on January 22, 2019, 07:36:15 AM
We always had school on Veterans' Day, but most of us figured the day after Thanksgiving was a fair trade. We did get Columbus Day. The day we got that most people don't was Inauguration Day every four years. Led to a really short week when it fell in the same week as what was then called Lee-Jackson-King Day. (Lee-Jackson Day is still a state holiday, but it's now the Friday before King Day. Schools are open. Courts and government offices are closed.)
Some schools don't have black friday off? That would make traveling a bitch.
I said we got the day after Thanksgiving instead of Veterans' Day and most of us were reasonably happy with that trade. We also had two teacher workdays earlier in November. By the time I was in third grade, those always coincided with Election Day so they could use the cafeterias as polling places. I recall one year we had school on Election Day and they wanted us to eat in silence due to adults coming in to vote. That didn't work so well and it was part of what led to the teacher workday schedule being adjusted.
Interesting, in Indiana (at least on the state level,) Black Friday is actually celebrated as Lincoln's Birthday. And Washington's Birthday is celebrated on Christmas Eve or the day after Christmas (depending on when Christmas falls in the week.) As a result the state doesn't celebrate any holidays in February with President's Day being purely a school holiday. That is if we didn't have to make the day up due to a snow day.
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on January 22, 2019, 08:05:59 AM
Quote from: 1995hoo on January 22, 2019, 07:36:15 AM
We always had school on Veterans' Day, but most of us figured the day after Thanksgiving was a fair trade. We did get Columbus Day. The day we got that most people don't was Inauguration Day every four years. Led to a really short week when it fell in the same week as what was then called Lee-Jackson-King Day. (Lee-Jackson Day is still a state holiday, but it's now the Friday before King Day. Schools are open. Courts and government offices are closed.)
Some schools don't have black friday off? That would make traveling a bitch.
In GA, where I attended high school and college, not only were the schools closed on Black Friday, they were also closed the day before Thanksgiving.
I think this tiering is accurate. I currently work for a bank and we don't observe Presidents' Day, Columbus Day, or Veterans Day (most banks do), and Christmas Eve and New Year's Eve are not holidays, nor is Black Friday, but we do start with 25 days of PTO a year and you get a bump of about 3 days every 5 years (maxing out at 35), which I think is better than having a bunch of random holidays.
Despite the low ratings given here by some posters, Hallowe'en is right behind New Year's Eve as a party day. Then comes Super Bowl Sunday, followed by St. Patrick's Day. If you are living in Louisiana or along most of the Gulf Coast, Mardi Gras is one to peg the meter with.
Very low tier holidays not mentioned: Earth Day, Talk Like A Pirate Day, Arbor Day, Flag Day.
A holiday which faded away: VJ Day. Who would have thought something as important as the end of World War II and once was a holiday in many states, would just flat out disappear?
Utah has a statehood day holiday. You can buy and shoot off fireworks then.
Yom Kippur drifts around the calendar like Easter and Mardi Gras. For non-Christian holidays it rates highly in some parts of the USA. With few Moslems, Ramadan gets little mention here. No Hindu, Shinto, Buddhist or more minor religions make honorable mention here.
Political holidays: Election Day. In some states this would be an anti-holiday since the sale of liquor would be prohibited.
Groundhog Day: Such a good one they made a movie about it. Go see it again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again
Rick
The Commonwealth of Kentucky has 11 1/2 official holidays when state offices are closed in most years. That number increases to 12 1/2 in presidential election years, and also usually when a new governor is inaugurated in Frankfort (primarily because they have a big parade, and street closures tie up access to many offices.)
Those holidays are:
Jan. 1 and one extra day for New Years Day.
MLK Jr. Day.
Memorial Day.
Independence Day.
Labor Day.
Veterans Day.
Thanksgiving and the day after.
Dec. 25 and one extra day for Christmas.
The half-day is for Good Friday.
Kentucky has shuffled holidays around. When I started in state government, Columbus Day was no longer observed as a state holiday. My understanding was that it had been swapped for MLK Day some years prior. Presidents Day was observed but Veterans Day was not. Somewhere along the line, the decision was made to swap Veterans Day for Presidents Day. This means that there are three holidays every November, and every four years, four holidays whenever there is a presidential election.
My preference would be to observe Presidents Day but not Veterans Day, merely because there are already holidays in November but none in February, and it's a long stretch between January (MLK Day) and May (Memorial Day). I also think it's odd that Kentucky observes MLK Day but not Presidents Day,which is officially still known as Washington's birthday but is also generally considered to be an observation of Lincoln's birthday, too. Lincoln was Kentucky's only native-born president, and I would argue that he did more for the civil rights of blacks via the Emancipation Proclamation than MLK did through his ministry and protests.
I do know that West Virginia celebrates a holiday for the anniversary of its statehood.
I think its extremely unfair that workers in certain industries get these little BS holidays off, while workers in other industries don't.
Nobody celebrates National Aluminum Siding Week anymore.
Quote from: inkyatari on January 22, 2019, 12:04:12 PM
Nobody celebrates National Aluminum Siding Week anymore.
Perhaps you could change that.
In WV the state takes the federal holidays, plus "West Virginia Day", which is June 20, which means it always falls on the same day of the week as the 4th of July. Plus both the general election and the primary election (2nd Tuesday in May) in even numbered years. The state used to get Lincoln's Birthday and the governor would always give state workers the day after Thanksgiving off by proclamation. About 10 years ago they eliminated Lincoln's Birthday and made "black Friday" a legal holiday "in honor of Abraham Lincoln". State workers get a half day on Christmas Eve and New Year's Eve, if they are work days, but get no make up day like you do for the actual holiday if it hits on a weekend.
Until the early 80s, the state gave workers a "shopping day" which was a half day on a Wednesday in December, because stores did not keep late hours. The advent of malls made that obselete long before it was eliminated.
Back in the day, in the coal fields, union miners got John L. Lewis' birthday (April 1) and "Coal Miner's Vacation" because all of the mines would shut down at the same time (last week of June and first week of July). Both long gone now. Textile mills in the Carolinas also used to all shut down at the same time, which is why the Firecracker 400 was started, to draw them to Daytona for their week off.
As to the holidays in tiers, IMHO:
LEGAL
ONE
Christmas. About the only day the vast part of the country shuts down. Most everybody, regardless of religion, notices at least. 96% of people celebrate it in some way, according to polls.
Thanksgiving. Again, celebrated by most everybody. While cracks are appearing, most of the country is still shut down.
TWO
Memorial Day, 4th of July, and Labor Day. Most people get the day off, and they act as the start, mid-point, and finish of "summer" for many people.
New Year's Day. Most people off. Used to be bigger when the college football season actually ended then. Now it is just another day off with some ball games, not much different from any other Saturday during football season.
THREE
MLK Day, Washington's Birthday, Columbus Day, Veteran's Day. Government is shut down and people with an axe to grind that they can relate to the figure(s) involved open their yaps, but that is about all.
NON-LEGAL
ONE
Halloween. When I was a kid, Halloween was for kids and was one evening. This has moved up the charts big time, with people decorating for weeks ahead and adults having parties.
Super Sunday. Everybody, even people who don't like the NFL, watches the game, often at a party.
TWO
Mother's Day, and, although slightly lower Father's Day. Most people with a living parent will at least call and send a present, even if not living where they can visit.
Easter. This one has moved down, as Halloween has moved up (which might be a commentary on the country). Still, a lot of people celebrate the non-religious side with the bunny and the eggs for kids, and a lot of people only go to church that one Sunday.
THREE
St. Patrick's Day, and, in certain places, other days associated with other ethnic groups. Really only a thing in big cities, mostly, other than the "get drunk" part of St. Pat's and Cinco de Mayo. Most people in the USA cannot trace their ethnic group to any single European country any more, and most do not care. I certainly don't.
Valentine's Day. If you are not in a relationship, you still notice because it is impossible to get a table at any restaurant.
New Year's Eve. Many people have a party. Many people just go to bed.
Quote from: SP Cook on January 22, 2019, 12:30:10 PM
In WV the state takes the federal holidays, plus "West Virginia Day", which is June 20, which means it always falls on the same day of the week as the 4th of July.
Nearly every state has a random holiday like this. Illinois has Casimir Pulaski Day, DC has Emancipation Day, Massachusetts has Patriots Day. Some Southern states celebrate Robert E. Lee's birthday.
Quote from: abefroman329 on January 22, 2019, 12:33:04 PM
Quote from: SP Cook on January 22, 2019, 12:30:10 PM
In WV the state takes the federal holidays, plus "West Virginia Day", which is June 20, which means it always falls on the same day of the week as the 4th of July.
Nearly every state has a random holiday like this. Illinois has Casimir Pulaski Day, DC has Emancipation Day, Massachusetts has Patriots Day. Some Southern states celebrate Robert E. Lee's birthday.
Our adopted home state of Florida (which we moved to from New Jersey in late-September 2017) is one of those Southern states that does NOT celebrate Robert E. Lee's birthday–instead celebrating Jeff(erson) Davis' birthday. Coincidentally we have come to live in Winn-Dixie's home territory of Jacksonville, Florida (which it has been since November 1944, a grand total of almost 75 years–although it was once known as Winn & Lovett from November 1944 to 1955, when it merged with the Dixie Home Super Markets chain and took on the well-known Winn-Dixie name), which has been home to the Davis family (originally from Texas) that started what has become known as Winn-Dixie (they acquired a boatload of land around where we live in the Southside of Jacksonville, FL from the Skinner family of dairy, real estate, and turpentine fame, who still own and operate a considerable amount of land in and around the same general area as the Davis family) for the same amount of years as the supermarket chain itself.
Quote from: 1995hoo on January 22, 2019, 08:25:20 AM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on January 22, 2019, 08:05:59 AM
Quote from: 1995hoo on January 22, 2019, 07:36:15 AM
We always had school on Veterans' Day, but most of us figured the day after Thanksgiving was a fair trade. We did get Columbus Day. The day we got that most people don't was Inauguration Day every four years. Led to a really short week when it fell in the same week as what was then called Lee-Jackson-King Day. (Lee-Jackson Day is still a state holiday, but it's now the Friday before King Day. Schools are open. Courts and government offices are closed.)
Some schools don't have black friday off? That would make traveling a bitch.
I said we got the day after Thanksgiving instead of Veterans' Day and most of us were reasonably happy with that trade. We also had two teacher workdays earlier in November. By the time I was in third grade, those always coincided with Election Day so they could use the cafeterias as polling places. I recall one year we had school on Election Day and they wanted us to eat in silence due to adults coming in to vote. That didn't work so well and it was part of what led to the teacher workday schedule being adjusted.
Given that most schools get BOTH Black Friday and Veterans Day off, I'm not sure that was really a "trade". Most schools where I grew up also got the day before Thanksgiving off too, though my school district didn't for a long time because we got the Jewish holidays off. I think they eventually traded December 23 for the day before Thanksgiving or something.
Quote from: vdeane on January 22, 2019, 02:55:26 PM
Quote from: 1995hoo on January 22, 2019, 08:25:20 AM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on January 22, 2019, 08:05:59 AM
Quote from: 1995hoo on January 22, 2019, 07:36:15 AM
We always had school on Veterans' Day, but most of us figured the day after Thanksgiving was a fair trade. We did get Columbus Day. The day we got that most people don't was Inauguration Day every four years. Led to a really short week when it fell in the same week as what was then called Lee-Jackson-King Day. (Lee-Jackson Day is still a state holiday, but it's now the Friday before King Day. Schools are open. Courts and government offices are closed.)
Some schools don't have black friday off? That would make traveling a bitch.
I said we got the day after Thanksgiving instead of Veterans' Day and most of us were reasonably happy with that trade. We also had two teacher workdays earlier in November. By the time I was in third grade, those always coincided with Election Day so they could use the cafeterias as polling places. I recall one year we had school on Election Day and they wanted us to eat in silence due to adults coming in to vote. That didn't work so well and it was part of what led to the teacher workday schedule being adjusted.
Given that most schools get BOTH Black Friday and Veterans Day off, I'm not sure that was really a "trade". Most schools where I grew up also got the day before Thanksgiving off too, though my school district didn't for a long time because we got the Jewish holidays off. I think they eventually traded December 23 for the day before Thanksgiving or something.
"Most" get both? Not around here they don't. At least in my lifetime, none of the school systems here ever gave Veterans' Day as a holiday. Our relatives in Florida don't get it either.
Quote from: inkyatari on January 22, 2019, 12:04:12 PM
Nobody celebrates National Aluminum Siding Week anymore.
I mean to. But who has the time?
The bank I do business with is open on MLK Jr. Day, but is closed on Veterans Day. Growing up, I never had MLK, Columbus, or Veterans Day off (Presidents' Day varied; some years we'd have it off but others we'd have school).
At my last full time job (non-government, but our main client was the Department of Defense), we just had the federal holidays off, which meant days like Black Friday and Christmas Eve (when it fell on a workday) were work days (Christmas Eve was a Sunday the year I worked there). At a previous office job, we had the following days off:
New Years' Day
Memorial Day
Independence Day
Labor Day
Thanksgiving
Black Friday
Christmas Eve (Christmas fell on a Thursday one of the years I was there, so that year Christmas Eve was a workday and this holiday was moved to the 26th)
Christmas Day
IMHO, the Veterans Day holiday should be moved to Election Day in even-numbered years (or the elections moved to Veterans Day).
Brandon, I take it you're a Lions fan. Forward down the field!
MLK Day still isn't a holiday in some states, and in others, it's shared with Robert E. Lee's birthday.
The worst was the decade I worked for law firms, since just because it was a firm holiday didn't mean I didn't have to come in and work. Same for weekends. And snow/inclement weather days.
For most of the NJ State Worker Unions, Lincoln's Birthday was removed as a state holiday a number of years ago. In November, we take off Election Day, but have to work on Black Friday. Many people seem to support switching Election Day with Black Friday, but the Union Leaders don't want to change that for whatever reason.
For decades, the Governor granted state workers a paid holiday on Black Friday anyway, but that ended with the Corzine administration a number of years ago.
On another somewhat related subject - I noticed a few Facebook friends this year complaining that their kids had to go back to school January 2nd. They asked why do they have to go back the day after a holiday? (And after they already had 1 1/2 weeks off). Why not January 3rd? Or why not January 7th (the following Monday)? I was in awe that some of these parents didn't seem to think that, well, everyone else works come January 2nd, so that would present some issues with kids staying home. Not to mention pushing the school year further into the summer. And I'm sure these same parents are complaining come June that it's so hot out and why does the school year end so late.
Quote from: abefroman329 on January 23, 2019, 09:28:01 AM
MLK Day still isn't a holiday in some states, and in others, it's shared with Robert E. Lee's birthday.
The worst was the decade I worked for law firms, since just because it was a firm holiday didn't mean I didn't have to come in and work. Same for weekends. And snow/inclement weather days.
What the heck is a shared MLK day/Robert E Lee day called? "Seeing both sides day?"
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on January 23, 2019, 09:42:40 AM
Quote from: abefroman329 on January 23, 2019, 09:28:01 AM
MLK Day still isn't a holiday in some states, and in others, it's shared with Robert E. Lee's birthday.
The worst was the decade I worked for law firms, since just because it was a firm holiday didn't mean I didn't have to come in and work. Same for weekends. And snow/inclement weather days.
What the heck is a shared MLK day/Robert E Lee day called? "Seeing both sides day?"
In Arkansas it was literally "MLK Day/Lee Day."
I think that giving neither MLK nor Robert E. Lee a holiday is better than trying to split the baby.
Quote from: abefroman329 on January 23, 2019, 10:56:08 AM
In Arkansas it was literally "MLK Day/Lee Day."
I think that giving neither MLK nor Robert E. Lee a holiday is better than trying to split the baby.
That's where Virginia wound up. A black Democratic governor successfully pushed for addition of an MLK holiday, combined with the existing Lee/Jackson holiday so state workers wouldn't get more time off. One of his white Republican successors concluded that the combined holiday didn't work, and got the Lee/Jackson holiday moved back to the Friday preceding the MLK holiday, even though that meant a four-day weekend for state workers.
Quote from: oscar on January 23, 2019, 11:19:41 AM
Quote from: abefroman329 on January 23, 2019, 10:56:08 AM
In Arkansas it was literally "MLK Day/Lee Day."
I think that giving neither MLK nor Robert E. Lee a holiday is better than trying to split the baby.
That's where Virginia wound up. A black Democratic governor successfully pushed for addition of an MLK holiday, combined with the existing Lee/Jackson holiday so state workers wouldn't get more time off. One of his white Republican successors concluded that the combined holiday didn't work, add got the Lee/Jackson holiday moved back to the Friday preceding the MLK holiday, even though that meant a four-day weekend for state workers.
It looks like Arkansas moved "Lee Day" to the second Saturday in October (which appears to coincide with Columbus Day). Also, what is known as Washington's Birthday at the federal level (Jesus fucking Christ is this forum ever pedantic) is "George Washington's Birthday and Daisy Gatson Bates Day," the latter being an Arkansan civil rights activist. Which appears to be even more baby-splitting: Omit any mention of Lincoln, but replace him with a civil rights activist.
Quote from: abefroman329 on January 23, 2019, 11:26:28 AM
Quote from: oscar on January 23, 2019, 11:19:41 AM
Quote from: abefroman329 on January 23, 2019, 10:56:08 AM
In Arkansas it was literally "MLK Day/Lee Day."
I think that giving neither MLK nor Robert E. Lee a holiday is better than trying to split the baby.
That's where Virginia wound up. A black Democratic governor successfully pushed for addition of an MLK holiday, combined with the existing Lee/Jackson holiday so state workers wouldn't get more time off. One of his white Republican successors concluded that the combined holiday didn't work, add got the Lee/Jackson holiday moved back to the Friday preceding the MLK holiday, even though that meant a four-day weekend for state workers.
It looks like Arkansas moved "Lee Day" to the second Saturday in October (which appears to coincide with Columbus Day). Also, what is known as President's Day at the federal level is "George Washington's Birthday and Daisy Gatson Bates Day," the latter being an Arkansan civil rights activist. Which appears to be even more baby-splitting: Omit any mention of Lincoln, but replace him with a civil rights activist.
Maybe they think of Lincoln as too "foreign"
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on January 23, 2019, 11:59:17 AM
Quote from: abefroman329 on January 23, 2019, 11:26:28 AM
Quote from: oscar on January 23, 2019, 11:19:41 AM
Quote from: abefroman329 on January 23, 2019, 10:56:08 AM
In Arkansas it was literally "MLK Day/Lee Day."
I think that giving neither MLK nor Robert E. Lee a holiday is better than trying to split the baby.
That's where Virginia wound up. A black Democratic governor successfully pushed for addition of an MLK holiday, combined with the existing Lee/Jackson holiday so state workers wouldn't get more time off. One of his white Republican successors concluded that the combined holiday didn't work, add got the Lee/Jackson holiday moved back to the Friday preceding the MLK holiday, even though that meant a four-day weekend for state workers.
It looks like Arkansas moved "Lee Day" to the second Saturday in October (which appears to coincide with Columbus Day). Also, what is known as President's Day at the federal level is "George Washington's Birthday and Daisy Gatson Bates Day," the latter being an Arkansan civil rights activist. Which appears to be even more baby-splitting: Omit any mention of Lincoln, but replace him with a civil rights activist.
Maybe they think of Lincoln as too "foreign"
154 years on, and there's still some butthurt down there.
Quote from: Brandon on January 23, 2019, 12:04:51 PM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on January 23, 2019, 11:59:17 AM
Quote from: abefroman329 on January 23, 2019, 11:26:28 AM
Quote from: oscar on January 23, 2019, 11:19:41 AM
Quote from: abefroman329 on January 23, 2019, 10:56:08 AM
In Arkansas it was literally "MLK Day/Lee Day."
I think that giving neither MLK nor Robert E. Lee a holiday is better than trying to split the baby.
That's where Virginia wound up. A black Democratic governor successfully pushed for addition of an MLK holiday, combined with the existing Lee/Jackson holiday so state workers wouldn't get more time off. One of his white Republican successors concluded that the combined holiday didn't work, add got the Lee/Jackson holiday moved back to the Friday preceding the MLK holiday, even though that meant a four-day weekend for state workers.
It looks like Arkansas moved "Lee Day" to the second Saturday in October (which appears to coincide with Columbus Day). Also, what is known as President's Day at the federal level is "George Washington's Birthday and Daisy Gatson Bates Day," the latter being an Arkansan civil rights activist. Which appears to be even more baby-splitting: Omit any mention of Lincoln, but replace him with a civil rights activist.
Maybe they think of Lincoln as too "foreign"
154 years on, and there's still some butthurt down there.
That's what she said. :bigass:
BTW, it is a myth that the federal name of the February holiday is "President's Day". The law was changed in 1968, coming into effect in 1971, and both Johnson and Nixon used the term "President's Day", but the Uniform Monday Holiday Act calls it "George Washington's Birthday". Lincoln's Birthday was never a federal holiday.
The name of the holiday is Presidents' (plural possessive) Day in NM, ND, OK, PA, PR, SD, TX, VT, and WA; President's (singular possessive) in AK, ID, MD, MA, NE, NH, TN WV and WY; Presidents (plural, not possive) Day in NV, NJ, and OR; Washington's Birthday and President's Day in ME; Lincoln/Washington/Presidents' Day in AZ; George Washington Day in VA; Washington's Birthday in IL, IA, MI, LA, and NY; Lincoln's and Washington's Birthday in MT; Washington-Lincoln Day in CO and OH; Washington and Lincoln Day in MN; George Washington/Thomas Jefferson Birthday in AL; and, as noted above, George Washington's Birthday and Daisy Gatson Bates Day in AR. In California it is "The third Monday in February". CA lists some holidays by name, including ones you might think not like Columbus Day, but just gives a date for others. Weird.
Veterans Day was included in the Monday deal from 1971 to 77, when it was put back an 11/11 at the request of the VFW. With WWI now over 100 years and all of its veterans now dead and the day thus used to honor veterans of later conflicts for whom 11/11 has no meaning, I would not mind moving it back to a Monday.
OT Politics. Back in the day, democrats would celebrate Jefferson-Jackson Day with a fundraiser dinner. Usually near the time of the Battle of New Orleans, but they would fudge to get a speaker. Around here they started calling it "Roosevelt-Kennedy Day" a couple years ago. The Republican equivalent used to be "Lincoln Day" which was usually near Lincoln's Birthday, but likewise fudge-able. Now the local GOP is calling it Lincoln-Reagan Day. Reagan was also born in February.
Quote from: SP Cook on January 23, 2019, 02:38:04 PM
OT Politics. Back in the day, democrats would celebrate Jefferson-Jackson Day with a fundraiser dinner. Usually near the time of the Battle of New Orleans, but they would fudge to get a speaker. Around here they started calling it "Roosevelt-Kennedy Day" a couple years ago. The Republican equivalent used to be "Lincoln Day" which was usually near Lincoln's Birthday, but likewise fudge-able. Now the local GOP is calling it Lincoln-Reagan Day. Reagan was also born in February.
It used to be Lincoln Day here, too, but has increasingly become Lincoln-Reagan Day. I don't think it has as much to do with both being born in February as it does with highlighting Regan's importance to the modern-day GOP.
Quote from: ftballfan on January 23, 2019, 09:18:45 AM
The bank I do business with is open on MLK Jr. Day
Interesting. I have long heard that the reason banks take federal holidays off is because if they are open on a federal holiday, and get robbed, FDIC will not cover losses. Before my local bank started absorbing other banks and becoming more of a regional bank, it epitomized the exact opposite of what's commonly called bankers' hours. They opened early, stayed open late, and took only a minimum of holidays when banks in other places were closed. Yet it's always closed for MLK Day since it became a federal holiday, and we don't have a significant black population in this community or among the customer base.
My current employer has seven paid holidays:
New Year's Day
MLK Day
Memorial Day
Independence Day
Labor Day
Thanksgiving Day
Christmas Day.
It was nice a few years ago when the holiday for Christmas, New Year's and MLK Day hit in three consecutive biweekly pay checks. Now Christmas and New Year's fall in the same pay period. As a hotel that is open 24/7/365, someone is always working, holiday or not. Our part-time employees get paid time and a half if they work the day of a holiday, and full-timers get an extra day's pay on that check for the day, regardless if they worked the actual day or not. Depending on the schedule, they can earn up to 48 hours of pay at straight time in a holiday week if they work 40 hours. Salaried managers get to take an extra day off within two weeks of either side of the actual holiday.
It's not really an "extra" paycheck if you're salaried. You get 26 paychecks a year if you're paid biweekly vs. 24 if you're paid semi-monthly, but you get paid the same amount of money for the year.
Quote from: hbelkins on January 23, 2019, 07:12:50 PM
Quote from: ftballfan on January 23, 2019, 09:18:45 AM
The bank I do business with is open on MLK Jr. Day
Interesting. I have long heard that the reason banks take federal holidays off is because if they are open on a federal holiday, and get robbed, FDIC will not cover losses.
That wouldn't even make sense. FDIC covers each holdings one has in each account category to $250,000. FDIC insurance has nothing to do with the money in the till or the vault.
There's no law or rule that banks must be closed on federal holidays. Many do because the Federal Reserve is closed, but even then that's more of an excuse than a rule. The Federal Reserve is also closed on Saturdays, when most banks are open, and on Sunday, when some banks are open.
Correct. The FDIC is a government run pool insurance against bank failures, which in simple terms means a bank having loaned too much to deadbeats that won't pay it back to cover the deposits. It really does not have anything to do with the actual physical cash in the vault, which, if insured at all, would be covered by private casualty insurance.
Probably most banks do not bother, because, in modern times, the amount of actual cash on hand is really not that much at all. It is 99% 1s and 0s in a computer file. Your local Wal-Mart has WAY more cash on hand than your local bank.
Also, the USPS now delivers Amazon packages and Express Mail on most federal holidays (with Priority Mail in some areas), exceptions normally being New Years Day, Fourth of July, Thanksgiving, and Christmas.
Quote from: abefroman329 on January 24, 2019, 08:13:07 AM
It's not really an "extra" paycheck if you're salaried. You get 26 paychecks a year if you're paid biweekly vs. 24 if you're paid semi-monthly, but you get paid the same amount of money for the year.
No, but where I've worked on salary, I've gotten to take one extra day off for the holiday without using personal or vacation time. Instead of working 10 days per pay period to earn my salary, I only need to work 9 (or with the Christmas/New Year's combo in the same period, only 8) to earn that pay.
Mardi Gras is tier 1 holiday in Louisiana. For the other 49 states, it's a tier 6.
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on January 23, 2019, 09:42:40 AM
What the heck is a shared MLK day/Robert E Lee day called? "Seeing both sides day?"
I grew up in Memphis. We had a local MLK holiday years before the federal holiday was created. However, the local holiday was in April, and was a commemoration of his assassination and its importance in the Civil Rights movement...and so that interested families could join in the observances downtown.
The year that MLK day became a federal holiday, the local public schools ended up having two MLK days. The local observance in April had already been placed on the school calendar and political pressure precluded removing it; and political pressure also precluded not recognizing the new federal holiday in January.
A few locals, annoyed by there being two MLK days that year, chose to refer to the January observance by the name of the old state holiday: "Robert E. Lee Day".
I believe standard practice is to refer to the holiday by one name or the other...but usually not both.
Quote from: MikeTheActuary on January 30, 2019, 11:27:12 AMI believe standard practice is to refer to the holiday by one name or the other...but usually not both.
The sign I saw at a public library in Arkansas in 2014 read "Closed Monday for MLK Day/Lee Day"
Sports talk sequestered to https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=24378.0
Today is National Bubble Gum Day.
Quote from: bandit957 on February 01, 2019, 04:28:59 PM
Today is National Bubble Gum Day.
Then, by all means, bubble away.
Quote from: Scott5114 on January 30, 2019, 05:01:05 PM
Sports talk sequestered to https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=24378.0
Why is that other thread still titled 'US holidays by tiers'?
Confusing.
Quote from: kphoger on February 01, 2019, 04:40:05 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on January 30, 2019, 05:01:05 PM
Sports talk sequestered to https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=24378.0
Why is that other thread still titled 'US holidays by tiers'?
Confusing.
Because I couldn't figure out an overarching theme for it other than "sports stuff that doesn't need to be clogging up a non-sports thread".
Quote from: Scott5114 on February 02, 2019, 03:15:20 PM
Quote from: kphoger on February 01, 2019, 04:40:05 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on January 30, 2019, 05:01:05 PM
Sports talk sequestered to https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=24378.0
Why is that other thread still titled 'US holidays by tiers'?
Confusing.
Because I couldn't figure out an overarching theme for it other than "sports stuff that doesn't need to be clogging up a non-sports thread".
You could have just left it alone.
Quote from: SSOWorld on February 02, 2019, 06:00:43 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on February 02, 2019, 03:15:20 PM
Quote from: kphoger on February 01, 2019, 04:40:05 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on January 30, 2019, 05:01:05 PM
Sports talk sequestered to https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=24378.0
Why is that other thread still titled 'US holidays by tiers'?
Confusing.
Because I couldn't figure out an overarching theme for it other than "sports stuff that doesn't need to be clogging up a non-sports thread".
You could have just left it alone.
That's what she said. :bigass:
Quote from: SSOWorld on February 02, 2019, 06:00:43 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on February 02, 2019, 03:15:20 PM
Quote from: kphoger on February 01, 2019, 04:40:05 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on January 30, 2019, 05:01:05 PM
Sports talk sequestered to https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=24378.0
Why is that other thread still titled 'US holidays by tiers'?
Confusing.
Because I couldn't figure out an overarching theme for it other than "sports stuff that doesn't need to be clogging up a non-sports thread".
You could have just left it alone.
I could have, but it is part of our mandate to separate such threads, so that those who are interested in the original topic can participate in the discussion without being interrupted by something they don't care about.
Quote from: Scott5114 on February 03, 2019, 03:02:50 AM
those who are interested in the original topic can participate in the discussion without being interrupted by something they don't care about.
Except I can't, because now my "Unread Posts" list has two different topics named "US holidays by tiers," so I still end up following both discussions anyway.
Quote from: kphoger on February 03, 2019, 03:36:57 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on February 03, 2019, 03:02:50 AM
those who are interested in the original topic can participate in the discussion without being interrupted by something they don't care about.
Except I can't, because now my "Unread Posts" list has two different topics named "US holidays by tiers," so I still end up following both discussions anyway.
The other one is called "
Re: US holidays by tiers".
Quote from: kphoger on February 03, 2019, 03:36:57 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on February 03, 2019, 03:02:50 AM
those who are interested in the original topic can participate in the discussion without being interrupted by something they don't care about.
Except I can't, because now my "Unread Posts" list has two different topics named "US holidays by tiers," so I still end up following both discussions anyway.
Point taken; I don't use that feature. I...tried to make it better?
Quote from: Scott5114 on February 05, 2019, 04:25:05 AM
Quote from: kphoger on February 03, 2019, 03:36:57 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on February 03, 2019, 03:02:50 AM
those who are interested in the original topic can participate in the discussion without being interrupted by something they don't care about.
Except I can't, because now my "Unread Posts" list has two different topics named "US holidays by tiers," so I still end up following both discussions anyway.
Point taken; I don't use that feature. I...tried to make it better?
"Sports and holidays"
There's your new topic name.
Growing up, I generally had school on all four of the minor federal holidays (MLK, Presidents, Columbus, and Veterans) but always had Good Friday off (even when it didn't fall during Spring Break; if Good Friday fell during Spring Break, either the Friday before Spring Break or the Monday following would also be a day off). Also, when my parents were growing up, they remember most business closing between noon and 3pm on Good Friday (for example, being open 9am-noon and then 3pm-6pm)
Quote from: ftballfan on February 13, 2019, 10:34:51 PM
Growing up, I generally had school on all four of the minor federal holidays (MLK, Presidents, Columbus, and Veterans) but always had Good Friday off (even when it didn't fall during Spring Break; if Good Friday fell during Spring Break, either the Friday before Spring Break or the Monday following would also be a day off). Also, when my parents were growing up, they remember most business closing between noon and 3pm on Good Friday (for example, being open 9am-noon and then 3pm-6pm)
When did summer break start/end?
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on February 14, 2019, 08:03:05 AM
Quote from: ftballfan on February 13, 2019, 10:34:51 PM
Growing up, I generally had school on all four of the minor federal holidays (MLK, Presidents, Columbus, and Veterans) but always had Good Friday off (even when it didn't fall during Spring Break; if Good Friday fell during Spring Break, either the Friday before Spring Break or the Monday following would also be a day off). Also, when my parents were growing up, they remember most business closing between noon and 3pm on Good Friday (for example, being open 9am-noon and then 3pm-6pm)
When did summer break start/end?
Summer break usually started in early June (there were a few years where we got out in late May) and school usually started back up the Tuesday after Labor Day. Then again, our school only got two days off at Thanksgiving, 8-10 weekdays off for Christmas break depending on when Christmas fell, and a week for Spring Break (usually starting on the last Monday in March). Some schools in Michigan (especially in the Detroit area) get the third week of February off and have Spring Break later in April, but summer break doesn't start there until around June 15-20.
When I was very young, we usually got Presidents Day, Columbus Day, and Veterans Day off, but those were gradually chipped away at, and they were gone by the time I graduated. Sometimes we had to go on Memorial Day too, because of some excuse our school district came up with. MLK Day wasn't an official holiday yet when I started school, but we were never off school on MLK Day after it became one.
Also, we were always the first to go back to school in August, and the last to get out in June.
Believe me, if there was a way to make us go to school on any day, they'd find it.
The thought of having to go to school on Memorial Day is bizarre–in Oklahoma, school lets out for the year before then.
Quote from: Scott5114 on February 19, 2019, 05:23:11 PM
The thought of having to go to school on Memorial Day is bizarre–in Oklahoma, school lets out for the year before then.
Wow we stay in school til at least June 13th, sometimes as late as the 28th depending on snow days.
^^ The school year like starts in early August on OK (regional preference) while schools in other regions start the school year in early September, notably the day after Labor Day.
The way I've always understood it, an extremely late school year (like what RGT describes above) is common in the Northeast but not really anywhere else. My cousins in Massachusetts always had a schedule like that.
Growing up in Utah, a typical school year ran from late August to early June. I know we'd get Labor Day, MLK, Presidents, and Memorial Day off. Veterans Day was never a school holiday, and Columbus Day usually wasn't either -- though I think we got it off one year for some reason.
I stopped getting Presidents' Day off in college. I had forgot the holiday even existed when one of my classmates asked a professor if we had it off.
In my Central Indiana school district President's Day was a holiday depending on the snow day situation. There were years when I was off on that day and years where I had to go to school to make up a snow day. This year so far they had to make up both MLK Day and President's Day for snow days.
As for summer vacation if I ever went to school in June it was for the first two or three days at most. From middle school on school ALWAYS ended right before Memorial Day and thusly began in mid August. I always wondered if the Indianapolis 500 had something to do with making sure that Memorial Day was part of the summer vacation. Starting school after Labor Day is a foreign concept to me as I was always in school at least two weeks before that holiday if not sooner. Now my school district (years after me graduating) have school begin in LATE JULY. They at least do get two-week long Fall, Winter and Spring breaks.
The Campbell County Schools always started earlier and ended later than the Covington Schools did, though Covington was the higher performing school district. I went to the Covington schools my senior year, I remember it being Labor Day and still not knowing when school was supposed to start.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on February 19, 2019, 07:13:10 PM
I stopped getting Presidents' Day off in college. I had forgot the holiday even existed when one of my classmates asked a professor if we had it off.
It doesn't exist. The holiday in question is properly called Washington's Birthday.
A number of schools in my area had Presidents Day (or, as noted above, still legally called Washington's Birthday) scheduled off, but then had classes because of snow days earlier in the year. And then, a number of districts ended up canceling classes for the rest of the week due to illness.
No one really complained about going to school on Presidents Day. However, if they had used MLK Day as a makeup day, the howls of protest would be loud and numerous.
Quote from: hbelkins on February 20, 2019, 02:25:38 PM
A number of schools in my area had Presidents Day (or, as noted above, still legally called Washington's Birthday) scheduled off, but then had classes because of snow days earlier in the year. And then, a number of districts ended up canceling classes for the rest of the week due to illness.
No one really complained about going to school on Presidents Day. However, if they had used MLK Day as a makeup day, the howls of protest would be loud and numerous.
President's Day is the first day of February Break here.
Why is it called Washington's Birthday when the holiday cannot fall on the 22nd?
With the rise of MLK Day, some colleges have extended their Christmas break until after that day (either starting on the Tuesday of that week or the following Monday). In Michigan, all of the public colleges have MLK Day off but none of them have Columbus, Veterans, or Presidents' Day off (Columbus Day isn't a state holiday in MI and has never been one AFAIK).
I have some minor changes to the federal holiday system:
1. Eliminate the Columbus Day holiday (almost all private sector businesses are open; this is also the only federal holiday the stock market is open on)
2. Either (a) move the elections to Veterans Day or (b) move the Veterans Day holiday to Election Day (in even-numbered years; in odd-numbered years, Veterans Day would remain on November 11)
3. To keep the # of federal holidays at 10, I would either make Good Friday, Black Friday, or Christmas Eve federal holidays (the latter two are already state holidays in Michigan)
We should really have more federal holidays.
Quote from: ftballfan on February 20, 2019, 05:46:49 PM
(in even-numbered years; in odd-numbered years, Veterans Day would remain on November 11)
VA, NJ, LA, MS, and KY disagree.
Quote from: 1 on February 20, 2019, 06:52:39 PM
Quote from: ftballfan on February 20, 2019, 05:46:49 PM
(in even-numbered years; in odd-numbered years, Veterans Day would remain on November 11)
VA, NJ, LA, MS, and KY disagree.
Then you have vote-by-mail states like Oregon (and others, present or future), for which messing with the Veterans Day holiday or adding a new Election Day holiday would not help with voter turnout.
Quote from: ftballfan on February 20, 2019, 05:46:49 PM
I have some minor changes to the federal holiday system:
1. Eliminate the Columbus Day holiday (almost all private sector businesses are open; this is also the only federal holiday the stock market is open on)
2. Either (a) move the elections to Veterans Day or (b) move the Veterans Day holiday to Election Day (in even-numbered years; in odd-numbered years, Veterans Day would remain on November 11)
3. To keep the # of federal holidays at 10, I would either make Good Friday, Black Friday, or Christmas Eve federal holidays (the latter two are already state holidays in Michigan)
Why not just move the Columbus Day holiday to Election Day (which, by the way, does in fact occur in all years, not just the even-numbered ones)? Seems simpler and accomplishes the same goal.
I'd miss my three day weekends if Columbus Day was no longer a holiday. Veterans Day has always struck me as being rather close to Thanksgiving for having another day off, though it was useful for route clinching last year since it generated a three day weekend.
Oddly enough, in college, Presidents Day is one of the only holidays we specifically got off (Thanksgiving being the other; everything else was either between semesters or we had classes - yes, we even had class on Labor Day), with a three day break (offset by starting the spring semester on a Thursday; the three day break for Thanksgiving was offset by a two day break in late September; the only other break was "spring break" in mid-March).
There's the Big Six that I get paid at work for: NYD, Memorial Day, July 4, Labor Day, Thanksgiving, Christmas.
Then there are government holidays where the mail doesn't run: MLK, Presidents Day, Columbus Day, Veterans Day, etc. That's the second level.
Then there are holidays with noble purposes (Valentines, Mother's Day, etc.); holidays that are excuses to get drunk (St. Patrick's, Cinco de Mayo, Halloween etc.) and finally, holidays for which you don't know why it's a holiday at all (Groundhog Day), the lowest tier of all.