Daylight Savings Time (2022): Once And For All!!!

[webny99]

Something I've proposed before is a "split the difference" solution: Advance all current time zones by 30 minutes and be done with it. Bully if Canada and Mexico join us. This would eliminate clock changes, but if we advance by only 30 minutes, it mitigates a lot of the "kids in the dark waiting for the school bus" wailing in the winter. And as others point out, a +30 minute time zone is not unheard of worldwide.

It's not unheard of, but it would get really annoying and unnecessarily complicated for those of us who need to make UTC conversions rapidly multiple times a day.

How many really need to do that though? And if it's one and done, I would think you would get used to the same differences pretty quick.

I find myself "calculating" what time it is in the other time zones at least several times a day, and not just for work-related purposes.. even just for friends/family that live in other time zones.

[hotdogPi]

The Wikipedia community also uses UTC.

[NWI_Irish96]

Something I've proposed before is a "split the difference" solution: Advance all current time zones by 30 minutes and be done with it. Bully if Canada and Mexico join us. This would eliminate clock changes, but if we advance by only 30 minutes, it mitigates a lot of the "kids in the dark waiting for the school bus" wailing in the winter. And as others point out, a +30 minute time zone is not unheard of worldwide.

It's not unheard of, but it would get really annoying and unnecessarily complicated for those of us who need to make UTC conversions rapidly multiple times a day.

How many really need to do that though? And if it's one and done, I would think you would get used to the same differences pretty quick.

I find myself "calculating" what time it is in the other time zones at least several times a day, and not just for work-related purposes.. even just for friends/family that live in other time zones.

I work remotely, and my office is on a different time zone.

[1995hoo]

Something I've proposed before is a "split the difference" solution: Advance all current time zones by 30 minutes and be done with it. Bully if Canada and Mexico join us. This would eliminate clock changes, but if we advance by only 30 minutes, it mitigates a lot of the "kids in the dark waiting for the school bus" wailing in the winter. And as others point out, a +30 minute time zone is not unheard of worldwide.

It's not unheard of, but it would get really annoying and unnecessarily complicated for those of us who need to make UTC conversions rapidly multiple times a day.

How many really need to do that though? And if it's one and done, I would think you would get used to the same differences pretty quick.

I find myself "calculating" what time it is in the other time zones at least several times a day, and not just for work-related purposes.. even just for friends/family that live in other time zones.

Not sure whether Windows 10 allows this because I haven't bothered to figure it out, but Windows XP and Windows 7 allowed for adding "additional clocks" to the time shown in the system tray so you could hover over the date and time and you'd see other listings–for example, I used to work with people in London a fair amount and while I know well that's normally a five-hour difference, having London added down there served as a useful reminder during the weeks of the year when the difference was something else (prior to 2007, the difference was six hours for one week at the end of March; since 2007, the difference has been four hours for a couple of weeks in March and for one week at the end of October/beginning of November).

Regarding local time usage, there are places in the world where people informally observe a time other than the legally-imposed time zone. I recall in Phenix City, Alabama, for example, a lot of the private-sector businesses operated on Eastern Time to be in sync with the much larger city of Columbus, Georgia, located immediately across the state line (but state and federal offices operated on Central Time). Then there's Central Western Time in Australia, which people observe despite it not being legally-sanctioned because it splits the difference on the 90-minute (under non-DST) or 2.5-hour (under DST) time difference between Western Australia and South Australia.

[kalvado]

Something I've proposed before is a "split the difference" solution: Advance all current time zones by 30 minutes and be done with it. Bully if Canada and Mexico join us. This would eliminate clock changes, but if we advance by only 30 minutes, it mitigates a lot of the "kids in the dark waiting for the school bus" wailing in the winter. And as others point out, a +30 minute time zone is not unheard of worldwide.

It's not unheard of, but it would get really annoying and unnecessarily complicated for those of us who need to make UTC conversions rapidly multiple times a day.

How many really need to do that though? And if it's one and done, I would think you would get used to the same differences pretty quick.

For me, Outlook takes care of many conversions. Zooms starting at .30 also happen.
Not totally convenient,  but... I still wonder what happened to free will of people. Shifting schedule by 30 minutes shouldn't be more difficult than shifting timezones.

[DenverBrian]

Something I've proposed before is a "split the difference" solution: Advance all current time zones by 30 minutes and be done with it. Bully if Canada and Mexico join us. This would eliminate clock changes, but if we advance by only 30 minutes, it mitigates a lot of the "kids in the dark waiting for the school bus" wailing in the winter. And as others point out, a +30 minute time zone is not unheard of worldwide.

It's not unheard of, but it would get really annoying and unnecessarily complicated for those of us who need to make UTC conversions rapidly multiple times a day.

How many really need to do that though? And if it's one and done, I would think you would get used to the same differences pretty quick.

Indeed. I'm certain there would be an app for that within days of such a time change.

[tradephoric]

With the shift to DST and the days getting longer, areas along the western edge of time zones are starting to see sunsets after 8PM.  These will keep extending later and for states on the fringe northwest edge of the timezone, these sunsets will extend to near 10PM during the summer.  I didn't think there was any spot in the lower 48 that saw sunsets after 10PM but i think i found one... the Isle Royale National Park is a remote island on Lake Superior near the Canadian border that sees sunsets after 10PM in late June.  Other than that remote island though, the sun never sets after 10PM anywhere within the lower 48.

[TheHighwayMan3561]

I also wouldn't want the US to be like Australia, which has 6 different time zones for its 7 states...

[kkt]

The Wikipedia community also uses UTC.

A bunch of people use UTC.  Airlines that operate intercontinentally, communications and computer networks, militaries that operate worldwide.

[jeffandnicole]

I find myself "calculating" what time it is in the other time zones at least several times a day, and not just for work-related purposes.. even just for friends/family that live in other time zones.

I work remotely, and my office is on a different time zone.

In both cases, after the initial 30 minute conversion, you'll still be calculating the number of hours.

Currently if you're sitting here saying it's 1:04pm, that means in the Pacific Time zone it's 10:04am.  If the difference from UTC was a factor of 30 minutes, if it's 1:04pm here, it's still going to be 10:04am Pacific Time.

[DenverBrian]

I find myself "calculating" what time it is in the other time zones at least several times a day, and not just for work-related purposes.. even just for friends/family that live in other time zones.

I work remotely, and my office is on a different time zone.

In both cases, after the initial 30 minute conversion, you'll still be calculating the number of hours.

Currently if you're sitting here saying it's 1:04pm, that means in the Pacific Time zone it's 10:04am.  If the difference from UTC was a factor of 30 minutes, if it's 1:04pm here, it's still going to be 10:04am Pacific Time.

But math is haaaaaaaard!

[tradephoric]

Something I've proposed before is a "split the difference" solution: Advance all current time zones by 30 minutes and be done with it. Bully if Canada and Mexico join us. This would eliminate clock changes, but if we advance by only 30 minutes, it mitigates a lot of the "kids in the dark waiting for the school bus" wailing in the winter. And as others point out, a +30 minute time zone is not unheard of worldwide.

Or easier still just shift our cultural norms by a half hour?  You mentioned schools and for years the American Academy of Pediatrics has recommended that middle and high schools start at 8:30 a.m. or later to give students the opportunity to get enough sleep.  Going to permanent DST in this country gives school boards the perfect opportunity to actually adhere to the American Academy of Pediatrics recommendations.  Under permanent DST I'm sure the inevitably stories of kids getting struck and killed while walking to school in the dark will arise.  But instead of putting all the blame on the switch to permanent DST, much of the focus should be on early school start times.  Less kids will be walking to school in the dark if the schools started after 8:30AM.

[TheHighwayMan3561]

Something I've proposed before is a "split the difference" solution: Advance all current time zones by 30 minutes and be done with it. Bully if Canada and Mexico join us. This would eliminate clock changes, but if we advance by only 30 minutes, it mitigates a lot of the "kids in the dark waiting for the school bus" wailing in the winter. And as others point out, a +30 minute time zone is not unheard of worldwide.

Or easier still just shift our cultural norms by a half hour?  You mentioned schools and for years the American Academy of Pediatrics has recommended that middle and high schools start at 8:30 a.m. or later to give students the opportunity to get enough sleep.  Going to permanent DST in this country gives school boards the perfect opportunity to actually adhere to the American Academy of Pediatrics recommendations.  Under permanent DST I'm sure the inevitably stories of kids getting struck and killed while walking to school in the dark will arise.  But instead of putting all the blame on the switch to permanent DST, much of the focus should be on early school start times.  Less kids will be walking to school in the dark if the schools started after 8:30AM.

The problems that have been pointed out with later school starts:

-Their parents' jobs will not also be starting an hour later than they do now, which fucking with parents' routines has been the most common objection to later school starts.
-It won't mean kids (HS in particular) will go to bed at a reasonable time - they'll just stay up an hour later than they did previously, and still not get enough sleep. Trust me, I can vouch for that.

[kkt]

Something I've proposed before is a "split the difference" solution: Advance all current time zones by 30 minutes and be done with it. Bully if Canada and Mexico join us. This would eliminate clock changes, but if we advance by only 30 minutes, it mitigates a lot of the "kids in the dark waiting for the school bus" wailing in the winter. And as others point out, a +30 minute time zone is not unheard of worldwide.

Or easier still just shift our cultural norms by a half hour?  You mentioned schools and for years the American Academy of Pediatrics has recommended that middle and high schools start at 8:30 a.m. or later to give students the opportunity to get enough sleep.  Going to permanent DST in this country gives school boards the perfect opportunity to actually adhere to the American Academy of Pediatrics recommendations.  Under permanent DST I'm sure the inevitably stories of kids getting struck and killed while walking to school in the dark will arise.  But instead of putting all the blame on the switch to permanent DST, much of the focus should be on early school start times.  Less kids will be walking to school in the dark if the schools started after 8:30AM.

Here the school district moved the middle and high school start times to 9:00 a few years ago.  But in winter sunup is 8:00 AM now, if we change to DST in winter sunup will be 9:00 AM when they're already supposed to be in school.  So we're back to getting to school in the dark, and without any sunlight at all to soften up the ice and snow that we get in overnight freezes here.  Should we move the start times to 10:00?  Well, once the kids get their required time in class, they wouldn't have much time after school.  Lots of kids in high school have jobs, practice for sports, drama, or music.  For many kids these extracurricular activities are what keeps them showing up for class.

(edit:  unmangled the quotes)

[tradephoric]

-Their parents' jobs will not also be starting an hour later than they do now, which fucking with parents' routines has been the most common objection to later school starts.

The "poor children waiting in the dark" argument shifts to "I'm not adjusting my work schedule for those little bastards" when the solution of later school times is brought up.

[kkt]

-Their parents' jobs will not also be starting an hour later than they do now, which fucking with parents' routines has been the most common objection to later school starts.

The "poor children waiting in the dark" argument shifts to "I'm not adjusting my work schedule for those little bastards" when the solution of later school times is brought up.

Lots of people really don't have the option of changing their work hours.

[Scott5114]

same damn thread we always have, I see