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Author Topic: Cancelled freeways  (Read 7600 times)

kernals12

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Cancelled freeways
« on: June 21, 2023, 10:16:47 PM »

Does Las Vegas set the record for the largest city without any cancelled freeways?
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Concrete Bob

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #1 on: June 21, 2023, 11:30:24 PM »

Probably.  Las Vegas is probably followed closely by Fresno, which never cancelled any of its adopted freeway routes.
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Plutonic Panda

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #2 on: June 21, 2023, 11:50:51 PM »

How many canceled freeways in OKC besides Sooner Freeway? Dallas? Phoenix? Orlando? I love Vegas. It’s my favorite city.
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kernals12

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2023, 12:06:34 AM »

How many canceled freeways in OKC besides Sooner Freeway? Dallas? Phoenix? Orlando? I love Vegas. It’s my favorite city.

Dallas has a ton of them



Most of these were never more than lines on a map, but a few, like the Trinity River Tollway and Fort Worth Loop did make it pretty far in the planning process.



Phoenix's Paradise Parkway also never made it, leaving the 10 mile gap between Loop 101 and I-10.

I don't know about Orlando.

The most obvious reason for LV's lack of cancellations is that it only became big enough to warrant freeways besides I-15 in the 1990s, long after NEPA, discouraging NDOT from even considering building freeways that would create large environmental or social impacts. As it happens, they did briefly consider making 215 a full loop in the 90s, but quickly ruled it out

Quote
Clark County officials studied several route options for the Beltway during the late 1990s, but Kulin said that this particular segment was never designed nor formally planned. The missing link was always part of the plan – and still is.

“There would have been significant impacts on existing homes and businesses, as adding a highway through that area would have required a significant amount of eminent domain procedures,”  Kulin said.

Weirdly unmentioned in that article is the imposing barrier that is Nellis AFB.
« Last Edit: June 22, 2023, 12:17:18 AM by kernals12 »
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Concrete Bob

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2023, 12:11:14 AM »

Phoenix cancelled the Paradise Parkway (SR 317/SR50), downgraded the Grand Avenue Corridor (us 60) from a freeway to an expressway and cancelled and downgraded the Sky Harbor Expressway (SR 153) to an urban arterial.  The original route of I-10 through Phoenix via the Buckeye Corridor (I-10; SR 280) has been revived through the new Rio Salado Freeway (SR 30) from SR 85 east through the I-17 Durango Curve. In Phoenix, it took staling and cancellation to make for a complete urban freeway system.
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Max Rockatansky

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2023, 12:23:00 AM »

Orlando doesn’t really have any true cancellations.  One of the worst street grids in the country and toll operator money did a lot ensuring most non-I-4 stuff got built.

Fresno kind of has an unbuilt freeway/expressway if you count the gap in CA 65.  Granted, it never was planned to touch the Fresno city limits.  CA 65 was planned to pass near the eastern limit of modern Clovis. 
« Last Edit: June 22, 2023, 12:26:52 AM by Max Rockatansky »
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Plutonic Panda

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2023, 12:30:42 AM »

I knew about the canceled Phoenix Paradise parkway but didn’t know about all of the canceled Dallas freeways. That is interesting. I do wish the Trinity Tollway would have been built but Dallas had a good freeway network. What about Missouri cities? STL and Kansas City both have an amazing freeway network.
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cl94

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2023, 12:54:46 AM »

Nevada as a whole doesn't have much in the way of "canceled freeways," but few were planned to begin with compared to other states and some of the plans are relatively recent. I-11 is still officially active by Congressional mandate (even if that has no chance in hell at being finished this century). Maybe you could say I-70, but that never got past rough corridor proposals. I-580 was built as planned apart from the southern interchange, even if construction took 45 years. I want to say the currently-unconstructed but in-advanced planning 395-445 connector is a relatively new proposal.
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roadfro

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2023, 10:53:17 AM »

The most obvious reason for LV's lack of cancellations is that it only became big enough to warrant freeways besides I-15 in the 1990s, long after NEPA, discouraging NDOT from even considering building freeways that would create large environmental or social impacts. As it happens, they did briefly consider making 215 a full loop in the 90s, but quickly ruled it out

Quote
Clark County officials studied several route options for the Beltway during the late 1990s, but Kulin said that this particular segment was never designed nor formally planned. The missing link was always part of the plan – and still is.

“There would have been significant impacts on existing homes and businesses, as adding a highway through that area would have required a significant amount of eminent domain procedures,”  Kulin said.

Weirdly unmentioned in that article is the imposing barrier that is Nellis AFB.

I would note that the existing US 95 freeway was planned and mostly constructed well before the 1990s. From I-15 west to the Rainbow Blvd interchange was planned (as the "Las Vegas Expressway") in the late 1960s and was complete by 1978, with construction north from Rainbow to Rancho Drive (now US 95 Business) built as expressway by 1980 and converted to freeway in the late 1980s. The I-515 portion east of Las Vegas Blvd was planned in the 1970s, and opened piecemeal during the 1980s with full freeway down to what is now the I-215 interchange by 1990 (AASHTO approval for the I-515 designation was first granted in 1976 and extended to Railroad Pass in 1984).

There was some kind of surface-level feasibility study for an eastern beltway leg in the early 2000s, after planning for the rest of the 215 was mostly complete and parts were built or under construction. (I came across this document online or through a file server some time ago, but unfortunately didn't save it and I haven't been able to find it again.) IIRC, much of the concept either overlapped Nellis Blvd or was close to it–and I think with that, passed west of most of the Nellis AFB. However, the ROW and construction costs at the concept stage were pegged at over a billion dollars at the time, so it was deemed unfeasible. Note that the Vegas valley built out east from the downtown core first before going other directions such that an eastern beltway would blaze miles through fully developed land–by contrast, much of the 215 beltway alignment (particularly the county portions) was planned through then-undeveloped land.
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skluth

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #9 on: June 22, 2023, 11:14:36 AM »

I knew about the canceled Phoenix Paradise parkway but didn’t know about all of the canceled Dallas freeways. That is interesting. I do wish the Trinity Tollway would have been built but Dallas had a good freeway network. What about Missouri cities? STL and Kansas City both have an amazing freeway network.

St Louis has one of the most well-known cancelled freeways, I-755, which would have connected the I-44/55 interchange with the recently removed stub just west of Union Station and continued north to the McKinley Bridge. Honestly, it would have been much better for city traffic had that been built rather than the current freeway which connects the two. There would be a full interchange where the freeways meet downtown rather than the partial one at the west end of the Poplar Street Bridge and the riverbank attractions like the Arch and Laclede's Landing wouldn't be separated from the downtown. It would have been fairly simple to build the Stan Span a bit further north and run a freeway along the east riverbank.

Kansas City's cancelled freeway is even more notorious, US 71 through the south side. IMO, KC's system is overbuilt with the north side of the downtown loop being redundant except when an accident closes I-670.
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The Ghostbuster

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #10 on: June 22, 2023, 01:19:42 PM »

Had Phoenix's Paradise Parkway been constructed, how well do any of you think it would have relieved congestion on Interstate 10? Back to Las Vegas, would the formerly proposed Interstate 11 eastern bypass alternative qualify as a cancelled freeway, since it never got off the drawing board?
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kernals12

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #11 on: June 22, 2023, 01:26:25 PM »

Had Phoenix's Paradise Parkway been constructed, how well do any of you think it would have relieved congestion on Interstate 10? Back to Las Vegas, would the formerly proposed Interstate 11 eastern bypass alternative qualify as a cancelled freeway, since it never got off the drawing board?

The usefulness of the Paradise Parkway would've been severely limited since it wouldn't go east of SR 51. The limited benefits compared to the extremely high cost (hundreds of homes in Glendale would've needed to be demolished) are why it was cancelled.

The I-11 Eastern Bypass was never considered seriously enough for me to say it was "cancelled".
« Last Edit: June 22, 2023, 01:32:24 PM by kernals12 »
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rte66man

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #12 on: June 22, 2023, 01:59:06 PM »

How many canceled freeways in OKC besides Sooner Freeway?

Depends on whether the freeway as ever anything more than a map maker's dream. At one point, the Northwest Expressway was supposed to be converted to a freeway once the growth reached it. You still see evidence of that at NW 63rd, Meridian, and MacArthur if you know where to look. ODOT sold off the land reserved for interchanges at those arterial crossings in the late 80's. It's too bad as getting anywhere northwest of Integris Hospital is a nightmare.

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froggie

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #13 on: June 23, 2023, 08:24:05 PM »

Kansas City had a lot more on the docket that never got built than just "US 71".  This map shows what was planned at the start of the Interstate system and shows quite a few gems, including a relocated US 24, a MO 210 freeway, "MO 735", "MO 769", and others.  This also shows what the ghost ramps and bridges at the I-70 curves east of downtown were intended for.
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Max Rockatansky

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #14 on: June 23, 2023, 09:12:54 PM »

Had Phoenix's Paradise Parkway been constructed, how well do any of you think it would have relieved congestion on Interstate 10? Back to Las Vegas, would the formerly proposed Interstate 11 eastern bypass alternative qualify as a cancelled freeway, since it never got off the drawing board?

The usefulness of the Paradise Parkway would've been severely limited since it wouldn't go east of SR 51. The limited benefits compared to the extremely high cost (hundreds of homes in Glendale would've needed to be demolished) are why it was cancelled.

The I-11 Eastern Bypass was never considered seriously enough for me to say it was "cancelled".

There probably wasn’t much of a need east of AZ 51 anyways.  I used to drive Lincoln through Paradise Valley everyday and that road was never inordinately busy.  I used to use it as a back way to get to downtown Scottsdale when I worked there. 
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Henry

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #15 on: June 23, 2023, 09:44:59 PM »

Chicago has not one, but two, cancelled I-494s! The best-known one is the Crosstown Expressway, and there was also the LSD freeway upgrade that later got renumbered to I-694.
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The Ghostbuster

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #16 on: June 23, 2023, 09:58:09 PM »

Since this thread has gone all over the place, and not just pertaining to the Pacific Southwest, would it be possible to move this thread to General Highway Talk?
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Henry

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #17 on: June 23, 2023, 10:00:57 PM »

Since this thread has gone all over the place, and not just pertaining to the Pacific Southwest, would it be possible to move this thread to General Highway Talk?
Agreed on that, because everybody else (including myself) has named places outside the region where freeway cancellations have and have not taken place.


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« Last Edit: June 24, 2023, 09:21:47 PM by roadfro »
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RG407

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #18 on: June 25, 2023, 11:13:20 PM »

How many canceled freeways in OKC besides Sooner Freeway? Dallas? Phoenix? Orlando? I love Vegas. It’s my favorite city.

Orlando has one, FL529, a.k.a. the Central Connector.  It was proposed in the late 80s to early 90s as toll road that would run from FL528 at the Orange Ave. overpass to I-4 near the Michigan St. and Kaley Ave. interchanges.  The last mile or so would have been on surface streets.  The purpose was to provide a more direct link between downtown and the airport, but it would have cut through long-established residential areas.  It was eventually cancelled due to local opposition.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2023, 11:17:01 PM by RG407 »
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ilpt4u

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #19 on: June 25, 2023, 11:43:47 PM »

I knew about the canceled Phoenix Paradise parkway but didn’t know about all of the canceled Dallas freeways. That is interesting. I do wish the Trinity Tollway would have been built but Dallas had a good freeway network. What about Missouri cities? STL and Kansas City both have an amazing freeway network.

St Louis has one of the most well-known cancelled freeways, I-755, which would have connected the I-44/55 interchange with the recently removed stub just west of Union Station and continued north to the McKinley Bridge. Honestly, it would have been much better for city traffic had that been built rather than the current freeway which connects the two. There would be a full interchange where the freeways meet downtown rather than the partial one at the west end of the Poplar Street Bridge and the riverbank attractions like the Arch and Laclede's Landing wouldn't be separated from the downtown. It would have been fairly simple to build the Stan Span a bit further north and run a freeway along the east riverbank.
And now a brand new soccer stadium sits on the former 755 stub! There also used to be a stub along I-70 where it was to meet 755 also, if memory serves, but is now gone with previous reconstruction projects

Also STL cancelled was I-170 south of I-64 - Hence why 170 ends (strangely) at a Target store/shopping center
« Last Edit: June 25, 2023, 11:48:59 PM by ilpt4u »
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BlueOutback7

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #20 on: June 26, 2023, 08:18:37 AM »

Boston has plenty of them. I-695 was the proposed Inner Belt and of course I-95 through Boston. Also US 3 was supposed to continue further past Burlington. There’s still leftover ramps where they were supposed to continue.
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skluth

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #21 on: June 26, 2023, 11:41:42 AM »

I knew about the canceled Phoenix Paradise parkway but didn’t know about all of the canceled Dallas freeways. That is interesting. I do wish the Trinity Tollway would have been built but Dallas had a good freeway network. What about Missouri cities? STL and Kansas City both have an amazing freeway network.

St Louis has one of the most well-known cancelled freeways, I-755, which would have connected the I-44/55 interchange with the recently removed stub just west of Union Station and continued north to the McKinley Bridge. Honestly, it would have been much better for city traffic had that been built rather than the current freeway which connects the two. There would be a full interchange where the freeways meet downtown rather than the partial one at the west end of the Poplar Street Bridge and the riverbank attractions like the Arch and Laclede's Landing wouldn't be separated from the downtown. It would have been fairly simple to build the Stan Span a bit further north and run a freeway along the east riverbank.
And now a brand new soccer stadium sits on the former 755 stub! There also used to be a stub along I-70 where it was to meet 755 also, if memory serves, but is now gone with previous reconstruction projects

Also STL cancelled was I-170 south of I-64 - Hence why 170 ends (strangely) at a Target store/shopping center

There was never a stub at I-70/McKinley Bridge though there is a fair amount of empty land that was leveled when the plan was active. The weird I-44/55/Truman Blvd interchange has ghost ramps. Here's a recent article about the highway. I haven't read it yet but other articles on this site have been accurate.
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SkyPesos

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #22 on: June 26, 2023, 12:28:20 PM »

Of the 3 largest Ohio Cities, I can't think of any cancelled freeways in Columbus, which is the largest city in Ohio by city limits population. Cleveland's most well-known example is I-490 (back then, I-290) east of its current end to connect with I-271. Cincinnati has a couple, including the Taft Freeway (along Taft Rd, cuts through the University of Cincinnati area), Colerain Freeway (along US 27), and one along the Western Hills Viaduct and Queen City Ave.

HighwayStar

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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #23 on: June 26, 2023, 01:23:06 PM »

I think it is somewhat useful to distinguish between cities with "canceled freeways" which were essentially alternatives to freeways that were completed (especially as a result of building plans widely separated in time) versus cities with canceled freeways which did not have any meaningful alternatives built either.
The former is perhaps more indicative of say DFW while the latter is of course notorious in many places (such as DC for example).
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Re: Cancelled freeways
« Reply #24 on: June 26, 2023, 03:30:52 PM »

Harrisburg has two as far as I'm aware. The first one is the East Shore Expressway, of which no plan exists online unfortunately, but there is a rough description of its proposed route here: https://harrisburg.pahighways.com/expressways/cancelled/esexpressway.html

The second is the West Shore Expressway, partly shown in this plan:

I have in my possession (until I return it to the Library today) the 1970 East Pennsboro Township plan which includes a map of the proposed expressway:


West Shore Expressway_Page_3 by WestPA31, on Flickr

Wow would this have been interesting if built.

Both would've been connectors between I-81 and I-83, I believe.
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