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ICC Intercounty Connector

Started by Alex, August 27, 2009, 12:06:04 AM

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1995hoo

Quote from: froggie on November 06, 2014, 03:48:33 PM
As I recall, they also went with a CFI at US 1.

You are correct, and here is the "fact sheet" they published about it:

http://roads.maryland.gov/OC/CFI_Fact_Sheet_.pdf
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.


NJRoadfan

Does this mean the perpetual speed camera construction zone is finally coming to an end?

BrianP

They were even alerting about the opening of the ICC to US 1 on a VMS on I-270 today.

DeaconG

Quote from: NJRoadfan on November 06, 2014, 05:31:46 PM
Does this mean the perpetual speed camera construction zone is finally coming to an end?

No, it now means the perpetual speed camera revenue enhancement zone begins...
Dawnstar: "You're an ape! And you can talk!"
King Solovar: "And you're a human with wings! Reality holds surprises for everyone!"
-Crisis On Infinite Earths #2

lepidopteran

Quote from: BrianP on November 07, 2014, 10:05:57 AM
They were even alerting about the opening of the ICC to US 1 on a VMS on I-270 today.

And on I-95 (is it possible to post a full-size picture from Flickr?)

cpzilliacus

Quote from: DeaconG on November 07, 2014, 11:40:23 AM
Quote from: NJRoadfan on November 06, 2014, 05:31:46 PM
Does this mean the perpetual speed camera construction zone is finally coming to an end?
No, it now means the perpetual speed camera revenue enhancement zone begins...

I am not aware of any speed camera enforcement on any freeway in Maryland, with the exception of construction zones, where signs warning of automated enforcement are posted well in advance.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

TheOneKEA

The only thing that annoys me about this extension is that the off-road multipurpose trail doesn't go any further than Virginia Manor Road. That interchange on I-95 would be awesome to see on foot or from a bike if the trail continued west to Old Gunpowder Road.

Mapmikey

Quote from: lepidopteran on November 07, 2014, 01:08:54 PM
Quote from: BrianP on November 07, 2014, 10:05:57 AM
They were even alerting about the opening of the ICC to US 1 on a VMS on I-270 today.

And on I-95 (is it possible to post a full-size picture from Flickr?)


The MD 200 extension to US 1 was open when I drove by there around 7 this evening after a day of clinching tons of Maryland routes...

Mapmikey

cpzilliacus

Quote from: Mapmikey on November 08, 2014, 09:48:50 PM
Quote from: lepidopteran on November 07, 2014, 01:08:54 PM
Quote from: BrianP on November 07, 2014, 10:05:57 AM
They were even alerting about the opening of the ICC to US 1 on a VMS on I-270 today.

And on I-95 (is it possible to post a full-size picture from Flickr?)


The MD 200 extension to US 1 was open when I drove by there around 7 this evening after a day of clinching tons of Maryland routes...

Mapmikey

Md. 200 opened to U.S. 1 shortly after dusk tonight.  Will try to snap some images tomorrow.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

TheOneKEA

I will be interested to see if there are any opinion pieces in the Sun or the WaPo about the completion of the ICC. I will be curious about public opinion of the ICC now that it is finished, for now.

I will also be interested to see if the land owners around the area start advertising their plans.

cpzilliacus

Quote from: TheOneKEA on November 09, 2014, 11:05:48 AM
I will be interested to see if there are any opinion pieces in the Sun or the WaPo about the completion of the ICC. I will be curious about public opinion of the ICC now that it is finished, for now.

I will also be interested to see if the land owners around the area start advertising their plans.

A fair chunk of the planned Konterra property is well through the M-NCP&PC Prince George's County approval process.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

cpzilliacus

#511
Quote from: TheOneKEA on November 08, 2014, 06:29:10 PM
The only thing that annoys me about this extension is that the off-road multipurpose trail doesn't go any further than Virginia Manor Road. That interchange on I-95 would be awesome to see on foot or from a bike if the trail continued west to Old Gunpowder Road.

The discontiguous multipurpose trail along Md. 200 is a major sore subject with me (otherwise everything about the road is great) and the blame for that belongs to the County Councils, Planning Boards and the M-NCP&PC planning staffs of both counties  for not insisting on a trail all the way from Md. 119 to U.S. 1. Do not blame the State Highway Administration and do not blame the Maryland Transportation Authority - the state agencies would have built it if the counties had been more aggressive in supporting it.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

froggie

MdTA may have some blame for that...I was under the distinct impression at the time that the unbuilt parts of the trail were cut in order to "cut costs".

TheOneKEA

Quote from: froggie on November 10, 2014, 07:44:48 AM
MdTA may have some blame for that...I was under the distinct impression at the time that the unbuilt parts of the trail were cut in order to "cut costs".

That was my impression too. I am certainly grateful that any portion of the trail was built at all but a complete trail from MD 119 to US 1 would have been a tremendously valuable transportation resource.

Henry

Theoretically, it could be extended to the B-W Parkway or even US 50 in the east, and VA 28 in the west, because it (along with the Franconia-Springfield Parkway, IIRC) follows the same path that the Washington Outer Beltway would've taken. But the current route is a good start for now.
Go Cubs Go! Go Cubs Go! Hey Chicago, what do you say? The Cubs are gonna win today!

NE2

Quote from: Henry on November 10, 2014, 12:18:30 PM
it (along with the Franconia-Springfield Parkway, IIRC) follows the same path that the Washington Outer Beltway would've taken.
Nope. The Outer Beltway alignment at I-270 is Montrose Parkway. The once-planned alignment is pretty obvious: http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=14/39.0717/-77.0782

On the other hand, it could be easily extended up I-270 to Hagerstown, I-70 to Kansas City, and the old Oregon Trail and US 20 to Yellowstone.
pre-1945 Florida route log

I accept and respect your identity as long as it's not dumb shit like "identifying as a vaccinated attack helicopter".

cpzilliacus

Quote from: froggie on November 10, 2014, 07:44:48 AM
MdTA may have some blame for that...I was under the distinct impression at the time that the unbuilt parts of the trail were cut in order to "cut costs".

Not MdTA, but SHA. 

However, both of the agencies above pay close attention to the county governments in situations like this - and both County Councils and their respective Planning Boards and planning staffs totally fell-down on the job. 

The Montgomery County planners were (for inexplicable reasons) not willing to go to the mat with regulators from the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, who claimed that having a separate bike/pedestrian trail next to the six lanes (plus shoulders) of Md. 200 would somehow damage the cold waters of the Paint Branch of the Anacostia River - a claim that was (and remains) ridiculous on its face. 
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

TheOneKEA

Agreed.

One other note about this new extension for the sign people: one of the original Exit 20 signs for Virginia Manor Road has been hilariously badly patched to read Konterra Drive instead. It's almost comical.

Also, the Exit 19C westbound sign for the C-D lane loop ramp to Contee Road and MD 198 hasn't been unpatched yet.

froggie

QuoteThe Montgomery County planners were (for inexplicable reasons) not willing to go to the mat with regulators from the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, who claimed that having a separate bike/pedestrian trail next to the six lanes (plus shoulders) of Md. 200 would somehow damage the cold waters of the Paint Branch of the Anacostia River - a claim that was (and remains) ridiculous on its face.

If that's truly the case, then perhaps the CoE shouldn't have allowed a permit for ANY of the ICC.  To allow a permit for a 6-lane freeway but not for a bike/ped path on the same corridor is pretty ludicrous.

QuoteTheoretically, it could be extended to the B-W Parkway or even US 50 in the east, and VA 28 in the west, because it (along with the Franconia-Springfield Parkway, IIRC) follows the same path that the Washington Outer Beltway would've taken. But the current route is a good start for now.

Besides what SPUI mentioned, neither VA 28 nor the Franconia-Springfield Parkway were ever part of the Outer Beltway proposal.  The Outer Beltway would have crossed I-66 near Stringfellow Rd and I-95 just north of the US 1/Woodbridge interchange.

cpzilliacus

Quote from: NE2 on November 10, 2014, 01:52:12 PM
Quote from: Henry on November 10, 2014, 12:18:30 PM
it (along with the Franconia-Springfield Parkway, IIRC) follows the same path that the Washington Outer Beltway would've taken.
Nope. The Outer Beltway alignment at I-270 is Montrose Parkway. The once-planned alignment is pretty obvious: http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=14/39.0717/-77.0782

Spui, that was superseded long ago by a crossing further to the north and west.  That is why the I-370/I-270 interchange stands where it does.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

cpzilliacus

#520
Quote from: froggie on November 11, 2014, 08:56:13 AM
QuoteThe Montgomery County planners were (for inexplicable reasons) not willing to go to the mat with regulators from the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, who claimed that having a separate bike/pedestrian trail next to the six lanes (plus shoulders) of Md. 200 would somehow damage the cold waters of the Paint Branch of the Anacostia River - a claim that was (and remains) ridiculous on its face.

If that's truly the case, then perhaps the CoE shouldn't have allowed a permit for ANY of the ICC.  To allow a permit for a 6-lane freeway but not for a bike/ped path on the same corridor is pretty ludicrous.

Yup - you hit the nail right on the head. 

It was (IMO) a bone thrown to staff people at the Corps and EPA Region III in Philadelphia, some of whom had been opposing any Clean Water Act Section 404 permits for the ICC since the Reagan Administration (and, I strongly suspect, engaging in ex-parte private meetings with ICC opponents to discuss ways to stop the project).

But this also demonstrates that the members of both County Councils, in spite of their  claims about wanting more people to ride bikes, are unwilling to back-up such claims with action.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

NE2

Quote from: cpzilliacus on November 11, 2014, 11:35:11 AM
Quote from: NE2 on November 10, 2014, 01:52:12 PM
Quote from: Henry on November 10, 2014, 12:18:30 PM
it (along with the Franconia-Springfield Parkway, IIRC) follows the same path that the Washington Outer Beltway would've taken.
Nope. The Outer Beltway alignment at I-270 is Montrose Parkway. The once-planned alignment is pretty obvious: http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=14/39.0717/-77.0782

Spui, that was superseded long ago by a crossing further to the north and west.  That is why the I-370/I-270 interchange stands where it does.
Got a map showing this alignment?
pre-1945 Florida route log

I accept and respect your identity as long as it's not dumb shit like "identifying as a vaccinated attack helicopter".

cpzilliacus

Quote from: NE2 on November 11, 2014, 11:45:32 AM
Quote from: cpzilliacus on November 11, 2014, 11:35:11 AM
Quote from: NE2 on November 10, 2014, 01:52:12 PM
Quote from: Henry on November 10, 2014, 12:18:30 PM
it (along with the Franconia-Springfield Parkway, IIRC) follows the same path that the Washington Outer Beltway would've taken.
Nope. The Outer Beltway alignment at I-270 is Montrose Parkway. The once-planned alignment is pretty obvious: http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=14/39.0717/-77.0782

Spui, that was superseded long ago by a crossing further to the north and west.  That is why the I-370/I-270 interchange stands where it does.
Got a map showing this alignment?

Look in the Washington Post archives (yes, you have to pay to use those), article entitled New Routes Proposed For Beltway in County, (no byline) dated 1965-08-07.

When you are done with that, look at Do We Need a Beltway II, written by the late Jack Eisen (maybe the best transportation beat reporter the Post ever had), dated 1974-01-10.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

lepidopteran

Quote from: TheOneKEA on November 11, 2014, 08:52:17 AM
One other note about this new extension for the sign people: one of the original Exit 20 signs for Virginia Manor Road has been hilariously badly patched to read Konterra Drive instead. It's almost comical.
Were the Konterra signs on the C-D lanes also patched, but from reading Contee Rd.?  I thought it read Contee when part of a tarp blew aside.  Or maybe I just saw the "onte" that both names share.

Quote from: TheOneKEA on November 11, 2014, 08:52:17 AM
Also, the Exit 19C westbound sign for the C-D lane loop ramp to Contee Road and MD 198 hasn't been unpatched yet.
And on the ICC EB loop ramp to the C-D lanes, the BGS displays only a forlorn MD-198 shield.  Not sure if there's greenout there.

NE2

#524
Quote from: cpzilliacus on November 11, 2014, 12:05:29 PM
Quote from: NE2 on November 11, 2014, 11:45:32 AM
Quote from: cpzilliacus on November 11, 2014, 11:35:11 AM
Quote from: NE2 on November 10, 2014, 01:52:12 PM
Quote from: Henry on November 10, 2014, 12:18:30 PM
it (along with the Franconia-Springfield Parkway, IIRC) follows the same path that the Washington Outer Beltway would've taken.
Nope. The Outer Beltway alignment at I-270 is Montrose Parkway. The once-planned alignment is pretty obvious: http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=14/39.0717/-77.0782

Spui, that was superseded long ago by a crossing further to the north and west.  That is why the I-370/I-270 interchange stands where it does.
Got a map showing this alignment?

Look in the Washington Post archives (yes, you have to pay to use those), article entitled New Routes Proposed For Beltway in County, (no byline) dated 1965-08-07.

When you are done with that, look at Do We Need a Beltway II, written by the late Jack Eisen (maybe the best transportation beat reporter the Post ever had), dated 1974-01-10.
In other words, no. (It wouldn't surprise me if you own Washington Post stock, and that's why you're giving me a runaround.)
pre-1945 Florida route log

I accept and respect your identity as long as it's not dumb shit like "identifying as a vaccinated attack helicopter".



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