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[seicer]

"TURNPIKE RIDE - Gasoline motor powered cars in which you drive your way to FUN."

Camden Park, west of Huntington, West Virginia, 1967.

[SP Cook]

Camden Park remains open, although the taxman backed up a truck several years ago and hauled off everything that wasn't nailed down, as they had been let slide on their taxes for decades.  The year round skating rink and office also had a fire of suspiscious origin. 

Among the things that are gone are the horses on the carosel, which, apparently unknown to management, were hand carved items from the early 1900s worth 10s of 1000s of $$ each.  Rich folk have them repainted and put on display.    Replaced with plastic.  The 1950s era wooden roller coaster is down to one car, as they canibalized the other to keep it running (parts have not been available for years).  When it goes, I suppose the place will close.   Pretty much now its old carnival rides too worn out to travel any more.

BTW, when Marshall U. had a real buffalo mascot (Marco) he lived in a pen in the infield of the WV Turnpike ride.  He has long since passed away, as has the ride.   He once escaped during a game at recently astroturfed Fairfield Stadium in the early 70, and went into a rampage when he found out the grass wasn't edible. 

I never did know why they called the ride the "WV Turnpike" (it even had signage from the era when the turnpike had its own route marker), since the place marketed at all three states (its on the banks of the Ohio and only 3 miles from the Big Sandy), no where near the actual route, and I-64, less than 100 yards from the place, was finished by then.

[vdeane]

Camden Park remains open, although the taxman backed up a truck several years ago and hauled off everything that wasn't nailed down, as they had been let slide on their taxes for decades.  The year round skating rink and office also had a fire of suspiscious origin. 

Among the things that are gone are the horses on the carosel, which, apparently unknown to management, were hand carved items from the early 1900s worth 10s of 1000s of $$ each.  Rich folk have them repainted and put on display.    Replaced with plastic.  The 1950s era wooden roller coaster is down to one car, as they canibalized the other to keep it running (parts have not been available for years).  When it goes, I suppose the place will close.   Pretty much now its old carnival rides too worn out to travel any more.

BTW, when Marshall U. had a real buffalo mascot (Marco) he lived in a pen in the infield of the WV Turnpike ride.  He has long since passed away, as has the ride.   He once escaped during a game at recently astroturfed Fairfield Stadium in the early 70, and went into a rampage when he found out the grass wasn't edible. 

I never did know why they called the ride the "WV Turnpike" (it even had signage from the era when the turnpike had its own route marker), since the place marketed at all three states (its on the banks of the Ohio and only 3 miles from the Big Sandy), no where near the actual route, and I-64, less than 100 yards from the place, was finished by then.

Funny, the local (Rochester) amusement park is able to keep their wooden roller coasters going just fine.  Why are parts so hard to come by in WV but not NY?

[amroad17]

Are you referring to SeaBreeze or Roseland (in Canandaigua)?

Either the park itself really does not want to invest in parts or because the nearest theme/amusement parks are at least 150 miles away for them to "borrow" parts they need.  "Order parts?  What's that?"

[nexus73]

Back in the day we had this thing called craftsmen.  You handed them a project and they made from scratch whatever it was that the project needed.  Nowadays we couldn't even find someone to replace lightbulbs when they burn out it seems.  This nation of ours is doomed.  Think "Idiocracy".

Rick

[thenetwork]

I never did know why they called the ride the "WV Turnpike" (it even had signage from the era when the turnpike had its own route marker).

Cedar Point in Sandusky, OH has a "Turnpike" ride of their own, as did Kennywood Amusement Park in Pittsburgh until a few years ago.  At least many of the people who came to those amusement parks drove on or crossed their state's Turnpikes to get there.  I guess they called them turnpikes since they were the first superhighways in their respective areas and the way these tracks would loop over and under themselves, it somewhat resembled a turnpike exit.

I've never seen an amusement park's car track like Camden's in West Virginia where there was no rail in the center of the track to keep the car from straying too far from the center of the "roadway".  Camden's looks like a 1-1/2 lane high speed go-kart track to me.

[SP Cook]

Funny, the local (Rochester) amusement park is able to keep their wooden roller coasters going just fine.  Why are parts so hard to come by in WV but not NY?

Mainly because the company that built Camden Park's went broke in 1973, and only built a few full sized roller coasters anyway (it mostly specialized in children's rides) leaving behind a very limited supply of parts.  In any event the park's finacial condition is such that buying much of anything is out of the question.

I've never seen an amusement park's car track like Camden's in West Virginia where there was no rail in the center of the track to keep the car from straying too far from the center of the "roadway".  Camden's looks like a 1-1/2 lane high speed go-kart track to me.

The design was that you were kept on the track via the guardrails.  The cars were also just wide enough that you could not pass.  But, within that you were really "driving", which was a selling point to kids in that era.

You could bump the car in front of you. 

[vdeane]

Are you referring to SeaBreeze or Roseland (in Canandaigua)?

Either the park itself really does not want to invest in parts or because the nearest theme/amusement parks are at least 150 miles away for them to "borrow" parts they need.  "Order parts?  What's that?"

SeaBreeze.  Roseland is a waterpark and was built within my lifetime, so probably not much within the realm of wooden roller coasters there.

[ShawnP]

67 isn't that long ago right?

Might be my birth year.

[qguy]

A similar ride operated at Hersheypark (then "Hershey Park") from 1960 to 1972. It was called simply the "Turnpike." I remember riding on it with my father around 1970 or 71. I was eight or nine years old and remember banging back and forth between the outer rails. It was damaged beyond repair by Hurricane Agnes in 1972 and afterward demolished. (Quite a few other rides met the same fate that year.)

Like the ride in this thread, it featured a travel lane with outer guard rails, unlike the typical car ride of today which features a center rail (one of which operates at Hersheypark today in a different location).

A postcard featuring the attraction can be seen here: http://www.playle.com/listing.php?i=APOPKAPCSHOPPE56871&PHPSESSID=7hn5hu88bskojpdia7g9ke4m11

[Alps]

A similar ride operated at Hersheypark (then "Hershey Park") from 1960 to 1972. It was called simply the "Turnpike." I remember riding on it with my father around 1970 or 71. I was eight or nine years old and remember banging back and forth between the outer rails. It was damaged beyond repair by Hurricane Agnes in 1972 and afterward demolished. (Quite a few other rides met the same fate that year.)

Like the ride in this thread, it featured a travel lane with outer guard rails, unlike the typical car ride of today which features a center rail (one of which operates at Hersheypark today in a different location).

A postcard featuring the attraction can be seen here: http://www.playle.com/listing.php?i=APOPKAPCSHOPPE56871&PHPSESSID=7hn5hu88bskojpdia7g9ke4m11

When I was little (80s), I got to ride on some of the guardrail rides. (I'm calling it guardrail, not guiderail, because it really did keep you on the course at all times.) I'm glad I still remember this, because after about 1994 or 95 every ride seemed to be middle-rail. There's always go-karting.

[cpzilliacus]

Charleston Gazette-Mail: If Turnpike tolls to be removed, planning must start now, lawmakers told

The process of taking the tolls off the West Virginia Turnpike and moving the road into the state Division of Highways system will need to begin next summer, state Parkways Authority General Manager Greg Barr told a legislative interim committee Tuesday.

Under current law, once the 30-year Turnpike bonds are paid off in 2019, the state Division of Highways is to assume operation of the 88-mile interstate if the road is in good condition. State Transportation Secretary Paul Maddox has said planning for the transition will take two years, Barr said.

However, Barr told the Select Committee on Infrastructure he has concerns about future funding for the roadway if tolls are removed.

[plain]

Charleston Gazette-Mail: If Turnpike tolls to be removed, planning must start now, lawmakers told

The process of taking the tolls off the West Virginia Turnpike and moving the road into the state Division of Highways system will need to begin next summer, state Parkways Authority General Manager Greg Barr told a legislative interim committee Tuesday.

Under current law, once the 30-year Turnpike bonds are paid off in 2019, the state Division of Highways is to assume operation of the 88-mile interstate if the road is in good condition. State Transportation Secretary Paul Maddox has said planning for the transition will take two years, Barr said.

However, Barr told the Select Committee on Infrastructure he has concerns about future funding for the roadway if tolls are removed.

Taking the tolls off this road would be one of West Virginia's biggest mistakes ever

[SP Cook]

Mr. Barr's comments are dishonest.  As is he.

Not just in WV, but in every state where keeping the promise of taking tolls off when paid the idiotic comment of "there is no money to pay for the upkeep".  Really.  So the other 500 odd miles of 4 lane roads in WV should have never been built, because there was no money to pay for the upkeep?  We should not finish H or US 35, and certainly forget about the Coalfields, Tolsia or King Coal, because there is no money to pay for upkeep?  Idiotic. 

WV DOH upkeeps 38,759 miles of roads.  88 more is not going to break the budget.

The reality of the situation is this:

- The turnpike was actually paid off in 1987.  By a subtrafuge they extended tolls for 30 more years and spent the money on other things.  They promised the profits would be spent on "economic development" but in fact, as outlined by the Legislative Auditor, mostly wasted or stole it. 

- The turnpike employment consists of 4 basic types of workers.  Toll takers.  Hey, it sucks to lose your job.  WV got out of the retail liquor business back in the late 80s.  All the clerks and such were fired.  They got preference in civil service and took other state jobs or found work in the real world.  Life.  General highway workers, who will mostly be rolled into the general DOH system .  The issue for these people is that the DOH does not give raises and the turnpike does.  Welcome.  Enjoy.  The beauracracy.  People like Barr and his cronies, who make many times what the same function earns at the DOH.  Some civil service, some contracted from the "private sector".  Fire 'em.  And the F-Troop of failed state troopers.  This is just like the "no money to maintain" lie.  When a new free road opened up, I can never remember anyone discussing how we were going to pay the cops to maintain it.  The local SP just added that to what ever else they did.  And the turnpike can be the same.  The local SP districts just add patrolling the turnpike into what ever else they do.  And you transfer the F-troop to general duties.  And, as to the cash, the number of troopers that retire every year is about 1/3rd of the number in F-troop.  So in three years of not having any new troopers, the SP budget is back to even.

Of course, WV should join honest states like KY and VA and keep its promise to treat southern WV like the other parts of WV and take these tolls off.  Yesterday.

[cpzilliacus]

WV DOH upkeeps 38,759 miles of roads.  88 more is not going to break the budget.

Not been there in the colder months, but does the West Virginia Turnpike require extra-heavy winter maintenance?  The Pennsylvania Turnpike, for all of its faults and massive diversion of assets to transit agencies with missions not related to the Turnpike, generally does a good job of keeping its roads open even in the worst winter weather.

Of course, WV should join honest states like KY and VA and keep its promise to treat southern WV like the other parts of WV and take these tolls off.  Yesterday.

Suggest you remove Virginia from that list for one reason - Va. 267 (the Dulles Toll Road).  The revenue bonds sold to build it (issued in the early 1980's) were to have been paid-off this decade (and the road become toll-free), but instead the road was transferred from the Commonwealth to the Metropolitan Airports Authority (MWAA), which has massively jacked-up tolls to fund repayment of the revenue bonds that it sold to build a very expensive train line (Metrorail Silver Line) from Falls Church to beyond the airport for many billions of dollars.

Also, the Chesapeake Bay Bridge Tunnel (U.S. 13) will probably be a toll crossing forever (that's is what the Commonwealth's legislative auditors suggested in a report back in 2003).  This is a suggestion I agree with, because of the length and unique nature of the crossing. Relevant language (with emphasis added):

Two concerns are of particular note.  First, it appears unlikely that VDOT would  have  sufficient  funds  to  operate  and  maintain  the  facility  without  continua­tion of  the tolls.  This is especially likely if the CBBT is able to defease its bonds by 2010, instead  of by  2025  as  scheduled.   Second,  the  need  to  construct  parallel  tunnels and other future capital requirements (such as replacement of the original tres­tles  and  bridges) is  clearly  beyond  the  financial  capability  of  VDOT.   On  the  other  hand, the district has proven its ability to operate and maintain the facility, and to fund necessary capital projects with toll revenues and bonded debt.  In short, transferring  the  Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel to VDOT is a solution without a problem.

Therefore,  the  district  and  commission  should  be  retained  to  operate  and  maintain  the  facility  in  perpetuity.  After  parallel  tunnels  have  been built  and  the  associated debt retired, minimal “maintenance tolls” should be retained for all vehi­cle  classes  to  cover  the  costs  for  operations,  maintenance,  and  future  capital  improvements, such as  the replacement  of aging bridge structures.

Note that I do not know if any of the language above applies to the West Virginia Turnpike, and I defer to your better knowledge of same.

[SP Cook]

No.  The Turnpike is pretty much indistinguishable from any other interstate, excepting the northern third which has a 60 SL (despite having been safely operated at 65 earlier) and a "jersey barrier" rather than a proper median and is quite twisty (this is because when they rebuilt the turnpike to 4 lanes in the 80s, they did a form of what HB calls "Virginia twining" by just adding two lanes to the existing two, and because the current two lanes were in use they could not/did not do the kind of blasting that most Appalachian interstates built over virgin land used) .  It is not particularly high in elevation nor in any way receives any weather or snow any differently from any of a number of interstates I can name.

[hbelkins]

As to the toll-takers, Kentucky found jobs for all those affected when the tolls were removed from its parkways. One of them is now my counterpart in the Somerset office. Another worked in accounts in my office for several years until she retired.

And as regards the construction, there are a few places where it's obvious which carriageway is the older one. You can tell by the style of bridge for roads that cross over the turnpike. The only place that it's really easy to tell there's a new alignment on the segment between Beckley in Charleston is where the Memorial Tunnel was bypassed.

[amroad17]

I am a bit bemused about how this thread started as an amusement park ride called the West Virginia Turnpike and has now evolved into a discussion about the actual West Virginia Turnpike.    

[plain]

I am a bit bemused about how this thread started as an amusement park ride called the West Virginia Turnpike and has now evolved into a discussion about the actual West Virginia Turnpike.    

You're right and I'm most likely to blame for this lol. I will discuss why I said what I said on another thread  (yeah I like to rap but that particular rhythm wasn't on purpose lmao)

[cpzilliacus]

No.  The Turnpike is pretty much indistinguishable from any other interstate, excepting the northern third which has a 60 SL (despite having been safely operated at 65 earlier) and a "jersey barrier" rather than a proper median and is quite twisty (this is because when they rebuilt the turnpike to 4 lanes in the 80s, they did a form of what HB calls "Virginia twining" by just adding two lanes to the existing two, and because the current two lanes were in use they could not/did not do the kind of blasting that most Appalachian interstates built over virgin land used) .  It is not particularly high in elevation nor in any way receives any weather or snow any differently from any of a number of interstates I can name.

Thanks for your reply.

Then it becomes fair to ask why it is still a toll road, at least if the bonds used to build and expand it are being paid-off. 

The Connecticut Turnpike (mostly I-95) was de-tolled in the 1980's, but the service plazas remain (and have recently been upgraded). So West Virginia could presumably de-toll the Turnpike and  keep the services on it forever.

[NE2]

I am a bit bemused about how this thread started as an amusement park ride called the West Virginia Turnpike and has now evolved into a discussion about the actual West Virginia Turnpike.    

Blame CP's news article pasting.

[hbelkins]

Speaking of the service plazas, another way it's easy to tell which carriageway of the WV Turnpike is the original is that both of the service plazas (not counting Tamarack) are on the northbound lanes.

[Bitmapped]

No.  The Turnpike is pretty much indistinguishable from any other interstate, excepting the northern third which has a 60 SL (despite having been safely operated at 65 earlier) and a "jersey barrier" rather than a proper median and is quite twisty (this is because when they rebuilt the turnpike to 4 lanes in the 80s, they did a form of what HB calls "Virginia twining" by just adding two lanes to the existing two, and because the current two lanes were in use they could not/did not do the kind of blasting that most Appalachian interstates built over virgin land used) .  It is not particularly high in elevation nor in any way receives any weather or snow any differently from any of a number of interstates I can name.

Thanks for your reply.

Then it becomes fair to ask why it is still a toll road, at least if the bonds used to build and expand it are being paid-off. 

Per WV Code 17-16A-18, the Turnpike shall be transferred to WVDOH upon payment of tolls if the road is in good condition to the satisfaction of the Commissioner of Highways. The bonds are expected to be paid off in 2019.

Major arguments against eliminating tolls are that the majority of tolls are paid by out-of-state drivers and eliminating them would add tens of millions of dollars in expenses to an agency that  already has a major cash crunch. There have also been proposals to do the same thing OH and PA have done and have the WV Parkways Authority float revenue bonds to pay for WVDOH projects.

[hbelkins]

I know West Virginia has a couple of special rate plans for its E-ZPass program. If they are concerned about capturing out-of-state revenue, perhaps they should really sweeten the deal for in-state drivers. Perhaps lower the rate for WV drivers to 50 cents or $1 per toll gate, and raise the rate for out-of-staters to $4 or $5. Or maybe even institute AET and allow vehicles with in-state plates to use the turnpike for free.

[GCrites80s]

Speaking of the service plazas, another way it's easy to tell which carriageway of the WV Turnpike is the original is that both of the service plazas (not counting Tamarack) are on the northbound lanes.

I've been on a few parts where the southbound carriageway seemed original due to the age of the concrete.