New York State Thruway

[seicer]

It says Boston to stay on the Thruway, but coming into this interchange from the north on I-87 it says to use free I-90 to Boston.

Also the Mass Pike Shield is nice off to the side of the Thruway shield.

The free I-90 is the cheaper way. Some people don't know about this and take the more expensive route by staying on I-87.

I notice that states will always direct traffic onto the toll road, even when the free way is the best way.

See: Portland as a control city on I-95 at the I-295/95 junction in West Gardiner, Maine. Even though I-295 goes through downtown Portland.

No, it's called toll authorities encouraging traffic to use their highways. In most of these cases, the toll authority placed the signage.

The toll authority is the state

As has been stated over and over again in these forums: No, it is not.  Public authorities (including NYSTA) may be created by the state, but they operate totally outside of it (essentially "spun off" from state government).  That lack of accountability (despite some Governor-appointed board members) is one of the reasons why I hate them.

This is the first time I've heard this - and as lame visitor who doesn't come here much, I would appreciate a more polite tone.

[cl94]

It says Boston to stay on the Thruway, but coming into this interchange from the north on I-87 it says to use free I-90 to Boston.

Also the Mass Pike Shield is nice off to the side of the Thruway shield.

The free I-90 is the cheaper way. Some people don't know about this and take the more expensive route by staying on I-87.

I notice that states will always direct traffic onto the toll road, even when the free way is the best way.

See: Portland as a control city on I-95 at the I-295/95 junction in West Gardiner, Maine. Even though I-295 goes through downtown Portland.

No, it's called toll authorities encouraging traffic to use their highways. In most of these cases, the toll authority placed the signage.

The toll authority is the state

As has been stated over and over again in these forums: No, it is not.  Public authorities (including NYSTA) may be created by the state, but they operate totally outside of it (essentially "spun off" from state government).  That lack of accountability (despite some Governor-appointed board members) is one of the reasons why I hate them.

No need for your dickish tone... In my mind created by the state it is "the state".. Just a different division. No different from the myriad of bureaucratic agencies etc.

But that doesn't mean your view is correct. Everyone in New York knows the Thruway Authority is its own entity. As Froggie said, many states have the toll authority as part of the state DOT and many do not. New York doesn't.

Maine is similar to New York in how it is structured, as are Ohio and Illinois.

[AMLNet49]

It says Boston to stay on the Thruway, but coming into this interchange from the north on I-87 it says to use free I-90 to Boston.

Also the Mass Pike Shield is nice off to the side of the Thruway shield.

The free I-90 is the cheaper way. Some people don't know about this and take the more expensive route by staying on I-87.

I notice that states will always direct traffic onto the toll road, even when the free way is the best way.

See: Portland as a control city on I-95 at the I-295/95 junction in West Gardiner, Maine. Even though I-295 goes through downtown Portland.

No, it's called toll authorities encouraging traffic to use their highways. In most of these cases, the toll authority placed the signage.

The toll authority is the state

As has been stated over and over again in these forums: No, it is not.  Public authorities (including NYSTA) may be created by the state, but they operate totally outside of it (essentially "spun off" from state government).  That lack of accountability (despite some Governor-appointed board members) is one of the reasons why I hate them.

No need for your dickish tone... In my mind created by the state it is "the state".. Just a different division. No different from the myriad of bureaucratic agencies etc.

But that doesn't mean your view is correct. Everyone in New York knows the Thruway Authority is its own entity. As Froggie said, many states have the toll authority as part of the state DOT and many do not. New York doesn't.

Maine is similar to New York in how it is structured, as are Ohio and Illinois.

Indeed. The toll highway authorities are self sustaining, almost like businesses. Tolls collected on the thruway for example don't go anywhere except back into Thruway maintenance.

[vdeane]

Not quite.  The Canal Corp was folded into the Thruway Authority, so some tolls go towards the canals (which are a financial drain).  They also pass along some money to NYSDOT.

[The Nature Boy]

To go back to my original point:

I-295 is maintained by the Maine Department of Transportation and the signage for the Falmouth Spur uses "NH - Mass" as the control city even when staying on I-295 is in fact quicker.

That is an example of a state DOT trying to at least direct money towards the Turnpike Authority.

[SignBridge]

Does anyone know what the bureaucratic structure was in Connecticut back when they had tolls on the Turnpike/I-95? I was never aware of any separate Authority back then.

[Alps]

To go back to my original point:

I-295 is maintained by the Maine Department of Transportation and the signage for the Falmouth Spur uses "NH - Mass" as the control city even when staying on I-295 is in fact quicker.

That is an example of a state DOT trying to at least direct money towards the Turnpike Authority.

Not necessarily, as they would want through traffic to bypass Portland.

[Beeper1]

Does anyone know what the bureaucratic structure was in Connecticut back when they had tolls on the Turnpike/I-95? I was never aware of any separate Authority back then.

Connecticut never had a separate authority for the old Conn Turnpike.  It was always administered by ConnDOT.   I believe the Merritt Parkway may have originally been under the control of a separate entity when it was first built, but was eventually taken over by ConnDOT by the 1950s.

[Pete from Boston]

It says Boston to stay on the Thruway, but coming into this interchange from the north on I-87 it says to use free I-90 to Boston.

Also the Mass Pike Shield is nice off to the side of the Thruway shield.

The free I-90 is the cheaper way. Some people don't know about this and take the more expensive route by staying on I-87.

I notice that states will always direct traffic onto the toll road, even when the free way is the best way.

See: Portland as a control city on I-95 at the I-295/95 junction in West Gardiner, Maine. Even though I-295 goes through downtown Portland.

No, it's called toll authorities encouraging traffic to use their highways. In most of these cases, the toll authority placed the signage.

The toll authority is the state

As has been stated over and over again in these forums: No, it is not.  Public authorities (including NYSTA) may be created by the state, but they operate totally outside of it (essentially "spun off" from state government).  That lack of accountability (despite some Governor-appointed board members) is one of the reasons why I hate them.

No need for your dickish tone... In my mind created by the state it is "the state".. Just a different division. No different from the myriad of bureaucratic agencies etc.

Depends on whether you mean "the state," the political subdivision of the United States, or "the state," the conceptual figment that is the government ("l'etat" in "l'etat, c'est moi.")

The Port Authority of New York and New Jersey's power derives from Congress, so it falls under the latter but not the former.  Its directors are chosen by the state governors, but that is the extent of its political or fiscal tie to state government.

[shadyjay]

To go back to my original point:

I-295 is maintained by the Maine Department of Transportation and the signage for the Falmouth Spur uses "NH - Mass" as the control city even when staying on I-295 is in fact quicker.

That is an example of a state DOT trying to at least direct money towards the Turnpike Authority.

That, and probably also since I-95 was the "thru route" (Maine Tpke, Falmouth Spur, I-295 north of spur) before the great renumbering c 2004. 

[Rothman]

It says Boston to stay on the Thruway, but coming into this interchange from the north on I-87 it says to use free I-90 to Boston.

Also the Mass Pike Shield is nice off to the side of the Thruway shield.

The free I-90 is the cheaper way. Some people don't know about this and take the more expensive route by staying on I-87.

I notice that states will always direct traffic onto the toll road, even when the free way is the best way.

See: Portland as a control city on I-95 at the I-295/95 junction in West Gardiner, Maine. Even though I-295 goes through downtown Portland.

No, it's called toll authorities encouraging traffic to use their highways. In most of these cases, the toll authority placed the signage.

The toll authority is the state

As has been stated over and over again in these forums: No, it is not.  Public authorities (including NYSTA) may be created by the state, but they operate totally outside of it (essentially "spun off" from state government).  That lack of accountability (despite some Governor-appointed board members) is one of the reasons why I hate them.

No need for your dickish tone... In my mind created by the state it is "the state".. Just a different division. No different from the myriad of bureaucratic agencies etc.

It's this mentality that leads the public to be easily misled into blaming the wrong people for bad behavior.

Thanks, Obama.

[Duke87]

In my mind created by the state it is "the state".. Just a different division. No different from the myriad of bureaucratic agencies etc.

It's this mentality that leads the public to be easily misled into blaming the wrong people for bad behavior.

Eh. I'll allow it under the principle of "the buck stops here". Just because the state government of New York has seen fit to create semi-autonomous "public benefit corporations" with the intention of shielding themselves from accountability does not mean we ought to let them off the hook as they would like us to do. The state has the authority to consolidate or dissolve these entities at any time if they see fit.

For the purpose of what started this argument, though, you are correct - NYSTA's decision to guide through traffic to stay on the Thruway rather than follow 90 was made by them, not the state government.

[roadman65]

I think the whole purpose behind the Boston and Mass Pike to stay on the Thruway was made as many non road geeks following I-90 to Boston know that that staying on 90 off the toll road goes there as well.   It just suggests to them that they could use the Thruway and the Berkshire Section to get there in a means to bypass Downtown Albany.

Remember non road geeks probably know that I-90 goes all the way to Boston and no break in route continuity.  Plus the GPS I am sure will send them on Free I-90 anyway.

[cl94]

I think the whole purpose behind the Boston and Mass Pike to stay on the Thruway was made as many non road geeks following I-90 to Boston know that that staying on 90 off the toll road goes there as well.   It just suggests to them that they could use the Thruway and the Berkshire Section to get there in a means to bypass Downtown Albany.

Remember non road geeks probably know that I-90 goes all the way to Boston and no break in route continuity.  Plus the GPS I am sure will send them on Free I-90 anyway.

Google Maps and Mapquest often route people down to Exit 21A. Saves one minute if driving the speed limit. I'd rather save money and have easy access to cheaper gas/food.

[roadman65]

I think the whole purpose behind the Boston and Mass Pike to stay on the Thruway was made as many non road geeks following I-90 to Boston know that that staying on 90 off the toll road goes there as well.   It just suggests to them that they could use the Thruway and the Berkshire Section to get there in a means to bypass Downtown Albany.

Remember non road geeks probably know that I-90 goes all the way to Boston and no break in route continuity.  Plus the GPS I am sure will send them on Free I-90 anyway.

Google Maps and Mapquest often route people down to Exit 21A. Saves one minute if driving the speed limit. I'd rather save money and have easy access to cheaper gas/food.

Me too. If I went from Syracuse to Boston, I would cut through town on free I-90.  I would only do the unnumbered Berkshire for clinching purposes only.

[Rothman]

Remember that the 45 mph work zone limit is still in effect around the Patroon Island Bridge (Free I-90's speed limit is 55 through Albany until Defreestville).  Also, as surprising as it may seem, Albany does have a rush hour where "Exit 24" (Thruway/Northway/Free I-90) and the I-90/I-787 interchanges do get congested.

Thruway can be faster, with a constant 65 mph speed limit, especially now with the lane that the Thruway "recently" added.

[vdeane]

Heck, Albany's rush hour is arguably WORSE than any other upstate city's rush hour.

[cl94]

Heck, Albany's rush hour is arguably WORSE than any other upstate city's rush hour.

I agree completely. The Northway is often stopped approaching the Twin Bridges. Buffalo has virtually no traffic (regardless of what people around here like to say). Rochester is a little worse, but not nearly as bad as Albany.

[SignBridge]

I drove north on the Thruway in Rockland County this past week and I was surprised at the signing for Exit-14B/Garden State Pkwy. The signs show a "standard" exit configuration, but it's actually not. The right-lane is an option-lane there is a lane-drop of an auxiliary-lane that starts maybe a half-mile back at the entrance from Route-59. It should have been signed accordingly but it's not. Thruway Authority must be asleep at their drawing boards, so to speak. But then, they've never been really sharp about signing.

[cl94]

I drove north on the Thruway in Rockland County this past week and I was surprised at the signing for Exit-14B/Garden State Pkwy. The signs show a "standard" exit configuration, but it's actually not. The right-lane is an option-lane there is a lane-drop of an auxiliary-lane that starts maybe a half-mile back at the entrance from Route-59. It should have been signed accordingly but it's not. Thruway Authority must be asleep at their drawing boards, so to speak. But then, they've never been really sharp about signing.

I can almost assure you that it will be replaced by an APL at some point. NYSTA option lane signage Upstate has been replaced by APLs when option lanes are installed or signs replaced.

[SignBridge]

Should have been done already, when the lane configuration was changed. Bet even NYS DOT Region-10 would have done it........

[cl94]

Should have been done already, when the lane configuration was changed. Bet even NYS DOT Region-10 would have done it........

It has been an option lane since long before NYSTA started using APLs

[Buffaboy]

So much sensationalism in this article, can anyone fill us in? cl94?

The Thruway's almost nightly eastbound backups — the joy of radio traffic reporters and the bane of commuters near the "big blue water tower"  — should be headed toward extinction under state plans to add a fourth lane to the superhighway.

Thruway Authority officials plan to add a fourth eastbound lane to the approximately one-mile stretch between the Youngmann Highway and Kensington Expressway. A fourth westbound lane was added to that section last year.

The result will be an "LA type"  stretch — rare for upstate — featuring eight lanes of two-way traffic in what Thruway officials label one of the nation's 50 most congested bottlenecks.

"There's really been a positive impact on the westbound lanes,"  said Maria C. Lehman, the Thruway Authority's interim executive director. "Now this will provide a better approach there where you have all that congestion."

Traffic tie-ups are a frequent affair during rush hour on this stretch of the Thruway as commuters leaving the city head east toward the Williamsville toll barrier. Volume on the Thruway's "free section"  hits about 145,000 vehicles daily, Lehman said, almost twice as much as the Kensington Expressway and equivalent to the Thruway's busiest downstate stretches near the Tappan Zee Bridge.

http://www.buffalonews.com/city-region/traffic/eight-lane-superhighway-expected-to-relieve-blue-water-tower-backups-20160204

[cl94]

So much sensationalism in this article, can anyone fill us in? cl94?

The Thruway's almost nightly eastbound backups — the joy of radio traffic reporters and the bane of commuters near the "big blue water tower"  — should be headed toward extinction under state plans to add a fourth lane to the superhighway.

Thruway Authority officials plan to add a fourth eastbound lane to the approximately one-mile stretch between the Youngmann Highway and Kensington Expressway. A fourth westbound lane was added to that section last year.

The result will be an "LA type"  stretch — rare for upstate — featuring eight lanes of two-way traffic in what Thruway officials label one of the nation's 50 most congested bottlenecks.

"There's really been a positive impact on the westbound lanes,"  said Maria C. Lehman, the Thruway Authority's interim executive director. "Now this will provide a better approach there where you have all that congestion."

Traffic tie-ups are a frequent affair during rush hour on this stretch of the Thruway as commuters leaving the city head east toward the Williamsville toll barrier. Volume on the Thruway's "free section"  hits about 145,000 vehicles daily, Lehman said, almost twice as much as the Kensington Expressway and equivalent to the Thruway's busiest downstate stretches near the Tappan Zee Bridge.

http://www.buffalonews.com/city-region/traffic/eight-lane-superhighway-expected-to-relieve-blue-water-tower-backups-20160204

You mean the 8th lane they just added? I don't know what the hell they're talking about because it already has 8 lanes. Maybe they're referring to how NYSTA wants to extend the auxiliary lane from the EB-EB loop ramp to where the WB ramp merges in?

It also isn't that rare - 8+ lanes between exits is normal in Albany when exits are spaced that closely. Almost all of I-90 between the Thruway and I-787 is 8-9 lanes between exits.

[Buffaboy]

So much sensationalism in this article, can anyone fill us in? cl94?

The Thruway’s almost nightly eastbound backups – the joy of radio traffic reporters and the bane of commuters near the “big blue water tower” – should be headed toward extinction under state plans to add a fourth lane to the superhighway.

Thruway Authority officials plan to add a fourth eastbound lane to the approximately one-mile stretch between the Youngmann Highway and Kensington Expressway. A fourth westbound lane was added to that section last year.

The result will be an “LA type” stretch – rare for upstate – featuring eight lanes of two-way traffic in what Thruway officials label one of the nation’s 50 most congested bottlenecks.

“There’s really been a positive impact on the westbound lanes,” said Maria C. Lehman, the Thruway Authority’s interim executive director. “Now this will provide a better approach there where you have all that congestion.”

Traffic tie-ups are a frequent affair during rush hour on this stretch of the Thruway as commuters leaving the city head east toward the Williamsville toll barrier. Volume on the Thruway’s “free section” hits about 145,000 vehicles daily, Lehman said, almost twice as much as the Kensington Expressway and equivalent to the Thruway’s busiest downstate stretches near the Tappan Zee Bridge.

http://www.buffalonews.com/city-region/traffic/eight-lane-superhighway-expected-to-relieve-blue-water-tower-backups-20160204

You mean the 8th lane they just added? I don't know what the hell they're talking about because it already has 8 lanes. Maybe they're referring to how NYSTA wants to extend the auxiliary lane from the EB-EB loop ramp to where the WB ramp merges in?

It also isn't that rare - 8+ lanes between exits is normal in Albany when exits are spaced that closely. Almost all of I-90 between the Thruway and I-787 is 8-9 lanes between exits.

Yeah this didn't make sense at all...

If I wasn't thinking, I would have thought they were building a beltway or something — this was the headline:

"Eight-lane superhighway expected to relieve blue water tower backups"

Maybe they mean four travel lanes?

Edit: they said they want to build sound barriers up to the Cheektowaga backyards, maybe they are actually doing the widening to 4 travel lanes as well as keeping the exit lanes