Atlanta, GA 1/28-29/ 2014 Snowmageddon

[froggie]

To be fair, it hasn't just been Atlanta or Birmingham either.  We had the snow bullseye here in Norfolk, with several Hampton Roads locations reporting 10 inches.  Some of you have probably seen the photos I've posted on Facebook and Twitter of the snow around here.

[NJRoadfan]

Atlanta area:


Anyone want to go skating on I-285?

[agentsteel53]

Anyone want to go skating on I-285?

sure.  looks like some Minnesota conditions I ran into several weeks ago. 

at least, there, they have the good sense to ditch in the ... well, the ditch.  as opposed to clogging the road with their failure.

[ZLoth]

To be fair, it hasn't just been Atlanta or Birmingham either.  We had the snow bullseye here in Norfolk, with several Hampton Roads locations reporting 10 inches.  Some of you have probably seen the photos I've posted on Facebook and Twitter of the snow around here.

To my defense, I saw the road conditions map posted on the "FreewayJim" Facebook page when Mark Demidovich stated "I've been working for Georgia DOT for 20+ years and NEVER in my career have I seen the entire freeway system turn red (i.e. <20 mph). This is a snowstorm for the (traffic) books." This was also combined with some posts from news organizations at 10 PM PT on my Twitter feed of kids still stuck on school buses HOURS after leaving school.

At what point do you look at the weather forecast and say "**** it, I'm taking the day off!"? I live in Sacramento, so the likelihood of severe weather like Atlanta and such experienced is rare.

[rickmastfan67]

Remember the Weather channel has this ridiculous knack for NAMING winter storms;.... So its not Snowmageddon anymore its Winter Storm LEON and apparently TWC is stating that its A DIRE SITUATION. yeah its dangerous out there but stay indoors and be safe. Stop blowing things out of proprotion... No wonder DirecTV stopped carrying them.... Enough of the sensationalism.

End Rant

TWC just isn't what it used to be. Ever since NBC/Comcast bought them, things have seemed to have went down hill. This is also a pretty clear case of mission creep, but applied to cable television.

I'm betting Al Roker has his hands in making the TWC turn into junk.  I'm betting that he was the one to give them the idea to name the winter storms...

[Chris]

How often do you see such extreme icing in metro areas up north? Atlanta's topography of low hills also doesn't help.

Atlanta has a large amount of freeway lane miles and not a lot of equipment to treat the freeways before the snow event began. Having all of the metro area leave at the same time was a major factor, the roads became so clogged that spreaders and plows didn't got through at all. Most traffic cameras revealed a huge amount of tractor-trailers being stuck.

Another factor could be the Atlanta freeway network itself. Unlike say, Minneapolis-St. Paul, there are very few alternate routes due to the radial network built for Atlanta of the 1960s. They have a limited, but very wide freeway network that carries traffic volumes that are much higher than in MSP. If you get semis stuck on hills, everything becomes gridlocked very fast.

We had this a few times in the Netherlands as well, where as few as one inch of snow can paralyze traffic with hundreds of miles of traffic jams. If the roads completely ice over sometimes trucks can't even get across interchange ramps and connectors.

edit: I found this overview that shows how extremely fast the freeway network came to a standstill. In basically 20 minutes, half of the metro freeway network went from free-flow to gridlock.

[Brandon]

How often do you see such extreme icing in metro areas up north? Atlanta's topography of low hills also doesn't help.

We often see lake effect snow squalls that can cause whiteout conditions in mere seconds.  That's what happened on I-94 in Indiana last week causing a 46 vehicle (19 semi-truck) pileup, killing 3.  These squalls have been known to dump over a foot or two of snow at rates over two inches an hour.

I went to college in Houghton, Michigan.  Houghton is known for averaging 220 inches of snow in a season (October through May) and has hills.  These hills start at lake level (600 feet above mean sea level) and go up to 1,200 feet above mean sea level in less than a half mile.

Anyone want to go skating on I-285?

Actually, it looks drivable.  The road is clear, the sun is out, and not a snow squall in sight.

Yoopers would laugh at such problems as they have down south right now.  These are folks who go 60-70 on snow-packed two-lane roads.

[kurumi]

TWC just isn't what it used to be. Ever since NBC/Comcast bought them, things have seemed to have went down hill. This is also a pretty clear case of mission creep, but applied to cable television.

Otherwise known as http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/NetworkDecay -- all channels eventually become reality TV

(sorry for TVTropes link; enjoy your day)

[realjd]

How often do you see such extreme icing in metro areas up north? Atlanta's topography of low hills also doesn't help.

We often see lake effect snow squalls that can cause whiteout conditions in mere seconds.  That's what happened on I-94 in Indiana last week causing a 46 vehicle (19 semi-truck) pileup, killing 3.  These squalls have been known to dump over a foot or two of snow at rates over two inches an hour.

I went to college in Houghton, Michigan.  Houghton is known for averaging 220 inches of snow in a season (October through May) and has hills.  These hills start at lake level (600 feet above mean sea level) and go up to 1,200 feet above mean sea level in less than a half mile.

Anyone want to go skating on I-285?

Actually, it looks drivable.  The road is clear, the sun is out, and not a snow squall in sight.

Yoopers would laugh at such problems as they have down south right now.  These are folks who go 60-70 on snow-packed two-lane roads.

That's not a snow packed road. That's a sheet of solid ice. Even Yoopers wouldn't be going 60-70 down a sheet of ice.

[Brandon]

^^ Ice can be driven on, contrary to the opinion of some.  People do it all the time whether ice fishing, operating the Zamboni, etc.  On ice like that, keeping it down to 30-35 works.  And yes, the freeway in the photo is drivable.  Just keep your distance from other vehicles.  Don't bunch up, don't make sudden steering movements, and for god's sake, don't fucking touch the fucking brake pedal.

Please, there was no reason for the panic or panicking of people beforehand.  It's not the first time Atlanta has gotten ice and snow, and it won't be the last.  One would think they'd have learned a little bit of skill over the years.  But no, we hear about this on the national media damn near every fricking year.

[agentsteel53]

don't fucking touch the fucking brake pedal.

oh, and if you do, learn what happens the first time, so don't fucking do it again.

[Brian556]

Just like in the DEC 2013 event here in North Texas, it seems that a good portion of the problem is caused by semi's getting stuck on the ice and blocking traffic.

The DOT's need to take notice of this phenomenon and strongly consider requiring commercial trucks to use chains during winter weather events, or not drive at all.

It is not right that they are blocking traffic and causing smaller vehicles that could otherwise drive on the ice just fine to be trapped for hours/days.

Colorado and other areas that see frequent snow/ice do have chain requirements, and I'm guessing that it probably is pretty effective.
The people in charge In the south are clueless, and don't seem smart enough to learn from past mistakes/situations, or to make an effort to research the matter and how it's handled successfully in other areas.

[jemacedo9]

Just like in the DEC 2013 event here in North Texas, it seems that a good portion of the problem is caused by semi's getting stuck on the ice and blocking traffic.

I agree...that does seem to be the issue here...at least on the freeways.  Once traffic behind the stuck trucks gets backed up, and the spillover hits side street detour routes, then accidents get thrown into the mix, then the salt trucks are trapped in traffic, and then...   

[jeffandnicole]

Blaming it on the trucks is a huge stretch, especially when you're looking at a single photo. The situation is common when there's an accident that shuts down a highway. Cars can maneuver around small areas, or turn around and reverse down the highway. Truckers can't do that. That can move forward until they can't move anymore and that's where they stay. Many of them have an advantage over cars in one area though when they can't go anywhere...sleeping quarters within the cab.   

[BamaZeus]

This is pretty impressive GoPro footage of Birmingham from a private quadcopter/drone.
http://blog.al.com/spotnews/2014/01/eye_in_the_sky_private_drone_c.html

It made me immediately think of the future as far as applications toward roadgeek type stuff.  There are obvious current limitations of battery life, distance from the source, etc. 

But, I could envision these things being used in an instant traffic report situation, or maybe a short roadgeek-style video.  Maybe at some point they'll replace the helicopter/airplane for overhead shots of sporting events.

Just something to think about.

[UNDSIOUX]

Just out of pure curiosity, I have been following a lot of the local coverage of the Atlanta storm (WSB, AJC.com, etc.).  I dread driving through Atlanta during our trips to Florida because you have to stay on your toes on what route to take (Perimeter or though town) to avoid traffic, and I have been interested in seeing what people were saying what caused this mess.

One of the major issues that people have talked about is the amount of truck traffic that got stuck on I-75 and other freeways inside the Perimeter.  Local law says semis cannot be there unless they have a local delivery or a base/depot inside of I-285, and with the amount of trucks that got stuck, it seems a lot of them were taking a shortcut through the city that day (though I-285 fared no better).

If this is the case, I hope the Georgia State Police was handing out hefty tickets to the trucking companies/drivers that had no proof (bill of lading, logbooks, etc). of needing to be there before they got them moving again.  I-75 and I-85 are a mess with the amount of cars already on there on a normal day and I can only imagine having a few trucks barely moving getting in the way (which some pics show).   

Atlanta is a city cursed with a lot of transient traffic because of the piss poor highway planning down there and some terrain limitations.  If you are going to Florida, you pretty much are stuck going through the Atlanta area unless you want to jog around it on US highways.  This situation will get no better in the years to come- the trucks will be there for sure doing their north to south runs unless there are plans to move the transient traffic away from the city and suburbs.  And while the area continues to grow and the sprawl gets worse and worse,  I can only see a repeat of this again until the infrastructure in improved.

[froggie]

In light of what UNDSIOUX posted, Atlanta is in a catch-22.  Unless they manage to find a way to shift that "transient traffic" to rail, any improvement made to address the transient traffic will just invite more sprawl.

[JoeP]

The roads were impacted very quickly in Atlanta. I left work 12:30ish and it was jammed solid.  All of the traffic compounded the mess. Don't forget, Atlanta isn't flat. It took me 9 hours to get home.  At certain points later in the evening, when I finally was out of gridlock, I was faced with icy hilly roads and had to work my way through the easiest path (with abandoned cars everywhere).

And once somebody stops - for whatever reason - going up a hill... it's a mess as I'm sure you all know... you lose momentum, some cars got stuck and then you have to try to get momentum without getting stuck too.

Most side roads where jammed too most of the day.

[Brandon]

In light of what UNDSIOUX posted, Atlanta is in a catch-22.  Unless they manage to find a way to shift that "transient traffic" to rail, any improvement made to address the transient traffic will just invite more sprawl.

That "transient traffic" isn't going to go to rail.  Maybe some local traffic, but through traffic is far less likely to do so.

The best option is just to avoid Atlanta if possible.  From here, I'd go down I-65 to Montgomery, then cut across to I-10 via Dothan, Alabama.

[froggie]

By "transient traffic", I was referring moreso to the trucks, many of which probably could be shifted to rail.

[Brandon]

By "transient traffic", I was referring moreso to the trucks, many of which probably could be shifted to rail.

Maybe, but not likely.  Much of what is on rail is already on rail.  A lot of these trucks are either deliveries that need to be made faster than rail can deliver them, or they are coming from/going to an intermodal yard and still need to get through the area.