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Author Topic: Interstate 14  (Read 7593 times)

HemiCRZ

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Interstate 14
« on: November 09, 2021, 12:35:54 AM »

It seems that Congress has given the green light to I-14 to expand beyond Texas. Whether the states build it, that's up for grabs without more federal money, but the official designation is there now.

https://www.natchezdemocrat.com/2021/11/08/local-leaders-elated-at-passage-of-1-trillion-infrastructure-bill-that-includes-i-14/

https://www.magnoliastatelive.com/2021/11/06/1t-infrastructure-bill-awaiting-bidens-signature-will-kick-start-next-phase-of-interstate-14-through-mississippi/

Mississippi all but abandoned I-69, so I have similar expectations for this. There are a few things I could see that would provide more incentive to build this than I-69 though. For one, most of US 84 is extremely rural, so upgrading to a freeway could be done relatively easy. MDOT has already bypassed most of the towns along US 84 with expressway. There's already a 82 mile freeway from the junction with I-59 in Laurel to US 80 in Cuba, AL. Closer proximity to population centers (Natchez, Collins, Laurel, Meridian, Hattiesburg), and overall a better economy in this region of the state compared to the region that I-69 passes through.

I don't think the current bridges across the Mississippi River for US 84 in Natchez/Vidalia, LA are freeway grade so those would need upgrade/replacement. Bringing another proper freeway-grade facility into Laurel, especially from the west, would be challenging in my opinion due to development and fitting a proper stack interchange with flyovers into the I-59 alignment in Laurel would also be challenging.

What are the thoughts of the masses?
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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #1 on: November 09, 2021, 01:04:04 AM »

Quote
For one, most of US 84 is extremely rural, so upgrading to a freeway could be done relatively easy.

Not necessarily.  84 may be rural, but it also has direct property access.  The more rural areas along 84 have an acute lack of a road network which means providing alternative access to those properties becomes a lot more difficult and a lot more expensive.

Traffic volumes don't even warrant a 4-lane road along much of 84, let alone an Interstate.  MDOT would do far better to use that money to improve 49 between Gulfport and Jackson...a corridor that actually DOES have the population and volumes to justify spending the money.
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SkyPesos

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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #2 on: November 09, 2021, 01:14:34 AM »

I don't know MS that well, but is I-14 actually needed in the state? It sits roughly 70-80 miles north of I-10, and 50-60 miles south of I-20, and doesn't pass through any sizable cities in the state, which are conditions that aren't really in favor of another E-W interstate through the state. I-20's AADT isn't that high either from the DOT map, at around 20k east of Jackson, and 30k west of Jackson.

The first place I would place I-14 in the southeast is the proposed Meridian-Montgomery interstate.
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Rothman

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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2021, 06:49:06 AM »

The second article doesn't say if there's any money attached to the designation in the bill, unless I missed it.  First article is paywalled.
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froggie

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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #4 on: November 09, 2021, 09:39:17 AM »

First article didn't mention it either, so I looked at the actual bill text.  There are no specific earmarks or apportionments for I-14 from what I could tell.
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Rothman

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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #5 on: November 09, 2021, 09:41:00 AM »

That means it has to come out of the existing apportionments.  Could be a long time before states can squeeze the work into their capital programs.
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Henry

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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #6 on: November 09, 2021, 10:50:30 AM »

I don't know about LA or GA, but is AL still trying to get that I-85 westward (or southward) extension done? That would conflict with I-14 running along the same corridor, if I'm not mistaken, and the Fall Line Freeway is a misnomer, as it's not even close to being one, not to mention that it would be out of place in the grid between Macon and Augusta, with I-16 existing to serve Savannah. Perhaps a wait-and-see situation for the states to the east?
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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #7 on: November 09, 2021, 10:57:41 AM »

I don't know about LA or GA, but is AL still trying to get that I-85 westward (or southward) extension done? That would conflict with I-14 running along the same corridor, if I'm not mistaken, and the Fall Line Freeway is a misnomer, as it's not even close to being one, not to mention that it would be out of place in the grid between Macon and Augusta, with I-16 existing to serve Savannah. Perhaps a wait-and-see situation for the states to the east?

Conflict? I saw a document labeling Meridian-Montgomery as proposed I-14. It's the same road.
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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #8 on: November 09, 2021, 12:21:15 PM »

You can make an argument for I-14 in certain parts of Texas, and there are a couple of areas where an upgrade of roadways would be nice in the other states, but for the most part, I don't see the entire project overall helping travel.  To me, even some of the remote Arkansas/Louisiana/Mississippi parts of I-69 could have more benefit when done than I-14 as a whole.
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Tom958

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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #9 on: November 09, 2021, 08:23:23 PM »

I don't know about LA or GA, but is AL still trying to get that I-85 westward (or southward) extension done? That would conflict with I-14 running along the same corridor, if I'm not mistaken, and the Fall Line Freeway is a misnomer, as it's not even close to being one, not to mention that it would be out of place in the grid between Macon and Augusta, with I-16 existing to serve Savannah. Perhaps a wait-and-see situation for the states to the east?

I prefer Fall Line Four Lane myself.  :bigass:

Georgia DOT's Statewide Freight and Logistics Plan found that a four-lane corridor between LaGrange and Macon would be an extremely good idea, with a ludicrously favorable benefit-cost ratio. That was largely because trucks could use it and US 27 to bypass Atlanta. No way it'll ever happen, but I'd like to see a study of a full-blown freeway between LaGrange and Bolingbroke, just north of where I-475 meets I-75. I think it'd perform well, and I think it'd be a better route for I-14 than upgrading or replacing the existing non-freeway route of GA 540 west of I-75. 
« Last Edit: November 25, 2021, 08:59:56 PM by Tom958 »
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kernals12

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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #10 on: November 11, 2021, 10:41:45 PM »

This project seems like it would be helpful for easing the freight bottlenecks that are in the news so much these days. Taking one of the two existing East West Interstates takes you through either Dallas-Fort Worth and Atlanta or San Antonio, Houston, and Jacksonville. Skipping that congestion must shave several hours off the trip.
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The Ghostbuster

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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #11 on: November 12, 2021, 01:31:27 PM »

The Interstate 14 proposed in 2005 always seemed like a pipe dream to me (same with the wrongly-numbered Interstate 3 proposal, which is probably why nothing has become of them in the 16 years since). The farthest east I see Texas's Interstate 14 getting is Interstate 49 in Alexandria, LA, and I'd be very surprised if it ever leaves Texas.
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golden eagle

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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #12 on: November 17, 2021, 12:46:24 PM »

Quote
For one, most of US 84 is extremely rural, so upgrading to a freeway could be done relatively easy.

Not necessarily.  84 may be rural, but it also has direct property access.  The more rural areas along 84 have an acute lack of a road network which means providing alternative access to those properties becomes a lot more difficult and a lot more expensive.

Traffic volumes don't even warrant a 4-lane road along much of 84, let alone an Interstate.  MDOT would do far better to use that money to improve 49 between Gulfport and Jackson...a corridor that actually DOES have the population and volumes to justify spending the money.

I donít know if itís been mentioned in either article, but a San Angelo news website said that a spur interstate is proposed to connect to the Port of Gulfport. Thereís been talk of that for quite a while. I even remember reading about a proposed Jackson-to-Gulfport interstate before Katrina struck. Perhaps, this will tie into I-14?
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golden eagle

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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #13 on: November 17, 2021, 03:37:28 PM »

I don't know MS that well, but is I-14 actually needed in the state? It sits roughly 70-80 miles north of I-10, and 50-60 miles south of I-20, and doesn't pass through any sizable cities in the state, which are conditions that aren't really in favor of another E-W interstate through the state. I-20's AADT isn't that high either from the DOT map, at around 20k east of Jackson, and 30k west of Jackson.

The first place I would place I-14 in the southeast is the proposed Meridian-Montgomery interstate.

I-14 could serve as an alternate route for travel in the event that a hurricane threatens the Gulf Coast region.
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kendallhart808

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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #14 on: November 17, 2021, 11:34:11 PM »

Quote
For one, most of US 84 is extremely rural, so upgrading to a freeway could be done relatively easy.

Not necessarily.  84 may be rural, but it also has direct property access.  The more rural areas along 84 have an acute lack of a road network which means providing alternative access to those properties becomes a lot more difficult and a lot more expensive.

Traffic volumes don't even warrant a 4-lane road along much of 84, let alone an Interstate.  MDOT would do far better to use that money to improve 49 between Gulfport and Jackson...a corridor that actually DOES have the population and volumes to justify spending the money.

I donít know if itís been mentioned in either article, but a San Angelo news website said that a spur interstate is proposed to connect to the Port of Gulfport. Thereís been talk of that for quite a while. I even remember reading about a proposed Jackson-to-Gulfport interstate before Katrina struck. Perhaps, this will tie into I-14?
Looking at the map itíll just be between Gulfport and I-59 in Hattiesburg. I canít imagine it being anything more than an I-X59 honestly since itís less than 70 miles between the two.

For the rest of the route, I just canít imagine it being beneficial between I-45 and Columbus, GA. I get the idea of building an Augusta-Columbus Interstate to bypass Atlanta and Central TX could use an East-west route. But the rest of the route really just hugs I-20 in a way that I think will be a waste.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2021, 11:37:39 PM by kendallhart808 »
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The Ghostbuster

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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #15 on: November 19, 2021, 03:16:58 PM »

golden eagle, the Interstate spur you mention is Interstate 310: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstate_310_(Mississippi). As the page says, construction was to begin in 2008, but never did, and I have a feeling 310 will never be constructed. This swath of land is likely all that will ever exist of Interstate 310 in Gulfport: https://www.google.com/maps/@30.3994983,-89.1174788,3988m/data=!3m1!1e3.
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Tom958

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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #16 on: November 25, 2021, 09:27:12 PM »

A triple multiplex with I-59 and I-20 is both silly and unnecessary. The I-14 corridor should end at I-59, and the parts in Alabama and Georgia should be I-18.
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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #17 on: November 25, 2021, 09:56:39 PM »

I don't know MS that well, but is I-14 actually needed in the state? It sits roughly 70-80 miles north of I-10, and 50-60 miles south of I-20, and doesn't pass through any sizable cities in the state, which are conditions that aren't really in favor of another E-W interstate through the state. I-20's AADT isn't that high either from the DOT map, at around 20k east of Jackson, and 30k west of Jackson.

The first place I would place I-14 in the southeast is the proposed Meridian-Montgomery interstate.

I-14 could serve as an alternate route for travel in the event that a hurricane threatens the Gulf Coast region.

It is as a whole predominately east west. To really get away from a hurricane you generally prefer to go in a northerly direction. . While the real devastation happens at one point, hundreds of miles are often within the forecast of landfall and the hurricane itself generally wields a path fifty or more miles wide. An east / west route is not nearly as effective as a N/ S one.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2021, 10:10:53 PM by bwana39 »
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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #18 on: November 25, 2021, 11:02:47 PM »

A triple multiplex with I-59 and I-20 is both silly and unnecessary. The I-14 corridor should end at I-59, and the parts in Alabama and Georgia should be I-18.
Save the I-18 number for Austin-Houston, whenever that becomes an interstate.
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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #19 on: November 25, 2021, 11:46:21 PM »

A triple multiplex with I-59 and I-20 is both silly and unnecessary. The I-14 corridor should end at I-59, and the parts in Alabama and Georgia should be I-18.
Save the I-18 number for Austin-Houston, whenever that becomes an interstate.
That portion can be a spur off I-35 - call it 335 or 535 or whatever. That would save I-18 for something more substantial.
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Tom958

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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #20 on: November 26, 2021, 12:10:09 PM »

A triple multiplex with I-59 and I-20 is both silly and unnecessary. The I-14 corridor should end at I-59, and the parts in Alabama and Georgia should be I-18.
Save the I-18 number for Austin-Houston, whenever that becomes an interstate.
That portion can be a spur off I-35 - call it 335 or 535 or whatever. That would save I-18 for something more substantial.

Or don't bother, because I-14, 18, whatever won't be built in Alabama or Georgia.
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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #21 on: November 26, 2021, 12:28:44 PM »

A triple multiplex with I-59 and I-20 is both silly and unnecessary. The I-14 corridor should end at I-59, and the parts in Alabama and Georgia should be I-18.
Save the I-18 number for Austin-Houston, whenever that becomes an interstate.
That portion can be a spur off I-35 - call it 335 or 535 or whatever. That would save I-18 for something more substantial.
I guess I donít see 2di status as something that has be one of length. Houston and Austin are #4 and #10 in the nation by population. Being in the same state, why not get a 2di?


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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #22 on: November 29, 2021, 01:27:05 AM »

A triple multiplex with I-59 and I-20 is both silly and unnecessary. The I-14 corridor should end at I-59, and the parts in Alabama and Georgia should be I-18.
Save the I-18 number for Austin-Houston, whenever that becomes an interstate.
That portion can be a spur off I-35 - call it 335 or 535 or whatever. That would save I-18 for something more substantial.
I guess I donít see 2di status as something that has be one of length. Houston and Austin are #4 and #10 in the nation by population. Being in the same state, why not get a 2di?

In that case, how about I-12?
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DenverBrian

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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #23 on: November 29, 2021, 01:21:11 PM »

A triple multiplex with I-59 and I-20 is both silly and unnecessary. The I-14 corridor should end at I-59, and the parts in Alabama and Georgia should be I-18.
Save the I-18 number for Austin-Houston, whenever that becomes an interstate.
That portion can be a spur off I-35 - call it 335 or 535 or whatever. That would save I-18 for something more substantial.
I guess I donít see 2di status as something that has be one of length. Houston and Austin are #4 and #10 in the nation by population. Being in the same state, why not get a 2di?

In that case, how about I-12?
I-12 is an even more ridiculous case of a 2di, already taken north of New Orleans by a freeway that SHOULD be I-210 or some such.
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froggie

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Re: Interstate 14
« Reply #24 on: November 29, 2021, 02:05:49 PM »

^ I-76, I-84, I-86, I-87, and I-88 all say hi to your "already taken" comment...
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