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Madison Beltline Study

Started by The Ghostbuster, April 16, 2015, 01:25:00 PM

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hobsini2

Yes I call it a phobia of some, both here and in various DOTs, that have a need to replace every single left exit and entrance. At this interchange, there is plenty of distance between US 51 and I-39/90 as well as between US 12 and I-94/Wis 30 that left hand exits could remain. But that's just me.
I knew it. I'm surrounded by assholes. Keep firing, assholes! - Dark Helmet (Spaceballs)


froggie

QuoteNo, 55 mph or better is necessary for a freeway to freeway ramp.  Speed should be able to be maintained between freeways.

For those who have a phobia for using a brake pedal, perhaps.  But it's not always feasible for any of a multitude of reasons.  Slowing down to 45 MPH for a freeway ramp isn't the end of the world, you know...

That said, I haven't looked at the specific geometry for 39/90 at the Beltline (yet), so what hobsini posted might be possible.

The Ghostbuster

I still think some sort of lane pricing should be implemented, otherwise the road will just fill back up. Not that I'm a proponent of the "induced travel" theory.

hobsini2

Quote from: froggie on April 22, 2015, 09:53:08 AM
QuoteNo, 55 mph or better is necessary for a freeway to freeway ramp.  Speed should be able to be maintained between freeways.

For those who have a phobia for using a brake pedal, perhaps.  But it's not always feasible for any of a multitude of reasons.  Slowing down to 45 MPH for a freeway ramp isn't the end of the world, you know...

That said, I haven't looked at the specific geometry for 39/90 at the Beltline (yet), so what hobsini posted might be possible.

Froggie, having grown up in Central Wisconsin and Northern Illinois, I can tell you that geometrically 39/90 at the Beltline is one of the few places in this part of the Midwest you can have a 55 mph 2 lane ramp in the current footprint from end to end.
I knew it. I'm surrounded by assholes. Keep firing, assholes! - Dark Helmet (Spaceballs)

triplemultiplex

The current EB-NB ramp can be taken at 55 in a car quite easily.
"That's just like... your opinion, man."

DaBigE

Quote from: triplemultiplex on April 25, 2015, 11:16:10 AM
The current EB-NB ramp can be taken at 55 in a car quite easily.

Or at 60 with dry conditions.
"We gotta find this road, it's like Bob's road!" - Rabbit, Twister

SSOWorld

I've done it at 65-70, but anyone riding with me who's paranoid about tipping vehicles would have a shit-fit :bigass:
Scott O.

Not all who wander are lost...
Ah, the open skies, wind at my back, warm sun on my... wait, where the hell am I?!
As a matter of fact, I do own the road.
Raise your what?

Wisconsin - out-multiplexing your state since 1918.

DaBigE

Quote from: SSOWorld on April 25, 2015, 01:56:19 PM
I've done it at 65-70, but anyone riding with me who's paranoid about tipping vehicles would have a shit-fit :bigass:

I've done that as well, but only if no one else is in the car. My fiancée grabs the oh-shit handle if I take it anywhere near 60. The car on the other hand, takes it like a champ.
"We gotta find this road, it's like Bob's road!" - Rabbit, Twister

SSOWorld

Quote from: DaBigE on April 25, 2015, 03:04:35 PM
Quote from: SSOWorld on April 25, 2015, 01:56:19 PM
I've done it at 65-70, but anyone riding with me who's paranoid about tipping vehicles would have a shit-fit :bigass:

I've done that as well, but only if no one else is in the car. My fiancée grabs the oh-shit handle if I take it anywhere near 60. The car on the other hand, takes it like a champ.
Exactly :happy:
Scott O.

Not all who wander are lost...
Ah, the open skies, wind at my back, warm sun on my... wait, where the hell am I?!
As a matter of fact, I do own the road.
Raise your what?

Wisconsin - out-multiplexing your state since 1918.

KCRoadFan

Pardon the bump, but here's a question I've had about the Beltline: has there been any talk about bringing it east of I-39/90 and having it swing north to meet I-94 east of the city? Presumably this "East Beltline Extension" would have an exit with Highway N south of Cottage Grove, as well as Highway BB to the east of that town, but where would it junction with I-94? I'm guessing either it would tie into the existing Highway 73 exit (near Deerfield) in some fashion, or a new interchange would be built a little to the west or east of it.

Anyway, this is just speculation on my part, and as far as I know, there are no official proposals for such a road from WisDOT. What are your thoughts?

SEWIGuy

Quote from: KCRoadFan on December 15, 2021, 01:42:54 AM
Pardon the bump, but here's a question I've had about the Beltline: has there been any talk about bringing it east of I-39/90 and having it swing north to meet I-94 east of the city? Presumably this "East Beltline Extension" would have an exit with Highway N south of Cottage Grove, as well as Highway BB to the east of that town, but where would it junction with I-94? I'm guessing either it would tie into the existing Highway 73 exit (near Deerfield) in some fashion, or a new interchange would be built a little to the west or east of it.

Anyway, this is just speculation on my part, and as far as I know, there are no official proposals for such a road from WisDOT. What are your thoughts?


My thoughts are that it would be a duplicate of I-39/90 and just not necessary.  Expansion of I-39/90 would just be easier and less expensive.

Also, east of the interstate, US-12/18 is primarily for local and regional traffic.  Expanding it as necessary as the suburbs grow east is likely sufficient.

triplemultiplex

There has not been any proposal, real or fictional for that matter, of this particular Beltline eastern extension to I-94.  I can't imagine such a facility would take very much traffic off of 39/90 since most of the Beltline traffic coming and going north is bound for the East Town area around US 151.  Lots of traffic heads to/from Sun Prairie or any of the sprawling big box stores in that general area, not to mention AmFam's HQ.

It's actually amazing how little traffic on 39/90 NB gets off on 94 EB compared to how much keeps chugging north to the next exit.  I think that's a result of how moderate the sprawl due east is compared to northeast.  And the reason is simple: interchange density.  There's a bunch of exits on US 151 as it goes north from the interstate while there is only one on 94.  This makes it harder to get to the freeway and discourages the type of sprawl in Cottage Grove that one sees in Sun Prairie.
Oh don't get me wrong, there's sprawl in Cottage Grove, but if there were two more exits between CTH N and 39/90, 94 would look like 151 with sprawl everywhere and daily slowdowns from commuters rather than fast-moving with mostly farms flanking the freeway.
"That's just like... your opinion, man."

KCRoadFan

Quote from: triplemultiplex on December 15, 2021, 05:07:30 PM
It's actually amazing how little traffic on 39/90 NB gets off on 94 EB compared to how much keeps chugging north to the next exit. 

I'm guessing that's because the primary beneficiary of that particular traffic movement (people heading from the Beloit/Janesville area to Milwaukee) would just be taking I-43 instead - right?

JREwing78

Quote from: KCRoadFan on December 15, 2021, 05:58:46 PM
Quote from: triplemultiplex on December 15, 2021, 05:07:30 PM
It's actually amazing how little traffic on 39/90 NB gets off on 94 EB compared to how much keeps chugging north to the next exit. 

I'm guessing that's because the primary beneficiary of that particular traffic movement (people heading from the Beloit/Janesville area to Milwaukee) would just be taking I-43 instead - right?

Depending on what part of Milwaukee I'm headed, I have a choice of either Hwy 26 or I-43. There's no reason for me to drive all the way to Madison first.

skluth

Quote from: KCRoadFan on December 15, 2021, 05:58:46 PM
Quote from: triplemultiplex on December 15, 2021, 05:07:30 PM
It's actually amazing how little traffic on 39/90 NB gets off on 94 EB compared to how much keeps chugging north to the next exit. 

I'm guessing that's because the primary beneficiary of that particular traffic movement (people heading from the Beloit/Janesville area to Milwaukee) would just be taking I-43 instead - right?

No. It's traffic coming off the Beltline going home. There's very little suburban growth going east on I-94 to Milwaukee. Cottage Grove has gotten bigger in the last forty years, but it's nothing compared to the growth Sun Prairie has experienced. The best way from Sun Prairie to the jobs on the west side (Epic, Research Park) is via the Beltline.

It's also the best way to get to the Fox Valley for Janesville, Beloit and if you are coming into Wisconsin from the south, but that's not the main reason for the difference in traffic levels.



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