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NC: The proposed I-685

Started by tolbs17, November 20, 2021, 01:37:44 PM

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SkyPesos

#25
Now I'm thinking about it, this I-685 would be better numbered as I-38, so we can make fun of a short 2di that has a similar role as I-12, as well that its orphaned 3di exists in the opposite side of the country  :bigass:


tolbs17

Quote from: SkyPesos on November 27, 2021, 05:54:00 PM
Now I'm thinking about it, this I-685 would be better numbered as I-38, so we can make fun of a short parent 2di that has a similar role as I-12, as well that its orphaned 3di exists in the opposite side of the country  :bigass:
A 2-digit interstate would be better if it would be extended further out of North Carolina!

wdcrft63

Quote from: Dirt Roads on November 27, 2021, 05:39:09 PM
Quote from: kendallhart808 on November 27, 2021, 04:30:35 PM
I feel like at one point or another such an Interstate was coming...although I personally feel like it should end at Sanford. If it makes it all the way to I-95 (if it gets to I-40 near Newton Grove I would be thoroughly shocked) the only real thru-route I see it being a part of is Wilmington-Greensboro. I'm not sure how much traffic it would really take off 40 in Raleigh.

Quote from: LM117 on November 27, 2021, 05:30:45 PM
If I-685 were extended to I-40, I could see truck traffic using it to bypass the parking lot Triangle, especially those that want to avoid paying tolls on NC-540 to bypass Raleigh. It would also come in handy as an additional high-speed hurricane evacuation route.

The more I think about it, the more I wonder why NC wants I-685 to end at I-95 and not I-40. If Toyota is in the picture, you'd think they would want a more direct shot to the Port of Wilmington. Sure, you could hop up I-95 to Benson and then come back down I-40, but that adds mileage compared to I-685 cutting across to I-40.

If history has any say in the matter, vacationers will decide whether to use I-685 and then take NC-55 from Dunn over to I-40 as an alternate route.  If they do this the way they did the Mount Airy -to- Lexington -to- Rockingham -to- Myrtle Beach pattern, NCDOT will eventually need to fill in the gap.
This thing was designed by politicians, not by NCDOT. I predict NCDOT will want to do the extension to I_40.

tolbs17

Quote from: wdcrft63 on November 27, 2021, 06:03:29 PM
Quote from: Dirt Roads on November 27, 2021, 05:39:09 PM
Quote from: kendallhart808 on November 27, 2021, 04:30:35 PM
I feel like at one point or another such an Interstate was coming...although I personally feel like it should end at Sanford. If it makes it all the way to I-95 (if it gets to I-40 near Newton Grove I would be thoroughly shocked) the only real thru-route I see it being a part of is Wilmington-Greensboro. I'm not sure how much traffic it would really take off 40 in Raleigh.

Quote from: LM117 on November 27, 2021, 05:30:45 PM
If I-685 were extended to I-40, I could see truck traffic using it to bypass the parking lot Triangle, especially those that want to avoid paying tolls on NC-540 to bypass Raleigh. It would also come in handy as an additional high-speed hurricane evacuation route.

The more I think about it, the more I wonder why NC wants I-685 to end at I-95 and not I-40. If Toyota is in the picture, you'd think they would want a more direct shot to the Port of Wilmington. Sure, you could hop up I-95 to Benson and then come back down I-40, but that adds mileage compared to I-685 cutting across to I-40.

If history has any say in the matter, vacationers will decide whether to use I-685 and then take NC-55 from Dunn over to I-40 as an alternate route.  If they do this the way they did the Mount Airy -to- Lexington -to- Rockingham -to- Myrtle Beach pattern, NCDOT will eventually need to fill in the gap.
This thing was designed by politicians, not by NCDOT. I predict NCDOT will want to do the extension to I_40.
As I said in my first post. Why end at I-95? Take it all the way to I-40!

kendallhart808

Quote from: Dirt Roads on November 27, 2021, 05:39:09 PM

If history has any say in the matter, vacationers will decide whether to use I-685 and then take NC-55 from Dunn over to I-40 as an alternate route.  If they do this the way they did the Mount Airy -to- Lexington -to- Rockingham -to- Myrtle Beach pattern, NCDOT will eventually need to fill in the gap.

I think to some extent it will be determined if the highway meets 95 north or south of Dunn. If it's north of Dunn, it will be faster to take 95N/40E, and while that adds miles, 95 will be able to handle the traffic after it's reconstruction. If it's south of Dunn then it's faster to take 55 and that might cause a problem.

Quote from: LM117 on November 27, 2021, 05:30:45 PM

If I-87 were extended down US-1, it would more likely end at I-73/I-74 in Rockingham.
Perhaps, but NCDOT has wanted to put an interstate on the Raleigh-Sanford section of US 1 for a while, and doing so would be pretty easy. I was only referring to that.

sprjus4

^ If this highway will truly connect to I-40 east of I-95, then it definitely should hold an I-x40 designation, given it will effectively (yes, not technically on the west end) link to I-40 on either side.

I-685 makes sense if it's to take a more logical Greensboro to Fayetteville routing using NC-87 south of Sanford.

tolbs17

If I-685 does TRULY get extended to I-40, then it can eliminate the need to widen I-40 to six lanes from Benson to Clayton!

It might also eliminate the need to add toll lanes on I-40... As well as the I-40/I-85 concurrency...

But I agree. I-640 would be a better number than I-685.

This proposal does remind me of jumping back on the idea of making a freeway from Lexington to Apex so you can bypass Greensboro completely hmm??

~Tolbs

RoadPelican

Quote from: tolbs17 on November 28, 2021, 12:40:22 PM
If I-685 does TRULY get extended to I-40, then it can eliminate the need to widen I-40 to six lanes from Benson to Clayton!

It might also eliminate the need to add toll lanes on I-40... As well as the I-40/I-85 concurrency...

But I agree. I-640 would be a better number than I-685.

This proposal does remind me of jumping back on the idea of making a freeway from Lexington to Apex so you can bypass Greensboro completely hmm??

~Tolbs

I bet the Lexington to Apex freeway will become reality someday.  Dunn has a population of only 10,000 and it's going to be the terminus of an interstate.  Lexington has 20,000 people so why not them too?

NCDOT is planning to upgrade US 64 to a freeway in Cary starting in 2029.  Just need a couple bypasses of Siler City and Ramseur, and widen US 64 to 4 lanes from Asheboro to Lexington.

kendallhart808

Quote from: RoadPelican on November 29, 2021, 10:15:03 AM

I bet the Lexington to Apex freeway will become reality someday.  Dunn has a population of only 10,000 and it's going to be the terminus of an interstate.  Lexington has 20,000 people so why not them too?

NCDOT is planning to upgrade US 64 to a freeway in Cary starting in 2029.  Just need a couple bypasses of Siler City and Ramseur, and widen US 64 to 4 lanes from Asheboro to Lexington.
Well technically you could say Lexington is the terminus of I-285, so theres that. In all seriousness, as much as I was supportive of 87, 42, and 587, even to a degree this 685 proposal, I feel like a Lexington-Raleigh Interstate might be overkill. I can see the merits of it as a reliever on I-40/85. But, it begs the question of how many Interstates is enough. I know what you said was more or less speculation but I'm sure its been talked about.

froggie

Quote from: RoadPelican on November 29, 2021, 10:15:03 AM
NCDOT is planning to upgrade US 64 to a freeway in Cary starting in 2029.

I was under the impression this was to be a hybrid and not a full freeway.  Have things changed recently?

orulz

Yes, it's planned to be a hybrid superstreet, with some interchanges. An eventual full freeway conversion is conceivable, though it's not likely to ever become an interstate (hills and vertical curves would be very expensive to remedy)

LM117

Quote from: kendallhart808 on November 29, 2021, 11:00:52 AM
Quote from: RoadPelican on November 29, 2021, 10:15:03 AM

I bet the Lexington to Apex freeway will become reality someday.  Dunn has a population of only 10,000 and it's going to be the terminus of an interstate.  Lexington has 20,000 people so why not them too?

NCDOT is planning to upgrade US 64 to a freeway in Cary starting in 2029.  Just need a couple bypasses of Siler City and Ramseur, and widen US 64 to 4 lanes from Asheboro to Lexington.
Well technically you could say Lexington is the terminus of I-285, so theres that. In all seriousness, as much as I was supportive of 87, 42, and 587, even to a degree this 685 proposal, I feel like a Lexington-Raleigh Interstate might be overkill. I can see the merits of it as a reliever on I-40/85. But, it begs the question of how many Interstates is enough. I know what you said was more or less speculation but I'm sure its been talked about.

I agree, and I honestly never thought I-685 would actually happen, given that it fell on deaf ears when the locals pitched it to NCDOT a few years ago, likely due to the cost and work involved. Amazing what happens when the state is desperate for an auto plant.
“I don’t know whether to wind my ass or scratch my watch!” - Jim Cornette

WashuOtaku

Quote from: LM117 on November 30, 2021, 08:07:54 AM
Quote from: kendallhart808 on November 29, 2021, 11:00:52 AM
Quote from: RoadPelican on November 29, 2021, 10:15:03 AM

I bet the Lexington to Apex freeway will become reality someday.  Dunn has a population of only 10,000 and it's going to be the terminus of an interstate.  Lexington has 20,000 people so why not them too?

NCDOT is planning to upgrade US 64 to a freeway in Cary starting in 2029.  Just need a couple bypasses of Siler City and Ramseur, and widen US 64 to 4 lanes from Asheboro to Lexington.
Well technically you could say Lexington is the terminus of I-285, so theres that. In all seriousness, as much as I was supportive of 87, 42, and 587, even to a degree this 685 proposal, I feel like a Lexington-Raleigh Interstate might be overkill. I can see the merits of it as a reliever on I-40/85. But, it begs the question of how many Interstates is enough. I know what you said was more or less speculation but I'm sure its been talked about.

I agree, and I honestly never thought I-685 would actually happen, given that it fell on deaf ears when the locals pitched it to NCDOT a few years ago, likely due to the cost and work involved. Amazing what happens when the state is desperate for an auto plant.

Both the county and North Carolina Railroad own all that land they want to put an auto plant at, so yea. Also, those are good paying jobs and would be a boost to the area.

LM117

Quote from: WashuOtaku on November 30, 2021, 08:20:53 AM
Quote from: LM117 on November 30, 2021, 08:07:54 AM
Quote from: kendallhart808 on November 29, 2021, 11:00:52 AM
Quote from: RoadPelican on November 29, 2021, 10:15:03 AM

I bet the Lexington to Apex freeway will become reality someday.  Dunn has a population of only 10,000 and it's going to be the terminus of an interstate.  Lexington has 20,000 people so why not them too?

NCDOT is planning to upgrade US 64 to a freeway in Cary starting in 2029.  Just need a couple bypasses of Siler City and Ramseur, and widen US 64 to 4 lanes from Asheboro to Lexington.
Well technically you could say Lexington is the terminus of I-285, so theres that. In all seriousness, as much as I was supportive of 87, 42, and 587, even to a degree this 685 proposal, I feel like a Lexington-Raleigh Interstate might be overkill. I can see the merits of it as a reliever on I-40/85. But, it begs the question of how many Interstates is enough. I know what you said was more or less speculation but I'm sure its been talked about.

I agree, and I honestly never thought I-685 would actually happen, given that it fell on deaf ears when the locals pitched it to NCDOT a few years ago, likely due to the cost and work involved. Amazing what happens when the state is desperate for an auto plant.

Both the county and North Carolina Railroad own all that land they want to put an auto plant at, so yea. Also, those are good paying jobs and would be a boost to the area.

I wasn't knocking the plant. I was just surprised at how quickly the tune changed once Toyota started making noise.
“I don’t know whether to wind my ass or scratch my watch!” - Jim Cornette

WashuOtaku

Quote from: LM117 on November 30, 2021, 08:27:41 AM
Quote from: WashuOtaku on November 30, 2021, 08:20:53 AM
Quote from: LM117 on November 30, 2021, 08:07:54 AM
Quote from: kendallhart808 on November 29, 2021, 11:00:52 AM
Quote from: RoadPelican on November 29, 2021, 10:15:03 AM

I bet the Lexington to Apex freeway will become reality someday.  Dunn has a population of only 10,000 and it's going to be the terminus of an interstate.  Lexington has 20,000 people so why not them too?

NCDOT is planning to upgrade US 64 to a freeway in Cary starting in 2029.  Just need a couple bypasses of Siler City and Ramseur, and widen US 64 to 4 lanes from Asheboro to Lexington.
Well technically you could say Lexington is the terminus of I-285, so theres that. In all seriousness, as much as I was supportive of 87, 42, and 587, even to a degree this 685 proposal, I feel like a Lexington-Raleigh Interstate might be overkill. I can see the merits of it as a reliever on I-40/85. But, it begs the question of how many Interstates is enough. I know what you said was more or less speculation but I'm sure its been talked about.

I agree, and I honestly never thought I-685 would actually happen, given that it fell on deaf ears when the locals pitched it to NCDOT a few years ago, likely due to the cost and work involved. Amazing what happens when the state is desperate for an auto plant.

Both the county and North Carolina Railroad own all that land they want to put an auto plant at, so yea. Also, those are good paying jobs and would be a boost to the area.

I wasn't knocking the plant. I was just surprised at how quickly the tune changed once Toyota started making noise.

I don't think the tune changed, if they tried to go through NCDOT again they would have likely been rejected again on the idea. All they did was skip the local level by having it Congressionally mandated, so now they have no choice but to either figure it out or explain why it cannot be done.

froggie

^ Won't be hard to do the latter.  NCDOT's finances are much worse now than they were even a year or two ago.  Adding unfunded "mandates" is not going to help that.

architect77

Quote from: wdcrft63 on November 22, 2021, 10:53:57 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on November 20, 2021, 06:30:05 PM
*sigh* another new Interstate in NC.
FWIW, the message of North Carolina's interstate extensions is, "We are serious about infrastructure to support economic development."  It may or may not be effective in the end but it is highly visible and may attract favorable attention to the state.

Yeah especially since the new budget will end all state coroporate tax by 2030 (2.75% now), and personal state income tax will lower to a final 3.99% also.

As long as they keep planting trees for an an attractive landscape it's ok, but i see too much clear cutting and am worried about what makes NC a beautiful state in which to live.

LM117

#42
Quote from: LM117 on November 21, 2021, 06:56:29 AM
As popular as it is to shit on NCDOT, I don't think they're the bad guys here. Part of I-685 was proposed a few years ago by counties along the corridor, but it didn't get anywhere. Fast forward to this year, when Toyota is looking for a spot to build a battery plant and, all of a sudden, NC politicians got I-685 shoved into the infrastructure bill.

There's strong indications so far that Toyota will locate to the Greensboro-Randolph megasite, which conveniently sits alongs US-421. If Toyota confirms their location there, then it's a safe bet that I-685 was part of negotiations between the state and Toyota. The timing of this is too perfect for it not to be a coincidence, IMO.

Megasite map for those interested: http://greensboro-randolphmegasite.com/map/megasite

The governor and Toyota just confirmed the battery plant location at the megasite. Guess that explains I-685...

https://governor.nc.gov/news/press-releases/2021/12/06/governor-cooper-announces-toyota-will-build-companys-first-north-american-battery-plant-north

https://pressroom.toyota.com/toyota-selects-north-carolina-greensboro-randolph-site-for-new-u-s-automotive-battery-plant/
“I don’t know whether to wind my ass or scratch my watch!” - Jim Cornette

CoolAngrybirdsrio4

I just thought of the corridor of US 421 (proposed I-685) from Greensboro to Dunn/I-40 as a bypass of the Research Triangle.
Renewed roadgeek

tolbs17

Quote from: CoolAngrybirdsrio4 on December 17, 2021, 09:50:57 PM
I just thought of the corridor of US 421 (proposed I-685) from Greensboro to Dunn/I-40 as a bypass of the Research Triangle.
Now it's official thanks to the Toyota plant!

CoolAngrybirdsrio4

Quote from: tolbs17 on December 17, 2021, 10:04:42 PM
Quote from: CoolAngrybirdsrio4 on December 17, 2021, 09:50:57 PM
I just thought of the corridor of US 421 (proposed I-685) from Greensboro to Dunn/I-40 as a bypass of the Research Triangle.
Now it's official thanks to the Toyota plant!

Thanks for the update!
Renewed roadgeek

tolbs17

Quote from: CoolAngrybirdsrio4 on December 17, 2021, 10:21:03 PM
Quote from: tolbs17 on December 17, 2021, 10:04:42 PM
Quote from: CoolAngrybirdsrio4 on December 17, 2021, 09:50:57 PM
I just thought of the corridor of US 421 (proposed I-685) from Greensboro to Dunn/I-40 as a bypass of the Research Triangle.
Now it's official thanks to the Toyota plant!

Thanks for the update!
No problem, anytime man.

CanesFan27

Quote from: wdcrft63 on November 22, 2021, 10:53:57 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on November 20, 2021, 06:30:05 PM
*sigh* another new Interstate in NC.
FWIW, the message of North Carolina's interstate extensions is, "We are serious about infrastructure to support economic development."  It may or may not be effective in the end but it is highly visible and may attract favorable attention to the state.

And further, the 421 Corridor from Greensboro to 95 has been on North Carolina's wish list for Interstate extensions since the 1960s.  A lot of North Carolina Interstate authorizations/requests/whathaveyou are very similar to various proposals they requested over 50 years ago.

CanesFan27

Quote from: kendallhart808 on November 27, 2021, 04:30:35 PM
I feel like at one point or another such an Interstate was coming...although I personally feel like it should end at Sanford. If it makes it all the way to I-95 (if it gets to I-40 near Newton Grove I would be thoroughly shocked) the only real thru-route I see it being a part of is Wilmington-Greensboro. I'm not sure how much traffic it would really take off 40 in Raleigh.

The only thing I really dislike is the number. "685" would traditionally mean its a loop, but a loop around what? Raleigh? In that case it would make more sense as I-640. Someone else said it but I feel like it would make more sense as I-785 extension or I-373 or something (given it somewhat parallels I-73).

On another note, I could see this eventually becoming the justification for an I-87 southern extension to Sanford.

There are really no rules on "connector" interstate which this, and 495 was before it became 87.  Nationally, there are connectors that are odd and connectors that are even.  NC has gone with even under the idea it connects 'two' interstates.  795, unless requested differently, will be an exception to NC using an even for a connector.

Thing 342

Quote from: LM117 on November 27, 2021, 05:30:45 PM
If I-685 were extended to I-40, I could see truck traffic using it to bypass the parking lot Triangle, especially those that want to avoid paying tolls on NC-540 to bypass Raleigh. It would also come in handy as an additional high-speed hurricane evacuation route.

The more I think about it, the more I wonder why NC wants I-685 to end at I-95 and not I-40. If Toyota is in the picture, you'd think they would want a more direct shot to the Port of Wilmington. Sure, you could hop up I-95 to Benson and then come back down I-40, but that adds mileage compared to I-685 cutting across to I-40.

Isn't this movement already being addressed by I-74?



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