Washington

[jakeroot]

I-405 I thought had a huge capacity issue north of I-90.  The express lanes were up to $10.50 when I drove through but dropped to $0.50 when I got south of I-90.  I'm was really surprised that I-405 wasn't at least six regular lanes instead of the four with two HOV.

I'm not following here.

A) the 405 north of I-90 is much wider than the 405 south of I-90. The capacity issue is south of I-90 at this point in time.
B) The tolls only go up to $10 (on all WA toll routes)
C) There are no tolls on the 405 south of I-90; there are tolls on 167, which off-peak are usually $0.50.

The 405 is going to be rebuilt in a few years to add a second HOV lane and another general purpose lane south of I-90 (err, Coal Creek Parkway), meanwhile converting it to express toll. This will connect the current 405 toll lanes to the 167 toll lanes (much needed).

[Bruce]

Those 70 minute drive times from Everett to Seattle look brutal to deal with on a regular basis.  Capacity seemed like a huge issue with no inside shoulders where the HOV lanes were.

I do the Everett to Seattle commute on a weekly basis by bus, and it usually takes about 60 minutes. The real bottleneck comes at the Stewart Street offramp, where the express lanes and regular lanes dump out into a four-laned one-way street; buses have to weave over traffic heading towards Denny Way, and it's a total nightmare.

[compdude787]

I-405 I thought had a huge capacity issue north of I-90.  The express lanes were up to $10.50 when I drove through but dropped to $0.50 when I got south of I-90.  I'm was really surprised that I-405 wasn't at least six regular lanes instead of the four with two HOV.

I'm not following here.

A) the 405 north of I-90 is much wider than the 405 south of I-90. The capacity issue is south of I-90 at this point in time.
B) The tolls only go up to $10 (on all WA toll routes)
C) There are no tolls on the 405 south of I-90; there are tolls on 167, which off-peak are usually $0.50.

I think he's referring to I-405 north of the WA 522 interchange since that is typically an absolute mess north of there, especially in the SB direction in the mornings.

[jakeroot]

I-405 I thought had a huge capacity issue north of I-90.  The express lanes were up to $10.50 when I drove through but dropped to $0.50 when I got south of I-90.  I'm was really surprised that I-405 wasn't at least six regular lanes instead of the four with two HOV.

I'm not following here.

A) the 405 north of I-90 is much wider than the 405 south of I-90. The capacity issue is south of I-90 at this point in time.
B) The tolls only go up to $10 (on all WA toll routes)
C) There are no tolls on the 405 south of I-90; there are tolls on 167, which off-peak are usually $0.50.

I think he's referring to I-405 north of the WA 522 interchange since that is typically an absolute mess north of there, especially in the SB direction in the mornings.

Perhaps, yeah. Still confused about the claimed $10.50 toll.

[Max Rockatansky]

I-405 I thought had a huge capacity issue north of I-90.  The express lanes were up to $10.50 when I drove through but dropped to $0.50 when I got south of I-90.  I'm was really surprised that I-405 wasn't at least six regular lanes instead of the four with two HOV.

I'm not following here.

A) the 405 north of I-90 is much wider than the 405 south of I-90. The capacity issue is south of I-90 at this point in time.
B) The tolls only go up to $10 (on all WA toll routes)
C) There are no tolls on the 405 south of I-90; there are tolls on 167, which off-peak are usually $0.50.

I think he's referring to I-405 north of the WA 522 interchange since that is typically an absolute mess north of there, especially in the SB direction in the mornings.

Perhaps, yeah. Still confused about the claimed $10.50 toll.

Looking at the map the traffic cleared somewhere approaching the I-90 interchange.  I saw $10 for certain near I-5, could be mistaken about $10.50.  Probably didn't help I was talking to my passenger the entire time, usually I'm paying way more attention. 

[jakeroot]

I-405 I thought had a huge capacity issue north of I-90.  The express lanes were up to $10.50 when I drove through but dropped to $0.50 when I got south of I-90.  I'm was really surprised that I-405 wasn't at least six regular lanes instead of the four with two HOV.

I'm not following here.

A) the 405 north of I-90 is much wider than the 405 south of I-90. The capacity issue is south of I-90 at this point in time.
B) The tolls only go up to $10 (on all WA toll routes)
C) There are no tolls on the 405 south of I-90; there are tolls on 167, which off-peak are usually $0.50.

I think he's referring to I-405 north of the WA 522 interchange since that is typically an absolute mess north of there, especially in the SB direction in the mornings.

Perhaps, yeah. Still confused about the claimed $10.50 toll.

Looking at the map the traffic cleared somewhere approaching the I-90 interchange.  I saw $10 for certain near I-5, could be mistaken about $10.50.  Probably didn't help I was talking to my passenger the entire time, usually I'm paying way more attention.

The northern stretch is definitely busier thanks to the fewer lanes, but I think you might have been mistaken. The base (and probably most common) toll is $0.50. That might have been what you saw? It doesn't hit $10 very often.

[Max Rockatansky]

I-405 I thought had a huge capacity issue north of I-90.  The express lanes were up to $10.50 when I drove through but dropped to $0.50 when I got south of I-90.  I'm was really surprised that I-405 wasn't at least six regular lanes instead of the four with two HOV.

I'm not following here.

A) the 405 north of I-90 is much wider than the 405 south of I-90. The capacity issue is south of I-90 at this point in time.
B) The tolls only go up to $10 (on all WA toll routes)
C) There are no tolls on the 405 south of I-90; there are tolls on 167, which off-peak are usually $0.50.

I think he's referring to I-405 north of the WA 522 interchange since that is typically an absolute mess north of there, especially in the SB direction in the mornings.

Perhaps, yeah. Still confused about the claimed $10.50 toll.

Looking at the map the traffic cleared somewhere approaching the I-90 interchange.  I saw $10 for certain near I-5, could be mistaken about $10.50.  Probably didn't help I was talking to my passenger the entire time, usually I'm paying way more attention.

The northern stretch is definitely busier thanks to the fewer lanes, but I think you might have been mistaken. The base (and probably most common) toll is $0.50. That might have been what you saw? It doesn't hit $10 very often.

Between 524 and 527 it definitely hit $10 dollars.  Somewhere approaching I-90 the toll dropped back down to $0.50.

[Hurricane Rex]

Does anyone have an explanation for why there is a Oregon style Speed 35 sign in Woodland? Looks pretty new too.

LG-TP260

[Bickendan]

As in no 'Limit'? That's uncanny.

[jakeroot]

Does anyone have an explanation for why there is a Oregon style Speed 35 sign in Woodland? Looks pretty new too.

Streetview or photo? I've only seen one of this style in Washington, and it was posted only a few years ago in Puyallup. Still standing today...

[Hurricane Rex]

Does anyone have an explanation for why there is a Oregon style Speed 35 sign in Woodland? Looks pretty new too.

Streetview or photo? I've only seen one of this style in Washington, and it was posted only a few years ago in Puyallup. Still standing today...

Didn't get a photo, driving home from Silver lake near Castle Rock and saw the sign. It was on the frontage road on the I-5 SB side next to the Safeway. I was already past the exit when I saw it.

LG-TP260

[BloonsTDFan360]

Does anyone have an explanation for why there is a Oregon style Speed 35 sign in Woodland? Looks pretty new too.

Streetview or photo? I've only seen one of this style in Washington, and it was posted only a few years ago in Puyallup. Still standing today...

Didn't get a photo, driving home from Silver lake near Castle Rock and saw the sign. It was on the frontage road on the I-5 SB side next to the Safeway. I was already past the exit when I saw it.

LG-TP260

The sign in Woodland must have been new, never saw an Oregon-style speed sign up there.

Clark County has quite a handful of these signs, pretty much inspired by our southern neighbor. Vancouver's F Street school zone has one; another one in Battle Ground. No pic or street view but there's yet another one in BG, in a new residential subdivision!

[jakeroot]

Does anyone have an explanation for why there is a Oregon style Speed 35 sign in Woodland? Looks pretty new too.

Streetview or photo? I've only seen one of this style in Washington, and it was posted only a few years ago in Puyallup. Still standing today...

https://i.imgur.com/Cl7Sliw.jpg

Didn't get a photo, driving home from Silver lake near Castle Rock and saw the sign. It was on the frontage road on the I-5 SB side next to the Safeway. I was already past the exit when I saw it.

The sign in Woodland must have been new, never saw an Oregon-style speed sign up there.

Clark County has quite a handful of these signs, pretty much inspired by our southern neighbor. Vancouver's F Street school zone has one; another one in Battle Ground. No pic or street view but there's yet another one in BG, in a new residential subdivision!

Damn, nice! I did not know of any other "SPEED" signs in Washington. That second sign (from Battle Ground) had to have come from an Oregon sign shop. It looks exactly like the limit signs in Oregon.

[Bruce]

A few photos of the "Revive I-5" project, which closed the mainline lanes over the weekend, including the new Business Loop shields.

Revive I-5 project from Holgate Street by SounderBruce, on Flickr

Revive I-5 project from Holgate Street by SounderBruce, on Flickr

I-5 Business Loop in Seattle by SounderBruce, on Flickr

Revive I-5 project from Holgate Street by SounderBruce, on Flickr

Revive I-5 project from Yesler Way by SounderBruce, on Flickr

Revive I-5 project from Yesler Way by SounderBruce, on Flickr


Revive I-5 elevated view from Columbia Center by SounderBruce, on Flickr

[Max Rockatansky]

^^^

Where is the new Business Loop going to run?

[Bruce]

^^^

Where is the new Business Loop going to run?

It's basically signage for the collector part of the collector-distributor lanes through downtown. It's probably a mistake from WSDOT.

[Max Rockatansky]

^^^

Where is the new Business Loop going to run?

It's basically signage for the collector part of the collector-distributor lanes through downtown. It's probably a mistake from WSDOT.

That's what I would have thought.  It would be really difficult to get a viable Business Loop back to I-5 given you can't take 4th Avenue directly to West Lake anymore.  It probably would be pretty handy to have some sort of signed business route through downtown since it isn't the most intuitive place get through on surface streets.

[Bruce]

^^^

Where is the new Business Loop going to run?

It's basically signage for the collector part of the collector-distributor lanes through downtown. It's probably a mistake from WSDOT.

That's what I would have thought.  It would be really difficult to get a viable Business Loop back to I-5 given you can't take 4th Avenue directly to West Lake anymore.  It probably would be pretty handy to have some sort of signed business route through downtown since it isn't the most intuitive place get through on surface streets.

City's official policy is to redirect cars away from downtown, because it's generally the right thing to do.

But a viable business loop would probably follow the commuter bus routes, or perhaps continue all the way to the Space Needle before turning east onto Mercer.

[sparker]

Probably not a particularly good idea to establish a business loop in as dense a downtown area as central Seattle unless plans included sufficient parking to serve any additional automotive traffic generated by the signage of the loop.  But as Seattle is attempting to discourage and/or divert such traffic out of downtown, providing parking would be counterproductive.  While slapping biz loop signage on a C/D lane seems either overkill or an errant concept, at least it (probably/hopefully) won't be construed as an invitation onto a specific continuum of surface streets.

[jakeroot]

Probably not a particularly good idea to establish a business loop in as dense a downtown area as central Seattle unless plans included sufficient parking to serve any additional automotive traffic generated by the signage of the loop.  But as Seattle is attempting to discourage and/or divert such traffic out of downtown, providing parking would be counterproductive.  While slapping biz loop signage on a C/D lane seems either overkill or an errant concept, at least it (probably/hopefully) won't be construed as an invitation onto a specific continuum of surface streets.

Oddly enough, I don't find parking downtown to be difficult. The various local transport agencies have really doubled down over the last 15 years to reduce downtown vehicular traffic, with the result being fewer cars entering downtown than ever before. This has made it easier to find parking, should someone pain the commute by car into the city.



FWIW, this new Biz I-5 shield is now at least the third example of WSDOT posting a shield that refers to a highway that doesn't legally exist on paper. The first two are in Clark County: WA-501 Spur near the abandoned Lower River Road (posted 2012), and WA-503 Biz near Battle Ground (posted 1996) (BGS here).

[Max Rockatansky]

Probably not a particularly good idea to establish a business loop in as dense a downtown area as central Seattle unless plans included sufficient parking to serve any additional automotive traffic generated by the signage of the loop.  But as Seattle is attempting to discourage and/or divert such traffic out of downtown, providing parking would be counterproductive.  While slapping biz loop signage on a C/D lane seems either overkill or an errant concept, at least it (probably/hopefully) won't be construed as an invitation onto a specific continuum of surface streets.

Oddly enough, I don't find parking downtown to be difficult. The various local transport agencies have really doubled down over the last 15 years to reduce downtown vehicular traffic, with the result being fewer cars entering downtown than ever before. This has made it easier to find parking, should someone pain the commute by car into the city.



FWIW, this new Biz I-5 shield is now at least the third example of WSDOT posting a shield that refers to a highway that doesn't legally exist on paper. The first two are in Clark County: WA-501 Spur near the abandoned Lower River Road (posted 2012), and WA-503 Biz near Battle Ground (posted 1996) (BGS here).

I thought it was easy to find parking this past month.  There was plenty of little side lots offering "somewhat" affordable parking in addition to various garages.  In particular I noticed there was a lot of parking to be found on 1st and 2nd Avenues.  The Seattle Center had a punch of parking at the facility and around the area.  Usually I just parked somewhere near the Space Needle and spent the day on foot in downtown.

[BloonsTDFan360]

FWIW, this new Biz I-5 shield is now at least the third example of WSDOT posting a shield that refers to a highway that doesn't legally exist on paper. The first two are in Clark County: WA-501 Spur near the abandoned Lower River Road (posted 2012), and WA-503 Biz near Battle Ground (posted 1996) (BGS here).

There's also an SR 14 Biz in the Camas-Washougal area, with frequent reassurance markers. I guess the SW Region loves making up their own highways.

[Bickendan]

14B has been there for years. I think it was even in the 1997 or 1999 Portland Thomas Guide.

[Henry]

^^^

Where is the new Business Loop going to run?

It's basically signage for the collector part of the collector-distributor lanes through downtown. It's probably a mistake from WSDOT.

That's what I would have thought.  It would be really difficult to get a viable Business Loop back to I-5 given you can't take 4th Avenue directly to West Lake anymore.  It probably would be pretty handy to have some sort of signed business route through downtown since it isn't the most intuitive place get through on surface streets.

City's official policy is to redirect cars away from downtown, because it's generally the right thing to do.

But a viable business loop would probably follow the commuter bus routes, or perhaps continue all the way to the Space Needle before turning east onto Mercer.

I agree that they should follow the commuter routes, and both pictures have a pretty good detail on what the north end of BL 5 would look like. Given that the southern end is also at the I-90 terminus, I'd like to know how that part of the route would run into downtown.

[akotchi]

Not quite sure where to post this, but this seemed to be the best place . . .

On a trip to Seattle last month, I found this sign at the exit of one of the ferry terminals -- Bainbridge, I think.  How old is this sign, and what does the TEMP refer to?  Old enough to pre-date the completion of I-90 across Lake Washington?  If so, what was the "I-90 TEMP" route?