1958 I-35E parade float in Dallas!

[TheStranger]

Don't know if any highway construction has been celebrated like this before or since... 

http://www.flickr.com/photos/fatguyinalittlecoat/3033127129/

[huskeroadgeek]

I've noticed in this and some other old photos, like the old photo of the I-80/I-80N(I-84) split in Utah that apparently in some places they used to sign the divided routes with a small letter underneath the numbers rather than the big letter beside the numbers as they do now. I wonder if this was consistent in all of the places that had divided routes. I much prefer the current way-makes it much easier to see at a quick glance. In that old photo of the I-80/I-80N(I-84) split, it looks like they both say I-80 until you look closer.

[TheStranger]

I've noticed in this and some other old photos, like the old photo of the I-80/I-80N(I-84) split in Utah that apparently in some places they used to sign the divided routes with a small letter underneath the numbers rather than the big letter beside the numbers as they do now. I wonder if this was consistent in all of the places that had divided routes. I much prefer the current way-makes it much easier to see at a quick glance. In that old photo of the I-80/I-80N(I-84) split, it looks like they both say I-80 until you look closer.

By the early 1960s, the equal-sized letter had started to see use, i.e. Interstate 5W (now I-580) in the Bay Area:



This was also true of the I-35 pair in Texas, signed with equal-sized suffix by the mid-1960s:


I'm not sure US routes had tiny suffix lettering all that long, certainly not as small as early Interstates - and today, equal-sized lettering.  This did exist at times:




---

In the case of the 35E/35W split in the Metroplex, isn't it true that both routes are normally referred to as just "35" (without the suffix) by the public?  Not that simply signing it with letter-underneath encouraged this, but that usage by common folk may have had this as one of the causes.  (The letter-underneath look actually resembles Texas's business loop signage style today.)

For folks traveling from north of the Metroplex to points south such as Waco, Austin, or San Antonio, referring to either branch as "35" isn't that big of a deal - but otherwise seems like an easy way to generate confusion.

[agentsteel53]

I cannot substantiate this, because neither AASHO manual specifies it, but I believe the suffix underneath was 1957 spec, and the suffix as a full-height digit was 1961.  certainly the addition of wider shields in 1961 allowed for the fitting of the suffix after a two-digit number.

the AASHO manual did not specify the size of the suffix letter in 1957, but conventionally it was 3 inches on the 24" blank, to go with a 8" digit.

but here is a counterexample with 6" digit and 5" suffix.



as for the US route suffixes, those tended to be - on the 16" cutouts - 3" letter, to go with 5" digits.  Most of the time (certainly on all the embossed ones) the letter was vertically centered, but I have seen it placed top-aligned and bottom-aligned as well.  The 99E shows top-aligned, which was California's standard for 16" and 24" shields (and probably 29" and 36" as well).

just looking at Tenn shows a lot of variety:

16" shield, 5" number, 3" suffix, top aligned:


16" shield, 7" number, 3" suffix, vertically centered:


24" shield, 10" number, 3" suffix, almost but not quite vertically centered:


and here is an example of bottom-aligned, which Connecticut seemed to prefer:

[TheStranger]

From the same Flickr collection, here's a shot of a 1958 I-35E shield in the field, note that the E is proportionally larger on the real deal than it was on the parade float:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/fatguyinalittlecoat/3033127863/



Jake - were there ever any examples of a 2di + suffix (as opposed to 1 digit + suffix like 5W) that used the early "tall" 3-digit shield, i.e. the shield below?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/tarkastad/2620656744/

[agentsteel53]

Jake - were there ever any examples of a 2di + suffix (as opposed to 1 digit + suffix like 5W) that used the early "tall" 3-digit shield, i.e. the shield below?

there probably were, though the closest thing I can think of is this 1970-spec shield:

[agentsteel53]

oops, I completely forgot about this one

[Brian556]

People around the D/FW area, including traffic reporters, often fail to use the "E" or "W" when refering to the highways. This bugs me because it's not accurate. The City of Lewisville identifies it as "I-35" on their street name blades. The also have a "TO 35 <-- shield assembly on Mill St. I hate inaccuracy.

I reference to the 3 digit number crammed into a 2-digit shield, several of these have popped up at intersections along I-35E in the Lewisville-Carrollton area. They are all contractor installations.

[agentsteel53]

I reference to the 3 digit number crammed into a 2-digit shield, several of these have popped up at intersections along I-35E in the Lewisville-Carrollton area. They are all contractor installations.

can you get a photo or two for us please?

[Brian556]

I e-mailed you some.

[agentsteel53]

I e-mailed you some.

thanks   alas, no state names.  that bubble shield on the white square is very strange; I've seen some standard 24x24 state-named I-35s (neither E nor W) on the white background - they were in a construction zone in Feb 2009 at the southern merge point of 35E and 35W and I don't know if they are still there.

[TheStranger]

People around the D/FW area, including traffic reporters, often fail to use the "E" or "W" when refering to the highways.

I'm curious - on the radio/TV traffic reports, is there a particular order in which the major routes are usually talked out?  What I mean more specifically: if one listens to a Metroplex-area broadcast, will one (confusingly) hear about "35 in downtown Fort Worth" and "35 along the Stemmons Corridor" in the same breath?

[Brian556]

Yes, that's what you hear.

[austrini]

I'm glad you found my flickr
I have some more 35E sign photos somewhere, those were all from old Chamber of Commerce publications.

TxDot is also really good about signing 35E and 35W as plain "35", especially south of DFW in the rural areas. After rebuilding 35E through DeSoto and Lancaster they dropped the "E" on a lot of the signage on the frontage roads. The City of Dallas overhead signs on traffic lights (like at Mockingbird or Inwood) omit the "E" from the city installations. The 35W business loop in Alvarado mysteriously lost its "W" some time ago.

[Brian556]

It's pretty bad that TxDot is making this mistake, they should know better. Then again, there's a route marker sign on Harry Hines that says " 354 Texas".( it's really LOOP 354 ).

[agentsteel53]

there's a US-288 somewhere. 



one of the correct ones must've fallen off, and the hasty replacement was a bit hasty

[bugo]

there's a US-288 somewhere.  



one of the correct ones must've fallen off, and the hasty replacement was a bit hasty

That US 288 shield is so much easier to read than the TX 288 one.  Maybe TXDOT should come up with a new shield design with larger numbers.

[bwana39]

As to it just being 35 in both Dallas and Fort Worth that is true, but it almost always is followed by the freeway name  (I-35 Stemmons, I-35 South RLT, I-35 South Freeway, or I-35 North Freeway.) In traffic reporting, they are also generally grouped by the city.  (Dalles, FtWorth, the mid-cities, and perhaps if there are problems add mention of Collin, Denton, or Rockwall counties.)

It is not confusing. I might add, the freeway NUMBER is generally added for imports and visitors.  I will concede that this is becoming more of an issue since the staff in DFW TV and Radio are much less likely to have spent their whole professional life here.

[rte66man]

As to it just being 35 in both Dallas and Fort Worth that is true, but it almost always is followed by the freeway name  (I-35 Stemmons, I-35 South RLT, I-35 South Freeway, or I-35 North Freeway.) In traffic reporting, they are also generally grouped by the city.  (Dalles, FtWorth, the mid-cities, and perhaps if there are problems add mention of Collin, Denton, or Rockwall counties.)

It is not confusing. I might add, the freeway NUMBER is generally added for imports and visitors.  I will concede that this is becoming more of an issue since the staff in DFW TV and Radio are much less likely to have spent their whole professional life here.

I believe this is a new record. You bumped a thread that was 10 YEARS OLD.