I-40 re-signing in AZ

[corco]

I was on I-40 a couple weeks ago between Holbrook and Winslow and noticed they were re-signing everything to Clearview  
First of all: Is this a normal way to do re-signing? There were double signs everywhere! I've never seen that before



The only good thing that's going on is correctly signing SR 87 and old 66 through Winslow and marking SR 99 ,for whatever that's worth


(suddenly you should get off sooner for Old 66, which makes sense since 257 is where the 66 alignment starts, not 255)



in Winslow, where 40 business is for whatever reason no longer the preferred route to Payson:





It looks like everything but reassurance shields have been doubled up, even mile markers!





(attribute all good grammar/spelling to Scott5114, all bad grammar/spelling to corco)

[Scott5114]

Please tell I-40 that we regretfully accept its resignation.

All kidding aside this is pretty sad. The old signs appear to be pretty good, so replacing them with Clearview is particularly bletcherous

[corco]

Ha! I'm a bit drunk. Re-sign would be correct. Allow me to edit and give you full credit.

Seriously though- I probably have 20 more photos of the same thing and then saw a few more and only maybe that Exit 255 Route 66 sign needed to be replaced. Maybe. That one is by far the worst.

But this was one of the best stretches of button copy in Arizona. It's a shame to see it go.

[roadfro]

I've seen the double signing during sign replacements before. But not to the extent seen here. The double signing I've seen has typically been where one or two signs were being replaced as part of a widening or other major construction--and most of these were where the old post-mounted sign was left in place while a new sign was installed overhead). Nevada doesn't often do wholesale sign replacement contracts, so something like this is unusual to see here.

Gotta agree with Scott. Most of those old button copy signs look pretty good, so it's a shame to see them replaced when they're still fairly serviceable--Clearview or not. That new guide sign for AZ 99 & Historic US 66 looks somewhat odd, though...

[J N Winkler]

I've seen the double signing during sign replacements before. But not to the extent seen here. The double signing I've seen has typically been where one or two signs were being replaced as part of a widening or other major construction--and most of these were where the old post-mounted sign was left in place while a new sign was installed overhead). Nevada doesn't often do wholesale sign replacement contracts, so something like this is unusual to see here.

In my experience, it is more common for a new sign to be placed on the same posts as the existing sign than for a "double signing" situation to exist where the new sign is either in front of or behind the existing sign.  In some of Corco's photographs, reuse of existing posts is clearly not possible either because the sign has been redesigned and is much larger (as is the case with the Exit 257 sign) or because the message on the new sign is almost the same as on the existing sign but at a larger type size (I spot one example of what appears to be a change from 16" uppercase to 20" uppercase for primary destination legend).  But there seem to be plenty of other examples where old and new signs are approximately the same size.

These new signs on I-40 have been erected as part of Arizona DOT project TRACS H775401C.  This was one of seven pure signing contracts which Arizona DOT awarded through a fast-track procurement process in September 2010 to two signing vendors.  This is an enormous amount of signing work for two companies to do within a relatively short period of time:  a more typical pace for Arizona DOT is two sign rehabilitation contracts per year, each awarded to different contractors.  I suspect the "double vision" signing on I-40 may result from the company which was assigned H775401C being short on workers to take down the existing signs.

Gotta agree with Scott. Most of those old button copy signs look pretty good, so it's a shame to see them replaced when they're still fairly serviceable--Clearview or not. That new guide sign for AZ 99 & Historic US 66 looks somewhat odd, though...

The signing plans for H775401C were consultant-developed (TransCore ITS, IIRC) and are a little overcomplicated compared to the existing signs, which were designed in-house by Arizona DOT and erected in the mid-1990's.

[nexus73]

RReevveerrbb anyone?  That's a hilarious sequence of photos...LOL! 

Rick

[Alps]

But this was one of the best stretches of button copy in Arizona. It's a shame to see it go.

I would count I-17 in Phoenix on this list, as well as most of the other Phoenix freeways. Quite a show there!

[corco]

I would count I-17 in Phoenix on this list, as well as most of the other Phoenix freeways. Quite a show there!

Sooo much has changed since you passed through- not even joking. They re-signed all of I-17! There's no button copy to be found. 10 still has some nice button copy, but that's disappearing.

Since I've moved to Arizona I'd bet they've replaced 60% of the button copy signs in Phoenix

[Ian]

That's a real shame on the button copy replacement. But I will admit, I like Arizona's implementation of Clearview.

[J N Winkler]

I would count I-17 in Phoenix on this list, as well as most of the other Phoenix freeways. Quite a show there!

Sooo much has changed since you passed through- not even joking. They re-signed all of I-17! There's no button copy to be found. 10 still has some nice button copy, but that's disappearing.

I-10 Dysart to 3rd St. and the entire Maricopa Freeway length of I-17 (basically, I-17 between the two I-10 interchanges) were another two of the jobs in the September 2010 procurement.  Of the remaining four jobs, one covered I-8 (California state line-Ligurta), another covered the older part of Loop 202, and the remaining two both covered noncontiguous lengths of I-17.  I think Anthem Way-Cherry (basically, far outskirts of Phoenix to the SR 69 interchange) has already been done, while Rocky Park-McConnell is still left to do.  Better hurry up before the signs get changed out.

[corco]

I think Anthem Way-Cherry (basically, far outskirts of Phoenix to the SR 69 interchange) has already been done, while Rocky Park-McConnell is still left to do.

Yep- I drove through Anthem Way-Cherry in January and again 2 weeks ago and the signs are all new. I haven't been on the other stretch since January, so I don't know.

I think the Black Canyon Freeway part of I-17 must have already been done- although looking again it appears those signs were FHWA non-button copy signs, except right by the Maricopa junction where it's definitely all Clearview



I-8 is weird- I was over there in July and it was a mix of button copy and Clearview, sometimes both on the same gantry!

[agentsteel53]

what's even weirder is seeing Clearview and a '57 spec shield on the same sign



and yes, those two back-to-back signs feature the only two '57 spec shields I know of in Arizona.  

[Quillz]

That "COMMERCIAL VEHICLES" black guide sign looks really sharp. Too bad those usability tests in the 1950s ended up going with white on green. I really think white on black looks a lot better.

[corco]

I only know of one other, but it's kind of a technicality




I think there's also a 57 spec I-10 trailblazer on...Litchfield? It's west of 101 and south of the freeway- I recall seeing it a couple years ago when I came down to visit one year. I'm up that way often; I'll hunt around for it.

[agentsteel53]

I did not know that California example existed.

the one I-10 would be quite the find.

there were some BL 40 shields of '57 spec, with 1985 stickers, on the Williams business loop in 2007, but they were gone by 2009.

[CL]

I think the Black Canyon Freeway part of I-17 must have already been done- although looking again it appears those signs were FHWA non-button copy signs, except right by the Maricopa junction where it's definitely all Clearview

Perfect example of Clearview horror on the two left signs (well, more so on the middle one) and proper Clearview implementation on the right. In general, Arizona's done well with Clearview but errors have slipped through the cracks.

[corco]

Perfect example of Clearview horror on the two left signs (well, more so on the middle one) and proper Clearview implementation on the right. In general, Arizona's done well with Clearview but errors have slipped through the cracks.

Yeah, I'm not sure what happened. All the signs on that approach are like that, but from the other direction they're fine



not as nice as


but whatever.

[J N Winkler]

I think the Black Canyon Freeway part of I-17 must have already been done- although looking again it appears those signs were FHWA non-button copy signs, except right by the Maricopa junction where it's definitely all Clearview

I-17 at the Stack and further north has received a series of widenings through the nineties and noughties, so most of the signing is new (albeit using Series E Modified) and so is not a prime candidate for comprehensive replacement.  Your photograph shows Clearview signs at the stack which were erected as part of an auxiliary lane improvement (TRACS number H746501C) ADOT did about a year ago.  The middle sign uses Clearview 3-W (instead of the Clearview 5-W one would expect, which ADOT indeed uses for signs in rural areas) in order to allow capital letter size to be increased from 16" to 20" without increasing the overall sign panel area.

I-8 is weird- I was over there in July and it was a mix of button copy and Clearview, sometimes both on the same gantry!

The contractor was at work in July, so you were seeing half-done work.  Taking pictures one by one:

All three panels were slated for replacement with new panels using Clearview (TRACS number H774701C, part of the September 2010 signing procurement).  This picture shows the new left-hand panel and the original (still to be replaced) two right-hand panels.

As in the previous example, all three panels (including the commercial vehicles sign--sigh) were to be replaced with new Clearview panels, but only the left-hand one had actually been changed out when you passed through.

The panels scheduled for replacement were all installed as part of the last I-8 California state line-Ligurta signing contract, which was carried out in 1998.  The current project covers only signs erected on Arizona's side of the Colorado River.  The 1998 contract had several pages' worth of signs erected by ADOT to its own standards--which, at the time, included button copy--on the California side of the border, by agreement with Caltrans.  Caltrans is unlikely to have touched them, so they should still be there.

[corco]

Just out of curiosity, are they putting an exit tab on the new sign for Business 8 in California?

[J N Winkler]

Just out of curiosity, are they putting an exit tab on the new sign for Business 8 in California?

Exit 172?  Yup.  It is being done to Arizona standards though, which means 36" tab height with Clearview legend.  "Winterhaven" will also appear in Clearview 4-W rather than 5-W.  On the existing sign it appears in Series E Modified but at reduced intercharacter spacing (this attracted attention in MTR back around 1999 or so when the sign was new).

The plans also call for an Exit 172 tab on a supplemental guide sign for Fort Yuma Indian Reservation.  This is because Arizona's approach to supplemental signing is to place the primary destination on the main sign panel by itself and to use an exit tab instead of putting an "EXIT XXX" message on the main panel.

[corco]

The plans also call for an Exit 172 tab on a supplemental guide sign for Fort Yuma Indian Reservation.  This is because Arizona's approach to supplemental signing is to place the primary destination on the main sign panel by itself and to use an exit tab instead of putting an "EXIT XXX" message on the main panel.

You mean this one?

[J N Winkler]

Yup, that one precisely.

BTW, I need to correct a few of my own mistakes.  I looked through my Arizona DOT "witching directory" and it turns out the TRACS number for the I-40 Hipkoe to Goodwater contract giving rise to the signs shown in the OP is H775501C, not H775401C (which, as it happens, is I-17 Anthem Way to Cherry).  The northern limit for the Anthem Way-Cherry contract is actually SR 169 rather than SR 69.

I also looked more closely at the signing plans for H774701C.  The sign layout sheets, which I looked at first, suggest that the white-on-black commercial vehicles sign (part of the gantry at the US 95/16th St. exit) would be replaced with a new Clearview sign.  However, the sign design sheet, which is probably more authoritative as regards the actual appearance of the sign panel, shows Series E Modified.

[corco]

I should add that my favorite part of the re-signing is this new sign



While I love seeing concurrencies signed, I don't really get the lovegasm for SR 99. Arizona 99 is about as unimportant a route as they come!

[roadfro]

^ That assembly makes US 180 seem like such an afterthought...

[Quillz]

I should add that my favorite part of the re-signing is this new sign



While I love seeing concurrencies signed, I don't really get the lovegasm for SR 99. Arizona 99 is about as unimportant a route as they come!

It may not be a very important route, but at 40+ miles it seems worthwhile to at least sign.