New Jersey Turnpike

[roadman65]

What amazes me is the fact that most people will protest the Rental Car daily usage fee of an AET Transponder, when that same person will spend hundreds on the latest smart or I Phone before their old one is gone.     With ORT you can use your credit card and the fact you can buy your own Sunpass without paying the rental car fee for use.    Being that most visit Florida frequently, they would want that device especially when they can cruise by the toll plaza and let their ego be pleased that they can ride by the suckers paying cash.

The fact is most people rely so much on the card which is why so much debt.  Even financial experts say to pay cash is the best way to budget your household allowances as you see the money in front of you to see how fast it goes.   With a visual aid like that you are more careful of what you buy especially when impulse buying occurs.  You know if you have 60 bucks in your pocket 3 days before your next payday, you won't buy that 10 dollar item in Target that you really do not need as supposed to not see the $60 even if you know your account has $60 in it per phone app.


Also many people are still new to tolls and you be a bit surprised how many motorists never even heard of the toll road concept especially semi drivers.  We get over 200 a day paying $7.50  instead of the $ 5.60 they would only pay if they use the Sunpass (and yes you do not have to live in FL to own one) and if you ask them why they do things the hard way, many of them will say they are a first time driver to the Orlando area.  Considering you multiply the 200 times 365 that is 72, 000.   Now really 72, 000 drivers are new to the industry or have driven off their normal route for the first time out of all the drivers in the trucking industry?  I think not.  I think typical ignorance plays into that.  Meanwhile you multiply that times the difference of the two prices and you could probably feed the homeless in the whole nation.

Cabbies are the worst, as the Haitian cab drivers love to pay the toll with cash over Sunpass as the companies Ace Metro and Diamond Cabe as well as a few others who let the drivers run the cab as their own business rather than operate a fleet facility like Mears does.   Some do not even fix their windows as they open the door to pay the tolls as you would figure the company must have a resident mechanic to do that.  Then receipts are only asked for if the customer wants it as the cab companies take the word of the driver for reimbursement instead of a receipt/ cash tradeoff as in the past.  Meanwhile one cabbie in particular honks his horn when a slowpoke is in front of him holding his passenger from getting to the airport on time and gets raged so much cause of it despite his Sunpass would eliminate it all.

Our world is most ignorant and yes you be a bit surprised how uniformed many individuals really are.  And most are far from being a doofus  and many have nice jobs and have their kids with them.

[vdeane]

What amazes me is the fact that most people will protest the Rental Car daily usage fee of an AET Transponder, when that same person will spend hundreds on the latest smart or I Phone before their old one is gone.

Because paying at cash booths had no fees.  Why should someone have to pay extra fees just to pay a toll?  Plus the rental car fees are clearly a cash grab - no way does it cost that much for them provide the service.  Doesn't help that many states seem to have taken inspiration from the rental companies by charging people upfront or monthly fees to get a transponder.

[roadman65]

I agree the rental car companies are ridiculous for charging extra.

However, that people still will buy the new cell phones and spend money they do not need to spend just to feel like royalty are not doing it at the toll plaza.

Considering they give Disney $20 to park their car and over a thousand dollars to the Magic Kingdom just to say they went to Disney World should really be caring about a 5 to 10 buck daily fee.  Really if you have money to burn at Disney and to get the latest Samsung Galaxy, you can afford to pay that and drive by the tolls to feel like royalty.

[MikeCL]

I'm surprised to read all these complaints. In almost fifty years of driving I can't remember ever having had any problems with toll collectors anywhere. But then I was normally courteous to them and they were usually courteous to me.

In recent years with E-Z Pass I've hardly had any contact with collectors anymore. Is it possible that the newest generation of collectors is less courteous than previous generations?

J&N, are there cameras at any or all NJTP toll booths that could help prove what did or didn't happen in these cases?

I remember I was taking the RFK bridge thought my window was down and I went to put my arm out the window and my hand hit the window and he saw it he both could not help but laugh it was too funny.. I would have been pissed if my money fell however lol

[Rothman]

Regarding credit cards and debt:  I pay mine off every month.  Enjoy the benefits of the loyalty program, don't pay a penny of interest and have built up my credit history so I don't have to worry about whether or not I will be able to get a car loan or whatnot from a bank.

Just using a credit card does not mean you are racking up debt.  How many free hotel nights has spending cash got you?

[jeffandnicole]

I agree the rental car companies are ridiculous for charging extra.

However, that people still will buy the new cell phones and spend money they do not need to spend just to feel like royalty are not doing it at the toll plaza.

Considering they give Disney $20 to park their car and over a thousand dollars to the Magic Kingdom just to say they went to Disney World should really be caring about a 5 to 10 buck daily fee.  Really if you have money to burn at Disney and to get the latest Samsung Galaxy, you can afford to pay that and drive by the tolls to feel like royalty.

By default, wouldn't this thought process apply to everything?  Why rent a car since you can be driven around in a limo your entire trip. Since you have money to burn at Disney and you bought a cell phone, might as well feel like royalty!

Disney is a very expensive vacation, so not everyone has money to burn.  Nor are all vacationers in the area going to Disney.

[roadman65]

Money does not count when you have it spent on technology.    As far as credit cards go its iffy.  Many people handle their usage well, but some do not.  And even though we can handle things ourselves its been proven that when you see money itself you do manage it better.  Remember the human mind is very complex just like the color of you walls can actually effect the way you sleep or feel.  Blue causes a mind to feel more serene as the color does effect a part of your brain that releases some chemicals within you to make you feel peaceful while red creates a shocking situation which is why red is used on a stop sign.  Not because the MUTCD thinks its a good color because that color triggers a part of your brain to wake the rest of you up!

We do not realize it but it all does.  Financial experts proved it with research as well as trial.

[Rothman]

Suit yourself.  I'll be over here racking up free hotel nights in the meantime for free.

Managing money is what Excel is for.

[jwolfer]

What amazes me is the fact that most people will protest the Rental Car daily usage fee of an AET Transponder, when that same person will spend hundreds on the latest smart or I Phone before their old one is gone.

Because paying at cash booths had no fees.  Why should someone have to pay extra fees just to pay a toll?  Plus the rental car fees are clearly a cash grab - no way does it cost that much for them provide the service.  Doesn't help that many states seem to have taken inspiration from the rental companies by charging people upfront or monthly fees to get a transponder.

The fee for Sunpass transponder is crazy.. it should be a deposit.  You can see the charges almost immediately online or on the app... The rental car companies are ripping you off.. just like with filling it with fuel after you turn it in. charging like $4/gallon when the price is 2.20/gallon

Sunpass is cheaper than cash

Z981

[roadman65]

Well don't use their sunpass.  Get your own its cheaper.  However, most people do not read the road signs and end up paying the awful fees cause they run a toll without even knowing it.  Many come to me wanting me to override the thing after they went through a coin only toll without coins which automatically kicks in that stupid daily usage fee. 

In the case, I tell them to just run every toll because you already paid for it.

[vdeane]

The fee to get your own SunPass is something like $20 for the hard case or $5 for the sticker.  Not worth it unless you travel in Florida and use toll roads regularly.  Heck, even if you do, I'd consider those fees to be illegitimate.  Why should you have to pay a one-time fee when there were no fees of any kind, one-time or recurring, for cash tolls?  It's highway robbery.  Thankfully the Thruway E-ZPass is fee free, as it should be.

[bzakharin]

The fee to get your own SunPass is something like $20 for the hard case or $5 for the sticker.  Not worth it unless you travel in Florida and use toll roads regularly.  Heck, even if you do, I'd consider those fees to be illegitimate.  Why should you have to pay a one-time fee when there were no fees of any kind, one-time or recurring, for cash tolls?  It's highway robbery.  Thankfully the Thruway E-ZPass is fee free, as it should be.

But you can't get it from out of state. At least not by mail. Can you get it free in person if you fly to New York and need to travel?

[vdeane]

People have found ways around it (E-ZPass-on-the-go, having it sent to a friend who lives in NY, etc.).  MA tags are completely free too, and those are easier to get.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E-ZPass#Fees_and_discounts_by_state

[Roadwarriors79]

Checking out some of the signage (via Google Maps) of the Turnpike extension WB at the US 130 exit. Most interesting is that there's a sign pointing towards I-295 at this exit. Is I-295 signed much anywhere else on the Turnpike (other than at the south end)?

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0979631,-74.7815047,3a,75y,291.49h,90.13t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sX9VODDRLBeIDtut9miKv-Q!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

It's also interesting to note that "Philadelphia" is not covered up on the BGS like it is on most of the signs on the mainline (along with the I-95 shields).

[Alps]

Checking out some of the signage (via Google Maps) of the Turnpike extension WB at the US 130 exit. Most interesting is that there's a sign pointing towards I-295 at this exit. Is I-295 signed much anywhere else on the Turnpike (other than at the south end)?

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0979631,-74.7815047,3a,75y,291.49h,90.13t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sX9VODDRLBeIDtut9miKv-Q!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

It's also interesting to note that "Philadelphia" is not covered up on the BGS like it is on most of the signs on the mainline (along with the I-95 shields).

You're right about 295. Philadelphia makes sense here given the next two interchanges on 276.

[odditude]

Is I-295 signed much anywhere else on the Turnpike (other than at the south end)?

Not on the Turnpike itself, but at the exits.

e.g. Exit 4, Exit 5, Exit 7A

[jeffandnicole]

295 isn't signed permanently on the Turnpike mainline anywhere.  Interestingly though, they do refer to it on the VMS timed signs on the Southbound side.  Unless there's significant congestion on the Turnpike without corresponding significant congestion on 295, the time to take 295 will almost always be higher.

[NJRoadfan]

Exit 2: https://goo.gl/maps/er5ZC4hmHoz
Exit 3: https://goo.gl/maps/MxJyMuy7JXK2
Exit 7: https://goo.gl/maps/UFxs7yoftav

They'll tell you where it is...after you pay that toll.

[PHLBOS]

They'll tell you where it is...after you pay that toll.

Similar is also true for the US 130 interchange (aka Exit 6A) that Roadwarriors79 posted; it's located beyond the connector toll plaza.

[jeffandnicole]

Well, at this point we have two arguments...the NJ Turnpike doesn't sign it anywhere along the mainline, but people also say/claim everyone uses GPSs. So if the 2nd is true, then the first isn't needed.

For what it's worth, and this is probably more significant - going Northbound motorists are more likely to use the NJ Turnpike anyway, even though coming off the Delaware Memorial Bridge 295 is clearly signed and there are numerous, well signed options to switch over to the Turnpike on 295.  Even if the Turnpike had signage for 295 Southbound, it probably wouldn't convince many people to switch over anyway, based on driver's preferences and habits going Northbound.

[bzakharin]

They'll tell you where it is...after you pay that toll.

Similar is also true for the US 130 interchange (aka Exit 6A) that Roadwarriors79 posted; it's located beyond the connector toll plaza.

But US 130 is signed on the main line in the image posted above. And I don't think 295 is signed approaching the terminus either. This is the first assembly to mention I-295:
https://www.google.com/maps/@39.6794833,-75.4895909,3a,37.5y,271.11h,104.61t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1so7ZDEPTbLFI8uEi7qBa9OQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!5m1!1e1
It's already *on* 295. I don't know who erected it, given no black backgrounds it's either NJTA or DRBA, but the "Entering Twp of Pennsville" sign in the background is definitely NJDOT. Even further ahead is an "NJTP Mile 0" sign to confuse things further.

[bzakharin]

Most interesting is that there's a sign pointing towards I-295 at this exit.

That *is* interesting. I've never noticed it. More oddly, it's hardly the best place to switch to 295, as it'll cost you about 10 minutes. If anything, 295 should be signed going Eastbound on the extension, where it is plausibly a faster route. Of course, if they did that, NJTA would lose all the revenue from PA Turnpike traffic going south. Even the bridge is toll free in that direction now.

[jeffandnicole]

They'll tell you where it is...after you pay that toll.

Similar is also true for the US 130 interchange (aka Exit 6A) that Roadwarriors79 posted; it's located beyond the connector toll plaza.

But US 130 is signed on the main line in the image posted above. And I don't think 295 is signed approaching the terminus either. This is the first assembly to mention I-295:
https://www.google.com/maps/@39.6794833,-75.4895909,3a,37.5y,271.11h,104.61t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1so7ZDEPTbLFI8uEi7qBa9OQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!5m1!1e1
It's already *on* 295. I don't know who erected it, given no black backgrounds it's either NJTA or DRBA, but the "Entering Twp of Pennsville" sign in the background is definitely NJDOT. Even further ahead is an "NJTP Mile 0" sign to confuse things further.

The signs are DRBA signage.  NJDOT didn't start doing blackground-less route numbers until very recently.  The signs here are several years old, replaced at the same time as the large signage on the Delaware side (which, btw, was just replaced again a few weeks ago).

As far as the sign structure...I believe it's a DRBA sign structure, based on the similarities to structures on the Delaware side of the bridge (ie: https://goo.gl/maps/HvX93iFGHqz)  However, it also has a NJDOT Structure Number sticker on it, and it's inventoried in the SLDs.

[bzakharin]

Now I'm wondering who controls that portion of Southbound roadway. Obviously the split Northbound happens at a different location place than the merge Southbound. The NJTP MM 0 painted on the US 130 bridge seems to have happened some time between 2007 and 2012. The NJTA MM 0.2 was replaced by NJDOT's I-295 MM 1.2 in 2016 (an MM 1.1 was also installed). The NJDOT "Entering Twp of Pennsville" sign has been there as far back as GSV has data. But the overheads are probably DRBA?

[jeffandnicole]

Now I'm wondering who controls that portion of Southbound roadway. Obviously the split Northbound happens at a different location place than the merge Southbound. The NJTP MM 0 painted on the US 40 bridge seems to have happened some time between 2007 and 2012. The NJTA MM 0.2 was replaced by NJDOT's I-295 MM 1.2 in 2016 (an MM 1.1 was also installed). The NJDOT "Entering Twp of Pennsville" sign has been there as far back as GSV has data. But the overheads are probably DRBA?

There's quite a bit of shared jurisdictional responsibility in that area. South/West of 49/130 to the bridge it's all DRPA, so that's easy.  North/East of that area though it's a bit hard to tell, as there's DRPA signage, NJDOT signage (including the Big Blue Food signage), and NJ Turnpike style stripes.  When I worked the snowplows down that way, NJDOT plowed the road there.