More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend

[TempoNick]

If I were to prioritize projects:

1 - Six laning the rest of I-65 between IN 47 and IN 2
2 - Six laning the rest of I-70 between IN 9 and US 35
3 - Upgrading US 30 to remove stoplights

In a perfect world US-30 would become part of an extended I-76 from its end in Ohio.

But one reason you haven't and won't see a lot of East West Northern Indiana road projects, is there is still a binding no compete clause in the Indiana Toll Road sale. Indiana can't go and upgrade a competing road. I can't remember though if that would include US-30 or not.

Interstate 76 would be one goofy alignment though. You're starting at just south of Pittsburgh, going north maybe 60 miles is the crow flies to get to Akron, then 33 miles south to get to Mansfield, then going in a northerly direction again as you drive toward Fort Wayne and Chicago. Not very practical.

[Moose]

If I were to prioritize projects:

1 - Six laning the rest of I-65 between IN 47 and IN 2
2 - Six laning the rest of I-70 between IN 9 and US 35
3 - Upgrading US 30 to remove stoplights

In a perfect world US-30 would become part of an extended I-76 from its end in Ohio.

But one reason you haven't and won't see a lot of East West Northern Indiana road projects, is there is still a binding no compete clause in the Indiana Toll Road sale. Indiana can't go and upgrade a competing road. I can't remember though if that would include US-30 or not.

Interstate 76 would be one goofy alignment though. You're starting at just south of Pittsburgh, going north maybe 60 miles is the crow flies to get to Akron, then 33 miles south to get to Mansfield, then going in a northerly direction again as you drive toward Fort Wayne and Chicago. Not very practical.

About follows some of the railroad alignments that flow east to west. The old EL and PRR comes to mind. B&O not far away.

its also no more weird really then the hard hook the Indiana Toll Road takes to run on the Michigan Border..
Probably need to find the old Toll Road thread and place the US 30 discussion there.

As to the IN-31 corridor. I can't imagine the end goal for now being anything less than interstate standards Indy to Kokomo.

[zzcarp]

Interstate 76 would be one goofy alignment though. You're starting at just south of Pittsburgh, going north maybe 60 miles is the crow flies to get to Akron, then 33 miles south to get to Mansfield, then going in a northerly direction again as you drive toward Fort Wayne and Chicago. Not very practical.

With the NE-SW trajectory of both the Turnpike and I-71, there's only about 20 miles of true N-S "backtracking", and only 16-ish on I-71 itself. It's not that far out of the way or impractical for a trip of hundreds of miles.

[silverback1065]

us 30 would make more sense as I-80. but that will Never happen.

[silverback1065]

Here's a link to INDOT's Major Project Delivery's 2022 Industry Day Presentation. This presentation, uploaded in PDF, gives a concise overview of the big projects currently underway and what's on the horizon.

So according to Page 27 of 56, INDOT is already needing to modify US 31 between I-465 and 116th Street?  Didn't think it had been that long since INDOT upgraded that stretch.

my guess is the flyover ramps are already in need of widening due to increased traffic and in order to accommodate the widening you need to extend the widening north a bit, but that's the only thing I can think of as to why that would need work. I used to live up there and the ramps to us 31 north really could use more lanes.

[monty]

Here's a link to INDOT's Major Project Delivery's 2022 Industry Day Presentation. This presentation, uploaded in PDF, gives a concise overview of the big projects currently underway and what's on the horizon.

So according to Page 27 of 56, INDOT is already needing to modify US 31 between I-465 and 116th Street?  Didn't think it had been that long since INDOT upgraded that stretch.

my guess is the flyover ramps are already in need of widening due to increased traffic and in order to accommodate the widening you need to extend the widening north a bit, but that's the only thing I can think of as to why that would need work. I used to live up there and the ramps to us 31 north really could use more lanes.

That area gets very congested - exiting to and entry from I 465. INDOT made a lane adjustment this summer restricting northbound Meridian to one entry lane to allow two lanes of entry from I 465. It seemed to help some. I 465 east to US 31 north backs up a lot during busy times - even slowing clear back onto eastbound travel lanes on I 465.

Southbound Traffic from US 31 exiting to I 465 backs up often clear back to 116th. The pinch point is the reduction of exit lanes just past the eastbound ramp.

[TempoNick]

us 30 would make more sense as I-80. but that will Never happen.

Now you're talking. Swap 80 and 76 west of Youngstown and just keep going west using US 30. 76 would terminate at I-90.

[Life in Paradise]

us 30 would make more sense as I-80. but that will Never happen.

Now you're talking. Swap 80 and 76 west of Youngstown and just keep going west using US 30. 76 would terminate at I-90.

And almost immediately you get rid of a lot of concurrencies. 

[I-55]

us 30 would make more sense as I-80. but that will Never happen.

Now you're talking. Swap 80 and 76 west of Youngstown and just keep going west using US 30. 76 would terminate at I-90.

And almost immediately you get rid of a lot of concurrencies.

- Alternative to the Borman
- US 30 gets significant safety upgrades
- Fort Wayne gets an east-west 2di AND an x0 at that
- Ohio might consider a direct interchange with I-75... (gonna stop here before getting too fictional)

I see this as an absolute win for the 260 gang.

[TempoNick]

- Fort Wayne gets an east-west 2di AND an x0

Spread the love around. Akron and Mansfield would also get an x0.

[JREwing78]

As to the US-31 corridor. I can't imagine the end goal for now being anything less than interstate standards Indy to Kokomo.

That is, indeed, the ultimate plan. Eventually, also for north of Kokomo to US-24, as the traffic counts justify freeway to that point. It's also much like the section south of Kokomo, with 4-lane built out on narrow ROW and too many access points, so it's going to be similarly expensive to upgrade.

The section between US-30 and US-24 will be the last section to go full-freeway, but it's also the lightest in traffic. It's primary problem are the handful of stoplights, which will only grow more dangerous as the sections south of US-24 replace stoplights with interchanges and people grow less accustomed to seeing them on US-31. It has plenty of ROW and access control is much better, so it's a much less daunting task to convert to freeway when needed.

[Revive 755]

- Alternative to the Borman

So far all the US 30 upgrades seem to stop at Valparaiso - not far enough west for a Borman alternative.  Now if the upgrades would make it to I-65 and be tied in with a revival/extension of the Illiana . . .

[cjw2001]

INDOT put out a new press release today: U.S. 31 Limited Access Upgrade from State Road 38 to 286th Street Project Update




See the project website for detailed intersection diagrams: https://www.in.gov/indot/about-indot/central-office/welcome-to-the-greenfield-district/us-31-limited-access-upgrade-from-sr-38-to-286th-street/?utm_campaign=&utm_content=&utm_medium=email&utm_source=govdelivery&utm_term=

Looks like the project also includes median cable barrier from 106th Street up to SR 26.

[ITB]

Grabbed some screenshots from Google Maps/Streetview. They're from June/July, so a bit old, but may be interest to some.


Google Maps/Streetview
236th Street overpass and interchange at Bakers Corner; looking southwest.


Google Maps/Streetview
View from the overpass; looking slightly northwest.


Google Maps/Streetview
Pounding piles for the overpass and interchange at 276th Street; looking slightly southwest.


Google Maps/Streetview
Earth and paving work at the 276th Street work zone; looking southeast.

[tdindy88]

I just happened to be looking at that Streetview last night along 236th Street. I was very intrigued to see them putting up mileage signs along 236th Street on both sides of the US 31 interchange. I don't think I've ever heard of INDOT doing that for non state highways as 236th is still very much a Hamilton County road.

To the west of the interchange there's a distance sign for Sheridan (5 miles) and Crawfordsville (45 miles.) Sheridan makes obvious sense but it was interesting to see Crawfordsville mentioned here. It does make sense since 236th Street turns into SR 47 in Sheridan.

And to the east there's a distance sign for Cicero (6 miles) and Anderson (25 miles.) I'm curious to know what they consider the most optimal route to Anderson from here.

[NWI_Irish96]

I just happened to be looking at that Streetview last night along 236th Street. I was very intrigued to see them putting up mileage signs along 236th Street on both sides of the US 31 interchange. I don't think I've ever heard of INDOT doing that for non state highways as 236th is still very much a Hamilton County road.

To the west of the interchange there's a distance sign for Sheridan (5 miles) and Crawfordsville (45 miles.) Sheridan makes obvious sense but it was interesting to see Crawfordsville mentioned here. It does make sense since 236th Street turns into SR 47 in Sheridan.

And to the east there's a distance sign for Cicero (6 miles) and Anderson (25 miles.) I'm curious to know what they consider the most optimal route to Anderson from here.

I've never had the need to go to Anderson directly from that spot, but if I did, it would be via 236th (and the other names the road takes along the way). Given the growth in northern Hamilton County, you could argue that 47 should be extended to Anderson.

[Life in Paradise]

I just happened to be looking at that Streetview last night along 236th Street. I was very intrigued to see them putting up mileage signs along 236th Street on both sides of the US 31 interchange. I don't think I've ever heard of INDOT doing that for non state highways as 236th is still very much a Hamilton County road.

To the west of the interchange there's a distance sign for Sheridan (5 miles) and Crawfordsville (45 miles.) Sheridan makes obvious sense but it was interesting to see Crawfordsville mentioned here. It does make sense since 236th Street turns into SR 47 in Sheridan.

And to the east there's a distance sign for Cicero (6 miles) and Anderson (25 miles.) I'm curious to know what they consider the most optimal route to Anderson from here.

I've never had the need to go to Anderson directly from that spot, but if I did, it would be via 236th (and the other names the road takes along the way). Given the growth in northern Hamilton County, you could argue that 47 should be extended to Anderson.

Apparently IN 47 used to go through Baker's Corner and US31, but was decommissioned and terminated at Sheridan and IN 38.  Can't have those state roads going through populated areas, that's for Interstates mostly.

[monty]

INDOT put out a new press release today: U.S. 31 Limited Access Upgrade from State Road 38 to 286th Street Project Update




See the project website for detailed intersection diagrams: https://www.in.gov/indot/about-indot/central-office/welcome-to-the-greenfield-district/us-31-limited-access-upgrade-from-sr-38-to-286th-street/?utm_campaign=&utm_content=&utm_medium=email&utm_source=govdelivery&utm_term=

Looks like the project also includes median cable barrier from 106th Street up to SR 26.

Interesting to see the RIRO at 286th St. That process was an indot preference for Tipton County as well, including Division Road. Local opposition lead to the Propel study now ongoing. The US 31 Coalition will oppose the RIRO applications in favor of true interstate standards. It's going to be interesting to see the Propel results and to what degree indot will endorse the recommendations. The median cable barrier up to SR 26 was also in the prior strategy and likely will eliminate numerous median crossings.

This newest Hamilton County segment surely will qualify for a 65 mph speed limit. Do RIRO intersections qualify for the 65 limit or must they stay at 60, as is the current case? Comparing the recent Hoosier Heartland corridor RIRO's make me think that 60 will be the max.

[Great Lakes Roads]

INDOT put out a new press release today: U.S. 31 Limited Access Upgrade from State Road 38 to 286th Street Project Update




See the project website for detailed intersection diagrams: https://www.in.gov/indot/about-indot/central-office/welcome-to-the-greenfield-district/us-31-limited-access-upgrade-from-sr-38-to-286th-street/?utm_campaign=&utm_content=&utm_medium=email&utm_source=govdelivery&utm_term=

Looks like the project also includes median cable barrier from 106th Street up to SR 26.

Interesting to see the RIRO at 286th St. That process was an indot preference for Tipton County as well, including Division Road. Local opposition lead to the Propel study now ongoing. The US 31 Coalition will oppose the RIRO applications in favor of true interstate standards. It's going to be interesting to see the Propel results and to what degree indot will endorse the recommendations. The median cable barrier up to SR 26 was also in the prior strategy and likely will eliminate numerous median crossings.

This newest Hamilton County segment surely will qualify for a 65 mph speed limit. Do RIRO intersections qualify for the 65 limit or must they stay at 60, as is the current case? Comparing the recent Hoosier Heartland corridor RIRO's make me think that 60 will be the max.

I have a feeling that INDOT will stick to 60 mph through the rest of Hamilton County until the segment through Tipton County gets upgraded to freeway standards.

[I-55]

Interesting to see the RIRO at 286th St. That process was an indot preference for Tipton County as well, including Division Road. Local opposition lead to the Propel study now ongoing. The US 31 Coalition will oppose the RIRO applications in favor of true interstate standards. It's going to be interesting to see the Propel results and to what degree indot will endorse the recommendations. The median cable barrier up to SR 26 was also in the prior strategy and likely will eliminate numerous median crossings.

This newest Hamilton County segment surely will qualify for a 65 mph speed limit. Do RIRO intersections qualify for the 65 limit or must they stay at 60, as is the current case? Comparing the recent Hoosier Heartland corridor RIRO's make me think that 60 will be the max.

US-24 east of Fort Wayne has a RIRO at Bruick Rd and a 65 mph limit. Not saying it's INDOT's preferred choice, but they've done it before.

I have a feeling that INDOT will stick to 60 mph through the rest of Hamilton County until the segment through Tipton County gets upgraded to freeway standards.

US-24 likely was 65 to match the portion in Ohio, INDOT will probably wait until there's enough freeway to keep a consistent speed on 31.

[tdindy88]

In any case, the RIRO at 286th is probably a temporary measure anyway. Once the PROPEL study comes back with the "recommendation" that US 31 should be made into a freeway through Tipton County with an interchange at Division Road they will start working on converting the rest to be like a freeway. I would guess that 286th would become a cul-de-sac with nearby 296th being an overpass. After all of that is completed then a uniform 65 MPH can be applied. Or even a 70 MPH if the General Assembly wills it so.

[TempoNick]

Well, dvferance, I don't think the corridor needs an Interstate designation, even though the 67 designation would fit the grid. I do think the US 31 corridor between Indianapolis and South Bend should be completely freeway, just keep it US 31. After the Interstate binges North Carolina and Texas have gone on, I don't think other states should follow their lead. Besides, if the Indianapolis-to-South Bend corridor were to get an Interstate designation, such a designation should continue into Michigan (perhaps to Grand Rapids). I don't think that would be illogical.

I'm a big fan of Interstate quality roads and Interstate designations. They are very helpful for travelers. A US shield means nothing. It could be anything from a crappy two-lane road like US 52 in the southern tip of West Virginia, to an interstate style highway. At the very least, they should come up with different colored US shields so that you know what kind of highway you are on. (Blue for true freeway and maybe red for divided four lane rural with at grade intersections.)

[The Ghostbuster]

I stand by my 2019 comment. The US 31 corridor does not need an Interstate designation, even if it is upgraded to freeway standards along its entire length between Indianapolis and South Bend. If I'm not mistaken, the portion of US 31 between IN 38 and IN 931 (southern segment) was also to be upgraded to freeway standards but was pushed back due to the original plans severely restricting access along the existing corridor. That portion will likely be upgraded in the future, but extensive mitigation of impacts would be needed before doing so.

[NWI_Irish96]

I stand by my 2019 comment. The US 31 corridor does not need an Interstate designation, even if it is upgraded to freeway standards along its entire length between Indianapolis and South Bend. If I'm not mistaken, the portion of US 31 between IN 38 and IN 931 (southern segment) was also to be upgraded to freeway standards but was pushed back due to the original plans severely restricting access along the existing corridor. That portion will likely be upgraded in the future, but extensive mitigation of impacts would be needed before doing so.

I don't think the segment between US 30 and US 24 is getting upgraded anytime soon, but if we did end up at the point where you had a full freeway from Indianapolis to Benton Harbor, then it absolutely should receive an interstate designation.

[sprjus4]

In any case, the RIRO at 286th is probably a temporary measure anyway. Once the PROPEL study comes back with the "recommendation" that US 31 should be made into a freeway through Tipton County with an interchange at Division Road they will start working on converting the rest to be like a freeway. I would guess that 286th would become a cul-de-sac with nearby 296th being an overpass. After all of that is completed then a uniform 65 MPH can be applied. Or even a 70 MPH if the General Assembly wills it so.

If the General Assembly wills it so, the entire corridor between Indianapolis and South Bend could go up to 65 mph or 70 mph as is. The cap of 60 mph due to access control is purely artificial.

We suffer the same fate here in Virginia.