Alaska roadmeet ever?

[brianreynolds]

Yeah. That's why I'm a bit hesitant on 2017 for the Dalton drive. 2018 might be better, but on the other hand, I really want to attempt this with other folks just like Brian suggested (to help split the costs). If '17 or '18 is Brian's only opportunity to do the Dalton drive, I might have to be flexible on that - just because I don't know when I'd have another opportunity to do something like this for with like-minded folks.

There are at least three Alaska trips I'd love to take in my lifetime: 1) the road meet in 2017 (driving there and back), 2) a drive up and down the Dalton Highway (with the Arctic Ocean tour that Oscar was talking about), and 3) a flight to Nome and back while exploring Nome for a few days. I just hope I can somehow combine numbers 1 and 2.

Is the 2017 meet a sure thing? A.J., based on your comments, I am ready to defer the Dalton adventure until 2018, but I'd like to make it part of a meet somewhere in Alaska.  I will definitely have to scrimp and save, and 2018 gives me another year to do so.  But if I wait (and save) that long, it will be an epic adventure for me.

My proposal.  I would like to time my visit to Deadhorse/Prudhoe for the summer solstice, which will be June 21, 2018 at 10:10 GMT, which would be evening local time (but still a month or two before sunset).  That happens to fall on a Thursday, not that anything that happens in Alaska will be weekend-dependent.  If there would be a Fairbanks meet associated with this, it would probably be two or three days before or after the solstice.  If it was Anchorage-based, it should be a day or two further out.  My personal preference would be for Fairbanks, but not really for any road-related reasons.  If there is a good reason to meet elsewhere, I can surely be persuaded.

[oscar]

My proposal.  I would like to time my visit to Deadhorse/Prudhoe for the summer solstice, which will be June 21, 2018 at 10:10 GMT, which would be evening local time (but still a month or two before sunset).  That happens to fall on a Thursday, not that anything that happens in Alaska will be weekend-dependent.  If there would be a Fairbanks meet associated with this, it would probably be two or three days before or after the solstice.  If it was Anchorage-based, it should be a day or two further out.  My personal preference would be for Fairbanks, but not really for any road-related reasons.  If there is a good reason to meet elsewhere, I can surely be persuaded.

Why the focus on the solstice? Even south of the Arctic Circle down to Anchorage, for at least all of June and a good part of July you'll have more daylight than you can possibly use, unless (a) you try to drive 18 hours or more per day, and (b) can't stand night driving. Even in the lower latitudes you'll be driving from or through, you'll have lots or daylight for weeks before and weeks after the solstice. So I'd try to optimize for other factors, such as mosquito avoidance.

[brianreynolds]

Why the focus on the solstice? Even south of the Arctic Circle down to Anchorage, for at least all of June and a good part of July you'll have more daylight than you can possibly use, unless (a) you try to drive 18 hours or more per day, and (b) can't stand night driving. Even in the lower latitudes you'll be driving from or through, you'll have lots or daylight for weeks before and weeks after the solstice. So I'd try to optimize for other factors, such as mosquito avoidance.

Why the solstice?  To experience the midnight sun at its most profound.  Maybe I'll make up a pagan ritual just for the moment.  As you have already advised, Alaska is too big to be consumed in a single bite.  Other trips will be arranged around practical factors like mosquito season.  But for the visit to Deadhorse I want to see the midnight sun as far above the horizon as possible.

According to http://www.alaska.org/advice/best-time-to-visit-alaska the optimum time to visit Alaska is June 15 - July 15, all factors considered.   

[Alps]

I was thinking more 2017 than 2018.

[brianreynolds]

I was thinking more 2017 than 2018.

Had you focused on a specific date and location?

[oscar]

Why the solstice?  To experience the midnight sun at its most profound.  Maybe I'll make up a pagan ritual just for the moment.  As you have already advised, Alaska is too big to be consumed in a single bite.  Other trips will be arranged around practical factors like mosquito season.  But for the visit to Deadhorse I want to see the midnight sun as far above the horizon as possible.

Heh. Only time I "experienced" 24-hour daylight, in Coldfoot when I was more than twenty years younger, I slept right through the midnight sun. My other evenings north of the Arctic Circle were in late July or August, well after the first sunset of the summer.

[cl94]

I really don't know why everyone wants to drive the Dalton - although it would be interesting, it would also be pretty darn boring.

Because you can. The Oh Shit Corner sign is famous.

[vdeane]

Just curious... is it possible to take a train ride from Albany to Alaska?  It might make it less of a stretch for me to get out that way.  Though Alaska is a reach for me regardless unless I decide to make an exception to my "no flying" rule.

[cl94]

Just curious... is it possible to take a train ride from Albany to Alaska?  It might make it less of a stretch for me to get out that way.  Though Alaska is a reach for me regardless unless I decide to make an exception to my "no flying" rule.

No rail connection between Alaska and the North American rail network. Closest you can get is Vancouver. Could always take a train to Seattle and take the ferry up to Alaska.

[oscar]

Just curious... is it possible to take a train ride from Albany to Alaska?  It might make it less of a stretch for me to get out that way.  Though Alaska is a reach for me regardless unless I decide to make an exception to my "no flying" rule.

No rail connection between Alaska and the North American rail network. Closest you can get is Vancouver. Could always take a train to Seattle and take the ferry up to Alaska.

You'd also need to make your way from Seattle to the AMHS ferry dock in Bellingham WA. But once there, you can take the ferry all the way up to Whittier AK, where you have a very easy Alaska Railroad connection to Anchorage, Fairbanks, or other "Railbelt" destinations. And you don't have to clear customs that way, even though you pass non-stop through Canadian waters.

Early reservations are recommended, especially on the popular routes out of Bellingham, if you want to take a vehicle or rent a cabin. Or you can be frugal and bring a sleeping bag to snooze in the solarium (some small self-supporting stake-less tents also work), in which case you might not need reservations as far in advance.

[froggie]

There's an Amtrak line between Seattle and Vancouver that stops right by the Bellingham ferry terminal, so theoretically yes it would be possible for someone to take the train+ferry from Albany to Anchorage.

[1995hoo]

The most important word is "theoretically." It'd take a very long time and the cost, plus meals (Amtrak fare doesn't include meals except on the Auto Train and in first class on the Acela), probably wouldn't save a whole lot over driving out. I use Amtrak pretty regularly between home and Florida via the Auto Train. That's about a 17-hour train ride and the ride is bumpy. I can't imagine doing it cross-country.

If it weren't for the need to connect to the ferry, vdeane would have another option due to living in Upstate New York–go north to Montreal and take VIA Rail across Canada to Vancouver. I do not know whether it's a better deal than Amtrak or whether the ride is better.

[vdeane]

Looks like carpooling is the more effective option.  Traveling on my own, it would take ~ 8 days (80 hours) to get up.  If the driving could be shared, that would allow for 16 hour days instead of 8, cutting the travel time to ~ 4 days each way... much more reasonable.  It would also cut gas/hotel costs in half.

[oscar]

The most important word is "theoretically." It'd take a very long time and the cost, plus meals (Amtrak fare doesn't include meals except on the Auto Train and in first class on the Acela), probably wouldn't save a whole lot over driving out. I use Amtrak pretty regularly between home and Florida via the Auto Train. That's about a 17-hour train ride and the ride is bumpy. I can't imagine doing it cross-country.

And the likelihood of delays would require building in lots of time to avoid missing connections.

If it weren't for the need to connect to the ferry, vdeane would have another option due to living in Upstate New York–go north to Montreal and take VIA Rail across Canada to Vancouver. I do not know whether it's a better deal than Amtrak or whether the ride is better.

Could connect to the ferry taking Amtrak south to Bellingham WA (means going through customs at both ends of the journey). Or taking VIA Rail to Prince Rupert BC, Alaska Marine Highway ferry into southeast Alaska, then connecting at a port between Ketchikan and Juneau to another AMHS ferry running between Bellingham WA and Whittier AK. But I don't know frequency of VIA Rail service to Prince Rupert, other than it's less than daily. There is no ferry service between Vancouver and Prince Rupert; the only ferry running south from Prince Rupert ends in Port Hardy, well short of Vancouver.

I don't know whether VIA Rail is as bad as Amtrak in sticking to its schedules on its cross-country routes. But VIA Rail warns travelers not to reserve connecting travel for the same day as scheduled arrival.

[brianreynolds]

Looks like carpooling is the more effective option.  Traveling on my own, it would take ~ 8 days (80 hours) to get up.  If the driving could be shared, that would allow for 16 hour days instead of 8, cutting the travel time to ~ 4 days each way... much more reasonable.  It would also cut gas/hotel costs in half.

Valerie, is your aversion to flying a deep-seated fear (like my mother-in-law) or a mere preference for road-warrior-type travel?   I love to travel - via whatever - so flying is not a problem for me.  Since I started keeping track of highways and counties, my affinity for flight has diminished dramatically.  I used to fly once or twice a year, but it has been almost ten years since my last travel by air.

Our group of road-warriors is a diverse bunch.  Some are tightly constrained by family or career considerations.  Others are not.  This diversity is not a problem, it is an opportunity.  A few posts back, I suggested how we might leverage this, but I may not have been expansive enough.

To do Alaska to any meaningful extent (by road only) would require perhaps three consecutive weeks.  Figure a week en route there, a similar time en route return, and a week exploring on the ground.   Some (not many) of us have the freedom of movement to pull that off.   

For illustration purposes only (I am not seizing control of the agenda - yet) let's assume a meet location of Fairbanks.  The most heavily constrained among us might only be able to arrange a few days of disposable time.  They could arrange to fly to the airport at Fairbanks, be picked up by another participant, and have the most complete Alaskan experience their schedule would allow. 

Some of us may be constrained, but to a lesser extent.  If two weeks is doable, and you live east of Chicago, perhaps you could fly to Toronto or Montreal, and then to (for example) Edmonton (returning the same way).  The flight takes out three or four travel days in each direction.  Someone from our group would meet and greet you there, and the most exotic segment of road would lie ahead.

For those of us with the least constraints, three (or four, or more) consecutive weeks of travel is what we live for. Meeting  our friends at Edmonton (or wherever), then sharing the ride and the expenses from there is logical, efficient, frugal, and fun.  As of the summer of 2015, I am not yet that footloose, but by 2017 (or 2018?) I hope to be.

The logistics of this are somewhat daunting.  Real commitments by really reliable people would be necessary.  Advance planning is a must.  As such, I would suggest a selection of date and location soon, for planning and scheduling purposes.  It should surprise nobody that I would lobby for Fairbanks in mid-late June. 

Over and out.

[Duke87]

Alright well there's advance planning and there's advance planning. In two years a lot can change with regards to anyone's financial situation, vacation time availability, place of residence, relationship status, and/or familial obligations. Let's not go too crazy here.

[1995hoo]

....

If it weren't for the need to connect to the ferry, vdeane would have another option due to living in Upstate New York–go north to Montreal and take VIA Rail across Canada to Vancouver. I do not know whether it's a better deal than Amtrak or whether the ride is better.

....

I don't know whether VIA Rail is as bad as Amtrak in sticking to its schedules on its cross-country routes. But VIA Rail warns travelers not to reserve connecting travel for the same day as scheduled arrival.

That's also a very good rule of thumb on Amtrak outside the Northeast Corridor. When people have asked me for advice on taking the Auto Train to spring training, I always tell them never to plan on making it to a 1:00 PM game the same day as the train is due to arrive.

vdeane, in case you don't know, to clarify what we're getting at here, the main issue is that outside of the Northeast Corridor (the very busy DC-to-Boston routes), Amtrak doesn't own the train tracks and instead runs on tracks owned by the freight companies because the US government made the freight companies give Amtrak access to their tracks back when Amtrak was created (prior to that, federal law required passenger space to be made available on freight trains). The downside is that the railroad equivalent of air traffic control is, naturally, controlled by the freight companies and therefore gives the freight trains priority when there's heavy traffic. I'll never forget the time it took over two hours to cover the approximately 80 miles from Lorton to the Richmond area because we kept having to stop for freight traffic.

This is not the only reason for delays, of course, but it's a major one.

[froggie]

(Amtrak fare doesn't include meals except on the Auto Train and in first class on the Acela)

Not entirely true.  On the long-distance trains, if you get a sleeper (whether bedroom or roomette), meals are included.

Looks like carpooling is the more effective option.  Traveling on my own, it would take ~ 8 days (80 hours) to get up.  If the driving could be shared, that would allow for 16 hour days instead of 8, cutting the travel time to ~ 4 days each way... much more reasonable.  It would also cut gas/hotel costs in half.

Even with two drivers, I think you're still underestimating the number of days involved given the sheer distance and the likelihood of lower speeds once you're beyond Edmonton (between construction zones, slow trucks, bad road conditions, paucity of services, etc etc).

And the likelihood of delays would require building in lots of time to avoid missing connections.

Not much different than the likelihood of delays going through major urban areas or the aforementioned construction zones on the Alaska Highway.

[1995hoo]

(Amtrak fare doesn't include meals except on the Auto Train and in first class on the Acela)

Not entirely true.  On the long-distance trains, if you get a sleeper (whether bedroom or roomette), meals are included.

....

Thanks for that. The webpage I read a few years ago when I was looking into some of the long-distance trains appeared to say otherwise, but I may have misunderstood it or I may have not realized the writer was talking about coach class.

As a practical matter, if someone were to go cross-country on Amtrak, I would highly recommend getting at least the roomette so as to have some privacy and a flat bed for sleeping (I still don't sleep all that great on the train, but I sleep better than I did in coach class). If you're travelling with another person, I'd get the larger rooms for reasons of space (Ms1995hoo and I book the "Superliner Bedroom" on the Auto Train because we felt neither of us had enough legroom in the roomette and because of an utter lack of space to stand up when it was in sleeping configuration); also, depending on which equipment Amtrak uses for a given route, on some of their train cars the roomette has an in-room toilet with no privacy, so if you're riding with someone else, one of you has to sit right next to the toilet most of the time and when one of you wants to use it, the other person has to wait out in the hall or else just sit and watch. (Amtrak announced they would phase this out and redesign those Viewliner cars, but I don't know if they've completed the process yet.) Of course, a solo traveller might find this style of in-room toilet to be just fine. (Some of the larger bedrooms have in-room showers as well. I've never used the one in the "Superliner Bedroom" on the Auto Train, but I'm sure I would if I were riding cross-country.)

[froggie]

My experience with the sleepers is on the Empire Builder (Seattle to Chicago) and the Capital Limited (Chicago to DC).  Val would be on the former if she chose to do the train option.  On both of these routes, Amtrak uses bi-level sleepers (not sure the specific name of the car type).  The roomettes do not have their own toilet, but there are 3 toilets and 1 shower on the lower level exclusively for roomette passenger use.  The slightly larger bedrooms do have their own shower/toilet in a separate enclosure.  I am not sure what type of gear Amtrak uses on the Lakeshore Limited (what Val would be using to get from Albany to Chicago).

As for scheduling, a few years ago VIA dropped their cross-country route to a 3-day-a-week route, whereas the Amtrak routes that would be involved are still daily trains.  On my latest trip 2 weeks ago on the Empire Builder, we were about an hour-and-a-half late getting from Seattle to Minneapolis, which really isn't that bad given all the oil trains across North Dakota.  We were actually on-time (or even pulling into stations early) from Seattle until we approached Williston.  But this should improve in the next year or two as BNSF is actively double-tracking lengthy sections of track on both sides of Williston plus filling one of the single-track gaps in Minnesota.

[1995hoo]

I suppose the train discussion might be off-topic because I kind of think the odds of any of us actually taking the train cross-country are slim, but it can't hurt to mention the options in case anyone does seriously consider it.

My experience with the sleepers is on the Empire Builder (Seattle to Chicago) and the Capital Limited (Chicago to DC).  Val would be on the former if she chose to do the train option.  On both of these routes, Amtrak uses bi-level sleepers (not sure the specific name of the car type).  The roomettes do not have their own toilet, but there are 3 toilets and 1 shower on the lower level exclusively for roomette passenger use.  The slightly larger bedrooms do have their own shower/toilet in a separate enclosure.  I am not sure what type of gear Amtrak uses on the Lakeshore Limited (what Val would be using to get from Albany to Chicago).

....

Good info. If you were on the Superliner cars, those downstairs toilets and shower are also for the use of the people in the "Family Bedroom," which is located downstairs at one end of the car and, oddly, doesn't have an in-room toilet. (There is no "Family Bedroom" on the Viewliner, only the Superliner.) The "Accessible Bedroom" at the other end has the toilet but no shower. Only the "Superliner Bedroom" and "Viewliner Bedroom" have the full in-room toilet and shower. I looked into the "Family Bedroom" once because when I was pricing out a trip, that room was only $50 more than the regular "Bedroom." I didn't book it for two reasons: (1) I figured since we didn't need the space, I should leave it available for a family with small kids. (2) More importantly, when I actually went to the station to buy tickets, the price had gone up and I didn't want to pay the increased price. (Why did I go in person when you can book online? I used American Express points to get a $300 discount, and when you do that you are sent a paper certificate that must be redeemed in person at an Amtrak station.)

For those unfamiliar, the shower froggie mentions is a single shower in a lockable room (no "gang shower" like your high school gym's locker room). There's a sort of entrance area where you put your clothes and towel and stuff and then the shower itself is behind a separate curtain. The showerhead itself is the hand-held type you see in some hotel rooms. I normally hate those, but on a bumpy train ride it makes it a lot easier to rinse off.

The Lake Shore Limited uses the Viewliner. That's the one where the roomette has the peculiar in-room toilet Amtrak intends to phase out. Info from Amtrak is here.....notice in the sleeping configuration, the lower passenger's head is next to the toilet! I have never ridden on the Viewliners and I don't know if those roomettes are more comfortable than the Superliner version. The page I linked says the room is two inches longer–on the Superliner, the roomette is 3'6" wide and 6'6" long, whereas on the Viewliner it's 3'6" by 6'8". This is why I described it as a good option for a solo traveller. I think it feels cramped for two adults, even just for a single overnight trip. The new Viewliner II cars will omit the in-room toilet in the roomette. Those cars were being built as of 2013; their entry into service was delayed and I believe it began this year, though I don't know on which routes.

It's hard to get good pictures of the sleeping options without a fisheye lens and I don't have one, but I have some pictures that at least give a bit of a sense for things. This first picture is half a Superliner roomette. I assume most folks are familiar with the size of a standard "broadsheet" newspaper, so that should help give a sense of the width. The other seat faces this one and the table pulls out from the wall to the left of that bottle of water. This is why, if you have two people, you have to sit at a bit of an angle so your feet aren't bumping each other when you want to stretch out. The second picture is the other half of the Superliner roomette, facing the seat seen in the first picture. The bag located to my right (viewer's left) with the hat sitting on top of it is on top of the upper step leading to the upper bunk. The lower step is next to my leg and my grey CPAP bag is sitting on it. When the upper bunk is lowered for sleeping, it's at about the level of the top of my head in this picture. In the roomette, the bunks run along the length of the car (your feet are normally located closer to the direction in which the train is going unless you request otherwise, which I have done because the electrical outlet for my CPAP was at the other end). Both these pictures were taken in Lorton waiting to depart for Florida.

I do not have a decent photo of the roomette in sleeping configuration. It's essentially two twin beds. The lower two seats slide down to form the lower bed and, as I said, the upper bunk lowers from the ceiling. The sleeping-car attendant does all this for you and makes the bed using provided mattress pads and linens. On a long-distance trip, you'd probably want to try to bring your own pillow because Amtrak's are not very supportive (all the more so if, like me, you use a memory-foam pillow!).




The Superliner Bedroom and the Viewliner Bedroom are again of a similar size but slightly different–on the Superliner it's 7'6" wide (corridor to side of train) and 6'6" long. On the Viewliner it's 6'8" wide and 7'1" long. There is a private in-room toilet and shower (both in the same sealed enclosure, and we have never smelled the toilet when the door is closed); in the first picture, it's behind the wall to the viewer's left, and in the second picture it's behind the wall to the viewer's right. In the third picture, it's to the viewer's right of that mirror next to me. (We have never used the in-room shower. I've showered downstairs, though. A bit awkward on a rocking train, but not awful.) The room has a couch-like seat (obvious in the second picture) that will comfortably seat two adults; there is also a third chair that folds up that faces the couch (in the third picture, I'm sitting in it). For me that third folding seat is very important because I invariably wake up before Ms1995hoo does and I want somewhere to sit that has some back support. Sitting in the folded-down bunk is uncomfortable. The table folds out from below the window. The upper bunk is the diagonal thing next to my head in the first picture. It folds down and a ladder attaches to provide access. The couch folds down into the lower bunk. There's a sink and mirror on the wall, most visible in the second picture, and there's a small coat closet opposite that. We much prefer this room to the roomette because it's more comfortable and allows us some room to move without bumping into each other constantly, and our legs aren't constantly in each other's way. You could make this work with two adults and a kid. I think it might feel confining for two adults and two kids. The upper bunk is basically the size of a twin bed. The lower one is a bit bigger, but we have not tried to share it. In this room, the bunks are crosswise to the direction of travel.

(The pictures where I'm wearing the red shirt are from this past June; the one where I'm wearing the black shirt is from December 2012. All three were taken in Sanford waiting for the train to depart for home.)



BTW, in terms of getting a sense for the size of the space, I'm just over 6'0".

The other thing in the Superliner Roomette is that if you have two people in there such that both bunks are in use, if you need to get up during the night to use the toilet, you have barely one foot of room in which to stand to put on some clothes to go down the hall. It's awkward.



One of our relatives in Florida sells Pampered Chef stuff and she gave us these TRAVEL MUG WINE GLASSES. When I first saw these, my reaction was basically "WTF" because I obviously can't use one when I'm driving! But they've proven to be perfect in our room on the train because the ride can get quite bumpy at times and with these we don't have to worry about spilling the wine. (We have also used them at home when eating out on the deck because the lids prevent the bugs from getting at the wine....) You could, in theory, bring a small cooler of beer if you wanted.

[vdeane]

Looks like carpooling is the more effective option.  Traveling on my own, it would take ~ 8 days (80 hours) to get up.  If the driving could be shared, that would allow for 16 hour days instead of 8, cutting the travel time to ~ 4 days each way... much more reasonable.  It would also cut gas/hotel costs in half.

Valerie, is your aversion to flying a deep-seated fear (like my mother-in-law) or a mere preference for road-warrior-type travel?   I love to travel - via whatever - so flying is not a problem for me.  Since I started keeping track of highways and counties, my affinity for flight has diminished dramatically.  I used to fly once or twice a year, but it has been almost ten years since my last travel by air.

Our group of road-warriors is a diverse bunch.  Some are tightly constrained by family or career considerations.  Others are not.  This diversity is not a problem, it is an opportunity.  A few posts back, I suggested how we might leverage this, but I may not have been expansive enough.

To do Alaska to any meaningful extent (by road only) would require perhaps three consecutive weeks.  Figure a week en route there, a similar time en route return, and a week exploring on the ground.   Some (not many) of us have the freedom of movement to pull that off.   

For illustration purposes only (I am not seizing control of the agenda - yet) let's assume a meet location of Fairbanks.  The most heavily constrained among us might only be able to arrange a few days of disposable time.  They could arrange to fly to the airport at Fairbanks, be picked up by another participant, and have the most complete Alaskan experience their schedule would allow. 

Some of us may be constrained, but to a lesser extent.  If two weeks is doable, and you live east of Chicago, perhaps you could fly to Toronto or Montreal, and then to (for example) Edmonton (returning the same way).  The flight takes out three or four travel days in each direction.  Someone from our group would meet and greet you there, and the most exotic segment of road would lie ahead.

For those of us with the least constraints, three (or four, or more) consecutive weeks of travel is what we live for. Meeting  our friends at Edmonton (or wherever), then sharing the ride and the expenses from there is logical, efficient, frugal, and fun.  As of the summer of 2015, I am not yet that footloose, but by 2017 (or 2018?) I hope to be.

The logistics of this are somewhat daunting.  Real commitments by really reliable people would be necessary.  Advance planning is a must.  As such, I would suggest a selection of date and location soon, for planning and scheduling purposes.  It should surprise nobody that I would lobby for Fairbanks in mid-late June. 

Over and out.

A bit of preferring road travel (which feels more "real" for me, plus giving a greater feel for the places in between) plus a desire to not have to be humiliated by what the TSA calls "security" these days, being crammed in with strangers, and I don't trust the airlines to not lose my luggage or delay/cancel the plane.

Having enough vacation time that I could theoretically take three weeks off isn't the issue so much as the logistics of taking that much time as a block in our busy season as well as hotel/gas/food costs.  Oh, and laundry too (only thought of that today; also car mileage or the cost of renting one).

I have a vague idea of how I'd drive over if making the route on my own:
-https://goo.gl/maps/lAr0L
-https://goo.gl/maps/qQJNN

That translates to 10-20 days driving, judging by the hours on Google (suggested feature for Google: set average daily drive time and have the map compute overnight stops).

Of course, all this is speculative and doesn't necessarily reflect what I could financially pull off at this stage in my life.

And some of us find the idea of seeing the northern lights more interesting than 24 hours of daylight.

[Duke87]

And some of us find the idea of seeing the northern lights more interesting than 24 hours of daylight.

Yes. This. Right near the summer solstice is absolutely the worst time to travel to the arctic since you miss out on the best part.

[cl94]

Going back to1995hoo's post and off-topic, the only active Viewliner IIs are baggage cars. Those were built first, as the old Heritage Fleet cars date back to before Amtrak. IIRC, diners are next (also replacing heritage fleet), then sleepers. Amtrak might have some at Beech Grove for testing purposes, but they aren't in service.

Once everything is built, it's very possible that Amtrak will increase long-distance service.

[1995hoo]

BTW, looking at my post again, I thought it wasn't entirely clear and that I should clarify that all those pictures were taken on Superliners since I have never been on a Viewliner, but the rooms are pretty darn similar except for that in-room toilet and sink in the Viewliner roomette. That feature would be located to my right (viewer's left) in the picture where I'm wearing the striped shirt and holding the glass of wine, had I been on a Viewliner at the time.

Incidentally.....regarding which equipment is used where, the Viewliner must be used on long-distance routes serving New York Penn Station or Baltimore because the Superliner is too tall to fit through the tunnels near those two stations. This is why, for example, the Lake Shore Limited (which runs from either Boston or New York to Chicago) uses the Viewliner but the Capitol Limited (which runs from DC's Union Station to Chicago) uses the Superliner.