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Author Topic: District of Columbia  (Read 266665 times)

Old Dominionite

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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1075 on: January 17, 2021, 03:09:07 PM »

I have no problem with I-395 replacing I-695, although I think it should keep its north/south cardinal directions. The roadway isn't long enough to merit changing directions to east/west at the river. "North" is away from Virginia; "South" is towards Virginia. Keep it simple.

As for the current I-395 stretch up to New York Avenue, I wish DDOT would have suggested "795" or "995." I'm not a fan of 3di spurs off 3di routes having a lower number than the route from which they're branching.

With that said, I think the chance of confusing a DC I-195 with MD's I-195 is pretty low...
...I hope.
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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1076 on: January 17, 2021, 03:16:43 PM »

The entire I-395, even the Virginia section, is more east-west than north-south.
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Rothman

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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1077 on: January 17, 2021, 04:34:28 PM »

The entire I-395, even the Virginia section, is more east-west than north-south.
Doesn't feel that way.
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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1078 on: January 17, 2021, 05:14:09 PM »

I have no problem with I-395 replacing I-695, although I think it should keep its north/south cardinal directions. The roadway isn't long enough to merit changing directions to east/west at the river. "North" is away from Virginia; "South" is towards Virginia. Keep it simple.

As for the current I-395 stretch up to New York Avenue, I wish DDOT would have suggested "795" or "995." I'm not a fan of 3di spurs off 3di routes having a lower number than the route from which they're branching.

With that said, I think the chance of confusing a DC I-195 with MD's I-195 is pretty low...
...I hope.
Someone comes up 95 knowing "take 95 to 195 to the airport". Oblivious, they go straight onto 395. They then see 195 and take it.

famartin

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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1079 on: January 17, 2021, 05:37:55 PM »

I have no problem with I-395 replacing I-695, although I think it should keep its north/south cardinal directions. The roadway isn't long enough to merit changing directions to east/west at the river. "North" is away from Virginia; "South" is towards Virginia. Keep it simple.

As for the current I-395 stretch up to New York Avenue, I wish DDOT would have suggested "795" or "995." I'm not a fan of 3di spurs off 3di routes having a lower number than the route from which they're branching.

With that said, I think the chance of confusing a DC I-195 with MD's I-195 is pretty low...
...I hope.
Someone comes up 95 knowing "take 95 to 195 to the airport". Oblivious, they go straight onto 395. They then see 195 and take it.

Theoretically, sure, but man that's an aweful long way to get to BWI. I have to think anyone coming south of DC is gonna go for Dulles or Reagan unless they are REALLY trying to penny-pinch.
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1995hoo

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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1080 on: January 17, 2021, 05:42:12 PM »

I have no problem with I-395 replacing I-695, although I think it should keep its north/south cardinal directions. The roadway isn't long enough to merit changing directions to east/west at the river. "North" is away from Virginia; "South" is towards Virginia. Keep it simple.

As for the current I-395 stretch up to New York Avenue, I wish DDOT would have suggested "795" or "995." I'm not a fan of 3di spurs off 3di routes having a lower number than the route from which they're branching.

With that said, I think the chance of confusing a DC I-195 with MD's I-195 is pretty low...
...I hope.
Someone comes up 95 knowing "take 95 to 195 to the airport". Oblivious, they go straight onto 395. They then see 195 and take it.

Theoretically, sure, but man that's an aweful long way to get to BWI. I have to think anyone coming south of DC is gonna go for Dulles or Reagan unless they are REALLY trying to penny-pinch.

Heh, define "REALLY." I once drove two hours on a Friday afternoon to get to BWI (and I live just south of the Beltway) because the airfare was $500 cheaper than either of the other airports. To me, that’s a no-brainer!
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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1081 on: January 17, 2021, 06:19:27 PM »

Of the 10 times I've flown to DC in the last few years, I think seven of those times I flew directly into Reagan; the other three times were to BWI. I don't consider that to be anywhere near an awful drive. The drive back has always terminated in Arlington.

The worst part of the drive was consistently the Anacostia Fwy. Once we got to the 11th St Bridges, it was smooth sailing from there.
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famartin

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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1082 on: January 17, 2021, 06:23:18 PM »

I'll remind you both that he said "someone coming UP 95". That presumes you are considerably south of the beltway. If you are near the beltway, then you'd probably just say "follow the beltway to 95 north in Maryland" etc.
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Old Dominionite

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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1083 on: January 17, 2021, 07:09:37 PM »

The entire I-395, even the Virginia section, is more east-west than north-south.
Doesn't feel that way.

I agree. I’ve driven on I-395 countless times over the last 20+ years. Aside from the fact that its alignment was originally supposed to be part of I-95, it functions as a north/south spur route.
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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1084 on: January 20, 2021, 01:29:12 AM »

Actually it WAS I-95 until it was decided that the highway wouldn't be extended beyond NY Ave NW. Not sure why that project was scrapped other than likely the NIMBY syndrome.
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famartin

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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1085 on: January 20, 2021, 07:37:00 AM »

Actually it WAS I-95 until it was decided that the highway wouldn't be extended beyond NY Ave NW. Not sure why that project was scrapped other than likely the NIMBY syndrome.

Yeah we know.
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1995hoo

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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1086 on: January 20, 2021, 08:28:00 AM »

Actually it WAS I-95 until it was decided that the highway wouldn't be extended beyond NY Ave NW. Not sure why that project was scrapped other than likely the NIMBY syndrome.

You don't say.
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The Ghostbuster

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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1087 on: January 20, 2021, 02:08:46 PM »

Well, neither Google Maps nor Wikipedia have been updated to include the new Interstate 195, or that 695 is now part of 395. The Interstate 395 (Virginia–District of Columbia) and Interstate 695 (District of Columbia) Wikipedia pages only include a paragraph about the approved 695-to-395 and the 395-195 plans, so it looks like the conversion hasn't officially occurred yet, even though it has allegedly been approved.
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famartin

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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1088 on: January 20, 2021, 02:10:09 PM »

Well, neither Google Maps nor Wikipedia have been updated to include the new Interstate 195, or that 695 is now part of 395. The Interstate 395 (Virginia–District of Columbia) and Interstate 695 (District of Columbia) Wikipedia pages only include a paragraph about the approved 695-to-395 and the 395-195 plans, so it looks like the conversion hasn't officially occurred yet, even though it has allegedly been approved.

I just heard about it over the weekend as something that was approved, so I imagine it will take a bit before signage goes up. That said, with all the closures for inauguration, it would've been a good time to do the signage changes.
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cpzilliacus

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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1089 on: January 20, 2021, 03:50:05 PM »

Well, neither Google Maps nor Wikipedia have been updated to include the new Interstate 195, or that 695 is now part of 395. The Interstate 395 (Virginia–District of Columbia) and Interstate 695 (District of Columbia) Wikipedia pages only include a paragraph about the approved 695-to-395 and the 395-195 plans, so it looks like the conversion hasn't officially occurred yet, even though it has allegedly been approved.

I just heard about it over the weekend as something that was approved, so I imagine it will take a bit before signage goes up. That said, with all the closures for inauguration, it would've been a good time to do the signage changes.

I am not aware that DDOT has even issued an invitation for bids for the job, and probably will not for some months.  They probably have to create drawings showing what the revised signs will look like.
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famartin

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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1090 on: January 20, 2021, 03:51:04 PM »

Well, neither Google Maps nor Wikipedia have been updated to include the new Interstate 195, or that 695 is now part of 395. The Interstate 395 (Virginia–District of Columbia) and Interstate 695 (District of Columbia) Wikipedia pages only include a paragraph about the approved 695-to-395 and the 395-195 plans, so it looks like the conversion hasn't officially occurred yet, even though it has allegedly been approved.

I just heard about it over the weekend as something that was approved, so I imagine it will take a bit before signage goes up. That said, with all the closures for inauguration, it would've been a good time to do the signage changes.

I am not aware that DDOT has even issued an invitation for bids for the job, and probably will not for some months.  They probably have to create drawings showing what the revised signs will look like.

That makes sense, I figured the signage change was still months away.
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cpzilliacus

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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1091 on: January 21, 2021, 10:40:44 AM »

Of the 10 times I've flown to DC in the last few years, I think seven of those times I flew directly into Reagan; the other three times were to BWI. I don't consider that to be anywhere near an awful drive. The drive back has always terminated in Arlington.

The worst part of the drive was consistently the Anacostia Fwy. Once we got to the 11th St Bridges, it was smooth sailing from there.

The I-295 and especially DC-295 corridors have bottlenecks with congestion every weekday, and in the case of DC-295, usually every day.

There's a lane drop on northbound I-295 that narrows down to 2 lanes, where there is usually recurring congestion every weekday.

DC-295 has congestion (usually every day) southbound approaching East Capitol Street because of the lane drop there.  This is made worse by drivers not familiar with the D.C. area using "dumb" GPS units (no congestion feedback in determining route) that direct them to use B-W Parkway, MD-201, DC-295, I-695, I-395 instead of I-95 (from Baltimore) and the east side of the Capital Beltway across the W. Wilson Bridge because it is slightly shorter in terms of miles, but usually a bad choice in terms of congestion and travel time reliability.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2021, 02:49:43 PM by cpzilliacus »
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jakeroot

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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1092 on: January 21, 2021, 01:21:56 PM »

DC-295 has congestion (usually every day) southbound approaching East Capitol Street because of the lane drop there.  This is made worse by drivers not familiar with the D.C. area using "dumb" GPS units (no congestion feedback in determining route) that direct them to use B-W Parkway, MD-201, DC-295, I-695, I-395 instead of the Capital Beltway across the W. Wilson Bridge because it is slightly shorter in terms of miles, but usually a bad choice in terms of congestion.

In our case, the drive was terminating near Rosslyn for the first couple years. It was really hard to justify using the beltway as, although certainly it would have had a higher average speed, it would have easily added 10 or 15 minutes no matter what. Mapping it out right now, it literally adds 20 miles using the beltway clockwise starting from the BW Parkway.

Depending on the traffic, we'd often escape the 395 via Maine Ave, and follow around the memorials to I-66. Otherwise it was 395 to the GW Parkway, up to Arlington Blvd and then to US-50.

The most utilized spot of the beltway for us is easily between 270 and the GW Parkway.
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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1093 on: January 21, 2021, 04:51:27 PM »

DC-295 has congestion (usually every day) southbound approaching East Capitol Street because of the lane drop there.  This is made worse by drivers not familiar with the D.C. area using "dumb" GPS units (no congestion feedback in determining route) that direct them to use B-W Parkway, MD-201, DC-295, I-695, I-395 instead of the Capital Beltway across the W. Wilson Bridge because it is slightly shorter in terms of miles, but usually a bad choice in terms of congestion.

In our case, the drive was terminating near Rosslyn for the first couple years. It was really hard to justify using the beltway as, although certainly it would have had a higher average speed, it would have easily added 10 or 15 minutes no matter what. Mapping it out right now, it literally adds 20 miles using the beltway clockwise starting from the BW Parkway.

Depending on the traffic, we'd often escape the 395 via Maine Ave, and follow around the memorials to I-66. Otherwise it was 395 to the GW Parkway, up to Arlington Blvd and then to US-50.

The most utilized spot of the beltway for us is easily between 270 and the GW Parkway.

The benefit of the completion of the 11th st bridge allows for a "poor man's" 95 through the city.  Springfield, VA - Arlington - Downtown DC- Bladensburg-Greenbelt.  Of course, it is much faster to go between Springfield and Greenbelt by way of I-495.  But, if either your origin or destination is well within the Beltway, it does make sense to use this roadway, as it is a full freeway, with chokepoints that CPZ has mentioned.

So, while of course, you would normally use the Beltway for a trip between VA and BWI airport, if the VA origin is well within the Beltway (and Rosslyn would definitely qualify), it would make sense to use the thru-DC freeway as opposed to going way out of your way (like taking the GW Pkwy to the American Legion Bridge to I-495 or the GW Pkwy to I-495 via Wilson Bridge
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famartin

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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1094 on: January 21, 2021, 06:19:11 PM »

DC-295 has congestion (usually every day) southbound approaching East Capitol Street because of the lane drop there.  This is made worse by drivers not familiar with the D.C. area using "dumb" GPS units (no congestion feedback in determining route) that direct them to use B-W Parkway, MD-201, DC-295, I-695, I-395 instead of the Capital Beltway across the W. Wilson Bridge because it is slightly shorter in terms of miles, but usually a bad choice in terms of congestion.

In our case, the drive was terminating near Rosslyn for the first couple years. It was really hard to justify using the beltway as, although certainly it would have had a higher average speed, it would have easily added 10 or 15 minutes no matter what. Mapping it out right now, it literally adds 20 miles using the beltway clockwise starting from the BW Parkway.

Depending on the traffic, we'd often escape the 395 via Maine Ave, and follow around the memorials to I-66. Otherwise it was 395 to the GW Parkway, up to Arlington Blvd and then to US-50.

The most utilized spot of the beltway for us is easily between 270 and the GW Parkway.

The benefit of the completion of the 11th st bridge allows for a "poor man's" 95 through the city.  Springfield, VA - Arlington - Downtown DC- Bladensburg-Greenbelt.  Of course, it is much faster to go between Springfield and Greenbelt by way of I-495.  But, if either your origin or destination is well within the Beltway, it does make sense to use this roadway, as it is a full freeway, with chokepoints that CPZ has mentioned.

So, while of course, you would normally use the Beltway for a trip between VA and BWI airport, if the VA origin is well within the Beltway (and Rosslyn would definitely qualify), it would make sense to use the thru-DC freeway as opposed to going way out of your way (like taking the GW Pkwy to the American Legion Bridge to I-495 or the GW Pkwy to I-495 via Wilson Bridge

Avoiding downtown DC would be even more desirable if the 95 portion of the beltway was raised to 65... #justsaying #notgonnahappen #fantasy
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jmacswimmer

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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1095 on: January 22, 2021, 09:04:56 AM »

Avoiding downtown DC would be even more desirable if the 95 portion of the beltway was raised to 65... #justsaying #notgonnahappen #fantasy

Even if the speed limit remains 55 around the beltway, the prevailing speed of traffic is definitely much higher on 95/495 than on 295 in my experience (and there aren't any *permanent speed cameras to watch out for).

*I think there is currently a work zone camera around the exit 9/Suitland Parkway/exit 11 area, but this should go away once the construction is done.  The DC speed cameras are also much less forgiving fine-wise, based on what I've heard.
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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1096 on: January 22, 2021, 01:08:42 PM »

Living along 395 inside the Beltway, I've been using 295 to go to points northeast (i.e. Philly and Baltimore) since the new 11th St Bridge opened. Generally the only real trouble spots are the SE-SW freeway (no real workarounds) and then parts of the B-W Parkway - I usually don't bother "shifting over" to I-95 at College Park.

There was a nightmare one time, however, when I had to get to BWI Airport. There was a bad delay on the SE-SW freeway, so I switched to downtown via NY Avenue. That was so arduous, and took forever to crawl up through NE DC during rush hour.
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cpzilliacus

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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1097 on: January 22, 2021, 07:00:40 PM »

Living along 395 inside the Beltway, I've been using 295 to go to points northeast (i.e. Philly and Baltimore) since the new 11th St Bridge opened. Generally the only real trouble spots are the SE-SW freeway (no real workarounds) and then parts of the B-W Parkway - I usually don't bother "shifting over" to I-95 at College Park.

There was a nightmare one time, however, when I had to get to BWI Airport. There was a bad delay on the SE-SW freeway, so I switched to downtown via NY Avenue. That was so arduous, and took forever to crawl up through NE DC during rush hour.

The federal part of the B-W Parkway (south of MD-175 at Odenton) has two segments that frequently are congested north of Greenbelt.

1.  Approaching and passing Powder Mill Road in Prince George's County; and
2.  Approaching and passing MD-32 near Fort Meade in Anne Arundel County.

3.  Another bad spot is south of Greenbelt - the northbound side of the parkway,
especially on weekday afternoons, can be congested all the way back to the
lane drop northbound at MD-450 due to the design of the cloverleaf interchange
at I-95/I-495, which cannot handle the demand placed on the cloverleaf ramp
from northbound B-W Parkway to the Outer Loop.
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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1098 on: January 23, 2021, 05:34:46 PM »

Of the 10 times I've flown to DC in the last few years, I think seven of those times I flew directly into Reagan; the other three times were to BWI. I don't consider that to be anywhere near an awful drive. The drive back has always terminated in Arlington.

The worst part of the drive was consistently the Anacostia Fwy. Once we got to the 11th St Bridges, it was smooth sailing from there.

The I-295 and especially DC-295 corridors have bottlenecks with congestion every weekday, and in the case of DC-295, usually every day.

There's a lane drop on northbound I-295 that narrows down to 2 lanes, where there is usually recurring congestion every weekday.

DC-295 has congestion (usually every day) southbound approaching East Capitol Street because of the lane drop there.  This is made worse by drivers not familiar with the D.C. area using "dumb" GPS units (no congestion feedback in determining route) that direct them to use B-W Parkway, MD-201, DC-295, I-695, I-395 instead of the Capital Beltway across the W. Wilson Bridge because it is slightly shorter in terms of miles, but usually a bad choice in terms of congestion.

Has DC ever considered widening DC-295 between the lane drop at East Capitol Street and the I-695/I-295 interchange? The stretch is only 2 miles, seemingly has plenty of ROW, and would only require the widening of one bridge over the railroad tracks. The bridges over East Capitol Street are wide enough already, the interchange at Pennsylvania Avenue could (and should) be reconfigured to where the existing weave lane on the bridge there could be converted into a 3rd GP lane, and the southbound bridge over 11th Street and I-695 is probably fine staying at 2 lanes. Seems like a worthwhile project to me given the constant traffic due to the lane drop.
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cpzilliacus

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Re: District of Columbia
« Reply #1099 on: January 24, 2021, 02:54:45 PM »

Has DC ever considered widening DC-295 between the lane drop at East Capitol Street and the I-695/I-295 interchange? The stretch is only 2 miles, seemingly has plenty of ROW, and would only require the widening of one bridge over the railroad tracks. The bridges over East Capitol Street are wide enough already, the interchange at Pennsylvania Avenue could (and should) be reconfigured to where the existing weave lane on the bridge there could be converted into a 3rd GP lane, and the southbound bridge over 11th Street and I-695 is probably fine staying at 2 lanes. Seems like a worthwhile project to me given the constant traffic due to the lane drop.

I have never, ever heard it discussed.  When the Barney Circle extension of the Southeast Freeway was being discussed in the 1980's  the proposal would have effectively eliminated that lane drop by way of a two lane exit from southbound DC-295 to that road, which would have spanned the Anacostia River and hooked up with the existing freeway at Barney Circle, S.E. (the stubs are still there on the DC-295 bridge over the CSX Yard).  In the 1990's there was a completed Final Environmental Impact Statement (FEIS) and Record of Decision (ROD) ready to go to bid, but the project was cancelled by the late former Mayor-for-Life Marion Shepilov Barry, Jr. at the last minute in his final term at the behest of D.C. environmental and NIMBY groups using the slogan "Stop it again."
« Last Edit: January 24, 2021, 03:00:03 PM by cpzilliacus »
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