New Jersey

[Alps]

Is Temporary Banners ever going to be removed from Route 41? Considering it's a permanent route and NJDOT will never build it's intended alignment, why not remove the banners altogether or did engineers forget about it with every sign replacement ending up being a carbon copy?

It's not NJDOT maintained so it's only happening if the county does it.

[roadman65]

https://goo.gl/maps/WDdorLtj9K6a669Z6

I think that signing Island Beach State Park on the NJ 35 pull through is non essential information that no one driving here is interested in that location.   

Also Keyport for NJ 36 is dumb as you have arrived there with the exit for its Downtown was passed by already via CR 516 Exit to Broadway.  Plus ground signage there uses Keansburg and Atlantic Highlands and the overhead it replaced originally used those two control points as well.

[Rothman]

https://goo.gl/maps/WDdorLtj9K6a669Z6

I think that signing Island Beach State Park on the NJ 35 pull through is non essential information that no one driving here is interested in that location.   

Or, they way overestimated how much people would want to shunpike the GSP by taking another two hours to get there.

[MATraveler128]

I do get what NJDOT is trying to do with signing Island Beach, but I do agree that NJ 35 wouldn’t be the fastest way to get there. If someone were to shunpike, wouldn’t it make more sense to follow US 9 down to NJ 18 and then NJ 34? Google doesn’t even acknowledge NJ 35 as an option if you set it to avoid highways.

[famartin]

I do get what NJDOT is trying to do with signing Island Beach, but I do agree that NJ 35 wouldn't be the fastest way to get there. If someone were to shunpike, wouldn't it make more sense to follow US 9 down to NJ 18 and then NJ 34? Google doesn't even acknowledge NJ 35 as an option if you set it to avoid highways.

This seems to be another example of the recent trend of signing exactly where the road ends as its final control city, without thinking about the logic of using said locale. I've seen this is other locations recently, like using Roxbury on westbound 10 at 287, and Parsippany and Kearny on 280 (even in places where using Newark would make more sense).

[roadman65]

Also to note NJ 35 to IBSP was added to the road system later in the game when NJ and Ocean County switched ownership with former NJ Route 180 in Manahawkin.  Originally it was Seaside Heights at Route 37 with the route south of there being under Ocean County unsigned.  This, I agree is making the end of the road the final control city regardless if something more prominent lies before or after the end of the route.  People are more interested in the places along the way, especially along local thoroughfares next to freeways as Route 35 is here

Shunpiking is more used by Route 9 to Route 37 to get to Seaside or Island Beach as 35 is red light city here and two lanes in Wall and from Pt. Pleasant to south of CR 528 at Mantaloking.

NCDOT signed Route 34 as Wall, where it ends, removing Asbury Park and Brielle that were previously used in Holmdel. Asbury Park changed due to demographics in the eighties to lose it's popularity as a beach resort it once was as well as leaving Route 34 at the Collingwood Circle for two other routes and a municipal street to reach the now defunct Boardwalk community. That I can understand it's removal, and Brielle was more seen on a map, but Point Pleasant is more prominent to have used and still use as nobody is really going to Wall who is unfamiliar with the roads.

NCDOT does it on Route 15 out of Dover using Frankford as the final mileage city for it instead of Lafayette or even Milford, PA. Most NJ 15 motorists are bound for Sussex County as well as US 206 north of Frankford, so using Sussex County points like Lafayette, Branchville, or Montague or even Milford would be better.

NJ 23 using Montague is also a bad choice being Montague is more notable for being on US 206, even though the township limits reach Route 23. Port Jervis is better suited for it and used to be at one time at the Ratzer Road Circle in Wayne before elimination on guide signs there.  The mileage signs at Verona near the Clraridge Apartments north or it's terminus and along the 40 mph part all ng the Kinnelon- West Milford Border near Butler mentions Montague as final mileage controls on the 1998 mileage statewide mileage sign replacement project.

Yeah NJ, is getting too technical with road sign control points especially on interstates like 195.and 280.

[storm2k]

Here's a dump of random signage replacements I've caught in various drives around the state.

Rt 1-9 North in Newark



(These signs are pretty busy. I feel like the clearance limits are not needed since trucks are not allowed on the Skyway anyway)

Rt 1-9 North Pulaski Skyway


(Again, these clearance limits are not needed since no trucks are allowed)

Rt 3 West



(The orange signs are obviously in the 3-46 interchange construction area)

Rt 46 West
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(I'm annoyed by the inconsistent control cities. Don't start with Dover until you're past Parsippany)

Rt 280 at 80

(Not at fan at all. Way too busy. The previous sign where the "local" lanes were just signed as the exit to 287 was way easier to follow)

Rt 9 South at 195

(Don't know why they didn't change "Shore Points" to "Belmar" as they've done up and down 195)

Rt 195 East


(They kept "Exit 36" even though that's technically on 138 and would be fine with no exit number)

[NoGoodNamesAvailable]

Wow. These are almost all awful.

[roadman65]

The one on I-195 at NJ 34 needs to combine the two left panels together as it's way too much info to comprehend.

Have the Garden State Parkway text is not only redundant, but wastes time to read it. Use NJ 138 and North (Parkway shield) 3/4 mile. Then END 1-195 on the bridge pull through in the distance

Then the Route 9 photo just use Belmar and have a TO Garden State Parkway shield with it along with a TO I-95 shield for Westbound to Trenton.  The Parkway and Turnpike are both noteworthy to be mentioned on overheads instead of just on ground shields.

[Alps]

Wow. These are almost all awful.

Almost all okay (not saying great necessarily), except CR 613 should be signed Passaic Ave. 600 routes are barely recognized in North Jersey.

[NJRoadfan]

NJDOT is still resistant to the concept of control cities for the parkway. Its really annoying now that they are openly signed and in the NJTA sign plans as well. Not to mention that the actual control cities are going to be less text to read than "Garden State Parkway".

I realize that Passaic County recently signed all their 600 and 700 series routes, but is it really a good idea to clutter all the signs with those shields? US-46 is a mess with traffic and the complicated intersection of NJ-23 and I-80. Might be best to use the KISS principal on that particular stretch of highway.

[roadman65]

NJDOT is still resistant to the concept of control cities for the parkway. Its really annoying now that they are openly signed and in the NJTA sign plans as well. Not to mention that the actual control cities are going to be less text to read than "Garden State Parkway".

I realize that Passaic County recently signed all their 600 and 700 series routes, but is it really a good idea to clutter all the signs with those shields? US-46 is a mess with traffic and the complicated intersection of NJ-23 and I-80. Might be best to use the KISS principal on that particular stretch of highway.

The Parkway is an important route in the state and should be signed with control cities like other highways

[famartin]

NJDOT is still resistant to the concept of control cities for the parkway. Its really annoying now that they are openly signed and in the NJTA sign plans as well. Not to mention that the actual control cities are going to be less text to read than "Garden State Parkway".

I realize that Passaic County recently signed all their 600 and 700 series routes, but is it really a good idea to clutter all the signs with those shields? US-46 is a mess with traffic and the complicated intersection of NJ-23 and I-80. Might be best to use the KISS principal on that particular stretch of highway.

I wonder if the county wanted them up there, or if that was NJDOT's idea.

[storm2k]

NJDOT is still resistant to the concept of control cities for the parkway. Its really annoying now that they are openly signed and in the NJTA sign plans as well. Not to mention that the actual control cities are going to be less text to read than "Garden State Parkway".

I realize that Passaic County recently signed all their 600 and 700 series routes, but is it really a good idea to clutter all the signs with those shields? US-46 is a mess with traffic and the complicated intersection of NJ-23 and I-80. Might be best to use the KISS principal on that particular stretch of highway.

I wonder if the county wanted them up there, or if that was NJDOT's idea.

That's an interesting question. Historically, NJDOT has only ever signed the 5xx county routes (since they function as a secondary state highway system of sorts) and not signed 6xx county routes on BGS's except for occasional random one offs (Exit 36 on 78 always comes to mind since it used to be a 5xx spur that was renumbered with a 6xx route but they replaced the 5xx spur shields with the 6xx route number... but it didn't happen at Exit 9 on 287 when that was changed). Honestly, at this point, as I've been chronicling, the engineer(s) at NJDOT who draft and/or approve the designs for these newer signs has embraced information overload and "interesting" choices for layout and information put on this current generation of BGSs. So who knows at this point.

[roadman65]

Considering NJDOT normally never signs 600 routes in North Jersey, most likely the county.


Also while on control cities, in Bedminster on US 202 & 206 at the entrance ramp to I-287 to control the interest of motorists traveling straight through on Route 206 SB to use the better quality road between Bedminster and Somerville, to sign both Somerville and Princeton onto the SB I-287 ramp.  In addition guide signs once at Exit 17 (Former Exit 13) on I-287 listed Somerville and Princeton as well to follow up.  However current street view shows the old guides on I-287 to be gone and no follow up to Princeton now.

The US 202 & 206 SB ramp to I-287 now has a situation like Morris County 511 in Parsippany with an extra control point of Singac but with the Mercer County College Township instead. 

IMO the supplemental Princeton signs need to be put back on I-287 South at Exit 17 or remove Princeton from the I-287 ramp altogether.


BTW I-287 never had control cities just as the Parkway except at some interchanges like I-80 and I-78.  US 22 East once used New Brunswick before Perth Amboy came into the picture there, but US 22 West once had large panel overheads at I-287, but no destinations for both I-287 ramps as well.  So NJRoadfan , it wasnt only the tolled freeways that lacked control cities from NJDOT, but I-287 and also I-78 as well.

[storm2k]

Considering NJDOT normally never signs 600 routes in North Jersey, most likely the county.


Also while on control cities, in Bedminster on US 202 & 206 at the entrance ramp to I-287 to control the interest of motorists traveling straight through on Route 206 SB to use the better quality road between Bedminster and Somerville, to sign both Somerville and Princeton onto the SB I-287 ramp.  In addition guide signs once at Exit 17 (Former Exit 13) on I-287 listed Somerville and Princeton as well to follow up.  However current street view shows the old guides on I-287 to be gone and no follow up to Princeton now.

The US 202 & 206 SB ramp to I-287 now has a situation like Morris County 511 in Parsippany with an extra control point of Singac but with the Mercer County College Township instead. 

IMO the supplemental Princeton signs need to be put back on I-287 South at Exit 17 or remove Princeton from the I-287 ramp altogether.


BTW I-287 never had control cities just as the Parkway except at some interchanges like I-80 and I-78.  US 22 East once used New Brunswick before Perth Amboy came into the picture there, but US 22 West once had large panel overheads at I-287, but no destinations for both I-287 ramps as well.  So NJRoadfan , it wasnt only the tolled freeways that lacked control cities from NJDOT, but I-287 and also I-78 as well.

I honestly have long thought that NJDOT would be better served routing 202-206 onto 287 between Exits 17 and 22 to just take some traffic off of a mostly two lane road that suffers from a decent amount of congestion (especially in Pluckemin where there is nowhere to expand the road without possibly taking down historic buildings) and hand the rest of the stretch to Somerset County but that doesn't ever seem likely to happen. I do agree that the mention of Princeton on the sign at the 287SB ramp gore should be changed to say Flemington and not Princeton to be consistent with the signage for Exit 17 which have been there since 1997.

[roadman65]

Another one of not being consistent is the NJTA at Parkway Exit 129 into Turnpike Exit 11.  Now with I-95 going to Philly without gap thanks to the long awaited I-95 and PA Turnpike Exchange, the Exit 129 SB Parkway guide features " Philadelphia " over previously "Camden,"  the sign is not in Canon with the post entry toll for the Turnpike ramp split which reads " Trenton."  

You now are directed to Philadelphia from the Parkway South onto the Turnpike, but once onto the Turnpike you get no follow up info.  There is room to add a second city SB after the 11 plazawhich should ideally read Trenton Philadelphia and not violate MUTCD policies ( not that both NJTA or NJ DOT ever cared about anyway) if they catered to both used Parkway Control cities for the Turnpike at Exit 129.

[storm2k]

Another one of not being consistent is the NJTA at Parkway Exit 129 into Turnpike Exit 11.  Now with I-95 going to Philly without gap thanks to the long awaited I-95 and PA Turnpike Exchange, the Exit 129 SB Parkway guide features " Philadelphia " over previously "Camden,"  the sign is not in Canon with the post entry toll for the Turnpike ramp split which reads " Trenton."  

You now are directed to Philadelphia from the Parkway South onto the Turnpike, but once onto the Turnpike you get no follow up info.  There is room to add a second city SB after the 11 plazawhich should ideally read Trenton Philadelphia and not violate MUTCD policies ( not that both NJTA or NJ DOT ever cared about anyway) if they catered to both used Parkway Control cities for the Turnpike at Exit 129.

It's because the previous exit for Rt 1 uses Trenton for the SB control city since that's what NJDOT does. I guess they didn't want to sign it twice even though NJTA's standard control city for the Turnpike SB is Trenton until 7A.

[famartin]

Another one of not being consistent is the NJTA at Parkway Exit 129 into Turnpike Exit 11.  Now with I-95 going to Philly without gap thanks to the long awaited I-95 and PA Turnpike Exchange, the Exit 129 SB Parkway guide features " Philadelphia " over previously "Camden,"  the sign is not in Canon with the post entry toll for the Turnpike ramp split which reads " Trenton."  

You now are directed to Philadelphia from the Parkway South onto the Turnpike, but once onto the Turnpike you get no follow up info.  There is room to add a second city SB after the 11 plazawhich should ideally read Trenton Philadelphia and not violate MUTCD policies ( not that both NJTA or NJ DOT ever cared about anyway) if they catered to both used Parkway Control cities for the Turnpike at Exit 129.

It's because the previous exit for Rt 1 uses Trenton for the SB control city since that's what NJDOT does. I guess they didn't want to sign it twice even though NJTA's standard control city for the Turnpike SB is Trenton until 7A.

That's inconsistency on NJDOT's side. US 1 south should be signed New Brunswick there, to match how it is signed northbound in the Trenton area.  NJDOT seems to have forgotten that quirk.

[storm2k]

Considering NJDOT normally never signs 600 routes in North Jersey, most likely the county.


Also while on control cities, in Bedminster on US 202 & 206 at the entrance ramp to I-287 to control the interest of motorists traveling straight through on Route 206 SB to use the better quality road between Bedminster and Somerville, to sign both Somerville and Princeton onto the SB I-287 ramp.  In addition guide signs once at Exit 17 (Former Exit 13) on I-287 listed Somerville and Princeton as well to follow up.  However current street view shows the old guides on I-287 to be gone and no follow up to Princeton now.

The US 202 & 206 SB ramp to I-287 now has a situation like Morris County 511 in Parsippany with an extra control point of Singac but with the Mercer County College Township instead. 

IMO the supplemental Princeton signs need to be put back on I-287 South at Exit 17 or remove Princeton from the I-287 ramp altogether.


BTW I-287 never had control cities just as the Parkway except at some interchanges like I-80 and I-78.  US 22 East once used New Brunswick before Perth Amboy came into the picture there, but US 22 West once had large panel overheads at I-287, but no destinations for both I-287 ramps as well.  So NJRoadfan , it wasnt only the tolled freeways that lacked control cities from NJDOT, but I-287 and also I-78 as well.

I would not assume that the county asked for it. NJDOT has been doing it more often. When they built the Chimney Rock Rd overpass over 22, all the signs for the new Chimey Rock Rd ramps show the CR675 shield, despite the fact that Somerset County does not sign it. In fact, the only other way you happen to know that this is a county route is the street name blade on the traffic light at 28, which is another NJDOT install (although my thought is that they should have rerouted CR525 onto this new alignment to still have it end either at 28 or CR533/Main Street and renumber the Thompson Ave stretch to a 6xx route to take a 5xx out of a residential neighborhood and it's not clearly signed that the route turns at that intersection now anyway).

[plain]

Another one of not being consistent is the NJTA at Parkway Exit 129 into Turnpike Exit 11.  Now with I-95 going to Philly without gap thanks to the long awaited I-95 and PA Turnpike Exchange, the Exit 129 SB Parkway guide features " Philadelphia " over previously "Camden,"  the sign is not in Canon with the post entry toll for the Turnpike ramp split which reads " Trenton."  

You now are directed to Philadelphia from the Parkway South onto the Turnpike, but once onto the Turnpike you get no follow up info.  There is room to add a second city SB after the 11 plazawhich should ideally read Trenton Philadelphia and not violate MUTCD policies ( not that both NJTA or NJ DOT ever cared about anyway) if they catered to both used Parkway Control cities for the Turnpike at Exit 129.

It's because the previous exit for Rt 1 uses Trenton for the SB control city since that's what NJDOT does. I guess they didn't want to sign it twice even though NJTA's standard control city for the Turnpike SB is Trenton until 7A.

Unless it's been changed after Google last went through there, the NB signage on the Parkway says Trenton as well at Exit 129.

[storm2k]

Almost all the signage on the freeway part of 202 from East Amwell to the New Hope toll bridge has been replaced. I will go through when it's not raining to get pictures. One note of interest is that the signs for the Mount Airy/Dilts Corner exit now has CR-605 shields on it. Here's the SB one, which Google already picked up for SV. This is even more complicated than needed as no one needs to care about "Frontage Road to". It's just extra noise that doesn't help motorists find their way. But I guess this means that CR shields are getting signed now whether they're 5xx or 6xx routes. Also of interest is that they spelled out Pennsylvania instead of just going with New Hope PA.

[Alps]

Almost all the signage on the freeway part of 202 from East Amwell to the New Hope toll bridge has been replaced. I will go through when it's not raining to get pictures. One note of interest is that the signs for the Mount Airy/Dilts Corner exit now has CR-605 shields on it. Here's the SB one, which Google already picked up for SV. This is even more complicated than needed as no one needs to care about "Frontage Road to". It's just extra noise that doesn't help motorists find their way. But I guess this means that CR shields are getting signed now whether they're 5xx or 6xx routes. Also of interest is that they spelled out Pennsylvania instead of just going with New Hope PA.

I saw them tonight and marveled at how stupid 605 was!

[Mr. Matté]

Does the NB signage say "Brief 2-way access road for compressor station back entrance to "?

[NE2]

Rt 1-9 North Pulaski Skyway

What's shitty here is that the first sign references the Tonnele Avenue exit, but the second one, with the main signage for the exit, doesn't say Tonnele Avenue anywhere.