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Author Topic: Is this MUTCD compliant or grandfathered ?  (Read 415 times)

roadman65

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Is this MUTCD compliant or grandfathered ?
« on: February 19, 2024, 07:12:24 AM »

https://maps.app.goo.gl/ptF4wyNWJMZQgXh56

The ALL TRAFFIC and improper use of WRONG WAY signs at this split in roadways.
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Re: Is this MUTCD compliant or grandfathered ?
« Reply #1 on: February 19, 2024, 08:32:09 PM »

The All Traffic sign was actually added in the Eleventh Edition (R4-20).
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ran4sh

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Re: Is this MUTCD compliant or grandfathered ?
« Reply #2 on: February 20, 2024, 11:51:00 PM »

I am not sure how those "wrong way" signs are improper
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Re: Is this MUTCD compliant or grandfathered ?
« Reply #3 on: February 21, 2024, 09:37:40 AM »

https://maps.app.goo.gl/ptF4wyNWJMZQgXh56

The ALL TRAFFIC and improper use of WRONG WAY signs at this split in roadways.

The All Traffic sign was actually added in the Eleventh Edition (R4-20).

Yeah, that's now in the MUTCD.  But I'm not sure this is the application the MUTCD has in mind.  What makes me say that is that none of the Movement Prohibition signs in Section 2B.26 seems to apply ...

The ALL TRAFFIC sign may be used at an intersection where all traffic on the approach to the intersection must turn in the direction indicated and the Movement Prohibition and/or ONE WAY signs do not adequately convey the allowable direction of travel.

... as well as this explicit prohibition:

The ALL TRAFFIC sign shall not be used to substitute for the Keep Right or Keep Left signs.

Going by the MUTCD, this type of sign should be there instead (note also the use of a WRONG WAY sign there as well).

I am not sure how those "wrong way" signs are improper

Yeah, I don't either.  As I'm reading the MUTCD...

check! — The DO NOT ENTER sign shall be used at ... The intersection of an interchange exit ramp with a crossroad.

check! — The DO NOT ENTER sign, if used, should be placed directly in view of a road user at the point where a road user could wrongly enter a divided highway, one-way roadway, or ramp. The sign should be mounted facing traffic that might enter the roadway or ramp in the wrong direction.

check! — The WRONG WAY sign may be used as a supplement to the DO NOT ENTER sign where a crossroad intersects a one-way roadway in a manner that does not physically discourage or prevent wrong-way entry.

check! — If used, the WRONG WAY sign should be placed at a location along the one-way roadway farther from the crossroad than the DO NOT ENTER sign.

check! — The WRONG WAY sign should be placed on the same side of the road as the DO NOT ENTER sign.

At interchange exit ramp terminals where the ramp intersects a crossroad in such a manner that wrong-way entry could inadvertently be made, the following signs shall be used:

fail! — At least one ONE WAY sign for each direction of travel on the crossroad shall be placed where the exit ramp intersects the crossroad.

check! — At least one DO NOT ENTER sign shall be conspicuously placed near the downstream end of the exit ramp in positions appropriate for full view of a road user starting to enter wrongly from the crossroad.

check! — At least one WRONG WAY sign shall be placed on the exit ramp facing a road user traveling in the wrong direction.

check! — Additional WRONG WAY signs may be used.
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mrsman

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Re: Is this MUTCD compliant or grandfathered ?
« Reply #4 on: February 22, 2024, 01:03:53 PM »

So a "wrong way" sign is simply optional?  It can supplement "do not enter" but is not required.

Are "wrong way" signs allowed without a "do not enter"?
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cjw2001

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Re: Is this MUTCD compliant or grandfathered ?
« Reply #5 on: February 22, 2024, 04:53:49 PM »

So a "wrong way" sign is simply optional?  It can supplement "do not enter" but is not required.

Are "wrong way" signs allowed without a "do not enter"?

no and no - at least one of each:

Quote
check! — At least one DO NOT ENTER sign shall be conspicuously placed near the downstream end of the exit ramp in positions appropriate for full view of a road user starting to enter wrongly from the crossroad.

check! — At least one WRONG WAY sign shall be placed on the exit ramp facing a road user traveling in the wrong direction.
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kphoger

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Re: Is this MUTCD compliant or grandfathered ?
« Reply #6 on: February 22, 2024, 05:34:45 PM »

To clarify:  the rules are slightly different depending on context.  A WRONG WAY sign is required at exit ramps, but optional at other types of intersection.
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