AARoads Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

The AARoads Wiki is live! Come check it out!

Author Topic: Bike Lanes  (Read 15640 times)

HighwayStar

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 1523
  • Location: Lilliput
  • Last Login: November 06, 2023, 10:56:26 AM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #25 on: October 03, 2021, 10:37:45 PM »

Kids have biked themselves to friends houses forever, using existing streets, cut-thrus, or whatever exists.  Seems like the classic "forgetting that everyone older than you was once young also" syndrome.

We never were allowed to do that when we were kids. We rode in the yard but never to anywhere else without our parents.
Logged
There are those who travel, and those who travel well

Scott5114

  • *
  • *
  • Online Online

  • Posts: 19829
  • Nit picker of unprecedented pedantry

  • Age: 34
  • Location: Las Vegas, NV
  • Last Login: Today at 02:14:59 AM
    • Denexa 100% Plastic Playing Cards
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #26 on: October 03, 2021, 11:34:22 PM »

As a driver I want more bike lanes and more people using them. The more people in the bike lane, the less people in my way in the general purpose lane.
Logged
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

jeffandnicole

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 14811
  • Age: 49
  • Location: South Jersey
  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 10:52:41 PM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #27 on: October 03, 2021, 11:45:25 PM »

Kids have biked themselves to friends houses forever, using existing streets, cut-thrus, or whatever exists.  Seems like the classic "forgetting that everyone older than you was once young also" syndrome.

We never were allowed to do that when we were kids. We rode in the yard but never to anywhere else without our parents.

Neighborhood streets...woods...railroads tracks...little league...high school...pizzeria...convenience store...

Rode all over the place in the 80s and 90s.
Logged

Bruce

  • [citation needed]
  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 5612
  • Stuck on I-5

  • Age: 26
  • Location: Snohomish County, WA
  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 01:32:08 AM
    • Wikipedia
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #28 on: October 04, 2021, 03:32:54 AM »

Instead of the MUTCD, one of the main US design guidelines for bike infra comes from NACTO: the Urban Bikeway Design Guide.

Protected bike lanes (with curbs and planters) are far better than a mere line in the road, especially if they can have better signal timing to prevent cars from intruding on turns. And yes, right hooks are a major issue because the majority of our drivers are complete idiots. In Berlin, I observed a lot of very simple bike lanes that would generate those right hook turn issues (especially since bikes didn't have many dedicated signals outside of the busiest areas), but Germany's more rigorous driver ed standards probably helps with people in cars not killing cyclists all over the place.

And a reminder: bicyclists in the road are legal vehicles on just about every city street or country road in the country. Give them space if passing in a legal spot; if you can't pass, then just suck it up and lose a few precious seconds instead of trying to murder people.
Logged

jeffandnicole

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 14811
  • Age: 49
  • Location: South Jersey
  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 10:52:41 PM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #29 on: October 04, 2021, 07:48:00 AM »

And a reminder: bicyclists in the road are legal vehicles on just about every city street or country road in the country. Give them space if passing in a legal spot; if you can't pass, then just suck it up and lose a few precious seconds instead of trying to murder people.

This is where it's tough to accompany the needs of both modes of transportation.  On normal roads, there are either minimum speeds, or 'obstruction of traffic laws'.  A car wouldn't be permitted to go 15 mph in a 50 mph zone legally.  But bicyclists aren't expected to go nearly 50 mph on a bike.  Also, it's not "a few seconds", but could be several minutes or longer if the road is a long road without passing.   

Sharing the road for all means actual *sharing of the road*.  Anytime one group says the other group has to suffer and suck it up erodes any definition of sharing.
Logged

1

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 14615
  • Age: 25
  • Location: MA/NH border
  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 09:41:17 PM
    • Flickr account
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #30 on: October 04, 2021, 07:54:44 AM »

And a reminder: bicyclists in the road are legal vehicles on just about every city street or country road in the country. Give them space if passing in a legal spot; if you can't pass, then just suck it up and lose a few precious seconds instead of trying to murder people.

This is where it's tough to accompany the needs of both modes of transportation.  On normal roads, there are either minimum speeds, or 'obstruction of traffic laws'.  A car wouldn't be permitted to go 15 mph in a 50 mph zone legally.  But bicyclists aren't expected to go nearly 50 mph on a bike.  Also, it's not "a few seconds", but could be several minutes or longer if the road is a long road without passing.   

Sharing the road for all means actual *sharing of the road*.  Anytime one group says the other group has to suffer and suck it up erodes any definition of sharing.

Reply #3 near the beginning of the thread: The speed limit is 40 in the first link and 45 in the second link. This seems like a pretty simple solution.
Logged
Clinched, minus I-93 (I'm missing a few miles and my file is incorrect)

Traveled, plus US 13, 44, and 50, and several state routes

I will be in Burlington VT for the eclipse.

jeffandnicole

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 14811
  • Age: 49
  • Location: South Jersey
  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 10:52:41 PM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #31 on: October 04, 2021, 08:07:24 AM »

And a reminder: bicyclists in the road are legal vehicles on just about every city street or country road in the country. Give them space if passing in a legal spot; if you can't pass, then just suck it up and lose a few precious seconds instead of trying to murder people.

This is where it's tough to accompany the needs of both modes of transportation.  On normal roads, there are either minimum speeds, or 'obstruction of traffic laws'.  A car wouldn't be permitted to go 15 mph in a 50 mph zone legally.  But bicyclists aren't expected to go nearly 50 mph on a bike.  Also, it's not "a few seconds", but could be several minutes or longer if the road is a long road without passing.   

Sharing the road for all means actual *sharing of the road*.  Anytime one group says the other group has to suffer and suck it up erodes any definition of sharing.

Reply #3 near the beginning of the thread: The speed limit is 40 in the first link and 45 in the second link. This seems like a pretty simple solution.

As long as the room already exists, that works. But if the road is more narrow, it's a very expensive solution to widen it by a few feet.
Logged

SectorZ

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 3162
  • Age: 45
  • Location: Massachusetts
  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 06:05:46 PM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #32 on: October 04, 2021, 08:25:21 AM »

Kids have biked themselves to friends houses forever, using existing streets, cut-thrus, or whatever exists.  Seems like the classic "forgetting that everyone older than you was once young also" syndrome.

We never were allowed to do that when we were kids. We rode in the yard but never to anywhere else without our parents.

I think I'm seeing where the anti-cycling tripe comes from with you. Since your parents deemed it unsafe, you've deemed it unsafe for everyone. I've met a few like you. Usually old ladies in Subaru Forresters but I guess you can come in all flavors. Kudos on having helicopter parents and now becoming a helicopter parent for adult cyclists that think you know what's best for me.
Logged

1995hoo

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 16384
  • Age: 50
  • Location: Fairfax County, Virginia
  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 04:22:06 PM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #33 on: October 04, 2021, 09:08:01 AM »

Kids have biked themselves to friends houses forever, using existing streets, cut-thrus, or whatever exists.  Seems like the classic "forgetting that everyone older than you was once young also" syndrome.

We never were allowed to do that when we were kids. We rode in the yard but never to anywhere else without our parents.

Neighborhood streets...woods...railroads tracks...little league...high school...pizzeria...convenience store...

Rode all over the place in the 80s and 90s.

Indeed, and we rode our bikes outside the neighborhood all the time, especially up to the 7-11 near the Beltway to buy Mad and Cracked magazines every month (this all when I was younger than age 10, as we moved out of that neighborhood when I was 10). It wasn't all that far–only about a mile each way–but parents today would be horrified that we were allowed to cross the street without supervision. Back then I regularly rode my bike to soccer practice a couple of neighborhoods over as well.

I recall riding my bike out to the public library in Fairfax City (maybe four miles each way) when I was in high school prior to getting my driver's license.
Logged
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

jamess

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 218
  • Location: New Jersey
  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 01:31:16 PM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #34 on: October 04, 2021, 02:42:24 PM »

Since there doesn't seem to be a general thread about bike lanes yet, I guess I'll start one here.

Over the past few weeks, I've been looking at Dutch roads for quite a bit, and noticed how well bike lanes are designed over there compared to here in the US. Note that I'm not going to suggest anything about removing/banning cars in favor of bikes here (unlike some "urbanists"). I think that both cars and bikes can coexist on a road, and with good infrastructure for both.

I've looked up the MUTCD for bike lane design standards here, and something that I don't get is that why does the bike lane have to cross at the start of a right turn lane? To me, it seems safer for the bike lane to stay on the right side of a right turn lane, as when the right turning car stops at the intersection to look at perpendicular traffic, they can also look at the bike lane while on that same stop before turning.

Short answer:

In the 1970s, the US and the Netherlands were in the same place. The first bicycle infrastructure was being installed and it looked the same, separate paths.

But then some people in the US, known as vehicular cyclists, starting making a lot of noise and pushing back against this. They said separate facilities would make them "second class road users". Bare in mind, this was a decade after the end of segregation where "separate but equal" was anything but. This group of folks won out in the great debate.

So the MUTCD reflects that. Bikes are treated like cars. So in that first image, right turning traffic should be to the right of thru traffic.

Unfortunately, this practice doesnt take into account comfort and real user behavior. The fact is, bikes arent cars. Theyre pretty damn different, and sharing the road doesnt make a whole lot of sense in most cases.

Thats where NACTO and such comes in. They basically said, correctly, that MUTCD designs are frozen in 1979 and started drawing up modern designs. Modern, being that they take into account 30 years of European experience in bicycle design. 

The proposed MUTCD is supposed to incorporate a lot of that, but even then, it will be a bit outdated when it comes out.

Heres en example of American infrastructure retrofit to a Dutch style intersection*. Note they took the very US frontage road and made that part of the bike path.

*Dutch intersections wouldnt have a billion lanes.

https://twitter.com/Derailluer/status/1444366516166688770
« Last Edit: October 04, 2021, 02:46:50 PM by jamess »
Logged

SkyPesos

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 5086
  • I-80E to NYC, not Clarion, Dubois, Bloomsburg, etc

  • Age: 21
  • Location: Cincinnati
  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 08:49:30 PM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #35 on: October 04, 2021, 02:49:58 PM »

But then some people in the US, known as vehicular cyclists, starting making a lot of noise and pushing back against this. They said separate facilities would make them "second class road users".
I don't get that reasoning from "vehicular cyclists". Bikes are much slower than cars, and ideally should be on their own path, not in the middle of the road. I always imagined bike paths as a win-win for both drivers and bikers. Would pedestrians also protest being treated as "second class road users" for walking on the sidewalk instead of the middle of the road too back then?

Along with Bruce a few posts up, thanks for letting me know about the NACTO. I'll take a look at it.

SkyPesos

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 5086
  • I-80E to NYC, not Clarion, Dubois, Bloomsburg, etc

  • Age: 21
  • Location: Cincinnati
  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 08:49:30 PM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #36 on: October 04, 2021, 02:55:48 PM »

Also, I just realized that there is already a recent thread about bike lanes  :banghead:

https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=24593.50
« Last Edit: October 04, 2021, 03:21:52 PM by SkyPesos »
Logged

SEWIGuy

  • *
  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 4070
  • Grid Anarchist

  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 08:05:19 PM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #37 on: October 04, 2021, 03:15:56 PM »

But then some people in the US, known as vehicular cyclists, starting making a lot of noise and pushing back against this. They said separate facilities would make them "second class road users".
I don't get that reasoning from "vehicular cyclists". Bikes are much slower than cars, and ideally should be on their own path, not in the middle of the road. I always imagined bike paths as a win-win for both drivers and bikers. Would pedestrians also protest being treated as "second class road users" for walking on the sidewalk instead of the middle of the road too back then?

Along with Bruce a few posts up, thanks for letting me know about the NACTO. I'll take a look at it.


I also think part of the problem in the 1970s is that there weren't a lot of bike friendly roads being constructed.  So bicyclists wanted to make sure they had the ability to "get places" by incorporating bike lanes into road construction, versus waiting for bike only paths to be constructed.  In reality in many places they ended up doing both and leading to kind of a hybrid system that seems rather fuctional.
Logged

jamess

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 218
  • Location: New Jersey
  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 01:31:16 PM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #38 on: October 04, 2021, 03:23:15 PM »

But then some people in the US, known as vehicular cyclists, starting making a lot of noise and pushing back against this. They said separate facilities would make them "second class road users".
I don't get that reasoning from "vehicular cyclists". Bikes are much slower than cars, and ideally should be on their own path, not in the middle of the road. I always imagined bike paths as a win-win for both drivers and bikers. Would pedestrians also protest being treated as "second class road users" for walking on the sidewalk instead of the middle of the road too back then?

Along with Bruce a few posts up, thanks for letting me know about the NACTO. I'll take a look at it.

Well, consider how often sidewalks are rebuilt versus roads repaved. Many sidewalks in this country are in atrocious conditions. Most roads are on a 5 year repave cycle, while maybe we get a new sidewalk surface every 50 years if youre lucky. Or if theres a lawsuit.

So to that end, theyre somewhat right that as long as we keep pouring all the money into roads, the bike path might become unusable.

Heres are examples of those 1970s bike paths.

https://goo.gl/maps/oux45Nhrm7qXkuRm8

If you move onto the main road on this one, the difference in pavement quality is obvious.

https://goo.gl/maps/a6TfQDTHQxA4WuVE7

Of course IMO, the solution is to properly fund the maintenance rather than giving up and not building them at all. This goes for sidewalks and bike paths.
Logged

jeffandnicole

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 14811
  • Age: 49
  • Location: South Jersey
  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 10:52:41 PM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #39 on: October 04, 2021, 09:50:38 PM »

But then some people in the US, known as vehicular cyclists, starting making a lot of noise and pushing back against this. They said separate facilities would make them "second class road users".
I don't get that reasoning from "vehicular cyclists". Bikes are much slower than cars, and ideally should be on their own path, not in the middle of the road. I always imagined bike paths as a win-win for both drivers and bikers. Would pedestrians also protest being treated as "second class road users" for walking on the sidewalk instead of the middle of the road too back then?

Along with Bruce a few posts up, thanks for letting me know about the NACTO. I'll take a look at it.

Most roads are on a 5 year repave cycle?

Eh?  I don't know of a single road repaved that often.

But regarding sidewalks...Once a sidewalk is built, it's usually left to the property owner to maintain it.  And they're going to generally do as little maintenance for something that they mostly see as a benefit to others.  Sidewalks also suffer from bad town planning or wishes, such as planting trees a foot away from the sidewalk.

Some people just don't want to walk on sidewalks. I don't care how new the sidewalk is...you'll find way too many people walking or jogging in the street, even if the sidewalk is in perfect condition as far as the eye can see.
Logged

fwydriver405

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 577
  • Location: Maine / Massachusetts, with ties to San Jose, CA
  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 09:48:14 PM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #40 on: October 16, 2021, 08:00:36 PM »

One thing I don't like is where a crosswalk crosses a bike lane at a T-intersection (this example is outside the US Treasury in DC). Legally, the cyclists must stop when the light goes red so that the pedestrians can cross the street with the "Walk" sign. Take a guess how often the cyclists actually stop. It's a wonder there aren't more collisions and injuries through this area.
There's a similar situation near me here. Note that the bike lane is the striped red/gray part. There's even a sign asking for cyclists to yield to crossing pedestrians, though from what I've observed, not a lot of people follow that.

At Beacon St and Grant Rd in Newton, MA, the eastbound thru bikes are treated like a Continuous Green T. The bike signal in the eastbound direction has an overlap with all phases (2, 4, 5, 6) except with Phase 9 (ex. ped) and only changes to red when Phase 9 (ex. ped) is active:

Logged

MCRoads

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 1046
  • Only 9,000 posts to go until I win the forum!

  • Age: 21
  • Location: Colorado Springs
  • Last Login: March 04, 2024, 03:43:12 PM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #41 on: October 16, 2021, 10:44:15 PM »

Colorado Springs has painted Northgate Blvd with a bike lane on the outside of the intersection. I don’t think it is the best idea, as I have seen many drivers not yield to pedestrians, at one point I almost got run over!
Logged
I build roads on Minecraft. Like, really good roads.
Interstates traveled:
 4/5/10*/11**/12**/15/25*/29*/35(E/W[TX])/40*/44**/49(LA**)/55*/64**/65/66*/70°/71*76(PA*,CO*)/78*°/80*/95°/99(PA**,NY**)

*/** indicates a terminus/termini being traveled
° Indicates a gap (I.E Breezwood, PA.)

more room plz

Mr. Matté

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 947
  • Age: 34
  • Location: NJTP - Exit '08
  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 11:39:24 AM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #42 on: October 16, 2021, 10:53:35 PM »

At Beacon St and Grant Rd in Newton, MA, the eastbound thru bikes are treated like a Continuous Green T. The bike signal in the eastbound direction has an overlap with all phases (2, 4, 5, 6) except with Phase 9 (ex. ped) and only changes to red when Phase 9 (ex. ped) is active:


What if you're a cyclist coming south on Grant making the left onto Beacon? Does the DOT expect the cyclist to just ride in the travel lane to just safely merge into the bike lane?

I know it's a stupid thing to plan for (and there probably won't be any situations of congested flow in the bike lane to necessitate the situation), but it has to be done.
Logged

jamess

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 218
  • Location: New Jersey
  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 01:31:16 PM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #43 on: October 17, 2021, 10:10:34 PM »

At Beacon St and Grant Rd in Newton, MA, the eastbound thru bikes are treated like a Continuous Green T. The bike signal in the eastbound direction has an overlap with all phases (2, 4, 5, 6) except with Phase 9 (ex. ped) and only changes to red when Phase 9 (ex. ped) is active:


What if you're a cyclist coming south on Grant making the left onto Beacon? Does the DOT expect the cyclist to just ride in the travel lane to just safely merge into the bike lane?

I know it's a stupid thing to plan for (and there probably won't be any situations of congested flow in the bike lane to necessitate the situation), but it has to be done.

At 0:34 you see a bike make the left turn from the vehicle lane.

A less confident cyclist would use the pedestrian phase. Considering its an all-way ped phase, the bicyclist would able able to cross diagonally.
Logged

HighwayStar

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 1523
  • Location: Lilliput
  • Last Login: November 06, 2023, 10:56:26 AM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #44 on: October 19, 2021, 12:09:25 AM »

As a driver I want more bike lanes and more people using them. The more people in the bike lane, the less people in my way in the general purpose lane.

Better yet, ban the bikes from the road, and use the space of the bike lanes for more parking.
Logged
There are those who travel, and those who travel well

Bruce

  • [citation needed]
  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 5612
  • Stuck on I-5

  • Age: 26
  • Location: Snohomish County, WA
  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 01:32:08 AM
    • Wikipedia
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #45 on: October 19, 2021, 12:49:38 AM »

As a driver I want more bike lanes and more people using them. The more people in the bike lane, the less people in my way in the general purpose lane.

Better yet, ban the bikes from the road, and use the space of the bike lanes for more parking.

Why don't we get rid of the parking spaces for more through lanes, pave over the sidewalks for through lanes, and demolish a few cities for even more through lanes.
Logged

SkyPesos

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 5086
  • I-80E to NYC, not Clarion, Dubois, Bloomsburg, etc

  • Age: 21
  • Location: Cincinnati
  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 08:49:30 PM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #46 on: October 19, 2021, 01:22:25 AM »

As a driver I want more bike lanes and more people using them. The more people in the bike lane, the less people in my way in the general purpose lane.

Better yet, ban the bikes from the road, and use the space of the bike lanes for more parking.

Why don't we get rid of the parking spaces for more through lanes, pave over the sidewalks for through lanes, and demolish a few cities for even more through lanes.
Sounds like an ideal cityscape to me, just like 1970s Houston  :bigass:

jamess

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 218
  • Location: New Jersey
  • Last Login: March 18, 2024, 01:31:16 PM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #47 on: October 19, 2021, 12:57:32 PM »

As a driver I want more bike lanes and more people using them. The more people in the bike lane, the less people in my way in the general purpose lane.

Better yet, ban the bikes from the road, and use the space of the bike lanes for more parking.

Transportation infrastructure should be used for transportation, not personal private storage.

At least thats why I choose this profession, to move people around. If I wanted to design parking, Id work for a commercial developer or something.
« Last Edit: October 19, 2021, 01:13:44 PM by jamess »
Logged

HighwayStar

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 1523
  • Location: Lilliput
  • Last Login: November 06, 2023, 10:56:26 AM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #48 on: October 20, 2021, 11:45:22 AM »

As a driver I want more bike lanes and more people using them. The more people in the bike lane, the less people in my way in the general purpose lane.

Better yet, ban the bikes from the road, and use the space of the bike lanes for more parking.

Why don't we get rid of the parking spaces for more through lanes, pave over the sidewalks for through lanes, and demolish a few cities for even more through lanes.

Because when you get where you are going you need to be able to park.
Classic case of optimization over 2 goods in Econ 101.
Logged
There are those who travel, and those who travel well

behogie230

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 20
  • Transportation Engineer

  • Location: Pennsylvania
  • Last Login: October 09, 2023, 11:36:21 PM
Re: Bike Lanes
« Reply #49 on: October 20, 2021, 11:12:36 PM »

OP, I hope I can clear up some of your confusion in your original post… I work as a transportation engineer for a municipality that’s head over heels for bike infrastructure.

The transition to stay alongside thru traffic is to avoid the most dangerous aspect of biking, the “right turn hook” . It’s much easier to see a cyclist when they’re in front of you rather than behind. Most of us lack the sense of awareness to check our blind spot when making a right hand turn. If a cyclist was approaching from behind, you’d slow down and turn directly into their path, so either you would hit them or they would hit you. Now imagine if it was a heavy vehicle… that’s a death sentence.

Secondly, sharrows are also a tool for bicyclists, not just motorists. They’re strategically placed where cyclists will be the most visible to drivers. This lets cyclists know where to position themselves in the lane. Additionally, sharrows can be used to delineate bike routes. If you have parallel streets with one being posted at 35mph and the other at 25mph, you can place sharrows on the 25mph street to encourage cyclists to opt for this route rather than the faster, more dangerous route beside it. Great, affordable option if you don’t have the funds or volume to put in a bike lane.

I like European bike infra just as much as the next guy, but the taxpayers won’t put up with spending hundreds of thousands on redesigning an intersection just to cater to 1% of the traffic stream!
Logged

 


Opinions expressed here on belong solely to the poster and do not represent or reflect the opinions or beliefs of AARoads, its creators and/or associates.