Walmart begins credit only at self checkout stands

[Scott5114]

The idea of a self checkout at Dollar Tree is kind of hilarious to me. How many items you got? 26? Okay, $26 plus tax. You already barely need a cashier as it is.

Obviously Dollar Tree cares which items you buy for stock keeping purposes, but putting that in the hands of a customer who has no real moral responsibility for ensuring proper stock keeping seems like it could be a problem. It would be tempting to just grab whichever item has the most conveniently-placed barcode and just scan it 26 times, since that would result in the same total as if you scanned all 26 items individually and therefore the store would be correctly compensated.

Food isn't taxed in Massachusetts and probably in every state.

It's taxed all to hell in Oklahoma.

[Pink Jazz]

Our local Dollar Tree just got self checkouts, with some being designated as both card and cash and others designated as card only.

The idea of a self checkout at Dollar Tree is kind of hilarious to me. How many items you got? 26? Okay, $26 plus tax. You already barely need a cashier as it is.

Obviously Dollar Tree cares which items you buy for stock keeping purposes, but putting that in the hands of a customer who has no real moral responsibility for ensuring proper stock keeping seems like it could be a problem. It would be tempting to just grab whichever item has the most conveniently-placed barcode and just scan it 26 times, since that would result in the same total as if you scanned all 26 items individually and therefore the store would be correctly compensated.

Dollar Tree will soon be raising the price on some of their items at most of their stores to $1.25 or $1.50.  Some stores now also got the Dollar Tree Plus treatment with more to come, with $3 and $5 items.

[Brandon]

The idea of a self checkout at Dollar Tree is kind of hilarious to me. How many items you got? 26? Okay, $26 plus tax. You already barely need a cashier as it is.

Obviously Dollar Tree cares which items you buy for stock keeping purposes, but putting that in the hands of a customer who has no real moral responsibility for ensuring proper stock keeping seems like it could be a problem. It would be tempting to just grab whichever item has the most conveniently-placed barcode and just scan it 26 times, since that would result in the same total as if you scanned all 26 items individually and therefore the store would be correctly compensated.

Food isn't taxed in Massachusetts and probably in every state.

It's taxed all to hell in Oklahoma.

1.25% in Illinois for regular grocery, regular sales tax rate for any candy or pop (8.5% here in Will County).  Our surrounding states of Wisconsin, Indiana, and Michigan do not tax food items, even candy and pop (10 cent deposit per bottle or can in Michigan).

[Scott5114]

The idea of a self checkout at Dollar Tree is kind of hilarious to me. How many items you got? 26? Okay, $26 plus tax. You already barely need a cashier as it is.

Obviously Dollar Tree cares which items you buy for stock keeping purposes, but putting that in the hands of a customer who has no real moral responsibility for ensuring proper stock keeping seems like it could be a problem. It would be tempting to just grab whichever item has the most conveniently-placed barcode and just scan it 26 times, since that would result in the same total as if you scanned all 26 items individually and therefore the store would be correctly compensated.

Food isn't taxed in Massachusetts and probably in every state.

It's taxed all to hell in Oklahoma.

1.25% in Illinois for regular grocery, regular sales tax rate for any candy or pop (8.5% here in Will County).  Our surrounding states of Wisconsin, Indiana, and Michigan do not tax food items, even candy and pop (10 cent deposit per bottle or can in Michigan).

Here, everything is taxed at whatever the general sales tax rate is (8.75% in Norman). Doesn't matter what it is. This way, Oklahoma can market itself as a low tax state, which is true for income and property tax...but they make up the revenue on sales tax and things like license plate fees. Regressive? You bet, pardner! But there's one tax-free weekend every August, so that makes up for it, right? ... Right?

[Brandon]

The idea of a self checkout at Dollar Tree is kind of hilarious to me. How many items you got? 26? Okay, $26 plus tax. You already barely need a cashier as it is.

Obviously Dollar Tree cares which items you buy for stock keeping purposes, but putting that in the hands of a customer who has no real moral responsibility for ensuring proper stock keeping seems like it could be a problem. It would be tempting to just grab whichever item has the most conveniently-placed barcode and just scan it 26 times, since that would result in the same total as if you scanned all 26 items individually and therefore the store would be correctly compensated.

Food isn't taxed in Massachusetts and probably in every state.

It's taxed all to hell in Oklahoma.

1.25% in Illinois for regular grocery, regular sales tax rate for any candy or pop (8.5% here in Will County).  Our surrounding states of Wisconsin, Indiana, and Michigan do not tax food items, even candy and pop (10 cent deposit per bottle or can in Michigan).

Here, everything is taxed at whatever the general sales tax rate is (8.75% in Norman). Doesn't matter what it is. This way, Oklahoma can market itself as a low tax state, which is true for income and property tax...but they make up the revenue on sales tax and things like license plate fees. Regressive? You bet, pardner! But there's one tax-free weekend every August, so that makes up for it, right? ... Right?

We don't even get that much here in Illinois.  High property taxes?  You bet.  High income tax?  Well, it's a flat tax now at 4.25%.  High fees?  Sure as hell yes.  A car registration will set you back $151 a year.  They tried to get electric vehicles to have a $1,000 registration per year, but that went over like a lead balloon.  Illinois is a very regressive state taxation-wise.

[SectorZ]

The idea of a self checkout at Dollar Tree is kind of hilarious to me. How many items you got? 26? Okay, $26 plus tax. You already barely need a cashier as it is.

Obviously Dollar Tree cares which items you buy for stock keeping purposes, but putting that in the hands of a customer who has no real moral responsibility for ensuring proper stock keeping seems like it could be a problem. It would be tempting to just grab whichever item has the most conveniently-placed barcode and just scan it 26 times, since that would result in the same total as if you scanned all 26 items individually and therefore the store would be correctly compensated.

Food isn't taxed in Massachusetts and probably in every state.

It's taxed all to hell in Oklahoma.

1.25% in Illinois for regular grocery, regular sales tax rate for any candy or pop (8.5% here in Will County).  Our surrounding states of Wisconsin, Indiana, and Michigan do not tax food items, even candy and pop (10 cent deposit per bottle or can in Michigan).

Here, everything is taxed at whatever the general sales tax rate is (8.75% in Norman). Doesn't matter what it is. This way, Oklahoma can market itself as a low tax state, which is true for income and property tax...but they make up the revenue on sales tax and things like license plate fees. Regressive? You bet, pardner! But there's one tax-free weekend every August, so that makes up for it, right? ... Right?

How is that a regressive tax? People with less money buy less stuff. I can't afford a yacht, so some billionaire that buys one and pays millions of dollars in taxes on that one purchase is more sales tax I would pay in multiple lifetimes.

[Rothman]

The idea of a self checkout at Dollar Tree is kind of hilarious to me. How many items you got? 26? Okay, $26 plus tax. You already barely need a cashier as it is.

Obviously Dollar Tree cares which items you buy for stock keeping purposes, but putting that in the hands of a customer who has no real moral responsibility for ensuring proper stock keeping seems like it could be a problem. It would be tempting to just grab whichever item has the most conveniently-placed barcode and just scan it 26 times, since that would result in the same total as if you scanned all 26 items individually and therefore the store would be correctly compensated.

Food isn't taxed in Massachusetts and probably in every state.

It's taxed all to hell in Oklahoma.

1.25% in Illinois for regular grocery, regular sales tax rate for any candy or pop (8.5% here in Will County).  Our surrounding states of Wisconsin, Indiana, and Michigan do not tax food items, even candy and pop (10 cent deposit per bottle or can in Michigan).

Here, everything is taxed at whatever the general sales tax rate is (8.75% in Norman). Doesn't matter what it is. This way, Oklahoma can market itself as a low tax state, which is true for income and property tax...but they make up the revenue on sales tax and things like license plate fees. Regressive? You bet, pardner! But there's one tax-free weekend every August, so that makes up for it, right? ... Right?

How is that a regressive tax? People with less money buy less stuff. I can't afford a yacht, so some billionaire that buys one and pays millions of dollars in taxes on that one purchase is more sales tax I would pay in multiple lifetimes.

Egads.  The tax is a higher percentage of the poorer person's income...

[Pink Jazz]

Arizona doesn't tax food at the state or county level, but local governments are free to tax groceries.

[hbelkins]

Tennessee taxes food. It's one reason I scratch my head when I hear people talking about how they prefer Tennessee's taxing structure over Kentucky's, where food is not taxed except for certain items such as candy, soft drinks, etc.

(Fun fact -- in Kentucky, a Hershey's chocolate bar is taxed, but a Kit Kat bar isn't, because the wafer included as part of the Kit Kat makes that candy bar qualify for a different tax status.)

Our local Dollar Tree just got self checkouts, with some being designated as both card and cash and others designated as card only.

The idea of a self checkout at Dollar Tree is kind of hilarious to me. How many items you got? 26? Okay, $26 plus tax. You already barely need a cashier as it is.

Obviously Dollar Tree cares which items you buy for stock keeping purposes, but putting that in the hands of a customer who has no real moral responsibility for ensuring proper stock keeping seems like it could be a problem. It would be tempting to just grab whichever item has the most conveniently-placed barcode and just scan it 26 times, since that would result in the same total as if you scanned all 26 items individually and therefore the store would be correctly compensated.

Dollar Tree will soon be raising the price on some of their items at most of their stores to $1.25 or $1.50.  Some stores now also got the Dollar Tree Plus treatment with more to come, with $3 and $5 items.

Five Below has already done that. They have a number of items now that are above the $5 threshold. And they also allow self-checkout.

[US 89]

And here I had no idea there were states that straight up didn't tax food. Utah taxes food, but at a significantly lower rate than non-food items. The state food tax is 1.75%, which when combined with the local option (1%) and county option (0.25%) results in a 3% statewide food tax rate.

The general sales tax, on the other hand, has a base rate of 6.1% (same local and county options, but state tax is 4.85%). However, most places have some additional county and local level taxes, and so the actual sales tax rate generally ranges from the mid 6s in more rural parts of the state to low 7s in urban areas to even higher in especially touristy areas. The highest sales tax rate in the state is the 9.05% you'll pay in Park City.

[jeffandnicole]

The PA/NJ/DE area is unusual in general when it comes to sales taxes. Both PA and NJ don't tax most clothing and most *unprepared* foods. Basically, if you're buying ingredients, it's not taxed; if you're buying prepared items, you are taxed. And this leads to the weirdness of the system where some prepared foods and candy aren't taxed, but other unprepared foods are.

Then there's DE, which doesn't have a sales tax on anything, although there is a 2% rental tax.  Buy a table saw or car? No tax.  Rent a table saw or car: Taxed.

[Bruce]

I guess we're veering way off topic here, but here's what we have in Washington:

6.5% sales tax and local tax; the highest combined sales tax is in a few Snohomish County cities that reach 10.4% or 10.5%. (Source: MRSC) Fresh food is exempt, but prepared foods and soft drinks are not; there are tons of other exemptions as well.

With no state income tax, we're left with other regressive sources for just about everything. A major one is vehicle registration (locally known as "car tabs"), which have a base rate of $43.25 and added  tiers of $25 to $72 based on weight, plus $75-150 for electric/hybrid vehicles. (Source: Dept of Licensing) There's additional rates on car tabs that are levied by cities or regions for other needs, mostly mass transit (which is also funded with sales tax for the most part); in Seattle, there's a $80 city fee for local transportation projects and the RTA rate for most of the metro area that is calculated based on vehicle depreciation. So for my decade-old SUV, I'd have an additional $68 on top of the $88.25, and then another $80 if I lived in the city proper for a grand total of $236.25 a year.

And the gas tax is $0.678/gal when combined with the federal rate. (Source: Dept of Revenue)

[cl94]

Food isn't taxed in Massachusetts and probably in every state.

Yeano. Some states tax all food, other states tax prepared food, sugary items, and/or carbonated beverages. Like, in New York, fresh food isn't taxed, but anything prepared, carbonated, or super sugary is taxed.

[Rothman]

The PA/NJ/DE area is unusual in general when it comes to sales taxes. Both PA and NJ don't tax most clothing and most *unprepared* foods. Basically, if you're buying ingredients, it's not taxed; if you're buying prepared items, you are taxed. And this leads to the weirdness of the system where some prepared foods and candy aren't taxed, but other unprepared foods are.

Then there's DE, which doesn't have a sales tax on anything, although there is a 2% rental tax.  Buy a table saw or car? No tax.  Rent a table saw or car: Taxed.

Wasn't there a time when PA didn't tax shoes?

[bwana39]

Yes, my closest Walmart converted to all self-checkout back in the summer.  Frankly it makes me mad.

Technically at those stores there is still a manned checkout or two at the service desk.

Believe it or not, at this point, there is no reduction of personnel. The Neighborhood Markets that they did this with often only had one full service lane plus the service desk open except at peak times.  There is a level of margin that is almost constant over the decades. The problem is traditionally reductions in staffing affected the cleanliness and shelf stock. IE the store was dirtier and the shelves were not stocked as well.

Fifteen years ago, probably 20% of the non-grocery merchandise in a store was in the back. Today that is less than half that amount with the goal to have it all out by the end of a given day.   It takes more bodies stocking, arranging, and cleaning to accomplish this.

Believe it or not, self checkouts actually don't cost jobs and get you out of the store faster.  If you want a full service grocery store, go to Kroger, Albertson's, or such. 

[Rothman]

Yes, my closest Walmart converted to all self-checkout back in the summer.  Frankly it makes me mad.

Technically at those stores there is still a manned checkout or two at the service desk.

Believe it or not, at this point, there is no reduction of personnel. The Neighborhood Markets that they did this with often only had one full service lane plus the service desk open except at peak times.  There is a level of margin that is almost constant over the decades. The problem is traditionally reductions in staffing affected the cleanliness and shelf stock. IE the store was dirtier and the shelves were not stocked as well.

Fifteen years ago, probably 20% of the non-grocery merchandise in a store was in the back. Today that is less than half that amount with the goal to have it all out by the end of a given day.   It takes more bodies stocking, arranging, and cleaning to accomplish this.

Believe it or not, self checkouts actually don't cost jobs and get you out of the store faster.  If you want a full service grocery store, go to Kroger, Albertson's, or such.

I choose not on this one.  You may not lose them 1:1, but I do still think you lose some.

[bwana39]

Yes, my closest Walmart converted to all self-checkout back in the summer.  Frankly it makes me mad.

Technically at those stores there is still a manned checkout or two at the service desk.

Believe it or not, at this point, there is no reduction of personnel. The Neighborhood Markets that they did this with often only had one full service lane plus the service desk open except at peak times.  There is a level of margin that is almost constant over the decades. The problem is traditionally reductions in staffing affected the cleanliness and shelf stock. IE the store was dirtier and the shelves were not stocked as well.

Fifteen years ago, probably 20% of the non-grocery merchandise in a store was in the back. Today that is less than half that amount with the goal to have it all out by the end of a given day.   It takes more bodies stocking, arranging, and cleaning to accomplish this.

Believe it or not, self checkouts actually don't cost jobs and get you out of the store faster.  If you want a full service grocery store, go to Kroger, Albertson's, or such.

I choose not on this one.  You may not lose them 1:1, but I do still think you lose some.

Maybe in the long run you lose a few. This was actually done at a time there was a need for a staffing INCREASE needed (shoppers for curbside and in-store pickup). This coupled with with the inability to hire folks even with the increased wage rate may result in minimal if any staffing increases. The reason they are doing this is to divert employees from  checkouts to doing necessary cleaning, stocking, and shopping.

[Rothman]

Yes, my closest Walmart converted to all self-checkout back in the summer.  Frankly it makes me mad.

Technically at those stores there is still a manned checkout or two at the service desk.

Believe it or not, at this point, there is no reduction of personnel. The Neighborhood Markets that they did this with often only had one full service lane plus the service desk open except at peak times.  There is a level of margin that is almost constant over the decades. The problem is traditionally reductions in staffing affected the cleanliness and shelf stock. IE the store was dirtier and the shelves were not stocked as well.

Fifteen years ago, probably 20% of the non-grocery merchandise in a store was in the back. Today that is less than half that amount with the goal to have it all out by the end of a given day.   It takes more bodies stocking, arranging, and cleaning to accomplish this.

Believe it or not, self checkouts actually don't cost jobs and get you out of the store faster.  If you want a full service grocery store, go to Kroger, Albertson's, or such.

I choose not on this one.  You may not lose them 1:1, but I do still think you lose some.

Maybe in the long run you lose a few. This was actually done at a time there was a need for a staffing INCREASE needed (shoppers for curbside and in-store pickup). This coupled with with the inability to hire folks even with the increased wage rate may result in minimal if any staffing increases. The reason they are doing this is to divert employees from  checkouts to doing necessary cleaning, stocking, and shopping.

Sounds like a party line.

[kalvado]

Yes, my closest Walmart converted to all self-checkout back in the summer.  Frankly it makes me mad.

Technically at those stores there is still a manned checkout or two at the service desk.

Believe it or not, at this point, there is no reduction of personnel. The Neighborhood Markets that they did this with often only had one full service lane plus the service desk open except at peak times.  There is a level of margin that is almost constant over the decades. The problem is traditionally reductions in staffing affected the cleanliness and shelf stock. IE the store was dirtier and the shelves were not stocked as well.

Fifteen years ago, probably 20% of the non-grocery merchandise in a store was in the back. Today that is less than half that amount with the goal to have it all out by the end of a given day.   It takes more bodies stocking, arranging, and cleaning to accomplish this.

Believe it or not, self checkouts actually don't cost jobs and get you out of the store faster.  If you want a full service grocery store, go to Kroger, Albertson's, or such.

I choose not on this one.  You may not lose them 1:1, but I do still think you lose some.

Maybe in the long run you lose a few. This was actually done at a time there was a need for a staffing INCREASE needed (shoppers for curbside and in-store pickup). This coupled with with the inability to hire folks even with the increased wage rate may result in minimal if any staffing increases. The reason they are doing this is to divert employees from  checkouts to doing necessary cleaning, stocking, and shopping.

Sounds like a party line.

Increased productivity meaned some people moving to a different career ever since the first mechanization kicked in. A pretty boring job, I would think, so it is only to be expected.
Amazon is trying to bring things to a new level with cameras looking into the basket and the total being calculated as you shop along. Not sure if I like that approach, though.

[abefroman329]

A pretty boring job, I would think, so it is only to be expected.

That is the line that is trotted out every time a company automates a process, or offshores jobs - "oh, don't worry, they're just doing the most boring parts of your job, that will free you up to do more interesting things!"  Eventually they teach the robot or the offshore employee how to do your job, and you're out of a job.

[hotdogPi]

A pretty boring job, I would think, so it is only to be expected.

That is the line that is trotted out every time a company automates a process, or offshores jobs - "oh, don't worry, they're just doing the most boring parts of your job, that will free you up to do more interesting things!"  Eventually they teach the robot or the offshore employee how to do your job, and you're out of a job.

No, they don't teach the robot how to do anyone's job. It walks along the floor in a set pattern every hour, making sure not to get in people's way. When it finds a spill, or thinks that something is a spill when it's really not, it will alert the entire store over the intercom that something's there and tells the employees to clean it up. It does not clean anything up itself.

At my store, it once infamously thought a beam of light (the sun was at exactly the right angle) was a solid object, refused to cross it, and had its eyes glow red because it thought it was blocked.

[kalvado]

A pretty boring job, I would think, so it is only to be expected.

That is the line that is trotted out every time a company automates a process, or offshores jobs - "oh, don't worry, they're just doing the most boring parts of your job, that will free you up to do more interesting things!"  Eventually they teach the robot or the offshore employee how to do your job, and you're out of a job.

In the ideal world (and I am looking towards France, for example) such automation should allow for more productivity with less effort, and paying a living wage to more people over fewer hours of work. Doesn't work that way in US for many reasons, though.

[abefroman329]

A pretty boring job, I would think, so it is only to be expected.

That is the line that is trotted out every time a company automates a process, or offshores jobs - "oh, don't worry, they're just doing the most boring parts of your job, that will free you up to do more interesting things!"  Eventually they teach the robot or the offshore employee how to do your job, and you're out of a job.

No, they don't teach the robot how to do anyone's job. It walks along the floor in a set pattern every hour, making sure not to get in people's way. When it finds a spill, or thinks that something is a spill when it's really not, it will alert the entire store over the intercom that something's there and tells the employees to clean it up. It does not clean anything up itself.

At my store, it once infamously thought a beam of light (the sun was at exactly the right angle) was a solid object, refused to cross it, and had its eyes glow red because it thought it was blocked.

Sorry, I was speaking about automation in manufacturing, nothing specific to Walmart or retail.  Although I have no doubt that the robots being used in retail now are step 1 towards replacing the human employees.

[jeffandnicole]

Although I have no doubt that the robots being used in retail now are step 1 towards replacing the human employees.

Where have I heard this one before? Go yeah... Forever.

Well it's certainly true that robots replace humans, humans are still needed for many other things. Hell, realize that Amazon is very heavily robotic, yet is a huge employer. Many of those employees are warehouse personnel and delivery drivers, but there's also a huge back office of other workers making big bucks. Don't forget about other companies that are selling their merchandise through Amazon, which have their own employees. Or vehicle manufacturers and resellers, that have made a pretty penny selling vans to Amazon.

When focused on one small development of robots, there's actually a lot more people involved. Including humans that work in businesses that make robots.

[abefroman329]

Many of those employees are warehouse personnel and delivery drivers

...that Amazon is currently working to automate out of existence.