Changing Control Cities

[DTComposer]

For example, on US-101 heading south from San Francisco, the control city is San Jose, but San Jose never appears as a control city in the northbound direction. SF remains the northbound control city all the way from Ventura north.  Similarly, Ventura is the control city on US-101 northbound from Los Angeles, but Ventura never appears in the southbound direction.  LA is the control city all the way south from San Jose.

They're actually both used in the opposite directions, just as secondary cities to either SF or LA. Northbound, San Jose is used with San Francisco from Salinas north; southbound, Ventura is used with Los Angeles from Santa Barbara south. Salinas, San Luis Obispo and Santa Barbara are used in the same manner.

[2Co5_14]

For example, on US-101 heading south from San Francisco, the control city is San Jose, but San Jose never appears as a control city in the northbound direction. SF remains the northbound control city all the way from Ventura north.  Similarly, Ventura is the control city on US-101 northbound from Los Angeles, but Ventura never appears in the southbound direction.  LA is the control city all the way south from San Jose.

They're actually both used in the opposite directions, just as secondary cities to either SF or LA. Northbound, San Jose is used with San Francisco from Salinas north; southbound, Ventura is used with Los Angeles from Santa Barbara south. Salinas, San Luis Obispo and Santa Barbara are used in the same manner.

The "secondary cities" you mentioned appear as the intermediate destination on the mileage signs at various intervals along the highway.  The "control cities" I was referring to are the ones that appear on directional signs, pull-through signs, and the bottom line of the mileage signs.

[DTComposer]

The "secondary cities" you mentioned appear as the intermediate destination on the mileage signs at various intervals along the highway.  The "control cities" I was referring to are the ones that appear on directional signs, pull-through signs, and the bottom line of the mileage signs.

While you are correct in that they don't appear on the bottom line of mileage signs, they do appear on pull-through signs and directional signs. Some examples:

Along US-101:

http://tinyurl.com/3zjfpm9

http://tinyurl.com/3mzeq7l

http://tinyurl.com/3pf754k

http://tinyurl.com/3ojn58t

Approaching US-101 from CA-1:

http://tinyurl.com/4yc5wz7

Approaching US-101 from CA-156:

http://tinyurl.com/3oyckjw

[bassoon1986]

Another curious but slightly different situation is where a control city appears in only one direction of a highway that passes through it.  It seems like this is done to differentiate the major destinations within a metropolitan area versus more distant destinations with statewide (or inter-state) significance.

Yeah in DFW heading north on 35E and 35W, the control city is Denton. There are plenty of suburbs before reaching Denton that are larger, and Oklahoma City is the control city north of there, but I'm sure that Denton was chosen because it's where both 35's meet. No mention of it southbound. I wonder if Waco is the same way coming north of Austin

On I-95 in Maine south of Kittery, the control "points" are New Hampshire & Massachusetts.  Just over the ME/NH state line, the control cities change to Hampton & Boston.

Another curious but slightly different situation is where a control city appears in only one direction of a highway that passes through it.  It seems like this is done to differentiate the major destinations within a metropolitan area versus more distant destinations with statewide (or inter-state) significance.




[/quote]

[thenetwork]

Drove 76 and 80 from Philadelphia to the far side of Cleveland yesterday (en route to Chicago and southern Wisconsin).  As I passed the bump near Youngstown, I looked back at eastbound signage.  Unless I missed it, New York doesn't appear for 80 east.  I thought it did.

Unless they changed the control cities after the rehab/widening of I-80, the only places on the mainline I-80 where "New York City" was mentioned on overhead BGSs was at I-680/SR-11 and on I-76 East before the Turnpike Trade with I-80 East (There may have been one or two mileage signs on the side as well). 

On the BGSs for all of the on-ramps to I-80 East across it's entire non-toll run in Ohio, it was always "New York" or "New York City", at least as of 5 years ago.

Also, slightly off topic perhaps:  the control cities for I-71 on the Turnpike westbound are Cleveland and Strongsville.  Given Ohio's control-city habits (which I approve highly of), I would have expected Cleveland and Columbus.  Looked back again at the eastbound side and it is Cleveland and Columbus eastbound.  Why doesn't Columbus rate a mention westbound - are they assuming everyone would have used 76 or something?

This goes back about 10 years ago when they made some BGS upgrades as a result of adding the 3rd lane.  Prior to the upgrade, all the overhead BGSs just said I-71/US-42, with the side posted signs saying Cleveland & Strongsville. 

Once the upgrade was complete, the Westbound BGSs kept both the I-71 and US-42 shields and the Strongsville control city.  Meanwhile, on the Eastbound side, The BGS's eliminated the US-42 shield (putting the US-42 info on a separate secondary sign), kept the I-71 shield only and swapped out Strongsville for Columbus.

What make's it even dumber, is the eastbound use of Columbus, since if you are coming from, say Indiana, you would be getting off the Turnpike well before I-71 if you were Columbus-bound (more likely I-75 in Toledo).  Hell, If I were in N. Ridgeville (the exit prior to I-71) and were heading to Columbus, I'd be using either SR-83 or SR-301 South to I-71 -- just as fast and shorter mileage. Columbus should be used on the Westbound BGSs, if at all. 

To my knowledge, Columbus is not mentioned at all on the westbound mainline turnpike, yet more Columbus-bound drivers would be coming from the east on the Turnpike to I-71 than the west.

[Hot Rod Hootenanny]

Also, slightly off topic perhaps:  the control cities for I-71 on the Turnpike westbound are Cleveland and Strongsville.  Given Ohio's control-city habits (which I approve highly of), I would have expected Cleveland and Columbus.  Looked back again at the eastbound side and it is Cleveland and Columbus eastbound.  Why doesn't Columbus rate a mention westbound - are they assuming everyone would have used 76 or something?

This goes back about 10 years ago when they made some BGS upgrades as a result of adding the 3rd lane.  Prior to the upgrade, all the overhead BGSs just said I-71/US-42, with the side posted signs saying Cleveland & Strongsville.  

Once the upgrade was complete, the Westbound BGSs kept both the I-71 and US-42 shields and the Strongsville control city.  Meanwhile, on the Eastbound side, The BGS's eliminated the US-42 shield (putting the US-42 info on a separate secondary sign), kept the I-71 shield only and swapped out Strongsville for Columbus.

What make's it even dumber, is the eastbound use of Columbus, since if you are coming from, say Indiana, you would be getting off the Turnpike well before I-71 if you were Columbus-bound (more likely I-75 in Toledo).  Hell, If I were in N. Ridgeville (the exit prior to I-71) and were heading to Columbus, I'd be using either SR-83 or SR-301 South to I-71 -- just as fast and shorter mileage. Columbus should be used on the Westbound BGSs, if at all.  

To my knowledge, Columbus is not mentioned at all on the westbound mainline turnpike, yet more Columbus-bound drivers would be coming from the east on the Turnpike to I-71 than the west.

If you were WB on the Turnpike (between Youngstown and Cleveland) looking to go to Columbus, you'd be exiting at SR 8 or I-77, then head over to I-271 SB to I-71 for Columbus.

[Michael in Philly]

I drove from Cleveland to North Jersey today.  There is indeed no signage for New York on the Turnpike, but on the ramp from the Turnpike eastbound to the toll-free segment of 80 eastbound, you can see below you to the left - on I-76 I assume - "New York City via Pennsylvania" for I-80.

More surprising, there is no indication whatsoever that the exit for 80 eastbound also accesses 76 westbound.  None.  Until you're through the tollbooth and presented with that choice.  As I was approaching the exit, thinking, "that's strange," I was assuming they'd reconfigured it so that 80 east and 76 west were separate exits, and if I'd actually been trying to get to 76 west, I'd have been screwed.

I like Ohio's roads and signage, generally, but this seems a major, major fail.  Are they assuming that no one going east on the Turnpike would be interested in turning west on 76?

Now, we all know about Pennsylvania's control-city issues on I-80.  But the one that had me shaking my head was at the 80/81 junction.  Hazleton is the control city for 80 east; Harrisburg for 81 south.  I assume the justification for this is that there's one more exit on 80 that serves Hazleton (or at least has Hazleton as its southbound control city), but I'd think most people actually trying to get to Hazleton from the 80/81 junction would turn south on 81, since that will get you closer to the city than 80 will.  So this makes no sense at all to me.

[roadman65]

How about Harrisburg being used for I-81 Northbound in Maryland.  Yet once across the PA Line it changes to Chambersburg and then Carlisle.  Harrisburg is not used again until Carlisle. 

I believe that a similar situation arises the other way as Roanoke, VA is used for I-81 Southbound in Maryland where it becomes Winchester at later points in WV and VA.

[Takumi]

I-95 southbound south of Petersburg alternates between Rocky Mount (NC) and Emporia. There's also a Miami appearance at the I-85 split.

[roadman65]

I-95 south of Petersburg alternates between Rocky Mount (NC) and Emporia. There's also a Miami appearance at the I-85 spilit.

From Rocky Mount, NC north on I-95 Richmond is used, but in VA it alternates from Petersburg and Richmond.

[Takumi]

From Rocky Mount, NC north on I-95 Richmond is used, but in VA it alternates from Petersburg and Richmond.

I figured that was the case northbound. I haven't been on I-95 south of Emporia for quite some time.

[roadman65]

From Rocky Mount, NC north on I-95 Richmond is used, but in VA it alternates from Petersburg and Richmond.

I figured that was the case northbound. I haven't been on I-95 south of Emporia for quite some time.

Southbound it is Rocky Mount from Emporia to Gold Rock, NC.  South of there it gets confusing all the way to Dunn I believe.  It has even changed over the years as at one time Wilson was a control city along with Smithfield at some places.  When I-40 finally opened in the early 90's (maybe 89), Benson started being used in some places.  Now on mileage signs from I-40 on NB I-95 Richmond is now being used on 3 destination signs.

[sp_redelectric]

The biggest changes seem to happen when you go from a state that uses larger control cities to a state with smaller control cities that change more often (or vice-versa.)  On I-5 in California north of Redding, the control city is Portland.  Once you cross the Oregon state line

I would just like to know why ODOT insists on using The Dalles (population, 12,500) as a control city instead of, say, Pendleton (which is a much more significant town) or Boise.  I remember when the I-84 exit off of I-80 in Utah listed Portland, but today it's just Ogden.

[roadman65]

Why is New Jersey using Easton, PA as a control city for I-78 WB instead of Allentown, PA.  Allentown is Pennsylvania's third largest city and Easton is much smaller and not even in the top ten population of the Keystone State.

Plus, Easton only has one exit (two if you count US 22 in New Jersey) and is not near its Downtown area.  Allentown has several exits and is the main city of the Lehigh Valley region.

[The High Plains Traveler]

At the I-80/25 interchange in Cheyenne, the old signage used to indicate Omaha for eastbound and Denver southbound. The new signage now uses Sidney eastbound and Ft. Collins southbound. The latter I understand but Sidney seems an unusual choice given the town only has a population around 6000 - it's probably the first significant town after entering Nebraska. Go a little more than twice the distance and you encounter North Platte, about four times the size of Sidney.

[hobsini2]

At the I-80/25 interchange in Cheyenne, the old signage used to indicate Omaha for eastbound and Denver southbound. The new signage now uses Sidney eastbound and Ft. Collins southbound. The latter I understand but Sidney seems an unusual choice given the town only has a population around 6000 - it's probably the first significant town after entering Nebraska. Go a little more than twice the distance and you encounter North Platte, about four times the size of Sidney.

Funny you mention this since I was at the Interchange just yesterday. Going east on 80, I also found it strange to use Sidney and not say North Platte, Kearney, Grand Island, Lincoln, or Omaha but once you leave the Cheyenne city limits, the mileage sign does indicate Omaha. I was also surprised that leaving eastbound from Utah into Wyoming, Cheyenne is only mentioned at the state line and then not again until just before Laramie.

[roadman65]

https://goo.gl/maps/Tk4RvEETt8uNQq7m7
Why is Walt Whitman Bridge a pull through control on a route originating from where that particular bridge leads back to? Should be Williamstown- Atlantic City.

[KCRoadFan]

I-35 going north from Des Moines alternates between Minneapolis and St. Paul on the mileage signs after every exit. Pretty much the same distance.

Same deal on I-94 west of Minneapolis with the signs for Fargo and Moorhead.

[hotdogPi]

How many control city threads have we had since 2011?

[webny99]

How many control city threads have we had since 2011?

If you include all variants, its almost certainly greater than the number of replies to this thread (now 44), and possibly even as many as one per month since this thread was last posted to (112).

[thspfc]

In the Madison area, I would sign Verona instead of Dodgeville for US-18/151 SWB at the Verona Road/Beltline interchange.

[roadman65]

https://goo.gl/maps/m3UfFQ8R3tcw5H2B7
This one should be Indianapolis and not the state of Illinois for I-70 across the Stan Musial Bridge in St. Louis.

[I-35]

Another curious but slightly different situation is where a control city appears in only one direction of a highway that passes through it.  It seems like this is done to differentiate the major destinations within a metropolitan area versus more distant destinations with statewide (or inter-state) significance.

Yeah in DFW heading north on 35E and 35W, the control city is Denton. There are plenty of suburbs before reaching Denton that are larger, and Oklahoma City is the control city north of there, but I'm sure that Denton was chosen because it's where both 35's meet. No mention of it southbound. I wonder if Waco is the same way coming north of Austin

Denton is mentioned southbound on 35 on alternating signs as you cross the Red River.  Ft Worth/Dallas are on alternating distance signs with Sanger/Denton near Gainesville.  There is no mention of Denton in Oklahoma except for new distance signs south of Marietta.  Fort Worth is not mentioned on any signs in Oklahoma on I-35, period.

As for signs coming out of Austin, the only Dallas sign I recall seeing south of Temple is a distance one on Toll 130 near Hutto.  The alternating Ft Worth/Dallas distance signs don't begin in earnest until north of Waco.

[odditude]

https://goo.gl/maps/Tk4RvEETt8uNQq7m7
Why is Walt Whitman Bridge a pull through control on a route originating from where that particular bridge leads back to? Should be Williamstown- Atlantic City.

if you're in downtown Camden and looking to head to the Walt, 676 is a decent way to go - I went that exact way quite a few times when heading to a Flyers game from class at Rutgers.

[NWI_Irish96]

How many control city threads have we had since 2011?

All we're missing is a thread where we list our favorite control cities threads.