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Regional Boards => Great Lakes and Ohio Valley => Topic started by: mukade on October 25, 2012, 09:27:04 PM

Title: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on October 25, 2012, 09:27:04 PM
1) I saw my first centerline rumble strip in Indiana on SR 26 near Kokomo. I know the contract lettings had one for US 231, but the first bids were rejected.

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FSR26RumbleStrips.jpg&hash=f12236d17135b7eb9da8a4f99a33fd9768326272)


2) News article: INDOT Nears Construction Season End (http://www.wibc.com/news/Story.aspx?ID=1792820)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on October 27, 2012, 10:58:27 PM
I was in South Bend, Mishawaka, and Elkhart today househunting for my daughter. In addition to seeing the normal projects like US 31, I went down Elkhart County CR 17 on the way home. I'm familiar with the northern part, but I was a bit surprised to see the southern part which is an expressway from at least US 33 (maybe US 20) south past SR 119 to CR 58. Also of interest, it goes from expressway to a narrow dirt road at CR 58. I've seen this out west, but not in Indiana.

This made me think of the phenomena here where non-intercity state roads in Indiana are dwindling, but locally maintained expressways or freeways are being built. These are the ones I am aware of:
- Elkhart CR 17 - expressway serves as eastern bypass of Elkhart and western bypass of Goshen
- Keystone Pkwy - old SR 431 in Carmel where access is now fully controlled from 96th Street up to US 31
- University Pkwy - expressway that serves as a western bypass of Evansville
- Ronald Reagan Pkwy - still being built in Hendricks County west of Indianapolis

Shorter versions are:
- 146th Street/Campus Pkwy in Noblesville and Fishers
- Airport Expressway in Fort Wayne

A future one will probably be Mt. Comfort Rd. in Hancock County/Olio Rd. in Hamilton County which will serve as a eastern beltway of Indy.

Normally, one would think these would all be state routes.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 29, 2012, 08:11:34 AM
Quote from: mukade on October 27, 2012, 10:58:27 PM
I was in South Bend, Mishawaka, and Elkhart today househunting for my daughter. In addition to seeing the normal projects like US 31, I went down Elkhart County CR 17 on the way home. I'm familiar with the northern part, but I was a bit surprised to see the southern part which is an expressway from at least US 33 (maybe US 20) south past SR 119 to CR 58. Also of interest, it goes from expressway to a narrow dirt road at CR 58. I've seen this out west, but not in Indiana.

That's CR 38, not 58.  Elkhart County has plans to extend the expressway from CR 38 down to US 6 but is not actively working on funding the project at this time.  (Kosciusko County has also discussed extending the road as far south as US 30.)  The next item on the list is to upgrade CR 38 from CR 17 to US 33, which would essentially complete a Western bypass of Goshen.

Between the Elkhart CR 17 project, the US 31 project, and the IN 331/Capital Ave project, north-south travel in St Joseph/Elkhart counties is about to get much easier.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on October 29, 2012, 06:54:38 PM
Yes, CR 38, not CR 58. Upgrading CR 38 would be great as going through Goshen is vey slow and painful. It would be amazing to see CR 17/CR 200W upgraded to expressway to US 30, but I doubt it would be justified. They definitely need some sort of interchange on CR 17 at US 33, though.

Similar to these locally-controlled expressways, INDOT is building two new ones now: SR 331 in Mishawaka and US 231 in West Lafayette. Both of these will greatly improve traffic in their areas. Maybe someday there will also be the US 231 Jasper bypass, but NW Indiana and Indianapolis areas are the ones that really need more such highways.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on November 11, 2012, 07:01:40 AM
The US 231 Lafayette bypass (which will also carry US 52) seems to be coming along nicely. The majority of the road is paved with only the hill from River Rd. to the airport remaining as a significant gap. Where the road meets existing US 52, they have yet to begin the intersection, but you can see the new road almost reaching. Yesterday, they were paving the SR 26 intersection just west of Purdue University.

I haven't heard when this is supposed to open, but I doubt that it will be this year.

This bypass is a much needed improvement, but I still think Lafayette needs another good east-west road. They are still finishing the westbound reconstruction of Sagamore Parkway (currently US 52) so both directions temporarily use the eastbound lanes. The eastbound traffic backup going into the construction area was over a mile yesterday.
Title: New I-69 rest area opened Thursday
Post by: mukade on November 15, 2012, 06:09:35 PM
The new rest area on I-69 near Auburn opened and another one near Markle on I-69 closed.

New I-69 rest area opened Thursday (http://www.wane.com/dpp/traffic/new-i-69-rest-area-to-open-thursday) (WANE)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on November 30, 2012, 06:47:21 AM
Here is an update on the US 231 West Lafayette bypass from JCOnline.

U.S. 231 project slows for winter (http://www.jconline.com/article/20121125/NEWS/311250034/U-S-231-constructions-slows-for-winter)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tvketchum on December 01, 2012, 10:47:39 AM
Another section of Ronald Reagan Parkway to open-

http://www.indystar.com/article/20121130/NEWS/212010319/Finally-Indiana-parkway-offers-link-from-70-U-S-36?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|Indianapolis News

Now, if INDOT would swap SR 267 for the RRP, it could be finished sooner, and take some load off of a two lane through Plainfield, where it has to zig zag, and Brownsburg.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 01, 2012, 11:41:09 AM
I saw the picture in the Star of the bridge this morning, am I to assume that it is four lanes south all the way to Plainfield then? On a similar note, I noticed driving out to Brownsburg for Thanksgiving last week that Exit 68 on I-74 is now the Clermont/Brownsburg exit, with no menton of the road's name execpt for a sign at the overpass for the RRP at the exit. Any ideas on why that was done?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tvketchum on December 02, 2012, 11:20:26 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 01, 2012, 11:41:09 AM
I saw the picture in the Star of the bridge this morning, am I to assume that it is four lanes south all the way to Plainfield then? On a similar note, I noticed driving out to Brownsburg for Thanksgiving last week that Exit 68 on I-74 is now the Clermont/Brownsburg exit, with no menton of the road's name execpt for a sign at the overpass for the RRP at the exit. Any ideas on why that was done?

I believe it is due to the fact that Ronald Reagan Parkway does not yet connect to the segment at I 74. That is yet to be built, and will likely be bridged over the CSX line which parallels US 136.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 04, 2012, 08:34:43 AM
That's interesting, I've read that SR 120 was supposed to use CR 17 down to US 20.  I wonder if INDOT will ever swap some its routes for these, the new ring around Indy would make sense to be all state routes. Plus they would all get done faster. 
Title: Indiana highways to get new look with diverging diamond interchanges
Post by: mukade on January 20, 2013, 08:24:49 AM
Quote
As drivers are finally learning to navigate roundabouts, the state is poised to cross-up the motoring public again with a new highway ramp design that flips traffic to the opposite sides of the road...

Indiana highways to get new look with diverging diamond interchanges (http://www.indystar.com/article/20130119/NEWS/301190338/Indiana-highways-get-new-look-diverging-diamond-interchanges) (Indy Star)

In addition to the two listed, if I remember correctly, another DDI is planned along the new I-265 section at will feed the Louisville east end bridge (I think a rebuild at SR 62). As for the one planned at SR 1 (Dupont Rd.) in Fort Wayne, because the new interchange at Union Chapel Road is now open, I was under the impression construction would begin this spring.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 28, 2013, 10:16:20 AM
Quote from: mukade on October 25, 2012, 09:27:04 PM
1) I saw my first centerline rumble strip in Indiana on SR 26 near Kokomo. I know the contract lettings had one for US 231, but the first bids were rejected.

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FSR26RumbleStrips.jpg&hash=f12236d17135b7eb9da8a4f99a33fd9768326272)


2) News article: INDOT Nears Construction Season End (http://www.wibc.com/news/Story.aspx?ID=1792820)


I've seen these on SR 38 east of SR 39
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefro on February 16, 2013, 05:16:06 AM
http://indianapublicmedia.org/news/house-republicans-restore-k12-funding-45012/

The new Indiana GOP House budget has $250 million more per year in road/bridge funding.  Obviously they still have to neogtiate with Governor Pence (who wants his 10% State Income Tax cut (http://www.indystar.com/article/20130215/NEWS05/302150021/Indiana-House-budget-boosts-education-roads-funding)), and the also GOP-controlled Senate.  Not going to be quite as much as they were getting from Major Moves, but it should be enough to fund well-needed projects out there.

QuoteTransportation Funding

The House Republican budget proposal contains what Brown calls one of the strongest, sustainable, long-term investments in infrastructure funding he's seen in his legislative career.


Funding for Indiana's roads and bridges has been a source of concern after the state's Major Moves dollars were tapped out by various projects, notably Interstate-69.

House Speaker Brian Bosma says he has heard from several of Indiana's major corporations worried about the condition of Indiana's roads.

"The phrase "˜Our infrastructure is crumbling' has come up more than once and I've noticed it myself just driving on the highway. So we're going to have to invest here in a strong fashion,"  he says.

Proposals in the House GOP budget would permanently increase road and bridge funding by $250 million a year.  Brown says that is done, in part, by ending diversions of the gas tax that help fund the Bureau of Motor Vehicles and State Police.

"If you have a dedicated tax, it should go for the dedicated purpose. 18.8 cents of gas tax should go for roads and bridges, shouldn't it?"  Brown says.

The House GOP budget also allocates 20 percent of the state sales tax on gasoline for infrastructure. Brown says the money is not targeted to specific projects, such the completion of I-69.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on June 17, 2013, 01:56:16 AM
Since this appears to be the miscellenous page for Indiana projects, I'll put this here. Looking at very recent signage plans I saw some things with the upcoming construction project at the interchange with I-465 and I-65 on the south side of Indianapolis, the second component of the Operation Indy Commute project (the other being work on I-69 on the northeast side.) The project features a new two-lane flyover ramp for WB 465 to SB 65 traffic and a widened ramp for NB 65 to EB 465 traffic. These traffic movements currently feature a heavy load of traffic that the original interchange wasn't built for (as the interchange was designed best for traffic moving into Downtown Indianapolis and back to the south side, not from the 465 loop. The project also adds auxilary lanes for I-465 from the interchange east to Emerson Avenue and on I-65 south from the interchange to Southport Road, effectively making both eight lanes in width. Being a local of the south side and one who travels through here every day this project is of interest for me, but it is one of the more troublesome chokepoints of Indy's freeway system so the project is needed. More info can be found at the website: http://www.in.gov/indot/3072.htm

Anyway, the signage plans do show a couple of changes with what is currently there, all button-copy that will be going away sadly. First, Peoria and Cincinnati appear as control cities for the loop as was recently redone at the I-70 interchange on the westside. And second, the northbound I-65 approach to the I-465 ramps will feature what I think is the first "one arrow per lane" signage in the state, or the first I know of. Three arrows pointing up will direct 65 traffic toward Indianapolis while another arrow curves up for the ramp for I-465 westbound traffic. Eastbound I-465 traffic, which gets two lanes interestingly gets its own sign and is not a part of the aforementioned sign.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 17, 2013, 07:36:52 AM
I use the NB-->EB and WB-->SB movements there a lot so yes, it is greatly needed but boy will it be a pain while under construction. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: hbelkins on June 17, 2013, 12:09:13 PM
I never understood why Peoria is the control city for I-74 westbound. I'd think Champaign/Urbana (intersection of I-57 and I-72) or Bloomington/Normal (intersection of I-55 and I-39) would be more appropriate, since there is no major Interstate highway intersection at Peoria and both the above examples are decent-sized cities.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 27, 2013, 12:27:55 PM
In Mishawaka, the SR 331 railroad underpass just south of SR 933 is opening today. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 17, 2013, 11:46:41 AM
http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/local/article_53f6d764-068e-11e3-98c2-0019bb30f31a.html

QuoteMISHAWAKA
Work began this week on a new road that will link Capital Avenue and Fir Road, giving access to 240 acres of vacant land where city officials hope to see development.
Mayor Dave Wood foresees that the three-quarters of a mile road will feel like Edison Lakes Parkway, with lighting, landscaping and a multi-use trail for walking or biking alongside the new road.
It will hook up to Capital right at the Indiana Toll Road interchange, then link to Fir Road at Grande Vista Drive.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ShawnP on August 17, 2013, 04:12:17 PM
Anyone know when the tolls went off on the Bradenburg-Corydon Bridge on Indiana 135? What were the toll rates? I know they opened it in the 60's.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NE2 on August 17, 2013, 06:24:05 PM
1992:
http://harrisoncountyhistory.com/timeline.html
http://www.lawserver.com/law/state/indiana/in-code/indiana_code_8-16-1-28
http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=JLdJAAAAIBAJ&sjid=fxANAAAAIBAJ&pg=4029,4043212
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 29, 2013, 02:15:31 PM
A couple of notes from Northwest Indiana:

Just at the separation point for traffic transitioning from I-65 North to I-80/94 west in Gary, a yellow diamond sign accompanied with a flashing yellow light warns semi-truck drivers of a potential tipping hazard as they take the curve under I-65. There have been numerous incidents of trucks coming into the curve too fast and tipping over for the last year.

Also, a new brown guidance sign has been placed on I-80/94 eastbound, a mile before the Ripley Street interchange. The purpose is to let drivers know which exits to take for the frequently visited destinations of the Indiana Dunes. For West Beach, use exit 15B (Indiana 51 north to US 20); for the Portage Lakefront, use exit 19 (Indiana 249); and for the Indiana Dunes Visitor Center, use exit 26B (Indiana 49 north).

In Hammond, the Nine Span Bridge Project in Hammond is moving as scheduled. Beams are being put in place, and pouring should begin later in September. The project should be finished in time for the Holidays.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on August 29, 2013, 05:57:00 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 17, 2013, 12:09:13 PM
I never understood why Peoria is the control city for I-74 westbound. I'd think Champaign/Urbana (intersection of I-57 and I-72) or Bloomington/Normal (intersection of I-55 and I-39) would be more appropriate, since there is no major Interstate highway intersection at Peoria and both the above examples are decent-sized cities.

Probably because back when control cities were being decided, Blormal and Chambana weren't as big as Peoria.  From Wikipedia

* Population of Peoria in 1950:  111,856
* Population of Peoria in 1960:  103,162 (though it's up to 126,963 in 1970)

* Population of Bloomington in 1950:  34,163
* Population of Bloomington in 1960:  36,274
* Population of Normal in 1950:  9,772
* Population of Normal in 1960:  13,357

* Population of Champaign in 1950:  39,563
* Population of Champaign in 1960:  49,583
* Population of Urbana is unfortunately not available for most years, but the 2010 population was 41,250

Also back in the early days both areas would not have been as important of junctions since neither I-72 nor I-39 were part of the original interstate plans; I-57 and I-55 are kind of double back routes in a sense that long distance interstate traffic (such as motorist going from Indianapolis to Chicago and beyond) would not change to those other interstates.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Captain Jack on September 12, 2013, 01:54:26 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 17, 2013, 12:09:13 PM
I never understood why Peoria is the control city for I-74 westbound. I'd think Champaign/Urbana (intersection of I-57 and I-72) or Bloomington/Normal (intersection of I-55 and I-39) would be more appropriate, since there is no major Interstate highway intersection at Peoria and both the above examples are decent-sized cities.

Rarely, do you see cities under 100,000 listed as control cities. The metropolitan Peoria area, with Pekin, is somewhat larger than both Blormal and Chambana. Also, when an interstate actually goes into the heart of a city, it is usually chosen as a control city. 74 goes right through the heart of Peoria, where it skirts both Blormal and Chambana. If these cities were to be used as control cities on 74, then places like Terre Haute on 70, Anderson on 69, and Bowling Green on 65 should also be used.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Indyroads on September 12, 2013, 02:03:27 AM
Quote from: Captain Jack on September 12, 2013, 01:54:26 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on June 17, 2013, 12:09:13 PM
I never understood why Peoria is the control city for I-74 westbound. I'd think Champaign/Urbana (intersection of I-57 and I-72) or Bloomington/Normal (intersection of I-55 and I-39) would be more appropriate, since there is no major Interstate highway intersection at Peoria and both the above examples are decent-sized cities.

Rarely, do you see cities under 100,000 listed as control cities. The metropolitan Peoria area, with Pekin, is somewhat larger than both Blormal and Chambana. Also, when an interstate actually goes into the heart of a city, it is usually chosen as a control city. 74 goes right through the heart of Peoria, where it skirts both Blormal and Chambana. If these cities were to be used as control cities on 74, then places like Terre Haute on 70, Anderson on 69, and Bowling Green on 65 should also be used.

Following this then should the control city for I-69 south from Indianapolis be Memphis TN since it doesn't go directly through Evansville or Paducah. It also bypasses Bloomington to the east, but that would also suffice as a control city as far as I am concerned.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Indyroads on September 12, 2013, 02:15:17 AM
Quote from: mukade on October 25, 2012, 09:27:04 PM
1) I saw my first centerline rumble strip in Indiana on SR 26 near Kokomo. I know the contract lettings had one for US 231, but the first bids were rejected.

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FSR26RumbleStrips.jpg&hash=f12236d17135b7eb9da8a4f99a33fd9768326272)


2) News article: INDOT Nears Construction Season End (http://www.wibc.com/news/Story.aspx?ID=1792820)

The centerline rumblestrip is a good idea. also the use of sunken markers placed into recessed pockets in the roadway could be used to prevent slowplows from removing them prematurely, similar to snowprone roads in the Sierras.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Brandon on September 12, 2013, 03:07:28 PM
Quote from: Indyroads on September 12, 2013, 02:15:17 AM
The centerline rumblestrip is a good idea. also the use of sunken markers placed into recessed pockets in the roadway could be used to prevent slowplows from removing them prematurely, similar to snowprone roads in the Sierras.

And similar to neighboring Illinois.  Illinois also uses the recessed reflectors.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Indyroads on September 12, 2013, 06:43:24 PM
Quote from: Brandon on September 12, 2013, 03:07:28 PM
Quote from: Indyroads on September 12, 2013, 02:15:17 AM
The centerline rumblestrip is a good idea. also the use of sunken markers placed into recessed pockets in the roadway could be used to prevent slowplows from removing them prematurely, similar to snowprone roads in the Sierras.
And similar to neighboring Illinois.  Illinois also uses the recessed reflectors.

http://minnesota.publicradio.org/display/web/2009/09/13/highway-safety
Another idea like for the reflectors is to have pavement markings recessed below the roadway surface as well. This can help avoid the snowplow wear and tear as well as longevity of the road markings.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: hbelkins on September 12, 2013, 10:23:24 PM
Quote from: Captain Jack on September 12, 2013, 01:54:26 AM
Rarely, do you see cities under 100,000 listed as control cities.

Wytheville says hello. As do Bluefield, Beckley, Parkersburg, Clarksburg, Lewisburg and Winchester.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: amroad17 on September 13, 2013, 05:47:43 PM
And Ashland, Carlisle, Jamestown, Elmira, Binghamton, and any city along I-80 in Pennsylvania.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Brandon on September 13, 2013, 06:18:25 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on September 12, 2013, 10:23:24 PM
Quote from: Captain Jack on September 12, 2013, 01:54:26 AM
Rarely, do you see cities under 100,000 listed as control cities.

Wytheville says hello. As do Bluefield, Beckley, Parkersburg, Clarksburg, Lewisburg and Winchester.

Green Bay also says hello.  As do Cheyenne, Casper, Jacksonville (IL), Quincy, Hannibal, Decatur, and DeKalb (IL).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Alps on September 14, 2013, 12:51:40 AM
Quote from: Brandon on September 13, 2013, 06:18:25 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on September 12, 2013, 10:23:24 PM
Quote from: Captain Jack on September 12, 2013, 01:54:26 AM
Rarely, do you see cities under 100,000 listed as control cities.

Wytheville says hello. As do Bluefield, Beckley, Parkersburg, Clarksburg, Lewisburg and Winchester.

Green Bay also says hello.  As do Cheyenne, Casper, Jacksonville (IL), Quincy, Hannibal, Decatur, and DeKalb (IL).
Rather than continue this thread, let's just say that 100,000 is by no means a defining criterion, and continue with Indiana.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mgk920 on September 17, 2013, 03:14:43 PM
Quote from: Brandon on September 13, 2013, 06:18:25 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on September 12, 2013, 10:23:24 PM
Quote from: Captain Jack on September 12, 2013, 01:54:26 AM
Rarely, do you see cities under 100,000 listed as control cities.

Wytheville says hello. As do Bluefield, Beckley, Parkersburg, Clarksburg, Lewisburg and Winchester.

Green Bay also says hello.  As do Cheyenne, Casper, Jacksonville (IL), Quincy, Hannibal, Decatur, and DeKalb (IL).

Actually, the USCensus guys found 104,057 people living in Green Bay in 2010.

OTOH, the control for US(I)-41 on the freeways in metro Milwaukee is 'Fond du Lac' (2010 USCensus - 43,021).

:nod:

Mike
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: amroad17 on September 18, 2013, 04:31:09 PM
Once US 41 becomes I-41, the control city may change to Green Bay (it should).

Anyway, enough about Wisconsin.  Any information on Indiana projects?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 18, 2013, 05:22:31 PM
Quote from: amroad17 on September 18, 2013, 04:31:09 PM
Once US 41 becomes I-41, the control city may change to Green Bay (it should).

Anyway, enough about Wisconsin.  Any information on Indiana projects?

US 31 in Kokomo will have traffic shifted onto the new SR 931 bridge soon, SR 25 is to be opened completely soon, and US 31 in hamilton county will have traffic shifted onto the new side. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on September 18, 2013, 09:35:59 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 18, 2013, 05:22:31 PM
US 31 in Kokomo will have traffic shifted onto the new SR 931 bridge soon, SR 25 is to be opened completely soon, and US 31 in hamilton county will have traffic shifted onto the new side. 

- US 31 Kokomo traffic was shifted a few days ago. The new highway is supposed to open November 30.
- SR 25 is supposed to open in late October
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 19, 2013, 07:34:11 AM
Quote from: mukade on September 18, 2013, 09:35:59 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 18, 2013, 05:22:31 PM
US 31 in Kokomo will have traffic shifted onto the new SR 931 bridge soon, SR 25 is to be opened completely soon, and US 31 in hamilton county will have traffic shifted onto the new side. 

- US 31 Kokomo traffic was shifted a few days ago. The new highway is supposed to open November 30.
- SR 25 is supposed to open in late October


That's the first time I've heard a date on the Kokomo opening.  I just happen to be going up 31 on the 27th and then back on the 1st, so I guess half the trip on the new road is better than nothing.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 19, 2013, 03:31:24 PM
Personally, I'm planning a trip that would include the new West Lafayette bypass, all of SR 25 and the Kokomo Bypass all on one day. I'm guessing it will be sometime in December.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Indyroads on September 19, 2013, 03:50:37 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 19, 2013, 07:34:11 AM
Quote from: mukade on September 18, 2013, 09:35:59 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 18, 2013, 05:22:31 PM
US 31 in Kokomo will have traffic shifted onto the new SR 931 bridge soon, SR 25 is to be opened completely soon, and US 31 in hamilton county will have traffic shifted onto the new side. 

- US 31 Kokomo traffic was shifted a few days ago. The new highway is supposed to open November 30.
- SR 25 is supposed to open in late October


That's the first time I've heard a date on the Kokomo opening.  I just happen to be going up 31 on the 27th and then back on the 1st, so I guess half the trip on the new road is better than nothing.

Personally i don't understand why Indot isn't relinquishing the US-31 segment that is being resigned as SR-931. It seems that if they are removing a perfectly good route (US-52) and rerouting that through a narrow 2 lane road bypassing the 4 lane expressway it was on before then why have SR-931. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 19, 2013, 04:04:55 PM
Quote from: Indyroads on September 19, 2013, 03:50:37 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 19, 2013, 07:34:11 AM
Quote from: mukade on September 18, 2013, 09:35:59 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 18, 2013, 05:22:31 PM
US 31 in Kokomo will have traffic shifted onto the new SR 931 bridge soon, SR 25 is to be opened completely soon, and US 31 in hamilton county will have traffic shifted onto the new side. 

- US 31 Kokomo traffic was shifted a few days ago. The new highway is supposed to open November 30.
- SR 25 is supposed to open in late October


That's the first time I've heard a date on the Kokomo opening.  I just happen to be going up 31 on the 27th and then back on the 1st, so I guess half the trip on the new road is better than nothing.

Personally i don't understand why Indot isn't relinquishing the US-31 segment that is being resigned as SR-931. It seems that if they are removing a perfectly good route (US-52) and rerouting that through a narrow 2 lane road bypassing the 4 lane expressway it was on before then why have SR-931.
931 will be let go soon, they just haven't inked out the terms of the deal, so until both sides agree, it will remain sr 931.  (same reason why right now there are 2 us 231s in WLaff)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on September 19, 2013, 09:54:57 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 19, 2013, 03:31:24 PM
Personally, I'm planning a trip that would include the new West Lafayette bypass, all of SR 25 and the Kokomo Bypass all on one day. I'm guessing it will be sometime in December.

That sounds like a good idea.  Although I personally might do it the other way as an ass-backwards way of getting to Lafayette.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on September 19, 2013, 10:13:58 PM
Kokomo wants something more like Carmel got for SR 431 while INDOT wants something more like the rebuilding of Sagamore Pkwy in Lafayette. Nothing like what was done in Carmel will happen so just like with SR 933, it is all up to the local government agencies.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 27, 2013, 01:02:45 AM
I heard that SR 130 has been handed over to Valpo, what are the official ends of this highway now?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 27, 2013, 02:36:27 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 27, 2013, 01:02:45 AM
I heard that SR 130 has been handed over to Valpo, what are the official ends of this highway now?

It was said the north end would remain at US 6 in Hobart. When the transfer goes down, the south end will be at Indiana 149.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: catch22 on October 16, 2013, 09:54:32 AM
According to this article from the Ft. Wayne Journal-Gazette, US-24 is being rerouted to I-69/I-469 on the north side of Ft. Wayne, instead of the south side.

http://www.journalgazette.net/article/20131015/LOCAL16/131019629
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Alex on October 16, 2013, 01:43:09 PM
Quote from: catch22 on October 16, 2013, 09:54:32 AM
According to this article from the Ft. Wayne Journal-Gazette, US-24 is being rerouted to I-69/I-469 on the north side of Ft. Wayne, instead of the south side.

http://www.journalgazette.net/article/20131015/LOCAL16/131019629

Question is are they just adding shields or are they also augmenting guide signs. It could mean the end of those US 27 markers for I69 at the north end of I469.

(https://www.aaroads.com/midwest/indiana469/i-469_wb_exit_031_05.jpg)

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 16, 2013, 04:18:28 PM
That original idea was stupid from the beginning, I don't know why they didn't try to route 24 on lafayette center road when they upgraded it, this new routing now at least makes sense.  US 27 still goes through the heart of ft wayne right?  The above post is inaccurate saying that us 27 follows 69 (INDOTs error) I always thought 27 ended at Lima road and 69 interchange. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Brandon on October 16, 2013, 04:32:48 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 16, 2013, 04:18:28 PM
That original idea was stupid from the beginning, I don't know why they didn't try to route 24 on lafayette center road when they upgraded it, this new routing now at least makes sense.  US 27 still goes through the heart of ft wayne right?  The above post is inaccurate saying that us 27 follows 69 (INDOTs error) I always thought 27 ended at Lima road and 69 interchange. 

US-27 went north into Michigan until 2001.  This sign predates the truncation of US-27 to Fort Wayne.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 16, 2013, 04:38:44 PM
Quote from: Brandon on October 16, 2013, 04:32:48 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 16, 2013, 04:18:28 PM
That original idea was stupid from the beginning, I don't know why they didn't try to route 24 on lafayette center road when they upgraded it, this new routing now at least makes sense.  US 27 still goes through the heart of ft wayne right?  The above post is inaccurate saying that us 27 follows 69 (INDOTs error) I always thought 27 ended at Lima road and 69 interchange. 

US-27 went north into Michigan until 2001.  This sign predates the truncation of US-27 to Fort Wayne.

That's what I thought, surprising a sign like that is still up there after all these years.  There's still a lone SR 37 sign on the southside on Madison Ave.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: agentsteel53 on October 16, 2013, 05:18:42 PM
I remember in 2006 finding the truncated north end of US-27... and just to the north, past the intersection, there was a US-27 north reassurance assembly!

that was the only one I found in Indiana, but I did not drive all of former 27, just up to US-6.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Alps on October 17, 2013, 08:59:25 PM
Quote from: catch22 on October 16, 2013, 09:54:32 AM
According to this article from the Ft. Wayne Journal-Gazette, US-24 is being rerouted to I-69/I-469 on the north side of Ft. Wayne, instead of the south side.

http://www.journalgazette.net/article/20131015/LOCAL16/131019629

This still makes no sense. All 24 has to do is follow Lafayette Center Road - trade with the county. I know, I brought it up before, and there's that railroad grade crossing. I'll still mention it.

Other peeves: No more wrong-way concurrency. Needing to change all my pages around.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NE2 on October 17, 2013, 09:14:39 PM
Hell, cutting down to US 224 is shorter than the rerouting (which is shorter than the old route, and of course Lafayette Center is shortest). The original through-city route is only one mile shorter than Lafayette Center.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on October 29, 2013, 11:05:45 PM
The ramp from the Westbound Indiana Toll Road to I-80/94 in Lake Station is closed once again, and it looks like this closure is for the long haul.

According to the Indiana Toll Road website, the ramp is set to be replaced (the timing of the closure had to be done in advance of the excess traffic due to happen in a few weeks) and won't be reopened until Spring 2015. In the meantime, traffic looking to jump to the Borman will have to use I-65, with those looking to access State Road 51 needing to double back on I-80/94 east.

There will be a considerable increase in traffic at the I-65 ramp, so be ready for it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 30, 2013, 12:32:56 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on October 29, 2013, 11:05:45 PM
The ramp from the Westbound Indiana Toll Road to I-80/94 in Lake Station is closed once again, and it looks like this closure is for the long haul.

According to the Indiana Toll Road website, the ramp is set to be replaced (the timing of the closure had to be done in advance of the excess traffic due to happen in a few weeks) and won't be reopened until Spring 2015. In the meantime, traffic looking to jump to the Borman will have to use I-65, with those looking to access State Road 51 needing to double back on I-80/94 east.

There will be a considerable increase in traffic at the I-65 ramp, so be ready for it.

Why does it take so long just to rebuild one ramp?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NE2 on October 30, 2013, 06:44:02 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 30, 2013, 12:32:56 AM
Why does it take so long just to rebuild one ramp?
Privatization.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Brandon on October 30, 2013, 07:55:44 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 30, 2013, 12:32:56 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on October 29, 2013, 11:05:45 PM
The ramp from the Westbound Indiana Toll Road to I-80/94 in Lake Station is closed once again, and it looks like this closure is for the long haul.

According to the Indiana Toll Road website, the ramp is set to be replaced (the timing of the closure had to be done in advance of the excess traffic due to happen in a few weeks) and won't be reopened until Spring 2015. In the meantime, traffic looking to jump to the Borman will have to use I-65, with those looking to access State Road 51 needing to double back on I-80/94 east.

There will be a considerable increase in traffic at the I-65 ramp, so be ready for it.

Why does it take so long just to rebuild one ramp?

It's a very old, decrepit flyover.  My guess is that it will have to be taken down to ground level and then replaced in its entirety.

In the meantime, you can also get off at the Portage Exit on the Toll Road (Exit 23) and get on I-94 just a couple of miles north (Exit 19, IN-249).  It's the same road.

Quote from: NE2 on October 30, 2013, 06:44:02 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 30, 2013, 12:32:56 AM
Why does it take so long just to rebuild one ramp?
Privatization.

And that explains why other public projects take so long?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mgk920 on October 30, 2013, 10:21:11 AM
What happened to the major rebuild of that interchange that was being designed in the late 1990s/early doubleaughts?

:hmmm:

Mike
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Brandon on October 30, 2013, 12:35:49 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on October 30, 2013, 10:21:11 AM
What happened to the major rebuild of that interchange that was being designed in the late 1990s/early doubleaughts?

:hmmm:

Mike

Apparently they all came to nothing.  I have no idea why they never came to fruition, even after the lease of the Toll Road and the rebuilding of the Borman.  Anyone from Indiana have any idea why?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Joe The Dragon on October 30, 2013, 08:11:49 PM
Quote from: Brandon on October 30, 2013, 12:35:49 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on October 30, 2013, 10:21:11 AM
What happened to the major rebuild of that interchange that was being designed in the late 1990s/early doubleaughts?

:hmmm:

Mike

Apparently they all came to nothing.  I have no idea why they never came to fruition, even after the lease of the Toll Road and the rebuilding of the Borman.  Anyone from Indiana have any idea why?

they don't want to rework the tolls?

The rest area is in the way?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on October 30, 2013, 09:24:03 PM
Quote from: Joe The Dragon on October 30, 2013, 08:11:49 PMthey don't want to rework the tolls?

The rest area is in the way?

There was a concept map that took the service areas in consideration during reconstruction, so they definitely kept it in mind. It just seems to me that money was an issue. Now that the Toll Road is out of INDOT's hands, it seems it's more difficult to pull off.

As for the length of time to rebuild the ramp, keep in mind the closure has started, not necessarily the work. Also, as stated, I'm sure the closure was done well in advance not just because of the amount of truck traffic that uses that ramp, but also the potential increase of traffic during the upcoming travel season. I'm sure full-blown work won't start until this spring.

Finally, as Brandon said, with the height of the ramp (it is the highest point in the tri-stack flyover system), it would require a few extra steps to take down and rebuild the bridge.

I'm surprised that they kept the decision to rebuild the ramp as "under the radar" as they did.
Title: Historic Byway Michigan Road: New signs dot roads in many parts of the state
Post by: mukade on October 30, 2013, 09:59:04 PM
Quote
New road signs have been put up in Ripley County and throughout the state recognizing a historic byway, Michigan Road. It's Indiana's newest state Byway. The signs are along US 421, not Michigan Road...

Historic Byway Michigan Road: New signs dot roads in many parts of the state (http://www.indianaeconomicdigest.com/main.asp?FromHome=1&TypeID=1&ArticleID=71891&SectionID=31&SubSectionID=226) (Indiana Economic Digest)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on October 30, 2013, 11:11:14 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on October 30, 2013, 09:24:03 PM
Quote from: Joe The Dragon on October 30, 2013, 08:11:49 PMthey don't want to rework the tolls?

The rest area is in the way?

There was a concept map that took the service areas in consideration during reconstruction, so they definitely kept it in mind. It just seems to me that money was an issue. Now that the Toll Road is out of INDOT's hands, it seems it's more difficult to pull off.

As for the length of time to rebuild the ramp, keep in mind the closure has started, not necessarily the work. Also, as stated, I'm sure the closure was done well in advance not just because of the amount of truck traffic that uses that ramp, but also the potential increase of traffic during the upcoming travel season. I'm sure full-blown work won't start until this spring.

Finally, as Brandon said, with the height of the ramp (it is the highest point in the tri-stack flyover system), it would require a few extra steps to take down and rebuild the bridge.

I'm surprised that they kept the decision to rebuild the ramp as "under the radar" as they did.

Keep in mind that this means the main line I-80 is down for that entire period, since this ramp carries that interstate from the ITR to the Borman. That's a very long time to have it down, but it's the price we pay for privatization.

I'm not sure what Joe meant about "reworking the tolls." Traffic on the main carriageway of the ITR hits a toll barrier shortly before this ramp, so there is no toll charged on the ramp being closed. I'm not clear though on whether the toll road managers benefit financially by rerouting the I-80 traffic an extra 8 miles to the west to reach the I-65 exit. Does anyone know if a toll is charged on that exit ramp (ITR WB to I-65 SB)?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Joe The Dragon on October 30, 2013, 11:25:01 PM
I think the old plan have all of the ramps moved?? and that may ended up with have to build new tolls well maybe they did want to keep part both some of old ramps and build new ones?


also to give traffic from the sky way / in toll road high speed ramps / better ramps to 94 going up to MI may need long lanes from the old toll area to the new ramps or even a new toll area.

also IN toll road and skyway needs gate free high speed tolling.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mobilene on October 31, 2013, 02:45:21 PM
Quote from: mukade on October 30, 2013, 09:59:04 PM
Quote
New road signs have been put up in Ripley County and throughout the state recognizing a historic byway, Michigan Road. It's Indiana's newest state Byway. The signs are along US 421, not Michigan Road...

Historic Byway Michigan Road: New signs dot roads in many parts of the state (http://www.indianaeconomicdigest.com/main.asp?FromHome=1&TypeID=1&ArticleID=71891&SectionID=31&SubSectionID=226) (Indiana Economic Digest)

Thanks for sharing that. I'm past President and current VP of the Historic Michigan Road Association, which is working with INDOT and local authorities to get these signs placed. 

www.historicmichiganroad.org.

-Jim
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NE2 on October 31, 2013, 02:56:40 PM
QuoteThe signs are along US 421, not Michigan Road.
QuoteThe county highway department installed the signs on Old Michigan Road as the alternate route.
Huh? So are signs on (Old) Michigan Road or not?

Also, what happens to signs where US 421 joins I-74?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mgk920 on October 31, 2013, 03:40:27 PM
Quote from: Joe The Dragon on October 30, 2013, 11:25:01 PM
I think the old plan have all of the ramps moved?? and that may ended up with have to build new tolls well maybe they did want to keep part both some of old ramps and build new ones?


also to give traffic from the sky way / in toll road high speed ramps / better ramps to 94 going up to MI may need long lanes from the old toll area to the new ramps or even a new toll area.

also IN toll road and skyway needs gate free high speed tolling.

The plan that I remember was to build an elaborate, fairly conventional-looking urban/suburban freeway-to-tollway interchange with direct free-flowing ramps in all directions, with tollgates/gantries to be installed on all of the appropriate ramps (the west-pointing ones as they connect with the Toll Road mainline).  The ramps connecting to the service plazas would be woven into it.

As things stand now, the Toll Road's mainline 'ticket' tollgate is already far enough east of there so as to not be a factor in its design.

Mike
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on October 31, 2013, 04:24:15 PM
To answer theline, there is no toll for the Westbound Toll Road to Southbound I-65 ramp.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on October 31, 2013, 10:17:13 PM
Thanks navigator. If I ever took that ramp from ITR WB to I-65 SB, it's been so long that I forgot if there was a toll.

mgk, you expressed in a much clearer way what I was trying to say about toll gates not being a factor in the ITR/Borman interchange. When the mainline barrier was placed just east of that interchange years ago, the toll booths at that interchange were removed.

Joe is right that gate-free tolling would be a great improvement, but it may be years away. The concessionaire has to figure the ROI on an expensive project, and their calculation is never to going to consider driver convenience, unless inconvenience drives enough users away from the road.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Joe The Dragon on October 31, 2013, 10:20:30 PM
can some one post the old plan??

My idea may be some like the old one.

https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=10031.msg236493#msg236493
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Joe The Dragon on October 31, 2013, 10:23:28 PM
Quote from: theline on October 31, 2013, 10:17:13 PM
Thanks navigator. If I ever took that ramp from ITR WB to I-65 SB, it's been so long that I forgot if there was a toll.

mgk, you expressed in a much clearer way what I was trying to say about toll gates not being a factor in the ITR/Borman interchange. When the mainline barrier was placed just east of that interchange years ago, the toll booths at that interchange were removed.

Joe is right that gate-free tolling would be a great improvement, but it may be years away. The concessionaire has to figure the ROI on an expensive project, and their calculation is never to going to consider driver convenience, unless inconvenience drives enough users away from the road.

how much does broken gates cost them???  The 15MPH EZ-pass / i-Zoom / I-pass lanes have gates in them and they kind of look the like the 15-30 ones in IL but with a gate deep down them. I almost took one out one day.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on October 31, 2013, 10:50:17 PM
Quote from: Joe The Dragon on October 31, 2013, 10:20:30 PM
can some one post the old plan??

My idea may be some like the old one.

https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=10031.msg236493#msg236493

This (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=7151.msg160299#msg160299) is the ramp system that was put into concept, tying into the nearby service areas. Follow the link provided.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ssummers72 on October 31, 2013, 11:01:49 PM
I did not think that was still out there (scanned by me in the early 2000's)

http://web.archive.org/web/20021220081218/http://nwindianahwys.homestead.com/i80909451newint.html

These plans predate the Daniels' administration and they were slated to be the final phasing of the I-80/94 (Borman Expressway) widening a rebuilding project. This project was completed to a point just past Clay St. in Lake Station. I am not aware of at this time whether these plans will ever be revived.

Stephen Summers
Title: Indiana Notes - US 35
Post by: mukade on November 03, 2013, 07:54:36 PM
Overshadowed by US 31, SR 25, and I-69, US 35 will have had five roadway changes in little over a year thanks to Major Moves:
- approximately one mile of new divided highway east of US 31 bypass in Kokomo (concurrent with SR 22)
- approximately 5 miles of new terrain freeway in Kokomo (concurrent with US 31)
- approximately 1.5 miles of new terrain alignment west of US 31
- approximately one mile on new terrain alignment of the Logansport south bypass (concurrent with US 24)
- approximately .5 mile of rebuilt and widened highway north of SR 25 in Logansport

All of these sections have concrete pavement, and include four new interchanges.

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS35Const-1.jpg&hash=8a911fa4b435d5dcb7741d7d20c975b6554838da)

New terrain US 35 approaching SR 931 (old US 31) north of Kokomo
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mobilene on November 06, 2013, 08:24:18 AM
Quote from: NE2 on October 31, 2013, 02:56:40 PM
Huh? So are signs on (Old) Michigan Road or not?

Also, what happens to signs where US 421 joins I-74?

Getting signs posted along the Historic Michigan Road Byway means working with state, county, and city/town officials, and each group moves at its own pace.

INDOT has actually been the most responsive group. They have overall been extremely cooperative and have been first in most places along the 270-mile byway to put up signs.

In Ripley County, "old" Michigan Road and US 421 from north of Madison to about Napoleon are both designated as the byway. INDOT got the signs up first along US 421. We're still working with Ripley County, I believe, on placing ALT signs and arrow signs pointing to the old Michigan Road alignment off US 421.  (Yes, the old alignment came first, but from a heritage tourism standpoint it is far less interesting as there isn't much on it. So we decided that US 421 will remain the primary alignment of the byway because it passes through two towns.) I imagine that the only signs on the older alignment will be at its ends, directing drivers back onto US 421.

The stretch of I-74 southeast of Indy that was built on top of the Michigan Road is officially part of the byway. We will place signs directing drivers on/off I-74 at the London Road and Acton Road exits. The only regret is that I-74 skirts the Pleasant View area and the original alignment of the road reappears there. But it is not through.

-Jim
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on November 15, 2013, 08:46:41 PM
All 4 lanes of the reconstructed SR-23 near the Notre Dame campus opened today, as that project nears completion. A couple of intersections remain partially or completely closed, as final work continues. All signals are operational, but signage is minimal for now.

This eliminates the troublesome intersection referred to locally as "five points," a name which indicates a lack of math skills. The old intersection was the crossroads for three streets, all of which extended both ways from the intersection. Wouldn't that be "six points"? Well, it's moot now.

Here's the story from WSBT television: http://www.wsbt.com/news/local/today-crews-opening-all-lanes-of-new-state-road-23-near-notre-dame/-/21046398/22992140/-/pg5ivfz/-/index.html (http://www.wsbt.com/news/local/today-crews-opening-all-lanes-of-new-state-road-23-near-notre-dame/-/21046398/22992140/-/pg5ivfz/-/index.html)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 16, 2013, 10:24:49 AM
Quote from: theline on November 15, 2013, 08:46:41 PM
All 4 lanes of the reconstructed SR-23 near the Notre Dame campus opened today, as that project nears completion. A couple of intersections remain partially or completely closed, as final work continues. All signals are operational, but signage is minimal for now.

This eliminates the troublesome intersection referred to locally as "five points," a name which indicates a lack of math skills. The old intersection was the crossroads for three streets, all of which extended both ways from the intersection. Wouldn't that be "six points"? Well, it's moot now.

Here's the story from WSBT television: http://www.wsbt.com/news/local/today-crews-opening-all-lanes-of-new-state-road-23-near-notre-dame/-/21046398/22992140/-/pg5ivfz/-/index.html (http://www.wsbt.com/news/local/today-crews-opening-all-lanes-of-new-state-road-23-near-notre-dame/-/21046398/22992140/-/pg5ivfz/-/index.html)

Five points got its name because of the five "corners" that faced Eddy Street in the intersection.  The sixth "point" was the SW corner of South Bend and Corby, and it sits back a ways from Eddy, so it didn't count. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on November 16, 2013, 06:23:01 PM
Here's an aerial from Google, taken before construction started:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi40.tinypic.com%2F29on18n.png&hash=1f688f49df5e3033d80b65326ff049e05dc221bb)

I labeled the "corners" as you describe. I'm still not getting it, maybe because I most often approached the intersection on South Bend Ave., from the NE or SW. Like I said, it's history now.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 16, 2013, 08:20:49 PM
Quote from: theline on November 16, 2013, 06:23:01 PM
Here's an aerial from Google, taken before construction started:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi40.tinypic.com%2F29on18n.png&hash=1f688f49df5e3033d80b65326ff049e05dc221bb)

I labeled the "corners" as you describe. I'm still not getting it, maybe because I most often approached the intersection on South Bend Ave., from the NE or SW. Like I said, it's history now.

Well, like you said it's too late now.  Ten years ago, you could have started a campaign for the underrepresented corner.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on December 08, 2013, 11:14:46 PM
With all the highway decommissionings in Lafayette, there is no longer any thru west to east state highway in Lafayette. If it weren't for a short gap between the end of SR 38 and US 52, there would, but still, it is a strange situation - especially for an area that has a major state university. I mapped state roads in Lafayette in Google Maps here (https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=213249388344738481670.0004ed11cfee4b900ed55&msa=0&ll=40.433882,-86.881256&spn=0.157577,0.338173).

Also, the Lafayette city center is also not served by a state highway any longer. Almost all county seats have a state road pretty near the courthouse.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 09, 2013, 06:15:34 AM
Quote from: mukade on December 08, 2013, 11:14:46 PM
With all the highway decommissionings in Lafayette, there is no longer any thru west to east state highway in Lafayette. If it weren't for a short gap between the end of SR 38 and US 52, there would, but still, it is a strange situation - especially for an area that has a major state university. I mapped state roads in Lafayette in Google Maps here (https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=213249388344738481670.0004ed11cfee4b900ed55&msa=0&ll=40.433882,-86.881256&spn=0.157577,0.338173).

Also, the Lafayette city center is also not served by a state highway any longer. Almost all county seats have a state road pretty near the courthouse.

I thought there was a law saying they had to do that (county seats must have a state highway) 25 and 26 were supposed to be continuous using teal with 52, but i don't know why that never actually happened.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on December 09, 2013, 06:38:46 AM
I-65, US 52, US 231, and SR 38 along with small portions of SR 25 (S) and SR 26 (E) are in the city limits of the county seat so I guess that counts.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 09, 2013, 08:38:06 AM
Counts just as much as with Bloomington, which I notice also doesn't have a state highway near its courthouse, surely a coincidence. Of course SR 37 used to travel through town along with SR 45 46, and 48. Indy would be iffy as there isn't a state or U.S. highway near its courthouse, but if interstates count than it's only a few blocks away.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 09, 2013, 11:35:24 AM
Quote from: mukade on December 09, 2013, 06:38:46 AM
I-65, US 52, US 231, and SR 38 along with small portions of SR 25 (S) and SR 26 (E) are in the city limits of the county seat so I guess that counts.

I think that's how they get away with it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefro on December 09, 2013, 01:59:33 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 09, 2013, 08:38:06 AM
Counts just as much as with Bloomington, which I notice also doesn't have a state highway near its courthouse, surely a coincidence. Of course SR 37 used to travel through town along with SR 45 46, and 48. Indy would be iffy as there isn't a state or U.S. highway near its courthouse, but if interstates count than it's only a few blocks away.

Business SR 37 still runs right by the courthouse on Walnut/College and SR 45/46 run through town and technically goes through the far east/north sides of IU's campus.  A good stretch of SR 37/future I-69 is within the city limits as well.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 09, 2013, 03:39:56 PM
Business SR 37 isn't a state highway however, it's locally maintained. And the state highways bypassing the main part of the city, yes they do travel well within city limits, makes the example similar to Lafayette's. I was merely commenting on the "courthouse" aspect of the situation. I would doubt that there are any incorporated communities in the state that are completely devoid of an INDOT-maintained highway.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefro on December 09, 2013, 04:26:01 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 09, 2013, 03:39:56 PM
Business SR 37 isn't a state highway however, it's locally maintained. And the state highways bypassing the main part of the city, yes they do travel well within city limits, makes the example similar to Lafayette's. I was merely commenting on the "courthouse" aspect of the situation. I would doubt that there are any incorporated communities in the state that are completely devoid of an INDOT-maintained highway.

Topeka, Indiana's town limits appear to be about a half-mile away from SR 5.

Grabill, IN is a couple miles away from both SR 1 & SR 37.

Both are incorporated as towns.  I'm sure there's a few more around the state.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 09, 2013, 04:41:25 PM
Quote from: thefro on December 09, 2013, 04:26:01 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 09, 2013, 03:39:56 PM
Business SR 37 isn't a state highway however, it's locally maintained. And the state highways bypassing the main part of the city, yes they do travel well within city limits, makes the example similar to Lafayette's. I was merely commenting on the "courthouse" aspect of the situation. I would doubt that there are any incorporated communities in the state that are completely devoid of an INDOT-maintained highway.

Topeka, Indiana's town limits appear to be about a half-mile away from SR 5.

Grabill, IN is a couple miles away from both SR 1 & SR 37.

Both are incorporated as towns.  I'm sure there's a few more around the state.

Neither of those are county seats.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 09, 2013, 05:35:27 PM
Okay, there are likely several communities that are devoid of state highways in their limits. Gaston in Delaware County would be another. As for county seats, the only one I can think of that "may" fit is Newport with SR 63 just outside the town, although Google Maps is showing the city limits including a little portion of that highway.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on December 09, 2013, 10:14:43 PM
The remarkable thing about Lafayette is that there is no thru east-west route there. That is a bit weird even if you support the state's strategy. Bloomington has both a N-S and E-W state road. I would expect more and more state roads migrating away from the courthouse areas of county seats in favor of bypasses.

I also would guess Lake County has to be high on INDOT's list with SR 51, SR 53, SR 55 north of US 30, SR 130, and SR 152 not fitting INDOT's idea for state roads. Also, US 12 could be paired with US 20 through both Lake and Porter Counties.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 10, 2013, 12:43:47 PM
The Nine Span Bridge on Indianapolis Boulevard in Hammond officially reopened yesterday, a few weeks ahead of schedule. The new bridge allows heavy trucks, supports four lanes of traffic, and includes sidewalks on each side. There are pictures of the old 30s-era bridge on each side for historic purposes.

From the pictures I saw, they did a very good job, and it seems they lowered the elevation of the bridge a bit.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 10, 2013, 05:28:04 PM
Quote from: mukade on December 09, 2013, 10:14:43 PM
The remarkable thing about Lafayette is that there is no thru east-west route there. That is a bit weird even if you support the state's strategy. Bloomington has both a N-S and E-W state road. I would expect more and more state roads migrating away from the courthouse areas of county seats in favor of bypasses.

I also would guess Lake County has to be high on INDOT's list with SR 51, SR 53, SR 55 north of US 30, SR 130, and SR 152 not fitting INDOT's idea for state roads. Also, US 12 could be paired with US 20 through both Lake and Porter Counties.

Being a road geek, I hope that never happens.  But I'm very surprised it hasn't happened yet though.  SR 53 is essentially worthless, as is sr 130 and 55.  US 12/20 is a good alternate to the interstate (If you're willing to drive through Gary). 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 13, 2013, 12:38:41 PM
Another portion of I-65 will see expansion in the next few years.

According to the NWI Times, the next scheduled widening will be in the Lafayette area. INDOT plans to work the stretch between Indiana 38 (exit 168) and Indiana 25 (exit 175). No extra space will be necessary, since the lanes will be installed in the median.

Bids will be sought next fall, with completion set for either 2016 or 2017.

As I said before, I like this approach to the initiative of widening I-65 from Gary to Louisville. Hit the major and intermediate cities first, then work the more lightly traveled sections.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 13, 2013, 12:56:33 PM
I understand that the Lafayette section has more traffic than the section between Lafayette and Lebanon, but by skipping over that section, at least for a while, there are going to be two choke points instead of one. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 13, 2013, 03:53:21 PM
Looking at the traffic counts according to INDOT for that stretch of highway, there's not a huge difference with traffic on either stretch. South of Lebanon, I-65 is at 65,000 and above heading to Indy. From Lebanon to SR 38 it's around 35,000 to 38,000. From SR 38 to SR 25, the proposed stretch to be widened, it's 34,000 to 40,000. And from SR 25 to SR 43 (not included in the widening,) it's 45,000, making that the busiest stretch of I-65 in Tippecanoe County. And if INDOT is indeed persuing the Gary to Indy stretch of I-65 first, it's 42,000 north of SR 2, another logical stretch to cover being from SR 2 to US 30.

Meanwhile, to the south, it's 44,000 and higher for all of I-65 north of Columbus with traffic counts over 55,000 north of Franklin. Of course I'm not saying that I-65 in Lafayette should not be widened, I'm just giving some comparisons in traffic along that stretch.

The link to the INDOT traffic map is: http://dotmaps.indot.in.gov/apps/trafficcounts/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 13, 2013, 04:09:04 PM
You certainly get no argument from me that Franklin-Columbus is the stretch of I-65 most in need if widening. 

I have to wonder if the choice of the Lafayette section is political, since it clearly isn't based on traffic counts.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Rick Powell on December 13, 2013, 04:09:23 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 13, 2013, 03:53:21 PM
And if INDOT is indeed persuing the Gary to Indy stretch of I-65 first, it's 42,000 north of SR 2, another logical stretch to cover being from SR 2 to US 30.

In NIRPC's vote yesterday, the stretch of I-65 from SR 2 to US 231 was approved, along with the Illiana Corridor, for inclusion in the NIRPC long range plan.  The stretch of I-65 from US 30 to US 231 is already in the plan, and should be a relatively inexpensive section to convert to 3-lanes in each direction; the inside shoulders were last rebuilt as a third inside lane of pavement rather than to shoulder standards, and only a new set of inside shoulders need to be added and the pavement re-striped for 3 lanes.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Brandon on December 13, 2013, 04:38:18 PM
Quote from: Rick Powell on December 13, 2013, 04:09:23 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 13, 2013, 03:53:21 PM
And if INDOT is indeed persuing the Gary to Indy stretch of I-65 first, it's 42,000 north of SR 2, another logical stretch to cover being from SR 2 to US 30.

In NIRPC's vote yesterday, the stretch of I-65 from SR 2 to US 231 was approved, along with the Illiana Corridor, for inclusion in the NIRPC long range plan.  The stretch of I-65 from US 30 to US 231 is already in the plan, and should be a relatively inexpensive section to convert to 3-lanes in each direction; the inside shoulders were last rebuilt as a third inside lane of pavement rather than to shoulder standards, and only a new set of inside shoulders need to be added and the pavement re-striped for 3 lanes.

Gee, InDOT makes it seem so easy.  Maybe IDOT could learn a thing or two them them.  :ded:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefro on December 16, 2013, 11:29:40 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 13, 2013, 04:09:04 PM
You certainly get no argument from me that Franklin-Columbus is the stretch of I-65 most in need if widening. 

I have to wonder if the choice of the Lafayette section is political, since it clearly isn't based on traffic counts.

I'm sure that Greenwood to Columbus section will be upgraded as well in the medium-term future considering Pence is from Columbus.  Obviously there's more to be gained politically in Lafayette than Columbus though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 16, 2013, 11:43:55 AM
So the inside shoulders would be shrunk to less than vehicle width to accommodate three lanes between US 30 and US 231? That would help with the 109th Avenue bridge, but the US 231 bridge would still need to be replaced.

I'm surprised the additional lane wasn't put into play when the initial work was done 10 years ago; I figured that was a given.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Indyroads on December 20, 2013, 06:20:10 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 09, 2013, 03:39:56 PM
Business SR 37 isn't a state highway however, it's locally maintained. And the state highways bypassing the main part of the city, yes they do travel well within city limits, makes the example similar to Lafayette's. I was merely commenting on the "courthouse" aspect of the situation. I would doubt that there are any incorporated communities in the state that are completely devoid of an INDOT-maintained highway.

More Business or CITY routes may be needed to promote wayfaring in cities where state routes now bypass the city or have been decommissioned altogether (ALA Lafayette, Bloomington, and Terre Haute) Locally maintained routes can still be signed as business routes. I had come up with a system of city route numbers for Indianapolis that even includes a special route marker to replace routes that were decommissioned long ago such as Meridian Street (City 1) Washington street (City 4) and Allisonville Road (City 7A). OR Washington St in the loop could become Business US 40, etc...
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 20, 2013, 06:32:02 PM
I doubt we would see City Routes signed, but I'd love to see some business routes, a Business U.S. 52 and U.S. 231 and Business SR 26. Given that many of the Indianapolis routes haven't been state highways for more than 20 years I don't see new shields coming up, but it would be nice. Given that, the Historic National Road is signed along Washington Street, if only we get a brown Historic U.S. 40 sign there.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 21, 2013, 04:59:55 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 20, 2013, 06:32:02 PM
I doubt we would see City Routes signed, but I'd love to see some business routes, a Business U.S. 52 and U.S. 231 and Business SR 26. Given that many of the Indianapolis routes haven't been state highways for more than 20 years I don't see new shields coming up, but it would be nice. Given that, the Historic National Road is signed along Washington Street, if only we get a brown Historic U.S. 40 sign there.

When INDOT decommissioned SR 111, 311, and 403 in Clark County, the county put up shields identifying the roads as County Road 111, 311, and 403, respectively.  Other counties cities could do something similar.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NE2 on December 21, 2013, 05:19:39 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 21, 2013, 04:59:55 PM
When INDOT decommissioned SR 111, 311, and 403 in Clark County, the county put up shields identifying the roads as County Road 111, 311, and 403, respectively.  Other counties cities could do something similar.
Are these routes signed from intersecting state roads?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 21, 2013, 06:09:44 PM
Wait, are these county highway shields, the pentagons, or just a regular street blade. I for one would love to see more pentagons in Indiana.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on December 21, 2013, 06:25:46 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 21, 2013, 06:09:44 PM
Wait, are these county highway shields, the pentagons, or just a regular street blade. I for one would love to see more pentagons in Indiana.

They are ugly rectangular signs that are not too unlike all the detour signs INDOT puts up when freeways are being built.

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FIMG_4426.JPG&hash=4ff96afea2acfded968ab711c97df01fcfdd1a56)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Brandon on December 21, 2013, 09:24:42 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 21, 2013, 04:59:55 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 20, 2013, 06:32:02 PM
I doubt we would see City Routes signed, but I'd love to see some business routes, a Business U.S. 52 and U.S. 231 and Business SR 26. Given that many of the Indianapolis routes haven't been state highways for more than 20 years I don't see new shields coming up, but it would be nice. Given that, the Historic National Road is signed along Washington Street, if only we get a brown Historic U.S. 40 sign there.

When INDOT decommissioned SR 111, 311, and 403 in Clark County, the county put up shields identifying the roads as County Road 111, 311, and 403, respectively.  Other counties cities could do something similar.

Of course, on the other hand, Elkhart County did jack shit for the old US-33.  IN-933 ends right at the county line.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NE2 on December 22, 2013, 07:04:58 AM
Someone put exit numbers on US 20 in northwest Indiana on the Goog. Are these real or some fictional shite?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 22, 2013, 07:21:17 AM
Flood warnings for nearly the entire state today.  A lot of roads closed right now, including:

I-70 EB near the Marion/Hancock line.
SR 1 in Randolph County
SR 135 in Brown County
SR 258 in Jackson County
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on December 22, 2013, 08:19:47 AM
Quote from: NE2 on December 22, 2013, 07:04:58 AM
Someone put exit numbers on US 20 in northwest Indiana on the Goog. Are these real or some fictional shite?

Wouldn't it almost be inconceivable that there could be an error in Google Maps? After all, Google fixes errors on the part of INDOT - read this post (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=10382.msg247741#msg247741).

Anyway, INDOT has an exit book with their internal numbers (based on mileage). I would guess they found that document. The link for the US highway one is here (http://www.in.gov/indot/div/interchange/us.htm).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on January 06, 2014, 10:44:16 AM
Pretty much every highway in the northern half of the state is closed, and there are travel bans in place even if the roads are passable.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tvketchum on January 06, 2014, 11:22:23 AM
IN 267 from in Avon and Brownsburg has been turned over to these cities and Hendricks County. Plainfield did not participate, so it appears the road will end at the north Plainfield city limits. Story was in the Sunday Indianapolis Star 01/05/2014.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Brandon on January 06, 2014, 11:43:30 AM
Quote from: NE2 on December 22, 2013, 07:04:58 AM
Someone put exit numbers on US 20 in northwest Indiana on the Goog. Are these real or some fictional shite?

The St Joseph Valley Pkwy has never had exit numbers posted.  As above, these are InDOT's internal numbers, not posted in the field.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Brandon on January 06, 2014, 11:45:38 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on January 06, 2014, 10:44:16 AM
Pretty much every highway in the northern half of the state is closed, and there are travel bans in place even if the roads are passable.

Yep, even I-80/94 between the Illinois State Line and US-421 (Exit 34).  Now, I'd like to know how they're closing it at the state line as the first exit is US-41/Calumet Avenue (Exit 1), and the last exit is for Torrence Avenue (Exit 161) in Illinois.  Are they forcing people off at Torrence or Calumet?  I would suspect Torrence.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Stratuscaster on January 06, 2014, 07:44:44 PM
I was looking at traffic cams last night and despite being "closed" there were indeed vehicles out on both I-80/94 and on I-65 (which was closed between Gary & Lafayette.)

Perhaps it wasn't a "hard closure." Didn't see any cops or barricades at all.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 06, 2014, 08:04:20 PM
Quote from: Stratuscaster on January 06, 2014, 07:44:44 PM
I was looking at traffic cams last night and despite being "closed" there were indeed vehicles out on both I-80/94 and on I-65 (which was closed between Gary & Lafayette.)

Perhaps it wasn't a "hard closure." Didn't see any cops or barricades at all.

It's supposed to be closed with barricades (according to the news), maybe they were blown away.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on January 07, 2014, 07:59:59 AM
Quote from: Stratuscaster on January 06, 2014, 07:44:44 PM
I was looking at traffic cams last night and despite being "closed" there were indeed vehicles out on both I-80/94 and on I-65 (which was closed between Gary & Lafayette.)

Perhaps it wasn't a "hard closure." Didn't see any cops or barricades at all.

I-80/94 reopened yesterday.  I-65 reopened yesterday for a while but then got closed again from US 30 to SR 43 at around 7pm.  I don't know if they are doing anything physically in addition to saying that the roads are closed--I'm just reporting what INDOT is saying.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Brandon on January 07, 2014, 10:01:53 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on January 07, 2014, 07:59:59 AM
Quote from: Stratuscaster on January 06, 2014, 07:44:44 PM
I was looking at traffic cams last night and despite being "closed" there were indeed vehicles out on both I-80/94 and on I-65 (which was closed between Gary & Lafayette.)

Perhaps it wasn't a "hard closure." Didn't see any cops or barricades at all.

I-80/94 reopened yesterday.  I-65 reopened yesterday for a while but then got closed again from US 30 to SR 43 at around 7pm.  I don't know if they are doing anything physically in addition to saying that the roads are closed--I'm just reporting what INDOT is saying.

Looking at the traffic cam at US-30 and I-65, it appears to be a berm of snow.  http://travelmidwest.com/lmiga/map.jsp?mapname=eventMap&id=IN-InDOT-462

Here's the other I-65 cameras: http://travelmidwest.com/lmiga/cameraReport.jsp?location=GATEWAY.IN.I-65
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 07, 2014, 06:15:57 PM
Quote from: tvketchum on January 06, 2014, 11:22:23 AM
IN 267 from in Avon and Brownsburg has been turned over to these cities and Hendricks County. Plainfield did not participate, so it appears the road will end at the north Plainfield city limits. Story was in the Sunday Indianapolis Star 01/05/2014.

I wonder why Plainfield didn't participate, and why doesn't the deal make 267 end at 74? 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on January 07, 2014, 06:37:04 PM
SR 267 in Plainfield, between US 40 and I-70 at least, is a four-lane highway that is pretty much as improved as it is going to be without turning it into a "Keystone Parkway"-like road. There's little that INDOT could do, while Brownsburg and Avon see opportunities to improve the former SR 267 corridor. Of course I'd like to see them finish the RR Pkwy first. As for the reason of why SR 267 doesn't end at I-74, because that would be logical and INDOT isn't always logical.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 07, 2014, 08:47:42 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on January 07, 2014, 06:37:04 PM
SR 267 in Plainfield, between US 40 and I-70 at least, is a four-lane highway that is pretty much as improved as it is going to be without turning it into a "Keystone Parkway"-like road. There's little that INDOT could do, while Brownsburg and Avon see opportunities to improve the former SR 267 corridor. Of course I'd like to see them finish the RR Pkwy first. As for the reason of why SR 267 doesn't end at I-74, because that would be logical and INDOT isn't always logical.

RR Pkwy is completely funded by Hendricks county I believe, so it will be a while.  The next pieces involve connecting the current southern part to the northern part, which involves a bridge that crosses us 136 and the rr tracks, and I don't think there is even money for that yet.  Also the boone county part is completely unplanned at this point.  They tried to get INDOT to take it over and call it SR 267, but they refused, I think it would have been a good idea for them, but I don't think they want to add to their mileage count. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Indyroads on January 08, 2014, 02:46:21 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 07, 2014, 08:47:42 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on January 07, 2014, 06:37:04 PM
SR 267 in Plainfield, between US 40 and I-70 at least, is a four-lane highway that is pretty much as improved as it is going to be without turning it into a "Keystone Parkway"-like road. There's little that INDOT could do, while Brownsburg and Avon see opportunities to improve the former SR 267 corridor. Of course I'd like to see them finish the RR Pkwy first. As for the reason of why SR 267 doesn't end at I-74, because that would be logical and INDOT isn't always logical.

RR Pkwy is completely funded by Hendricks county I believe, so it will be a while.  The next pieces involve connecting the current southern part to the northern part, which involves a bridge that crosses us 136 and the rr tracks, and I don't think there is even money for that yet.  Also the boone county part is completely unplanned at this point.  They tried to get INDOT to take it over and call it SR 267, but they refused, I think it would have been a good idea for them, but I don't think they want to add to their mileage count. 

As for the segment of former SR-267 between CR700 N and I-74, it makes Zero sense why the state relinquished this short section of highway, they should have just relinquished the whole section of SR-267 north of US-40 all the way to I-65 rather than leaving the open end and not keeping such a short section that connects to I-74.

It also makes me wonder if Indot will be removing the IN-267 shields from the brownsburg interchange signs at I-74 since the highway no longer connects, or will thye place the word "TO" next to the shield instead.  It seems like the later would be appropriate.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on January 08, 2014, 10:59:41 PM
Quote from: Brandon on January 07, 2014, 10:01:53 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on January 07, 2014, 07:59:59 AM
Quote from: Stratuscaster on January 06, 2014, 07:44:44 PM
I was looking at traffic cams last night and despite being "closed" there were indeed vehicles out on both I-80/94 and on I-65 (which was closed between Gary & Lafayette.)

Perhaps it wasn't a "hard closure." Didn't see any cops or barricades at all.

I-80/94 reopened yesterday.  I-65 reopened yesterday for a while but then got closed again from US 30 to SR 43 at around 7pm.  I don't know if they are doing anything physically in addition to saying that the roads are closed--I'm just reporting what INDOT is saying.

Looking at the traffic cam at US-30 and I-65, it appears to be a berm of snow.  http://travelmidwest.com/lmiga/map.jsp?mapname=eventMap&id=IN-InDOT-462

Here's the other I-65 cameras: http://travelmidwest.com/lmiga/cameraReport.jsp?location=GATEWAY.IN.I-65
Just this afternoon, I completed what turned out to be a 2-day trip from Evansville to South Bend. It was a bit of an ordeal.

We got rear-ended by a semi at one of the stop lights on US 41 in Terre Haute. The poor bastard didn't have a chance to stop on the ice. Thank goodness he had the sense to go slow, so the rental car took just minor damage and the humans took no damage.

I-70 to Indy was impossible. Semis, in both lanes of course, were doing just 5-10 MPH. We switched over to US 40 at Brazil, and could go 35-40. I-465 was a sheet of glass, and US-31 heading north had the washboard effect, so 40 MPH was pushing it. I finally gave up at Kokomo for the night. The drive this afternoon was much easier, with speeds up to 55 north of Peru.

It great to be home!   
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on January 09, 2014, 07:47:36 AM
Quote from: theline on January 08, 2014, 10:59:41 PM
Quote from: Brandon on January 07, 2014, 10:01:53 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on January 07, 2014, 07:59:59 AM
Quote from: Stratuscaster on January 06, 2014, 07:44:44 PM
I was looking at traffic cams last night and despite being "closed" there were indeed vehicles out on both I-80/94 and on I-65 (which was closed between Gary & Lafayette.)

Perhaps it wasn't a "hard closure." Didn't see any cops or barricades at all.

I-80/94 reopened yesterday.  I-65 reopened yesterday for a while but then got closed again from US 30 to SR 43 at around 7pm.  I don't know if they are doing anything physically in addition to saying that the roads are closed--I'm just reporting what INDOT is saying.

Looking at the traffic cam at US-30 and I-65, it appears to be a berm of snow.  http://travelmidwest.com/lmiga/map.jsp?mapname=eventMap&id=IN-InDOT-462

Here's the other I-65 cameras: http://travelmidwest.com/lmiga/cameraReport.jsp?location=GATEWAY.IN.I-65
Just this afternoon, I completed what turned out to be a 2-day trip from Evansville to South Bend. It was a bit of an ordeal.

We got rear-ended by a semi at one of the stop lights on US 41 in Terre Haute. The poor bastard didn't have a chance to stop on the ice. Thank goodness he had the sense to go slow, so the rental car took just minor damage and the humans took no damage.

I-70 to Indy was impossible. Semis, in both lanes of course, were doing just 5-10 MPH. We switched over to US 40 at Brazil, and could go 35-40. I-465 was a sheet of glass, and US-31 heading north had the washboard effect, so 40 MPH was pushing it. I finally gave up at Kokomo for the night. The drive this afternoon was much easier, with speeds up to 55 north of Peru.

It great to be home!   

I'm glad you made it!

I was fortunate enough not to have to venture outside my home county for the duration.  And here, the snow cover was measured in millimeters and not inches.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on January 13, 2014, 02:45:56 PM
This past Saturday night, Cline Avenue (Indiana 912) closed between I-80/94 and Columbus Drive because of excess potholes. It opened again this morning in time for commutes, but drivers are still reporting pothole problems. Be careful if you're using that road in the coming days.

Cline Avenue may start rising from the ashes starting this year. Work is set for full resurfacing on that very stretch this spring, along with bridge repairs on that section. Also, work to rebuild the condemned Indiana Harbor bridge is (finally) set to begin this spring, with completion set for the next spring.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 13, 2014, 02:59:15 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on January 13, 2014, 02:45:56 PM
This past Saturday night, Cline Avenue (Indiana 912) closed between I-80/94 and Columbus Drive because of excess potholes. It opened again this morning in time for commutes, but drivers are still reporting pothole problems. Be careful if you're using that road in the coming days.

Cline Avenue may start rising from the ashes starting this year. Work is set for full resurfacing on that very stretch this spring, along with bridge repairs on that section. Also, work to rebuild the condemned Indiana Harbor bridge is (finally) set to begin this spring, with completion set for the next spring.

Good to see that long ignored road getting fixed
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Brandon on January 13, 2014, 05:25:00 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on January 13, 2014, 02:45:56 PM
This past Saturday night, Cline Avenue (Indiana 912) closed between I-80/94 and Columbus Drive because of excess potholes. It opened again this morning in time for commutes, but drivers are still reporting pothole problems. Be careful if you're using that road in the coming days.

That's something I've noticed all over the region for the past few days.  There's a shitload of potholes out there.  I missed more than a few just on my way to work this morning, and several of them looked pretty nasty.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on January 13, 2014, 05:51:07 PM
I've been dodging potholes in South Bend, and the TV news tonight showed crews out doing temporary repairs. There was plenty of moisture in the pavement cracks when the polar vortex hit last week. The freezing water pulverized a lot of pavement. Be careful out there!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on February 11, 2014, 08:36:57 AM
I-69 north of Exit 205 (SR 37) is going to be widened to six lanes by the end of 2016 or beginning of 2017. The stretch covers I-69 from SR 37 all the way to Exit 218 (SR 38) in Pendleton. I'm sure most here will be happy to hear this news as that has become a busy stretch of highway. I was actually just expecting it to be widened to Exit 210, but 18 miles of a six-lane or higher I-69 isn't a bad deal. Now if we can get that pushed up to Anderson we be all good. I wonder if a widening of I-65 to the south of Greenwood isn't too far behind?

http://wishtv.com/2014/02/10/plans-in-the-works-to-add-lanes-to-interstate-69/

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on February 11, 2014, 09:10:55 AM
I-65 needs six lanes the entire stretch between Greenwood and Sellersburg.  You can and will get stuck behind a backlog of truck traffic at any point in between.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 11, 2014, 11:40:58 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on February 11, 2014, 09:10:55 AM
I-65 needs six lanes the entire stretch between Greenwood and Sellersburg.  You can and will get stuck behind a backlog of truck traffic at any point in between.

That can wait until they 6 lane it from Indy to Gary
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on February 11, 2014, 12:17:25 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 11, 2014, 11:40:58 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on February 11, 2014, 09:10:55 AM
I-65 needs six lanes the entire stretch between Greenwood and Sellersburg.  You can and will get stuck behind a backlog of truck traffic at any point in between.

That can wait until they 6 lane it from Indy to Gary

I drive 65 a lot, more south of Indy than north, but I get slowed down by truck traffic much more frequently south of Indy than north.  Maybe the northern section has higher overall traffic counts, but the southern section certainly seems to have more truck traffic.  On the northern section I set my cruise at 79 and am getting passed by a lot of cars.  On the southern section, I'm lucky to be able to go over 75 for more than half the trip.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on February 11, 2014, 05:45:49 PM
I'll third the motion that I-65 should be widened south of Indy first.  Granted I've rarely driven I-65 across Indiana, but the last time the Louisville to I-465 section seemed to have more traffic and more difficulties passing.

The northern section also already has a partial alternative via I-74 and US 41; there does not appear to be an option south of Indy.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefro on February 14, 2014, 09:42:00 AM
http://www.ibj.com/state-wants-early-access-to-long-term-transportation-fund/PARAMS/article/46164

QuoteThe Indiana Department of Transportation on Thursday asked the state Senate Appropriations Committee to approve the release of $400 million saved in a special trust fund created last year.

Lawmakers plan to put $200 million per year into the Major Moves 2020 fund for a long-term project for Indiana roads until they reach more than $1 billion in savings in 2020.

But the transportation department and Gov. Mike Pence say they hope to start spending before inflation eats away at the state's purchasing power. Pence said the sitting on the cash could cost the state $56 million.

"We have great opportunities in Indiana to improve our infrastructure," Pence said during a news conference earlier this month. "That will contribute not just to our economy in terms of that work being done, but also to making Indiana more attractive for investment by improving our logistics of capacity."

Among the project INDOT is proposing to use the money for include widening Interstates 65, 70 and 69 to six lanes in certain areas.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: RevZimmerman on March 01, 2014, 12:55:01 PM
Diverging Diamond Interchange in Indiana construction to begin in mid-April:
http://www.journalgazette.net/article/20140225/BLOGS01/140229543/0/SEARCH (http://www.journalgazette.net/article/20140225/BLOGS01/140229543/0/SEARCH)

QuoteALLEN COUNTY, Ind. — The Indiana Department of Transportation (INDOT) Fort Wayne District announces that work will begin for the I-69 and SR 1/Dupont Road interchange modification project by mid-April, weather permitting. The bridge deck will be modified, and the ramps will be upgraded to fit the diverging diamond design.

The interchange will be converted from a traditional diamond to a diverging diamond interchange (DDI). When entering the DDI, drivers will crossover to the left side of the bridge, guided by signals, signs and pavement markings. This configuration efficiently allows drivers to maneuver to and from I-69 with little to no delays. Traffic congestion is reduced by eliminating the left-turn phase from the traffic signal cycle.


INDOT's site on the construction: http://www.in.gov/indot/2894.htm (http://www.in.gov/indot/2894.htm)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on March 16, 2014, 12:29:15 AM
I have a brief update about SR 267 in Hendricks County after visiting a friend in Avon tonight. Although I haven't checked anything around Brownsburg, I can confirm that all SR 267 shields in Avon AND in Plainfield north of US 40 are gone. Regardless to that, nearly every white on green street sign in both Avon and Plainfield still say SR 267 on it. I'm betting a lot of people in the area are still calling the highway 267 without even realizing that that number no longer exists for that highway. In Brownsburg I bet it's easier calling it Green Street. At the intersection with US 40 and old SR 267 the sign refers to the road as Avon Ave. Indeed at the intersection with US 40 and Quaker Boulevard, the four-lane segment of SR 267 connect 40 with I-70, there is an "end" sign posted with the SR 267 shield, indicating that the highway now ends there. I'd guess the shields are gone in Brownsburg but I have no clue about north of there.

One thing I noticed heading east on I-70 that I didn't see before, they have a new message board sign over the C/D lanes of the highway between the airport and I-465 interchanges. This is over basically the exit ramp from I-70 to I-465, not the I-70 mainline itself. To my knowledge this is the first time that there's been something like this. I know I've seen it on the Dan Ryan in Chicago where message board signs are up over both the express and local lanes.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tvketchum on March 16, 2014, 03:00:20 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on March 16, 2014, 12:29:15 AM
I have a brief update about SR 267 in Hendricks County after visiting a friend in Avon tonight. Although I haven't checked anything around Brownsburg, I can confirm that all SR 267 shields in Avon AND in Plainfield north of US 40 are gone. Regardless to that, nearly every white on green street sign in both Avon and Plainfield still say SR 267 on it. I'm betting a lot of people in the area are still calling the highway 267 without even realizing that that number no longer exists for that highway. In Brownsburg I bet it's easier calling it Green Street. At the intersection with US 40 and old SR 267 the sign refers to the road as Avon Ave. Indeed at the intersection with US 40 and Quaker Boulevard, the four-lane segment of SR 267 connect 40 with I-70, there is an "end" sign posted with the SR 267 shield, indicating that the highway now ends there. I'd guess the shields are gone in Brownsburg but I have no clue about north of there.

One thing I noticed heading east on I-70 that I didn't see before, they have a new message board sign over the C/D lanes of the highway between the airport and I-465 interchanges. This is over basically the exit ramp from I-70 to I-465, not the I-70 mainline itself. To my knowledge this is the first time that there's been something like this. I know I've seen it on the Dan Ryan in Chicago where message board signs are up over both the express and local lanes.


There is now a variable message sign in that area on mainline 70 facing the westbound traffic. Likely because of the multitude of accidents on the route to Terre Haute, which allows INDOT to advise exiting at IN 267 and using US 40 as an alternate.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on March 16, 2014, 06:50:24 PM
The long-awaited contract for the northern part of SR 641 has been awarded so I guess we'll see quite a bit of construction on I-70 this year. If you look at the traffic plans, you'll see some weird stuff (IMO). This following sign design is awful - I certainly hope this series of signs gets redesigned.

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FI70--SR641-Plan.jpg&hash=6441dd8de4d8a344067108b983dca3f8dad18eec)

What is the deal with the middle section from SR 46 to the current northern end point? The INDOT lettings showed that the contract was awarded to Walsh Construction in 2012, but when I went there in fall 2013, there was very little evidence of construction other than orange signs.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on March 16, 2014, 06:57:20 PM
Agreed, much to be desired by that sign, and a lot of the signs designed there. I could almost think that this would be a good spot for one of them tall signs with three lines: SR 641 south/US 40 east/SR 46, with perhaps a TO US 41 south thrown in there something. A mention of Vincennes or Evansville could be nice too. We known I-70 goes to St. Louis, but where's this 641 heading off too?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NE2 on March 17, 2014, 04:22:32 AM
Holy crap, is INDOT putting directions above shields?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: trafficsignal on March 17, 2014, 06:34:34 AM
Quote from: NE2 on March 17, 2014, 04:22:32 AM
Holy crap, is INDOT putting directions above shields?

For multiple shields, they are trending that way.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NE2 on March 17, 2014, 07:57:37 AM
Quote from: trafficsignal on March 17, 2014, 06:34:34 AM
Quote from: NE2 on March 17, 2014, 04:22:32 AM
Holy crap, is INDOT putting directions above shields?

For multiple shields, they are trending that way.
Good riddance to space wastage.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tvketchum on March 20, 2014, 08:49:55 PM
When the route joining the interstate, the departing portion of the route gets the direction. IOW, this proposed design would face westbound I 70, so continuing westbound will add US40 westbound. To go east on 40, you exit. Since SR 46 north of I 70 has US 40, and south of I 70 will be SR 641, that afterthought SR 46 sheild may be intended to be removed when the work is all said and done. The SR 641 may be covered when the sign goes up if it is not open, so the switch in the field will be easy.
Title: $30 million highway project in Huntington and Allen counties gets funding
Post by: mukade on March 20, 2014, 10:23:30 PM
Quote
Indiana Senate President Pro Tempore David Long officially announced $30 million, which will completely fund the Huntington County Road 900 North/Lafayette Center Road project, at a press conference Wednesday morning at Indiana Tech in Fort Wayne....

$30 million highway project in Huntington and Allen counties gets funding (http://www.indianaeconomicdigest.com/main.asp?SectionID=31&SubSectionID=188&ArticleID=73938) (Indiana Economic Digest)
Title: Re: $30 million highway project in Huntington and Allen counties gets funding
Post by: silverback1065 on March 20, 2014, 11:11:56 PM
Quote from: mukade on March 20, 2014, 10:23:30 PM
Quote
Indiana Senate President Pro Tempore David Long officially announced $30 million, which will completely fund the Huntington County Road 900 North/Lafayette Center Road project, at a press conference Wednesday morning at Indiana Tech in Fort Wayne....

$30 million highway project in Huntington and Allen counties gets funding (http://www.indianaeconomicdigest.com/main.asp?SectionID=31&SubSectionID=188&ArticleID=73938) (Indiana Economic Digest)

US 24 should run along that road
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on March 26, 2014, 10:10:04 PM
I wonder if they will move US 24 to it after the project is done.  Nah.  (Would add a couple miles to the system, probably a deal-breaker even if the state is paying for all the construction. They probably won't pay for the maintenance.)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on March 27, 2014, 01:17:02 AM
Actually, INDOT could reduce their supported mileage by about 2.7 miles, if they move 24 to Lafayette Center and turn the existing route between Roanoke and I-69 over to the locals. If I know INDOT, they'd find that very hard to resist.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on March 27, 2014, 08:55:53 AM
Wasn't 24 just rerouted to the north of Fort Wayne along I-69 and I-469. I recall seeing a contract for moving the signs for the highway for the reroute, I'm not sure if INDOT would want to do that again and reroute the highway to the south. Of course, INDOT could just use Lafayette Center and then I-69 north from there too. Or for once, INDOT could just leave it alone.
Title: Indiana to widen Interstate 65 south of Southport
Post by: mukade on March 31, 2014, 07:18:48 PM
Quote
INDOT will be able to expand a section of I-65 from Southport to Franklin after Gov. Mike Pence signed a bill releasing $200 million in highway construction money...

State to widen Interstate 65 south of Southport (http://www.ibj.com/state-to-widen-interstate-65-south-of-southport/PARAMS/article/46925) (IBJ)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on March 31, 2014, 09:00:49 PM
I'm sure most of us saw this coming after the bill was passed. I go home each morning along this highway in the opposite direction and see plenty of traffic heading north. Of course, Southport to Greenwood is already six lanes so what does this actually mean for that highway. Greenwood to Franklin though is surly appreciated. I would expect the next two widenings to be I-65 north from Sellersburg to probably Henryville and maybe I-70 from Mt. Comfort to Greenfield.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on March 31, 2014, 09:47:24 PM
I would also hope I-65 from US 30 in Merrillville to US 231 in Crown Point. Especially because this is essentially building new shoulders.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: trafficsignal on April 01, 2014, 07:22:38 AM
The IBJ article says #2 is I-65 in Lafayette (SR 38 to SR 26).  #3 would be I-69 from 116th to old SR 238.  #4 would be more I-65 in southern Indiana.  I've heard INDOT had more Indy-area widenings planned for that money, including the I-70 stretch out to Greenfield, but was told to include all portions of the state in the widening work.

Also, the I-65 stretch near Crown Point is included with the Illiana work.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: froggie on April 01, 2014, 08:20:47 AM
Question:  I took US 231 up from Owensboro to I-64 after last weekend's Nashville meet.  Was the 4-laning of that stretch part of Major Moves?  I know from maps (and an early 2000s trip through Dale but not on US 231) that this 4-laning is relatively new, to tie into the new(ish) river bridge.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on April 01, 2014, 08:42:24 AM
In short, yes.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 01, 2014, 03:14:25 PM
they want to 4 lane it throughout most of the state eventually
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on April 01, 2014, 04:31:04 PM
Quote from: mukade on March 16, 2014, 06:50:24 PM
The long-awaited contract for the northern part of SR 641 has been awarded so I guess we'll see quite a bit of construction on I-70 this year. If you look at the traffic plans, you'll see some weird stuff (IMO). This following sign design is awful - I certainly hope this series of signs gets redesigned.

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FI70--SR641-Plan.jpg&hash=6441dd8de4d8a344067108b983dca3f8dad18eec)

What is the deal with the middle section from SR 46 to the current northern end point? The INDOT lettings showed that the contract was awarded to Walsh Construction in 2012, but when I went there in fall 2013, there was very little evidence of construction other than orange signs.

Where did you find this sign at? If you know can you give me the link to the site it's on or show me others?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: agentsteel53 on April 01, 2014, 05:03:02 PM
if I saw that sign, I would have no idea what that floating 46 meant.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on April 01, 2014, 09:37:18 PM
Quote from: US 41 on April 01, 2014, 04:31:04 PM
Quote from: mukade on March 16, 2014, 06:50:24 PM
The long-awaited contract for the northern part of SR 641 has been awarded so I guess we'll see quite a bit of construction on I-70 this year. If you look at the traffic plans, you'll see some weird stuff (IMO). This following sign design is awful - I certainly hope this series of signs gets redesigned.

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FI70--SR641-Plan.jpg&hash=6441dd8de4d8a344067108b983dca3f8dad18eec)

What is the deal with the middle section from SR 46 to the current northern end point? The INDOT lettings showed that the contract was awarded to Walsh Construction in 2012, but when I went there in fall 2013, there was very little evidence of construction other than orange signs.

Where did you find this sign at? If you know can you give me the link to the site it's on or show me others?

It is a bit convoluted to get there. The URL is https://netservices.indot.in.gov/ViewDocs2.0/ (https://netservices.indot.in.gov/ViewDocs2.0/), but you need the contract number to see the plans. You can get the contact number here (http://www.in.gov/dot/div/contracts/letting/lettingtable.htm).

In this case, you will find it is contract "30091" because the contract was awarded in the March 5, 2014 regular letting. So enter that contract number, and choose the value "Plan/Drawing Set" value in the dropdown. In the next page, signs are usually in the plan/drawing marked as "Traffic" in the column with heading of "Final Tracing Type".

Pretty intuitive. Anyway, the SR 641 Traffic document has numerous sign designs.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on April 01, 2014, 09:55:49 PM
Quote
The Wall Street Journal is reporting the Indiana Toll Road is again facing pressure from bondholders, with its controlling partners facing a possible debt restructuring, perhaps in Chapter 11 bankruptcy...

Indiana Toll Road again facing debt problems (http://www.nwitimes.com/business/local/reports-indiana-toll-road-again-facing-debt-problems/article_975bf7dc-ddc8-56f1-a184-0c3187fb31fc.html) (NWI Times)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 01, 2014, 11:04:54 PM
Quote from: mukade on April 01, 2014, 09:55:49 PM
Quote
The Wall Street Journal is reporting the Indiana Toll Road is again facing pressure from bondholders, with its controlling partners facing a possible debt restructuring, perhaps in Chapter 11 bankruptcy...

Indiana Toll Road again facing debt problems (http://www.nwitimes.com/business/local/reports-indiana-toll-road-again-facing-debt-problems/article_975bf7dc-ddc8-56f1-a184-0c3187fb31fc.html) (NWI Times)

If the Toll Road goes back to the public, who is in charge of maintenance operations? Does INDOT get it back, or is another third party in control?

In another note, while the expansion of I-65 from four to six lanes is still a while off, I observed there are some preparations done when the project eventually begins. Two pairs of bridges located between Indiana 10 (Exit 230) and Indiana 14 (Exit 220) were rebuilt with a concrete barrier in the middle, which can support a third lane and an inside shoulder.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on April 02, 2014, 08:13:30 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on March 31, 2014, 09:00:49 PM
I'm sure most of us saw this coming after the bill was passed. I go home each morning along this highway in the opposite direction and see plenty of traffic heading north. Of course, Southport to Greenwood is already six lanes so what does this actually mean for that highway. Greenwood to Franklin though is surly appreciated. I would expect the next two widenings to be I-65 north from Sellersburg to probably Henryville and maybe I-70 from Mt. Comfort to Greenfield.

I live in Jeffersonville, with my wife's family in Indy and my family in South Bend, so I drive I-65 between Jeffersonville and Indy a LOT.  Adding lanes in certain sections is nice, but the traffic bottlenecks don't really occur more frequently between Greenwood-Franklin and Sellersburg-Henryville than any other 2-lane stretch in between.  The bottlenecks occur when you get semis in the left lane going 66 passing semis in the right lane going 65, with a long line of cars trying to go 70 (or more) stuck in the left lane behind the semis.  This happens in pretty much every stretch of road. 

Now, the Greenwood-Franklin section may help those who commute daily from the southern half of Johnson county, but beyond that, the entire distance needs that extra lane.  Just doing a couple sections has minimal impact on those traversing the entire distance.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefro on April 02, 2014, 09:32:00 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 01, 2014, 11:04:54 PM
Quote from: mukade on April 01, 2014, 09:55:49 PM
Quote
The Wall Street Journal is reporting the Indiana Toll Road is again facing pressure from bondholders, with its controlling partners facing a possible debt restructuring, perhaps in Chapter 11 bankruptcy...

Indiana Toll Road again facing debt problems (http://www.nwitimes.com/business/local/reports-indiana-toll-road-again-facing-debt-problems/article_975bf7dc-ddc8-56f1-a184-0c3187fb31fc.html) (NWI Times)

If the Toll Road goes back to the public, who is in charge of maintenance operations? Does INDOT get it back, or is another third party in control?

http://www.governing.com/topics/mgmt/indiana-toll-road-model-privatization.html

QuoteWill Wingfield, a spokesman for the Indiana Department of Transportation, says that if the ITR project defaults or declares bankruptcy, Macquarie and Cintra would have the opportunity to find new investors. If that effort fails, tolling authority would return to the state, and Indiana would keep its lump-sum payment.

So INDOT would get the Indiana Toll Road back if the company can't get new investors.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on April 02, 2014, 11:24:46 AM
Thank you mukade.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on April 02, 2014, 09:47:42 PM
My guess about the future of the ITR is that new investors will be found. It seems that it does have value as an investment, because there is significant income from tolls and fees from the service plaza tenants. That should more than cover maintenance costs. The current concessionaire is caught in a bind because they are no doubt making payments to whoever loaned the money used to pay the state, using income that falls short of their original estimates. The obligation to the original investors will undoubtedly be erased in part through the bankruptcy process. It's also possible that the current concessionaire may retain control if they get enough relief from the bankruptcy.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Joe The Dragon on April 02, 2014, 09:51:31 PM
Quote from: theline on April 02, 2014, 09:47:42 PM
My guess about the future of the ITR is that new investors will be found. It seems that it does have value as an investment, because there is significant income from tolls and fees from the service plaza tenants. That should more than cover maintenance costs. The current concessionaire is caught in a bind because they are no doubt making payments to whoever loaned the money used to pay the state, using income that falls short of their original estimates. The obligation to the original investors will undoubtedly be erased in part through the bankruptcy process. It's also possible that the current concessionaire may retain control if they get enough relief from the bankruptcy.

they to add high speed tolling or at least gate free ETC only lanes.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefro on April 04, 2014, 08:31:10 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on April 02, 2014, 08:13:30 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on March 31, 2014, 09:00:49 PM
I'm sure most of us saw this coming after the bill was passed. I go home each morning along this highway in the opposite direction and see plenty of traffic heading north. Of course, Southport to Greenwood is already six lanes so what does this actually mean for that highway. Greenwood to Franklin though is surly appreciated. I would expect the next two widenings to be I-65 north from Sellersburg to probably Henryville and maybe I-70 from Mt. Comfort to Greenfield.

I live in Jeffersonville, with my wife's family in Indy and my family in South Bend, so I drive I-65 between Jeffersonville and Indy a LOT.  Adding lanes in certain sections is nice, but the traffic bottlenecks don't really occur more frequently between Greenwood-Franklin and Sellersburg-Henryville than any other 2-lane stretch in between.  The bottlenecks occur when you get semis in the left lane going 66 passing semis in the right lane going 65, with a long line of cars trying to go 70 (or more) stuck in the left lane behind the semis.  This happens in pretty much every stretch of road. 

Now, the Greenwood-Franklin section may help those who commute daily from the southern half of Johnson county, but beyond that, the entire distance needs that extra lane.  Just doing a couple sections has minimal impact on those traversing the entire distance.

Apparently just the Southport to Franklin section (sounds like they may add some extra travel/ramp lanes from Greenwood to Southport) and the Lafayette section are going to eat up $200 million

http://www.indystar.com/story/news/politics/2014/04/03/state-add-lanes-sections-franklin-southport/7269209/

QuoteConstruction could begin as early as this fall on a 14.5-mile stretch of I-65 from Ind. 44, east of downtown Franklin, to Southport Road in Marion County.

Will Wingfield, spokesman for the Indiana Department of Transportation, said the four-lane highway would be expanded to six lanes (three in each direction) from Franklin to Greenwood. From Main Street in Greenwood to Southport Road, construction may include adding travel lanes or building ramp lanes, depending on where right- of- way exists.

The other project would widen four-lane I-65 in the Lafayette area to at least six lanes from Ind. 38 to Ind. 26.

QuoteIf the second $200 million in highway funding is released, three additional projects involving 19 miles of interstate will be started as early as next spring.

- Nine miles of I-69 from Ind. 37 in Fishers to Ind. 13 in Madison County.

- Three miles of I-65 from Ind. 26 to Ind. 25 in Lafayette area.

- Seven miles of I-65 from Sellersburg (Exit 9) to Memphis (Exit 16) in Clark County.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Henry on April 04, 2014, 02:33:42 PM

And that's not all...
Quote
The $200 million was a compromise on Pence's push to take $400 million out of the Major Moves 2020 Trust Fund, created last year during the General Assembly's budget session.

Pence and House leaders argued that the money is needed now, but Senate Appropriations Chairman Luke Kenley, R-Noblesville, cut the amount in half based on the state's financial condition. The other $200 million could be released after a review of the state's finances this December by the State Budget Committee.

INDOT would spend the additional money, if granted, on Interstate 69 northeast of State Road 37 and 116th Street, and on I-65 in southern Indiana, Wingfield said.

Quote from: mukade on March 31, 2014, 07:18:48 PM
Quote
INDOT will be able to expand a section of I-65 from Southport to Franklin after Gov. Mike Pence signed a bill releasing $200 million in highway construction money...

State to widen Interstate 65 south of Southport (http://www.ibj.com/state-to-widen-interstate-65-south-of-southport/PARAMS/article/46925) (IBJ)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 15, 2014, 07:22:27 PM
Speaking of I-65, is anyone familiar with what's about to happen between US 30 and US 231? There are construction signs up with the speed limit reduced to 55 before the US 30 exit (heading southbound).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on April 15, 2014, 08:27:02 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 15, 2014, 07:22:27 PM
Speaking of I-65, is anyone familiar with what's about to happen between US 30 and US 231? There are construction signs up with the speed limit reduced to 55 before the US 30 exit (heading southbound).

I thought I saw a contract for concrete pavement restoration for that section. If so, I hope they do a better job than on the Borman.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on April 16, 2014, 09:29:09 PM
If all of the currently announced I-65 widenings happen, about 30% (or 78 miles) of the highway would be six lanes or wider in Indiana.










South MMNorth MMMiles
099Ohio River-Sellersburg -SR 311
9167Sellersburg-MemphisOld SR 311-Memphis Rd
9912324Franklin-Indianapolis (NE)SR 44-I-65
12914112Whitestown-LebanonI-865-US 52
1681724LafayetteSR 38-SR 26
1721753LafayetteSR 26-SR 25
24025313Lowell-MerrillvilleSR 2-US 30
2532596Merrillville-GaryUS 30-I-94
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on April 24, 2014, 07:06:35 PM
I-70 is also supposed to get widened to 6 lanes from Indianapolis to Terre Haute.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on April 26, 2014, 10:01:30 AM
Quote from: US 41 on April 24, 2014, 07:06:35 PM
I-70 is also supposed to get widened to 6 lanes from Indianapolis to Terre Haute.

I don't think there are any immediate plans for I-70, are there? There is a long-range plan to make all of I-65 and I-70 six (or more) lanes thru the state, but announced plans are for I-65 and I-69 AFAIK.

Major Moves 2020 (http://www.in.gov/indot/3238.htm)
[INDOT] Gov. Pence Launches 'Major Moves 2020' Construction (http://www.in.gov/activecalendar/EventList.aspx?view=EventDetails&eventidn=166394&information_id=199082&type=&syndicate=syndicate)


Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on April 26, 2014, 11:17:50 AM
Quote from: mukade on April 26, 2014, 10:01:30 AM
Quote from: US 41 on April 24, 2014, 07:06:35 PM
I-70 is also supposed to get widened to 6 lanes from Indianapolis to Terre Haute.

I don't think there are any immediate plans for I-70, are there? There is a long-range plan to make all of I-65 and I-70 six (or more) lanes thru the state, but announced plans are for I-65 and I-69 AFAIK.

Major Moves 2020 (http://www.in.gov/indot/3238.htm)
[INDOT] Gov. Pence Launches 'Major Moves 2020' Construction (http://www.in.gov/activecalendar/EventList.aspx?view=EventDetails&eventidn=166394&information_id=199082&type=&syndicate=syndicate)

I think the I-70 widening is going to start around 2025. Terre Haute is definitely getting widened to 6 lanes from Exit 7 - Exit 11. There are also light talks of putting in an interchange between US 41 and SR 46 (SR 641). (The Terre Haute section will definitely need widened to 6 lanes if that ever happens.) The part between Terre Haute and Indy is still in discussion as for whether or not it will be widened to 6 lanes.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on April 26, 2014, 06:16:44 PM
^^ Now I'm confused. I thought SR-641 was planned to tie in with 46 south of I-70. I can see that they might modify the existing 46/70 interchange, but why would they need a new one? Has the route been changed?  :hmmm:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on April 26, 2014, 10:16:07 PM
Quote from: theline on April 26, 2014, 06:16:44 PM
^^ Now I'm confused. I thought SR-641 was planned to tie in with 46 south of I-70. I can see that they might modify the existing 46/70 interchange, but why would they need a new one? Has the route been changed?  :hmmm:

Ext 11 is going to be where SR 641 ties into I-70. I was saying that there are light talks of putting an interchange in at either Erie Canal Road, Sidenbender Road, or Fruitridge Ave. I was just saying that if Terre Haute ever gets a 3rd interchange, then I-70 would have to be widened to handle all of the Terre Haute traffic. INDOT plans on widedning I-70 through Terre Haute to 6 lanes anyways for a hefty 160 million. My guess is that INDOT wants to but up a concrete barrier wall down the middle with street lights through Terre Haute. It will be nice when it does happen. Also if the 3rd interchange ever happens the speed limit might get dropped to 55.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on April 27, 2014, 12:12:18 AM
Now I understand. I misunderstood your post, US 41. Thanks for straightening me out. I certainly concur that the widening will be much needed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 06, 2014, 12:13:04 AM
Looks like some pretty extensive road work is set to be underway on I-80/94 from Central Avenue to the western end of the bridge work zone currently in place east of the Toll Road interchange. Does anyone have any ideas what's going on? Seems like full blown pavement restoration, which is not anywhere near as bad as the section of I-94 between Indiana 249 and Indiana 49.

Also, if anyone gives me a link to the letting list so I can have an idea of what's going down this year in my area, I'd greatly appreciate it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 06, 2014, 07:47:47 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 06, 2014, 12:13:04 AM
Looks like some pretty extensive road work is set to be underway on I-80/94 from Central Avenue to the western end of the bridge work zone currently in place east of the Toll Road interchange. Does anyone have any ideas what's going on? Seems like full blown pavement restoration, which is not anywhere near as bad as the section of I-94 between Indiana 249 and Indiana 49.

Also, if anyone gives me a link to the letting list so I can have an idea of what's going down this year in my area, I'd greatly appreciate it.

If you are on Facebook, I highly recommend following the INDOT Northwest page.  They provide a lot of information about both long and short term projects.  If you don't see anything about that particular area, you can ask.  The guy who maintains the page is pretty responsive.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ssummers72 on May 06, 2014, 09:34:36 PM
The project on I-80/94 from Central Ave to the Toll Road interchange is a HMA overlay project.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 15, 2014, 06:13:33 PM
Quote from: ssummers72 on May 06, 2014, 09:34:36 PM
The project on I-80/94 from Central Ave to the Toll Road interchange is a HMA overlay project.

Thank you for the update. Greatly appreciated.

Also of note: the NWI Times reports that some roads will get total resurface treatment as a result of the brutal winter we just witnessed. Cline Avenue (Indiana 912) is already being worked on for resurfacing between I-80/94 and Michigan Street, which was scheduled for this year regardless of condition. Indiana 49 between the Indiana Toll Road and U.S. 30 is also slated for summer resurfacing. U.S. 20 between I-94 (the Porter interchange, not the Michigan City interchange) and the Porter/LaPorte County line will get resurfaced this summer. The 10+ mile stretch was set for next year, but was bumped up to this year because of the conditions.

Any of you visiting the Indiana Dunes Lakeshore should be aware that U.S. 12 is closed at the Old Hobart Road and CSX bridges in Miller for replacement. The official detour for both directions is U.S. 20 to Indiana 149 North to 12 (vice versa for the opposite direction). However, you can also use County Line Road (no semis) to connect 20 to 12 if you are heading to Ogden Dunes or West Beach, as well as 20 to Indiana 249. The closure is scheduled to last throughout the summer.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 20, 2014, 10:41:22 PM
The Borman-ITR connection will be crippled further next week. The bridge over I-94 will be replaced, but one lane will remain open throughout the duration. Unfortunately, the movement from the eastbound Toll Road to I-94 eastbound will be sacrificed until completion this fall. Those looking to make the movement will be asked to use I-65 (exit 17, the ramp four miles before I-94) to make the connection. The currently demolished ramp connecting the Westbound Toll Road to westbound I-94 (aka I-80) should see activity next week as well. The completion date for that replacement has been reportedly moved up to November. This will put even more pressure on that small stretch of I-65, since I already see a swell of traffic because of the current closure.

The ramp connecting I-94 to the Westbound Toll Road will see its bridge replaced next Spring.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 21, 2014, 07:36:33 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 20, 2014, 10:41:22 PM
The Borman-ITR connection will be crippled further next week. The bridge over I-94 will be replaced, but one lane will remain open throughout the duration. Unfortunately, the movement from the eastbound Toll Road to I-94 eastbound will be sacrificed until completion this fall. Those looking to make the movement will be asked to use I-65 (exit 17, the ramp four miles before I-94) to make the connection. The currently demolished ramp connecting the Westbound Toll Road to westbound I-94 (aka I-80) should see activity next week as well. The completion date for that replacement has been reportedly moved up to November. This will put even more pressure on that small stretch of I-65, since I already see a swell of traffic because of the current closure.

The ramp connecting I-94 to the Westbound Toll Road will see its bridge replaced next Spring.

I am doing Indy-Chicago and back Saturday.  Should I do Borman/Ford or ITR/Skyway to get to the Ryan? 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 21, 2014, 08:53:58 AM
Save for a couple of small, minor construction zones before you get to Illinois, the Toll Road-Skyway connection still trumps Borman-Ford easily coming from Indianapolis. I'd take the Borman-Ford connection going to Indy. By the time you merge on I-65, the detoured traffic would already be off the highway.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ShawnP on May 21, 2014, 02:33:27 PM
!@#!@#!@#!@# the Construction Zone on I-65 between Seymour and Scottsburg.

D@mn idiots have it down to one lane at times on THE major north-south Interstate in the state of Indiana.

Do your best to avoid this cluster fudge this summer.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 23, 2014, 11:15:07 PM
I know I keep bringing up the Toll Road, and I apologize. However, it looks like that's where most of the action is in my area.

On top of everything I mentioned previously, extensive rehabilitation will begin as early as next week at the Salt Creek bridges, located between the Portage Toll Barrier and Indiana 149. During construction, a reversible lane system will be implemented, where rush-hour traffic will have two lanes while off-peak traffic will have only one lane open throughout the zone. Expect this to last throughout the summer.

Good news: the bridge rehab on I-94 east of the Toll Road exchange (over U.S. 20) is in its final phase. Next week, the outer portion of the westbound bridge will be worked on, and this project may see midsummer completion.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 26, 2014, 07:39:32 AM
So this weekend I made a round trip covering 99% of I-65 in Indiana.  Maybe it was just because it was Holiday weekend, but we ended up having to constantly pass cars on the right because people were driving in the passing lane.  I'm not exaggerating when I say that we probably averaged having to do this once every five minutes.  More than half of these cars had Illinois plates.  Maybe Indiana (and other states) need to put up periodic signs reminding people to keep their asses in the right lane when they are not passing.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 26, 2014, 05:30:07 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 26, 2014, 07:39:32 AM
So this weekend I made a round trip covering 99% of I-65 in Indiana.  Maybe it was just because it was Holiday weekend, but we ended up having to constantly pass cars on the right because people were driving in the passing lane.  I'm not exaggerating when I say that we probably averaged having to do this once every five minutes.  More than half of these cars had Illinois plates.  Maybe Indiana (and other states) need to put up periodic signs reminding people to keep their asses in the right lane when they are not passing.

That doesn't shock me, people do that every time I use 65, I am surprised the people were from Illinois.  Whenever I use 65, the fastest drivers are always the Illinois drivers!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on May 27, 2014, 01:15:30 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 26, 2014, 07:39:32 AM
So this weekend I made a round trip covering 99% of I-65 in Indiana.  Maybe it was just because it was Holiday weekend, but we ended up having to constantly pass cars on the right because people were driving in the passing lane.  I'm not exaggerating when I say that we probably averaged having to do this once every five minutes.  More than half of these cars had Illinois plates.  Maybe Indiana (and other states) need to put up periodic signs reminding people to keep their asses in the right lane when they are not passing.

It's a common occurrence around Indy.  The emptiest lane in morning rush hour on 465 southbound on the East Side is the right lane.  People just move to the center two lanes and hold up traffic. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: trafficsignal on May 27, 2014, 09:10:53 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 26, 2014, 07:39:32 AM
So this weekend I made a round trip covering 99% of I-65 in Indiana.  Maybe it was just because it was Holiday weekend, but we ended up having to constantly pass cars on the right because people were driving in the passing lane.  I'm not exaggerating when I say that we probably averaged having to do this once every five minutes.  More than half of these cars had Illinois plates.  Maybe Indiana (and other states) need to put up periodic signs reminding people to keep their asses in the right lane when they are not passing.

No surprise to me, I remember frequent drives from Purdue to Indy with at least one or two Illinois drivers stuck in the left lane doing 70 exactly, with a wide open right lane next to them.  Infuriating.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Brandon on May 27, 2014, 10:23:01 AM
Quote from: trafficsignal on May 27, 2014, 09:10:53 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 26, 2014, 07:39:32 AM
So this weekend I made a round trip covering 99% of I-65 in Indiana.  Maybe it was just because it was Holiday weekend, but we ended up having to constantly pass cars on the right because people were driving in the passing lane.  I'm not exaggerating when I say that we probably averaged having to do this once every five minutes.  More than half of these cars had Illinois plates.  Maybe Indiana (and other states) need to put up periodic signs reminding people to keep their asses in the right lane when they are not passing.

No surprise to me, I remember frequent drives from Purdue to Indy with at least one or two Illinois drivers stuck in the left lane doing 70 exactly, with a wide open right lane next to them.  Infuriating.

The stupid thing is, Illinois has a keep right law.  It's paid about as much attention to as any other traffic law in Illinois, specifically Chicagoland.  There's a reason the middle letter in "FIB" is for Illinois.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 29, 2014, 01:13:44 PM
Some indiana news: ronald reagan pwky has funding for the stretch between 30th st and i-74. Also sr 267 will be getting a new name in avon soon they have a survey monkey link out to submit 3 names of your choice. Anyone familiar with the area have any ideas for the new name?

SAMSUNG-SGH-I337

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 29, 2014, 10:30:15 PM
link to the survey: http://www.avongov.org/egov/documents/1395071868_93683.pdf
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on May 30, 2014, 06:23:41 PM
Now it's time for Bloomington and Monroe County to get in on the decommissioning action!

http://wishtv.com/2014/05/30/state-looks-to-give-up-some-bloomington-area-roads/

May be time to say goodbye to SR 446, SR 48 (don't worry two stretches of that highway will remain elsewhere :D) and SR 45. No word on how Greene, Brown and Lawrence Counties will react to their stretches.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 30, 2014, 07:10:28 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on May 30, 2014, 06:23:41 PM
Now it's time for Bloomington and Monroe County to get in on the decommissioning action!

http://wishtv.com/2014/05/30/state-looks-to-give-up-some-bloomington-area-roads/

May be time to say goodbye to SR 446, SR 48 (don't worry two stretches of that highway will remain elsewhere :D) and SR 45. No word on how Greene, Brown and Lawrence Counties will react to their stretches.

So SR 45 and 446 will no longer exist at all? 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on May 30, 2014, 07:19:58 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on May 30, 2014, 06:23:41 PM
Now it's time for Bloomington and Monroe County to get in on the decommissioning action!

http://wishtv.com/2014/05/30/state-looks-to-give-up-some-bloomington-area-roads/

May be time to say goodbye to SR 446, SR 48 (don't worry two stretches of that highway will remain elsewhere :D) and SR 45. No word on how Greene, Brown and Lawrence Counties will react to their stretches.

Oh goodness!  :wow: I hope this doesn't happen!  :banghead:  :ded:

Except for IN 48. I can understand that decision. (One less random segment to deal with! :pan: )
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 31, 2014, 12:47:06 PM
45 makes sense since it is mostly being replaced by 69, i don't understand the 446 idea.  Why don't they rid themselves of 57?  It's completely useless now!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 31, 2014, 02:21:39 PM
I-94 is undergoing more repairs in the wake of this past winter. Repaving is in progress from Indiana 249 to the Michigan state line (with gaps in between). One lane will stay closed at all times with 45 mph speed limits. If you're making the journey to Michigan, it's probably best just to take US 20 and connect to US 12 anywhere east of Indiana 249 (because of the US 12 closure I mentioned earlier up thread).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on May 31, 2014, 05:48:40 PM
The only thing not right about SR 446 going away is it's access to state recreational areas along Lake Monroe, plus Hardin Ridge and the Hoosier National Forest. I'm not sure if it's entirely law or not, but it seems that the state has gone out of the way to make sure DNR properties are connected to the state highway system. SRs 369, 264 and 364 among a few others exist solely for that purpose. That said, no one will probably miss SR 48, which I would bet most people call 3rd Street anyway and SR 45 will have I-69 supersede it. I'm just not sure how that highway's truncation will go in the neighboring counties as this appears to be an arrangement with Monroe County only. Nothing's a done deal though it seems.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jnewkirk77 on May 31, 2014, 10:41:45 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on May 31, 2014, 05:48:40 PM
The only thing not right about SR 446 going away is it's access to state recreational areas along Lake Monroe, plus Hardin to and the Hoosier National Forest. I'm not sure if it's entirely law or not, but it seems that the state has gone out of the way to make sure DNR properties are connected to the state highway system. SRs 369, 264 and 364 among a few others exist solely for that purpose. That said, no one will probably miss SR 48, which I would bet most people call 3rd Street anyway and SR 45 will have I-69 supersede it. I'm just not sure how that highway's truncation will go in the neighboring counties as this appears to be an arrangement with Monroe County only. Nothing's a done deal though it seems.
I wouldn't be surprised to see them decommission the three you mentioned as well (minor correction: 269 not 369 over at Harmonie). But keep in mind that all roads inside state park boundaries are still considered state highways; they just aren't numbered.  Not sure how they'd do that with 446.

As for 45 and 57, they should get the ax as well, but it will be a question of if the counties feel they can maintain the added mileage. I don't see too many SW Indiana counties bragging that they have too much road money!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: andy on June 04, 2014, 12:11:20 AM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on May 31, 2014, 10:41:45 PM
As for 45 and 57, they should get the ax as well, but it will be a question of if the counties feel they can maintain the added mileage. I don't see too many SW Indiana counties bragging that they have too much road money!

I'm not sure why Monroe county would want to take over 45 SW of the city.  There is a lot along the road and the first I-69 exit west SR 37 doesn't effectively serve any of Monroe County. ( :-o, that's probably another story.)   Also interesting is that the two exchanges between SR-37 and US-231 are both tied to 45.  The first, a stub to 45 and 54 could be renamed from 445 to some ?54.  But, making 45 a county road could be seen as a down grade for those exchanges.

Probably because I live near it, I don't agree 57 is useless.  If so, I suppose 52 from Lebanon to Lafayette, US 40 and US 31 should also be axed.  Or do those get special exemption for being US routes?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on June 04, 2014, 08:25:21 AM
Yeah, the U.S. highway thing forces INDOT to keep those highways around. But even with that, as I pointed out earlier on another thread, SR 46 follows parts of I-74, SR 68 follows I-64, and SR 42 follows I-70.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on June 04, 2014, 12:21:26 PM
If Indiana can't take care of their roads then maybe they should stop building new ones.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 04, 2014, 04:01:25 PM
Quote from: US 41 on June 04, 2014, 12:21:26 PM
If Indiana can't take care of their roads then maybe they should stop building new ones.

Except that I'd rather INDOT focus their efforts building and taking care of nice new stretches of I-69 and US 31 rather than maintaining what are essentially a bunch of city streets.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 27, 2014, 10:59:34 AM
From INDOT's Facebook page:

KOKOMO, Ind. — The Indiana Department of Transportation and Kokomo Mayor Greg Goodnight have reached a tentative agreement to transfer 5.8 miles of State Road 22 to the city in exchange for cash and federal funding totaling more than $4 million.

"State Road 22 travels through the heart of Kokomo,"  said Mayor Goodnight. "We believe this transfer is good for both INDOT and the City."

Pending contract approval, the City of Kokomo - City Hall would take over responsibility for State Road 22 where it follows Sycamore Street, Washington Street and Markland Avenue between the west city limits and the new U.S. 31 freeway. As compensation, the city would receive $1 million in cash and just over $3 million in federal funds over the next three years to use for transportation improvements.

"This agreement allows the city to develop the road to community standards and fund transportation improvements across the city,"  said INDOT District Deputy Commissioner Brandye Hendrickson.

This announcement follows ongoing meetings and discussions between INDOT and local officials, State Reps. Mike Karickhoff and Heath VanNatter, and State Sen. James Buck.

INDOT remains fully committed to continuing support of Kokomo and Howard County. During the past seven years, INDOT has invested an average of $53 million per year on highway improvements in Howard County. Transportation taxes collected in the county is approximately $13 million annually.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on June 27, 2014, 12:00:34 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 27, 2014, 10:59:34 AM
From INDOT's Facebook page:

KOKOMO, Ind. — The Indiana Department of Transportation and Kokomo Mayor Greg Goodnight have reached a tentative agreement to transfer 5.8 miles of State Road 22 to the city in exchange for cash and federal funding totaling more than $4 million.

"State Road 22 travels through the heart of Kokomo,"  said Mayor Goodnight. "We believe this transfer is good for both INDOT and the City."

Pending contract approval, the City of Kokomo - City Hall would take over responsibility for State Road 22 where it follows Sycamore Street, Washington Street and Markland Avenue between the west city limits and the new U.S. 31 freeway. As compensation, the city would receive $1 million in cash and just over $3 million in federal funds over the next three years to use for transportation improvements.

"This agreement allows the city to develop the road to community standards and fund transportation improvements across the city,"  said INDOT District Deputy Commissioner Brandye Hendrickson.

This announcement follows ongoing meetings and discussions between INDOT and local officials, State Reps. Mike Karickhoff and Heath VanNatter, and State Sen. James Buck.

INDOT remains fully committed to continuing support of Kokomo and Howard County. During the past seven years, INDOT has invested an average of $53 million per year on highway improvements in Howard County. Transportation taxes collected in the county is approximately $13 million annually.

And it begins again... :ded:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on June 27, 2014, 07:34:17 PM
INDOT is giving parts of SR 56 in Madison back to the city as well.

http://www.in.gov/activecalendar/EventList.aspx?view=EventDetails&eventidn=176357&information_id=202992&type=&syndicate=syndicate

Hopefully they just reroute 56 around the city via US 421 and SR 62 to avoid a Lafayette scenario. As for SR 22, anyone else just think we should kill that highway as it is. Give the remaining several miles from the Kokomo city limits to SR 29 to Howard County and give the short stretch of non-multiplexed highway from I-69 to SR 5 in Grant County some short three-digit number, or give it back to that county, and make the rest of the highway solely US 35.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on June 27, 2014, 10:44:01 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on June 27, 2014, 07:34:17 PM
INDOT is giving parts of SR 56 in Madison back to the city as well.

http://www.in.gov/activecalendar/EventList.aspx?view=EventDetails&eventidn=176357&information_id=202992&type=&syndicate=syndicate

Hopefully they just reroute 56 around the city via US 421 and SR 62 to avoid a Lafayette scenario. As for SR 22, anyone else just think we should kill that highway as it is. Give the remaining several miles from the Kokomo city limits to SR 29 to Howard County and give the short stretch of non-multiplexed highway from I-69 to SR 5 in Grant County some short three-digit number, or give it back to that county, and make the rest of the highway solely US 35.

INDOT is going crazy on decommissioning its state routes. It may save money, but the discontinuity of routes I am afraid is going to confuse drivers. :banghead: As for SR 22 I support decommissioning it west of 931.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 28, 2014, 11:26:23 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on June 27, 2014, 07:34:17 PM
INDOT is giving parts of SR 56 in Madison back to the city as well.

http://www.in.gov/activecalendar/EventList.aspx?view=EventDetails&eventidn=176357&information_id=202992&type=&syndicate=syndicate

Hopefully they just reroute 56 around the city via US 421 and SR 62 to avoid a Lafayette scenario. As for SR 22, anyone else just think we should kill that highway as it is. Give the remaining several miles from the Kokomo city limits to SR 29 to Howard County and give the short stretch of non-multiplexed highway from I-69 to SR 5 in Grant County some short three-digit number, or give it back to that county, and make the rest of the highway solely US 35.

What about SR 7? and SR 22 is useless, why can't INDOT reroute its highways in ways that make sense?  Starting and stopping them is stupid, if you can't decommission an entire route, don't do it in pieces, it's confusing, who is in charge of this?!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on June 28, 2014, 01:01:08 PM
Quote from: billtm on June 27, 2014, 10:44:01 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on June 27, 2014, 07:34:17 PM
INDOT is giving parts of SR 56 in Madison back to the city as well.

http://www.in.gov/activecalendar/EventList.aspx?view=EventDetails&eventidn=176357&information_id=202992&type=&syndicate=syndicate

Hopefully they just reroute 56 around the city via US 421 and SR 62 to avoid a Lafayette scenario. As for SR 22, anyone else just think we should kill that highway as it is. Give the remaining several miles from the Kokomo city limits to SR 29 to Howard County and give the short stretch of non-multiplexed highway from I-69 to SR 5 in Grant County some short three-digit number, or give it back to that county, and make the rest of the highway solely US 35.

INDOT is going crazy on decommissioning its state routes. It may save money, but the discontinuity of routes I am afraid is going to confuse drivers. :banghead: As for SR 22 I support decommissioning it west of 931.

On the contrary. The parts of between cities (such as the route from Burlington to Kokomo) are not the target - the targets are the miles of roads in built up areas. The problems with INDOT's strategy are that you either get some strangely discontinuous routes and/or state roads that just abruptly end at an arbitrary boundary.

If such roads as SR 22 west of Kokomo were to be targeted I'd start with ones with very low volumes of traffic (like SR 26 west of Lafayette). Still, the idea is that we need decent routes in rural areas where state maintenance is the only guarantee of that.

As for decommisioning SR 22 in favor of US 35, why not the opposite? US 35 as a route in Indiana makes no sense whatsoever. Dump US 35 and call it SR 35 north of Kokomo and SR 34 from Richmond to Muncie. All other parts are multiplexed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on June 28, 2014, 02:24:36 PM
Quote from: mukade on June 28, 2014, 01:01:08 PM
Quote from: billtm on June 27, 2014, 10:44:01 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on June 27, 2014, 07:34:17 PM
INDOT is giving parts of SR 56 in Madison back to the city as well.

http://www.in.gov/activecalendar/EventList.aspx?view=EventDetails&eventidn=176357&information_id=202992&type=&syndicate=syndicate

Hopefully they just reroute 56 around the city via US 421 and SR 62 to avoid a Lafayette scenario. As for SR 22, anyone else just think we should kill that highway as it is. Give the remaining several miles from the Kokomo city limits to SR 29 to Howard County and give the short stretch of non-multiplexed highway from I-69 to SR 5 in Grant County some short three-digit number, or give it back to that county, and make the rest of the highway solely US 35.

INDOT is going crazy on decommissioning its state routes. It may save money, but the discontinuity of routes I am afraid is going to confuse drivers. :banghead: As for SR 22 I support decommissioning it west of 931.

On the contrary. The parts of between cities (such as the route from Burlington to Kokomo) are not the target - the targets are the miles of roads in built up areas. The problems with INDOT's strategy are that you either get some strangely discontinuous routes and/or state roads that just abruptly end at an arbitrary boundary.

If such roads as SR 22 west of Kokomo were to be targeted I'd start with ones with very low volumes of traffic (like SR 26 west of Lafayette). Still, the idea is that we need decent routes in rural areas where state maintenance is the only guarantee of that.

As for decommisioning SR 22 in favor of US 35, why not the opposite? US 35 as a route in Indiana makes no sense whatsoever. Dump US 35 and call it SR 35 north of Kokomo and SR 34 from Richmond to Muncie. All other parts are multiplexed.


I totally agree, INDOT is creating a bunch of gaps in routes through cities that should be continuous. A prime example of that is Lafayette with US 52 being routed awkwardly, and state routes 26 and 25 being split.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on June 28, 2014, 08:49:12 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 28, 2014, 11:26:23 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on June 27, 2014, 07:34:17 PM
INDOT is giving parts of SR 56 in Madison back to the city as well.

http://www.in.gov/activecalendar/EventList.aspx?view=EventDetails&eventidn=176357&information_id=202992&type=&syndicate=syndicate

Hopefully they just reroute 56 around the city via US 421 and SR 62 to avoid a Lafayette scenario. As for SR 22, anyone else just think we should kill that highway as it is. Give the remaining several miles from the Kokomo city limits to SR 29 to Howard County and give the short stretch of non-multiplexed highway from I-69 to SR 5 in Grant County some short three-digit number, or give it back to that county, and make the rest of the highway solely US 35.

What about SR 7? and SR 22 is useless, why can't INDOT reroute its highways in ways that make sense?  Starting and stopping them is stupid, if you can't decommission an entire route, don't do it in pieces, it's confusing, who is in charge of this?!

I assume SR 7 will be truncated to SR 62 north of Madison. Might as well, I wasn't even sure if that part of SR 7 was still a state highway and thought that it might have been decommissioned already, but apparently it isn't.

While in places like Kokomo and Madison getting rid of the highway but keeping the street name probably doesn't hurt much on confussion other than a lack of highway shield. In Avon on the other hand, there are still street signs that say SR 267 all over the place and right now I am not even sure what the name of the road is. They are coming up with a name right now (too bad Reagan's already taken to the east, knowing Hendricks County.) It's easy for Brownsburg to say Brown Street but harder when finding out what road my friend lives off of in Avon.

And then there's the former SR 334 off of I-65, which is Whitestown Parkway, even if the actual town of Whitestown (city limits do stretch to the former SR 334) is a few miles to the north. Most of my life, this was the highway that connected I-65 with Zionsville, so of course Whitestown Parkway it is. It does become Oak Street once you cross into Zionsville limits however. And finally, I'm still trying to get used to Campus Parkway and Southeastern Parkway outside of Fishers and Noblesville....ugh, why can't it just be 146th Street out to I-69. Okay, end rant.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ctrabs74 on June 29, 2014, 07:32:03 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 23, 2014, 11:15:07 PM
I know I keep bringing up the Toll Road, and I apologize. However, it looks like that's where most of the action is in my area.

On top of everything I mentioned previously, extensive rehabilitation will begin as early as next week at the Salt Creek bridges, located between the Portage Toll Barrier and Indiana 149. During construction, a reversible lane system will be implemented, where rush-hour traffic will have two lanes while off-peak traffic will have only one lane open throughout the zone. Expect this to last throughout the summer.

Good news: the bridge rehab on I-94 east of the Toll Road exchange (over U.S. 20) is in its final phase. Next week, the outer portion of the westbound bridge will be worked on, and this project may see midsummer completion.

It's about time they're finally starting to work on the Toll Road. That has to be one of the roughest stretches of road that I don't think has been rebuilt in decades. It's especially uncomfortable when you're riding as a passenger on a Greyhound bus (as I did last weekend).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 30, 2014, 07:52:05 AM
Quote from: billtm on June 28, 2014, 02:24:36 PM
I totally agree, INDOT is creating a bunch of gaps in routes through cities that should be continuous. A prime example of that is Lafayette with US 52 being routed awkwardly, and state routes 26 and 25 being split.

I am perfectly fine with INDOT turning over control of urban routes to cities.  Anything that gives INDOT more resources to get I-65 six-laned faster.

How to deal with the signing and numbering of highways once this happens seems to have no perfect solutions.  One thing that Clark county did was to re-sign the decommissioned state highways as 'County Highways' of the same number.  So IN 111, 160, 311 and 403 are now CR 111, 160, 311 and 403.  They even made signs that look exactly like state highway signs except that the top of the sign reads 'County Highway' in place of 'INDIANA'.  This way everybody can still call the roads by their numbers.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on June 30, 2014, 11:50:56 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 30, 2014, 07:52:05 AM
Quote from: billtm on June 28, 2014, 02:24:36 PM
I totally agree, INDOT is creating a bunch of gaps in routes through cities that should be continuous. A prime example of that is Lafayette with US 52 being routed awkwardly, and state routes 26 and 25 being split.

I am perfectly fine with INDOT turning over control of urban routes to cities.  Anything that gives INDOT more resources to get I-65 six-laned faster.

How to deal with the signing and numbering of highways once this happens seems to have no perfect solutions.  One thing that Clark county did was to re-sign the decommissioned state highways as 'County Highways' of the same number.  So IN 111, 160, 311 and 403 are now CR 111, 160, 311 and 403.  They even made signs that look exactly like state highway signs except that the top of the sign reads 'County Highway' in place of 'INDIANA'.  This way everybody can still call the roads by their numbers.

That's really clever! :thumbsup: But instead of 'County Highway' I would've put 'CLARK' in the top line.
Does anyone have any pics? :hmmm:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on June 30, 2014, 08:36:18 PM
The idea is good, but the signs are done very poorly.

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FSR1%2FSR160StartEast-2013-4.jpg&hash=264b3e2616a6073687a8053df395f79d349d1e7f)

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on June 30, 2014, 09:29:45 PM
Quote from: mukade on June 30, 2014, 08:36:18 PM
The idea is good, but the signs are done very poorly.

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FSR1%2FSR160StartEast-2013-4.jpg&hash=264b3e2616a6073687a8053df395f79d349d1e7f)

Ahh! My eyes!!! :crazy: X-(
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 01, 2014, 11:47:52 AM
Has construction began on the new us 41 Lloyd expressway interchange began?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Avalanchez71 on July 01, 2014, 12:46:20 PM
Someone should advise said county that the MUCTD already has an approved county highway shield.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 01, 2014, 05:35:10 PM
For whatever reason Indiana just doesn't do the pentagon for county highways. Anyways, the county highway shields look similar to what I've seen in Ohio, so maybe that's what's up.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on July 01, 2014, 08:37:46 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 01, 2014, 05:35:10 PM
For whatever reason Indiana just doesn't do the pentagon for county highways. Anyways, the county highway shields look similar to what I've seen in Ohio, so maybe that's what's up.

In rare cases you see them - I have seen one each in Johnson and Montgomery counties and the ITR had a pentagon at the Elkhart CR 17 exit.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jnewkirk77 on July 02, 2014, 05:53:23 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 01, 2014, 11:47:52 AM
Has construction began on the new us 41 Lloyd expressway interchange began?

They've been clearing the necessary land, so I think it is underway.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 02, 2014, 08:08:24 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on May 30, 2014, 06:23:41 PM
Now it's time for Bloomington and Monroe County to get in on the decommissioning action!

http://wishtv.com/2014/05/30/state-looks-to-give-up-some-bloomington-area-roads/

May be time to say goodbye to SR 446, SR 48 (don't worry two stretches of that highway will remain elsewhere :D) and SR 45. No word on how Greene, Brown and Lawrence Counties will react to their stretches.
Any idea why sr 446 is signed east west?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 02, 2014, 08:39:10 AM
It's an even-numbered highway. It's completely stupid (and this is coming from someone who's driven that highway plenty of times) but for Indiana state highway, odd numbers are N-S, even numbers are E-W, though there may be an exception somewhere to that.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: andy on July 02, 2014, 09:59:14 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 02, 2014, 08:39:10 AM
It's an even-numbered highway. It's completely stupid (and this is coming from someone who's driven that highway plenty of times) but for Indiana state highway, odd numbers are N-S, even numbers are E-W, though there may be an exception somewhere to that.

As a three digit road, it is a child of 46 and does not follow the even/odd rule.
But, I thought an even leading digit indicated a loop or returning child. This should have been 146, 346, 546, or whatever.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on July 02, 2014, 10:24:46 AM
Today's Kokomo Tribune states that the city of Kokomo will take control of IN 22 all the way east to the new US 31.  This resolves the feud between the city and INDOT of the proposed INDOT installation of "tuff curbs" along Markland Ave / IN 22 on both sides of IN 931. The mayor states that they may remove some traffic signals on the street, a practice that has been successfull throughout the city the last few years.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on July 02, 2014, 01:01:08 PM
Quote from: andy on July 02, 2014, 09:59:14 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 02, 2014, 08:39:10 AM
It's an even-numbered highway. It's completely stupid (and this is coming from someone who's driven that highway plenty of times) but for Indiana state highway, odd numbers are N-S, even numbers are E-W, though there may be an exception somewhere to that.

As a three digit road, it is a child of 46 and does not follow the even/odd rule.
But, I thought an even leading digit indicated a loop or returning child. This should have been 146, 346, 546, or whatever.

IIRC, the loop/spur rule doesn't apply for 3-digit Indiana state routes. I think the rule is: The higher the first digit, the less of a priority the route is.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 02, 2014, 05:40:54 PM
Quote from: monty on July 02, 2014, 10:24:46 AM
Today's Kokomo Tribune states that the city of Kokomo will take control of IN 22 all the way east to the new US 31.  This resolves the feud between the city and INDOT of the proposed INDOT installation of "tuff curbs" along Markland Ave / IN 22 on both sides of IN 931. The mayor states that they may remove some traffic signals on the street, a practice that has been successfull throughout the city the last few years.

Kokomo got screwed in that deal, only $4 million for 6 miles of state road?  Also what are tuff curbs?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on July 02, 2014, 06:24:08 PM
Quote from: andy on July 02, 2014, 09:59:14 AM
But, I thought an even leading digit indicated a loop or returning child. This should have been 146, 346, 546, or whatever.
No such rule exists. For example, SR 201, SR 212, SR 213, SR 218, SR 225, SR 227, SR 237, SR 240, and many others never return to their parent. As a matter of fact, there is no guarantee they even touch their parent: SR 201, SR 213, SR 218, and SR 236.

Quote from: monty on July 02, 2014, 10:24:46 AM
Today's Kokomo Tribune states that the city of Kokomo will take control of IN 22 all the way east to the new US 31.  This resolves the feud between the city and INDOT of the proposed INDOT installation of "tuff curbs" along Markland Ave / IN 22 on both sides of IN 931. The mayor states that they may remove some traffic signals on the street, a practice that has been successfull throughout the city the last few years.

This is consistent with what INDOT is doing in other cities. I am not sure why Kokomo doesn't take SR 931 because the same principle applies there and the city has constant problems with the mowing of the median. If INDOT gives the city money to rebuild the road, i don't see a down side.

Quote from: billtm on July 02, 2014, 01:01:08 PM
I think the rule is: The higher the first digit, the less of a priority the route is.

No such rule exists. SR 912 is almost all freeway in an urban area so is a major highway. SR 106, SR 115, SR 117, SR 128, SR 130, and SR 269 are examples of minor state roads.

Quote from: silverback1065 on July 02, 2014, 05:40:54 PM
Kokomo got screwed in that deal, only $4 million for 6 miles of state road?  Also what are tuff curbs?

Over half the road has been rebuilt in the last 15 years or so. They need to improve and widen Markland Avenue at SR 931, though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on July 02, 2014, 06:38:49 PM
Aren't the 900 series IN routes a separate class though?

INDOT has been anal about 3-digit routes not changing directions midway, going so far as to have SR 126 and 526 end at each other just so that 126, which ran east-west, could be signed E-W, and 526, running north-south, could be signed N-S.  Together they really made up one route that started at US 231, crossed SR 26, and ended at Purdue Airport.  But two numbers to avoid an N-S route running for a mile east-west.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on July 02, 2014, 07:10:06 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on July 02, 2014, 06:38:49 PM
Aren't the 900 series IN routes a separate class though?

INDOT has been anal about 3-digit routes not changing directions midway, going so far as to have SR 126 and 526 end at each other just so that 126, which ran east-west, could be signed E-W, and 526, running north-south, could be signed N-S.  Together they really made up one route that started at US 231, crossed SR 26, and ended at Purdue Airport.  But two numbers to avoid an N-S route running for a mile east-west.

The 900 series were all in major urban areas, and SR 930, 931, and 933 are apparently ones INDOT wants to turn back to local agencies. I wouldn't call Kokomo a major urban area, however. But SR 912 is not really in the category of a local road that should be turned back.

As for routes changing directions midway through, SR 162 changes direction twice making a backward "C" shape. I think others change direction as well - SR 235, for example. While SR 126 and 526 are two routes that don't make an "L shape, back in the 1970s SR 146 and SR 346 near IU did.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on July 02, 2014, 07:50:15 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on July 02, 2014, 06:38:49 PM
Aren't the 900 series IN routes a separate class though?

INDOT has been anal about 3-digit routes not changing directions midway, going so far as to have SR 126 and 526 end at each other just so that 126, which ran east-west, could be signed E-W, and 526, running north-south, could be signed N-S.  Together they really made up one route that started at US 231, crossed SR 26, and ended at Purdue Airport.  But two numbers to avoid an N-S route running for a mile east-west.

Actually, in looking at older maps, it looks like SR 526 originally only went south from SR 26 to the airport (as late as 1962). So when it was extended north, it was probably easier to do what they did rather than renumbering one or the other.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on July 02, 2014, 10:43:22 PM
Quote from: mukade on July 02, 2014, 07:50:15 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on July 02, 2014, 06:38:49 PM
Aren't the 900 series IN routes a separate class though?

INDOT has been anal about 3-digit routes not changing directions midway, going so far as to have SR 126 and 526 end at each other just so that 126, which ran east-west, could be signed E-W, and 526, running north-south, could be signed N-S.  Together they really made up one route that started at US 231, crossed SR 26, and ended at Purdue Airport.  But two numbers to avoid an N-S route running for a mile east-west.

Actually, in looking at older maps, it looks like SR 526 originally only went south from SR 26 to the airport (as late as 1962). So when it was extended north, it was probably easier to do what they did rather than renumbering one or the other.

Interesting--the 1964 topo shows 526 and 126, with 526 indeed only south of 26 to the airport in the 1952 topo.  Did the extension of 526 and the addition of 126 happen separately? Why would they have numbered 126 if it didn't meet 26 or 526?  INDOT is a mystery...  :P

126/526 was a weirdo especially because of the slightly acute angle where they met; after heading west on 126, if you turned onto 526 you were heading south-southeast but eventually meet 26 where you can continue west.  With 26 "ending" just west of the former 26/526 junction at 52/231 now, 526 would be orphaned and away it went.  God, I hate all these silly decommissionings, especially for thru routes like 25 and 26 that just end and pick up again with no sign for people actually trying to follow the routes as to how to find the continuation.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on July 02, 2014, 10:54:02 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on July 02, 2014, 10:43:22 PM
Quote from: mukade on July 02, 2014, 07:50:15 PM

Actually, in looking at older maps, it looks like SR 526 originally only went south from SR 26 to the airport (as late as 1962). So when it was extended north, it was probably easier to do what they did rather than renumbering one or the other.

Interesting--the 1964 topo shows 526 and 126, with 526 indeed only south of 26 to the airport in the 1952 topo.  Did the extension of 526 and the addition of 126 happen separately? Why would they have numbered 126 if it didn't meet 26 or 526?  INDOT is a mystery...  :P

126/526 was a weirdo especially because of the slightly acute angle where they met; after heading west on 126, if you turned onto 526 you were heading south-southeast but eventually meet 26 where you can continue west.  With 26 "ending" just west of the former 26/526 junction at 52/231 now, 526 would be orphaned and away it went.  God, I hate all these silly decommissionings, especially for thru routes like 25 and 26 that just end and pick up again with no sign for people actually trying to follow the routes as to how to find the continuation.

It is not too uncommon that three digit state roads do not ever meet their parents. I listed some in another post, but there are actually several more. Some used to meet their parent and some never have. The perpendicular child routes (like SR 526) are much less common than the parallel ones (like SR 126).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: trafficsignal on July 03, 2014, 07:36:07 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 02, 2014, 05:40:54 PM

Kokomo got screwed in that deal, only $4 million for 6 miles of state road?  Also what are tuff curbs?

Tuff curbs:

https://maps.google.com/?ll=40.042641,-86.13674&spn=0.000002,0.001206&t=h&z=20&layer=c&cbll=40.042641,-86.13674&panoid=3xpj5nLTAh-ew5mFCdDuWQ&cbp=12,67.66,,0,1.1 (https://maps.google.com/?ll=40.042641,-86.13674&spn=0.000002,0.001206&t=h&z=20&layer=c&cbll=40.042641,-86.13674&panoid=3xpj5nLTAh-ew5mFCdDuWQ&cbp=12,67.66,,0,1.1)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: andy on July 03, 2014, 11:52:34 AM
Quote from: trafficsignal on July 03, 2014, 07:36:07 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 02, 2014, 05:40:54 PM

Kokomo got screwed in that deal, only $4 million for 6 miles of state road?  Also what are tuff curbs?

Tuff curbs:

https://maps.google.com/?ll=40.042641,-86.13674&spn=0.000002,0.001206&t=h&z=20&layer=c&cbll=40.042641,-86.13674&panoid=3xpj5nLTAh-ew5mFCdDuWQ&cbp=12,67.66,,0,1.1 (https://maps.google.com/?ll=40.042641,-86.13674&spn=0.000002,0.001206&t=h&z=20&layer=c&cbll=40.042641,-86.13674&panoid=3xpj5nLTAh-ew5mFCdDuWQ&cbp=12,67.66,,0,1.1)

Makes me wonder if the word was originally "tuft" instead of "tuff"

Edit: actually, a google search for tuft curb verifies this.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefro on July 10, 2014, 08:41:54 AM
A report by a Blue Ribbon Panel commissioned by Governor Pence makes recommendations about future transportation priorities in Indiana (http://www.in.gov/gov/files/Blue_Ribbon_Panel_Report_July_9_2014.pdf)

Firstly, the report lists as the highest-priority to finish existing projects:
1) Ohio River Bridges Project
2) I-69 Extension from Evansville to Indianapolis
3) lliana Expressway
4) US 31 from Indianapolis to South Bend

For future road projects, there are 3 tiers

Tier 1 Projects:
1) Upgrade I-65 to 6-Lanes statewide
2) Upgrade I-70 to 6-Lanes statewide
3) I-69 Ohio River Bridge
4) Indiana Commerce Connector

Tier 2 Projects:
1) I-69 added travel lanes between Hamilton County and Muncie
2) SW Indiana Port Connections - Freeway upgrade of SR 62 from Mount Vernon to future I-69 (currently signed I-164)
3) Mid-States Corridor (I-67 upgrade of US 231 and connector to I-69 near Petersburg)
4) Freeway upgrade of US 30 Fort Wayne to Valparaiso

Tier 3 Projects:
1) Port of Indiana bridge over National Rail Corridor
2) Upgrade of SR 256 to 4-lanes to connect Madison to I-65 (seems really dumb to me when they could upgrade SR 56 instead)
3) Upgrade of SR1 to 4-lane expressway from Connersville to I-70

There are also recommendations to index the gas tax to inflation, move to a user fee model to fund transportation costs, and to designate a 1-mile section of I-65 as the "I-Way" to pilot future technologies (basically sounds like the Solar Roadway idea).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: trafficsignal on July 10, 2014, 10:46:51 AM
I saw this in a blurb a couple weeks ago and forgot until this recent gas tax discussion, but among the new laws that went into effect July 1 was a change in the gas tax:

INDIANAPOLIS, Ind. (June 30, 2014) — A host of new laws are taking effect on July 1 and rising prices at the pump will likely be the most immediate impact felt by Hoosiers.

Instead of the current 19-cent-per-gallon sales tax, Indiana is moving Tuesday to a rolling use tax.  The new gas use tax will be 7 percent of the average price of gasoline in the state during the previous month.

The Department of Revenue has released that July's gas tax will be $0.229 per gallon, calculated off of an average price of $3.269

Read more: http://fox59.com/2014/06/30/gas-tax-change-pumps-up-prices-as-several-new-state-laws-take-effect/#ixzz374pbgmhM


I remember hearing nothing about this leading up to July 1st, it seemingly appeared out of nowhere but was in effect a fairly significant bump in the gas tax - average price would need to be lower than $2.71 to get less tax than the old $0.19 tax.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on July 10, 2014, 12:45:14 PM
Quote from: thefro on July 10, 2014, 08:41:54 AM
A report by a Blue Ribbon Panel commissioned by Governor Pence makes recommendations about future transportation priorities in Indiana (http://www.in.gov/gov/files/Blue_Ribbon_Panel_Report_July_9_2014.pdf)

Firstly, the report lists as the highest-priority to finish existing projects:
1) Ohio River Bridges Project
2) I-69 Extension from Evansville to Indianapolis
3) lliana Expressway
4) US 31 from Indianapolis to South Bend

For future road projects, there are 3 tiers

Tier 1 Projects:
1) Upgrade I-65 to 6-Lanes statewide
2) Upgrade I-70 to 6-Lanes statewide
3) I-69 Ohio River Bridge
4) Indiana Commerce Connector

Tier 2 Projects:
1) I-69 added travel lanes between Hamilton County and Muncie
2) SW Indiana Port Connections - Freeway upgrade of SR 62 from Mount Vernon to future I-69 (currently signed I-164)
3) Mid-States Corridor (I-67 upgrade of US 231 and connector to I-69 near Petersburg)
4) Freeway upgrade of US 30 Fort Wayne to Valparaiso

Tier 3 Projects:
1) Port of Indiana bridge over National Rail Corridor
2) Upgrade of SR 256 to 4-lanes to connect Madison to I-65 (seems really dumb to me when they could upgrade SR 56 instead)
3) Upgrade of SR1 to 4-lane expressway from Connersville to I-70

There are also recommendations to index the gas tax to inflation, move to a user fee model to fund transportation costs, and to designate a 1-mile section of I-65 as the "I-Way" to pilot future technologies (basically sounds like the Solar Roadway idea).

I'm surprised a US-24 connector from Roanoke to I-469 wasn't mentioned/proposed on the document. :confused: All of the projects that were mentioned look great!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: hbelkins on July 10, 2014, 01:07:59 PM
Quote from: thefro on July 10, 2014, 08:41:54 AM
3) Mid-States Corridor (I-67 upgrade of US 231 and connector to I-69 near Petersburg)

Don't tell Owensboro's mayor.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 10, 2014, 04:32:14 PM
If I were to prioritize the future projects:

Quote from: thefro on July 10, 2014, 08:41:54 AM

1) Upgrade I-65 to 6-Lanes statewide
2) Upgrade I-70 to 6-Lanes statewide
3) I-69 Ohio River Bridge
4) I-69 added travel lanes between Hamilton County and Muncie
5) SW Indiana Port Connections - Freeway upgrade of SR 62 from Mount Vernon to future I-69 (currently signed I-164)
6) Freeway upgrade of US 30 Fort Wayne to Valparaiso
7) Mid-States Corridor (I-67 upgrade of US 231 and connector to I-69 near Petersburg)
8) Upgrade of SR 256 to 4-lanes to connect Madison to I-65 (seems really dumb to me when they could upgrade SR 56 instead)
9) Indiana Commerce Connector
10) Upgrade of SR1 to 4-lane expressway from Connersville to I-70
11) Port of Indiana bridge over National Rail Corridor

As to #8, if you are traveling from Indy to Madison, SR 256 is a shorter route than SR 56, so that's why SR 256.

As somebody who drives I-65 from Jeffersonville to Indy frequently and from Indy to Chicago occasionally, #1 can't happen fast enough.

One thing not on the list I would add is upgrading the rest of US 31 from SB to Indy that isn't currently under construction, or is that lumped in with the "existing project"?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 10, 2014, 05:58:44 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 10, 2014, 04:32:14 PM
If I were to prioritize the future projects:

Quote from: thefro on July 10, 2014, 08:41:54 AM

1) Upgrade I-65 to 6-Lanes statewide
2) Upgrade I-70 to 6-Lanes statewide
3) I-69 Ohio River Bridge
4) I-69 added travel lanes between Hamilton County and Muncie
5) SW Indiana Port Connections - Freeway upgrade of SR 62 from Mount Vernon to future I-69 (currently signed I-164)
6) Freeway upgrade of US 30 Fort Wayne to Valparaiso
7) Mid-States Corridor (I-67 upgrade of US 231 and connector to I-69 near Petersburg)
8) Upgrade of SR 256 to 4-lanes to connect Madison to I-65 (seems really dumb to me when they could upgrade SR 56 instead)
9) Indiana Commerce Connector
10) Upgrade of SR1 to 4-lane expressway from Connersville to I-70
11) Port of Indiana bridge over National Rail Corridor

As to #8, if you are traveling from Indy to Madison, SR 256 is a shorter route than SR 56, so that's why SR 256.

As somebody who drives I-65 from Jeffersonville to Indy frequently and from Indy to Chicago occasionally, #1 can't happen fast enough.

One thing not on the list I would add is upgrading the rest of US 31 from SB to Indy that isn't currently under construction, or is that lumped in with the "existing project"?

I think they are all good except the commerce connector and 67.  They need to upgrade 65 and 70 really bad!  I used US 41/52 going back to indy from chicago just to see if it was better, and honestly, if you can get over the lights in hammond and lafayette, its actually better, not sure if its actually faster, but at least I don't have to deal with a billion semis backing up traffic trying to pass each other! 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on July 10, 2014, 07:58:25 PM
I would expect that widening SR 46 east of Columbus toward Nashville  might make a list sooner or later. I am surprised the expensive I-465/I-69 NE Indy interchange rebuild is not listed in there.

As for US 31, I also hope that item entitled "4) US 31 from Indianapolis to South Bend" covers the sections not built or currently under construction.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on July 10, 2014, 08:46:37 PM
Quote from: mukade on July 10, 2014, 07:58:25 PM
I would expect that widening SR 46 east of Columbus toward Nashville  might make a list sooner or later. I am surprised the expensive I-465/I-69 NE Indy interchange rebuild is not listed in there.

As for US 31, I also hope that item entitled "4) US 31 from Indianapolis to South Bend" covers the sections not built or currently under construction.

The I-465/I-69 NE Indy interchange rebuild was mentioned in the document.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on July 10, 2014, 09:41:44 PM
Quote from: thefro on July 10, 2014, 08:41:54 AM
A report by a Blue Ribbon Panel commissioned by Governor Pence makes recommendations about future transportation priorities in Indiana (http://www.in.gov/gov/files/Blue_Ribbon_Panel_Report_July_9_2014.pdf)

My comments:

* I don't care for some of the ideas in the Chart on Page 14 such as adding HOV and truck only lanes, or allowing longer truck trailers.

* First I've heard of any consideration of upgrading US 36 to a freeway from I-465 (west side) to Avon (Page 64) - although the text on Page 113 only indicates upgrading to expressway standards.

* Given the proposed upgrading of IN 62 to a freeway from I-164 to Mount Vernon, and the slow upgrading of US 45 from IL 13 to the IL 141/IN 62 corridor, might be worth just planning on connecting the two corridors.

* Have to wonder a little about not at least reserving a corridor for the northern half of the Commerce Connecting, especially with the US 31 freeway upgrades - there won't be any long distance trips that use the US 31 corridor and some other corridor like there supposedly will be for I-69?

* The western terminus of the US 30 upgrades is lacking.  Consideration should be given to either restarting the fight to bring the Illiana east of I-65 to tie into US 30, or the freeway upgrades on IN 49 need to be finished between Valparaiso and the Toll Road.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on July 11, 2014, 04:57:12 PM
Wabash Pass Memorial Toll Bridge now toll free:

https://wabashpass.com/ (https://wabashpass.com/)

QuoteEffective July 1, 2014, the State of Indiana will discontinue tolls on the Wabash Bridge in Posey County, Ind. Motorists will no longer need to have a vehicle transponder or Wabash Pass account to use the bridge.

INDOT considered many factors in its evaluation, such as the volume of traffic, and the cost to maintain and operate the bridge versus the cost to continue tolling. INDOT believes this is the right decision regarding this particular bridge.

Motorists who have a Wabash Pass account with a positive account balance after July 1 will receive full refunds.

INDOT will continue collection efforts for those who are now in collection or who owe tolls accrued prior to July 1. Bridge users who have an outstanding negative toll balance have until July 31 to pay accrued charges. Unpaid balances will be turned over to a collection agency after that date.

Account holders can verify account balances, pay accrued charges, and confirm their mailing address for refunds by logging into their Wabash Pass accounts or calling (toll free) 1-855-Wabash1 (1-855-922-2741).

Since 1956, the Wabash Bridge has been a vital link for motorists traveling between White County, Ill., and Posey County, Ind. Our goal is to maintain this bridge as a key link for area residents who work, shop or travel in west central Illinois or southwestern Indiana.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 11, 2014, 05:02:33 PM
Well, we'll get another toll bridge in that part of the state soon enough, but with New Harmony's crossing closed I'm sure this is welcomed news for those in Posey County.

As for the panel's recommendations: Finish I-69 including the bridge, finish US 31 Indy to South Bend and widen I-65 and I-70 AND all of I-465 that isn't eight lanes yet. Those would be my priorities.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: J N Winkler on July 12, 2014, 06:36:56 PM
Short note, largely of a technical nature:  Indiana DOT has changed the ViewDocs platform that it uses to distribute plans, contract information books, question-and-answer sheets, permits, geotechnical reports, etc. for its construction projects.

The new interface, which gives access to projects of the June 20, 2014 and later lettings, is available here:

https://netservices.indot.in.gov/ViewDocs11g/

The old interface, which (for now, at least) is necessary to access older projects, has been moved here:

http://pscsapp.indot.in.gov/Viewdocs2.0/

The new interface loads a listing of all the documents available for a given contract in response to a search on its number.  This is an improvement over the old one, which required you to choose document type and showed you only 20 items per page for a given type.  It also makes batch-downloading easier to code since postdata has to be confected at only two points (to search by contract and to download a document), as opposed to three (to search by contract, to choose a document type, and to retrieve multiple pages of listings when more than 20 of a given type of document are available).  However, the new interface doesn't expose links to individual documents (in other words, you must retrieve them using the HTTP POST method, not the GET method), so it is no more friendly to spidering than the old one was.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on July 12, 2014, 10:47:39 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on July 10, 2014, 09:41:44 PM

* First I've heard of any consideration of upgrading US 36 to a freeway from I-465 (west side) to Avon (Page 64) - although the text on Page 113 only indicates upgrading to expressway standards.

* The western terminus of the US 30 upgrades is lacking.  Consideration should be given to either restarting the fight to bring the Illiana east of I-65 to tie into US 30, or the freeway upgrades on IN 49 need to be finished between Valparaiso and the Toll Road.

US 36 would be hard to upgrade. It's too built up. Extending the Illiana would be a good idea, but the locals don't want it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: pianocello on July 13, 2014, 12:03:22 PM
Quote from: US 41 on July 12, 2014, 10:47:39 PM
Extending the Illiana would be a good idea, but the locals don't want it.

Agreed. It would be easier to simply eliminate the 3 intersections left on SR 49 between Valparaiso and the Toll Road.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 13, 2014, 01:39:18 PM
Quote from: US 41 on July 12, 2014, 10:47:39 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on July 10, 2014, 09:41:44 PM

* First I've heard of any consideration of upgrading US 36 to a freeway from I-465 (west side) to Avon (Page 64) - although the text on Page 113 only indicates upgrading to expressway standards.

* The western terminus of the US 30 upgrades is lacking.  Consideration should be given to either restarting the fight to bring the Illiana east of I-65 to tie into US 30, or the freeway upgrades on IN 49 need to be finished between Valparaiso and the Toll Road.

US 36 would be hard to upgrade. It's too built up. Extending the Illiana would be a good idea, but the locals don't want it.

why do they want to upgrade us 36? there's nothing wrong with it, use 100S/100N if it's so bad (i wish they would rename those streets)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Indyroads on July 13, 2014, 06:35:28 PM
Does anyone have a list of recently decommissioned state roads in Indiana. I have just noticed that they have removed the SR-32 shields from the BGS overhead signs along I-65 which signals that SR-32 may have been decommissioned in that area but have not found any news reports about that.

Also i think that following in the footsteps of Florida these decommissioned routes should retain their numbers as County Highways instead of State Highways as mentioned earlier in this thread.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on July 13, 2014, 10:49:42 PM
Quote from: Indyroads on July 13, 2014, 06:35:28 PM
Does anyone have a list of recently decommissioned state roads in Indiana. I have just noticed that they have removed the SR-32 shields from the BGS overhead signs along I-65 which signals that SR-32 may have been decommissioned in that area but have not found any news reports about that.

I noticed that they were missing northbound but they still had the sheild on the southbound BGS. I went by there a couple weeks ago. So maybe they took down the southbound shields later? :confused:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Indyroads on July 14, 2014, 12:01:39 AM
no just verified that the 32 shields remain on the SB approaching 3 BGS's seems it may be just the NB exit BGS that is missing the route 32 marker. although there isn't a SR-32 reassurance marker WB of I-65 until you get about 5 miles west of town just past 500W.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 14, 2014, 06:28:35 PM
Quote from: Indyroads on July 14, 2014, 12:01:39 AM
no just verified that the 32 shields remain on the SB approaching 3 BGS's seems it may be just the NB exit BGS that is missing the route 32 marker. although there isn't a SR-32 reassurance marker WB of I-65 until you get about 5 miles west of town just past 500W.

I wondered the same thing today driving to Chicago, I'm almost certain the northbound bgs's say SR 32, just that the last of the 3 bgs's telling you of the exit is missing the 32 shield.  I think it just fell off.  There are so many BGS's blown over or damaged around the state.  If you look at INDOT's roadway inventory, it still says it's their road: https://gis.in.gov/apps/DOT/RoadwayInventory/ I'm not sure how much they update it, but that's where I go to see what they decommission. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 17, 2014, 11:06:03 PM
I drove it, and SR does still exist as it always has been, it is just horribly signed, all the signs must have been knocked down due to weather.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on August 04, 2014, 03:19:15 PM
Observed INDOT installing what appears to be a left turn signal from SR 28 westbound to US 31 southbound this morning.  this will aid traffic heading south from the Tipton Transmission plant until the new interchange is built.
Title: Hamilton County pushes for 9 roundabouts on Ind. 37
Post by: mukade on August 08, 2014, 10:37:34 PM
Quote
The Hamilton County Board of Commissioners is pushing a solution – nine new roundabouts on Ind. 37 – to keep traffic moving. They also are considering purchasing the highway from Indiana Department of Transportation as part of a $243 million road improvement deal.

Negotiations with INDOT have not started yet, but commissioners have launched a series of meetings with the Fishers and Noblesville councils to gain support for the plan.

Hamilton County pushes for 9 roundabouts on Ind. 37 (http://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/hamilton-county/fishers/2014/08/08/hamilton-county-pushes-roundabouts-ind/13779775/) (Indy Star)
Title: Re: Hamilton County pushes for 9 roundabouts on Ind. 37
Post by: silverback1065 on August 08, 2014, 11:17:04 PM
Quote from: mukade on August 08, 2014, 10:37:34 PM
Quote
The Hamilton County Board of Commissioners is pushing a solution – nine new roundabouts on Ind. 37 – to keep traffic moving. They also are considering purchasing the highway from Indiana Department of Transportation as part of a $243 million road improvement deal.

Negotiations with INDOT have not started yet, but commissioners have launched a series of meetings with the Fishers and Noblesville councils to gain support for the plan.

Hamilton County pushes for 9 roundabouts on Ind. 37 (http://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/hamilton-county/fishers/2014/08/08/hamilton-county-pushes-roundabouts-ind/13779775/) (Indy Star)

I like the idea, but don't like the idea of them taking on maintenance of SR 37, I think the people raising concerns about that are right, I don't see them being able to afford it in the future when major repairs are needed.  It makes no sense why they added to the problem by adding a new road and light at 135th street, they complain about the traffic lights, and turn around and add another one?  I know it's just one light, but seriously?  Was it really necessary?  I really feel like that whole area was poorly planned.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: trafficsignal on August 11, 2014, 09:29:49 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 08, 2014, 11:17:04 PM
Quote from: mukade on August 08, 2014, 10:37:34 PM
Quote
The Hamilton County Board of Commissioners is pushing a solution – nine new roundabouts on Ind. 37 – to keep traffic moving. They also are considering purchasing the highway from Indiana Department of Transportation as part of a $243 million road improvement deal.

Negotiations with INDOT have not started yet, but commissioners have launched a series of meetings with the Fishers and Noblesville councils to gain support for the plan.

Hamilton County pushes for 9 roundabouts on Ind. 37 (http://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/hamilton-county/fishers/2014/08/08/hamilton-county-pushes-roundabouts-ind/13779775/) (Indy Star)

I like the idea, but don't like the idea of them taking on maintenance of SR 37, I think the people raising concerns about that are right, I don't see them being able to afford it in the future when major repairs are needed.  It makes no sense why they added to the problem by adding a new road and light at 135th street, they complain about the traffic lights, and turn around and add another one?  I know it's just one light, but seriously?  Was it really necessary?  I really feel like that whole area was poorly planned.

In theory, its there to reduce delays for the adjacent signals (that the internal network connects to) when the additional development happens.  In practice, the developer has an easier job selling prospects when there is a signal in front of their outlot.  The only people that lose are the commuters that are heading past the site, but even then INDOT has done a lot of work in coordinating the signals to maintain platoons through the system.

Adding a lane (as some of those quoted in the article suggested) would help for a while, but eventually several of the intersections would need to become interchanges anyway.  Might as well do it now while its cheaper and leave room for the added lane in the future.

Final thought - I see no need to transfer ownership from INDOT.  Carmel did it to get a pot of money to do their prefered option, but with 3 entities sharing costs they could just throw a ton of money at INDOT to do the interchanges the way they want.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 11, 2014, 09:31:47 AM
Good insite
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on August 13, 2014, 09:51:13 PM
In addition to the roundabout interchanges under discussion for 37, there was an article last week (at the corner of Allisonville Road and 146th Street)  (edited to add the info in the previous set of parentheses).

Cost estimated at $22 million.  Hamilton County, Noblesville and Fishers would be involved.

No time frame given.

I'm adding a link below, but it is a pay site - doubt the link works for a non-subscriber, but maybe ...

http://thetimes24-7.com/main.asp?Search=1&ArticleID=40110&SectionID=1&SubSectionID=1&S=1

A portion of the article:

"There is no definite plan at this point," said Brad Davis, director of the Hamilton County Highway Department. "(The study) showed that because of the growth and increased traffic flow in that area, something needed to be done."

He painted a visual picture of the future interchange. "What would happen is 146th Street would actually dip down and go underneath Allisonville Road. Drivers would just have to get off on the ramp to go to Allisonville."

Davis said the cost of the project is estimated to be between $22 and $23 million after construction, right-of-way acquisitions, engineering fees and construction inspections.

"The interchange would take a little bit of additional property that we would have to buy," Davis said. "That's where we're at now."

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 13, 2014, 10:13:25 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on August 13, 2014, 09:51:13 PM
In addition to the roundabout interchanges under discussion for 37, there was an article last week

Cost estimated at $22 million.  Hamilton County, Noblesville and Fishers would be involved.

No time frame given.

I'm adding a link below, but it is a pay site - doubt the link works for a non-subscriber, but maybe ...

http://thetimes24-7.com/main.asp?Search=1&ArticleID=40110&SectionID=1&SubSectionID=1&S=1

A portion of the article:

"There is no definite plan at this point," said Brad Davis, director of the Hamilton County Highway Department. "(The study) showed that because of the growth and increased traffic flow in that area, something needed to be done."

He painted a visual picture of the future interchange. "What would happen is 146th Street would actually dip down and go underneath Allisonville Road. Drivers would just have to get off on the ramp to go to Allisonville."

Davis said the cost of the project is estimated to be between $22 and $23 million after construction, right-of-way acquisitions, engineering fees and construction inspections.

"The interchange would take a little bit of additional property that we would have to buy," Davis said. "That's where we're at now."

So is SR 37 going to be decommissioned?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on August 13, 2014, 11:51:11 PM
Ugh - somehow a portion of my post got erased before I hit post....   :pan: :pan:  Operator Error

The article is talking about a roundabout at the corner of Allisonville Road (old State Route 37) and 146th Street - this is about a mile or so west of current 37.  I saw nothing about decommissioning 37.

Let me try to edit my original post so no one else is confused by my stupidity...
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 14, 2014, 08:19:49 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on August 13, 2014, 09:51:13 PM
In addition to the roundabout interchanges under discussion for 37, there was an article last week (at the corner of Allisonville Road and 146th Street)  (edited to add the info in the previous set of parentheses).

Cost estimated at $22 million.  Hamilton County, Noblesville and Fishers would be involved.

No time frame given.

I'm adding a link below, but it is a pay site - doubt the link works for a non-subscriber, but maybe ...

http://thetimes24-7.com/main.asp?Search=1&ArticleID=40110&SectionID=1&SubSectionID=1&S=1

A portion of the article:

"There is no definite plan at this point," said Brad Davis, director of the Hamilton County Highway Department. "(The study) showed that because of the growth and increased traffic flow in that area, something needed to be done."

He painted a visual picture of the future interchange. "What would happen is 146th Street would actually dip down and go underneath Allisonville Road. Drivers would just have to get off on the ramp to go to Allisonville."

Davis said the cost of the project is estimated to be between $22 and $23 million after construction, right-of-way acquisitions, engineering fees and construction inspections.

"The interchange would take a little bit of additional property that we would have to buy," Davis said. "That's where we're at now."


With all the growth the area has seen and with 146th being the only E-W road between 116th and 32 that crosses the White River, 146th really could stand to get the Keystone treatment from 31 all the way over to 69, or at least to 37.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on August 14, 2014, 08:48:19 AM
146th Street has typically been viewed as the mythical northern leg of the outer Indianapolis beltway, along with Olio/Mt. Comfort Road, RR Pkwy and Worthsville Rd/SR 144, vaguely speaking of course. Despite that, I highly doubt we'll see the Keystone treatment done to that road in the near future, SR 37 will be done first. But to the question further up, the topic of decommissioning that part of SR 37 has been brought up before. Presumably to do this roundabout work that is what would have to happen, unless the state is willing to pay for all of this.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: trafficsignal on August 14, 2014, 10:27:53 AM
SR 37 should definitely be done first - I know the first time this was presented to the County it was suggested that SR 37 could be rerouted up I-69 to SR 13, then cosigned until they split in Elwood (they're already cosigned for 6+ miles in that area).  That could work, although SR 13 thru Lapel is not very fun as a through route.

The County has already begun preliminary investigations, knowing a 4-lane 146th Street won't work too far into the future - I've seen a queue extending from Allisonville to Hazel Dell (2.5+ miles) just due to volumes (no crashes).  It'll either need another through lane for the length or some alternative intersection designs to work in the future, since there doesn't seem to be any slowdown in the development.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 14, 2014, 04:21:08 PM
Quote from: trafficsignal on August 14, 2014, 10:27:53 AM
SR 37 should definitely be done first - I know the first time this was presented to the County it was suggested that SR 37 could be rerouted up I-69 to SR 13, then cosigned until they split in Elwood (they're already cosigned for 6+ miles in that area).  That could work, although SR 13 thru Lapel is not very fun as a through route.

The County has already begun preliminary investigations, knowing a 4-lane 146th Street won't work too far into the future - I've seen a queue extending from Allisonville to Hazel Dell (2.5+ miles) just due to volumes (no crashes).  It'll either need another through lane for the length or some alternative intersection designs to work in the future, since there doesn't seem to be any slowdown in the development.

I've actually developed a partially unnumbered workaround to getting NE of Indy without going through either Noblesville or Lapel.  I get off I-69 at Exit 210 and use Olio Rd and one other road whose name escapes me right now, to get up to 32 and then over to 13. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 14, 2014, 06:14:58 PM
can't they just build another bridge over the white river?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 15, 2014, 10:15:53 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 14, 2014, 06:14:58 PM
can't they just build another bridge over the white river?

Along the White River between 116th and 32 there are two golf courses and Conner Prairie, so no, they really couldn't build another bridge. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 15, 2014, 10:18:59 AM
You're right I forgot about that. They should imminent domain the golf courses haha but wishful thinking.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 15, 2014, 10:35:24 AM
But in all seriousness if you look at a map they could put bridges at 126th and 141st none of the golf courses cross where the road would go
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: trafficsignal on August 15, 2014, 01:16:58 PM
126th would be good, but it looks like it'd run through a park in Carmel, plus the backyards of $1 million+ homes in Fishers, so it'd be tough to buy the land and to persuade politicians to proceed.  141st doesn't connect to anything of consequence and is so close to 146th it probably wouldn't do much good.  There aren't any more good options for drawing regional traffic, although something between SR 32 & 146th would be helpful, maybe around 161st?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 15, 2014, 05:18:24 PM
Quote from: trafficsignal on August 15, 2014, 01:16:58 PM
126th would be good, but it looks like it'd run through a park in Carmel, plus the backyards of $1 million+ homes in Fishers, so it'd be tough to buy the land and to persuade politicians to proceed.  141st doesn't connect to anything of consequence and is so close to 146th it probably wouldn't do much good.  There aren't any more good options for drawing regional traffic, although something between SR 32 & 146th would be helpful, maybe around 161st?

they need to do something that's for sure, they can't carmelize (keystone pkwy) everything! Does anyone agree with me and saying that whole area wasn't very well planned in a transportation sense?  With the Whitestown/Zionsville area now growing, I hope they build better roads in that area before it's too late!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on August 17, 2014, 10:38:24 AM
161st looks like the best alternative to me. I would carmelize that before its too late! Even though there are alot of neighborhood entrances to get rid of, a mine to pave over, and some neighborhoods near 37 to bulldoze, it would be the next logical corridor after 146th.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on September 01, 2014, 05:03:04 PM
The 2015 Roadway Map is out. These are the changes I noticed at first glance:
- I-164 is gone in favor of I-69
- US 24 Fort to Port is shown as a freeway
- US 31 Kokomo is shown as a freeway
- SR 750 is shown, but without a route number
- SR 267 middle section is gone
- SR 60 and SR 135 follow the new bypass in Salem
- SR 126, SR 443, and SR 526 are gone
- Old Michigan Road and Lincoln Highway are shown in green

Errors and omissions:
- US 31 South Bend still shown as under construction
- SR 25 thru Lafayette shows the old route thru town (it is now decommissioned)

The only city map, again, is the Indy one.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 01, 2014, 08:34:17 PM
Quote from: mukade on September 01, 2014, 05:03:04 PM
The 2015 Roadway Map is out. These are the changes I noticed at first glance:
- I-164 is gone in favor of I-69
- US 24 Fort to Port is shown as a freeway
- US 31 Kokomo is shown as a freeway
- SR 750 is shown, but without a route number
- SR 267 middle section is gone
- SR 60 and SR 135 follow the new bypass in Salem
- SR 126, SR 443, and SR 526 are gone
- Old Michigan Road and Lincoln Highway are shown in green

Errors and omissions:
- US 31 South Bend still shown as under construction
- SR 25 thru Lafayette shows the old route thru town (it is now decommissioned)

The only city map, again, is the Indy one.

Are they going to continue that bypass to meet 135 north of salem, or is this it?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: trafficsignal on September 18, 2014, 07:04:51 AM
Toll Road troubles...

http://www.ibj.com/indiana-asks-tollway-firm-to-prove-financial-stability/PARAMS/article/49549 (http://www.ibj.com/indiana-asks-tollway-firm-to-prove-financial-stability/PARAMS/article/49549)
Title: Indiana Toll Road company to declare bankruptcy Monday
Post by: mukade on September 20, 2014, 07:48:30 AM
Toll Road company to declare bankruptcy Monday (http://www.nwitimes.com/business/transportation/toll-road-company-to-declare-bankruptcy-monday/article_2af1fdf2-45c1-5e50-bd70-3ad177a866a1.html) (NWI Times)

Quote
The operator of the Indiana Toll Road plans to declare bankruptcy on Monday and put its 75-year lease for the road up for sale to interested bidders...

If there are no takers, then what?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: oscar on September 20, 2014, 09:46:42 AM
Quote from: mukade on September 20, 2014, 07:48:30 AM
Toll Road company to declare bankruptcy Monday (http://www.nwitimes.com/business/transportation/toll-road-company-to-declare-bankruptcy-monday/article_2af1fdf2-45c1-5e50-bd70-3ad177a866a1.html) (NWI Times)

Quote
The operator of the Indiana Toll Road plans to declare bankruptcy on Monday and put its 75-year lease for the road up for sale to interested bidders...

If there are no takers, then what?

Worst-case scenario is that the state gets its toll road back (it still owns the road), but gets to keep the $3.8 billion it got for the lease.  But as the end of the article indicates, the more likely outcome is that if the lease isn't sold, the company keeps the lease, but the bondholders get what bankruptcy lawyers politely call a "haircut" (sometimes more like getting scalped), to bring the company's debt payments more in line with actual toll revenues.

The planned bankruptcy is "prepackaged", with most bondholders accepting that they're going to get screwed, and agreeing to the company's plan.  That's usually what happens with privatized toll roads, anyway.  The bondholders, knowing that history, presumably held out for above-average interest rates, to offset the risk that their gravy train would sooner or later grind to a halt.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on September 21, 2014, 09:17:30 PM
New Tipton County Road 560 W / 550 W is now open across the NS Frankfort - Tipton rail line.  This newly constructed county road is just a half mile east of US 31.  The new road connects Division Road and SR 28 to the truck entrance of the new Tipton Chrysler plant.  The new gated RR crossing replaces a dangerous angled one on the narrow road (100 S) that parallels the railroad.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US71 on September 24, 2014, 12:00:15 PM
Looks like it's official  (http://online.wsj.com/articles/indiana-toll-road-operator-files-for-bankruptcy-1411395866)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: J N Winkler on October 15, 2014, 01:36:02 PM
Thought I'd mention this:  Indiana DOT contract number 36984 (described as a "sign modernization"), for which bids were opened on September 10, will convert I-164 to I-69.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NE2 on October 15, 2014, 02:02:42 PM
Quote from: J N Winkler on October 15, 2014, 01:36:02 PM
Thought I'd mention this:  Indiana DOT contract number 36984 (described as a "sign modernization"), for which bids were opened on September 10, will convert I-164 to I-69.
Where will milepost 0 be? The official south end of I-69 is at the US 41 overpass, despite I-164 officially extending 0.78 miles farther west (though the mileposts reset at US 41).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: on_wisconsin on October 15, 2014, 02:08:38 PM
Quote from: US71 on September 24, 2014, 12:00:15 PM
Looks like it's official  (http://online.wsj.com/articles/indiana-toll-road-operator-files-for-bankruptcy-1411395866)
Anyone have a non-paywall'ed version?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: J N Winkler on October 15, 2014, 02:38:04 PM
Quote from: NE2 on October 15, 2014, 02:02:42 PMWhere will milepost 0 be? The official south end of I-69 is at the US 41 overpass, despite I-164 officially extending 0.78 miles farther west (though the mileposts reset at US 41).

This construction plans set doesn't include mileposts and signs that have exit numbers are being left unchanged (US 41, for example, is still Exit 0), so I suspect this new length of I-69 will retain I-164's milepointing.  Google Maps suggests that I-69 milepointing and exit numbering north of the I-64 interchange already includes I-164 mileage.  I don't know how they plan to accommodate an Ohio River crossing.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 15, 2014, 03:15:53 PM
Quote from: J N Winkler on October 15, 2014, 02:38:04 PM
Quote from: NE2 on October 15, 2014, 02:02:42 PMWhere will milepost 0 be? The official south end of I-69 is at the US 41 overpass, despite I-164 officially extending 0.78 miles farther west (though the mileposts reset at US 41).

This construction plans set doesn't include mileposts and signs that have exit numbers are being left unchanged (US 41, for example, is still Exit 0), so I suspect this new length of I-69 will retain I-164's milepointing.  Google Maps suggests that I-69 milepointing and exit numbering north of the I-64 interchange already includes I-164 mileage.  I don't know how they plan to accommodate an Ohio River crossing.

I always thought the plans were to call that little piece in between 41 and 69 after the bridge is built 1-169. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NE2 on October 15, 2014, 03:26:23 PM
Quote from: J N Winkler on October 15, 2014, 02:38:04 PM
This construction plans set doesn't include mileposts
Must be another contract, since mileposts have I-164 shields.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on October 15, 2014, 06:54:30 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 15, 2014, 03:15:53 PM

I always thought the plans were to call that little piece in between 41 and 69 after the bridge is built 1-169.

That's most likely speculation you read in the "I-69 in Indiana" thread. I've seen nothing official on that, and would like a cite if anyone has heard official word.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 17, 2014, 08:34:35 AM
http://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/johnson-county/2014/10/17/can-diverging-diamonds-revolutionize-indiana-highways/17356505/

The new I-65 interchange at Worthsville Road (between existing exits 95 and 99) will have a diverging diamond.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 17, 2014, 11:42:36 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 17, 2014, 08:34:35 AM
http://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/johnson-county/2014/10/17/can-diverging-diamonds-revolutionize-indiana-highways/17356505/

The new I-65 interchange at Worthsville Road (between existing exits 95 and 99) will have a diverging diamond.

good article, but we've known that it will be a diverging diamond for years now.  I prefer to call them double reverse interchanges.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on October 17, 2014, 05:04:43 PM
Now that this is brought up, there was a link to another article about a proposed project at SR 135 and Smith Valley Road in Greenwood. It proposes two roundabouts a short distance from the intersection with no left turns allowed from Smith Valley onto 135. Left turning traffic has to continue to a roundabout, turn around and head back to to the intersection and turn right. The paper calls it a modified Michigan-left but I wasn't sure if there was a better term for this kind of intersection, Michigan-lefts, at least the ones I've encountered in Michigan, don't use roundabouts.

http://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/johnson-county/2014/10/10/michigan-left-greenwood-johnson-county/17045019/

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on October 19, 2014, 10:18:16 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 17, 2014, 11:42:36 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 17, 2014, 08:34:35 AM
http://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/johnson-county/2014/10/17/can-diverging-diamonds-revolutionize-indiana-highways/17356505/

The new I-65 interchange at Worthsville Road (between existing exits 95 and 99) will have a diverging diamond.

good article, but we've known that it will be a diverging diamond for years now.  I prefer to call them double reverse interchanges.

I prefer to call them double diamonds. :-P I'm special.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on October 20, 2014, 07:06:59 AM
The diverging diamond on I-69 at SR 1/Dupont Rd. in Fort Wayne is open, but the pavement markings are not yet down (as of yesterday) so going thru there is still a bit confusing. I took the chance to also check out the Union Chapel Rd. interchange with its roundabouts as I only used it when it was brand new last year. It looks pretty nice after all the plantings are in.

On US 24 at SR 101 (i.e. the Fort to Port section of the Hoosier Heartland), a big Love's Travel Center is going in. A truck stop isn't necessarily a premier development, but I think that is probably a an OK location.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on October 20, 2014, 10:19:01 AM
Speaking of roundabouts. SR 641 construction is moving along well. The sr 46 interchange is currently under construction as is the I 70 interchange. The Moyer drive overpass is also being worked on. I 70 has been narrowed down to one lane each direction.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 20, 2014, 12:54:06 PM
Quote from: US 41 on October 20, 2014, 10:19:01 AM
Speaking of roundabouts. SR 641 construction is moving along well. The sr 46 interchange is currently under construction as is the I 70 interchange. The Moyer drive overpass is also being worked on. I 70 has been narrowed down to one lane each direction.

The backups caused by them narrowing 70 are very frustrating, are there roundabouts planned for this interchange?  Do you have any pictures of the proposed interchange?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on October 20, 2014, 05:55:55 PM
The roundabouts are going to be at the sr 641 / sr 46 interchange a mile south of interstate 70. The sr 641 / I 70 interchange is going to be a Partial cloverleaf. Project maps can be found on indot's website under major projects or if you type "SR 641" into google the first option should be the projects home page. I'm currently using an unfamiliar device or else I would just copy and paste the link. I hope my description helps.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on October 26, 2014, 01:58:27 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on October 17, 2014, 05:04:43 PM
Now that this is brought up, there was a link to another article about a proposed project at SR 135 and Smith Valley Road in Greenwood. It proposes two roundabouts a short distance from the intersection with no left turns allowed from Smith Valley onto 135. Left turning traffic has to continue to a roundabout, turn around and head back to to the intersection and turn right. The paper calls it a modified Michigan-left but I wasn't sure if there was a better term for this kind of intersection, Michigan-lefts, at least the ones I've encountered in Michigan, don't use roundabouts.

http://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/johnson-county/2014/10/10/michigan-left-greenwood-johnson-county/17045019/

Something needs to be done about that intersection, but I can't see how that solution will make things much better. It's still going to be a long line of cars except now they'll be turning right onto 135 instead of turning left, and they really need to lengthen the light for Smith Valley going through.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 26, 2014, 02:46:53 PM
Quote from: jhuntin1 on October 26, 2014, 01:58:27 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on October 17, 2014, 05:04:43 PM
Now that this is brought up, there was a link to another article about a proposed project at SR 135 and Smith Valley Road in Greenwood. It proposes two roundabouts a short distance from the intersection with no left turns allowed from Smith Valley onto 135. Left turning traffic has to continue to a roundabout, turn around and head back to to the intersection and turn right. The paper calls it a modified Michigan-left but I wasn't sure if there was a better term for this kind of intersection, Michigan-lefts, at least the ones I've encountered in Michigan, don't use roundabouts.

http://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/johnson-county/2014/10/10/michigan-left-greenwood-johnson-county/17045019/

Something needs to be done about that intersection, but I can't see how that solution will make things much better. It's still going to be a long line of cars except now they'll be turning right onto 135 instead of turning left, and they really need to lengthen the light for Smith Valley going through.

It should make things better, but problems could arise from the light causing backups in the roundabouts.  It isn't a real Michigan left, since nothing is being done on SR 135. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on October 28, 2014, 10:53:20 AM
From what I've seen, nobody seems to know how to use roundabouts on the south side. This will be an interesting intersection for sure.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 28, 2014, 11:14:55 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on October 28, 2014, 10:53:20 AM
From what I've seen, nobody seems to know how to use roundabouts on the south side. This will be an interesting intersection for sure.

are there even more than 5 of them down there?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on October 28, 2014, 12:02:40 PM
I've only seen 2 and have witnessed people driving the wrong way around one of them multiple times
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on October 28, 2014, 06:44:42 PM
Odd, I never have seen any wrong-way drivers there and I live a few blocks away from one of them. I think traffic in that area has gotten better personally. I don't see 20+ car backups on those streets anymore at rush hour. I'd say that people in the area have gotten used to the roundabouts a lot quicker than I thought they would have. I went through both of them no more than a couple of hours ago.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on October 29, 2014, 01:11:53 AM
That's good to hear. They certainly do help traffic if used correctly. The particular one I'm talking about is at the Greenwood Park Mall and I witnessed these events a year or two ago. I haven't been on that side of town much lately.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 29, 2014, 07:25:47 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on October 29, 2014, 01:11:53 AM
That's good to hear. They certainly do help traffic if used correctly. The particular one I'm talking about is at the Greenwood Park Mall and I witnessed these events a year or two ago. I haven't been on that side of town much lately.

Developers of shopping malls should replace all their 4 way stops with roundabouts, it would make things so much better!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: trafficsignal on October 29, 2014, 08:07:34 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on October 29, 2014, 01:11:53 AM
That's good to hear. They certainly do help traffic if used correctly. The particular one I'm talking about is at the Greenwood Park Mall and I witnessed these events a year or two ago. I haven't been on that side of town much lately.

I saw the same thing several times when the roundabouts first went in in Noblesville at the Lowes & Walmart entrances off 37.  There are always a few that have no clue what they're doing, even in Hamilton Co.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 29, 2014, 10:40:59 AM
Quote from: trafficsignal on October 29, 2014, 08:07:34 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on October 29, 2014, 01:11:53 AM
That's good to hear. They certainly do help traffic if used correctly. The particular one I'm talking about is at the Greenwood Park Mall and I witnessed these events a year or two ago. I haven't been on that side of town much lately.

I saw the same thing several times when the roundabouts first went in in Noblesville at the Lowes & Walmart entrances off 37.  There are always a few that have no clue what they're doing, even in Hamilton Co.

I don't get it, I know they are different and new, but it isn't that hard to figure out! they are all clearly marked, follow your arrow!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on November 18, 2014, 10:43:37 PM
http://wishtv.com/2014/11/18/roundabouts-suggested-to-curb-congestion-on-sr37/
HAMILTON COUNTY (WISH) — Local leaders say a six mile stretch of road between Noblesville and Fishers could be easier to travel with roundabouts.

A proposal to improve that roadway for drivers would be by installing roundabouts and it is something currently being discussed.

A Hamilton County commissioner 24-Hour News 8 spoke with on Tuesday night said that something has to be done in order to reduce traffic congestion on State Road 37.

Christine Altman said the problem is not just heavy traffic volume on 37, it's the fact that the traffic going east-west at several intersections doesn't get to cross 37 as efficiently as it should either.

Altman says there are three ways to address the problem, they could do nothing, Hamilton County could find the funding and have control of the design of roundabouts or they could leave it in the hands of INDOT to make improvements.

"We have intersections that are operating at C to D level, the study Purdue said within five years we would have failing intersections if we do nothing,"  said Altman.

This project would be a joint effort between the county, Noblesville, Fishers and INDOT. It is expected to cost about $243 million.

There are nine intersections along state road 37 that would be fixed by this project, but this is still years away.

Altman said work wouldn't begin until 2019.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 19, 2014, 09:12:04 AM
I like the idea, I just wish it were still SR 37 after it's done. They should go further north than SR 38/32 though
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Henry on November 19, 2014, 09:34:14 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 19, 2014, 09:12:04 AM
I like the idea, I just wish it were still SR 37 after it's done. They should go further north than SR 38/32 though
It's not like the designation will suddenly go away. Plus, I like the idea of making roundabouts for congested intersections; they seem to reduce this problem that traffic lights can create, if done right.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on November 19, 2014, 01:08:37 PM
Quote from: Henry on November 19, 2014, 09:34:14 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 19, 2014, 09:12:04 AM
I like the idea, I just wish it were still SR 37 after it's done. They should go further north than SR 38/32 though
It's not like the designation will suddenly go away. Plus, I like the idea of making roundabouts for congested intersections; they seem to reduce this problem that traffic lights can create, if done right.
If this project will be handled like the Keystone Pkwy. project then the designation will probably go away after the project is done. But who knows, maybe INDOT will feel like maintaining major arterials within cities again.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on November 19, 2014, 01:50:07 PM
Unlikely.  I'm in Franklin right now and saw that SR 44 has been decommissioned through town. Add 44 onto the growing list of broken-upped highways.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 19, 2014, 02:48:35 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on November 19, 2014, 01:50:07 PM
Unlikely.  I'm in Franklin right now and saw that SR 44 has been decommissioned through town. Add 44 onto the growing list of broken-upped highways.

Do the exit signs on I-65 still say 44?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 19, 2014, 05:26:57 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on November 19, 2014, 01:50:07 PM
Unlikely.  I'm in Franklin right now and saw that SR 44 has been decommissioned through town. Add 44 onto the growing list of broken-upped highways.

This must have just happened, there's now a gap from SR 144 to I-65. I'm not sure if that means SR 144 at US 31 or further west where they split off.  Here's what I could find: http://www.franklin.in.gov/egov/documents/13848079381820.pdf

They should have gotten rid of SR 144 too between there and SR 135.  I wonder which highway will be next to get the swiss cheese treatment.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 19, 2014, 05:35:13 PM
well according to wikipedia, it is from where 144 and 44 split to 65 where the gap is.  I wish they would at least make an effort to make the routes make sense, constant stopping and starting is confusing.  They should really let cities continue to sign routes throughout their city limits. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_State_Road_44
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on November 19, 2014, 08:00:19 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 19, 2014, 05:26:57 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on November 19, 2014, 01:50:07 PM
Unlikely.  I'm in Franklin right now and saw that SR 44 has been decommissioned through town. Add 44 onto the growing list of broken-upped highways.

This must have just happened, there's now a gap from SR 144 to I-65. I'm not sure if that means SR 144 at US 31 or further west where they split off.  Here's what I could find: http://www.franklin.in.gov/egov/documents/13848079381820.pdf

They should have gotten rid of SR 144 too between there and SR 135.  I wonder which highway will be next to get the swiss cheese treatment.

I wouldn't be surprised if they tries to decommission SR 263.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on November 20, 2014, 07:13:42 AM
Sagamore Parkway Bridge project to hold public hearing
http://wlfi.com/2014/11/19/sagamore-parkway-bridge-project-to-hold-public-hearing/ (http://wlfi.com/2014/11/19/sagamore-parkway-bridge-project-to-hold-public-hearing/)
According to the article the new bridge is supposed to be only 2 lanes wide! I hope this is a case of bad reporting... :pan: Perhaps they are only replacing one of the spans? But I do like the idea of adding a bike trail on the side :spin:
P.S. Sorry I posted this after the public hearing was over, but I didn't hear about it on the news until just today.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 20, 2014, 07:22:46 AM
Quote from: billtm on November 20, 2014, 07:13:42 AM
Sagamore Parkway Bridge project to hold public hearing
http://wlfi.com/2014/11/19/sagamore-parkway-bridge-project-to-hold-public-hearing/ (http://wlfi.com/2014/11/19/sagamore-parkway-bridge-project-to-hold-public-hearing/)
According to the article the new bridge is supposed to be only 2 lanes wide! I hope this is a case of bad reporting... :pan: Perhaps they are only replacing one of the spans? But I do like the idea of adding a bike trail on the side :spin:
P.S. Sorry I posted this after the public hearing was over, but I didn't hear about it on the news until just today.

I believe it is just one bridge, I know one of the bridges is really old, i think the 30s or something like that.  The other span is much newer.  In other news US 31 in Carmel is set to open next week!  The news report said that "only 2 lanes will be open in each direction" I thought this road was only going to be 2 lanes in each direction, is it supposed to be 3? I hope the speed limit will be 60 but I highly doubt it will be.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on November 20, 2014, 11:04:33 AM
State Road 37 overhaul plan has business owners on alert

http://www.ibj.com/blogs/11-north-of-96th/post/50533-state-road-37-overhaul-plan-has-business-owners-on-alert
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on November 20, 2014, 05:53:11 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 20, 2014, 07:22:46 AM
I believe it is just one bridge, I know one of the bridges is really old, i think the 30s or something like that.  The other span is much newer.  In other news US 31 in Carmel is set to open next week!  The news report said that "only 2 lanes will be open in each direction" I thought this road was only going to be 2 lanes in each direction, is it supposed to be 3? I hope the speed limit will be 60 but I highly doubt it will be.

Probably since the stretch of US 31 from I-465 to 116th Street is only four lanes they'll have the new freeway segment be the same width for continuity sake. I've ran into heavy traffic along I-71 in the middle of Ohio because they had a construction zone on two separate four-lane sections of highway with one short six-lane segment in the middle. It wouldn't make sense at rush hour to open up a lane just to close it a few miles down.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on December 12, 2014, 02:54:45 PM
http://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/INSTATE/bulletins/e23778

QuoteINDIANAPOLIS — Contractors for the Indiana Department of Transportation (INDOT) plan to paint lane markings this week on I-465 in order to open new traffic lanes and a new flyover ramp at the south side Interstate 65 interchange.  Weather permitting, all remaining improvements from the south side Operation Indy Commute interchange project are expected to be open before the end of next week.

They screwed up earlier this week and kept the closures in place well into the morning rush because the striping wasn't dry yet.  Caused MASSIVE traffic issues.

Otherwise, I'm excited that the next time I go to the south side, I'll be able to use the new flyover ramp!  Now if they can just replace the left entrance ramps, this would be a nice interchange.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 20, 2014, 08:45:33 PM
Speaking of the south side project at I-65 and I-465, the two lane flyover connecting westbound 465 with southbound 65 is now open. They're still working on getting the lanes in their final configuration along 465 but surely by the end of this weekend most of the work should be done. The ramp from northbound 65 to eastbound 465 is now two lanes as well with auxiliary lanes between the new exit ramps and the Emerson Avenue exit and along 65 south to Southport. The former loop ramp from WB 465 to SB 65 is now closed and presumably will be torn up in the future.

Also of note in terms of signage, what I believe is Indiana's first one-arrow-per-lane sign is up along I-65 north approaching the 465 interchange. There are three up arrows for I-65 north thru traffic and a curved arrow for the ramp to I-465 west (now signed with Peoria for I-74.) The two-lane ramp for the ramp to I-465 east (now signed with Cincinnati for I-74) is on a separate sign. Usually I think these signs go the width of the highway, so it's interesting to see that there weren't two more curved arrows for those two far right lanes, right at the gore point for the 465 ramps. If I ever get the ability to take some pictures of the sign I'll post them. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on December 21, 2014, 01:35:57 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 20, 2014, 08:45:33 PM
Also of note in terms of signage, what I believe is Indiana's first one-arrow-per-lane sign is up along I-65 north approaching the 465 interchange. There are three up arrows for I-65 north thru traffic and a curved arrow for the ramp to I-465 west (now signed with Peoria for I-74.) The two-lane ramp for the ramp to I-465 east (now signed with Cincinnati for I-74) is on a separate sign. Usually I think these signs go the width of the highway, so it's interesting to see that there weren't two more curved arrows for those two far right lanes, right at the gore point for the 465 ramps. If I ever get the ability to take some pictures of the sign I'll post them.
I think the first one-arrow-per-lane ramp is on I-465 south at I-70 on the east side. It's been there for at least a year. Here's the Google Map view: (https://www.google.com/maps/@39.8035584,-86.0319996,3a,75y,180h,90t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1seOHfPh7RVCDKMEobR2RDFQ!2e0!6m1!1e1)

Also, any new exit signage that INDOT has put up for I-465 & 74 has references to Peoria and Cincinnati as control cities. I-70 has them in both directions for the I-465 exit, as does I-65 now. I don't know if it's an MUTCD requirement or not, but it's only been in the last several years that they've done it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 21, 2014, 04:06:59 PM
I was talking more about signs like in this thread.

https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=8965.0

The "One-Arrow-Per-Lane" sign as I've seen it here is a newer type of sign with an up arrow in each lane instead of a down arrow. Those signs you showed have been there since that interchange was rebuilt more than a decade ago, probably before the first of these kind of signs were up.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on December 21, 2014, 05:18:53 PM
As far as that type of sign goes, I believe you're right (at least in the Indianapolis area). I noticed it a week ago and said to myself that it looked like INDOT was trying something new.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 22, 2014, 07:37:12 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 20, 2014, 08:45:33 PM
Speaking of the south side project at I-65 and I-465, the two lane flyover connecting westbound 465 with southbound 65 is now open. They're still working on getting the lanes in their final configuration along 465 but surely by the end of this weekend most of the work should be done. The ramp from northbound 65 to eastbound 465 is now two lanes as well with auxiliary lanes between the new exit ramps and the Emerson Avenue exit and along 65 south to Southport. The former loop ramp from WB 465 to SB 65 is now closed and presumably will be torn up in the future.

Also of note in terms of signage, what I believe is Indiana's first one-arrow-per-lane sign is up along I-65 north approaching the 465 interchange. There are three up arrows for I-65 north thru traffic and a curved arrow for the ramp to I-465 west (now signed with Peoria for I-74.) The two-lane ramp for the ramp to I-465 east (now signed with Cincinnati for I-74) is on a separate sign. Usually I think these signs go the width of the highway, so it's interesting to see that there weren't two more curved arrows for those two far right lanes, right at the gore point for the 465 ramps. If I ever get the ability to take some pictures of the sign I'll post them. 

I saw those this weekend.  I use that interchange a couple times a month so I'm glad for that work to be over with.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 17, 2015, 09:58:34 AM
SR 38 is no longer cosigned with US 421 and sr 39 in Frankfort it now has a gap in it. It ends north of the city and picks up again just south of the city.
Very confusing at first as I was going to use 38 to get to Lafayette from there.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jnewkirk77 on January 18, 2015, 09:55:46 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 17, 2015, 09:58:34 AM
SR 38 is no longer cosigned with US 421 and sr 39 in Frankfort it now has a gap in it. It ends north of the city and picks up again just south of the city.
Very confusing at first as I was going to use 38 to get to Lafayette from there.

Where are the endpoints exactly?  Are they just random like at the city limits, or at actual road junctions?  (Such as the junction of 38 and 39 at Antioch, south of Frankfort.)  Not that it makes any real sense to drop 38 for no reason, but if they did it, at least make it make some sense.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 18, 2015, 10:22:04 PM
The north end is where they split off north of the city. And the south end is at Antioch. My guess is they did this because they thought 3 routes on the same road is confusing. Sr 38 west of us 31 is a weird road. It zigzags like crazy!
Any other decommissioning/reroute news?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NE2 on January 18, 2015, 11:14:11 PM
Well, they tried back in 1926...
QuoteThe entire state highway system has been renumbered, which was effective at the beginning of the fiscal year October 1, 1926. In records and tables for the fiscal year ending September 30, 1926, the "old" road numbers are used. The "new" numbers are used in tables for year ending September 30, 1927. The renumbering of the state roads was made necessary from two causes:

First. To accommodate the new mileage of about 1,000 miles which the Commission is taking into the state system. When the original system was numbered, April 1, 1920, it was not known what additional roads might be added to the system, and hence numbers could not be applied to the roads at that time in such a way as to make provisions for the added mileage which was to come later. In order to take care of added mileage, the numbers on about one-fourth the system were changed on October 1, 1923. However, only such changes were made at that time as were necessary to accommodate new roads taken over up to that date. This left some inconsistencies in the numbering system which were corrected by changing the entire numbering system on October 1, 1926.

Second. This change is to conform with the new federal system of numbering U. S. highways. A joint board appointed by the Secretary of Agriculture from the state highway officials and bureau of public roads selected and numbered a system of through routes in the United States, disregarding state boundaries. In this federal numbering system a road extending from coast to coast, from Canada to Mexico, or such other length across the borders of the various states, has the same number. These routes are known as U. S. highways and will be a great convenience to through traffic. In order to conform with these new numbers it was necessary to change our numbering system in many respects. In the state of Indiana there are 1,909.49 miles of U. S. highways. The length of these U. S. highways, which are now being maintained as state roads, is 1,653.26 miles; 179.17 miles are inside of towns over 2,500 population; 19.4 miles are not yet in state system and 57.66 miles are duplicated on two routes. Table 3 on page 1214 gives these roads by number.

In renumbering the roads, an attempt was made to apply, as far as possible, the numbers in such a way as to make provisions for future additions to the state system, without having to change numbers on roads now in the system. This made it necessary to skip certain numbers at this time.

In applying new numbers to the state system the U. S. highway numbers as prescribed by the joint board were adopted. The remainder of state roads were assigned a new number as described below. The joint board system of numbering applied so far as practicable even numbers to the east and west roads, beginning in the northern part of the United States and numbering southward; odd numbers to the north and south roads, beginning in the eastern part of the United States and extending westward. The new state numbering applied this same system so far as it was practical, using even numbers for the east and west roads, beginning with the smaller number in the northern part of the state and extending southward; using odd numbers for the north and south roads, beginning in the eastern part of the state and extending westward. Inasmuch as U. S. highways had already been numbered by the joint board, the state system of numbering did not apply a second number to them.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on January 18, 2015, 11:28:38 PM
Are there actual "end" signs at both ends. I'm just not sure why it just can't be a silent merge sort of thing. Just thinking here, but, as one who's driven the route, the part of SR 38 from Frankfort to Sheridan could be gutted to leave two solid pieces of highway. SR 38 (parts of it) isn't even the fastest route between Frankfort and Sheridan.

Or, you radically change things up by rerouting US 421 onto SR 38 north of Frankfort to I-65 by Lafayette, follow I-65 up to the SR 43 exit and follow SR 43 north to Reynolds and resume heading north from there along its original path. That way, there's no split in SR 38 anymore and with SR 43 gone north of Lafayette there's no longer a "gap" in that highway. Finally, SR 39 can be by itself once more from Frankfort all the way to Monticello and US 24 loses its concurrency west to Reynolds. You would eliminate two gaps in state highway and a pretty long concurrency with US 421/SR 39. Fictional highways stuff sure, but I see some logic in it. When INDOT gives you lemons.....
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 19, 2015, 07:32:34 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on January 18, 2015, 11:28:38 PM
Are there actual "end" signs at both ends. I'm just not sure why it just can't be a silent merge sort of thing. Just thinking here, but, as one who's driven the route, the part of SR 38 from Frankfort to Sheridan could be gutted to leave two solid pieces of highway. SR 38 (parts of it) isn't even the fastest route between Frankfort and Sheridan.

Or, you radically change things up by rerouting US 421 onto SR 38 north of Frankfort to I-65 by Lafayette, follow I-65 up to the SR 43 exit and follow SR 43 north to Reynolds and resume heading north from there along its original path. That way, there's no split in SR 38 anymore and with SR 43 gone north of Lafayette there's no longer a "gap" in that highway. Finally, SR 39 can be by itself once more from Frankfort all the way to Monticello and US 24 loses its concurrency west to Reynolds. You would eliminate two gaps in state highway and a pretty long concurrency with US 421/SR 39. Fictional highways stuff sure, but I see some logic in it. When INDOT gives you lemons.....

yes there are end signs at either end.  They should make SR 38 take over for 47 between 421 and sheridan, then cosign it all the way to the point it splits off just north of Frankfort.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jnewkirk77 on January 20, 2015, 03:33:44 PM
I'm glad they at least used logical endpoints ... INDOT doesn't always, you know (cough - 61 in Vincennes, 257 in Stendal, etc. etc. etc.).

I've driven that stretch of 38 a few times, and my brother who lives in Westfield and works in Frankfort does every day ... not a happy highway.  I could see the reroutes being done, but would they?  Probably not.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 20, 2015, 04:12:25 PM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on January 20, 2015, 03:33:44 PM
I'm glad they at least used logical endpoints ... INDOT doesn't always, you know (cough - 61 in Vincennes, 257 in Stendal, etc. etc. etc.).

I've driven that stretch of 38 a few times, and my brother who lives in Westfield and works in Frankfort does every day ... not a happy highway.  I could see the reroutes being done, but would they?  Probably not.

SR 450 also makes no sense SR 257 is the only route in Indiana that I know of that doesn't end at another highway on either end. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on January 20, 2015, 07:20:38 PM
Wait, so for SR 38, did any actual road get decomissioned? Or was it just the numbering?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jnewkirk77 on January 21, 2015, 04:17:46 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 20, 2015, 04:12:25 PM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on January 20, 2015, 03:33:44 PM
I'm glad they at least used logical endpoints ... INDOT doesn't always, you know (cough - 61 in Vincennes, 257 in Stendal, etc. etc. etc.).

I've driven that stretch of 38 a few times, and my brother who lives in Westfield and works in Frankfort does every day ... not a happy highway.  I could see the reroutes being done, but would they?  Probably not.

SR 450 also makes no sense SR 257 is the only route in Indiana that I know of that doesn't end at another highway on either end.

Technically 257 does end at a state highway at its north end, or at least it did last time I checked. As of last year, INDOT still maintains Old 50/150 from Maysville through Washington ... it's even listed as the "longest old U.S. route" in the state highway system on their website.  Evidently they've never gotten Washington and Daviess County to take it over - and what's it been since the 50/150 bypass opened, 25 years???
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 21, 2015, 06:50:10 AM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on January 21, 2015, 04:17:46 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 20, 2015, 04:12:25 PM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on January 20, 2015, 03:33:44 PM
I'm glad they at least used logical endpoints ... INDOT doesn't always, you know (cough - 61 in Vincennes, 257 in Stendal, etc. etc. etc.).

I've driven that stretch of 38 a few times, and my brother who lives in Westfield and works in Frankfort does every day ... not a happy highway.  I could see the reroutes being done, but would they?  Probably not.

SR 450 also makes no sense SR 257 is the only route in Indiana that I know of that doesn't end at another highway on either end.

Technically 257 does end at a state highway at its north end, or at least it did last time I checked. As of last year, INDOT still maintains Old 50/150 from Maysville through Washington ... it's even listed as the "longest old U.S. route" in the state highway system on their website.  Evidently they've never gotten Washington and Daviess County to take it over - and what's it been since the 50/150 bypass opened, 25 years???
Really I wonder why they won't sign it
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: hbelkins on January 21, 2015, 01:56:59 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 21, 2015, 06:50:10 AM
Really I wonder why they won't sign it

I seem to recall it being signed as Business 50.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jnewkirk77 on January 21, 2015, 07:13:42 PM
We were through there in November, and it's signed as Business 50 as a trailblazer off of mainline 50, just west of I-69, but nowhere else that I saw.  Out at Maysville, there used to be advance signs for "To 50" before the 300W intersection - I presume they're still up.  Next time I'm out that way, I'll look.

At the 257 and 57 junctions, I remember there used to be Business 50 signs, but they're gone now.  Not sure why.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 21, 2015, 08:02:05 PM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on January 21, 2015, 07:13:42 PM
We were through there in November, and it's signed as Business 50 as a trailblazer off of mainline 50, just west of I-69, but nowhere else that I saw.  Out at Maysville, there used to be advance signs for "To 50" before the 300W intersection - I presume they're still up.  Next time I'm out that way, I'll look.

At the 257 and 57 junctions, I remember there used to be Business 50 signs, but they're gone now.  Not sure why.

Streetview says the north end of 257 is completely unsigned. Weird, INDOT doesnt have many unsigned SRs this is really the only one I can think of, other than old US 31 in St Joseph county (I don't think that's signed as 931)  I think US 52 in West Lafayette was finally turned over.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jnewkirk77 on January 21, 2015, 08:43:36 PM
It is weird ... but, that's today's INDOT.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 04, 2015, 05:44:24 PM
Taking a read of the letting list which was effective last month, here's some highlights of what's to come for Northwest Indiana, highly likely to start this year:

(Much needed) Concrete restoration is planned for I-65 between I-80/94 and U.S. 30. There are some ragged breaks in the concrete (which really hasn't been treated since the extension and modification projects ended more than 10 years ago), so this will be welcoming, delays be damned.

Another round of bridge deck repairs are set for I-94 from the Toll Road junction to Michigan. The bridges that weren't touched last year or the year before will get the treatment this time.

The TrafficWise system is set to expand on I-94 beyond State Road 249. More cameras and Distance/Time signs are to be installed as far northeast as the Michigan State Line.

On a local level, Indiana 51 (Ripley Street) will face a big project replacing the bridge over Burns Ditch (located just north of the Borman Expressway interchange). This has the potential for massive delays since it's located near a busy intersection and along a major stopping point for truckers.

Indiana 2 will be among the first highways in NWI to have center line rumble strips installed. The stretch covered will be between U.S. 41 and I-65.

Indiana 130 will have work done between the Indiana 51 split and Indiana 149. Rumble strips will be installed on the shoulders for the aforementioned stretch, and a much needed fix will be in place for the intersection with County Line Road. A traffic signal is scheduled to replace the current flashing red light schematic, and the intersection will be slightly adjusted to improve its safety (the four-way stop currently sits next to a busy set of railroad tracks, which is potentially hazardous during peak times; school and work traffic is heavy in that area, with the nearby County Line Orchard compounding things during the fall).

For those in the Hobart-Merrillville area, 61st Avenue between Arizona Street and Indiana 51 will be widened. Included in this project will be landscaped medians, a new bridge over the Deep River, and a roundabout at Wisconsin Street (which will only be three points). Work is set to be completed in 2016.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 04, 2015, 05:49:36 PM
the state should rid themselves of SR 130 completely and SR 149 south of US 6
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 04, 2015, 06:00:52 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 04, 2015, 05:49:36 PM
the state should rid themselves of SR 130 completely and SR 149 south of US 6

Respectfully disagree. Highway 130 is a major connection between Valparaiso and a large portion of Northern Lake County. Giving it to local municipalities (many of which SR 130 doesn't even touch) would hurt it in the long run. The proposed truncation to Indiana 149 - if it's taking place - is enough.

Same with Indiana 149. This is another fast track corridor that would lose its effectiveness if the state relinquishes it. Leave these roads be.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 04, 2015, 07:44:08 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 04, 2015, 06:00:52 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 04, 2015, 05:49:36 PM
the state should rid themselves of SR 130 completely and SR 149 south of US 6

Respectfully disagree. Highway 130 is a major connection between Valparaiso and a large portion of Northern Lake County. Giving it to local municipalities (many of which SR 130 doesn't even touch) would hurt it in the long run. The proposed truncation to Indiana 149 - if it's taking place - is enough.

Same with Indiana 149. This is another fast track corridor that would lose its effectiveness if the state relinquishes it. Leave these roads be.
Sr 130 doesn't exist anymore east of 149. At least that's what the indot map says. Does anyone know if sr 56 has been rerouted around Madison?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: pianocello on February 04, 2015, 09:29:04 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 04, 2015, 07:44:08 PM
Sr 130 doesn't exist anymore east of 149. At least that's what the indot map says.

I've heard that for over a year (page 2 of this thread, actually), and I can confirm that SR 130 still exists all the way to the corner of Sturdy and 30, at least in the field. I'll let you know when the signs start disappearing.

FWIW, if 130 does disappear completely, it'll just turn into one of those roads that's known solely by its former designation. It's one of the preferred routes between Valpo and Chicago (cheaper than the Toll Road, fewer stoplights than 30-65 and 49-94), so INDOT may as well hold on to it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 04, 2015, 09:35:38 PM
Quote from: pianocello on February 04, 2015, 09:29:04 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 04, 2015, 07:44:08 PM
Sr 130 doesn't exist anymore east of 149. At least that's what the indot map says.

I've heard that for over a year (page 2 of this thread, actually), and I can confirm that SR 130 still exists all the way to the corner of Sturdy and 30, at least in the field. I'll let you know when the signs start disappearing.

FWIW, if 130 does disappear completely, it'll just turn into one of those roads that's known solely by its former designation. It's one of the preferred routes between Valpo and Chicago (cheaper than the Toll Road, fewer stoplights than 30-65 and 49-94), so INDOT may as well hold on to it.

And MUCH shorter, since it's a virtual straight line from Valpo to Hobart. Definitely one road INDOT should keep.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: pianocello on February 08, 2015, 03:35:33 PM
Quote from: pianocello on February 04, 2015, 09:29:04 PM
I can confirm that SR 130 still exists all the way to the corner of Sturdy and 30, at least in the field. I'll let you know when the signs start disappearing.

UPDATE: Signs are gone near the roundabout near its eastern end. I'm disappointed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 10, 2015, 08:19:39 PM
Quote from: pianocello on February 08, 2015, 03:35:33 PM
Quote from: pianocello on February 04, 2015, 09:29:04 PM
I can confirm that SR 130 still exists all the way to the corner of Sturdy and 30, at least in the field. I'll let you know when the signs start disappearing.

UPDATE: Signs are gone near the roundabout near its eastern end. I'm disappointed.

A couple assurance signs still exist between downtown and Indiana 149. Do not yet despair. :)

Also in Valparaiso, the first instance of Red Arrow traffic lights have been installed on U.S. 30 from just west of Indiana 2 (west junction) to at least the Indiana 2 west junction. I turned left there so I don't know how far they're going with it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: pianocello on February 10, 2015, 08:58:42 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 10, 2015, 08:19:39 PM
Quote from: pianocello on February 08, 2015, 03:35:33 PM
Quote from: pianocello on February 04, 2015, 09:29:04 PM
I can confirm that SR 130 still exists all the way to the corner of Sturdy and 30, at least in the field. I'll let you know when the signs start disappearing.

UPDATE: Signs are gone near the roundabout near its eastern end. I'm disappointed.

A couple assurance signs still exist between downtown and Indiana 149. Do not yet despair. :)

Also in Valparaiso, the first instance of Red Arrow traffic lights have been installed on U.S. 30 from just west of Indiana 2 (west junction) to at least the Indiana 2 west junction. I turned left there so I don't know how far they're going with it.

They replaced the ones between SR 2 and SR 49 as well. They even included a red arrow for right turns, but they didn't sync it up with the opposing left turn arrow, which is weird.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 10, 2015, 10:09:40 PM
Quote from: pianocello on February 10, 2015, 08:58:42 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 10, 2015, 08:19:39 PM
Quote from: pianocello on February 08, 2015, 03:35:33 PM
Quote from: pianocello on February 04, 2015, 09:29:04 PM
I can confirm that SR 130 still exists all the way to the corner of Sturdy and 30, at least in the field. I'll let you know when the signs start disappearing.

UPDATE: Signs are gone near the roundabout near its eastern end. I'm disappointed.

A couple assurance signs still exist between downtown and Indiana 149. Do not yet despair. :)

Also in Valparaiso, the first instance of Red Arrow traffic lights have been installed on U.S. 30 from just west of Indiana 2 (west junction) to at least the Indiana 2 west junction. I turned left there so I don't know how far they're going with it.

They replaced the ones between SR 2 and SR 49 as well. They even included a red arrow for right turns, but they didn't sync it up with the opposing left turn arrow, which is weird.

I was just going to post about this!  They are all over Lafayette too, they don't seem to serve any purpose, they have no special phase, they are green for the entire thru movement and red all other times.  I really don't get their purpose. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on February 11, 2015, 07:55:25 PM
Quote
Construction of a new, privately operated Cline Avenue Bridge over the Indiana Harbor and Ship Canal in East Chicago finally will begin this spring...


Cline Avenue Bridge construction to begin in spring (http://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/govt-and-politics/cline-avenue-bridge-construction-to-begin-in-spring/article_3d05eb48-e6c9-5667-b813-b5da8a291e2a.html)  (NWI Times)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 11, 2015, 09:24:38 PM
I wonder if this will be signed as SR 912 it will be at each end.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 12, 2015, 07:20:56 PM
About damned time. After all the false starts I posted in this thread alone, I just about gave up on it.

And I'm sure the Indiana 912 designation will stay in place.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 17, 2015, 07:35:05 AM
So I asked a friend at INDOT, and he said the right turn signals in Lafayette don't have a phase (it wasn't specified in the contract), they are there for safety purposes to delineate the lanes.  He didn't say if the signals in the Valpo area are for the same reason, but it's possible that it is. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on February 25, 2015, 06:31:08 PM
Carmel has a lot of roundabout projects in the works. Most notably "expediting the roundabout interchange at 96th and Keystone"
Carmel mayor announces improvements for city's east side

http://www.wthr.com/story/28200860/carmel-mayor-announces-improvements-for-citys-east-side
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 25, 2015, 07:03:49 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on February 25, 2015, 06:31:08 PM
Carmel has a lot of roundabout projects in the works. Most notably "expediting the roundabout interchange at 96th and Keystone"
Carmel mayor announces improvements for city's east side

http://www.wthr.com/story/28200860/carmel-mayor-announces-improvements-for-citys-east-side

You beat me to it, these are all great ideas, the only thing I wish would be done is another bridge over the white river.  Why are they so vague on 96th street?  What do they mean by "expedite the process"?  it will start construction soon?  Also where are these roundabouts on 96th street going?  I wish they had more specifics.  What will the river road realignment look like, will 122nd cease to exist? unrelated to carmel, imo fishers needs to scrap plans for a 69/106th st interchange and move it to 126th street. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on February 25, 2015, 07:11:19 PM
96th Street east of Keystone toward I-69 strikes me as a very commercial corridor with a lot of businesses, I'm not sure how this whole roundabout thing would work on that stretch. At that rate I wonder how far we are until Carmel proposes roundabouts along 146th Street east of US 31 to the White River. Here I thought that a few roads were safe from roundabouts due to traffic volume but I was wrong.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 25, 2015, 07:29:19 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 25, 2015, 07:11:19 PM
96th Street east of Keystone toward I-69 strikes me as a very commercial corridor with a lot of businesses, I'm not sure how this whole roundabout thing would work on that stretch. At that rate I wonder how far we are until Carmel proposes roundabouts along 146th Street east of US 31 to the White River. Here I thought that a few roads were safe from roundabouts due to traffic volume but I was wrong.

I said the same thing, I never thought they'd put them on 146th, but they are at every intersection west of Spring Mill.  The Ditch rd one is finished i think, but the other 4 way stops havent been fixed just yet.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on February 26, 2015, 09:41:03 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 25, 2015, 07:11:19 PM
96th Street east of Keystone toward I-69 strikes me as a very commercial corridor with a lot of businesses, I'm not sure how this whole roundabout thing would work on that stretch. At that rate I wonder how far we are until Carmel proposes roundabouts along 146th Street east of US 31 to the White River. Here I thought that a few roads were safe from roundabouts due to traffic volume but I was wrong.

The map included in the article just shows "96th Street Improvements" and doesn't mention roundabouts, although the article did: http://carmel.in.gov/modules/showdocument.aspx?documentid=5692

I've never really had much of an issue with traffic on that stretch of 96th street (other than at Keystone). Seems to function just fine the way it is.

I've always thought that Gray Road needed roundabouts.  Glad that's finally happening.  And I'm happy to hear about the bike lane improvements along 126th street.  Riding from the Monon to my parent's house around Gray Rd isn't the safest.  Had a fire truck speed by me with its siren going once and I about rode into the ditch.

I'm curious to find out more details on the River Rd. reconstruction and realignment.  I wonder what that will look like.

Glad to see this city that likes to blow money is blowing some of it on their roads!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 26, 2015, 10:10:29 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on February 26, 2015, 09:41:03 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 25, 2015, 07:11:19 PM
96th Street east of Keystone toward I-69 strikes me as a very commercial corridor with a lot of businesses, I'm not sure how this whole roundabout thing would work on that stretch. At that rate I wonder how far we are until Carmel proposes roundabouts along 146th Street east of US 31 to the White River. Here I thought that a few roads were safe from roundabouts due to traffic volume but I was wrong.

The map included in the article just shows "96th Street Improvements" and doesn't mention roundabouts, although the article did: http://carmel.in.gov/modules/showdocument.aspx?documentid=5692

I've never really had much of an issue with traffic on that stretch of 96th street (other than at Keystone). Seems to function just fine the way it is.

I've always thought that Gray Road needed roundabouts.  Glad that's finally happening.  And I'm happy to hear about the bike lane improvements along 126th street.  Riding from the Monon to my parent's house around Gray Rd isn't the safest.  Had a fire truck speed by me with its siren going once and I about rode into the ditch.

I'm curious to find out more details on the River Rd. reconstruction and realignment.  I wonder what that will look like.

Glad to see this city that likes to blow money is blowing some of it on their roads!

that's one thing carmel does that all cities should do, blow money on much needed street/infrastructure improvements that make sense. I wish Indy were more like this.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on February 26, 2015, 08:45:49 PM
If Indy had the money for it. They have some money available for some projects but not nearly enough for all the things that should be done with the roads. It's the size of the city that's a problem, it's too big with too many roads and not enough money to cover it all. Carmel covers a much smaller space and can dedicate money to a variety of road projects that just appears to cover more of the city.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 27, 2015, 07:27:44 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 26, 2015, 08:45:49 PM
If Indy had the money for it. They have some money available for some projects but not nearly enough for all the things that should be done with the roads. It's the size of the city that's a problem, it's too big with too many roads and not enough money to cover it all. Carmel covers a much smaller space and can dedicate money to a variety of road projects that just appears to cover more of the city.

you're completely right, but one can dream.  there are so many things Indy could do if there was any money to do it. does anyone have any projects they wish indy would do?  (it might be better to post this as a topic in the fictional thread)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: trafficsignal on February 27, 2015, 02:34:44 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 27, 2015, 07:27:44 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 26, 2015, 08:45:49 PM
If Indy had the money for it. They have some money available for some projects but not nearly enough for all the things that should be done with the roads. It's the size of the city that's a problem, it's too big with too many roads and not enough money to cover it all. Carmel covers a much smaller space and can dedicate money to a variety of road projects that just appears to cover more of the city.

you're completely right, but one can dream.  there are so many things Indy could do if there was any money to do it. does anyone have any projects they wish indy would do?  (it might be better to post this as a topic in the fictional thread)

Turn Keystone to freeway / expressway from 465 to 70, and replace the signals on Binford with interchanges.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 27, 2015, 02:36:29 PM
Quote from: trafficsignal on February 27, 2015, 02:34:44 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 27, 2015, 07:27:44 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 26, 2015, 08:45:49 PM
If Indy had the money for it. They have some money available for some projects but not nearly enough for all the things that should be done with the roads. It's the size of the city that's a problem, it's too big with too many roads and not enough money to cover it all. Carmel covers a much smaller space and can dedicate money to a variety of road projects that just appears to cover more of the city.

you're completely right, but one can dream.  there are so many things Indy could do if there was any money to do it. does anyone have any projects they wish indy would do?  (it might be better to post this as a topic in the fictional thread)

Turn Keystone to freeway / expressway from 465 to 70, and replace the signals on Binford with interchanges.
I'd go further and upgrade fall creek parkway to capitol ave to either interchanges or roundabouts. I'd also put a roundabout at college and Kessler.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on February 28, 2015, 08:53:00 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 27, 2015, 02:36:29 PM
Quote from: trafficsignal on February 27, 2015, 02:34:44 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 27, 2015, 07:27:44 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 26, 2015, 08:45:49 PM
If Indy had the money for it. They have some money available for some projects but not nearly enough for all the things that should be done with the roads. It's the size of the city that's a problem, it's too big with too many roads and not enough money to cover it all. Carmel covers a much smaller space and can dedicate money to a variety of road projects that just appears to cover more of the city.

you're completely right, but one can dream.  there are so many things Indy could do if there was any money to do it. does anyone have any projects they wish indy would do?  (it might be better to post this as a topic in the fictional thread)

Turn Keystone to freeway / expressway from 465 to 70, and replace the signals on Binford with interchanges.
I'd go further and upgrade fall creek parkway to capitol ave to either interchanges or roundabouts. I'd also put a roundabout at college and Kessler.
Why specifically College and Kessler? I'd agree that it needs a roundabout, but what makes that one special?
Also, does Binford end at Keystone? If so, I would totally be in favor of turning it into a freeway.
But I feel like upgrading Fall Creek Pkwy. to Capitol would be really hard considering what is passes by. (State fair, Ivy tech, creekfront property, etc.)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 28, 2015, 08:59:35 PM
The college/Kessler intersection can get pretty congested during rush hour. Putting roundabouts on fall creek parkway could work. Binford ends 1 block east of keystone at allisonville rd
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mobilene on March 02, 2015, 10:22:36 AM
Quote
I'd go further and upgrade fall creek parkway to capitol ave to either interchanges or roundabouts. I'd also put a roundabout at college and Kessler.

There are viable businesses on all four corners there. Not sure which of them would be happy about being killed off in favor of a roundabout.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 02, 2015, 11:40:11 AM
Quote from: mobilene on March 02, 2015, 10:22:36 AM
Quote
I'd go further and upgrade fall creek parkway to capitol ave to either interchanges or roundabouts. I'd also put a roundabout at college and Kessler.

There are viable businesses on all four corners there. Not sure which of them would be happy about being killed off in favor of a roundabout.

one can dream
Title: Groundbreaking Tuesday on major south side Indy I-65 construction project
Post by: mukade on March 10, 2015, 06:42:38 AM
Widening I-65 south of Indianapolis will begin next week:

Quote
Groundbreaking on a major construction project on I-65 is Tuesday. Work begins Sunday... It's a Major Moves 2020 project, the first one...

Groundbreaking Tuesday on major south side I-65 construction project (http://www.wthr.com/story/28348090/groundbreaking-tuesday-on-major-south-side-i-65-construction-project) (WTHR)
Title: Re: Groundbreaking Tuesday on major south side Indy I-65 construction project
Post by: silverback1065 on March 12, 2015, 04:30:08 PM
Quote from: mukade on March 10, 2015, 06:42:38 AM
Widening I-65 south of Indianapolis will begin next week:

Quote
Groundbreaking on a major construction project on I-65 is Tuesday. Work begins Sunday... It's a Major Moves 2020 project, the first one...

Groundbreaking Tuesday on major south side I-65 construction project (http://www.wthr.com/story/28348090/groundbreaking-tuesday-on-major-south-side-i-65-construction-project) (WTHR)

What other sections are being done? It only mentions the greenwood portion.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on March 12, 2015, 07:32:06 PM
The section of I-65 bypassing Lafayette from the SR 38 exit to the SR 25 exit will be done too... so I've heard. :-P
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on March 12, 2015, 09:09:58 PM
Also with Major Moves 2020 the stretch of I-65 from Exit 9 in Sellersburg to Exit 15 in Memphis will be widened to three lanes, I think that's already been annouced. A widening of I-65 from US 30 to SR 2 in Lake County has been mentioned as part of the Illiana Expressway project and with that currently on the backburner I wonder if the widening is still planned or not with or without the tollway.

In the coming weeks I believe work will also be announced for I-69 from Exit 205 to Exit 210 for widening to three lanes along with the stretch from Exit 210 to 213, a two-phase project. Looking at plans on INDOT's website for the Greenfield District it also appears as if the Exit 210 (old SR 238, now Campus-Southeastern Parkways) interchange will be redone as a diverging diamond as a part of this project.

Just like how the Southsiders are now having to endure yet another road project further down the highway, it looks as if Northsiders will have to do the same.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on March 13, 2015, 08:05:09 AM
All they need now is just that last little segment from Memphis to Franklin and they're all set.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on March 14, 2015, 01:59:16 AM
I'd say there's more construction coming up for I-69. Just received this email from INDOT today

Quote_The Indiana Department of Transportation (INDOT) will hold a public hearing on Thursday, March 19, 2015 at the Fishers City Hall Auditorium, One Municipal Drive, Fishers, Indiana 46038, the public hearing will begin 6:00 p.m._ *The purpose of the public hearing is to offer all interested persons an opportunity to comment on current plans for a proposed I-69 Interstate Expansion project which includes added travel lanes from 106th Street to 0.5 mile north of Southeastern Parkway/Campus Parkway and added travel lanes from 0.5 mile north of Southeastern Parkway/Campus Parkway to 0.5 East of S.R. 13 in Hamilton and Madison Counties. In addition, the proposed project involves an interchange modification at exit 210 (Campus Parkway/Southeastern Parkway) in Hamilton County.   

The proposed I-69 expansion project involves the construction of additional lanes within the existing median from Exit 205 (116th Street and SR 37 in Fishers) to 0.5 mile north of Exit 210 (Southeastern Parkway/Campus Parkway). An outside auxiliary lane will be added on SB I-69 from 106th Street to 116th Street. Existing pavement will be resurfaced. All mainline bridges will be widened in the median (including the Sand Creek NB bridge and SB bridge). In addition, the project will construct additional lanes within the existing median from 0.5 mile north of Exit 210 to 0.5 mile east of S.R. 13. Existing pavement will be resurfaced. All mainline bridges will be widened in the median (including the Mud Creek NB bridge and SB bridge, the Thorpe Creek NB bridge and SB bridge, and the S.R. 13 NB bridge and SB bridge. The interchange at Exit 210 (Campus Parkway/Southeastern Parkway) is proposed to be modified. The project also involves noise analysis as part of the interstate expansion. INDOT is evaluating noise impact to determine abatement measures as part of this project. Additional details regarding the interstate expansion and interchange modification will be presented in greater detail at the public hearing.

The environmental document and related project documentation are available for viewing at the following locations:

1.   Hearings Examiner, Room N642, Indiana Government Center North, 100 North Senate Avenue, Indianapolis, Indiana 46204‑2216, Phone  (317) 232-6601 (8am to 5pm)

2.   Fishers City Hall, One Municipal Drive, Fishers, Indiana 46038, Phone  (317) 595-3111 (8:30am to 4:30pm)

3.   INDOT website at http://www.indot.in.gov Greenfield District Page



The tentative timetables for construction will be discussed during the formal presentation. This project does not involve the acquisition of right-of-way as work is proposed to take place entirely within existing right-of-way. The proposed maintenance of traffic plan will be presented as part of the formal presentation. Public statements for the record will be accepted as part of the public hearing procedure. All verbal statements recorded during the public hearing and all written comments submitted prior to, during and for a period of two (2) weeks following the hearing date, will be evaluated, considered and addressed in subsequent environmental documentation. Written comments may be submitted prior to the public hearing and within the comment period to: INDOT Public Hearings, IGCN Room N642, 100 North Senate Avenue, Indianapolis, IN 46204.



With advance notice, INDOT can provide special accommodation for persons with disabilities and/or limited English speaking ability and persons needing auxiliary aids or services such as interpreters, signers, readers, or large print. Should special accommodation be needed in regards to the attendance and participation during the public hearing, please contact the Office of Public Involvement at (317) 232-6601, or email rclark@indot.in.gov. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 14, 2015, 04:17:30 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on March 14, 2015, 01:59:16 AM
I'd say there's more construction coming up for I-69. Just received this email from INDOT today

Quote_The Indiana Department of Transportation (INDOT) will hold a public hearing on Thursday, March 19, 2015 at the Fishers City Hall Auditorium, One Municipal Drive, Fishers, Indiana 46038, the public hearing will begin 6:00 p.m._ *The purpose of the public hearing is to offer all interested persons an opportunity to comment on current plans for a proposed I-69 Interstate Expansion project which includes added travel lanes from 106th Street to 0.5 mile north of Southeastern Parkway/Campus Parkway and added travel lanes from 0.5 mile north of Southeastern Parkway/Campus Parkway to 0.5 East of S.R. 13 in Hamilton and Madison Counties. In addition, the proposed project involves an interchange modification at exit 210 (Campus Parkway/Southeastern Parkway) in Hamilton County.   

The proposed I-69 expansion project involves the construction of additional lanes within the existing median from Exit 205 (116th Street and SR 37 in Fishers) to 0.5 mile north of Exit 210 (Southeastern Parkway/Campus Parkway). An outside auxiliary lane will be added on SB I-69 from 106th Street to 116th Street. Existing pavement will be resurfaced. All mainline bridges will be widened in the median (including the Sand Creek NB bridge and SB bridge). In addition, the project will construct additional lanes within the existing median from 0.5 mile north of Exit 210 to 0.5 mile east of S.R. 13. Existing pavement will be resurfaced. All mainline bridges will be widened in the median (including the Mud Creek NB bridge and SB bridge, the Thorpe Creek NB bridge and SB bridge, and the S.R. 13 NB bridge and SB bridge. The interchange at Exit 210 (Campus Parkway/Southeastern Parkway) is proposed to be modified. The project also involves noise analysis as part of the interstate expansion. INDOT is evaluating noise impact to determine abatement measures as part of this project. Additional details regarding the interstate expansion and interchange modification will be presented in greater detail at the public hearing.

The environmental document and related project documentation are available for viewing at the following locations:

1.   Hearings Examiner, Room N642, Indiana Government Center North, 100 North Senate Avenue, Indianapolis, Indiana 46204‑2216, Phone  (317) 232-6601 (8am to 5pm)

2.   Fishers City Hall, One Municipal Drive, Fishers, Indiana 46038, Phone  (317) 595-3111 (8:30am to 4:30pm)

3.   INDOT website at http://www.indot.in.gov Greenfield District Page



The tentative timetables for construction will be discussed during the formal presentation. This project does not involve the acquisition of right-of-way as work is proposed to take place entirely within existing right-of-way. The proposed maintenance of traffic plan will be presented as part of the formal presentation. Public statements for the record will be accepted as part of the public hearing procedure. All verbal statements recorded during the public hearing and all written comments submitted prior to, during and for a period of two (2) weeks following the hearing date, will be evaluated, considered and addressed in subsequent environmental documentation. Written comments may be submitted prior to the public hearing and within the comment period to: INDOT Public Hearings, IGCN Room N642, 100 North Senate Avenue, Indianapolis, IN 46204.



With advance notice, INDOT can provide special accommodation for persons with disabilities and/or limited English speaking ability and persons needing auxiliary aids or services such as interpreters, signers, readers, or large print. Should special accommodation be needed in regards to the attendance and participation during the public hearing, please contact the Office of Public Involvement at (317) 232-6601, or email rclark@indot.in.gov. 
Nice they are going to do a double reverse interchange (diverging diamond)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 17, 2015, 03:04:10 PM
does anyone know what the keystone parkway/96th street interchange will look like?  will it be exactly the same as all the others?  can they fit one like that in the area (would weaving become a problem going from the on ramp from 96th to south keystone and the same issue from north keystone to 96th)?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on March 17, 2015, 07:31:25 PM
Has US-421 been decommissioned? I had to make the full circle on I-465 yesterday for work related reasons and noticed that the Michigan Road exit signage (at least eastbound) is missing all references to US-421. The I-74 interchange in the southeast corner hasn't had 421 markings in years.

Who's paying for the Keystone/96th interchange? I can't imagine Indianapolis will and the state won't. Would Carmel really pony up that much money for it?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 17, 2015, 07:43:10 PM
Quote from: jhuntin1 on March 17, 2015, 07:31:25 PM
Has US-421 been decommissioned? I had to make the full circle on I-465 yesterday for work related reasons and noticed that the Michigan Road exit signage (at least eastbound) is missing all references to US-421. The I-74 interchange in the southeast corner hasn't had 421 markings in years.

Who's paying for the Keystone/96th interchange? I can't imagine Indianapolis will and the state won't. Would Carmel really pony up that much money for it?

US 421 still exists, the michigan road segment's signs are really old and falling apart, the shields simply fell off the BGS, and one was knocked down last winter by a vehicle, INDOT is just too lazy to fix it.  It still does leave the city via I-74 on the SE side, but for some reason they forgot to add the 421 shield to the BGS down there. As soon as you leave 465 on both sides of the city, 421 shields are still up.  Carmel will be paying for the interchange in full i believe.  Indianapolis doesn't own keystone in between 465 and 96th street, it's unsigned, but according to INDOT maps (online map of their highway inventory) it's 431 still for that short piece.  Granted, 421 should begin in Greensburg, and Michigan Road should be SR 29.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 18, 2015, 10:37:26 PM
More Toll Road woes at Lake Station, per the Times.

The westbound entrance from the Borman will close March 30 for ramp reconstruction. The closure is expected to last for 13 weeks. Those looking to make the jump from the Borman to the Westbound Toll Road will have to use nearby I-65 to do it.

This is said to be part of an even bigger project that will (finally) see the ramp bridge connecting the westbound Toll Road to the westbound Borman (essentially westbound I-80) rebuilt, which is targeted for fall completion.

So, to summarize, these will be the only movements available at the Lake Station interchange starting in April:

The Borman Expressway (either direction) to the Eastbound Toll Road
The Eastbound Toll Road to either direction of the Borman Expressway

All other movements must be facilitated via I-65, which will pinch traffic for a short stretch.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 23, 2015, 11:18:10 AM
Not sure where to ask this, but is Home Place part of Carmel?  I remember a few years ago Carmel tried to annex them, and they were very against it.

Unrelated, but here is some more information on a new Keystone interchange: http://currentincarmel.com/hamilton-county-to-build-new-keystone-ramp-from-146th-street-in-2017

This one shows a map of the new road.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on March 23, 2015, 11:41:52 AM
As far as I know, it's still its own community. Technically I believe it's just considered an incorporated part of Clay Township, which has the same boundaries as Carmel. To date Carmel has not been able to annex them.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on March 23, 2015, 01:56:38 PM
Fishers and Hamilton County are planning some improvements for 96th street East of I-69 including 2 new lanes and 2 roundabouts.  I personally think it could be 4 lanes all the way to the new roundabout at Fall Creek, but this is a good start:
http://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/hamilton-county/2015/03/23/county-fishers-add-roundabouts-lanes-th-street/25035855/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on March 25, 2015, 08:48:20 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on March 23, 2015, 11:41:52 AM
As far as I know, it's still its own community. Technically I believe it's just considered an incorporated part of Clay Township, which has the same boundaries as Carmel. To date Carmel has not been able to annex them.

I'm not sure about Home Place, but I do know that there are parts of Hamilton County that are within the city limits (and school district boundary) of Westfield but have Carmel addresses.  USPS had the Carmel PO delivering mail to these areas back when they were unincorporated, and never bothered to change once the areas got annexed by Westfield.  I wonder how many people bought houses with "Carmel addresses" with the false belief that they would be in Carmel's school district?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 25, 2015, 09:04:24 PM
Interesting. Westfield's borders are weird. It's like they purposely annexed out to the county line just so Carmel couldn't go north of 146th st. I wonder if Carmel will try to annex home place again in the future. I wonder why they are so against it
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on March 25, 2015, 10:06:48 PM
Westfield's borders were annexed that way exactly so Carmel couldn't expand north. Boone County has Lebanon, Whitestown and Zionsville annexation everything for the same reasons. I'm sure the addresses aren't exactly perfect there either. Southern Madison County has had some issues as well with annexing involving Ingals, Lapel and Fortville.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 25, 2015, 10:08:32 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on March 25, 2015, 10:06:48 PM
Westfield's borders were annexed that way exactly so Carmel couldn't expand north. Boone County has Lebanon, Whitestown and Zionsville annexation everything for the same reasons. I'm sure the addresses aren't exactly perfect there either. Southern Madison County has had some issues as well with annexing involving Ingals, Lapel and Fortville.
Granted, I don't think Carmel wanted to go north of 146th.  The northern suburbs all appear to be rivals. There's a lot of development along 146th st now going toward boone county.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 25, 2015, 10:17:41 PM
i noticed signs saying there would be construction on (starting on 4/10/15) 421/michigan road on the northside, any idea on what's going on? I'm sure it's minor work, I wish they'd redo that and 865.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 29, 2015, 02:33:58 PM
this is unrelated to my previous post, but I stumbled upon this a minute ago: http://www.wthr.com/story/6153060/state-has-more-plans-for-us-421
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on March 29, 2015, 08:32:37 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 25, 2015, 07:29:19 PM

I said the same thing, I never thought they'd put them on 146th, but they are at every intersection west of Spring Mill.  The Ditch rd one is finished i think, but the other 4 way stops havent been fixed just yet.

The roundabout is finished however 146th street has not yet been relocated to meet up with the new roundabout.  The 4 way stop still exists south of the roundabout.  That portion of the project should be done by fall.   You can see the plans  here (http://www.hamiltoncounty.in.gov/eGov/apps/document/center.egov?view=item;id=7825).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 29, 2015, 09:58:13 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on March 29, 2015, 08:32:37 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 25, 2015, 07:29:19 PM

I said the same thing, I never thought they'd put them on 146th, but they are at every intersection west of Spring Mill.  The Ditch rd one is finished i think, but the other 4 way stops havent been fixed just yet.

The roundabout is finished however 146th street has not yet been relocated to meet up with the new roundabout.  The 4 way stop still exists south of the roundabout.  That portion of the project should be done by fall.   You can see the plans  here (http://www.hamiltoncounty.in.gov/eGov/apps/document/center.egov?view=item;id=7825).

interesting, they went with all roundabouts, and frontage roads.  the small portion from the county line to 421 needs to be widened too, but that's boone county's problem.  I wonder why the road was realigned so far north at ditch.  Also, is the roundabout at little eagle creek ave. needed?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Indyroads on March 31, 2015, 05:49:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 17, 2015, 09:58:34 AM
SR 38 is no longer cosigned with US 421 and sr 39 in Frankfort it now has a gap in it. It ends north of the city and picks up again just south of the city.
Very confusing at first as I was going to use 38 to get to Lafayette from there.

I only anticipate that SR38 will be further truncated as warranted in the future there is no need for several sections of the highway. T Only the eastern section east of I-69 in pendleton and eastward should remain. The central sections through Noblesville, Sheridan, Kirklin and Frankfort are not needed because they are served by other state highways. (On that note SR-47 should be extended along 236th street to US-31.)  the western half of the highway, it should be relinquished to the state as it currently serves only the small town of Mulberry and terminates on a non state highway (Sagamore Parkway; aka. former US-52)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 31, 2015, 05:52:50 PM
Quote from: Indyroads on March 31, 2015, 05:49:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 17, 2015, 09:58:34 AM
SR 38 is no longer cosigned with US 421 and sr 39 in Frankfort it now has a gap in it. It ends north of the city and picks up again just south of the city.
Very confusing at first as I was going to use 38 to get to Lafayette from there.

I only anticipate that SR38 will be further truncated as warranted in the future there is no need for several sections of the highway. T Only the eastern section east of I-69 in pendleton and eastward should remain. The central sections through Noblesville, Sheridan, Kirklin and Frankfort are not needed because they are served by other state highways. (On that note SR-47 should be extended along 236th street to US-31.)  the western half of the highway, it should be relinquished to the state as it currently serves only the small town of Mulberry and terminates on a non state highway (Sagamore Parkway; aka. former US-52)
Sr 47 once used to go to us 31 via 236th. Im honestly surprised sr 32 hasn't been cut into ribbons yet. Sr 38 is too zig zaggy to make sense anymore
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 01, 2015, 12:12:32 AM
Flashing yellow arrows will be coming to Northwest Indiana. U.S. 6 and U.S. 30 are the two highways that will be the first to have them. Nine intersections collectively along those routes will be modernized with the new signal system, beginning with U.S. 30 and Fountain Park Drive in Schererville on March 30.

U.S. 30 has already seen signal improvements over a large stretch of its route from Valparaiso to Merrillville, with red left arrow signals in place from just west of Indiana 49 to (at least) Indiana 55.

They haven't announced which intersections on U.S. 6 will get the flashing yellow arrows, but I have an idea...

Indiana 149 near South Haven
Indiana 51 in Hobart
County Line Road
The Meijer/Walmart entrance just east of Willowcreek Road
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Indyroads on April 01, 2015, 07:20:55 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 01, 2015, 12:12:32 AM
Flashing yellow arrows will be coming to Northwest Indiana. U.S. 6 and U.S. 30 are the two highways that will be the first to have them. Nine intersections collectively along those routes will be modernized with the new signal system, beginning with U.S. 30 and Fountain Park Drive in Schererville on March 30.

U.S. 30 has already seen signal improvements over a large stretch of its route from Valparaiso to Merrillville, with red left arrow signals in place from just west of Indiana 49 to (at least) Indiana 55.

They haven't announced which intersections on U.S. 6 will get the flashing yellow arrows, but I have an idea...

Indiana 149 near South Haven
Indiana 51 in Hobart
County Line Road
The Meijer/Walmart entrance just east of Willowcreek Road

FYA signal already installed north of Indy in the costruction zone of US31 and 196th street.. this is a temporary signal however while US-31 is being upgraded to freeway
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 01, 2015, 07:23:29 AM
The 421 construction I heard was a resurfacing project from 465 to 116th.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on April 01, 2015, 07:48:38 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 01, 2015, 12:12:32 AM
Flashing yellow arrows will be coming to Northwest Indiana. U.S. 6 and U.S. 30 are the two highways that will be the first to have them. Nine intersections collectively along those routes will be modernized with the new signal system, beginning with U.S. 30 and Fountain Park Drive in Schererville on March 30.

Is INDOT going with the traditional four-section FYA heads for those, or are they using the newer thee-section combined FYA - steady yellow arrow heads for these signals?  It appears they recently received interim approval for the three-section version. (scroll to the bottom of this page) (http://mutcd.fhwa.dot.gov/resources/interim_approval/ialistreq.htm#ia17)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 06, 2015, 06:08:50 PM
Has SR 342 (by the terre haute airport) been decommissioned?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on April 07, 2015, 09:33:34 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 06, 2015, 06:08:50 PM
Has SR 342 (by the terre haute airport) been decommissioned?
Why would you think its been decommissioned? :confused:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 07, 2015, 09:34:45 PM
Quote from: billtm on April 07, 2015, 09:33:34 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 06, 2015, 06:08:50 PM
Has SR 342 (by the terre haute airport) been decommissioned?
Why would you think its been decommissioned? :confused:
Looking at the street view all the signs are gone and the Indiana highway ends site lists it as being decommissioned.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on April 07, 2015, 09:42:24 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 07, 2015, 09:34:45 PM
Quote from: billtm on April 07, 2015, 09:33:34 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 06, 2015, 06:08:50 PM
Has SR 342 (by the terre haute airport) been decommissioned?
Why would you think its been decommissioned? :confused:
Looking at the street view all the signs are gone and the Indiana highway ends site lists it as being decommissioned.
The stub that is/was IN-342 does appear on my "INDIANA Official 2015 Roadway Map", though it is not labeled as IN-342. It appears the same way in the 2014 version of the map. Of all the highways in the state road system, this seems like one of the most likely to be unsigned. But INDOT normally does a very good job of signing all its state highways.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on April 07, 2015, 09:58:19 PM
Just did a little more research. On Indiana Hwy. Ends, the signage is still there at 2005. But, on street view the signage seems to be gone by 2009. The road is probably decommissioned. So now my question is: What's INDOT's policy with roads to military locations? Is there one? And if there is one, does it say that they need state road access? I know Crane has 645 or 558 serving it. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on April 08, 2015, 01:53:57 PM
Quote from: billtm on April 07, 2015, 09:58:19 PM
Just did a little more research. On Indiana Hwy. Ends, the signage is still there at 2005. But, on street view the signage seems to be gone by 2009. The road is probably decommissioned. So now my question is: What's INDOT's policy with roads to military locations? Is there one? And if there is one, does it say that they need state road access? I know Crane has 645 or 558 serving it. 

Fort Harrison was never directly connected to a signed highway, so I doubt there is an INDOT policy regarding that. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Indyroads on April 08, 2015, 04:06:46 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on April 01, 2015, 07:48:38 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 01, 2015, 12:12:32 AM
Flashing yellow arrows will be coming to Northwest Indiana. U.S. 6 and U.S. 30 are the two highways that will be the first to have them. Nine intersections collectively along those routes will be modernized with the new signal system, beginning with U.S. 30 and Fountain Park Drive in Schererville on March 30.

Is INDOT going with the traditional four-section FYA heads for those, or are they using the newer thee-section combined FYA - steady yellow arrow heads for these signals?  It appears they recently received interim approval for the three-section version. (scroll to the bottom of this page) (http://mutcd.fhwa.dot.gov/resources/interim_approval/ialistreq.htm#ia17)

The 4 section FYA replaced the 3 section. if interrim approval has been granted for the 3 section signal then they will likely be converted over to the 4 section at some point. This is what happened in SW idaho when they were first being installed here about 6-7 years ago.

The ones being installed here will be the 4 section FYA. I actually like them better than the doghouses. Now if we can get indiana to switch to the mast arms instead of cable stayed. Plus Indiana needs to install SIDE signals instead of just overhead ones.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 08, 2015, 09:14:02 PM
I just came home from our drive in Cincinnati and noticed some activity on I-65 to be on the lookout for.

Two pairs of bridges south of the Kankakee River are being worked on, and from the observation, it looks like crews are rebuilding the bridges to accommodate a third lane and an inner shoulder in the future.

Also, I saw signs warning drivers of construction for a 43-mile stretch, between just north of Indiana 43 and Lafayette Avenue in Lebanon. Very minimal activity right now, but it looks like this will be a long term effort to widen this section of I-65. If this is indeed the case, we'll eventually see six lanes from Indiana 43 to I-865, nearly fifty miles of work.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 08, 2015, 09:20:34 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 08, 2015, 09:14:02 PM
I just came home from our drive in Cincinnati and noticed some activity on I-65 to be on the lookout for.

Two pairs of bridges south of the Kankakee River are being worked on, and from the observation, it looks like crews are rebuilding the bridges to accommodate a third lane and an inner shoulder in the future.

Also, I saw signs warning drivers of construction for a 43-mile stretch, between just north of Indiana 43 and Lafayette Avenue in Lebanon. Very minimal activity right now, but it looks like this will be a long term effort to widen this section of I-65. If this is indeed the case, we'll eventually see six lanes from Indiana 43 to I-865, nearly fifty miles of work.

that would be great! i wonder if the small portion between 465 and 865 will be widened
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 08, 2015, 10:03:38 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 08, 2015, 09:20:34 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 08, 2015, 09:14:02 PM
I just came home from our drive in Cincinnati and noticed some activity on I-65 to be on the lookout for.

Two pairs of bridges south of the Kankakee River are being worked on, and from the observation, it looks like crews are rebuilding the bridges to accommodate a third lane and an inner shoulder in the future.

Also, I saw signs warning drivers of construction for a 43-mile stretch, between just north of Indiana 43 and Lafayette Avenue in Lebanon. Very minimal activity right now, but it looks like this will be a long term effort to widen this section of I-65. If this is indeed the case, we'll eventually see six lanes from Indiana 43 to I-865, nearly fifty miles of work.

that would be great! i wonder if the small portion between 465 and 865 will be widened

I'm sure that's in the works. The overall goal is to have ALL of I-65 seeing at least three lanes of traffic in Indiana. They have to look at how to safely tie that section to the previously widened sections north and south of the area you speak of.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on April 08, 2015, 10:15:26 PM
So far though, I don't think INDOT's announced any plans to actually widen the highway from Lafayette to Lebanon and I thought the work they were doing was only repaving. But if they are at least doing shoulder work and bridge work to prepare for the eventual time that will happen then I can mark Indiana down for being a little progressive for once.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 08, 2015, 10:17:07 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on April 08, 2015, 10:15:26 PM
So far though, I don't think INDOT's announced any plans to actually widen the highway from Lafayette to Lebanon and I thought the work they were doing was only repaving. But if they are at least doing shoulder work and bridge work to prepare for the eventual time that will happen then I can mark Indiana down for being a little progressive for once.
I thought the next phase was to widen it around Lafayette from 43 to 38
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 09, 2015, 01:27:34 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on April 08, 2015, 10:15:26 PM
So far though, I don't think INDOT's announced any plans to actually widen the highway from Lafayette to Lebanon and I thought the work they were doing was only repaving. But if they are at least doing shoulder work and bridge work to prepare for the eventual time that will happen then I can mark Indiana down for being a little progressive for once.

It just seems logical. The south end of that 43-mile zone is right at the north end of the recently-finished expansion of I-65, and the north end is just a bit north of the section soon to be up for bids. I think 43 miles is a bit aggressive for simple paving, but I can be wrong.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on April 09, 2015, 09:00:56 PM
http://wishtv.com/2015/01/08/i-65-expanding-to-six-lanes-in-the-lafayette-area/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 09, 2015, 09:10:22 PM
Great news!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 10, 2015, 07:48:21 AM
another Google map maker fuck up, i tried to fix a small error on keystone.  I tried to remove the expressway part from 96th st to 465, and they accepted the edit, later i see some genius has changed it to have keystone be an expressway all the way down to south of 86th st.  Why is it that they refuse to accept any of your edits, when a lot of times even street view proves you right?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on April 11, 2015, 11:40:46 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 10, 2015, 07:48:21 AM
another Google map maker fuck up, i tried to fix a small error on keystone.  I tried to remove the expressway part from 96th st to 465, and they accepted the edit, later i see some genius has changed it to have keystone be an expressway all the way down to south of 86th st.  Why is it that they refuse to accept any of your edits, when a lot of times even street view proves you right?

Per Google's definition of Expressway this segment is marked correctly.   The segment would not qualify as a Freeway, since it has a few intersections.   It DOES qualify as Expressway since Google's definition allows a few intersections on an Expressway.  It doesn't matter that it doesn't match your personal definition of Expressway -- what matters is it matches Google's definition which is clearly defined in the Google Maps help section.  You may disagree with their definition, but you will be denied every time if you make an edit that ignores their definition.

"Expressways are high quality roads with few intersections that usually traverse an entire region. These roads are usually quite broad and can be easily identified when zoomed out in satellite imagery.

How to identify an expressway:

Accessible from both ramps and intersections, although intersections should be relatively rare and widely spaced.
Walking or biking not allowed, except in rare cases such as California in the U.S.
Either single or dual carriageway depending on the country."
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NE2 on April 11, 2015, 12:34:23 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on April 11, 2015, 11:40:46 AM
Walking or biking not allowed, except in rare cases such as California in the U.S.
As I said last time someone posted this, walking and biking *is* allowed on the vast majority of surface expressways in the U.S.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: dfwmapper on April 12, 2015, 08:06:57 AM
Right or wrong, the intent of the priority is to generally apply to roads that are almost freeways but with some at-grade intersections, and are still mostly access controlled. Keystone clearly meets the guidelines. Where exactly the priority change should occur on the south side is up for debate, but it's certainly not wrong to extend it to south of 86th given the full diamond interchange there.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 13, 2015, 07:49:04 AM
In a perfect world, Keystone ave would be I-270.  Anyway, Google needs to have different colors to differentiate expressways and interstates (ex. 465 should be a different color than keystone).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mobilene on April 13, 2015, 10:59:51 AM
Quote from: Indyroads on March 31, 2015, 05:49:22 PM
(On that note SR-47 should be extended along 236th street to US-31.)

That would restore its original path -- once upon a time, it went all the way to US 31. Old maps show it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Indyroads on April 14, 2015, 04:58:29 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 13, 2015, 07:49:04 AM
In a perfect world, Keystone ave would be I-270.  Anyway, Google needs to have different colors to differentiate expressways and interstates (ex. 465 should be a different color than keystone).

Areed... LIMITED ACCESS FREEWAYS that are completely grade separated should be indicated in a unique color to differentiate them from LIMITED ACCESS EXPRESSWAYS which allow at-grade intersections. Thomas Bros, Rand McNasty, Gousha maps, and AAA maps had a very good way of differentiating the two. Google should follow suit
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on April 14, 2015, 09:41:59 PM
QuoteRand McNasty

Why the hate? :confused:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 16, 2015, 10:40:27 PM
I can confirm that crews are (finally) working to replace the long shuttered ramp connecting the westbound Toll Road to I-80/94 in Lake Station. The old, battered twin piers that formed the old bridge has been torn down and replaced with modern day single piers. Beams and other material should be coming soon. As mentioned earlier, that ramp and the ramp connecting the Borman to the westbound Toll Road should be completely refurbished by the fall.

Of note: the VMS on I-94 westbound between exits 22 and 19 (U.S. 20 and Indiana 249) has been taken down due to damage from a lost semi load. No word on when it will be replaced.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 30, 2015, 12:20:03 PM
does SR 56 still exist between US 421 and SR 62 near madison?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on April 30, 2015, 12:54:59 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 30, 2015, 12:20:03 PM
does SR 56 still exist between US 421 and SR 62 near madison?

I haven't been over to Madison in a while, but I haven't heard anything about that stretch of road being turned over to county/city control. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on April 30, 2015, 01:34:50 PM
I thought I remember hearing that they did want to return SR 56 through Madison to local control but I can't say when or if that would happen. The plan I thought was to reroute 56 along SR 62 and then US 421 around the city, but I suppose they could always just split that highway up at its western and eastern ends. I haven't been there for some time and can't visibly confirm anything.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 30, 2015, 01:36:04 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on April 30, 2015, 01:34:50 PM
I thought I remember hearing that they did want to return SR 56 through Madison to local control but I can't say when or if that would happen. The plan I thought was to reroute 56 along SR 62 and then US 421 around the city, but I suppose they could always just split that highway up at its western and eastern ends. I haven't been there for some time and can't visibly confirm anything.

I heard the same thing.  Can anyone confirm that his has happened?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on April 30, 2015, 02:21:55 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on April 08, 2015, 01:53:57 PM
Quote from: billtm on April 07, 2015, 09:58:19 PM
Just did a little more research. On Indiana Hwy. Ends, the signage is still there at 2005. But, on street view the signage seems to be gone by 2009. The road is probably decommissioned. So now my question is: What's INDOT's policy with roads to military locations? Is there one? And if there is one, does it say that they need state road access? I know Crane has 645 or 558 serving it. 

Fort Harrison was never directly connected to a signed highway, so I doubt there is an INDOT policy regarding that.

Indiana 342 used to connect SR 42 to the military base at the Terre Haute Int'l Airport. I've never read anything official, but the signs no longer exist on the short 1/2 mile state highway, so maybe it's just unsigned now because they didn't want random cars driving down it or maybe it was decommissioned.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on April 30, 2015, 08:03:04 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on April 30, 2015, 01:34:50 PM
I thought I remember hearing that they did want to return SR 56 through Madison to local control but I can't say when or if that would happen. The plan I thought was to reroute 56 along SR 62 and then US 421 around the city, but I suppose they could always just split that highway up at its western and eastern ends. I haven't been there for some time and can't visibly confirm anything.

I thought the deal was that INDOT would rebuild the US 421 approach to the Madison-Milton bridge in exchange for the turnover of SR 56 to the city. AFAIK, that new approach hasn't been built.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mrsman on May 03, 2015, 11:43:43 AM
Quote from: Indyroads on April 14, 2015, 04:58:29 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 13, 2015, 07:49:04 AM
In a perfect world, Keystone ave would be I-270.  Anyway, Google needs to have different colors to differentiate expressways and interstates (ex. 465 should be a different color than keystone).

Areed... LIMITED ACCESS FREEWAYS that are completely grade separated should be indicated in a unique color to differentiate them from LIMITED ACCESS EXPRESSWAYS which allow at-grade intersections. Thomas Bros, Rand McNasty, Gousha maps, and AAA maps had a very good way of differentiating the two. Google should follow suit

Don't forget better distinctions between free and toll roads as well.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on May 03, 2015, 01:29:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 13, 2015, 07:49:04 AM
In a perfect world, Keystone ave would be I-270.  Anyway, Google needs to have different colors to differentiate expressways and interstates (ex. 465 should be a different color than keystone).

I would have thought it would be a better I-x69, as in a more perfect world from my point of view I-69 would been constructed to the northern split of I-65 and I-70. :spin:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on May 10, 2015, 12:12:06 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 01, 2015, 12:12:32 AM
Flashing yellow arrows will be coming to Northwest Indiana. U.S. 6 and U.S. 30 are the two highways that will be the first to have them. Nine intersections collectively along those routes will be modernized with the new signal system, beginning with U.S. 30 and Fountain Park Drive in Schererville on March 30.

Interesting how the 'Left Turn Yield on Flashing Yellow Arrow' signs next to the FYA heads on US 30 and US 6 are around 48" tall - they are at least as long as the four section FYA head.  Seems most other states use smaller signs.

The FYA signals on US 6 also have a noticeable delay between adjoining through traffic getting a green and the red arrow changing to a FYA.

Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 01, 2015, 12:12:32 AMIndiana 51 in Hobart

This one did not get them, I don't know why it didn't since all four legs only have single left turn lanes with no offset issues.  There are also a couple other intersections on US 6 that are still protected only that seem like good FYA candidates.

I'm guessing INDOT doesn't like using three section FYA heads for permitted only turns, given that they weren't used on US 6 through Portage.

Also interesting that there are a bunch of other intersections in NW Indiana that have been modified to include red arrows and retroreflective backplates, but no FYAs.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 10, 2015, 08:02:04 AM
I just saw one on 146th st at spring mill rd.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 10, 2015, 08:53:46 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on May 10, 2015, 12:12:06 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 01, 2015, 12:12:32 AM
Flashing yellow arrows will be coming to Northwest Indiana. U.S. 6 and U.S. 30 are the two highways that will be the first to have them. Nine intersections collectively along those routes will be modernized with the new signal system, beginning with U.S. 30 and Fountain Park Drive in Schererville on March 30.

Interesting how the 'Left Turn Yield on Flashing Yellow Arrow' signs next to the FYA heads on US 30 and US 6 are around 48" tall - they are at least as long as the four section FYA head.  Seems most other states use smaller signs.

The FYA signals on US 6 also have a noticeable delay between adjoining through traffic getting a green and the red arrow changing to a FYA.

Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 01, 2015, 12:12:32 AMIndiana 51 in Hobart

This one did not get them, I don't know why it didn't since all four legs only have single left turn lanes with no offset issues.  There are also a couple other intersections on US 6 that are still protected only that seem like good FYA candidates.

I'm guessing INDOT doesn't like using three section FYA heads for permitted only turns, given that they weren't used on US 6 through Portage.

Also interesting that there are a bunch of other intersections in NW Indiana that have been modified to include red arrows and retroreflective backplates, but no FYAs.

I actually like the timed delay between through-traffic green and the FYA. It's a subtle way of telling left turn drivers new to this process that oncoming traffic still has the right of way. From what I've seen, drivers seem to have an idea on how it works. Even though not all intersections have the FYA (more on that in a bit), it's good that INDOT is implementing a uniform traffic light design that translates from intersection to intersection.

I am surprised that the Indiana 51 intersection didn't get the FYA. The traffic volumes justified the need for one, and it would greatly benefit the south-to-east left turn at that particular light. County Line Road could have used it too, since traffic is light (no pun intended) at that intersection, even at peak.

Willowcreek Road, however, should have stayed with the protected arrow system, though the light cycle there is considerably shorter than what it used to be.

Quick note: the Toll Road exit to I-80/94 westbound is shaping up nicely, since crews have decided it's the more important of the two ramps needing to reopen. I say that ramp should be ready by mid-summer.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 23, 2015, 10:43:22 PM
"Slower Traffic Keep Right" will officially become law July 1. Those refusing to relinquish the left lane for passing traffic will be faced with a fine up to $500.

There are provisions written into this law, saying that the lane restrictions won't apply to inclement weather, left lane exits, moving over for emergency vehicles, or special construction rules.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 25, 2015, 01:18:07 AM
Does anyone know the official routing of SR 22 now?  I know a piece through kokomo was handed over, I drove 931 today and it isn't signed anymore there.  It sounds like it begins cosigned with US 35 at the new bypass and goes east toward upland.  But does the piece from 421 to just outside Kokomo still exist as SR 22?  22 is completely useless as a state road now, just get rid of it and resign the piece east of I-69 as SR 105 and the part south of 5 as an extension of SR 5.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on May 25, 2015, 02:52:42 AM
The stretch from 421 to Kokomo should still exist but yes the route is completely worthless, probably been that way since US 35 was routed along that.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on May 25, 2015, 08:32:23 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 25, 2015, 01:18:07 AM
Does anyone know the official routing of SR 22 now?  I know a piece through kokomo was handed over, I drove 931 today and it isn't signed anymore there.  It sounds like it begins cosigned with US 35 at the new bypass and goes east toward upland.  But does the piece from 421 to just outside Kokomo still exist as SR 22?  22 is completely useless as a state road now, just get rid of it and resign the piece east of I-69 as SR 105 and the part south of 5 as an extension of SR 5.

The eastern part does supposedly go from the US 31 bypass to Upland, but the "begin" sign is actually about .75 miles east just past the Kokomo city limits. Presumably, the western part goes from SR 29 to the Kokomo city limits (I think that is Malfafa Rd.).

Quote from: tdindy88 on May 25, 2015, 02:52:42 AM
The stretch from 421 to Kokomo should still exist but yes the route is completely worthless, probably been that way since US 35 was routed along that.

Personally, I think US 35 is the number that should go - it is either overlapped or superceded state road numbers (like SR 17, SR 21 and SR 29). For SR 22, there always have been the parts from SR 29 to US 31 and from I-69 to Upland which never were designated as US 35. Still, when you have a long est-west highway marked only as a north-south highway, that is not good so I would guess that keeping an est-west number was kept on purpose.

Also, SR 22 used to go all the way to the Ohio line and the old maps show what is now SR 352 as SR 22. That eastern part was decommissioned, but SR 22 would be a better designation than SR 352 for the latter.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 26, 2015, 07:57:17 AM
http://www.indystar.com/story/news/2015/05/16/travel-nightmare-coming-soon/27453447/

good to see them widening 65 again, just think it's weird to do this small piece, now there's a gap from SR 32 to SR 38 that will be 4 lanes for the foreseeable future. The detours they provide are much harder to follow now that INDOT messed up all the highway routings up there in 2013. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 26, 2015, 08:33:55 AM
Quote from: mukade on May 25, 2015, 08:32:23 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 25, 2015, 01:18:07 AM
Does anyone know the official routing of SR 22 now?  I know a piece through kokomo was handed over, I drove 931 today and it isn't signed anymore there.  It sounds like it begins cosigned with US 35 at the new bypass and goes east toward upland.  But does the piece from 421 to just outside Kokomo still exist as SR 22?  22 is completely useless as a state road now, just get rid of it and resign the piece east of I-69 as SR 105 and the part south of 5 as an extension of SR 5.

The eastern part does supposedly go from the US 31 bypass to Upland, but the "begin" sign is actually about .75 miles east just past the Kokomo city limits. Presumably, the western part goes from SR 29 to the Kokomo city limits (I think that is Malfafa Rd.).

Quote from: tdindy88 on May 25, 2015, 02:52:42 AM
The stretch from 421 to Kokomo should still exist but yes the route is completely worthless, probably been that way since US 35 was routed along that.

Personally, I think US 35 is the number that should go - it is either overlapped or superceded state road numbers (like SR 17, SR 21 and SR 29). For SR 22, there always have been the parts from SR 29 to US 31 and from I-69 to Upland which never were designated as US 35. Still, when you have a long est-west highway marked only as a north-south highway, that is not good so I would guess that keeping an est-west number was kept on purpose.

Also, SR 22 used to go all the way to the Ohio line and the old maps show what is now SR 352 as SR 22. That eastern part was decommissioned, but SR 22 would be a better designation than SR 352 for the latter.

Since INDOT got on their kick about giving up highways through cities, we've gotten situations like this all over the state.  INDOT has to sign the roads they own as state highways.  They can't/won't sign the roads they don't own as state highways.  When you have what used to be a through highway like 22 that has the city portion no longer owned by INDOT, you end up with routing issues.

Sometimes you can do some weird reroutes like they did in Lafayette, but in Kokomo there is no other state highway to reroute to from the east side.  I'm guessing Howard County doesn't want to take over their part of 22, so you're just stuck with 22 ending at the city limits on each end with no signage directing you from one end to the other.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 26, 2015, 08:35:46 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 26, 2015, 08:33:55 AM
Quote from: mukade on May 25, 2015, 08:32:23 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 25, 2015, 01:18:07 AM
Does anyone know the official routing of SR 22 now?  I know a piece through kokomo was handed over, I drove 931 today and it isn't signed anymore there.  It sounds like it begins cosigned with US 35 at the new bypass and goes east toward upland.  But does the piece from 421 to just outside Kokomo still exist as SR 22?  22 is completely useless as a state road now, just get rid of it and resign the piece east of I-69 as SR 105 and the part south of 5 as an extension of SR 5.

The eastern part does supposedly go from the US 31 bypass to Upland, but the "begin" sign is actually about .75 miles east just past the Kokomo city limits. Presumably, the western part goes from SR 29 to the Kokomo city limits (I think that is Malfafa Rd.).

Quote from: tdindy88 on May 25, 2015, 02:52:42 AM
The stretch from 421 to Kokomo should still exist but yes the route is completely worthless, probably been that way since US 35 was routed along that.

Personally, I think US 35 is the number that should go - it is either overlapped or superceded state road numbers (like SR 17, SR 21 and SR 29). For SR 22, there always have been the parts from SR 29 to US 31 and from I-69 to Upland which never were designated as US 35. Still, when you have a long est-west highway marked only as a north-south highway, that is not good so I would guess that keeping an est-west number was kept on purpose.

Also, SR 22 used to go all the way to the Ohio line and the old maps show what is now SR 352 as SR 22. That eastern part was decommissioned, but SR 22 would be a better designation than SR 352 for the latter.

Since INDOT got on their kick about giving up highways through cities, we've gotten situations like this all over the state.  INDOT has to sign the roads they own as state highways.  They can't/won't sign the roads they don't own as state highways.  When you have what used to be a through highway like 22 that has the city portion no longer owned by INDOT, you end up with routing issues.

Sometimes you can do some weird reroutes like they did in Lafayette, but in Kokomo there is no other state highway to reroute to from the east side.  I'm guessing Howard County doesn't want to take over their part of 22, so you're just stuck with 22 ending at the city limits on each end with no signage directing you from one end to the other.
Clearly indot doesn't care about continuity. I wonder if they'll ever get kokomo to take 931.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on May 26, 2015, 08:41:23 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 26, 2015, 08:33:55 AM
I'm guessing Howard County doesn't want to take over their part of 22, so you're just stuck with 22 ending at the city limits on each end with no signage directing you from one end to the other.

I don't think the state wants to turn back the part of SR 22 west of Kokomo. They want to get rid of city streets. The first really weird one I remember was SR 61 which ended at the city limits in Vincennes over ten years ago. So this in't really new - it is just getting to be more common.

The funny thing is that SR 22 seems to end at the city limits on both sides (if you go by sign placement), but US 35 continues to the US 31 freeway.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 26, 2015, 08:56:14 PM
Quote from: mukade on May 26, 2015, 08:41:23 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 26, 2015, 08:33:55 AM
I'm guessing Howard County doesn't want to take over their part of 22, so you're just stuck with 22 ending at the city limits on each end with no signage directing you from one end to the other.

I don't think the state wants to turn back the part of SR 22 west of Kokomo. They want to get rid of city streets. The first really weird one I remember was SR 61 which ended at the city limits in Vincennes over ten years ago. So this in't really new - it is just getting to be more common.

The funny thing is that SR 22 seems to end at the city limits on both sides (if you go by sign placement), but US 35 continues to the US 31 freeway.
I wish indot would at least work out a deal where they could post "to Indiana 22" directional signs over the old route
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: dfwmapper on May 27, 2015, 12:26:03 AM
Quote from: mukade on May 26, 2015, 08:41:23 PM
The funny thing is that SR 22 seems to end at the city limits on both sides (if you go by sign placement), but US 35 continues to the US 31 freeway.
INDOT is only allowed to fuck up its own road network. AASHTO has control over US routes and generally won't let states make them discontinuous. Determining why the state can't delegate ownership and maintenance of roads that carry US routes to a city/county is left as an exercise to those more familiar with Indiana law.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 10, 2015, 04:24:56 PM
Bridge work has picked up again on I-94, at the U.S. 20 interchange at Burns Harbor and Porter (exits 22a-b) and just west of Indiana 49. Because of work at the U.S. 20 interchange, the loop ramps (I-94 east to U.S. 20 east and I-94 west to U.S. 20 west) are closed. The "opposite direction" ramps have been modified to allow traffic looking to make the closed loop movements to instead turn left at temporarily placed traffic signals.

Broadway is the newest road in the region to have flashing yellow left arrows installed at some intersections. As I drove by yesterday, crews were installing a set at 80th Place (the light just north of U.S. 30). That is all I saw, but I'm sure there are more installed between U.S. and U.S. 231, with more to be installed up to at least 61st Avenue.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 15, 2015, 02:53:08 PM
I'm surprised indot hasnt tried to kill SR 53 altogether, they're obsessed with getting rid of highways in cities. On an unrelated note, what's going on with the Salem bypass? Is it signed as anything? Did they move 135 or 60 on it? Why is there a bridge over SR 160? Now it looks like it ends at a city street. Why doesn't the bypass tie into 135 on the north side?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jnewkirk77 on June 15, 2015, 10:08:38 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 15, 2015, 02:53:08 PM
I'm surprised indot hasnt tried to kill SR 53 altogether, they're obsessed with getting rid of highways in cities. On an unrelated note, what's going on with the Salem bypass? Is it signed as anything? Did they move 135 or 60 on it? Why is there a bridge over SR 160? Now it looks like it ends at a city street. Why doesn't the bypass tie into 135 on the north side?

As of the last time I was up that way, the Salem Bypass is signed as 135 over its full length, and picks up 60 on the SE side of town - so those are co-signed up to 56.  They then follow 56 west into town.  I don't think that's changed recently ...
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 17, 2015, 01:43:00 PM
some actual news about keystone & 96th st http://currentincarmel.com/brainard-moves-forward-with-plans-for-96th-and-keystone-interchange
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on June 26, 2015, 04:55:07 PM
I-94 to westbound Toll Road entry ramp to re-open
QuoteLAKE STATION, Ind. — Beginning 9 p.m. CST Friday, June 26, the westbound entry ramp at the Lake Station (Exit 21) interchange on the Indiana Toll Road will be re-opened ahead of schedule after a nearly three-month closure. The ramp connects both directions of traffic from I-80/94 traveling to westbound Indiana Toll Road.

The ramp work was part of the ongoing Lake Station rehabilitation project that began in October 2013, and will rebuild three structures in the interchange: BHX-A, BHX-B and 5262B. The structure that re-opens tonight is Structure BHX-A (see attached map for clarification). The ramp has been closed since March 30, 2015, for demolition and reconstruction.

Although the I-94 to westbound Indiana Toll Road ramp will open, the previous Lake Station exit restriction remains in place (ramp closed to westbound Indiana Toll Road traffic exiting at MP 21 (to go either direction on I-94). This traffic is still diverted to Exit 17, Gary East. At Gary East, patrons are to take I-65 South and re-connect with I-94. Exit 17 remains a free exit, just as Exit 21.)

The entire process is expected to be completed in early fall 2015. Upon completion, the interchange will function as it did prior to the project. No permanent removal of any structure is planned.

Lake Station reconstruction summary:
(see attached map for locations)

-   Structure BHX-B: Demolished in October 2013. BHX-B remains closed, with reconstruction currently in progress. Anticipated completion in fall 2015.
-   Structure 5262B: Reconstruction began in June 2014 and completed in November 2014.
-   Structure BHX-A: Demolished in April 2015. Reconstruction completed June 26, 2015.
-   Indiana Toll Road entering/exiting eastbound traffic is not impacted.

Here's the map:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi57.tinypic.com%2Fw7hdht.jpg&hash=aea60a772346dea56e63020a5a873174e7d2044f)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on June 30, 2015, 07:35:12 PM
QuoteINDOT officials say they're working on a cost effective way to keep more drivers safe. INDOT crews identified seven interstate ramps in the Indianapolis area with a history of more crash issues, especially crashes involving semi trucks...

INDOT tracks interstate ramps with most crashes (http://fox59.com/2015/06/30/indot-tracks-interstate-ramps-with-most-crashes/) (Fox59)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 30, 2015, 07:54:37 PM
Quote from: mukade on June 30, 2015, 07:35:12 PM
QuoteINDOT officials say they're working on a cost effective way to keep more drivers safe. INDOT crews identified seven interstate ramps in the Indianapolis area with a history of more crash issues, especially crashes involving semi trucks...

INDOT tracks interstate ramps with most crashes (http://fox59.com/2015/06/30/indot-tracks-interstate-ramps-with-most-crashes/) (Fox59)

The i-865/US 52 exit is a deathtrap. semis routinely have to floor it to make it from 86th st all the way to the fast lane to get onto 865/52.  This also backs up very bad every fucking day during both rush hours.  INDOT fix it by adding lanes, make it an exit from the right and be done with it.  It should be at very least 8 lanes entering the exit in either direction with 2 turning into the on/off ramps in either direction, like the 65 interchange on the west side.  865/52 should remain 4 lanes.  This area is only going to grow with Whitestown and Zionsville growing.  Michigan road needs longer merging lanes as well as it has issues too.  of course they're too cheap to do this
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 01, 2015, 11:10:25 PM
Taking a page from IDOT, INDOT will use most of its DMS to display travel times to specific points along the highways (barring major events like accidents or Amber Alerts). Already implemented in the Indianapolis and Jeffersonville areas, Northwest Indiana will be part of the system starting this holiday weekend for highways that don't already have dedicated travel time signs installed.

One DMS with travel time information will be on I-80/94 eastbound at mile 12 (at the merge from I-65) with travel times to Indiana 49 (exit 26), U.S. 421 (exit 34), and the Michigan state line (approximately mile 46)

The other in this region will be on I-65 southbound just before the 61st Avenue exit, displaying travel times to Indiana 2 (exit 240), Indiana 26 (exit 172), and I-865 (exit 129).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 02, 2015, 05:42:41 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 01, 2015, 11:10:25 PM
Taking a page from IDOT, INDOT will use most of its DMS to display travel times to specific points along the highways (barring major events like accidents or Amber Alerts). Already implemented in the Indianapolis and Jeffersonville areas, Northwest Indiana will be part of the system starting this holiday weekend for highways that don't already have dedicated travel time signs installed.

One DMS with travel time information will be on I-80/94 eastbound at mile 12 (at the merge from I-65) with travel times to Indiana 49 (exit 26), U.S. 421 (exit 34), and the Michigan state line (approximately mile 46)

The other in this region will be on I-65 southbound just before the 61st Avenue exit, displaying travel times to Indiana 2 (exit 240), Indiana 26 (exit 172), and I-865 (exit 129).
I saw these on i-70 by the airport Tuesday
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 02, 2015, 07:56:21 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 01, 2015, 11:10:25 PM
Taking a page from IDOT, INDOT will use most of its DMS to display travel times to specific points along the highways (barring major events like accidents or Amber Alerts). Already implemented in the Indianapolis and Jeffersonville areas, Northwest Indiana will be part of the system starting this holiday weekend for highways that don't already have dedicated travel time signs installed.

One DMS with travel time information will be on I-80/94 eastbound at mile 12 (at the merge from I-65) with travel times to Indiana 49 (exit 26), U.S. 421 (exit 34), and the Michigan state line (approximately mile 46)

The other in this region will be on I-65 southbound just before the 61st Avenue exit, displaying travel times to Indiana 2 (exit 240), Indiana 26 (exit 172), and I-865 (exit 129).

Never once have I seen a travel time listed on a DMS anywhere near here.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 02, 2015, 08:36:09 AM
The DMS on 65 north of the river reads out the distance and time to SR 56, US 50 and I-465, at least when it's not being used for construction information.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 02, 2015, 02:02:59 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 02, 2015, 08:36:09 AM
The DMS on 65 north of the river reads out the distance and time to SR 56, US 50 and I-465, at least when it's not being used for construction information.

I'm not doubting you, but I see that sign 2-3 times a week and have only ever seen construction information.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 30, 2015, 12:43:31 PM
http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/local/lakeville-lapaz-trying-not-to-be-passed-by-after-u/article_2562b8e4-05f0-5c06-b32e-9f607362b9b5.html

Can anyone confirm that the old us 31 near south bend is signed as SR 931? according to this article it is, what are the signed limits of the highway?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on July 30, 2015, 02:39:12 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 30, 2015, 12:43:31 PM
http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/local/lakeville-lapaz-trying-not-to-be-passed-by-after-u/article_2562b8e4-05f0-5c06-b32e-9f607362b9b5.html

Can anyone confirm that the old us 31 near south bend is signed as SR 931? according to this article it is, what are the signed limits of the highway?

I read it is going to be SR 931 in St. Joseph County until sometime later in the year when the county officially will take it over.

http://www.us31plysb.com/faq.html#14
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 30, 2015, 06:57:16 PM
I was in terre haute today and saw one of these: https://www.google.com/maps/@39.527248,-87.370892,3a,75y,247.37h,68.42t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sipwTyyAFJmw5Z4Hb8XYpqw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
how long has it been since us 41 was on this road?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jnewkirk77 on July 30, 2015, 11:39:21 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 30, 2015, 06:57:16 PM
I was in terre haute today and saw one of these: https://www.google.com/maps/@39.527248,-87.370892,3a,75y,247.37h,68.42t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sipwTyyAFJmw5Z4Hb8XYpqw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
how long has it been since us 41 was on this road?

Early '70s, maybe??  It was still sporadically signed as Business 41 (with old signage) in the mid-'90s when I lived up there, but that sign is fairly recent.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on July 31, 2015, 10:54:12 AM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on July 30, 2015, 11:39:21 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 30, 2015, 06:57:16 PM
I was in terre haute today and saw one of these: https://www.google.com/maps/@39.527248,-87.370892,3a,75y,247.37h,68.42t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sipwTyyAFJmw5Z4Hb8XYpqw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
how long has it been since us 41 was on this road?

Early '70s, maybe??  It was still sporadically signed as Business 41 (with old signage) in the mid-'90s when I lived up there, but that sign is fairly recent.

I live only about 5 miles from where I live so I can explain. They just put a brand new stoplight at the intersection of Park and Lafayette Ave. Note there has been a stoplight there for a long time, but they added turn lanes and a brand new traffic signal a couple of years ago. Before the new stoplight there was a Business US 41 sign in the same spot. Whenever they reconstructed the intersection, for some reason they decided to put a new US 41 sign up on the road, rather than a Business 41 sign. Why? I have no idea. I wouldn't have replaced it at all since Lafayette isn't really Business 41 anymore.

Here's a streetview image of the old sign.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.527251,-87.370889,3a,75y,263.9h,92.69t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s7Jslnc3prvyXMtF2_jfzdA!2e0!7i3328!8i1664!6m1!1e1?hl=en-US
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 03, 2015, 09:44:29 AM
Quote from: US 41 on July 31, 2015, 10:54:12 AM
I live only about 5 miles from where I live

That's quite a talent you have there.  I wish I could do that.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on August 03, 2015, 10:28:21 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 03, 2015, 09:44:29 AM
Quote from: US 41 on July 31, 2015, 10:54:12 AM
I live only about 5 miles from where I live

That's quite a talent you have there.  I wish I could do that.

Live-ception  :spin:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on August 03, 2015, 08:10:09 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 30, 2015, 12:43:31 PM
http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/local/lakeville-lapaz-trying-not-to-be-passed-by-after-u/article_2562b8e4-05f0-5c06-b32e-9f607362b9b5.html

Can anyone confirm that the old us 31 near south bend is signed as SR 931? according to this article it is, what are the signed limits of the highway?

I will be up there in a few weeks and will try to check.  I did not see any 931 signs when I was last there in May.

Interesting story - I wonder how much money Lakeville lost last year in reduced speeding tickets given, particularly on Notre Dame football weekends.  I don't miss that speed trap at all (and no, they never got me).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on August 03, 2015, 09:03:24 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on August 03, 2015, 10:28:21 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 03, 2015, 09:44:29 AM
Quote from: US 41 on July 31, 2015, 10:54:12 AM
I live only about 5 miles from where I live

That's quite a talent you have there.  I wish I could do that.

Live-ception  :spin:

Oops. Perfect example of me not double checking what I typed. :pan:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 04, 2015, 08:09:25 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 30, 2015, 12:43:31 PM
http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/local/lakeville-lapaz-trying-not-to-be-passed-by-after-u/article_2562b8e4-05f0-5c06-b32e-9f607362b9b5.html

Can anyone confirm that the old us 31 near south bend is signed as SR 931? according to this article it is, what are the signed limits of the highway?

I thought I read somewhere that it was going to be an unsigned highway.  Later when I have time I will check the US 31 Plymouth-SB thread because that's where I think I read it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 04, 2015, 06:40:47 PM
this cant be good...
http://wlfi.com/2015/08/04/stretch-of-i-65-closed-for-emergency-bridge-repairs/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Rushmeister on August 05, 2015, 11:43:53 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 04, 2015, 06:40:47 PM
this cant be good...
http://wlfi.com/2015/08/04/stretch-of-i-65-closed-for-emergency-bridge-repairs/

It's not.  I'd characterize it as double-plus ungood. 

I witnessed much of the post—rush-hour mayhem on the south side of Lafayette yesterday.   Teal Rd was a disaster.   How much of this was caused by westbound US 52 traffic faithfully following the US 52 route markers from Sagamore Pkwy onto Teal Rd, thinking they were doing the right thing by staying on the marked highway?  I don't know.  Many trucks continued north on Sagamore Pkwy for their transit through/around Lafayette, presumably knowing from experience that the now-unsigned 4-lane road around Lafayette was the better option for them.  Good for them. 

I-65 closures in the Lafayette area usually result in this kind of flustercluck.  The overhead message boards on I-65 south of Indy are warning motorists about the road closure.  Those warning messages start at MM 86 now. Boards on WB I-70 and I-74 east of Indy have similar messages.

Man, I would just avoid the whole mess and take I-74 west from Indy to Crawfordsville, exiting onto US 231 north there.  Sure, you'll get slowed down a bit in the Lafayette area, but you would avoid the long backups on US 52 near Clarks Hill and the mess that has been created all along IND 28 from I-65 to Romney.  (Check out the traffic speeds on Google Maps for real-time confirmation of this.)  Hopefully everything will be back to "normal" by the end of the day.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 05, 2015, 11:46:17 AM
Quote from: Rushmeister on August 05, 2015, 11:43:53 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 04, 2015, 06:40:47 PM
this cant be good...
http://wlfi.com/2015/08/04/stretch-of-i-65-closed-for-emergency-bridge-repairs/

It's not.  I'd characterize it as double-plus ungood. 

I witnessed much of the post—rush-hour mayhem on the south side of Lafayette yesterday.   Teal Rd was a disaster.   How much of this was caused by westbound US 52 traffic faithfully following the US 52 route markers from Sagamore Pkwy onto Teal Rd, thinking they were doing the right thing by staying on the marked highway?  I don't know.  Many trucks continued north on Sagamore Pkwy for their transit through/around Lafayette, presumably knowing from experience that the now-unsigned 4-lane road around Lafayette was the better option for them.  Good for them. 

I-65 closures in the Lafayette area usually result in this kind of flustercluck.  The overhead message boards on I-65 south of Indy are warning motorists about the road closure.  Those warning messages start at MM 86 now. Boards on WB I-70 and I-74 east of Indy have similar messages.

Man, I would just avoid the whole mess and take I-74 west from Indy to Crawfordsville, exiting onto US 231 north there.  Sure, you'll get slowed down a bit in the Lafayette area, but you would avoid the long backups on US 52 near Clarks Hill and the mess that has been created all along IND 28 from I-65 to Romney.  (Check out the traffic speeds on Google Maps for real-time confirmation of this.)  Hopefully everything will be back to "normal" by the end of the day.

This is exactly why us 52 should never have been rerouted.  they need to post "emergency detour i-65" shields along sagamore parkway
Is it open yet?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on August 05, 2015, 12:01:58 PM
I think we all knew this would come back to bite INDOT in the ass some day...

Here's the backup on I-65 at US 52 as of ~ noon.  Looks like it's backing up past SR 32:
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2029769/pictures/roads/Screen%20Shot%202015-08-05%20at%2011.59.28%20AM.png)

It's eerie following the traffic cameras north towards lafayette and seeing no northbound traffic.  Probably even more eerie driving southbound.

As mentioned earlier, the traffic looks pretty awful in the Clarks Hill / Romney area. (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2029769/pictures/roads/Screen%20Shot%202015-08-05%20at%2011.49.28%20AM.png)

According to this map, 231 seems to actually be flowing fairly well even though it doesn't turn to 4 lanes until a few miles north of 28.

Sagamore Parkway looks pretty awful in Lafayette.  I'm sure the construction going on there isn't helping the situation.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 2trailertrucker on August 05, 2015, 08:53:35 PM
The interstate is back open as of 8:15 tonight.

INDOT: I-65 bridge reopening section-by-section. Details in app.

http://www.wthr.com/story/29707484/northbound-i-65-closed-in-tippecanoe-co-for-unsafe-bridge

(Sent from WTHR)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: TravelingBethelite on August 05, 2015, 10:14:02 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on August 05, 2015, 12:01:58 PM
I think we all knew this would come back to bite INDOT in the ass some day...

Here's the backup on I-65 at US 52 as of ~ noon.  Looks like it's backing up past SR 32:
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2029769/pictures/roads/Screen%20Shot%202015-08-05%20at%2011.59.28%20AM.png)

It's eerie following the traffic cameras north towards lafayette and seeing no northbound traffic.  Probably even more eerie driving southbound.

As mentioned earlier, the traffic looks pretty awful in the Clarks Hill / Romney area. (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2029769/pictures/roads/Screen%20Shot%202015-08-05%20at%2011.49.28%20AM.png)

According to this map, 231 seems to actually be flowing fairly well even though it doesn't turn to 4 lanes until a few miles north of 28.

Sagamore Parkway looks pretty awful in Lafayette.  I'm sure the construction going on there isn't helping the situation.

I'm sorry if this unrelated, but why does it look like all traffic cameras still use VHS?
ON TOPIC: Why is INDOT still letting heavy vehicle traffic over a sagging bridge? Oy.  :ded:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 05, 2015, 10:32:57 PM
Quote from: TravelingBethelite on August 05, 2015, 10:14:02 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on August 05, 2015, 12:01:58 PM
I think we all knew this would come back to bite INDOT in the ass some day...

Here's the backup on I-65 at US 52 as of ~ noon.  Looks like it's backing up past SR 32:
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2029769/pictures/roads/Screen%20Shot%202015-08-05%20at%2011.59.28%20AM.png)

It's eerie following the traffic cameras north towards lafayette and seeing no northbound traffic.  Probably even more eerie driving southbound.

As mentioned earlier, the traffic looks pretty awful in the Clarks Hill / Romney area. (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2029769/pictures/roads/Screen%20Shot%202015-08-05%20at%2011.49.28%20AM.png)

According to this map, 231 seems to actually be flowing fairly well even though it doesn't turn to 4 lanes until a few miles north of 28.

Sagamore Parkway looks pretty awful in Lafayette.  I'm sure the construction going on there isn't helping the situation.

I'm sorry if this unrelated, but why does it look like all traffic cameras still use VHS?
ON TOPIC: Why is INDOT still letting heavy vehicle traffic over a sagging bridge? Oy.  :ded:
It's been fixed, I don't know the technical name but those metal boxes that hold up the beams that cross the top of the peers fell off causing the sagging, the put them back on and everything is back to normal.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: andy on August 05, 2015, 11:32:41 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 05, 2015, 10:32:57 PM
It's been fixed, I don't know the technical name but those metal boxes that hold up the beams that cross the top of the peers fell off causing the sagging, the put them back on and everything is back to normal.

If I understand you correctly, I believe those are simply called "bearings". Sort of makes sense.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bridge_bearing (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bridge_bearing)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 06, 2015, 05:10:29 PM
Quote from: andy on August 05, 2015, 11:32:41 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 05, 2015, 10:32:57 PM
It's been fixed, I don't know the technical name but those metal boxes that hold up the beams that cross the top of the peers fell off causing the sagging, the put them back on and everything is back to normal.

If I understand you correctly, I believe those are simply called "bearings". Sort of makes sense.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bridge_bearing (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bridge_bearing)

correct, here's a closeup of one here: https://www.google.com/maps/@39.912326,-86.114254,3a,15y,172.71h,114.02t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sPDHwK1dn1gUChi4L8oV55g!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo0.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fcb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile%26output%3Dthumbnail%26thumb%3D2%26panoid%3DPDHwK1dn1gUChi4L8oV55g%26w%3D88%26h%3D60%26yaw%3D83%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D96%26ll%3D39.912326,-86.114254!7i13312!8i6656
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Pete from Boston on August 06, 2015, 05:26:09 PM
Not sure if it's come up yet but I was on US 41 in Evansville a few weeks ago and it looks like all movements are paved (in concrete) at the intersection with the Lloyd Expressway (Indiana 62/66).  This is the intersection that a traffic light on either side but is being converted to a full cloverleaf. The night I was there a new pedestrian span was being hoisted into place over the Lloyd adjacent to 41.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 06, 2015, 05:27:12 PM
Quote from: Pete from Boston on August 06, 2015, 05:26:09 PM
Not sure if it's come up yet but I was on US 41 in Evansville a few weeks ago and it looks like all movements are paved (in concrete) at the intersection with the Lloyd Expressway (Indiana 62/66).  This is the intersection that a traffic light on either side but is being converted to a full cloverleaf. The night I was there a new pedestrian span was being hoisted into place over the Lloyd adjacent to 41.
Cool, is this supposed to be done this fall?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: iBallasticwolf2 on August 06, 2015, 05:28:27 PM
Quote from: Pete from Boston on August 06, 2015, 05:26:09 PM
Not sure if it's come up yet but I was on US 41 in Evansville a few weeks ago and it looks like all movements are paved (in concrete) at the intersection with the Lloyd Expressway (Indiana 62/66).  This is the intersection that a traffic light on either side but is being converted to a full cloverleaf. The night I was there a new pedestrian span was being hoisted into place over the Lloyd adjacent to 41.

I happened to go through that area on the Lloyd Expressway a week ago and can confirm the concrete aspect of this.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Pete from Boston on August 06, 2015, 06:00:15 PM

Quote from: silverback1065 on August 06, 2015, 05:27:12 PM
Quote from: Pete from Boston on August 06, 2015, 05:26:09 PM
Not sure if it's come up yet but I was on US 41 in Evansville a few weeks ago and it looks like all movements are paved (in concrete) at the intersection with the Lloyd Expressway (Indiana 62/66).  This is the intersection that a traffic light on either side but is being converted to a full cloverleaf. The night I was there a new pedestrian span was being hoisted into place over the Lloyd adjacent to 41.
Cool, is this supposed to be done this fall?

Not sure, but they would have to really slow down not to be.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 2trailertrucker on August 07, 2015, 03:00:04 PM
The bridge over Wildcat Creek on I 65
in Tippecanoe county is closed again! Just in time
for the weekend!

Damaged bridge closes I-65 northbound again near Lafayette

http://www.wthr.com/story/29707484/northbound-i-65-closed-in-tippecanoe-co-for-unsafe-bridge

(Sent from WTHR)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NE2 on August 07, 2015, 03:32:21 PM
Quote from: dfwmapper on May 27, 2015, 12:26:03 AM
INDOT is only allowed to fuck up its own road network. AASHTO has control over US routes and generally won't let states make them discontinuous.
But Colorado.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 10, 2015, 05:24:13 PM
Well the bridge is now closed indefinitely.
The official detour is now i-74 to i-57 for Chicago traffic. And most logical local detours are impossible because a lot of secondary state roads are closed for unrelated projects.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on August 10, 2015, 05:55:39 PM
^ Is there some project that prevents use of the IN 63/US 41 as part of the detour?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 10, 2015, 05:57:22 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on August 10, 2015, 05:55:39 PM
^ Is there some project that prevents use of the IN 63/US 41 as part of the detour?
Not that I know of, but since that corridor isn't an interstate I think that's why they don't list it as an official detour.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: TravelingBethelite on August 10, 2015, 05:58:51 PM
Quote from: 2trailertrucker on August 07, 2015, 03:00:04 PM
The bridge over Wildcat Creek on I 65
in Tippecanoe county is closed again! Just in time
for the weekend!

Damaged bridge closes I-65 northbound again near Lafayette

http://www.wthr.com/story/29707484/northbound-i-65-closed-in-tippecanoe-co-for-unsafe-bridge

(Sent from WTHR)

Fox 59 had a similar story:
http://fox59.com/2015/08/10/indot-to-answer-questions-about-i-65-northbound-bridge-closure-in-lafayette/ (http://fox59.com/2015/08/10/indot-to-answer-questions-about-i-65-northbound-bridge-closure-in-lafayette/)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Rushmeister on August 11, 2015, 09:49:42 AM
Last Friday I went over the Wildcat Creek bridge on I-65 just before they closed it again.  I could clearly feel the dip where one pier has dropped down -- rather noticeable and somewhat alarming, actually.  I heard on the news this morning that the pier has dropped 9 inches.  When I heard later in the day that the bridge was closed again, I was actually sort of relieved.  Although I'm reasonably certain the bridge was not in danger of imminent collapse, I know we really can't afford to gamble with public safety.

My advice for anyone traveling from Indianapolis to Lafayette is to avoid all of the detour options advertised on highway message boards and the news media.  The delays can be extensive along those routes (US 52-IND 28-US 231) at certain times of day.  Depending on your specific destination in the Lafayette area there could be many better options for making a northbound approach.  Hint:  Stay to the east of Lafayette and go through Frankfort.  There are a number of well-built secondary roads in the Jefferson-Mulberry area that should get the job done nicely for entering the Lafayette area.  If the primary detour route is your first choice you should check traffic conditions on-line first and then use your discretion.  Now that temporary automatic signals are in place at Clarks Hill and Romney, safety and congestion are improved.

Indy to Chicago through traffic, especially large vehicles, should just take I-74 west and then use IND 63/US 41 for the rest of the trip to Chicago.  Not the only way to get the job done, of course; I'm just sayin'...
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 11, 2015, 09:51:46 AM
Quote from: Rushmeister on August 11, 2015, 09:49:42 AM
Last Friday I went over the Wildcat Creek bridge on I-65 just before they closed it again.  I could clearly feel the dip where one pier has dropped down -- rather noticeable and somewhat alarming, actually.  I heard on the news this morning that the pier has dropped 9 inches.  When I heard later in the day that the bridge was closed again, I was actually sort of relieved.  Although I'm reasonably certain the bridge was not in danger of imminent collapse, I know we really can't afford to gamble with public safety.

My advice for anyone traveling from Indianapolis to Lafayette is to avoid all of the detour options advertised on highway message boards and the news media.  The delays can be extensive along those routes (US 52-IND 28-US 231) at certain times of day.  Depending on your specific destination in the Lafayette area there could be many better options for making a northbound approach.  Hint:  Stay to the east of Lafayette and go through Frankfort.  There are a number of well-built secondary roads in the Jefferson-Mulberry area that should get the job done nicely for entering the Lafayette area.  If the primary detour route is your first choice you should check traffic conditions on-line first and then use your discretion.  Now that temporary automatic signals are in place at Clarks Hill and Romney, safety and congestion are improved.

Indy to Chicago through traffic, especially large vehicles, should just take I-74 west and then use IND 63/US 41 for the rest of the trip to Chicago.  Not the only way to get the job done, of course; I'm just sayin'...
Where are the temporary signals specifically?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 11, 2015, 11:31:08 AM
Never mind I found them both at SR 28. How's traffic flowing around there? This bridge could be closed for several months now.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 13, 2015, 06:13:28 PM
The wait ends.

Per INDOT, the long-closed ramp connecting the Indiana Toll Road to I-80/94 and Ripley Street (exit 21) is scheduled to reopen ahead of schedule tomorrow morning at 9am (8/14), ending a series of rehab projects involving the interchange system. This will take a LOT of pressure off I-65 and should allow for the major channels to flow normally. The ramp to I-65 further west had a history of jammed traffic for the almost two years the ramp had been shuttered, and it will be a welcome relief for those who drove the stretch, like me.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: pianocello on August 14, 2015, 04:48:57 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 13, 2015, 06:13:28 PM
The wait ends.

Per INDOT, the long-closed ramp connecting the Indiana Toll Road to I-80/94 and Ripley Street (exit 21) is scheduled to reopen ahead of schedule tomorrow morning at 9am (8/14), ending a series of rehab projects involving the interchange system. This will take a LOT of pressure off I-65 and should allow for the major channels to flow normally. The ramp to I-65 further west had a history of jammed traffic for the almost two years the ramp had been shuttered, and it will be a welcome relief for those who drove the stretch, like me.

Cool, I'll have to check that out when I go back there.

Is it just the WB Toll Rd -> I-94 ramp that's back open, or is the ramp from 94 to the WB Toll Rd back open too? (Or am I making up the WB on-ramp's closure?)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 14, 2015, 07:52:46 PM
Quote from: pianocello on August 14, 2015, 04:48:57 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 13, 2015, 06:13:28 PM
The wait ends.

Per INDOT, the long-closed ramp connecting the Indiana Toll Road to I-80/94 and Ripley Street (exit 21) is scheduled to reopen ahead of schedule tomorrow morning at 9am (8/14), ending a series of rehab projects involving the interchange system. This will take a LOT of pressure off I-65 and should allow for the major channels to flow normally. The ramp to I-65 further west had a history of jammed traffic for the almost two years the ramp had been shuttered, and it will be a welcome relief for those who drove the stretch, like me.

Cool, I'll have to check that out when I go back there.

Is it just the WB Toll Rd -> I-94 ramp that's back open, or is the ramp from 94 to the WB Toll Rd back open too? (Or am I making up the WB on-ramp's closure?)

You're not making that up. That ramp was closed at the end of March and opened before the end of June. Work on both bridges was concurrent, with the westbound on ramp requiring less time.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mgk920 on August 15, 2015, 10:39:41 AM
^^
I'm still wondering what happened with the proposed major interchange rebuild that was on the table back in the late 1990s.

Mike
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 15, 2015, 10:40:42 AM
65 will be closed until mid September
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on August 16, 2015, 02:01:26 PM
I drove a lot of the I 65 detour from West Lafayette to Indy on Thursday and boy, it's a challenge!  INDOT has done a good job of adding signage and alerts.  They also put a temporary stoplight at IN 28 & US 52.  I'd encourage drivers to avoid the route and it's obvious there are many people exploring throughout the Lafayette area for better options, adding to the burden of Sagamore Parkway construction that has that traffic running one lane in each direction.  I 74 to US 41 and even Keystone to US 31 may be decent options going north.  The two lane rural roads with the Interstate level of traffic just seem dangerous.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 16, 2015, 02:04:24 PM
Us 52 can handle it, its just 28 that can't. All the at grade intersections are also a safety concern.
Also SR 63 is the better route, us 41 is a 2 lane road around 74
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Pete from Boston on August 17, 2015, 10:42:39 AM

Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on August 06, 2015, 05:28:27 PM
Quote from: Pete from Boston on August 06, 2015, 05:26:09 PM
Not sure if it's come up yet but I was on US 41 in Evansville a few weeks ago and it looks like all movements are paved (in concrete) at the intersection with the Lloyd Expressway (Indiana 62/66).  This is the intersection that a traffic light on either side but is being converted to a full cloverleaf. The night I was there a new pedestrian span was being hoisted into place over the Lloyd adjacent to 41.

I happened to go through that area on the Lloyd Expressway a week ago and can confirm the concrete aspect of this.

Got a better look at things the other day.  All eight new ramps are open and the lights are gone from the Lloyd Expressway. 

Also, construction of another new pedestrian overpass is underway at Vann Ave. just east of here.
Title: Indiana Notes
Post by: Pete from Boston on August 17, 2015, 10:51:40 AM
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on August 06, 2015, 05:28:27 PM
Quote from: Pete from Boston on August 06, 2015, 05:26:09 PM
Not sure if it's come up yet but I was on US 41 in Evansville a few weeks ago and it looks like all movements are paved (in concrete) at the intersection with the Lloyd Expressway (Indiana 62/66).  This is the intersection that a traffic light on either side but is being converted to a full cloverleaf. The night I was there a new pedestrian span was being hoisted into place over the Lloyd adjacent to 41.

I happened to go through that area on the Lloyd Expressway a week ago and can confirm the concrete aspect of this.

Got a better look at things the other day.  All eight new ramps are open and the lights are gone from the Lloyd Expressway. 

Also, construction of another new pedestrian overpass is underway at Vann Ave. just east of here.  Not a little one, either–concrete-walled embankments are being built up on either side, enough to make me wonder for a minute if the Vann crossing was being grade-separated.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on August 20, 2015, 01:37:52 AM
Quote from: Indyroads on March 31, 2015, 05:49:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 17, 2015, 09:58:34 AM
SR 38 is no longer cosigned with US 421 and sr 39 in Frankfort it now has a gap in it. It ends north of the city and picks up again just south of the city.
Very confusing at first as I was going to use 38 to get to Lafayette from there.

I only anticipate that SR38 will be further truncated as warranted in the future there is no need for several sections of the highway. T Only the eastern section east of I-69 in pendleton and eastward should remain. The central sections through Noblesville, Sheridan, Kirklin and Frankfort are not needed because they are served by other state highways. (On that note SR-47 should be extended along 236th street to US-31.)  the western half of the highway, it should be relinquished to the state as it currently serves only the small town of Mulberry and terminates on a non state highway (Sagamore Parkway; aka. former US-52)

From a Purdue sports discussion board thread regarding the detour(s) around the closed section of I-65, a statement by someone who tried to do 421 to 38...

Quote
Still haven't figured out where we lost 38 in Frankfort. I picked it back up in Mulberry.

This is why continuing route numbers across a city matters, INDOT!!  God forbid anyone try to use a route number to, you know, navigate...especially in an unusual situation like getting around an emergency closure.

INDOT not being able to post route numbers over city/county roads really irks me.  Do like they do in places like Massachusetts and allow the route number to continue.  Drivers don't care about maintenance of the road when it comes to signage of route numbers.  They are trying to navigate with the route numbers.  Why not at least some TO trailblazers along the old route?  Oi.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jnewkirk77 on August 20, 2015, 02:15:13 AM
I apologize in advance if this gets me in trouble, but surpluses are more important to the Pence administration than roads and bridges.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 20, 2015, 06:26:47 AM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on August 20, 2015, 02:15:13 AM
I apologize in advance if this gets me in trouble, but surpluses are more important to the Pence administration than roads and bridges.
I agree, having money in savings is meaningless when everything around you is falling apart. We should save money but we also need to spend more to fix real problems. Maybe this bridge will get them to care more. They claim next year is "infrastructure year" we'll see.
It really just seems like we have a large surplus so politicians can brag about it (I know Indiana cannot be in a deficit by law)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 20, 2015, 06:29:30 AM
This bridge is causing so many accidents on us 52 that normally wouldn't have happened otherwise. Everyday there's a new horrible accident on that stretch. The coffee accident is by far the worst I've heard.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 20, 2015, 06:59:16 AM
Quote from: PurdueBill on August 20, 2015, 01:37:52 AM
Quote from: Indyroads on March 31, 2015, 05:49:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 17, 2015, 09:58:34 AM
SR 38 is no longer cosigned with US 421 and sr 39 in Frankfort it now has a gap in it. It ends north of the city and picks up again just south of the city.
Very confusing at first as I was going to use 38 to get to Lafayette from there.

I only anticipate that SR38 will be further truncated as warranted in the future there is no need for several sections of the highway. T Only the eastern section east of I-69 in pendleton and eastward should remain. The central sections through Noblesville, Sheridan, Kirklin and Frankfort are not needed because they are served by other state highways. (On that note SR-47 should be extended along 236th street to US-31.)  the western half of the highway, it should be relinquished to the state as it currently serves only the small town of Mulberry and terminates on a non state highway (Sagamore Parkway; aka. former US-52)

From a Purdue sports discussion board thread regarding the detour(s) around the closed section of I-65, a statement by someone who tried to do 421 to 38...

Quote
Still haven't figured out where we lost 38 in Frankfort. I picked it back up in Mulberry.

This is why continuing route numbers across a city matters, INDOT!!  God forbid anyone try to use a route number to, you know, navigate...especially in an unusual situation like getting around an emergency closure.

INDOT not being able to post route numbers over city/county roads really irks me.  Do like they do in places like Massachusetts and allow the route number to continue.  Drivers don't care about maintenance of the road when it comes to signage of route numbers.  They are trying to navigate with the route numbers.  Why not at least some TO trailblazers along the old route?  Oi.
I totally agree, but I don't think designing 38 has anything to do with not signing city streets, nothing in that area has been decommissioned, and they really can't since it's a us route principally and those are harder for indot to fuck up. Having 38 signed is a good idea because some people actually are trying to use it to get to Lafayette.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on August 20, 2015, 07:04:46 AM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on August 20, 2015, 02:15:13 AM
I apologize in advance if this gets me in trouble, but surpluses are more important to the Pence administration than roads and bridges.

Of course both are extremely important. Indiana's AAA credit rating is why it has more flexibility financing things like I-69 section 5 (and presumably section 6). Look at the price Illinois has to pay due to their poor financial condition. One of the reasons why it is so important to this and the previous administrations is that Indiana was in such poor financial shape in the early 2000s. The key is to effectively maintain a healthy balance sheet while improving the highway infrastructure - and that is somewhat difficult.

Quote from: silverback1065 on August 20, 2015, 06:26:47 AM
I agree, having money in savings is meaningless when everything around you is falling apart.
I am not sure everything is falling apart. The remarkably bad things I have seen are ones that are planned for large investment like the I-465 & I-69 interchange and US 31 & US 20 interchange. I thought Indiana compared better to most states on bridges, and most state roads are acceptably smooth. They have a ways to go on upgrading corridors like US 31 and widening I-65 and I-70.

Even the I-65 bridge fiasco was not a result of inadequate investment. The contractor messed up while widening the bridge.

Quote from: silverback1065 on August 20, 2015, 06:26:47 AM
It really just seems like we have a large surplus so politicians can brag about it (I know Indiana cannot be in a deficit by law)

It is an important differentiator when Indiana competes against other states. Illinois, despite its poor financial shape, has a magnet called Chicago. Indiana does not so it needs distinctions.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 20, 2015, 07:34:01 AM
I guess it could be worse, we have better roads than Michigan.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on August 20, 2015, 10:08:05 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 20, 2015, 06:59:16 AM
Quote from: PurdueBill on August 20, 2015, 01:37:52 AM
Quote from: Indyroads on March 31, 2015, 05:49:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 17, 2015, 09:58:34 AM
SR 38 is no longer cosigned with US 421 and sr 39 in Frankfort it now has a gap in it. It ends north of the city and picks up again just south of the city.
Very confusing at first as I was going to use 38 to get to Lafayette from there.

I only anticipate that SR38 will be further truncated as warranted in the future there is no need for several sections of the highway. T Only the eastern section east of I-69 in pendleton and eastward should remain. The central sections through Noblesville, Sheridan, Kirklin and Frankfort are not needed because they are served by other state highways. (On that note SR-47 should be extended along 236th street to US-31.)  the western half of the highway, it should be relinquished to the state as it currently serves only the small town of Mulberry and terminates on a non state highway (Sagamore Parkway; aka. former US-52)

From a Purdue sports discussion board thread regarding the detour(s) around the closed section of I-65, a statement by someone who tried to do 421 to 38...

Quote
Still haven't figured out where we lost 38 in Frankfort. I picked it back up in Mulberry.

This is why continuing route numbers across a city matters, INDOT!!  God forbid anyone try to use a route number to, you know, navigate...especially in an unusual situation like getting around an emergency closure.

INDOT not being able to post route numbers over city/county roads really irks me.  Do like they do in places like Massachusetts and allow the route number to continue.  Drivers don't care about maintenance of the road when it comes to signage of route numbers.  They are trying to navigate with the route numbers.  Why not at least some TO trailblazers along the old route?  Oi.
I totally agree, but I don't think designing 38 has anything to do with not signing city streets, nothing in that area has been decommissioned, and they really can't since it's a us route principally and those are harder for indot to fuck up. Having 38 signed is a good idea because some people actually are trying to use it to get to Lafayette.

Indeed, stopping and starting 38 in Frankfort is different from 25 and 26 in Lafayette for example, but the end result for navigation is the same...if you're unfamiliar with the area and trying to navigate by number because you know 38 goes to Lafayette, you're stuck when 38 randomly disappears.  It's impossible now to tell people to stay on 25 or 26 from one side of Lafayette to the other.  No driver cares if there is a state shield and the town maintains the road.

As far as the bridge, it's damn lucky that there wasn't some Schoharie Creek bridge type failure out of nowhere with heavy traffic.  It's not as tall a bridge and not exactly the same design, but if the whole thing decided to fall into the creek, the result could be the same for people.  At least it just settled.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 20, 2015, 11:06:49 AM
Quote from: PurdueBill on August 20, 2015, 10:08:05 AM
Indeed, stopping and starting 38 in Frankfort is different from 25 and 26 in Lafayette for example, but the end result for navigation is the same...if you're unfamiliar with the area and trying to navigate by number because you know 38 goes to Lafayette, you're stuck when 38 randomly disappears.  It's impossible now to tell people to stay on 25 or 26 from one side of Lafayette to the other.  No driver cares if there is a state shield and the town maintains the road.

As far as the bridge, it's damn lucky that there wasn't some Schoharie Creek bridge type failure out of nowhere with heavy traffic.  It's not as tall a bridge and not exactly the same design, but if the whole thing decided to fall into the creek, the result could be the same for people.  At least it just settled.

In lieu of co-signing 38 with 39, maybe INDOT could add Lafayette to a few of what I call "arrow signs" in advance of intersections.  Put one where EB 38 ends at 39 directing Lafayette traffic to turn right, and then a couple in Frankfort at the 421/28 and 75 intersections directing Lafayette traffic to continue straight. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 20, 2015, 12:02:29 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 20, 2015, 11:06:49 AM
Quote from: PurdueBill on August 20, 2015, 10:08:05 AM
Indeed, stopping and starting 38 in Frankfort is different from 25 and 26 in Lafayette for example, but the end result for navigation is the same...if you're unfamiliar with the area and trying to navigate by number because you know 38 goes to Lafayette, you're stuck when 38 randomly disappears.  It's impossible now to tell people to stay on 25 or 26 from one side of Lafayette to the other.  No driver cares if there is a state shield and the town maintains the road.

As far as the bridge, it's damn lucky that there wasn't some Schoharie Creek bridge type failure out of nowhere with heavy traffic.  It's not as tall a bridge and not exactly the same design, but if the whole thing decided to fall into the creek, the result could be the same for people.  At least it just settled.

In lieu of co-signing 38 with 39, maybe INDOT could add Lafayette to a few of what I call "arrow signs" in advance of intersections.  Put one where EB 38 ends at 39 directing Lafayette traffic to turn right, and then a couple in Frankfort at the 421/28 and 75 intersections directing Lafayette traffic to continue straight.

good idea they could also post signs saying "indiana 38 west/east follow indiana 39 north/south"
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on August 22, 2015, 09:07:50 AM
So, the 2016 Indiana Roadway Map is out (yes in August.) Below I have a few observations to share with anyone interested.

-The map is the same format as the previous last two with the state map in the front and tourist related stuff in the back. Only the Indianapolis inset on the front with the state map.

-Interstate 69 in Southern Indiana is more or less the same as last time with Section 4 being shown as under construction, even though it will be open by 2016. But now Section 5 from Bloomington to Martinsville is also shown as under construction. The "Corridor I-69" symbology remains for SR 37 from Martinsville north to I-465. I imagine with the state releasing these maps in August before the coming year there's going to be a one-year delay on various projects that usually open at the end of the year.

-Ohio River Bridges project basically shown as the same, although the construction corridor for the East End Bridge is now shown with a "Corridor SR 265" symbol whereas last year it had a "Corridor I-265" CORRIDOR.

-US 31 is shown as  freeway from Plymouth up to South Bend, along the Kokomo bypass and in parts of Hamilton County (116th Street up to SR 32) with the highway under construction for the other two segments in that area. No mention for the Veterans Parkway (I think that's the name now) along 31 north of Plymouth. New this year however are exit numbers around Kokomo and Plymouth to South Bend....so progress?

-SR 931 designated along old US 31 in St. Joseph County, I've never seen a sign for this but okay.

-SR 22 gone within Kokomo and I'm not sure about any other decommissions, the Lafayette area was shown last year with its new (stupid as we are finding out) rerouting.

-Several new towns are now showing their town boundaries instead of a dot or dot-inside-a-rectangle symbol. Among the communities to have "graduated" are Tipton, Avon, Danville, New Whiteland, Ellettsville and Batesville. Communities like Carmel, Zionsville, Brownsburg, Whitestown and Lebanon don't have their boundaries adjusted to what they are now, annexation and all that.

-Bridge is still present outside of New Harmony, that thing is still closed right?

-The Indianapolis inset does have the new exit configuration at 465 and 65 on the south side as well as US 31 and 465 on the north side. For some reason it still shows the location of Fort Benjamin Harrison.

-No new exit for Worthsville Road in Johnson County (Exit 97,) supposed to be open by the end of the year.

-And for some reason there are city limits for part of Niles, Michigan shown on the far northern edge of the map bordering Indiana. Why we care that much for Michigan when we haven't updated the city limits for Louisville or Owensboro forever I'm not sure.

-Finally, I-65 is shown as COMPLETE around the Lafayette area.  :D

I think that's it but there may be more in there but for now that's what I've seen.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 22, 2015, 09:33:30 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on August 22, 2015, 09:07:50 AM
So, the 2016 Indiana Roadway Map is out (yes in August.) Below I have a few observations to share with anyone interested.

-The map is the same format as the previous last two with the state map in the front and tourist related stuff in the back. Only the Indianapolis inset on the front with the state map.

-Interstate 69 in Southern Indiana is more or less the same as last time with Section 4 being shown as under construction, even though it will be open by 2016. But now Section 5 from Bloomington to Martinsville is also shown as under construction. The "Corridor I-69" symbology remains for SR 37 from Martinsville north to I-465. I imagine with the state releasing these maps in August before the coming year there's going to be a one-year delay on various projects that usually open at the end of the year.

-Ohio River Bridges project basically shown as the same, although the construction corridor for the East End Bridge is now shown with a "Corridor SR 265" symbol whereas last year it had a "Corridor I-265" CORRIDOR.

-US 31 is shown as  freeway from Plymouth up to South Bend, along the Kokomo bypass and in parts of Hamilton County (116th Street up to SR 32) with the highway under construction for the other two segments in that area. No mention for the Veterans Parkway (I think that's the name now) along 31 north of Plymouth. New this year however are exit numbers around Kokomo and Plymouth to South Bend....so progress?

-SR 931 designated along old US 31 in St. Joseph County, I've never seen a sign for this but okay.

-SR 22 gone within Kokomo and I'm not sure about any other decommissions, the Lafayette area was shown last year with its new (stupid as we are finding out) rerouting.

-Several new towns are now showing their town boundaries instead of a dot or dot-inside-a-rectangle symbol. Among the communities to have "graduated" are Tipton, Avon, Danville, New Whiteland, Ellettsville and Batesville. Communities like Carmel, Zionsville, Brownsburg, Whitestown and Lebanon don't have their boundaries adjusted to what they are now, annexation and all that.

-Bridge is still present outside of New Harmony, that thing is still closed right?

-The Indianapolis inset does have the new exit configuration at 465 and 65 on the south side as well as US 31 and 465 on the north side. For some reason it still shows the location of Fort Benjamin Harrison.

-No new exit for Worthsville Road in Johnson County (Exit 97,) supposed to be open by the end of the year.

-And for some reason there are city limits for part of Niles, Michigan shown on the far northern edge of the map bordering Indiana. Why we care that much for Michigan when we haven't updated the city limits for Louisville or Owensboro forever I'm not sure.

-Finally, I-65 is shown as COMPLETE around the Lafayette area.  :D

I think that's it but there may be more in there but for now that's what I've seen.
What the heck is veterans parkway?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on August 22, 2015, 09:47:43 AM
The 7A Road exit off of US 31 north of Plymouth. As explained here, https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=5642.250
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 22, 2015, 09:50:07 AM
That's weird that the old 31 is 931 up on the north part of the state, I thought they got a deal to give it to the county? Also is kokomo ever going to take over their 931?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: renegade on August 22, 2015, 04:31:55 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 20, 2015, 07:34:01 AM
I guess it could be worse, we have better roads than Michigan.

Yeah, not by much ... I-94 between Lake Station and Michigan City could use some work.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 22, 2015, 09:23:14 PM
Quote from: renegade on August 22, 2015, 04:31:55 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 20, 2015, 07:34:01 AM
I guess it could be worse, we have better roads than Michigan.

Yeah, not by much ... I-94 between Lake Station and Michigan City could use some work.

The good news is that INDOT has major resurfacing planned for that exact stretch in 2017. Hopefully they have more winter-resistant material this time.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 23, 2015, 01:13:24 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 22, 2015, 09:50:07 AM
That's weird that the old 31 is 931 up on the north part of the state, I thought they got a deal to give it to the county? Also is kokomo ever going to take over their 931?

Marshall County took over their portion of Old 31, but St. Joseph's portion is still maintained by INDOT.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 23, 2015, 01:16:21 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 23, 2015, 01:13:24 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 22, 2015, 09:50:07 AM
That's weird that the old 31 is 931 up on the north part of the state, I thought they got a deal to give it to the county? Also is kokomo ever going to take over their 931?

Marshall County took over their portion of Old 31, but St. Joseph's portion is still maintained by INDOT.
Someone on here said that St Joseph will take over sometime later this year.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on August 23, 2015, 10:14:14 PM
Does INDOT usually post a stop sign at the top of a loop ramp - as they have done with the loop from NB I-69 to WB I-64, where the only change during construction is closure of the passing lane (the normal weaving area of the cloverleaf is still available) - or is this just a one-off bad design by INDOT?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 23, 2015, 10:54:30 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on August 23, 2015, 10:14:14 PM
Does INDOT usually post a stop sign at the top of a loop ramp - as they have done with the loop from NB I-69 to WB I-64, where the only change during construction is closure of the passing lane (the normal weaving area of the cloverleaf is still available) - or is this just a one-off bad design by INDOT?
There shouldn't be a sign there at all, unless it's some new policy. Did it look permanent?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on August 24, 2015, 05:26:22 PM
^ No, it was definitely a temporary sign.  Just seems most other jurisdictions would use a yield sign instead since there was a lane present to accelerate into.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on August 25, 2015, 02:24:26 PM
http://www.in.gov/indot/files/PI_I69Interchange.pdf

QuoteINDOT, in coordination with the City of Fishers and Hamilton County as partners, intends to construct a new I-69 interchange at the 106th Street overpass located within the City of Fishers in Hamilton County, Indiana. The interchange configuration will be a two-lane, oval-shaped roundabout centered over the I-69 centerline. The existing 106th Street structure over I-69 will be totally removed as part of this project and replaced with two one-way structures (south structure and north structure). The north bridge will provide a variable six foot to eight foot wide sidewalk along the north side of 106th Street for the entire project length, with crosswalks across 106th Street at Crosspoint Boulevard and USA Parkway. Construction along I-69 will include new bridge piers in the median and new bridge abutments to the outside of mainline I-69. No roadway work is proposed for existing mainline I-69, and all roadway work along I-69 will be limited to construction of the ramps for the new interchange.

Interesting interchange design... I wonder why they chose this design out of the 4 listed in the pdf.  I think this interchange has been needed for a long time but I'm thinking they should spend money on the I-69 / I-465 interchange first.  I'm going to try to go to the public meeting.  If they don't mention that interchange, I'll have to ask somebody if there are any plans for that interchange and if the plans for this interchange affect that one.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 25, 2015, 02:26:28 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on August 25, 2015, 02:24:26 PM
http://www.in.gov/indot/files/PI_I69Interchange.pdf

QuoteINDOT, in coordination with the City of Fishers and Hamilton County as partners, intends to construct a new I-69 interchange at the 106th Street overpass located within the City of Fishers in Hamilton County, Indiana. The interchange configuration will be a two-lane, oval-shaped roundabout centered over the I-69 centerline. The existing 106th Street structure over I-69 will be totally removed as part of this project and replaced with two one-way structures (south structure and north structure). The north bridge will provide a variable six foot to eight foot wide sidewalk along the north side of 106th Street for the entire project length, with crosswalks across 106th Street at Crosspoint Boulevard and USA Parkway. Construction along I-69 will include new bridge piers in the median and new bridge abutments to the outside of mainline I-69. No roadway work is proposed for existing mainline I-69, and all roadway work along I-69 will be limited to construction of the ramps for the new interchange.

Interesting interchange design... I wonder why they chose this design out of the 4 listed in the pdf.  I think this interchange has been needed for a long time but I'm thinking they should spend money on the I-69 / I-465 interchange first.  I'm going to try to go to the public meeting.  If they don't mention that interchange, I'll have to ask somebody if there are any plans for that interchange and if the plans for this interchange affect that one.

I think this exit should be at 126th not 106th.  I wonder how this will make traffic better or worse, will weaving be an issue at all?  Meh, it's probably an invalid concern. interesting idea though, the original idea I thought was a teardrop interchange.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 25, 2015, 03:08:35 PM
Maybe this design was chosen due to the higher speeds you can drive in this type of roundabout configuration? 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on August 25, 2015, 10:14:49 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 25, 2015, 02:26:28 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on August 25, 2015, 02:24:26 PM
http://www.in.gov/indot/files/PI_I69Interchange.pdf

QuoteINDOT, in coordination with the City of Fishers and Hamilton County as partners, intends to construct a new I-69 interchange at the 106th Street overpass located within the City of Fishers in Hamilton County, Indiana. The interchange configuration will be a two-lane, oval-shaped roundabout centered over the I-69 centerline. The existing 106th Street structure over I-69 will be totally removed as part of this project and replaced with two one-way structures (south structure and north structure). The north bridge will provide a variable six foot to eight foot wide sidewalk along the north side of 106th Street for the entire project length, with crosswalks across 106th Street at Crosspoint Boulevard and USA Parkway. Construction along I-69 will include new bridge piers in the median and new bridge abutments to the outside of mainline I-69. No roadway work is proposed for existing mainline I-69, and all roadway work along I-69 will be limited to construction of the ramps for the new interchange.

Interesting interchange design... I wonder why they chose this design out of the 4 listed in the pdf.  I think this interchange has been needed for a long time but I'm thinking they should spend money on the I-69 / I-465 interchange first.  I'm going to try to go to the public meeting.  If they don't mention that interchange, I'll have to ask somebody if there are any plans for that interchange and if the plans for this interchange affect that one.

I think this exit should be at 126th not 106th.  I wonder how this will make traffic better or worse, will weaving be an issue at all?  Meh, it's probably an invalid concern. interesting idea though, the original idea I thought was a teardrop interchange.

The interchange at 106th has been planned for awhile.  As noted in the pdf, it is mostly about reducing congestion on 116th and 96th - the lines to enter southbound 69 in the morning, particularly from the East are very long.  Lots of housing developments along 106th.  The new interchange will also serve the office buildings on each side of 69.

I've always thought an exit at 126th made sense, but I don't see it happening.  A then Fishers councilman told me several years ago that the then Town did not want an exit at 126th.  That was before Billericay Park was built in the most obvious spot for southbound exit and entrance ramps.  The angle at which 126th crosses 69 is very hard to work with.

As for the roundabout interchange, the handful of times I've been on Keystone during rush hour, those exits seem to work well.  Although mine is definitely a small sample size.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 25, 2015, 10:20:08 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on August 25, 2015, 10:14:49 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 25, 2015, 02:26:28 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on August 25, 2015, 02:24:26 PM
http://www.in.gov/indot/files/PI_I69Interchange.pdf

QuoteINDOT, in coordination with the City of Fishers and Hamilton County as partners, intends to construct a new I-69 interchange at the 106th Street overpass located within the City of Fishers in Hamilton County, Indiana. The interchange configuration will be a two-lane, oval-shaped roundabout centered over the I-69 centerline. The existing 106th Street structure over I-69 will be totally removed as part of this project and replaced with two one-way structures (south structure and north structure). The north bridge will provide a variable six foot to eight foot wide sidewalk along the north side of 106th Street for the entire project length, with crosswalks across 106th Street at Crosspoint Boulevard and USA Parkway. Construction along I-69 will include new bridge piers in the median and new bridge abutments to the outside of mainline I-69. No roadway work is proposed for existing mainline I-69, and all roadway work along I-69 will be limited to construction of the ramps for the new interchange.

Interesting interchange design... I wonder why they chose this design out of the 4 listed in the pdf.  I think this interchange has been needed for a long time but I'm thinking they should spend money on the I-69 / I-465 interchange first.  I'm going to try to go to the public meeting.  If they don't mention that interchange, I'll have to ask somebody if there are any plans for that interchange and if the plans for this interchange affect that one.

I think this exit should be at 126th not 106th.  I wonder how this will make traffic better or worse, will weaving be an issue at all?  Meh, it's probably an invalid concern. interesting idea though, the original idea I thought was a teardrop interchange.

The interchange at 106th has been planned for awhile.  As noted in the pdf, it is mostly about reducing congestion on 116th and 96th - the lines to enter southbound 69 in the morning, particularly from the East are very long.  Lots of housing developments along 106th.  The new interchange will also serve the office buildings on each side of 69.

I've always thought an exit at 126th made sense, but I don't see it happening.  A then Fishers councilman told me several years ago that the then Town did not want an exit at 126th.  That was before Billericay Park was built in the most obvious spot for southbound exit and entrance ramps.  The angle at which 126th crosses 69 is very hard to work with.

As for the roundabout interchange, the handful of times I've been on Keystone during rush hour, those exits seem to work well.  Although mine is definitely a small sample size.
Keystone parkway was supposed to have the same exit type that's being used on 106 th but that was scrapped due to cost. Traffic moves OK on it after you pass 116th St. There are too many lanes between 96th and 106th, its horribly signed (mayors fault) so people end up merging at the last minute. Merge distances on and off are way to short. But again it's just OK. 31 will be way better. And I've said this before but I've always thought 126th should have crossed the white river to allow for better traffic on 96th 116th and 146th, there are too few crossings in the area.
But honestly I don't think you can fix the traffic issues fishers and noblesville have, 69 can't be 10,000 lanes.
Who's paying for this? I thought indot didn't want to build it because they claimed it wasn't necessary.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on August 28, 2015, 08:20:55 PM
Quote
Southern Indiana's first true roundabouts are opening this weekend with the unveiling of the Ind. 265/Ind. 62/Port Road interchange as part of the east-end crossing project...

East-end interchange opening with 3 roundabouts in Jeffersonville (http://www.indianaeconomicdigest.net/main.asp?SectionID=31&SubSectionID=164&ArticleID=80955) (Indiana Economic Digest/News and Tribune)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 01, 2015, 08:19:26 AM
Quote from: mukade on August 28, 2015, 08:20:55 PM
Quote
Southern Indiana's first true roundabouts are opening this weekend with the unveiling of the Ind. 265/Ind. 62/Port Road interchange as part of the east-end crossing project...

East-end interchange opening with 3 roundabouts in Jeffersonville (http://www.indianaeconomicdigest.net/main.asp?SectionID=31&SubSectionID=164&ArticleID=80955) (Indiana Economic Digest/News and Tribune)

So I drove this last night.  There is one problem I see with how this is designed.  Previously, traffic on eastbound 265 that didn't exit at 62/10th St was able to just continue straight on to Port Rd. 

Of course once the bridge is finished the new thru movement on eastbound 265 will be on to the new segment of 265 and eventually the new bridge.  The way the interchange is set up now is that eastbound 265 traffic has to take the exit ramp and then proceed through the roundabout in order to get to Port Rd.  This is causing a lot of backups on eastbound 265 because getting through the roundabout slows traffic down quite a bit, especially when a lot of it is truck traffic heading to the industrial park.

In hindsight, a direct ramp from eastbound 265 to Port Rd. should have been built.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 01, 2015, 09:32:27 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on August 22, 2015, 09:07:50 AM
So, the 2016 Indiana Roadway Map is out (yes in August.) Below I have a few observations to share with anyone interested.

-The map is the same format as the previous last two with the state map in the front and tourist related stuff in the back. Only the Indianapolis inset on the front with the state map.

-Interstate 69 in Southern Indiana is more or less the same as last time with Section 4 being shown as under construction, even though it will be open by 2016. But now Section 5 from Bloomington to Martinsville is also shown as under construction. The "Corridor I-69" symbology remains for SR 37 from Martinsville north to I-465. I imagine with the state releasing these maps in August before the coming year there's going to be a one-year delay on various projects that usually open at the end of the year.

-Ohio River Bridges project basically shown as the same, although the construction corridor for the East End Bridge is now shown with a "Corridor SR 265" symbol whereas last year it had a "Corridor I-265" CORRIDOR.

-US 31 is shown as  freeway from Plymouth up to South Bend, along the Kokomo bypass and in parts of Hamilton County (116th Street up to SR 32) with the highway under construction for the other two segments in that area. No mention for the Veterans Parkway (I think that's the name now) along 31 north of Plymouth. New this year however are exit numbers around Kokomo and Plymouth to South Bend....so progress?

-SR 931 designated along old US 31 in St. Joseph County, I've never seen a sign for this but okay.

-SR 22 gone within Kokomo and I'm not sure about any other decommissions, the Lafayette area was shown last year with its new (stupid as we are finding out) rerouting.

-Several new towns are now showing their town boundaries instead of a dot or dot-inside-a-rectangle symbol. Among the communities to have "graduated" are Tipton, Avon, Danville, New Whiteland, Ellettsville and Batesville. Communities like Carmel, Zionsville, Brownsburg, Whitestown and Lebanon don't have their boundaries adjusted to what they are now, annexation and all that.

-Bridge is still present outside of New Harmony, that thing is still closed right?

-The Indianapolis inset does have the new exit configuration at 465 and 65 on the south side as well as US 31 and 465 on the north side. For some reason it still shows the location of Fort Benjamin Harrison.

-No new exit for Worthsville Road in Johnson County (Exit 97,) supposed to be open by the end of the year.

-And for some reason there are city limits for part of Niles, Michigan shown on the far northern edge of the map bordering Indiana. Why we care that much for Michigan when we haven't updated the city limits for Louisville or Owensboro forever I'm not sure.

-Finally, I-65 is shown as COMPLETE around the Lafayette area.  :D

I think that's it but there may be more in there but for now that's what I've seen.

is this map out to get physically, or is it just digital right now?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on September 01, 2015, 10:30:56 AM
What's up with US 52 in Lafayette? I drove through there Friday night and it's routed on some crappy road on the south side of Lafayette. When did that happen? Didn't it run on the northeast side of Lafayette on the inner bypass? Why is INDOT allowed to f*ck up the US Highways now? If they want to mess their own road network up then whatever, but US highways, really? You would think they would be protected since they are a federal highway, but I guess I am wrong. It also appears like SR 26 has a might have a gap in it. Someone in INDOT needs fired. The fact that these towns are allowing this to happen is even more amazing to me. I would never let INDOT abandon a highway in my town if I was in charge. Kokomo is the only smart town in Indiana apparently since they refused to take over Old 31 / SR 931. Kokomo deserves a  :clap:.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 01, 2015, 10:39:07 AM
Quote from: US 41 on September 01, 2015, 10:30:56 AM
What's up with US 52 in Lafayette? I drove through there Friday night and it's routed on some crappy road on the south side of Lafayette. When did that happen? Didn't it run on the northeast side of Lafayette on the inner bypass? Why is INDOT allowed to f*ck up the US Highways now? If they want to mess their own road network up then whatever, but US highways, really? You would think they would be protected since they are a federal highway, but I guess I am wrong. It also appears like SR 26 has a might have a gap in it. Someone in INDOT needs fired. The fact that these towns are allowing this to happen is even more amazing to me. I would never let INDOT abandon a highway in my town if I was in charge. Kokomo is the only smart town in Indiana apparently since they refused to take over Old 31 / SR 931. Kokomo deserves a  :clap:.

this fuck up happened 9/13/13, when the new bypass opened up, US 52 follows the old route of 25 on teal road, then is cosigned on the new bypass with us 231, the mileage on the bypass is us 52's.  all the other decommissionings happened that day too.  Originally US 52 was never going to be moved and in fact, SR 26 was supposed to be cosigned with 52 until it crossed south street, this was even on the plans up until the last minute.  this new routing I agree is stupid, I'm actually surprised the cities went along with it, seeing as there's a bridge over the Wabash that needs to be repaired relatively soon.  And the only rule I know of is you cannot have a discontinuity in a us route, (unsigned portions aren't technically a discontinuity).  This new route (teal road segment) doesn't really seem truck friendly either. No one refers to it as being us 52 also (the bypass), only as 231.  Also INDOT does this a lot (weird reroutings), look at the salem bypass.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 01, 2015, 01:34:03 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 01, 2015, 10:39:07 AM
Quote from: US 41 on September 01, 2015, 10:30:56 AM
What's up with US 52 in Lafayette? I drove through there Friday night and it's routed on some crappy road on the south side of Lafayette. When did that happen? Didn't it run on the northeast side of Lafayette on the inner bypass? Why is INDOT allowed to f*ck up the US Highways now? If they want to mess their own road network up then whatever, but US highways, really? You would think they would be protected since they are a federal highway, but I guess I am wrong. It also appears like SR 26 has a might have a gap in it. Someone in INDOT needs fired. The fact that these towns are allowing this to happen is even more amazing to me. I would never let INDOT abandon a highway in my town if I was in charge. Kokomo is the only smart town in Indiana apparently since they refused to take over Old 31 / SR 931. Kokomo deserves a  :clap:.

this fuck up happened 9/13/13, when the new bypass opened up, US 52 follows the old route of 25 on teal road, then is cosigned on the new bypass with us 231, the mileage on the bypass is us 52's.  all the other decommissionings happened that day too.  Originally US 52 was never going to be moved and in fact, SR 26 was supposed to be cosigned with 52 until it crossed south street, this was even on the plans up until the last minute.  this new routing I agree is stupid, I'm actually surprised the cities went along with it, seeing as there's a bridge over the Wabash that needs to be repaired relatively soon.  And the only rule I know of is you cannot have a discontinuity in a us route, (unsigned portions aren't technically a discontinuity).  This new route (teal road segment) doesn't really seem truck friendly either. No one refers to it as being us 52 also (the bypass), only as 231.  Also INDOT does this a lot (weird reroutings), look at the salem bypass.

I don't know Lafayette really well, so I don't know the answer, but I do know the question:

If you are traveling back and forth between US 52 south of Lafayette and the junction of the new 231 bypass and Sagamore Pkway, what is the quickest route?  The answer to that is what should probably be the routing of US 52.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 01, 2015, 01:38:37 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 01, 2015, 01:34:03 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 01, 2015, 10:39:07 AM
Quote from: US 41 on September 01, 2015, 10:30:56 AM
What's up with US 52 in Lafayette? I drove through there Friday night and it's routed on some crappy road on the south side of Lafayette. When did that happen? Didn't it run on the northeast side of Lafayette on the inner bypass? Why is INDOT allowed to f*ck up the US Highways now? If they want to mess their own road network up then whatever, but US highways, really? You would think they would be protected since they are a federal highway, but I guess I am wrong. It also appears like SR 26 has a might have a gap in it. Someone in INDOT needs fired. The fact that these towns are allowing this to happen is even more amazing to me. I would never let INDOT abandon a highway in my town if I was in charge. Kokomo is the only smart town in Indiana apparently since they refused to take over Old 31 / SR 931. Kokomo deserves a  :clap:.

this fuck up happened 9/13/13, when the new bypass opened up, US 52 follows the old route of 25 on teal road, then is cosigned on the new bypass with us 231, the mileage on the bypass is us 52's.  all the other decommissionings happened that day too.  Originally US 52 was never going to be moved and in fact, SR 26 was supposed to be cosigned with 52 until it crossed south street, this was even on the plans up until the last minute.  this new routing I agree is stupid, I'm actually surprised the cities went along with it, seeing as there's a bridge over the Wabash that needs to be repaired relatively soon.  And the only rule I know of is you cannot have a discontinuity in a us route, (unsigned portions aren't technically a discontinuity).  This new route (teal road segment) doesn't really seem truck friendly either. No one refers to it as being us 52 also (the bypass), only as 231.  Also INDOT does this a lot (weird reroutings), look at the salem bypass.

I don't know Lafayette really well, so I don't know the answer, but I do know the question:

If you are traveling back and forth between US 52 south of Lafayette and the junction of the new 231 bypass and Sagamore Pkway, what is the quickest route?  The answer to that is what should probably be the routing of US 52.

I know Lafayette pretty well, having to drive back and forth from school to home when I went to Purdue, and the current routing of 52 is the better route in terms of speed to and from Indy and Purdue.  But the more logical route is the old one, it's slower only because of the local congestion with all of the signals and businesses along Sagamore Pkwy. That's just my case; if you're talking about from other locations, it may be different for you. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on September 01, 2015, 02:07:08 PM
The only reason could be that Teal Road was already in INDOT jurisdiction as SR 25 coming in from the south; it briefly used to overlap US 231 on S 4th St. before heading east on Teal while 231 went north on 4th St.  When the new 231 opened in 2001, 25 was still on that same alignment.  When INDOT went all crazy killing 126, 526, and 443 and making 25 and 26 discontinuous across Lafayette and West Lafayette (which is still stupid), they also wanted to give up Sagamore Parkway which the locals still call the 52 Bypass sometimes.  (It once was a speedy bypass out in nowhere.)  INDOT already "owned" Teal Road so that was the easiest reroute to get 52 over to the "new" 231.  A more sensible route might have used one of the county roads to the south, widened for capacity, but even 350 South which used to be through nothing but corn and soybeans is now a congested stop and go fest of development, possibly worse than Teal now.

On Teal Road, you have to deal with a lot of lights plus it going down to two lanes; passing Jeff High School and the fairgrounds....it is NOT friendly to thru traffic.  The new 231 bypass is very nice but it is a fatal flaw to not have it connected to I-65 in some meaningful way other than the dread new alignment of 52 on Teal.  Getting traffic to and from Purdue from the south, for example, still involves using the old 26 routing across both cities, using former 25 to get to 65, or taking current 52, 38, or 350 South.  Allowing 350 South to become the monster it has become was a mistake; it used to be a pretty reasonable way to get from new 231 to 65.  Not anymore...it's not any better than Teal.

The "new" US 231 bridge over the Wabash was disconnected from anything and everything for quite a while after being built; it was visible from South River Road in the mid-90s sitting there ready to go with no dual carriageway to connect to it at either end. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 01, 2015, 02:09:58 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on September 01, 2015, 02:07:08 PM
The only reason could be that Teal Road was already in INDOT jurisdiction as SR 25 coming in from the south; it briefly used to overlap US 231 on S 4th St. before heading east on Teal while 231 went north on 4th St.  When the new 231 opened in 2001, 25 was still on that same alignment.  When INDOT went all crazy killing 126, 526, and 443 and making 25 and 26 discontinuous across Lafayette and West Lafayette (which is still stupid), they also wanted to give up Sagamore Parkway which the locals still call the 52 Bypass sometimes.  (It once was a speedy bypass out in nowhere.)  INDOT already "owned" Teal Road so that was the easiest reroute to get 52 over to the "new" 231.  A more sensible route might have used one of the county roads to the south, widened for capacity, but even 350 South which used to be through nothing but corn and soybeans is now a congested stop and go fest of development, possibly worse than Teal now.

On Teal Road, you have to deal with a lot of lights plus it going down to two lanes; passing Jeff High School and the fairgrounds....it is NOT friendly to thru traffic.  The new 231 bypass is very nice but it is a fatal flaw to not have it connected to I-65 in some meaningful way other than the dread new alignment of 52 on Teal.  Getting traffic to and from Purdue from the south, for example, still involves using the old 26 routing across both cities, using former 25 to get to 65, or taking current 52, 38, or 350 South.  Allowing 350 South to become the monster it has become was a mistake; it used to be a pretty reasonable way to get from new 231 to 65.  Not anymore...it's not any better than Teal.

The "new" US 231 bridge over the Wabash was disconnected from anything and everything for quite a while after being built; it was visible from South River Road in the mid-90s sitting there ready to go with no dual carriageway to connect to it at either end.

isn't that bypass supposed to go to 65 in the very far future?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on September 01, 2015, 02:29:48 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 01, 2015, 02:09:58 PM
isn't that bypass supposed to go to 65 in the very far future?

It probably could have gone there 15 years ago!  As it is (and has been since 2001), the 2001 and 2013 segments of the 231 bypass are a fast route to nowhere if you need to get toward Indy from Purdue or the west side. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on September 01, 2015, 05:27:34 PM
I think the federal government needs to make it to where a US route can only be rerouted if there is an improvement being made to it. In US 52's case, running it on Teal St. is not an improvement.

Indiana in reality needs to raise their mileage cap and take care of their own roads rather than bribing the local governments to do it for them. People that aren't familiar with the area will drive far out of the way following the signed highway rather than taking the old routes that are much faster. Is Sagamore Parkway signed as an emergency detour for I-65? I know that US 40 in Terre Haute that was decomissioned is signed as an emergency detour for I-70. It would make sense to sign Sagamore Parkway as the emergency detour since there is a bridge out on I-65. I would hate to see interstate traffic trying to take Teal St.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 01, 2015, 05:34:11 PM
Quote from: US 41 on September 01, 2015, 05:27:34 PM
I think the federal government needs to make it to where a US route can only be rerouted if there is an improvement being made to it. In US 52's case, running it on Teal St. is not an improvement.

Indiana in reality needs to raise their mileage cap and take care of their own roads rather than bribing the local governments to do it for them. People that aren't familiar with the area will drive far out of the way following the signed highway rather than taking the old routes that are much faster. Is Sagamore Parkway signed as an emergency detour for I-65? I know that US 40 in Terre Haute that was decomissioned is signed as an emergency detour for I-70. It would make sense to sign Sagamore Parkway as the emergency detour since there is a bridge out on I-65. I would hate to see interstate traffic trying to take Teal St.
Nope its not even signed as truck 52 its just sagamore.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on September 01, 2015, 09:31:45 PM
Everybody in town (West Lafayette) still calls the Sagamore Pkwy. US 52. For example, many times people say to take a left onto 52 across the river from Salisbury, then take another left onto Indiana 25, if someone requests directions to 65 southbound from the high school athletic complex. I just don't get why the state and cities can't share the road. Have the state take care of (good) route signage, pavement, and road markings, while the city takes care of other stuff (Like stoplights, auxilliary signage, and sidewalks). And for big projects, like the State St. (Old 26) project through Purdue, the state and local people should pool their money in together for one unified project. An example where unity would've been nice is Northwestern Ave. The state repaved the entire thing, and then the city tears up some new pavement for a new median. Why couldn't the new median have been installed with the new pavement? :hmmm: 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 01, 2015, 09:39:06 PM
Quote from: billtm on September 01, 2015, 09:31:45 PM
Everybody in town (West Lafayette) still calls the Sagamore Pkwy. US 52. For example, many times people say to take a left onto 52 across the river from Salisbury, then take another left onto Indiana 25, if someone requests directions to 65 southbound from the high school athletic complex. I just don't get why the state and cities can't share the road. Have the state take care of (good) route signage, pavement, and road markings, while the city takes care of other stuff (Like stoplights, auxilliary signage, and sidewalks). And for big projects, like the State St. (Old 26) project through Purdue, the state and local people should pool their money in together for one unified project. An example where unity would've been nice is Northwestern Ave. The state repaved the entire thing, and then the city tears up some new pavement for a new median. Why couldn't the new median have been installed with the new pavement? :hmmm:
I agree with you but I'll add 2 points, 26 should have been removed through west Lafayette only, through traffic especially semis should not be on that road, too many students jwalking, when i was a student, even crossing state St the right way was dangerous at times. Other thing is I believe any time a city wants to add a signal to a state road, the state will put it up, but the city has to pay for and maintain the signal.  26 should have went north up to sagamore followed it all the way around to south st. Or to 43 back to state St at river road
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on September 01, 2015, 09:56:02 PM
Quote from: billtm on September 01, 2015, 09:31:45 PM
Everybody in town (West Lafayette) still calls the Sagamore Pkwy. US 52. For example, many times people say to take a left onto 52 across the river from Salisbury, then take another left onto Indiana 25, if someone requests directions to 65 southbound from the high school athletic complex. I just don't get why the state and cities can't share the road. Have the state take care of (good) route signage, pavement, and road markings, while the city takes care of other stuff (Like stoplights, auxilliary signage, and sidewalks). And for big projects, like the State St. (Old 26) project through Purdue, the state and local people should pool their money in together for one unified project. An example where unity would've been nice is Northwestern Ave. The state repaved the entire thing, and then the city tears up some new pavement for a new median. Why couldn't the new median have been installed with the new pavement? :hmmm: 

West Lafayette really got out of control on Northwestern.  The streetscaping and stuff going all the way up to Yeager is out of control.  I lost count of the number of times in the last 20 years that the signals at Northwestern and Stadium Ave have been replaced...the most recent time being entirely for appearance really, as the existing INDOT installation was fine but not pretty enough. 

26's jaunt eastbound around the graduate houses, Harry's, and Chauncey Hill Mall with all those turns was a bit much for some traffic, but a sensible option would have been to run it with 231 south on the new bypass, then maybe over Teal (if they insist on using Teal in the state network) to Sagamore, then up that to 26's old routing (South St.).  Bonus: this would have allowed 38 to end at another route (26 instead of 25/52 or just 52 as it has been before) vs. ending all by itself like it does now.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 01, 2015, 09:59:08 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on September 01, 2015, 09:56:02 PM
Quote from: billtm on September 01, 2015, 09:31:45 PM
Everybody in town (West Lafayette) still calls the Sagamore Pkwy. US 52. For example, many times people say to take a left onto 52 across the river from Salisbury, then take another left onto Indiana 25, if someone requests directions to 65 southbound from the high school athletic complex. I just don't get why the state and cities can't share the road. Have the state take care of (good) route signage, pavement, and road markings, while the city takes care of other stuff (Like stoplights, auxilliary signage, and sidewalks). And for big projects, like the State St. (Old 26) project through Purdue, the state and local people should pool their money in together for one unified project. An example where unity would've been nice is Northwestern Ave. The state repaved the entire thing, and then the city tears up some new pavement for a new median. Why couldn't the new median have been installed with the new pavement? :hmmm: 

West Lafayette really got out of control on Northwestern.  The streetscaping and stuff going all the way up to Yeager is out of control.  I lost count of the number of times in the last 20 years that the signals at Northwestern and Stadium Ave have been replaced...the most recent time being entirely for appearance really, as the existing INDOT installation was fine but not pretty enough. 

26's jaunt eastbound around the graduate houses, Harry's, and Chauncey Hill Mall with all those turns was a bit much for some traffic, but a sensible option would have been to run it with 231 south on the new bypass, then maybe over Teal (if they insist on using Teal in the state network) to Sagamore, then up that to 26's old routing (South St.).  Bonus: this would have allowed 38 to end at another route (26 instead of 25/52 or just 52 as it has been before) vs. ending all by itself like it does now.
I don't know why 38 wasn't just made to turn south to meet at us 52 at teal road. Teal road is in terrible shape, thankfully they will be redoing the entire road and fixing the 4th St intersection.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on September 01, 2015, 10:05:57 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 01, 2015, 09:59:08 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on September 01, 2015, 09:56:02 PM
Quote from: billtm on September 01, 2015, 09:31:45 PM
Everybody in town (West Lafayette) still calls the Sagamore Pkwy. US 52. For example, many times people say to take a left onto 52 across the river from Salisbury, then take another left onto Indiana 25, if someone requests directions to 65 southbound from the high school athletic complex. I just don't get why the state and cities can't share the road. Have the state take care of (good) route signage, pavement, and road markings, while the city takes care of other stuff (Like stoplights, auxilliary signage, and sidewalks). And for big projects, like the State St. (Old 26) project through Purdue, the state and local people should pool their money in together for one unified project. An example where unity would've been nice is Northwestern Ave. The state repaved the entire thing, and then the city tears up some new pavement for a new median. Why couldn't the new median have been installed with the new pavement? :hmmm: 

West Lafayette really got out of control on Northwestern.  The streetscaping and stuff going all the way up to Yeager is out of control.  I lost count of the number of times in the last 20 years that the signals at Northwestern and Stadium Ave have been replaced...the most recent time being entirely for appearance really, as the existing INDOT installation was fine but not pretty enough. 

26's jaunt eastbound around the graduate houses, Harry's, and Chauncey Hill Mall with all those turns was a bit much for some traffic, but a sensible option would have been to run it with 231 south on the new bypass, then maybe over Teal (if they insist on using Teal in the state network) to Sagamore, then up that to 26's old routing (South St.).  Bonus: this would have allowed 38 to end at another route (26 instead of 25/52 or just 52 as it has been before) vs. ending all by itself like it does now.
I don't know why 38 wasn't just made to turn south to meet at us 52 at teal road. Teal road is in terrible shape, thankfully they will be redoing the entire road and fixing the 4th St intersection.
Glad to hear that! :clap: I definitely agree that Teal Rd. should be extended to meet IN-38. It would only have to be 0.36 mi. long, and the only building in the way is an (easily replaceable/relocatable) Chase Bank.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on September 01, 2015, 10:18:09 PM
Quote from: billtm on September 01, 2015, 10:05:57 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 01, 2015, 09:59:08 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on September 01, 2015, 09:56:02 PM
Quote from: billtm on September 01, 2015, 09:31:45 PM
Everybody in town (West Lafayette) still calls the Sagamore Pkwy. US 52. For example, many times people say to take a left onto 52 across the river from Salisbury, then take another left onto Indiana 25, if someone requests directions to 65 southbound from the high school athletic complex. I just don't get why the state and cities can't share the road. Have the state take care of (good) route signage, pavement, and road markings, while the city takes care of other stuff (Like stoplights, auxilliary signage, and sidewalks). And for big projects, like the State St. (Old 26) project through Purdue, the state and local people should pool their money in together for one unified project. An example where unity would've been nice is Northwestern Ave. The state repaved the entire thing, and then the city tears up some new pavement for a new median. Why couldn't the new median have been installed with the new pavement? :hmmm: 

West Lafayette really got out of control on Northwestern.  The streetscaping and stuff going all the way up to Yeager is out of control.  I lost count of the number of times in the last 20 years that the signals at Northwestern and Stadium Ave have been replaced...the most recent time being entirely for appearance really, as the existing INDOT installation was fine but not pretty enough. 

26's jaunt eastbound around the graduate houses, Harry's, and Chauncey Hill Mall with all those turns was a bit much for some traffic, but a sensible option would have been to run it with 231 south on the new bypass, then maybe over Teal (if they insist on using Teal in the state network) to Sagamore, then up that to 26's old routing (South St.).  Bonus: this would have allowed 38 to end at another route (26 instead of 25/52 or just 52 as it has been before) vs. ending all by itself like it does now.
I don't know why 38 wasn't just made to turn south to meet at us 52 at teal road. Teal road is in terrible shape, thankfully they will be redoing the entire road and fixing the 4th St intersection.
Glad to hear that! :clap: I definitely agree that Teal Rd. should be extended to meet IN-38. It would only have to be 0.36 mi. long, and the only building in the way is an (easily replaceable/relocatable) Chase Bank.
Teal extending over to 38 would only make sense if 38 turned onto it to meet where 52 turns onto Teal; it would be weird but no weirder than what exists now (southbound on Sagamore, intersect the end of 38 at one light and then meet 52 at the next straight or to the right, with 38 never touching 52).  It would save a bit of messing around  through both intersections for people doing 38 WB to 52 WB or 52 EB to 38 EB; there are probably plenty of such people considering that 38 is a great shot out to 65.  I have been known to cut through the driveway near the bank and Bed Bath & Beyond or the lot of the former Hobby Lobby to make the move from Teal EB to 38.

The whole thing around Lafayette is bonkers.  It makes me wonder if IU people infiltrated to stick it to Purdue or something.  :P

38 making the hairpin around to end at Teal would be odd-looking but would at least make it connect legally.  It seems that INDOT doesn't care about such things, though. 

It is weird that the powers that be won't allow a US route to be moved from an Interstate-grade road to a surface road (see US 117 in NC--granted, NCDOT just did what it wanted to anyway) but moving US 52 from a four-lane divided alignment onto a city street that goes down to 2 lanes, passes school zones and the county fairgrounds with associated backups and issues at every fairground event or high school football game, is A-OK. 

They really need to do like other states that allow route numbers to be posted over city/county roads.  There isn't much reason not to except for how the accounting and responsibilities are assigned, and drivers don't care who paves vs. who erects signs.  38 ending and reappearing in Frankfort only to disappear again in Lafayette, this time for good, at an intersection near but not at any other state route, is stupid.  25 and 26 pulling their disappearing acts now is stupid as well.  I'm still shocked that 225 remains; it must be because of the old one-lane bridge.  Its end at old 25 makes no sense.  If they wanted to, they could have 225 go one way (or the other) on old 25 and meet 25, but once again, that puts miles back in the state system that INDOT doesn't want and can't afford due to the law.  If 25, 26, and 225 could be signed over city and county roads, it would be a boon to connectivity and continuity, and aid greatly in navigation.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 01, 2015, 10:27:12 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on September 01, 2015, 10:18:09 PM
Quote from: billtm on September 01, 2015, 10:05:57 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 01, 2015, 09:59:08 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on September 01, 2015, 09:56:02 PM
Quote from: billtm on September 01, 2015, 09:31:45 PM
Everybody in town (West Lafayette) still calls the Sagamore Pkwy. US 52. For example, many times people say to take a left onto 52 across the river from Salisbury, then take another left onto Indiana 25, if someone requests directions to 65 southbound from the high school athletic complex. I just don't get why the state and cities can't share the road. Have the state take care of (good) route signage, pavement, and road markings, while the city takes care of other stuff (Like stoplights, auxilliary signage, and sidewalks). And for big projects, like the State St. (Old 26) project through Purdue, the state and local people should pool their money in together for one unified project. An example where unity would've been nice is Northwestern Ave. The state repaved the entire thing, and then the city tears up some new pavement for a new median. Why couldn't the new median have been installed with the new pavement? :hmmm: 

West Lafayette really got out of control on Northwestern.  The streetscaping and stuff going all the way up to Yeager is out of control.  I lost count of the number of times in the last 20 years that the signals at Northwestern and Stadium Ave have been replaced...the most recent time being entirely for appearance really, as the existing INDOT installation was fine but not pretty enough. 

26's jaunt eastbound around the graduate houses, Harry's, and Chauncey Hill Mall with all those turns was a bit much for some traffic, but a sensible option would have been to run it with 231 south on the new bypass, then maybe over Teal (if they insist on using Teal in the state network) to Sagamore, then up that to 26's old routing (South St.).  Bonus: this would have allowed 38 to end at another route (26 instead of 25/52 or just 52 as it has been before) vs. ending all by itself like it does now.
I don't know why 38 wasn't just made to turn south to meet at us 52 at teal road. Teal road is in terrible shape, thankfully they will be redoing the entire road and fixing the 4th St intersection.
Glad to hear that! :clap: I definitely agree that Teal Rd. should be extended to meet IN-38. It would only have to be 0.36 mi. long, and the only building in the way is an (easily replaceable/relocatable) Chase Bank.
Teal extending over to 38 would only make sense if 38 turned onto it to meet where 52 turns onto Teal; it would be weird but no weirder than what exists now (southbound on Sagamore, intersect the end of 38 at one light and then meet 52 at the next straight or to the right, with 38 never touching 52).  It would save a bit of messing around  through both intersections for people doing 38 WB to 52 WB or 52 EB to 38 EB; there are probably plenty of such people considering that 38 is a great shot out to 65.  I have been known to cut through the driveway near the bank and Bed Bath & Beyond or the lot of the former Hobby Lobby to make the move from Teal EB to 38.

The whole thing around Lafayette is bonkers.  It makes me wonder if IU people infiltrated to stick it to Purdue or something. 

38 making the hairpin around to end at Teal would be odd-looking but would at least make it connect legally.  It seems that INDOT doesn't care about such things, though. 

It is weird that the powers that be won't allow a US route to be moved from an Interstate-grade road to a surface road (see US 117 in NC--granted, NCDOT just did what it wanted to anyway) but moving US 52 from a four-lane divided alignment onto a city street that goes down to 2 lanes, passes school zones and the county fairgrounds with associated backups and issues at every fairground event or high school football game, is A-OK. 

They really need to do like other states that allow route numbers to be posted over city/county roads.  There isn't much reason not to except for how the accounting and responsibilities are assigned, and drivers don't care who paves vs. who erects signs.  38 ending and reappearing in Frankfort only to disappear again in Lafayette, this time for good, at an intersection near but not at any other state route, is stupid.  25 and 26 pulling their disappearing acts now is stupid as well.  I'm still shocked that 225 remains; it must be because of the old one-lane bridge.  Its end at old 25 makes no sense.  If they wanted to, they could have 225 go one way (or the other) on old 25 and meet 25, but once again, that puts miles back in the state system that INDOT doesn't want and can't afford due to the law.  If 25, 26, and 225 could be signed over city and county roads, it would be a boon to connectivity and continuity, and aid greatly in navigation.
Realigning 38 would be a good idea. INDOT is trying their best to fuck up Bloomington's routes too, but it won't be as bad as Lafayette's mess. SR 45, 446, and 48 are all routes indot is dying to kill. Also SR 22's routing is bullshit, just decommission it from 29 to kokomo and east of 31 just sign it as us 35. I think the only reason why 931 exists is because kokomo wanted to carmelize it (keystone Pkwy) and indot refused to give them the money for it. So it's likely to turn into 930 and 933 and 912 a road indot gives no shits about.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on September 02, 2015, 07:07:08 AM
I am not a huge fan of all of the discontinuous state road numbers either. I would rather see them marked irrespective of which agency is responsible for maintenance, but I think this would be the other side:
- INDOT does not want to be in the business of improving and maintaining city streets. Municipalities should control that
- Most people now use GPS to navigate so route numbers are less important
- The way people drive has changed a lot since the state highway systems were created. For example, the old SR 25 and SR 26 routings through Lafayette are not highways by any stretch unlike when they were built. Even SR 931 in Kokomo functions as a road to serve local drivers so I can see why this would not need a route number. INDOT wants to focus mostly on inter-city highways and freeways/expressways
- There is nothing stopping the local agencies from improving signage for travellers, and I think most cities are making some effort to do that.

I think the bigger problems with the Lafayette area are:
- Lack of a sufficient and uncongested east-west road
- The lack of a direct connection between the US 231 bypass and I-65. Having this would also serve to tie SR 25 (Hoosier Heartland) to US 231.

INDOT has invested a lot in both Lafayette and Bloomington in the last 4-5 years, and these improvements have been critical. Its a shame that poor decisions like the US 52 routing overshadow the good that was done.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 02, 2015, 07:11:50 AM
There really should be county highways.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on September 02, 2015, 08:05:28 AM
I think the towns that get their routes decommissioned should put up Business Route signs for where the old highway used to be. For example US 50 in Bedford was rerouted north along SR 37, but the old 50 is now Business 50.  It is faster to take Business 50 in this situation as well. It would make sense for cities like Terre Haute, Lafayette, and Indianapolis to sign the old highways that have been recently decommissioned as Business Routes.

Map of Bedford: https://www.google.com/maps/@38.8505693,-86.484364,14z
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 02, 2015, 08:07:10 AM
Meridian and Washington would be great business routes, Binford should still be SR 37 or at least CH 37
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 02, 2015, 08:47:42 AM
Quote from: US 41 on September 02, 2015, 08:05:28 AM
I think the towns that get their routes decommissioned should put up Business Route signs for where the old highway used to be. For example US 50 in Bedford was rerouted north along SR 37, but the old 50 is now Business 50.  It is faster to take Business 50 in this situation as well. It would make sense for cities like Terre Haute, Lafayette, and Indianapolis to sign the old highways that have been recently decommissioned as Business Routes.

Map of Bedford: https://www.google.com/maps/@38.8505693,-86.484364,14z

When INDOT decommissioned 311, 403 and part of 160 in Clark County, the county signed the roads as County Highway 311, 403 and 160. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 02, 2015, 08:49:15 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 02, 2015, 08:47:42 AM
Quote from: US 41 on September 02, 2015, 08:05:28 AM
I think the towns that get their routes decommissioned should put up Business Route signs for where the old highway used to be. For example US 50 in Bedford was rerouted north along SR 37, but the old 50 is now Business 50.  It is faster to take Business 50 in this situation as well. It would make sense for cities like Terre Haute, Lafayette, and Indianapolis to sign the old highways that have been recently decommissioned as Business Routes.

Map of Bedford: https://www.google.com/maps/@38.8505693,-86.484364,14z

When INDOT decommissioned 311, 403 and part of 160 in Clark County, the county signed the roads as County Highway 311, 403 and 160.

The shields I've seen for those roads are horrible looking, I wonder why they didn't use the blue pentagon shield.  They tried and failed at copying the standard SR Shield
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 02, 2015, 08:54:29 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 02, 2015, 08:49:15 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 02, 2015, 08:47:42 AM
When INDOT decommissioned 311, 403 and part of 160 in Clark County, the county signed the roads as County Highway 311, 403 and 160.

The shields I've seen for those roads are horrible looking, I wonder why they didn't use the blue pentagon shield

I've never seen a blue pentagon shield in Indiana.  In fact, I've never seen a shield for any county road anywhere in Indiana until these, so I doubt there is even a state standard for such a thing.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 02, 2015, 09:02:00 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 02, 2015, 08:54:29 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 02, 2015, 08:49:15 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 02, 2015, 08:47:42 AM
When INDOT decommissioned 311, 403 and part of 160 in Clark County, the county signed the roads as County Highway 311, 403 and 160.

The shields I've seen for those roads are horrible looking, I wonder why they didn't use the blue pentagon shield

I've never seen a blue pentagon shield in Indiana.  In fact, I've never seen a shield for any county road anywhere in Indiana until these, so I doubt there is even a state standard for such a thing.

i don't think indiana allows, or maybe more accurately, has no standards or business or county highways, which explains why there are so few.  I've seen only 1 and it's gone now. it was for the gap of SR 144 it was signed as Johnson County 144. http://www.highwayexplorer.com/Gallery.php?id=544&section=11442&terminus=Eastern+Terminus On a side note, SR 44's routing is also bullshit.  I can't confirm this, but I thought elkhart's CR 17 had at least one blue pentagon shield on a bgs in the past, but I'm not sure. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on September 02, 2015, 06:33:20 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 02, 2015, 08:54:29 AM
I've never seen a blue pentagon shield in Indiana.  In fact, I've never seen a shield for any county road anywhere in Indiana until these, so I doubt there is even a state standard for such a thing.

I've seen 3 blue pentagon shields:
- Montgomery County right off I-74 at SR 32
- CR 144 in Johnson County (between the two sections of SR 144)
- Signs for Elkhart County CR 17 on the Toll Road
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 02, 2015, 06:34:57 PM
Quote from: mukade on September 02, 2015, 06:33:20 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 02, 2015, 08:54:29 AM
I've never seen a blue pentagon shield in Indiana.  In fact, I've never seen a shield for any county road anywhere in Indiana until these, so I doubt there is even a state standard for such a thing.

I've seen 3 blue pentagon shields:
- Montgomery County right off I-74 at SR 32
- CR 144 in Johnson County (between the two sections of SR 144)
- Signs for Elkhart County CR 17 on the Toll Road
Interesting, man I wish Indiana had more of these
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on September 02, 2015, 07:31:59 PM
So why can't INDOT legally afford to put more road miles back into the state system? :hmmm:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 02, 2015, 07:34:31 PM
Quote from: billtm on September 02, 2015, 07:31:59 PM
So why can't INDOT legally afford to put more road miles back into the state system? :hmmm:
It's a stupid law in our Constitution (or some statute) that disallows us from having so many miles of highways. Not sure why we have a cap at all really, it has a lot of unintended consequences. I can't remember the exact number but it's not a very high number and 69 is eating into it.
I think there's also a law saying every county seat must be connected to the state highway system in some way. And I think more specifically the courthouse/government offices must be connected in some way.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: noelbotevera on September 02, 2015, 08:14:53 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 02, 2015, 07:34:31 PM
Quote from: billtm on September 02, 2015, 07:31:59 PM
So why can't INDOT legally afford to put more road miles back into the state system? :hmmm:
It's a stupid law in our Constitution (or some statute) that disallows us from having so many miles of highways. Not sure why we have a cap at all really, it has a lot of unintended consequences. I can't remember the exact number but it's not a very high number and 69 is eating into it.
I think there's also a law saying every county seat must be connected to the state highway system in some way. And I think more specifically the courthouse/government offices must be connected in some way.
Simply Indiana™
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 02, 2015, 08:16:38 PM
Quote from: noelbotevera on September 02, 2015, 08:14:53 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 02, 2015, 07:34:31 PM
Quote from: billtm on September 02, 2015, 07:31:59 PM
So why can't INDOT legally afford to put more road miles back into the state system? :hmmm:
It's a stupid law in our Constitution (or some statute) that disallows us from having so many miles of highways. Not sure why we have a cap at all really, it has a lot of unintended consequences. I can't remember the exact number but it's not a very high number and 69 is eating into it.
I think there's also a law saying every county seat must be connected to the state highway system in some way. And I think more specifically the courthouse/government offices must be connected in some way.
Simply Indiana™
You mean Honest to goodness Indiana! (Ugh I hate that moniker)

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on September 02, 2015, 08:24:21 PM
The number of miles in the highway system is nowhere near the cap. If it was you would have never seen the advent of SR 931 and SR 750 or the extension of SR 445.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on September 02, 2015, 10:22:53 PM
Quote from: mukade on September 02, 2015, 08:24:21 PM
The number of miles in the highway system is nowhere near the cap. If it was you would have never seen the advent of SR 931 and SR 750 or the extension of SR 445.
Then why the fk is INDOT deconnecting all these state roads? :confused:
BTW, I don't think the courthouse rule exists, because the Tippecanoe County Courthouse is no longer served by a state road.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 02, 2015, 10:27:43 PM
Quote from: billtm on September 02, 2015, 10:22:53 PM
Quote from: mukade on September 02, 2015, 08:24:21 PM
The number of miles in the highway system is nowhere near the cap. If it was you would have never seen the advent of SR 931 and SR 750 or the extension of SR 445.
Then why the fk is INDOT deconnecting all these state roads? :confused:
BTW, I don't think the courthouse rule exists, because the Tippecanoe County Courthouse is no longer served by a state road.
The courthouse probably isn't true. I do think the county seat part is true, but I think the decommissionings are more preemptive to stay under even if they aren't close, it's still a factor. But most likely is that INDOT just hates city streets, they're expensive to maintain.  And dealing with cities requests, which can range from completely reasonable to insane, is also probably annoying for them. Just speculation on my part
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 02, 2015, 10:33:06 PM
I would also guess that there is a some disconnect between what the state thinks is right and what a city believes is right for their street. INDOT wanted for six-lane Keystone (old SR 431) and leave the stoplights, Carmel had a better idea to turn it into a limited access highway, I don't think anyone here now would argue who had the better idea. I know Bloomington would probably love it if INDOT left their streets alone, they tried it with SR 37.

As for the county pentagon signs if I remember the one in Montgomery County it was just the regular county road number, something like "500 E" written in yellow in the middle of the pentagon. Hell we could do that for any county road in the state if their county uses the grid system.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 02, 2015, 10:38:48 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 02, 2015, 10:33:06 PM
I would also guess that there is a some disconnect between what the state thinks is right and what a city believes is right for their street. INDOT wanted for six-lane Keystone (old SR 431) and leave the stoplights, Carmel had a better idea to turn it into a limited access highway, I don't think anyone here now would argue who had the better idea. I know Bloomington would probably love it if INDOT left their streets alone, they tried it with SR 37.

As for the county pentagon signs if I remember the one in Montgomery County it was just the regular county road number, something like "500 E" written in yellow in the middle of the pentagon. Hell we could do that for any county road in the state if their county uses the grid system.
I think keystone was more of indot being cheap than anything, they were always going to upgrade 31 to a interstate quality highway, having to do 431 too seems to be not worth it from their prospective. Might be what they're thinking with 37. Is there any chance indot keeps 37? Also, does anyone know when 431 was built around Carmel? (Not the roundabout stuff). Carmel also kind of got the deal of a lifetime when it came to money for the turnover. Kokomo got peanuts for 22, barely enough to pave the thing if I remember correctly.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on September 03, 2015, 06:57:08 AM
I thought Kokomo got $6M between upfront cash and grants, but a lot of that road has been rebuilt in the last 10 years. The  part by US 31 is four years old so they got a fair deal because I doubt that INDOT would never do more than maintenance on it from here on out. I believe the reason Kokomo/Howard County don't want SR 931 is that they think it needs to be rebuilt - which I am sure is true. I don't think they wanted a Keystone Parkway, but INDOT did say they would offer something more in line with what Sagamore Parkway got.

In general, I think the local jurisdictions like the turnbacks because they can improve the streets the way they want, and they can reduce truck traffic in some places (like Pendleton). Obviously, they reject the offer otherwise. This trend has been going on over 20 years.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on September 03, 2015, 08:56:17 AM
I believe Indiana's mileage cap is at 12,000 miles and currently they are somewhere around 11,300 miles. I don't think decommissioning 4 mile sections of highway through a town is really going to help bring their numbers down much. It's INDOT's fault for building the roads through the towns in the first place.

I think the state highway signs should remain signed in the towns that the road was decommissioned in. I believe that in some states that some state highways are actually maintained by the local governments rather than the state.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 03, 2015, 08:58:17 AM
Quote from: US 41 on September 03, 2015, 08:56:17 AM
I believe Indiana's mileage cap is at 12,000 miles and currently they are somewhere around 11,300 miles. I don't think decommissioning 4 mile sections of highway through a town is really going to help bring their numbers down much. It's INDOT's fault for building the roads through the towns in the first place.

I think the state highway signs should remain signed in the towns that the road was decommissioned in. I believe that in some states that some state highways are actually maintained by the local governments rather than the state.

this is done in a few states, is Ohio one of them?  Ohio has an insane amount of highways, and a lot of seemingly useless ones in cities. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Alex on September 03, 2015, 09:10:17 AM
Quote from: US 41 on September 03, 2015, 08:56:17 AM
I believe Indiana's mileage cap is at 12,000 miles and currently they are somewhere around 11,300 miles. I don't think decommissioning 4 mile sections of highway through a town is really going to help bring their numbers down much. It's INDOT's fault for building the roads through the towns in the first place.

I think the state highway signs should remain signed in the towns that the road was decommissioned in. I believe that in some states that some state highways are actually maintained by the local governments rather than the state.

Is that mileage cap number ever increased to reflect population growth and the associated traffic demand increases?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: The Ghostbuster on September 03, 2015, 05:08:29 PM
I read on Wikipedia that the Terre Haute Bypass (State Highway 641) is going to become Interstate 170. I don't see how that is possible, since the interchange at Interstate 70 is not going to become a free-flow freeway-to-freeway interchange.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: noelbotevera on September 03, 2015, 05:26:18 PM
Quote from: Alex on September 03, 2015, 09:10:17 AM
Quote from: US 41 on September 03, 2015, 08:56:17 AM
I believe Indiana's mileage cap is at 12,000 miles and currently they are somewhere around 11,300 miles. I don't think decommissioning 4 mile sections of highway through a town is really going to help bring their numbers down much. It's INDOT's fault for building the roads through the towns in the first place.

I think the state highway signs should remain signed in the towns that the road was decommissioned in. I believe that in some states that some state highways are actually maintained by the local governments rather than the state.

Is that mileage cap number ever increased to reflect population growth and the associated traffic demand increases?
Seems not. AARoads posts dating from 2009 don't show any changes. This website here dates to the MTR days of 1994/1995 and last updated in 2008...
http://thisisindiana.angelfire.com/roadsandhighways.htm

I will try and see if I can dig further...
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 03, 2015, 05:28:04 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on September 03, 2015, 05:08:29 PM
I read on Wikipedia that the Terre Haute Bypass (State Highway 641) is going to become Interstate 170. I don't see how that is possible, since the interchange at Interstate 70 is not going to become a free-flow freeway-to-freeway interchange.
Interesting, I don't think that's true at all but it would be interesting to have another interstate
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on September 03, 2015, 06:52:42 PM
Google Maps now shows the new ramp from east 70 to SR 46. It will eventually be the eastbound 70 to southbound 641.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.4307873,-87.3354247,17z

Quote from: silverback1065 on September 03, 2015, 05:28:04 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on September 03, 2015, 05:08:29 PM
I read on Wikipedia that the Terre Haute Bypass (State Highway 641) is going to become Interstate 170. I don't see how that is possible, since the interchange at Interstate 70 is not going to become a free-flow freeway-to-freeway interchange.
Interesting, I don't think that's true at all but it would be interesting to have another interstate

I saw that too. I actually think that's a good idea and I hope it happens. It probably isn't true, but you never know. The only part of the interchange that wouldn't be free flowing (interstate to interstate) would be north 170 to west 70.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 2trailertrucker on September 03, 2015, 10:37:11 PM
The new ramps from eastbound I 70 to SR 46 are now open. It was dark when I drive through, so I couldn't get much of a look.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 2trailertrucker on September 03, 2015, 10:42:38 PM
I have noticed that INDOT has seemed to have changed their thinking about construction zones. The last few years, they were dangerous to drive through, with truck lanes on soft asphalt and tilted toward the median amongst other configurations.

This year, they seem to have spent some time designing them with safety in mind. Because of this, traffic is flowing through with little congestion, and fewer accidents.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on September 03, 2015, 11:38:34 PM

Quote from: The Ghostbuster on September 03, 2015, 05:08:29 PM
I read on Wikipedia that the Terre Haute Bypass (State Highway 641) is going to become Interstate 170. I don't see how that is possible, since the interchange at Interstate 70 is not going to become a free-flow freeway-to-freeway interchange.

Don't believe everything you read on Wikipedia :)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 2trailertrucker on September 03, 2015, 11:51:32 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on September 03, 2015, 11:38:34 PM

Quote from: The Ghostbuster on September 03, 2015, 05:08:29 PM
I read on Wikipedia that the Terre Haute Bypass (State Highway 641) is going to become Interstate 170. I don't see how that is possible, since the interchange at Interstate 70 is not going to become a free-flow freeway-to-freeway interchange.

Don't believe everything you read on Wikipedia :)

Bonjour!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: The Ghostbuster on September 04, 2015, 04:37:15 PM
It did seem a little far-fetched to me.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on September 04, 2015, 04:58:55 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on September 04, 2015, 04:37:15 PM
It did seem a little far-fetched to me.

SR 641 is being built with Major Moves funds. I don't think it has received any federal money.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: noelbotevera on September 04, 2015, 05:47:48 PM
Quote from: US 41 on September 04, 2015, 04:58:55 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on September 04, 2015, 04:37:15 PM
It did seem a little far-fetched to me.

SR 641 is being built with Major Moves funds. I don't think it has received any federal money.
Ehhhhh...that's a problem. Major Moves got battered down by opposition when the Indiana Toll Road tried it...I'm expecting the same result.  :bigass:  :ded:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on September 04, 2015, 05:57:25 PM
Quote from: US 41 on September 04, 2015, 04:58:55 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on September 04, 2015, 04:37:15 PM
It did seem a little far-fetched to me.

SR 641 is being built with Major Moves funds. I don't think it has received any federal money.

Major Moves funds the state portion of the cost, but I bet SR 641 construction is using some sort of Federal funding as well. I-69 and US 31 definitely included Federal funding.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on September 04, 2015, 07:03:58 PM
Quote from: noelbotevera on September 04, 2015, 05:47:48 PM
Quote from: US 41 on September 04, 2015, 04:58:55 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on September 04, 2015, 04:37:15 PM
It did seem a little far-fetched to me.

SR 641 is being built with Major Moves funds. I don't think it has received any federal money.
Ehhhhh...that's a problem. Major Moves got battered down by opposition when the Indiana Toll Road tried it...I'm expecting the same result.  :bigass:  :ded:

I thought Major Moves is the money Indiana got when they made a long term lease agreement with whoever runs the Indiana Toll Road now. I am pretty sure that SR 641 is 100% funded by Major Moves or it was advertised that way.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 06, 2015, 08:15:14 PM
65 is open
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on September 07, 2015, 09:34:50 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 06, 2015, 08:15:14 PM
65 is open
10 days ahead of schedule too! :biggrin: My Dad (with me in the car) just drove over the previously closed segment this afternoon on our way back from Lexington, and everything looks the same. While we were going past Greensburg, I saw a something horrible! On the bridge at Exit 132 over I-74, the northbound BGS over the bridge had a IN-421 sign on it instead of a US 421 sign. :-o
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: iBallasticwolf2 on September 07, 2015, 09:39:59 PM
Quote from: billtm on September 07, 2015, 09:34:50 PMOn the bridge at Exit 132 over I-74, the northbound BGS over the bridge had a IN-421 sign on it instead of a US 421 sign. :-o
I've seen that before myself. Absolutely Ennorus.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 07, 2015, 09:47:50 PM
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on September 07, 2015, 09:39:59 PM
Quote from: billtm on September 07, 2015, 09:34:50 PMOn the bridge at Exit 132 over I-74, the northbound BGS over the bridge had a IN-421 sign on it instead of a US 421 sign. :-o
I've seen that before myself. Absolutely Ennorus.
Same here, there's also one for us 27 somewhere in Indiana
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 08, 2015, 08:28:25 AM
Can anyone driving up to Lafayette via US 52 confirm that all the temporary signage/signals have been removed?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 08, 2015, 08:34:39 AM
Quote from: billtm on September 02, 2015, 10:22:53 PM
Quote from: mukade on September 02, 2015, 08:24:21 PM
The number of miles in the highway system is nowhere near the cap. If it was you would have never seen the advent of SR 931 and SR 750 or the extension of SR 445.
Then why the fk is INDOT deconnecting all these state roads? :confused:
BTW, I don't think the courthouse rule exists, because the Tippecanoe County Courthouse is no longer served by a state road.

Current INDOT rules are that if a road is not maintained by INDOT, then it can't be signed as a state highway.  As more highways are built/improved (I-69, US 31, I-65), INDOT believes (rightly so) that it's a better use of their resources to focus on these roads rather than state highways running through cities, plus if cities maintian the roads, they get to decide how to maintain them rather than INDOT deciding.

With the large number of disconnected state highways we now have, I think there needs to be some way for INDOT and cities to agree on a way to keep roads signed even if INDOT isn't maintaining them. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 08, 2015, 08:39:46 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 08, 2015, 08:34:39 AM
Quote from: billtm on September 02, 2015, 10:22:53 PM
Quote from: mukade on September 02, 2015, 08:24:21 PM
The number of miles in the highway system is nowhere near the cap. If it was you would have never seen the advent of SR 931 and SR 750 or the extension of SR 445.
Then why the fk is INDOT deconnecting all these state roads? :confused:
BTW, I don't think the courthouse rule exists, because the Tippecanoe County Courthouse is no longer served by a state road.

Current INDOT rules are that if a road is not maintained by INDOT, then it can't be signed as a state highway.  As more highways are built/improved (I-69, US 31, I-65), INDOT believes (rightly so) that it's a better use of their resources to focus on these roads rather than state highways running through cities, plus if cities maintian the roads, they get to decide how to maintain them rather than INDOT deciding.

With the large number of disconnected state highways we now have, I think there needs to be some way for INDOT and cities to agree on a way to keep roads signed even if INDOT isn't maintaining them.

Bring business routes to the mainstream here. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on September 08, 2015, 11:23:30 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 08, 2015, 08:34:39 AM
Quote from: billtm on September 02, 2015, 10:22:53 PM
Quote from: mukade on September 02, 2015, 08:24:21 PM
The number of miles in the highway system is nowhere near the cap. If it was you would have never seen the advent of SR 931 and SR 750 or the extension of SR 445.
Then why the fk is INDOT deconnecting all these state roads? :confused:
BTW, I don't think the courthouse rule exists, because the Tippecanoe County Courthouse is no longer served by a state road.

Current INDOT rules are that if a road is not maintained by INDOT, then it can't be signed as a state highway.  As more highways are built/improved (I-69, US 31, I-65), INDOT believes (rightly so) that it's a better use of their resources to focus on these roads rather than state highways running through cities, plus if cities maintian the roads, they get to decide how to maintain them rather than INDOT deciding.

With the large number of disconnected state highways we now have, I think there needs to be some way for INDOT and cities to agree on a way to keep roads signed even if INDOT isn't maintaining them.

Are Emergency Detrour Routes maintained (at least parially) by the state? The reason I ask this is because Wabash Ave through Terre Haute was signed by INDOT as Emergency Route 70 through Terre Haute on the old 40.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 08, 2015, 11:29:03 AM
Quote from: US 41 on September 08, 2015, 11:23:30 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 08, 2015, 08:34:39 AM
Quote from: billtm on September 02, 2015, 10:22:53 PM
Quote from: mukade on September 02, 2015, 08:24:21 PM
The number of miles in the highway system is nowhere near the cap. If it was you would have never seen the advent of SR 931 and SR 750 or the extension of SR 445.
Then why the fk is INDOT deconnecting all these state roads? :confused:
BTW, I don't think the courthouse rule exists, because the Tippecanoe County Courthouse is no longer served by a state road.

Current INDOT rules are that if a road is not maintained by INDOT, then it can't be signed as a state highway.  As more highways are built/improved (I-69, US 31, I-65), INDOT believes (rightly so) that it's a better use of their resources to focus on these roads rather than state highways running through cities, plus if cities maintian the roads, they get to decide how to maintain them rather than INDOT deciding.

With the large number of disconnected state highways we now have, I think there needs to be some way for INDOT and cities to agree on a way to keep roads signed even if INDOT isn't maintaining them.

Are Emergency Detrour Routes maintained (at least parially) by the state? The reason I ask this is because Wabash Ave through Terre Haute was signed by INDOT as Emergency Route 70 through Terre Haute on the old 40.

I think the only portion that INDOT gave up was the portion from SR 46 to US 41, they still own and maintain National ave I believe, but don't sign it. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on September 08, 2015, 11:41:49 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 08, 2015, 11:29:03 AM
Quote from: US 41 on September 08, 2015, 11:23:30 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 08, 2015, 08:34:39 AM
Quote from: billtm on September 02, 2015, 10:22:53 PM
Quote from: mukade on September 02, 2015, 08:24:21 PM
The number of miles in the highway system is nowhere near the cap. If it was you would have never seen the advent of SR 931 and SR 750 or the extension of SR 445.
Then why the fk is INDOT deconnecting all these state roads? :confused:
BTW, I don't think the courthouse rule exists, because the Tippecanoe County Courthouse is no longer served by a state road.

Current INDOT rules are that if a road is not maintained by INDOT, then it can't be signed as a state highway.  As more highways are built/improved (I-69, US 31, I-65), INDOT believes (rightly so) that it's a better use of their resources to focus on these roads rather than state highways running through cities, plus if cities maintian the roads, they get to decide how to maintain them rather than INDOT deciding.

With the large number of disconnected state highways we now have, I think there needs to be some way for INDOT and cities to agree on a way to keep roads signed even if INDOT isn't maintaining them.

Are Emergency Detrour Routes maintained (at least parially) by the state? The reason I ask this is because Wabash Ave through Terre Haute was signed by INDOT as Emergency Route 70 through Terre Haute on the old 40.

I think the only portion that INDOT gave up was the portion from SR 46 to US 41, they still own and maintain National ave I believe, but don't sign it.

I didn't know that. It makes sense though. I always thought West Terre Haute or Vigo County would be crazy to buy into taking care of a 4 lane highway. INDOT ought to to sign it as either SR 340 or 940 IMO.

Construction News: On National Ave they are currently rebuilding all of the bridges between West Terre Haute and I-70.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 08, 2015, 11:52:09 AM
Quote from: US 41 on September 08, 2015, 11:41:49 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 08, 2015, 11:29:03 AM
Quote from: US 41 on September 08, 2015, 11:23:30 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 08, 2015, 08:34:39 AM
Quote from: billtm on September 02, 2015, 10:22:53 PM
Quote from: mukade on September 02, 2015, 08:24:21 PM
The number of miles in the highway system is nowhere near the cap. If it was you would have never seen the advent of SR 931 and SR 750 or the extension of SR 445.
Then why the fk is INDOT deconnecting all these state roads? :confused:
BTW, I don't think the courthouse rule exists, because the Tippecanoe County Courthouse is no longer served by a state road.

Current INDOT rules are that if a road is not maintained by INDOT, then it can't be signed as a state highway.  As more highways are built/improved (I-69, US 31, I-65), INDOT believes (rightly so) that it's a better use of their resources to focus on these roads rather than state highways running through cities, plus if cities maintian the roads, they get to decide how to maintain them rather than INDOT deciding.

With the large number of disconnected state highways we now have, I think there needs to be some way for INDOT and cities to agree on a way to keep roads signed even if INDOT isn't maintaining them.

Are Emergency Detrour Routes maintained (at least parially) by the state? The reason I ask this is because Wabash Ave through Terre Haute was signed by INDOT as Emergency Route 70 through Terre Haute on the old 40.

I think the only portion that INDOT gave up was the portion from SR 46 to US 41, they still own and maintain National ave I believe, but don't sign it.

I didn't know that. It makes sense though. I always thought West Terre Haute or Vigo County would be crazy to buy into taking care of a 4 lane highway. INDOT ought to to sign it as either SR 340 or 940 IMO.

Construction News: On National Ave they are currently rebuilding all of the bridges between West Terre Haute and I-70.

I guess us 40 was rerouted because terre haute wanted to take care of their small portion.  I do think they should sign National Av.  I'm guess SR 340 (near brazil) exists because the county doesn't want it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on September 23, 2015, 11:36:50 AM
Thought this was a cool article to share here:
http://historicindianapolis.com/the-crumbling-crossroads-of-america/

Talks about the origin of the slogan "The Crossroads of America" (and the controversy surrounding it), has some cool old pictures of US 40, and compares our highway infrastructure issues today with those back before state highway standards were introduced.

Side note: if you're interested in the history of Indianapolis, this website is a great read: http://historicindianapolis.com.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 23, 2015, 04:07:08 PM
news on SR 912: http://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/cline-avenue-bridge-rebuild-looking-good-copeland-says/article_3a8623a4-f7e8-561a-a533-9fa3ee09fdbb.html

I'm not familiar with the toll roads in the area, but isn't $2.50 pretty high just for one bridge?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on September 24, 2015, 11:28:12 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 23, 2015, 04:07:08 PM
news on SR 912: http://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/cline-avenue-bridge-rebuild-looking-good-copeland-says/article_3a8623a4-f7e8-561a-a533-9fa3ee09fdbb.html

I'm not familiar with the toll roads in the area, but isn't $2.50 pretty high just for one bridge?

And that's if you use EZPASS or I-PASS. If you don't have either one of those it will be over $5 to cross it. I think that is pretty high.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 24, 2015, 11:31:27 AM
Quote from: US 41 on September 24, 2015, 11:28:12 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 23, 2015, 04:07:08 PM
news on SR 912: http://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/cline-avenue-bridge-rebuild-looking-good-copeland-says/article_3a8623a4-f7e8-561a-a533-9fa3ee09fdbb.html

I'm not familiar with the toll roads in the area, but isn't $2.50 pretty high just for one bridge?

And that's if you use EZPASS or I-PASS. If you don't have either one of those it will be over $5 to cross it. I think that is pretty high.

That's not worth it, I don't understand why INDOT just doesn't seem to care enough about this road to do it themselves and make it toll free like before, wasn't this a decently traveled highway?   
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on September 24, 2015, 12:16:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 24, 2015, 11:31:27 AM
Quote from: US 41 on September 24, 2015, 11:28:12 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 23, 2015, 04:07:08 PM
news on SR 912: http://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/cline-avenue-bridge-rebuild-looking-good-copeland-says/article_3a8623a4-f7e8-561a-a533-9fa3ee09fdbb.html

I'm not familiar with the toll roads in the area, but isn't $2.50 pretty high just for one bridge?

And that's if you use EZPASS or I-PASS. If you don't have either one of those it will be over $5 to cross it. I think that is pretty high.

That's not worth it, I don't understand why INDOT just doesn't seem to care enough about this road to do it themselves and make it toll free like before, wasn't this a decently traveled highway?

I believe it did receive quite a bit of traffic. I think taking SR 312 to US 41 would make more sense than paying anywhere from $2.50 to $5 to cross a bridge. I can only imagine how much it would cost an 18 wheeler to cross.

This is also a perfect example of why I am against privatization of toll roads. I think state governments should operate them and only charge an equal amount of what it will cost to pay / take care of the road. Toll roads should not be money makers for a business.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 24, 2015, 12:48:40 PM
Quote from: US 41 on September 24, 2015, 12:16:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 24, 2015, 11:31:27 AM
Quote from: US 41 on September 24, 2015, 11:28:12 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 23, 2015, 04:07:08 PM
news on SR 912: http://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/cline-avenue-bridge-rebuild-looking-good-copeland-says/article_3a8623a4-f7e8-561a-a533-9fa3ee09fdbb.html

I'm not familiar with the toll roads in the area, but isn't $2.50 pretty high just for one bridge?

And that's if you use EZPASS or I-PASS. If you don't have either one of those it will be over $5 to cross it. I think that is pretty high.

That's not worth it, I don't understand why INDOT just doesn't seem to care enough about this road to do it themselves and make it toll free like before, wasn't this a decently traveled highway?

I believe it did receive quite a bit of traffic. I think taking SR 312 to US 41 would make more sense than paying anywhere from $2.50 to $5 to cross a bridge. I can only imagine how much it would cost an 18 wheeler to cross.

This is also a perfect example of why I am against privatization of toll roads. I think state governments should operate them and only charge an equal amount of what it will cost to pay / take care of the road. Toll roads should not be money makers for a business.

I would avoid it if I was a commuter in the area too.  Classic INDOT: SR 312 now randomly disappears just before US 41, the part inside the city limits of Hammond was turned over a few years ago.  They might as well decommission it all, or at least until it hits US 20. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on September 24, 2015, 01:30:05 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 24, 2015, 12:48:40 PM
I would avoid it if I was a commuter in the area too.  Classic INDOT: SR 312 now randomly disappears just before US 41, the part inside the city limits of Hammond was turned over a few years ago.  They might as well decommission it all, or at least until it hits US 20.

   Why am I not all surprised?  I feel really bad for anyone that has to drive through Indiana on our state highway network. Really anything possible to mess it up they have done. They have even messed it up in places I thought were safe from them destroying, like US 52 in Lafayette.
   I wish INDOT would at least leave up the old signs and just get rid of the directional signs and put "OLD" in its place. Example: Instead of West Indiana 26 it would read Old Indiana 26.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Joe The Dragon on September 24, 2015, 05:30:48 PM
Quote from: US 41 on September 24, 2015, 12:16:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 24, 2015, 11:31:27 AM
Quote from: US 41 on September 24, 2015, 11:28:12 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 23, 2015, 04:07:08 PM
news on SR 912: http://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/cline-avenue-bridge-rebuild-looking-good-copeland-says/article_3a8623a4-f7e8-561a-a533-9fa3ee09fdbb.html

I'm not familiar with the toll roads in the area, but isn't $2.50 pretty high just for one bridge?

And that's if you use EZPASS or I-PASS. If you don't have either one of those it will be over $5 to cross it. I think that is pretty high.

That's not worth it, I don't understand why INDOT just doesn't seem to care enough about this road to do it themselves and make it toll free like before, wasn't this a decently traveled highway?

I believe it did receive quite a bit of traffic. I think taking SR 312 to US 41 would make more sense than paying anywhere from $2.50 to $5 to cross a bridge. I can only imagine how much it would cost an 18 wheeler to cross.

This is also a perfect example of why I am against privatization of toll roads. I think state governments should operate them and only charge an equal amount of what it will cost to pay / take care of the road. Toll roads should not be money makers for a business.

At least they are not billing Ipass users that transaction fee
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: peterj920 on September 24, 2015, 07:12:54 PM
Quote from: US 41 on September 24, 2015, 11:28:12 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 23, 2015, 04:07:08 PM
news on SR 912: http://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/cline-avenue-bridge-rebuild-looking-good-copeland-says/article_3a8623a4-f7e8-561a-a533-9fa3ee09fdbb.html

I'm not familiar with the toll roads in the area, but isn't $2.50 pretty high just for one bridge?

And that's if you use EZPASS or I-PASS. If you don't have either one of those it will be over $5 to cross it. I think that is pretty high.

Kind of sad when it's cheaper for a cash customer to cross the Mackinac Bridge ($4) than the new Cline Ave Bridge.  The maintenance costs on that bridge are way higher than they will be on the Cline Ave Bridge.  The only people I see needing to use the new bridge are compulsive gamblers that need quick access to the casinos and people that may be in a hurry to reach the harbor.  There are plenty of other alternatives so it will be interesting to see how many people want to pay the high price to cross the new bridge, whenever they start building it. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on September 24, 2015, 07:38:30 PM
Quote from: peterj920 on September 24, 2015, 07:12:54 PM
The only people I see needing to use the new bridge are compulsive gamblers that need quick access to the casinos and people that may be in a hurry to reach the harbor.  There are plenty of other alternatives so it will be interesting to see how many people want to pay the high price to cross the new bridge, whenever they start building it.

Yes, there are alternatives, and that is why INDOT could not justify rebuilding this bridge. When Cline Avenue was extended in the 70s and 80s, there were tens of thousands of steel mill and refinery workers in close proximity so there needed to be a better highway there. With so many less workers today, it just is not needed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: peterj920 on September 24, 2015, 08:23:59 PM
Quote from: mukade on September 24, 2015, 07:38:30 PM
Quote from: peterj920 on September 24, 2015, 07:12:54 PM
The only people I see needing to use the new bridge are compulsive gamblers that need quick access to the casinos and people that may be in a hurry to reach the harbor.  There are plenty of other alternatives so it will be interesting to see how many people want to pay the high price to cross the new bridge, whenever they start building it.

Yes, there are alternatives, and that is why INDOT could not justify rebuilding this bridge. When Cline Avenue was extended in the 70s and 80s, there were tens of thousands of steel mill and refinery workers in close proximity so there needed to be a better highway there. With so many less workers today, it just is not needed.

It doesn't seem like INDOT tried very hard to try and get the bridge fixed.  MNDOT received a lot of federal money to replace I-35W and WISDOT received federal money the Leo Frigo Bridge in Green Bay on an emergency basis.  They're both interstates, but I do notice that the FWHA gives priority on federal highway dollars to fixing bridges.  The area is also economically depressed and federal funds like to go to those areas also.  If there's a will, there's a way and INDOT could have received a lot of aid in rebuilding the bridge but chose not to.  I think it would have been a worthwhile investment because it helps the area out.  Even if the industries leave, the area can always be redeveloped with the proximity to the lake. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 24, 2015, 08:38:07 PM
Quote from: peterj920 on September 24, 2015, 08:23:59 PM
Quote from: mukade on September 24, 2015, 07:38:30 PM
Quote from: peterj920 on September 24, 2015, 07:12:54 PM
The only people I see needing to use the new bridge are compulsive gamblers that need quick access to the casinos and people that may be in a hurry to reach the harbor.  There are plenty of other alternatives so it will be interesting to see how many people want to pay the high price to cross the new bridge, whenever they start building it.

Yes, there are alternatives, and that is why INDOT could not justify rebuilding this bridge. When Cline Avenue was extended in the 70s and 80s, there were tens of thousands of steel mill and refinery workers in close proximity so there needed to be a better highway there. With so many less workers today, it just is not needed.

It doesn't seem like INDOT tried very hard to try and get the bridge fixed.  MNDOT received a lot of federal money to replace I-35W and WISDOT received federal money the Leo Frigo Bridge in Green Bay on an emergency basis.  They're both interstates, but I do notice that the FWHA gives priority on federal highway dollars to fixing bridges.  The area is also economically depressed and federal funds like to go to those areas also.  If there's a will, there's a way and INDOT could have received a lot of aid in rebuilding the bridge but chose not to.  I think it would have been a worthwhile investment because it helps the area out.  Even if the industries leave, the area can always be redeveloped with the proximity to the lake.

I feel like the LaPorte district of INDOT is the worst in the state.  The NW part of the state always seems to get ignored infrastructurewise, if this were I-X90/80/94 it would have been fixed immediately, regardless of the traffic. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 24, 2015, 08:39:48 PM
Completely unrelated to what was just said:
http://www.indystar.com/story/news/politics/2015/09/18/indot-probes-crumbling-road-mystery/72399450/

INDOT has asphalt issues.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 30, 2015, 07:59:44 PM
Something should be done to the SR 267/I-65 Interchange
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 30, 2015, 08:15:29 PM
Didn't INDOT rebuild the exit there a few years ago and add an additional ramp to a nearby street. You can't fault them them for Whitestown wanting to build more stuff there.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 30, 2015, 08:25:12 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 30, 2015, 08:15:29 PM
Didn't INDOT rebuild the exit there a few years ago and add an additional ramp to a nearby street. You can't fault them them for Whitestown wanting to build more stuff there.

Actually I should said Whitestown needs to fix the approach to the interchange.  It makes no sense at all for it to still be the way it is, Albert S. White Dr. should be the continuous movement, having to make a left turn at the signal there is bullshit, and worse when Amazon is busy.  Yes it's still rural, but amazon traffic makes it an issue.  Realign the intersection to make Albert S White the continuous movement, cul-de-sac or move Perry Worth further north.  It also makes no sense for that road to be a 4 lane high speed blvd, then cross Fishback Creek and essentially turn into a low speed subdivision street.  Also INDOT's sign is wrong, minor issue but it's Albert S. White Drive not blvd.

Just south Whitestown Pkwy is a disaster during rush hour, I don't think it's INDOT's fault, it's Whitestown's.  I wish Zionsville approved the cooper rd 865/US 52 interchange, but for some reason Zionsville is scared to turn into a city and wants to preserve the rural nature of the area.  I hope this area doesn't turn into a traffic hazard like Fishers/Noblesville in a few yrs. Whitestown and Zionsville appear to hate each other. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 07, 2015, 06:14:53 PM
I hear that an interchange is being looked at for us 20 and SR 2.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on October 07, 2015, 09:07:20 PM
Any designs for this, I've been looking for anything on this. I'm assuming this is near Rolling Prairie?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 07, 2015, 09:12:33 PM
No I only know about it because a friend at indot mentioned it, it must be in the early stages of design. Looking at the satellite view it looks like it could be a diamond since it looks like indot owns the row for one. It may involve roundabouts too. I wonder why doesn't indot just swap the routes there. I remember him saying he thinks a lot of the safety issues has to do with the left turns for thru traffic to follow 20 or 2.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on October 07, 2015, 11:20:42 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2015, 09:12:33 PM
No I only know about it because a friend at indot mentioned it, it must be in the early stages of design. Looking at the satellite view it looks like it could be a diamond since it looks like indot owns the row for one. It may involve roundabouts too. I wonder why doesn't indot just swap the routes there. I remember him saying he thinks a lot of the safety issues has to do with the left turns for thru traffic to follow 20 or 2.

Yeah it looks like a diamond is the most likely interchange. SR 2 and US 20 is basically northern Indiana's version of US 41 and SR 63 in western Indiana. It makes no sense not to have the US Highway follow the best surface route. All it does it make things more confusing. In both situations at the minimum the state route should be consigned as an Alternate US Highway.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 08, 2015, 08:28:51 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2015, 09:12:33 PM
No I only know about it because a friend at indot mentioned it, it must be in the early stages of design. Looking at the satellite view it looks like it could be a diamond since it looks like indot owns the row for one. It may involve roundabouts too. I wonder why doesn't indot just swap the routes there. I remember him saying he thinks a lot of the safety issues has to do with the left turns for thru traffic to follow 20 or 2.

I've thought for a long time that US 20 and IN 2 should flip-flop east of their intersection.  My guess as to why they haven't done it is because US 20 is the route of the historic Michigan Road.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 08, 2015, 08:33:34 AM
Seems like it would make more sense since SR 2 is a divided highway, don't think 20 is. I thought us 31 was Michigan road up there.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on October 08, 2015, 05:40:41 PM
This site shows the historic Michigan Road going West from South Bend to Michigan City

http://historicmichiganroad.org/directions.html (http://historicmichiganroad.org/directions.html)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 09, 2015, 08:23:33 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 08, 2015, 08:33:34 AM
Seems like it would make more sense since SR 2 is a divided highway, don't think 20 is. I thought us 31 was Michigan road up there.

Old US 31/Michigan Street carries Michigan Road into downtown South Bend.  Then it runs along Old 20/20 from South Bend to Michigan City.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 09, 2015, 12:16:45 PM
http://www.wthr.com/story/30223355/indot-takes-to-social-media-to-defend-road-record

What do you guys think of this? Is indot right? I'd say what indot is saying is mostly true.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on October 09, 2015, 12:57:14 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 09, 2015, 12:16:45 PM
http://www.wthr.com/story/30223355/indot-takes-to-social-media-to-defend-road-record

What do you guys think of this? Is indot right? I'd say what indot is saying is mostly true.

I'd say this is mostly true as well. The state highways (and bridges) overall are very well maintained. If people want to complain about state highways they need to drive some of the rural county roads. Pot holes everywhere and where there are bridges that are easily over 80 years old. Those are the bridges I'd be most concerned about.

My biggest INDOT Complaints:
1) Smooth transitions - You know what I'm talking about. New blacktop to old blacktop, blacktop to bridges. There are some very rough transitions in the state.
2) Decommissioning Highways - They seem to want you to drive way out of the way to get from Point A to Point B. They've successfully created a mess in Lafayette. The US 52 reroute was plainly stupid.
3) Manholes where you're supposed to drive. - Sort of goes with smooth transitions or maybe just poor engineering.
4) Control Cities - IMO Terre Haute should be the control city on I-70 west of Indy. It used to be (see link).   https://goo.gl/maps/oSk2rgXXWyr
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 09, 2015, 01:20:16 PM
Quote from: US 41 on October 09, 2015, 12:57:14 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 09, 2015, 12:16:45 PM
http://www.wthr.com/story/30223355/indot-takes-to-social-media-to-defend-road-record

What do you guys think of this? Is indot right? I'd say what indot is saying is mostly true.

I'd say this is mostly true as well. The state highways (and bridges) overall are very well maintained. If people want to complain about state highways they need to drive some of the rural county roads. Pot holes everywhere and where there are bridges that are easily over 80 years old. Those are the bridges I'd be most concerned about.

My biggest INDOT Complaints:
1) Smooth transitions - You know what I'm talking about. New blacktop to old blacktop, blacktop to bridges. There are some very rough transitions in the state.
2) Decommissioning Highways - They seem to want you to drive way out of the way to get from Point A to Point B. They've successfully created a mess in Lafayette. The US 52 reroute was plainly stupid.
3) Manholes where you're supposed to drive. - Sort of goes with smooth transitions or maybe just poor engineering.
4) Control Cities - IMO Terre Haute should be the control city on I-70 west of Indy. It used to be (see link).   https://goo.gl/maps/oSk2rgXXWyr
I-70s control cities make no sense going east either, it changes from Dayton to Columbus randomly. It should be simply Dayton since it's closer. Or both on the same sign.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on October 09, 2015, 07:10:58 PM
Terre Haute should be a secondary control city at best, the same with Richmond to the east. Using St. Louis as a control city for I-70 west of Indy is consistant with INDOT's practices. They use larger cities for control cities along their interstates. I-65 as Chicago, Indy and Louisville, I-70 has St. Louis, Indy and Dayton (mostly,) and there's also Peoria and Cincinnati and Fort Wayne, it's consistent. Some states use smaller communities for control cities but Indiana isn't one of them.

That said, they should just finish off the Columbus on the control cities and be done with them. Changing the cities seems to go along with when they replace their highway signs. If it's button copy it's probably Columbus, if not then it's probably Dayton, seeing the signs slowly transition to the non-button copy kind we'll see more Dayton, though there is one unusual exception with the reconstructed South Split interchange where a new sign as Columbus up near the Washington Street exit.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 09, 2015, 07:17:34 PM
Why is exit 79b signed as meridian street? It doesn't even take you to meridian St, it takes you to Madison ave. It used to say Mccarty St (why did they change it?) which is just as accurate as saying Madison ave. But meridian St? Not even close! Meridian St is 2 blocks west. I guess it's getting too technical but this exit doesn't even intersect meridian St in anyway it feeds directly into Madison avenue and Mccarty St.

Are there any other exits like this?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on October 09, 2015, 08:49:53 PM
Well, the roadway that comes off of the exit does become Meridian St once you reach South Street. The roads in that area are a little screwy as it is, but I'm sure you knew that. What is Meridian St turns into Illinois St, while the "Meridian St" part turns off onto a small road that connects to Madison Ave via Henry St, and from that point it becomes Meridian St to the north. For what it's worth, Madison Ave should begin at the point where Pennsylvania and Delaware break off right underneath I-70. There's too many weird configurations of streets and an insistence on keeping the street pattern what it is with the street names. At least the signage coming off of the highway does reflect that the road goes "to" Meridian. Perhaps the signs on I-70 should do the same.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 09, 2015, 08:51:57 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on October 09, 2015, 08:49:53 PM
Well, the roadway that comes off of the exit does become Meridian St once you reach South Street. The roads in that area are a little screwy as it is, but I'm sure you knew that. What is Meridian St turns into Illinois St, while the "Meridian St" part turns off onto a small road that connects to Madison Ave via Henry St, and from that point it becomes Meridian St to the north. For what it's worth, Madison Ave should begin at the point where Pennsylvania and Delaware break off right underneath I-70. There's too many weird configurations of streets and an insistence on keeping the street pattern what it is with the street names. At least the signage coming off of the highway does reflect that the road goes "to" Meridian. Perhaps the signs on I-70 should do the same.
Was the building of 70 the reason why these roads make no sense in this area? 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on October 09, 2015, 09:00:39 PM
Probably, but I also think the building of the Madison Avenue expressway, specifically so that it would tie into Pennsylvania and Delaware also had a part, in effectively breaking off Madison into two separate sections.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: trafficsignal on October 12, 2015, 11:16:50 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 09, 2015, 07:17:34 PM
Why is exit 79b signed as meridian street? It doesn't even take you to meridian St, it takes you to Madison ave. It used to say Mccarty St (why did they change it?) which is just as accurate as saying Madison ave. But meridian St? Not even close! Meridian St is 2 blocks west. I guess it's getting too technical but this exit doesn't even intersect meridian St in anyway it feeds directly into Madison avenue and Mccarty St.

Are there any other exits like this?

They changed it before the super bowl, the exit takes you (eventually) to Meridian, and they presumed people knew all the action was focused on Meridian St. and wanted the signage to direct them that way (even for longterm tourism guidance, Meridian St is much more helpful than Madison Ave or McCarty).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on October 14, 2015, 08:52:24 PM
I received the following e-mail / news release today from INDOT regarding I-69 in Hamilton and Madison Counties

INDIANAPOLIS (Oct. 14, 2015) — The Indiana Finance Authority Board today made a preliminary selection of an $85 million Milestone Contractors L.P. proposal to widen and rehabilitate 15 miles of Interstate 69 in Hamilton and Madison counties as part of the state's Major Moves 2020 program. Public hearings are scheduled in November to collect public comment on the selected proposal.

Two public hearings will be held, with the first taking place at 6 p.m. Thursday, Nov. 5, in the Miami Room at the Anderson Public Library, 111 E. 12th St. in Anderson. The second hearing will begin at 6 p.m. on Thursday, Nov. 12 in the Council Chambers at Noblesville City Hall, 16 S. 10th St. in Noblesville.

Milestone Contractors of Columbus and designer United Consulting Engineers Inc. propose to add a travel lane in each direction between State Road 37 (Exit 205) and State Road 38 (Exit 219), and add a southbound lane between the 116th Street entrance ramp and the future 106th Street exit ramp. In addition, the project includes reconfiguring the Campus Parkway interchange (Exit 210) into a diverging-diamond design to improve traffic flow, widening the Campus Parkway bridge over I-69, and replacing the Brooks School Road bridge deck over I-69.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on October 14, 2015, 09:47:34 PM
First I've heard of the widening taking place all the way out to Exit 219. Last I checked they were only doing the first part to Exit 214. Not a bad thing though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mobilene on October 15, 2015, 12:05:06 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 08, 2015, 08:28:51 AM
I've thought for a long time that US 20 and IN 2 should flip-flop east of their intersection.  My guess as to why they haven't done it is because US 20 is the route of the historic Michigan Road.

I'm Vice President of the Historic Michigan Road Association, and I can state for the record that we don't care whether the Michigan Road is SR 2 or US 20 or a local road.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mrsman on October 16, 2015, 11:07:06 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on October 09, 2015, 07:10:58 PM
Terre Haute should be a secondary control city at best, the same with Richmond to the east. Using St. Louis as a control city for I-70 west of Indy is consistant with INDOT's practices. They use larger cities for control cities along their interstates. I-65 as Chicago, Indy and Louisville, I-70 has St. Louis, Indy and Dayton (mostly,) and there's also Peoria and Cincinnati and Fort Wayne, it's consistent. Some states use smaller communities for control cities but Indiana isn't one of them.

That said, they should just finish off the Columbus on the control cities and be done with them. Changing the cities seems to go along with when they replace their highway signs. If it's button copy it's probably Columbus, if not then it's probably Dayton, seeing the signs slowly transition to the non-button copy kind we'll see more Dayton, though there is one unusual exception with the reconstructed South Split interchange where a new sign as Columbus up near the Washington Street exit.

IMO Indiana (and many other midwestern states) are the model for control city usage.  Big well known cities are used on 2dis and loops that most people have heard of.  No usage of small towns and no favorites for in-state cities.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mrsman on October 16, 2015, 11:38:20 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 09, 2015, 08:51:57 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on October 09, 2015, 08:49:53 PM
Well, the roadway that comes off of the exit does become Meridian St once you reach South Street. The roads in that area are a little screwy as it is, but I'm sure you knew that. What is Meridian St turns into Illinois St, while the "Meridian St" part turns off onto a small road that connects to Madison Ave via Henry St, and from that point it becomes Meridian St to the north. For what it's worth, Madison Ave should begin at the point where Pennsylvania and Delaware break off right underneath I-70. There's too many weird configurations of streets and an insistence on keeping the street pattern what it is with the street names. At least the signage coming off of the highway does reflect that the road goes "to" Meridian. Perhaps the signs on I-70 should do the same.
Was the building of 70 the reason why these roads make no sense in this area?

Atlanta has similar confusion in its Downtown with regard to Spring Street.  This has been alleviated somewhat by renaming part of Spring Street in honor of Ted Turner.

If there is much confusion caused by Indy's street pattern, perhaps some street renamings are in order here too.

Penn leads to Madison, leading to the Madison Expy.  OK. 

The portion of Madison leading from Exit 79B to North Meridian should probably be renamed "Meridian Street Extension" or perhaps after a local personality (Reggie Miller Avenue).  Signs should be erected guiding traffic to connect between both parts of Meridian along McCarty street.

Meridian Street between Russell and Henry is a very small street and should be renamed to a new name or perhaps to Charles Street to avoid confusion.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on October 17, 2015, 02:27:11 PM
Why does the Salem Bypass not intersect with IN-160? :confused:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 17, 2015, 02:29:34 PM
Quote from: billtm on October 17, 2015, 02:27:11 PM
Why does the Salem Bypass not intersect with IN-160? :confused:
I have no idea, it makes SR 160 end at a city street too. Like SR 61 does in Vincennes. I also have no idea why they didn't make it go north of SR 60, the highway routings around there are all messed up.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on October 18, 2015, 12:04:58 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 17, 2015, 02:29:34 PM
Quote from: billtm on October 17, 2015, 02:27:11 PM
Why does the Salem Bypass not intersect with IN-160? :confused:
I have no idea, it makes SR 160 end at a city street too. Like SR 61 does in Vincennes. I also have no idea why they didn't make it go north of SR 60, the highway routings around there are all messed up.

So SR 60 in Salem is now decommissioned? Are there any other changes in Salem?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on October 18, 2015, 12:45:41 AM
I believe SR 60 was simply rerouted onto the bypass around the town center of Salem and north to the current concurrency with SR 56 on the north side of town.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 18, 2015, 09:43:43 AM
135 was rerouted too
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 19, 2015, 10:01:11 AM
Quote from: billtm on October 17, 2015, 02:27:11 PM
Why does the Salem Bypass not intersect with IN-160? :confused:

I was just in Salem yesterday, specifically for the purpose of clinching IN 160 (very pretty drive between Salem and Henryville BTW).  IN 160 was not rerouted or truncated when IN 60 and 135 were rereouted onto the new bypass, so IN 160 does end at what used to be IN 60 but is now just a city street.  There is a substantial elevation difference between the two roads where the new bypass crosses over 160, and my guess is that 160 just isn't used enough to justify an interchange.  Extending 160 further into Salem defeats the purpose of rerouting state highways onto the bypass and there isn't any feasible way I see to have 160 link up with the other highways.  It's probably going to have to continue as is, ending at a city street.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 19, 2015, 10:06:55 AM
Quote from: trafficsignal on October 12, 2015, 11:16:50 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 09, 2015, 07:17:34 PM
Why is exit 79b signed as meridian street? It doesn't even take you to meridian St, it takes you to Madison ave. It used to say Mccarty St (why did they change it?) which is just as accurate as saying Madison ave. But meridian St? Not even close! Meridian St is 2 blocks west. I guess it's getting too technical but this exit doesn't even intersect meridian St in anyway it feeds directly into Madison avenue and Mccarty St.

Are there any other exits like this?

They changed it before the super bowl, the exit takes you (eventually) to Meridian, and they presumed people knew all the action was focused on Meridian St. and wanted the signage to direct them that way (even for longterm tourism guidance, Meridian St is much more helpful than Madison Ave or McCarty).

I've always thought it should say:

Madison Ave.
TO Meridian St.

like it does once you are on the ramp. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 19, 2015, 10:07:57 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 19, 2015, 10:01:11 AM
Quote from: billtm on October 17, 2015, 02:27:11 PM
Why does the Salem Bypass not intersect with IN-160? :confused:

I was just in Salem yesterday, specifically for the purpose of clinching IN 160 (very pretty drive between Salem and Henryville BTW).  IN 160 was not rerouted or truncated when IN 60 and 135 were rereouted onto the new bypass, so IN 160 does end at what used to be IN 60 but is now just a city street.  There is a substantial elevation difference between the two roads where the new bypass crosses over 160, and my guess is that 160 just isn't used enough to justify an interchange.  Extending 160 further into Salem defeats the purpose of rerouting state highways onto the bypass and there isn't any feasible way I see to have 160 link up with the other highways.  It's probably going to have to continue as is, ending at a city street.
Is this bypass going to always be 2 lanes or are their future plans to make it a divided highway? Also they could end it at the bridge like they do SR 61 in Vincennes.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on October 20, 2015, 07:05:44 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 19, 2015, 10:01:11 AM
Quote from: billtm on October 17, 2015, 02:27:11 PM
Why does the Salem Bypass not intersect with IN-160? :confused:

I was just in Salem yesterday, specifically for the purpose of clinching IN 160 (very pretty drive between Salem and Henryville BTW).  IN 160 was not rerouted or truncated when IN 60 and 135 were rereouted onto the new bypass, so IN 160 does end at what used to be IN 60 but is now just a city street.  There is a substantial elevation difference between the two roads where the new bypass crosses over 160, and my guess is that 160 just isn't used enough to justify an interchange.  Extending 160 further into Salem defeats the purpose of rerouting state highways onto the bypass and there isn't any feasible way I see to have 160 link up with the other highways.  It's probably going to have to continue as is, ending at a city street.

What INDOT should do is just have 160 run east on the former 60 to the Salem Bypass. It is only 0.6 miles. Of course it won't happen because it's INDOT.

What they should really do is stop decommissioning highways. Or maybe INDOT should just decommission every state highway besides interstates and a few major state / US highways in the state since those are the only ones that matter in their eyes. I'm about sick of INDOT decommissioning highways. They've basically ruined our state highway network. Nothing like driving 8 miles out of the way whenever the old route is 6 miles shorter just so INDOT can get rid of a few miles. A few people in INDOT need fired and / or find a new career. This is getting ridiculous. State highways should not just end at a city street or at a town's city limit. You really can't extend 160 by 0.6 miles INDOT. Pathetic.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on October 20, 2015, 07:58:57 PM
I am not a fan of all the in-city INDOT decommissionings (especially ones with illogical endings), but realistically, how much does it matter?
- In exchange for the turning back of roads, INDOT provides funding for more road improvements than would otherwise occur
- INDOT funds a good chunk of local street improvements irrespective of state highway status
- City streets are marked much better than they were in days past (larger, higher, reflective signs) so anyone should be able to find their way around a city.
- I would say most people use GPS and turn by turn on their phones nowadays so why does having a marked highway matter? It is funny that the Google Maps guys really dislike the decommissionings, but their product was a significant breakthrough that changed the way people get around. Google Maps certainly does not religiously route you on state highways.

I just wonder if it is merely nostalgia from people like me or if there is some objective reason why it does not make sense.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on October 20, 2015, 10:28:35 PM
Shouldn't have to get your own GPS or be looking at your phone to follow the route that the signs adequately did before.  Indiana's rationale and laws regarding route numbers on non-state-maintained roads are goofy.  Do it like Massachusetts or Ohio or something and allow state routes to be posted over non-state-maintained roadways in cities/towns if needed, for the sake of being able to navigate.  Getting from 25 on one side of town to 25 on the other shouldn't involve getting out a phone and looking at it or having to be told to follow Schuyler to Sagamore to Teal to 4th or whatever.  It was 25 before; why not let it be 25 still?

38 ending at Sagamore Parkway just feet from where 52 turns onto Teal, the two now never meeting and there being not even a TO 52 (left) sign at the end of 38, is absurd.  If nothing else, 38 could at least legally turn left to meet 52--but that would add several feet so it can't be done.  Give me a break!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on October 20, 2015, 11:13:25 PM
In other news SR 446, 48, and 45 in Monroe County will remain under INDOT control. Monroe County rejected INDOT's offer. Does anyone know if SR 45 has been reopened between Beanblossom and Needmore and why it is (was) closed?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 21, 2015, 04:37:02 PM
Quote from: US 41 on October 20, 2015, 07:05:44 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 19, 2015, 10:01:11 AM
Quote from: billtm on October 17, 2015, 02:27:11 PM
Why does the Salem Bypass not intersect with IN-160? :confused:

I was just in Salem yesterday, specifically for the purpose of clinching IN 160 (very pretty drive between Salem and Henryville BTW).  IN 160 was not rerouted or truncated when IN 60 and 135 were rereouted onto the new bypass, so IN 160 does end at what used to be IN 60 but is now just a city street.  There is a substantial elevation difference between the two roads where the new bypass crosses over 160, and my guess is that 160 just isn't used enough to justify an interchange.  Extending 160 further into Salem defeats the purpose of rerouting state highways onto the bypass and there isn't any feasible way I see to have 160 link up with the other highways.  It's probably going to have to continue as is, ending at a city street.

What INDOT should do is just have 160 run east on the former 60 to the Salem Bypass. It is only 0.6 miles. Of course it won't happen because it's INDOT.

What they should really do is stop decommissioning highways. Or maybe INDOT should just decommission every state highway besides interstates and a few major state / US highways in the state since those are the only ones that matter in their eyes. I'm about sick of INDOT decommissioning highways. They've basically ruined our state highway network. Nothing like driving 8 miles out of the way whenever the old route is 6 miles shorter just so INDOT can get rid of a few miles. A few people in INDOT need fired and / or find a new career. This is getting ridiculous. State highways should not just end at a city street or at a town's city limit. You really can't extend 160 by 0.6 miles INDOT. Pathetic.

Having 160 turn back east there doesn't really make sense.  If you are traveling west on 160, you're likely headed to Salem, so having 160 turn directly away from Salem would cause more confusion than just having it end where it is. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefro on November 23, 2015, 08:28:59 AM
http://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/johnson-county/2015/11/23/diverging-diamond-interchange-greenwood-only-second-indiana/76099658/

QuoteThink roundabouts are confusing? Wait until a new diverging diamond interchange on I-65 opens this week in Greenwood.

The new highway overpass at Worthsville Road is the first diverging diamond interchange in Central Indiana and only the second in the state.

Drivers should stay alert as traffic switches sides along the new bridge to allow vehicles to turn directly onto I-65 without having to cross the path of oncoming traffic.

The  $16.1 million diverging diamond interchange might take some getting used to, but Indiana Department of Transportation spokesman Harry Maginity said everyone will be fine as long as they stay in their proper lanes and pay attention.

"There will be plenty of signs and lights directing cars," he said.

Driving lanes get shuffled for a short distance, Maginity said, but "the stoplight at the end of the bridge is where all that gets corrected."
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 23, 2015, 08:44:58 AM
INDOT was originally going to do a DDI at the new I-265/IN 62/Port Rd interchange in Jeffersonville but changed it to roundabouts, which is causing problems with the large amount of truck traffic.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 23, 2015, 09:33:06 AM
This really annoys me about media when they talk about new roadway features, it's the media's job to educate the public on these matters! Don't just say it's confusing, teach people how it works. Honestly it's way less confusing imo than a roundabout if it was your first time seeing it. People will get used to it eventually.

Nexus 6P

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 2trailertrucker on November 23, 2015, 08:29:43 PM
Here is a piece by WXIN with video

http://fox59.com/2015/11/23/indot-greenwood-cut-ribbon-on-first-diverging-diamond-interchange-in-central-indiana/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on November 24, 2015, 11:27:50 AM
Any thoughts about INDOT's proposed "J-Turns?" http://www.pharostribune.com/news/local_news/article_e3d09a59-80b2-5bb6-a4db-1a40bb0e32cd.html
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on November 24, 2015, 12:19:46 PM
They're planning a couple along US 231 in Spencer County at SR 62 and SR 68, I think.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jnewkirk77 on November 25, 2015, 02:01:32 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on November 24, 2015, 12:19:46 PM
They're planning a couple along US 231 in Spencer County at SR 62 and SR 68, I think.

That's what the plan was, but after holding public meetings on it, all of a sudden Vincennes District clammed up and they're no longer discussing anything about the intersections.  It's weird.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on November 25, 2015, 07:00:18 AM
Back to DDIs:

Quote
Indiana's first diverging diamond interchange at I-69 and SR 1 in Fort Wayne was honored with an engineering award Tuesday...

Fort Wayne diverging diamond interchange honored with engineering award (http://www.21alive.com/news/local/353225621.html) (21Alive)

My daughter who lives in Fort Wayne sent me the URL, but she said she hates driving through the interchange on DuPont Road. I don't see the issue, personally. I believe the next Indiana DDI will be at Campus Parkway on I-69.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: captkirk_4 on November 25, 2015, 09:02:46 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on October 20, 2015, 10:28:35 PM
Shouldn't have to get your own GPS or be looking at your phone to follow the route that the signs adequately did before.  Indiana's rationale and laws regarding route numbers on non-state-maintained roads are goofy.  Do it like Massachusetts or Ohio or something and allow state routes to be posted over non-state-maintained roadways in cities/towns if needed, for the sake of being able to navigate.  Getting from 25 on one side of town to 25 on the other shouldn't involve getting out a phone and looking at it or having to be told to follow Schuyler to Sagamore to Teal to 4th or whatever.  It was 25 before; why not let it be 25 still?

38 ending at Sagamore Parkway just feet from where 52 turns onto Teal, the two now never meeting and there being not even a TO 52 (left) sign at the end of 38, is absurd.  If nothing else, 38 could at least legally turn left to meet 52--but that would add several feet so it can't be done.  Give me a break!
Coming back to Central Illinois from Michigan I wanted to avoid the horrendous bottleneck and traffic Jam of I80/90/94 along the lake so I checked out the US24 to Hoosier Heartland Highway from Ft Wayne and made good time until all of a sudden this major NE/SW route came to a DEAD STOP in the middle of Lafayette ending on unmarked urban streets. No signs how to get to the SW corner of town and head on down to I74. Lafayette is completely lacking an adequate way to get from the circle at the end of the Hoosier Heartland Highway to I74. No bypass of this traffic signal laden city, no diagonal highways heading towards Danville.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 25, 2015, 09:05:03 PM
Quote from: captkirk_4 on November 25, 2015, 09:02:46 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on October 20, 2015, 10:28:35 PM
Shouldn't have to get your own GPS or be looking at your phone to follow the route that the signs adequately did before.  Indiana's rationale and laws regarding route numbers on non-state-maintained roads are goofy.  Do it like Massachusetts or Ohio or something and allow state routes to be posted over non-state-maintained roadways in cities/towns if needed, for the sake of being able to navigate.  Getting from 25 on one side of town to 25 on the other shouldn't involve getting out a phone and looking at it or having to be told to follow Schuyler to Sagamore to Teal to 4th or whatever.  It was 25 before; why not let it be 25 still?

38 ending at Sagamore Parkway just feet from where 52 turns onto Teal, the two now never meeting and there being not even a TO 52 (left) sign at the end of 38, is absurd.  If nothing else, 38 could at least legally turn left to meet 52--but that would add several feet so it can't be done.  Give me a break!
Coming back to Central Illinois from Michigan I wanted to avoid the horrendous bottleneck and traffic Jam of I80/90/94 along the lake so I checked out the US24 to Hoosier Heartland Highway from Ft Wayne and made good time until all of a sudden this major NE/SW route came to a DEAD STOP in the middle of Lafayette ending on unmarked urban streets. No signs how to get to the SW corner of town and head on down to I74. Lafayette is completely lacking an adequate way to get from the circle at the end of the Hoosier Heartland Highway to I74. No bypass of this traffic signal laden city, no diagonal highways heading towards Danville.

You can thank INDOT for that, it used to be signed through lafayette, but INDOT wanted to fuck that up, so they did.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 25, 2015, 09:05:46 PM
Worthsville Rd is open today, anyone been down there yet?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on November 26, 2015, 02:47:14 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 25, 2015, 09:05:03 PM
Quote from: captkirk_4 on November 25, 2015, 09:02:46 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on October 20, 2015, 10:28:35 PM
Shouldn't have to get your own GPS or be looking at your phone to follow the route that the signs adequately did before.  Indiana's rationale and laws regarding route numbers on non-state-maintained roads are goofy.  Do it like Massachusetts or Ohio or something and allow state routes to be posted over non-state-maintained roadways in cities/towns if needed, for the sake of being able to navigate.  Getting from 25 on one side of town to 25 on the other shouldn't involve getting out a phone and looking at it or having to be told to follow Schuyler to Sagamore to Teal to 4th or whatever.  It was 25 before; why not let it be 25 still?

38 ending at Sagamore Parkway just feet from where 52 turns onto Teal, the two now never meeting and there being not even a TO 52 (left) sign at the end of 38, is absurd.  If nothing else, 38 could at least legally turn left to meet 52--but that would add several feet so it can't be done.  Give me a break!
Coming back to Central Illinois from Michigan I wanted to avoid the horrendous bottleneck and traffic Jam of I80/90/94 along the lake so I checked out the US24 to Hoosier Heartland Highway from Ft Wayne and made good time until all of a sudden this major NE/SW route came to a DEAD STOP in the middle of Lafayette ending on unmarked urban streets. No signs how to get to the SW corner of town and head on down to I74. Lafayette is completely lacking an adequate way to get from the circle at the end of the Hoosier Heartland Highway to I74. No bypass of this traffic signal laden city, no diagonal highways heading towards Danville.

You can thank INDOT for that, it used to be signed through lafayette, but INDOT wanted to fuck that up, so they did.

Quote from: captkirk_4 on November 25, 2015, 09:02:46 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on October 20, 2015, 10:28:35 PM
Shouldn't have to get your own GPS or be looking at your phone to follow the route that the signs adequately did before.  Indiana's rationale and laws regarding route numbers on non-state-maintained roads are goofy.  Do it like Massachusetts or Ohio or something and allow state routes to be posted over non-state-maintained roadways in cities/towns if needed, for the sake of being able to navigate.  Getting from 25 on one side of town to 25 on the other shouldn't involve getting out a phone and looking at it or having to be told to follow Schuyler to Sagamore to Teal to 4th or whatever.  It was 25 before; why not let it be 25 still?

38 ending at Sagamore Parkway just feet from where 52 turns onto Teal, the two now never meeting and there being not even a TO 52 (left) sign at the end of 38, is absurd.  If nothing else, 38 could at least legally turn left to meet 52--but that would add several feet so it can't be done.  Give me a break!
Coming back to Central Illinois from Michigan I wanted to avoid the horrendous bottleneck and traffic Jam of I80/90/94 along the lake so I checked out the US24 to Hoosier Heartland Highway from Ft Wayne and made good time until all of a sudden this major NE/SW route came to a DEAD STOP in the middle of Lafayette ending on unmarked urban streets. No signs how to get to the SW corner of town and head on down to I74. Lafayette is completely lacking an adequate way to get from the circle at the end of the Hoosier Heartland Highway to I74. No bypass of this traffic signal laden city, no diagonal highways heading towards Danville.

Lafayette at the very least should have "TO SR 25" and "TO US 231" signs installed, I know they have the emergency detour signs for I-65 there for Sagamore Parkway. INDOT must assume that most traffic traveling southwest to Lafayette end there or go onto I-65 and not travel further south and west. Otherwise they would give a damn about that particular movement of travel. That and they probably assume that you have typed in Danville on your phone and just followed that.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on November 26, 2015, 09:14:59 AM
Well you were asking about the diverging diamond interchange in Greenwood, so here's some pictures. Of course there's still some additional construction going on along Worthsville Road, which is being converted into a four-lane boulevard from I-65 to US 31. I was surprised to see some of that still ongoing despite the road being closed for about two years at this point.

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1030.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy361%2Fthomasj88%2FIMG_4367_zpstgjia4ki.jpg&hash=78bd6b475ec58fd79735ca8d53cb914b59cd510c) (http://s1030.photobucket.com/user/thomasj88/media/IMG_4367_zpstgjia4ki.jpg.html)

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1030.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy361%2Fthomasj88%2FIMG_4369_zpsma5rd9ke.jpg&hash=cfc6674ff477203ec46d26402fa627cb47939a2d) (http://s1030.photobucket.com/user/thomasj88/media/IMG_4369_zpsma5rd9ke.jpg.html)

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1030.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy361%2Fthomasj88%2FIMG_4370_zps2zg4vfw4.jpg&hash=2564970016e413efb1b78adfaf5a999ec9eccc25) (http://s1030.photobucket.com/user/thomasj88/media/IMG_4370_zps2zg4vfw4.jpg.html)

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1030.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy361%2Fthomasj88%2FIMG_4372_zpsm13aojua.jpg&hash=9021cde595f6de4a6b865013ad3bdea2db7a9720) (http://s1030.photobucket.com/user/thomasj88/media/IMG_4372_zpsm13aojua.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Big John on November 26, 2015, 11:28:43 AM
^^ Using a No Right Turn and No Left Turn signs on the same post instead of a No Turns sign?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 30, 2015, 08:28:16 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 25, 2015, 09:05:46 PM
Worthsville Rd is open today, anyone been down there yet?

Used the northbound exit Thursday morning on the way to the in-laws.  I don't get how this makes traffic flow better than other interchanges.  I got stopped at both stoplights. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 30, 2015, 08:29:54 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on November 30, 2015, 08:28:16 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 25, 2015, 09:05:46 PM
Worthsville Rd is open today, anyone been down there yet?

Used the northbound exit Thursday morning on the way to the in-laws.  I don't get how this makes traffic flow better than other interchanges.  I got stopped at both stoplights.

It has to do with the delay caused from left turn phases, since every movement is using right turns, it should theoretically make traffic better, not sure how much better though. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on November 30, 2015, 08:56:11 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on November 30, 2015, 08:28:16 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 25, 2015, 09:05:46 PM
Worthsville Rd is open today, anyone been down there yet?

Used the northbound exit Thursday morning on the way to the in-laws.  I don't get how this makes traffic flow better than other interchanges.  I got stopped at both stoplights.
The biggest benefit is safety, as it eliminates left turns that cross opposing traffic.  The traffic signals are only two phase, which results in higher green times.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eLAwwl3EtN4 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eLAwwl3EtN4)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 30, 2015, 08:57:21 PM
Is there a new type of intersection that isn't under study in Indiana?

Nexus 6P

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on November 30, 2015, 09:23:00 PM
I think left exits for diamond interchanges would improve traffic flow. Then there would only be 1 stoplight rather than 2. I think there used to be one of these on US 41 north of Chicago, near Waukeegan (aka the free route to Milwaukee).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on November 30, 2015, 10:14:28 PM
Quote from: US 41 on November 30, 2015, 09:23:00 PM
I think left exits for diamond interchanges would improve traffic flow. Then there would only be 1 stoplight rather than 2.

You would improve traffic flow on the arterial at the expense of safety on the freeway - left side exits don't have a good safety record.

Quote from: US 41 on November 30, 2015, 09:23:00 PMI think there used to be one of these on US 41 north of Chicago, near Waukeegan (aka the free route to Milwaukee).

You are thinking of US 41 at IL 132, which was a left side ramp SPUI before its conversion to a completely split phased SPUI.  I-290 at IL 43/Harlem Avenue and I-290 at Austin Avenue also are of the left side ramp SPUI design, and both contribute to issues with traffic on I-290.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 01, 2015, 02:00:39 PM
Not sure if this has been mentioned, but SR 28 & US 31 interchange in Tipton is supposed to be driveable by November 2016.  This of course could change due to weather and other unforeseen delays.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 08, 2015, 07:30:42 PM
Plans are underway to widen I-65 from south of U.S. 30 to (for now) Indiana 2. Part of that work includes replacement of the Kankakee River bridges at the Lake-Newton County line.

The $70 million project is set to begin in 2017, with the aim to have the project finished by November 2018.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 08, 2015, 07:32:07 PM
Wow they're really committed to widening 65, but why no action at all on 70? How do traffic and truck counts compare on the routes?

Nexus 6P

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 08, 2015, 08:01:06 PM
While I try to find the information, keep in mind that Interstate 65 is the only major freeway connecting central Indiana to Chicago, with few viable alternatives. Same can be said with Louisville, because US 31 couldn't shoulder the load of a shutdown on I-65.

I-65 has a high tendency to get strangled with traffic clusters, especially near the Lafayette area (for now) and north of Indiana 2. There's justification in giving I-65 high priority.

Also, the only major points of traffic contention on I-70 in Indiana (not counting Indianapolis of course) would be Richmond and Terrre Haute. Not much compared to I-65 (Gary, Merrillville, Lafayette, Indy, Columbus, and Jeffersonville).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 08, 2015, 08:02:35 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 08, 2015, 08:01:06 PM
While I try to find the information, keep in mind that Interstate 65 is the only major freeway connecting central Indiana to Chicago, with few viable alternatives. Same can be said with Louisville, because US 31 couldn't shoulder the load of a shutdown on I-65.

I-65 has a high tendency to get strangled with traffic clusters, especially near the Lafayette area (for now) and north of Indiana 2. There's justification in giving I-65 high priority.

Also, the only major points of traffic contention on I-70 in Indiana (not counting Indianapolis of course) would be Richmond and Terrre Haute. Not much compared to I-65 (Gary, Merrillville, Lafayette, Indy, Columbus, and Jeffersonville).
I agree with everything you said, just curious about the traffic counts.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on December 08, 2015, 08:47:47 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 08, 2015, 07:30:42 PM
Plans are underway to widen I-65 from south of U.S. 30 to (for now) Indiana 2. Part of that work includes replacement of the Kankakee River bridges at the Lake-Newton County line.

The $70 million project is set to begin in 2017, with the aim to have the project finished by November 2018.

Excellent news. Its about time! Now if they could only do the Keystone Parkway treatment to key parts of US 30.

Quote from: silverback1065 on December 08, 2015, 07:32:07 PM
Wow they're really committed to widening 65, but why no action at all on 70? How do traffic and truck counts compare on the routes?

INDOT Traffic Counts (https://entapps.indot.in.gov/TrafficCounts/)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on December 08, 2015, 09:21:36 PM
Quote from: mukade on December 08, 2015, 08:47:47 PM
INDOT Traffic Counts (https://entapps.indot.in.gov/TrafficCounts/)

Looks to me INDOT should be focusing on I-65 between Indy and Louisville first.  The section between Chicagoland and Indy mostly be bypassed using some combination of US 41, US 52, US 231, and/or I-74; I'm not seeing any good alternates for I-65 between I-465 and I-265.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 08, 2015, 09:31:17 PM
That also adds something about I-70, it has US 40 as an alternative route, a relatively good four-lane highway outside of some communities. That said, I can see I-70 widening near Terre Haute and Richmond down the road.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on December 08, 2015, 10:01:58 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on December 08, 2015, 09:21:36 PM
Quote from: mukade on December 08, 2015, 08:47:47 PM
INDOT Traffic Counts (https://entapps.indot.in.gov/TrafficCounts/)

Looks to me INDOT should be focusing on I-65 between Indy and Louisville first.  The section between Chicagoland and Indy mostly be bypassed using some combination of US 41, US 52, US 231, and/or I-74; I'm not seeing any good alternates for I-65 between I-465 and I-265.

Clearly, I-65 from US 30 to US 231 was at the top of the list, but to SR 2 is also a very good move.

These look to be the top areas for future widening:
- I-65 from SR 44 to US 31 in Edinburgh
- I-70 from SR 39 south of Danville to SR 267
- I-70 from Mt. Comfort Rd. to SR 9 in Greenfield
- I-69 from SR 38 to SR 67/SR 32 in Daleville
- I-69 from I-469 to US 24/Jefferson in Fort Wayne
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on December 09, 2015, 09:27:32 AM
Here is an I65 news story: Governor Mike Pence announced plans today to widen Interstate 65 in Lake County to three lanes in each direction from Merrillville south to at least State Road 2 near Lowell. The $70 million project is part of Pence's Major Moves 2020 highway program. http://www.insideindianabusiness.com/story/30695634/pence-announces-plan-to-widen-i-65-in-lake-county
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mvak36 on December 09, 2015, 11:26:16 AM
How many miles of I-65 are left to be widened to 3 lanes? The above article mentioned some other sections being constructed right now, so I was curious to see how much work they have left throughout the state. Thanks in advance
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 09, 2015, 11:47:40 AM
Quote from: mvak36 on December 09, 2015, 11:26:16 AM
How many miles of I-65 are left to be widened to 3 lanes? The above article mentioned some other sections being constructed right now, so I was curious to see how much work they have left throughout the state. Thanks in advance

not sure of the mileage, but the gaps are between (going south) SR 2 to SR 25, SR 38 to SR 32, SR 44 and Memphis Rd.  I think the SR 44 to Memphis Rd is the largest gap, but that's off the top of my head. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on December 09, 2015, 11:56:34 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 09, 2015, 11:47:40 AM
not sure of the mileage, but the gaps are between (going south) SR 2 to SR 25, SR 38 to SR 32, SR 44 and Memphis Rd.  I think the SR 44 to Memphis Rd is the largest gap, but that's off the top of my head.

Actually the 3-laning in Lebanon starts at U.S. 52 now.  So that second gap is (will be) SR 38 - U.S. 52.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mvak36 on December 09, 2015, 12:07:24 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 09, 2015, 11:47:40 AM
Quote from: mvak36 on December 09, 2015, 11:26:16 AM
How many miles of I-65 are left to be widened to 3 lanes? The above article mentioned some other sections being constructed right now, so I was curious to see how much work they have left throughout the state. Thanks in advance

not sure of the mileage, but the gaps are between (going south) SR 2 to SR 25, SR 38 to SR 32, SR 44 and Memphis Rd.  I think the SR 44 to Memphis Rd is the largest gap, but that's off the top of my head.

Thanks for the info. Going by the exit numbers, it looks like about 167 miles still left to go.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 09, 2015, 12:08:29 PM
I forgot the gap between 865/52 and 465
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mvak36 on December 09, 2015, 12:10:00 PM
Another 6 miles I guess. So approx. 173!!!

I could see why they're doing 65 first.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 09, 2015, 12:12:13 PM
i think the 856/52 465 gap will be last filled.  it will be nice to fill the Lafayette Lebanon gap, it would be cool to have a partial beltway around lafayette, at least an at grade divided highway to replace teal road south of the city, then they could throw 52 on a legitimate bypass.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 09, 2015, 01:53:48 PM
on a different note, was SR 3 rerouted onto SR 750 to meet SR 7 in North Vernon? 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mvak36 on December 09, 2015, 02:21:36 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 09, 2015, 12:12:13 PM
i think the 856/52 465 gap will be last filled.  it will be nice to fill the Lafayette Lebanon gap, it would be cool to have a partial beltway around lafayette, at least an at grade divided highway to replace teal road south of the city, then they could throw 52 on a legitimate bypass.

Hopefully they start widening more and more sections eventually.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 09, 2015, 03:57:03 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 09, 2015, 01:53:48 PM
on a different note, was SR 3 rerouted onto SR 750 to meet SR 7 in North Vernon? 

There's no reason to really. SR 3 meets SR 7 a short distance south of SR 750, I can't see why getting rid of that would do anything.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 09, 2015, 03:58:03 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 09, 2015, 03:57:03 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 09, 2015, 01:53:48 PM
on a different note, was SR 3 rerouted onto SR 750 to meet SR 7 in North Vernon? 

There's no reason to really. SR 3 meets SR 7 a short distance south of SR 750, I can't see why getting rid of that would do anything.

I was just curious, I saw the new street view footage and some of the signage made it look like it was true.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 09, 2015, 04:07:55 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 09, 2015, 11:47:40 AM
Quote from: mvak36 on December 09, 2015, 11:26:16 AM
How many miles of I-65 are left to be widened to 3 lanes? The above article mentioned some other sections being constructed right now, so I was curious to see how much work they have left throughout the state. Thanks in advance

not sure of the mileage, but the gaps are between (going south) SR 2 to SR 25, SR 38 to SR 32, SR 44 and Memphis Rd.  I think the SR 44 to Memphis Rd is the largest gap, but that's off the top of my head. 

Yes, SR 44 to Memphis Rd is by far the largest gap, and I'll also point out that the Memphis to Sellersburg section is still in the very early stages.  Will be a while until that part is done.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 11, 2015, 12:58:12 AM
Re: I-65...

I just realized that widening I-65 to Indiana 2 would open the way for building a continuous six-lane highway from I-80/94 to Indiana 14. When the Kankakee River bridges get rebuilt, all the bridges south to Indiana 14 will have been rebuilt to support a third lane. That would leave crews to fill in the gaps with minimal bridge work, allowing more miles of widening to be done during construction seasons.

That would definitely shorten the gap between the work set to be done and Lafayette.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on December 11, 2015, 09:30:46 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 11, 2015, 12:58:12 AM
Re: I-65...

I just realized that widening I-65 to Indiana 2 would open the way for building a continuous six-lane highway from I-80/94 to Indiana 14. When the Kankakee River bridges get rebuilt, all the bridges south to Indiana 14 will have been rebuilt to support a third lane. That would leave crews to fill in the gaps with minimal bridge work, allowing more miles of widening to be done during construction seasons.

That would definitely shorten the gap between the work set to be done and Lafayette.

They might as well go ahead and widen down to IN-10 with this project if they're going to replace that bridge.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 16, 2015, 03:59:42 PM
more headaches on 65.

http://www.wthr.com/story/30767964/large-hole-in-i-65-bridge-causes-backups-in-tippecanoe-county
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on December 23, 2015, 09:51:37 PM
Carmel Indiana just announced a $217 million plan to add over 30 roundabouts and other infrastructure improvements over the next 3 years.  This includes the long awaited Keystone Parkway and 96th Street project.

ROADWORK, ROUNDABOUTS AND INFRASTRUCTURE PROJECTS PROPOSED FOR CITY OF CARMEL AMBITIOUS PLAN WOULD INVEST $217 MILLION OVER 3 YEARS
(http://www.carmel.in.gov/index.aspx?page=25&recordid=1323&returnURL=%2findex.aspx)

Carmel on road to $217M in infrastructure projects (http://www.ibj.com/articles/56342-carmel-sets-plans-for-217m-in-infrastructure-projects)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Lyon Wonder on December 24, 2015, 01:33:08 AM
according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_State_Road_931 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_State_Road_931) INDOT's going to put US 31 on I-65 between the KY state line and I-465 in Indianapolis and renumber the parallel US 31 as IN-931 (which is also applied to former US 31 in Kokomo) and sounds similar to I-39 and IL-251 in Illinois.  If true, I guess this may or may not be a prelude to INDOT decommissioning some or all of the surface route that parallels I-65.

The only other US highways in IN that closely parallel non-toll interstates are US 40 close to I-70, US 52 close to I-65 from Lafayette to Lebanon and US 136 close to I-74 from the IL state line to Indianapolis.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: rawmustard on December 24, 2015, 08:21:25 AM
Quote from: Lyon Wonder on December 24, 2015, 01:33:08 AM
according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_State_Road_931 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_State_Road_931) INDOT's going to put US 31 on I-65 between the KY state line and I-465 in Indianapolis and renumber the parallel US 31 as IN-931 (which is also applied to former US 31 in Kokomo) and sounds similar to I-39 and IL-251 in Illinois.  If true, I guess this may or may not be a prelude to INDOT decommissioning some or all of the surface route that parallels I-65.

There's no citation to that section. If some other source had reported it, I'm sure it would be well known by now.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: TheHighwayMan3561 on December 25, 2015, 10:53:42 PM
A truck attempted to drive across the one-lane 1880 Paoli Bridge today, and destroyed it.

http://www.wdrb.com/story/30830559/truck-wedges-itself-in-paoli-bridge-causing-it-to-collapse
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Pete from Boston on December 25, 2015, 11:31:33 PM

Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on December 25, 2015, 10:53:42 PM
A truck attempted to drive across the one-lane 1880 Paoli Bridge today, and destroyed it.

http://www.wdrb.com/story/30830559/truck-wedges-itself-in-paoli-bridge-causing-it-to-collapse

Let's call it what it is–a person with terrible judgement attempted to drive across the bridge in a truck.

I hope that $135 fine turns into a liability claim for the cost to rebuild.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 25, 2015, 11:41:52 PM
Very sad to see, and there's a state highway one block to the west of this street. At least I got to see it and take a picture of it before its demise.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on December 26, 2015, 08:55:45 AM
he
Quote from: Pete from Boston on December 25, 2015, 11:31:33 PM

Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on December 25, 2015, 10:53:42 PM
A truck attempted to drive across the one-lane 1880 Paoli Bridge today, and destroyed it.

http://www.wdrb.com/story/30830559/truck-wedges-itself-in-paoli-bridge-causing-it-to-collapse

Let's call it what it is–a person with terrible judgement attempted to drive across the bridge in a truck.

I hope that $135 fine turns into a liability claim for the cost to rebuild.

The signs says the weight limit is 6 tons. This moron's truck weighed 35 tons. Based off the pictures it looks like the truck was too tall for the bridge. Looking at GSV I have to wonder if this guy has a brain at all. Like really who would even attempt to drive a semi truck and trailer on that bridge.

https://www.google.com/maps/@38.5548297,-86.4684462,3a,66.8y,187.22h,86.66t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sSWYUkz-hb0gTZDRgup5oUA!2e0
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 26, 2015, 10:08:16 AM
Quote from: Lyon Wonder on December 24, 2015, 01:33:08 AM
according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_State_Road_931 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_State_Road_931) INDOT's going to put US 31 on I-65 between the KY state line and I-465 in Indianapolis and renumber the parallel US 31 as IN-931 (which is also applied to former US 31 in Kokomo) and sounds similar to I-39 and IL-251 in Illinois.  If true, I guess this may or may not be a prelude to INDOT decommissioning some or all of the surface route that parallels I-65.

The only other US highways in IN that closely parallel non-toll interstates are US 40 close to I-70, US 52 close to I-65 from Lafayette to Lebanon and US 136 close to I-74 from the IL state line to Indianapolis.

I don't believe this, there's no proof, someone could have just typed that talking out of their ass.  Also, the truck driver is clearly a dumbass.  I love how the bridge says, no trucks clearly in front of it, and the truck empty would way more than the limit!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on December 26, 2015, 10:44:17 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 26, 2015, 10:08:16 AM
Quote from: Lyon Wonder on December 24, 2015, 01:33:08 AM
according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_State_Road_931 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_State_Road_931) INDOT's going to put US 31 on I-65 between the KY state line and I-465 in Indianapolis and renumber the parallel US 31 as IN-931 (which is also applied to former US 31 in Kokomo) and sounds similar to I-39 and IL-251 in Illinois.  If true, I guess this may or may not be a prelude to INDOT decommissioning some or all of the surface route that parallels I-65.

The only other US highways in IN that closely parallel non-toll interstates are US 40 close to I-70, US 52 close to I-65 from Lafayette to Lebanon and US 136 close to I-74 from the IL state line to Indianapolis.

I don't believe this, there's no proof, someone could have just typed that talking out of their ass.  Also, the truck driver is clearly a dumbass.  I love how the bridge says, no trucks clearly in front of it, and the truck empty would way more than the limit!

Wikipedia is usually pretty reliable, but there are some things on there that are just stupid and wrong. Someone not too long ago also said that SR 641 in Terre Haute was going to be renamed I-170 once complete, which is not true at all. I don't believe for one second that US 31 will be rerouted onto I-65 just to be renamed SR 931, especially with talks of maybe tolling the rural sections of I-65 across the state.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 26, 2015, 08:37:22 PM
if anything, they should rid themselves of US 136, but it still serves a good alternate.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 27, 2015, 10:18:52 AM
Quote from: Lyon Wonder on December 24, 2015, 01:33:08 AM
according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_State_Road_931 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_State_Road_931) INDOT's going to put US 31 on I-65 between the KY state line and I-465 in Indianapolis and renumber the parallel US 31 as IN-931 (which is also applied to former US 31 in Kokomo)

Unless the person who put that on Wikipedia has an inside connection at INDOT, there is no credibility to that.  Any plan of that sort would have received extensive media coverage all over Southern Indiana, and there has been none.

Also, re-routing a US highway requires AASHTO approval.  Additionally, it doesn't even make sense.

I posted this on INDOT Southeast's FB page.  I'll let you know what they say about it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 27, 2015, 11:08:05 PM
us 31 is a very major highway from 465 to the crossing with 65 in Columbus, after that, it's just a useful local road.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Lyon Wonder on December 28, 2015, 12:48:57 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 27, 2015, 11:08:05 PM
us 31 is a very major highway from 465 to the crossing with 65 in Columbus, after that, it's just a useful local road.

IMO, US 31 south of Columbus from IN-46 to Clarksville can become a southern extension of IN-9, though that's a discussion best mentioned in the fictional forum.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on December 28, 2015, 07:31:45 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 27, 2015, 10:18:52 AM
Quote from: Lyon Wonder on December 24, 2015, 01:33:08 AM
according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_State_Road_931 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_State_Road_931) INDOT's going to put US 31 on I-65 between the KY state line and I-465 in Indianapolis and renumber the parallel US 31 as IN-931 (which is also applied to former US 31 in Kokomo)

Unless the person who put that on Wikipedia has an inside connection at INDOT, there is no credibility to that.  Any plan of that sort would have received extensive media coverage all over Southern Indiana, and there has been none.

Also, re-routing a US highway requires AASHTO approval.  Additionally, it doesn't even make sense.

I posted this on INDOT Southeast's FB page.  I'll let you know what they say about it.

Although the possible re-routing of US 31 is news to me, it would make sense from two perspectives:
- Quite a few miles of the current US 31 route would be the type of highway INDOT would like to turn back to local jurisdictions. As a US highway route, that cannot be done.
- US 31 is a major route from Indy north to Ludington Michigan. Why not make all of US 31 in Indiana a divided highway by moving the route to I-65?

Personally, it makes no sense to me to keep these slow and narrow historic routings that make no sense today. Who would prefer to take US 31 from Louisville to Indy? Or US 136 from Danville, Illinois to Indy? US 31 really should be routed with I-65, IMO.

Quote from: silverback1065 on December 27, 2015, 11:08:05 PM
us 31 is a very major highway from 465 to the crossing with 65 in Columbus, after that, it's just a useful local road.

It is definitely a major road, but it is not a major intercity route. I would say from the Edinburgh outlet mall or Franklin up to I-465, US 31 is the type of road INDOT would like to rid itself of.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 28, 2015, 07:36:11 AM
Quote from: mukade on December 28, 2015, 07:31:45 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 27, 2015, 10:18:52 AM
Quote from: Lyon Wonder on December 24, 2015, 01:33:08 AM
according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_State_Road_931 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_State_Road_931) INDOT's going to put US 31 on I-65 between the KY state line and I-465 in Indianapolis and renumber the parallel US 31 as IN-931 (which is also applied to former US 31 in Kokomo)

Unless the person who put that on Wikipedia has an inside connection at INDOT, there is no credibility to that.  Any plan of that sort would have received extensive media coverage all over Southern Indiana, and there has been none.

Also, re-routing a US highway requires AASHTO approval.  Additionally, it doesn't even make sense.

I posted this on INDOT Southeast's FB page.  I'll let you know what they say about it.

Although the possible re-routing of US 31 is news to me, it would make sense from two perspectives:
- Quite a few miles of the current US 31 route would be the type of highway INDOT would like to turn back to local jurisdictions. As a US highway route, that cannot be done.
- US 31 is a major route from Indy north to Ludington Michigan. Why not make all of US 31 in Indiana a divided highway by moving the route to I-65?

Personally, it makes no sense to me to keep these slow and narrow historic routings that make no sense today. Who would prefer to take US 31 from Louisville to Indy? Or US 136 from Danville, Illinois to Indy? US 31 really should be routed with I-65, IMO.

Quote from: silverback1065 on December 27, 2015, 11:08:05 PM
us 31 is a very major highway from 465 to the crossing with 65 in Columbus, after that, it's just a useful local road.

It is definitely a major road, but it is not a major intercity route. I would say from the Edinburgh outlet mall or Franklin up to I-465, US 31 is the type of road INDOT would like to rid itself of.

I think you're right, but it would be sad to see 31 go if that's true, I feel like all the parallel highways to interstates need to be maintained.  They do still serve a purpose as an alternate, as we've seen with us 52.  I hope this isn't true, anyone with INDOT connections on here that could confirm if it IS true? Now I'm curious. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefro on December 28, 2015, 08:16:51 AM
US 31 is at least four lanes from Indianapolis all the way through Columbus and gets a good amount of traffic.

South of Columbus it's important to a lot of small towns along the route like Reddington, Crothersville, Uniontown, Austin, Scottsburg, and Memphis.  Obviously once you get to Sellersburg you get into the Louisville suburbs.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 28, 2015, 08:47:13 AM
INDOT doesn't just force roads back to local control.  It's generally negotiated with the cities/counties involved and usually involves a lump sum payment from INDOT to the jurisdiction to cover the added costs of maintaining the road. 

I don't see Johnson or Bartholomew counties, or any of the cities within, being interested in taking control of the road.  I could see a switch happening for some or all of the part south of US 50. 

Still no response to my FB post on the INDOT-SE page asking for verification.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 28, 2015, 08:52:05 AM
it's certainly an interesting drive from Columbus back to 465, it still gives off the vibe of the old ways people traveled between big cities before the interstate system. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on December 28, 2015, 09:28:01 AM
Rerouting US 31 onto I-65 or any other parallel US highway for that matter is the stupidest idea I have ever heard of. Why would anyone think rerouting US 31 onto I-65 is a good idea? If that's a good idea maybe we should just get rid of US highways altogether or just decommission US 31 from Indy to Mobile.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 28, 2015, 09:54:39 AM
speaking of US 31, the railroad tracks north of SR 28 will be bridged relatively soon. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on December 28, 2015, 09:55:42 AM
Quote from: thefro on December 28, 2015, 08:16:51 AM
US 31 is at least four lanes from Indianapolis all the way through Columbus and gets a good amount of traffic.

Yes, but remember INDOT is all about highways that serve intercity traffic. Keystone Parkway was and is a busy road, but it is now maintained by Carmel. South Street west of I-65 in Lafayette is another of many examples.

Also, why should there be two N-S state roads serving local traffic between I-65 and I-69?

Quote from: thefro on December 28, 2015, 08:16:51 AM
South of Columbus it's important to a lot of small towns along the route like Reddington, Crothersville, Uniontown, Austin, Scottsburg, and Memphis.  Obviously once you get to Sellersburg you get into the Louisville suburbs.

Again, going back to the unsubstantiated SR 931 rumor, INDOT would still serve all or most of these small cities. It would just not necessarily be US 31 or one continuous route. It is all speculation, but that would be the rationale.

Quote from: cabiness42 on December 28, 2015, 08:47:13 AM
INDOT doesn't just force roads back to local control.  It's generally negotiated with the cities/counties involved and usually involves a lump sum payment from INDOT to the jurisdiction to cover the added costs of maintaining the road. 

I agree that it is negotiated. Even if the US 31 road itself is in good shape (which I think much of it is - at least in Indy and Greenwood), INDOT entices cities with grants to improve other roads in addition to the lump sum. I would think that at least Columbus, Greenwood, and Franklin might be tempted with a deal like that. If you consider the number of turnbacks, local jurisdictions must see the value or they would not have happened. Kokomo took over SR 22 thru town for that sort of deal - I am not sure any of the funds will go toward improving the old SR 22 route itself.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 28, 2015, 09:58:23 AM
usually when INDOT slaps a 9 in front of a route, it usually means it's low priority, or they really really want to get rid of it, but the locals refuse.  INDOT really wants to rid themselves of SR 930 and Kokomo's 931.  And it sure seems like they hate 912 as well. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on December 28, 2015, 10:03:39 AM
The truck driver that tried to cross the iron bridge in Paoli was a woman (of course haha). Here's a link to a news story that was released this morning.

http://www.newsmax.com/TheWire/paoli-bridge-collapse/2015/12/28/id/707260/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Pete from Boston on December 28, 2015, 10:16:41 AM

Quote from: US 41 on December 28, 2015, 10:03:39 AM
The truck driver that tried to cross the iron bridge in Paoli was a woman (of course haha).

And comments on online articles are flooded with this same dumb joke.  It's nearly 2016, let's grow up a little. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on December 28, 2015, 10:21:41 AM
Quote from: US 41 on December 28, 2015, 09:28:01 AM
Rerouting US 31 onto I-65 or any other parallel US highway for that matter is the stupidest idea I have ever heard of. Why would anyone think rerouting US 31 onto I-65 is a good idea? If that's a good idea maybe we should just get rid of US highways altogether or just decommission US 31 from Indy to Mobile.

Why is it a good idea to have it designated US 31 when no one uses it for long distance travel? Let's say someone wnated to travel from Ludington, Michigan to Louisville, Kentucky and wanted to take US 31 the whole way. Would it be better if US 31 followed I-65 or remained stretches that are a congested commercial strips or are a slow, narrow, winding road? If the route number means anything, it should be with I-65.

In Indiana, there are many examples of Interstate and US highway overlaps:
- I-70 and US 40 in Terre Haute
- I-74 and US 421 from Greensburg to Indy
- I-65 and US 52
- I-80/94 and US 6 thru Lake County
- All the many I-465 concurrencies

So there is a lot of precedent even here. In Michigan, I-196 and US 31 are concurrent for 44 miles. I-39 and US 51 are concurrent in Illinois for around 117 miles. If US 31 ended in Indiana, it could be decommissioned in southern Indiana much like US 66, US 460 in southern Indiana, or US 16 in Michigan were. US 150 in Indiana is another fairly useless designation but it exists in bordering states so it stays.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 28, 2015, 10:24:00 AM
Quote from: mukade on December 28, 2015, 10:21:41 AM
Quote from: US 41 on December 28, 2015, 09:28:01 AM
Rerouting US 31 onto I-65 or any other parallel US highway for that matter is the stupidest idea I have ever heard of. Why would anyone think rerouting US 31 onto I-65 is a good idea? If that's a good idea maybe we should just get rid of US highways altogether or just decommission US 31 from Indy to Mobile.

Why is it a good idea to have it designated US 31 when no one uses it for long distance travel? Let's say someone wnated to travel from Ludington, Michigan to Louisville, Kentucky and wanted to take US 31 the whole way. Would it be better if US 31 followed I-65 or remained stretches that are a congested commercial strips or are a slow, narrow, winding road? If the route number means anything, it should be with I-65.

In Indiana, there are many examples of Interstate and US highway overlaps:
- I-70 and US 40 in Terre Haute
- I-74 and US 421 from Greensburg to Indy
- I-65 and US 52
- I-80/94 and US 6 thru Lake County
- All the many I-465 concurrencies

So there is a lot of precedent even here. In Michigan, I-196 and US 31 are concurrent for 44 miles. I-39 and US 51 are concurrent in Illinois for around 117 miles. If US 31 ended in Indiana, it could be decommissioned in southern Indiana much like US 66, US 460 in southern Indiana, or US 16 in Michigan were. US 150 in Indiana is another fairly useless designation but it exists in bordering states so it stays.

Is that why US 460 doesn't exist in Indiana anymore? i thought it went all the way to St. Louis at one time.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on December 28, 2015, 11:35:33 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 28, 2015, 09:54:39 AM
speaking of US 31, the railroad tracks north of SR 28 will be bridged relatively soon.
Awesome! Where did you hear that?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 28, 2015, 11:43:02 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on December 28, 2015, 11:35:33 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 28, 2015, 09:54:39 AM
speaking of US 31, the railroad tracks north of SR 28 will be bridged relatively soon.
Awesome! Where did you hear that?

Meeting at work today, my boss mentioned it, he didn't have specifics in terms of a completion date, but it's in the very early phases of design.  INDOT has just started the process of choosing the companies that will do the work. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on December 28, 2015, 11:51:10 AM
The overpass would be a welcome improvement. The Bakers Corner stoplight removal would hopefully also be in the plans.

Regarding the previous topic of US 31 being re-routed, in case you haven't read "History of the Interstate System in Indiana: Volume 1 - Chapters I-IV: Development of the National Program" by David Alan Ripple from 1975, you can get some good insights on how the Indiana Interstates came to be the way they were ultimately built. The URLs are:

History of the Interstate System in Indiana - Purdue e-Pubs - Volume 1 (http://docs.lib.purdue.edu/jtrp/768/)
History of the Interstate System in Indiana - Purdue e-Pubs - Volume 2 (http://docs.lib.purdue.edu/jtrp/1415/)
History of the Interstate System in Indiana - Purdue e-Pubs - Volume 3 part 2 (http://docs.lib.purdue.edu/jtrp/1417/)
History of the Interstate System in Indiana - Purdue e-Pubs - Volume 4 (http://docs.lib.purdue.edu/jtrp/769/)

The following quote is from volume 3:

Quote
Interstate Route 64
The Interstate 64 corridor parallels US 60 from Norfolk, Virginia, to Louisville, Kentucky; however, because the traditionally recognized major routing from Louisville to St. Louis was composed of US 150 from Louisville to Shoals and US 50 from Shoals to St. Louis, Interstate 64 was initially designated as paralleling the traditional routing. Due to the size of the Cincinnati Metropolitan Area, Interstate 64 could have been moved northward to cross the Ohio River near Cincinnati and to parallel US 50 to St. Louis; however, the introduction of Interstate 71 between Cincinnati and Louisville forced Interstate 64 farther south on US 60 through Lexington, Frankfort and Louisville.

Interstate 64 passes through sparsely populated areas of Illinois and Indiana and might not have been extended from Louisville to St. Louis in the Interstate inception stage of the early 1940's if Indiana had not promoted such an extension. From a national standpoint, the route probably could have terminated at Louisville with little opposition. In fact, Interstate 64 from Louisville to St. Louis was one of the few Interstates east of the Mississippi River that was originally designated for construction with only two lanes.

The State of Illinois for some years had planned to build a four-lane divided highway to replace inadequate US 50 from East St. Louis to Vincennes. The intervention of World War II delayed such reconstruction and the possibility of similar reconstruction in Indiana. Consequently, US 50-150, being a part of the strategic highway network, further deteriorated during the war. Before US 50-150 became a part of the Interstate System in 1947, Indiana had envisioned a new US 50 from Vincennes to Cincinnati. On the basis of US 50 development studies by Illinois and Indiana, plans for a toll bridge that was to link Mt. Vernon and New Haven were shifted to the north of Vincennes to serve new US 50. When legislation placed emphasis on the Interstates, the US 50 plans came to be utilized for the Interstate Route from Louisville to St. Louis. The improvement of US 50 all the way to Cincinnati was irrelevant to the Interstate Program. Thus, the normal sequence of upgrading US 50 in the Vincennes area became the construction of Interstate 64.

Construction contracts were let to four-lane US 50, Interstate 64, from Vincennes to Lawrenceville in 1956 and 1957. On April 7, 1958 Illinois and Indiana submitted an agreement to the Bureau of Public Roads covering the con- struction of the Interstate 64 bridge over the Wabash River north of Vincennes. The agreement was approved on June 12, 1958 and construction soon began on the bridge. The Wabash River bridge and the relocation of US 50 from Vincennes across the bridge to Lawrenceville was eventually completed and dedicated as a part of the Interstate System; however, these improvements ultimately became a part of the US 50 bypass of Vincennes rather than a part of the final location of Interstate 64.

Shifting Corridors
Because of the necessity to meet the Bureau of Public Roads deadline of January 1, 1957 for the submission of all general Interstate route alignments, the Indiana State Highway Commission submitted strip maps of US 50-150 from Vincennes to New Albany for the proposed alignment of Interstate 64. Plans had been developed to upgrade US 50 in the Vincennes area, and US 50-150 had been the general corridor for Interstate 64 since the 1940's.

To gain informal approval of the route by the Bureau of Public Roads, Indiana agreed as soon as possible after June 30, 1957 (the date of formal approval of all routes to be included in the Interstate System) to begin comparative studies with a more direct alignment between Vincennes and New Albany. The initial alignment studied was a straight line from New Albany to Vincennes which passed about ten miles south of Washington.

When local interests heard of the consideration of several alternatives (particularly more southern alternatives) in the development of a more detailed alignment, they began to develop information and to lobby in support of an alternative through their area. The local Chambers of Commerce and civic groups formed two major factions, one favoring the originally designated alignment through Vincennes, and the other favoring a southern alignment closer to Evansville.

In the spring of 1957, Evansville interest groups attempted to enlist the support of Southern Illinois Incorporated (an association of community development groups) to promote the shifting of Interstate 64 southward from US 50 in Illinois and US 150 in Indiana. At a meeting of Southern Indiana Incorporated (an association of community development groups which represented both Vincennes and Evansville) on October 30, 1957, Governor Handley of Indiana announced that Illinois and Indiana were considering the shift of Interstate 64 southward to serve a greater number of people. The supporters of the original alignment formed the St. Louis - Vincennes - Louisville Interstate Highway Committee on November 17, 1957, to promote their interests. On February 12, 1958, Governor Handley formally announced the moving of Interstate 64 to the southern alignment.

Original Location Proponents - The interests favoring the original alignment were slower to organize than those favoring the southern alignment. Because construction had already begun on Interstate 64 in the Vincennes area, the shifting of the route had not seemed possible. Nevertheless, the shifting of the route southward resulted in the formation of vocal interest groups bitterly opposed to the shift.

The arguments for the original location centered on the possibility of economic loss if the southern alignment was built. If the Interstate were shifted south, US 50-150 might not be developed as a four-lane divided highway from Vincennes to Louisville or Vincennes to Cincinnati. Because Interstate 64 on the southern alignment would divert through traffic from US 50-150, highway-oriented business on US 50-150 would lose patronage. The failure to improve US 50-150 would retard all development.

The original location proponents also contended that the southern route would not serve the best interests of a majority of the urban areas in Indiana, that industrial and commercial activities of Evansville were geared to a north-south axis not an east-west axis from St. Louis to Louisville, that Interstate 64 was not far enough south to adequately serve Evansville, and that the original location would better serve its population area than the southern route would serve its population area. Since traffic volumes were heavier on US 50 than US 460, the original alignment of Interstate 64 would better serve existing travel demands.

Although the Interstate System was to serve defense installations, the southern alignment of Interstate 64 would provide inadequate service to the Crane Naval Depot. The relocation of Interstate 64 to the south would delay completion of Interstate 64 and cost Indiana more money due to the greater length in Indiana. Cities on the northern route claimed to have adequate facilities to serve the traveling public (emergency facilities, resturants, motels, garages and gas stations), while the southern alignment lacked these facilities.

Southern Route Proponents - The primary contention of the southern alignment proponents was that Evansville would be one of the few metropolitan areas in- the United States excluded from the Interstate System. The May of 1958 report by the Evansville faction summarized their arguments as follows:
"The communities and related counties in southern Indiana and southern Illinois believe that the more southerly relocation, as close to the Ohio River as is consistent with sound engineering and reasonable cost, will more properly integrate this east-west road into the National System of Interstate Highways, will better serve the requirement of our country's defense in case of a national emergency, and will, at the same time, allow for a vastly improved service to the, present and potential economies in both areas".

The southern route proponents felt Interstate 64 should be relocated to the south to serve the greater population, the greater present and potential manufacturing production and capability, the greater present and potential manufacturing work force, the greater present and potential agricultural production and capability, the greater present and potential production of prime natural resources, the greater existing State road mileage, the greater vehicle registration, and the greater wholesale trade of the counties within twenty miles of the southern location as compared to the same for the northern location.

Evansville had been an area of chronic labor surplus for many years. The east-west route near the Ohio River was essential to continued manufacturing growth along the Ohio River. At the time, there was still a possibility that Interstate 24 from Nashville to St. Louis might come through Evansville; in such a case, the southern location of Interstate 64 would make Interstate 24 shorter. Although Interstate 64 through Vincennes was closer to the Crane Naval Depot, it would not serve the defense related industries in the Evansville area. One fact of major importance was that the southern location of Interstate 64 would not replace an existing major east-west route; whereas, the northern location would replace an existing primary east-west route resulting in duplication.

Comparison of Route Alternatives - In 1957, Indiana and Illinois began to develop more detailed locations for Interstate 64. Due to the proximity of Interstate 64 to Interstate 70, Illinois proceeded to study a more southerly corridor on a more direct line from St. Louis to Louisville which crossed the Indiana- Illinois State Line between Mt. Carmel and New Harmony. Indiana followed suit and eventually made made an economic comparison of the original alignment from New Albany to Vincennes (north line) with the alternate alignment from New Albany to Grayville (south line). The economic comparison of the north and south line revealed that the south line was preferable on all points of comparison within Indiana.

Population Density. Referring to Figure 73 t p. 603, the study area for each line was a forty- mile corridor with the common area excluded. No portion of Illinois or the Louisville Metropolitan Area was included; however, parts of Kentucky that fell in the corridor were included. The population densities were 56 persons per square-mile for the area served only by the north line, 36 persons per square-mile for the......  (starting at page 501)

Quote
Interstate Route 65
The Interstate 65 corridor as initially designated followed US 31 from Louisville to Indianapolis, US 52 from Indianapolis to Kentland, and US 41 from Kentland to the Chicago Metropolitan Area.  (page 529)

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Lyon Wonder on December 28, 2015, 10:51:08 PM
IMO, if I-64 was built on it's originally proposed alignment along US 50 in IL and IN, I think US 460 in IL would have been eventually upgraded to a 4-lane expressway from East St Louis to Mt Vernon and I-69's alignment in IN from US 50 south toward Evansville could have been built earlier as part of I-164, though I also think US 41 from Vincennes south to Evansville might have been chosen to become I-164 had I-64 followed US 50.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on December 28, 2015, 11:10:26 PM
Quote from: Lyon Wonder on December 28, 2015, 10:51:08 PM
IMO, if I-64 was built on it's originally proposed alignment along US 50 in IL and IN, I think US 460 in IL would have been eventually upgraded to a 4-lane expressway from East St Louis to Mt Vernon and I-69's alignment in IN from US 50 at Washington south toward Evansville could have been built earlier as part of I-164, though US 41 from Vincennessouth to Evansville might have been chosen to become I-164 had I-64 followed US 50.

INDOT wanted an I-63 from Brazil to Evansville in 1968 according to the AARoads Indiana I-70 information page.

Quote: In 1968, INDOT unsuccessfully lobbied for an Interstate 63 corridor leading south from the Brazil area to Evansville to provide a route between Indianapolis and southwest Indiana. Construction of Interstate 164 was a result of that original proposal.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Lyon Wonder on December 28, 2015, 11:24:07 PM
Quote from: US 41 on December 28, 2015, 11:10:26 PM
Quote from: Lyon Wonder on December 28, 2015, 10:51:08 PM
IMO, if I-64 was built on it's originally proposed alignment along US 50 in IL and IN, I think US 460 in IL would have been eventually upgraded to a 4-lane expressway from East St Louis to Mt Vernon and I-69's alignment in IN from US 50 at Washington south toward Evansville could have been built earlier as part of I-164, though US 41 from Vincennessouth to Evansville might have been chosen to become I-164 had I-64 followed US 50.

INDOT wanted an I-63 from Brazil to Evansville in 1968 according to the AARoads Indiana I-70 information page.

Quote: In 1968, INDOT unsuccessfully lobbied for an Interstate 63 corridor leading south from the Brazil area to Evansville to provide a route between Indianapolis and southwest Indiana. Construction of Interstate 164 was a result of that original proposal.


Had I-63 been built between Evansville and I-70, I-69's current alignment south of Indy would have probably never been built and I-63 would be incorporated into I-69 via I-70.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 29, 2015, 09:52:00 AM
INDOT Press Release:

State to Invest $50 Million to Improve I-465/I-69 Interchange on Indy's Northeast Side
INDOT Requesting Proposals to Reconfigure Heavily Traveled Interchange to Ease Congestion
INDIANAPOLIS — Governor Mike Pence announced today that the State will invest an estimated $50 million to reconfigure the busy I-465/I-69 interchange on the northeast side of Indianapolis. The project will ease congestion, improve safety, and reduce travel time in the heavily traveled corridor used by more than 165,000 drivers each day.
"Significant growth in Noblesville, Fishers and the northeast side of Indianapolis has created the need to update our highway infrastructure in the area,"  Governor Mike Pence said. "Building this interchange will increase capacity and improve traffic flow. This project, along with recent and planned projects to widen I-69, a scheduled interchange at 106th Street, and the modernization of State Road 37 in Fishers, will dramatically improve the ability of people and commerce to move efficiently in Central Indiana."
The project will include:
-   Building a high-speed, two-lane ramp for traffic exiting I-465 eastbound onto I-69 northbound. The new ramp would bridge over Binford Boulevard and I-465, while the existing low-speed loop ramp would remain for I-465 eastbound traffic exiting I-69 onto 82nd Street in Castleton.
-   Widening I-465 to four travel lanes in each direction between the White River bridge and I-69. In addition, two ramp lanes in each direction would run continuously between the I-69, Allisonville Road and Keystone Avenue interchanges for traffic entering and exiting the interstate.     
The Indiana Department of Transportation this week will publish a formal request for proposals seeking engineering companies interested in designing the project. INDOT expects to begin preliminary design of the project in 2016 with construction anticipated to begin in 2020.
The request for proposals asks consultants to design additional improvements should more funding become available in the future. For more information about INDOT's work to modernize Indiana's transportation infrastructure, visit www.in.gov/indot.
Stay informed
Motorists can learn about highway work zones and other traffic alerts at indot.carsprogram.org, 1-800-261-ROAD (7623) or 511 from a mobile phone.
Subscribe to receive text and email alerts about INDOT projects at https://public.govdelivery.com/accounts/INDOT/subscriber/new.
Follow @INDOT_ECentral on Twitter at https://twitter.com/INDOT_ECentral and on Facebook at https://www.facebook.com/INDOTEastCentral.


great news for one of the worst interchanges in the indy area!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 29, 2015, 09:58:35 AM
here's a picture of the proposed interchange: (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi66.tinypic.com%2F24drj3n.jpg&hash=f54da52bddd18818e4810bd1443a1970ba45b5c5)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on December 29, 2015, 04:50:22 PM
I was just going to post this. It's about damn time! This is desperately needed. There's a bottleneck on 465 after Allisonville where it goes down to 3 lanes and it backs up past Keystone every rush hour. Having at least 4 continuous lanes from 31 all the way through to 70 should clear this up nicely. That EB to NB loop ramp is a joke. It's not made for the capacity and the merging is dangerous.  Too bad we have to wait till 2020

Nexus 7

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Alex on December 30, 2015, 11:37:38 AM
Quote from: mukade on December 28, 2015, 11:51:10 AM
The overpass would be a welcome improvement. The Bakers Corner stoplight removal would hopefully also be in the plans.

Regarding the previous topic of US 31 being re-routed, in case you haven't read "History of the Interstate System in Indiana: Volume 1 - Chapters I-IV: Development of the National Program" by David Alan Ripple from 1975, you can get some good insights on how the Indiana Interstates came to be the way they were ultimately built. The URLs are:

History of the Interstate System in Indiana - Purdue e-Pubs - Volume 1 (http://docs.lib.purdue.edu/jtrp/768/)
History of the Interstate System in Indiana - Purdue e-Pubs - Volume 2 (http://docs.lib.purdue.edu/jtrp/1415/)
History of the Interstate System in Indiana - Purdue e-Pubs - Volume 3 part 2 (http://docs.lib.purdue.edu/jtrp/1417/)
History of the Interstate System in Indiana - Purdue e-Pubs - Volume 4 (http://docs.lib.purdue.edu/jtrp/769/)


This was a fantastic resource, thanks for both finding it and sharing it here. I read through the section on the northern versus southern alignments of Interstate 64, and updated the Interstate-Guide article on the route (http://www.interstate-guide.com/i-064.html) accordingly.

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcdn-3.interstate-guide.com%2Fmaps%2Fillinois_south_1960_480.jpg&hash=9756b42f64a61f9a8f5b7a2494ed7430c930f72d)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on December 30, 2015, 01:53:23 PM
I wish I-64 would have went through Vincennes, because it would be a great route to Louisville from Terre Haute. I also think an I-64 paralleling US 50 and 150 would have been better for the state of Indiana. Regionally I think I-64 current route was the best route, but as far as Indiana is concerned I think it would have served more people in Indiana if it would have went through Vincennes. I may be wrong however.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Lyon Wonder on December 30, 2015, 07:27:15 PM
Quote from: US 41 on December 30, 2015, 01:53:23 PM
I wish I-64 would have went through Vincennes, because it would be a great route to Louisville from Terre Haute. I also think an I-64 paralleling US 50 and 150 would have been better for the state of Indiana. Regionally I think I-64 current route was the best route, but as far as Indiana is concerned I think it would have served more people in Indiana if it would have went through Vincennes. I may be wrong however.

IMO, I-164 would have been located along or near US 41 from Evansville to Vincennes, which would have likely become part of I-69 too, especially since opponents of the existing I-69 corridor were proposing an alternative via US 41 and I-70, which I think would have been chosen for I-69 if I-164 (or even I-63) was already built along the US 41 corridor.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 30, 2015, 07:34:09 PM
Quote from: Lyon Wonder on December 30, 2015, 07:27:15 PM
Quote from: US 41 on December 30, 2015, 01:53:23 PM
I wish I-64 would have went through Vincennes, because it would be a great route to Louisville from Terre Haute. I also think an I-64 paralleling US 50 and 150 would have been better for the state of Indiana. Regionally I think I-64 current route was the best route, but as far as Indiana is concerned I think it would have served more people in Indiana if it would have went through Vincennes. I may be wrong however.

IMO, I-164 would have been located along or near US 41 from Evansville to Vincennes, which would have likely become part of I-69 too, especially since opponents of the existing I-69 corridor were proposing an alternative via US 41 and I-70, which I think would have been chosen for I-69 if I-164 (or even I-63) was already built along the US 41 corridor.
It probably wouldn't have been very hard to turn 41 through town into an interstate either.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 15, 2016, 08:35:26 AM
SR 252 will be decommissioned between i-65 and SR 9 in about 2 yrs, after a major reconstruction project. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 20, 2016, 08:14:31 AM
The project I mentioned about 31 actually will include a bridge over the RR tracks at 100 S and Division Road will bridge over 31, so pretty soon 2 lights and a RR Xing will be gone in tipton county, sure looks like the kokomo to westfield gap will be filled 1st.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on January 20, 2016, 09:30:23 AM
US 41 and SR 163 in Lyford is all messed up now. The speed limit on 163 was 55 and the speed limit on 41 was 40 through Lyford. Now it is 30 on both 41 and 163, which is ridiculously slow. There was a semi that tipped over and killed a girl there and a bunch of people protested and said INDOT should do something about the intersection. Well they did something. They created a huge speed trap. It might be better to reconfigure the Y into a 3 way stop.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on January 20, 2016, 08:51:39 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 30, 2015, 07:34:09 PM
It probably wouldn't have been very hard to turn 41 through town into an interstate either.

Upgrading US 41 into I-164 was looked at in the EIS stage, but IIRC it was dropped fairly early.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 03, 2016, 02:08:57 AM
Work is set to begin on major rehabilitation of the Indiana Toll Road. Starting in March, crews will be doing significant improvements on the stretch between Portage and Elkhart. Work includes mainline paving, interchange paving, bridge refurbishments, increased shoulder safety standards, some widening, and even VMS installation. Service plazas will be worked on too, with demolition and rebuilding scheduled from April to August for the Portage and Elkhart plazas, expansion of the Howe plaza, and the complete removal of the easternmost plaza in Steuben County.

This $200 million project is set to last through this year and 2017, and is funded entirely by the lessees of the Toll Road.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: codyg1985 on February 03, 2016, 10:24:43 AM
It's about time. It looked to be in rough shape the last time I was on it this past August.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on February 03, 2016, 12:34:48 PM
Here's the South Bend Tribune article on the project: http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/business/indiana-toll-road-targeted-for-m-in-improvements/article_4ca0677c-c9e7-11e5-913e-7bf3dcd4789d.html (http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/business/indiana-toll-road-targeted-for-m-in-improvements/article_4ca0677c-c9e7-11e5-913e-7bf3dcd4789d.html)

QuoteKen Daley, the CEO of ITR Concession Co., said the project, named 80/90 PUSH, is "almost a complete rebuild" of the 73-mile section of highway. The acronym PUSH stands for Pavement Upgrade for a Superior Highway.

"What's happened previously is what we call a mill-and-fill – that's scraping off the top couple of inches (of pavement) and then putting it back again," Daley said.

With this project, he said, "We're going back down to the structure of the actual road, cracking the concrete that's below and putting in a new bonding layer over the top. Rather than get three to five or perhaps seven years of life out of the pavement, we'll be getting 12 to 14 years of life out of the new pavement. It'll be much smoother and less prone to cracking."
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: coatimundi on February 03, 2016, 01:19:51 PM
Quote from: Lyon Wonder on December 30, 2015, 07:27:15 PM
Quote from: US 41 on December 30, 2015, 01:53:23 PM
I wish I-64 would have went through Vincennes, because it would be a great route to Louisville from Terre Haute. I also think an I-64 paralleling US 50 and 150 would have been better for the state of Indiana. Regionally I think I-64 current route was the best route, but as far as Indiana is concerned I think it would have served more people in Indiana if it would have went through Vincennes. I may be wrong however.

IMO, I-164 would have been located along or near US 41 from Evansville to Vincennes, which would have likely become part of I-69 too, especially since opponents of the existing I-69 corridor were proposing an alternative via US 41 and I-70, which I think would have been chosen for I-69 if I-164 (or even I-63) was already built along the US 41 corridor.

While living in Bloomington, I would almost always use US 50 to go to St. Louis. It was often faster than SR 46 to I-70, especially after I-69 was built up to US 231. I haven't read through the history of Indiana interstates yet (but that's an awesome document, and that's what I'll be reading today), but I would assume I-64 was routed to the south because Evansville has always been the regional center for Kentuckiana yet geography prevented it from crossing the Wabash closer to Evansville. Same reason I-69 was brought through Evansville instead of following US 231 over that nice, new bridge over the Ohio.
What map is that that shows I-64 routed through Vincennes and along 50?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on February 04, 2016, 02:09:47 PM
A portion of SR-933 in South Bend will be turned over to the city, in an agreement with INDOT. The city will get $4.43 million in the deal. The city wanted control of the paired one-way streets, Main and Michigan/St. Joseph, so it can transform the streets to two-way throughout downtown. This will presumably leave SR-933 in two sections, from Marion Street north to the Michigan state line and Michigan Street east to the Elkhart County line. The city of Mishawaka has been reported previously to be negotiating to take over its rather lengthy portion of the route. The town of Osceola has no interest in taking its portion.

I've been predicting disaster for South Bend's plan to convert the streets. It will reduce two busy four lane streets into a pair of two lane streets.

http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/state-to-transfer-to-south-bend-pay-city-million/article_22f5f31e-cb64-11e5-95ed-a3565a327f22.html (http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/state-to-transfer-to-south-bend-pay-city-million/article_22f5f31e-cb64-11e5-95ed-a3565a327f22.html)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 04, 2016, 02:13:56 PM
Quote from: theline on February 04, 2016, 02:09:47 PM
A portion of SR-933 in South Bend will be turned over to the city, in an agreement with INDOT. The city will get $4.43 million in the deal. The city wanted control of the paired one-way streets, Main and Michigan/St. Joseph, so it can transform the streets to two-way throughout downtown. This will presumably leave SR-933 in two sections, from Marion Street north to the Michigan state line and Michigan Street east to the Elkhart County line. The city of Mishawaka has been reported previously to be negotiating to take over its rather lengthy portion of the route. The town of Osceola has no interest in taking its portion.

I've been predicting disaster for South Bend's plan to convert the streets. It will reduce two busy four lane streets into a pair of two lane streets.

http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/state-to-transfer-to-south-bend-pay-city-million/article_22f5f31e-cb64-11e5-95ed-a3565a327f22.html (http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/state-to-transfer-to-south-bend-pay-city-million/article_22f5f31e-cb64-11e5-95ed-a3565a327f22.html)

INDOT has been desperate to rid themselves of 933 for years, it's going to be weird seeing 2 sections though.  Maybe they'll do something like Delaware st in downtown indy, 3 lanes in the direction it always did when it was one way, and 1 lane in the opposite direction. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: seicer on February 04, 2016, 02:37:03 PM
Disaster? That's what they said for Huntington, W.Va. when they converted a four-lane one-way street to one-lane in each direction with on-street parking and a turning lane. Traffic will funnel onto other side streets to complete their trip - and those trips in downtown and urban areas should be slower, not faster.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on February 04, 2016, 04:31:50 PM
The Tribune's story on this seemed to indicate that Main Street was going to remain under INDOT control and I thought they were going to make that two-way as well. Could 933 simply be rerouted to Main Street from Sample Road north to Marion Street to maintain a single routing? Or was there something there I missed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on February 04, 2016, 05:20:56 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 04, 2016, 04:31:50 PM
The Tribune's story on this seemed to indicate that Main Street was going to remain under INDOT control and I thought they were going to make that two-way as well. Could 933 simply be rerouted to Main Street from Sample Road north to Marion Street to maintain a single routing? Or was there something there I missed.

You're right, tdindy88. The story was updated about 2 hours ago with the additional information about Main Street still being part of 933. The plan all along has been for both Main and Michigan/St. Joseph to be converted to angle parking, with one through lane in each direction, plus a center turn lane. I presume that this will still be done to Main, though we will have to see if the agreement with INDOT revised that plan at all. If Main remains a part of 933, then the route will remain continuous through downtown South Bend, though with far less capacity. It seems asinine to have 933 four lanes outside downtown and then shrink it to two through lanes downtown.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 04, 2016, 06:32:03 PM
i would think 933 will still be continuous and signed.  i wonder if they will still sign it as one of indiana's few business routes.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on February 05, 2016, 08:04:17 AM
The routing of 933 already doesn't make sense, now it will make less.  If you're heading west on 933 from Mishawaka, want to get downtown, and know the area, you stay on Linconway/Monroe to Michigan instead of exiting onto Sample.  Now, the NB routing is going to take you a block farther west than you need to go to Main.

Oh, and what are they going to do with the Main/Michigan/Marion intersection?  It's designed for a one-way pair, not for two two-way streets?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on February 05, 2016, 12:12:21 PM
Several roundabouts are in the works for this project. I think one of them will replace the Main-Michigan-Marion intersection. It now appears that 933 will remain continuous, though rerouted, through downtown, but leaving just bits and pieces of signed highways with random ends is nothing new to INDOT:
Do I need to go on?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 05, 2016, 12:16:25 PM
Quote from: theline on February 05, 2016, 12:12:21 PM
Several roundabouts are in the works for this project. I think one of them will replace the Main-Michigan-Marion intersection. It now appears that 933 will remain continuous, though rerouted, through downtown, but leaving just bits and pieces of signed highways with random ends is nothing new to INDOT:

  • The Marshall County-St. Joseph County portion of SR-931 has it's northern terminus at the South Bend city limit. Some time I'll drive down there and get a pic of the END sign.
  • The southern (eastern) terminus of SR-933 is at the Elkhart County line.
  • SR-332 has its east end at a random street in Muncie, though the road it is on (McGalliard) continues on as a major road through Muncie.
  • Then there's the awkward disappearance of SR-25 in Lafayette.
Do I need to go on?

I'll add one more the completely useless SR 662, also I thought SR 931 was handed over to the counties it went through up there last year, did the deal fall through?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on February 05, 2016, 12:33:14 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 05, 2016, 12:16:25 PM
Quote from: theline on February 05, 2016, 12:12:21 PM
Several roundabouts are in the works for this project. I think one of them will replace the Main-Michigan-Marion intersection. It now appears that 933 will remain continuous, though rerouted, through downtown, but leaving just bits and pieces of signed highways with random ends is nothing new to INDOT:

  • The Marshall County-St. Joseph County portion of SR-931 has it's northern terminus at the South Bend city limit. Some time I'll drive down there and get a pic of the END sign.
  • The southern (eastern) terminus of SR-933 is at the Elkhart County line.
  • SR-332 has its east end at a random street in Muncie, though the road it is on (McGalliard) continues on as a major road through Muncie.
  • Then there's the awkward disappearance of SR-25 in Lafayette.
Do I need to go on?

I'll add one more the completely useless SR 662, also I thought SR 931 was handed over to the counties it went through up there last year, did the deal fall through?

IMO counties have no business taking care of 4 lane highways. I hope it remains SR 931 for a very long time.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 05, 2016, 12:44:52 PM
Ya I agree, like sagamore and binford Blvd

Nexus 6P

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: rawmustard on February 05, 2016, 12:58:58 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 05, 2016, 12:16:25 PM
...also I thought SR 931 was handed over to the counties it went through up there last year, did the deal fall through?

As far as I know it begins at the Marshall-St Joseph line and, as mentioned above, ends at the South Bend city limit. There was only one set of reassurance markers at SR 4.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on February 05, 2016, 01:04:47 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 05, 2016, 12:44:52 PM
Ya I agree, like sagamore and binford Blvd

Nexus 6P

And now the former US 52 in Lafayette and pretty soon US 40 west of West Terre Haute. Just wait until these roads need redone. County roads in Indiana are already pretty bad for the most part, does the state really think that these counties can handle 4 lane highways. The only reason the counties and towns across Indiana are doing it is because they are getting immediate money, and by the time this problem (the roads needing fixed) comes around the current people in office will be long gone and it won't be their problem.

If I remember right, the mayor of Terre Haute (Duke Bennett) vetoed the city council's vote of maintaining US 40 through Terre Haute, but then the city council overrided his veto.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 05, 2016, 01:09:43 PM
Indot did the same with sr 22, gave kokomo barely enough money to mill and resurface the road.

Nexus 6P
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on February 06, 2016, 08:18:11 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 05, 2016, 12:16:25 PM
Quote from: theline on February 05, 2016, 12:12:21 PM
Several roundabouts are in the works for this project. I think one of them will replace the Main-Michigan-Marion intersection. It now appears that 933 will remain continuous, though rerouted, through downtown, but leaving just bits and pieces of signed highways with random ends is nothing new to INDOT:

  • The Marshall County-St. Joseph County portion of SR-931 has it's northern terminus at the South Bend city limit. Some time I'll drive down there and get a pic of the END sign.
  • The southern (eastern) terminus of SR-933 is at the Elkhart County line.
  • SR-332 has its east end at a random street in Muncie, though the road it is on (McGalliard) continues on as a major road through Muncie.
  • Then there's the awkward disappearance of SR-25 in Lafayette.
Do I need to go on?

I'll add one more the completely useless SR 662, also I thought SR 931 was handed over to the counties it went through up there last year, did the deal fall through?

Marshall County agreed to take control of their portion of Old US 31, but St Joseph County did not want to so that part is SR 931.  I thought it read that it was going to be unsigned, but maybe they decided to sign it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on February 06, 2016, 08:51:22 AM
St. Joseph County is smart then. Also what's up with SR 4? Is INDOT really that pathetic not to extend it east to the new US 31?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on February 06, 2016, 08:53:23 AM
I believe it is extended east to the new US 31. The highway sign at the exit there does say SR 4, not TO SR 4.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on February 06, 2016, 09:12:15 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 06, 2016, 08:53:23 AM
I believe it is extended east to the new US 31. The highway sign at the exit there does say SR 4, not TO SR 4.

You're probably right. On Google Maps it shows SR 4 ending at SR 931 (Old 31).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on February 06, 2016, 11:02:13 AM
Quote from: US 41 on February 06, 2016, 09:12:15 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 06, 2016, 08:53:23 AM
I believe it is extended east to the new US 31. The highway sign at the exit there does say SR 4, not TO SR 4.

You're probably right. On Google Maps it shows SR 4 ending at SR 931 (Old 31).

SR 4 was extended to the new US 31 before the freeway opened. I think that actually happened in 2012 or 2013. The freeway opened in 2014. That extension required a rebuild of the road. It had been a narrow county road before.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on February 06, 2016, 11:04:09 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 05, 2016, 01:09:43 PM
Indot did the same with sr 22, gave kokomo barely enough money to mill and resurface the road.

Nexus 6P


But they also gave the access to additional Federal grant money. If i remember right, it was around $5M which could be used anywhere in the city.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on February 07, 2016, 03:50:21 PM
Quote from: US 41 on February 06, 2016, 09:12:15 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 06, 2016, 08:53:23 AM
I believe it is extended east to the new US 31. The highway sign at the exit there does say SR 4, not TO SR 4.

You're probably right. On Google Maps it shows SR 4 ending at SR 931 (Old 31).

I've extended SR 4 on Google Maps over to the new US 31.   May take a day for the changes to show up.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on February 07, 2016, 06:46:43 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on February 07, 2016, 03:50:21 PM
Quote from: US 41 on February 06, 2016, 09:12:15 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 06, 2016, 08:53:23 AM
I believe it is extended east to the new US 31. The highway sign at the exit there does say SR 4, not TO SR 4.

You're probably right. On Google Maps it shows SR 4 ending at SR 931 (Old 31).

I've extended SR 4 on Google Maps over to the new US 31.   May take a day for the changes to show up.

Off topic a little, but do you need an account to update Google Maps?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on February 07, 2016, 09:27:32 PM
Looks like the Smart Streets project will push me to try some different approaches to and from Notre Dame on football Saturdays. 

I often end up weaving my way over to Miami Street after the game to avoid the traffic through downtown, but I've always gone straight up Michigan before the game.    The first few gamedays with new two way traffic should be a total cluster.  I'm guessing the gains I've made in reducing travel time with the upgrades to 31 are going to be given back inside South Bend.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on February 07, 2016, 09:33:05 PM
Quote from: US 41 on February 07, 2016, 06:46:43 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on February 07, 2016, 03:50:21 PM
Quote from: US 41 on February 06, 2016, 09:12:15 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 06, 2016, 08:53:23 AM
I believe it is extended east to the new US 31. The highway sign at the exit there does say SR 4, not TO SR 4.

You're probably right. On Google Maps it shows SR 4 ending at SR 931 (Old 31).

I've extended SR 4 on Google Maps over to the new US 31.   May take a day for the changes to show up.

Off topic a little, but do you need an account to update Google Maps?

Go to http://www.google.com/mapmaker and signin with your google account.  Read the help topics to learn the basics before making edits.  Your edits will need approval to be published.   Over time as you demonstrate a history of good edits your trust level will grow and you can make more changes without waiting on approvals.  Most edits are reviewed by Regional Leads which are other users with a history of good edits that have been chosen by Google to work as moderators.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on February 08, 2016, 09:40:14 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on February 07, 2016, 09:27:32 PM
Looks like the Smart Streets project will push me to try some different approaches to and from Notre Dame on football Saturdays. 

I often end up weaving my way over to Miami Street after the game to avoid the traffic through downtown, but I've always gone straight up Michigan before the game.    The first few gamedays with new two way traffic should be a total cluster.  I'm guessing the gains I've made in reducing travel time with the upgrades to 31 are going to be given back inside South Bend.

Even before the changes, best way to beat Gameday traffic is to turn right off Michigan at Ireland.  Take Ireland to Miami and turn left.  Take Miami to Ridgeland and turn right, and then an immediate left onto Twyckenham.  Twyckenham is always the least crowded N-S street that gets you close to campus. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on February 08, 2016, 01:58:02 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on February 08, 2016, 09:40:14 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on February 07, 2016, 09:27:32 PM
Looks like the Smart Streets project will push me to try some different approaches to and from Notre Dame on football Saturdays. 

I often end up weaving my way over to Miami Street after the game to avoid the traffic through downtown, but I've always gone straight up Michigan before the game.    The first few gamedays with new two way traffic should be a total cluster.  I'm guessing the gains I've made in reducing travel time with the upgrades to 31 are going to be given back inside South Bend.

Even before the changes, best way to beat Gameday traffic is to turn right off Michigan at Ireland.  Take Ireland to Miami and turn left.  Take Miami to Ridgeland Ridgedale and turn right, and then an immediate left onto Twyckenham.  Twyckenham is always the least crowded N-S street that gets you close to campus.
FIFY. As a South Bend resident. I agree that that's a good route. Just don't speed through the neighborhood, please.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on February 08, 2016, 03:28:09 PM
Quote from: theline on February 08, 2016, 01:58:02 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on February 08, 2016, 09:40:14 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on February 07, 2016, 09:27:32 PM
Looks like the Smart Streets project will push me to try some different approaches to and from Notre Dame on football Saturdays. 

I often end up weaving my way over to Miami Street after the game to avoid the traffic through downtown, but I've always gone straight up Michigan before the game.    The first few gamedays with new two way traffic should be a total cluster.  I'm guessing the gains I've made in reducing travel time with the upgrades to 31 are going to be given back inside South Bend.

Even before the changes, best way to beat Gameday traffic is to turn right off Michigan at Ireland.  Take Ireland to Miami and turn left.  Take Miami to Ridgeland Ridgedale and turn right, and then an immediate left onto Twyckenham.  Twyckenham is always the least crowded N-S street that gets you close to campus.
FIFY. As a South Bend resident. I agree that that's a good route. Just don't speed through the neighborhood, please.

I'm usually early enough before the games and parking in the neighborhood south of campus, that going up Michigan has not been an issue.

My departure route this last year became working my way down to Northside, across the Eddy Street bridge and over to Miami.  Your suggested route has given me another departure option.  I will need to check that out in a few weeks when I am back on campus.

I know they convert several streets near campus to one way on gamedays.  I suppose they could do something similar downtown, but that would take some significant police manpower to accomplish.  It will be interesting to see what guidance South Bend PD and Notre Dame provide prior to the first game.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on February 08, 2016, 04:10:52 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on February 08, 2016, 03:28:09 PM
Quote from: theline on February 08, 2016, 01:58:02 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on February 08, 2016, 09:40:14 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on February 07, 2016, 09:27:32 PM
Looks like the Smart Streets project will push me to try some different approaches to and from Notre Dame on football Saturdays. 

I often end up weaving my way over to Miami Street after the game to avoid the traffic through downtown, but I've always gone straight up Michigan before the game.    The first few gamedays with new two way traffic should be a total cluster.  I'm guessing the gains I've made in reducing travel time with the upgrades to 31 are going to be given back inside South Bend.

Even before the changes, best way to beat Gameday traffic is to turn right off Michigan at Ireland.  Take Ireland to Miami and turn left.  Take Miami to Ridgeland Ridgedale and turn right, and then an immediate left onto Twyckenham.  Twyckenham is always the least crowded N-S street that gets you close to campus.
FIFY. As a South Bend resident. I agree that that's a good route. Just don't speed through the neighborhood, please.

I'm usually early enough before the games and parking in the neighborhood south of campus, that going up Michigan has not been an issue.

My departure route this last year became working my way down to Northside, across the Eddy Street bridge and over to Miami.  Your suggested route has given me another departure option.  I will need to check that out in a few weeks when I am back on campus.

I know they convert several streets near campus to one way on gamedays.  I suppose they could do something similar downtown, but that would take some significant police manpower to accomplish.  It will be interesting to see what guidance South Bend PD and Notre Dame provide prior to the first game.


Ha, yeah I used to live near a Ridgleand Ave in another city so that's why I got that mixed up.

Northside is excellent for getting yourself from one side of Eddy St to the other.  If I'm ever parked west of Eddy, I'll work my way down to Northside and then over to Twyckenham (though Northside passes under Twyckenham so you have to cut over through a neighborhood.

I've never, ever run into traffic problems going that way to leave the stadium. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on February 14, 2016, 03:16:30 AM
I was looking up signage plans for the new interchange at I-69 and 106th Street (Exit 204) and was in for a surprise. In addition to the typical signs for the future exit it appears that traffic getting off for Exit 205 (116th St and SR 37) will exit off right at 106th Street with a solid white line separating traffic from the exit lanes and mainline I-69, a white line that I'm sure no one will ever cross. Traffic heading north off of 106th Street with an intent of heading up to I-69 north will be directed onto the current C/D setup with Exit 205, returning to I-69 at the gore point for SR 37 north and I-69 north of 116th Street. I hope that makes sense.

Back to the signs, the contract includes adding new interchange sequence signs to be installed on butterfly-style supports in the median of the highway from just north of 82nd Street up past Exit 210 (old SR 238.) Signs like these are around in parts of Indiana but this is the first time I've seen them added like this. Below is an example of such signage along with one of the Exit 204 signs:

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1030.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy361%2Fthomasj88%2F69north_zpssmhypy2q.jpg&hash=a81cdb64009cbb7a351b392ed63393e5fd4f5b8c) (http://s1030.photobucket.com/user/thomasj88/media/69north_zpssmhypy2q.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 16, 2016, 10:37:50 AM
A map of the upcoming I-65 Lane Expansion was recently made available on INDOT's website, and gives more details about what's to happen.

The lane addition from U.S. 30 to U.S. 231 will be performed on the outer shoulders, and will move to the inner shoulders for the remainder of the stretch.

Speaking of which, the map reveals that the work zone has been stretched to Indiana 10, tying into recent bridge work performed just south of the Kankakee River last year.

Four construction companies are competing for the contract, and work is on schedule to begin next year.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: adt1982 on February 23, 2016, 03:48:07 PM
What's that?  Another bridge problem in Indiana?

http://wthitv.com/2016/02/23/one-westbound-lane-of-i-70-over-u-s-41-to-remain-closed-until-bridge-repaired/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 23, 2016, 03:52:35 PM
Quote from: adt1982 on February 23, 2016, 03:48:07 PM
What's that?  Another bridge problem in Indiana?

http://wthitv.com/2016/02/23/one-westbound-lane-of-i-70-over-u-s-41-to-remain-closed-until-bridge-repaired/

More reason to get some sort of funding bill passed that actually addresses the problem of our shitty roads. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Super Mateo on February 23, 2016, 04:34:36 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on February 07, 2016, 09:33:05 PM
Quote from: US 41 on February 07, 2016, 06:46:43 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on February 07, 2016, 03:50:21 PM
Quote from: US 41 on February 06, 2016, 09:12:15 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 06, 2016, 08:53:23 AM
I believe it is extended east to the new US 31. The highway sign at the exit there does say SR 4, not TO SR 4.

You're probably right. On Google Maps it shows SR 4 ending at SR 931 (Old 31).

I've extended SR 4 on Google Maps over to the new US 31.   May take a day for the changes to show up.

Off topic a little, but do you need an account to update Google Maps?

Go to http://www.google.com/mapmaker and signin with your google account.  Read the help topics to learn the basics before making edits.  Your edits will need approval to be published.   Over time as you demonstrate a history of good edits your trust level will grow and you can make more changes without waiting on approvals.  Most edits are reviewed by Regional Leads which are other users with a history of good edits that have been chosen by Google to work as moderators.

I've tried to fix the routing of US 52 in Lafayette, but the changes kept getting rejected.  So it's just going to stay wrong on the map until someone else fixes it.

That's not to say that US 52's routing makes any sense, anyway.  US 52 now makes several turns, but enters and exits the area on the same road.  There shouldn't be any turns at all.  Nothing related to roads makes any sense in Indiana.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 23, 2016, 04:37:14 PM
Quote from: Super Mateo on February 23, 2016, 04:34:36 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on February 07, 2016, 09:33:05 PM
Quote from: US 41 on February 07, 2016, 06:46:43 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on February 07, 2016, 03:50:21 PM
Quote from: US 41 on February 06, 2016, 09:12:15 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 06, 2016, 08:53:23 AM
I believe it is extended east to the new US 31. The highway sign at the exit there does say SR 4, not TO SR 4.

You're probably right. On Google Maps it shows SR 4 ending at SR 931 (Old 31).

I've extended SR 4 on Google Maps over to the new US 31.   May take a day for the changes to show up.

Off topic a little, but do you need an account to update Google Maps?

Go to http://www.google.com/mapmaker and signin with your google account.  Read the help topics to learn the basics before making edits.  Your edits will need approval to be published.   Over time as you demonstrate a history of good edits your trust level will grow and you can make more changes without waiting on approvals.  Most edits are reviewed by Regional Leads which are other users with a history of good edits that have been chosen by Google to work as moderators.

I've tried to fix the routing of US 52 in Lafayette, but the changes kept getting rejected.  So it's just going to stay wrong on the map until someone else fixes it.

That's not to say that US 52's routing makes any sense, anyway.  US 52 now makes several turns, but enters and exits the area on the same road.  There shouldn't be any turns at all.  Nothing related to roads makes any sense in Indiana.

one of the regional mods says it's near impossible to fix for some reason, I also don't know why it keeps changing color all the time from yellow to white.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 29, 2016, 03:24:02 PM
What happened to Chicago Ave (Old SR 312) in Gary?  There's a gap in it between SR 912 and Old US 12, is it permanent?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on February 29, 2016, 05:59:15 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 23, 2016, 03:52:35 PM
Quote from: adt1982 on February 23, 2016, 03:48:07 PM
What's that?  Another bridge problem in Indiana?

http://wthitv.com/2016/02/23/one-westbound-lane-of-i-70-over-u-s-41-to-remain-closed-until-bridge-repaired/

More reason to get some sort of funding bill passed that actually addresses the problem of our shitty roads.

I could have sworn they just did work on the I-70 bridges in Terre Haute a year or two ago.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mhking on February 29, 2016, 08:11:29 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 29, 2016, 03:24:02 PM
What happened to Chicago Ave (Old SR 312) in Gary?  There's a gap in it between SR 912 and Old US 12, is it permanent?

Unless I miss my guess, they're probably truncating it at Cline Avenue permanently. Chicago Avenue dead-ends at Old 12 (I think they're calling it Airport Road now instead of Industrial Hwy), and with 12 multiplexing with 912 down to 20, my guess is that since 312 used to end at old 12, they're just ending it at Cline Avenue instead of going all the way over to old 12.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on February 29, 2016, 08:48:30 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 23, 2016, 04:37:14 PM
Quote from: Super Mateo on February 23, 2016, 04:34:36 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on February 07, 2016, 09:33:05 PM
Quote from: US 41 on February 07, 2016, 06:46:43 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on February 07, 2016, 03:50:21 PM
Quote from: US 41 on February 06, 2016, 09:12:15 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 06, 2016, 08:53:23 AM
I believe it is extended east to the new US 31. The highway sign at the exit there does say SR 4, not TO SR 4.

You're probably right. On Google Maps it shows SR 4 ending at SR 931 (Old 31).

I've extended SR 4 on Google Maps over to the new US 31.   May take a day for the changes to show up.

Off topic a little, but do you need an account to update Google Maps?

Go to http://www.google.com/mapmaker and signin with your google account.  Read the help topics to learn the basics before making edits.  Your edits will need approval to be published.   Over time as you demonstrate a history of good edits your trust level will grow and you can make more changes without waiting on approvals.  Most edits are reviewed by Regional Leads which are other users with a history of good edits that have been chosen by Google to work as moderators.

I've tried to fix the routing of US 52 in Lafayette, but the changes kept getting rejected.  So it's just going to stay wrong on the map until someone else fixes it.

That's not to say that US 52's routing makes any sense, anyway.  US 52 now makes several turns, but enters and exits the area on the same road.  There shouldn't be any turns at all.  Nothing related to roads makes any sense in Indiana.

one of the regional mods says it's near impossible to fix for some reason, I also don't know why it keeps changing color all the time from yellow to white.

I can't believe that Google is making mistakes on the maps!  It's so annoying that I have to look at the map again and again!
https://www.aaroads.com/forum/Smileys/default/pan.gif.  Also, why is INDOT keeping on eliminating some routes within the city limits?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 29, 2016, 08:53:17 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on February 29, 2016, 08:48:30 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 23, 2016, 04:37:14 PM
Quote from: Super Mateo on February 23, 2016, 04:34:36 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on February 07, 2016, 09:33:05 PM
Quote from: US 41 on February 07, 2016, 06:46:43 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on February 07, 2016, 03:50:21 PM
Quote from: US 41 on February 06, 2016, 09:12:15 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 06, 2016, 08:53:23 AM
I believe it is extended east to the new US 31. The highway sign at the exit there does say SR 4, not TO SR 4.

You're probably right. On Google Maps it shows SR 4 ending at SR 931 (Old 31).

I've extended SR 4 on Google Maps over to the new US 31.   May take a day for the changes to show up.

Off topic a little, but do you need an account to update Google Maps?

Go to http://www.google.com/mapmaker and signin with your google account.  Read the help topics to learn the basics before making edits.  Your edits will need approval to be published.   Over time as you demonstrate a history of good edits your trust level will grow and you can make more changes without waiting on approvals.  Most edits are reviewed by Regional Leads which are other users with a history of good edits that have been chosen by Google to work as moderators.

I've tried to fix the routing of US 52 in Lafayette, but the changes kept getting rejected.  So it's just going to stay wrong on the map until someone else fixes it.

That's not to say that US 52's routing makes any sense, anyway.  US 52 now makes several turns, but enters and exits the area on the same road.  There shouldn't be any turns at all.  Nothing related to roads makes any sense in Indiana.

one of the regional mods says it's near impossible to fix for some reason, I also don't know why it keeps changing color all the time from yellow to white.

I can't believe that Google is making mistakes on the maps!  It's so annoying that I have to look at the map again and again!
https://www.aaroads.com/forum/Smileys/default/pan.gif.  Also, why is INDOT keeping on eliminating some routes within the city limits?

City streets are expensive to maintain, and indot probably hates dealing with cities when they want them to make changes.  I think that every city should have a few state roads in them, but some are completely useless, ohio has a lot of these.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on March 01, 2016, 08:27:33 AM
Hmm.  Didn't know US 12 had been re-routed.  I guess I need to make a side trip next time I go to Chicago to re-clinch US 12. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 01, 2016, 08:31:34 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on March 01, 2016, 08:27:33 AM
Hmm.  Didn't know US 12 had been re-routed.  I guess I need to make a side trip next time I go to Chicago to re-clinch US 12.

Yes, it now follows us 20 to SR 912 then takes 912 to Columbus dr where it goes back to its old alignment.  I think it was rerouted because Gary wanted to do something with the airport over there.  I don't think it's signed on 912 though, just at the ends.  For some reason they replaced the bgs at colombus dr but never added the us 12 shield: https://www.google.com/maps/@41.6367688,-87.4344826,3a,75y,105.75h,80.49t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1smhZ3GB5HSJ0IDDpebr93pQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

it's actually not signed very well from both ends anymore.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mgk920 on March 01, 2016, 10:57:28 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 01, 2016, 08:31:34 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on March 01, 2016, 08:27:33 AM
Hmm.  Didn't know US 12 had been re-routed.  I guess I need to make a side trip next time I go to Chicago to re-clinch US 12.

Yes, it now follows us 20 to SR 912 then takes 912 to Columbus dr where it goes back to its old alignment.  I think it was rerouted because Gary wanted to do something with the airport over there.  I don't think it's signed on 912 though, just at the ends.  For some reason they replaced the bgs at colombus dr but never added the us 12 shield: https://www.google.com/maps/@41.6367688,-87.4344826,3a,75y,105.75h,80.49t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1smhZ3GB5HSJ0IDDpebr93pQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

it's actually not signed very well from both ends anymore.

Flipping that image to air photo, it is very clear that the closure is permanent - the airport's runway is being extended northwestward and a railroad was relocated to make room, requiring that the road no longer be there.

Mike
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 01, 2016, 12:07:16 PM
it's interesting that they didn't add a RR Xing, I guess traffic counts didn't justify keeping it open.  I wonder how recent this was.  Side note, was this airport ever picked to be Chicago's 3rd airport?  Or was it 5th?  I don't remember the actual number, but I remember Chicago thinking of adding a smaller airport to use as a relief airport. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: seicer on March 01, 2016, 12:58:41 PM
3rd - it has no scheduled service, which is allowing it to pursue the runway expansion. Good timing as it needed it (and terminal improvements).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 02, 2016, 01:23:40 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 01, 2016, 08:31:34 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on March 01, 2016, 08:27:33 AM
Hmm.  Didn't know US 12 had been re-routed.  I guess I need to make a side trip next time I go to Chicago to re-clinch US 12.

Yes, it now follows us 20 to SR 912 then takes 912 to Columbus dr where it goes back to its old alignment.  I think it was rerouted because Gary wanted to do something with the airport over there.  I don't think it's signed on 912 though, just at the ends.  For some reason they replaced the bgs at colombus dr but never added the us 12 shield: https://www.google.com/maps/@41.6367688,-87.4344826,3a,75y,105.75h,80.49t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1smhZ3GB5HSJ0IDDpebr93pQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

it's actually not signed very well from both ends anymore.

You are right in that rerouting US 12 would help with runway expansion with minimal traffic disruption. In actuality though, the reroute was in place since 2005, and this was well before runway expansion entered the stage when it was ready to become public news. A little backstory...

A project was in place for a full rebuild of a bridge on what was then US 12 just west of Bridge Street. The project was to take place for a full year (the closure actually began in fall of 2004), and for a brief moment, the detour called for traffic to follow Bridge Street (where US 20 used to split from US 12) and take it to Cline Avenue North to Columbus Drive. As the project progressed, INDOT and Gary saw it better to make the detour the permanent routing for US 12.

You have to pay extra special attention to follow US 12, as they didn't notify drivers of the reroute with BGSes (at Cline Avenue), but rather standard guidance signs.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 02, 2016, 01:27:47 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 02, 2016, 01:23:40 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 01, 2016, 08:31:34 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on March 01, 2016, 08:27:33 AM
Hmm.  Didn't know US 12 had been re-routed.  I guess I need to make a side trip next time I go to Chicago to re-clinch US 12.

Yes, it now follows us 20 to SR 912 then takes 912 to Columbus dr where it goes back to its old alignment.  I think it was rerouted because Gary wanted to do something with the airport over there.  I don't think it's signed on 912 though, just at the ends.  For some reason they replaced the bgs at colombus dr but never added the us 12 shield: https://www.google.com/maps/@41.6367688,-87.4344826,3a,75y,105.75h,80.49t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1smhZ3GB5HSJ0IDDpebr93pQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

it's actually not signed very well from both ends anymore.

You are right in that rerouting US 12 would help with runway expansion with minimal traffic disruption. In actuality though, the reroute was in place since 2005, and this was well before runway expansion entered the stage when it was ready to become public news. A little backstory...

A project was in place for a full rebuild of a bridge on what was then US 12 just west of Bridge Street. The project was to take place for a full year (the closure actually began in fall of 2004), and for a brief moment, the detour called for traffic to follow Bridge Street (where US 20 used to split from US 12) and take it to Cline Avenue North to Columbus Drive. As the project progressed, INDOT and Gary saw it better to make the detour the permanent routing for US 12.

You have to pay extra special attention to follow US 12, as they didn't notify drivers of the reroute with BGSes (at Cline Avenue), but rather standard guidance signs.

I wouldn't be surprised it US 12 and 20 were cosigned from where they meet just east of 65 all the way to the state line, does us 12 really need to split off at all west of 912?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on March 02, 2016, 02:48:13 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 02, 2016, 01:27:47 PM
I wouldn't be surprised it US 12 and 20 were cosigned from where they meet just east of 65 all the way to the state line, does us 12 really need to split off at all west of 912?

I would guess that East Chicago is not interested in taking over Columbus Dr or Indianapolis Blvd, so they would need to remain separate, or else you'd need to turn one of the two into a state highway if you want to keep 12 and 20 together.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 02, 2016, 11:56:51 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on March 02, 2016, 02:48:13 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 02, 2016, 01:27:47 PM
I wouldn't be surprised it US 12 and 20 were cosigned from where they meet just east of 65 all the way to the state line, does us 12 really need to split off at all west of 912?

I would guess that East Chicago is not interested in taking over Columbus Dr or Indianapolis Blvd, so they would need to remain separate, or else you'd need to turn one of the two into a state highway if you want to keep 12 and 20 together.

That's pretty much it. Keeping 12 and 20 together would be viable, but that would leave Columbus Drive in the hands of East Chicago, and with all I've been reading, they probably don't want that burden right now. Indianapolis Boulevard would still be in INDOT's hands.

However, when work FINALLY begins to rebuild the Cline Avenue bridge and if/when revenue from tolls start to roll in, then that may be a subject to revisit.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 03, 2016, 07:37:14 AM
unless they plan to add an exit at indianapolis blvd, I doubt they'd add anymore routes to it.  I suspect 312 will be the next to go.   
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on March 11, 2016, 09:27:03 AM
I know INDOT is all about decommissioning their highways, but I really think, just by looking at a map, that SR 70 should be extended north along Old US 231 to SR 62.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on March 13, 2016, 08:46:41 PM
Quote from: US 41 on March 11, 2016, 09:27:03 AM
I know INDOT is all about decommissioning their highways, but I really think, just by looking at a map, that SR 70 should be extended north along Old US 231 to SR 62.

Just NE of Tell City there is another portion of Indiana 70, and it is not marked between the two segments.  I don't think INDOT really cares about orphaned roads as long as they can drop them off of their ledger.

I was up in Franklin a few weeks ago and came in on IN 44.  When I left to return home, I was looking for the intersection of IN 44 and US 31, and couldn't find it.  IN 44 starts about 1 mile west of US 31.  It also appears east of Franklin, but not marked through the town.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on March 14, 2016, 12:39:16 PM
Quote from: Life in Paradise on March 13, 2016, 08:46:41 PM
Quote from: US 41 on March 11, 2016, 09:27:03 AM
I know INDOT is all about decommissioning their highways, but I really think, just by looking at a map, that SR 70 should be extended north along Old US 231 to SR 62.

Just NE of Tell City there is another portion of Indiana 70, and it is not marked between the two segments.  I don't think INDOT really cares about orphaned roads as long as they can drop them off of their ledger.

I was up in Franklin a few weeks ago and came in on IN 44.  When I left to return home, I was looking for the intersection of IN 44 and US 31, and couldn't find it.  IN 44 starts about 1 mile west of US 31.  It also appears east of Franklin, but not marked through the town.

Wow! That might be the dumbest thing INDOT has ever done. INDOT is a complete joke. They care more about finishing I-69 then actually taking care of the roads that already exist. Now we have roads and bridges that are (literally) falling apart.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on March 17, 2016, 04:52:52 PM
Here is something I found while searching around Google on INDOT construction...

http://www.insideindianabusiness.com/story/31474784/indot-announces-117m-in-road-projects
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on March 17, 2016, 06:56:37 PM
Quote from: US 41 on March 14, 2016, 12:39:16 PM
Quote from: Life in Paradise on March 13, 2016, 08:46:41 PM

Just NE of Tell City there is another portion of Indiana 70, and it is not marked between the two segments.  I don't think INDOT really cares about orphaned roads as long as they can drop them off of their ledger.

I was up in Franklin a few weeks ago and came in on IN 44.  When I left to return home, I was looking for the intersection of IN 44 and US 31, and couldn't find it.  IN 44 starts about 1 mile west of US 31.  It also appears east of Franklin, but not marked through the town.

Wow! That might be the dumbest thing INDOT has ever done. INDOT is a complete joke. They care more about finishing I-69 then actually taking care of the roads that already exist. Now we have roads and bridges that are (literally) falling apart.

Such decommissionings have happened since at least 2004 so it is nothing new. SR 61 has ended at the Vincennes city limits for over 10 years.

The problem with INDOT is the poor marking of former state highways in cities where decommissionings happened. The issue is not that they don't maintain roads and bridges any worse than before. The press release today said this:
Quote
Over the last three years, state bridges rated as "fair or better" have increased from 93 percent to 95.3 percent. The national average is 94 percent.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 28, 2016, 11:55:04 AM
I'm not posting this for political reasons, just find it interesting all of these projects that could have happened, but didn't: http://www.indystar.com/story/news/politics/2016/03/28/transportation-dollars-remain-unspent-years-later/82253034/

The weird gap that SR 128/332 makes between SR 37/13 and I-69 was going to be a state road at one point. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Rothman on March 28, 2016, 12:05:18 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 28, 2016, 11:55:04 AM
I'm not posting this for political reasons, just find it interesting all of these projects that could have happened, but didn't: http://www.indystar.com/story/news/politics/2016/03/28/transportation-dollars-remain-unspent-years-later/82253034/

The weird gap that SR 128/332 makes between SR 37/13 and I-69 was going to be a state road at one point. 

Sounds like they were old earmarks that were not large enough to take a real bite out of the overall cost of the projects mentioned.  Now that FHWA is allowing them to be swept up and reassigned under FAST, the money will be used somehow.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 29, 2016, 10:04:38 AM
Anyone from the Goshen area have any idea where SR 4 ends now?  Looking at the street view which is current as of last yr (oct 2015), SR 4 signs are now gone at its end point at US 33/SR 15.  Knowing INDOT, it probably just ends at the town boarder.  Was its decommissioning a result of the incoming reroute of us 33 around downtown?  Also, what does this mean for SR 15?

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.5864309,-85.8345059,3a,75y,95.44h,76.64t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1susbhkUu_0AXYUlqTBtkAyQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on March 29, 2016, 10:18:00 AM
I wish INDOT could make a deal to leave the state highway signs up on decommissioned roads or at least put "TO" signs up. It's kind of confusing to have state highways end at town limits and then start up again on the other side. Their already paying these towns to take over the highway. Part of the deal should be that they can leave their state highway shields up.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: rawmustard on March 29, 2016, 10:33:50 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 29, 2016, 10:04:38 AM
Anyone from the Goshen area have any idea where SR 4 ends now?  Looking at the street view which is current as of last yr (oct 2015), SR 4 signs are now gone at its end point at US 33/SR 15.  Knowing INDOT, it probably just ends at the town boarder.  Was its decommissioning a result of the incoming reroute of us 33 around downtown?  Also, what does this mean for SR 15?

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.5864309,-85.8345059,3a,75y,95.44h,76.64t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1susbhkUu_0AXYUlqTBtkAyQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

It ends at the Goshen city limits, as there are begin and end signs there. (This took me by surprise when I drove through a few weeks ago.)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 29, 2016, 10:34:59 AM
I Wonder what this means for SR 15, surely they won't do the same to it too. They should just get rid of this entire section of SR 4
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 29, 2016, 11:47:37 AM
SR 37 is the final route for 69 as per this article: http://www.indystar.com/story/news/2016/03/29/ind-37-chosen-last-leg--69/82177650/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on March 29, 2016, 01:26:15 PM
I may be wrong, but it appears that INDOT may be rebuilding the Otter Creek bridges on US 41. They have road construction signs posted and the "end construction" signs are on the opposite sides of the bridges. I'll keep everyone updated on that little project. It's supposed to start on April 4th.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on March 29, 2016, 01:33:42 PM
Quote from: rawmustard on March 29, 2016, 10:33:50 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 29, 2016, 10:04:38 AM
Anyone from the Goshen area have any idea where SR 4 ends now?  Looking at the street view which is current as of last yr (oct 2015), SR 4 signs are now gone at its end point at US 33/SR 15.  Knowing INDOT, it probably just ends at the town boarder.  Was its decommissioning a result of the incoming reroute of us 33 around downtown?  Also, what does this mean for SR 15?

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.5864309,-85.8345059,3a,75y,95.44h,76.64t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1susbhkUu_0AXYUlqTBtkAyQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

It ends at the Goshen city limits, as there are begin and end signs there. (This took me by surprise when I drove through a few weeks ago.)
If you go half a block east of Main St. in GSV, there is an overhead END SR-4 sign. I assume that is just left over, and may be gone now: https://www.google.com/maps/@41.5864446,-85.8336872,3a,75y,270h,76.64t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sjjI4bqaSagCaGvmPMzIMYg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656 (https://www.google.com/maps/@41.5864446,-85.8336872,3a,75y,270h,76.64t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sjjI4bqaSagCaGvmPMzIMYg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 30, 2016, 10:23:55 AM
It is if you look at it from us 33 it's gone.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Henry on March 30, 2016, 10:32:03 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 29, 2016, 11:47:37 AM
SR 37 is the final route for 69 as per this article: http://www.indystar.com/story/news/2016/03/29/ind-37-chosen-last-leg--69/82177650/
I knew it was only a matter of time before it happened. Really, how else would you route I-69 from Bloomington back to Indianapolis?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 30, 2016, 10:32:59 AM
Quote from: Henry on March 30, 2016, 10:32:03 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 29, 2016, 11:47:37 AM
SR 37 is the final route for 69 as per this article: http://www.indystar.com/story/news/2016/03/29/ind-37-chosen-last-leg--69/82177650/
I knew it was only a matter of time before it happened. Really, how else would you route I-69 from Bloomington back to Indianapolis?
They had some bad ideas thankfully they didn't pick any of those
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 13, 2016, 10:18:54 PM
Plenty of interstate road work underway this week and going throughout the spring and summer. What to look out for:

Interstate 65 (from I-80/94 to U.S. 30): work on concrete pavement restoration begins Monday (April 18). Nighttime work will reduce traffic to one lane as workers prepare to shift lanes. Three lanes of traffic are to be maintained during daytime hours. Work will be split into two sets of two stages; northbound lanes will be repaired from U.S. 30 to 61st Avenue, followed by southbound. The same system will be in place from 61st Avenue to I-80/94.

Interstate 94: More bridge refurbishments are scheduled east of Indiana 49 and south of the Michigan state line. Also, there's work set to begin from just east of Indiana 249 to the Indiana Toll Road ramp. Speaking of the Toll Road...

Indiana Toll Road: Work has started on the big capital repair project mentioned in this thread a few weeks ago. Work begins in two 10-mile sections: the stretch from the Lake Station exit to Indiana 49 (mile 21 to 31) and the stretch from US 421 to Indiana 39 (mile 40 to 50). Lane closures are round-the-clock and WILL result in heavy delays. (Today, I saw the loop ramp from I-94 east to the Toll Road entry log jammed, along with the mainline itself.)

If you have to travel to Ohio, it would be quicker to take I-94 to U.S. 20 East (exit 40A) to Indiana 39 south, and pick up the Toll Road from there.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ssummers72 on April 14, 2016, 04:22:28 PM
Here is the roadwork in a nutshell:

I-80/94: By June it will under construction from Calumet Avenue to the IN/MI Line

Toll Road: MM-20 to MM-93

US-20: US-12 to SR-51, SR-249 to SR-149, A bridge project between SR-149 and SR-49

I-65 from I-80/94 South to US-30, From the Kankakee River Bridge South to Lafayette

This is just the beginning
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 27, 2016, 08:56:53 PM
does anyone have any idea what's about to happen on SR 37 from around 146th st to 191st st?  It can't be the roundabout interchanges. I see survey stakes and all the reflectors in the road have been removed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on April 27, 2016, 09:26:15 PM
I believe they are just repaving it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 10, 2016, 10:44:35 AM
I think 465 will be widened from us 421 to us 31 in the far future, they are closing ditch road for a few days to do a geotechnical study, I read that it was for a future bridge project, it may be nothing but a replacement, but it sure seems that this is the ultimate purpose. Anyone else hear about this?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 2trailertrucker on May 10, 2016, 11:13:41 AM
The bridges along for 65 from US 421 to US 31 are under height along that stretch. 13'7" and 13'3" clearances are problematic for truckers. Even though they are on the shoulder, these bridges need to be redone.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on May 10, 2016, 11:23:27 AM
Wouldn't hurt to widen Ditch and that bridge either along with the roundabout at 96th.  Lots of traffic backups there around rush hour.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 10, 2016, 11:25:29 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on May 10, 2016, 11:23:27 AM
Wouldn't hurt to widen Ditch and that bridge either along with the roundabout at 96th.  Lots of traffic backups there around rush hour.
That roundabout is overmatched at times, I wish it were 2 lanes coming in from all directions. They are metering the roundabout at keystone and smokey row (136th) due to congestion during rush hr.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on May 12, 2016, 09:23:15 AM
A nice aerial view of the upcoming reroute of US 33 in Goshen in this story

http://www.wndu.com/content/news/Ceremony-for-groundbreaking-of-US-33-realignment-project-379155001.html (http://www.wndu.com/content/news/Ceremony-for-groundbreaking-of-US-33-realignment-project-379155001.html)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on May 14, 2016, 10:11:55 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on May 12, 2016, 09:23:15 AM
A nice aerial view of the upcoming reroute of US 33 in Goshen in this story

http://www.wndu.com/content/news/Ceremony-for-groundbreaking-of-US-33-realignment-project-379155001.html (http://www.wndu.com/content/news/Ceremony-for-groundbreaking-of-US-33-realignment-project-379155001.html)

So why in the world would they put US33/SR15 on Main St. instead of 3rd for the stretch between Pike and Madison St.? 3rd looks like a higher quality road to me. :confused:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on May 14, 2016, 12:38:42 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 10, 2016, 11:25:29 AM
They are metering the roundabout at keystone and smokey row (136th) due to congestion during rush hr.

I'm curious how they are doing the metering - with an upstream traffic signal, police directing traffic, or did they install ramp meter type indications?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 14, 2016, 12:43:26 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on May 14, 2016, 12:38:42 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 10, 2016, 11:25:29 AM
They are metering the roundabout at keystone and smokey row (136th) due to congestion during rush hr.

I'm curious how they are doing the metering - with an upstream traffic signal, police directing traffic, or did they install ramp meter type indications?
with a signal
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 16, 2016, 10:36:55 AM
A google maps error now shows that SR 431 has been resurrected on keystone. And SR 37 is back on binford!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on May 16, 2016, 11:23:24 AM
Shakes head.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 16, 2016, 12:08:05 PM
Quote from: billtm on May 14, 2016, 10:11:55 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on May 12, 2016, 09:23:15 AM
A nice aerial view of the upcoming reroute of US 33 in Goshen in this story

http://www.wndu.com/content/news/Ceremony-for-groundbreaking-of-US-33-realignment-project-379155001.html (http://www.wndu.com/content/news/Ceremony-for-groundbreaking-of-US-33-realignment-project-379155001.html)

So why in the world would they put US33/SR15 on Main St. instead of 3rd for the stretch between Pike and Madison St.? 3rd looks like a higher quality road to me. :confused:

My memory may be rusty, but this is how I think it went down: City of Goshen wanted to take control of Main between Pike and Madison.  They upgraded 3rd in the hopes of getting 33 and 15 re-routed over to 3rd.  For some reason they didn't get approval to move 33.  Maybe it was because this project was in the works or something to do with it being a US highway.  Now that the new segment of 33 is being built that will get it off Main, I imagine they'll move 15 over to 3rd. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 16, 2016, 12:14:23 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 16, 2016, 12:08:05 PM
Quote from: billtm on May 14, 2016, 10:11:55 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on May 12, 2016, 09:23:15 AM
A nice aerial view of the upcoming reroute of US 33 in Goshen in this story

http://www.wndu.com/content/news/Ceremony-for-groundbreaking-of-US-33-realignment-project-379155001.html (http://www.wndu.com/content/news/Ceremony-for-groundbreaking-of-US-33-realignment-project-379155001.html)

So why in the world would they put US33/SR15 on Main St. instead of 3rd for the stretch between Pike and Madison St.? 3rd looks like a higher quality road to me. :confused:

My memory may be rusty, but this is how I think it went down: City of Goshen wanted to take control of Main between Pike and Madison.  They upgraded 3rd in the hopes of getting 33 and 15 re-routed over to 3rd.  For some reason they didn't get approval to move 33.  Maybe it was because this project was in the works or something to do with it being a US highway.  Now that the new segment of 33 is being built that will get it off Main, I imagine they'll move 15 over to 3rd.
Hopefully indot won't just leave a gap like they normally love to do.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: dfwmapper on May 16, 2016, 10:10:50 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 16, 2016, 10:36:55 AM
A google maps error now shows that SR 431 has been resurrected on keystone. And SR 37 is back on binford!
Some dumbshit keeps putting highways back on their old routings, citing out of date maps hosted by IU. Google's Indians showed their typical understanding of things and approved the changes instead of telling him to piss off, even when I and other mappers had left comments about just how wrong he is. We're trying to get his garbage undone and him banned.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on May 16, 2016, 11:22:01 PM
This is an interesting concept that Vigo County and INDOT came up with 10 years ago that never happened. INDOT was going to build an interchange on US 41 at Harlan Drive south of Terre Haute. SR 63 was also going to be rerouted onto Harlan Drive. It's too bad that this never happened.

http://www.indianaeconomicdigest.net/main.asp?SectionID=31&SubSectionID=62&ArticleID=35771

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.3308617,-87.4446348,13z
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on May 17, 2016, 11:28:17 AM
Quote from: dfwmapper on May 16, 2016, 10:10:50 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 16, 2016, 10:36:55 AM
A google maps error now shows that SR 431 has been resurrected on keystone. And SR 37 is back on binford!
Some dumbshit keeps putting highways back on their old routings, citing out of date maps hosted by IU. Google's Indians showed their typical understanding of things and approved the changes instead of telling him to piss off, even when I and other mappers had left comments about just how wrong he is. We're trying to get his garbage undone and him banned.
It's been escalated to the appropriate places, however it may take some time to undo the damage.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on May 17, 2016, 01:52:10 PM
Has INDOT ever considered decommissioning SR 134?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on May 18, 2016, 01:12:37 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on May 17, 2016, 11:28:17 AM
Quote from: dfwmapper on May 16, 2016, 10:10:50 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 16, 2016, 10:36:55 AM
A google maps error now shows that SR 431 has been resurrected on keystone. And SR 37 is back on binford!
Some dumbshit keeps putting highways back on their old routings, citing out of date maps hosted by IU. Google's Indians showed their typical understanding of things and approved the changes instead of telling him to piss off, even when I and other mappers had left comments about just how wrong he is. We're trying to get his garbage undone and him banned.
It's been escalated to the appropriate places, however it may take some time to undo the damage.
Quite a bit of the damage has been cleaned up, however there is more yet to do.   Unfortunately the effort to do the cleanup is quite a bit more complicated and time consuming than the effort it took by the spammer to break things in the first place.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on May 23, 2016, 08:23:13 PM
After this weekend's Friday night-Monday morning lane restrictions on I-465 in southwest Indy, the westbound lanes between US-31 and Sam Jones Expwy. have a new lane in the inside median and the outside lane is barrel-ed off. It still allows 3 lanes of traffic. The eastbound lanes weren't affected, just patches in the inside lane.

It had to be a pain for the asphalt-layer driver. The inside median on that section of I-465 has a lot of drainage plates along the base of the jersey barrier with thin diagonal line drains coming off them (imagine a letter "K" where the barrier is the | with the drain lines forming the diagonal; obviously I don't know the technical names for this  :D). The paver left them all exposed while paving the space in-between, which made for some interesting looking asphalt sections on my commute in the new inside lane this morning.

Does anyone know if this is the sign of something bigger to come, or is it simply to make paving the outside lane easier without having to close lanes again?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 23, 2016, 08:25:42 PM
Quote from: jhuntin1 on May 23, 2016, 08:23:13 PM
After this weekend's Friday night-Monday morning lane restrictions on I-465 in southwest Indy, the westbound lanes between US-31 and Sam Jones Expwy. have a new lane in the inside median and the outside lane is barrel-ed off. It still allows 3 lanes of traffic. The eastbound lanes weren't affected, just patches in the inside lane.

It had to be a pain for the asphalt-layer driver. The inside median on that section of I-465 has a lot of drainage plates along the base of the jersey barrier with thin diagonal line drains coming off them (imagine a letter "K" where the barrier is the | with the drain lines forming the diagonal; obviously I don't know the technical names for this  :D). The paver left them all exposed while paving the space in-between, which made for some interesting looking asphalt sections on my commute in the new inside lane this morning.

Does anyone know if this is the sign of something bigger to come, or is it simply to make paving the outside lane easier without having to close lanes again?

The technical name is "slotted drain" you typically see these on interstates or in sags (low) spots to keep ponding from happening when you can't solve this with a couple of inlets.  My guess for your other question is either the shoulder just needed paving, or they will cross traffic onto the shoulder to do more major mainline paving. haven't heard anything about widening there though.  465 at us 421 appears to be in the early stages of something, I see a new cantilever sign is up, without a bgs on it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on May 23, 2016, 08:36:16 PM
They repaved what was the inside lane as well, so those two lanes of asphalt look really nice. I imagine that they're going to repave the other two lanes then move things back to normal, but I've never seen INDOT do this before on a repave job.

EDIT: Thanks for the technical help, silverback1065!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: dvferyance on May 24, 2016, 08:37:55 PM
Quote from: US 41 on May 17, 2016, 01:52:10 PM
Has INDOT ever considered decommissioning SR 134?
I think INDOT has decommissioned enough already if anything too much.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on May 24, 2016, 09:23:55 PM
SR 134, as short as it is, connects to the Indiana Women's Prison which is a state institution and I think INDOT likes to keep state facilities connected to the state highway system as much as they can. I see to recall a few short three-number spurs to state parks and whatnot to go along with this theory of mine.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 25, 2016, 08:50:07 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on May 24, 2016, 09:23:55 PM
SR 134, as short as it is, connects to the Indiana Women's Prison which is a state institution and I think INDOT likes to keep state facilities connected to the state highway system as much as they can. I see to recall a few short three-number spurs to state parks and whatnot to go along with this theory of mine.

Yes, INDOT does maintain a lot of short roads running to state institutions and parks.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on May 26, 2016, 11:41:50 PM
INDOT is going to redesign the current US 41 / SR 163 intersection in Lyford from a "Y" into a "T". Construction is supposed to start next February.

http://wthitv.com/2016/05/25/driving-towards-a-safer-future-indot-plans-for-new-intersection-at-lyford-y/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Avalanchez71 on May 27, 2016, 01:13:08 PM
Is there a resource for any of the former Business US 41 routes along US 41 in IN?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on May 27, 2016, 01:29:19 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on May 27, 2016, 01:13:08 PM
Is there a resource for any of the former Business US 41 routes along US 41 in IN?

I'm not sure what you mean. I know for a fact that Clinton St and Lafayette Ave (same road, different names) in Terre Haute used to be BR 41. There is still a sign just south of the Lafayette / Park Ave intersection that labels the route as 41.

There is also a BR 41 in Vincennes that still exists and it is signed very well. It starts at the US 41/150/50 cloverleaf and ends at SR 441.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Avalanchez71 on May 27, 2016, 01:53:50 PM
I know that there was one in Princeton.  I seem to recall one in Kentland and I thought that there used to be others.  I thought there was one in Evansville at one time as well.  I seem to recall a few BR US 41 routes back in the 90s.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 27, 2016, 10:18:29 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on May 27, 2016, 01:53:50 PM
I know that there was one in Princeton.  I seem to recall one in Kentland and I thought that there used to be others.  I thought there was one in Evansville at one time as well.  I seem to recall a few BR US 41 routes back in the 90s.

the evansville one was killed when they redid SR 66, it's now signed as "old business 41" which is like saying "old old us 41"
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on May 29, 2016, 07:36:53 PM
Construction has started on the replacement of the Indiana 912 bridge that was closed in 2009 and demolished in 2013.  They are also going to build a maintenance building as part of that project. 
Completion date: 2019
Tolls?: Yes (All-Electronic-Tolling)
Contractor: Ross Group from Portage

Article:
http://www.chicagotribune.com/suburbs/post-tribune/news/ct-ptb-cline-project-groundbreaking-st-0527-20160526-story.html
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 29, 2016, 08:38:23 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on May 29, 2016, 07:36:53 PM
Construction has started on the replacement of the Indiana 912 bridge that was closed in 2009 and demolished in 2013.  They are also going to build a maintenance building as part of that project. 
Completion date: 2019
Tolls?: Yes (All-Electronic-Tolling)
Contractor: Ross Group from Portage

Article:
http://www.chicagotribune.com/suburbs/post-tribune/news/ct-ptb-cline-project-groundbreaking-st-0527-20160526-story.html

It's about damn time!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Joe The Dragon on May 30, 2016, 12:05:22 AM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on May 29, 2016, 07:36:53 PM
Construction has started on the replacement of the Indiana 912 bridge that was closed in 2009 and demolished in 2013.  They are also going to build a maintenance building as part of that project. 
Completion date: 2019
Tolls?: Yes (All-Electronic-Tolling)
Contractor: Ross Group from Portage

Article:
http://www.chicagotribune.com/suburbs/post-tribune/news/ct-ptb-cline-project-groundbreaking-st-0527-20160526-story.html
dispensary for the electronic passes?? Why not just have people get a EZ-PASS or I-PASS from the places that give them out now?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on May 30, 2016, 10:58:20 AM


Carmel Indiana just announced the timeline for the 30+ new roundabouts, including the new 96th street interchange for Keystone Parkway.

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.gannett-cdn.com%2F-mm-%2F8e52cec714b9b2c20ed725ae936d9700ea46d508%2Fc%3D109-0-755-486%26amp%3Br%3Dx404%26amp%3Bc%3D534x401%2Flocal%2F-%2Fmedia%2F2015%2F12%2F18%2FIndianapolis%2FIndianapolis%2F635860612482558547-96thKeystone.jpg&hash=0655d6e364beb7b9a438d6b03b918ffc061ff819)

http://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/hamilton-county/2016/05/30/carmel-releases-timeline-229m-roadwork/84968662/ (http://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/hamilton-county/2016/05/30/carmel-releases-timeline-229m-roadwork/84968662/)

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Finteractives.indystar.com%2Fstatic%2Froundabout0116.jpg&hash=47af8dddae4a665612b627e4c14dcd3d8b5d2158)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 30, 2016, 03:30:15 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on May 30, 2016, 10:58:20 AM


Carmel Indiana just announced the timeline for the 30+ new roundabouts, including the new 96th street interchange for Keystone Parkway.

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.gannett-cdn.com%2F-mm-%2F8e52cec714b9b2c20ed725ae936d9700ea46d508%2Fc%3D109-0-755-486%26amp%3Br%3Dx404%26amp%3Bc%3D534x401%2Flocal%2F-%2Fmedia%2F2015%2F12%2F18%2FIndianapolis%2FIndianapolis%2F635860612482558547-96thKeystone.jpg&hash=0655d6e364beb7b9a438d6b03b918ffc061ff819)

http://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/hamilton-county/2016/05/30/carmel-releases-timeline-229m-roadwork/84968662/ (http://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/hamilton-county/2016/05/30/carmel-releases-timeline-229m-roadwork/84968662/)

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Cannot wait for the keystone interchange.  Looks like the city's dream of having only one traffic light left in the city will actually happen.  Interesting that the first traffic signal in the state was in Carmel, now the roundabout mecca.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on May 30, 2016, 05:37:59 PM
I'm at the point where I get annoyed each time I have to sit at one of the few stoplights left in the area.   The more roundabouts the better.  My gas mileage has noticeably improved since the addition of so many roundabout and completion of the US 31 freeway project.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: seicer on May 31, 2016, 09:55:18 PM
There goes the whole notion of "roundabouts are a foreign concept" when they are widespread in most states. I wish some cities would adopt more of them. Come up to northeast Ohio, where crazy five and six (and seven and eight) way intersections abound.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on June 04, 2016, 05:39:29 PM
I didn't know they could build 30+ new roundabouts in Carmel! I thought the city is almost maxed out roundabout-wise...
The Keystone & 96th interchange will be amazing though :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on June 04, 2016, 08:31:23 PM
Central Indiana seems to be enamored with alternative highway construction the last few years. From roundabouts to Michigan lefts to diverging diamonds, everything has been put to use it seems.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 05, 2016, 08:49:09 AM
Quote from: jhuntin1 on June 04, 2016, 08:31:23 PM
Central Indiana seems to be enamored with alternative highway construction the last few years. From roundabouts to Michigan lefts to diverging diamonds, everything has been put to use it seems.

The reason for this at the state level is that it is now official INDOT policy to investigate alternative intersections first for all new projects.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 11, 2016, 02:10:13 PM
For any of you planning to visit County Line Orchard in late summer/early fall, the following information is very important (also for those who use Indiana 130 to connect from Hobart to Valparaiso).

Starting June 20, the entire intersection of Indiana 130 and County Line Road will be closed to traffic for intersection modernization. Currently a four-way stop buttressed by railroad crossings at the south end (and notorious for heavy delays because of trains and said four-way stop), the intersection will undergo a complete resurface, along with turn lanes and a traffic signal programmed to coincide with all railroad signal activities. The project is scheduled to finish at the end of September.

The official detour (which INDOT says will be enforced for heavy vehicles) calls for drivers to use US 6 (Ridge Road) from Indiana 51 and Indiana 149 to connect to Indiana 130. For anyone heading to northern or eastern Valparaiso, it would be easier to use the Toll Road or US 6 to Indiana 49.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: pianocello on June 11, 2016, 11:35:49 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 11, 2016, 02:10:13 PM
For any of you planning to visit County Line Orchard in late summer/early fall, the following information is very important (also for those who use Indiana 130 to connect from Hobart to Valparaiso).

Starting June 20, the entire intersection of Indiana 130 and County Line Road will be closed to traffic for intersection modernization. Currently a four-way stop buttressed by railroad crossings at the south end (and notorious for heavy delays because of trains and said four-way stop), the intersection will undergo a complete resurface, along with turn lanes and a traffic signal programmed to coincide with all railroad signal activities. The project is scheduled to finish at the end of September.

The official detour (which INDOT says will be enforced for heavy vehicles) calls for drivers to use US 6 (Ridge Road) from Indiana 51 and Indiana 149 to connect to Indiana 130. For anyone heading to northern or eastern Valparaiso, it would be easier to use the Toll Road or US 6 to Indiana 49.

:clap: :clap: :clap: That intersection is terrible, I'm glad they're finally doing something about it! Thanks for the info, that's the route I normally take to get between Valpo and I-80/94. Definitely passing it on to others who using that route.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ssummers72 on June 12, 2016, 09:31:08 AM
This project will help the morning and afternoon traffic through the area once it has been completed. The Contractor and the Railroads have been coordinated so that all of the improvements can be completed at once.

Some notable features of the improvements:

1. The addition of a Traffic Signal

2. Upgrades to the railroad signals with interconnects to the traffic signals

3. The addition of Left Turn Lanes at SR-130 and County Line Rd.

4. Improvements to the Vertical Curve South of the railroad tracks on County Line Rd.

5. The closure is for 100 days, this is stipulated in the contract documents

6. This contract has been on the books since 1983

I hope this clarifies some design elements. If you have any other questions please contact me.

Stephan Summers
INDOT PM
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 12, 2016, 01:00:58 PM
Quote from: ssummers72 on June 12, 2016, 09:31:08 AM
This project will help the morning and afternoon traffic through the area once it has been completed. The Contractor and the Railroads have been coordinated so that all of the improvements can be completed at once.

Some notable features of the improvements:

1. The addition of a Traffic Signal

2. Upgrades to the railroad signals with interconnects to the traffic signals

3. The addition of Left Turn Lanes at SR-130 and County Line Rd.

4. Improvements to the Vertical Curve South of the railroad tracks on County Line Rd.

5. The closure is for 100 days, this is stipulated in the contract documents

6. This contract has been on the books since 1983

I hope this clarifies some design elements. If you have any other questions please contact me.

Stephan Summers
INDOT PM

Will there be a right turn lane for those going from eastbound Indiana 130 to southbound County Line Road? That may pose a problem when trains roll through that crossing. At least by having that turn lane, that would offset the pressure. Thanks for the details, by the way.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ssummers72 on June 12, 2016, 08:36:17 PM
    This project will help the morning and afternoon traffic through the area once it has been completed. The Contractor and the Railroads have been coordinated so that all of the improvements can be completed at once.

    Some notable features of the improvements:

    1. The addition of a Traffic Signal

    2. Upgrades to the railroad signals with interconnects to the traffic signals

    3. The addition of Left Turn Lanes at SR-130 and County Line Rd.

    4. Improvements to the Vertical Curve South of the railroad tracks on County Line Rd.

    5. The closure is for 100 days, this is stipulated in the contract documents

    6. This contract has been on the books since 1983

    I hope this clarifies some design elements. If you have any other questions please contact me.

    Stephan Summers
    INDOT PM


Will there be a right turn lane for those going from eastbound Indiana 130 to southbound County Line Road? That may pose a problem when trains roll through that crossing. At least by having that turn lane, that would offset the pressure. Thanks for the details, by the way.

There will be a Right Turn only lane for EB 130 to SB County Line Rd.

If you want to see the plans go to to the following link:

https://erms.indot.in.gov/viewdocs/

Then type in contract number: 24643

Then select Plans/Drawing Sets to access plans
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on June 13, 2016, 11:09:33 AM
I've used this intersection once in my entire life, when a train happened to be crossing.  Took me roughly a half hour to get from this intersection to County Line Orchard.  Glad to hear that improvements are being made!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 13, 2016, 07:58:25 PM
Random question maybe you guys know the answer to, was the Sam Jones Expressway ever a state road? Did it ever have a number, or a planned number, or even a secret number? (On the books as a number just not signed in the field) I'm almost certain it's just a city street now but I've always wondered this.


Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 14, 2016, 10:39:58 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 13, 2016, 07:58:25 PM
Random question maybe you guys know the answer to, was the Sam Jones Expressway ever a state road? Did it ever have a number, or a planned number, or even a secret number? (On the books as a number just not signed in the field) I'm almost certain it's just a city street now but I've always wondered this.

I don't remember it ever having a number, nor can I find anything online about a number ever being associated with it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 14, 2016, 10:40:36 AM
Was it ever a state road?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 14, 2016, 10:44:09 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 14, 2016, 10:40:36 AM
Was it ever a state road?

I don't think so, but I can't be 100% certain.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on June 14, 2016, 07:46:02 PM
I would also say no because:
- I haven't seen it marked as anything other than "Airport Expressway" until 2008 when it became "Sam Jones Expressway" when the new midfield terminal opened
- The interchanges are weird and not like anything else INDOT has

It seems like it was the equivalent to the current airport access. Is that maintained by INDOT?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 14, 2016, 08:06:45 PM
Quote from: mukade on June 14, 2016, 07:46:02 PM
I would also say no because:
- I haven't seen it marked as anything other than "Airport Expressway" until 2008 when it became "Sam Jones Expressway" when the new midfield terminal opened
- The interchanges are weird and not like anything else INDOT has

It seems like it was the equivalent to the current airport access. Is that maintained by INDOT?

I do think the new road is INDOT maintained, it's secret name is something like "colonel wier cook drive" or something like that.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on June 14, 2016, 09:28:07 PM
This is my opinion, but honestly I doubt that INDOT has secretly maintained routes, they barely want to have the maintained ones they have. I would guess the Col. Wier Cook Drive roadway is under the Indianapolis Airport Authority's jurisdiction. The blue signs, odd font and Spanish language on the signs sure don't say INDOT to me. When you reach the ramps the signs revert to typical INDOT style, telling me that they likely own the ramps but nothing else past there.

As for the Sam Jones, that has almost certainly always been an Indianapolis roadway.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 2trailertrucker on June 15, 2016, 02:56:20 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 14, 2016, 08:06:45 PM
Quote from: mukade on June 14, 2016, 07:46:02 PM
I would also say no because:
- I haven't seen it marked as anything other than "Airport Expressway" until 2008 when it became "Sam Jones Expressway" when the new midfield terminal opened
- The interchanges are weird and not like anything else INDOT has

It seems like it was the equivalent to the current airport access. Is that maintained by INDOT?

I do think the new road is INDOT maintained, it's secret name is something like "colonel wier cook drive" or something like that.

Weir Cook Dr leads from I 70 to the midfield terminal.Since the airport bought up all that property years ago due to noise, I would guess that the Airport Authority maintains it. Also, the IAA also has their own police department that runs the whole sector.

Sam Jones Expressway (née Airport Expressway) I would hazard a guess that it is a city of Indianapolis road. There are no highway numbers that I have seen in almost 30 years of using the road.

When the snow flies, I'll let you know who does the plowing! 😫
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 15, 2016, 07:54:16 AM
SR 37 is being surveyed for the upcoming roundabout project. It's going to be a while before construction starts, this is survey for the design.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on June 15, 2016, 08:37:00 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 13, 2016, 07:58:25 PM
Random question maybe you guys know the answer to, was the Sam Jones Expressway ever a state road? Did it ever have a number, or a planned number, or even a secret number? (On the books as a number just not signed in the field) I'm almost certain it's just a city street now but I've always wondered this.
It's a city of Indianapolis street.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: westerninterloper on June 16, 2016, 07:35:26 AM
Quote from: cjw2001 on June 15, 2016, 08:37:00 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 13, 2016, 07:58:25 PM
Random question maybe you guys know the answer to, was the Sam Jones Expressway ever a state road? Did it ever have a number, or a planned number, or even a secret number? (On the books as a number just not signed in the field) I'm almost certain it's just a city street now but I've always wondered this.
It's a city of Indianapolis street.

I think it's always been a local road - it was the Airport Expressway before the new terminal opened, and I don't recall ever seeing a state or federal road designation for it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: captkirk_4 on June 23, 2016, 10:38:04 AM
I really think I-865 needs to be extended eastwards to meet I-74 for traffic transitioning to and from I-70. It is currently a really long way around Indianapolis for I-74 traffic. The shortest route is Indiana 32 from Crawfordsville to Lebanon, then the shorter northern loop around. I took that last month but of course got stuck in a "funeral procession" on the two lane Indiana 32 with about 15 cars delayed by some senile old coot who wanted to drive 50 mph and didn't bother to pull off the dang road and let all the people who were competent to drive cars pass. When you see all these vehicles behind you have a clue, get off the darn road and let the big boys by.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 23, 2016, 10:41:03 AM
Quote from: captkirk_4 on June 23, 2016, 10:38:04 AM
I really think I-865 needs to be extended eastwards to meet I-74 for traffic transitioning to and from I-70. It is currently a really long way around Indianapolis for I-74 traffic. The shortest route is Indiana 32 from Crawfordsville to Lebanon, then the shorter northern loop around. I took that last month but of course got stuck in a "funeral procession" on the two lane Indiana 32 with about 15 cars delayed by some senile old coot who wanted to drive 50 mph and didn't bother to pull off the dang road and let all the people who were competent to drive cars pass. When you see all these vehicles behind you have a clue, get off the darn road and let the big boys by.

That's an interesting idea, it won't happen due to money and I don't think traffic counts would justify it. They do need to redo the 465/865 52 interchange though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 23, 2016, 11:51:27 AM
Quote from: captkirk_4 on June 23, 2016, 10:38:04 AM
I really think I-865 needs to be extended eastwards to meet I-74 for traffic transitioning to and from I-70. It is currently a really long way around Indianapolis for I-74 traffic. The shortest route is Indiana 32 from Crawfordsville to Lebanon, then the shorter northern loop around. I took that last month but of course got stuck in a "funeral procession" on the two lane Indiana 32 with about 15 cars delayed by some senile old coot who wanted to drive 50 mph and didn't bother to pull off the dang road and let all the people who were competent to drive cars pass. When you see all these vehicles behind you have a clue, get off the darn road and let the big boys by.

The route you described is 4 miles longer than just following 74 via 465.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on July 05, 2016, 02:15:06 PM
Starting on July 6th or after, Interstate 65 southbound traffic will see a new traffic pattern in Lafayette. This will require the left lane to travel on the future northbound lane. Access to Exit 175 (Indiana State Road 25) will be maintained via the right lane before the split after the Wabash River bridge.

Article: http://fox59.com/2016/07/05/i-65-added-travel-lanes-project-will-shift-traffic-in-tippecanoe-county/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: dvferyance on July 05, 2016, 05:03:47 PM
Quote from: captkirk_4 on June 23, 2016, 10:38:04 AM
I really think I-865 needs to be extended eastwards to meet I-74 for traffic transitioning to and from I-70. It is currently a really long way around Indianapolis for I-74 traffic. The shortest route is Indiana 32 from Crawfordsville to Lebanon, then the shorter northern loop around. I took that last month but of course got stuck in a "funeral procession" on the two lane Indiana 32 with about 15 cars delayed by some senile old coot who wanted to drive 50 mph and didn't bother to pull off the dang road and let all the people who were competent to drive cars pass. When you see all these vehicles behind you have a clue, get off the darn road and let the big boys by.
The only thing I-865 needs is an interchange at Cooper Rd.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 05, 2016, 08:37:46 PM
Just as we got back used to using the Lake Station Toll Road interchange, we will have to go a good portion of the rest of the year without it.

Starting Monday July 11, the east- and westbound exit ramps from the Toll Road to the Borman will be closed for structural repairs, including the bridge over Burns Ditch (but not the bridges that were replaced during previous projects). Access to the Toll Road from the Borman will still be available. This work is scheduled to end mid-November.

Effective TONIGHT, the travel plazas near the Lake Station interchange will be closed for demolition and remodeling until summer 2017. Truck drivers will still be allowed to park for rest at designated areas, but there will be no gas, food, or restrooms available. Eastbound drivers will have to go to the next plaza east of State Route 39 for services, while westbound drivers will have to ride out to Chicago.

Finally, the next set of lane closures for the 80/90 PUSH project will begin tomorrow night, with one set between mileposts 55-62 in LaPorte County and the other set between mileposts 73-83 in the South Bend-Mishawaka area. This phase is to last four weeks.

Long range travelers may want to consider using US 20 to Indiana 331 to get to the Toll Road bound for Ohio (or the reverse if coming westbound).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Joe The Dragon on July 06, 2016, 12:14:36 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 05, 2016, 08:37:46 PM
Just as we got back used to using the Lake Station Toll Road interchange, we will have to go a good portion of the rest of the year without it.


Effective TONIGHT, the travel plazas near the Lake Station interchange will be closed for demolition and remodeling until summer 2017. Truck drivers will still be allowed to park for rest at designated areas, but there will be no gas, food, or restrooms available. Eastbound drivers will have to go to the next plaza east of State Route 39 for services, while westbound drivers will have to ride out to Chicago.


Will they rework them to fit direct ramps to the borman down the road?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 06, 2016, 09:07:35 PM
Quote from: Joe The Dragon on July 06, 2016, 12:14:36 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 05, 2016, 08:37:46 PM
Just as we got back used to using the Lake Station Toll Road interchange, we will have to go a good portion of the rest of the year without it.


Effective TONIGHT, the travel plazas near the Lake Station interchange will be closed for demolition and remodeling until summer 2017. Truck drivers will still be allowed to park for rest at designated areas, but there will be no gas, food, or restrooms available. Eastbound drivers will have to go to the next plaza east of State Route 39 for services, while westbound drivers will have to ride out to Chicago.


Will they rework them to fit direct ramps to the borman down the road?

There's no indication of any work of that scope to be done to those facilities either during this project or down the road.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 09, 2016, 07:11:08 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 16, 2016, 12:08:05 PM
Quote from: billtm on May 14, 2016, 10:11:55 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on May 12, 2016, 09:23:15 AM
A nice aerial view of the upcoming reroute of US 33 in Goshen in this story

http://www.wndu.com/content/news/Ceremony-for-groundbreaking-of-US-33-realignment-project-379155001.html (http://www.wndu.com/content/news/Ceremony-for-groundbreaking-of-US-33-realignment-project-379155001.html)

So why in the world would they put US33/SR15 on Main St. instead of 3rd for the stretch between Pike and Madison St.? 3rd looks like a higher quality road to me. :confused:

My memory may be rusty, but this is how I think it went down: City of Goshen wanted to take control of Main between Pike and Madison.  They upgraded 3rd in the hopes of getting 33 and 15 re-routed over to 3rd.  For some reason they didn't get approval to move 33.  Maybe it was because this project was in the works or something to do with it being a US highway.  Now that the new segment of 33 is being built that will get it off Main, I imagine they'll move 15 over to 3rd. 

So I spent some time in Goshen today.  IN 4 does now end at the city limits instead of downtown.  There are Begin and End signs at the eastern city limits.  Also, 15 and 33 are still on Main St. for now. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 10, 2016, 04:39:36 PM
the michigan st conversion is well under construction now, a lot of old business 31 signs are going down. Also, the us 31/20 bypass is in awful shape.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on July 13, 2016, 10:10:37 AM
Eastbound Sagamore Parkway bridge demolished:

http://wlfi.com/2016/07/12/eastbound-sagamore-parkway-bridge-demolished/ (http://wlfi.com/2016/07/12/eastbound-sagamore-parkway-bridge-demolished/)

This used to be US 52, until INDOT decided to screw up routings in the area, but I believe INDOT still owns the bridge. I'm not sure which, but one of the two bridges has the same design as the I-35(E or W) bridge that collapsed in the Minneapolis/St. Paul area.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on July 13, 2016, 10:24:20 AM
Quote from: billtm on July 13, 2016, 10:10:37 AM
I'm not sure which, but one of the two bridges has the same design as the I-35(E or W) bridge that collapsed in the Minneapolis/St. Paul area.

It's the one that they demolished.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 13, 2016, 03:46:13 PM
ya that was a very old bridge.  I'm not sure if ownership will turn over after it's complete though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on July 13, 2016, 04:54:38 PM
So I decided to look up the bridges and I found something kind of interesting. The one that was demolished was structurally deficient, but the other one (which I presume will also be demolished) was listed as 'functionally obsolete'. According to VirginiaDOT, "Functionally obsolete bridges are those that do not have adequate lane widths, shoulder widths, or vertical clearances to serve current traffic demand, or those that may be occasionally flooded." But what about the other bridge makes it functionally obsolete? It can't be flooded and they won't 3-lane it. :confused:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 13, 2016, 05:00:21 PM
Quote from: billtm on July 13, 2016, 04:54:38 PM
So I decided to look up the bridges and I found something kind of interesting. The one that was demolished was structurally deficient, but the other one (which I presume will also be demolished) was listed as 'functionally obsolete'. According to VirginiaDOT, "Functionally obsolete bridges are those that do not have adequate lane widths, shoulder widths, or vertical clearances to serve current traffic demand, or those that may be occasionally flooded." But what about the other bridge makes it functionally obsolete? It can't be flooded and they won't 3-lane it. :confused:
The other bridge I believe will not be repaired.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on July 13, 2016, 08:42:01 PM
The news article linked above said that they're going to rehabilitate the remaining bridge alongside building a new one.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on July 14, 2016, 05:12:24 PM
Quote from: jhuntin1 on July 13, 2016, 08:42:01 PM
The news article linked above said that they're going to rehabilitate the remaining bridge alongside building a new one.
I was too lazy to read to the end of the article... :pan:.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 19, 2016, 01:52:58 PM
this isn't really worthy of another thread, so I'll ask it here, does anyone think Lafayette should get a freeway bypass akin to i-469?  Or maybe the same thing but all at grade (so SR X65)?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: rawmustard on July 19, 2016, 02:40:43 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 19, 2016, 01:52:58 PM
this isn't really worthy of another thread, so I'll ask it here, does anyone think Lafayette should get a freeway bypass akin to i-469?  Or maybe the same thing but all at grade (so SR X65)?

I don't think there's as much traffic which bypasses Lafayette in the way it bypasses Fort Wayne. The new expressway on the west side seems more than adequate.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on July 19, 2016, 06:09:51 PM
Quote from: rawmustard on July 19, 2016, 02:40:43 PMI don't think there's as much traffic which bypasses Lafayette in the way it bypasses Fort Wayne. The new expressway on the west side seems more than adequate.

I disagree:

* The current west side bypass already has too many stoplights.  There's more interchanges on the old US 52 alignment/Sagamore Parkway.

* Lacks a decent connection to/from I-65 on the north

* Appears to lack the ROW for future upgrades if necessary.   Might have made a good canidate for a Texas-style design - starting with frontage roads and a wide median, and upgrading as necessary.

I would certainly be curious how much traffic a high quality connection to I-65 north of Lafayette that provided better access to Purdue would get.  Also, since per Wikipedia the Lafayette area has a decent growth rate, I would eventually expect a four lane connection to I-74 to end up being looked at, which would could also increase traffic on any bypass.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on July 19, 2016, 07:37:13 PM
My (INDOT thinking) solution to Lafayette would be to put US 52 on Veterans Memorial Parkway if they are going to route it over to the new US 231 alignment. Teal Rd in my opinion is hardly worthy enough to be carrying a US highway, plus it has that odd intersection at the bottom of the hill. I'd have SR 38 end at I-65 and have SRs 25 / 26 run concurrent with US 52 (and I-65) to fill the gaps. Then 4 lane US 231 down to Crawfordsville.

Using my personal brain (and not INDOT's) I'd put US 52 back onto Sagamore.  :banghead:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 19, 2016, 07:46:25 PM
Quote from: US 41 on July 19, 2016, 07:37:13 PM
My (INDOT thinking) solution to Lafayette would be to put US 52 on Veterans Memorial Parkway if they are going to route it over to the new US 231 alignment. Teal Rd in my opinion is hardly worthy enough to be carrying a US highway, plus it has that odd intersection at the bottom of the hill. I'd have SR 38 end at I-65 and have SRs 25 / 26 run concurrent with US 52 (and I-65) to fill the gaps. Then 4 lane US 231 down to Crawfordsville.

Using my personal brain (and not INDOT's) I'd put US 52 back onto Sagamore.  :banghead:
I completely agree, but to be fair, indot does plan on redoing teal and fixing that bizzare intersection.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on July 20, 2016, 10:25:03 PM
I think Lafayette could use an SR X65 expressway on the east side to help fill in the gaps. In my mind, it would tie into the Hoosier Heartland on one end, and US 231 on the other. This would help give US 52 a better routing, and give both SR 25 and SR 26 a routing, though not an efficient one for either of them.
Here's a picture I drew up a few years ago(Yes, I know, the zoom is quite far out :banghead:)
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/OoGgZn19RZvU334bhj_5JN3oh5CuK8oB9_l1i7hwHqc2gPi-bBgDAfF51EbxxCIaobEKQ-hahoFB1mZdbT2VkMI0wLqJDDwZlp9Qjc0P0p3LkaBEe4V3LZqNkev0TsUKRmX_y6skazGoYJA3s1AmSdXH0N8Z1nUjpqoJ_xp1lZAE6Tt3UMkow2CQ4zgNTufk71xTXwM92EwIHzmruwyj3JDq0T4EOWf85FbRDB7tQO4lOVrJWKraf7TwwF0wvIwRzjJnS5KcJ3-bjw35CPsLGUHZYvpmsWwJ5w8RKX6wCD6bzUm1070s4Fd9Crx7KkuaLtDdel9C8uY21gjeNnnUd_SRZ16Yr_KrUCMbKf9xlyG3X4oDlJ3sTafeM0YoZm0lHddaXW2frEwRiqyzqS9dl1x7o-0lfoB0ojFbMgA6R_CwMpVTZ1tmG1xrVyc243xKzlHGilWP6Mr40r0Rbup1W3XDTW79nn4TG0nKpSkhhDtmklGvIiLKInLdr2-NUrisa_ywqgqDukVu7fOWGdXIEA4RzzE9L8C800hjDZFmFfwlgszThrnn-HqBunS5xKelif9SPYaZ3CXNzlWg_kzYbmlmol_0MZs=w988-h594-no (https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/OoGgZn19RZvU334bhj_5JN3oh5CuK8oB9_l1i7hwHqc2gPi-bBgDAfF51EbxxCIaobEKQ-hahoFB1mZdbT2VkMI0wLqJDDwZlp9Qjc0P0p3LkaBEe4V3LZqNkev0TsUKRmX_y6skazGoYJA3s1AmSdXH0N8Z1nUjpqoJ_xp1lZAE6Tt3UMkow2CQ4zgNTufk71xTXwM92EwIHzmruwyj3JDq0T4EOWf85FbRDB7tQO4lOVrJWKraf7TwwF0wvIwRzjJnS5KcJ3-bjw35CPsLGUHZYvpmsWwJ5w8RKX6wCD6bzUm1070s4Fd9Crx7KkuaLtDdel9C8uY21gjeNnnUd_SRZ16Yr_KrUCMbKf9xlyG3X4oDlJ3sTafeM0YoZm0lHddaXW2frEwRiqyzqS9dl1x7o-0lfoB0ojFbMgA6R_CwMpVTZ1tmG1xrVyc243xKzlHGilWP6Mr40r0Rbup1W3XDTW79nn4TG0nKpSkhhDtmklGvIiLKInLdr2-NUrisa_ywqgqDukVu7fOWGdXIEA4RzzE9L8C800hjDZFmFfwlgszThrnn-HqBunS5xKelif9SPYaZ3CXNzlWg_kzYbmlmol_0MZs=w988-h594-no)
Also, I think that the US 231 bypass should be extended northward to I-65 in order to make Chicago access to the area better.
P.S. Google photos no longer puts the .png at the end of its urls, so I can't embed images anymore...  :angry:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: captkirk_4 on July 21, 2016, 09:33:25 PM
Quote from: billtm on July 20, 2016, 10:25:03 PM
I think Lafayette could use an SR X65 expressway on the east side to help fill in the gaps. In my mind, it would tie into the Hoosier Heartland on one end, and US 231 on the other. This would help give US 52 a better routing, and give both SR 25 and SR 26 a routing, though not an efficient one for either of them.
Here's a picture I drew up a few years ago(Yes, I know, the zoom is quite far out :banghead:)
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/OoGgZn19RZvU334bhj_5JN3oh5CuK8oB9_l1i7hwHqc2gPi-bBgDAfF51EbxxCIaobEKQ-hahoFB1mZdbT2VkMI0wLqJDDwZlp9Qjc0P0p3LkaBEe4V3LZqNkev0TsUKRmX_y6skazGoYJA3s1AmSdXH0N8Z1nUjpqoJ_xp1lZAE6Tt3UMkow2CQ4zgNTufk71xTXwM92EwIHzmruwyj3JDq0T4EOWf85FbRDB7tQO4lOVrJWKraf7TwwF0wvIwRzjJnS5KcJ3-bjw35CPsLGUHZYvpmsWwJ5w8RKX6wCD6bzUm1070s4Fd9Crx7KkuaLtDdel9C8uY21gjeNnnUd_SRZ16Yr_KrUCMbKf9xlyG3X4oDlJ3sTafeM0YoZm0lHddaXW2frEwRiqyzqS9dl1x7o-0lfoB0ojFbMgA6R_CwMpVTZ1tmG1xrVyc243xKzlHGilWP6Mr40r0Rbup1W3XDTW79nn4TG0nKpSkhhDtmklGvIiLKInLdr2-NUrisa_ywqgqDukVu7fOWGdXIEA4RzzE9L8C800hjDZFmFfwlgszThrnn-HqBunS5xKelif9SPYaZ3CXNzlWg_kzYbmlmol_0MZs=w988-h594-no (https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/OoGgZn19RZvU334bhj_5JN3oh5CuK8oB9_l1i7hwHqc2gPi-bBgDAfF51EbxxCIaobEKQ-hahoFB1mZdbT2VkMI0wLqJDDwZlp9Qjc0P0p3LkaBEe4V3LZqNkev0TsUKRmX_y6skazGoYJA3s1AmSdXH0N8Z1nUjpqoJ_xp1lZAE6Tt3UMkow2CQ4zgNTufk71xTXwM92EwIHzmruwyj3JDq0T4EOWf85FbRDB7tQO4lOVrJWKraf7TwwF0wvIwRzjJnS5KcJ3-bjw35CPsLGUHZYvpmsWwJ5w8RKX6wCD6bzUm1070s4Fd9Crx7KkuaLtDdel9C8uY21gjeNnnUd_SRZ16Yr_KrUCMbKf9xlyG3X4oDlJ3sTafeM0YoZm0lHddaXW2frEwRiqyzqS9dl1x7o-0lfoB0ojFbMgA6R_CwMpVTZ1tmG1xrVyc243xKzlHGilWP6Mr40r0Rbup1W3XDTW79nn4TG0nKpSkhhDtmklGvIiLKInLdr2-NUrisa_ywqgqDukVu7fOWGdXIEA4RzzE9L8C800hjDZFmFfwlgszThrnn-HqBunS5xKelif9SPYaZ3CXNzlWg_kzYbmlmol_0MZs=w988-h594-no)
Also, I think that the US 231 bypass should be extended northward to I-65 in order to make Chicago access to the area better.
P.S. Google photos no longer puts the .png at the end of its urls, so I can't embed images anymore...  :angry:

I noticed that the route from Champaign to Ft Wayne is really terrible trying to get through Lafayette, the best seems to be 231 to Veterans, 38 over to I65 and then to the Hoosier Highway. Also tried staying on US 24 all the way across Indiana to I-57 but once it goes down to two lanes west of Logansport you crawl through every small and medium sized town and was probably even worse.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on July 22, 2016, 08:32:34 PM
Quote from: captkirk_4 on July 21, 2016, 09:33:25 PM
Quote from: billtm on July 20, 2016, 10:25:03 PM
I think Lafayette could use an SR X65 expressway on the east side to help fill in the gaps. In my mind, it would tie into the Hoosier Heartland on one end, and US 231 on the other. This would help give US 52 a better routing, and give both SR 25 and SR 26 a routing, though not an efficient one for either of them.
Here's a picture I drew up a few years ago(Yes, I know, the zoom is quite far out :banghead:)
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/OoGgZn19RZvU334bhj_5JN3oh5CuK8oB9_l1i7hwHqc2gPi-bBgDAfF51EbxxCIaobEKQ-hahoFB1mZdbT2VkMI0wLqJDDwZlp9Qjc0P0p3LkaBEe4V3LZqNkev0TsUKRmX_y6skazGoYJA3s1AmSdXH0N8Z1nUjpqoJ_xp1lZAE6Tt3UMkow2CQ4zgNTufk71xTXwM92EwIHzmruwyj3JDq0T4EOWf85FbRDB7tQO4lOVrJWKraf7TwwF0wvIwRzjJnS5KcJ3-bjw35CPsLGUHZYvpmsWwJ5w8RKX6wCD6bzUm1070s4Fd9Crx7KkuaLtDdel9C8uY21gjeNnnUd_SRZ16Yr_KrUCMbKf9xlyG3X4oDlJ3sTafeM0YoZm0lHddaXW2frEwRiqyzqS9dl1x7o-0lfoB0ojFbMgA6R_CwMpVTZ1tmG1xrVyc243xKzlHGilWP6Mr40r0Rbup1W3XDTW79nn4TG0nKpSkhhDtmklGvIiLKInLdr2-NUrisa_ywqgqDukVu7fOWGdXIEA4RzzE9L8C800hjDZFmFfwlgszThrnn-HqBunS5xKelif9SPYaZ3CXNzlWg_kzYbmlmol_0MZs=w988-h594-no (https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/OoGgZn19RZvU334bhj_5JN3oh5CuK8oB9_l1i7hwHqc2gPi-bBgDAfF51EbxxCIaobEKQ-hahoFB1mZdbT2VkMI0wLqJDDwZlp9Qjc0P0p3LkaBEe4V3LZqNkev0TsUKRmX_y6skazGoYJA3s1AmSdXH0N8Z1nUjpqoJ_xp1lZAE6Tt3UMkow2CQ4zgNTufk71xTXwM92EwIHzmruwyj3JDq0T4EOWf85FbRDB7tQO4lOVrJWKraf7TwwF0wvIwRzjJnS5KcJ3-bjw35CPsLGUHZYvpmsWwJ5w8RKX6wCD6bzUm1070s4Fd9Crx7KkuaLtDdel9C8uY21gjeNnnUd_SRZ16Yr_KrUCMbKf9xlyG3X4oDlJ3sTafeM0YoZm0lHddaXW2frEwRiqyzqS9dl1x7o-0lfoB0ojFbMgA6R_CwMpVTZ1tmG1xrVyc243xKzlHGilWP6Mr40r0Rbup1W3XDTW79nn4TG0nKpSkhhDtmklGvIiLKInLdr2-NUrisa_ywqgqDukVu7fOWGdXIEA4RzzE9L8C800hjDZFmFfwlgszThrnn-HqBunS5xKelif9SPYaZ3CXNzlWg_kzYbmlmol_0MZs=w988-h594-no)
Also, I think that the US 231 bypass should be extended northward to I-65 in order to make Chicago access to the area better.
P.S. Google photos no longer puts the .png at the end of its urls, so I can't embed images anymore...  :angry:

I noticed that the route from Champaign to Ft Wayne is really terrible trying to get through Lafayette, the best seems to be 231 to Veterans, 38 over to I65 and then to the Hoosier Highway. Also tried staying on US 24 all the way across Indiana to I-57 but once it goes down to two lanes west of Logansport you crawl through every small and medium sized town and was probably even worse.

I used Google Maps and was really shocked to see that they would have you cut through downtown. After taking the exit for IN-25 north, they have you take a left on CR S100W, right on Elston, left on Old Romney which then turns into Wabash. Next, take a right on South, then left on 4th which then turns into Fannon, and then becomes Greenbush. Finally, take a left on 15th which becomes Schuyler to get out of Lafayatte.
What a fckd up routing... :wow:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on July 22, 2016, 10:25:31 PM
Quote from: billtm on July 22, 2016, 08:32:34 PM
Quote from: captkirk_4 on July 21, 2016, 09:33:25 PM
Quote from: billtm on July 20, 2016, 10:25:03 PM
I think Lafayette could use an SR X65 expressway on the east side to help fill in the gaps. In my mind, it would tie into the Hoosier Heartland on one end, and US 231 on the other. This would help give US 52 a better routing, and give both SR 25 and SR 26 a routing, though not an efficient one for either of them.
Here's a picture I drew up a few years ago(Yes, I know, the zoom is quite far out :banghead:)
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/OoGgZn19RZvU334bhj_5JN3oh5CuK8oB9_l1i7hwHqc2gPi-bBgDAfF51EbxxCIaobEKQ-hahoFB1mZdbT2VkMI0wLqJDDwZlp9Qjc0P0p3LkaBEe4V3LZqNkev0TsUKRmX_y6skazGoYJA3s1AmSdXH0N8Z1nUjpqoJ_xp1lZAE6Tt3UMkow2CQ4zgNTufk71xTXwM92EwIHzmruwyj3JDq0T4EOWf85FbRDB7tQO4lOVrJWKraf7TwwF0wvIwRzjJnS5KcJ3-bjw35CPsLGUHZYvpmsWwJ5w8RKX6wCD6bzUm1070s4Fd9Crx7KkuaLtDdel9C8uY21gjeNnnUd_SRZ16Yr_KrUCMbKf9xlyG3X4oDlJ3sTafeM0YoZm0lHddaXW2frEwRiqyzqS9dl1x7o-0lfoB0ojFbMgA6R_CwMpVTZ1tmG1xrVyc243xKzlHGilWP6Mr40r0Rbup1W3XDTW79nn4TG0nKpSkhhDtmklGvIiLKInLdr2-NUrisa_ywqgqDukVu7fOWGdXIEA4RzzE9L8C800hjDZFmFfwlgszThrnn-HqBunS5xKelif9SPYaZ3CXNzlWg_kzYbmlmol_0MZs=w988-h594-no (https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/OoGgZn19RZvU334bhj_5JN3oh5CuK8oB9_l1i7hwHqc2gPi-bBgDAfF51EbxxCIaobEKQ-hahoFB1mZdbT2VkMI0wLqJDDwZlp9Qjc0P0p3LkaBEe4V3LZqNkev0TsUKRmX_y6skazGoYJA3s1AmSdXH0N8Z1nUjpqoJ_xp1lZAE6Tt3UMkow2CQ4zgNTufk71xTXwM92EwIHzmruwyj3JDq0T4EOWf85FbRDB7tQO4lOVrJWKraf7TwwF0wvIwRzjJnS5KcJ3-bjw35CPsLGUHZYvpmsWwJ5w8RKX6wCD6bzUm1070s4Fd9Crx7KkuaLtDdel9C8uY21gjeNnnUd_SRZ16Yr_KrUCMbKf9xlyG3X4oDlJ3sTafeM0YoZm0lHddaXW2frEwRiqyzqS9dl1x7o-0lfoB0ojFbMgA6R_CwMpVTZ1tmG1xrVyc243xKzlHGilWP6Mr40r0Rbup1W3XDTW79nn4TG0nKpSkhhDtmklGvIiLKInLdr2-NUrisa_ywqgqDukVu7fOWGdXIEA4RzzE9L8C800hjDZFmFfwlgszThrnn-HqBunS5xKelif9SPYaZ3CXNzlWg_kzYbmlmol_0MZs=w988-h594-no)
Also, I think that the US 231 bypass should be extended northward to I-65 in order to make Chicago access to the area better.
P.S. Google photos no longer puts the .png at the end of its urls, so I can't embed images anymore...  :angry:

I noticed that the route from Champaign to Ft Wayne is really terrible trying to get through Lafayette, the best seems to be 231 to Veterans, 38 over to I65 and then to the Hoosier Highway. Also tried staying on US 24 all the way across Indiana to I-57 but once it goes down to two lanes west of Logansport you crawl through every small and medium sized town and was probably even worse.

I used Google Maps and was really shocked to see that they would have you cut through downtown. After taking the exit for IN-25 north, they have you take a left on CR S100W, right on Elston, left on Old Romney which then turns into Wabash. Next, take a right on South, then left on 4th which then turns into Fannon, and then becomes Greenbush. Finally, take a left on 15th which becomes Schuyler to get out of Lafayatte.
What a fckd up routing... :wow:

What are they thinking? Why not at worst follow the old routing of 231 (S 4th St) to the old routing of 26 (South St eastbound; Columbia St westbound from Main near Five Points if coming from that way) to the old routing of 25 (on Sagamore Pkwy, then right at Schuyler)?  Oh yeah, can't have route numbers anywhere they might make sense for people traveling a distance or going from one side of town to the other. Gotta go to GPS and let it calculate bonkers crap.

The Google routing is an example of the stupidity of INDOT getting rid of the route numbers across town.  As it is right now, the Hoosier Heartland route ties to I-65 okay, but what about traffic coming from the Champaign direction southwest of Lafayette? There is currently no thru route that makes any sense that is blazed with any numbering--38 now ends short of 52 by a block on the east side, 25 and 26 are discontinuous, 43 ends at 65 instead of coming down to meet 231/52 on South River or something--everything is whacked. The best way might possibly be to take the new 231 to near the new Meijer and turn right on old 52 down to Schuyler and turn left--but that is not a blazed trail anymore (and has the bridge construction going on right now with one lane each way to boot).  The route numbers being posted would have at least allowed for something like "taking 231 northbound to 25 northbound" and letting the signs do the talking, instead of inane GPS guesses on numerous city streets.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on July 23, 2016, 07:33:14 AM
I think the only realistic hope is for INDOT to complete the western bypass up to I-65 which I think will connect at SR 43. It may not be as direct as we would want for a connection to the Hoosier Heartland from the south, but it would be a huge improvement - assuming stoplights would be kept to a minimum.

If you look at a map, the only value of US 231 north of Lafayette is an a alternate to I-65 so why the US highway designation on it? Also, US 421 looks like it should end at I-74 in Greensburg. If that US 231 bypass in Lafayette is ever extended north, that would be a chance to re-route US 231 to SR 43 and US 421 to Michigan City. The value of some of the US routes in Indiana is questionable, at best.

BTW, it seems that about two thirds of a mile of US 35 in Kokomo may be decommissioned. It might be worth a note to INDOT to confirm, but this is the way it is:
- east of the US 31 freeway, the US 35 is not marked until CR 300E where the signs say "BEGIN" SR 22 and SOUTH US 35. Other than the US 31 bypass itself and one green sign on Markland Ave., US 35 signs do no not exist in Kokomo.
-  SR 22 was turned over to Kokomo, and the city re-striped the former SR 22 road this year including the part of the road that supposedly carries US 35 from US 31 to the Kokomo city limits on the east side

So is this the first US highway gap? Markland Avenue appears to be maintained by the City of Kokomo including that section that supposedly carries US 35, and there is no US 35 signage on that part. On the other hand, there is not any "END" or "BEGIN" signage for US 35 as there is for SR 22. It is just a weird situation, but more evidence of needing to get rid of an unnecessary US highway designation. Who would ever take US 35 for long distance travel anyway?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 23, 2016, 10:32:17 AM
Quote from: mukade on July 23, 2016, 07:33:14 AM
I think the only realistic hope is for INDOT to complete the western bypass up to I-65 which I think will connect at SR 43. It may not be as direct as we would want for a connection to the Hoosier Heartland from the south, but it would be a huge improvement - assuming stoplights would be kept to a minimum.

If you look at a map, the only value of US 231 north of Lafayette is an a alternate to I-65 so why the US highway designation on it? Also, US 421 looks like it should end at I-74 in Greensburg. If that US 231 bypass in Lafayette is ever extended north, that would be a chance to re-route US 231 to SR 43 and US 421 to Michigan City. The value of some of the US routes in Indiana is questionable, at best.

BTW, it seems that about two thirds of a mile of US 35 in Kokomo may be decommissioned. It might be worth a note to INDOT to confirm, but this is the way it is:
- east of the US 31 freeway, the US 35 is not marked until CR 300E where the signs say "BEGIN" SR 22 and SOUTH US 35. Other than the US 31 bypass itself and one green sign on Markland Ave., US 35 signs do no not exist in Kokomo.
-  SR 22 was turned over to Kokomo, and the city re-striped the former SR 22 road this year including the part of the road that supposedly carries US 35 from US 31 to the Kokomo city limits on the east side

So is this the first US highway gap? Markland Avenue appears to be maintained by the City of Kokomo including that section that supposedly carries US 35, and there is no US 35 signage on that part. On the other hand, there is not any "END" or "BEGIN" signage for US 35 as there is for SR 22. It is just a weird situation, but more evidence of needing to get rid of an unnecessary US highway designation. Who would ever take US 35 for long distance travel anyway?

US 35 is cosigned with 31 from the split just north of the city down to markland, that's how they fill the gap, SR 22 is still discontinuous and useless imo. also US 231 is unnecessary north of lafayette, same with 421 north of greensburg. the portion north of 465 should be SR 29. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 23, 2016, 10:33:53 AM
honestly us 421 has one of the most bizarre routings in the state. and it's not even signed at the i-74 exit with 465 for some reason.  side note, us 35 is completely useless in indiana. so is us 33 honestly
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 24, 2016, 07:44:50 PM
I think you guys are making too big of a deal about the distinction between US and state highways.  The highways that we now know as US 33, 35 and 421 have been called that for a long time now and changing them just because they no longer seem important enough to be US Highways seems frivolous to me.  It doesn't really matter that nobody would follow the routing of US 35 to get from Richmond to Michigan City.  The people who use all of the various parts of US 35 are used to the road being known as US 35 and changing it just to satisfy road geeks doesn't really make sense.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on July 24, 2016, 10:37:34 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 24, 2016, 07:44:50 PM
I think you guys are making too big of a deal about the distinction between US and state highways.  The highways that we now know as US 33, 35 and 421 have been called that for a long time now and changing them just because they no longer seem important enough to be US Highways seems frivolous to me.  It doesn't really matter that nobody would follow the routing of US 35 to get from Richmond to Michigan City.  The people who use all of the various parts of US 35 are used to the road being known as US 35 and changing it just to satisfy road geeks doesn't really make sense.

INDOT even makes note of that on the state maps--they have always mentioned something to the effect of "US Routes are shown in red but are not always the shortest or best routes between points"....basically saying that US routes are not anything special necessarily.  Might as well leave them alone and not renumber just for the sake of renumbering.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 25, 2016, 07:01:45 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 23, 2016, 10:33:53 AM
honestly us 421 has one of the most bizarre routings in the state. and it's not even signed at the i-74 exit with 465 for some reason.  side note, us 35 is completely useless in indiana. so is us 33 honestly

I don't see how US 33 is useless. That highway is part of the National Highway System and connects Elkhart County (one of the top 10 in Indiana by population) and Fort Wayne (2nd largest city.) US 35 however could stop in Muncie and US 421 in Greensburg. That said, what I think they should do is just get rid of SR 22 altogether. Decommission the part from Kokomo west to SR 29 or make it a spur of SR 29, and do the same with the stretch of roadway from I-69 to Upland (a spur of SR 5 in this case.) I don't think two three-digit highways are going to get people here too crazed and we can at least get rid of that long multiplex.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on July 25, 2016, 07:15:25 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 23, 2016, 10:32:17 AM
US 35 is cosigned with 31 from the split just north of the city down to markland, that's how they fill the gap, SR 22 is still discontinuous and useless imo. also US 231 is unnecessary north of lafayette, same with 421 north of greensburg. the portion north of 465 should be SR 29. 

No - the US 35 gap is east of the US 31 freeway for 2/3 of a mile. As for SR 22, it does also exist east of I-69 and west of Kokomo.

Quote from: silverback1065 on July 23, 2016, 10:33:53 AM
honestly us 421 has one of the most bizarre routings in the state. and it's not even signed at the i-74 exit with 465 for some reason.  side note, us 35 is completely useless in indiana. so is us 33 honestly

US 33 is the direct connection between Fort Wayne and Elkhart so that designation has some marginal value.

Quote from: cabiness42 on July 24, 2016, 07:44:50 PM
I think you guys are making too big of a deal about the distinction between US and state highways.  The highways that we now know as US 33, 35 and 421 have been called that for a long time now and changing them just because they no longer seem important enough to be US Highways seems frivolous to me.  It doesn't really matter that nobody would follow the routing of US 35 to get from Richmond to Michigan City.  The people who use all of the various parts of US 35 are used to the road being known as US 35 and changing it just to satisfy road geeks doesn't really make sense.

Well, the original point was there now seems to be a discontinuous US highway - even if it is a short gap.

US highways were meant to provide consistent numbering for highways before the Interstate age. US 35 replaced all or parts of SR 29, SR 17, and SR 21. US 421 replaced parts of SR 43 and SR 29. People travelling from Michigan City to Richmond may have actually driven US 35 all the way in 1955. Today, I bet most people would take US 35 to US 30 to US 31 to I-65 to I-70. So if it has no meaning, why would you think that it does not matter? BTW, I live two blocks from US 35, and we all call it "22", not "35" or "19". For those sections that are not concurrent with another route, why not just make it SR 35. US 421 is just plain silly.

To me, it comes down to thinking about the reason we have highway route numbers in the first place. If a routing no longer serves its intended purpose, why should it exist anymore? If route numbers could change once (from SR to US), why can't they change back? There have been states (Michigan and California come to mind) that have gotton rid of useless US highway designations.

Quote from: tdindy88 on July 25, 2016, 07:01:45 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 23, 2016, 10:33:53 AM
honestly us 421 has one of the most bizarre routings in the state. and it's not even signed at the i-74 exit with 465 for some reason.  side note, us 35 is completely useless in indiana. so is us 33 honestly

I don't see how US 33 is useless. That highway is part of the National Highway System and connects Elkhart County (one of the top 10 in Indiana by population) and Fort Wayne (2nd largest city.) US 35 however could stop in Muncie and US 421 in Greensburg. That said, what I think they should do is just get rid of SR 22 altogether. Decommission the part from Kokomo west to SR 29 or make it a spur of SR 29, and do the same with the stretch of roadway from I-69 to Upland (a spur of SR 5 in this case.) I don't think two three-digit highways are going to get people here too crazed and we can at least get rid of that long multiplex.

Why would we want another E-W highway with only an odd number like SR 47? I assume the reason why SR 22 was not replaced by the US 35 designation was so that it could be marked with proper cardinal directions.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 25, 2016, 08:13:07 PM
US 35 is a diagonal route across Indiana, perhaps the route should be given some flexibility on which cardinal direction is used, sign it east-west along its multiplex with SR 22, number be damned. Sign it east-west across northern Delaware County as well, sign it north-south for all other stretches. Driving that road, I'd be more interested in what direction I'm traveling than whether or not the highway number ends in an odd or even digit. I know it's the Indiana system to do things that way but perhaps a little flexibility could be used. Besides, SR 446 which clearly travels north to south from SR 46 to US 50 is signed east-west because it ends in an even number. When I'm traveling to Lake Monroe from Bloomington I sure as hell ain't driving east.

Or we could get rid of US 35 and sign the highways SR 17, 21 and 29. And bring back SR 35, why the hell not, no Hoosier would bitch about that.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 25, 2016, 08:16:18 PM
Does anyone know the original ending of SR 135 (former 35) in Indianapolis? 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 25, 2016, 08:39:14 PM
I believe it would be roughly at the intersection of Madison Avenue and South Street where Madison becomes Meridian Street (just south of Union Station.) It appears on some old city maps that SR 35 (and then 135) broke off onto Meridian Street and went south from there where US 31 followed Madison Avenue.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 25, 2016, 08:56:56 PM
interesting. on another note, google maps has been redone again, the look is weird and washed out.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: dvferyance on July 27, 2016, 10:58:39 PM
Quote from: billtm on July 20, 2016, 10:25:03 PM
I think Lafayette could use an SR X65 expressway on the east side to help fill in the gaps. In my mind, it would tie into the Hoosier Heartland on one end, and US 231 on the other. This would help give US 52 a better routing, and give both SR 25 and SR 26 a routing, though not an efficient one for either of them.
Here's a picture I drew up a few years ago(Yes, I know, the zoom is quite far out :banghead:)
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/OoGgZn19RZvU334bhj_5JN3oh5CuK8oB9_l1i7hwHqc2gPi-bBgDAfF51EbxxCIaobEKQ-hahoFB1mZdbT2VkMI0wLqJDDwZlp9Qjc0P0p3LkaBEe4V3LZqNkev0TsUKRmX_y6skazGoYJA3s1AmSdXH0N8Z1nUjpqoJ_xp1lZAE6Tt3UMkow2CQ4zgNTufk71xTXwM92EwIHzmruwyj3JDq0T4EOWf85FbRDB7tQO4lOVrJWKraf7TwwF0wvIwRzjJnS5KcJ3-bjw35CPsLGUHZYvpmsWwJ5w8RKX6wCD6bzUm1070s4Fd9Crx7KkuaLtDdel9C8uY21gjeNnnUd_SRZ16Yr_KrUCMbKf9xlyG3X4oDlJ3sTafeM0YoZm0lHddaXW2frEwRiqyzqS9dl1x7o-0lfoB0ojFbMgA6R_CwMpVTZ1tmG1xrVyc243xKzlHGilWP6Mr40r0Rbup1W3XDTW79nn4TG0nKpSkhhDtmklGvIiLKInLdr2-NUrisa_ywqgqDukVu7fOWGdXIEA4RzzE9L8C800hjDZFmFfwlgszThrnn-HqBunS5xKelif9SPYaZ3CXNzlWg_kzYbmlmol_0MZs=w988-h594-no (https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/OoGgZn19RZvU334bhj_5JN3oh5CuK8oB9_l1i7hwHqc2gPi-bBgDAfF51EbxxCIaobEKQ-hahoFB1mZdbT2VkMI0wLqJDDwZlp9Qjc0P0p3LkaBEe4V3LZqNkev0TsUKRmX_y6skazGoYJA3s1AmSdXH0N8Z1nUjpqoJ_xp1lZAE6Tt3UMkow2CQ4zgNTufk71xTXwM92EwIHzmruwyj3JDq0T4EOWf85FbRDB7tQO4lOVrJWKraf7TwwF0wvIwRzjJnS5KcJ3-bjw35CPsLGUHZYvpmsWwJ5w8RKX6wCD6bzUm1070s4Fd9Crx7KkuaLtDdel9C8uY21gjeNnnUd_SRZ16Yr_KrUCMbKf9xlyG3X4oDlJ3sTafeM0YoZm0lHddaXW2frEwRiqyzqS9dl1x7o-0lfoB0ojFbMgA6R_CwMpVTZ1tmG1xrVyc243xKzlHGilWP6Mr40r0Rbup1W3XDTW79nn4TG0nKpSkhhDtmklGvIiLKInLdr2-NUrisa_ywqgqDukVu7fOWGdXIEA4RzzE9L8C800hjDZFmFfwlgszThrnn-HqBunS5xKelif9SPYaZ3CXNzlWg_kzYbmlmol_0MZs=w988-h594-no)
Also, I think that the US 231 bypass should be extended northward to I-65 in order to make Chicago access to the area better.
P.S. Google photos no longer puts the .png at the end of its urls, so I can't embed images anymore...  :angry:
Just reroute IN-26 on the old US 52 it bypasses the heart of the city. The gap is gone problem solved.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 28, 2016, 06:53:51 AM
Quote from: mukade on July 25, 2016, 07:15:25 PM

Quote from: cabiness42 on July 24, 2016, 07:44:50 PM
I think you guys are making too big of a deal about the distinction between US and state highways.  The highways that we now know as US 33, 35 and 421 have been called that for a long time now and changing them just because they no longer seem important enough to be US Highways seems frivolous to me.  It doesn't really matter that nobody would follow the routing of US 35 to get from Richmond to Michigan City.  The people who use all of the various parts of US 35 are used to the road being known as US 35 and changing it just to satisfy road geeks doesn't really make sense.

Well, the original point was there now seems to be a discontinuous US highway - even if it is a short gap.

US highways were meant to provide consistent numbering for highways before the Interstate age. US 35 replaced all or parts of SR 29, SR 17, and SR 21. US 421 replaced parts of SR 43 and SR 29. People travelling from Michigan City to Richmond may have actually driven US 35 all the way in 1955. Today, I bet most people would take US 35 to US 30 to US 31 to I-65 to I-70. So if it has no meaning, why would you think that it does not matter? BTW, I live two blocks from US 35, and we all call it "22", not "35" or "19". For those sections that are not concurrent with another route, why not just make it SR 35. US 421 is just plain silly.

When the Federal Government created the US Highway system, the expense and inconvenience of changing the numbers of established highways was necessary.  Now it is not.  It would be a huge waste of money to re-sign a bunch of roads just to make a numbering system make a little bit more sense.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 28, 2016, 06:54:54 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 25, 2016, 08:13:07 PM
US 35 is a diagonal route across Indiana, perhaps the route should be given some flexibility on which cardinal direction is used, sign it east-west along its multiplex with SR 22, number be damned. Sign it east-west across northern Delaware County as well, sign it north-south for all other stretches. Driving that road, I'd be more interested in what direction I'm traveling than whether or not the highway number ends in an odd or even digit. I know it's the Indiana system to do things that way but perhaps a little flexibility could be used. Besides, SR 446 which clearly travels north to south from SR 46 to US 50 is signed east-west because it ends in an even number. When I'm traveling to Lake Monroe from Bloomington I sure as hell ain't driving east.

Or we could get rid of US 35 and sign the highways SR 17, 21 and 29. And bring back SR 35, why the hell not, no Hoosier would bitch about that.

Taxpayers paying for unnecessary signs would bitch about that.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 28, 2016, 07:48:26 AM
Quote from: dvferyance on July 27, 2016, 10:58:39 PM
Quote from: billtm on July 20, 2016, 10:25:03 PM
I think Lafayette could use an SR X65 expressway on the east side to help fill in the gaps. In my mind, it would tie into the Hoosier Heartland on one end, and US 231 on the other. This would help give US 52 a better routing, and give both SR 25 and SR 26 a routing, though not an efficient one for either of them.
Here's a picture I drew up a few years ago(Yes, I know, the zoom is quite far out :banghead:)
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/OoGgZn19RZvU334bhj_5JN3oh5CuK8oB9_l1i7hwHqc2gPi-bBgDAfF51EbxxCIaobEKQ-hahoFB1mZdbT2VkMI0wLqJDDwZlp9Qjc0P0p3LkaBEe4V3LZqNkev0TsUKRmX_y6skazGoYJA3s1AmSdXH0N8Z1nUjpqoJ_xp1lZAE6Tt3UMkow2CQ4zgNTufk71xTXwM92EwIHzmruwyj3JDq0T4EOWf85FbRDB7tQO4lOVrJWKraf7TwwF0wvIwRzjJnS5KcJ3-bjw35CPsLGUHZYvpmsWwJ5w8RKX6wCD6bzUm1070s4Fd9Crx7KkuaLtDdel9C8uY21gjeNnnUd_SRZ16Yr_KrUCMbKf9xlyG3X4oDlJ3sTafeM0YoZm0lHddaXW2frEwRiqyzqS9dl1x7o-0lfoB0ojFbMgA6R_CwMpVTZ1tmG1xrVyc243xKzlHGilWP6Mr40r0Rbup1W3XDTW79nn4TG0nKpSkhhDtmklGvIiLKInLdr2-NUrisa_ywqgqDukVu7fOWGdXIEA4RzzE9L8C800hjDZFmFfwlgszThrnn-HqBunS5xKelif9SPYaZ3CXNzlWg_kzYbmlmol_0MZs=w988-h594-no (https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/OoGgZn19RZvU334bhj_5JN3oh5CuK8oB9_l1i7hwHqc2gPi-bBgDAfF51EbxxCIaobEKQ-hahoFB1mZdbT2VkMI0wLqJDDwZlp9Qjc0P0p3LkaBEe4V3LZqNkev0TsUKRmX_y6skazGoYJA3s1AmSdXH0N8Z1nUjpqoJ_xp1lZAE6Tt3UMkow2CQ4zgNTufk71xTXwM92EwIHzmruwyj3JDq0T4EOWf85FbRDB7tQO4lOVrJWKraf7TwwF0wvIwRzjJnS5KcJ3-bjw35CPsLGUHZYvpmsWwJ5w8RKX6wCD6bzUm1070s4Fd9Crx7KkuaLtDdel9C8uY21gjeNnnUd_SRZ16Yr_KrUCMbKf9xlyG3X4oDlJ3sTafeM0YoZm0lHddaXW2frEwRiqyzqS9dl1x7o-0lfoB0ojFbMgA6R_CwMpVTZ1tmG1xrVyc243xKzlHGilWP6Mr40r0Rbup1W3XDTW79nn4TG0nKpSkhhDtmklGvIiLKInLdr2-NUrisa_ywqgqDukVu7fOWGdXIEA4RzzE9L8C800hjDZFmFfwlgszThrnn-HqBunS5xKelif9SPYaZ3CXNzlWg_kzYbmlmol_0MZs=w988-h594-no)
Also, I think that the US 231 bypass should be extended northward to I-65 in order to make Chicago access to the area better.
P.S. Google photos no longer puts the .png at the end of its urls, so I can't embed images anymore...  :angry:
Just reroute IN-26 on the old US 52 it bypasses the heart of the city. The gap is gone problem solved.

The original plan was to leave 52 alone and throw 26 onto it to bypass the city, then INDOT decided they'd rather fuck it up more and changed it to the mess we have now.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: dvferyance on July 28, 2016, 09:41:36 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 28, 2016, 07:48:26 AM
Quote from: dvferyance on July 27, 2016, 10:58:39 PM
Quote from: billtm on July 20, 2016, 10:25:03 PM
I think Lafayette could use an SR X65 expressway on the east side to help fill in the gaps. In my mind, it would tie into the Hoosier Heartland on one end, and US 231 on the other. This would help give US 52 a better routing, and give both SR 25 and SR 26 a routing, though not an efficient one for either of them.
Here's a picture I drew up a few years ago(Yes, I know, the zoom is quite far out :banghead:)
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/OoGgZn19RZvU334bhj_5JN3oh5CuK8oB9_l1i7hwHqc2gPi-bBgDAfF51EbxxCIaobEKQ-hahoFB1mZdbT2VkMI0wLqJDDwZlp9Qjc0P0p3LkaBEe4V3LZqNkev0TsUKRmX_y6skazGoYJA3s1AmSdXH0N8Z1nUjpqoJ_xp1lZAE6Tt3UMkow2CQ4zgNTufk71xTXwM92EwIHzmruwyj3JDq0T4EOWf85FbRDB7tQO4lOVrJWKraf7TwwF0wvIwRzjJnS5KcJ3-bjw35CPsLGUHZYvpmsWwJ5w8RKX6wCD6bzUm1070s4Fd9Crx7KkuaLtDdel9C8uY21gjeNnnUd_SRZ16Yr_KrUCMbKf9xlyG3X4oDlJ3sTafeM0YoZm0lHddaXW2frEwRiqyzqS9dl1x7o-0lfoB0ojFbMgA6R_CwMpVTZ1tmG1xrVyc243xKzlHGilWP6Mr40r0Rbup1W3XDTW79nn4TG0nKpSkhhDtmklGvIiLKInLdr2-NUrisa_ywqgqDukVu7fOWGdXIEA4RzzE9L8C800hjDZFmFfwlgszThrnn-HqBunS5xKelif9SPYaZ3CXNzlWg_kzYbmlmol_0MZs=w988-h594-no (https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/OoGgZn19RZvU334bhj_5JN3oh5CuK8oB9_l1i7hwHqc2gPi-bBgDAfF51EbxxCIaobEKQ-hahoFB1mZdbT2VkMI0wLqJDDwZlp9Qjc0P0p3LkaBEe4V3LZqNkev0TsUKRmX_y6skazGoYJA3s1AmSdXH0N8Z1nUjpqoJ_xp1lZAE6Tt3UMkow2CQ4zgNTufk71xTXwM92EwIHzmruwyj3JDq0T4EOWf85FbRDB7tQO4lOVrJWKraf7TwwF0wvIwRzjJnS5KcJ3-bjw35CPsLGUHZYvpmsWwJ5w8RKX6wCD6bzUm1070s4Fd9Crx7KkuaLtDdel9C8uY21gjeNnnUd_SRZ16Yr_KrUCMbKf9xlyG3X4oDlJ3sTafeM0YoZm0lHddaXW2frEwRiqyzqS9dl1x7o-0lfoB0ojFbMgA6R_CwMpVTZ1tmG1xrVyc243xKzlHGilWP6Mr40r0Rbup1W3XDTW79nn4TG0nKpSkhhDtmklGvIiLKInLdr2-NUrisa_ywqgqDukVu7fOWGdXIEA4RzzE9L8C800hjDZFmFfwlgszThrnn-HqBunS5xKelif9SPYaZ3CXNzlWg_kzYbmlmol_0MZs=w988-h594-no)
Also, I think that the US 231 bypass should be extended northward to I-65 in order to make Chicago access to the area better.
P.S. Google photos no longer puts the .png at the end of its urls, so I can't embed images anymore...  :angry:
Just reroute IN-26 on the old US 52 it bypasses the heart of the city. The gap is gone problem solved.

The original plan was to leave 52 alone and throw 26 onto it to bypass the city, then INDOT decided they'd rather fuck it up more and changed it to the mess we have now.
Hopefully this split routes will be done away with one day. They are just insane.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 11, 2016, 08:45:41 AM
does anyone know what the original routing of US 31 was between downtown indy and downtown carmel?  Rangeline road used to be 31 a long long time ago how did it jump from meridian to rangeline?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on August 11, 2016, 09:14:28 AM
Westfield Blvd from Meridian St north to the Hamilton County line, where it becomes Rangeline.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 11, 2016, 09:15:33 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on August 11, 2016, 09:14:28 AM
Westfield Blvd from Meridian St north to the Hamilton County line, where it becomes Rangeline.

that makes sense. that must have been a LONG time ago.  I'm assuming westfield blvd went through as a thoroughfare in broad ripple
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on August 11, 2016, 08:28:45 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 11, 2016, 09:15:33 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on August 11, 2016, 09:14:28 AM
Westfield Blvd from Meridian St north to the Hamilton County line, where it becomes Rangeline.

that makes sense. that must have been a LONG time ago.  I'm assuming westfield blvd went through as a thoroughfare in broad ripple

Yep. Though I'm not sure whether or not that tiny riverfront segment was wider and part of US 31 in the past or not.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on August 22, 2016, 06:12:38 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on February 08, 2016, 04:10:52 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on February 08, 2016, 03:28:09 PM
Quote from: theline on February 08, 2016, 01:58:02 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on February 08, 2016, 09:40:14 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on February 07, 2016, 09:27:32 PM
Looks like the Smart Streets project will push me to try some different approaches to and from Notre Dame on football Saturdays. 

I often end up weaving my way over to Miami Street after the game to avoid the traffic through downtown, but I've always gone straight up Michigan before the game.    The first few gamedays with new two way traffic should be a total cluster.  I'm guessing the gains I've made in reducing travel time with the upgrades to 31 are going to be given back inside South Bend.

Even before the changes, best way to beat Gameday traffic is to turn right off Michigan at Ireland.  Take Ireland to Miami and turn left.  Take Miami to Ridgeland Ridgedale and turn right, and then an immediate left onto Twyckenham.  Twyckenham is always the least crowded N-S street that gets you close to campus.
FIFY. As a South Bend resident. I agree that that's a good route. Just don't speed through the neighborhood, please.

I'm usually early enough before the games and parking in the neighborhood south of campus, that going up Michigan has not been an issue.

My departure route this last year became working my way down to Northside, across the Eddy Street bridge and over to Miami.  Your suggested route has given me another departure option.  I will need to check that out in a few weeks when I am back on campus.

I know they convert several streets near campus to one way on gamedays.  I suppose they could do something similar downtown, but that would take some significant police manpower to accomplish.  It will be interesting to see what guidance South Bend PD and Notre Dame provide prior to the first game.


Ha, yeah I used to live near a Ridgleand Ave in another city so that's why I got that mixed up.

Northside is excellent for getting yourself from one side of Eddy St to the other.  If I'm ever parked west of Eddy, I'll work my way down to Northside and then over to Twyckenham (though Northside passes under Twyckenham so you have to cut over through a neighborhood.

I've never, ever run into traffic problems going that way to leave the stadium. 

And today comes a story from WNDU that indicates the Smart Streets project will not be complete until November 15.  The story indicates they will convert Michigan and Main to two way traffic between Chippewa and Sample by September 10.  The remaining sections will not be completely switched over until November

http://www.wndu.com/content/news/Some-push-for-Smart-Streets-weekend-evening-work-390961391.html

I was in South Bend last Wednesday.  Michigan was mostly striped for two way traffic up to Sample.  The roundabout at Chippewa was open.   I could tell whether they had done any striping on Main as the road was closed due to flooding.  The small section I was on had not be striped.  There was also a huge hole in the pavement near the Burger King on Main.  I knew then the project could not possibly be completed by September 10.

I will be heeding all the advice above for football games this year - looking like we could have a total cluster, especially when southbound post game traffic on Main will go from three lanes to one at Sample.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 22, 2016, 08:31:39 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on August 22, 2016, 06:12:38 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on February 08, 2016, 04:10:52 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on February 08, 2016, 03:28:09 PM
Quote from: theline on February 08, 2016, 01:58:02 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on February 08, 2016, 09:40:14 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on February 07, 2016, 09:27:32 PM
Looks like the Smart Streets project will push me to try some different approaches to and from Notre Dame on football Saturdays. 

I often end up weaving my way over to Miami Street after the game to avoid the traffic through downtown, but I've always gone straight up Michigan before the game.    The first few gamedays with new two way traffic should be a total cluster.  I'm guessing the gains I've made in reducing travel time with the upgrades to 31 are going to be given back inside South Bend.

Even before the changes, best way to beat Gameday traffic is to turn right off Michigan at Ireland.  Take Ireland to Miami and turn left.  Take Miami to Ridgeland Ridgedale and turn right, and then an immediate left onto Twyckenham.  Twyckenham is always the least crowded N-S street that gets you close to campus.
FIFY. As a South Bend resident. I agree that that's a good route. Just don't speed through the neighborhood, please.

I'm usually early enough before the games and parking in the neighborhood south of campus, that going up Michigan has not been an issue.

My departure route this last year became working my way down to Northside, across the Eddy Street bridge and over to Miami.  Your suggested route has given me another departure option.  I will need to check that out in a few weeks when I am back on campus.

I know they convert several streets near campus to one way on gamedays.  I suppose they could do something similar downtown, but that would take some significant police manpower to accomplish.  It will be interesting to see what guidance South Bend PD and Notre Dame provide prior to the first game.


Ha, yeah I used to live near a Ridgleand Ave in another city so that's why I got that mixed up.

Northside is excellent for getting yourself from one side of Eddy St to the other.  If I'm ever parked west of Eddy, I'll work my way down to Northside and then over to Twyckenham (though Northside passes under Twyckenham so you have to cut over through a neighborhood.

I've never, ever run into traffic problems going that way to leave the stadium. 

And today comes a story from WNDU that indicates the Smart Streets project will not be complete until November 15.  The story indicates they will convert Michigan and Main to two way traffic between Chippewa and Sample by September 10.  The remaining sections will not be completely switched over until November

http://www.wndu.com/content/news/Some-push-for-Smart-Streets-weekend-evening-work-390961391.html

I was in South Bend last Wednesday.  Michigan was mostly striped for two way traffic up to Sample.  The roundabout at Chippewa was open.   I could tell whether they had done any striping on Main as the road was closed due to flooding.  The small section I was on had not be striped.  There was also a huge hole in the pavement near the Burger King on Main.  I knew then the project could not possibly be completed by September 10.

I will be heeding all the advice above for football games this year - looking like we could have a total cluster, especially when southbound post game traffic on Main will go from three lanes to one at Sample.

So what makes these "smart streets"
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 23, 2016, 10:04:56 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on August 22, 2016, 06:12:38 PM
And today comes a story from WNDU that indicates the Smart Streets project will not be complete until November 15.  The story indicates they will convert Michigan and Main to two way traffic between Chippewa and Sample by September 10.  The remaining sections will not be completely switched over until November

http://www.wndu.com/content/news/Some-push-for-Smart-Streets-weekend-evening-work-390961391.html

I was in South Bend last Wednesday.  Michigan was mostly striped for two way traffic up to Sample.  The roundabout at Chippewa was open.   I could tell whether they had done any striping on Main as the road was closed due to flooding.  The small section I was on had not be striped.  There was also a huge hole in the pavement near the Burger King on Main.  I knew then the project could not possibly be completed by September 10.

I will be heeding all the advice above for football games this year - looking like we could have a total cluster, especially when southbound post game traffic on Main will go from three lanes to one at Sample.

I never use Main for heading south after a game anyway.  I always get myself to Twyckenham or Miami. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on August 23, 2016, 01:49:40 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 23, 2016, 10:04:56 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on August 22, 2016, 06:12:38 PM
And today comes a story from WNDU that indicates the Smart Streets project will not be complete until November 15.  The story indicates they will convert Michigan and Main to two way traffic between Chippewa and Sample by September 10.  The remaining sections will not be completely switched over until November

http://www.wndu.com/content/news/Some-push-for-Smart-Streets-weekend-evening-work-390961391.html

I was in South Bend last Wednesday.  Michigan was mostly striped for two way traffic up to Sample.  The roundabout at Chippewa was open.   I could tell whether they had done any striping on Main as the road was closed due to flooding.  The small section I was on had not be striped.  There was also a huge hole in the pavement near the Burger King on Main.  I knew then the project could not possibly be completed by September 10.

I will be heeding all the advice above for football games this year - looking like we could have a total cluster, especially when southbound post game traffic on Main will go from three lanes to one at Sample.

I never use Main for heading south after a game anyway.  I always get myself to Twyckenham or Miami. 

Leaving immediately after the game, Miami has always been my choice, although after the USC game last year was able to just head down Main. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 23, 2016, 01:51:01 PM
Does anyone have a link or just information on what's going on?  all I know is that the oneways are going 2 way and i've heard about roundabouts somewhere. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 23, 2016, 01:58:18 PM
on a different note, i fear the new 106th st interchange will seriously fuck up traffic on 69/37.  I hope they force traffic trying to go north on 69 to stay in the c/d to 116th and 37.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on August 23, 2016, 03:33:15 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 23, 2016, 01:51:01 PM
Does anyone have a link or just information on what's going on?  all I know is that the oneways are going 2 way and i've heard about roundabouts somewhere.

Here you go: https://smartstreets.southbendin.gov/ (https://smartstreets.southbendin.gov/)

I'm amused by you whiners complaining about dealing with it a few times this fall. I've had to deal with it every day for months, since I work in downtown South Bend.  :banghead:

Quote from: silverback1065 on August 22, 2016, 08:31:39 PM
So what makes these "smart streets"

Absolutely nothing IMHO. Main and Michigan Streets are vital thoroughfares through downtown, and this project will choke them down to almost nothing. The mayor and council were trying to do something to revitalize downtown, so they hired a consultant. The consultant sells some nostalgic ideas about creating space for bikers and pedestrians. Building that space won't make them come. Once they paid millions to the consultant, they were pretty much stuck with his advice.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 23, 2016, 03:35:59 PM
Sounds like "smart streets" was nothing more than hot air then

Nexus 6P

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on August 23, 2016, 07:25:18 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 23, 2016, 01:58:18 PM
on a different note, i fear the new 106th st interchange will seriously fuck up traffic on 69/37.  I hope they force traffic trying to go north on 69 to stay in the c/d to 116th and 37.

Looking at the project diagram it shows a solid white line separating the traffic bound for 116th starting prior to the merge of the 106th entering traffic.  So I'd say yes on your c/d question.

https://secure.in.gov/indot/files/GFD_ProjectLocationMap.pdf
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on August 24, 2016, 10:44:16 PM
Quote from: theline on August 23, 2016, 03:33:15 PM

I'm amused by you whiners complaining about dealing with it a few times this fall. I've had to deal with it every day for months, since I work in downtown South Bend.  :banghead:

[/quote]

Hey, its all about me  :)

In all seriousness, I was thinking Wednesday about how much of a pain in the ass it had to be to deal with that construction on a daily basis. 

And Yeah, I struggle to see how this will change anything as far as downtown business.  I hope I'm wrong, but it will be a long slog that will require a lot of investment in new construction to get new businesses open on Main and Michigan.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on August 25, 2016, 06:25:40 PM
^^ I hope you're right and I'm wrong about the effect of Smart Streets on downtown development. There have been multiple signs that you might be right. The owner of the South Bend Cubs minor league baseball team has announced plans for a $21 million development near the Four Winds Field ballpark. The historic JMS Building is undergoing a $7.6 million renovation. A $14 million hotel project is replacing the vacant former College Football Hall of Fame. The city's tallest building, the long-neglected Chase Bank Tower, has chased out all its tenants in preparation for major renovations. There are many other projects in the works, so maybe I'm all wet.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on September 07, 2016, 11:04:57 AM
Update on the Smart Streets project from the South Bend Tribune

http://m.southbendtribune.com/news/local/smart-streets-set-to-open-in-advance-of-notre-dame/article_6ba2d05e-c974-57f2-a764-94d23c9b732b.html

Full completion of converting both Main and Michigan to two traffic is now set for November 15.

All roundabouts will open Thursday.

Two way traffic on Main and Michigan will start Thursday between Chippewa and Ewing (where Main was closed due to flooding last month).

Two traffic between Ewing and Sample is scheduled for October 15.



Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 07, 2016, 07:27:33 PM
Can someone in the area confirm whether SR 933 has been resigned along Main exclusively?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on September 08, 2016, 01:31:10 PM
^^ Not resigned so far and no word yet on when that will happen.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on September 10, 2016, 01:21:55 AM
Off topic, but here is a MAJOR project they will start working on in downtown Indy... Interstate 65 northbound traffic between Exit 113 and Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. Street will be CLOSED for 20 nights between 9pm and 6am. Advanced warning signs will direct through traffic - including large trucks - to take I-465 around Indianapolis.

Article:
http://kokomoherald.com/Content/Closings-and-Delays/Latest-News/Article/-4-6-million-project-will-modernize-downtown-I-65-bridges/29/760/28990
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on September 11, 2016, 12:47:44 AM
For all my angst about the impact today of Smartstreets on Notre Dame football traffic, today was rather uneventful for my trip.

I arrived in South Bend around 10:30 and decided to head straight up Michigan Street to campus.  No issues at all.  A bit of a line at the traffic light at Ewing where there was just single lane traffic, but nothing significant.  Went up through the new roundabouts and picked up my son who walked out to Peashway to meet us.  We went to lunch at Pitts BBQ and returned to park at the corner of Peashway and Foster.

Postgame we worked our way over to Eddy Street to Lincolnway to Miami to Ireland to 31 - the only issue was getting across Howard Street to work our down near St Jospeh High School then over to Eddy Street.   But 16 minutes after we got in the car, we were at the light on Ireland waiting to turn on 31.  I was back in Fishers about 2:10 after I got in the car.

Circumstances today may have made this a best case scenario - rain in the morning may have delayed the arrival of many people to closer to Noon or 1 pm versus the 10:30 am when we arrived.   Many fans left early given the large lead for Notre Dame coupled with the falling temps. 

Next week's game is a night game so traffic patterns may well change.  However fans will be arriving over a longer period during the day.  And when the game ends around 11 pm or later, there is not nearly as much as other traffic.

Perhaps inbound traffic was worse in the early afternoon and maybe southbound exit was problematic after the game.  But i did not see it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: captkirk_4 on September 11, 2016, 02:47:41 PM
Noticed how consistently "stinky" the bathrooms are in the Indiana Interstate Rest Stops. Nasty old musty bathroom smell, and doorknobs you have to grab to pull GOING OUT unlike all modern designs that let you push to leave so you don't have to touch your newly cleaned hands on some doorknob someone who didn't wash their hands just touched. Yuck. The hand drier in the one in Michigan City was also in the most awkward spot, in a narrow alcove between the sinks way way too low for even a short man to comfortably use. In contrast the Illinois Farmer City Rest Stop is clean and fresh.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: westerninterloper on September 11, 2016, 04:33:43 PM
Quote from: captkirk_4 on September 11, 2016, 02:47:41 PM
Noticed how consistently "stinky" the bathrooms are in the Indiana Interstate Rest Stops. Nasty old musty bathroom smell, and doorknobs you have to grab to pull GOING OUT unlike all modern designs that let you push to leave so you don't have to touch your newly cleaned hands on some doorknob someone who didn't wash their hands just touched. Yuck. The hand drier in the one in Michigan City was also in the most awkward spot, in a narrow alcove between the sinks way way too low for even a short man to comfortably use. In contrast the Illinois Farmer City Rest Stop is clean and fresh.

I agree...the ITR rest areas area all vintage, and not in a good way. When I drive from Toledo to Chicago, I always make a stop at the last Ohio Turnpike rest area, so I don't have to stop in Hoosierland.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on September 12, 2016, 01:37:04 PM
^^ The good news about the ITR rest rooms, in the long run, is that the concessionaire has announced plans to reconstruct all of the service plazas. That will surely include new rest rooms. Work has begun, but I suspect it will be several years for all to be finished.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: kennyshark on September 13, 2016, 01:07:54 PM
Speaking of the ITR, they seriously need to replace some of the signs in the stretch between Fremont and South Bend/Mishawaka.  Some of the lettering is wearing out so bad that, if I didn't go to South Bend three or four times a year, I would think they haven't put up any new signs since the 1960s (and I know that's not true).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on September 13, 2016, 01:32:44 PM
^^ Agreed. I noticed the same thing in almost all sections of the ITR, but forgot to comment here. Some of the signs are hard to read and most of them look awful.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 13, 2016, 01:45:43 PM
there are a few areas like this around the state.  some portions of 465 badly need new BGSes
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 24, 2016, 10:48:09 PM
Some major notes to pass along here as construction season begins to wind down...

For Indiana Toll Road travelers, some major interchanges will be closed (on top of the Lake Station exit) for pavement resurfacing. The first exit will be the Indiana 49 interchange (exit 31), which closes next week and stays closed until mid-October. Those looking to use Indiana 49 are asked to use the I-65 and US 12/20 ramp if coming from Chicago (exit 17, already facing heavy pressure due to the Lake Station ramp closure. I'd recommend using East Dunes Highway to US 20 east if you have time to spare). Those coming from Ohio or South Bend are encouraged to use US 421 to I-94 to connect to Indiana 49 (that ramp has recently reopened after it was resurfaced over the late summer).

The other major ramp closure set to begin next week involves the St. Joseph Valley Parkway ramp (US 31 Bypass, exit 72). Traffic from both directions are asked to use exit 83 (Indiana 331), but those coming from Chicago can use Indiana 39 to US 20 and Indiana 2 to hit the bypass.

On I-65, concrete restoration work has moved northward, with the work zone covering the area between I-80/94 and 61st Avenue. Entry to both directions of I-65 from Ridge Road has been cut off until the end of next week. Also, southbound drivers should expect heavy delays during rush hour at the work zone entry. Mainline traffic is reduced to one lane before traffic coming from I-80/94 east supplements the other two lanes. Northbound traffic has to watch the splits right after Ridge Road; only the left lane is allocated for I-65 traffic while the right two lanes split off for I-80/94 west. This project is expected to be completed before holiday travel commences.

On a more local note, I scouted the worksite at Indiana 130 and County Line Road to see progress. The traffic lights are up, along with the new railroad gantries, but they're all covered up at the moment. Also, the section of pavement by the railroad crossings have yet to be paved to fit the widened areas around said zone. They have to work QUICKLY to get done before the September 28 deadline.

Other observations: County Line Road will have the left turn signal for both directions, but Indiana 130 oddly will not. Instead, there will be illuminating "NO LEFT/RIGHT TURN" signs that will light up in the event of an approaching train.

Keep in mind that intersection is still CLOSED. I've seen traffic illegally drive around the barricades because the surface is driveable. DO NOT DO THAT.

UPDATE: Due to multiple factors, including concerns of increased traffic during Notre Dame home games, the ITRCC has decided to delay the Exit 72 resurfacing to Spring 2017. The Indiana 49 ramp closure, however, is currently in effect.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 28, 2016, 11:28:34 AM
someone finally fixed lafayette on google maps!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on September 28, 2016, 09:16:28 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 28, 2016, 11:28:34 AM
someone finally fixed lafayette on google maps!

Well, almost. It still shows SR 43 south of I-65.

Kokomo still shows SR 22 thru town.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 28, 2016, 09:42:33 PM
On a similar note, Apple Maps finally has I-69 extended from US 231 to Bloomington. They also have the new exit at Worthsville Road and I-65 in (that opened last Thanksgiving.)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: dfwmapper on September 29, 2016, 12:26:40 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 28, 2016, 11:28:34 AM
someone finally fixed lafayette on google maps!
The only possible option was for Google themselves to fix it, because Map Maker has broken edits blocking any changes to add or remove road names.

Now if it could just be fixed by INDOT to not run a US highway over a road that is pretty much the worst possible choice for passing through an area instead of following the goal of the US highway system and taking the best possible route between points, either remaining signed along Sagamore, or following I-65 north to SR 18 or US 24.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 12, 2016, 01:05:13 PM
any updates on the new downtown "smart" streets project in south bend?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on October 12, 2016, 10:23:23 PM
Funny you should ask.  Saw this story earlier today

http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/local/main-street-set-to-open-to-two-way-traffic-in/article_47bb549f-c260-5184-8c14-2d068eda19b1.html (http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/local/main-street-set-to-open-to-two-way-traffic-in/article_47bb549f-c260-5184-8c14-2d068eda19b1.html)

Both Michigan and Main open to two way traffic from Sample Street to the South on Friday.  Both had been open to two traffic from Ewing to the South.

Main will open completely to two way traffic on Saturday

No word in the story on when two way traffic on Michigan will be complete.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 12, 2016, 10:26:00 PM
Anyone up there willing to post some pictures?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on November 11, 2016, 12:19:39 PM
Updates from a local front.

With the exception of a few ramps, work on I-65 between 61st Avenue and I-80/94 has been suspended for the winter. The project was expected to finish by the end of this month, but a tragic accident involving a construction worker delayed the project for a few weeks. The ramps that were closed at the time will reopen soon, while all the lanes have been shifted to the original positions. Widening work between US 30 and Indiana 2 is to begin next spring, as scheduled. (The goal was amended to Indiana 10, but INDOT and the contractors agreed to scale it back to Indiana 2 to ensure higher quality work.)

Phase I of I-94 restoration should be wrapping up shortly. All that remains is rumble strip installation on the shoulders. Very nicely done, with a unique striping method for acceleration/deceleration lanes (at least, unique to Northwest Indiana): instead of the standard dashed lines to mark lanes, they use very short dashes in rapid succession from the lane's start to the gore (or from the merging point of the gore to the lane's termination for entering traffic). I wonder if that will be continued practice for future projects. I applaud this if so.

The Norfolk Southern portion of the County Line Road/Indiana 130 intersection improvement project has all but wrapped up. It was still closed as of Wednesday, but was striped. County Line Road has the benefit of left turn signals, while Indiana 130 traffic will have the benefit of a constant green light, along with "NO LEFT/RIGHT TURN" signs that light up, in the event of an oncoming train (triggered by the modified railroad crossing signals). Northbound County Line Road traffic has an extra traffic light in front of the railroad crossing should drivers be stuck behind them.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on November 16, 2016, 06:32:54 PM
Updates:

The County Line Road/Indiana 130 intersection is now fully open. There may be landscaping work to be done in the spring, but traffic will be unaffected.

In more important good news, two major ramps will reopen this Friday, just in time to keep Thanksgiving traffic flowing. The Indiana Toll Road ramps to both Indiana 49 (exit 31) and the Borman Expressway (the Lake Station interchange, Exit 21) will be opened after months of rehabilitation work. This should take a lot of pressure off the Interstate 65 ramp (exit 17) and the Portage/Willowcreek Road ramp (exit 24) as traffic is supposed to swell in the coming days.

On a more local note, the final phase of the 61st Avenue modernization project in Hobart is nearing its end. All major restructuring is finished; the last few days will be devoted to curbing, striping, landscaping, and adding guard rails to the new bridge. New features include a roundabout at Wisconsin street (with four spokes, but only three are usable since the newest spoke simply dead ends), a landscaped median, LED lighting, and center turn lanes where applicable. Like all other local projects, it's set for completion before Thanksgiving.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 26, 2016, 09:59:00 AM
I've heard INDOT has resurrected SR 329 in logansport, can anyone confirm this and where the start/end is?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 27, 2016, 11:45:26 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 26, 2016, 09:59:00 AM
I've heard INDOT has resurrected SR 329 in logansport, can anyone confirm this and where the start/end is?

Drove through there Wednesday.  The very short stretch of Burlington Ave between where IN 29 veers off to meet US 24/35 and where IN 25 exits off US 24/35 to go through town is now signed as IN 329. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 27, 2016, 12:13:31 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on November 27, 2016, 11:45:26 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 26, 2016, 09:59:00 AM
I've heard INDOT has resurrected SR 329 in logansport, can anyone confirm this and where the start/end is?

Drove through there Wednesday.  The very short stretch of Burlington Ave between where IN 29 veers off to meet US 24/35 and where IN 25 exits off US 24/35 to go through town is now signed as IN 329.

is the old us 24/35 segment still signed as monticello road?  Tried to add 329 back to google maps, but map maker is garbage and won't let me, looking forward to its demise in march
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 27, 2016, 01:03:01 PM
Passed under old 24/35 on 25, so I have no idea how it's signed. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on November 27, 2016, 09:02:47 PM
INDOT has seriously got to do something about I-70 between Terre Haute and Indy. There is always perpetual construction and you always run into a traffic jam. Honestly you're better off taking US 40. I'd fully support widening I-70 to 3 lanes each direction between TH and Indy in exchange for making it a toll road. It needs done somehow.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on November 27, 2016, 09:47:53 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 27, 2016, 12:13:31 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on November 27, 2016, 11:45:26 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 26, 2016, 09:59:00 AM
I've heard INDOT has resurrected SR 329 in logansport, can anyone confirm this and where the start/end is?

Drove through there Wednesday.  The very short stretch of Burlington Ave between where IN 29 veers off to meet US 24/35 and where IN 25 exits off US 24/35 to go through town is now signed as IN 329.

is the old us 24/35 segment still signed as monticello road?  Tried to add 329 back to google maps, but map maker is garbage and won't let me, looking forward to its demise in march

Drove by there a week ago and the exit signage for Monticello Road is still there on US24/35 west/northbound.  The old stretch of road is Monticello Road at least to INDOT's signage, anyway.

It is still weird seeing that dual carriageway ahead of you and peeling left, not using it.  Not something you expect to see in a place like Logansport for some reason.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 27, 2016, 09:49:10 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on November 27, 2016, 09:47:53 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 27, 2016, 12:13:31 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on November 27, 2016, 11:45:26 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 26, 2016, 09:59:00 AM
I've heard INDOT has resurrected SR 329 in logansport, can anyone confirm this and where the start/end is?

Drove through there Wednesday.  The very short stretch of Burlington Ave between where IN 29 veers off to meet US 24/35 and where IN 25 exits off US 24/35 to go through town is now signed as IN 329.

is the old us 24/35 segment still signed as monticello road?  Tried to add 329 back to google maps, but map maker is garbage and won't let me, looking forward to its demise in march

Drove by there a week ago and the exit signage for Monticello Road is still there on US24/35 west/northbound.  The old stretch of road is Monticello Road at least to INDOT's signage, anyway.

It is still weird seeing that dual carriageway ahead of you and peeling left, not using it.  Not something you expect to see in a place like Logansport for some reason.

they should have removed it
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 27, 2016, 09:50:05 PM
Quote from: US 41 on November 27, 2016, 09:02:47 PM
INDOT has seriously got to do something about I-70 between Terre Haute and Indy. There is always perpetual construction and you always run into a traffic jam. Honestly you're better off taking US 40. I'd fully support widening I-70 to 3 lanes each direction between TH and Indy in exchange for making it a toll road. It needs done somehow.

us 40 is usually the better choice if traffic is horrible and you aren't in a hurry.  they do plan on widening it to 6 lanes in about 500 yrs or so
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on November 28, 2016, 01:54:59 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 27, 2016, 09:49:10 PM


they should have removed it

I don't know why they didn't narrow it down to 2 lanes that would meet the Monticello Road "ramp".  There would be fewer bridges to maintain, less snow to plow....

They even left the BGSs in place for the former US 24/35 turn at SR 29--they basically walked away from it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 29, 2016, 05:52:55 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on November 28, 2016, 01:54:59 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 27, 2016, 09:49:10 PM


they should have removed it

I don't know why they didn't narrow it down to 2 lanes that would meet the Monticello Road "ramp".  There would be fewer bridges to maintain, less snow to plow....

They even left the BGSs in place for the former US 24/35 turn at SR 29--they basically walked away from it.
I hate it when INDOT does that, they do it all the time, look at old sr 43 in west lafayette, they just removed their shields and left the rest of the signs up.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 30, 2016, 05:43:38 PM
drove by the smokey row road (136th st) keystone pkwy interchange, the ramp going from nb keystone to smokey row/ 136th will be metered.  It's not functioning yet, but it's a hawk signal, which is a weird choice, since those are only used for ped crossings in between intersections.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on November 30, 2016, 09:53:57 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on August 23, 2016, 07:25:18 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 23, 2016, 01:58:18 PM
on a different note, i fear the new 106th st interchange will seriously fuck up traffic on 69/37.  I hope they force traffic trying to go north on 69 to stay in the c/d to 116th and 37.

Looking at the project diagram it shows a solid white line separating the traffic bound for 116th starting prior to the merge of the 106th entering traffic.  So I'd say yes on your c/d question.

https://secure.in.gov/indot/files/GFD_ProjectLocationMap.pdf

Looks like they are getting close to opening the 106th Street exit on I-69.  I drove through tonight and all the barriers along 69 seem to have been removed.  I came through about 8:00 p.m. so very dark and I may have missed a few.

iAs noted, It looks like there will be no barrier to stop you from entering northbound off 106th street and directly moving over to the northbound 69 lanes, although traffic will likely prevent that.  The overhead signs at the start the c/d of exit 205 include one lane marked as North 37 TO I-69 North.  I would guess there will be a rash of near misses (and quite a few not misses) until motorists get used to the setup.  I will have my head on a swivel moving through there.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on December 01, 2016, 10:56:26 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 30, 2016, 05:43:38 PM
drove by the smokey row road (136th st) keystone pkwy interchange, the ramp going from nb keystone to smokey row/ 136th will be metered.  It's not functioning yet, but it's a hawk signal, which is a weird choice, since those are only used for ped crossings in between intersections.

https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/publications/research/safety/00067/000678.pdf
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on December 02, 2016, 12:30:23 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on November 30, 2016, 09:53:57 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on August 23, 2016, 07:25:18 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 23, 2016, 01:58:18 PM
on a different note, i fear the new 106th st interchange will seriously fuck up traffic on 69/37.  I hope they force traffic trying to go north on 69 to stay in the c/d to 116th and 37.

Looking at the project diagram it shows a solid white line separating the traffic bound for 116th starting prior to the merge of the 106th entering traffic.  So I'd say yes on your c/d question.

https://secure.in.gov/indot/files/GFD_ProjectLocationMap.pdf

Looks like they are getting close to opening the 106th Street exit on I-69.  I drove through tonight and all the barriers along 69 seem to have been removed.  I came through about 8:00 p.m. so very dark and I may have missed a few.

iAs noted, It looks like there will be no barrier to stop you from entering northbound off 106th street and directly moving over to the northbound 69 lanes, although traffic will likely prevent that.  The overhead signs at the start the c/d of exit 205 include one lane marked as North 37 TO I-69 North.  I would guess there will be a rash of near misses (and quite a few not misses) until motorists get used to the setup.  I will have my head on a swivel moving through there.

I just reworked the northbound ramp connection on Google Maps to make it clear that northbound traffic entering from 106th must  stay on the c/d and not enter directly into I69.   At least that way navigation directions shouldn't contribute to a potential problem.  (Changes published in mapmaker, won't show up on the public map til tomorrow.)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on December 02, 2016, 05:31:48 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on December 02, 2016, 12:30:23 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on November 30, 2016, 09:53:57 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on August 23, 2016, 07:25:18 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 23, 2016, 01:58:18 PM
on a different note, i fear the new 106th st interchange will seriously fuck up traffic on 69/37.  I hope they force traffic trying to go north on 69 to stay in the c/d to 116th and 37.

Looking at the project diagram it shows a solid white line separating the traffic bound for 116th starting prior to the merge of the 106th entering traffic.  So I'd say yes on your c/d question.

https://secure.in.gov/indot/files/GFD_ProjectLocationMap.pdf

Looks like they are getting close to opening the 106th Street exit on I-69.  I drove through tonight and all the barriers along 69 seem to have been removed.  I came through about 8:00 p.m. so very dark and I may have missed a few.

iAs noted, It looks like there will be no barrier to stop you from entering northbound off 106th street and directly moving over to the northbound 69 lanes, although traffic will likely prevent that.  The overhead signs at the start the c/d of exit 205 include one lane marked as North 37 TO I-69 North.  I would guess there will be a rash of near misses (and quite a few not misses) until motorists get used to the setup.  I will have my head on a swivel moving through there.

I just reworked the northbound ramp connection on Google Maps to make it clear that northbound traffic entering from 106th must  stay on the c/d and not enter directly into I69.   At least that way navigation directions shouldn't contribute to a potential problem.  (Changes published in mapmaker, won't show up on the public map til tomorrow.)

Saw the set up a little better in the daylight this morning as I was on 69 Southbound. .  Starting just before the 106th northbound entrance ramp reaches I-69, the two right lanes on 69 North are separated by a double white line - looks to be maybe a foot apart.  The two overhead gantries each have a square white sign that says "Do Not Cross Double White Line".  There is one just past 106th and one further down near the 116th Street exit.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on December 02, 2016, 05:38:51 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on December 02, 2016, 12:30:23 AM
I just reworked the northbound ramp connection on Google Maps to make it clear that northbound traffic entering from 106th must  stay on the c/d and not enter directly into I69.   At least that way navigation directions shouldn't contribute to a potential problem.  (Changes published in mapmaker, won't show up on the public map til tomorrow.)

The update to separate the c/d lane is now live on Google Maps and reflected in navigation directions.   It will take a week or two for the traffic view to catch up.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 03, 2016, 07:24:27 PM
that's good to know.  I feel like a jersey barrier would have been better though.  I hope they plan to mill and resurface the interstate, they've been moving the lines so much the old lines that have been removed are making things confusing. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: wanderer2575 on December 03, 2016, 11:26:05 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on November 28, 2016, 01:54:59 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 27, 2016, 09:49:10 PM


they should have removed it

I don't know why they didn't narrow it down to 2 lanes that would meet the Monticello Road "ramp".  There would be fewer bridges to maintain, less snow to plow....

They even left the BGSs in place for the former US 24/35 turn at SR 29--they basically walked away from it.

Why remove the BGSs?  They still correctly point to the routes.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 03, 2016, 11:29:10 PM
Quote from: wanderer2575 on December 03, 2016, 11:26:05 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on November 28, 2016, 01:54:59 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 27, 2016, 09:49:10 PM


they should have removed it

I don't know why they didn't narrow it down to 2 lanes that would meet the Monticello Road "ramp".  There would be fewer bridges to maintain, less snow to plow....

They even left the BGSs in place for the former US 24/35 turn at SR 29--they basically walked away from it.

Why remove the BGSs?  They still correctly point to the routes.
Because they fall into disrepair (the city never maintains them), also the one I was referring to is particularly annoying because the old 43 bgs now just says "Brookston" which makes you think that you're in Brookston.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on December 06, 2016, 10:37:10 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on December 02, 2016, 05:31:48 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on December 02, 2016, 12:30:23 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on November 30, 2016, 09:53:57 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on August 23, 2016, 07:25:18 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 23, 2016, 01:58:18 PM
on a different note, i fear the new 106th st interchange will seriously fuck up traffic on 69/37.  I hope they force traffic trying to go north on 69 to stay in the c/d to 116th and 37.

Looking at the project diagram it shows a solid white line separating the traffic bound for 116th starting prior to the merge of the 106th entering traffic.  So I'd say yes on your c/d question.

https://secure.in.gov/indot/files/GFD_ProjectLocationMap.pdf

Looks like they are getting close to opening the 106th Street exit on I-69.  I drove through tonight and all the barriers along 69 seem to have been removed.  I came through about 8:00 p.m. so very dark and I may have missed a few.

iAs noted, It looks like there will be no barrier to stop you from entering northbound off 106th street and directly moving over to the northbound 69 lanes, although traffic will likely prevent that.  The overhead signs at the start the c/d of exit 205 include one lane marked as North 37 TO I-69 North.  I would guess there will be a rash of near misses (and quite a few not misses) until motorists get used to the setup.  I will have my head on a swivel moving through there.

I just reworked the northbound ramp connection on Google Maps to make it clear that northbound traffic entering from 106th must  stay on the c/d and not enter directly into I69.   At least that way navigation directions shouldn't contribute to a potential problem.  (Changes published in mapmaker, won't show up on the public map til tomorrow.)

Saw the set up a little better in the daylight this morning as I was on 69 Southbound. .  Starting just before the 106th northbound entrance ramp reaches I-69, the two right lanes on 69 North are separated by a double white line - looks to be maybe a foot apart.  The two overhead gantries each have a square white sign that says "Do Not Cross Double White Line".  There is one just past 106th and one further down near the 116th Street exit.

I let myself drift in to the double white lines tonight on my way home.  There are rumble strips between the white lines.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 07, 2016, 07:38:00 AM
it's scheduled to be open today i think, INDOT says it has a "major" announcement today.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 07, 2016, 03:23:43 PM
it's open
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on December 07, 2016, 04:22:30 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 07, 2016, 03:23:43 PM
it's open

The segments on google maps have been changed from "closed for maint" to "completed".

The northbound exit ramp still shows up as "closed" on traffic view, but that's old data from the ramp I removed and reworked last week.   The traffic view data will eventually catch up the next time an export happens.   For navigation purposes it should be fine.  (Update: Just tested, navigation is working correctly).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on December 07, 2016, 11:00:01 PM
I use 69 each day for my commute to downtown Indy.  I have to say this project had the least impact on my commute of any of the multitude of projects on 69/465/70 over the 20 years I've lived here.

Part of it, I'm sure, is that for the most part the addition of the fourth lane in each direction on 69 has significantly eased congestion during a normal rush hour without accidents.  For the most part any delays I have on my commute now occur on 70 instead of 69.

But still, kudos to all involved in the construction.  Decided tonight to wait until the weekend when I can use the new interchange during daylight to check things out. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 09, 2016, 02:31:39 PM
the new exit is nice, here are my thoughts on it:

it's really nice, the roundabout makes for high speeds to get through.

worried that wb 106th ramp to nb c/d ramp will cause weaving issues for travelers trying to get to 116th from 69/37.

didn't drive the ramps to and from sb 69.

they don't mention 37 at all on 106th st, which is weird since it is on 82nd, 96th, and 116th.

they painted a US 37 shield on 69, i don't know how they allowed that to happen.

very minor error, but the ped xing sign arrows are pointing in the wrong direction at the xwalks. 

i'm not sure i believe the idea that this will make traffic better, sounds like pr bs, we'll see.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 13, 2016, 07:29:06 AM
random thought, why did the state rename sr 35 to 135 when us 35 was routed into the state, but sr 64, 65, 69, and 70 still exist?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on December 13, 2016, 09:27:36 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 13, 2016, 07:29:06 AM
random thought, why did the state rename sr 35 to 135 when us 35 was routed into the state, but sr 64, 65, 69, and 70 still exist?

They probably figured no one was going to confuse interstate highways with 2 lane state routes, but someone might confuse a 2 lane state route with another two lane US route of the same number. That's my guess.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 13, 2016, 02:21:37 PM
Quote from: US 41 on December 13, 2016, 09:27:36 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 13, 2016, 07:29:06 AM
random thought, why did the state rename sr 35 to 135 when us 35 was routed into the state, but sr 64, 65, 69, and 70 still exist?

They probably figured no one was going to confuse interstate highways with 2 lane state routes, but someone might confuse a 2 lane state route with another two lane US route of the same number. That's my guess.

That was probably the thought process, but let me tell you from experience that it can get confusing when you have to tell somebody to take 64 to 64 as part of the directions.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 13, 2016, 08:09:59 PM
If I understand correctly, SR 35 became SR 135 in 1935 well before interstates became a thing. I think the state always had a policy of not repeating state and U.S. highway numbers but by the time the interstates were being built (with their own nationally-designated numbers) it was deemed too much to change the numbers of several state highways. Changing the name of a long state highway (such as SR 64) would probably be deemed a waste of time and money now.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on December 13, 2016, 09:55:40 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 09, 2016, 02:31:39 PM

they painted a US 37 shield on 69, i don't know how they allowed that to happen.


In fact they painted four US 37 shields on 69.  Two sets of two, one before the 106th ramp, one after.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on December 13, 2016, 10:02:11 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 13, 2016, 08:09:59 PM
If I understand correctly, SR 35 became SR 135 in 1935 well before interstates became a thing. I think the state always had a policy of not repeating state and U.S. highway numbers but by the time the interstates were being built (with their own nationally-designated numbers) it was deemed too much to change the numbers of several state highways. Changing the name of a long state highway (such as SR 64) would probably be deemed a waste of time and money now.

Ohio Route 90 used to run through my home town (it ran from Petersburg north to Lake Erie, through downtown Youngstown.  When I-90 came to Ohio (before I was born), they removed the Ohio 90 designation and extended Ohio 170 north from Petersburg (a small section heading southeast to Pennsylvania became an extension of Ohio 617).  Later, Ohio 170 north of Youngstown became Ohio 193.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 13, 2016, 10:16:49 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on December 13, 2016, 09:55:40 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 09, 2016, 02:31:39 PM

they painted a US 37 shield on 69, i don't know how they allowed that to happen.


In fact they painted four US 37 shields on 69.  Two sets of two, one before the 106th ramp, one after.

careless contractor and inspector  :banghead:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: pianocello on December 14, 2016, 11:23:02 AM
New signs displaying the Lincoln Highway around Valparaiso:

(https://c5.staticflickr.com/1/738/31497033572_080f0435a1_k.jpg)

This was eastbound on Penna Hill Dr, and it notes the Lincoln Highway turning south onto Sturdy Rd and east on Comeford Rd towards US 30 (map) (https://www.google.com/maps/@41.4558418,-87.0316551,16.25z). Funnily enough, I had no idea Penna Hill Rd was part of the route. From downtown Valpo, I always thought it took Lincolnway->Garfield->LaPorte->Sturdy after it was rerouted from South Bend.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on December 18, 2016, 12:24:30 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on December 02, 2016, 05:31:48 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on December 02, 2016, 12:30:23 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on November 30, 2016, 09:53:57 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on August 23, 2016, 07:25:18 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 23, 2016, 01:58:18 PM
on a different note, i fear the new 106th st interchange will seriously fuck up traffic on 69/37.  I hope they force traffic trying to go north on 69 to stay in the c/d to 116th and 37.

Looking at the project diagram it shows a solid white line separating the traffic bound for 116th starting prior to the merge of the 106th entering traffic.  So I'd say yes on your c/d question.

https://secure.in.gov/indot/files/GFD_ProjectLocationMap.pdf

Looks like they are getting close to opening the 106th Street exit on I-69.  I drove through tonight and all the barriers along 69 seem to have been removed.  I came through about 8:00 p.m. so very dark and I may have missed a few.

iAs noted, It looks like there will be no barrier to stop you from entering northbound off 106th street and directly moving over to the northbound 69 lanes, although traffic will likely prevent that.  The overhead signs at the start the c/d of exit 205 include one lane marked as North 37 TO I-69 North.  I would guess there will be a rash of near misses (and quite a few not misses) until motorists get used to the setup.  I will have my head on a swivel moving through there.

I just reworked the northbound ramp connection on Google Maps to make it clear that northbound traffic entering from 106th must  stay on the c/d and not enter directly into I69.   At least that way navigation directions shouldn't contribute to a potential problem.  (Changes published in mapmaker, won't show up on the public map til tomorrow.)

Saw the set up a little better in the daylight this morning as I was on 69 Southbound. .  Starting just before the 106th northbound entrance ramp reaches I-69, the two right lanes on 69 North are separated by a double white line - looks to be maybe a foot apart.  The two overhead gantries each have a square white sign that says "Do Not Cross Double White Line".  There is one just past 106th and one further down near the 116th Street exit.

For those that are using this regularly, how is traffic compliance with the new setup?   Are people staying where they should or are lots of people crossing the double white line barrier?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on December 21, 2016, 02:30:35 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on December 18, 2016, 12:24:30 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on December 02, 2016, 05:31:48 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on December 02, 2016, 12:30:23 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on November 30, 2016, 09:53:57 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on August 23, 2016, 07:25:18 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 23, 2016, 01:58:18 PM
on a different note, i fear the new 106th st interchange will seriously fuck up traffic on 69/37.  I hope they force traffic trying to go north on 69 to stay in the c/d to 116th and 37.

Looking at the project diagram it shows a solid white line separating the traffic bound for 116th starting prior to the merge of the 106th entering traffic.  So I'd say yes on your c/d question.

https://secure.in.gov/indot/files/GFD_ProjectLocationMap.pdf

Looks like they are getting close to opening the 106th Street exit on I-69.  I drove through tonight and all the barriers along 69 seem to have been removed.  I came through about 8:00 p.m. so very dark and I may have missed a few.

iAs noted, It looks like there will be no barrier to stop you from entering northbound off 106th street and directly moving over to the northbound 69 lanes, although traffic will likely prevent that.  The overhead signs at the start the c/d of exit 205 include one lane marked as North 37 TO I-69 North.  I would guess there will be a rash of near misses (and quite a few not misses) until motorists get used to the setup.  I will have my head on a swivel moving through there.

I just reworked the northbound ramp connection on Google Maps to make it clear that northbound traffic entering from 106th must  stay on the c/d and not enter directly into I69.   At least that way navigation directions shouldn't contribute to a potential problem.  (Changes published in mapmaker, won't show up on the public map til tomorrow.)

Saw the set up a little better in the daylight this morning as I was on 69 Southbound. .  Starting just before the 106th northbound entrance ramp reaches I-69, the two right lanes on 69 North are separated by a double white line - looks to be maybe a foot apart.  The two overhead gantries each have a square white sign that says "Do Not Cross Double White Line".  There is one just past 106th and one further down near the 116th Street exit.

For those that are using this regularly, how is traffic compliance with the new setup?   Are people staying where they should or are lots of people crossing the double white line barrier?

I go through there every night on my way home from work.  Granted I'm usually there between 6:30 and 7:00, after the rush hour.

I've seen no issues - everyone staying where they should be.  That being said, I haven't seen that many people coming down the ramp.  I think until IKEA open later next year, a considerable majority of the traffic at this exit (maybe 80% plus) will be exiting while Northbound and entering Southbound.  Right now this interchange serves the handful of office buildings to the south of the exit and a lot of residential neighborhoods both east and west.  I think it is reasonable to assume most access to here will be to and from Indianapolis.

I would think once IKEA opens and you have an influx of people not from the area and not familiar with the traffic pattern, you will likely have some issues with people not following the rules.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 26, 2016, 09:43:40 AM
this p3 has been a nightmare http://www.theindychannel.com/news/local-news/i-69-from-bloomington-to-martinsville-is-nearly-a-year-behind-schedule
this company just plain sucks.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 28, 2016, 07:56:07 AM
Quote from: US 41 on December 13, 2016, 09:27:36 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 13, 2016, 07:29:06 AM
random thought, why did the state rename sr 35 to 135 when us 35 was routed into the state, but sr 64, 65, 69, and 70 still exist?

They probably figured no one was going to confuse interstate highways with 2 lane state routes, but someone might confuse a 2 lane state route with another two lane US route of the same number. That's my guess.

this sound anger you US 41, but I'm sure you've heard about the McDaniel road bridge wall collapsing, the road is now closed and a fix isn't going to be easy
http://www.mywabashvalley.com/news/sr-641-east-of-41-closed-along-with-part-of-mcdaniel-road/631911452
here's the bridge in question: https://www.google.com/maps/@39.3993545,-87.3765962,3a,75y,114.69h,81.34t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sj8I7iKakKudZN_AUBWITBA!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo2.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3Dj8I7iKakKudZN_AUBWITBA%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dsearch.TACTILE.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D392%26h%3D106%26yaw%3D98.55383%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on December 28, 2016, 10:34:40 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 28, 2016, 07:56:07 AM
Quote from: US 41 on December 13, 2016, 09:27:36 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 13, 2016, 07:29:06 AM
random thought, why did the state rename sr 35 to 135 when us 35 was routed into the state, but sr 64, 65, 69, and 70 still exist?

They probably figured no one was going to confuse interstate highways with 2 lane state routes, but someone might confuse a 2 lane state route with another two lane US route of the same number. That's my guess.

this sound anger you US 41, but I'm sure you've heard about the McDaniel road bridge wall collapsing, the road is now closed and a fix isn't going to be easy
http://www.mywabashvalley.com/news/sr-641-east-of-41-closed-along-with-part-of-mcdaniel-road/631911452
here's the bridge in question: https://www.google.com/maps/@39.3993545,-87.3765962,3a,75y,114.69h,81.34t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sj8I7iKakKudZN_AUBWITBA!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo2.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3Dj8I7iKakKudZN_AUBWITBA%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dsearch.TACTILE.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D392%26h%3D106%26yaw%3D98.55383%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656

This project gets more ridiculous by the day.

The good news is at least it wasn't on SR 641 itself. Within the next month or so they should still be able to open SR 641 from 41 to 70. They'll just have to close the McDaniel Rd interchange for a while.

The bad news is who knows how long it will take for them to actually fix the bridge on McDaniel Rd.

I'll have to drive down there and check it out today.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 28, 2016, 10:37:18 AM
Quote from: US 41 on December 28, 2016, 10:34:40 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 28, 2016, 07:56:07 AM
Quote from: US 41 on December 13, 2016, 09:27:36 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 13, 2016, 07:29:06 AM
random thought, why did the state rename sr 35 to 135 when us 35 was routed into the state, but sr 64, 65, 69, and 70 still exist?

They probably figured no one was going to confuse interstate highways with 2 lane state routes, but someone might confuse a 2 lane state route with another two lane US route of the same number. That's my guess.

this sound anger you US 41, but I'm sure you've heard about the McDaniel road bridge wall collapsing, the road is now closed and a fix isn't going to be easy
http://www.mywabashvalley.com/news/sr-641-east-of-41-closed-along-with-part-of-mcdaniel-road/631911452
here's the bridge in question: https://www.google.com/maps/@39.3993545,-87.3765962,3a,75y,114.69h,81.34t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sj8I7iKakKudZN_AUBWITBA!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo2.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3Dj8I7iKakKudZN_AUBWITBA%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dsearch.TACTILE.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D392%26h%3D106%26yaw%3D98.55383%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656

This project gets more ridiculous by the day.

The good news is at least it wasn't on SR 641 itself. Within the next month or so they should still be able to open SR 641 from 41 to 70. They'll just have to close the McDaniel Rd interchange for a while.

The bad news is who knows how long it will take for them to actually fix the bridge on McDaniel Rd.

I'll have to drive down there and check it out today.

it may take a while, i think the ownership of the road is in question at this point.  it's supposed to be a county road, but i don't think vigo co has taken ownership of it yet, so it's sort of a state road i guess? 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on December 28, 2016, 12:17:00 PM
I'm pretty sure INDOT built it, and with the bridge being so new I think it is only right that they fix it as well.

Here's a photo I took about an hour ago. It will definitely be closed for a while.

(https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/15697938_218555865219947_4165071172631122138_n.jpg?oh=98b11a5af34d21bacadd01c44a6c276a&oe=58E41AA0)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 10, 2017, 10:06:38 AM
465 closed for the next week at us 36 http://www.wthr.com/article/semi-crashes-into-rockville-rd-overpass-at-i-465
semi driver fucked the bridge up really bad.  i think WEEKS not just a week. US 36 for far longer.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on January 10, 2017, 08:20:42 PM
Rockville Road (US 36) is already open with one lane each direction on the undamaged half of the bridge.

Northbound 465 has no ETA for being reopened.   Looks like demo work has already started on the damaged portion of the bridge based on traffic camera video from the state traffic web site.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on January 11, 2017, 09:22:56 AM
A/O 9:18 this morning.

(https://www.bradmeiser.com/images/roads/172_21_71_29.jpg)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: hbelkins on January 11, 2017, 10:39:17 AM
Looks worse than it actually is in terms of repairs. If the prestressed concrete beams are of a standard size, it should not be a big issue to get new ones set and then pour a new deck. Probably could be done within a month if weather permits.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on January 11, 2017, 11:05:24 AM
And they don't necessarily need to keep 465 north completely shut down during the repair.  During the demolition and cleanup, yes, but they should be able to open up the majority of the NB lanes during repair and have further restrictions at night as they set the beams/pour the bridge deck, like they do for a new bridge construction.  I bet they'll open some lanes up within a week.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on January 11, 2017, 01:08:08 PM
I guess I should have said "I bet they'll open all lanes up within a day!

Quote
Indiana Department of Transportation (INDOT), law enforcement and contractor crews are safely reopening all lanes of I-465 on the west side of Indianapolis.

Unfortunately, it doesn't sound like these are standard beams and they'll need to be custom ordered:

Quote
New, custom concrete bridge beams must be produced, delivered and erected. Crews must install concrete forms and working platforms before new concrete decking and railings may be poured. Winter temperatures may slow concrete curing times and require special heaters or insulation.

https://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/INDOT/bulletins/17fa81a
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 11, 2017, 01:15:22 PM
Kudos to indot in being fast, looks like this bridge will be done before the summer
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: hbelkins on January 11, 2017, 03:48:59 PM
That photo I saw showed that just about the entire damaged NB side of the bridge had been torn out. Are they going to shunt some traffic over to the other carriageway temporarily?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 11, 2017, 06:20:27 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on January 11, 2017, 03:48:59 PM
That photo I saw showed that just about the entire damaged NB side of the bridge had been torn out. Are they going to shunt some traffic over to the other carriageway temporarily?

Currently the highway on the bridge (us 36) is using the undamaged portion as a 2 way street.  I am not sure what the lane config is for 465 (below) i'm going to drive over there tonight to check it out. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on January 11, 2017, 07:38:27 PM
The loop ramp from Rockville Road / US 36 Eastbound to I 465 Northbound is closed (due to the fact that this ramp starts from the bridge lanes than no longer exist).   Other than that INDOT has managed to get everything opened back up to traffic earlier today.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 11, 2017, 07:44:57 PM
Yep all 5 lanes are open
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: CtrlAltDel on January 11, 2017, 07:59:48 PM
Holy moly. I had just driven that part of 465 (albeit in the other direction) the night before. I remembered the bridge because I thought the fake stone was interesting.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on January 12, 2017, 08:09:54 AM
Massive kudos to INDOT and their contractor for getting northbound I-465 reopened in less than 36 hours. After having to take an alternate route Wednesday to get to work in Avon it was a pleasure to be able to get off on 10th St. again.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on January 12, 2017, 09:14:21 AM
Quote from: jhuntin1 on January 12, 2017, 08:09:54 AM
Massive kudos to INDOT and their contractor for getting northbound I-465 reopened in less than 36 hours. After having to take an alternate route Wednesday to get to work in Avon it was a pleasure to be able to get off on 10th St. again.

It looks like you're from Greenwood.  I heard 65N from the south side was hell yesterday.  Is that the route you had to take?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on January 13, 2017, 11:55:41 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on January 12, 2017, 09:14:21 AM
It looks like you're from Greenwood.  I heard 65N from the south side was hell yesterday.  Is that the route you had to take?
No, I come up US 31 to I-465, but it was a horrible mess on 65N with all lanes closed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on January 14, 2017, 01:49:36 AM
Hey, did anyone heard the new proposed law coming to Indiana that requires you to yield to large trucks?

Carmel mayor pushes for statewide right-of-way change for roundabouts
Article: http://www.ibj.com/articles/62034-carmel-mayor-pushes-for-statewide-right-of-way-change-for-roundabouts

Personally, I think that it's a great idea to do this as other states like Wisconsin modified its law to yield to trucks...  :clap: :nod: :clap: :nod:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on January 14, 2017, 10:53:41 AM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on January 14, 2017, 01:49:36 AM
Hey, did anyone heard the new proposed law coming to Indiana that requires you to yield to large trucks?

Carmel mayor pushes for statewide right-of-way change for roundabouts
Article: http://www.ibj.com/articles/62034-carmel-mayor-pushes-for-statewide-right-of-way-change-for-roundabouts

Personally, I think that it's a great idea to do this as other states like Wisconsin modified its law to yield to trucks...  :clap: :nod: :clap: :nod:
First time I've seen this, thanks for posting the link.

My honest opinion the first time I read it is let Carmel deal with the mess they made with all their roundabouts and create a local ordinance if it's so important. Brainard created this mess; let him deal with it and don't let him dictate to the state what should be done to fix his problem. Large trucks shouldn't be going through roundabouts to begin with, but in more and more places now they don't have a choice to get to their destinations.

I didn't know Wisconsin had changed their law, and I drive up there multiple times a year. I've never seen it signed anywhere.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on January 14, 2017, 01:48:15 PM
What mess?  The roads in Carmel are far far better now than they were 10 years ago.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: seicer on January 14, 2017, 02:38:39 PM
^This. The notion that roundabouts are far less safer than traffic signals, especially for disjointed intersections, has been proven wrong. They can also handle traffic very well, especially at higher volumes.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: hbelkins on January 14, 2017, 09:50:06 PM
QuoteIn Carmel, Brainard said the plan would be to let drivers know about the change through social media and different marketing techniques.

Torr made it clear that they did not want to "clutter up"  the roadside with signs. Instead, he expects the bill to be an educational tool.

I guess anyone who comes up the east side of I-465 and is using Keystone as a shortcut to get to US 31 north and gets off at one of those barbell exits is supposed to like Carmel's Facebook page, even if they're from Kentucky or Tennessee or Alabama?

Idiots. If there's a specific ordinance or condition in affect in a certain location, put a sign up.

And isn't the reason they put a truck berm on the inside of those botched abortions of intersections is to allow big rigs to cut the tight corner that roundabouts force on them?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on January 14, 2017, 10:29:07 PM
I'm not arguing that roundabouts are worse than signaled intersections, and I drive through them almost every day. It's almost impossible to get around Carmel without driving through at least one and they're not designed well for large trucks. Brainard's love affair with roundabouts helped create the problem.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on January 14, 2017, 10:50:59 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on January 14, 2017, 09:50:06 PM
And isn't the reason they put a truck berm on the inside of those botched abortions of intersections is to allow big rigs to cut the tight corner that roundabouts force on them?

Yes, but the truck apron would only work with single lane roundabouts.

Linked here is the text of the Wisconsin law. (https://docs.legis.wisconsin.gov/2015/related/acts/139)  Granted I am not familiar with accident liability in Wisconsin, but I have reservations that the law might be an easy way for a semi to be excused from failing to yield to traffic already in the roundabout.

(Edited to fix bad response to question)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mgk920 on January 15, 2017, 10:17:17 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on January 14, 2017, 10:50:59 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on January 14, 2017, 09:50:06 PM
And isn't the reason they put a truck berm on the inside of those botched abortions of intersections is to allow big rigs to cut the tight corner that roundabouts force on them?

Yes, but the truck apron would only work with single lane roundabouts.

Linked here is the text of the Wisconsin law. (https://docs.legis.wisconsin.gov/2015/related/acts/139)  Granted I am not familiar with accident liability in Wisconsin, but I have reservations that the law might be an easy way for a semi to be excused from failing to yield to traffic already in the roundabout.

(Edited to fix bad response to question)

Large vehicles still have to yield before entering a roundabout, but they then have absolute priority over everything else in one - nothing else can be along side one.

It's to prevent sideswipe collisions.

Mike
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on January 15, 2017, 01:02:51 PM
It always amuses me that the ones that complain the most about roundabouts are the ones that least use them.   There is no mass discontent locally with the roundabouts.   Carmel is in the process of adding 30 more because they work well and the locals are happy with them.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 15, 2017, 06:00:48 PM
pretty much every roundabout has been working well. i don't like 116th and keystone though. and 116th and hazel dell next yr is going to be crazy
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 15, 2017, 06:01:57 PM
there needs to be a law that you have to signal in a roundabout though
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on January 16, 2017, 11:10:38 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 15, 2017, 06:01:57 PM
there needs to be a law that you have to signal in a roundabout though


I agree.  It is very rare to see anyone signal in a roundabout in Indiana.  When I was driving in Ireland, everyone signaled and it was very helpful.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on January 16, 2017, 12:50:25 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 15, 2017, 06:00:48 PM
pretty much every roundabout has been working well. i don't like 116th and keystone though. and 116th and hazel dell next yr is going to be crazy

Same thing was said about Carmel Drive and Range Line -- and every time I've driven through that new roundabout it has been working quite well.

116th and Keystone makes people uncomfortable due to the traffic volume.   However I'd argue that being uncomfortable at a roundabout is healthy - it makes you watch out for other traffic.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 16, 2017, 12:52:38 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on January 16, 2017, 12:50:25 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 15, 2017, 06:00:48 PM
pretty much every roundabout has been working well. i don't like 116th and keystone though. and 116th and hazel dell next yr is going to be crazy

Same thing was said about Carmel Drive and Range Line -- and every time I've driven through that new roundabout it has been working quite well.

it is working well there, but I've seen what the hazel dell one will look like, it's pretty weird and confusing even for a carmel roundabout.  that intersection gets about the same amount of traffic as rangeline and carmel. It will take some getting used too. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on January 16, 2017, 05:06:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 16, 2017, 12:52:38 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on January 16, 2017, 12:50:25 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 15, 2017, 06:00:48 PM
pretty much every roundabout has been working well. i don't like 116th and keystone though. and 116th and hazel dell next yr is going to be crazy

Same thing was said about Carmel Drive and Range Line -- and every time I've driven through that new roundabout it has been working quite well.

it is working well there, but I've seen what the hazel dell one will look like, it's pretty weird and confusing even for a carmel roundabout.  that intersection gets about the same amount of traffic as rangeline and carmel. It will take some getting used too.

Here in West Lafayette I've heard that they're planning on putting in a new roundabout at the intersection of River Rd., State St., and Brown St. as part of the State Street Project. That one will have to be massive! I almost think that the intersection is too big for a roundabout, but it looks like maybe there isn't such a thing as an intersection being too large for carmelization! :-D
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 16, 2017, 05:33:47 PM
Quote from: billtm on January 16, 2017, 05:06:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 16, 2017, 12:52:38 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on January 16, 2017, 12:50:25 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 15, 2017, 06:00:48 PM
pretty much every roundabout has been working well. i don't like 116th and keystone though. and 116th and hazel dell next yr is going to be crazy

Same thing was said about Carmel Drive and Range Line -- and every time I've driven through that new roundabout it has been working quite well.

it is working well there, but I've seen what the hazel dell one will look like, it's pretty weird and confusing even for a carmel roundabout.  that intersection gets about the same amount of traffic as rangeline and carmel. It will take some getting used too.

Here in West Lafayette I've heard that they're planning on putting in a new roundabout at the intersection of River Rd., State St., and Brown St. as part of the State Street Project. That one will have to be massive! I almost think that the intersection is too big for a roundabout, but it looks like maybe there isn't such a thing as an intersection being too large for carmelization! :-D

I was told that that roundabout might not happen due to r/w costs.  But I cannot confirm this.  I guess we'll see.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on January 17, 2017, 09:26:55 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 16, 2017, 05:33:47 PM
Quote from: billtm on January 16, 2017, 05:06:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 16, 2017, 12:52:38 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on January 16, 2017, 12:50:25 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 15, 2017, 06:00:48 PM
pretty much every roundabout has been working well. i don't like 116th and keystone though. and 116th and hazel dell next yr is going to be crazy

Same thing was said about Carmel Drive and Range Line -- and every time I've driven through that new roundabout it has been working quite well.

it is working well there, but I've seen what the hazel dell one will look like, it's pretty weird and confusing even for a carmel roundabout.  that intersection gets about the same amount of traffic as rangeline and carmel. It will take some getting used too.

Here in West Lafayette I've heard that they're planning on putting in a new roundabout at the intersection of River Rd., State St., and Brown St. as part of the State Street Project. That one will have to be massive! I almost think that the intersection is too big for a roundabout, but it looks like maybe there isn't such a thing as an intersection being too large for carmelization! :-D

I was told that that roundabout might not happen due to r/w costs.  But I cannot confirm this.  I guess we'll see.

I decided to do some more research, and the roundabout appears in their long therm vision but not the prss proposal. So I guess the roundabout is not being built? If so I think they made the right call.The only thing from the long term vision that I wish made its way into the prss proposal is the Cherry Lane extension to US 231.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 17, 2017, 09:30:48 AM
Quote from: billtm on January 17, 2017, 09:26:55 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 16, 2017, 05:33:47 PM
Quote from: billtm on January 16, 2017, 05:06:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 16, 2017, 12:52:38 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on January 16, 2017, 12:50:25 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 15, 2017, 06:00:48 PM
pretty much every roundabout has been working well. i don't like 116th and keystone though. and 116th and hazel dell next yr is going to be crazy

Same thing was said about Carmel Drive and Range Line -- and every time I've driven through that new roundabout it has been working quite well.

it is working well there, but I've seen what the hazel dell one will look like, it's pretty weird and confusing even for a carmel roundabout.  that intersection gets about the same amount of traffic as rangeline and carmel. It will take some getting used too.

Here in West Lafayette I've heard that they're planning on putting in a new roundabout at the intersection of River Rd., State St., and Brown St. as part of the State Street Project. That one will have to be massive! I almost think that the intersection is too big for a roundabout, but it looks like maybe there isn't such a thing as an intersection being too large for carmelization! :-D

I was told that that roundabout might not happen due to r/w costs.  But I cannot confirm this.  I guess we'll see.

I decided to do some more research, and the roundabout appears in their long therm vision but not the prss proposal. So I guess the roundabout is not being built? If so I think they made the right call.The only thing from the long term vision that I wish made its way into the prss proposal is the Cherry Lane extension to US 231.
I believe Purdue is going to do that extension eventually. I think River road from tapawingo to the old 231 exit should be 2 lanes. If they want that area to be PED friendly and slow traffic down (which they keep saying is something they want to do) do a road diet and add the roundabout at state. If it were 2 lanes the roundabout could be added without much or any r/w at all. That road was designed to make you drive much much faster than the posted 30mph. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on January 17, 2017, 07:46:08 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 17, 2017, 09:30:48 AM
Quote from: billtm on January 17, 2017, 09:26:55 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 16, 2017, 05:33:47 PM
Quote from: billtm on January 16, 2017, 05:06:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 16, 2017, 12:52:38 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on January 16, 2017, 12:50:25 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 15, 2017, 06:00:48 PM
pretty much every roundabout has been working well. i don't like 116th and keystone though. and 116th and hazel dell next yr is going to be crazy

Same thing was said about Carmel Drive and Range Line -- and every time I've driven through that new roundabout it has been working quite well.

it is working well there, but I've seen what the hazel dell one will look like, it's pretty weird and confusing even for a carmel roundabout.  that intersection gets about the same amount of traffic as rangeline and carmel. It will take some getting used too.

Here in West Lafayette I've heard that they're planning on putting in a new roundabout at the intersection of River Rd., State St., and Brown St. as part of the State Street Project. That one will have to be massive! I almost think that the intersection is too big for a roundabout, but it looks like maybe there isn't such a thing as an intersection being too large for carmelization! :-D

I was told that that roundabout might not happen due to r/w costs.  But I cannot confirm this.  I guess we'll see.

I decided to do some more research, and the roundabout appears in their long therm vision but not the prss proposal. So I guess the roundabout is not being built? If so I think they made the right call.The only thing from the long term vision that I wish made its way into the prss proposal is the Cherry Lane extension to US 231.
I believe Purdue is going to do that extension eventually. I think River road from tapawingo to the old 231 exit should be 2 lanes. If they want that area to be PED friendly and slow traffic down (which they keep saying is something they want to do) do a road diet and add the roundabout at state. If it were 2 lanes the roundabout could be added without much or any r/w at all. That road was designed to make you drive much much faster than the posted 30mph.
30mph!?  :-D That is funny. The road could definitely handle 45mph speeds. I agree that a road diet seems like a logical change, and if that happens the roundabout at State begins to make a whole lot more sense. But I think that the road diet could be carried up all the way to Robinson. Though I could definitely see arguments going both ways.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on January 25, 2017, 08:11:08 PM
Today's Kokomo Tribune ran an article about the prospects of an interchange at Division Road with US 31 near Tipton. Of greater interest to me, INDOT spokesman said they are conducting a study for the next steps of the Indy - South Bend corridor.  Stated that INDOT was studying what were the preferred options to make the corridor "stop free."  The evaluation will recommend what type of highway design - freeway, expressway, etc. is best for the unimproved segments of the corridor.

Study to be performed by CHA Consulting. Results to be released sometime in 2018.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 25, 2017, 09:40:47 PM
Quote from: monty on January 25, 2017, 08:11:08 PM
Today's Kokomo Tribune ran an article about the prospects of an interchange at Division Road with US 31 near Tipton. Of greater interest to me, INDOT spokesman said they are conducting a study for the next steps of the Indy - South Bend corridor.  Stated that INDOT was studying what were the preferred options to make the corridor "stop free."  The evaluation will recommend what type of highway design - freeway, expressway, etc. is best for the unimproved segments of the corridor.

Study to be performed by CHA Consulting. Results to be released sometime in 2018.

this has a good chance at happening (along with a lot of other projects) if they pass the new road funding measure, the legislature is actually interested in solving the funding issues, which excites me, we need to fix a lot of stuff!  can you post the article you mentioned on here?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JREwing78 on January 26, 2017, 08:21:55 AM
Quote from: monty on January 25, 2017, 08:11:08 PM
Today's Kokomo Tribune ran an article about the prospects of an interchange at Division Road with US 31 near Tipton. Of greater interest to me, INDOT spokesman said they are conducting a study for the next steps of the Indy - South Bend corridor.  Stated that INDOT was studying what were the preferred options to make the corridor "stop free."  The evaluation will recommend what type of highway design - freeway, expressway, etc. is best for the unimproved segments of the corridor.

Study to be performed by CHA Consulting. Results to be released sometime in 2018.

http://www.kokomotribune.com/news/at-a-crossroads-discussions-start-about-potential-division-road-interchange/article_f86345b4-e284-11e6-8a7f-8b4c6b5f0991.html
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 26, 2017, 08:56:27 AM
i always thought they were going to put an interchange at division rd one day, but the proximity to 28 may make them just want an overpass.  but it seems busy enough to warrant one.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on January 31, 2017, 01:02:27 PM
Does this count toward clinching highway segments?

http://www.indystar.com/story/news/fox59/2017/01/31/plane-makes-emergency-landing-us-31/97287490/

QuoteHOWARD COUNTY, Ind.— An airplane made an emergency landing Tuesday on U.S. 31 in Howard County, Fox59 reported.
The plane landed in the southbound lanes of U.S. 31, just north of County Road 300 South, around noon. Drivers should avoid the area for the time being.
Police said the pilot took off from Brownsburg and experienced trouble in the air, forcing the landing. The plane was not damaged.
No injuries were reported, according to Howard County EMA Director Janice Hart. Kokomo Police are investigating and the FAA has been called.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on January 31, 2017, 02:48:05 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on January 31, 2017, 01:02:27 PM
Does this count toward clinching highway segments?

http://www.indystar.com/story/news/fox59/2017/01/31/plane-makes-emergency-landing-us-31/97287490/

QuoteHOWARD COUNTY, Ind.— An airplane made an emergency landing Tuesday on U.S. 31 in Howard County, Fox59 reported.
The plane landed in the southbound lanes of U.S. 31, just north of County Road 300 South, around noon. Drivers should avoid the area for the time being.
Police said the pilot took off from Brownsburg and experienced trouble in the air, forcing the landing. The plane was not damaged.
No injuries were reported, according to Howard County EMA Director Janice Hart. Kokomo Police are investigating and the FAA has been called.

Maybe so, but if I were those people I'd definitely be adding Howard County, Indiana to my list of counties visited  :sombrero:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 15, 2017, 09:17:07 AM
sprawl in westfield http://www.ibj.com/articles/62515-henke-hopes-to-land-hotels-eateries-grocery-along-us-31-in-westfield
I'm not really against this, it just makes me hope this doesn't cause more signals to be placed on the non-interstate portion of 31 north of 38.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on February 15, 2017, 11:09:30 AM
Now that SR 641 is finished (besides the interchange at I-70), Emergency Detour 70 now follows SR 46 to SR 59 rather than along US 40.

I was told by city officials a while back that once 641 is finished (which it is now) if any wreck that requires 70 to be shut off happens between Exit 7 and 11 that traffic will be routed south to/on SR 641 and back up to I-70 rather than through downtown Terre Haute.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on February 15, 2017, 12:40:30 PM
Quote from: US 41 on February 15, 2017, 11:09:30 AM
Now that SR 641 is finished (besides the interchange at I-70), Emergency Detour 70 now follows SR 46 to SR 59 rather than along US 40.

I was told by city officials a while back that once 641 is finished (which it is now) if any wreck that requires 70 to be shut off happens between Exit 7 and 11 that traffic will be routed south to/on SR 641 and back up to I-70 rather than through downtown Terre Haute.

Awesome.  I hope to get some IN-641 shield photos before the year is done.  Do you have any local insight on where we might find some IN-641 standalone shields?  Or is pretty much everything shown on BGS's?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 15, 2017, 12:53:04 PM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on February 15, 2017, 12:40:30 PM
Quote from: US 41 on February 15, 2017, 11:09:30 AM
Now that SR 641 is finished (besides the interchange at I-70), Emergency Detour 70 now follows SR 46 to SR 59 rather than along US 40.

I was told by city officials a while back that once 641 is finished (which it is now) if any wreck that requires 70 to be shut off happens between Exit 7 and 11 that traffic will be routed south to/on SR 641 and back up to I-70 rather than through downtown Terre Haute.

Awesome.  I hope to get some IN-641 shield photos before the year is done.  Do you have any local insight on where we might find some IN-641 standalone shields?  Or is pretty much everything shown on BGS's?

They ought to be after each on ramp.  I hope they used the large size ones and not the small size
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on February 15, 2017, 01:06:58 PM
Like this? https://goo.gl/maps/YBvZ9uQjkAx
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 15, 2017, 02:21:34 PM
96th and keystone will be started this year, really nice video and renderings of the project: http://carmellink.com/project.php?title=96th%20Street%20and%20Keystone%20Parkway%20Interchange%20construction%20Roundabout
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on February 16, 2017, 07:34:22 AM
Intersection overhaul planned for US 20, Ind. 2

Article: http://www.heraldargus.com/news/intersection-overhaul-planned-for-us-ind/article_b3740a66-678a-5a9d-9e44-a7c3cb4eab0c.html?mode=story



Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 16, 2017, 07:52:38 AM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on February 16, 2017, 07:34:22 AM
Intersection overhaul planned for US 20, Ind. 2

Article: http://www.heraldargus.com/news/intersection-overhaul-planned-for-us-ind/article_b3740a66-678a-5a9d-9e44-a7c3cb4eab0c.html?mode=story

it's finally happening.  A friend at INDOT told me a few yrs ago this would happen eventually.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 16, 2017, 10:26:16 AM
US 20 And SR 2 should swap routes at that intersection.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefro on February 16, 2017, 10:28:34 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 15, 2017, 09:17:07 AM
sprawl in westfield http://www.ibj.com/articles/62515-henke-hopes-to-land-hotels-eateries-grocery-along-us-31-in-westfield
I'm not really against this, it just makes me hope this doesn't cause more signals to be placed on the non-interstate portion of 31 north of 38.

That's at the 191st street exit, so they've got that to fill up with sprawl and the SR 38 exit before you'd see the possibility of more traffic lights north of that.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 20, 2017, 09:46:59 PM
Phase 2 of the 80/90 PUSH Project started over the past weekend (helps when spring arrives early). Lane closures are currently in place between mileposts 20 and 93 (in sections, not the entire 73 mile stretch). Like last year, work consists of resurfacing, bridge refurbishments, and ramp closures. Speaking of which...

The most prominent ramp closures include the Portage Exit (exit 23). The eastbound entrance and westbound exit will be closed to traffic for the next few weeks. Traffic is being directed to I-94 and detoured to Indiana 49 (for those looking to drive eastbound to Ohio. Westbound drivers looking to exit to Willowcreek Road should consider using the exit eight miles before (Indiana 49) and use I-94 to Indiana 249, or head directly to I-94 and double back east to Indiana 249.

I've been told by INDOT that the major widening project on I-65 between US 30 and Indiana 2 will commence on either the first or second week of April, depending on the weather. The concrete restoration project between 61st Avenue and I-80/94 (which was scheduled to finish last year but was suspended due to the tragic construction accident last October) is scheduled to restart about the same time. Enforcement will be heavy and no warnings will be issued. Widening work is scheduled to end in late 2019. The concrete restoration is scheduled to last through the summer.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on February 21, 2017, 08:26:27 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 16, 2017, 10:26:16 AM
US 20 And SR 2 should swap routes at that intersection.

I guess being the route of the Old Michigan Road is what keeps US 20 where it is, but yes, anybody traveling between SB and MC would normally follow 2 instead of 20 east of their intersection.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on February 21, 2017, 05:17:29 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 20, 2017, 09:46:59 PM
I've been told by INDOT that the major widening project on I-65 between US 30 and Indiana 2 will commence on either the first or second week of April, depending on the weather. The concrete restoration project between 61st Avenue and I-80/94 (which was scheduled to finish last year but was suspended due to the tragic construction accident last October) is scheduled to restart about the same time. Enforcement will be heavy and no warnings will be issued. Widening work is scheduled to end in late 2019. The concrete restoration is scheduled to last through the summer.

And INDOT is going to actually post reasonable work zone speed limits for once, or another obnoxiously long 45 mph section where I can gamble for getting a ticket or getting run over?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 22, 2017, 10:33:35 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on February 21, 2017, 05:17:29 PMAnd INDOT is going to actually post reasonable work zone speed limits for once, or another obnoxiously long 45 mph section where I can gamble for getting a ticket or getting run over?

At least in my area, INDOT has been good with imposing reasonable work zone speed limits based on the area. South of US 30 should see a work speed zone of 55/60 mph. I remember when a 55 mph speed zone was put into place during the "Restore 94" project, since the area is normally 70 mph otherwise.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 22, 2017, 10:50:54 AM
they may have changed the standards on work zone speed limits.  it's in the indot design manual somewhere. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on February 23, 2017, 09:20:22 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on February 16, 2017, 07:34:22 AM
Intersection overhaul planned for US 20, Ind. 2

Article: http://www.heraldargus.com/news/intersection-overhaul-planned-for-us-ind/article_b3740a66-678a-5a9d-9e44-a7c3cb4eab0c.html?mode=story


Sorry for being late here but I had one question about this interchange project. If SR 2 and US 20 change alignments at this interchange, as they do the intersection right now, what is the highway designation in between the entrance and exit ramps along the divided highway?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on February 23, 2017, 09:40:27 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 23, 2017, 09:20:22 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on February 16, 2017, 07:34:22 AM
Intersection overhaul planned for US 20, Ind. 2

Article: http://www.heraldargus.com/news/intersection-overhaul-planned-for-us-ind/article_b3740a66-678a-5a9d-9e44-a7c3cb4eab0c.html?mode=story


Sorry for being late here but I had one question about this interchange project. If SR 2 and US 20 change alignments at this interchange, as they do the intersection right now, what is the highway designation in between the entrance and exit ramps along the divided highway?

It would be interesting to know what they legally call the road between the exit and entrance ramps at the split diamond near Logansport at US 24-35/IN 25.  Heading eastbound, 25 exits and 24-35 enters; all three overlap on the ramp between the intersections while no route is technically on the road after the exit but before the entrance ramp merges.  It must be called something or inventoried as something.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on February 23, 2017, 10:04:56 PM
I wrote the guide for AARoads page on SR 25. I just called that stretch of highway the Hoosier Heartland Highway, since that corridor already had a name. I don't believe the highway from Michigan City to South Bend does though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 23, 2017, 11:08:45 PM
how'd that smart streets project go in SB?  did they ruin all of the old signage?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on February 24, 2017, 06:50:20 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 23, 2017, 10:04:56 PM
I wrote the guide for AARoads page on SR 25. I just called that stretch of highway the Hoosier Heartland Highway, since that corridor already had a name. I don't believe the highway from Michigan City to South Bend does though.

US 20 is the Michigan Road, though it's rarely referred to that locally.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: captkirk_4 on February 28, 2017, 09:18:37 AM
Quote from: PurdueBill on February 23, 2017, 09:40:27 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 23, 2017, 09:20:22 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on February 16, 2017, 07:34:22 AM
Intersection overhaul planned for US 20, Ind. 2

Article: http://www.heraldargus.com/news/intersection-overhaul-planned-for-us-ind/article_b3740a66-678a-5a9d-9e44-a7c3cb4eab0c.html?mode=story



It would be interesting to know what they legally call the road between the exit and entrance ramps at the split diamond near Logansport at US 24-35/IN 25.  Heading eastbound, 25 exits and 24-35 enters; all three overlap on the ramp between the intersections while no route is technically on the road after the exit but before the entrance ramp merges.  It must be called something or inventoried as something.

I don't know what that stretch is, reminds me of some temporary arrangement you see when construction is going on. There is a split off ghost divided highway about another mile east of there that may be where US24 was supposed to have it's interchange, but funding never allowed four laneing west of Logansport. Would be quite an expense, but to four lane it from Logansport to Peoria Illinois would provide a well needed way for trans continental truck traffic to bypass the awful Kingery Borman parking lot on the south end of Lake Michigan. I generally make pretty good time going on US 24 from I-57 to Ft. Wayne. But it does need bypasses of several towns like Watseka IL and Monitcello IN, even keeping it two lane would still greatly benefit from these towns getting bypassed as they really slow you down.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 28, 2017, 09:20:14 AM
does indot do secret route numbers?  also, is that stub Montecello Road one of them?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on February 28, 2017, 10:20:49 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 28, 2017, 09:20:14 AM
does indot do secret route numbers?  also, is that stub Montecello Road one of them?

The only unsigned route I'm aware of is IN 931 in St. Joseph County.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 04, 2017, 02:14:23 PM
INDOT has (all but) officially announced the litany of road work projects affecting the Northwest Indiana area, and there are a LOT of them.

As I mentioned before, the first 25 miles of I-65 will see road work in some form (Paving work from the US 12/20 terminus to just north of the Borman Expressway interchange, concrete restoration from just south of that point to 61st Avenue, widening from just south of US 30 to Indiana 2, and replacement of the Kankakee River bridges). There will also be bridge work just south of the Indiana 10 interchange. Those traveling long range may want to add extra time to their travel, or (coming from Michigan) consider using US 421 or (coming from Chicago) US 41.

A large chunk of I-94 will see work this year, with concrete restoration planned for the stretch from Kennedy Avenue to just west of I-65, as well as the stretch from US 421 to US 20/35. HMA overlay work is planned for the stretch of the Borman from east of Central Avenue to the Indiana Toll Road exit, and from just east of Indiana 249 to just east of Indiana 49. Two bridges are also slated for repair, including the bridge over the Indiana Toll Road (which will overlap with the road work already in progress on the Toll Road itself), and the bridge just east of the Indiana 49 interchange. Finally, interchange modification will be performed on the ramp connecting Eastbound I-94 to East/Southbound US 20/35.

In more local roads, the entirety of Broadway will be worked on from Gary to Crown Point, with repaving, installation of bus shelters between 6th Avenue and 86th Place, crosswalk improvements near the IU Northwest Campus, and complete removal of the IHB railroad bridge near Downtown Gary.

US 30 will see resurfacing work from US 41 to Indiana 55 (Taft Street) in Lake County, and from Indiana 49 to the Porter-LaPorte County Line. The infamous Mississippi Street intersection near Southlake Mall will also see work, but details are not yet made known. US 20, Indiana 51, Calumet Avenue, Indiana 2, Indiana 39, and Indiana 49 (from the Toll Road to US 30) will all be seeing resurfacing work done as well.

Told you there will be a lot.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: spell4yr on March 04, 2017, 11:22:07 PM
Thoughts on this construction work:

-- I wish that the paving of I-65 between I-80/94 and US 12/20 had been timed with the interchange construction a few years ago, as (if I recall correctly) part of that stretch was closed anyway.
-- I live right off of US 41 in Highland, and I dread the increased traffic from long-haul drivers, considering how crazy the local traffic already is.
-- Good to hear about I-94 east of US 421, as that stretch is not fun to drive.
-- It's great the state will be working on US 30/Mississippi, but it's more important that Lake County or the Town of Merrillville, whoever was in charge of the Mississippi/mall entrance reconstruction, re-stripes that light. Southbound went from two lanes like this: < | <^> to a standard < | ^ | ^ | > format, and the left-turn lane is nowhere near adequate to handle mall traffic, nor is the cycle long enough. It spilled over onto US 30 and other parts of Mississippi over the holiday. It needs to be fixed immediately.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on March 06, 2017, 03:11:47 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on February 28, 2017, 10:20:49 AM
The only unsigned route I'm aware of is IN 931 in St. Joseph County.

What is unsigned? When I drove it, it was signed between the Marshall/St. Joseph county line and the south city limit of South Bend. That's the part still in INDOT control.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 06, 2017, 03:31:37 PM
Quote from: theline on March 06, 2017, 03:11:47 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on February 28, 2017, 10:20:49 AM
The only unsigned route I'm aware of is IN 931 in St. Joseph County.

What is unsigned? When I drove it, it was signed between the Marshall/St. Joseph county line and the south city limit of South Bend. That's the part still in INDOT control.

i thought they finally turned that over last yr
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JREwing78 on March 06, 2017, 08:45:09 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 04, 2017, 02:14:23 PM
A large chunk of I-94 will see work this year, with concrete restoration planned for the stretch from Kennedy Avenue to just west of I-65, as well as the stretch from US 421 to US 20/35. HMA overlay work is planned for the stretch of the Borman from east of Central Avenue to the Indiana Toll Road exit, and from just east of Indiana 249 to just east of Indiana 49. Two bridges are also slated for repair, including the bridge over the Indiana Toll Road (which will overlap with the road work already in progress on the Toll Road itself), and the bridge just east of the Indiana 49 interchange. Finally, interchange modification will be performed on the ramp connecting Eastbound I-94 to East/Southbound US 20/35.

I'm going to be thankful that I rarely have to travel through there during peak times. There's not a way across the bottom of Lake Michigan that isn't going to be under construction and/or absurdly slow.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on March 07, 2017, 06:57:59 AM
Quote from: theline on March 06, 2017, 03:11:47 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on February 28, 2017, 10:20:49 AM
The only unsigned route I'm aware of is IN 931 in St. Joseph County.

What is unsigned? When I drove it, it was signed between the Marshall/St. Joseph county line and the south city limit of South Bend. That's the part still in INDOT control.

OK, then apparently they've signed it.  It WAS unsigned for a while.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: captkirk_4 on March 07, 2017, 09:14:19 AM
Quote from: spell4yr on March 04, 2017, 11:22:07 PM
Thoughts on this construction work:

-- I wish that the paving of I-65 between I-80/94 and US 12/20 had been timed with the interchange construction a few years ago, as (if I recall correctly) part of that stretch was closed anyway.
-- I live right off of US 41 in Highland, and I dread the increased traffic from long-haul drivers, considering how crazy the local traffic already is.
-- Good to hear about I-94 east of US 421, as that stretch is not fun to drive.


Drove the backroads from Kankakee-Momence-Roselawn and definitely noticed a massive amount of semi-trucks along the very minor state routes Illinois 114 Indiana 10. Seems that if they don't build some sort of southern bypass the truckers will make their own spilling onto the backroads.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on March 07, 2017, 05:52:10 PM
Quote from: captkirk_4 on March 07, 2017, 09:14:19 AM
Drove the backroads from Kankakee-Momence-Roselawn and definitely noticed a massive amount of semi-trucks along the very minor state routes Illinois 114 Indiana 10. Seems that if they don't build some sort of southern bypass the truckers will make their own spilling onto the backroads.

IDOT and INDOT did look into building the Illiana as a bypass.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 07, 2017, 06:06:26 PM
931 is signed and you can see it on street view now. It starts at the St Joseph county line and ends at the South bend city limits. It's like an island it only crossed SR 4 and that's it. I think indot is trying their best to get rid of it. Kokomos portion is likely to be around for a very long time likely for good.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: amroad17 on March 07, 2017, 11:46:52 PM
Quote from: captkirk_4 on March 07, 2017, 09:14:19 AM
Quote from: spell4yr on March 04, 2017, 11:22:07 PM
Thoughts on this construction work:

-- I wish that the paving of I-65 between I-80/94 and US 12/20 had been timed with the interchange construction a few years ago, as (if I recall correctly) part of that stretch was closed anyway.
-- I live right off of US 41 in Highland, and I dread the increased traffic from long-haul drivers, considering how crazy the local traffic already is.
-- Good to hear about I-94 east of US 421, as that stretch is not fun to drive.


Drove the backroads from Kankakee-Momence-Roselawn and definitely noticed a massive amount of semi-trucks along the very minor state routes Illinois 114 Indiana 10. Seems that if they don't build some sort of southern bypass the truckers will make their own spilling onto the backroads.
I would take that route sometimes when I drove for an expediting company just so I could avoid the Borman/Kingery Expressways and did not need to get into central Chicago.  I also would take IL 17 east out of Kankakee to IN 2, US 41 south, to IN 10 to I-65 again to avoid the Borman/Kingery.  Many truckers do both of these routes.  Beats sitting in a massive amount of traffic.

It would be nice if there was a southern bypass of Chicago.  Even an expressway (similar to Corridor H) from I-65 near IN 10 to Kankakee or even curving up to Peotone would help immensely (I know, this is approximately the routing of the moribund Illiana Corridor).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on March 08, 2017, 02:04:04 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 07, 2017, 06:06:26 PM
931 is signed and you can see it on street view now. It starts at the St Joseph county line and ends at the South bend city limits. It's like an island it only crossed SR 4 and that's it. I think indot is trying their best to get rid of it. Kokomos portion is likely to be around for a very long time likely for good.

And it is still signed, as of my last trip along the route last month.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 2trailertrucker on March 08, 2017, 01:45:21 PM
Quote from: amroad17 on March 07, 2017, 11:46:52 PM
Quote from: captkirk_4 on March 07, 2017, 09:14:19 AM
Quote from: spell4yr on March 04, 2017, 11:22:07 PM
Thoughts on this construction work:

-- I wish that the paving of I-65 between I-80/94 and US 12/20 had been timed with the interchange construction a few years ago, as (if I recall correctly) part of that stretch was closed anyway.
-- I live right off of US 41 in Highland, and I dread the increased traffic from long-haul drivers, considering how crazy the local traffic already is.
-- Good to hear about I-94 east of US 421, as that stretch is not fun to drive.


Drove the backroads from Kankakee-Momence-Roselawn and definitely noticed a massive amount of semi-trucks along the very minor state routes Illinois 114 Indiana 10. Seems that if they don't build some sort of southern bypass the truckers will make their own spilling onto the backroads.
I would take that route sometimes when I drove for an expediting company just so I could avoid the Borman/Kingery Expressways and did not need to get into central Chicago.  I also would take IL 17 east out of Kankakee to IN 2, US 41 south, to IN 10 to I-65 again to avoid the Borman/Kingery.  Many truckers do both of these routes.  Beats sitting in a massive amount of traffic.

It would be nice if there was a southern bypass of Chicago.  Even an expressway (similar to Corridor H) from I-65 near IN 10 to Kankakee or even curving up to Peotone would help immensely (I know, this is approximately the routing of the moribund Illiana Corridor).

Truckers have been taking this route for years. When the Borman was closed a few years ago, it was very busy. Those against the Iliana have never taken the backseat !
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 11, 2017, 02:46:33 PM
Quote from: spell4yr on March 04, 2017, 11:22:07 PM
Thoughts on this construction work:

-- I wish that the paving of I-65 between I-80/94 and US 12/20 had been timed with the interchange construction a few years ago, as (if I recall correctly) part of that stretch was closed anyway.

The road was still serviceable in 2008 (when that stretch was closed for the reconstruction of the Borman Interchange). They would have probably had to redo that section anyway, since the winter of 2013-2014 put a beating on the area's highways, with that section of I-65 and I-94 between the Toll Road and Michigan getting it the worst.

I do agree that it should have been done sooner, but with other roads with considerably longer stretches needing the TLC first, I could see why they waited until now to put it in the forefront.

Regarding the Chicago Bypass, I had a thought...would it be considerably difficult to use the existing network of roads and widen them into divided highways where needed (using I-57, Illinois 17, Indiana 2, US 41, and Indiana 10) as a measure to alleviate traffic and divert southbound traffic away from the city?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 17, 2017, 08:29:28 PM
I hope this doesn't mean 32 will be decommissioned. http://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/hamilton-county/2017/03/17/westfield-eyes-ind-32-expansion-downtown/99299326/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on March 17, 2017, 09:31:50 PM
Considering they want the state to pay for the improvements, I'd say no.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 17, 2017, 09:34:00 PM
I think it's a bad idea, you want traffic to slow down in your downtown, not speed up.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on March 19, 2017, 09:51:41 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 17, 2017, 09:34:00 PM
I think it's a bad idea, you want traffic to slow down in your downtown, not speed up.

Yes but if you think the slowness of the road is causing people to bypass your downtown entirely then it's worth a shot.  As it stands now, whenever I'm heading up 31 I generally stop for gas/food at the 151st St exit.  Maybe with this road project and some signing/advertising, Westfield can get me to try the IN 32 exit instead.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 21, 2017, 02:43:49 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on March 19, 2017, 09:51:41 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 17, 2017, 09:34:00 PM
I think it's a bad idea, you want traffic to slow down in your downtown, not speed up.

Yes but if you think the slowness of the road is causing people to bypass your downtown entirely then it's worth a shot.  As it stands now, whenever I'm heading up 31 I generally stop for gas/food at the 151st St exit.  Maybe with this road project and some signing/advertising, Westfield can get me to try the IN 32 exit instead.

i think it's really because there's no reason to go there, downtown westfield has nothing of note in it, yet.  I know they're working on this, but honestly the portion east of downtown to the white river is what needs to be widened.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 21, 2017, 02:51:18 PM
random question, but when were the highways inside the 265 beltway rerouted in the new albany area?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on March 21, 2017, 03:44:59 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 21, 2017, 02:51:18 PM
random question, but when were the highways inside the 265 beltway rerouted in the new albany area?

When I moved to the area in 2006, the only state highway inside of 265 was IN 111.  From south to north it ran Main St -> Vincennes St -> Charlestown Rd -> Beechwood Ave -> Grant Line Rd. 

The southern end of IN 311 (formerly US31W) had already been truncated at I-265 by 2006 (previously continued down Charlestown to Beechwood) and IN 62 (Spring St -> Vincennes St -> Main St -> Corydon Pike) had also already been rerouted along I-265 by 2006.

I don't remember the exact date, but I believe it was in 2012, IN 111 got rerouted along I-64 and I-265.  In January 2013, the northern end of IN 111 got truncated to I-64 in downtown New Albany.  At the same time, IN 311 and IN 403 were eliminated entirely and the eastern end of IN 160 was truncated to US 31. 

There also used to be an IN 131 that ran through Clarksville between I-65/US 31 and the old alignment of IN 62 but that was also gone by 2006.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 22, 2017, 03:59:30 PM
it must have been in the 90s, i'm looking at some old plans dated 1983 for the old interchange at 62 and 131 (now browns station and lewis and clark). i bet mukade knows
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mvak36 on March 27, 2017, 05:10:00 PM
This probably should be in the Ohio Valley forum but I'll post in this thread. It looks like the state will be expanding the section between Seymour and Columbus to six lanes. http://www.tribtown.com/2017/03/27/state-planning-to-widen-interstate/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 27, 2017, 06:25:44 PM
why are they widening 65 in seemingly random areas?  why not continue from sr 44 down to sr 58 in phases?  now there are several islands of 6 lanes. i wonder how they're going to fix the 46 bridge when they inevitably widen that one
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mvak36 on March 27, 2017, 10:26:24 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 27, 2017, 06:25:44 PM
why are they widening 65 in seemingly random areas?  why not continue from sr 44 down to sr 58 in phases?  now there are several islands of 6 lanes. i wonder how they're going to fix the 46 bridge when they inevitably widen that one
Yeah, it seems a little odd that they're doing this segment first. I was thinking they would be making their way from Indianapolis outwards.

Maybe that area has old pavement and they're rebuilding that first?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on March 28, 2017, 09:09:20 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 27, 2017, 06:25:44 PM
why are they widening 65 in seemingly random areas?  why not continue from sr 44 down to sr 58 in phases?  now there are several islands of 6 lanes. i wonder how they're going to fix the 46 bridge when they inevitably widen that one

As someone who drives New Albany to Indy a LOT, I can tell you that if they can't do it all, doing a section in the middle is the next best thing.  Getting stuck in a large block of trucks going 66 in the left lane passing trucks going 65 in the right lane is a regular occurrence.  Doing the next section in the middle minimizes the longest stretches of 2-lane sections, giving relief to these truck blockades. 

It does seem to have the older pavement though, and I would guess that traffic counts are higher on that section than the others that are yet to be done.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 28, 2017, 09:20:15 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on March 28, 2017, 09:09:20 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 27, 2017, 06:25:44 PM
why are they widening 65 in seemingly random areas?  why not continue from sr 44 down to sr 58 in phases?  now there are several islands of 6 lanes. i wonder how they're going to fix the 46 bridge when they inevitably widen that one

As someone who drives New Albany to Indy a LOT, I can tell you that if they can't do it all, doing a section in the middle is the next best thing.  Getting stuck in a large block of trucks going 66 in the left lane passing trucks going 65 in the right lane is a regular occurrence.  Doing the next section in the middle minimizes the longest stretches of 2-lane sections, giving relief to these truck blockades. 

It does seem to have the older pavement though, and I would guess that traffic counts are higher on that section than the others that are yet to be done.

that makes sense.  also why do they make trucks go 5 miles slower than normal traffic?  i don't see how 5 miles less is safer, does it have to do with damage to the pavement?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on March 30, 2017, 09:08:38 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 28, 2017, 09:20:15 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on March 28, 2017, 09:09:20 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 27, 2017, 06:25:44 PM
why are they widening 65 in seemingly random areas?  why not continue from sr 44 down to sr 58 in phases?  now there are several islands of 6 lanes. i wonder how they're going to fix the 46 bridge when they inevitably widen that one

As someone who drives New Albany to Indy a LOT, I can tell you that if they can't do it all, doing a section in the middle is the next best thing.  Getting stuck in a large block of trucks going 66 in the left lane passing trucks going 65 in the right lane is a regular occurrence.  Doing the next section in the middle minimizes the longest stretches of 2-lane sections, giving relief to these truck blockades. 

It does seem to have the older pavement though, and I would guess that traffic counts are higher on that section than the others that are yet to be done.

that makes sense.  also why do they make trucks go 5 miles slower than normal traffic?  i don't see how 5 miles less is safer, does it have to do with damage to the pavement?

I'd guess that it probably has more to do with stopping distances.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: dvferyance on March 30, 2017, 12:32:27 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on March 21, 2017, 03:44:59 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 21, 2017, 02:51:18 PM
random question, but when were the highways inside the 265 beltway rerouted in the new albany area?

When I moved to the area in 2006, the only state highway inside of 265 was IN 111.  From south to north it ran Main St -> Vincennes St -> Charlestown Rd -> Beechwood Ave -> Grant Line Rd. 

The southern end of IN 311 (formerly US31W) had already been truncated at I-265 by 2006 (previously continued down Charlestown to Beechwood) and IN 62 (Spring St -> Vincennes St -> Main St -> Corydon Pike) had also already been rerouted along I-265 by 2006.

I don't remember the exact date, but I believe it was in 2012, IN 111 got rerouted along I-64 and I-265.  In January 2013, the northern end of IN 111 got truncated to I-64 in downtown New Albany.  At the same time, IN 311 and IN 403 were eliminated entirely and the eastern end of IN 160 was truncated to US 31. 

There also used to be an IN 131 that ran through Clarksville between I-65/US 31 and the old alignment of IN 62 but that was also gone by 2006.
IN 311 was one state highway that was axed that I would have kept. Indiana is becoming worse than Wisconsin just axing highways on request from local governments. I never get why that's a good idea.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: seicer on March 30, 2017, 04:28:14 PM
State of Indiana has a mileage cap. But I would agree that it can be extreme. When you are in rural areas, it's hard to find through routes because the roadways have reverted to county or township control, so quality of signage and pavement conditions is all over the place.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: dvferyance on March 30, 2017, 09:08:17 PM
Quote from: Sherman Cahal on March 30, 2017, 04:28:14 PM
State of Indiana has a mileage cap. But I would agree that it can be extreme. When you are in rural areas, it's hard to find through routes because the roadways have reverted to county or township control, so quality of signage and pavement conditions is all over the place.
I know but they are a good 300 miles under it. No danger of exceeding it at all. I have suggested Indiana does what Virginia does the city can own it but still be signed as a state highway so it's still a through route.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefro on March 31, 2017, 04:20:55 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 27, 2017, 06:25:44 PM
why are they widening 65 in seemingly random areas?  why not continue from sr 44 down to sr 58 in phases?  now there are several islands of 6 lanes. i wonder how they're going to fix the 46 bridge when they inevitably widen that one

I'd guess the segment from SR 58 to US 50 is probably the easiest/cheapest to widen of anything left south of Indianapolis.  Not much traffic
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: compdude787 on April 02, 2017, 06:26:21 PM
Quote from: dvferyance on March 30, 2017, 09:08:17 PM
I have suggested Indiana does what Virginia does the city can own it but still be signed as a state highway so it's still a through route.

This is a tangent, but California should do the same thing, too.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 10, 2017, 08:48:16 PM
An update regarding the concrete restoration project on I-65 in Lake County, and it will rub a lot of drivers the wrong way.

Work and lane realignment starts Tuesday night (4-11-17) and will last throughout the summer, from north of 61st Avenue to the I-80/94 merge/split. However, unlike last year, one lane will be closed in each direction at all times, making delays inevitable. This is a safeguard to keep workers safe, which I am totally okay with. The expansion project south of US 30 should be starting soon after.

Long range travelers between Chicago and Indianapolis (and beyond) should strongly consider US 41 as an alternate route (or, in extreme cases, I-57).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on April 27, 2017, 09:15:30 PM
Heard on the radio this afternoon that Indiana's governor signed off on a proposed gas tax increase.

http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/local/beat-up-south-bend-roads-to-benefit-from-indiana-gas/article_76e4c8ff-c8f5-535a-9213-54e63dc8e276.html (http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/local/beat-up-south-bend-roads-to-benefit-from-indiana-gas/article_76e4c8ff-c8f5-535a-9213-54e63dc8e276.html)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-39 on April 27, 2017, 11:12:48 PM
Excellent! And they are indexing it to inflation too! Good for Indiana. Hopefully, this will provide funding for finishing the US 31 freeway conversion between South Bend and Indianapolis.

EDIT: I agree now with the consensus that the US 31 freeway conversion should come after I-69 and the I-65 widenings are completed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on April 28, 2017, 08:59:28 AM
Quote from: I-39 on April 27, 2017, 11:12:48 PM
Excellent! And they are indexing it to inflation too! Good for Indiana. Hopefully, this will provide funding for finishing the US 31 freeway conversion between South Bend and Indianapolis.

Hopefully that project falls in line behind finishing I-69 and six-laning I-65 and I-70.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: dvferyance on April 28, 2017, 07:11:38 PM
Quote from: I-39 on April 27, 2017, 11:12:48 PM
Excellent! And they are indexing it to inflation too! Good for Indiana. Hopefully, this will provide funding for finishing the US 31 freeway conversion between South Bend and Indianapolis.
Say hello to I-67!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on April 29, 2017, 01:28:42 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on April 28, 2017, 08:59:28 AM
Quote from: I-39 on April 27, 2017, 11:12:48 PM
Excellent! And they are indexing it to inflation too! Good for Indiana. Hopefully, this will provide funding for finishing the US 31 freeway conversion between South Bend and Indianapolis.

Hopefully that project falls in line behind finishing I-69 and six-laning I-65 and I-70.

And re-take control of state highways that fall within city limits! :thumbsup: (Or at least responsibility for signing them)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on April 29, 2017, 04:14:31 PM
Quote from: billtm on April 29, 2017, 01:28:42 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on April 28, 2017, 08:59:28 AM
Quote from: I-39 on April 27, 2017, 11:12:48 PM
Excellent! And they are indexing it to inflation too! Good for Indiana. Hopefully, this will provide funding for finishing the US 31 freeway conversion between South Bend and Indianapolis.

Hopefully that project falls in line behind finishing I-69 and six-laning I-65 and I-70.

And re-take control of state highways that fall within city limits! :thumbsup: (Or at least responsibility for signing them)

In West Lafayette, it seems that the city doesn't want that anyway.  The reason given for the State Street project going on now is that with the completion of 231, State Street is no longer a state road so we finally can do whatever we want with it!  Not that there is a very good through route alternate other than going completely around on some roads that can't handle it.  If you were taking SR 26 from one side of Lafayette/West Lafayette as thru traffic and (as it is now) State Street is just completely closed, what is the best route? Take 231 south and follow 52 over Teal Road (which is slow and 2-lane) and then onto unnumbered Sagamore Parkway up to former 26?  Or go the other way around, north on 231 and then south on former 231/52 and again down unnumbered Sagamore Parkway?  When the project is done, the path of former 26 will be open but still unnumbered.  How does INDOT expect people to navigate?  (Don't say GPS. Can't always trust GPS.)  Why have route numbers if they randomly end and restart?

Indeed, blazing the numbers over non-state-maintained roads would help a lot.  But also I don't know that some cities even want that...West Lafayette seems to be happy to let 26 hit a black hole.  Heck, they found $$$ to take down perfectly functional INDOT signals that weren't pretty enough and replace them with fancier posts all over town, and even take the signs off the gantry on North River Road (former 231) but still paint the gantry black for style even if it sits empty.  Wacky stuff.  Why not just paint the signal masts and arms too and save some $$$?  They'd look about the same in the end and you could still be using what INDOT left behind.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 01, 2017, 06:30:38 PM
For those of you who regularly use the Indiana Toll Road, be prepared to put a lot more money into your EZ(I)-Passes.

Rates for transponder users will finally increase to match the rates of cash payers starting in June, with another increase in play July 1. Long story short, going from the Portage Toll Barrier to the Ohio State Line will cost $10.75 for passenger car drivers.

Construction updates on the interstates in Northwest Indiana:

I-80/94 has been reduced to two lanes at Indiana 51 (Ripley Street) for bridge work over the Toll Road; this also includes a new sign gantry for the eastbound Borman to Toll Road exit (replacing the one destroyed by a truck load a couple years back). However, for safety reasons, traffic from either direction of I-94 is unable to exit to the Toll Road, and the ramps from Ripley Street northbound and the Toll Road to I-94 eastbound are closed. Those in that immediate area are encouraged to use the loop ramps to enter I-94 eastbound. If you're on (or west of) I-65, use I-65 to get on the Toll Road. If you're out further east, use Indiana 49. (Speaking of the section west of I-65, only three lanes are open between Kennedy Avenue and I-65 for concrete restoration. Work areas will be separated by concrete barriers.)

Work to widen I-65 from Merrillville to Lowell officially broke ground this past weekend, with work officially starting this week. Utility and digging work starts this week, but major lane shifts will start in June. Concrete restoration north of US 30 is in progress, with work going in each direction, and in small sections. Much like the Borman, work areas are separated with concrete barriers, which will prevent any weaving or illegal crossovers. Finally, resurfacing is in progress between the Borman and US 12/20, with the original surface stripped. All lanes are open, and lane closures will only take place during actual work. Be wary of uneven pavement.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Joe The Dragon on May 01, 2017, 09:15:49 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 01, 2017, 06:30:38 PM
For those of you who regularly use the Indiana Toll Road, be prepared to put a lot more money into your EZ(I)-Passes.

Rates for transponder users will finally increase to match the rates of cash payers starting in June, with another increase in play July 1. Long story short, going from the Portage Toll Barrier to the Ohio State Line will cost $10.75 for passenger car drivers.

Construction updates on the interstates in Northwest Indiana:

I-80/94 has been reduced to two lanes at Indiana 51 (Ripley Street) for bridge work over the Toll Road; this also includes a new sign gantry for the eastbound Borman to Toll Road exit (replacing the one destroyed by a truck load a couple years back). However, for safety reasons, traffic from either direction of I-94 is unable to exit to the Toll Road, and the ramps from Ripley Street northbound and the Toll Road to I-94 eastbound are closed. Those in that immediate area are encouraged to use the loop ramps to enter I-94 eastbound. If you're on (or west of) I-65, use I-65 to get on the Toll Road. If you're out further east, use Indiana 49. (Speaking of the section west of I-65, only three lanes are open between Kennedy Avenue and I-65 for concrete restoration. Work areas will be separated by concrete barriers.)

Work to widen I-65 from Merrillville to Lowell officially broke ground this past weekend, with work officially starting this week. Utility and digging work starts this week, but major lane shifts will start in June. Concrete restoration north of US 30 is in progress, with work going in each direction, and in small sections. Much like the Borman, work areas are separated with concrete barriers, which will prevent any weaving or illegal crossovers. Finally, resurfacing is in progress between the Borman and US 12/20, with the original surface stripped. All lanes are open, and lane closures will only take place during actual work. Be wary of uneven pavement.
so I-PASS / EZ-PASS users will pay more then cash?? with added fee? or is that going away?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on May 01, 2017, 09:58:32 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on April 29, 2017, 04:14:31 PM
Quote from: billtm on April 29, 2017, 01:28:42 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on April 28, 2017, 08:59:28 AM
Quote from: I-39 on April 27, 2017, 11:12:48 PM
Excellent! And they are indexing it to inflation too! Good for Indiana. Hopefully, this will provide funding for finishing the US 31 freeway conversion between South Bend and Indianapolis.

Hopefully that project falls in line behind finishing I-69 and six-laning I-65 and I-70.

And re-take control of state highways that fall within city limits! :thumbsup: (Or at least responsibility for signing them)

In West Lafayette, it seems that the city doesn't want that anyway.  The reason given for the State Street project going on now is that with the completion of 231, State Street is no longer a state road so we finally can do whatever we want with it!  Not that there is a very good through route alternate other than going completely around on some roads that can't handle it.  If you were taking SR 26 from one side of Lafayette/West Lafayette as thru traffic and (as it is now) State Street is just completely closed, what is the best route? Take 231 south and follow 52 over Teal Road (which is slow and 2-lane) and then onto unnumbered Sagamore Parkway up to former 26?  Or go the other way around, north on 231 and then south on former 231/52 and again down unnumbered Sagamore Parkway?  When the project is done, the path of former 26 will be open but still unnumbered.  How does INDOT expect people to navigate?  (Don't say GPS. Can't always trust GPS.)  Why have route numbers if they randomly end and restart?

Indeed, blazing the numbers over non-state-maintained roads would help a lot.  But also I don't know that some cities even want that...West Lafayette seems to be happy to let 26 hit a black hole.  Heck, they found $$$ to take down perfectly functional INDOT signals that weren't pretty enough and replace them with fancier posts all over town, and even take the signs off the gantry on North River Road (former 231) but still paint the gantry black for style even if it sits empty.  Wacky stuff.  Why not just paint the signal masts and arms too and save some $$$?  They'd look about the same in the end and you could still be using what INDOT left behind.

Yes I agree the State Street project is going to be a lot better than INDOT could ever do, but what could be better would be a partnership system where cities can take responsibility for any major construction that THEY want, while INDOT takes care of routine maintenance and signage. I feel like that way INDOT could help people find the most efficient routes through areas better. I bet there's something I've overlooked but there must be some way to upgrade a route if the demand is there, while not having to create a gap in order to fund the project.  :hmmm:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 01, 2017, 11:21:47 PM
Quote from: Joe The Dragon on May 01, 2017, 09:15:49 PMso I-PASS / EZ-PASS users will pay more then cash?? with added fee? or is that going away?

To clear this up...the electronic toll rate will increase to match the cash rate in June. On July 1, the overall toll rate (which will be the same for both cash and electronic payers) will increase again. This increase was already scheduled before this news broke.

So, an equal rate regardless of whatever method you use to pay. Not too sure about the surcharges.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 13, 2017, 01:17:42 PM
So another stretch of I-65 will be seeing road reconstruction immediately after Memorial Day.

Work will take place from mile 197 to mile 207 (the White-Jasper County area). The mainline will be resurfaced, along with the interchanges on that stretch (US 24/231, exit 201, and US 231, exit 205). Bridges in this section will be overdecked and repaired, and the bridge over US 231 at exit 205 will be widened (inner shoulders with a concrete median, to accommodate future lane expansion work).

During work, the ramp connecting US 24/231 to I-65 Southbound, the ramp connecting I-65 South to US 231 at exit 205, and the ramp connecting US 231 to I-65 Northbound will be closed at all times. The remaining ramps will be utilized as detours.

Work will be aggressive, as this project is planned for completion at the end of July.

So, to summarize, there will be road work in some form for the first 55 miles of I-65 (or last 55, if you're driving northbound) through the summer. Plan accordingly.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 14, 2017, 03:05:12 PM
If you're going to do that much work on a stretch of road, why not go ahead and make it 6 lanes while you're at it?  I wondered the same thing when they did essentially the same thing between miles 29 and 39 a couple years ago.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 14, 2017, 11:21:35 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 14, 2017, 03:05:12 PM
If you're going to do that much work on a stretch of road, why not go ahead and make it 6 lanes while you're at it?  I wondered the same thing when they did essentially the same thing between miles 29 and 39 a couple years ago.

No argument here. I get proactively refitting the bridges to make space for (and speed up) future lane expansion, but why resurface an area that would be resurfaced again when the actual expansion is done? Makes me wonder if they're putting off this section for a few years.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 16, 2017, 02:25:13 PM
the i-69 campus parkway interchange will be changed to the full double reverse configuration tonight.  it should be complete by july
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 24, 2017, 08:02:22 PM
On or after June 1, the widening of I-65 from Merrillville to Lowell will begin in earnest. Here's the breakdown:

Two lanes of traffic will be maintained in both directions, with intermittent closures during nighttime hours. From south of US 30 to US 231, these two lanes will be shifted toward the median. Work will begin with signage removal, along with erosion measures and patching of existing pavement. Then, a new outside shoulder will be built, with new signage and guardrails. The road will then be re-striped to accommodate three full lanes of traffic.

From US 231 to south of Indiana 2, the outer shoulder will be reconstructed as a driveable lane for the first week. then, traffic will be shifted to the outer lanes while construction of new drainage and pavement takes place within the median (this includes the bridge over US 231, as well as the Kankakee River bridges). All mainline work should reach the endgame by the end of 2018.

Crown Point traffic will be affected as the project moves forward. In mid-July, the 93rd Avenue bridge over I-65 will be closed for resurfacing. Through traffic will be detoured to 101st Avenue. Once work on 93rd Avenue is complete, the 113th Avenue bridge will be closed for resurfacing, with through traffic being detoured via 109th Avenue (though it is strongly recommended to use US 231 if you have a little extra time on your hands; 109th Avenue traffic swells during peak times).

Work zone speed limits will be set at 55 mph. Be safe out there.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-39 on June 02, 2017, 12:50:23 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 24, 2017, 08:02:22 PM
On or after June 1, the widening of I-65 from Merrillville to Lowell will begin in earnest.

Just was on there yesterday, and not a lick of construction has begun. The construction zone wasn't even set up.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-39 on June 02, 2017, 12:54:54 PM
After driving the entire length of I-65 in Indiana yesterday, I can say that I now fully agree that I-65 needs to be six lanes throughout the ENTIRE state. Eight lanes are needed in areas such as Lafayette and the section from I-80/94 south to IN-2 (which they are only just now widening those sections to six lanes).

This needs to be done before finishing the US 31 freeway conversion.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 02, 2017, 04:58:59 PM
with the recent gas tax increase, i'd expect to see more widening projects in the future.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-39 on June 02, 2017, 07:37:54 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 02, 2017, 04:58:59 PM
with the recent gas tax increase, i'd expect to see more widening projects in the future.

True, but will they complete it throughout the entire state?

I don't understand why they aren't going to 4 lanes in each direction between I-80/94 and IN-2.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on June 02, 2017, 07:55:04 PM
What do you think about tolling Indiana's existing interstates?  :clap: :clap: :clap:

Article: http://www.journalgazette.net/news/local/indiana/20170602/indot-seeking-information-that-could-expand-interstate-tolling
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 02, 2017, 10:07:07 PM
Quote from: I-39 on June 02, 2017, 07:37:54 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 02, 2017, 04:58:59 PM
with the recent gas tax increase, i'd expect to see more widening projects in the future.

True, but will they complete it throughout the entire state?

I don't understand why they aren't going to 4 lanes in each direction between I-80/94 and IN-2.
yes, indot wants to 6 lane 65 and 70 throughout the entire state, they just need the money
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 02, 2017, 10:07:49 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on June 02, 2017, 07:55:04 PM
What do you think about tolling Indiana's existing interstates?  :clap: :clap: :clap:

Article: http://www.journalgazette.net/news/local/indiana/20170602/indot-seeking-information-that-could-expand-interstate-tolling

it ain't gonna happen
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-39 on June 02, 2017, 11:00:54 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 02, 2017, 10:07:49 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on June 02, 2017, 07:55:04 PM
What do you think about tolling Indiana's existing interstates?  :clap: :clap: :clap:

Article: http://www.journalgazette.net/news/local/indiana/20170602/indot-seeking-information-that-could-expand-interstate-tolling

it ain't gonna happen

If this were Illinois, they'd be rushing to put up the toll gantries.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Joe The Dragon on June 03, 2017, 01:11:13 AM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on June 02, 2017, 07:55:04 PM
What do you think about tolling Indiana's existing interstates?  :clap: :clap: :clap:

Article: http://www.journalgazette.net/news/local/indiana/20170602/indot-seeking-information-that-could-expand-interstate-tolling

it better be with ORT and if they do I-94 from the Illinois state line to the Michigan state line they better put in high speed ramps linking to the old toll road. also I-94 can be 5 lanes each way + aux from the toll road to IL
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 09, 2017, 09:19:12 AM
US 31 at SR 10 and SR 110 will be converted to  J-turns soon. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-39 on June 09, 2017, 09:49:03 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 09, 2017, 09:19:12 AM
US 31 at SR 10 and SR 110 will be converted to  J-turns soon.

I wonder if this means freeway conversion in that segment won't be coming anytime soon. Not that it's a bad thing, since there are bigger priorities.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 09, 2017, 09:50:25 AM
Quote from: I-39 on June 09, 2017, 09:49:03 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 09, 2017, 09:19:12 AM
US 31 at SR 10 and SR 110 will be converted to  J-turns soon.

I wonder if this means freeway conversion in that segment won't be coming anytime soon. Not that it's a bad thing, since there are bigger priorities.

i'd say yes it will be a while.  i'd at least fill the kokomo westfield gap.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 09, 2017, 12:40:38 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 09, 2017, 09:19:12 AM
US 31 at SR 10 and SR 110 will be converted to  J-turns soon. 

South side of IN 10 is going to be a tight fit with the railroad overpass there.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-39 on June 09, 2017, 01:33:38 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 09, 2017, 09:50:25 AM
Quote from: I-39 on June 09, 2017, 09:49:03 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 09, 2017, 09:19:12 AM
US 31 at SR 10 and SR 110 will be converted to  J-turns soon.

I wonder if this means freeway conversion in that segment won't be coming anytime soon. Not that it's a bad thing, since there are bigger priorities.

i'd say yes it will be a while.  i'd at least fill the kokomo westfield gap.

Yes, they should do the section between Kokomo and SR 38, but north of Kokomo can wait for a while.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 09, 2017, 10:44:23 PM
Quote from: I-39 on June 02, 2017, 12:50:23 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 24, 2017, 08:02:22 PM
On or after June 1, the widening of I-65 from Merrillville to Lowell will begin in earnest.

Just was on there yesterday, and not a lick of construction has begun. The construction zone wasn't even set up.

And I found out why: according to INDOT, crews were setting up a camera system to monitor the work zone, but there was a delay in the utility service that caused them to push back the start of the project.

A new start date is set for June 15, at the earliest.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: pianocello on June 14, 2017, 09:35:36 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 09, 2017, 10:44:23 PM
And I found out why: according to INDOT, crews were setting up a camera system to monitor the work zone, but there was a delay in the utility service that caused them to push back the start of the project.

A new start date is set for June 15, at the earliest.

Seriously? Is the camera feed really all that important to delay an entire construction project? Unless it's a liability thing...
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 14, 2017, 10:49:44 PM
Quote from: pianocello on June 14, 2017, 09:35:36 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 09, 2017, 10:44:23 PM
And I found out why: according to INDOT, crews were setting up a camera system to monitor the work zone, but there was a delay in the utility service that caused them to push back the start of the project.

A new start date is set for June 15, at the earliest.

Seriously? Is the camera feed really all that important to delay an entire construction project? Unless it's a liability thing...

INDOT has been working with Purdue on time lapse vids of their projects, this could be another one
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 02 Park Ave on June 20, 2017, 10:51:40 PM
Have the new, July 1st, toll rates for the Toll Road been published yet?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on June 26, 2017, 04:33:48 PM
Well, this topic is very interesting...

Indianapolis is trying to sue Carmel for building roundabouts along 96th Street, which is the border between the two counties (Marion and Hamilton)...

Article:
http://fox59.com/2017/06/22/carmel-sued-by-city-of-indianapolis-over-roundabouts/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 26, 2017, 04:42:34 PM
This story really angers me, the counsel woman from Indy should consider worrying about the conditions of the roads in her district.  Indy is paying a whopping $0.00 for this project.  I hope Brainard moves them into Carmel territory.  I also don't believe her argument that they aren't needed, she's clearly never been in the area.  If there isn't congestion, why is she basically saying there is with her statement about stopping to see what's in the area?  Same bullshit they used to try to stop SR 37 in Fishers and Noblesville, it lost there too.  She claims Carmel never told the businesses about the project, Carmel basically is saying she's lying.  I think she's lying, especially since R/W acquisition would require the notification of the project.  As someone who works in her district, it would be nice for her to actually care about it. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on June 28, 2017, 12:19:40 PM
A public meeting is scheduled for tonight at Oregon Davis Junior-Senior High School in Starke County (5 p.m. Central Time), discussing conversion of US 30 to a freeway between I-69 in Ft. Wayne to SR 49 in Valparaiso: http://wsbt.com/news/local/your-chance-to-weigh-in-on-us-30-project (http://wsbt.com/news/local/your-chance-to-weigh-in-on-us-30-project). The story doesn't state who is sponsoring the meeting or if INDOT reps will attend.

I doubt that it would go full freeway in the foreseeable future, but improvements are sorely needed. There is a long history of really nasty accidents along that route.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 28, 2017, 02:11:21 PM
Quote from: theline on June 28, 2017, 12:19:40 PM
A public meeting is scheduled for tonight at Oregon Davis Junior-Senior High School in Starke County (5 p.m. Central Time), discussing conversion of US 30 to a freeway between I-69 in Ft. Wayne to SR 49 in Valparaiso: http://wsbt.com/news/local/your-chance-to-weigh-in-on-us-30-project (http://wsbt.com/news/local/your-chance-to-weigh-in-on-us-30-project). The story doesn't state who is sponsoring the meeting or if INDOT reps will attend.

I doubt that it would go full freeway in the foreseeable future, but improvements are sorely needed. There is a long history of really nasty accidents along that route.

wonderful idea, except it should go from 65 to 69 not 49 to 69
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: The Ghostbuster on June 28, 2017, 02:42:59 PM
Does anyone know how much this conversion will cost? Or how many right-of-way impacts and relocations might be needed to implement this plan?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 28, 2017, 02:54:05 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 28, 2017, 02:11:21 PM
Quote from: theline on June 28, 2017, 12:19:40 PM
A public meeting is scheduled for tonight at Oregon Davis Junior-Senior High School in Starke County (5 p.m. Central Time), discussing conversion of US 30 to a freeway between I-69 in Ft. Wayne to SR 49 in Valparaiso: http://wsbt.com/news/local/your-chance-to-weigh-in-on-us-30-project (http://wsbt.com/news/local/your-chance-to-weigh-in-on-us-30-project). The story doesn't state who is sponsoring the meeting or if INDOT reps will attend.

I doubt that it would go full freeway in the foreseeable future, but improvements are sorely needed. There is a long history of really nasty accidents along that route.

wonderful idea, except it should go from 65 to 69 not 49 to 69

That will never happen. The section from I-65 to Indiana 49 is far too developed. They don't even have the room to convert 30 into a freeway with frontage roads and Texas turnarounds - which I think would be a good idea if they had more ROW.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 28, 2017, 03:00:35 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 28, 2017, 02:54:05 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 28, 2017, 02:11:21 PM
Quote from: theline on June 28, 2017, 12:19:40 PM
A public meeting is scheduled for tonight at Oregon Davis Junior-Senior High School in Starke County (5 p.m. Central Time), discussing conversion of US 30 to a freeway between I-69 in Ft. Wayne to SR 49 in Valparaiso: http://wsbt.com/news/local/your-chance-to-weigh-in-on-us-30-project (http://wsbt.com/news/local/your-chance-to-weigh-in-on-us-30-project). The story doesn't state who is sponsoring the meeting or if INDOT reps will attend.

I doubt that it would go full freeway in the foreseeable future, but improvements are sorely needed. There is a long history of really nasty accidents along that route.

wonderful idea, except it should go from 65 to 69 not 49 to 69

That will never happen. The section from I-65 to Indiana 49 is far too developed. They don't even have the room to convert 30 into a freeway with frontage roads and Texas turnarounds - which I think would be a good idea if they had more ROW.

Maybe they could at least do everything except Warsaw.  Warsaw would be the really expensive section.  The rest shouldn't be too bad.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on June 28, 2017, 07:44:12 PM
My wife and I are thinking that safety could be improved on a bit of a budget with the addition of overpasses at key locations and perhaps some J-turns, like the ones that are in the works for the most hazardous remaining intersections on US 31. Like I said above, the chance of a full freeway belongs in the fantasy section.

Edited to add that converting the SR 49 to I-65 section to freeway are really a pipe-dream. Like silverback said, it's way too developed. Warsaw, on the other hand, I think is doable as a freeway in the long range.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on June 28, 2017, 08:39:09 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 28, 2017, 02:54:05 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 28, 2017, 02:11:21 PM
wonderful idea, except it should go from 65 to 69 not 49 to 69

That will never happen. The section from I-65 to Indiana 49 is far too developed. They don't even have the room to convert 30 into a freeway with frontage roads and Texas turnarounds - which I think would be a good idea if they had more ROW.

They managed to convert US 31 to a freeway through Carmel north of Keystone - how was that ROW-wise compared to US 30 through Merrillville?  Cost-wise though I agree it is very unlikely since INDOT seems to shaft northwest Indiana (with the Cline Avenue bridge replacement as an example).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 28, 2017, 10:14:22 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on June 28, 2017, 08:39:09 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 28, 2017, 02:54:05 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 28, 2017, 02:11:21 PM
wonderful idea, except it should go from 65 to 69 not 49 to 69

That will never happen. The section from I-65 to Indiana 49 is far too developed. They don't even have the room to convert 30 into a freeway with frontage roads and Texas turnarounds - which I think would be a good idea if they had more ROW.

They managed to convert US 31 to a freeway through Carmel north of Keystone - how was that ROW-wise compared to US 30 through Merrillville?  Cost-wise though I agree it is very unlikely since INDOT seems to shaft northwest Indiana (with the Cline Avenue bridge replacement as an example).

INDOT doesn't think NW IN exists  :-D
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Finrod on June 28, 2017, 10:59:00 PM
Here's another url about this-- looks like it was a local group that organized this, including the mayors of the cities along the route:

http://wsbt.com/news/local/local-leaders-propose-limited-access-freeway-for-us-30
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Finrod on June 28, 2017, 11:03:46 PM
And here's the follow-up story:

http://wsbt.com/news/local/debate-continues-on-proposal-to-turn-us-30-into-limited-access-freeway
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 29, 2017, 07:35:30 AM
this sounds a lot like us 31.  also, they could do it to 65, ever heard of immanent domain?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on June 29, 2017, 08:08:34 AM
Would the increased volume on US 30 (forecasting going from 30k to 80k traffic) be from the toll roads in Indiana and Ohio?  If you are going through the area and want to shunpike, US 30 would then be a very limited access all the way to I-71, and you could darn well find a 4 lane most of the way through Canton to hook up with I-76 south of Youngstown.  That could cause another bankruptcy for the toll road company.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 29, 2017, 09:07:53 AM
Carmel now officially has 105 roundabouts.  They will never get down to 1 signal though, due to US 421.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 29, 2017, 09:51:23 AM
Quote from: Life in Paradise on June 29, 2017, 08:08:34 AM
Would the increased volume on US 30 (forecasting going from 30k to 80k traffic) be from the toll roads in Indiana and Ohio?  If you are going through the area and want to shunpike, US 30 would then be a very limited access all the way to I-71, and you could darn well find a 4 lane most of the way through Canton to hook up with I-76 south of Youngstown.  That could cause another bankruptcy for the toll road company.

Gary, IN to Cleveland, OH via toll roads:
317 miles, about 5 hours, $16.90 in tolls, $32.42 in gas

Gary, IN to Cleveland, OH via I-65, US 30, I-71:
366 miles, about 6.25 hours (if entire length of US 30 is upgraded to freeway, otherwise it's longer), $0.00 in tolls, $37.43 in gas

So if someone wants to take an extra 75 minutes to get from Gary to Cleveland just to spend $11.89 less, I hope they realize they are essentially earning $9.51 per hour for their time.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 29, 2017, 10:02:33 AM
With all those lights on 30 I'll just pay for the tolls

Nexus 6P

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 29, 2017, 12:18:14 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 29, 2017, 10:02:33 AM
With all those lights on 30 I'll just pay for the tolls

Nexus 6P



This was using the scenario that 30 gets converted to limited access and how that might impact the toll road.  I was pointing out that even without lights, it's a lot of time to save a little bit of money.

That said, 30 already has seen a big increase in truck traffic, possibly due to increased tolls, and I see reports of bad accidents on 30 almost daily now.  I do think traffic has gotten to the point where something needs to be done for safety.  If I still lived up in that part of the state, I'd be avoiding 30 at all costs. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on June 29, 2017, 05:52:15 PM
Back in the 80's, one of my fraternity buddies had such a rise against toll roads, that he routed a group to avoid the Kentucky turnpikes (then tolled), and also the Florida Turnpike to go to Fort Lauderdale.  Needless to say, his car buddies decided that when they went back, they were going to pay the tolls.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: pianocello on June 29, 2017, 06:27:04 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on June 28, 2017, 08:39:09 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 28, 2017, 02:54:05 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 28, 2017, 02:11:21 PM
wonderful idea, except it should go from 65 to 69 not 49 to 69

That will never happen. The section from I-65 to Indiana 49 is far too developed. They don't even have the room to convert 30 into a freeway with frontage roads and Texas turnarounds - which I think would be a good idea if they had more ROW.

They managed to convert US 31 to a freeway through Carmel north of Keystone - how was that ROW-wise compared to US 30 through Merrillville?  Cost-wise though I agree it is very unlikely since INDOT seems to shaft northwest Indiana (with the Cline Avenue bridge replacement as an example).

I think it's comparable as far as ROW width goes, but US 30's developed section in Merrillville is much longer than US 31 in Carmel used to be. Plus, there's the full interchange with I-65 to consider too. And yeah, INDOT typically seems to forget about NWI.

Personally, I'd love to see a US 30 freeway from Fort Wayne to Valparaiso, but it wouldn't be feasible to take it any further west of there. As much as I want it to happen, though, I'd be lucky to see it by the time I retire.


Quote from: silverback1065 on June 29, 2017, 09:07:53 AM
Carmel now officially has 105 roundabouts.  They will never get down to 1 signal though, due to US 421.

Last I heard (April of this year), the mayor's plan is to eliminate all of the stoplights on city-maintained (i.e. non-INDOT) intersections. Have they gotten there yet?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 29, 2017, 07:06:40 PM
Quote from: pianocello on June 29, 2017, 06:27:04 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on June 28, 2017, 08:39:09 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 28, 2017, 02:54:05 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 28, 2017, 02:11:21 PM
wonderful idea, except it should go from 65 to 69 not 49 to 69

That will never happen. The section from I-65 to Indiana 49 is far too developed. They don't even have the room to convert 30 into a freeway with frontage roads and Texas turnarounds - which I think would be a good idea if they had more ROW.

They managed to convert US 31 to a freeway through Carmel north of Keystone - how was that ROW-wise compared to US 30 through Merrillville?  Cost-wise though I agree it is very unlikely since INDOT seems to shaft northwest Indiana (with the Cline Avenue bridge replacement as an example).

I think it's comparable as far as ROW width goes, but US 30's developed section in Merrillville is much longer than US 31 in Carmel used to be. Plus, there's the full interchange with I-65 to consider too. And yeah, INDOT typically seems to forget about NWI.

Personally, I'd love to see a US 30 freeway from Fort Wayne to Valparaiso, but it wouldn't be feasible to take it any further west of there. As much as I want it to happen, though, I'd be lucky to see it by the time I retire.


Quote from: silverback1065 on June 29, 2017, 09:07:53 AM
Carmel now officially has 105 roundabouts.  They will never get down to 1 signal though, due to US 421.

Last I heard (April of this year), the mayor's plan is to eliminate all of the stoplights on city-maintained (i.e. non-INDOT) intersections. Have they gotten there yet?

they're close, i don't know the exact count, but it's not a lot
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: amroad17 on June 30, 2017, 02:22:00 AM
I could see a freeway built along US 30 to Valpariso and then upgrading IN 49 to the Toll Road.  IN 49 is already an expressway/freeway hybrid.  To make this idea into a freeway would involve a reconstruction of the Toll Road interchange, grade-separating three intersections along this stretch, shoulder upgrades, and a reconstruction of the US 30/IN 49 interchange so that the SB 49/EB 30 and WB 30/NB 49 are the through movements.  On US 30, Warsaw would definitely have to be bypassed north of the city and the airport and Columbia City may even have to be bypassed--probably south of the city.

It is doable--only if the funds are there.  And no, there doesn't have to be an I-shield attached to this.  This freeway could be built without worrying about "Interstate Standards".  Just as long as it is safer to drive with less "stoppage" time along the way.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 30, 2017, 07:29:29 AM
what is so hard about warsaw and columbia city?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 30, 2017, 10:11:40 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 30, 2017, 07:29:29 AM
what is so hard about warsaw and columbia city?

Much like Merrillville and points west, US 30 cuts through highly developed areas of those two cities. It is unfeasible to build a freeway on the existing terrain with tight ROWs.

They would have to build a whole new set of roadway around those cities in order to make a nonstop Valparaiso to Fort Wayne expressway. Otherwise, it wouldn't be a bad thing to have breaks in the freeway in those two areas (much like US 41/SR 63 from Kentland to Evansville).

(I am aware that US 41/SR 63 isn't a full blown Expressway between those two points; I just cite it because of the sparsity of traffic lights between those two points, with exceptions of hub points like Terre Haute.)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 05, 2017, 10:13:15 AM
Drove 31 to Michigan, and noticed a few things:

there is a lone I-31 shield on a mile marker sign, southbound just north of SR 32
they need to mill and resurface the southbend bypass, they also need to remile mark it for us 31 mileage. 
the end of the new bypass up to the old cloverleaf interchange is substandard, still using a median instead of a jersey barrier. 
driving it in it's current form is great. adding the jturns at SR 10 and 110 will make it better, the current signals aren't that bad. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 05, 2017, 10:06:20 PM
An "I-31" shield, did I read that right?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on July 05, 2017, 10:24:40 PM
That's mile 131 - sure you didn't just mis read the 1 as an I ?

When I look on google maps street view the mile marker signs look fine.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 05, 2017, 10:49:25 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 05, 2017, 10:06:20 PM
An "I-31" shield, did I read that right?

yes you did, they screwed up, it's not on street view.  i'll see if i can get a picture.  i did a double take when i saw it!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on July 06, 2017, 06:30:29 PM
Sounds like the "US 37" shields painted on 69 in Fishers
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on July 06, 2017, 07:32:29 PM
US 30 between Warsaw and Fort Wayne is already a nice divided highway with 60 mph speed limits in the rural areas, what more do you guys want? We can't make every road an interstate.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on July 06, 2017, 08:57:07 PM
Quote from: csw on July 06, 2017, 07:32:29 PM
US 30 between Warsaw and Fort Wayne is already a nice divided highway with 60 mph speed limits in the rural areas, what more do you guys want? We can't make every road an interstate.

How about an expressway free of stoplights and where the speed limit never drops below 65?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 06, 2017, 09:34:33 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on July 06, 2017, 06:30:29 PM
Sounds like the "US 37" shields painted on 69 in Fishers

i just drove by and they fixed it! (us 37 shields in fishers)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on July 07, 2017, 09:59:36 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 06, 2017, 09:34:33 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on July 06, 2017, 06:30:29 PM
Sounds like the "US 37" shields painted on 69 in Fishers

i just drove by and they fixed it! (us 37 shields in fishers)

Yes - I noticed that Wednesday evening and remembered I needed to post about it. I am positive the US 37 shields were there last week.  I did not go that way Monday evening or over the weekend, so I'm not sure when they changed it, but very recently.

The pavement markings are now 37 in a square.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SEWIGuy on July 07, 2017, 10:23:47 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on July 06, 2017, 08:57:07 PM
Quote from: csw on July 06, 2017, 07:32:29 PM
US 30 between Warsaw and Fort Wayne is already a nice divided highway with 60 mph speed limits in the rural areas, what more do you guys want? We can't make every road an interstate.

How about an expressway free of stoplights and where the speed limit never drops below 65?


Do traffic counts warrant that?  Or do we just want to knock five minutes off a trip for convenience sake?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on July 07, 2017, 10:29:52 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on July 07, 2017, 09:59:36 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 06, 2017, 09:34:33 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on July 06, 2017, 06:30:29 PM
Sounds like the "US 37" shields painted on 69 in Fishers

i just drove by and they fixed it! (us 37 shields in fishers)

Yes - I noticed that Wednesday evening and remembered I needed to post about it. I am positive the US 37 shields were there last week.  I did not go that way Monday evening or over the weekend, so I'm not sure when they changed it, but very recently.

The pavement markings are now 37 in a square.

I find this rather hilarious.  I'm sure not too many people even noticed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 07, 2017, 10:33:22 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on July 07, 2017, 10:29:52 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on July 07, 2017, 09:59:36 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 06, 2017, 09:34:33 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on July 06, 2017, 06:30:29 PM
Sounds like the "US 37" shields painted on 69 in Fishers

i just drove by and they fixed it! (us 37 shields in fishers)

Yes - I noticed that Wednesday evening and remembered I needed to post about it. I am positive the US 37 shields were there last week.  I did not go that way Monday evening or over the weekend, so I'm not sure when they changed it, but very recently.

The pavement markings are now 37 in a square.

I find this rather hilarious.  I'm sure not too many people even noticed.

only us road geeks would notice  :-D  i notice signage and marking fuck ups all the time.  the most common are the pedestrian crossing signs with the arrow pointing the wrong way. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on July 07, 2017, 11:45:28 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on July 07, 2017, 10:29:52 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on July 07, 2017, 09:59:36 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 06, 2017, 09:34:33 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on July 06, 2017, 06:30:29 PM
Sounds like the "US 37" shields painted on 69 in Fishers

i just drove by and they fixed it! (us 37 shields in fishers)

Yes - I noticed that Wednesday evening and remembered I needed to post about it. I am positive the US 37 shields were there last week.  I did not go that way Monday evening or over the weekend, so I'm not sure when they changed it, but very recently.

The pavement markings are now 37 in a square.

I find this rather hilarious.  I'm sure not too many people even noticed.
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 07, 2017, 10:33:22 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on July 07, 2017, 10:29:52 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on July 07, 2017, 09:59:36 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 06, 2017, 09:34:33 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on July 06, 2017, 06:30:29 PM
Sounds like the "US 37" shields painted on 69 in Fishers

i just drove by and they fixed it! (us 37 shields in fishers)

Yes - I noticed that Wednesday evening and remembered I needed to post about it. I am positive the US 37 shields were there last week.  I did not go that way Monday evening or over the weekend, so I'm not sure when they changed it, but very recently.

The pavement markings are now 37 in a square.

I find this rather hilarious.  I'm sure not too many people even noticed.

only us road geeks would notice  :-D  i notice signage and marking fuck ups all the time.  the most common are the pedestrian crossing signs with the arrow pointing the wrong way. 

Guilty as charged....
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 07, 2017, 05:48:30 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on July 07, 2017, 10:23:47 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on July 06, 2017, 08:57:07 PM
Quote from: csw on July 06, 2017, 07:32:29 PM
US 30 between Warsaw and Fort Wayne is already a nice divided highway with 60 mph speed limits in the rural areas, what more do you guys want? We can't make every road an interstate.

How about an expressway free of stoplights and where the speed limit never drops below 65?


Do traffic counts warrant that?  Or do we just want to knock five minutes off a trip for convenience sake?

The discussion was precipitated by a rash of serious accidents on 30, so no it isn't just for convenience sake.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 07, 2017, 11:40:48 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 07, 2017, 05:48:30 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on July 07, 2017, 10:23:47 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on July 06, 2017, 08:57:07 PM
Quote from: csw on July 06, 2017, 07:32:29 PM
US 30 between Warsaw and Fort Wayne is already a nice divided highway with 60 mph speed limits in the rural areas, what more do you guys want? We can't make every road an interstate.

How about an expressway free of stoplights and where the speed limit never drops below 65?


Do traffic counts warrant that?  Or do we just want to knock five minutes off a trip for convenience sake?

The discussion was precipitated by a rash of serious accidents on 30, so no it isn't just for convenience sake.

Also mentioned up-thread was the predicted spike in traffic counts along US 30 in the coming years (an increase of ADT by about 50,000), possibly due to drivers evading the Toll Road. There is some level of justification for freeway conversion.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sparker on July 07, 2017, 11:53:08 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 07, 2017, 11:40:48 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 07, 2017, 05:48:30 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on July 07, 2017, 10:23:47 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on July 06, 2017, 08:57:07 PM
Quote from: csw on July 06, 2017, 07:32:29 PM
US 30 between Warsaw and Fort Wayne is already a nice divided highway with 60 mph speed limits in the rural areas, what more do you guys want? We can't make every road an interstate.

How about an expressway free of stoplights and where the speed limit never drops below 65?


Do traffic counts warrant that?  Or do we just want to knock five minutes off a trip for convenience sake?

The discussion was precipitated by a rash of serious accidents on 30, so no it isn't just for convenience sake.

Also mentioned up-thread was the predicted spike in traffic counts along US 30 in the coming years (an increase of ADT by about 50,000), possibly due to drivers evading the Toll Road. There is some level of justification for freeway conversion.

We pretty much know that Indiana's not totally averse to freeway or at least expressway development -- I-69 and the Heartland corridor attest to that -- but unless Ohio's on board with similar US 30 freeway upgrades, development of that route through Indiana might be a futile pursuit.  Unless -- the idea was to shunt traffic onto US 24 east of Ft. Wayne to get it back to I-80/90 in the Toledo area (essentially shunpiking the problematic ITR but not most of the Ohio Turnpike).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JREwing78 on July 08, 2017, 12:35:11 AM
Quote from: sparker on July 07, 2017, 11:53:08 PM
We pretty much know that Indiana's not totally averse to freeway or at least expressway development -- I-69 and the Heartland corridor attest to that -- but unless Ohio's on board with similar US 30 freeway upgrades, development of that route through Indiana might be a futile pursuit.  Unless -- the idea was to shunt traffic onto US 24 east of Ft. Wayne to get it back to I-80/90 in the Toledo area (essentially shunpiking the problematic ITR but not most of the Ohio Turnpike).

US 30 is expressway or freeway in Ohio (i.e. no stoplights) from I-71 in Mansfield clear to the Indiana line. Not much more you can really ask of them other than to eliminate the remaining cross-traffic and to continue work east of Mansfield. But as it sits now, US 30 is a considerably safer drive in western Ohio than in Indiana.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SEWIGuy on July 08, 2017, 09:56:36 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 07, 2017, 11:40:48 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 07, 2017, 05:48:30 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on July 07, 2017, 10:23:47 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on July 06, 2017, 08:57:07 PM
Quote from: csw on July 06, 2017, 07:32:29 PM
US 30 between Warsaw and Fort Wayne is already a nice divided highway with 60 mph speed limits in the rural areas, what more do you guys want? We can't make every road an interstate.

How about an expressway free of stoplights and where the speed limit never drops below 65?


Do traffic counts warrant that?  Or do we just want to knock five minutes off a trip for convenience sake?

The discussion was precipitated by a rash of serious accidents on 30, so no it isn't just for convenience sake.

Also mentioned up-thread was the predicted spike in traffic counts along US 30 in the coming years (an increase of ADT by about 50,000), possibly due to drivers evading the Toll Road. There is some level of justification for freeway conversion.


Thank you both.  Should have read more obviously.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 08, 2017, 06:46:29 PM
It's all good. I agree with the "not building a freeway for the sake of convenience argument," but since US 30 is the only major divided highway serving Northern Indiana from end to end (the Toll Road being the other), rebuilding it as a viable, free-flowing roadway would help alleviate the ever growing pressure.

On that note...next week, work on I-65 between the Kankakee River bridges and US 30 will pick up significantly. Lane shifts between Indiana 2 and US 231 have already been completed, and shifts from US 231 to US 30 will be implemented next week. On or after July 10, the 93rd Avenue overpass will be closed six weeks for resurfacing. The 113th Avenue overpass will be worked on immediately after.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mgk920 on July 08, 2017, 11:59:14 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 08, 2017, 06:46:29 PM
It's all good. I agree with the "not building a freeway for the sake of convenience argument," but since US 30 is the only major divided highway serving Northern Indiana from end to end (the Toll Road being the other), rebuilding it as a viable, free-flowing roadway would help alleviate the ever growing pressure.

On that note...next week, work on I-65 between the Kankakee River bridges and US 30 will pick up significantly. Lane shifts between Indiana 2 and US 231 have already been completed, and shifts from US 231 to US 30 will be implemented next week. On or after July 10, the 93rd Avenue overpass will be closed six weeks for resurfacing. The 113th Avenue overpass will be worked on immediately after.

Is US 30 covered by the Toll Road's 'no compete' agreement with InDOT?

Mike
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ukfan758 on July 09, 2017, 08:18:34 PM
Are crews still working on the newly widened part of 65 south of Indy? I drove through there for the Indy 500 and the new lane had a very rough transition to the original lanes (was built higher).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on July 09, 2017, 08:43:13 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 01, 2017, 11:21:47 PM
Quote from: Joe The Dragon on May 01, 2017, 09:15:49 PMso I-PASS / EZ-PASS users will pay more then cash?? with added fee? or is that going away?

To clear this up...the electronic toll rate will increase to match the cash rate in June. On July 1, the overall toll rate (which will be the same for both cash and electronic payers) will increase again. This increase was already scheduled before this news broke.

So, an equal rate regardless of whatever method you use to pay.

Doesn't look that way for every toll plaza per the recent toll rate listing posted. (http://www.ezpassin.com/wp-content/uploads/Toll-Rates-as-of-July-1st-2017.pdf)  Granted it's only a difference of a few pennies.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 09, 2017, 08:45:53 PM
Quote from: ukfan758 on July 09, 2017, 08:18:34 PM
Are crews still working on the newly widened part of 65 south of Indy? I drove through there for the Indy 500 and the new lane had a very rough transition to the original lanes (was built higher).

Are you talking from I-465 to Southport Road or Southport Road to Franklin/SR 44. If it's the former, that stretch of highway "is" complete. It is just the contractors had no intent apparently in redoing the entire width of the highway, only adding the lane to the side and patching up any connections between the two. Compared with south of Southport Road where the entire interstate was rebuilt with lane additions. I think the building of the two-lane flyover ramp at the 465/65 interchange took too much energy from the rest of the project resulting in them doing the bare minimum on I-65 south of there. INDOT will likely throw money at someone else to completely repave that stretch of highway somewhere down the road.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 09, 2017, 08:56:40 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 09, 2017, 08:45:53 PM
Quote from: ukfan758 on July 09, 2017, 08:18:34 PM
Are crews still working on the newly widened part of 65 south of Indy? I drove through there for the Indy 500 and the new lane had a very rough transition to the original lanes (was built higher).

Are you talking from I-465 to Southport Road or Southport Road to Franklin/SR 44. If it's the former, that stretch of highway "is" complete. It is just the contractors had no intent apparently in redoing the entire width of the highway, only adding the lane to the side and patching up any connections between the two. Compared with south of Southport Road where the entire interstate was rebuilt with lane additions. I think the building of the two-lane flyover ramp at the 465/65 interchange took too much energy from the rest of the project resulting in them doing the bare minimum on I-65 south of there. INDOT will likely throw money at someone else to completely repave that stretch of highway somewhere down the road.
Is it still concrete and asphalt?

Nexus 6P

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 09, 2017, 08:57:04 PM
Cool video on how INDOT makes signs
http://wishtv.com/2017/07/09/getting-an-inside-look-at-the-citys-signs-with-indot/

Nexus 6P

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on July 11, 2017, 08:42:03 PM
Pretty interesting. Nothing really surprising as far as the manufacturing process goes but I'd love to spend a few hours browsing that warehouse.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 13, 2017, 07:07:09 AM
I guess this is an Indiana note: in about a month or so, I will be relocating from near the far southern end of I-65 in Indiana to somewhere in the vicinity of the far northern end of I-65 in Indiana (exact location yet to be determined).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 13, 2017, 02:51:42 PM
here is what the gas tax got us, click on your county to see what projects are going to be done: http://www.in.gov/indot/div/nextlevel/
it looks like they are removing some of the bridges over the ghost ramps to 69 at the north split
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on July 13, 2017, 09:30:08 PM
Lots of resurfacing and bridge jobs. It's hard to pick out major improvements. Looks like the US 31 bridge over the NS RR in Tipton County is going - although not much of a secret. They've been doing lots of soil boring there along with survey work for resurfacing between the two freeway segments.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 13, 2017, 09:31:16 PM
It would be nice to see an interchange at division road.  These projects are boring, but needed.

Nexus 6P

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 13, 2017, 10:01:58 PM
There are plans for I-69 to be widened to six lanes from Exit 218 to 226 around the south side of Anderson.

I also read about an upcoming project to widen I-70 west from Exit 66 in Plainfield to Exit 59 at SR 39 outside of Monrovia.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: spell4yr on July 13, 2017, 10:03:32 PM
I find it interesting in LaPorte County that there's mention of US 12 just east of US 35. Did Michigan Boulevard in Michigan City get transferred back to state control without any fanfare? (Last I knew, US 35 ended at US 20/I-94 or US 20/SR 212, dependent on which sign you looked at.)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 13, 2017, 10:15:29 PM
Quote from: spell4yr on July 13, 2017, 10:03:32 PM
I find it interesting in LaPorte County that there's mention of US 12 just east of US 35. Did Michigan Boulevard in Michigan City get transferred back to state control without any fanfare? (Last I knew, US 35 ended at US 20/I-94 or US 20/SR 212, dependent on which sign you looked at.)

Probably a typo. The city did a lot of landscaping improvements to that area since they've taken control of Michigan Boulevard. US 35 still officially ends at the cloverleaf with US 20/Indiana 212.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on July 13, 2017, 10:22:11 PM
What is the twenty year major mobility designation all about?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 13, 2017, 10:39:46 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 13, 2017, 10:15:29 PM
Quote from: spell4yr on July 13, 2017, 10:03:32 PM
I find it interesting in LaPorte County that there's mention of US 12 just east of US 35. Did Michigan Boulevard in Michigan City get transferred back to state control without any fanfare? (Last I knew, US 35 ended at US 20/I-94 or US 20/SR 212, dependent on which sign you looked at.)

Probably a typo. The city did a lot of landscaping improvements to that area since they've taken control of Michigan Boulevard. US 35 still officially ends at the cloverleaf with US 20/Indiana 212.
They need to get rid of that concurrency, end it at 20, no need to have it go to 212
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on July 14, 2017, 05:26:53 PM
Quote from: monty on July 13, 2017, 10:22:11 PM
What is the twenty year major mobility designation all about?
I would guess that essentially means "major projects". Most of the sections designated as such are major thoroughfares: I-65, I-69, I-70, US 231, US 31, etc.

There also seems to be a fair bit of work to be done on US 30.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 16, 2017, 05:11:36 PM
INDOT needs to start using business routes.  the random ones that exist are signed poorly, and i don't even think indot even signs those themselves
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: wanderer2575 on July 16, 2017, 06:20:32 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 13, 2017, 10:39:46 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 13, 2017, 10:15:29 PM
Quote from: spell4yr on July 13, 2017, 10:03:32 PM
I find it interesting in LaPorte County that there's mention of US 12 just east of US 35. Did Michigan Boulevard in Michigan City get transferred back to state control without any fanfare? (Last I knew, US 35 ended at US 20/I-94 or US 20/SR 212, dependent on which sign you looked at.)

Probably a typo. The city did a lot of landscaping improvements to that area since they've taken control of Michigan Boulevard. US 35 still officially ends at the cloverleaf with US 20/Indiana 212.
They need to get rid of that concurrency, end it at 20, no need to have it go to 212

I'd be happy if they were to just clearly post an END US-35 assembly.  No excuse for a terminus to not be signed when the physical road continues.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 23, 2017, 09:40:44 AM
Was in Valpo Friday and did not see any IN 130 signs inside the city limits of Valpo, nor at the intersection with US 30/IN 2.  Has the city's portion of IN 130 been turned over from INDOT to the city like has happened other places?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SEWIGuy on July 23, 2017, 09:49:44 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 23, 2017, 09:40:44 AM
Was in Valpo Friday and did not see any IN 130 signs inside the city limits of Valpo, nor at the intersection with US 30/IN 2.  Has the city's portion of IN 130 been turned over from INDOT to the city like has happened other places?

Yes.  It was truncated back to IN-149 a couple years ago.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 24, 2017, 07:37:29 AM
they should get rid of all of 130 and 149 south of us 6
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 24, 2017, 08:47:08 AM
i tried to put up the picture and failed, the I-31 shield can be found at mile marker 133.1 on US 31 (Basically just north of SR 32)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 24, 2017, 08:50:03 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on July 23, 2017, 09:49:44 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 23, 2017, 09:40:44 AM
Was in Valpo Friday and did not see any IN 130 signs inside the city limits of Valpo, nor at the intersection with US 30/IN 2.  Has the city's portion of IN 130 been turned over from INDOT to the city like has happened other places?

Yes.  It was truncated back to IN-149 a couple years ago.

Are you sure it was cut back all the way to 149?  I saw a couple 130 signs between 149 and the city limits.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 24, 2017, 08:51:34 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 24, 2017, 08:50:03 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on July 23, 2017, 09:49:44 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 23, 2017, 09:40:44 AM
Was in Valpo Friday and did not see any IN 130 signs inside the city limits of Valpo, nor at the intersection with US 30/IN 2.  Has the city's portion of IN 130 been turned over from INDOT to the city like has happened other places?

Yes.  It was truncated back to IN-149 a couple years ago.

Are you sure it was cut back all the way to 149?  I saw a couple 130 signs between 149 and the city limits.

it was supposed to be, maybe they forgot some signs east of 149?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on July 24, 2017, 08:54:07 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 24, 2017, 08:47:08 AM
i tried to put up the picture and failed, the I-31 shield can be found at mile marker 133.1 on US 31 (Basically just north of SR 32)

Well here is the likely reason for the replaced sign https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0557821,-86.1311301,3a,90y,169.45h,81.71t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s1c756YN3Y8QnjvPEY1FBuA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 24, 2017, 09:19:12 PM
Speaking of erroneous signs, one I've been passing each day coming home that is new is along I-65 south of Downtown Indianapolis. The sign is for the University of Indianapolis with an exit tab reading "Exit 109." The problem is, this sign is approaching Exit 107, which is the accurate exit number. By this point you've already passed Exit 109. I'm waiting to see how long that one lasts, I can't imagine UIndy would be too pleased with a sign confusing people like that.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: pianocello on July 24, 2017, 09:49:30 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 24, 2017, 08:50:03 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on July 23, 2017, 09:49:44 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 23, 2017, 09:40:44 AM
Was in Valpo Friday and did not see any IN 130 signs inside the city limits of Valpo, nor at the intersection with US 30/IN 2.  Has the city's portion of IN 130 been turned over from INDOT to the city like has happened other places?

Yes.  It was truncated back to IN-149 a couple years ago.

Are you sure it was cut back all the way to 149?  I saw a couple 130 signs between 149 and the city limits.

Yep. AFAIK, there's still one sign westbound at the corner of Joliet Rd, and the signs at 149 indicate that 130 goes both directions. Also, there's no "END" marker.

Typical INDOT, to be honest: Delete a section of a route to save money, and not do a thorough job of removing signs to save money.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 25, 2017, 08:02:01 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 24, 2017, 09:19:12 PM
Speaking of erroneous signs, one I've been passing each day coming home that is new is along I-65 south of Downtown Indianapolis. The sign is for the University of Indianapolis with an exit tab reading "Exit 109." The problem is, this sign is approaching Exit 107, which is the accurate exit number. By this point you've already passed Exit 109. I'm waiting to see how long that one lasts, I can't imagine UIndy would be too pleased with a sign confusing people like that.

i'm pretty sure this sign is very old, so it's been wrong for a while
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: dvferyance on July 25, 2017, 06:35:05 PM
Quote from: pianocello on July 24, 2017, 09:49:30 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 24, 2017, 08:50:03 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on July 23, 2017, 09:49:44 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 23, 2017, 09:40:44 AM
Was in Valpo Friday and did not see any IN 130 signs inside the city limits of Valpo, nor at the intersection with US 30/IN 2.  Has the city's portion of IN 130 been turned over from INDOT to the city like has happened other places?

Yes.  It was truncated back to IN-149 a couple years ago.

Are you sure it was cut back all the way to 149?  I saw a couple 130 signs between 149 and the city limits.

Yep. AFAIK, there's still one sign westbound at the corner of Joliet Rd, and the signs at 149 indicate that 130 goes both directions. Also, there's no "END" marker.

Typical INDOT, to be honest: Delete a section of a route to save money, and not do a thorough job of removing signs to save money.
I just hope this isn't another splitting routes up like they have been doing before.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 30, 2017, 07:39:09 PM
There's another i-31 shield on a mm just after the keystone overpass going south bound


Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 01, 2017, 03:04:50 PM
the website for the new 465 project is up and has a name "clear path 465"
http://www.in.gov/indot/3654.htm

this basically fixes the daily clusterfuck on the east side.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on August 01, 2017, 09:19:09 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 01, 2017, 03:04:50 PM
the website for the new 465 project is up and has a name "clear path 465"
http://www.in.gov/indot/3654.htm

this basically fixes the daily clusterfuck on the east side.

No real details on the website yet, but I'm betting it will be similar to the other Interstate intersections that INDOT has done on I-465 like I-74 (both west and east) and I-70. The advance BGS's on eastbound I-465 for the I-69 interchange already have 82nd St. covered over at the bottom, so they'll probably build it as a long flyover ramp with a ramp directly for 82nd St. It will be interesting to see how long this takes.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on August 01, 2017, 10:14:29 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 01, 2017, 03:04:50 PM
the website for the new 465 project is up and has a name "clear path 465"
http://www.in.gov/indot/3654.htm

this basically fixes the daily clusterfuck on the east side.
in 2020 - better late than never.  :clap:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on August 01, 2017, 10:17:54 PM
Quote from: jhuntin1 on August 01, 2017, 09:19:09 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 01, 2017, 03:04:50 PM
the website for the new 465 project is up and has a name "clear path 465"
http://www.in.gov/indot/3654.htm

this basically fixes the daily clusterfuck on the east side.

No real details on the website yet, but I'm betting it will be similar to the other Interstate intersections that INDOT has done on I-465 like I-74 (both west and east) and I-70. The advance BGS's on eastbound I-465 for the I-69 interchange already have 82nd St. covered over at the bottom, so they'll probably build it as a long flyover ramp with a ramp directly for 82nd St. It will be interesting to see how long this takes.

Years ago there were plans for that posted on the state web site -- then they got pulled when priorities were rearranged.   Most likely it will be the same setup that was posted at that time.

Found this image from 2009 (https://1l24ap4b9anu18q8bd42w471-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/indot.jpg) (thanks Google image search).   The plan at the time was a 3 lane flyover from I465 east to I69 north.  The old loop ramp was going to be saved for traffic going to 82nd.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 02, 2017, 08:06:31 AM
Quote from: cjw2001 on August 01, 2017, 10:17:54 PM
Quote from: jhuntin1 on August 01, 2017, 09:19:09 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 01, 2017, 03:04:50 PM
the website for the new 465 project is up and has a name "clear path 465"
http://www.in.gov/indot/3654.htm

this basically fixes the daily clusterfuck on the east side.

No real details on the website yet, but I'm betting it will be similar to the other Interstate intersections that INDOT has done on I-465 like I-74 (both west and east) and I-70. The advance BGS's on eastbound I-465 for the I-69 interchange already have 82nd St. covered over at the bottom, so they'll probably build it as a long flyover ramp with a ramp directly for 82nd St. It will be interesting to see how long this takes.

Years ago there were plans for that posted on the state web site -- then they got pulled when priorities were rearranged.   Most likely it will be the same setup that was posted at that time.

Found this image from 2009 (https://1l24ap4b9anu18q8bd42w471-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/indot.jpg) (thanks Google image search).   The plan at the time was a 3 lane flyover from I465 east to I69 north.  The old loop ramp was going to be saved for traffic going to 82nd.

that's exactly what will happen.  also 465 will be 8 lanes wide from white river to fall creek!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 02, 2017, 08:08:36 AM
the nw side portion should be widened in the next decade too, they are going to build new bridges at ditch and township line, they should be longer. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on August 02, 2017, 10:11:28 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 02, 2017, 08:08:36 AM
the nw side portion should be widened in the next decade too, they are going to build new bridges at ditch and township line, they should be longer.

Agreed. That will the the last remaining choke point on 465 after this is completed. The turn should AT LEAST be 3 lanes instead of 2 and if they could somehow get rid of the left exit to 865 and do something to prevent traffic coming from Michigan from needing to instantly cut across lanes to get to 865 or continue on 465, that would be even better.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on August 04, 2017, 04:28:19 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on August 02, 2017, 10:11:28 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 02, 2017, 08:08:36 AM
the nw side portion should be widened in the next decade too, they are going to build new bridges at ditch and township line, they should be longer.

Agreed. That will the the last remaining choke point on 465 after this is completed. The turn should AT LEAST be 3 lanes instead of 2 and if they could somehow get rid of the left exit to 865 and do something to prevent traffic coming from Michigan from needing to instantly cut across lanes to get to 865 or continue on 465, that would be even better.

Not the last choke point, unfortunately. Something needs to be done on the southwest side between I-70 and Harding St. Traffic has gotten horrible in that stretch in the afternoon, and it will only get worse when I-69 finally makes it up there.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 04, 2017, 09:30:34 AM
Quote from: jhuntin1 on August 04, 2017, 04:28:19 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on August 02, 2017, 10:11:28 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 02, 2017, 08:08:36 AM
the nw side portion should be widened in the next decade too, they are going to build new bridges at ditch and township line, they should be longer.

Agreed. That will the the last remaining choke point on 465 after this is completed. The turn should AT LEAST be 3 lanes instead of 2 and if they could somehow get rid of the left exit to 865 and do something to prevent traffic coming from Michigan from needing to instantly cut across lanes to get to 865 or continue on 465, that would be even better.

Not the last choke point, unfortunately. Something needs to be done on the southwest side between I-70 and Harding St. Traffic has gotten horrible in that stretch in the afternoon, and it will only get worse when I-69 finally makes it up there.

i was just going to ask about the south side, i'm never down there, so i don't know anything about the traffic patterns there.  all the interchanges are the originals though which is surprising, 65 has recently changed, but i believe all the other ones are the same.  what do you think needs to be done to fix that choke point?  they were supposed to redo the 67 interchange, but scrapped it, and i believe the 70 interchange had more flyovers, but was scaled back.  i believe 67 was a parclo.  they need to remove every exit and entrance from the left down there, i can't believe they didn't do this with the 65 interchange project. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on August 04, 2017, 08:00:29 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 04, 2017, 09:30:34 AM
Quote from: jhuntin1 on August 04, 2017, 04:28:19 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on August 02, 2017, 10:11:28 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 02, 2017, 08:08:36 AM
the nw side portion should be widened in the next decade too, they are going to build new bridges at ditch and township line, they should be longer.

Agreed. That will the the last remaining choke point on 465 after this is completed. The turn should AT LEAST be 3 lanes instead of 2 and if they could somehow get rid of the left exit to 865 and do something to prevent traffic coming from Michigan from needing to instantly cut across lanes to get to 865 or continue on 465, that would be even better.

Not the last choke point, unfortunately. Something needs to be done on the southwest side between I-70 and Harding St. Traffic has gotten horrible in that stretch in the afternoon, and it will only get worse when I-69 finally makes it up there.

i was just going to ask about the south side, i'm never down there, so i don't know anything about the traffic patterns there.  all the interchanges are the originals though which is surprising, 65 has recently changed, but i believe all the other ones are the same.  what do you think needs to be done to fix that choke point?  they were supposed to redo the 67 interchange, but scrapped it, and i believe the 70 interchange had more flyovers, but was scaled back.  i believe 67 was a parclo.  they need to remove every exit and entrance from the left down there, i can't believe they didn't do this with the 65 interchange project.
I'm pretty sure the East St interchange is the only one remaining with entrances on the left. If memory serves, the Rockville Rd and 10th St interchanges on the west sides used to be like that. So maybe it's reasonable to expect that if they do update the East St interchange in the future, it will look like the new ones on the west side. Although I'm not too fond of the traffic light system they have going on at Rockville Rd.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 04, 2017, 08:57:58 PM
65 still has the left exits
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on August 04, 2017, 09:36:57 PM
I-65 still has the left exits and despite the bridges being rebuilt there this year the left exits look to remain. Now they will be left hand exits with new bridges. The plans for Section 6 of I-69 do show some widening of I-465 at least between Mann Road and East Street to account for the new traffic off of 69.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on August 05, 2017, 06:06:05 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 04, 2017, 09:30:34 AM
<snip> what do you think needs to be done to fix that choke point?   

Eventually it will need to be 8-laned. It looked like they may be going to do something like that a year or two ago when they shifted the lanes left for a repaving project. There's enough concrete in the median to add another lane in both directions between I-70 and US-31. With all the semis that use the south side to avoid I-70 downtown, I'm amazed INDOT hasn't done more. There are some interchange reconstructions that would help, but I don't see them happening soon.

When they reconstructed the Harding St. interchange they did not do enough to handle the traffic. Both directions need a long collector lane to handle the number of trucks that get off. It's not uncommon in the afternoons to see the right lane backed up a quarter-mile or more. The left-side ramps for US-31 and I-65 are not a huge block most of the time. The ramp from westbound I-465 to southbound US-31 can back up, since it's a tight loop and that lane has to merge on the bridge before the traffic comes off from eastbound I-465. I have other ideas, but they wander in to Fictional Highways land.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 20, 2017, 05:22:36 PM
Updates regarding I-65:

With the exception of the southbound section between I-80/94 and 49th Avenue (which should be shifted back into regular position this week), the section of I-65 between the northern terminus and US 30 is complete. North of the Borman has a much smoother layer of asphalt, and south of the Borman has repaired concrete.

Starting Monday August 21, US 231 will be reduced to one lane in each direction at the Exit 247 underpass. This will allow crews to work on widening the bridge on I-65 itself. This portion of the widening project is scheduled to last through November. Similar work is in progress at the Indiana 2 overpass near Lowell, with the same target completion time.

Now it makes sense why the project team held off on working the 30 to 231 section of the project. It seems they wanted to get the major bridges wrapped up first.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 25, 2017, 09:44:53 AM
3 alternatives have been released for the new 465/69 interchange:
http://www.in.gov/indot/files/Alternatives.pdf
there are several more here:
http://www.in.gov/indot/3654.htm

i like C the best, one observation is that there will be a traffic light for people wanting to go south on binford from 465 east, slightly annoying, but no one really cares.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on August 25, 2017, 10:37:58 AM
Am I missing something?  Is there no way for anybody exiting 82nd street to get to 465 in any of the alternatives?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: pianocello on August 25, 2017, 04:49:27 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on August 25, 2017, 10:37:58 AM
Am I missing something?  Is there no way for anybody exiting 82nd street to get to 465 in any of the alternatives?

There is. In all of them, there's a split at the end of the loop.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on August 25, 2017, 05:17:20 PM
I sure hope so.  Otherwise traffic wanting to go West would have to take 82nd to Allisonville to 465 and traffic going south would have to take Shadeland to 465 (which isn't as horrible).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 30, 2017, 10:42:34 PM
Does anyone know why the ramp from Virginia Ave to 65/70 in fountain square is closed? It's been that way for literally months now, with no evidence that anything is happening.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on August 30, 2017, 11:37:43 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 30, 2017, 10:42:34 PM
Does anyone know why the ramp from Virginia Ave to 65/70 in fountain square is closed? It's been that way for literally months now, with no evidence that anything is happening.

Safety concerns or some BS. May be closed permanently.

http://cbs4indy.com/2016/10/12/virginia-avenue-shortcut-to-i-65-in-downtown-to-close-thursday/amp/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 31, 2017, 06:48:23 AM
And how exactly is visibility a concern there? There is literally nothing blocking your view there, also why close this without any indication of removal? All the signage is there. I could seriously get out of my car and move the barrels and open the ramp again. What a lazy excuse.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 31, 2017, 07:00:09 AM
It's a stupid ramp to begin with, who thought it was a good idea to have a ramp with 0 merge area connect to the fast lane?!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 31, 2017, 07:44:32 AM
just a few miles north of this, a massive hole has appeared in a bridge over 10th st at the north split, you can see clear through, rebar and all.  10th st is closed, and a lane is closed on 65/70.  i believe every bridge on the cosigned portion of 65/70 will be redone with the stip funds. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Henry on August 31, 2017, 09:38:59 AM
To remove a shortcut is incredibly stupid. While that may not be the only on-/off-ramp that crosses another street on its way to/from the interstate, closing it creates a great inconvenience to drivers who will now have to make an extra maneuver onto the other street to access the ramp.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 31, 2017, 09:40:40 AM
Quote from: Henry on August 31, 2017, 09:38:59 AM
To remove a shortcut is incredibly stupid. While that may not be the only on-/off-ramp that crosses another street on its way to/from the interstate, closing it creates a great inconvenience to drivers who will now have to make an extra maneuver onto the other street to access the ramp.

especially when they don't even sign it, it's signed as if nothing happened.  google maps shows it as a dead road. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 31, 2017, 12:05:16 PM
so I asked INDOT, and they mentioned it was safety issues at calvary st., she also said this: The plan is to reconstruct the south split and the geometrics will totally change.
now this really has my interests piqued.  I asked my boss if he knows anything about it, and he said not much, but that something will happen there soon.  I will keep digging and see if I can figure out what this means. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 16, 2017, 07:14:22 PM
Interstate updates for my neck of the woods as construction season begins "winding down:"

Work on I-94 throughout the state continues, including now the stretch between I-65 and the Toll Road interchange. From Kennedy Avenue to I-65, concrete restoration continues (westbound lanes, with eastbound slated for next year), and from I-65 to Michigan, work is continuing for full blown resurfacing. Work is still scheduled to finish in November.

On I-65, work progresses nicely on the widening project between US 30 and Indiana 2. Bridge work over US 231 and Indiana 2 is on schedule, with beam installation starting in the coming weeks. INDOT Northwest posted photos on their Facebook page showing work done south of US 231. Median excavation has given way to asphalt paving, which started earlier this week. As for the stretch between US 231 and US 30, that portion of the project was held off until next year because of a "greater need" for this section. If I were to venture a guess, I wonder if it has to do with the concrete of the driving lanes; the lanes feel a bit ratted and uneven...VERY bumpy for a concrete surface. Work is still scheduled to end December 2018.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on September 19, 2017, 12:00:54 PM
INDOT to reconstruct North Split in Indy - possible late 2019 construction start

https://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/INDOT/bulletins/1b7fc08
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 19, 2017, 12:11:03 PM
the south split is also going to be reconstructed eventually, it's in the concept phase now.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: CtrlAltDel on September 19, 2017, 05:03:14 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on September 19, 2017, 12:00:54 PM
INDOT to reconstruct North Split in Indy - possible late 2019 construction start

https://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/INDOT/bulletins/1b7fc08

I hope they fix that northbound curve on I-65.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 19, 2017, 09:00:53 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 19, 2017, 12:11:03 PM
the south split is also going to be reconstructed eventually, it's in the concept phase now.

What exactly of the South Split needs to be rebuilt? They redid the highway from Washington Street down to the split and redid all of the bridges there. Plus the bridges in the actual interchange have been rebuilt. Other than maybe repaving some of the asphalt stretches left in that interchange I don't see how it can be redone more. Not certainly like the North Split which does indeed need to be rebuilt from the ground up.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 19, 2017, 09:03:22 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 19, 2017, 09:00:53 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 19, 2017, 12:11:03 PM
the south split is also going to be reconstructed eventually, it's in the concept phase now.

What exactly of the South Split needs to be rebuilt? They redid the highway from Washington Street down to the split and redid all of the bridges there. Plus the bridges in the actual interchange have been rebuilt. Other than maybe repaving some of the asphalt stretches left in that interchange I don't see how it can be redone more. Not certainly like the North Split which does indeed need to be rebuilt from the ground up.

i-70 needs to come in from the right, not the left.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 19, 2017, 09:50:29 PM
Of course if they redo the North Split exit so that I-70 traffic leaves from the left and I-65 north traffic from the right then that problem is taken care of. Not sure if that is exactly part of the plan though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on September 20, 2017, 08:45:44 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 19, 2017, 09:50:29 PM
Of course if they redo the North Split exit so that I-70 traffic leaves from the left and I-65 north traffic from the right then that problem is taken care of. Not sure if that is exactly part of the plan though.
Maybe not the plan, but I think it would provide the best option to build longer ramps with gentler curves to decrease the number of accidents that happen there. I can't imagine how they could do that easily, though, without extended road closures.

Speaking of closures, Hyperfix had the entire 65-70 multiplex closed for several months and life went on. If they could come up with a solid plan that, once the initial groundwork was done with the usual lane closures, could complete the project in 4-6 months instead of two years if they closed it entirely would INDOT go for it?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: DevalDragon on October 11, 2017, 11:34:57 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 16, 2017, 07:14:22 PM
Interstate updates for my neck of the woods as construction season begins "winding down:"

Work on I-94 throughout the state continues, including now the stretch between I-65 and the Toll Road interchange. From Kennedy Avenue to I-65, concrete restoration continues (westbound lanes, with eastbound slated for next year), and from I-65 to Michigan, work is continuing for full blown resurfacing. Work is still scheduled to finish in November.


They have flipped the 'suicide lane' to the westbound side and have started concrete restoration on the eastbound side. I thought it was kind of late in the season to do that, but they did. And I am very happy to see it as the eastbound lanes, especially near Cline Ave, have become very rough.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mvak36 on October 19, 2017, 10:36:49 AM
http://www.nwitimes.com/business/local/indiana-interstate-tolling-study-advances-with-a-request-for-proposals/article_ce0e9943-7b38-585b-82b3-881b356e7526.html

Maybe I should go clinch I-65 in Indiana before they start tolling it lol.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 19, 2017, 12:11:41 PM
I knew about 65 and 70, but 94? why? what's the free alternate? us 12?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ilpt4u on October 19, 2017, 07:07:04 PM
Not against the tolling idea per say...

But the routes getting new investment money and new builds, like I-69 and US 31 -- why aren't they up for tolling? Why only the "old"/existing corridors?

As far as why I-94...hmmm...its a short distance in Indiana that does serve some Hoosiers, but really, its the Interstate Chicago-Detroit route, and especially the Multiplex with I-80, very heavy Truck Traffic -- its not a bad idea. IL should join with them on that, and toll I-80 more than just the Tri-State/I-294 Multiplex
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 19, 2017, 07:10:39 PM
I think it's to pay for the 6 laning of both routes not sure why 94 needs tolls
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 20, 2017, 08:36:36 AM
I live 100 feet from 94.  Going to be hard to avoid tolls if they are implemented.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Joe The Dragon on October 20, 2017, 12:05:41 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on October 19, 2017, 07:07:04 PM
Not against the tolling idea per say...

But the routes getting new investment money and new builds, like I-69 and US 31 -- why aren't they up for tolling? Why only the "old"/existing corridors?

As far as why I-94...hmmm...its a short distance in Indiana that does serve some Hoosiers, but really, its the Interstate Chicago-Detroit route, and especially the Multiplex with I-80, very heavy Truck Traffic -- its not a bad idea. IL should join with them on that, and toll I-80 more than just the Tri-State/I-294 Multiplex
if they toll it they then they will need high speed tolling and gate free lanes on the ramps.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 20, 2017, 02:22:27 PM
I pictured what they did for the ohio river bridges all digital no widening needed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on October 20, 2017, 09:47:58 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 19, 2017, 07:10:39 PM
I think it's to pay for the 6 laning of both routes not sure why 94 needs tolls

Based on this FHWA website, (https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/ipd/fact_sheets/tolling_programs.aspx) I doubt tolls on I-94 would be allowed unless INDOT is going to completely rebuild it or use variable pricing.

Seems there's been enough construction on I-94 in Indiana lately that a rebuild could be avoided for a while.  Nor do I see tolling going over well with the locals unless there is some type of improvements going with it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 21, 2017, 10:00:55 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on October 20, 2017, 09:47:58 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 19, 2017, 07:10:39 PM
I think it's to pay for the 6 laning of both routes not sure why 94 needs tolls

Based on this FHWA website, (https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/ipd/fact_sheets/tolling_programs.aspx) I doubt tolls on I-94 would be allowed unless INDOT is going to completely rebuild it or use variable pricing.

Seems there's been enough construction on I-94 in Indiana lately that a rebuild could be avoided for a while.  Nor do I see tolling going over well with the locals unless there is some type of improvements going with it.

I'm on board with variable pricing.  Semi trucks are $0.01 per mile between 6pm and 6am and $1.00 per mile between 6am and 6pm.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on October 21, 2017, 12:52:37 PM
I get the sense that the tolling system won't go over so well unless the counties involved get a piece of the pie for local works. This will be a pretty complex issue for years to come, but if it does happen, my hope is that they keep it low for passenger cars (maybe 3 cents a mile, which doesn't seem like much until it adds up during peak travel periods).

One stretch of the Borman Expressway should be nearing completion soon. The stretch between Central Avenue and the Indiana Toll Road has a new asphalt surface layer on all areas except the inner shoulder (which is currently being worked on). Gone will be the concrete patches of road which were in place three years ago (I wonder if that work was done in preparation for this project?). All other portion of I-94 is on schedule to wrap up by the end of next month.

Year one of the I-65 expansion project is wrapping up as well, with construction fully focused on the stretch between Indiana 2 and US 231. Asphalt paving of the future third lane and inner shoulder is in progress north of the weigh station, with median excavation in progress south of that point. The bridges over Indiana 2, Wurtz Ditch, and US 231 should be finished by year's end. To help prepare for the US 30 to US 231 stretch, the entrance ramp from 109th Avenue to I-65 northbound will be closed Monday Night into Tuesday Morning for ramp repairs.

On a more local note, something is happening at the super busy intersection of US 30 and Mississippi Street in Merrillville. I'm trying to glean some details from INDOT, but it does appear they're adding a second left turn lane for traffic turning from westbound US 30 to Southbound Mississippi (toward Southlake Mall for reference). Whatever is going on, work is to be finished before winter. I bring this one up because it will make for some very tricky traveling during the weekends and into November, so plan accordingly if you plan to be out in the area.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on October 21, 2017, 09:48:56 PM
^ To me - at least on weekends - it seemed US 30 at Mississippi Street needed the right turn lane converted into shared thru-right.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on October 22, 2017, 12:04:44 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on October 21, 2017, 09:48:56 PM
^ To me - at least on weekends - it seemed US 30 at Mississippi Street needed the right turn lane converted into shared thru-right.

If you're referring to westbound, I agree. That would help improve the flow of traffic. For anyone who's blocked waiting for the right turn, US 30 Westbound is first in the sequence, so that would be a moot point.

It's very similar to US 30 Westbound at Colorado Street a mile further east. There's a "right turn lane"  that actually becomes the third through lane past the light. Although there's a right turn arrow in the pavement, there's no "ONLY"  marked in the pavement, and the traffic light up ahead implies that it's a shared thru-right (a light with a solid green ball with a right green arrow light closely spaced next to it). I'm surprised by how few drivers take advantage of this exploit during the morning commute (I do).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on October 23, 2017, 07:28:21 PM
I don't know which thread I want to post this topic on, but here you go: a future I-67 corridor on U.S. 231...

Article:
https://www.duboiscountyfreepress.com/economic-development-group-announces-support-midstate-corridor/

It also seems that they are planning to add a third lane all the way to Anderson...

Article:
http://www.greensburgdailynews.com/news/extra-i--lanes-in-works/article_1c0d161d-a0dd-50f1-86c7-4b6c83f7b61f.html
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: KeithE4Phx on October 23, 2017, 10:57:45 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on October 23, 2017, 07:28:21 PM
I don't know which thread I want to post this topic on, but here you go: a future I-67 corridor on U.S. 231...

Article:
https://www.duboiscountyfreepress.com/economic-development-group-announces-support-midstate-corridor/.html

I thought I-67 was supposed to replace US 31 from I-465 on the north side of Indy, going into Michigan.  Sounds like the part from Washington to Indy would have to be duplexed with I-69 if this were to happen.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 24, 2017, 07:42:33 AM
Quote from: KeithE4Phx on October 23, 2017, 10:57:45 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on October 23, 2017, 07:28:21 PM
I don't know which thread I want to post this topic on, but here you go: a future I-67 corridor on U.S. 231...

Article:
https://www.duboiscountyfreepress.com/economic-development-group-announces-support-midstate-corridor/.html

I thought I-67 was supposed to replace US 31 from I-465 on the north side of Indy, going into Michigan.  Sounds like the part from Washington to Indy would have to be duplexed with I-69 if this were to happen.

67 will likely be cosigned with 31 one day, the southern 67 corridor along 231 will not happen.  just some bs that keeps coming up.  there is no need for an interstate down there, a divided highway will be enough.  If 67 down there does happen, it wouldn't be for several decades.  think of any project that needs to be done in Indiana, and it's more important than this 67 idea.  as close as this is to 69, i see no point in doing this. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 30, 2017, 06:07:48 PM
has anyone noticed the new signs they're putting up around indianapolis on the interstates have this massive gap in between the shields and the name of the road on the bgs? 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Stephane Dumas on October 31, 2017, 06:32:16 PM
I saw some satellite shots at https://mapper.acme.com/?ll=40.96050,-85.35760&z=17&t=S showing some acquired ROW on E 900N/Lafayette Center Road between US-24 and I-69. Is there any plans to upgrade that road into a 4-lanes boulevard?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on October 31, 2017, 07:47:02 PM
Quote from: Stephane Dumas on October 31, 2017, 06:32:16 PM
I saw some satellite shots at https://mapper.acme.com/?ll=40.96050,-85.35760&z=17&t=S showing some acquired ROW on E 900N/Lafayette Center Road between US-24 and I-69. Is there any plans to upgrade that road into a 4-lanes boulevard?

Never mind plans.  They just finished doing so.  4 lanes plus a center turn lane.  Bridge over railroad.  Had they done it some time ago, US 24 could have cut over that way to 469 instead of now going around the north side instead of south on 69 to 469 which it did until a couple years ago. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 31, 2017, 07:47:28 PM
is the us 33/30 interchange being redone in ft wayne?  it looks different now
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 31, 2017, 07:48:27 PM
it was done by indot too, they should make 24 go that way. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 31, 2017, 07:50:30 PM
nevermind, they are, they're flipping it! http://wane.com/2017/03/29/u-s-3033-interchange-work-could-begin-friday/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 02, 2017, 12:34:09 PM
Here's how much tolling would generate on the interstates here: https://www.indystar.com/story/news/politics/2017/11/02/where-toll-roads-would-generate-most-money-indiana/824772001/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 02, 2017, 04:30:34 PM
My recommendation: Toll I-94.  Estimate the percentage of toll revenue that would be paid by in-state drivers and return that amount to residents of Lake/Porter/LaPorte counties via some sort of tax credit.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on November 03, 2017, 03:01:51 PM
INDOT recently installed rumble strips along the center line of US 20 in eastern LaPorte County. They are touting a reduction in the number of crashes and fatalities. Since this is a heavily-travelled, high-speed road, the improvement is hardly surprising.

Here is the South Bend Tribune story, featuring a good close-up photo by the daring Robert Franklin: https://www.southbendtribune.com/news/publicsafety/fewer-crashes-fatalities-after-rumble-strips-on-u-s/article_15e982ae-76f7-5795-b1c0-f18c3a0957b7.html (https://www.southbendtribune.com/news/publicsafety/fewer-crashes-fatalities-after-rumble-strips-on-u-s/article_15e982ae-76f7-5795-b1c0-f18c3a0957b7.html)

This stretch of road would be a candidate to upgrade to a divided expressway, but development along the route would make right-of-way acquisition very costly.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: captkirk_4 on November 05, 2017, 02:48:19 PM
The four lane portion of US 24 across central Indiana is mostly fast open travel. But those stoplights in Wabash are really awful. I've driven that way a couple dozen times and NOT ONCE did I ever get through Wabash without stopping and waiting at those lights. If they are not going to give a major thoroughfare the majority of a lights green time means an interchange really needs to be built there. Since they continued the four lane SW to Lafayette it looks like the expressway on US 24 won't be extended from it's terminus at Logansport to the Illinois State line. A real federal infrastructure bill should look at a regional bypass south of Chicagoland and that I80-90-94 bottleneck nightmare. A Peoria-Toledo expressway along the US24 corridor would be nice.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on November 05, 2017, 05:42:51 PM
Quote from: captkirk_4 on November 05, 2017, 02:48:19 PM
The four lane portion of US 24 across central Indiana is mostly fast open travel. But those stoplights in Wabash are really awful. I've driven that way a couple dozen times and NOT ONCE did I ever get through Wabash without stopping and waiting at those lights. If they are not going to give a major thoroughfare the majority of a lights green time means an interchange really needs to be built there. Since they continued the four lane SW to Lafayette it looks like the expressway on US 24 won't be extended from it's terminus at Logansport to the Illinois State line. A real federal infrastructure bill should look at a regional bypass south of Chicagoland and that I80-90-94 bottleneck nightmare. A Peoria-Toledo expressway along the US24 corridor would be nice.

I am amazed at how I can catch red lights at all three Wabash lights these days, the one between SR 13 and SR 15 being added the last couple years.  The one at SR 13 seems to be especially apt at stopping a platoon of traffic on 24 to let one person across on 13, but I've gotten all three reds at all times of day or night (11am, 11pm, 1am, 4pm, it doesn't matter). 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 05, 2017, 06:11:39 PM
I just drove this route for the first time from 69 to 31, I got stopped at the 15 light.  Not sure why 24 isn't the continuous movement when it hits 35.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on November 05, 2017, 11:47:55 PM
Well the US 35 bypass of Logansport is considerably older than the four-lane US 24 in that area. And until the recent completion of SR 25 southwest to Lafayette I'm sure it didn't matter that you had to stop there, you were going to be getting off US 35 onto another two-lane highway soon enough. Now that it's a continous flow south toward Lafayette perhaps a change is in order.

In a similar vain, US 24 also requires a turning motion at the junction with SR 9 west of Huntington. Again the SR 9 bypass is an older highway. That's another intersection that could be redesigned since there is very little traffic to the south, SR 9 really shoudn't even be a four-lane highway past Huntington.

And speaking of Huntington, I wonder why there isn't an exit at US 224/SR 5 with US 24. It always has seem to me that the right of way is actually there for a diamond interchange.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 06, 2017, 07:38:44 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on November 05, 2017, 11:47:55 PM
Well the US 35 bypass of Logansport is considerably older than the four-lane US 24 in that area. And until the recent completion of SR 25 southwest to Lafayette I'm sure it didn't matter that you had to stop there, you were going to be getting off US 35 onto another two-lane highway soon enough. Now that it's a continous flow south toward Lafayette perhaps a change is in order.

In a similar vain, US 24 also requires a turning motion at the junction with SR 9 west of Huntington. Again the SR 9 bypass is an older highway. That's another intersection that could be redesigned since there is very little traffic to the south, SR 9 really shoudn't even be a four-lane highway past Huntington.

And speaking of Huntington, I wonder why there isn't an exit at US 224/SR 5 with US 24. It always has seem to me that the right of way is actually there for a diamond interchange.

looking at satellite view, the land around the intersection appears to be intentionally reserved for exactly that purpose
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on November 09, 2017, 05:44:02 PM
Drove through Fowler today, looks like they have just recently finished the US 52 resurfacing job through town.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on November 15, 2017, 11:17:23 PM
Resurfacing of a 10-or-so-mile section of the St. Joseph Valley Parkway is essentially complete. It's the part that comprises the entire US 31/US 20 concurrency. Traffic had been restricted to one lane each way for several months, but all lanes are open now. It looks like a fine job, with the addition of reflectors along the centerline and on the ramp gore points.

In another matter, INDOT is abandoning (at least for now) plans to install J-turns at several locations on US-24 and US-31, citing public objections. I think those objecting have a reasonable point, since the mainline traffic on both highways have posted speed limits of 60 and traffic generally flows at speeds between 65 and 70. Here's a news story: https://www.southbendtribune.com/news/indiana/transportation-officials-call-off-proposed-j-turn-projects/article_2c2bb9b6-ca70-11e7-82c4-af9946d00d8a.html (https://www.southbendtribune.com/news/indiana/transportation-officials-call-off-proposed-j-turn-projects/article_2c2bb9b6-ca70-11e7-82c4-af9946d00d8a.html)

INDOT may need to look into additional traffic lights in the trouble spots, until permanent solutions like overpasses and interchanges can be effected.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: pianocello on November 16, 2017, 12:02:08 AM
Quote from: theline on November 15, 2017, 11:17:23 PM
INDOT may need to look into additional traffic lights in the trouble spots, until permanent solutions like overpasses and interchanges can be effected.

That's a slippery slope. I agree with you from a safety standpoint, but my experience with traffic lights on expressways in Indiana has been nothing short of aggravating.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on November 16, 2017, 01:03:39 AM
Quote from: pianocello on November 16, 2017, 12:02:08 AM
Quote from: theline on November 15, 2017, 11:17:23 PM
INDOT may need to look into additional traffic lights in the trouble spots, until permanent solutions like overpasses and interchanges can be effected.

That's a slippery slope. I agree with you from a safety standpoint, but my experience with traffic lights on expressways in Indiana has been nothing short of aggravating.

The lights around Huntington and Wabash on 24 are prime examples of lights that really screw up the through route, especially when they seem to be timed to require stopping at multiple ones in short order.  As noted before recently (was it in this thread? maybe on a previous page but I'd lose my post to look), they saved space at SR 5/US 224 to build a diamond interchange with US 24, but that ship has sailed with the addition of lights on either side of that intersection.  Wabash has one more light now than it did 10 years ago which always seems to stop a platoon of traffic that only just started moving from one of the other Wabash lights.  Traffic indeed moves at 65 or 70 and the speed limit should probably be 65 to reflect reality.  The crossroads with problems need some kind of help but the J-turns may not be it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 16, 2017, 07:29:27 AM
Quote from: pianocello on November 16, 2017, 12:02:08 AM
Quote from: theline on November 15, 2017, 11:17:23 PM
INDOT may need to look into additional traffic lights in the trouble spots, until permanent solutions like overpasses and interchanges can be effected.

That's a slippery slope. I agree with you from a safety standpoint, but my experience with traffic lights on expressways in Indiana has been nothing short of aggravating.

signals don't make things safer, they can actually make things worse.  you have and increase in different types of accidents when you add a signal. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 16, 2017, 08:18:42 AM
random question, why doesn't INDOT cosign SR 3 with I-69 from US 224 to US 27? 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 16, 2017, 08:50:12 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 16, 2017, 08:18:42 AM
random question, why doesn't INDOT cosign SR 3 with I-69 from US 224 to US 27? 

I don't know why, but INDOT does not sign state highways on interstates.  IN 37 and IN 67 have hidden concurrencies with I-465.  There has been some debate about whether IN 3 is also a hidden concurrency or separate segments and I think the conclusion was that they are separate segments but either way there would be no signage.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 16, 2017, 08:53:15 AM
Quote from: theline on November 15, 2017, 11:17:23 PM
In another matter, INDOT is abandoning (at least for now) plans to install J-turns at several locations on US-24 and US-31, citing public objections. I think those objecting have a reasonable point, since the mainline traffic on both highways have posted speed limits of 60 and traffic generally flows at speeds between 65 and 70. Here's a news story: https://www.southbendtribune.com/news/indiana/transportation-officials-call-off-proposed-j-turn-projects/article_2c2bb9b6-ca70-11e7-82c4-af9946d00d8a.html (https://www.southbendtribune.com/news/indiana/transportation-officials-call-off-proposed-j-turn-projects/article_2c2bb9b6-ca70-11e7-82c4-af9946d00d8a.html)

I wonder where on 31 these were being considered?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 16, 2017, 08:55:17 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on November 16, 2017, 08:53:15 AM
Quote from: theline on November 15, 2017, 11:17:23 PM
In another matter, INDOT is abandoning (at least for now) plans to install J-turns at several locations on US-24 and US-31, citing public objections. I think those objecting have a reasonable point, since the mainline traffic on both highways have posted speed limits of 60 and traffic generally flows at speeds between 65 and 70. Here's a news story: https://www.southbendtribune.com/news/indiana/transportation-officials-call-off-proposed-j-turn-projects/article_2c2bb9b6-ca70-11e7-82c4-af9946d00d8a.html (https://www.southbendtribune.com/news/indiana/transportation-officials-call-off-proposed-j-turn-projects/article_2c2bb9b6-ca70-11e7-82c4-af9946d00d8a.html)

I wonder where on 31 these were being considered?

they were going to be at SR 10 and 110. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 16, 2017, 08:56:46 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on November 16, 2017, 08:50:12 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 16, 2017, 08:18:42 AM
random question, why doesn't INDOT cosign SR 3 with I-69 from US 224 to US 27? 

I don't know why, but INDOT does not sign state highways on interstates.  IN 37 and IN 67 have hidden concurrencies with I-465.  There has been some debate about whether IN 3 is also a hidden concurrency or separate segments and I think the conclusion was that they are separate segments but either way there would be no signage.

i think it's 2 separate pieces, because they have TO SR 3 shields at 224.  I don't understand why they didn't do the same that they did to SR 1 and have it end at 469.  Google thinks 3 is cosigned secretly with 69 though. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 16, 2017, 09:40:47 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 16, 2017, 08:55:17 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on November 16, 2017, 08:53:15 AM
Quote from: theline on November 15, 2017, 11:17:23 PM
In another matter, INDOT is abandoning (at least for now) plans to install J-turns at several locations on US-24 and US-31, citing public objections. I think those objecting have a reasonable point, since the mainline traffic on both highways have posted speed limits of 60 and traffic generally flows at speeds between 65 and 70. Here's a news story: https://www.southbendtribune.com/news/indiana/transportation-officials-call-off-proposed-j-turn-projects/article_2c2bb9b6-ca70-11e7-82c4-af9946d00d8a.html (https://www.southbendtribune.com/news/indiana/transportation-officials-call-off-proposed-j-turn-projects/article_2c2bb9b6-ca70-11e7-82c4-af9946d00d8a.html)

I wonder where on 31 these were being considered?

they were going to be at SR 10 and 110. 

I wouldn't bother with J Turns.  There's either enough danger to warrant interchanges or there isn't. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 16, 2017, 10:04:14 AM
I'm against them on 31, the idea is to remove ALL at grades. this isn't doing that.  would have been a good idea on 24 though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on November 16, 2017, 12:19:24 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on November 16, 2017, 09:40:47 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 16, 2017, 08:55:17 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on November 16, 2017, 08:53:15 AM
Quote from: theline on November 15, 2017, 11:17:23 PM
In another matter, INDOT is abandoning (at least for now) plans to install J-turns at several locations on US-24 and US-31, citing public objections. I think those objecting have a reasonable point, since the mainline traffic on both highways have posted speed limits of 60 and traffic generally flows at speeds between 65 and 70. Here's a news story: https://www.southbendtribune.com/news/indiana/transportation-officials-call-off-proposed-j-turn-projects/article_2c2bb9b6-ca70-11e7-82c4-af9946d00d8a.html (https://www.southbendtribune.com/news/indiana/transportation-officials-call-off-proposed-j-turn-projects/article_2c2bb9b6-ca70-11e7-82c4-af9946d00d8a.html)

I wonder where on 31 these were being considered?

they were going to be at SR 10 and 110. 

I wouldn't bother with J Turns.  There's either enough danger to warrant interchanges or there isn't.

I agree. If the plan is for a limited access highway down the road, don't waste money on a stop-gap "solution" .  Maybe they should go ahead and do interchanges at a couple of the proposed J turn locations now and then revisit in a few years when the budget allows and determine if more are needed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on November 16, 2017, 04:24:42 PM
Indiana doesn't do that.  They would rather spend 10% of the money needed to do the job right now, and then pay 150% to 200% of what they would have paid now to re-do the work in about 5 to 10 years.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tribar on November 17, 2017, 12:13:22 AM
If I have an Ipass, can I use any lane at an ITRt oll booth or can you only use the I-pass/ez-pass lanes?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on November 17, 2017, 03:49:25 AM
Quote from: tribar on November 17, 2017, 12:13:22 AM
If I have an Ipass, can I use any lane at an ITRt oll booth or can you only use the I-pass/ez-pass lanes?

You can use any toll booth lane with the Ipass. If the EZpass only lane is backed up, I sometimes slide over to one of the cash lanes if it's empty.

In reality, cash, credit cards, and transponders are accepted in all lanes. If it's a barrier where tickets are issued, they are available in all lanes. Now, if you don't have a transponder, please be kind to others and stay out of the EZpass only lanes. I've been known to experience road rage waiting behind somebody who got into the EZpass lane on a hunch he has a valid transponder.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 17, 2017, 08:53:01 AM
i think INDOT fucked up the us 31/465 interchange, the lane configuration for 31 makes no sense, why make the lane drops on the part of the road that gets the most traffic?  2 through lanes for meridian st, and 1 for getting on and off 465, with a BS lane that ends for both movements.  Causes traffic slowdowns every morning and evening.  Who thought this was a good idea?! I do love the tubular markers they put in the gore though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on November 17, 2017, 09:09:22 AM
My thought on the SB to EB movement is that it would cost significantly more to build a 2 lane flyover than 1. But it seems like something they would need in the future so why not go ahead and do it now? Damn non-forward thinking Indiana.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 17, 2017, 09:15:36 AM
that's not the problem in my opinion, the flyovers are fine as 1 lane. the problem is that it should have been designed in the opposite manner:

For SB 31, have the right 2 through lanes be the lanes that exit to the interstate, not have just one, have one lane go to meridian street, then have it widen out later.  the current lane config is absurd, what the hell is the point of that right lane that appears, only to just disappear a few thousand feet up the road?!

For NB 31 have the 2 lanes from 465 E &W become 2 of the 3 through lanes on NB 31, have NB meridian come in with just one lane. 

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on November 17, 2017, 09:26:29 AM
Makes sense.  Although 465 needs increased capacity going west to handle traffic coming from 31.  Traffic on 465 west bottlenecks right at the entrance ramps from 31 at rush hour.  It's pretty awful.  Having 2 dedicated lanes on 31 for 465; one for EB and one for WB; would help the traffic on 31 south at that same time, though.  Maybe when they (hopefully) add additional lanes to 465 in that area, they'll reconfigure the lanes and ramps on 31.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 17, 2017, 06:20:10 PM
it will one day be widened, the tell tale signs are there.  the ditch road bridge is going to be raised and lengthened next year, township line in 2020ish
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on November 29, 2017, 11:35:14 PM
Northwest Indiana work is starting to break for the winter.

On I-65, lanes between Indiana 2 and US 231 will shift slightly more inside to allow for wider shoulders on both sides of the road, and the bridges over US 231, Wurtz Ditch, and Indiana 2 have been reportedly filled on the inside. Next week, lane restrictions on Indiana 2 will be lifted for the winter, but restrictions on US 231 will remain.

"Restore 94"  is set to conclude within the next week. Concrete restoration west of I-65 is nearing its end; east of I-65, all that remains is installation of RPMs on the main lanes and striping of gore points. Shoulders remain closed for completion of drainage grate replacement. New additions along the way: more traffic cameras between Indiana 249 and Indiana 49, a new overhead VMS for westbound traffic near the weigh station west of Michigan City, and flashing yellow lights for drivers transitioning from eastbound I-94 to the Indiana Toll Road (to warn of the 25 mph loop ramp, including a tipping hazard sign for trucks). New cameras have also been installed on I-65 between the Toll Road and I-80/94.

On a more local note: intersection improvement at US 30 and Mississippi Street in Merrillville is winding down, with some rather significant improvements: a second left turn lane for traffic going from westbound US 30 to southbound Mississippi Street, a second left turn lane for traffic going from southbound Mississippi to US 30 (now all left turn transitions have two lanes), traffic entering/exiting the Outback and Ashley plaza funneled to one location, and (a major improvement) a dedicated right turn lane for southbound Mississippi to westbound US 30, allowing for through traffic to use two lanes and eliminating the shared right turn snarl that has plagued traffic there for years.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 30, 2017, 08:42:29 AM
Hopefully evening eastbound traffic on 80/94 will move better than it has been.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 05, 2017, 02:19:28 PM
indot is trying to fix their fuck up of the 31/465 interchange, new signs have been installed delineating the lanes, now the useless right lane has a use!  It is signed as the lane for WB 465, the other lane is now signed as for SB 31 and EB 465.  a few hundred feet south a bgs now shows the arrow per lane sign showing where to go.  let's hope this fixes the problem (i won't hold my breath)!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on December 07, 2017, 11:04:46 PM
INDOT issued a press release stating that three lanes will be open on I-69 between State Road 37 and State Road 38 beginning Friday morning.

The release indicates Southbound traffic will be narrowed to two lanes at State Road 37 due to the ongoing construction of an added lane between 116th and 106th street.  This pattern is noted as the "winter traffic pattern".

I get on Southbound each day from 37, but should be travelling to Anderson on Saturday. It will be nice to have the extra lanes
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 08, 2017, 06:06:07 PM
I just traveled US 35 East of US 31, and I have to say, I think there is a gap in US 35 there.  It isn't signed at all until after you leave Kokomo, a few thousand feet east of 31.  If you are traveling west (or technically north) on US 35, you have no idea it turns north, joining 31.  I have no idea what genius at INDOT allowed this to happen.  NB 31 ramp to SB 35 does in fact show that 35 turns east there.  I haven't traveled the SB 31 Ramp to SB 35 ramp yet, I will tomorrow though.   
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on December 08, 2017, 07:31:01 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 05, 2017, 02:19:28 PM
indot is trying to fix their fuck up of the 31/465 interchange, new signs have been installed delineating the lanes, now the useless right lane has a use!  It is signed as the lane for WB 465, the other lane is now signed as for SB 31 and EB 465.  a few hundred feet south a bgs now shows the arrow per lane sign showing where to go.  let's hope this fixes the problem (i won't hold my breath)!
The real problem here is inadequate lane capacity on 465 westbound, resulting in backups onto US 31 during heavy traffic periods.   I don't see anything getting better here until that problem is addressed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on December 09, 2017, 09:24:43 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 08, 2017, 06:06:07 PM
I just traveled US 35 East of US 31, and I have to say, I think there is a gap in US 35 there.  It isn't signed at all until after you leave Kokomo, a few thousand feet east of 31.  If you are traveling west (or technically north) on US 35, you have no idea it turns north, joining 31.  I have no idea what genius at INDOT allowed this to happen.  NB 31 ramp to SB 35 does in fact show that 35 turns east there.  I haven't traveled the SB 31 Ramp to SB 35 ramp yet, I will tomorrow though.   

The Eastern interchange of US 31 & US 35 / SR 22 took a direct hit from a tornado. Actually two tornadoes tore through there within 18 months. Anyway, the signs got messed up. The overhead signs were repaired but I'm thinking those that were on posts were not.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 10, 2017, 06:43:31 PM
Speaking of construction projects in the state, they finished a couple of weeks ago the building of two new bridges of I-65 over I-465 on the south side of Indianapolis. The bridges look nice and are extra wide to handle any additional new lanes they may add to I-65 in the future. It was good for once to see them get a little proactive with them.

However for any positive there must also be a negative. They redid all the remaining bridges in this interchange complex, including new bridges for the NB I-65 ramp to WB I-465 and the SB I-65 ramp to EB I-465. They kept the ramps exactly where they are so that traffic has to continue entering I-465 from the left side, keeping that interchange arrangement in tact for years to come. This design is also cited as one of the reasons for keeping I-465 speed limit at 55 MPH.

Also glaring, the new bridges of these ramps over the travel lanes of I-465, one over the westbound lanes and the other over the eastbound lanes did not leave any extra room for any potential expansion of I-465 to four lanes. There is only room for three travel lanes and one ramp lane from traffic entering the highway from the left side. This means that if the interstate would be expanded to four lanes the ramps would have to go or the bridge would have to be rebuilt again.

Symbolically though in my mind this completes several years worth of construction projects that have transformed the I-65 corridor from Exit 90 in Franklin north to Exit 106 at I-465. With the exception of the crappy pavement that remains in the left three lanes of I-65 between Exits 103 and 106 (because no one ever bothered to repave that stretch at all when adding a new auxiliary lane) the roadway is much improved to handle more traffic from the southern suburbs into Indy.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 11, 2017, 07:31:44 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 10, 2017, 06:43:31 PM
Speaking of construction projects in the state, they finished a couple of weeks ago the building of two new bridges of I-65 over I-465 on the south side of Indianapolis. The bridges look nice and are extra wide to handle any additional new lanes they may add to I-65 in the future. It was good for once to see them get a little proactive with them.

However for any positive there must also be a negative. They redid all the remaining bridges in this interchange complex, including new bridges for the NB I-65 ramp to WB I-465 and the SB I-65 ramp to EB I-465. They kept the ramps exactly where they are so that traffic has to continue entering I-465 from the left side, keeping that interchange arrangement in tact for years to come. This design is also cited as one of the reasons for keeping I-465 speed limit at 55 MPH.

Also glaring, the new bridges of these ramps over the travel lanes of I-465, one over the westbound lanes and the other over the eastbound lanes did not leave any extra room for any potential expansion of I-465 to four lanes. There is only room for three travel lanes and one ramp lane from traffic entering the highway from the left side. This means that if the interstate would be expanded to four lanes the ramps would have to go or the bridge would have to be rebuilt again.

Symbolically though in my mind this completes several years worth of construction projects that have transformed the I-65 corridor from Exit 90 in Franklin north to Exit 106 at I-465. With the exception of the crappy pavement that remains in the left three lanes of I-65 between Exits 103 and 106 (because no one ever bothered to repave that stretch at all when adding a new auxiliary lane) the roadway is much improved to handle more traffic from the southern suburbs into Indy.

no one goes 55 on 465 anyway.  I call bs on INDOT for that.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on December 11, 2017, 10:08:17 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 10, 2017, 06:43:31 PM
Speaking of construction projects in the state, they finished a couple of weeks ago the building of two new bridges of I-65 over I-465 on the south side of Indianapolis. The bridges look nice and are extra wide to handle any additional new lanes they may add to I-65 in the future. It was good for once to see them get a little proactive with them.

However for any positive there must also be a negative. They redid all the remaining bridges in this interchange complex, including new bridges for the NB I-65 ramp to WB I-465 and the SB I-65 ramp to EB I-465. They kept the ramps exactly where they are so that traffic has to continue entering I-465 from the left side, keeping that interchange arrangement in tact for years to come. This design is also cited as one of the reasons for keeping I-465 speed limit at 55 MPH.

Also glaring, the new bridges of these ramps over the travel lanes of I-465, one over the westbound lanes and the other over the eastbound lanes did not leave any extra room for any potential expansion of I-465 to four lanes. There is only room for three travel lanes and one ramp lane from traffic entering the highway from the left side. This means that if the interstate would be expanded to four lanes the ramps would have to go or the bridge would have to be rebuilt again.

Symbolically though in my mind this completes several years worth of construction projects that have transformed the I-65 corridor from Exit 90 in Franklin north to Exit 106 at I-465. With the exception of the crappy pavement that remains in the left three lanes of I-65 between Exits 103 and 106 (because no one ever bothered to repave that stretch at all when adding a new auxiliary lane) the roadway is much improved to handle more traffic from the southern suburbs into Indy.

I too am disappointed and frustrated that they didn't get rid of those left entrances.  I'm not sure of the statistics on accidents in that area but those ramps certainly aren't safe.  I remember having to exit onto 465 via one of those ramps in drivers ed (actually it was one of the ones off of 31) and it was terrifying.  You can tell that many people have the same sentiment based on how slowly they enter from those ramps. I still prefer not to take them if at all possible but they're hard to avoid.   It's upsetting that INDOT chose to save money rather than lives.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 11, 2017, 10:18:05 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on December 11, 2017, 10:08:17 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 10, 2017, 06:43:31 PM
Speaking of construction projects in the state, they finished a couple of weeks ago the building of two new bridges of I-65 over I-465 on the south side of Indianapolis. The bridges look nice and are extra wide to handle any additional new lanes they may add to I-65 in the future. It was good for once to see them get a little proactive with them.

However for any positive there must also be a negative. They redid all the remaining bridges in this interchange complex, including new bridges for the NB I-65 ramp to WB I-465 and the SB I-65 ramp to EB I-465. They kept the ramps exactly where they are so that traffic has to continue entering I-465 from the left side, keeping that interchange arrangement in tact for years to come. This design is also cited as one of the reasons for keeping I-465 speed limit at 55 MPH.

Also glaring, the new bridges of these ramps over the travel lanes of I-465, one over the westbound lanes and the other over the eastbound lanes did not leave any extra room for any potential expansion of I-465 to four lanes. There is only room for three travel lanes and one ramp lane from traffic entering the highway from the left side. This means that if the interstate would be expanded to four lanes the ramps would have to go or the bridge would have to be rebuilt again.

Symbolically though in my mind this completes several years worth of construction projects that have transformed the I-65 corridor from Exit 90 in Franklin north to Exit 106 at I-465. With the exception of the crappy pavement that remains in the left three lanes of I-65 between Exits 103 and 106 (because no one ever bothered to repave that stretch at all when adding a new auxiliary lane) the roadway is much improved to handle more traffic from the southern suburbs into Indy.

I too am disappointed and frustrated that they didn't get rid of those left entrances.  I'm not sure of the statistics on accidents in that area but those ramps certainly aren't safe.  I remember having to exit onto 465 via one of those ramps in drivers ed (actually it was one of the ones off of 31) and it was terrifying.  You can tell that many people have the same sentiment based on how slowly they enter from those ramps. I still prefer not to take them if at all possible but they're hard to avoid.   It's upsetting that INDOT chose to save money rather than lives.

they almost always tend to do that.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 15, 2017, 08:23:50 AM
per indot:
BLOOMINGTON, Ind. (Dec. 14, 2017) — Motorists traveling between Bloomington and Martinsville on SR 37 will notice changes to traffic patterns and access points beginning on Friday, Dec. 15. The lane shifts and new access will allow crews to get SR 37 ready for a winter configuration that will have four lanes of traffic moving both north and south bound in most of the corridor.
On Friday, northbound traffic on SR 37 between the Sample Road interchange and Crossover Road will be shifted onto the new I-69 northbound travel lanes.  Access on and off this stretch of the northbound roadway will be limited to East Sample/Wayport Road.  When northbound traffic moves to new I-69 pavement, the current SR 37 northbound lanes will become a bidirectional access road for homes and businesses east of SR 37.
Southbound motorists get to the new access road by turning left off of SR 37 at East Sample/Wayport; northbound motorists get to the new access road by turning right at East Sample/Wayport.  Motorists traveling north on Wayport Road can get to the new access road by using the East Sample roundabout. Because the new access road is bidirectional, motorists are urged to use caution and turn signals when entering and exiting the roadway.
Direct access to the Mobile/Circle K gas station from SR 37 will be eliminated.  Customers will need to go south on the East Sample/Wayport access road to reach the service station and Nature's Way.  Bloomington Auto Parts, Worm's Way, Inc., Oliver Winery, Fox Hollow Road, the Family Life Worship Center and Parker Pools can be accessed by traveling north on the new access road (old SR 37 northbound lanes) from East Sample/Wayport.   
U-turns at the northern and southern ends of the new northbound travel lanes will be located at Crossover Road and the East Sample/Wayport access road just north of the Sample Road overpass. Northbound motorists needing access to the west side of the highway will need to make a U-turn at Crossover Road and proceed southbound to Lee Paul Road.
In addition, on Monday, Dec. 18, southbound traffic entering the northern limits of the construction zone at Indian Creek will be placed on new I-69 pavement, separating it from northbound traffic that will remain on the current SR 37 northbound lanes.  Both north and south bound traffic will remain in single lanes, allowing crews to continue with patching, paving and maintenance operations as long as the weather permits.
INDOT reminds all motorists that work will continue at various points in the construction zone throughout the winter, and the posted speed limit remains 45 mph.  Motorists are urged to be aware of the new lane configurations and changes in traffic patterns, and to always drive safely and for the conditions.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 15, 2017, 08:37:49 AM
unrelated, Indy is going to spend 2.7 million on Binford/FCPWY.  They're going to repave it, and modernize the signals.  I wish they'd just carmelize it and make it like keystone pkwy.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 15, 2017, 08:50:46 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 15, 2017, 08:37:49 AM
unrelated, Indy is going to spend 2.7 million on Binford/FCPWY.  They're going to repave it, and modernize the signals.  I wish they'd just carmelize it and make it like keystone pkwy.

They'd have to buy up a lot of property to do that. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 15, 2017, 03:20:23 PM
has SR 111 been rerouted?  It used to just die at the ohio river in new boston, now google says it ends at SR 11 in Laconia (which would be a better route)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on December 15, 2017, 07:35:28 PM
I drove through Laconia on SR 11 a few months ago, there are no signs there indicating that SR 111 goes in or out of Laconia. I think Google maps is in error. I remember being confused as well when I checked it back then. How it looks on GSV is pretty much how it still looks now.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 16, 2017, 09:03:08 AM
Google maps is incorrect.  IN 111 does not connect to IN 11 at Laconia.  It turns south where Google Maps has it turning north and dead ends at the Ohio River.  I drove that area a few years ago.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on January 01, 2018, 03:32:57 PM
I picked up a copy of the new 2018 Indiana Roadway Map and wanted to make a few notes about changes to it. Since this is a general Indiana notes thread then I figure this would be the best spot for this. As a fan of maps I do notice a lot of details to things like this, although I can say that there's not a whole lot different in this year's map as opposed to last year's.

-I-69 in Southern Indiana has no changes from last year. Sections 1-4 are shown complete and Section 5 is shown as under construction. For once this is accurate.

-SR 61 bypass around Boonville is shown as complete. I haven't heard much about his project but last I checked it was not finished.

-US 50 bypass around North Vernon is finished and signed on the map. SR 3 is shown along its usual route north of North Vernon as well.

-SR 641 bypass is shown as complete but is now marked as a divided highway with interchanges as opposed to a freeway

-I-65 and SR 265 bridges over the Ohio River at Louisville are shown correctly as tolled highways

-Exit 97 on I-65 in Greenwood is marked.

-US 31 and SR 28 interchange west of Tipton is shown

-Exit 227 along US 31 north of Plymouth is still not shown

-And on a non-highway note: The city of Clinton in Vermillion County, was apparently downgraded in terms of city size based on population. On the Indiana map communities with more than 5,000 people have their city limits shown, those below that have either a rectangle with a circle inside of it, a double circle or a single circle based on size. Clinton was moved from the city-limits showing to the rectangle with circle symbology, maybe something that might only interest me, but I've never seen a community go down in symbology as opposed as going up, getting city limits added due to additional growth in places like Ellettsville, Batesville and Avon.

On another note, I'm still not a fan of the newer Indiana map design over the past few years, getting rid of all the city insets, I don't know of many states that have done something like that. And for places like Lafayette having a city map might be helpful to people (yeah, yeah, there's phones and stuff like that too.) Kind of egregious this year, there's two identical "advertisements" on the map about Indiana's new Real ID law that I don't think has much meaning on a map that's focused more on people traveling through the state.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 01, 2018, 07:01:13 PM
it won't open until this year now http://wiky.com/news/articles/2017/nov/07/boonville-bypass-opening-delayed-until-2018/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 03, 2018, 09:12:38 AM
So I called INDOT this morning about 2 signage problems in the Kokomo area.

The first was the fact that exit 161 on US 31 incorrectly states the exit is for "East Blvd ; CR 100 S" when it should be "Boulevard St. ; CR 100 S"  they said that they acknowledge the error, talked to the city, and they were ok with it, and determined that it shouldn't be confusing to motorists.  Someone on here mentioned this issue, I forget who it was, but credit to them for figuring this one out!

The second was discovered by monty I believe from here.  There are no signs for US 35 turning right to join US 31 at the Markland exit.  They said they will look into it and get back to me in a few weeks.  So maybe that one will be fixed.  We'll see. 

Anyone notice any other signage screw ups around the state?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on January 03, 2018, 10:36:50 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 03, 2018, 09:12:38 AM
The first was the fact that exit 161 on US 31 incorrectly states the exit is for "East Blvd ; CR 100 S" when it should be "Boulevard St. ; CR 100 S"  they said that they acknowledge the error, talked to the city, and they were ok with it, and determined that it shouldn't be confusing to motorists.  Someone on here mentioned this issue, I forget who it was, but credit to them for figuring this one out!

I was the one who brought up that sign error, in this thread: https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=17892.msg2240546#msg2240546 (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=17892.msg2240546#msg2240546). Boulevard is a dumb name for a street, but that's the name. If that's the name INDOT should use it properly, but it's not up to me. Thanks for reporting it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 10, 2018, 06:08:50 PM
INDOT really wants to commission I-31.  they've just installed new mile markers between at least mm 124 and 126, every tenth of a mile it incorrectly shows i-31 shields.   :-D
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Terry Shea on January 12, 2018, 01:08:51 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 10, 2018, 06:08:50 PM
INDOT really wants to commission I-31.  they've just installed new mile markers between at least mm 124 and 126, every tenth of a mile it incorrectly shows i-31 shields.   :-D
This is on US-31 I take it?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 12, 2018, 01:10:38 PM
Yes, and they're going to fix it.

Pixel 2 XL

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 22, 2018, 09:44:21 AM
https://www.ibj.com/articles/67125-north-split-construction-critics-want-more-neighborhood-friendly-plan

This proves you can't build anything without someone bitching about it.  What these guys propose is insane, do they know how much a tunnel would cost?  Plus 170k cars at the north split alone on a surface street? give me a break!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on January 22, 2018, 11:31:32 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 22, 2018, 09:44:21 AM
https://www.ibj.com/articles/67125-north-split-construction-critics-want-more-neighborhood-friendly-plan

This proves you can't build anything without someone bitching about it.  What these guys propose is insane, do they know how much a tunnel would cost?  Plus 170k cars at the north split alone on a surface street? give me a break!

Well, you know, everyone will be sent around 465 so it's no problem.  Sigh.

The comments are fun to read.  "They tore down the Embarcadero and no traffic problems, so there would be none here!".....sure. They didn't interrupt two major Interstates where they meet; they demolished something that was already a stub.  Do the people who say that use 465?  It already is often awful without adding ALL the traffic trying to get across on I-70 or I-65.

I doubt the Feds would like the idea of interrupting I-65 or I-70 for a surface street, or routing both around I-465.  Although if they rerouted right, they could have an overlap of I-65, I-69, I-70, I-74, I-465, US 36, US 40, IN 37, and IN 67. Am I missing any?  Yep, that's a great idea!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 23, 2018, 08:05:34 AM
170k cars use this interchange a day, it's one of the busiest in the state, and a ton of it is from the northern suburbs: Carmel, Westfield, Noblesville, Fishers, Cicero, and exburbs.  The idea of burying it is clearly something someone who's never built a road would say is a good idea.  I doubt this will go anywhere, they'll likely just doll it up a bit to make them stop complaining.  They are supposed to do the same thing at the south split in a few years.  Things that need to be done in the area are to turn all the surface streets being used as exits into concrete pavement facilities, remove all bgs (on surface streets only) and replace them with sgs (small green signs) or shields.  Replace all signs with something more decorative, like the green ones in the wholesale district, do other beautification things, like make the sidewalks with the same bricks as the cultural trail.  that would at least make the new design look better.

I'm interested to see how they are fixing the 11th and 12th street exit roads.  it's understandable, but annoying that the split diamond is placed in between 2 one way pairs, you can get to Illinois, but not Capitol easily, and you can get to delaware and pennsylvania only from one direction (NB has no access to Delaware for some reason). 

I must admit i-70 on the southern end of downtown really did fuck up the street grid royally, I wouldn't remove the highway, but I would change around the exits. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on January 23, 2018, 08:09:22 AM
Quote from: PurdueBill on January 22, 2018, 11:31:32 PM
I doubt the Feds would like the idea of interrupting I-65 or I-70 for a surface street, or routing both around I-465.  Although if they rerouted right, they could have an overlap of I-65, I-69, I-70, I-74, I-465, US 36, US 40, IN 37, and IN 67. Am I missing any?  Yep, that's a great idea!
Don't forget US 52 and US 421!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 23, 2018, 08:18:44 AM
Quote from: csw on January 23, 2018, 08:09:22 AM
Quote from: PurdueBill on January 22, 2018, 11:31:32 PM
I doubt the Feds would like the idea of interrupting I-65 or I-70 for a surface street, or routing both around I-465.  Although if they rerouted right, they could have an overlap of I-65, I-69, I-70, I-74, I-465, US 36, US 40, IN 37, and IN 67. Am I missing any?  Yep, that's a great idea!
Don't forget US 52 and US 421!

could you imagine the signage for that?   :-D
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: captkirk_4 on January 23, 2018, 08:55:06 AM
Quote from: PurdueBill on January 22, 2018, 11:31:32 PM

I doubt the Feds would like the idea of interrupting I-65 or I-70 for a surface street, or routing both around I-465.
When I lived in Portland a bunch of granola chomping, environmental wacko, anti-car hipster types were seriously talking about tearing down I-5 through central Portland and making all the cross country trucks and cars using the main west coast artery use a bunch of surface streets through downtown Portland. These nutcases had the gall to say "Expressways are a thing of the past." Hopefully the Feds would never allow this, but with these tech nerds trying to pry my fingers off my beloved steering wheel of my car banning my favorite activity of DRIVING with their nutcase self-driving car nonsense I wouldn't be so sure. Just riding up I-57 in Iroquois County Saturday I was wondering just how comfortable I'd feel helpless in one of their gadgets trusting that the transistors would make the gentle curve ahead of me instead of driving me STRAIGHT INTO THAT ICE COVERED POND.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 23, 2018, 09:03:48 AM
Quote from: captkirk_4 on January 23, 2018, 08:55:06 AM
Quote from: PurdueBill on January 22, 2018, 11:31:32 PM

I doubt the Feds would like the idea of interrupting I-65 or I-70 for a surface street, or routing both around I-465.
When I lived in Portland a bunch of granola chomping, environmental wacko, anti-car hipster types were seriously talking about tearing down I-5 through central Portland and making all the cross country trucks and cars using the main west coast artery use a bunch of surface streets through downtown Portland. These nutcases had the gall to say "Expressways are a thing of the past." Hopefully the Feds would never allow this, but with these tech nerds trying to pry my fingers off my beloved steering wheel of my car banning my favorite activity of DRIVING with their nutcase self-driving car nonsense I wouldn't be so sure. Just riding up I-57 in Iroquois County Saturday I was wondering just how comfortable I'd feel helpless in one of their gadgets trusting that the transistors would make the gentle curb ahead of me instead of driving me STRAIGHT INTO THAT ICE COVERED POND.

the nutcases that propose these ideas all conveniently live downtown, and have never commuted from the burbs into downtown.  self driving cars are also garbage in bad weather. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 23, 2018, 09:12:23 AM
but bruh, mass transit
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on January 23, 2018, 12:45:03 PM
Quote from: csw on January 23, 2018, 08:09:22 AM
Quote from: PurdueBill on January 22, 2018, 11:31:32 PM
I doubt the Feds would like the idea of interrupting I-65 or I-70 for a surface street, or routing both around I-465.  Although if they rerouted right, they could have an overlap of I-65, I-69, I-70, I-74, I-465, US 36, US 40, IN 37, and IN 67. Am I missing any?  Yep, that's a great idea!
Don't forget US 52 and US 421!

I thought they went around the north and east sides.  Would either of them overlap 70 and 74 at the same time as 65, 69, and the others?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on January 23, 2018, 04:21:42 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on January 23, 2018, 12:45:03 PM
Quote from: csw on January 23, 2018, 08:09:22 AM
Quote from: PurdueBill on January 22, 2018, 11:31:32 PM
I doubt the Feds would like the idea of interrupting I-65 or I-70 for a surface street, or routing both around I-465.  Although if they rerouted right, they could have an overlap of I-65, I-69, I-70, I-74, I-465, US 36, US 40, IN 37, and IN 67. Am I missing any?  Yep, that's a great idea!
Don't forget US 52 and US 421!

I thought they went around the north and east sides.  Would either of them overlap 70 and 74 at the same time as 65, 69, and the others?
All of them would overlap (except I-74) between the US 52/Brookville Rd and US 40/Washington St exits.

heck, you can throw US 31 on there too.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on January 23, 2018, 07:16:46 PM
Quote from: csw on January 23, 2018, 04:21:42 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on January 23, 2018, 12:45:03 PM
Quote from: csw on January 23, 2018, 08:09:22 AM
Quote from: PurdueBill on January 22, 2018, 11:31:32 PM
I doubt the Feds would like the idea of interrupting I-65 or I-70 for a surface street, or routing both around I-465.  Although if they rerouted right, they could have an overlap of I-65, I-69, I-70, I-74, I-465, US 36, US 40, IN 37, and IN 67. Am I missing any?  Yep, that's a great idea!
Don't forget US 52 and US 421!

I thought they went around the north and east sides.  Would either of them overlap 70 and 74 at the same time as 65, 69, and the others?
All of them would overlap (except I-74) between the US 52/Brookville Rd and US 40/Washington St exits.

heck, you can throw US 31 on there too.

I don't get how 65 would overlap over there if it went the logical route down the west side from current Exit 123 and exited onto itself at the 0 mile marker on 465.  65 would be on the other half of 465 from 421 and 52. Routing it onto the north side and down the east side back to the west seems out of the way and makes for an issue of what to do with 65 from Exit 129 southward instead of just south of 123.  Are you imagining routing 65 and 70 over the north end of 465 through the two-lane part at the NW corner?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 23, 2018, 07:23:09 PM
The original temporary routing of 65 was around the west side

Pixel 2 XL

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on January 23, 2018, 07:34:33 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 23, 2018, 07:23:09 PM
The original temporary routing of 65 was around the west side

Pixel 2 XL



That's what I thought.  If 65 were to have to be rerouted because of some insane decommissioning of the roadway between the north and south splits, it would go down the west side.  Going over the north, down the east, and back to the west to exit onto itself going south would be way out of the way.  70 would also best go around the south side.

The oddity of going down the west side for 65 would be that it would have a wrong-way overlap with 69 on the south side of 465.  65 south and 69 north both traveling compass east with 36, 40, 70, 74, and 465 all being east as well, and 37 and 67 being north.  I would pay real money to see that sign assembly in all its glory, and maybe chip in to have it put up.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 23, 2018, 07:40:53 PM
Indot has started placing signs to alert through traffic to bypass downtown. It shows travel times and just flat out says to not go downtown if you're through traffic

Pixel 2 XL

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on January 23, 2018, 08:51:19 PM
Well, the signs don't EXACTLY say not to go to downtown, they just warn you of the projected travel time of going through the city versus going around. And most of the time there is really no difference in either route, only during rush hour is there usually a difference that warrants going around the city and that is only if there is nothing slowing down traffic on 465.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 23, 2018, 09:22:03 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on January 23, 2018, 08:51:19 PM
Well, the signs don't EXACTLY say not to go to downtown, they just warn you of the projected travel time of going through the city versus going around. And most of the time there is really no difference in either route, only during rush hour is there usually a difference that warrants going around the city and that is only if there is nothing slowing down traffic on 465.

if you enter the city on 65 south, they do have a sign saying "to i-70 east dayton follow i-865" and it says it again but with 465 at 865's end.  that's the only place i've seen that. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on January 23, 2018, 09:29:23 PM
The signs can tell people that but if they look it up on the spot, they will choose the faster route probably.  As of this moment, it is not only 2.7 miles shorter to stay on I-65 if you are coming from the north and going through to the south to stay on 65 through the city, but it is 3 minutes faster.  No one is going to bother getting on 465 to take more time.  At rush hour times it would make sense, but even at rush hour times I've managed to have to cross Indy coming from the east to get to the airport to pick someone up and the travel time signs showed it was appreciably faster to stay on 70 than to go around 465.  It all depends on incidents and road conditions at the particular moment.

Getting rid of the Interstates between the splits would be insanity though--there would no longer be a backup route to take if one were blocked or extremely slow.  How much can 465 handle? 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mvak36 on January 23, 2018, 09:57:52 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on January 23, 2018, 09:29:23 PM

Getting rid of the Interstates between the splits would be insanity though--there would no longer be a backup route to take if one were blocked or extremely slow.  How much can 465 handle?

That is a horrible idea. I hope that INDOT doesn't even consider it. There is no way the whole loop would be able to handle that much extra traffic.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 24, 2018, 07:35:51 AM
There's a very low chance of them caring, it's currently almost done being designed.  This is just the urbanists saying: "but bruh, mass transit"
Because clearly everyone uses Indygo.  I personally supported the red line, but I know no one is going to ride it.  It's really going to fuck up traffic flow along college and meridian.  I'll have to reread the article, but I don't think the guy wants it removed, he wants it buried, with a blvd on top, like i-93.  Maybe he can pay for it?  :hmmm:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: captkirk_4 on January 24, 2018, 08:47:34 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 23, 2018, 09:22:03 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on January 23, 2018, 08:51:19 PM
Well, the signs don't EXACTLY say not to go to downtown, they just warn you of the projected travel time of going through the city versus going around. And most of the time there is really no difference in either route, only during rush hour is there usually a difference that warrants going around the city and that is only if there is nothing slowing down traffic on 465.

if you enter the city on 65 south, they do have a sign saying "to i-70 east dayton follow i-865" and it says it again but with 465 at 865's end.  that's the only place i've seen that.
When I came west bound from Ohio on 70 I noticed there was not any good through flow onto 74 west. I had to go into the downtown, then way south and up. 865 should have been extended straight west from it's terminus at 65 into 74 so that movement could go around the north beltway. I also tried IN 32 from Crawfordsville to Lebanon and made good time once, but another time got stuck behind a senile old coot doing 50 with about 12 cars lined up unable to pass on the winding two lane road. Don't know why 74 comes to a dead end at 465 instead of going into the downtown like the others? Must have been an add on expressway?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 24, 2018, 08:51:32 AM
Quote from: captkirk_4 on January 24, 2018, 08:47:34 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 23, 2018, 09:22:03 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on January 23, 2018, 08:51:19 PM
Well, the signs don't EXACTLY say not to go to downtown, they just warn you of the projected travel time of going through the city versus going around. And most of the time there is really no difference in either route, only during rush hour is there usually a difference that warrants going around the city and that is only if there is nothing slowing down traffic on 465.

if you enter the city on 65 south, they do have a sign saying "to i-70 east dayton follow i-865" and it says it again but with 465 at 865's end.  that's the only place i've seen that.
When I came west bound from Ohio on 70 I noticed there was not any good through flow onto 74 west. I had to go into the downtown, then way south and up. 865 should have been extended straight west from it's terminus at 65 into 74 so that movement could go around the north beltway. I also tried IN 32 from Crawfordsville to Lebanon and made good time once, but another time got stuck behind a senile old coot doing 50 with about 12 cars lined up unable to pass on the winding two lane road. Don't know why 74 comes to a dead end at 465 instead of going into the downtown like the others? Must have been an add on expressway?

74 was never planned to go downtown and i have no idea why.  it would be interesting to see in come in and shoot straight west and tie into 65 at 38th st
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Henry on January 24, 2018, 09:37:34 AM
Quote from: PurdueBill on January 23, 2018, 09:29:23 PM
Getting rid of the Interstates between the splits would be insanity though--there would no longer be a backup route to take if one were blocked or extremely slow.  How much can 465 handle? 
Well, you have I-74 running along the south side of the loop (was there ever a proposal to route that through town instead?), and the future I-69 along the east side, so that statement is not completely true. Sure, you would go out of the way on the loop, but at least there's an alternative around the area.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on January 24, 2018, 04:18:28 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 24, 2018, 08:51:32 AM
74 was never planned to go downtown and i have no idea why.  it would be interesting to see in come in and shoot straight west and tie into 65 at 38th st

Checking historic aerials, it appears that there was hardly any development along the part of 38th Street between 465 and 65 back in the days when the interstates were under construction in Indy. It would have been logical to build 74 along that route then. Too bad that they didn't do it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 24, 2018, 04:19:51 PM
Quote from: theline on January 24, 2018, 04:18:28 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 24, 2018, 08:51:32 AM
74 was never planned to go downtown and i have no idea why.  it would be interesting to see in come in and shoot straight west and tie into 65 at 38th st

Checking historic aerials, it appears that there was hardly any development along the part of 38th Street between 465 and 65 back in the days when the interstates were under construction in Indy. It would have been logical to build 74 along that route then. Too bad that they didn't do it.

you should look at the 37/69 corridor around castleton, it's crazy how much has changed!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mgk920 on January 24, 2018, 10:44:33 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 24, 2018, 04:19:51 PM
Quote from: theline on January 24, 2018, 04:18:28 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 24, 2018, 08:51:32 AM
74 was never planned to go downtown and i have no idea why.  it would be interesting to see in come in and shoot straight west and tie into 65 at 38th st

Checking historic aerials, it appears that there was hardly any development along the part of 38th Street between 465 and 65 back in the days when the interstates were under construction in Indy. It would have been logical to build 74 along that route then. Too bad that they didn't do it.

you should look at the 37/69 corridor around castleton, it's crazy how much has changed!

I was always under the impression that I-74 was planned to go through the city, with how the original cloverleaf interchanges at I-465 were laid out feeding directly into major surface streets 'in' from I-465 and how the downtown area has that neat-looking incomplete freeway rectangle.  Have I-74 connect into it from the east at the south I-65/70 split and from the west at the I-65 curve by 11th/California.

Mike
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on January 25, 2018, 02:28:22 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on January 24, 2018, 10:44:33 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 24, 2018, 04:19:51 PM
Quote from: theline on January 24, 2018, 04:18:28 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 24, 2018, 08:51:32 AM
74 was never planned to go downtown and i have no idea why.  it would be interesting to see in come in and shoot straight west and tie into 65 at 38th st

Checking historic aerials, it appears that there was hardly any development along the part of 38th Street between 465 and 65 back in the days when the interstates were under construction in Indy. It would have been logical to build 74 along that route then. Too bad that they didn't do it.

you should look at the 37/69 corridor around castleton, it's crazy how much has changed!

I was always under the impression that I-74 was planned to go through the city, with how the original cloverleaf interchanges at I-465 were laid out feeding directly into major surface streets 'in' from I-465 and how the downtown area has that neat-looking incomplete freeway rectangle.  Have I-74 connect into it from the east at the south I-65/70 split and from the west at the I-65 curve by 11th/California.

Mike
Although it may seem as if, the only connection that I know of that was proposed to the downtown originally was the arm that would have connected now I-69 to the NE corner of the downtown interstates.  I believe it was being tagged as I-169.  Just thinkin', if they would put a few interchanges or overpasses on Binford like at 71st and 75th, they might help traffic to move on that road and alleviate the backlog of people getting off on I-69 to I-465.  Just a bit of dreaming.  No one up there wants it, and you are looking a tens of millions of dollars, perhaps over a hundred million just to get within striking distance of Keystone.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 25, 2018, 02:31:14 PM
Quote from: Life in Paradise on January 25, 2018, 02:28:22 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on January 24, 2018, 10:44:33 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 24, 2018, 04:19:51 PM
Quote from: theline on January 24, 2018, 04:18:28 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 24, 2018, 08:51:32 AM
74 was never planned to go downtown and i have no idea why.  it would be interesting to see in come in and shoot straight west and tie into 65 at 38th st

Checking historic aerials, it appears that there was hardly any development along the part of 38th Street between 465 and 65 back in the days when the interstates were under construction in Indy. It would have been logical to build 74 along that route then. Too bad that they didn't do it.

you should look at the 37/69 corridor around castleton, it's crazy how much has changed!

I was always under the impression that I-74 was planned to go through the city, with how the original cloverleaf interchanges at I-465 were laid out feeding directly into major surface streets 'in' from I-465 and how the downtown area has that neat-looking incomplete freeway rectangle.  Have I-74 connect into it from the east at the south I-65/70 split and from the west at the I-65 curve by 11th/California.

Mike
Although it may seem as if, the only connection that I know of that was proposed to the downtown originally was the arm that would have connected now I-69 to the NE corner of the downtown interstates.  I believe it was being tagged as I-169.  Just thinkin', if they would put a few interchanges or overpasses on Binford like at 71st and 75th, they might help traffic to move on that road and alleviate the backlog of people getting off on I-69 to I-465.  Just a bit of dreaming.  No one up there wants it, and you are looking a tens of millions of dollars, perhaps over a hundred million just to get within striking distance of Keystone.

i started out as 69 all the way downtown, feds refused to pay.  then they floated 165, no money.  and yes interchanges on binford are a fantasy, indy can't even fill potholes, let alone actually do something good to alleviate traffic. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on January 26, 2018, 12:45:56 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 24, 2018, 04:19:51 PM
Quote from: theline on January 24, 2018, 04:18:28 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 24, 2018, 08:51:32 AM
74 was never planned to go downtown and i have no idea why.  it would be interesting to see in come in and shoot straight west and tie into 65 at 38th st

Checking historic aerials, it appears that there was hardly any development along the part of 38th Street between 465 and 65 back in the days when the interstates were under construction in Indy. It would have been logical to build 74 along that route then. Too bad that they didn't do it.

you should look at the 37/69 corridor around castleton, it's crazy how much has changed!

I don't actually have to check historic aerials to picture the changes in the Castleton area. I grew up in Muncie and we frequently visited or passed through that area for shopping, sports events, etc. over the years. Even after moving to South Bend 40+ years ago, visits to the old stomping grounds have been frequent.

Back to 74, I've never seen any historical document indicating any intention to build it inside 465. Everything shows it stopping at 465.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on January 26, 2018, 09:06:34 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 25, 2018, 02:31:14 PM
Quote from: Life in Paradise on January 25, 2018, 02:28:22 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on January 24, 2018, 10:44:33 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 24, 2018, 04:19:51 PM
Quote from: theline on January 24, 2018, 04:18:28 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 24, 2018, 08:51:32 AM
74 was never planned to go downtown and i have no idea why.  it would be interesting to see in come in and shoot straight west and tie into 65 at 38th st

Checking historic aerials, it appears that there was hardly any development along the part of 38th Street between 465 and 65 back in the days when the interstates were under construction in Indy. It would have been logical to build 74 along that route then. Too bad that they didn't do it.

you should look at the 37/69 corridor around castleton, it's crazy how much has changed!

I was always under the impression that I-74 was planned to go through the city, with how the original cloverleaf interchanges at I-465 were laid out feeding directly into major surface streets 'in' from I-465 and how the downtown area has that neat-looking incomplete freeway rectangle.  Have I-74 connect into it from the east at the south I-65/70 split and from the west at the I-65 curve by 11th/California.

Mike
Although it may seem as if, the only connection that I know of that was proposed to the downtown originally was the arm that would have connected now I-69 to the NE corner of the downtown interstates.  I believe it was being tagged as I-169.  Just thinkin', if they would put a few interchanges or overpasses on Binford like at 71st and 75th, they might help traffic to move on that road and alleviate the backlog of people getting off on I-69 to I-465.  Just a bit of dreaming.  No one up there wants it, and you are looking a tens of millions of dollars, perhaps over a hundred million just to get within striking distance of Keystone.

i started out as 69 all the way downtown, feds refused to pay.  then they floated 165, no money.  and yes interchanges on binford are a fantasy, indy can't even fill potholes, let alone actually do something good to alleviate traffic. 

Hamilton County has grown to the point where some kind of rail line running downtown would make a lot of sense.  It's really the only way you're going to alleviate traffic at this point.  You could have a line running along Rangeline/Westfield starting at 146th with stops at Main, 116th, and 96th, and a line running along 37/69 starting at 141st with stops at 126th, 116th and 96th.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on January 26, 2018, 10:06:05 AM
https://www.southbendtribune.com/news/local/st-joseph-county-plans-takeover-of-indiana-near-notre-dame/article_9ad61dc4-52f9-53a0-8732-cdbbee18b9d5.html

What is unclear in this article is that it says that the county wants to take over the "whole 6.5-mile stretch of Indiana 933 from the state, which runs north from Angela Boulevard to State Line Road."  It's only 4.5 miles from Angela Blvd to State Line Road, so I don't know if that's a typo, or of the 6.5 miles is supposed to be including some other parts of 933 (perhaps the part between 331 and Ash Rd?)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Finrod on January 26, 2018, 04:48:22 PM
I imagine that I-74 was never planned to go inside I-465 because coming in from the west, I-74 would have had to go right by the Indianapolis 500.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 26, 2018, 05:22:26 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on January 26, 2018, 09:06:34 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 25, 2018, 02:31:14 PM
Quote from: Life in Paradise on January 25, 2018, 02:28:22 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on January 24, 2018, 10:44:33 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 24, 2018, 04:19:51 PM
Quote from: theline on January 24, 2018, 04:18:28 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 24, 2018, 08:51:32 AM
74 was never planned to go downtown and i have no idea why.  it would be interesting to see in come in and shoot straight west and tie into 65 at 38th st

Checking historic aerials, it appears that there was hardly any development along the part of 38th Street between 465 and 65 back in the days when the interstates were under construction in Indy. It would have been logical to build 74 along that route then. Too bad that they didn't do it.

you should look at the 37/69 corridor around castleton, it's crazy how much has changed!

I was always under the impression that I-74 was planned to go through the city, with how the original cloverleaf interchanges at I-465 were laid out feeding directly into major surface streets 'in' from I-465 and how the downtown area has that neat-looking incomplete freeway rectangle.  Have I-74 connect into it from the east at the south I-65/70 split and from the west at the I-65 curve by 11th/California.

Mike
Although it may seem as if, the only connection that I know of that was proposed to the downtown originally was the arm that would have connected now I-69 to the NE corner of the downtown interstates.  I believe it was being tagged as I-169.  Just thinkin', if they would put a few interchanges or overpasses on Binford like at 71st and 75th, they might help traffic to move on that road and alleviate the backlog of people getting off on I-69 to I-465.  Just a bit of dreaming.  No one up there wants it, and you are looking a tens of millions of dollars, perhaps over a hundred million just to get within striking distance of Keystone.

i started out as 69 all the way downtown, feds refused to pay.  then they floated 165, no money.  and yes interchanges on binford are a fantasy, indy can't even fill potholes, let alone actually do something good to alleviate traffic. 

Hamilton County has grown to the point where some kind of rail line running downtown would make a lot of sense.  It's really the only way you're going to alleviate traffic at this point.  You could have a line running along Rangeline/Westfield starting at 146th with stops at Main, 116th, and 96th, and a line running along 37/69 starting at 141st with stops at 126th, 116th and 96th.

you know INDOT is desperate to get rid of 931 and 933, the only thing is, why not the whole thing?  SB should take over its portion. just kill the whole thing.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mgk920 on January 26, 2018, 09:39:50 PM
Quote from: Finrod on January 26, 2018, 04:48:22 PM
I imagine that I-74 was never planned to go inside I-465 because coming in from the west, I-74 would have had to go right by the Indianapolis 500.

I was going on the assumption that it would loop a bit south of the track and then head approximately due eastward to I-65.

Mike
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on January 27, 2018, 11:34:28 AM

Quote from: silverback1065 on January 26, 2018, 05:22:26 PM
you know INDOT is desperate to get rid of 931 and 933, the only thing is, why not the whole thing?  SB should take over its portion. just kill the whole thing.

I don't think South Bend and Mishawaka want to take over the maintenance costs of 933.  I imagine that 933 will continue to exist from Angela Blvd in South Bend to 331 in Mishawaka for the time being. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 27, 2018, 08:48:37 PM
here is their genius idea for 65/70, hopefully indot wins this
http://www.urbanindy.com/2018/01/27/indot-proposes-a-devastating-blow-to-downtown-neighborhoods/

here is indots idea
http://www.urbanindy.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/1_2018-01-08_North-Split_North-Side-Analysis.pdf
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on January 28, 2018, 01:33:23 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on January 26, 2018, 10:06:05 AM
https://www.southbendtribune.com/news/local/st-joseph-county-plans-takeover-of-indiana-near-notre-dame/article_9ad61dc4-52f9-53a0-8732-cdbbee18b9d5.html

What is unclear in this article is that it says that the county wants to take over the "whole 6.5-mile stretch of Indiana 933 from the state, which runs north from Angela Boulevard to State Line Road."  It's only 4.5 miles from Angela Blvd to State Line Road, so I don't know if that's a typo, or of the 6.5 miles is supposed to be including some other parts of 933 (perhaps the part between 331 and Ash Rd?)

6.5 miles is the approximate combined mileage of both sections of 933 in St. Joseph County, excluding portions inside the city limits of South Bend and Mishawaka. I suppose that is why the writer uses that figure. That includes the section from Angela to State Line Road and the section from Mishawaka's east city limit to Ash Road. Mishawaka's city limit is not at 331, but about a half mile east of Bittersweet Road. INDOT is certainly interested in divesting the whole thing.

My understanding is that the the county can negotiate the takeover of portions outside the cities, including the towns of Roseland and Osceola, but INDOT must negotiate separately with the cities for their portions.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on January 28, 2018, 10:04:09 AM
When driving along recently resurfaced portions of Indiana 49, I-94, and I-65, it appears the striping between lanes has been grooved into the pavement, possibly as a means of keeping the paint from fading quickly due to weather and driving.

Can anyone confirm this? Also, is this becoming a practice in other parts of the state?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 28, 2018, 10:10:11 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on January 28, 2018, 10:04:09 AM
When driving along recently resurfaced portions of Indiana 49, I-94, and I-65, it appears the striping between lanes has been grooved into the pavement, possibly as a means of keeping the paint from fading quickly due to weather and driving.

Can anyone confirm this? Also, is this becoming a practice in other parts of the state?
Whenever thermoplastic is used as a pavement marking, it's now required to groove the pavement. Helps shield it from snow plows and other things that will fade the markings. It's not required for paint though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on January 28, 2018, 10:34:10 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 28, 2018, 10:10:11 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on January 28, 2018, 10:04:09 AM
When driving along recently resurfaced portions of Indiana 49, I-94, and I-65, it appears the striping between lanes has been grooved into the pavement, possibly as a means of keeping the paint from fading quickly due to weather and driving.

Can anyone confirm this? Also, is this becoming a practice in other parts of the state?
Whenever thermoplastic is used as a pavement marking, it's now required to groove the pavement. Helps shield it from snow plows and other things that will fade the markings. It's not required for paint though.

So that isn't even paint, but a more weather resistant material? That's a great idea, along with grooving it into the pavement.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 28, 2018, 10:11:19 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on January 28, 2018, 10:34:10 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 28, 2018, 10:10:11 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on January 28, 2018, 10:04:09 AM
When driving along recently resurfaced portions of Indiana 49, I-94, and I-65, it appears the striping between lanes has been grooved into the pavement, possibly as a means of keeping the paint from fading quickly due to weather and driving.

Can anyone confirm this? Also, is this becoming a practice in other parts of the state?
Whenever thermoplastic is used as a pavement marking, it's now required to groove the pavement. Helps shield it from snow plows and other things that will fade the markings. It's not required for paint though.

So that isn't even paint, but a more weather resistant material? That's a great idea, along with grooving it into the pavement.

yes, on new asphalt roadways, thermoplastic is the standard (unless it's rural, or the road owner requests paint)  it's molten plastic, and little reflective beads are mixed in to add reflectivity.  it's my favorite material for markings.  on concrete, they typically use preformed plastic or epoxy, the preformed plastic i believe is more like tape, it's not molten.  paint lasts about 3-5 yrs, depending on traffic, and location of the road according to INDOT, i forget thermo's length, but it's significantly more.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 28, 2018, 10:12:15 PM
it's fun watching them place pavement markings down   :biggrin:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 15, 2018, 07:16:57 PM
well this is depressing: https://www.indystar.com/story/news/2018/02/15/indys-streets-so-bad-making-them-fair-would-take-10-times-current-budget/324044002/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on February 15, 2018, 08:08:33 PM
Makes me wonder what would have happened if INDOT was still in charge of Meridian Street, Washington Street, 38th Street and other formerly commissioned highways through the city. It may not have fixed things entirely but it could have taken a little of the burden off the city.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 15, 2018, 08:10:00 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on February 15, 2018, 08:08:33 PM
Makes me wonder what would have happened if INDOT was still in charge of Meridian Street, Washington Street, 38th Street and other formerly commissioned highways through the city. It may not have fixed things entirely but it could have taken a little of the burden off the city.
They wouldn't be in trash shape like they are in now. INDOTs roads in the metro area are in excellent shape in comparison.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 26, 2018, 01:10:53 PM
Will SR 15 still be continuous in Goshen, after the US 33 bypass is finished? Also, is SR 4 completely dead in that area?  I thought it was cut back to the city limits a few years ago, creating INDOT's favorite thing, a random end on a SR. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on February 26, 2018, 04:05:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 26, 2018, 01:10:53 PM
Will SR 15 still be continuous in Goshen, after the US 33 bypass is finished? Also, is SR 4 completely dead in that area?  I thought it was cut back to the city limits a few years ago, creating INDOT's favorite thing, a random end on a SR. 

My parents live in Goshen.  I've not heard any talk of any changes to SR 15 once US 33 is finished.  That's a lot of road that I doubt the city of Goshen is willing to give up.  SR 4 does indeed end at the city limits instead of at Main St. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 26, 2018, 04:10:45 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on February 26, 2018, 04:05:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 26, 2018, 01:10:53 PM
Will SR 15 still be continuous in Goshen, after the US 33 bypass is finished? Also, is SR 4 completely dead in that area?  I thought it was cut back to the city limits a few years ago, creating INDOT's favorite thing, a random end on a SR. 

My parents live in Goshen.  I've not heard any talk of any changes to SR 15 once US 33 is finished.  That's a lot of road that I doubt the city of Goshen is willing to give up.  SR 4 does indeed end at the city limits instead of at Main St.

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.5891765,-85.8362849,3a,73.8y,185.06h,93.5t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sb0QimP98OUNz4yfZEHEqcg!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo3.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3Db0QimP98OUNz4yfZEHEqcg%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D6.443623%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656

i hope this is just coming down due to a detour 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 26, 2018, 04:13:47 PM
looks to be the case for now.  looking around on street view
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on February 26, 2018, 08:22:29 PM
Interesting article on the contractors on I-69 and its proposed law...

Article:
https://www.theindychannel.com/news/local-news/indianapolis/lawmakers-cite-i-69-delays-in-effort-to-change-how-state-contractors-are-selected
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 28, 2018, 08:12:23 AM
I called INDOT a few months ago about how US 35 isn't signed well, I just got a call back from them.  US 35 will have new signs added at the US 31 interchange and new guide signs added in the area too, so now it will be obvious that US 35 shoots east from US 31 there! 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 28, 2018, 02:51:38 PM
Also, there may be a new state road connecting the port of indiana with i-265. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on February 28, 2018, 03:21:09 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 28, 2018, 02:51:38 PM
Also, there may be a new state road connecting the port of indiana with i-265. 

Interesting.  I hadn't heard this.  Would it be making a state highway out of Port Rd or would it be a new road?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 28, 2018, 03:26:40 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on February 28, 2018, 03:21:09 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on February 28, 2018, 02:51:38 PM
Also, there may be a new state road connecting the port of indiana with i-265. 

Interesting.  I hadn't heard this.  Would it be making a state highway out of Port Rd or would it be a new road?

I should emphasize the MAY, INDOT is planning a "heavy hall truck corridor" to provide a connection for trucks from i-265 to the port of Indiana, it looks like it is going to happen, but it's still in the very early phases, they have a few alternatives being considered, and one is to simply upgrade port road.  I asked them via email if this means a new state road and this is what they told me:

It is too early to know for sure at this point. INDOT is working to receive federal approval for the route, which we do not have at this time, in which the public hearing and completing the environmental document are a significant part of the process. Until INDOT requests and subsequently receives federal approval for the heavy haul transportation corridor, it would not be appropriate to comment on the route numbering or signage.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 28, 2018, 03:27:45 PM
here is the website: http://www.in.gov/indot/3689.htm

there is a public meeting soon for the project.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on February 28, 2018, 05:00:46 PM
IN 365 makes sense if they do designate it.  Hopefully a part of the project would be fixing the disastrous error of routing traffic from EB 265 to Port Rd though the grade-level roundabout at 10th St.  That thing is a mess.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 28, 2018, 06:03:17 PM
Work is starting to ramp up again as we get close to the end of winter.

One of the bigger trouble spots will be on Indiana 51 (Ripley Street) at the Burns Ditch bridge in Lake Station (for reference, that's immediately north of the Borman/Toll Road interchange.) Starting March 5, lane shifts and restrictions will be in place. Southbound traffic will be down to one lane, sharing one side of the bridge with northbound traffic, which will maintain two lanes. Old Hobart Road will be closed at the intersection with Indiana 51 for the duration of the project. No ramps nearby will be affected. However, it is strongly recommended to use Indiana 249 if you need a gas stop or access to the beaches (I-65 to US 12 is another option if you plan to go to Miller or West Beach). This project is slated for October completion.

Two sets of bridges on the Indiana Toll Road (I-80/90) will be (or already are) under construction. The first set will be the CSX bridge located just east of the Lake Station interchange, and the other set will be the pair over Indiana 149. The latter will require a complete closure of Indiana 149 for a few months. Because of the Indiana 51 work mentioned above, the official detour will require US 20, Indiana 49, and US 6.

I-65 widening work between US 30 and Indiana 2 is set to begin again. This time around, there will be work on the concrete section between US 231 and US 30 (barrels are in place this time around). The original plan to shift all lanes toward the inner shoulder to allow for placement of an extra lane and a new outer shoulder will still be implemented. However, I read somewhere that when that is done, traffic will be shifted onto the new pavement so that crews can complete any necessary repairs to the present lanes.

Further south at the Kankakee River bridge, a new traffic pattern will be in place this season. Northbound traffic will shift to share traffic with the newly re-decked southbound bridge as a new northbound deck will be built. All work is still on target to end before November 2018.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 05, 2018, 07:30:58 AM
thursday 3/22/18 there will be a public meeting on the 65 widening from SR 2 to US 30, at Crown Point High School, to update the public on the progress of the project.  It's from 5-7pm
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 06, 2018, 03:00:44 PM
Just saw a presentation on the 69/465 NE side interchange. They have selected a modified alternative c for design.  Check it out here: http://www.in.gov/indot/3654.htm

Basic thing they're doing is separating all local and interstate to interstate movements.

Expect them to start blowing stuff up in March of 2020. Can't wait to see this done, worst bottleneck in the city!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mgk920 on March 06, 2018, 05:35:46 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 06, 2018, 03:00:44 PM
Just saw a presentation on the 69/465 NE side interchange. They have selected a modified alternative c for design.  Check it out here: http://www.in.gov/indot/3654.htm

Basic thing they're doing is separating all local and interstate to interstate movements.

Expect them to start blowing stuff up in March of 2020. Can't wait to see this done, worst bottleneck in the city!

What is/are the modification(s) in alternative 'C' from what is shown in that linked site?

I do agree that alternative 'C' is the best option with there being little likelihood of any substantial upgrades being made in the Binfield corridor 'in' from I-465 within the planning period.

Mike
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 06, 2018, 10:30:12 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on March 06, 2018, 05:35:46 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 06, 2018, 03:00:44 PM
Just saw a presentation on the 69/465 NE side interchange. They have selected a modified alternative c for design.  Check it out here: http://www.in.gov/indot/3654.htm

Basic thing they're doing is separating all local and interstate to interstate movements.

Expect them to start blowing stuff up in March of 2020. Can't wait to see this done, worst bottleneck in the city!

What is/are the modification(s) in alternative 'C' from what is shown in that linked site?

I do agree that alternative 'C' is the best option with there being little likelihood of any substantial upgrades being made in the Binfield corridor 'in' from I-465 within the planning period.

Mike

Apologies, the Alternative C seen there is the unmodified version, the one i saw has the South 69 to Binford being moved way over to the left going west of the massive fly around 69 South uses to get to South 465.  After listening to their presentation, this interchange is insanely complicated, there are so many movements to consider.  They said that the key is to separate interstate to interstate movements from local movements (interstate to any of the surface streets nearby)  the signal is there for South Binford to slow people down for the left turn many use at 75th.  The other alternatives required 3 level bridge crossings.  The death loop replacement will be a flyunder ramp that is 2 lanes wide, and will have a 45 mph design speed (wish it were higher).  Death loop stays but will just go to 82nd, it will be reconstructed, but won't change in design speed radius, etc.  there will be 2 lanes going to Allisonville from east and westbound, with one being exclusive, and the other being a straight or exit lane (called a decision lane).  465 will be between 10-12 lanes wide, with 8 of them being though lanes.  Likely will see some 1 arrow per lane signs in the area.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 06, 2018, 10:40:23 PM
465 north to 69 north will be 3 lanes, 69 south to 465 south will be 3 lanes, not sure if the merge or die will go away.  Project is just about to hit stage 1 (20%) complete.  Allisonville Road bridge will not be touched. There will be a narrower center median shoulder in that area.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on March 09, 2018, 10:32:50 PM
If I interpreted the maps correctly, it seems that this reworking of the interchange will provide a bonus for I-69 traffic. Once 69 is completed from Bloomington to Indy and it's signed along 465, southbound I-69 will be the "through" movement throughout the interchange. All other movements (82nd St, I-465 West, and Binford Blvd.) will be right exits off the mainline, the ramp that continues on to merge with 465 south.

BTW, does anybody have a count on how many times this intersection has undergone major reconstructions since the original construction? I've been driving through the intersection on a semi-regular basis for about 50 years. Non living in the city, I'm not too familiar with the history, but my experience leads me to believe it's been reworked several times.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Beltway on March 09, 2018, 11:17:00 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on January 24, 2018, 10:44:33 PM
I was always under the impression that I-74 was planned to go through the city, with how the original cloverleaf interchanges at I-465 were laid out feeding directly into major surface streets 'in' from I-465 and how the downtown area has that neat-looking incomplete freeway rectangle.  Have I-74 connect into it from the east at the south I-65/70 split and from the west at the I-65 curve by 11th/California.
Mike

How about the unbuilt west leg of the inner loop freeway around the downtown, wasn't that originally planned as I-265?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on March 10, 2018, 10:21:59 AM
Quote from: theline on March 09, 2018, 10:32:50 PM
BTW, does anybody have a count on how many times this intersection has undergone major reconstructions since the original construction? I've been driving through the intersection on a semi-regular basis for about 50 years. Non living in the city, I'm not too familiar with the history, but my experience leads me to believe it's been reworked several times.

Going by aerial photography from the City of Indianapolis is appears that the interchange has not changed its configuration at all since first being constructed. There was a project about ten years ago that changed the lane configuration along I-69 just north of the I-465 interchange which allowed for slightly better merging going north and configured the southbound approach so that there were two lanes going onto WB 465 as well as SB 465. As others might mention the reconstruction of the interchange with the local-express set up was original proposed when they rebuilt I-465 from US 31 past Keystone and toward Allisonville but scrapped for budget reasons or whatever. So they are simply doing something they had promised to do ten years ago now. But other than the aforementioned lane changes along I-69 there has been little change to the interchange itself, this would be the first radical change in design ever.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: captkirk_4 on March 10, 2018, 02:01:24 PM
Drove US 231 from Crawfordsville to Lafayette on Thursday afternoon and it was completely over capacity for a two lane highway. Both directions were non-stop columns of cars, not a single gap ever occurred in which one could do a safe pass. I felt sorry for some car waiting in a rural driveway down in a creek bed where the winding road and rising terrain had no more that 200 feet visibility in either direction. They were waiting for how long for any gap in the traffic to make a desperate turn onto the road which may have 60mph traffic coming around the trees at any second. Lafayette has absolutely terrible road access to westbound I-74 for freight and passenger vehicles. Hoosier Heartland Highway is sort of a road to nowhere, it dumps you right in Lafayette with no easy access through the city on to a further southwest movement. It's almost easier to continue on US24 from Logansport all the way to I-57. Not a well thought out regional highway plan.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on March 10, 2018, 04:00:07 PM
Quote from: Beltway on March 09, 2018, 11:17:00 PM
How about the unbuilt west leg of the inner loop freeway around the downtown, wasn't that originally planned as I-265?

First I've heard about an I-265 for Indianapolis.

On a related note - I found this 1958 CBD plan (http://www.indy.gov/eGov/City/DMD/Planning/Documents/1962CPSR005-RegionalCenterCBD1958.pdf) online today, which has a map showing some of the downtown Indianapolis loop.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Beltway on March 10, 2018, 04:48:47 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on March 10, 2018, 04:00:07 PM
Quote from: Beltway on March 09, 2018, 11:17:00 PM
How about the unbuilt west leg of the inner loop freeway around the downtown, wasn't that originally planned as I-265?
First I've heard about an I-265 for Indianapolis.
On a related note - I found this 1958 CBD plan (http://www.indy.gov/eGov/City/DMD/Planning/Documents/1962CPSR005-RegionalCenterCBD1958.pdf) online today, which has a map showing some of the downtown Indianapolis loop.

That has maps showing a west leg of the inner loop.  Maybe it was I-270 or I-165, I don't recall exactly.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JREwing78 on March 10, 2018, 05:04:59 PM
Quote from: captkirk_4 on March 10, 2018, 02:01:24 PM
Drove US 231 from Crawfordsville to Lafayette on Thursday afternoon and it was completely over capacity for a two lane highway. Both directions were non-stop columns of cars, not a single gap ever occurred in which one could do a safe pass. I felt sorry for some car waiting in a rural driveway down in a creek bed where the winding road and rising terrain had no more that 200 feet visibility in either direction. They were waiting for how long for any gap in the traffic to make a desperate turn onto the road which may have 60mph traffic coming around the trees at any second. Lafayette has absolutely terrible road access to westbound I-74 for freight and passenger vehicles. Hoosier Heartland Highway is sort of a road to nowhere, it dumps you right in Lafayette with no easy access through the city on to a further southwest movement. It's almost easier to continue on US24 from Logansport all the way to I-57. Not a well thought out regional highway plan.

I agree. No thought whatsoever given to accommodating traffic not originating or ending their trips in Lafayette. 4-laning US-231 north of Crawfordsville looks simple enough, but it's the movement eastward around the south side of Lafayette to I-65 that's a slow slog. A 4-lane bypass from I-65 around Wyandotte westward to US-231 would solve that issue, and provide smoother access from the SE to the Purdue campus.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 10, 2018, 06:17:32 PM
lafayette has terrible east west roads to begin with.  it is indot's dream to have 231 be a divided highway through its entire length in indiana, at least up to 65.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on March 11, 2018, 01:48:23 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on March 10, 2018, 10:21:59 AM
Quote from: theline on March 09, 2018, 10:32:50 PM
BTW, does anybody have a count on how many times this intersection has undergone major reconstructions since the original construction? I've been driving through the intersection on a semi-regular basis for about 50 years. Non living in the city, I'm not too familiar with the history, but my experience leads me to believe it's been reworked several times.

Going by aerial photography from the City of Indianapolis is appears that the interchange has not changed its configuration at all since first being constructed. There was a project about ten years ago that changed the lane configuration along I-69 just north of the I-465 interchange which allowed for slightly better merging going north and configured the southbound approach so that there were two lanes going onto WB 465 as well as SB 465. As others might mention the reconstruction of the interchange with the local-express set up was original proposed when they rebuilt I-465 from US 31 past Keystone and toward Allisonville but scrapped for budget reasons or whatever. So they are simply doing something they had promised to do ten years ago now. But other than the aforementioned lane changes along I-69 there has been little change to the interchange itself, this would be the first radical change in design ever.

Thanks for checking that out. It's funny how the mind works. I could have sworn that the intersection had been reworked more than once. I suppose that I just had a vague idea that the roads had changed because of the overall buildup of that area over the years. There's been plenty of change in the surrounding buildings and roads over the last 50 years.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on March 18, 2018, 04:41:12 PM
Anyone have an idea what the construction on I-74 between the SR 32 and SR 39 exits is? Signs have gone up in both directions indicating lane restrictions starting April 2nd.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 22, 2018, 07:51:49 AM
there's nothing i hate more than an "armchair engineer" thinking they know exactly how things should be done.  The roadway was designed with standards 50 yrs ago, and they spent years researching the proper routing, and had reasons for the final route.  Their idea to remove the interstates and replace it with a boulevard with roundabouts, or just bury it.  I would support burying it, but that won't happen due to the high cost.  The boulevard idea is awful, it would be handed over to Indianapolis, who will proceed to do nothing to it for 50 years and it will turn into the other shitty roads they have in marion county, it would be a congested mess with tons of traffic lights. 

https://www.indystar.com/story/opinion/columnists/suzette-hackney/2018/03/22/hackney-its-time-rethink-downtown-indy-interstates/445221002/

The never ending rivalry between engineers and architects/urban planners continues...
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 23, 2018, 11:46:08 PM
As Silverback noted upthread, there was a public meeting regarding the progress of the I-65 Expansion Project in Northwest Indiana. Some liner notes, from the Post-Tribune:


A question for the group: I've noticed that newly widened sections of I-65 throughout the state have been designed with the standard metal guardrails in the grass instead of the concrete medians I'm more accustomed to. Which method is safer? I'm curious; it doesn't worry me in any form.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Crash_It on March 24, 2018, 02:47:41 PM
They need to do something about that deteriorated pavement on US20 through all of LaPorte county.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on March 24, 2018, 10:57:27 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on March 24, 2018, 02:47:41 PM
They need to do something about that deteriorated pavement on US20 through all of LaPorte county.

You ask, and INDOT delivers, at least in this case. According to the Next Level Indiana program, most of US 20 in LaPorte County is scheduled to get major attention this year. Map and table of projects: https://entapps.indot.in.gov/dotmaps/NextLevelMap/pdf/LaPorte%20County.pdf
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Crash_It on March 24, 2018, 11:24:29 PM
Quote from: theline on March 24, 2018, 10:57:27 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on March 24, 2018, 02:47:41 PM
They need to do something about that deteriorated pavement on US20 through all of LaPorte county.

You ask, and INDOT delivers, at least in this case. According to the Next Level Indiana program, most of US 20 in LaPorte County is scheduled to get major attention this year. Map and table of projects: https://entapps.indot.in.gov/dotmaps/NextLevelMap/pdf/LaPorte%20County.pdf

Unfortunately, it excludes the portion through Michigan City. At least they got the worst portion of it due for work. What do I care anyway? The reason I would drive there is no longer in my life in that manner which is quite unfortunate but at least she will have some fresh pavement to drive on whenever she returns there. It was grueling driving through there when we were together last fall though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JREwing78 on March 25, 2018, 12:19:11 AM
Quote from: theline on March 24, 2018, 10:57:27 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on March 24, 2018, 02:47:41 PM
They need to do something about that deteriorated pavement on US20 through all of LaPorte county.

You ask, and INDOT delivers, at least in this case. According to the Next Level Indiana program, most of US 20 in LaPorte County is scheduled to get major attention this year. Map and table of projects: https://entapps.indot.in.gov/dotmaps/NextLevelMap/pdf/LaPorte%20County.pdf

I kinda wish they had done that before the work on I-94 last year. I spent an awful lot of time avoiding I-94, and most of those alternates were not in good shape.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on March 25, 2018, 11:38:05 PM
Quote from: JREwing78 on March 25, 2018, 12:19:11 AM
Quote from: theline on March 24, 2018, 10:57:27 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on March 24, 2018, 02:47:41 PM
They need to do something about that deteriorated pavement on US20 through all of LaPorte county.

You ask, and INDOT delivers, at least in this case. According to the Next Level Indiana program, most of US 20 in LaPorte County is scheduled to get major attention this year. Map and table of projects: https://entapps.indot.in.gov/dotmaps/NextLevelMap/pdf/LaPorte%20County.pdf

I kinda wish they had done that before the work on I-94 last year. I spent an awful lot of time avoiding I-94, and most of those alternates were not in good shape.

Me too. With work underway on both I-94 and the ITR, I spent a lot of time on US 20, dodging potholes and hoping my fillings would stay in my mouth. At least traffic kept moving on 20, unlike on the freeways. I'm glad it's going to get some attention.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 11, 2018, 03:49:22 PM
horrible sign choice by terre haute for the to us 40 sign, sign maker must have been drunk: https://www.google.com/maps/@39.4675163,-87.4046008,3a,16.4y,20.8h,89.19t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sKgksfszZqxKTlRpgarJimw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on April 12, 2018, 09:09:32 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 11, 2018, 03:49:22 PM
horrible sign choice by terre haute for the to us 40 sign, sign maker must have been drunk: https://www.google.com/maps/@39.4675163,-87.4046008,3a,16.4y,20.8h,89.19t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sKgksfszZqxKTlRpgarJimw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Could have been worse--the arrow could have been pointing the opposite direction as the one way sign.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on April 12, 2018, 10:10:45 AM
That's a not-so-scenic Bayhway.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 12, 2018, 10:44:32 AM
Indiana REALLY needs business routes
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on April 13, 2018, 02:53:15 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 12, 2018, 10:44:32 AM
Indiana REALLY needs business routes

AMEN! When INDOT decides to put a micro gap into a route, they should give the city money to sign it as a city route. Also, it would be super nice if cities would sign bypassed sections of routes as business routes because that would aid a lot in navigation imho.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on April 14, 2018, 12:56:12 PM
Quote from: billtm on April 13, 2018, 02:53:15 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 12, 2018, 10:44:32 AM
Indiana REALLY needs business routes

AMEN! When INDOT decides to put a micro gap into a route, they should give the city money to sign it as a city route. Also, it would be super nice if cities would sign bypassed sections of routes as business routes because that would aid a lot in navigation imho.
I would totally agree.  I've considered sending a proposal to  my state rep that the state should consider authorizing county highway routes that can utilize the old route number (perhaps in a blue sign like some states, or the round versions of WV county roads), and are subject to restrictions that the counties place on roads.  In my area, a county/city accepted return of a state highway to local control, since they could restrict truck traffic from city limits, and they could not with it being a state highway.  I would also mandate that the state would pay for the signs for the roadway (it's the least they could do, since municipalities like Indianapolis can't afford potholes the way it is).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 17, 2018, 08:44:28 AM
random piece of info I have just learned:  INDOT is no longer going to place RPMs (those reflectors you see in the pavement)  on bridges. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on April 17, 2018, 08:49:53 AM
Quote from: Life in Paradise on April 14, 2018, 12:56:12 PM
Quote from: billtm on April 13, 2018, 02:53:15 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 12, 2018, 10:44:32 AM
Indiana REALLY needs business routes

AMEN! When INDOT decides to put a micro gap into a route, they should give the city money to sign it as a city route. Also, it would be super nice if cities would sign bypassed sections of routes as business routes because that would aid a lot in navigation imho.
I would totally agree.  I've considered sending a proposal to  my state rep that the state should consider authorizing county highway routes that can utilize the old route number (perhaps in a blue sign like some states, or the round versions of WV county roads), and are subject to restrictions that the counties place on roads.  In my area, a county/city accepted return of a state highway to local control, since they could restrict truck traffic from city limits, and they could not with it being a state highway.  I would also mandate that the state would pay for the signs for the roadway (it's the least they could do, since municipalities like Indianapolis can't afford potholes the way it is).

The only problem I see with signing the decommissioned state routes as county routes is that most of them are in cities, and I can see confusion where motorists call county governments instead of city governments to complain about the road conditions due to the county road shield.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on April 17, 2018, 04:52:41 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on April 17, 2018, 08:49:53 AM
Quote from: Life in Paradise on April 14, 2018, 12:56:12 PM
Quote from: billtm on April 13, 2018, 02:53:15 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 12, 2018, 10:44:32 AM
Indiana REALLY needs business routes

AMEN! When INDOT decides to put a micro gap into a route, they should give the city money to sign it as a city route. Also, it would be super nice if cities would sign bypassed sections of routes as business routes because that would aid a lot in navigation imho.
I would totally agree.  I've considered sending a proposal to  my state rep that the state should consider authorizing county highway routes that can utilize the old route number (perhaps in a blue sign like some states, or the round versions of WV county roads), and are subject to restrictions that the counties place on roads.  In my area, a county/city accepted return of a state highway to local control, since they could restrict truck traffic from city limits, and they could not with it being a state highway.  I would also mandate that the state would pay for the signs for the roadway (it's the least they could do, since municipalities like Indianapolis can't afford potholes the way it is).

The only problem I see with signing the decommissioned state routes as county routes is that most of them are in cities, and I can see confusion where motorists call county governments instead of city governments to complain about the road conditions due to the county road shield.
My idea would include the word "County Road" or "County Highway".  The idea of using the decommissioned routes is because there are several cities where INDOT has removed the road from the city limits, and then picks it up on the other side of the city.  If you are a traveler, you suddenly are not sure where you are going.  This would make is somewhat easier.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mvak36 on April 20, 2018, 10:56:21 PM
It looks like they started the widening on the Columbus to Seymour segment of I-65 last week: http://www.wdrb.com/story/37950941/indiana-officials-break-ground-on-143-million-expansion-of-i-65

Looks like it was funded by the 10 cent gas tax increase last year. https://www.theindychannel.com/news/local-news/indianapolis/construction-season-is-officially-underway-in-indiana
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on April 21, 2018, 12:36:49 AM
Quote from: mvak36 on April 20, 2018, 10:56:21 PM
It looks like they started the widening on the Columbus to Seymour segment of I-65 last week: http://www.wdrb.com/story/37950941/indiana-officials-break-ground-on-143-million-expansion-of-i-65

Looks like it was funded by the 10 cent gas tax increase last year. https://www.theindychannel.com/news/local-news/indianapolis/construction-season-is-officially-underway-in-indiana

So what parts of I-65 will still be two lanes after this and all current projects are complete?  I know northern Indiana better than southern so please correct me if I'm wrong on this list.

Radially out from Indy:


I wonder which segment (or part of a segment) will be done next?  Many bridges between IN 25 and IN 2 are already wide enough for 3 lanes and the Kankakee River bridge is being expanded so I'm sure parts of that will be done in the not so distant future.  Although, to me, it makes sense to continue from IN-44 down to IN 58.  Much shorter segment and pretty heavily traveled.  What do you guys think?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on April 21, 2018, 08:35:17 AM
I would think that the SR 44 to SR 58 stretch should be next, I kind of wonder why it wasn't first. Columbus (and the furthest southern exit at that) to Seymour just doesn't rank too high immediately to be widened. I'm guessing this may be because the other stretches of highway in Southern Indiana had been recently repaved and INDOT didn't want to screw that up.

As for next, I think US 52 to SR 38 would be logical to connect the two six lane segments of the highway. Out of curiosity, is the stretch of I-65 around Lafayette now complete?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mvak36 on April 21, 2018, 09:12:15 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on April 21, 2018, 12:36:49 AM
Quote from: mvak36 on April 20, 2018, 10:56:21 PM
It looks like they started the widening on the Columbus to Seymour segment of I-65 last week: http://www.wdrb.com/story/37950941/indiana-officials-break-ground-on-143-million-expansion-of-i-65

Looks like it was funded by the 10 cent gas tax increase last year. https://www.theindychannel.com/news/local-news/indianapolis/construction-season-is-officially-underway-in-indiana

So what parts of I-65 will still be two lanes after this and all current projects are complete?  I know northern Indiana better than southern so please correct me if I'm wrong on this list.

Radially out from Indy:


  • US 52 - IN 38 - 27 Mi
  • IN 25 - IN 2 - 65 Mi
  • IN 44 - IN 58 - 26 Mi
  • US 50 - Blue Lick Rd? - 34 Mi

I wonder which segment (or part of a segment) will be done next?  Many bridges between IN 25 and IN 2 are already wide enough for 3 lanes and the Kankakee River bridge is being expanded so I'm sure parts of that will be done in the not so distant future.  Although, to me, it makes sense to continue from IN-44 down to IN 58.  Much shorter segment and pretty heavily traveled.  What do you guys think?

I think you are right with the list above. As far as what section is next, I have no idea. I suppose if this tolling idea passes, they will do all of the remaining sections in quick succession.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on April 21, 2018, 12:13:38 PM
Quote from: mvak36 on April 21, 2018, 09:12:15 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on April 21, 2018, 12:36:49 AM
Quote from: mvak36 on April 20, 2018, 10:56:21 PM
It looks like they started the widening on the Columbus to Seymour segment of I-65 last week: http://www.wdrb.com/story/37950941/indiana-officials-break-ground-on-143-million-expansion-of-i-65

Looks like it was funded by the 10 cent gas tax increase last year. https://www.theindychannel.com/news/local-news/indianapolis/construction-season-is-officially-underway-in-indiana

So what parts of I-65 will still be two lanes after this and all current projects are complete?  I know northern Indiana better than southern so please correct me if I'm wrong on this list.

Radially out from Indy:


  • US 52 - IN 38 - 27 Mi
  • IN 25 - IN 2 - 65 Mi
  • IN 44 - IN 58 - 26 Mi
  • US 50 - Blue Lick Rd? - 34 Mi

I wonder which segment (or part of a segment) will be done next?  Many bridges between IN 25 and IN 2 are already wide enough for 3 lanes and the Kankakee River bridge is being expanded so I'm sure parts of that will be done in the not so distant future.  Although, to me, it makes sense to continue from IN-44 down to IN 58.  Much shorter segment and pretty heavily traveled.  What do you guys think?

I think you are right with the list above. As far as what section is next, I have no idea. I suppose if this tolling idea passes, they will do all of the remaining sections in quick succession.

And I also know that some bridges along I-65 are planned to be expanded and the decks replaced in the future (over Indiana SR 43 and the Wabash River for example)... some of the bridges along that stretch will be replaced with new, wider bridges (hopefully)...

Also, I noticed that INDOT are expanding their ITS along I-65 in Boone, Clinton, Jasper, Tippecanoe, and White counties...  :clap: :clap: :clap:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on April 21, 2018, 08:26:26 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on April 21, 2018, 12:13:38 PM
Also, I noticed that INDOT are expanding their ITS along I-65 in Boone, Clinton, Jasper, Tippecanoe, and White counties...  :clap: :clap: :clap:

May I ask how they are expanding their ITS, signs? cameras? I remember years ago I saw a map from the state that did show expanded ITS coverage along I-65, I-70 and I-69 across the state but thought that the state decided not to do so.

Also, what is the condition of I-65 in the Lafayette area? Is that project finished?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 21, 2018, 10:29:04 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on April 21, 2018, 12:36:49 AM
Quote from: mvak36 on April 20, 2018, 10:56:21 PM
It looks like they started the widening on the Columbus to Seymour segment of I-65 last week: http://www.wdrb.com/story/37950941/indiana-officials-break-ground-on-143-million-expansion-of-i-65

Looks like it was funded by the 10 cent gas tax increase last year. https://www.theindychannel.com/news/local-news/indianapolis/construction-season-is-officially-underway-in-indiana

So what parts of I-65 will still be two lanes after this and all current projects are complete?  I know northern Indiana better than southern so please correct me if I'm wrong on this list.

Radially out from Indy:


  • US 52 - IN 38 - 27 Mi
  • IN 25 - IN 2 - 65 Mi
  • IN 44 - IN 58 - 26 Mi
  • US 50 - Blue Lick Rd? - 34 Mi

I wonder which segment (or part of a segment) will be done next?  Many bridges between IN 25 and IN 2 are already wide enough for 3 lanes and the Kankakee River bridge is being expanded so I'm sure parts of that will be done in the not so distant future.  Although, to me, it makes sense to continue from IN-44 down to IN 58.  Much shorter segment and pretty heavily traveled.  What do you guys think?

you're missing 465 to 865 this portion boarders eagle creek park, so i would assume the widening would be in the median.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on April 21, 2018, 10:52:25 PM
I don't think I-65 near Lafayette is done, I haven't been out there for several weeks but as far I know it's still ongoing.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 22, 2018, 10:47:40 AM
Quote from: csw on April 21, 2018, 10:52:25 PM
I don't think I-65 near Lafayette is done, I haven't been out there for several weeks but as far I know it's still ongoing.

When we went to Florida a few weeks ago, it looked like a lot of the heavy machinery was gone from the area. The lanes were driveable, but it looked like there was a considerable amount of cosmetic work left to go (guard rails, rumble strips, etc.), preventing the third lane from being open in each direction.

As for which section of I-65 gets widened next, I'm thinking the stretch from Indiana 2 to Indiana 14 gets it next. The biggest reason is that, with the exception of a couple bridges just south of Indiana 2, all the bridges between the aforementioned stretch (including the Kankakee River bridge by this year's end) will already be built to accommodate a third lane, making future work there a relative breeze (and possibly a one-cycle venture). I'd think they would terminate that section south of Indiana 14, where the road noise zone ends.

Speaking of the work currently in progress on I-65 here in my region, some observations and questions...

The future outer shoulder in both directions have been carved out at least between US 30 and 109th Avenue (based on camera shots). Have they gone further south of there?

I noticed at the Indiana 2 camera that work to build the new inside lanes haven't yet started, but I did notice what appeared to be a new gantry for an overhead sign...possibly a lane ends warning?

Back to the road noise area (that stretch around Indiana 14 that used to be all concrete)...was there any specific reason that the concrete was replaced with that unique surface? I figured concrete patching would've been considerably easier.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on April 22, 2018, 02:08:00 PM
Quote from: csw on April 21, 2018, 10:52:25 PM
I don't think I-65 near Lafayette is done, I haven't been out there for several weeks but as far I know it's still ongoing.

The last time I drove down I-65 to Indy and back was last Tuesday (April 10), and at that point in time the third lanes weren't open to traffic yet, though they looked to be mostly complete.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 22, 2018, 10:48:26 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 22, 2018, 10:47:40 AM
Quote from: csw on April 21, 2018, 10:52:25 PM
I don't think I-65 near Lafayette is done, I haven't been out there for several weeks but as far I know it's still ongoing.

When we went to Florida a few weeks ago, it looked like a lot of the heavy machinery was gone from the area. The lanes were driveable, but it looked like there was a considerable amount of cosmetic work left to go (guard rails, rumble strips, etc.), preventing the third lane from being open in each direction.

As for which section of I-65 gets widened next, I'm thinking the stretch from Indiana 2 to Indiana 14 gets it next. The biggest reason is that, with the exception of a couple bridges just south of Indiana 2, all the bridges between the aforementioned stretch (including the Kankakee River bridge by this year's end) will already be built to accommodate a third lane, making future work there a relative breeze (and possibly a one-cycle venture). I'd think they would terminate that section south of Indiana 14, where the road noise zone ends.

Speaking of the work currently in progress on I-65 here in my region, some observations and questions...

The future outer shoulder in both directions have been carved out at least between US 30 and 109th Avenue (based on camera shots). Have they gone further south of there?

I noticed at the Indiana 2 camera that work to build the new inside lanes haven't yet started, but I did notice what appeared to be a new gantry for an overhead sign...possibly a lane ends warning?

Back to the road noise area (that stretch around Indiana 14 that used to be all concrete)...was there any specific reason that the concrete was replaced with that unique surface? I figured concrete patching would've been considerably easier.

not sure what surface you're talking about, but INDOT has been trying this special surface on a lot of bridges around the state, it could be that.  It is a special type of asphalt with a much lower freezing point than normal asphalt.  one bridge I know for sure it's on is 465 on the east side, just north of the 70 interchange.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: dvferyance on April 27, 2018, 03:34:20 PM
Yesterday coming home from Cincinnati I decided to make a a slight detour to Greenwood to check out the fairly new Worthsville Rd DDI interchange. Just west of the interchange a school zone which is strictly patrolled. Indaina's laws on school zones are far stricter than in my state and it wasn't aware of it. I was pulled of and thankfully was let off with a warning but it was still no fun being pulled over 300 miles away from home. I just thought I would mention this to anyone thinking about checking this out sometime. I did some research and it turns out the school zone law in Indiana applies to 7-4 on every school day regardless of whether children are present or not. I was there around 3:30 PM. I don't get why they did not install some sort of warning lights to make it clear to drivers being so close to a freeway interchange.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on April 27, 2018, 10:38:36 PM
It actually depends on the school district.  In Carmel, it's 7-7 but only when school is in session (ie: not in the summer).  In some places in Marion county, they've installed school zone speed limit sirens with flashing lights and you're only required to observe that speed limit when the lights are flashing.  The lights appear to be controlled / scheduled by the individual schools because I've noticed that some flash at different times than others.  I pass 3 different schools on the way to work: 1 public, one private, and the school for the blind.  They're all on different schedules.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on April 27, 2018, 10:53:59 PM
INDOT says I 65 Lafayette project opens to three lanes each way on Monday.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on April 28, 2018, 02:41:09 PM
Quote from: monty on April 27, 2018, 10:53:59 PM
INDOT says I 65 Lafayette project opens to three lanes each way on Monday.
Cool, thanks for the update! Just in time for the hot weather (one extreme to the other, that's Indiana for ya). I'm also sure drivers from up north heading here next month for the 500 will appreciate the added lanes around Lafayette.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on April 28, 2018, 02:41:44 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on April 28, 2018, 02:41:09 PM
Quote from: monty on April 27, 2018, 10:53:59 PM
INDOT says I 65 Lafayette project opens to three lanes each way on Monday.
Cool, thanks for the update! Just in time for the hot weather (one extreme to the other, that's Indiana for ya). I'm also sure drivers from up north heading here next month for the 500 will appreciate the added lanes around Lafayette.

Yes we will.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 03, 2018, 12:47:36 PM
https://www.indystar.com/story/news/2018/05/03/indot-looks-7-different-ways-rethink-downtown-indys-highways/573356002/

god i hope the removal advocates lose this one.  it's shocking that such a small amount of traffic is through traffic
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 03, 2018, 02:10:49 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 03, 2018, 12:47:36 PM
https://www.indystar.com/story/news/2018/05/03/indot-looks-7-different-ways-rethink-downtown-indys-highways/573356002/

god i hope the removal advocates lose this one.  it's shocking that such a small amount of traffic is through traffic

Not entirely sure how they are defining through traffic.
Traffic going all the way through on 65 or 70 is only minorly inconvenienced if they have to go around on 465.
The bigger problem is traffic originating within the 465 beltway that is going to or beyond the other side of town.  If you need to go from UIndy to Butler or something like that you are royally screwed if the duplex part of 65/70 goes away.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 03, 2018, 02:50:06 PM
it will get worse if they remove it, the surface streets can't handle the extra traffic, the major north south streets are going to get a road diet to make way for the red line bus no one is going to use. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on May 03, 2018, 05:11:14 PM
Might be of interest:  https://northsplit.com/system-level-analysis/ (https://northsplit.com/system-level-analysis/)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on May 03, 2018, 06:12:31 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 03, 2018, 12:47:36 PM
https://www.indystar.com/story/news/2018/05/03/indot-looks-7-different-ways-rethink-downtown-indys-highways/573356002/

god i hope the removal advocates lose this one.  it's shocking that such a small amount of traffic is through traffic
I read that article earlier today over lunch and was amazed that as of 12:30 PM the underground option in the poll was leading. That's all Indianapolis needs, a Big Dig-style debacle. I would have guessed that the amount of through traffic was low, but I didn't think it was that low.

Thanks, Revive, for posting that link. The myth vs. fact document is very informative, among other information at the site.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 03, 2018, 06:57:01 PM
I'm looking at this from a regional perspective, these highways are needed for the region as a whole, the mass transit planned doesn't go to any of the suburbs.  I like all the ideas except the blvd only option.  The new west leg idea is actually pretty cool, I actually like that one.  I just feel like any tunnel idea is a nonstarter, it's going to cost to much, and i just don't see them paying for it.  I wish they'd bury them and add the fabled 69 connection in the process.  I feel like this story is being reported as if the only people involved are downtown, this is a regional problem.  I also don't trust Indianapolis in taking care of the maintenance of the blvds.  They can't even be trusted in taking care of the roads they already have!  The myth/fact document was very helpful, the media has been very fallacious in their reporting of this story.  It really pissed me off with that fake news plans that they peddled, claiming that was the final design!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on May 03, 2018, 08:59:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 03, 2018, 12:47:36 PM
https://www.indystar.com/story/news/2018/05/03/indot-looks-7-different-ways-rethink-downtown-indys-highways/573356002/

god i hope the removal advocates lose this one.  it's shocking that such a small amount of traffic is through traffic

It's really not shocking at all--I-465 was created to accommodate all of the through traffic, and the urban freeways were left so the city can be accessed from the outside.  That's just how traffic works in urban areas with beltways around them.  I say this as someone who comes from the Chicago area and uses I-465 anytime I wish to access any points to the south and east.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on May 04, 2018, 01:47:44 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on May 03, 2018, 05:11:14 PM
Might be of interest:  https://northsplit.com/system-level-analysis/ (https://northsplit.com/system-level-analysis/)

Personally, I feel like the best option is concept 2 when cost is factored in. Except I wouldn't do the tolling part of it because I feel that would be ineffective for a city like Indy, and instead of BRT I would do light rail (because I feel people are more likely to ride trains than buses). I like concept 2 the best because in my experience with driving in downtown Indy, traffic hasn't been a major issue, so I don't feel like the Interstates need extra lanes. Though, to be fair, I don't have too much experience driving in downtown Indy (I only do it about 4 times per year).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 04, 2018, 01:52:56 PM
Quote from: billtm on May 04, 2018, 01:47:44 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on May 03, 2018, 05:11:14 PM
Might be of interest:  https://northsplit.com/system-level-analysis/ (https://northsplit.com/system-level-analysis/)

Personally, I feel like the best option is concept 2 when cost is factored in. Except I wouldn't do the tolling part of it because I feel that would be ineffective for a city like Indy, and instead of BRT I would do light rail (because I feel people are more likely to ride trains than buses). I like concept 2 the best because in my experience with driving in downtown Indy, traffic hasn't been a major issue, so I don't feel like the Interstates need extra lanes. Though, to be fair, I don't have too much experience driving in downtown Indy (I only do it about 4 times per year).

light rail is illegal to build in indianapolis, due to the state legislature, also, there is no mass transit in the suburbs, and the transit that we do have doesn't even serve Marion county fully.  70 coming in surprises me, it's the busiest stretch of interstate in the city, and probably in the state, I'm sure the borman is higher though. Also traffic is pretty good on the surface streets because of the interstates.  also, they aren't widening it per se, it's just removing the exits from the left to be from the right, aux lanes will be added.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on May 04, 2018, 06:23:04 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 04, 2018, 01:52:56 PM
Quote from: billtm on May 04, 2018, 01:47:44 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on May 03, 2018, 05:11:14 PM
Might be of interest:  https://northsplit.com/system-level-analysis/ (https://northsplit.com/system-level-analysis/)

Personally, I feel like the best option is concept 2 when cost is factored in. Except I wouldn't do the tolling part of it because I feel that would be ineffective for a city like Indy, and instead of BRT I would do light rail (because I feel people are more likely to ride trains than buses). I like concept 2 the best because in my experience with driving in downtown Indy, traffic hasn't been a major issue, so I don't feel like the Interstates need extra lanes. Though, to be fair, I don't have too much experience driving in downtown Indy (I only do it about 4 times per year).

light rail is illegal to build in indianapolis, due to the state legislature, also, there is no mass transit in the suburbs, and the transit that we do have doesn't even serve Marion county fully.  70 coming in surprises me, it's the busiest stretch of interstate in the city, and probably in the state, I'm sure the borman is higher though. Also traffic is pretty good on the surface streets because of the interstates.  also, they aren't widening it per se, it's just removing the exits from the left to be from the right, aux lanes will be added.

Yeah I think that reconfiguring the interchanges is much needed, but all of the other concepts have things that I either don't support or don't think are needed. Looking at the diagrams for the Upgrading Existing Interstates concept, they want to add 1 travel lane in each direction to I-65 between the north split and the West St. interchange and they want to add 2 travel lanes in each direction to the I-65/I-70 overlap, but I don't think that those extra lanes are necessary. Boulevards would create an unreasonable amount of added congestion, tunnels would be unreasonably expensive, and the new interstate link also seems like it would cost way too much.

Why in the world would the state legislature ban light rail? That just makes so little sense to me. :banghead:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 04, 2018, 06:31:54 PM
Quote from: billtm on May 04, 2018, 06:23:04 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 04, 2018, 01:52:56 PM
Quote from: billtm on May 04, 2018, 01:47:44 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on May 03, 2018, 05:11:14 PM
Might be of interest:  https://northsplit.com/system-level-analysis/ (https://northsplit.com/system-level-analysis/)

Personally, I feel like the best option is concept 2 when cost is factored in. Except I wouldn't do the tolling part of it because I feel that would be ineffective for a city like Indy, and instead of BRT I would do light rail (because I feel people are more likely to ride trains than buses). I like concept 2 the best because in my experience with driving in downtown Indy, traffic hasn't been a major issue, so I don't feel like the Interstates need extra lanes. Though, to be fair, I don't have too much experience driving in downtown Indy (I only do it about 4 times per year).

light rail is illegal to build in indianapolis, due to the state legislature, also, there is no mass transit in the suburbs, and the transit that we do have doesn't even serve Marion county fully.  70 coming in surprises me, it's the busiest stretch of interstate in the city, and probably in the state, I'm sure the borman is higher though. Also traffic is pretty good on the surface streets because of the interstates.  also, they aren't widening it per se, it's just removing the exits from the left to be from the right, aux lanes will be added.

Yeah I think that reconfiguring the interchanges is much needed, but all of the other concepts have things that I either don't support or don't think are needed. Looking at the diagrams for the Upgrading Existing Interstates concept, they want to add 1 travel lane in each direction to I-65 between the north split and the West St. interchange and they want to add 2 travel lanes in each direction to the I-65/I-70 overlap, but I don't think that those extra lanes are necessary. Boulevards would create an unreasonable amount of added congestion, tunnels would be unreasonably expensive, and the new interstate link also seems like it would cost way too much.

Why in the world would the state legislature ban light rail? That just makes so little sense to me. :banghead:

i can't remember the reason, but it wasn't a good one.  the red line is going to fuck up traffic anyway, every road it goes on will lose 2 lanes of traffic to buses!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on May 05, 2018, 01:21:00 PM
The junction of US41 and IN-114 at Morocco now has this Michigan left garbage.  This photo was taken facing west.  I guess the village of Morocco didn't want people continuing west on IN-114 and getting lost in their town.

(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/870/40940828555_2f1c9e98bd_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/25nNrYp)
IN-US41-114W (https://flic.kr/p/25nNrYp) by Paul Drives (https://www.flickr.com/photos/138603251@N02/), on Flickr
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Aaron Camp on May 05, 2018, 07:03:19 PM
Quote from: captkirk_4 on March 10, 2018, 02:01:24 PM
Drove US 231 from Crawfordsville to Lafayette on Thursday afternoon and it was completely over capacity for a two lane highway. Both directions were non-stop columns of cars, not a single gap ever occurred in which one could do a safe pass. I felt sorry for some car waiting in a rural driveway down in a creek bed where the winding road and rising terrain had no more that 200 feet visibility in either direction. They were waiting for how long for any gap in the traffic to make a desperate turn onto the road which may have 60mph traffic coming around the trees at any second. Lafayette has absolutely terrible road access to westbound I-74 for freight and passenger vehicles. Hoosier Heartland Highway is sort of a road to nowhere, it dumps you right in Lafayette with no easy access through the city on to a further southwest movement. It's almost easier to continue on US24 from Logansport all the way to I-57. Not a well thought out regional highway plan.

If my parents had to drive me to Lafayette for any reason (I live in Westville, Illinois), they'd probably take US-150/IL-1 to US-136 to IN-63 to IN-263 to IN-28 to IN-25. That might be a less congested route than I-74 to US-231 would be, even if it's a convoluted one.

A Danville, Illinois to Lafayette, Indiana freeway or expressway connection would be fantastic (especially if it could be linked to the IN-25 portion of the Hoosier Heartland corridor), but I don't think there's ever been anything resembling a serious proposal by IDOT and INDOT to build such a freeway.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on May 05, 2018, 08:37:37 PM
Quote from: Aaron Camp on May 05, 2018, 07:03:19 PM
Quote from: captkirk_4 on March 10, 2018, 02:01:24 PM
Drove US 231 from Crawfordsville to Lafayette on Thursday afternoon and it was completely over capacity for a two lane highway. Both directions were non-stop columns of cars, not a single gap ever occurred in which one could do a safe pass. I felt sorry for some car waiting in a rural driveway down in a creek bed where the winding road and rising terrain had no more that 200 feet visibility in either direction. They were waiting for how long for any gap in the traffic to make a desperate turn onto the road which may have 60mph traffic coming around the trees at any second. Lafayette has absolutely terrible road access to westbound I-74 for freight and passenger vehicles. Hoosier Heartland Highway is sort of a road to nowhere, it dumps you right in Lafayette with no easy access through the city on to a further southwest movement. It's almost easier to continue on US24 from Logansport all the way to I-57. Not a well thought out regional highway plan.

If my parents had to drive me to Lafayette for any reason (I live in Westville, Illinois), they'd probably take US-150/IL-1 to US-136 to IN-63 to IN-263 to IN-28 to IN-25. That might be a less congested route than I-74 to US-231 would be, even if it's a convoluted one.

A Danville, Illinois to Lafayette, Indiana freeway or expressway connection would be fantastic (especially if it could be linked to the IN-25 portion of the Hoosier Heartland corridor), but I don't think there's ever been anything resembling a serious proposal by IDOT and INDOT to build such a freeway.

That would be nice, but I think it would be nice for such a small amount of people that we are at least 20 years out from a southwest extension of the Hoosier Heartland around the south side of Lafayette to Danville becoming a reality. (Though I imagine the highway terminating at I-74 well before Danville. I would put its terminus somewhere between the interchange with US-41, and where SR-341 crosses I-74)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on May 05, 2018, 10:43:26 PM
^ More likely INDOT will just widen US 231 down to I-74, since they have already been studying that corridor. 

General study webpage (https://www.in.gov/indot/div/projects/us231/)

Notes for section from I-74 to Tippecanoe CR 550 S (https://www.in.gov/indot/div/projects/us231/pubs/utility_10.pdf) 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 05, 2018, 10:44:45 PM
indot really wants it to be a divided highway from 65 down to 64 in the far future.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 06, 2018, 10:15:08 AM
they're about to start blowing up SR 37, here is the site for the plans: http://in-stateroad37portal.civicplus.com/156/Project-Plans
it's surprising, they actually posted the complete plan set for each interchange.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on May 06, 2018, 02:03:08 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 06, 2018, 10:15:08 AM
they're about to start blowing up SR 37, here is the site for the plans: http://in-stateroad37portal.civicplus.com/156/Project-Plans
it's surprising, they actually posted the complete plan set for each interchange.
They should "blow up" these plans instead! Allowing zero room for future added lanes on 37 will be penny-wise & pound foolish, just so Fishers can have a mess like Keystone "Parkway" (I refuse to recognize Carmel's renaming of Keystone AVENUE). Then again, expecting sanity from Fishers is asking too much (I have to deal with the ridiculous Michigan Left at 96th & Allisonville all the time).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on May 06, 2018, 09:17:07 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on May 06, 2018, 02:03:08 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 06, 2018, 10:15:08 AM
they're about to start blowing up SR 37, here is the site for the plans: http://in-stateroad37portal.civicplus.com/156/Project-Plans
it's surprising, they actually posted the complete plan set for each interchange.
They should "blow up" these plans instead! Allowing zero room for future added lanes on 37 will be penny-wise & pound foolish, just so Fishers can have a mess like Keystone "Parkway" (I refuse to recognize Carmel's renaming of Keystone AVENUE). Then again, expecting sanity from Fishers is asking too much (I have to deal with the ridiculous Michigan Left at 96th & Allisonville all the time).
I feel like upgrading SR-37 to a grade-separated expressway is miles better than adding extra lanes. Also, how exactly is the Keystone Parkway a mess? When I drove on it, it was really smooth (except for the stoplight at 96th which thankfully they are getting rid of).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 07, 2018, 07:45:02 AM
Quote from: billtm on May 06, 2018, 09:17:07 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on May 06, 2018, 02:03:08 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 06, 2018, 10:15:08 AM
they're about to start blowing up SR 37, here is the site for the plans: http://in-stateroad37portal.civicplus.com/156/Project-Plans
it's surprising, they actually posted the complete plan set for each interchange.
They should "blow up" these plans instead! Allowing zero room for future added lanes on 37 will be penny-wise & pound foolish, just so Fishers can have a mess like Keystone "Parkway" (I refuse to recognize Carmel's renaming of Keystone AVENUE). Then again, expecting sanity from Fishers is asking too much (I have to deal with the ridiculous Michigan Left at 96th & Allisonville all the time).
I feel like upgrading SR-37 to a grade-separated expressway is miles better than adding extra lanes. Also, how exactly is the Keystone Parkway a mess? When I drove on it, it was really smooth (except for the stoplight at 96th which thankfully they are getting rid of).

It has REALLY shitty merging areas, causes issues at times, also no one knows that the right lane is an exit only on NB once you get to 106th st, traffic grinds to a halt there due to this.  I still think it works though.  The project to remove the light at 96th allegedly begins this yr, they haven't started though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sparker on May 07, 2018, 06:26:11 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on May 05, 2018, 10:43:26 PM
^ More likely INDOT will just widen US 231 down to I-74, since they have already been studying that corridor. 

General study webpage (https://www.in.gov/indot/div/projects/us231/)

Notes for section from I-74 to Tippecanoe CR 550 S (https://www.in.gov/indot/div/projects/us231/pubs/utility_10.pdf) 

This is a project probably intended to kill two birds with one stone -- provide an expressway connection that can function as a connection between Lafayette and the IN 25/Heartland corridor and I-74, while increasing capacity on a currently congested rural road between two of the more significant towns in west central IN.  By constructing it as an archetypal "Midwest" corridor -- an expressway complete with frontage roads as needed but with grade separations/interchanges at major crossing highways as well as bypasses of towns along the corridor's length -- they can preserve ROW for any potential future upgrades.  Since the Heartland itself has been constructed in a similar fashion, it's quite appropriate for US 231 -- although not the most efficient of connectors regarding westerly points on I-74 -- to be likewise expanded. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on May 08, 2018, 10:21:43 AM
They could go two steps further and extend it around Cloverdale and Spencer and connect into Ellettsville which would complete an Indiana Univiersity/Purdue University corridor, also serving DePaw U in Greencastle and Wabash College in Crawfordsville.  If done right it might also create a bypass of Indianapolis via the route from I-65 to I-69 south.  Just sayin'
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on May 08, 2018, 04:11:31 PM
Quote from: Life in Paradise on May 08, 2018, 10:21:43 AM
They could go two steps further and extend it around Cloverdale and Spencer and connect into Ellettsville which would complete an Indiana Univiersity/Purdue University corridor, also serving DePaw U in Greencastle and Wabash College in Crawfordsville.  If done right it might also create a bypass of Indianapolis via the route from I-65 to I-69 south.  Just sayin'

I also thought about a Terre Haute-Crawfordsville corridor, to serve as an extension of the current Fort Wayne-Lafayette-Crawfordsville route.  That would be awesome.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 09, 2018, 01:21:59 PM
Didn't see this mentioned earlier, but IN 8 is closed indefinitely between US 421 and IN 39.  Flooding severely damaged the road.  All INDOT is saying now is that work should begin later this summer.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 09, 2018, 07:05:41 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 09, 2018, 01:21:59 PM
Didn't see this mentioned earlier, but IN 8 is closed indefinitely between US 421 and IN 39.  Flooding severely damaged the road.  All INDOT is saying now is that work should begin later this summer.

Saw this on INDOT Northwest's Facebook page just a few days ago. They have to test the roadbed constantly to check the extent of the damage. Pipe and drainage work may also be necessary.

In other news, I took a drive down I-65 to look at expansion work progress between US 30 and Indiana 2, largely because the cameras throughout the NW Indiana section of Trafficwise are down. A few notes:

There's definitely more focus on the Indiana 2 to US 231 stretch, and there's a lot of progress in that area. Right up to the southbound weigh station (which is oddly open during construction), the future inside shoulder, left lane, and permanent guardrails are in place. The median section between that weigh station and south of Indiana 2 is currently being excavated for similar work. Looks like more lane shifts will be in place within the coming weeks.

A new gantry is in place on I-65 southbound near the Indiana 2 exit. It's covered up, but it's obvious the sign says "LEFT LANE ENDS 1 MILE"  and will be uncovered when substantial work is finished.

Crews have finished pouring the decks for the bridges over US 231, Wurtz Ditch, and Indiana 2. The Wurtz Ditch bridge will have a concrete median included (and is installed); it's not yet known if the US 231 and Indiana 2 bridges will similarly be done or will have a small gap between the new decks.

As for the stretch between US 30 and US 231, it looks like most of the focus will be on the 109th Avenue bridge and the bridge just north of the interchange. It appears they're going to get the bridge resurfaced to the point where the future outside lane and outside shoulder are seamlessly built around the bridges.

Long story short...even if the cameras were online, they don't tell the full story of what's going on. They're pushing hard to get that work done in time for the end-of-October deadline.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 10, 2018, 07:43:07 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 09, 2018, 07:05:41 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 09, 2018, 01:21:59 PM
Didn't see this mentioned earlier, but IN 8 is closed indefinitely between US 421 and IN 39.  Flooding severely damaged the road.  All INDOT is saying now is that work should begin later this summer.

Saw this on INDOT Northwest's Facebook page just a few days ago. They have to test the roadbed constantly to check the extent of the damage. Pipe and drainage work may also be necessary.

In other news, I took a drive down I-65 to look at expansion work progress between US 30 and Indiana 2, largely because the cameras throughout the NW Indiana section of Trafficwise are down. A few notes:

There's definitely more focus on the Indiana 2 to US 231 stretch, and there's a lot of progress in that area. Right up to the southbound weigh station (which is oddly open during construction), the future inside shoulder, left lane, and permanent guardrails are in place. The median section between that weigh station and south of Indiana 2 is currently being excavated for similar work. Looks like more lane shifts will be in place within the coming weeks.

A new gantry is in place on I-65 southbound near the Indiana 2 exit. It's covered up, but it's obvious the sign says "LEFT LANE ENDS 1 MILE"  and will be uncovered when substantial work is finished.

Crews have finished pouring the decks for the bridges over US 231, Wurtz Ditch, and Indiana 2. The Wurtz Ditch bridge will have a concrete median included (and is installed); it's not yet known if the US 231 and Indiana 2 bridges will similarly be done or will have a small gap between the new decks.

As for the stretch between US 30 and US 231, it looks like most of the focus will be on the 109th Avenue bridge and the bridge just north of the interchange. It appears they're going to get the bridge resurfaced to the point where the future outside lane and outside shoulder are seamlessly built around the bridges.

Long story short...even if the cameras were online, they don't tell the full story of what's going on. They're pushing hard to get that work done in time for the end-of-October deadline.

Will the final design have a small grassy median with W-beam metal guardrail in the middle, or have a concrete jersey barrier?
I also wonder if on the southern end of the state (they are widening down there too), the SR 46 bridge will need to be widened.  It has that weird red metal thingy in the middle that could prove expensive to replace.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 10, 2018, 08:02:48 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 10, 2018, 07:43:07 AMWill the final design have a small grassy median with W-beam metal guardrail in the middle, or have a concrete jersey barrier?
I also wonder if on the southern end of the state (they are widening down there too), the SR 46 bridge will need to be widened.  It has that weird red metal thingy in the middle that could prove expensive to replace.

From immediately south of the US 231 bridge to south of Indiana 2, the final design will be the small grassy median with the W-Beam guardrails. The exception will be the bridge between Indiana 2 and US 231, which already has its Jersey barrier installed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 10, 2018, 08:05:01 AM
good, can't wait for at least one continuous piece to finish from Indy to Gary or Louisville.  I wonder if they have any plans to widen 70, I know they want to, but not sure if it's happening any time soon. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on May 10, 2018, 08:32:45 AM
As for the I-65 bridge over SR 46, if they eliminate the shoulders they could probably fit three lanes on each bridge, or maybe they can add to the sides, the arch thing seems focused mainly on the center of the bridge and it's not like it's a suspension bridge, it's mainly for looks. I think. 

As for I-70, I believe the next part of that interstate they want to widen is from SR 39 to SR 267. That should be coming up in the next few years.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 10, 2018, 04:00:00 PM
There will be a new exit in Whitestown soon, at I-65 and CR 550 South, it will be a double reverse interchange too (diverging diamond) here are the links:

https://www.in.gov/indot/files/Preliminary%20Preferred%20Alternative%20Schematic%20Layouts%20on%20Aerial%20Imagery%20for%20CR550S%20and%20SR%20267.pdf

https://www.in.gov/indot/3729.htm

this will also involve some minor lane modifications to the now mediocre Whitestown Parkway exit
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on May 13, 2018, 06:44:53 PM
Quote from: billtm on May 06, 2018, 09:17:07 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on May 06, 2018, 02:03:08 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 06, 2018, 10:15:08 AM
they're about to start blowing up SR 37, here is the site for the plans: http://in-stateroad37portal.civicplus.com/156/Project-Plans
it's surprising, they actually posted the complete plan set for each interchange.
They should "blow up" these plans instead! Allowing zero room for future added lanes on 37 will be penny-wise & pound foolish, just so Fishers can have a mess like Keystone "Parkway" (I refuse to recognize Carmel's renaming of Keystone AVENUE). Then again, expecting sanity from Fishers is asking too much (I have to deal with the ridiculous Michigan Left at 96th & Allisonville all the time).
I feel like upgrading SR-37 to a grade-separated expressway is miles better than adding extra lanes. Also, how exactly is the Keystone Parkway a mess? When I drove on it, it was really smooth (except for the stoplight at 96th which thankfully they are getting rid of).
It's a "mess" because it has limited merge areas, inadequate shoulders, poor sight lines, and the underpasses can never support added travel lanes in the future. Try driving it twice a day, every weekday and you may agree with me (but if not, I still respect your opinion). Carmel did what they could with the INDOT money they got when SR 431 was decommissioned, and it's better that all the stoplights that used to be there, but it's far from adequate given the heavy development & traffic. Can't wait to see how they f*** up the 96th & Keystone rebuild, but Indy has put a brake check on Carmel's plan to put like a zillion roundabouts on 96th between there and the White River bridge.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 13, 2018, 06:51:55 PM
Here is a rendering of the 96th and Keystone roundabout, it will begin construction this year.  All the roundabouts proposed on 96th st will be built except at randal drive, they came to a compromise last year.  by the end of the year there will be one signal on 96th street in the area, the now useless on at randall drive.  hopefully they turn it into a flasher.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 23, 2018, 08:29:41 AM
96th and keystone starts june 5th

it looks like North Vernon bypass is showing up on google maps, has 50 been rerouted yet, or is it still 750?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 23, 2018, 09:09:47 AM
Quote from: SSR_317 on May 13, 2018, 06:44:53 PM
Quote from: billtm on May 06, 2018, 09:17:07 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on May 06, 2018, 02:03:08 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 06, 2018, 10:15:08 AM
they're about to start blowing up SR 37, here is the site for the plans: http://in-stateroad37portal.civicplus.com/156/Project-Plans
it's surprising, they actually posted the complete plan set for each interchange.
They should "blow up" these plans instead! Allowing zero room for future added lanes on 37 will be penny-wise & pound foolish, just so Fishers can have a mess like Keystone "Parkway" (I refuse to recognize Carmel's renaming of Keystone AVENUE). Then again, expecting sanity from Fishers is asking too much (I have to deal with the ridiculous Michigan Left at 96th & Allisonville all the time).
I feel like upgrading SR-37 to a grade-separated expressway is miles better than adding extra lanes. Also, how exactly is the Keystone Parkway a mess? When I drove on it, it was really smooth (except for the stoplight at 96th which thankfully they are getting rid of).
It's a "mess" because it has limited merge areas, inadequate shoulders, poor sight lines, and the underpasses can never support added travel lanes in the future. Try driving it twice a day, every weekday and you may agree with me (but if not, I still respect your opinion). Carmel did what they could with the INDOT money they got when SR 431 was decommissioned, and it's better that all the stoplights that used to be there, but it's far from adequate given the heavy development & traffic. Can't wait to see how they f*** up the 96th & Keystone rebuild, but Indy has put a brake check on Carmel's plan to put like a zillion roundabouts on 96th between there and the White River bridge.

Back when Keystone got converted, it got heavy traffic because of only one stoplight while there were still several on 31.  Now that the lights are gone off of 31, I would think that would reduce the traffic on Keystone, or have people just not adjusted? 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 23, 2018, 09:25:24 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 23, 2018, 09:09:47 AM
Quote from: SSR_317 on May 13, 2018, 06:44:53 PM
Quote from: billtm on May 06, 2018, 09:17:07 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on May 06, 2018, 02:03:08 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 06, 2018, 10:15:08 AM
they're about to start blowing up SR 37, here is the site for the plans: http://in-stateroad37portal.civicplus.com/156/Project-Plans
it's surprising, they actually posted the complete plan set for each interchange.
They should "blow up" these plans instead! Allowing zero room for future added lanes on 37 will be penny-wise & pound foolish, just so Fishers can have a mess like Keystone "Parkway" (I refuse to recognize Carmel's renaming of Keystone AVENUE). Then again, expecting sanity from Fishers is asking too much (I have to deal with the ridiculous Michigan Left at 96th & Allisonville all the time).
I feel like upgrading SR-37 to a grade-separated expressway is miles better than adding extra lanes. Also, how exactly is the Keystone Parkway a mess? When I drove on it, it was really smooth (except for the stoplight at 96th which thankfully they are getting rid of).
It's a "mess" because it has limited merge areas, inadequate shoulders, poor sight lines, and the underpasses can never support added travel lanes in the future. Try driving it twice a day, every weekday and you may agree with me (but if not, I still respect your opinion). Carmel did what they could with the INDOT money they got when SR 431 was decommissioned, and it's better that all the stoplights that used to be there, but it's far from adequate given the heavy development & traffic. Can't wait to see how they f*** up the 96th & Keystone rebuild, but Indy has put a brake check on Carmel's plan to put like a zillion roundabouts on 96th between there and the White River bridge.

Back when Keystone got converted, it got heavy traffic because of only one stoplight while there were still several on 31.  Now that the lights are gone off of 31, I would think that would reduce the traffic on Keystone, or have people just not adjusted?

it's pretty bad during rush hour, traffic backs up onto 465 westbound due to the signal.  it will be nice to have it gone.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Henry on May 24, 2018, 09:49:12 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 23, 2018, 09:25:24 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 23, 2018, 09:09:47 AM
Quote from: SSR_317 on May 13, 2018, 06:44:53 PM
Quote from: billtm on May 06, 2018, 09:17:07 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on May 06, 2018, 02:03:08 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 06, 2018, 10:15:08 AM
they're about to start blowing up SR 37, here is the site for the plans: http://in-stateroad37portal.civicplus.com/156/Project-Plans
it's surprising, they actually posted the complete plan set for each interchange.
They should "blow up" these plans instead! Allowing zero room for future added lanes on 37 will be penny-wise & pound foolish, just so Fishers can have a mess like Keystone "Parkway" (I refuse to recognize Carmel's renaming of Keystone AVENUE). Then again, expecting sanity from Fishers is asking too much (I have to deal with the ridiculous Michigan Left at 96th & Allisonville all the time).
I feel like upgrading SR-37 to a grade-separated expressway is miles better than adding extra lanes. Also, how exactly is the Keystone Parkway a mess? When I drove on it, it was really smooth (except for the stoplight at 96th which thankfully they are getting rid of).
It's a "mess" because it has limited merge areas, inadequate shoulders, poor sight lines, and the underpasses can never support added travel lanes in the future. Try driving it twice a day, every weekday and you may agree with me (but if not, I still respect your opinion). Carmel did what they could with the INDOT money they got when SR 431 was decommissioned, and it's better that all the stoplights that used to be there, but it's far from adequate given the heavy development & traffic. Can't wait to see how they f*** up the 96th & Keystone rebuild, but Indy has put a brake check on Carmel's plan to put like a zillion roundabouts on 96th between there and the White River bridge.

Back when Keystone got converted, it got heavy traffic because of only one stoplight while there were still several on 31.  Now that the lights are gone off of 31, I would think that would reduce the traffic on Keystone, or have people just not adjusted?

it's pretty bad during rush hour, traffic backs up onto 465 westbound due to the signal.  it will be nice to have it gone.
AKA the last hindrance of a nonstop drive from Indianapolis to South Bend-Elkhart. Even if the corridor does not sport a red, white and blue shield, it'll still be one worth driving.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on May 24, 2018, 05:07:10 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 23, 2018, 09:09:47 AM
Back when Keystone got converted, it got heavy traffic because of only one stoplight while there were still several on 31.  Now that the lights are gone off of 31, I would think that would reduce the traffic on Keystone, or have people just not adjusted?
Not sure to which "one stoplight" you are referring (I assume the one at 96th Street where Keystone Avenue becomes "Keystone Parkway" as it leaves Indianapolis/Marion County & enters Carmel/Hamilton County), but that will soon go away with the project mentioned above.  However, there will still be two sets of stoplights controlling four movements at the Keystone/I-465 interchange (E465-Keystone & W465-Keystone, with the movements from Keystone to I-465 all being free-flow). Traffic along Keystone is still heavy, in spite of the City of Carmel trying to ban through trucks on it. IMHO, INDOT screwed up at Meridian (US 31) & I-465 by making the flyover ramp from SB 31 to EB 465 only one lane wide (penny-wise, pound foolish). The inevitable slow truck screws up traffic flow mightily almost every rush hour, in spite of that serpentine ramp having no severe grades whatsoever.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 24, 2018, 07:24:07 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on May 24, 2018, 05:07:10 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 23, 2018, 09:09:47 AM
Back when Keystone got converted, it got heavy traffic because of only one stoplight while there were still several on 31.  Now that the lights are gone off of 31, I would think that would reduce the traffic on Keystone, or have people just not adjusted?
Not sure to which "one stoplight" you are referring (I assume the one at 96th Street where Keystone Avenue becomes "Keystone Parkway" as it leaves Indianapolis/Marion County & enters Carmel/Hamilton County), but that will soon go away with the project mentioned above.  However, there will still be two sets of stoplights controlling four movements at the Keystone/I-465 interchange (E465-Keystone & W465-Keystone, with the movements from Keystone to I-465 all being free-flow). Traffic along Keystone is still heavy, in spite of the City of Carmel trying to ban through trucks on it. IMHO, INDOT screwed up at Meridian (US 31) & I-465 by making the flyover ramp from SB 31 to EB 465 only one lane wide (penny-wise, pound foolish). The inevitable slow truck screws up traffic flow mightily almost every rush hour, in spite of that serpentine ramp having no severe grades whatsoever.

that's INDOT's biggest fuck up in the metro area, both approaches to the flyovers should have been 2 lanes, why they fuck did they think meridian street deserved 2 through lanes, but the ramps deserved 1 through lane and one that drops? 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 31, 2018, 10:35:49 PM
More work on both long- and short-range fronts in Northwest Indiana, primarily in Lake County.

The most prevalent work is on I-65 between the northern terminus at US 12/20 and I-80/94. Crews have one lane closed just north of the I-80/94 interchange due to extensive work on the Central Avenue/CSX bridge. Eastbound traffic can enter I-65 northbound, but westbound traffic cannot (for safety reasons; the long, gradual merge is temporarily converted into an instant yield-and-merge...way too dangerous for the westbound ramp to negotiate). Westbound traffic that must take I-65 into Gary can either go directly to Broadway as a detour to 15th Avenue or US 12/20, or use the southbound I-65 ramp, take the ramp to Ridge Road, and use the loops to merge into I-65 northbound.

The more problematic closure takes place on I-65 southbound at its starting point at US 12/20. The road is completely closed to traffic with no access to or from 15th Avenue. Southbound traffic will be detoured through Broadway to I-80/94 eastbound. INDOT has been mum so far regarding this particular closure and its duration. This will complicate things because of another closure where I-65 is a detour...

Indiana 51 is closed for the next two weeks as part of its resurfacing and reconstruction project, between US 30 and 73rd Avenue. This particular segment has been littered with potholes, some of which have gone deep beyond the road bed. Access to the clinics along this stretch is available from 73rd Avenue. The official detour uses US 30, I-65, and US 20, although southbound traffic will be hampered a bit by the aforementioned I-65 southbound closure.

EDIT: I just got word from INDOT; the southbound closure (including the 15th Avenue ramps) is in relation to the bridge work just south. This is a full-blown bridge replacement requiring round-the-clock lane closures. No word yet on if there will be traffic crossovers involved. The closures are in place to minimize traffic flow, but traffic coming from the Toll Road will have unrestricted access to I-65 south. This project is scheduled to last until November.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Crash_It on June 03, 2018, 06:04:36 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 09, 2018, 07:05:41 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 09, 2018, 01:21:59 PM
Didn't see this mentioned earlier, but IN 8 is closed indefinitely between US 421 and IN 39.  Flooding severely damaged the road.  All INDOT is saying now is that work should begin later this summer.

Saw this on INDOT Northwest's Facebook page just a few days ago. They have to test the roadbed constantly to check the extent of the damage. Pipe and drainage work may also be necessary.

In other news, I took a drive down I-65 to look at expansion work progress between US 30 and Indiana 2, largely because the cameras throughout the NW Indiana section of Trafficwise are down. A few notes:

There's definitely more focus on the Indiana 2 to US 231 stretch, and there's a lot of progress in that area. Right up to the southbound weigh station (which is oddly open during construction), the future inside shoulder, left lane, and permanent guardrails are in place. The median section between that weigh station and south of Indiana 2 is currently being excavated for similar work. Looks like more lane shifts will be in place within the coming weeks.

A new gantry is in place on I-65 southbound near the Indiana 2 exit. It's covered up, but it's obvious the sign says "LEFT LANE ENDS 1 MILE"  and will be uncovered when substantial work is finished.

Crews have finished pouring the decks for the bridges over US 231, Wurtz Ditch, and Indiana 2. The Wurtz Ditch bridge will have a concrete median included (and is installed); it's not yet known if the US 231 and Indiana 2 bridges will similarly be done or will have a small gap between the new decks.

As for the stretch between US 30 and US 231, it looks like most of the focus will be on the 109th Avenue bridge and the bridge just north of the interchange. It appears they're going to get the bridge resurfaced to the point where the future outside lane and outside shoulder are seamlessly built around the bridges.

Long story short...even if the cameras were online, they don't tell the full story of what's going on. They're pushing hard to get that work done in time for the end-of-October deadline.

And with all of that, it seems that they still don't have sense enough to obscure the rumble strips in the right lane that has shifted to the shoulder. It's a major PIA driving that stretch because of that and it's the only high speed way to Lowell. This is something that has been done in IL during road work and even in WI, I don't get how INDOT missed that concept.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on June 04, 2018, 11:13:38 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 03, 2018, 06:04:36 PM
And with all of that, it seems that they still don't have sense enough to obscure the rumble strips in the right lane that has shifted to the shoulder. It's a major PIA driving that stretch because of that and it's the only high speed way to Lowell. This is something that has been done in IL during road work and even in WI, I don't get how INDOT missed that concept.

Definitely seems to be an INDOT thing.  Places on I-469 involve the same thing with the rumble strip, although fortunately it is mostly the concrete surface type which makes more short bursts of lighter rumbles than the continuous and deeper asphalt rumble strip, which I have also seen them leave for people to drive on and over.  It would be one thing in a very short term arrangement but doesn't seem appropriate for something that will stay for months.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on June 04, 2018, 02:44:49 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 03, 2018, 06:04:36 PM
And with all of that, it seems that they still don't have sense enough to obscure the rumble strips in the right lane that has shifted to the shoulder. It's a major PIA driving that stretch because of that and it's the only high speed way to Lowell. This is something that has been done in IL during road work and even in WI, I don't get how INDOT missed that concept.

This was a grievance of mine during the I-65 reconstruction around Lafayette that reached completion in the past year.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 05, 2018, 05:53:58 PM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on June 04, 2018, 02:44:49 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on June 03, 2018, 06:04:36 PM
And with all of that, it seems that they still don't have sense enough to obscure the rumble strips in the right lane that has shifted to the shoulder. It's a major PIA driving that stretch because of that and it's the only high speed way to Lowell. This is something that has been done in IL during road work and even in WI, I don't get how INDOT missed that concept.

This was a grievance of mine during the I-65 reconstruction around Lafayette that reached completion in the past year.

Funny you guys say this; I took another drive through most of the construction zone today to see if any progress has been made in the last month...and there's a lot of progress. The one that stuck out the most (and pertains to this convo) is that traffic has been shifted onto the new pavement from just south of the US 231 overpass to the weigh station near Indiana 2 (which has now been closed and occupied by construction vehicles). While hitting the rumble strips will be an issue from south of the weigh station to the south end of the project limits, a lot of that has been allayed.

The above section has been almost completely carved out in the median. Piping installation should begin soon, which will pave the way (pun not intended) for asphalt layering in the not-too-distant future. There's definitely much more focus on the US 231 to Indiana 2 stretch; I think the reason is that it will take less time to lay down one lane of concrete and resurface the existing pavement than carving the median, installing proper drainage, laying down new asphalt, and installing a median guardrail.

North of US 231, there are stacks of dowel bars in place to prepare for concrete installation, but there are still a few sections of shoulder that needs to be dug up before concrete shoulder installation can begin in earnest.

On a related note, all I-65 traffic will be shifted onto the new southbound structure of the Kankakee River bridge so that crews can replace the northbound structure.

Other quick notes:
The stretch of Indiana 149 between US 20 and US 6, which has been closed off so crews can repair the Toll Road bridge over the highway, is scheduled to reopen by June 23.

This week (if it hasn't started already), US 20 will be down to one lane in each direction in the Portage area so crews can repair the CSX bridge. For reference, that's between Indiana 51 and Indiana 249. Work is expected to last until November.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 06, 2018, 10:17:05 AM
I-65 will be closed completely for 35 days starting july 1st for bridge repair, between 465 on the west side down to Delaware st downtown.  this isn't related to the north split project.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 06, 2018, 12:35:12 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 05, 2018, 05:53:58 PM
Funny you guys say this; I took another drive through most of the construction zone today to see if any progress has been made in the last month...and there's a lot of progress. The one that stuck out the most (and pertains to this convo) is that traffic has been shifted onto the new pavement from just south of the US 231 overpass to the weigh station near Indiana 2 (which has now been closed and occupied by construction vehicles). While hitting the rumble strips will be an issue from south of the weigh station to the south end of the project limits, a lot of that has been allayed.

The above section has been almost completely carved out in the median. Piping installation should begin soon, which will pave the way (pun not intended) for asphalt layering in the not-too-distant future. There's definitely much more focus on the US 231 to Indiana 2 stretch; I think the reason is that it will take less time to lay down one lane of concrete and resurface the existing pavement than carving the median, installing proper drainage, laying down new asphalt, and installing a median guardrail.

North of US 231, there are stacks of dowel bars in place to prepare for concrete installation, but there are still a few sections of shoulder that needs to be dug up before concrete shoulder installation can begin in earnest.

On a related note, all I-65 traffic will be shifted onto the new southbound structure of the Kankakee River bridge so that crews can replace the northbound structure.

Other quick notes:
The stretch of Indiana 149 between US 20 and US 6, which has been closed off so crews can repair the Toll Road bridge over the highway, is scheduled to reopen by June 23.

This week (if it hasn't started already), US 20 will be down to one lane in each direction in the Portage area so crews can repair the CSX bridge. For reference, that's between Indiana 51 and Indiana 249. Work is expected to last until November.

One more NWI note: Calumet Avenue (US 41) between Michigan and Sibley streets in Hammond is closed until further notice after a site inspection Thursday revealed a massive cavity beneath the roadway tied to INDOT's reconstruction work.  No word as to whether or not INDOT has a dentist on staff.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 13, 2018, 09:59:14 AM
New projects for the Lloyd in Evansville
http://www.tristatehomepage.com/news/local-news/indot-considering-changes-to-lloyd-expressway-vanderburgh-co-commissioner-says/1234191372
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on June 13, 2018, 01:29:18 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 13, 2018, 09:59:14 AM
New projects for the Lloyd in Evansville
http://www.tristatehomepage.com/news/local-news/indot-considering-changes-to-lloyd-expressway-vanderburgh-co-commissioner-says/1234191372

I am all for the Vann Avenue and Grimm Road options.  That would get rid of one traffic light, and cause another one not to be installed (Grimm), even after they had placed the traffic light poles a few years ago.  I really wish instead of the displaced left turn lanes, they would use that money as a down payment towards interchanges.  (How about I-569 from I-69 to the west side of Evansville??)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 13, 2018, 03:39:31 PM
they should have just had interchanges
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jnewkirk77 on June 16, 2018, 01:15:34 PM
INDOT doesn't seem to know what to do with the Lloyd. There's more traffic now than I think anyone ever believed it would have to handle, and leaving it as-is doesn't seem like a viable option.  I'm solidly with the group that says it needs interchanges, not more lights.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 16, 2018, 11:37:19 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 06, 2018, 12:35:12 PMOne more NWI note: Calumet Avenue (US 41) between Michigan and Sibley streets in Hammond is closed until further notice after a site inspection Thursday revealed a massive cavity beneath the roadway tied to INDOT's reconstruction work.  No word as to whether or not INDOT has a dentist on staff.

US 41 can't seem to catch a break. Between the work in Highland and this closure, it's almost better to find a viable route (either US 24 or US 52) to connect to I-57 and get to Chicago that way at this point.

Also, it has been announced that the Cline Avenue bridge (Indiana 912), which will be shuttered for more than a decade, will be opened to traffic in January 2020. Crews are building new piers and have been receiving transports for beams and deck material. The final design will support two lanes in each direction and will carry tolls from $2 to $2.25. In the wake of the Florida walkway collapse earlier this year (from the same design team), an independent construction team will review the work upon completion to determine if the bridge is deemed safe for travel before opening to traffic.

This upcoming week (likely starting Monday), I-65 in Lake County will see movements in current construction zones. As I mentioned upthread, full blown bridge replacement work will be underway at the bridges over the CSX railroad and Central Avenue, just north of the I-80/94 interchange. Crews have built and striped temporary crossovers inside the median to facilitate traffic. All traffic (one lane in each direction) will share the northbound bridge while the southbound bridge is replaced, then the configuration will switch when the northbound bridge is up for replacement. Only traffic from the Toll Road has access to I-65 southbound currently; it appears they will allow traffic from US 12/20 and 15th Avenue to enter once all switchovers are completed (indicated by the "Speed Limit 45 ahead"  signs laying on their sides by the 15th Avenue ramp).

Further south, I was told by a worker on INDOT's Facebook page that concrete paving of the future outer shoulder between US 30 and US 231 begins Monday, weather permitting. I'm curious to see how that will tie into the 109th Avenue interchange...
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 18, 2018, 04:08:24 PM
I asked INDOT why not do interchanges on the Lloyd, and this is their response to me:

Thank you for contacting the Indiana Department of Transportation regarding the Lloyd Expressway. INDOT typically considers interchanges as a part of projects of this nature. However, we must also consider other options using innovative techniques and creative engineering that will improve the safety and mobility of the Lloyd expressway corridor. Interchanges can improve safety and mobility but they come at a high cost ($15-25 million each) to taxpayers and typically displace businesses and residential areas. Additionally choosing interchange projects means INDOT must acquire large amounts of property that will impact businesses and/or possibly residential areas which drives up the cost of the projects, and causes families and businesses from their homes and properties. This is something INDOT actively tries to avoid. The point of considering these type treatments is that they can be easily changed in the future if they no longer operate at an acceptable level of service. Treatments of this type solve the challenges INDOT is trying to fix and are effective investments for taxpayers for multiple years. They also allow INDOT to focus on pavement and bridge conditions in order to maintain and fortify the integrity of those assets while improving the traveling public's experience on Indiana's roadways. The presentation of the consultant's proposed improvements are only concepts at this point in time. INDOT has not posted the presentation on its website because no decisions have been made regarding the proposals. Once decisions have been made how to approach the corridor, the projects will be scored and go through a deliberation process. This process can take five to 10 years to accomplish. INDOT appreciates your questions and feedback.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 18, 2018, 04:17:03 PM
indot presentation of the preferred alternative for the 69/465 interchange:

https://www.in.gov/indot/files/CAC_Meeting_Presentation_ClearPath465_5.9.18.pdf
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on June 18, 2018, 05:50:00 PM
While that new setup looks a whole lot better than what is currently there, am I seeing it right that traffic continuing on to Binford Blvd from SB I-69 has to bypass the whole interchange just to stop at a traffic signal before turning onto to present-day Binford to continue south?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 18, 2018, 05:53:45 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on June 18, 2018, 05:50:00 PM
While that new setup looks a whole lot better than what is currently there, am I seeing it right that traffic continuing on to Binford Blvd from SB I-69 has to bypass the whole interchange just to stop at a traffic signal before turning onto to present-day Binford to continue south?

yes, and the engineer firm said that the reason behind this is to address issues with people wanting to make a left turn at 75th street not having the time to do so with the current setup, so they added the light to allow this movement to be easier. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on June 22, 2018, 07:59:35 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 18, 2018, 05:53:45 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on June 18, 2018, 05:50:00 PM
While that new setup looks a whole lot better than what is currently there, am I seeing it right that traffic continuing on to Binford Blvd from SB I-69 has to bypass the whole interchange just to stop at a traffic signal before turning onto to present-day Binford to continue south?

yes, and the engineer firm said that the reason behind this is to address issues with people wanting to make a left turn at 75th street not having the time to do so with the current setup, so they added the light to allow this movement to be easier.
This is the exact same complaint I had last Summer at the INDOT public meeting. It's not that they don't have "time", it's that they don't have sufficient "space" to do so safely. All those snooty Heritage "Christian" School parents seem to feel that both lanes of SB Binford through traffic should yield to THEM just so they can exit I-465 then immediately turn east on 71st. I say let THEM pay for their own special dedicated ramp from the Interstate to the school themselves! In my opinion, all SB left turns should be PROHIBITED at this intersection.

To safely accommodate that EB-SB-EB movement, a Michigan-left could be easily installed in the median well south of the intersection, or better yet, on 75th Street to the west of the intersection (which would require no weaving on Binford). That IMHO is a MUCH better solution than adding yet another traffic signal to an already congested major arterial. I would speculate that particular engineering firm may be getting a kickback from traffic signal manufacturers (who may be losing tons of money in nearby Hamilton County, what with roundabouts replacing signals in droves). Slapping a signal on Binford for that current free-flow ramp is a LAZY "solution" to this problem which will also not be energy efficient.

BTW, the City of Indianapolis really needs to add a 3rd travel lane on Binford between I-465 and 46th Street, ASAP! But city-wide chuckhole repair from this Winter & Spring will likely take budgetary precedence (as it should) for IndyDOT.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: edwaleni on June 22, 2018, 11:12:18 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on June 22, 2018, 07:59:35 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 18, 2018, 05:53:45 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on June 18, 2018, 05:50:00 PM
While that new setup looks a whole lot better than what is currently there, am I seeing it right that traffic continuing on to Binford Blvd from SB I-69 has to bypass the whole interchange just to stop at a traffic signal before turning onto to present-day Binford to continue south?

yes, and the engineer firm said that the reason behind this is to address issues with people wanting to make a left turn at 75th street not having the time to do so with the current setup, so they added the light to allow this movement to be easier.
This is the exact same complaint I had last Summer at the INDOT public meeting. It's not that they don't have "time", it's that they don't have sufficient "space" to do so safely. All those snooty Heritage "Christian" School parents seem to feel that both lanes of SB Binford through traffic should yield to THEM just so they can exit I-465 then immediately turn east on 71st. I say let THEM pay for their own special dedicated ramp from the Interstate to the school themselves! In my opinion, all SB left turns should be PROHIBITED at this intersection.

To safely accommodate that EB-SB-EB movement, a Michigan-left could be easily installed in the median well south of the intersection, or better yet, on 75th Street to the west of the intersection (which would require no weaving on Binford). That IMHO is a MUCH better solution than adding yet another traffic signal to an already congested major arterial. I would speculate that particular engineering firm may be getting a kickback from traffic signal manufacturers (who may be losing tons of money in nearby Hamilton County, what with roundabouts replacing signals in droves). Slapping a signal on Binford for that current free-flow ramp is a LAZY "solution" to this problem which will also not be energy efficient.

BTW, the City of Indianapolis really needs to add a 3rd travel lane on Binford between I-465 and 46th Street, ASAP! But city-wide chuckhole repair from this Winter & Spring will likely take budgetary precedence (as it should) for IndyDOT.

I dont think you have your facts right or a good reason to "quote" the schools purpose. Heritage has a planned circular 1 way drive using 75th Street. They split the traffic to Kittrey for the left turn back to 75th for those going west.

They (the school) discourages the wholesale use of Aldgate and Fulham for special events because they are residential streets.

Instead of consuming yet more land, perhaps INDOT should look at doing an urban style flyover for Binford for 75th and 71st.

Faulting a schools educational purpose has absolutely nothing to do with highway planning.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 23, 2018, 09:32:02 AM
Quote from: SSR_317 on June 22, 2018, 07:59:35 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 18, 2018, 05:53:45 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on June 18, 2018, 05:50:00 PM
While that new setup looks a whole lot better than what is currently there, am I seeing it right that traffic continuing on to Binford Blvd from SB I-69 has to bypass the whole interchange just to stop at a traffic signal before turning onto to present-day Binford to continue south?

yes, and the engineer firm said that the reason behind this is to address issues with people wanting to make a left turn at 75th street not having the time to do so with the current setup, so they added the light to allow this movement to be easier.
This is the exact same complaint I had last Summer at the INDOT public meeting. It's not that they don't have "time", it's that they don't have sufficient "space" to do so safely. All those snooty Heritage "Christian" School parents seem to feel that both lanes of SB Binford through traffic should yield to THEM just so they can exit I-465 then immediately turn east on 71st. I say let THEM pay for their own special dedicated ramp from the Interstate to the school themselves! In my opinion, all SB left turns should be PROHIBITED at this intersection.

To safely accommodate that EB-SB-EB movement, a Michigan-left could be easily installed in the median well south of the intersection, or better yet, on 75th Street to the west of the intersection (which would require no weaving on Binford). That IMHO is a MUCH better solution than adding yet another traffic signal to an already congested major arterial. I would speculate that particular engineering firm may be getting a kickback from traffic signal manufacturers (who may be losing tons of money in nearby Hamilton County, what with roundabouts replacing signals in droves). Slapping a signal on Binford for that current free-flow ramp is a LAZY "solution" to this problem which will also not be energy efficient.

BTW, the City of Indianapolis really needs to add a 3rd travel lane on Binford between I-465 and 46th Street, ASAP! But city-wide chuckhole repair from this Winter & Spring will likely take budgetary precedence (as it should) for IndyDOT.

the city of potholeville has no money to do anything.  they can't even restripe the roads the patch.  potholeville is broke af
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on June 24, 2018, 06:45:37 PM
Quote from: edwaleni on June 22, 2018, 11:12:18 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on June 22, 2018, 07:59:35 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 18, 2018, 05:53:45 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on June 18, 2018, 05:50:00 PM
While that new setup looks a whole lot better than what is currently there, am I seeing it right that traffic continuing on to Binford Blvd from SB I-69 has to bypass the whole interchange just to stop at a traffic signal before turning onto to present-day Binford to continue south?

yes, and the engineer firm said that the reason behind this is to address issues with people wanting to make a left turn at 75th street not having the time to do so with the current setup, so they added the light to allow this movement to be easier.
This is the exact same complaint I had last Summer at the INDOT public meeting. It's not that they don't have "time", it's that they don't have sufficient "space" to do so safely. All those snooty Heritage "Christian" School parents seem to feel that both lanes of SB Binford through traffic should yield to THEM just so they can exit I-465 then immediately turn east on 71st. I say let THEM pay for their own special dedicated ramp from the Interstate to the school themselves! In my opinion, all SB left turns should be PROHIBITED at this intersection.

To safely accommodate that EB-SB-EB movement, a Michigan-left could be easily installed in the median well south of the intersection, or better yet, on 75th Street to the west of the intersection (which would require no weaving on Binford). That IMHO is a MUCH better solution than adding yet another traffic signal to an already congested major arterial. I would speculate that particular engineering firm may be getting a kickback from traffic signal manufacturers (who may be losing tons of money in nearby Hamilton County, what with roundabouts replacing signals in droves). Slapping a signal on Binford for that current free-flow ramp is a LAZY "solution" to this problem which will also not be energy efficient.

BTW, the City of Indianapolis really needs to add a 3rd travel lane on Binford between I-465 and 46th Street, ASAP! But city-wide chuckhole repair from this Winter & Spring will likely take budgetary precedence (as it should) for IndyDOT.

I dont think you have your facts right or a good reason to "quote" the schools purpose. Heritage has a planned circular 1 way drive using 75th Street. They split the traffic to Kittrey for the left turn back to 75th for those going west.

They (the school) discourages the wholesale use of Aldgate and Fulham for special events because they are residential streets.

Instead of consuming yet more land, perhaps INDOT should look at doing an urban style flyover for Binford for 75th and 71st.

Faulting a schools educational purpose has absolutely nothing to do with highway planning.
You are correct in that my editorial comment about the school's purpose is not germane to our discussion, but its existence as a major traffic generator is. I am not talking about this private school's driveways, nor am I talking about their relationship with 75th Street. I am talking about the attitude of many the drivers who exit EB I-465 to SB Binford then immediately dash across 2 lanes of thru traffic to get to the left turn lanes for EB 75th. Most of these folks are heading to the school, though some may be heading to other destinations. That is the safety situation the engineers are trying to solve (in my opinion, in the laziest & cheapest way possible) by installing yet another unnecessary stoplight. This signal will further hinder the smooth flow of traffic from I-69 onto Binford, even though INDOT claims it will be synchronized with the one at 75th itself. We'll see how long they actually stay in sync, once installed.

As for south of there, INDOT's jurisdiction has ended at 75th ever since Binford was turned over to the City of Indianapolis many years ago now. So it would be IndyDOT, not INDOT, that would have to deal with any potential grade separation or other changes at 71st & Binford or further south. I'm sure these agencies would (and will) work together at 75th, but anything beyond that would be up to a city which (unfortunately) has many other higher-priority projects & problems to address.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on June 26, 2018, 02:41:45 PM
I noticed this morning all lanes appear to be open on southbound I-69 at exit 205 (116th Street).

I get on from 37 south, but all three lanes to my left are open.  Two of the lanes have had a final layer of asphalt applied and I imagine the third lane will be paved shortly.

The added lane between 116th and 106th had the barrels pushed back a week or two ago.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 26, 2018, 02:47:34 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on June 26, 2018, 02:41:45 PM
I noticed this morning all lanes appear to be open on southbound I-69 at exit 205 (116th Street).

I get on from 37 south, but all three lanes to my left are open.  Two of the lanes have had a final layer of asphalt applied and I imagine the third lane will be paved shortly.

The added lane between 116th and 106th had the barrels pushed back a week or two ago.

I wish 69 was concrete from 465 to campus pkwy
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 05, 2018, 09:04:55 AM
The new alignment of US 33 in Goshen is now open.  Drove it yesterday while visiting family for the 4th.  The new section of road contains an overpass over the 9th street railroad tracks, thus eliminating an at-grade crossing from the route.  The new alignment re-routes the section previously routed along 3rd and Madison Streets. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 05, 2018, 09:12:05 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 05, 2018, 09:04:55 AM
The new alignment of US 33 in Goshen is now open.  Drove it yesterday while visiting family for the 4th.  The new section of road contains an overpass over the 9th street railroad tracks, thus eliminating an at-grade crossing from the route.  The new alignment re-routes the section previously routed along 3rd and Madison Streets.

Did they fuck up the routing of SR 15 in the area?

Does anyone know if SR 252 still exists between I-65 and SR 9?  I heard that after the construction on that stretch was finished, it would be decommissioned. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 05, 2018, 09:18:42 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 05, 2018, 09:12:05 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 05, 2018, 09:04:55 AM
The new alignment of US 33 in Goshen is now open.  Drove it yesterday while visiting family for the 4th.  The new section of road contains an overpass over the 9th street railroad tracks, thus eliminating an at-grade crossing from the route.  The new alignment re-routes the section previously routed along 3rd and Madison Streets.

Did they fuck up the routing of SR 15 in the area?

Does anyone know if SR 252 still exists between I-65 and SR 9?  I heard that after the construction on that stretch was finished, it would be decommissioned. 

Several years ago, Goshen got approval to re-route 15 and 33 through downtown from Pike/Main to 3rd/Madison so they could close off Main for city events/festivals without having to get INDOT's permission for every event.  It's not really a significant change for traffic.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 05, 2018, 09:21:27 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 05, 2018, 09:18:42 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 05, 2018, 09:12:05 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 05, 2018, 09:04:55 AM
The new alignment of US 33 in Goshen is now open.  Drove it yesterday while visiting family for the 4th.  The new section of road contains an overpass over the 9th street railroad tracks, thus eliminating an at-grade crossing from the route.  The new alignment re-routes the section previously routed along 3rd and Madison Streets.

Did they fuck up the routing of SR 15 in the area?

Does anyone know if SR 252 still exists between I-65 and SR 9?  I heard that after the construction on that stretch was finished, it would be decommissioned. 

Several years ago, Goshen got approval to re-route 15 and 33 through downtown from Pike/Main to 3rd/Madison so they could close off Main for city events/festivals without having to get INDOT's permission for every event.  It's not really a significant change for traffic.

So this bypass carries both 15 and 33 then? (15 is signed on the bypass?)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 05, 2018, 12:39:47 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 05, 2018, 09:21:27 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 05, 2018, 09:18:42 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 05, 2018, 09:12:05 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 05, 2018, 09:04:55 AM
The new alignment of US 33 in Goshen is now open.  Drove it yesterday while visiting family for the 4th.  The new section of road contains an overpass over the 9th street railroad tracks, thus eliminating an at-grade crossing from the route.  The new alignment re-routes the section previously routed along 3rd and Madison Streets.

Did they fuck up the routing of SR 15 in the area?

Does anyone know if SR 252 still exists between I-65 and SR 9?  I heard that after the construction on that stretch was finished, it would be decommissioned. 

Several years ago, Goshen got approval to re-route 15 and 33 through downtown from Pike/Main to 3rd/Madison so they could close off Main for city events/festivals without having to get INDOT's permission for every event.  It's not really a significant change for traffic.

So this bypass carries both 15 and 33 then? (15 is signed on the bypass?)

No, 15 still runs down 3rd and then Main on out to the south.  15 doesn't ever cross the 9th street tracks so there was no need to reroute it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 05, 2018, 12:56:40 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 05, 2018, 12:39:47 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 05, 2018, 09:21:27 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 05, 2018, 09:18:42 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 05, 2018, 09:12:05 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 05, 2018, 09:04:55 AM
The new alignment of US 33 in Goshen is now open.  Drove it yesterday while visiting family for the 4th.  The new section of road contains an overpass over the 9th street railroad tracks, thus eliminating an at-grade crossing from the route.  The new alignment re-routes the section previously routed along 3rd and Madison Streets.

Did they fuck up the routing of SR 15 in the area?

Does anyone know if SR 252 still exists between I-65 and SR 9?  I heard that after the construction on that stretch was finished, it would be decommissioned. 

Several years ago, Goshen got approval to re-route 15 and 33 through downtown from Pike/Main to 3rd/Madison so they could close off Main for city events/festivals without having to get INDOT's permission for every event.  It's not really a significant change for traffic.

So this bypass carries both 15 and 33 then? (15 is signed on the bypass?)

No, 15 still runs down 3rd and then Main on out to the south.  15 doesn't ever cross the 9th street tracks so there was no need to reroute it.

o ok, makes sense!

Can anyone confirm that SR 252 still exists between I-65 and SR 9?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 10, 2018, 04:56:12 PM
465 will be closed for a week between SR 67 and 37 on the southside, one week per direction.  They're going to fix the shitty pavement and bridges in the area, I-70 and 65 will be the detour. Starting 9/14/18
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 10, 2018, 07:31:45 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 10, 2018, 04:56:12 PM
465 will be closed for a week between SR 67 and 37 on the southside, one week per direction.  They're going to fix the shitty pavement and bridges in the area, I-70 and 65 will be the detour. Starting 9/14/18

It's smart they're waiting until all the dust settles on the current I-65 work on the northwest side - and the summer traffic dies down - before working on this endeavor. Also shows how Indianapolis has a much better highway network then here in NWI; if one highway goes down, there are plenty of alternatives to shoulder the load. Here in Northwest Indiana...not so much.

Also, note the location of this particular project...could they also be preparing for the building of I-69 with this (series of) work(s)?

Meanwhile, on my stretch of I-65, they're gunning for the finish line with expansion. While I can't see what's going on near Indiana 2 (cameras are STILL down, and State Police are cracking down HARD on traffic violators), the picture starts to get a little clearer from US 231 to US 30. The southbound bridge over US 231 has been completely resurfaced, with brand new concrete and guardrails. Crews still have to resurface the northbound span (by shifting traffic to the new inside lanes, which are traffic ready). If the southbound side is any indication, that shouldn't take long (the existing beam structures are staying in place).

Crews are also pouring concrete for the future northbound shoulder and made it halfway between US 231 and the 113th Street overpass as of yesterday afternoon. INDOT is staying firm on their end of October deadline and says that everything is on schedule.

The infamous Lake Station ramp from the westbound Indiana Toll Road to the Borman has been closed for a while (yet again), but it's only guardrail damage that needs to be repaired. It should be done before fall. I really wish they would monitor truck traffic in this area, since a lot of the problems affecting that particular ramp have been truck related. If it has to come to it, enact and enforce a "No trucks"  policy and shunt them onto the I-65 exit further west.

Finally, Indiana 51 has been a pain to get through, but it's finally starting to manifest itself. The stretch from US 30 to Lincoln Street south of downtown Hobart has been paved, striped, and reflectorized; the section between 9th and 10th Streets (which was closed for three months due to a sinkhole) should be opened soon, if it hasn't already, the Third Street portion is closed in downtown for drainage and beautification, and concrete/bridge restoration from Central Avenue to US 20 is still in progress. It's strongly advised to avoid that section during peak traffic hours.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 10, 2018, 07:57:46 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 10, 2018, 07:31:45 PM
Also, note the location of this particular project...could they also be preparing for the building of I-69 with this (series of) work(s)?

Oh God no. That would involve some proactive thinking and that is usually not in the INDOT toolbox.

I know I drove this stretch the other week but I thought a large part of it was recently repaved. I think Mann Road up to Kentucky Avenue may have not been but I'm guessing there's other bits in there.

Speaking of shoddy roadwork, the stretch of I-65 from Southport to I-465 has some dips and ruts in the pavement. Largely this is due to most of that pavement being there for over ten years now despite recent construction in that area. That has to be up to a full repaving soon, despite the fact that they could have done it back when they added the auxiliary lane in conjunction with the new ramps at I-465 and I-65.

Finally, in another mark of pure genius, driving to work last night the ramp from 65 north to 465 west, you know THE DETOUR for I-65 around the city was closed for roadwork. Can this seriously not wait until after the 65 project is over, or when they close off 465 in September? I drive by a sign that says to use 465 west as a detour around the city for 65 north traffic, and then I pass a DMS saying that the ramp to 465 west is closed. I know it's nighttime but still. No wonder people think that INDOT might be stupid enough to close 465 while doing the 65 project.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 10, 2018, 08:00:23 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 10, 2018, 07:57:46 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 10, 2018, 07:31:45 PM
Also, note the location of this particular project...could they also be preparing for the building of I-69 with this (series of) work(s)?

Oh God no. That would involve some proactive thinking and that is usually not in the INDOT toolbox.

I know I drove this stretch the other week but I thought a large part of it was recently repaved. I think Mann Road up to Kentucky Avenue may have not been but I'm guessing there's other bits in there.

Speaking of shoddy roadwork, the stretch of I-65 from Southport to I-465 has some dips and ruts in the pavement. Largely this is due to most of that pavement being there for over ten years now despite recent construction in that area. That has to be up to a full repaving soon, despite the fact that they could have done it back when they added the auxiliary lane in conjunction with the new ramps at I-465 and I-65.

Finally, in another mark of pure genius, driving to work last night the ramp from 65 north to 465 west, you know THE DETOUR for I-65 around the city was closed for roadwork. Can this seriously not wait until after the 65 project is over, or when they close off 465 in September? I drive by a sign that says to use 465 west as a detour around the city for 65 north traffic, and then I pass a DMS saying that the ramp to 465 west is closed.

And you think they want to plan ahead for I-69?

I seems like INDOT policy to redesign roads with at least one major fuck up, idk what they were thinking when they redid 31 and 465.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on July 10, 2018, 09:39:05 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 10, 2018, 04:56:12 PM
465 will be closed for a week between SR 67 and 37 on the southside, one week per direction.  They're going to fix the shitty pavement and bridges in the area, I-70 and 65 will be the detour. Starting 9/14/18
Thanks for the "head's up!" Though it's on the opposite side of town from me, the last time I was down that way I did note the decrepit state of the pavement. The entire south leg of I-465 has some of the oldest pavement on the entire I-465 loop, and is in dire need of a total rebuild. However, these September repairs are likely just a giant band-aid to keep this section serviceable until the I-69 Phase 6 project completely rebuilds it between Mann Rd & East St (US 31 South).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 10, 2018, 10:40:15 PM
Update: INDOT is now showing maps of 465 being closed from I-70 to 65 on the south side, this may be the point where they place "local traffic only" signs, it will be where through traffic is forced to go. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on July 13, 2018, 09:55:05 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 05, 2018, 12:56:40 PM
Can anyone confirm that SR 252 still exists between I-65 and SR 9?

The exit ramp still lists SR 252, but the road is closed east of I-65. The detour refers to SR 252, which takes I-65 south to US 31 south (Taylorsville exit), but I don't know where it goes from there. I passed the interchange there and back this afternoon picking up my son from camp and could only see what I could from the driver's seat. There were no directional signs for 252 at the end of each exit ramp, and I couldn't see any reassurance markers in either direction from my limited vantage point.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 16, 2018, 01:33:26 PM
From INDOT:

NOTICE OF PUBLIC HEARING REGARDING PROPOSED NEW INTERCHANGE CONSTRUCTION AT U.S. 20 AND S.R. 2 IN LAPORTE COUNTY
The Indiana Department of Transportation (INDOT) will hold a public hearing on Wednesday, August 1, 2018 at 6:00 p.m. (local time) at the New Prairie Middle School Cafeteria, 5325 North Cougar Road, New Carlisle, IN 46552.   The purpose of the public hearing is to offer all interested persons an opportunity to comment on current design plans for a proposed new interchange at US 20 and State Road (SR) 2, between the towns of Rolling Prairie and New Carlisle, located in LaPorte County, Indiana.
The preferred alternative will convert the existing signalized intersection to a new grade separated, "dog-bone"  interchange.  The east-west corridor will remain at grade and traffic will flow uninterrupted.  The north-south corridor will be elevated and a new bridge will be constructed overtop the east-west corridor.  The dog-bone interchange will utilize roundabouts north and south of the bridge.  This modification from a more typical stop-controlled interchange will further reduce conflict points, is anticipated to provide safer and more efficient access from the off-ramps into mainline traffic flow, and reduces impacts to adjacent properties by containing the improvements within the existing right-of-way.  Additional right-of-way is not anticipated to be necessary and maintenance of traffic will be phased. The first phase will involve lane restrictions along the east-west corridor and road closures with corresponding detours for the north-south corridor.
The official state maintained detour route will utilize SR 39 to the west and US 31 to the east.  Detoured traffic will be directed between those roads by way of US 20/SR 2, through the subject intersection.  The second phase of the project construction will utilize the same detour, but will also require temporary short-term daytime closures (with flaggers) along the east-west route to accommodate bridge construction. Access would be maintained to all local properties.  School corporations and emergency services will be notified prior to any construction that would block or limit access.
The environmental document and preliminary design plans are available to view prior to the public hearing at the following locations:
Rolling Prairie Public Library , 1 East Michigan Street, Rolling Prairie, IN 46371
Phone # (219) 778-2390
INDOT La Porte District Office, 315 E Boyd Blvd., La Porte, IN Phone # (855) 464-6368
Hearings Examiner, Indiana Government Center North, N642, 100 North Senate Ave., Indianapolis, IN 46204 2216, Phone # (317) 234 0796
Public statements for the record will be taken as part of the public hearing procedure.  All verbal statements recorded during the public hearing and all written comments submitted prior to, during and for a period of two (2) weeks following the hearing date, will be evaluated, considered and addressed in subsequent environmental documentation.  Written comments in regard to the project may be submitted prior to the public hearing and within the comment period to: INDOT Public Hearings, IGCN Room N642, 100 North Senate Avenue, Indianapolis, IN 46204.
With advance notice, INDOT can provide accommodation for persons with disabilities and/or limited English speaking ability and persons needing auxiliary aids or services such as interpreters, signers, readers, or large print.  Should accommodation be required, please contact Rickie Clark, Office of Public Involvement at (317) 232-6601, or email rclark@indot.in.gov.   
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 16, 2018, 01:34:11 PM
Also From INDOT:

NOTICE OF PUBLIC HEARING

The Indiana Department of Transportation (INDOT) will hold a public hearing on Thursday, August 2, 2018 at 6:00 p.m. (local time) at the St. John Town Hall, 10955 West 93rd Avenue, St. John, Indiana 46373. The purpose of the public hearing is to offer all interested persons an opportunity to comment on current design plans for a proposed US 41 roadway widening and added center turn lanes from US 231 north for 1.5 miles to approximately Standard Drive within the Town of St. John, located in Lake County.

The project proposes to modify and widen the US 41 roadway to include a 14-foot wide auxiliary center left-turn lane throughout the length of the project area. Exceptions will be at intersections where left turns already exist and at bridge or culvert structures. The current north and south bound lanes will remain as through lanes. Existing driveway culverts will be replaced in-kind as needed, and two new detention basins will be constructed. No detours are required for this project, however there will be phased lane closures and shifting of traffic as needed. Access to all properties along the US 41 corridor will be maintained during construction. Construction of the project will require approximately 3 acres of new permanent right-of-way. Federal and state funds are proposed for use towards the construction of this project.

The environmental document and preliminary design plans are available to view prior to the public hearing at the following locations:
1.   St. John Branch of the Lake Co. Public Library, 9450 Wicker Ave., St. John, IN 46373         Phone# (219) 365-5379
2.   INDOT LaPorte District at 315 E. Boyd Rd., LaPorte, IN  46350, Phone # (855) 463-6848
3.    Hearings Examiner, Room N642-COM of the IGCN, 100 North Senate Ave., Indianapolis, IN         46204 2216, Phone # (317) 234-0796

Public statements for the record will be taken as part of the public hearing procedure. All verbal statements recorded during the public hearing and all written comments submitted prior to, during and for a period of two (2) weeks following the hearing date, will be evaluated, considered and addressed in subsequent environmental documentation. Verbal comments may be restricted to time limitations based on the number of speakers. Written comments in regard to the project may be submitted prior to the public hearing and within the comment period to: INDOT Public Hearings, IGCN Room N642, 100 North Senate Avenue, Indianapolis, IN 46204.

With advance notice, INDOT can provide accommodation for persons with disabilities and/or limited English speaking ability and persons needing auxiliary aids or services such as interpreters, signers, readers, or large print.  Should accommodation be needed please contact Rickie Clark, Office of Public Involvement at (317) 232-6601, or email rclark@indot.in.gov.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 18, 2018, 12:28:03 AM
The stretch of US 20 between I-94 and Indiana 2 has been a major point of contention, with all the accidents (preventable as they are). Coupled with the current resurfacing and centerline rumble strips, that should alleviate some of the issues, though no amount of safety measures will matter until they address the increasing stupidity/ignorance of the average driver.

I will say similar work that was done to the Indiana 49-Vale Park Road intersection (now interchange) has definitely improved the safety and flow of that small stretch, so there is precedent.

As for US 41 in St. John, that section of road could use the love. There's a plaza in the area that have non-lighted entrances, so imagine pulling off a left turn in the middle of an area that has speed limits between 45 and 55 mph. Sucks they will have to rip up that freshly laid pavement, but it's a necessary evil.

Indiana 51 is the latest road to have centerline rumble strips installed as part of its rehabilitation project from at least 61st Avenue to US 30. I didn't even know that was part of the work and it is a pleasant surprise.

One more quick note: crews are now resurfacing the remaining unfinished portion of the US 231 overpass on I-65, which means traffic have shifted to the inside. Because of this, the northbound lanes are separated by the median (left lane is sharing the southbound bridge). Be cautious if you're merging onto northbound I-65 from US 231. It's disorienting because it looks like you're going straight into traffic, but you're not. There's plenty of time to merge, then all lanes fuse together north of the bridge.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 18, 2018, 07:41:20 AM
it makes no sense for US 20 and SR 2 swapping routes there, they should be reversed. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 18, 2018, 09:04:06 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 18, 2018, 12:28:03 AM
The stretch of US 20 between I-94 and Indiana 2 has been a major point of contention, with all the accidents (preventable as they are). Coupled with the current resurfacing and centerline rumble strips, that should alleviate some of the issues, though no amount of safety measures will matter until they address the increasing stupidity/ignorance of the average driver.

I will say similar work that was done to the Indiana 49-Vale Park Road intersection (now interchange) has definitely improved the safety and flow of that small stretch, so there is precedent.

As for US 41 in St. John, that section of road could use the love. There's a plaza in the area that have non-lighted entrances, so imagine pulling off a left turn in the middle of an area that has speed limits between 45 and 55 mph. Sucks they will have to rip up that freshly laid pavement, but it's a necessary evil.

Indiana 51 is the latest road to have centerline rumble strips installed as part of its rehabilitation project from at least 61st Avenue to US 30. I didn't even know that was part of the work and it is a pleasant surprise.

One more quick note: crews are now resurfacing the remaining unfinished portion of the US 231 overpass on I-65, which means traffic have shifted to the inside. Because of this, the northbound lanes are separated by the median (left lane is sharing the southbound bridge). Be cautious if you're merging onto northbound I-65 from US 231. It's disorienting because it looks like you're going straight into traffic, but you're not. There's plenty of time to merge, then all lanes fuse together north of the bridge.

I drive 20/2 between Michigan City and South Bend several times a year.  The number of people who putt along in the left lane at or below the speed limit with no cars in sight in the right lane is astounding.  I see why there are a lot of accidents. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 18, 2018, 09:05:31 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 18, 2018, 07:41:20 AM
it makes no sense for US 20 and SR 2 swapping routes there, they should be reversed. 

The only thing I can figure is that the current routing of 20 is more or less the routing of the old Michigan Road and that's why it hasn't gotten switched.  If they're going to construct an interchange that would be an ideal time to make the switch though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 18, 2018, 07:07:53 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 18, 2018, 09:05:31 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 18, 2018, 07:41:20 AM
it makes no sense for US 20 and SR 2 swapping routes there, they should be reversed. 

The only thing I can figure is that the current routing of 20 is more or less the routing of the old Michigan Road and that's why it hasn't gotten switched.  If they're going to construct an interchange that would be an ideal time to make the switch though.

It would make a lot of sense. Indiana 2 would still end at the Valley Parkway, and US 20 would still be defaulted onto the Parkway, just two miles further south and not crossing the road it left (or is about to join) about 10 miles west. By now, I'm sure all references to US 20 within the South Bend-Mishawaka limits have been removed (I saw them before, but that was way back in 2008), so that would make the switch feasible. The mileage difference would be negligible, so no need to redo the mileposts.

When control cities are assigned at this interchange, the one thing I'd do (assuming alignments are switched to where Indiana 2 and US 20 stay on their physical roads) is give Elkhart to US 20 eastbound. Indiana 2 east would serve a more direct feed to downtown South Bend and its major transit centers. Plus, US 20 goes beyond the area whereas Indiana 2 does not, so assigning a further away control city would be ideal.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on July 19, 2018, 03:13:54 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 18, 2018, 07:07:53 PM
By now, I'm sure all references to US 20 within the South Bend-Mishawaka limits have been removed (I saw them before, but that was way back in 2008), so that would make the switch feasible.
(Emphasis added.)

Not exactly.

Here's an old one: https://goo.gl/maps/ao8DbTQm2S42. Note that this sign never got updated to Business 20. It's probably the only one left in downtown SB. Most route markers have disappeared under the Smart Streets project. This one will likely disappear soon.

Multiple Business 20 shields (like these (https://goo.gl/maps/bLc6WxGxPb42)) are posted on the east side of South Bend, where the route jogs from Colfax to McKinley via Jacobs St. These signs are quite new. They are likely to remain, since they mark the primary route between downtown South Bend and the near-northside Mishawaka business district.

More signs at corner of McKinley and Ironwood Dr.: https://goo.gl/maps/cA2tyBfvK4F2.

At Main St. (formerly SR 331) in Mishawaka (I couldn't get GSV zoomed in any better): https://goo.gl/maps/s3566RUtAe42.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 19, 2018, 09:13:47 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 18, 2018, 07:07:53 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 18, 2018, 09:05:31 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 18, 2018, 07:41:20 AM
it makes no sense for US 20 and SR 2 swapping routes there, they should be reversed. 

The only thing I can figure is that the current routing of 20 is more or less the routing of the old Michigan Road and that's why it hasn't gotten switched.  If they're going to construct an interchange that would be an ideal time to make the switch though.

It would make a lot of sense. Indiana 2 would still end at the Valley Parkway, and US 20 would still be defaulted onto the Parkway, just two miles further south and not crossing the road it left (or is about to join) about 10 miles west. By now, I'm sure all references to US 20 within the South Bend-Mishawaka limits have been removed (I saw them before, but that was way back in 2008), so that would make the switch feasible. The mileage difference would be negligible, so no need to redo the mileposts.

When control cities are assigned at this interchange, the one thing I'd do (assuming alignments are switched to where Indiana 2 and US 20 stay on their physical roads) is give Elkhart to US 20 eastbound. Indiana 2 east would serve a more direct feed to downtown South Bend and its major transit centers. Plus, US 20 goes beyond the area whereas Indiana 2 does not, so assigning a further away control city would be ideal.

Even if they don't swap the routes, because of tradition or laziness or whatever, they should still at least fix the control cities on the bypass exits.  Right now, Michigan City is signed at 20 and LaPorte at 2, but the fastest way to get to either is via 2.  The only control "city" for 20 should be New Carlisle.  Going to New Carlisle or wanting to follow the Old Michigan Road are really the only reasons to take 20 instead of 2. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 19, 2018, 09:19:39 AM
Quote from: theline on July 19, 2018, 03:13:54 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 18, 2018, 07:07:53 PM
By now, I'm sure all references to US 20 within the South Bend-Mishawaka limits have been removed (I saw them before, but that was way back in 2008), so that would make the switch feasible.
(Emphasis added.)

Not exactly.

Here's an old one: https://goo.gl/maps/ao8DbTQm2S42. Note that this sign never got updated to Business 20. It's probably the only one left in downtown SB. Most route markers have disappeared under the Smart Streets project. This one will likely disappear soon.

Multiple Business 20 shields (like these (https://goo.gl/maps/bLc6WxGxPb42)) are posted on the east side of South Bend, where the route jogs from Colfax to McKinley via Jacobs St. These signs are quite new. They are likely to remain, since they mark the primary route between downtown South Bend and the near-northside Mishawaka business district.

More signs at corner of McKinley and Ironwood Dr.: https://goo.gl/maps/cA2tyBfvK4F2.

At Main St. (formerly SR 331) in Mishawaka (I couldn't get GSV zoomed in any better): https://goo.gl/maps/s3566RUtAe42.

before that project Business US 31 and 20 were actually well signed, and easily followed.  I bet if someone asked, they would actually put signs back up.  Things like that are afterthoughts, not many designers are also roadgeeks unfortunately!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 19, 2018, 08:16:06 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 19, 2018, 09:13:47 AMEven if they don't swap the routes, because of tradition or laziness or whatever, they should still at least fix the control cities on the bypass exits.  Right now, Michigan City is signed at 20 and LaPorte at 2, but the fastest way to get to either is via 2.  The only control "city" for 20 should be New Carlisle.  Going to New Carlisle or wanting to follow the Old Michigan Road are really the only reasons to take 20 instead of 2.

I was never a fan of assigning the control city of Michigan City to US 20 west in that area, for the same reason. Maybe I would assign Michigan City for US 20 West only for southbound traffic, for the sole reason that this exit is first, but Indiana 2 would get the priority.

Also, I'm not a fan of simply using "South Bend"  for the exits going into the city. I think it's well established that South Bend is the next chain of exits between the US 31 separation and the Michigan State Line (Toll Road excluded), so it wouldn't hurt to be more specific. At the Indiana 2 cloverleaf, I would simply use "EAST Western Ave.,"  and then would use "Lincolnway, Airport"  for the US 20 cloverleaf. Both lead to downtown, but establish each road's respective purpose.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on July 20, 2018, 01:23:47 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 19, 2018, 09:19:39 AM
before that project Business US 31 and 20 were actually well signed, and easily followed.  I bet if someone asked, they would actually put signs back up.  Things like that are afterthoughts, not many designers are also roadgeeks unfortunately!

I'll take that as a challenge. I'll contact Mayor Pete or his people and see what I can do. I think signage on the Lincolnway portion of BR 20 was also mostly removed when it got the "streetscape" treatment. I'll mention that too.

Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 19, 2018, 08:16:06 PM
Also, I'm not a fan of simply using "South Bend"  for the exits going into the city. I think it's well established that South Bend is the next chain of exits between the US 31 separation and the Michigan State Line (Toll Road excluded), so it wouldn't hurt to be more specific. At the Indiana 2 cloverleaf, I would simply use "EAST Western Ave.,"  and then would use "Lincolnway, Airport"  for the US 20 cloverleaf. Both lead to downtown, but establish each road's respective purpose.

I've always thought that the exits going into the city were poorly marked. Your suggestions are good. I'd also add exit numbers. I've got no idea why they've not been used. The only question would be whether to use US-20 mileage or US-31 mileage for the exit numbers for the multiplex area. Currently, US-20 mileage is used on the mile markers.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 20, 2018, 07:51:11 AM
Quote from: theline on July 20, 2018, 01:23:47 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 19, 2018, 09:19:39 AM
before that project Business US 31 and 20 were actually well signed, and easily followed.  I bet if someone asked, they would actually put signs back up.  Things like that are afterthoughts, not many designers are also roadgeeks unfortunately!

I'll take that as a challenge. I'll contact Mayor Pete or his people and see what I can do. I think signage on the Lincolnway portion of BR 20 was also mostly removed when it got the "streetscape" treatment. I'll mention that too.

Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 19, 2018, 08:16:06 PM
Also, I'm not a fan of simply using "South Bend"  for the exits going into the city. I think it's well established that South Bend is the next chain of exits between the US 31 separation and the Michigan State Line (Toll Road excluded), so it wouldn't hurt to be more specific. At the Indiana 2 cloverleaf, I would simply use "EAST Western Ave.,"  and then would use "Lincolnway, Airport"  for the US 20 cloverleaf. Both lead to downtown, but establish each road's respective purpose.

I've always thought that the exits going into the city were poorly marked. Your suggestions are good. I'd also add exit numbers. I've got no idea why they've not been used. The only question would be whether to use US-20 mileage or US-31 mileage for the exit numbers for the multiplex area. Currently, US-20 mileage is used on the mile markers.

Good! let us know what you hear from the city! 

Also, I'm not sure why they didn't add exit numbers when they finished the bypass a few years ago.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 20, 2018, 06:09:28 PM
I know someone brought this up not too long ago, so this will be good news for Michigan City drivers. Next week, work will begin on US 20 from (Laporte/Porter) County Line Road to the Indiana 212/US 35 cloverleaf. There will be continuous lane closures and reduced speed limits throughout the zone. Work is scheduled to last through October.

Also, the ramp from the westbound Toll Road to Lake Station is reopen, as of today.

Regarding adding exit tabs to the US 20/31 bypass, I wouldn't be surprised if INDOT revisited this topic in light of the recent freeway conversions of US 31 further downstate. I think the US 31 portion would get the tabs, but I think they cut it off where US 20 stands alone.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 20, 2018, 09:34:14 PM
Speaking of the exit signs around the South Bend area. It's been my observation that within urban areas of Indiana the signage usually just mentions the route number and the street name with no control cities. It's this way along I-465 around Indianapolis, I-80/94 in Northwest Indiana and I-69 through Fort Wayne. Control cities receive auxiliary sign status approaching their respective exits. I wonder if perhaps a changeover to this style along the bypass around South Bend could happen in respect to all the other ideas shared here.

I'm honestly a bit surprised that they don't use the exit numbers for the US 31 part of the bypass already to match up to the rest of the highway. As well as assign exit numbers to the US 24 and SR 25 interchanges along US 31 near Peru and Rochester respectively.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 25, 2018, 08:56:44 AM
INDOT says the SR 61 Boonville Bypass will be open next month.  Not sure why that ties into the 261 intersection and not the 61 intersection with 62.  Probably property issues.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jnewkirk77 on July 26, 2018, 12:26:03 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 25, 2018, 08:56:44 AM
INDOT says the SR 61 Boonville Bypass will be open next month.  Not sure why that ties into the 261 intersection and not the 61 intersection with 62.  Probably property issues.

I think it had more to do with the railroad crossing being so close to 61/62, but it also didn't hurt that Warrick County was willing to offer up some existing county roads to help with the ROW.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 27, 2018, 02:49:11 PM
https://www.courierpress.com/story/news/2018/07/26/draft-indot-recommendation-no-interchange-evansvilles-east-side/839580002/

Here is a story about INDOT providing a long list of excuses in order to avoid spending money to actually solve a problem. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Crash_It on July 28, 2018, 02:29:46 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 18, 2018, 07:41:20 AM
it makes no sense for US 20 and SR 2 swapping routes there, they should be reversed.

It does this because IN2 goes directly into SB whereas US20 bypasses it. Having IN2 end on the parkway would mean basically a road to nowhere. That whole path drags as it is, can't count how many times I've struggled staying awake driving on it. What I don't get however, is why the current IN2 ends at the interchange for the parkway instead of continuing along Western Ave into SB and ending at the intersection with business 20 or IN23. That would make more sense.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 28, 2018, 04:54:00 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on July 28, 2018, 02:29:46 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 18, 2018, 07:41:20 AM
it makes no sense for US 20 and SR 2 swapping routes there, they should be reversed.

It does this because IN2 goes directly into SB whereas US20 bypasses it. Having IN2 end on the parkway would mean basically a road to nowhere. That whole path drags as it is, can't count how many times I've struggled staying awake driving on it. What I don't get however, is why the current IN2 ends at the interchange for the parkway instead of continuing along Western Ave into SB and ending at the intersection with business 20 or IN23. That would make more sense.

IN 2 used to follow Western all the way to downtown, but it was turned back to the city a long time ago.  One of the first of what is now a regular practice by INDOT.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Crash_It on July 28, 2018, 08:49:53 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 28, 2018, 04:54:00 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on July 28, 2018, 02:29:46 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 18, 2018, 07:41:20 AM
it makes no sense for US 20 and SR 2 swapping routes there, they should be reversed.

It does this because IN2 goes directly into SB whereas US20 bypasses it. Having IN2 end on the parkway would mean basically a road to nowhere. That whole path drags as it is, can't count how many times I've struggled staying awake driving on it. What I don't get however, is why the current IN2 ends at the interchange for the parkway instead of continuing along Western Ave into SB and ending at the intersection with business 20 or IN23. That would make more sense.

IN 2 used to follow Western all the way to downtown, but it was turned back to the city a long time ago.  One of the first of what is now a regular practice by INDOT.

IDOT is guilty of this too, only a handful of state routes are in the Chicago City limits and many of them are just municipal extensions (marked as a state route but maintained by the city. Examples of such are: IL64, IL19, US14 and US41. Others were decommissioned entirely (IL38 ends right before the city). This trend can also be observed in Lake County with IL120, IL132 and County Highway A22 ending right at the Waukegan City Limits. Wisconsin looks to be doing the same as well as HWY50 is planned to be turned over to the city of Kenosha east of WI31 in the next couple years. Anyway, I'm glad US20 through LaPorte County is finally getting attention, it was probably the worst stretch of pavement one could drive on.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on July 28, 2018, 09:08:56 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on July 28, 2018, 08:49:53 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 28, 2018, 04:54:00 PM
IN 2 used to follow Western all the way to downtown, but it was turned back to the city a long time ago.  One of the first of what is now a regular practice by INDOT.

IDOT is guilty of this too, only a handful of state routes are in the Chicago City limits and many of them are just municipal extensions (marked as a state route but maintained by the city. Examples of such are: IL64, IL19, US14 and US41. Others were decommissioned entirely (IL38 ends right before the city). This trend can also be observed in Lake County with IL120, IL132 and County Highway A22 ending right at the Waukegan City Limits.

I think in IDOT's case it is worse, as for a decent number of routes the numbered route ends but the roadway continues under IDOT's maintenance and/or jurisdiction.  IL 38/Roosevelt Road, IL 58/Dempster Street, IL 21/Milwaukee Avenue, and US 34/Ogden Avenue are examples.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 28, 2018, 09:14:11 PM
Us 34 ends in a weird place. Should end at us 45
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Crash_It on July 29, 2018, 12:11:09 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 28, 2018, 09:14:11 PM
Us 34 ends in a weird place. Should end at us 45

It ends at IL43 where US66 then takes over on Ogden. This is another unique IL trait where one road ends at another with the numbers changed around, For example US14 ends at US41 and IL22 starts at US41 but ends at US14.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: edwaleni on July 30, 2018, 12:46:09 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 27, 2018, 02:49:11 PM
https://www.courierpress.com/story/news/2018/07/26/draft-indot-recommendation-no-interchange-evansvilles-east-side/839580002/

Here is a story about INDOT providing a long list of excuses in order to avoid spending money to actually solve a problem.

It sounds more like an issue of priorities. The Lloyd doesn't have any high accident hot spots but serves a lot of east/west suburban traffic.

I am guessing INDOT is focused on I-69 when it comes to strategic funding in the SW.

If a study showed no chronic and immediate issues that don't sacrifice safety, then I wouldn't call that spend avoidance.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 07, 2018, 10:01:20 AM
65 is back open and traffic is much better now, well normal, on 465.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Henry on August 07, 2018, 11:09:01 AM
Quote from: edwaleni on July 30, 2018, 12:46:09 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 27, 2018, 02:49:11 PM
https://www.courierpress.com/story/news/2018/07/26/draft-indot-recommendation-no-interchange-evansvilles-east-side/839580002/

Here is a story about INDOT providing a long list of excuses in order to avoid spending money to actually solve a problem.

It sounds more like an issue of priorities. The Lloyd doesn't have any high accident hot spots but serves a lot of east/west suburban traffic.

I am guessing INDOT is focused on I-69 when it comes to strategic funding in the SW.

If a study showed no chronic and immediate issues that don't sacrifice safety, then I wouldn't call that spend avoidance.


Since the routing of the I-69 bridge over the Ohio River has not been selected yet, this makes sense as a short-term solution. This will certainly change when the final routing is settled, and I-69 has a new interchange at the Lloyd. BTW, I prefer the Central Alternative over the West ones.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on August 07, 2018, 11:23:01 AM
I do not believe there will be any new interchange between the Lloyd and I-69. The Ohio River Bridge, whichever route they decide will have no bearing on the Lloyd Expressway.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 27, 2018, 08:06:27 PM
Crews have installed a new overhead time sign on I-65 southbound just before the 61st Avenue interchange, the first for that direction of the highway in this area. When it goes live, it will give travel time to US 231 (nine miles from that point) and Indiana 2 (16 miles from that point). It has not been updated into the Trafficwise site yet. According to INDOT, the system updates should be completed within the week, which will include an updated interface and new cameras (where those new cameras will be located is yet to be determined).

I have no on the field updates at this time, but INDOT says the I-65 expansion project, as well as the Kankakee River bridge project further south, is in the wind down phase, and is still on schedule to be completed by the end of October.

EDIT: There is a lot of progress made between US 30 and US 231 (again, didn't go down to Indiana 2). Between US 30 and 109th Avenue, crews have striped the future middle and right lanes, which means a pattern shift is likely to happen soon (possibly after the Labor Day weekend). With some exceptions within the immediate area around the 109th Avenue interchange, as well as the southbound side just before US 231, the future outer shoulders are almost complete.

Resurfacing of the US 231 bridge is all but finished. Crews are removing foundation pieces from the just-finished northbound span and are completing work off the mainline. With the span completed, the split lanes are removed for northbound traffic. Operations are set to move to the 109th Avenue and Beaver Dam Ditch bridges.

Final tidbits: new to I-65 (southbound only) is a parking space counter for the next three rest areas, along with their respective distances from said sign, which is located by the 93rd Avenue overpass. It isn't live yet, but it is expected to be at the same time the new travel time sign mentioned above will go live. Also, it appears a new VMS gantry will go up just before the 101st Avenue bridge, though its purpose remains unknown (I'm curious what three major points will be used for time and distance).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on August 28, 2018, 11:19:32 PM
On my way back from Indy, I saw these parking lots available signs and the distance for the next three rest areas... I would say that personally that is BADLY needed because sometimes, I would see trucks park on the side of the shoulder on I-65!!  :clap: :clap: :clap:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 29, 2018, 07:59:58 AM
is this new widening in concrete or asphalt?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 29, 2018, 01:25:27 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 29, 2018, 07:59:58 AM
is this new widening in concrete or asphalt?

The portion from US 30 to just south of US 231 is concrete. Then it's asphalt from that point to just south of Indiana 2.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: dvferyance on August 30, 2018, 07:39:48 PM
According the Wikipedia there is a proposed I-269 in Indiana but I can't find any information about it? Can anyone confirm this? I know Wikipedia isn't the most reliable source for roads.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 30, 2018, 07:42:40 PM
Quote from: dvferyance on August 30, 2018, 07:39:48 PM
According the Wikipedia there is a proposed I-269 in Indiana but I can't find any information about it? Can anyone confirm this? I know Wikipedia isn't the most reliable source for roads.

Might be fake news, but it could be the Anthony Wayne Expressway, a highway that was proposed in downtown FT Wayne.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on August 31, 2018, 10:35:53 AM
Quote from: dvferyance on August 30, 2018, 07:39:48 PM
According the Wikipedia there is a proposed I-269 in Indiana but I can't find any information about it? Can anyone confirm this? I know Wikipedia isn't the most reliable source for roads.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstate_69_in_Indiana#Indiana_Commerce_Connector
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Interstate 69 Fan on August 31, 2018, 11:34:06 AM
Quote from: dvferyance on August 30, 2018, 07:39:48 PM
According the Wikipedia there is a proposed I-269 in Indiana but I can't find any information about it? Can anyone confirm this? I know Wikipedia isn't the most reliable source for roads.
I-269, or I-470, was the original designation for the "Indiana Commerce Connector,"  an outer beltway of Indianapolis from I-70 near Mooresville to I-69 around Exit 210.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: edwaleni on August 31, 2018, 11:36:10 PM
Quote from: Interstate 69 Fan on August 31, 2018, 11:34:06 AM
Quote from: dvferyance on August 30, 2018, 07:39:48 PM
According the Wikipedia there is a proposed I-269 in Indiana but I can't find any information about it? Can anyone confirm this? I know Wikipedia isn't the most reliable source for roads.
I-269, or I-470, was the original designation for the "Indiana Commerce Connector,"  an outer beltway of Indianapolis from I-70 near Mooresville to I-69 around Exit 210.

Does anyone know if the Ronald Reagan Parkway in Hendricks County ever get more than it is?

A relative told me that the ROW is supposed to support a Super 4 from I-74 in Brownsburg to I-69 around Smith Valley. Right now it ends at IN-67 south of the airport.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 01, 2018, 01:28:14 AM
There's virtually no way it can connect to future I-69 near Smith Valley Road as the highway currently is. That is a lot of land in between the two spaces and most certainly is it not reserved ROW at the moment. The city of Indianapolis is currently planning out an extension of Ameriplex Parkway (Ronald Reagan Parkway's name inside Indianapolis) to the southeast to meet up Southport Road at Mann Road. From there one can follow Southport across the White River to a future interchange with I-69. Right now it looks as if the planned corridor would be four-lane to Mann Road but the stretch of Southport is currently only two lanes and would need a new bridge across the river to make it four-lanes to I-69. In any case a new four-lane bridge across the river would have to be built if the roadway were to ever connect with I-69 in any way.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: gilpdawg on September 01, 2018, 11:36:52 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on August 28, 2018, 11:19:32 PM
On my way back from Indy, I saw these parking lots available signs and the distance for the next three rest areas... I would say that personally that is BADLY needed because sometimes, I would see trucks park on the side of the shoulder on I-65!!  :clap: :clap: :clap:
There's one of these on 70 WB near Richmond as well. Not active yet.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: edwaleni on September 03, 2018, 01:11:26 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 01, 2018, 01:28:14 AM
There's virtually no way it can connect to future I-69 near Smith Valley Road as the highway currently is. That is a lot of land in between the two spaces and most certainly is it not reserved ROW at the moment. The city of Indianapolis is currently planning out an extension of Ameriplex Parkway (Ronald Reagan Parkway's name inside Indianapolis) to the southeast to meet up Southport Road at Mann Road. From there one can follow Southport across the White River to a future interchange with I-69. Right now it looks as if the planned corridor would be four-lane to Mann Road but the stretch of Southport is currently only two lanes and would need a new bridge across the river to make it four-lanes to I-69. In any case a new four-lane bridge across the river would have to be built if the roadway were to ever connect with I-69 in any way.

I think you mean this?

http://www.indy.gov/eGov/City/DPW/RebuildIndy/Projects/Documents/Ameriplex%20Extension%20Public%20Meeting%20Handouts%205-11-17.pdf (http://www.indy.gov/eGov/City/DPW/RebuildIndy/Projects/Documents/Ameriplex%20Extension%20Public%20Meeting%20Handouts%205-11-17.pdf)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: edwaleni on September 03, 2018, 01:19:24 AM
Quote from: edwaleni on September 03, 2018, 01:11:26 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 01, 2018, 01:28:14 AM
There's virtually no way it can connect to future I-69 near Smith Valley Road as the highway currently is. That is a lot of land in between the two spaces and most certainly is it not reserved ROW at the moment. The city of Indianapolis is currently planning out an extension of Ameriplex Parkway (Ronald Reagan Parkway's name inside Indianapolis) to the southeast to meet up Southport Road at Mann Road. From there one can follow Southport across the White River to a future interchange with I-69. Right now it looks as if the planned corridor would be four-lane to Mann Road but the stretch of Southport is currently only two lanes and would need a new bridge across the river to make it four-lanes to I-69. In any case a new four-lane bridge across the river would have to be built if the roadway were to ever connect with I-69 in any way.

I think you mean this?

http://www.indy.gov/eGov/City/DPW/RebuildIndy/Projects/Documents/Ameriplex%20Extension%20Public%20Meeting%20Handouts%205-11-17.pdf (http://www.indy.gov/eGov/City/DPW/RebuildIndy/Projects/Documents/Ameriplex%20Extension%20Public%20Meeting%20Handouts%205-11-17.pdf)

I just checked and INDOT is going to take the Ronald Reagan Parkway all the way to I-65 in 2020. 

All the way to either Whitestown Parkway, or to the IN-267 exit with I-65 where the Amazon Center is.

Maybe this is where I got my story wrong, he might have said I-65, not I-69.  Still, I didn't realize INDOT was going to take it that far.

http://www.brownsburg.org/egov/documents/1370357017_461242.pdf (http://www.brownsburg.org/egov/documents/1370357017_461242.pdf)

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: edwaleni on September 03, 2018, 01:43:12 AM
Quote from: edwaleni on September 03, 2018, 01:19:24 AM
Quote from: edwaleni on September 03, 2018, 01:11:26 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 01, 2018, 01:28:14 AM
There's virtually no way it can connect to future I-69 near Smith Valley Road as the highway currently is. That is a lot of land in between the two spaces and most certainly is it not reserved ROW at the moment. The city of Indianapolis is currently planning out an extension of Ameriplex Parkway (Ronald Reagan Parkway's name inside Indianapolis) to the southeast to meet up Southport Road at Mann Road. From there one can follow Southport across the White River to a future interchange with I-69. Right now it looks as if the planned corridor would be four-lane to Mann Road but the stretch of Southport is currently only two lanes and would need a new bridge across the river to make it four-lanes to I-69. In any case a new four-lane bridge across the river would have to be built if the roadway were to ever connect with I-69 in any way.

I think you mean this?

http://www.indy.gov/eGov/City/DPW/RebuildIndy/Projects/Documents/Ameriplex%20Extension%20Public%20Meeting%20Handouts%205-11-17.pdf (http://www.indy.gov/eGov/City/DPW/RebuildIndy/Projects/Documents/Ameriplex%20Extension%20Public%20Meeting%20Handouts%205-11-17.pdf)

I just checked and INDOT is going to take the Ronald Reagan Parkway all the way to I-65 in 2020. 

All the way to either Whitestown Parkway, or to the IN-267 exit with I-65 where the Amazon Center is.

Maybe this is where I got my story wrong, he might have said I-65, not I-69.  Still, I didn't realize INDOT was going to take it that far.

http://www.brownsburg.org/egov/documents/1370357017_461242.pdf (http://www.brownsburg.org/egov/documents/1370357017_461242.pdf)

In the I-69 Tier 2 study, they were identifying which E-W routes in the regional plans would/should be tied into the the I-69 traffic study.

Essentially they identified 3 routes from Smith Valley over to Mooresville that either need to be built that don't exist, widen Southport Road to 4 lanes and a host of others.

https://www.in.gov/indot/projects/i69/files/Draft_Purpose_and_Need.pdf (https://www.in.gov/indot/projects/i69/files/Draft_Purpose_and_Need.pdf)

Interesting is that they all tied in with Mann Road, which is where the Ameriplex Parkway will be extended to.

I would surmise that an additional Ameriplex Parkway extension (or whatever name it takes) will pop up not long or during construction of I-69 south of Indianapolis to meet these requirements.

Not only would this give I-69 way better access from the west of the White River, but get travelers to the airport from the south without having to tie up I-465 (ie: Martinsville resident reaching the airport)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 2trailertrucker on September 03, 2018, 12:37:32 PM
Quote from: edwaleni on September 03, 2018, 01:19:24 AM
Quote from: edwaleni on September 03, 2018, 01:11:26 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 01, 2018, 01:28:14 AM
There's virtually no way it can connect to future I-69 near Smith Valley Road as the highway currently is. That is a lot of land in between the two spaces and most certainly is it not reserved ROW at the moment. The city of Indianapolis is currently planning out an extension of Ameriplex Parkway (Ronald Reagan Parkway's name inside Indianapolis) to the southeast to meet up Southport Road at Mann Road. From there one can follow Southport across the White River to a future interchange with I-69. Right now it looks as if the planned corridor would be four-lane to Mann Road but the stretch of Southport is currently only two lanes and would need a new bridge across the river to make it four-lanes to I-69. In any case a new four-lane bridge across the river would have to be built if the roadway were to ever connect with I-69 in any way.

I think you mean this?

http://www.indy.gov/eGov/City/DPW/RebuildIndy/Projects/Documents/Ameriplex%20Extension%20Public%20Meeting%20Handouts%205-11-17.pdf (http://www.indy.gov/eGov/City/DPW/RebuildIndy/Projects/Documents/Ameriplex%20Extension%20Public%20Meeting%20Handouts%205-11-17.pdf)

I just checked and INDOT is going to take the Ronald Reagan Parkway all the way to I-65 in 2020. 

All the way to either Whitestown Parkway, or to the IN-267 exit with I-65 where the Amazon Center is.

Maybe this is where I got my story wrong, he might have said I-65, not I-69.  Still, I didn't realize INDOT was going to take it that far.

http://www.brownsburg.org/egov/documents/1370357017_461242.pdf (http://www.brownsburg.org/egov/documents/1370357017_461242.pdf)

Years ago, I went to the public hearing on the then proposed RR. After seeing the plans, I told one of the state people there that if they demolish the low bridge in SR 267 in Fayette, they could have a straight through route to I-65 without needing to go on I-465. When I said that, the state person got a higher up to talk to me. I was hauling gas out of Clermint, and we couldn't get underneath the bridge. The gentleman took notes and thanked me.

The next year, the underpass was gone, replaced with an at-grade crossing.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 04, 2018, 05:15:12 PM
Pretty big news today that will affect a large portion of the state.

The Indiana Toll Road Concession Company (ITRCC) is giving the state $1 billion in exchange for allowing a one-time 35% rate increase for trucks on the Indiana Toll Road. The bulk of the money will be used to speed up construction of Interstate 69 from Martinsville to I-465, but the funds will also be used to work improvements along US Highways 20 and 30, as well as speed up efforts to convert US 31 to full interstate standards from Indianapolis to the Michigan State Line.

The windfall will also go to expand rural broadband internet access, expand the network of hike, bike, and ride trails, allow nonstop international flights to and from Indianapolis International Airport, and free up resources for mowing and trash pickups along the highways.

If approved, the rate hike will be implemented in October. Passenger cars and trucks will not be affected.

Source here: https://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/lake-newsletter/state-to-receive-billion-in-exchange-for-allowing-higher-truck/article_640a7253-34cb-5bfe-a7fd-5b653ba4ef86.html (https://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/lake-newsletter/state-to-receive-billion-in-exchange-for-allowing-higher-truck/article_640a7253-34cb-5bfe-a7fd-5b653ba4ef86.html)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mvak36 on September 04, 2018, 06:56:33 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 04, 2018, 05:15:12 PM
Pretty big news today that will affect a large portion of the state.

The Indiana Toll Road Concession Company (ITRCC) is giving the state $1 billion in exchange for allowing a one-time 35% rate increase for trucks on the Indiana Toll Road. The bulk of the money will be used to speed up construction of Interstate 69 from Martinsville to I-465, but the funds will also be used to work improvements along US Highways 20 and 30, as well as speed up efforts to convert US 31 to full interstate standards from Indianapolis to the Michigan State Line.

The windfall will also go to expand rural broadband internet access, expand the network of hike, bike, and ride trails, allow nonstop international flights to and from Indianapolis International Airport, and free up resources for mowing and trash pickups along the highways.

If approved, the rate hike will be implemented in October. Passenger cars and trucks will not be affected.

Source here: https://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/lake-newsletter/state-to-receive-billion-in-exchange-for-allowing-higher-truck/article_640a7253-34cb-5bfe-a7fd-5b653ba4ef86.html (https://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/lake-newsletter/state-to-receive-billion-in-exchange-for-allowing-higher-truck/article_640a7253-34cb-5bfe-a7fd-5b653ba4ef86.html)

I saw that too. This article (https://www.wfyi.org/news/articles/state-announces-1b-infrastructure-investment-moves-up-i-69-completion-date) says that they could finish I-69 section 6 by 2024.

EDIT: Here is the factsheet. https://www.in.gov/gov/files/NextLevel%20Connections%20facts%20sheet.pdf
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 04, 2018, 10:01:49 PM
The fact sheet is quite revealing. Good that some of the money is going to help fund the double tracking of the main South Shore Line from Gary to Michigan City, as well as (a portion of) the South Shore Extension that has been bandied about in one form or another for at least a decade.

I also hope that the ITRCC uses some of the money to fix the section between Cline Avenue and I-65. There's no way a section that's been rebuilt seven years ago should look like it hasn't been touched in 20.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:00:45 PM
Wonder if it is really kosher for toll revenue from a facility to be used for funding an entire state's capital program.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ilpt4u on September 04, 2018, 11:11:16 PM
Quote from: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:00:45 PM
Wonder if it is really kosher for toll revenue from a facility to be used for funding an entire state's capital program.
Um, PA is calling...
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:20:37 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on September 04, 2018, 11:11:16 PM
Quote from: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:00:45 PM
Wonder if it is really kosher for toll revenue from a facility to be used for funding an entire state's capital program.
Um, PA is calling...
Not sure what you're saying.  Because PA infamously uses the Turnpike as a bank the practice is okay?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ilpt4u on September 04, 2018, 11:31:43 PM
Quote from: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:20:37 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on September 04, 2018, 11:11:16 PM
Quote from: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:00:45 PM
Wonder if it is really kosher for toll revenue from a facility to be used for funding an entire state's capital program.
Um, PA is calling...
Not sure what you're saying.  Because PA infamously uses the Turnpike as a bank the practice is okay?
Not that the practice is OK, but clearly the states of IN and PA think it is. And could include the City of Chicago, leasing out the Skyway

Personally, I think I-69 from Indy to Evansville should have been the Indiana North-South, or possibly Southwest Toll Road, but that ship already sailed...Has not a decent amount of the I-69 project in Indiana been paid for via the Toll Road lease?

Maybe if an upgraded US 41 in Indiana between Chicago and Evansville can become a freeway (maybe I-41 making it further South?) that could be a Truck/Freight Route, Chicago and Points Northwest to Nashville and Points Southeast, and that a viable Indiana North-South Toll Road, similar to I-80/90 being a Truck/Freight Route for Chicago and Points Northwest and Toledo and Points East on the current Indiana East-West Toll Road
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:57:14 PM
Also makes me wonder how much the Toll Road is keeping of the expected revenue from the toll increase.  How much of the expected revenue is this $1 billion?

Also wondering if the lease really is working out.  People are paying more to drive on the Toll Road, the capital program in Indiana is becoming reliant one these one-time draws from the Toll Road (spending the bulk on special projects rather than general maintenance of the system) and the state route relinquishing program continues, passing burdens onto localities.  Would the traveling public been better served without the lease?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mvak36 on September 05, 2018, 08:45:13 AM
So that factsheet said only 2 stoplights would remain on US31 between Indy and South Bend after the intersections listed in there are completed. Out of curiosity, where are those?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on September 05, 2018, 09:04:44 AM
Not counting flashing yellows, I counted 3 last night:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SEWIGuy on September 05, 2018, 09:38:02 AM
Quote from: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:20:37 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on September 04, 2018, 11:11:16 PM
Quote from: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:00:45 PM
Wonder if it is really kosher for toll revenue from a facility to be used for funding an entire state's capital program.
Um, PA is calling...
Not sure what you're saying.  Because PA infamously uses the Turnpike as a bank the practice is okay?


Sure.  They are both state agencies so I don't see a problem with it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Rothman on September 05, 2018, 10:39:58 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on September 05, 2018, 09:38:02 AM
Quote from: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:20:37 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on September 04, 2018, 11:11:16 PM
Quote from: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:00:45 PM
Wonder if it is really kosher for toll revenue from a facility to be used for funding an entire state's capital program.
Um, PA is calling...
Not sure what you're saying.  Because PA infamously uses the Turnpike as a bank the practice is okay?


Sure.  They are both state agencies so I don't see a problem with it.
I do not believe public authorities are technically state agencies.  At least here in NY, public authorities certainly have more autonomy, despite sometimes having state officials on their boards.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 05, 2018, 11:05:35 AM
I'm pretty sure INDOT has nothing to do with RR Pkwy, if they did, it would be SR 267
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: J N Winkler on September 05, 2018, 11:14:06 AM
Quote from: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:00:45 PMWonder if it is really kosher for toll revenue from a facility to be used for funding an entire state's capital program.

I am sure it is legal, but it does create a powerful rebuttal to the usual user-pays argument in favor of toll roads that is trotted out when a fuel tax increase is on the table.

Quote from: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:57:14 PMAlso wondering if the lease really is working out.  People are paying more to drive on the Toll Road, the capital program in Indiana is becoming reliant one these one-time draws from the Toll Road (spending the bulk on special projects rather than general maintenance of the system) and the state route relinquishing program continues, passing burdens onto localities.  Would the traveling public been better served without the lease?

The consensus appears to be that Cintra took a bath on the original 2003 lease, which helped scuttle similar privatization plans in Pennsylvania, Ohio, and New York, since there was an expectation that the private players would have wised up and not be willing to give any of those states as sweet a deal as Indiana got.

Using the Toll Road as a piggybank is perhaps more politically convenient in Indiana than it would be elsewhere because its location is so thoroughly specialized to serve out-of-state traffic.  The only metropolitan area of any importance it passes through is South Bend-Mishawaka-Elkhart and there are plenty of parallel free alternatives in the Chicago southeast suburbs, so it serves very little in-state traffic, while the toll-free alternatives for a Cleveland-Toledo-Chicago trunk itinerary involve at least 100 miles of out-of-the-way travel.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on September 05, 2018, 11:18:14 AM

[/quot
Quote from: bmeiser on September 05, 2018, 09:04:44 AM
Not counting flashing yellows, I counted 3 last night:

  • Division Rd. in Tipton County
  • SR 218 in Miami County - North of Grissom
  • W. 100N in Miami county - at the Gallahan Travel Plaza

I recall there being discussions about an interchange at Division Road.

http://www.kokomotribune.com/news/at-a-crossroads-discussions-start-about-potential-division-road-interchange/article_f86345b4-e284-11e6-8a7f-8b4c6b5f0991.html

An interchange at the travel plaza would seem to be too close to the US 24 interchange.



Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on September 05, 2018, 12:36:46 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on September 05, 2018, 11:18:14 AM

[/quot
Quote from: bmeiser on September 05, 2018, 09:04:44 AM
Not counting flashing yellows, I counted 3 last night:

  • Division Rd. in Tipton County
  • SR 218 in Miami County - North of Grissom
  • W. 100N in Miami county - at the Gallahan Travel Plaza

I recall there being discussions about an interchange at Division Road.

http://www.kokomotribune.com/news/at-a-crossroads-discussions-start-about-potential-division-road-interchange/article_f86345b4-e284-11e6-8a7f-8b4c6b5f0991.html

An interchange at the travel plaza would seem to be too close to the US 24 interchange.

I believe these are two different Divison Roads.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 05, 2018, 12:41:13 PM
The division road in question is the one right after the rr tracks. They're building a bridge over those tracks soon btw
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Rothman on September 05, 2018, 01:38:23 PM
Quote from: J N Winkler on September 05, 2018, 11:14:06 AM
Quote from: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:00:45 PMWonder if it is really kosher for toll revenue from a facility to be used for funding an entire state's capital program.

I am sure it is legal, but it does create a powerful rebuttal to the usual user-pays argument in favor of toll roads that is trotted out when a fuel tax increase is on the table.

Quote from: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:57:14 PMAlso wondering if the lease really is working out.  People are paying more to drive on the Toll Road, the capital program in Indiana is becoming reliant one these one-time draws from the Toll Road (spending the bulk on special projects rather than general maintenance of the system) and the state route relinquishing program continues, passing burdens onto localities.  Would the traveling public been better served without the lease?

The consensus appears to be that Cintra took a bath on the original 2003 lease, which helped scuttle similar privatization plans in Pennsylvania, Ohio, and New York, since there was an expectation that the private players would have wised up and not be willing to give any of those states as sweet a deal as Indiana got.

Using the Toll Road as a piggybank is perhaps more politically convenient in Indiana than it would be elsewhere because its location is so thoroughly specialized to serve out-of-state traffic.  The only metropolitan area of any importance it passes through is South Bend-Mishawaka-Elkhart and there are plenty of parallel free alternatives in the Chicago southeast suburbs, so it serves very little in-state traffic, while the toll-free alternatives for a Cleveland-Toledo-Chicago trunk itinerary involve at least 100 miles of out-of-the-way travel.
I agree with this assessment of Cintra's perspective, but I wonder about the public.  Travelers are paying more to travel the Indiana Toll Road.  Indiana lost a steadier stream of income from the Toll Road, since they are now dependent upon these one-time agreements with the private operator as outlined in the announcement and the money is targeted towards a host of special projects rather than just a boost to their capital program.  The fact Indiana blew through the first influx of funding from the Toll Road after the lease and then cried poverty is still disconcerting.

I suppose I am just wondering whether things are better or worse for Hoosiers since the lease.  I suspect for those unaffected by the special projects that things must be pretty volatile, especially as Indiana turns state routes over to localities.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 05, 2018, 01:49:44 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 04, 2018, 05:15:12 PM
Pretty big news today that will affect a large portion of the state.

The Indiana Toll Road Concession Company (ITRCC) is giving the state $1 billion in exchange for allowing a one-time 35% rate increase for trucks on the Indiana Toll Road. The bulk of the money will be used to speed up construction of Interstate 69 from Martinsville to I-465, but the funds will also be used to work improvements along US Highways 20 and 30, as well as speed up efforts to convert US 31 to full interstate standards from Indianapolis to the Michigan State Line.

The windfall will also go to expand rural broadband internet access, expand the network of hike, bike, and ride trails, allow nonstop international flights to and from Indianapolis International Airport, and free up resources for mowing and trash pickups along the highways.

If approved, the rate hike will be implemented in October. Passenger cars and trucks will not be affected.

Source here: https://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/lake-newsletter/state-to-receive-billion-in-exchange-for-allowing-higher-truck/article_640a7253-34cb-5bfe-a7fd-5b653ba4ef86.html (https://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/lake-newsletter/state-to-receive-billion-in-exchange-for-allowing-higher-truck/article_640a7253-34cb-5bfe-a7fd-5b653ba4ef86.html)

Really wish they would prioritize 6-laning the rest of I-65 and I-70 over converting the rest of US 31 to freeway.  Maybe go ahead and fix the railroad crossing/light at Division just north of Tipton but the rest can wait.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SEWIGuy on September 05, 2018, 02:19:57 PM
Quote from: Rothman on September 05, 2018, 10:39:58 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on September 05, 2018, 09:38:02 AM
Quote from: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:20:37 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on September 04, 2018, 11:11:16 PM
Quote from: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:00:45 PM
Wonder if it is really kosher for toll revenue from a facility to be used for funding an entire state's capital program.
Um, PA is calling...
Not sure what you're saying.  Because PA infamously uses the Turnpike as a bank the practice is okay?


Sure.  They are both state agencies so I don't see a problem with it.
I do not believe public authorities are technically state agencies.  At least here in NY, public authorities certainly have more autonomy, despite sometimes having state officials on their boards.


Well then they can sue them.  My guess is that this is all above board.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefro on September 05, 2018, 03:27:01 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 05, 2018, 01:49:44 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 04, 2018, 05:15:12 PM
Pretty big news today that will affect a large portion of the state.

The Indiana Toll Road Concession Company (ITRCC) is giving the state $1 billion in exchange for allowing a one-time 35% rate increase for trucks on the Indiana Toll Road. The bulk of the money will be used to speed up construction of Interstate 69 from Martinsville to I-465, but the funds will also be used to work improvements along US Highways 20 and 30, as well as speed up efforts to convert US 31 to full interstate standards from Indianapolis to the Michigan State Line.

The windfall will also go to expand rural broadband internet access, expand the network of hike, bike, and ride trails, allow nonstop international flights to and from Indianapolis International Airport, and free up resources for mowing and trash pickups along the highways.

If approved, the rate hike will be implemented in October. Passenger cars and trucks will not be affected.

Source here: https://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/lake-newsletter/state-to-receive-billion-in-exchange-for-allowing-higher-truck/article_640a7253-34cb-5bfe-a7fd-5b653ba4ef86.html (https://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/lake-newsletter/state-to-receive-billion-in-exchange-for-allowing-higher-truck/article_640a7253-34cb-5bfe-a7fd-5b653ba4ef86.html)

Really wish they would prioritize 6-laning the rest of I-65 and I-70 over converting the rest of US 31 to freeway.  Maybe go ahead and fix the railroad crossing/light at Division just north of Tipton but the rest can wait.

IIRC, I think they have gas tax money allocated for that.  It's going to be incredibly disruptive to traffic if they tried to do the whole I-65/I-70 project at once.  I-69 and upgrading US 31 are probably way further down the pike in terms of being close to shovel-ready.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on September 06, 2018, 03:19:18 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on September 04, 2018, 11:31:43 PM
Quote from: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:20:37 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on September 04, 2018, 11:11:16 PM
Quote from: Rothman on September 04, 2018, 11:00:45 PM
Wonder if it is really kosher for toll revenue from a facility to be used for funding an entire state's capital program.
Um, PA is calling...
Not sure what you're saying.  Because PA infamously uses the Turnpike as a bank the practice is okay?
Not that the practice is OK, but clearly the states of IN and PA think it is. And could include the City of Chicago, leasing out the Skyway

Personally, I think I-69 from Indy to Evansville should have been the Indiana North-South, or possibly Southwest Toll Road, but that ship already sailed...Has not a decent amount of the I-69 project in Indiana been paid for via the Toll Road lease?

Maybe if an upgraded US 41 in Indiana between Chicago and Evansville can become a freeway (maybe I-41 making it further South?) that could be a Truck/Freight Route, Chicago and Points Northwest to Nashville and Points Southeast, and that a viable Indiana North-South Toll Road, similar to I-80/90 being a Truck/Freight Route for Chicago and Points Northwest and Toledo and Points East on the current Indiana East-West Toll Road
With all due respect, please keep toll roads over there in Illinois as many (I would argue MOST) Hoosiers despise them! Tolling the I-69 extension was a stupid idea from the beginning, and thankfully was quickly buried.

As for the State of Indiana using our one toll road (not counting the Ohio River bridges) as a piggy bank for projects throughout the state, you have to remember it is located so far north that few Hoosiers ever use it, outside of those in & between South Bend and Gary (granted, a lot of people, but not compared to the whole state). A majority of the heavy truck traffic on it is pass-through from & to other states. Thus our politicians have little incentive NOT to use revenue from that highway elsewhere. Is that "fair"? Perhaps not, but I could argue that the whole idea of tolling highways in the first place is patently unfair.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: hbelkins on September 06, 2018, 09:27:27 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on September 06, 2018, 03:19:18 PM

As for the State of Indiana using our one toll road (not counting the Ohio River bridges) as a piggy bank for projects throughout the state, you have to remember it is located so far north that few Hoosiers ever use it, outside of those in & between South Bend and Gary (granted, a lot of people, but not compared to the whole state). A majority of the heavy truck traffic on it is pass-through from & to other states. Thus our politicians have little incentive NOT to use revenue from that highway elsewhere. Is that "fair"? Perhaps not, but I could argue that the whole idea of tolling highways in the first place is patently unfair.

Heard in lunchtime discussion yesterday that Indiana had just extended the lease of the toll road and gotten a pretty good chunk of change out of the deal.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Rothman on September 06, 2018, 09:36:54 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on September 06, 2018, 09:27:27 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on September 06, 2018, 03:19:18 PM

As for the State of Indiana using our one toll road (not counting the Ohio River bridges) as a piggy bank for projects throughout the state, you have to remember it is located so far north that few Hoosiers ever use it, outside of those in & between South Bend and Gary (granted, a lot of people, but not compared to the whole state). A majority of the heavy truck traffic on it is pass-through from & to other states. Thus our politicians have little incentive NOT to use revenue from that highway elsewhere. Is that "fair"? Perhaps not, but I could argue that the whole idea of tolling highways in the first place is patently unfair.

Heard in lunchtime discussion yesterday that Indiana had just extended the lease of the toll road and gotten a pretty good chunk of change out of the deal.
That is what we were talking about and how the chunk of change is not as advantageous as a steadier flow of revenue.  Indiana gave up the Toll Road and is now at the mercy of the benevolence of the private operator.

Just like last time, Indiana will burn through the funds on their chosen special projects, leaving its core capital program anemic and stressing localities by turning more mileage over to them.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 06, 2018, 09:38:02 PM
They raised the gas tax for everything else
Quote from: Rothman on September 06, 2018, 09:36:54 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on September 06, 2018, 09:27:27 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on September 06, 2018, 03:19:18 PM

As for the State of Indiana using our one toll road (not counting the Ohio River bridges) as a piggy bank for projects throughout the state, you have to remember it is located so far north that few Hoosiers ever use it, outside of those in & between South Bend and Gary (granted, a lot of people, but not compared to the whole state). A majority of the heavy truck traffic on it is pass-through from & to other states. Thus our politicians have little incentive NOT to use revenue from that highway elsewhere. Is that "fair"? Perhaps not, but I could argue that the whole idea of tolling highways in the first place is patently unfair.

Heard in lunchtime discussion yesterday that Indiana had just extended the lease of the toll road and gotten a pretty good chunk of change out of the deal.
That is what we were talking about and how the chunk of change is not as advantageous as a steadier flow of revenue.  Indiana gave up the Toll Road and is now at the mercy of the benevolence of the private operator.

Just like last time, Indiana will burn through the funds on their chosen special projects, leaving its core capital program anemic and stressing localities by turning more mileage over to them.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 2trailertrucker on September 08, 2018, 01:21:02 PM
I am waiting to see when the trucking companies start routing their drivers off the ITR and onto US 20 and US 30. Even with the discount from EXPass, there will be a breaking point, and "shunpiking"  begins.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mvak36 on September 08, 2018, 02:04:07 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on September 05, 2018, 09:04:44 AM
Not counting flashing yellows, I counted 3 last night:

  • Division Rd. in Tipton County
  • SR 218 in Miami County - North of Grissom
  • W. 100N in Miami county - at the Gallahan Travel Plaza

What will they do with the intersection for US24 business (W Logansport Road) in Peru? It looks like there is a road on the SW side of the intersection that connects the two roads.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 08, 2018, 02:12:16 PM
Quote from: mvak36 on September 08, 2018, 02:04:07 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on September 05, 2018, 09:04:44 AM
Not counting flashing yellows, I counted 3 last night:

  • Division Rd. in Tipton County
  • SR 218 in Miami County - North of Grissom
  • W. 100N in Miami county - at the Gallahan Travel Plaza

What will they do with the intersection for US24 business (W Logansport Road) in Peru? It looks like there is a road on the SW side of the intersection that connects the two roads.
Yes there is a small road connection. My guess is they remove it permanently. It's next to a bridge over a river, seems too much trouble to add an exit there with us 24 just up the street
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on September 09, 2018, 07:20:03 PM
It's a good thing that they got the dual carriageway US 24 done west of there when they did.  US 24 eastbound traffic used to have to turn left onto 31 northbound there to get up to the new alignment which was completed already.  It was not that safe.  I can't imagine that the access there is all that popular but it does cut off some distance for people going to and from the south.  It would be best to make it a RIRO if they do keep it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: edwaleni on September 09, 2018, 08:02:50 PM
Quote from: 2trailertrucker on September 08, 2018, 01:21:02 PM
I am waiting to see when the trucking companies start routing their drivers off the ITR and onto US 20 and US 30. Even with the discount from EXPass, there will be a breaking point, and "shunpiking"  begins.

Agreed, many companies have logistics software that calculates the least cost route from A to B.

If the toll increases cost more than re-routing them over US-30, which would also include the cost to have the driver operating longer since the route is mildly slower/further, then they will gladly shunpike the route.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 09, 2018, 10:04:49 PM
after driving US 30 in Warsaw, that needs to be an interstate grade facility. traffic is awful! and theres a lot of trucks!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: pianocello on September 10, 2018, 05:48:15 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 09, 2018, 10:04:49 PM
after driving US 30 in Warsaw, that needs to be an interstate grade facility. traffic is awful! and theres a lot of trucks!

Just get rid of the lights and call it good. Unfortunately, that probably still means a completely new-alignment bypass of Warsaw, as well as some creative roadway designs at Plymouth, Columbia City, the NE side of Fort Wayne, and the east side of Valparaiso.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on September 10, 2018, 11:16:43 PM
Quote from: edwaleni on September 09, 2018, 08:02:50 PM
Quote from: 2trailertrucker on September 08, 2018, 01:21:02 PM
I am waiting to see when the trucking companies start routing their drivers off the ITR and onto US 20 and US 30. Even with the discount from EXPass, there will be a breaking point, and "shunpiking"  begins.

Agreed, many companies have logistics software that calculates the least cost route from A to B.

If the toll increases cost more than re-routing them over US-30, which would also include the cost to have the driver operating longer since the route is mildly slower/further, then they will gladly shunpike the route.

Check out this report from WNDU-TV: https://www.wndu.com/content/news/Governor-Holcomb-says-new-toll-hikes-shouldnt-be-a-concern-492532611.html

The young reporter does a good job of trying to put Gov. Holcomb on the spot, but he just keeps spouting the same cliche about the ITR being the finest toll road in the country. :rolleyes: I'd be interested in seeing what the contract calls for in the likely event that the increased rates lead to decreased usage. I'd bet that the lessee gets a break and taxpayers end up with their projects short-funded. Another negative outcome for Hoosiers would be increased truck traffic on US 20 and US 30 caused by shunpikers.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on September 13, 2018, 11:06:10 AM
The Indiana Toll Road might be the worst-maintained toll road I've ever been on lmao
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: westerninterloper on September 13, 2018, 06:34:58 PM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on September 13, 2018, 11:06:10 AM
The Indiana Toll Road might be the worst-maintained toll road I've ever been on lmao

It is so so bad. I drive between Chicago and Toledo several times a year, and always exhale with relief when I reach the Ohio Turnpike, which is one of the best roads in the US.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on September 14, 2018, 08:04:27 PM
Quote from: westerninterloper on September 13, 2018, 06:34:58 PM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on September 13, 2018, 11:06:10 AM
The Indiana Toll Road might be the worst-maintained toll road I've ever been on lmao

It is so so bad. I drive between Chicago and Toledo several times a year, and always exhale with relief when I reach the Ohio Turnpike, which is one of the best roads in the US.

There are reasons for the lack of maintenance. When the road was state-run, money was very tight due to a (probably politically-motivated) reluctance to raise tolls. The former lessee, the one that went bankrupt, was able to raise rates but was hit by the recession. Usage of the road decreased and  that company struggled due to other bad investments.

The new lessee has promised a lot of improvements and delivered on some. The road has been repaved west of South Bend and some of the ancient service plazas have been rebuilt. I thought that the repaving was to continue to the east this summer, but nothing happened. That's a discouraging development.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 17, 2018, 07:31:54 AM
465/74 EB on the southside is now closed for pavement resurfacing, and deck overlays.  70 and 65 are now a mess, due to them being the official detour. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 2trailertrucker on September 17, 2018, 10:45:19 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 17, 2018, 07:31:54 AM
465/74 EB on the southside is now closed for pavement resurfacing, and deck overlays.  70 and 65 are now a mess, due to them being the official detour.

Here is the info on the closures:
https://www.in.gov/indot/3775.htm
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 19, 2018, 06:40:29 PM
Took another trip down I-65, this time to Indiana 2, to see how the expansion project is going. Now it's at the point where we get glimpses of the final product. Traffic in both directions is driving in the current middle and right lanes from US 30 to 109th Avenue, and again from the US 231 bridge to two miles north of Indiana 2. The sections that aren't just need to be striped, along with a section of concrete median that is currently being built just north of the US 231 overpass.

There is a lot of new signage along the stretch; the BGS's have been replaced and refreshed a while ago (with the lone exception of the US 231 gantry sign facing southbound traffic, which may happen after all the other affairs are in order), and new reassurance signs have been put up as well.

One thing I noticed was that the bridges near the 109th Avenue interchange have already been resurfaced. You can tell as you cross the bridges; the main surface looks like smooth concrete, while the bridge surfaces look more coarse, like sandpaper. Speaking of which, it doesn't appear crews will resurface the existing concrete areas after major work is done...at least not in this time period.

A new travel time sign is up for northbound traffic; while not active yet, it will provide times for US 30 (7 miles from that point) and I-80/94 (13 miles from that point).

I'll wait until the work is substantially complete to take another ride through the area. At the rate they're working, it might be another two weeks before the project reaches completion. It definitely looks like they'll be done well before the end of October.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 19, 2018, 10:34:58 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 19, 2018, 06:40:29 PM
Took another trip down I-65, this time to Indiana 2, to see how the expansion project is going. Now it's at the point where we get glimpses of the final product. Traffic in both directions is driving in the current middle and right lanes from US 30 to 109th Avenue, and again from the US 231 bridge to two miles north of Indiana 2. The sections that aren't just need to be striped, along with a section of concrete median that is currently being built just north of the US 231 overpass.

There is a lot of new signage along the stretch; the BGS's have been replaced and refreshed a while ago (with the lone exception of the US 231 gantry sign facing southbound traffic, which may happen after all the other affairs are in order), and new reassurance signs have been put up as well.

One thing I noticed was that the bridges near the 109th Avenue interchange have already been resurfaced. You can tell as you cross the bridges; the main surface looks like smooth concrete, while the bridge surfaces look more coarse, like sandpaper. Speaking of which, it doesn't appear crews will resurface the existing concrete areas after major work is done...at least not in this time period.

A new travel time sign is up for northbound traffic; while not active yet, it will provide times for US 30 (7 miles from that point) and I-80/94 (13 miles from that point).

I'll wait until the work is substantially complete to take another ride through the area. At the rate they're working, it might be another two weeks before the project reaches completion. It definitely looks like they'll be done well before the end of October.

i believe that new bridge surface is a special material that has a much lower freezing point, so reduce likelyhood of freezing in the winter.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mgk920 on September 20, 2018, 12:21:40 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 19, 2018, 10:34:58 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 19, 2018, 06:40:29 PM
Took another trip down I-65, this time to Indiana 2, to see how the expansion project is going. Now it's at the point where we get glimpses of the final product. Traffic in both directions is driving in the current middle and right lanes from US 30 to 109th Avenue, and again from the US 231 bridge to two miles north of Indiana 2. The sections that aren't just need to be striped, along with a section of concrete median that is currently being built just north of the US 231 overpass.

There is a lot of new signage along the stretch; the BGS's have been replaced and refreshed a while ago (with the lone exception of the US 231 gantry sign facing southbound traffic, which may happen after all the other affairs are in order), and new reassurance signs have been put up as well.

One thing I noticed was that the bridges near the 109th Avenue interchange have already been resurfaced. You can tell as you cross the bridges; the main surface looks like smooth concrete, while the bridge surfaces look more coarse, like sandpaper. Speaking of which, it doesn't appear crews will resurface the existing concrete areas after major work is done...at least not in this time period.

A new travel time sign is up for northbound traffic; while not active yet, it will provide times for US 30 (7 miles from that point) and I-80/94 (13 miles from that point).

I'll wait until the work is substantially complete to take another ride through the area. At the rate they're working, it might be another two weeks before the project reaches completion. It definitely looks like they'll be done well before the end of October.

i believe that new bridge surface is a special material that has a much lower freezing point, so reduce likelyhood of freezing in the winter.

WisDOT's been doing that on a lot of new and resurfaced freeway bridges over the past decade or so, too.

Mike
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 20, 2018, 09:13:06 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 19, 2018, 06:40:29 PM
Took another trip down I-65, this time to Indiana 2, to see how the expansion project is going. Now it's at the point where we get glimpses of the final product. Traffic in both directions is driving in the current middle and right lanes from US 30 to 109th Avenue, and again from the US 231 bridge to two miles north of Indiana 2. The sections that aren't just need to be striped, along with a section of concrete median that is currently being built just north of the US 231 overpass.

There is a lot of new signage along the stretch; the BGS's have been replaced and refreshed a while ago (with the lone exception of the US 231 gantry sign facing southbound traffic, which may happen after all the other affairs are in order), and new reassurance signs have been put up as well.

One thing I noticed was that the bridges near the 109th Avenue interchange have already been resurfaced. You can tell as you cross the bridges; the main surface looks like smooth concrete, while the bridge surfaces look more coarse, like sandpaper. Speaking of which, it doesn't appear crews will resurface the existing concrete areas after major work is done...at least not in this time period.

A new travel time sign is up for northbound traffic; while not active yet, it will provide times for US 30 (7 miles from that point) and I-80/94 (13 miles from that point).

I'll wait until the work is substantially complete to take another ride through the area. At the rate they're working, it might be another two weeks before the project reaches completion. It definitely looks like they'll be done well before the end of October.

I was through there last night, though it was too dark to see much.  There were crews out working in a couple different spots.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 26, 2018, 07:37:56 PM
Remember when I said I was going to wait until project completion to roll through I-65's newest widened area? I lied. :)

I went just to 231 and back today, but a lot of work was done in just that week. Permanent striping is in place for the driving lanes; only the inner shoulder has yet to be done. Northbound lanes had white paint on the inner shoulder and far left lane (more on the possibility why in a bit), and the new southbound VMS is up near 101st Avenue, but not yet active.

The section of unfinished concrete median I mentioned upthread is now up...and it didn't take long for it to be tested, as I saw police tending to a car that lightly careened into it (thankfully, the driver was unhurt).

There were sections of ratted asphalt in the area between 109th Avenue and US 30 that I thought needed resurfacing. I thought they would go through and redo those areas with fresh concrete to make it uniform, but they at least did the next best thing; those sections were patched with fresh, smooth asphalt (which is probably why they had the aforementioned inner lanes north of 231 marked with white paint...to move traffic aside while that work concludes).

I really think they're going to be finished by mid-October. The remaining crews are primarily out for cleanup and (soon) electrical logistics for the new VMS and Rest Area Smart Parking signs. They've really put in the work.

The other major point of contention is US 20. Work on the stretch between (Porter/LaPorte) County Line Road and Indiana 2 has been stalled due to road testing, but both areas should be repaved by the end of October. The one section that won't be completely finished will be the section in Michigan City between Woodland Avenue and Johnson Road. Next year, plans are in place to install a center left-turn lane in that section. Currently, there are no turn lanes AT ALL, which leaves eastbound traffic ripe for rear end accidents or sideswipes because of the chain of plazas along the left hand side. This time next year, it should be remedied.

INDOT warns of possible (but short-lasting) full blown closures at the intersection of US 20 and US 421 for asphalt paving, but drivers will be warned beforehand via portable VMS or its Facebook page.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 28, 2018, 02:49:01 PM
INDOT has released the preferred alternative to the north split project:

https://northsplit.com/maps/alternative-4c-maps/

this looks great, the exits from the left are all gone, and 70wb comes in from the right and leaves at the south split from the right, and going in reverse, 70eb enters at the south split on the left and leaves the north split on the left, no more big weave there.

no more need to floor it to hit 70 eb from the delaware street ramp either.

interchange as a whole gets much smaller

one negative, no more access to exit 111 for 65 sb (michigan st, ohio st, and fletcher ave.) in order to do that you will have to get off on exit 113 and ride 11th street and get back onto the highway.

still staring at the map, so i may post more observations or corrections later!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on September 28, 2018, 04:10:03 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 28, 2018, 02:49:01 PM

one negative, no more access to exit 111 for 65 sb (michigan st, ohio st, and fletcher ave.) in order to do that you will have to get off on exit 113 and ride 11th street and get back onto the highway.

How much use does that movement get currently?

also the ghost ramps' days are now officially numbered.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on September 28, 2018, 05:33:42 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 28, 2018, 02:49:01 PM
INDOT has released the preferred alternative to the north split project:

https://northsplit.com/maps/alternative-4c-maps/

this looks great, the exits from the left are all gone, and 70wb comes in from the right and leaves at the south split from the right, and going in reverse, 70eb enters at the south split on the left and leaves the north split on the left, no more big weave there.

no more need to floor it to hit 70 eb from the delaware street ramp either.

interchange as a whole gets much smaller

one negative, no more access to exit 111 for 65 sb (michigan st, ohio st, and fletcher ave.) in order to do that you will have to get off on exit 113 and ride 11th street and get back onto the highway.

still staring at the map, so i may post more observations or corrections later!
Another MAJOR negative, no access from WB I-70 to the NB I-65 Pennsylvania/Meridian exit. Traffic from the NE & N sides wanting to access the north portions of Downtown will have to go all the way to the I-65 West Street/MLK left exit (which granted, will be easier given the relocated W70-N65 ramp) then double back on surface streets. This could be avoided by using the existing alignment of the W70-N65 ramp to create a dedicated ramp from WB I-70 that would join up with the new NB I-65 exit ramp for Pennsylvania/Meridian off of the mainline just east of the Central Ave grade separation. It would mean adding back 2 bridges along the current route of the W70-N65 ramp that this plan completely eliminates (over Lewis St & Monon Trail and over College Ave), but it would most certainly improve traffic flow on the surface streets on the north & NW sides of the CBD.

Also, while this plan makes the EB I-70 curve much shallower, it also severely tightens the NB I-65 curve. Several significant left merges still remain as well, most notably the Pine St entry ramp to EB I-70 (now the NB I-65 entry ramp). That being said, no plan for this junction will be perfect and the elimination of the NB/EB weave for through traffic and the elimination of the left entry for the S65-E70 movement will both be major accomplishments.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 28, 2018, 06:21:41 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on September 28, 2018, 05:33:42 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 28, 2018, 02:49:01 PM
INDOT has released the preferred alternative to the north split project:

https://northsplit.com/maps/alternative-4c-maps/

this looks great, the exits from the left are all gone, and 70wb comes in from the right and leaves at the south split from the right, and going in reverse, 70eb enters at the south split on the left and leaves the north split on the left, no more big weave there.

no more need to floor it to hit 70 eb from the delaware street ramp either.

interchange as a whole gets much smaller

one negative, no more access to exit 111 for 65 sb (michigan st, ohio st, and fletcher ave.) in order to do that you will have to get off on exit 113 and ride 11th street and get back onto the highway.

still staring at the map, so i may post more observations or corrections later!
Another MAJOR negative, no access from WB I-70 to the NB I-65 Pennsylvania/Meridian exit. Traffic from the NE & N sides wanting to access the north portions of Downtown will have to go all the way to the I-65 West Street/MLK left exit (which granted, will be easier given the relocated W70-N65 ramp) then double back on surface streets. This could be avoided by using the existing alignment of the W70-N65 ramp to create a dedicated ramp from WB I-70 that would join up with the new NB I-65 exit ramp for Pennsylvania/Meridian off of the mainline just east of the Central Ave grade separation. It would mean adding back 2 bridges along the current route of the W70-N65 ramp that this plan completely eliminates (over Lewis St & Monon Trail and over College Ave), but it would most certainly improve traffic flow on the surface streets on the north & NW sides of the CBD.

Also, while this plan makes the EB I-70 curve much shallower, it also severely tightens the NB I-65 curve. Several significant left merges still remain as well, most notably the Pine St entry ramp to EB I-70 (now the NB I-65 entry ramp). That being said, no plan for this junction will be perfect and the elimination of the NB/EB weave for through traffic and the elimination of the left entry for the S65-E70 movement will both be major accomplishments.

i didnt notice that, that could be fixed pretty easily.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 28, 2018, 06:24:31 PM
knowing INDOT, they will fuck up at least one lane configuration and we'll be stuck with it for 50 yrs.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on September 28, 2018, 09:12:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 28, 2018, 02:49:01 PM
INDOT has released the preferred alternative to the north split project:

https://northsplit.com/maps/alternative-4c-maps/

this looks great, the exits from the left are all gone, and 70wb comes in from the right and leaves at the south split from the right, and going in reverse, 70eb enters at the south split on the left and leaves the north split on the left, no more big weave there.

no more need to floor it to hit 70 eb from the delaware street ramp either.

interchange as a whole gets much smaller

one negative, no more access to exit 111 for 65 sb (michigan st, ohio st, and fletcher ave.) in order to do that you will have to get off on exit 113 and ride 11th street and get back onto the highway.

still staring at the map, so i may post more observations or corrections later!

I want to give my personal opinion on this project, and I think that this project is BADLY needed!! Look at how much traffic weaves on I-65 heading south to get onto I-70 east. Also, we were not expecting all of this growth on the north side of Indianapolis. Looking forward to this project!!  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 28, 2018, 09:19:30 PM
I just wanted to make sure I had this clear about the Meridian Street/Illinois Street interchange on the north side of downtown. I can access it from I-65 to the south, but if I were to leave in the same direction I can only take I-70 to the east?

Granted, I've always figured that the downtown exits are designed to provide several entry and exit points for those traveling from each side. Southsiders can access via Fountain Square, Meridian off of I-70 and Washington Street, Eastsiders from the C/D ramps and Meridian on the north side, Northsiders from MLK and Illinois/Meridian Street and Westsiders via West Street and Illinois Street.

I suppose this could still change a little, the reduction in footprint isn't too bad though, I get an need to make the interchange look a little smaller since it's obvious that I-69 isn't going to connect with it anymore.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 28, 2018, 09:19:54 PM
I bet this configuration is on purpose, with this configuration, they don't need to do anything new with the south split. After all the controversy with the north split, they don't want to deal with it down there. 

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 28, 2018, 09:21:13 PM
69 was never going to connect, but one can dream. 
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 28, 2018, 09:19:30 PM
I just wanted to make sure I had this clear about the Meridian Street/Illinois Street interchange on the north side of downtown. I can access it from I-65 to the south, but if I were to leave in the same direction I can only take I-70 to the east?

Granted, I've always figured that the downtown exits are designed to provide several entry and exit points for those traveling from each side. Southsiders can access via Fountain Square, Meridian off of I-70 and Washington Street, Eastsiders from the C/D ramps and Meridian on the north side, Northsiders from MLK and Illinois/Meridian Street and Westsiders via West Street and Illinois Street.

I suppose this could still change a little, the reduction in footprint isn't too bad though, I get an need to make the interchange look a little smaller since it's obvious that I-69 isn't going to connect with it anymore.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 29, 2018, 03:13:45 PM
Looks like there will be one final round of new I-65 work in my area before they shut it down for the upcoming winter.

The southbound stretch between 61st Avenue and US 30 will be under construction for concrete restoration. It is a continuation of a project that was (thought to be) concluded in 2017, though the section mentioned wasn't completely done. Work starts Wednesday October 3.

A split-lane configuration will be in effect, with two lanes to the left of the work zone, and one lane to the right. The single right lane will be the only one open during nighttime hours (8pm - 5am Monday-Thursday, 10pm-10am Friday night into Saturday, and 9pm-9am Saturday night into Sunday). Also during those hours, all ramps connecting 61st Avenue to I-65 southbound will be closed. This project is scheduled to go into the middle of October.

Also of note: part one of the bridge replacement project north of I-80/94 is still on pace to end at the end of November, with part two (the northbound bridge) set to begin next spring.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on September 30, 2018, 12:13:16 AM
Concrete work is something you really want to get done when the weather's good.  Concrete will only cure if it's warm enough, so pouring it in the winter requires a lot of expensive additional measures (heaters, heat blankets, etc).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on October 02, 2018, 04:23:57 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 28, 2018, 09:21:13 PM
69 was never going to connect, but one can dream. 
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 28, 2018, 09:19:30 PM
I just wanted to make sure I had this clear about the Meridian Street/Illinois Street interchange on the north side of downtown. I can access it from I-65 to the south, but if I were to leave in the same direction I can only take I-70 to the east?

Granted, I've always figured that the downtown exits are designed to provide several entry and exit points for those traveling from each side. Southsiders can access via Fountain Square, Meridian off of I-70 and Washington Street, Eastsiders from the C/D ramps and Meridian on the north side, Northsiders from MLK and Illinois/Meridian Street and Westsiders via West Street and Illinois Street.

I suppose this could still change a little, the reduction in footprint isn't too bad though, I get an need to make the interchange look a little smaller since it's obvious that I-69 isn't going to connect with it anymore.
You're too young to remember, but yes, I-69 was supposed to connect to the I-65/I-70 north split interchange. That's why the ghost bridges/ramps exist in the present design. But in the mid-1970s, a deal was struck between the city, state, & the FHWA to divert the funds allocated for the completion of I-69 between Castleton and downtown to projects which widened I-465 & I-70 from the NE side to handle most of that traffic. The canceled "Northeast Freeway", would've taken I-69 down what was then SR 37 (now Binford Blvd) to a point near Fall Creek & Keystone, then across that waterway and onto new terrain (near the old Nickel Plate & Monon railroads) south to the north split. The "freeway revolt" of that era, which caught on here because so many city neighborhoods (particularly impacting African-Americans) had been divided by building the inner legs of I-65 & I-70 to downtown, caused the cancellation of that I-69 project. This is part of the reason why NEPA studies now include "social justice" as part of the review process for new projects.

Some historical maps from the era of original dasign & construction of the "inner loop" showed I-69 continuing on south past downtown (on the canceled "Harding Freeway" corridor) to at least I-465. Some also showed the "missing west leg" of the inner loop along West Street as being I-69, which would have resulted in a "wrong-way concurrency" taking SB I-69 west on NB I-65 along the north leg of the loop. But once the plan for a freeway along Harding Street bit the dust and the western leg of the inner loop was downgraded to a surface arterial, the southern terminus of I-69 was reassigned back to the North Split. Later, when the Northeast Freeway also was killed off, that southern national terminus for I-69 remained at I-465 in Castleton until the current century.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on October 02, 2018, 04:30:22 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 28, 2018, 09:19:30 PM
I just wanted to make sure I had this clear about the Meridian Street/Illinois Street interchange on the north side of downtown. I can access it from I-65 to the south, but if I were to leave in the same direction I can only take I-70 to the east?

...
No, you will still be able to access the East Leg C/D going EB from the Delaware St on-ramp, which will (eventually) get you to either I-65 SB or I-70 WB. You just won't be able to directly access the SB I-65 mainline from this entrance (which will help prevent weaving).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 02, 2018, 04:40:18 PM
living in the northern burbs, it would be nice to have 69 go down there.  any maps of these cancelled freeways?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on October 02, 2018, 10:39:17 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 02, 2018, 04:40:18 PM
living in the northern burbs, it would be nice to have 69 go down there.  any maps of these cancelled freeways?

I seem to recall an old concept map (or at least a link to it) in the I-69 extension thread. It showed a proposed route spoking northward away from the interchange. At one point, it was going to be I-165 if I-69 didn't make it (again, I am roting this from memory, so bear with me if the details are a bit off).

Big news coming from Laporte County: Indiana 8 between US 421 and Indiana 39 has been opened nearly eight months after being all but washed away due to the historic February flooding. Crews will still be out for striping and minor landscaping, but the bulk of the work is done. The washed out area has been replaced with all new roadbed, along with a brand new bridge structure (the replacement was already scheduled before the flooding).

Also, the I-65 expansion project is definitely on the wind down. Three lanes of southbound traffic are now open from south of US 30 to just before US 231, and three lanes are opened northbound from just north of the 101st Avenue overpass. The remaining lane closures are primarily for cleanup and minor landscaping; all lanes have been striped. Looks like substantial completion will be happening within the next week.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 03, 2018, 08:26:28 AM
https://northsplit.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/20180921-North-Split-Alternatives-Screening-Report-Appendix.pdf

here is the report of the alternatives, the pavement is the original from 1968! wow!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on October 03, 2018, 10:11:41 AM
What's the deal with Indiana 14 west of US231?  Why has that been closed for 6 or more months with no signs of reopening?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 03, 2018, 11:13:12 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on October 03, 2018, 10:11:41 AM
What's the deal with Indiana 14 west of US231?  Why has that been closed for 6 or more months with no signs of reopening?

I think it's flood damage.  Don't know why they haven't been working on it though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on October 11, 2018, 10:48:25 AM
Hi to everybody in this thread...I need your knowledge and expertise!  My goal is to photograph a road sign for every state, US, and Interstate highway in Indiana.  I think I have the collection completed as of this week, but I need to verify if there's anything I'm missing. If you're an expert on Indiana, could you check here (https://www.flickr.com/photos/138603251@N02/albums/72157669661614025/page1) to see if I'm missing anything??  That album is a bunch of cropped out shield photos; you might enjoy looking through the source photos with context (https://www.flickr.com/photos/138603251@N02/albums/72157669156486922) a bit more in my other album.

I might check against the listing on Travel Mapping just to be sure, too.

Note that I am getting one shield per number, so I'm not distinguishing between separate highways with the same number, and I'm not distinguishing between business, truck, and mainline routes, either.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Interstate 69 Fan on October 11, 2018, 11:36:54 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on October 11, 2018, 10:48:25 AM
Hi to everybody in this thread...I need your knowledge and expertise!  My goal is to photograph a road sign for every state, US, and Interstate highway in Indiana.  I think I have the collection completed as of this week, but I need to verify if there's anything I'm missing. If you're an expert on Indiana, could you check here (https://www.flickr.com/photos/138603251@N02/albums/72157669661614025/page1) to see if I'm missing anything??  That album is a bunch of cropped out shield photos; you might enjoy looking through the source photos with context (https://www.flickr.com/photos/138603251@N02/albums/72157669156486922) a bit more in my other album.

I might check against the listing on Travel Mapping just to be sure, too.

Note that I am getting one shield per number, so I'm not distinguishing between separate highways with the same number, and I'm not distinguishing between business, truck, and mainline routes, either.
I'm pretty sure you got them all!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on October 11, 2018, 11:40:47 AM
Looks like you're only missing SR 342. But it's so short that I don't know if there are any actual shields posted.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on October 11, 2018, 11:45:45 AM
Quote from: csw on October 11, 2018, 11:40:47 AM
Looks like you're only missing SR 342. But it's so short that I don't know if there are any actual shields posted.

I drove the length of SR342 to see if there were any signs for it.  There was nothing.  My evidence for my visit there is this photo, which labeled as a westbound reassurance marker off of IN-342 (that's what the code means at the base of the photo).  I'm led to believe it's been decommissioned but have no official documentation of that belief.

(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/830/27969276428_44bbce8cb1_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/JBxRrW)
IN-042-342WR (https://flic.kr/p/JBxRrW) by Paul Drives (https://www.flickr.com/photos/138603251@N02/), on Flickr
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 11, 2018, 11:52:56 AM
I'm pretty sure it doesn't exist anymore (SR 342) it used to be signed a few yrs ago, and the old Indiana routes website had the pics.  They took the signs down a few years ago.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: westerninterloper on October 11, 2018, 02:35:27 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 11, 2018, 11:52:56 AM
I'm pretty sure it doesn't exist anymore (SR 342) it used to be signed a few yrs ago, and the old Indiana routes website had the pics.  They took the signs down a few years ago.

I recall that the road is still officially SR 342, because it connects to a government/federal facility, but was unsigned because people were confused why a state road was so short. The state's asset map shows it as SR 342.

https://indot.maps.arcgis.com/apps/View/index.html?appid=a7479e1aef194c5e9c93a7d3164730e6
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on October 11, 2018, 03:07:30 PM
Quote from: westerninterloper on October 11, 2018, 02:35:27 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 11, 2018, 11:52:56 AM
I'm pretty sure it doesn't exist anymore (SR 342) it used to be signed a few yrs ago, and the old Indiana routes website had the pics.  They took the signs down a few years ago.

I recall that the road is still officially SR 342, because it connects to a government/federal facility, but was unsigned because people were confused why a state road was so short. The state's asset map shows it as SR 342.

https://indot.maps.arcgis.com/apps/View/index.html?appid=a7479e1aef194c5e9c93a7d3164730e6

The indication of SR-342 is just OpenStreetMap calling it that.  The layer owned by INDOT isn't showing the road as anything.  The road is closed, so whether INDOT maintains it or not, they probably aren't going to advertise its existence to anyone.  When I visited the site in late April, the road was blocked off with barricades.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: westerninterloper on October 12, 2018, 10:01:33 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on October 11, 2018, 03:07:30 PM
Quote from: westerninterloper on October 11, 2018, 02:35:27 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 11, 2018, 11:52:56 AM
I'm pretty sure it doesn't exist anymore (SR 342) it used to be signed a few yrs ago, and the old Indiana routes website had the pics.  They took the signs down a few years ago.

I recall that the road is still officially SR 342, because it connects to a government/federal facility, but was unsigned because people were confused why a state road was so short. The state's asset map shows it as SR 342.

https://indot.maps.arcgis.com/apps/View/index.html?appid=a7479e1aef194c5e9c93a7d3164730e6

The indication of SR-342 is just OpenStreetMap calling it that.  The layer owned by INDOT isn't showing the road as anything.  The road is closed, so whether INDOT maintains it or not, they probably aren't going to advertise its existence to anyone.  When I visited the site in late April, the road was blocked off with barricades.

Could be...I havent visited in a few years. The National Guard building address on that route is South SR 342, but I didn't know it was barricaded and closed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 29, 2018, 04:43:31 PM
does anyone know whats going on on I-69 between SR 9/109 and SR 332?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on October 29, 2018, 08:29:37 PM
INDOT is rebuilding I-69 from SR 9/109 up to SR 32/67. The highway will still be four lanes but the roadway is supposed to be rebuilt completely. Not sure what is happening north of there to SR 332, I thought that stretch was repaved a few years ago.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on October 30, 2018, 01:17:08 AM
I'm old enough to remember that the section of 69 from Pendleton to Daleville was the first section built back in the Fifties. I presume it was first because the corresponding part of SR-67 was a three-lane deathtrap (complete with a suicide lane), so this replacement was sure to save lives right away. Although I'm sure it was repaved many times in the 60+ years since, it was time for a complete rebuild.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on October 30, 2018, 12:19:52 PM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on October 11, 2018, 03:07:30 PM
Quote from: westerninterloper on October 11, 2018, 02:35:27 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 11, 2018, 11:52:56 AM
I'm pretty sure it doesn't exist anymore (SR 342) it used to be signed a few yrs ago, and the old Indiana routes website had the pics.  They took the signs down a few years ago.

I recall that the road is still officially SR 342, because it connects to a government/federal facility, but was unsigned because people were confused why a state road was so short. The state's asset map shows it as SR 342.

https://indot.maps.arcgis.com/apps/View/index.html?appid=a7479e1aef194c5e9c93a7d3164730e6

The indication of SR-342 is just OpenStreetMap calling it that.  The layer owned by INDOT isn't showing the road as anything.  The road is closed, so whether INDOT maintains it or not, they probably aren't going to advertise its existence to anyone.  When I visited the site in late April, the road was blocked off with barricades.

SR 342 was the entrance to the Indiana Nat'l Guard base. The entrance has since been moved east to the new roundabout at Swalls Dr. This new entrance however is not signed as SR 342. I almost forgot SR 342 ever existed and I've lived in Terre Haute my whole life. I only drove on it once a few years ago when it still existed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 31, 2018, 07:35:34 AM
The expanded section of I-65 between Sellersburg and Memphis now has all 3 lanes open in both directions with speed limit restrictions removed.  Work on the Seymour to Columbus section is hitting full stride, with a 60 mph speed limit restriction for the length of that project.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 31, 2018, 07:48:59 AM
i hope they keep that bridge over 46
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 13, 2018, 07:50:08 AM
good news the rethink 65/70 coalition isn't actually interested in removing any interstates from downtown indy, they propose depressing them all below grade, open trench style.  INDOT isn't remotely interested in this, they just want to fix the north split.  I actually think their idea is good from what little I know about it at this point, but it won't happen due to cost.  I will post a link if there is one later today, unless someone beats me to it. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mvak36 on November 13, 2018, 08:52:29 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 13, 2018, 07:50:08 AM
good news the rethink 65/70 coalition isn't actually interested in removing any interstates from downtown indy, they propose depressing them all below grade, open trench style.  INDOT isn't remotely interested in this, they just want to fix the north split.  I actually think their idea is good from what little I know about it at this point, but it won't happen due to cost.  I will post a link if there is one later today, unless someone beats me to it.

I found this: https://cbs4indy.com/2018/11/12/rethink-65-70-has-their-own-ideas-to-improve-the-north-split/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on November 13, 2018, 08:16:05 PM
Quote from: cbs4indy.com article
The Rethink 65/70 coalition, made up of local business owners, residents and community organizations, hired a consulting firm to take a look at INDOT's plans and suggest some improvements. They want the North Split plan to follow these four guiding principles:

   1. No lane expansion
   2. No above-grade walls outside the North Split
   3. Enhanced economic development
   4. Increased connectivity between downtown and surrounding neighborhoods

INDOT's new plan meets only one of the coalition's principles and that's having no large walls.
Number 4 makes sense, but it's not part of the project and is the city's job not INDOT's. Also, why do they think it's INDOT's job to enhance economic development? I understand that the area around the north split was messed up 50+ years ago, but it's not going to get fixed in any meaningful way today and the construction needs to be done.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 19, 2018, 08:54:37 PM
INDOT is looking into reconstructing 465 from 86th street to US 31 on the northside of indy!  This is in the study phase, so construction is likely several years off. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on November 21, 2018, 03:39:26 PM
This is gonna suck.

Effective Tuesday (November 27), I-65 southbound from US 12/20 to I-94 will be completely closed off to all traffic as the bridge replacement project continues through the winter. Northbound traffic will continue to go through the area unimpeded with both lanes open. Those looking to enter I-65 southbound will have to get to I-94 to access it (for those coming from Chicago via the Toll Road, the most viable detour is Cline Avenue near East Chicago). Local traffic will be asked to enter I-94 via Indiana 51, though Broadway is also available.

This configuration will be in effect until next summer.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 23, 2018, 10:28:55 AM
So the construction zone 55 mph speed limit on I-65 is still in effect from 109th Ave all the way down almost to IN 10, and the new third lane is still closed in each direction from 109th Ave to IN 2 even though it appears that all construction has been completed for a while.  What's up with that?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on November 24, 2018, 02:20:26 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 19, 2018, 08:54:37 PM
INDOT is looking into reconstructing 465 from 86th street to US 31 on the northside of indy!  This is in the study phase, so construction is likely several years off.
They at LEAST fixed the rough bridges over Williams Creek & Spring Mill Run (between the underpasses at 96th St & Spring Mill Rd). But this section desperately needed its widening & reconstruction years ago. Guess they were too busy rebuilding the Michigan Road (US 421) interchange over and over and over again. And when are they going to get around to rebuilding the I-65/I-465 interchange on the NW side?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 24, 2018, 02:58:13 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on November 24, 2018, 02:20:26 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 19, 2018, 08:54:37 PM
INDOT is looking into reconstructing 465 from 86th street to US 31 on the northside of indy!  This is in the study phase, so construction is likely several years off.
They at LEAST fixed the rough bridges over Williams Creek & Spring Mill Run (between the underpasses at 96th St & Spring Mill Rd). But this section desperately needed its widening & reconstruction years ago. Guess they were too busy rebuilding the Michigan Road (US 421) interchange over and over and over again. And when are they going to get around to rebuilding the I-65/I-465 interchange on the NW side?

those bridges are great now.  and yes, 465 north to 65 north needs to be moved to the right.  65 north to 465 north needs to be realigned with a higher speed radius. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on November 26, 2018, 11:04:25 PM
Well, the Chase Street bridge over I-80/94 in Gary is going to be reconstructed soon... I think that this bridge was where the fire happened back a couple of years ago...

Anyway, traffic will be reduced from five to three lanes starting TONIGHT from 9pm until 6am... All lanes will be opened during the day...

Map: https://www.google.com/maps/@41.5696281,-87.3750242,3a,75y,262.26h,91.88t/data=!3m5!1e1!3m3!1sNIuzOfIcOhHXulH36flf6w!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo3.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3DNIuzOfIcOhHXulH36flf6w%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D183.54005%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100?hl=en
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on November 26, 2018, 11:44:17 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 24, 2018, 02:58:13 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on November 24, 2018, 02:20:26 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 19, 2018, 08:54:37 PM
INDOT is looking into reconstructing 465 from 86th street to US 31 on the northside of indy!  This is in the study phase, so construction is likely several years off.
They at LEAST fixed the rough bridges over Williams Creek & Spring Mill Run (between the underpasses at 96th St & Spring Mill Rd). But this section desperately needed its widening & reconstruction years ago. Guess they were too busy rebuilding the Michigan Road (US 421) interchange over and over and over again. And when are they going to get around to rebuilding the I-65/I-465 interchange on the NW side?

those bridges are great now.  and yes, 465 north to 65 north needs to be moved to the right.  65 north to 465 north needs to be realigned with a higher speed radius.

I'll say it again: I really wish they'd reconstruct the 465/865 interchange / 465 NW corner.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 27, 2018, 11:29:30 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on November 26, 2018, 11:44:17 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 24, 2018, 02:58:13 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on November 24, 2018, 02:20:26 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 19, 2018, 08:54:37 PM
INDOT is looking into reconstructing 465 from 86th street to US 31 on the northside of indy!  This is in the study phase, so construction is likely several years off.
They at LEAST fixed the rough bridges over Williams Creek & Spring Mill Run (between the underpasses at 96th St & Spring Mill Rd). But this section desperately needed its widening & reconstruction years ago. Guess they were too busy rebuilding the Michigan Road (US 421) interchange over and over and over again. And when are they going to get around to rebuilding the I-65/I-465 interchange on the NW side?

those bridges are great now.  and yes, 465 north to 65 north needs to be moved to the right.  65 north to 465 north needs to be realigned with a higher speed radius.

I'll say it again: I really wish they'd reconstruct the 465/865 interchange / 465 NW corner.

the project i mentioned includes that.  reconstruction from 86th to US 31
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on November 27, 2018, 11:43:13 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 27, 2018, 11:29:30 AM
the project i mentioned includes that.  reconstruction from 86th to US 31

Duh.  Not sure why I didn't realize that.  For some reason I thought by 86th St you meant Michigan Rd.  I guess because I used to live off 86th St. and I'd get off at Michigan to get home.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Interstate 69 Fan on November 27, 2018, 03:09:43 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 19, 2018, 08:54:37 PM
INDOT is looking into reconstructing 465 from 86th street to US 31 on the northside of indy!  This is in the study phase, so construction is likely several years off.
Where'd you find the info for this?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 27, 2018, 03:15:28 PM
Quote from: Interstate 69 Fan on November 27, 2018, 03:09:43 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 19, 2018, 08:54:37 PM
INDOT is looking into reconstructing 465 from 86th street to US 31 on the northside of indy!  This is in the study phase, so construction is likely several years off.
Where'd you find the info for this?

INDOT RFP (Request for Proposals) this won't be announced any time soon, it is just at the proposal/study phase.  An engineer I know told me about it. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on November 29, 2018, 06:37:36 PM
In a surprising reversal from about a year ago, Governor Holcomb states that he won't have tolls imposed on Indiana's free interstates during his tenure in office. He says the fuel tax and vehicle registration fees are enough to sustain the state's construction blitz.

However, he does say the tolling plan will be on the table in case his successor needs a funding option. In short, tolling plans won't be revisited until as early as 2021.

Edited to avoid double posting

Effective tonight (11-30-18), all lanes on I-65 are open from US 30 to Indiana 2. The last of the barrels were removed earlier today. There's still a few loose ends to tie up (mainly activation of message board and travel time signs along both directions, including the travel time sign for southbound traffic well north of the work zone), but all long-term closures have been lifted. This includes the Kankakee River bridge south of Indiana 2.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mvak36 on December 07, 2018, 09:28:48 AM
http://www.insideindianabusiness.com/story/39605079/i-65-projects-land-40m-in-funding
QuoteWASHINGTON, D.C. -

The U.S. Department of Transportation has awarded Indiana $40 million in grants for major interstate projects. The Indiana Department of Transportation will use the two $20 million grants for the South Central and North Central I-65 expansion projects.

The South Central Indiana Expansion Project aims to increase capacity on I-65 between SR 58 and SR 56. It involves reconstructing two lanes and adding a travel lane and shoulders to the northbound and southbound lanes. INDOT will also replace the superstructures on the Carr Hill Road and CR 200 South bridges over I-65. You can find more information on the project by clicking here.

The North Central Indiana Expansion Project will increase I-65 capacity between SR 32 and SR 47. It also involves rebuilding two lanes and adding a travel land and shoulders to northbound and southbound lanes. It will additional involve work on several bridges and ramps.

I think the first project is between SR58 and SR46, not SR56. https://grants.ost.dot.gov/public/ViewMessage.cfm?MsgID=ri8ho03z9u
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mvak36 on December 07, 2018, 10:53:49 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 21, 2018, 10:29:04 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on April 21, 2018, 12:36:49 AM
Quote from: mvak36 on April 20, 2018, 10:56:21 PM
It looks like they started the widening on the Columbus to Seymour segment of I-65 last week: http://www.wdrb.com/story/37950941/indiana-officials-break-ground-on-143-million-expansion-of-i-65

Looks like it was funded by the 10 cent gas tax increase last year. https://www.theindychannel.com/news/local-news/indianapolis/construction-season-is-officially-underway-in-indiana

So what parts of I-65 will still be two lanes after this and all current projects are complete?  I know northern Indiana better than southern so please correct me if I'm wrong on this list.

Radially out from Indy:


  • US 52 - IN 38 - 27 Mi
  • IN 25 - IN 2 - 65 Mi
  • IN 44 - IN 58 - 26 Mi
  • US 50 - Blue Lick Rd? - 34 Mi

I wonder which segment (or part of a segment) will be done next?  Many bridges between IN 25 and IN 2 are already wide enough for 3 lanes and the Kankakee River bridge is being expanded so I'm sure parts of that will be done in the not so distant future.  Although, to me, it makes sense to continue from IN-44 down to IN 58.  Much shorter segment and pretty heavily traveled.  What do you guys think?

you're missing 465 to 865 this portion boarders eagle creek park, so i would assume the widening would be in the median.
With the new BUILD grant, that knocks off about 4 miles from both the US52 to IN38 section and the IN44 to IN58 section.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 08, 2018, 08:32:29 AM
From bottom to top:

IN/KY line to Memphis (16 miles) - already 3+ lanes
Memphis to US 50 (34 miles) - 2 lanes with no action planned
US 50 to IN 58 (14 miles) - currently being widened to 3 lanes
IN 58 to IN 46 (4 miles) - planned for widening to 3 lanes
IN 46 to IN 44 (22 miles) - 2 lanes with no action planned
IN 44 to I-465 westside (33 miles) - already 3+ lanes
I-465 westside to I-865 (6 miles) - 2 lanes with no action planned
I-865 to IN 32 (11 miles) - already 3 lanes
IN 32 to IN 47 (6 miles) - planned for widening to 3 lanes
IN 47 to IN 38 (22 miles) - 2 lanes with no action planned
IN 38 to IN 25 (7 miles) - already 3 lanes
IN 25 to IN 2 (65 miles) - 2 lanes with no action planned
IN 2 to US 12/20 (22 miles) - already 3+ lanes

So by my count there are still 149 miles that have yet to had any planning begun for expansion. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 08, 2018, 08:23:44 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 08, 2018, 08:32:29 AM
From bottom to top:

IN/KY line to Memphis (16 miles) - already 3+ lanes
Memphis to US 50 (34 miles) - 2 lanes with no action planned
US 50 to IN 58 (14 miles) - currently being widened to 3 lanes
IN 58 to IN 46 (4 miles) - planned for widening to 3 lanes
IN 46 to IN 44 (22 miles) - 2 lanes with no action planned
IN 44 to I-465 westside (33 miles) - already 3+ lanes
I-465 westside to I-865 (6 miles) - 2 lanes with no action planned
I-865 to IN 32 (11 miles) - already 3 lanes
IN 32 to IN 47 (6 miles) - planned for widening to 3 lanes
IN 47 to IN 38 (22 miles) - 2 lanes with no action planned
IN 38 to IN 25 (7 miles) - already 3 lanes
IN 25 to IN 2 (65 miles) - 2 lanes with no action planned
IN 2 to US 12/20 (22 miles) - already 3+ lanes

So by my count there are still 149 miles that have yet to had any planning begun for expansion.

Bolded emphasis mine.

If I had the opportunity to wager a guess on which of the "no action areas"  would get the treatment next, I'd say the northern third or so of the bolded section (from Indiana 2 southward to Indiana 14). The reasoning...

For a brief moment before the project broke ground, the original plan for the just-finished section of I-65 was to take the widening project to just south of Indiana 10. That plan was nixed in order to get the area that was worked on completed in the "accelerated timeline"  given. It's very easy to revisit this plan in the near future, especially with the Kankakee River bridge completed, along with the bridges just south of that area rebuilt to allow future lane expansion a few years prior. The other bridge in that area (south of Indiana 2) can get finished in a single construction season.

The section just south of Indiana 10 has a bridge that likely needs to be rebuilt for widening, but there are already two bridges between Indiana 10 and Indiana 14 that were rebuilt to accommodate new lanes. After those bridges, it should be easy to finish expansion south to and beyond Indiana 14. A full-blown resurface would be needed on each side of Indiana 14, but the rest should come easy. Just south of there would require more intensive work (the Iroquois River bridge immediately comes to mind), so that would be a good break point.

It's a LONG way off, but a lot of the pieces are in place.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: billtm on December 08, 2018, 08:26:30 PM
So today I decided to go to Indianapolis the long way and during my drive I noticed something weird. Signage indicated that IN-38 ended at US-421 north of Frankfort. I thought okay I guess they got rid of the redundant section of IN-38 between south Frankfort and Kirklin. But when I was driving on US-421 through Kirklin, signage indicated that IN-38 crossed US-421 at Kirklin. So I'm assuming they only got rid of the concurrency with SR-39.
:confused:
Why create a gap in a route when you own all of the road needed to make the route continuous?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 08, 2018, 11:56:40 PM
Quote from: billtm on December 08, 2018, 08:26:30 PM
So today I decided to go to Indianapolis the long way and during my drive I noticed something weird. Signage indicated that IN-38 ended at US-421 north of Frankfort. I thought okay I guess they got rid of the redundant section of IN-38 between south Frankfort and Kirklin. But when I was driving on US-421 through Kirklin, signage indicated that IN-38 crossed US-421 at Kirklin. So I'm assuming they only got rid of the concurrency with SR-39.
:confused:
Why create a gap in a route when you own all of the road needed to make the route continuous?

because indot loves gaps.  they did this a few years ago
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on December 10, 2018, 07:37:25 PM
Funny. Some five to ten years ago, INDOT invested in new signage to make SR 19 a continuous route from Noblesville to Elkhart. Routed 19 over SR 22 & US 35 to SR 13 and then SR 18 to make the connection happen. Then this stuff happens on other routes. Hard to figure.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 11, 2018, 07:46:28 AM
I was at INDOT Greenfield District for a meeting and they had a map on the wall with all the districts projects on it.  I noticed a few random lines around some cities, clearly bypasses, they didn't have any labels though.  I noticed one around the west side of Shelbyville, i wonder if there are plans to bypass it in the future.  Or i may have looked at the map wrong.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 11, 2018, 09:46:55 AM
I believe there are plans for a western connector road that runs from SR 44 west of Shelbyville north to I-74 near Fairland. A small section of this roadway has already been built in the form of Tom Hession Drive, going from CR 400 N to CR 300 N. Ultimately the plan is to run this roadway south SR 44. To my knowledge thought it is not a state project.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: hockeyjohn on December 11, 2018, 09:49:35 AM
Quote from: billtm on December 08, 2018, 08:26:30 PM
So today I decided to go to Indianapolis the long way and during my drive I noticed something weird. Signage indicated that IN-38 ended at US-421 north of Frankfort. I thought okay I guess they got rid of the redundant section of IN-38 between south Frankfort and Kirklin. But when I was driving on US-421 through Kirklin, signage indicated that IN-38 crossed US-421 at Kirklin. So I'm assuming they only got rid of the concurrency with SR-39.
:confused:
Why create a gap in a route when you own all of the road needed to make the route continuous?

It's understandable that INDOT prefers not to have three highways marked concurrently, but then it should have eliminated SR 39.   That would not only get rid of the 421-38-39 concurrency around Frankfort, but also the 421-18-39 concurrency near Delphi.

Another thought would be to re-route US-421 over SR 43 from Reynolds to I-65; along I-65 down to SR 28; then east along SR 28 into Frankfort.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: hockeyjohn on December 11, 2018, 09:55:05 AM
Quote from: monty on December 10, 2018, 07:37:25 PM
Funny. Some five to ten years ago, INDOT invested in new signage to make SR 19 a continuous route from Noblesville to Elkhart. Routed 19 over SR 22 & US 35 to SR 13 and then SR 18 to make the connection happen. Then this stuff happens on other routes. Hard to figure.

Agreed.   If INDOT really feels SR 19 should be continuous from Noblesville to Elkhart, it would be more direct to put 19 onto US-31 from Kokomo to Peru and re-number SR 19 between Peru and SR 18 either back to SR 21 (it's previous designation) or SR 17 to better fit into the grid.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: hockeyjohn on December 11, 2018, 09:58:25 AM
The existing SR 17 would better fit the grid as SR 21 and would allow CR 17 near Elkhart (the extension of M-217) to be numbered SR 17 if INDOT were ever to pick it up.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 12, 2018, 08:38:20 AM
Quote from: hockeyjohn on December 11, 2018, 09:58:25 AM
The existing SR 17 would better fit the grid as SR 21 and would allow CR 17 near Elkhart (the extension of M-217) to be numbered SR 17 if INDOT were ever to pick it up.

INDOT is never going to renumber SR 17 just to use the number elsewhere.  If CR 17 does ever become a state highway, it would either be 217 to keep the continuity with the Michigan section or it could be an extension of 119, with the existing part of 119 east of CR 17 turned over to the county/city.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on December 12, 2018, 09:53:04 AM
Quote from: hockeyjohn on December 11, 2018, 09:58:25 AM
The existing SR 17 would better fit the grid as SR 21 and would allow CR 17 near Elkhart (the extension of M-217) to be numbered SR 17 if INDOT were ever to pick it up.

I find it pretty inexcusable that CR 17 near Elkhart isn't still a state highway.  INDOT trying to absolve itself from as much responsibility as possible, as usual.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 12, 2018, 11:46:15 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on December 12, 2018, 09:53:04 AM
Quote from: hockeyjohn on December 11, 2018, 09:58:25 AM
The existing SR 17 would better fit the grid as SR 21 and would allow CR 17 near Elkhart (the extension of M-217) to be numbered SR 17 if INDOT were ever to pick it up.

I find it pretty inexcusable that CR 17 near Elkhart isn't still a state highway.  INDOT trying to absolve itself from as much responsibility as possible, as usual.

INDOT didn't build the road.  Elkhart County built the road.  I'm not sure why INDOT should automatically be responsible for the road just because it's nice now.  Reagan Parkway in Hendricks County would fall into the same boat.

It would be nice for INDOT to take the road so it can get a number, but they are under no obligation to do so.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 12, 2018, 12:05:41 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 12, 2018, 11:46:15 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on December 12, 2018, 09:53:04 AM
Quote from: hockeyjohn on December 11, 2018, 09:58:25 AM
The existing SR 17 would better fit the grid as SR 21 and would allow CR 17 near Elkhart (the extension of M-217) to be numbered SR 17 if INDOT were ever to pick it up.

I find it pretty inexcusable that CR 17 near Elkhart isn't still a state highway.  INDOT trying to absolve itself from as much responsibility as possible, as usual.

INDOT didn't build the road.  Elkhart County built the road.  I'm not sure why INDOT should automatically be responsible for the road just because it's nice now.  Reagan Parkway in Hendricks County would fall into the same boat.

It would be nice for INDOT to take the road so it can get a number, but they are under no obligation to do so.

I think INDOT was offered RR Pkwy by hendricks county and they declined. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sparker on December 12, 2018, 12:33:49 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 12, 2018, 12:05:41 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 12, 2018, 11:46:15 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on December 12, 2018, 09:53:04 AM
Quote from: hockeyjohn on December 11, 2018, 09:58:25 AM
The existing SR 17 would better fit the grid as SR 21 and would allow CR 17 near Elkhart (the extension of M-217) to be numbered SR 17 if INDOT were ever to pick it up.

I find it pretty inexcusable that CR 17 near Elkhart isn't still a state highway.  INDOT trying to absolve itself from as much responsibility as possible, as usual.

INDOT didn't build the road.  Elkhart County built the road.  I'm not sure why INDOT should automatically be responsible for the road just because it's nice now.  Reagan Parkway in Hendricks County would fall into the same boat.

It would be nice for INDOT to take the road so it can get a number, but they are under no obligation to do so.

I think INDOT was offered RR Pkwy by hendricks county and they declined. 

Questions: (1) doesn't INDOT have a hard mileage cap; and (2) why would a state take over maintenance of a facility constructed by the relevant county -- especially with ostensibly a significant $$ amount attached to do so -- unless there were a pressing need for such an action.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 12, 2018, 12:45:56 PM
Quote from: sparker on December 12, 2018, 12:33:49 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 12, 2018, 12:05:41 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 12, 2018, 11:46:15 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on December 12, 2018, 09:53:04 AM
Quote from: hockeyjohn on December 11, 2018, 09:58:25 AM
The existing SR 17 would better fit the grid as SR 21 and would allow CR 17 near Elkhart (the extension of M-217) to be numbered SR 17 if INDOT were ever to pick it up.

I find it pretty inexcusable that CR 17 near Elkhart isn't still a state highway.  INDOT trying to absolve itself from as much responsibility as possible, as usual.

INDOT didn't build the road.  Elkhart County built the road.  I'm not sure why INDOT should automatically be responsible for the road just because it's nice now.  Reagan Parkway in Hendricks County would fall into the same boat.

It would be nice for INDOT to take the road so it can get a number, but they are under no obligation to do so.

I think INDOT was offered RR Pkwy by hendricks county and they declined. 

Questions: (1) doesn't INDOT have a hard mileage cap; and (2) why would a state take over maintenance of a facility constructed by the relevant county -- especially with ostensibly a significant $$ amount attached to do so -- unless there were a pressing need for such an action.

1 - they do, but they aren't really close to hitting it
2 - i think the county was going to basically let them finish what they started, they wanted them to swap roads where 267 would be signed on RR Pkwy and old 267 would go to the county

unrelated but i think CR 17 could be SR 120, it's weird it just dies at some random intersection where it does, it's a major highway up there.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 13, 2018, 08:31:00 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 12, 2018, 12:45:56 PM
Quote from: sparker on December 12, 2018, 12:33:49 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 12, 2018, 12:05:41 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 12, 2018, 11:46:15 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on December 12, 2018, 09:53:04 AM
Quote from: hockeyjohn on December 11, 2018, 09:58:25 AM
The existing SR 17 would better fit the grid as SR 21 and would allow CR 17 near Elkhart (the extension of M-217) to be numbered SR 17 if INDOT were ever to pick it up.

I find it pretty inexcusable that CR 17 near Elkhart isn't still a state highway.  INDOT trying to absolve itself from as much responsibility as possible, as usual.

INDOT didn't build the road.  Elkhart County built the road.  I'm not sure why INDOT should automatically be responsible for the road just because it's nice now.  Reagan Parkway in Hendricks County would fall into the same boat.

It would be nice for INDOT to take the road so it can get a number, but they are under no obligation to do so.

I think INDOT was offered RR Pkwy by hendricks county and they declined. 

Questions: (1) doesn't INDOT have a hard mileage cap; and (2) why would a state take over maintenance of a facility constructed by the relevant county -- especially with ostensibly a significant $$ amount attached to do so -- unless there were a pressing need for such an action.

1 - they do, but they aren't really close to hitting it
2 - i think the county was going to basically let them finish what they started, they wanted them to swap roads where 267 would be signed on RR Pkwy and old 267 would go to the county

unrelated but i think CR 17 could be SR 120, it's weird it just dies at some random intersection where it does, it's a major highway up there.

If INDOT does ever take over Reagan Pkwy, I wouldn't number it 267.  Would cause too much confusion with people who might think you're referring to the old 267.

120 used to go all the way into Elkhart to Jackson/Goshen, where it ended at US 20.  Once the 20 bypass was built, 120 was then disconnected from 20, and some point later Elkhart took over their portion so thus the end at CR 15.  I would imagine that if INDOT ever took over CR 17, the county would take back that mile or so of 120 west of there.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 2trailertrucker on December 14, 2018, 10:52:18 AM
Regarding moving 267 to  RR Parkway:
267 has been moved in the past. The locals refer to the original section as "Old 267" , and there is no confusion.

The fact that RR Pkwy is moving north toward Whitestown in Boone county might mean that INDOT takes it over, since it would utilize Marion (As Ameriplex Pkwy), Hendricks, then Boone Counties. The part from north of Brownsburg to I-65 is still numbered as 267, where south of I-74 is county owned.

It wouldn't be a stretch for INDOT to take it over and number it 267. As far as the locals being "confused" , C'mon Man!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 17, 2018, 12:15:02 PM
It looks like right now all that will be done to the NW portion of 465 will be to completely redo the 865 interchange, and widen 465 from 86th to US 31, the US 421 interchange looks to be staying the same.  All the exit and entrances from the left will be changed to the right at 865.  This is very early in the planning phases, so this will likely change.  US 421 exit might be a SPUI if they decide to include it in this project.  96TH St will be realigned under 465, and the bridge over nothing (used to be RR tracks) may turn into a box culvert with a trail in it instead of a waterway, i think that will be the farm heritage trail. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 17, 2018, 06:47:09 PM
Will the 465/865 interchange look the same but with the right exits instead? I'm also guessing/hoping that the 465 part of the interchange will feature three lanes on the ramps instead of two. I'm sure that's a major contributor to the congestion there now.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 17, 2018, 07:10:01 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 17, 2018, 06:47:09 PM
Will the 465/865 interchange look the same but with the right exits instead? I'm also guessing/hoping that the 465 part of the interchange will feature three lanes on the ramps instead of two. I'm sure that's a major contributor to the congestion there now.

i'll take another look at the rendering tomorrow.  there are currently 3 alternatives, all are pretty much the same look and all will have exits from the right.  the main difference between them is what is done with the 465 nb to 865 wb ramp, it's always on the right, but some have larger radii
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 18, 2018, 08:11:18 AM
465 will be 4 through lanes throughout the interchange.  865 east will come in from the right at 2 lanes.  865 west will leave from the right as 3 lanes. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 18, 2018, 02:32:48 PM
Construction on the US 41 (Indianapolis Blvd) railroad overpass in Highland is now finished.  Road had been down to one lane each direction but now has both lanes open in both directions.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 22, 2018, 10:16:57 PM
Two new overhead gantries were built along I-80/94 westbound in the Lake Station area, in an effort to better guide drivers to which lanes are for Interstate 65 and which lanes are thru for the Borman. It's in a style very similar to what you see in Minnesota, with no control cities or cardinal directions mentioned (with the one exception in the second gantry, where the far right lane is marked for I-65 north and the second lane from the right is for I-65 south, all on one sign).

What's weird, however, is that only three lanes are marked for I-80/94 at that point, when the fourth lane begins to open up. However, it appears they redesigned the lane flow westbound where the fourth lane doesn't materialize until after all I-65 traffic merges in. Can anyone confirm this?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on December 23, 2018, 12:19:57 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 22, 2018, 10:16:57 PM
Two new overhead gantries were built along I-80/94 westbound in the Lake Station area, in an effort to better guide drivers to which lanes are for Interstate 65 and which lanes are thru for the Borman. It’s in a style very similar to what you see in Minnesota, with no control cities or cardinal directions mentioned (with the one exception in the second gantry, where the far right lane is marked for I-65 north and the second lane from the right is for I-65 south, all on one sign).

What’s weird, however, is that only three lanes are marked for I-80/94 at that point, when the fourth lane begins to open up. However, it appears they redesigned the lane flow westbound where the fourth lane doesn’t materialize until after all I-65 traffic merges in. Can anyone confirm this?

Yes, I think that is correct, and that will be a permanent traffic pattern... I think that will work out better than having all I-65 north traffic merge over a lane to continue onto I-94...
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 23, 2018, 11:38:26 AM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 23, 2018, 12:19:57 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 22, 2018, 10:16:57 PM
Two new overhead gantries were built along I-80/94 westbound in the Lake Station area, in an effort to better guide drivers to which lanes are for Interstate 65 and which lanes are thru for the Borman. It's in a style very similar to what you see in Minnesota, with no control cities or cardinal directions mentioned (with the one exception in the second gantry, where the far right lane is marked for I-65 north and the second lane from the right is for I-65 south, all on one sign).

What's weird, however, is that only three lanes are marked for I-80/94 at that point, when the fourth lane begins to open up. However, it appears they redesigned the lane flow westbound where the fourth lane doesn't materialize until after all I-65 traffic merges in. Can anyone confirm this?

Yes, I think that is correct, and that will be a permanent traffic pattern... I think that will work out better than having all I-65 north traffic merge over a lane to continue onto I-94...

Having to make that merge myself, I can attest to the extreme difficulty of having to merge into the mainline while achieving the speed limit. The one working camera near the interchange confirm solid diagonal lines on the extra wide shoulder.

If it means sacrificing the westbound fourth lane until after I-65, which has no detriment to traffic flow, then so be it. That will also help traffic on the connector, which won't be forced into one lane, then forced again to shift into the mainline. Instead, the inner lane of that ramp will be the new fourth lane, while the right lane is for Broadway.

However, it creates another problem; traffic on I-80/94 has to jump two lanes to get to the Broadway lane. It probably won't be too much of an issue once the ramp to I-65 north reopens soon.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ssummers72 on December 23, 2018, 01:58:47 PM
The reduction in one lane Westbound on I-80/94 was setup to allow the Northbound I-65 to Westbound I-80/94 to be a continuous travel. This new pattern was setup to balance the queues between I-80/94 and I-65, it would not eliminate them just balance them out. This queue analysis was performed by NIRPC and the FHWA's Indiana office and EPA agreed that the pollution and traffic numbers were acceptable. I have not field checked it yet, but on I-80/94 Westbound around the 15.6, the pull through sign should have been changed to "Jct I-65, 2 1/4 Miles" this was done to bring this interchange into MUTCD compliance, as all major junctions having a 2 mile advance junction sign. If you have any other questions about the project, please let me know.
Thank You

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 23, 2018, 03:48:27 PM
Quote from: ssummers72 on December 23, 2018, 01:58:47 PM
The reduction in one lane Westbound on I-80/94 was setup to allow the Northbound I-65 to Westbound I-80/94 to be a continuous travel. This new pattern was setup to balance the queues between I-80/94 and I-65, it would not eliminate them just balance them out. This queue analysis was performed by NIRPC and the FHWA's Indiana office and EPA agreed that the pollution and traffic numbers were acceptable. I have not field checked it yet, but on I-80/94 Westbound around the 15.6, the pull through sign should have been changed to "Jct I-65, 2 1/4 Miles" this was done to bring this interchange into MUTCD compliance, as all major junctions having a 2 mile advance junction sign. If you have any other questions about the project, please let me know.
Thank You

First off, thank you so much for your input. Hearing analysis from the field is really helpful, and this lane reduction makes sense since the lionshare of the traffic is west of the I-65 Northwest Connector interchange. Also, thank you for telling me what that sign said near the Toll Road interchange. That makes it a lot more informative than the sign that it replaced ("I-94 West, I-80 West, US 6 West" ), and I couldn't tell what it said since I was heading east.

Any more plans for new or replacement gantries in that area in the future? I feel there are some signs that can be replaced with more relevant information, especially since some of the signs are still the old button copy, and there's hardly any mention of US 6 or exit 15a until you get right up to the interchange. Thank you once again for your time.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ShawnP on December 23, 2018, 04:12:53 PM
Went thru rebuild/expansion on I-65 from mm-50 to 68.

Original plan was mm-50 to mm-64 as a rebuild/expand and mm-64 to mm-68 as just a rebuild.

The build grants from 2 weeks ago gave Indiana extra money to expand mm 64 to 68. Looks like Indiana already rebuilt mm-64 to 68 so some rebuilding will happen.

MM-64 to 68 looks like a asphalt rebuild and mm-64 to 50 as concrete.

The completion date is fall of 2020.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on January 16, 2019, 09:14:21 PM
A new traffic pattern is in effect for I-65 northbound at the CSX/Central Avenue bridge just north of I-80/94. Northbound traffic has shifted over and is now driving over the recently finished southbound bridge. A lot of the structure is fresh; most of the concrete guardrails are tarped over (and will likely stay that way until the effects of the upcoming winter storm abate). This pattern will stay in effect until the northbound bridge is replaced, which is still on target for summer completion.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on January 16, 2019, 11:14:21 PM
Tippecanoe County major road projects for 2019:

https://www.jconline.com/story/news/2019/01/14/upcoming-construction-tippecaone-county-2019/2570086002/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 24, 2019, 11:07:26 PM
The first of many major road projects in Northwest Indiana (not currently in progress) is scheduled to start March 4.

The Indiana Avenue bridge in downtown Laporte (which carries both US 35 and Indiana 39) will undergo a bridge deck replacement. Only one lane of traffic will be open in each direction, as crews will work on the northbound side of the bridge first, then shift focus to the southbound side. The project is scheduled for October completion.

There is no viable detour, even for local traffic. It's even likely that the surface street alternatives (Madison and Rockwood Street to the west, Detroit Avenue and Clear Lake Boulevard to the east) may take longer due to the large volume of train traffic that runs through the area. Those looking for long range travel southbound on Indiana 39 or US 35 may want to consider using US 421 (if coming from the west) or US 31 (if coming from the east) and US 6 to reach those routes.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on February 24, 2019, 11:59:22 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 24, 2019, 11:07:26 PM
The first of many major road projects in Northwest Indiana (not currently in progress) is scheduled to start March 4.

The Indiana Avenue bridge in downtown Laporte (which carries both US 35 and Indiana 39) will undergo a bridge deck replacement. Only one lane of traffic will be open in each direction, as crews will work on the northbound side of the bridge first, then shift focus to the southbound side. The project is scheduled for October completion.

There is no viable detour, even for local traffic. It’s even likely that the surface street alternatives (Madison and Rockwood Street to the west, Detroit Avenue and Clear Lake Boulevard to the east) may take longer due to the large volume of train traffic that runs through the area. Those looking for long range travel southbound on Indiana 39 or US 35 may want to consider using US 421 (if coming from the west) or US 31 (if coming from the east) and US 6 to reach those routes.

And do not forget that they will start on SR 2/US 20 interchange project this year as well... it's going to be a mess this year in La Porte County in terms of construction and the impacts from them...
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on February 27, 2019, 03:24:35 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 17, 2017, 06:20:10 PM
it will one day be widened, the tell tale signs are there.  the ditch road bridge is going to be raised and lengthened next year, township line in 2020ish
The Ditch Road overpass of I-465 will be replaced, starting next Monday & running through September 30. Source: https://cbs4indy.com/2019/02/25/work-to-replace-ditch-road-bridge-over-i-465-set-to-begin-march-4/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on March 05, 2019, 09:18:57 PM
I just got a copy of the new 2019 Indiana Roadway Map. In case anyone is interested here's a few noticable changes to it.

-The biggest and probably most anticipated change is the addition of Section 5 to Interstate 69 between Bloomington and Martinsville complete with exit numbers.

-New bypasses around Boonville and North Vernon (SR 61 and US 50 respectively)

-County seats are now marked on the map with an astrisk

-What appears to be CR 17 in Elkhart County is marked as an expressway from the Michigan state line south to SR 119 west of Goshen. US 33 appears to have been moved slightly on its new alignment in Goshen as well.

-One thing I've noticed that is still on the map, the travel plazas out by Fremont on the Toll Road, closed for several years now.

That's it for now, as usual no city inserts on the map other than Indianapolis and the map format of having ads and stuff on the backside is the same as it's been.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on March 06, 2019, 01:33:21 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on February 24, 2019, 11:59:22 PM

And do not forget that they will start on SR 2/US 20 interchange project this year as well... it's going to be a mess this year in La Porte County in terms of construction and the impacts from them...

Just wanted to add that the interchange project will start on March 14... cross traffic to/from La Porte or New Carlisle will have to find a different way to get around this closure...

The detours will be the following:
If you are heading to/from La Porte, the detour will be to take U.S. 35 to IN SR 39 to U.S. 20
If you are heading to/from New Carlisle, the detour will be to take IN SR 2 to U.S. 20/31 to U.S. 20
Or take the county roads (if you are a local)

Completion is expected to be in November of this year... One lane of traffic will be open in each direction on U.S. 20/IN SR 2 (Michigan City-South Bend traffic)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on March 06, 2019, 01:35:52 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 24, 2019, 11:07:26 PM
The first of many major road projects in Northwest Indiana (not currently in progress) is scheduled to start March 4.

The Indiana Avenue bridge in downtown Laporte (which carries both US 35 and Indiana 39) will undergo a bridge deck replacement. Only one lane of traffic will be open in each direction, as crews will work on the northbound side of the bridge first, then shift focus to the southbound side. The project is scheduled for October completion.

There is no viable detour, even for local traffic. It's even likely that the surface street alternatives (Madison and Rockwood Street to the west, Detroit Avenue and Clear Lake Boulevard to the east) may take longer due to the large volume of train traffic that runs through the area. Those looking for long range travel southbound on Indiana 39 or US 35 may want to consider using US 421 (if coming from the west) or US 31 (if coming from the east) and US 6 to reach those routes.

I just went through that construction zone today, and it's a mess right now... no trucks allowed on the bridge due to narrower lanes than usual...
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 06, 2019, 08:14:25 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on March 06, 2019, 01:33:21 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on February 24, 2019, 11:59:22 PM

And do not forget that they will start on SR 2/US 20 interchange project this year as well... it's going to be a mess this year in La Porte County in terms of construction and the impacts from them...

Just wanted to add that the interchange project will start on March 14... cross traffic to/from La Porte or New Carlisle will have to find a different way to get around this closure...

The detours will be the following:
If you are heading to/from La Porte, the detour will be to take U.S. 35 to IN SR 39 to U.S. 20
If you are heading to/from New Carlisle, the detour will be to take IN SR 2 to U.S. 20/31 to U.S. 20
Or take the county roads (if you are a local)

Completion is expected to be in November of this year... One lane of traffic will be open in each direction on U.S. 20/IN SR 2 (Michigan City-South Bend traffic)

So part of the LaPorte detour requires you to drive through the other major construction zone, which will compound delays. At this point, it would probably be quicker to use I-94, US 12, and M-51 to get to South Bend (toll-free).

With that said, it will be a tremendous improvement over what is currently there; it worked wonders when this same project was performed at the intersection (now interchange) of Vale Park Road and Indiana 49 in Valparaiso.

On a related note, there are talks of adding traffic lights just east of said interchange. There have been concerns about Cougar Road at both US 20 (which carries a 55 mph speed limit at that point) and Indiana 2 (which is a divided highway carrying a 60 mph speed limit at that point). This street is where New Prairie High School is located, where bus traffic is quite high at times. INDOT is said to be working with Laporte County officials on that matter.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on March 11, 2019, 12:00:57 PM
Indy Construction Alert: A major project begins today on Fall Creek Parkway, North Drive and Binford Boulevard (former SR 37) on the northeast side of Indianapolis that will run through most of the rest of 2019. The goal is to improve all 17 intersections, from 38th/Fall Creek to 75th/Binford/I-69, and to replace pavement & subsurface as needed to deter future chuckholes from developing. all traffic signals along this stretch will be upgraded (and hopefully, interconnected). Sadly, a badly needed third travel lane in each direction between just north of 46th Street and I-69 is not part of this plan (IMHO, this would be the ideal time to add the sorely needed extra capacity). This project is the responsibility of the City of Indianapolis. Expect even more delays than usual on Binford & FCPND through November, as well as additional traffic along Allisonville Road and on I-465 & I-70 between downtown Indy & Castleton.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 13, 2019, 09:28:45 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on March 11, 2019, 12:00:57 PM
Indy Construction Alert: A major project begins today on Fall Creek Parkway, North Drive and Binford Boulevard (former SR 37) on the northeast side of Indianapolis that will run through most of the rest of 2019. The goal is to improve all 17 intersections, from 38th/Fall Creek to 75th/Binford/I-69, and to replace pavement & subsurface as needed to deter future chuckholes from developing. all traffic signals along this stretch will be upgraded (and hopefully, interconnected). Sadly, a badly needed third travel lane in each direction between just north of 46th Street and I-69 is not part of this plan (IMHO, this would be the ideal time to add the sorely needed extra capacity). This project is the responsibility of the City of Indianapolis. Expect even more delays than usual on Binford & FCPND through November, as well as additional traffic along Allisonville Road and on I-465 & I-70 between downtown Indy & Castleton.

INDOT will widen the 75th st intersection to 3 lanes in each direction to get more cars through the intersection there, this will be part of the "clear path" project that will finally fix the clusterfuck that is 465/69.  Unfortunately, the City of Potholeville is too poor to do anything of significance anywhere to any of its roads.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on March 13, 2019, 09:37:35 PM
If Binford was still SR 37 INDOT could have been responsible for this project, which would free up some money to work on other city streets. Instead the city has to rebuild a roadway that is basically used by Hamilton County commuters without any of them footing the bill for it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on March 14, 2019, 01:05:14 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on March 13, 2019, 09:37:35 PM
If Binford was still SR 37 INDOT could have been responsible for this project, which would free up some money to work on other city streets. Instead the city has to rebuild a roadway that is basically used by Hamilton County commuters without any of them footing the bill for it.
That is not entirely true, as I live in Marion County and use Binford Blvd all the time. But I understand your point. Too bad it was relinquished long before SR 431 was, where the state gave tons of money to Carmel to build their totally inadequate "Keystone Parkway" (I still call by it's proper name... Keystone AVENUE).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 14, 2019, 08:02:55 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on March 14, 2019, 01:05:14 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on March 13, 2019, 09:37:35 PM
If Binford was still SR 37 INDOT could have been responsible for this project, which would free up some money to work on other city streets. Instead the city has to rebuild a roadway that is basically used by Hamilton County commuters without any of them footing the bill for it.
That is not entirely true, as I live in Marion County and use Binford Blvd all the time. But I understand your point. Too bad it was relinquished long before SR 431 was, where the state gave tons of money to Carmel to build their totally inadequate "Keystone Parkway" (I still call by it's proper name... Keystone AVENUE).

Ya it would have been nice if they upgraded Binford/FC Pkwy N Dr. to an expressway, widen it to 6 lanes and add roundabout interchanges at each cross street, with the expressway ending at 38th st., and continuing with at grade roundabouts until capitol ave and removing the suicide lane.  They could at least fix the lack of turn lanes at many of those intersections down there. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 27, 2019, 06:10:44 PM
looks like SR 267 now just exists from I-74 to 65 and from US 40 to I-70.  Portion south of I-70 must have been recently decommissioned, INDOT maps show it gone and street view in downtown Mooresville confirms it.

https://gis.in.gov/apps/dot/mapinsert/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on March 27, 2019, 07:36:41 PM
^ Last April/May I went driving around that area near Plainfield, IN, looking for an IL-267 marker.  I didn't find anything for that southern segment at all. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on March 27, 2019, 07:56:40 PM
That doesn't sound surprising, I would imagine it would be hard to find an Illinois 267 route marker around Plainfield, Indiana.

But on a more serious note, this now separates SR 267 from its parent SR 67. The Plainfield part has to be bound to go eventually. I can see the 74 to 65 part sticking around for now but now I think it may need a new number now.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on March 28, 2019, 02:20:28 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on March 27, 2019, 07:56:40 PM
That doesn't sound surprising, I would imagine it would be hard to find an Illinois 267 route marker around Plainfield, Indiana.

But on a more serious note, this now separates SR 267 from its parent SR 67. The Plainfield part has to be bound to go eventually. I can see the 74 to 65 part sticking around for now but now I think it may need a new number now.
This is one of the main things that I loathe about INDOT.  They are cutting up highways all over the place, and if you are not a local, you may have been depending on following one highway to another one, and now they disappear on you.  Yep, they may be saving money, but part of their purpose should be to make transportation easier within the state.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Interstate 69 Fan on March 28, 2019, 02:37:08 PM
I honestly don't see a need to decommission segments of 267 in the first place. I could understand north of I-74, but 267 is a better route number for Ronald Reagan Parkway, which parallels 267 for all of it's route, even the plans to extend it from 74 to 65 have it paralleling 267.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 28, 2019, 06:22:51 PM
Quote from: Interstate 69 Fan on March 28, 2019, 02:37:08 PM
I honestly don't see a need to decommission segments of 267 in the first place. I could understand north of I-74, but 267 is a better route number for Ronald Reagan Parkway, which parallels 267 for all of it's route, even the plans to extend it from 74 to 65 have it paralleling 267.

RR Pkwy was going to be 267, county offered a road swap, INDOT refused.  Also the 74 to 65 portion will likely be axed when RR Pkwy is extended to 65, it's currently under design, have no idea when it will be built though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: hockeyjohn on March 28, 2019, 09:06:06 PM

Quote from: Life in Paradise on March 28, 2019, 02:20:28 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on March 27, 2019, 07:56:40 PM
That doesn't sound surprising, I would imagine it would be hard to find an Illinois 267 route marker around Plainfield, Indiana.

But on a more serious note, this now separates SR 267 from its parent SR 67. The Plainfield part has to be bound to go eventually. I can see the 74 to 65 part sticking around for now but now I think it may need a new number now.
This is one of the main things that I loathe about INDOT.  They are cutting up highways all over the place, and if you are not a local, you may have been depending on following one highway to another one, and now they disappear on you.  Yep, they may be saving money, but part of their purpose should be to make transportation easier within the state.


Agreed.   Indiana should follow what Florida often does by signing truncated State Roads with the blue/yellow pentagonal marker using the same number for continuity.   INDOT often pays the county or municipality for required maintenance or does major maintenance prior to the turnback and the signing requirement could be written into the agreement.    If the receiving county/municipality does not want the former traffic load on a now county road or local street, e.g.  SR 22 in Kokomo, then the State and receiving entity would need to agree on an alternate route that would be signed for continuity.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jnewkirk77 on March 29, 2019, 12:24:42 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on March 27, 2019, 07:56:40 PM
That doesn't sound surprising, I would imagine it would be hard to find an Illinois 267 route marker around Plainfield, Indiana.

But on a more serious note, this now separates SR 267 from its parent SR 67. The Plainfield part has to be bound to go eventually. I can see the 74 to 65 part sticking around for now but now I think it may need a new number now.

267 hasn't met 67 for quite a few years; it's been no closer than a few blocks west of it for at least the 25+ years I've been driving.  And at one point, 42, 144 and 267 all ended at the intersection of Indiana and High streets.  Sometime in the last 15-20 years, INDOT moved the ends of 42 and 144 out to 67.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 29, 2019, 10:26:41 PM
Back to work...

Today, INDOT has reopened southbound I-65 to limited traffic between the Indiana Toll Road entrance and I-80/94 in Gary. Traffic from the Indiana Toll Road and nearby 15th Avenue can enter I-65 southbound and cross the bridge project zone, but traffic from US 12/20 will still be unable to enter and will be detoured via Indiana 51 (Ripley Street) or Indiana 53 (Broadway) to I-80/94.

The project was expected to be finished sometime this summer, but crews discovered one of the piers in need of a complete replacement, which will push completion to late fall.

US 12 will be repaved from the marina bridge (just west of the Midwest Steel/Lakefront bridge) to Indiana 149, starting next week. This project is expected to last through mid-June, with one lane open in each direction.

Work resumes on Indiana 51 in Lake Station to finish the northbound span of the Burns Ditch bridge, located just north of I-80/94. This project is expected to wrap up this summer.

Watch for lane closures on I-65 around the 101st Avenue bridge. The overpass is currently being replaced, and all lane closures will be during nighttime hours. Work is expected to finish in time for the next school year.

As you may already know, the US 20/Indiana 2 interchange project is underway near Rolling Prairie. The north-south movements are cut off during the project, so New Carlisle and Laporte traffic will have to follow the designated detours, or do some major doubling back via the St. Joseph Valley Parkway or Indiana 39.

Welcome back to construction season.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on April 02, 2019, 01:14:42 PM
US 41/Indianapolis Blvd overpass over the tracks in Highland is back down to one lane each way.  I thought that wrapped up last summer but apparently not.

Main St on the Munster/Dyer border is closed until June for a bridge replacement.

The 45th St/Calumet Ave railroad underpass project is beginning soon, with a closure of 45th St east of Calumet being the first closure.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 03, 2019, 06:18:37 PM
On top of that...

There's more major roadwork on tap along US 20 in Laporte County. Along with the dog bone interchange near Rolling Prairie, major work is underway from Laporte-Porter County Line Road to the Indiana 212/US 35 interchange.

For the entire aforementioned stretch, US 20 will undergo full resurfacing. The stretch from Woodland Avenue to Johnson Road will also include a center left turn lane, which will allow safer left turns for eastbound drivers entering into the plazas. During construction in this area, one lane will be open in each direction, with a temporary center turn lane to keep traffic moving. All work is expected to conclude in October.

As mentioned upthread, drivers who have interests in South Bend, Mishawaka, or Elkhart, and not willing to use the Indiana Toll Road, should consider jumping into Michigan via I-94, picking up US 12, and returning to Indiana via US 31 or M-57 (Indiana 933 south of the state line).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 03, 2019, 06:36:35 PM
gas tax dollars at work.

INDOT plans to repave all interstates in Marion county this yr (the asphalt portions)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on April 04, 2019, 10:01:08 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 03, 2019, 06:18:37 PM
On top of that...

There's more major roadwork on tap along US 20 in Laporte County. Along with the dog bone interchange near Rolling Prairie, major work is underway from Laporte-Porter County Line Road to the Indiana 212/US 35 interchange.

For the entire aforementioned stretch, US 20 will undergo full resurfacing. The stretch from Woodland Avenue to Johnson Road will also include a center left turn lane, which will allow safer left turns for eastbound drivers entering into the plazas. During construction in this area, one lane will be open in each direction, with a temporary center turn lane to keep traffic moving. All work is expected to conclude in October.

As mentioned upthread, drivers who have interests in South Bend, Mishawaka, or Elkhart, and not willing to use the Indiana Toll Road, should consider jumping into Michigan via I-94, picking up US 12, and returning to Indiana via US 31 or M-57 (Indiana 933 south of the state line).

US 20/IN 2 between I-94 and South Bend should still be fine.  Being down to one lane at the interchange construction isn't really any more of a slowdown than having the light there.  At least not on weekends when I am going that way.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 05, 2019, 11:27:58 PM
And get this...there's more road work on US 20 in the Burns Harbor area, and it starts this Monday.

Resurfacing will take place from just west of Indiana 149 to just east of I-94 (the Burns Harbor-Porter interchange) and is scheduled to last through June. One lane of traffic will be maintained in each direction. While it is a short stretch, delays will likely take place during peak traffic hours, mainly at the truck stops on both sides of I-94; both are busy havens for travelers and are set with traffic lights.

What may complicate things...upthread, I mentioned resurfacing work being planned on US 12 from Ogden Dunes to east of Indiana 149. Well, that project is also scheduled to start Monday and last through June. This will likely be problematic come Memorial Day Weekend, since one of the major beach entrances (Portage Lakefront Park) is facilitated via US 12 (you can also enter this park from the south via I-94 or US 20, which would be a better alternative).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 26, 2019, 10:10:17 PM
Crews will be revisiting the I-65 area between US 30 and US 231, this time for more invasive concrete restoration that is expected to last through the summer.

Next week, one lane will be closed in each direction as crews install a temporary barrier wall. when that is completed, all traffic will have two lanes in each direction on the southbound side. When patching is completed on the northbound side, all traffic will share those lanes while southbound lanes get the same treatment. This project is to last through mid-September.

Keep in mind that traffic may be down to one lane during nighttime hours at the 101st Avenue overpass, since bridge replacement is currently in progress.

Further south, be aware of lane closures due to guardrail repair between Indiana 2 and US 231.

Crews will resurface US 6 in the Hobart and Portage areas, from just east of Indiana 51 to just west of Airport Road. Lane closures will take place soon after crews finish curb repairs along the plazas. Expect this to last throughout the summer.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 07, 2019, 01:35:50 PM
The likely final design of the north split is up.

https://northsplit.com/project-overview/preliminary-preferred-alternative/

It's a lot smaller now!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on May 07, 2019, 06:54:01 PM
Some interesting ideas in that plan. Some seem obvious, like switching the ramps on northbound to avoid the weave. I'm surprised that the Delaware ramp will only be able to access I-70 and not I-65. I use that ramp periodically to go south, but would never use it to get on to I-70 because the weave is horrible in a short amount of time. Are there that many people getting on there to use I-70, or are they mostly simplifying the design?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 07, 2019, 10:05:31 PM
Quote from: jhuntin1 on May 07, 2019, 06:54:01 PM
Some interesting ideas in that plan. Some seem obvious, like switching the ramps on northbound to avoid the weave. I'm surprised that the Delaware ramp will only be able to access I-70 and not I-65. I use that ramp periodically to go south, but would never use it to get on to I-70 because the weave is horrible in a short amount of time. Are there that many people getting on there to use I-70, or are they mostly simplifying the design?

More people use the 70 movement that's why they kept that movement. Most of the movements are preserved.  I think the Pennsylania from 70 west movement being lost is unfortunate.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 17, 2019, 06:01:21 PM
apparently US 27 still exists north of FT Wayne  :-D https://www.in.gov/dnr/parklake/files/pokagon_trail.pdf
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 21, 2019, 11:06:29 PM
As mentioned upthread, concrete restoration is in progress on I-65 between US 30 and US 231, but starting soon, ramp closures will accompany this project.

If not already underway, crews will close the northbound entrance and exit ramps at 109th Avenue so those ramps can be repaired. Once mainline traffic shifts to the northbound lanes, the southbound entry and exit ramps will close. The best detours for these closures will be the routes that proceed them (if heading northbound, US 231 to Broadway. When southbound ramps close, it'll be US 30 to Broadway, though it's likely better to use US 231 and double back to Broadway because of slightly lighter traffic).

Along that same section, the 101st Avenue overpass is scheduled to finish later than expected, around mid-September.

Intersection improvements are set to start next week at US 30 and Randolph Street in Merrillville (for reference, that's 4 miles east of I-65 and just west of the Deep River Waterpark. US 30 will be largely unaffected (save for unrelated pipe work nearby on the outer shoulders, which has a "45 when workers present"  rule in place). Currently having only one lane in each direction when crossing US 30 (creating massive backups during the weekend), Randolph Street will have a left turn, through, and right turn lane at each approach. While not mentioned, this project will hopefully address the timing of that traffic light (left turn traffic from US 30 barely has any time to make turns because of the short intervals) and fix the cycles (protected left + through, one direction at a time for Randolph traffic). This project is expected to last through summer.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on May 22, 2019, 03:06:15 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 07, 2019, 10:05:31 PM
More people use the 70 movement that's why they kept that movement. Most of the movements are preserved.  I think the Pennsylania [sic] from 70 west movement being lost is unfortunate.
I'd say it's much more than unfortunate, it's RIDICULOUS! But then INDOT is quite often penny-wise, pound-foolish IMHO.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 16, 2019, 04:28:45 PM
It hasn't been mentioned yet, but I thought it would be best to bring it to attention...

The Indiana Toll Road has started their "Push 2.0"  project. The website mentions work going from Cline Avenue (exit 10) to the Illinois state line. What isn't mentioned is that the work also extends from Cline Avenue east to the Lake Station interchange, a section that has been a major point of contention. That section is undergoing a full-blown resurface, and because of that, only one lane gets by.

I'm glad that they're addressing the ratted pavement, because that area looks bad for it only being finished 6-7 years ago. This project will last through the summer and into the early portion of fall. Delays are to be expected.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 16, 2019, 09:14:02 PM
Down here in Potholeville all the asphalt sections of interstate will be resurfaced, as are the concrete portions of 70 between 465 and the south split.  Very much needed project.  65 is closed northbound between 465 and 865.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on June 21, 2019, 08:26:24 PM
Read this article last night, INDOT plans on widening I-465 on the southwest side from I-65 to I-70 (miles 0 to 8) starting in 2021. The interstate will be widened one lane in each direction with several bridges rebuilt. Part of the project is part of the construction for the I-69 interchange where Section 6 meets I-465.

https://www.theindychannel.com/news/local-news/big-changes-planned-for-i-465-on-indys-south-side
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on June 22, 2019, 04:50:31 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on June 21, 2019, 08:26:24 PM
Read this article last night, INDOT plans on widening I-465 on the southwest side from I-65 to I-70 (miles 0 to 8) starting in 2021. The interstate will be widened one lane in each direction with several bridges rebuilt. Part of the project is part of the construction for the I-69 interchange where Section 6 meets I-465.

https://www.theindychannel.com/news/local-news/big-changes-planned-for-i-465-on-indys-south-side

This would be getting ahead of the curve.  Once I-69 opens in a few years, there will be substantial traffic that will be traveling the completion portion of the road along with the adjacent I-465 connection (this area).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 28, 2019, 11:06:41 AM
Updates along I-65 in Lake County:

The Central Avenue bridge project (north of I-80/94) continues to progress. One portion of the deck has been poured while another section of the bridge is waiting for the gap in the middle to be filled. The road is expected to be fully open by mid- to late fall, along with the ramps affected by this project.

The action is mainly between US 30 and US 231. Beams have been put into place for the 101st Avenue overpass. While crews work on the bridge, concrete restoration is also in progress in the area. Traffic in both directions currently shares the southbound side of the road, as crews patch the center lane (former right line before widening) on the northbound side. By mid-August, traffic will be moved to the northbound lanes while the same work is performed on the southbound side. Northbound access to and from 109th Avenue is closed off; the detour requires traffic to use Indiana 53 (Broadway) to US 30 east to access I-65 north.

All above work is set for fall completion.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 2trailertrucker on July 04, 2019, 11:59:13 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on June 21, 2019, 08:26:24 PM
Read this article last night, INDOT plans on widening I-465 on the southwest side from I-65 to I-70 (miles 0 to 8) starting in 2021. The interstate will be widened one lane in each direction with several bridges rebuilt. Part of the project is part of the construction for the I-69 interchange where Section 6 meets I-465.

https://www.theindychannel.com/news/local-news/big-changes-planned-for-i-465-on-indys-south-side

I can understand widening the east side of I-465 (since that will handle 90% of the traffic), but people going west on I-465 from I-69 will be minimal. People going west will use IN-67 from Martinsville to either Ameriplex Parkway or I-465.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 04, 2019, 07:07:42 PM
Not if the 37 corridor becomes a full freeway as is planned. Coming from Bloomington anyway the new I-69 should still be quicker all the way up to I-465 since 67 will still have a lower speed limit and there are stoplights around Moorseville and up along Kentucky Avenue. And in any case, the stretch of I-465 from 37 west to I-70 should be eight lanes anyway based the traffic using that highway as it is, regardless of I-69. Nearly all of I-465 should be at least eight lanes wide now based on the day-to-day traffic before the I-69 extension is completed. The northern half of the beltway by that measure should be nearly ten lanes in width.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 2trailertrucker on July 06, 2019, 01:42:28 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 04, 2019, 07:07:42 PM
Not if the 37 corridor becomes a full freeway as is planned. Coming from Bloomington anyway the new I-69 should still be quicker all the way up to I-465 since 67 will still have a lower speed limit and there are stoplights around Moorseville and up along Kentucky Avenue. And in any case, the stretch of I-465 from 37 west to I-70 should be eight lanes anyway based the traffic using that highway as it is, regardless of I-69. Nearly all of I-465 should be at least eight lanes wide now based on the day-to-day traffic before the I-69 extension is completed. The northern half of the beltway by that measure should be nearly ten lanes in width.

Thanks.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 09, 2019, 12:00:57 PM
INDOT is looking into ramp meters and shoulder lanes (shoulders are an extra lane only during rush hour) for the borman.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 09, 2019, 06:54:17 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 09, 2019, 12:00:57 PM
INDOT is looking into ramp meters and shoulder lanes (shoulders are an extra lane only during rush hour) for the borman.

An RFI (Request for Information) is due Friday for this endeavor. They're going to mine information from other states currently employing this practice. Given how accident-prone this stretch is during peak times (again, devolving driver culture, not necessarily the layout of the road itself), I feel it opens up the door for more problems. With new management in Illinois, it's almost time to revisit the Illiana concept.

Another potentially major project (this one actually on the schedule for next year) will be discussed by INDOT with Gary residents this week. As part of a long term plan to double-track the South Shore Line, including beautification of the Miller area, Dunes Highway (US 12/20) is set to undergo a major realignment.

As part of the realignment, a section of US 12 from the current east split with US 20 (about 2 miles east of I-65, for reference) to a tenth of a mile east of Lake Street (near the Miller South Shore station) will be removed, with all existing intersections removed as well. That means US 12 and 20 will share pavement to just east of Lake Street, where a lighted intersection will take a newly southward-angled US 12 to the current CSX and Old Hobart Road bridges and its present course.

The realigned stretch will be reconstructed, with sidewalks on each side of the highway, decorative lighting, landscaping, new signage, and enhanced pedestrian crossings. Lake Street will also see improvements, including new median islands, bike paths, and parallel parking spaces.

The hearing for this project is this Thursday (July 11).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 10, 2019, 07:41:30 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 09, 2019, 06:54:17 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 09, 2019, 12:00:57 PM
INDOT is looking into ramp meters and shoulder lanes (shoulders are an extra lane only during rush hour) for the borman.

An RFI (Request for Information) is due Friday for this endeavor. They're going to mine information from other states currently employing this practice. Given how accident-prone this stretch is during peak times (again, devolving driver culture, not necessarily the layout of the road itself), I feel it opens up the door for more problems. With new management in Illinois, it's almost time to revisit the Illiana concept.

Another potentially major project (this one actually on the schedule for next year) will be discussed by INDOT with Gary residents this week. As part of a long term plan to double-track the South Shore Line, including beautification of the Miller area, Dunes Highway (US 12/20) is set to undergo a major realignment.

As part of the realignment, a section of US 12 from the current east split with US 20 (about 2 miles east of I-65, for reference) to a tenth of a mile east of Lake Street (near the Miller South Shore station) will be removed, with all existing intersections removed as well. That means US 12 and 20 will share pavement to just east of Lake Street, where a lighted intersection will take a newly southward-angled US 12 to the current CSX and Old Hobart Road bridges and its present course.

The realigned stretch will be reconstructed, with sidewalks on each side of the highway, decorative lighting, landscaping, new signage, and enhanced pedestrian crossings. Lake Street will also see improvements, including new median islands, bike paths, and parallel parking spaces.

The hearing for this project is this Thursday (July 11).

So if I understand you correctly, US 12 from the split to Lake street will be removed, 12/20 will be cosigned to lake street where 12/20 will split again?  Any links or renderings available from INDOT? US 12 is a fun drive from the split to Michigan.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 10, 2019, 10:18:52 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 10, 2019, 07:41:30 PMSo if I understand you correctly, US 12 from the split to Lake street will be removed, 12/20 will be cosigned to lake street where 12/20 will split again?  Any links or renderings available from INDOT? US 12 is a fun drive from the split to Michigan.

Almost. You are correct that US 12 and 20 will have nearly an additional mile and a half of concurrency when this project is concluded. However, US 12 will have a new stretch of pavement just east of Lake Street to connect US 20 to the rest of its current course by the two bridges. US 12 will not share pavement with Lake Street; that particular intersection will be completely removed.

INDOT doesn't have any renderings yet, but I'm certain they'll be available after tomorrow night's hearing. I'll keep an eye out. Also, this project is located literally within my neck of the woods (my parents' house, where I lived for 15 years, will be partially affected), so I would likely provide photos when it begins in 2021 (not next year as originally posted).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 11, 2019, 11:54:28 PM
As promised, here (https://www.in.gov/indot/files/US12US20EnvironmentalDocumentPartIII.pdf) is the document (including maps) regarding the realignment.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 17, 2019, 02:51:40 PM
An interchange at 276th and US 31 will be built in the coming years. There will be one at 236th soon.

Pixel 2 XL

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on July 17, 2019, 02:52:53 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 17, 2019, 02:51:40 PM
An interchange at 276th and US 31 will be built in the coming years. There will be one at 236th soon.

Pixel 2 XL

Nice!  Do you have a link to more info?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 17, 2019, 02:56:40 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on July 17, 2019, 02:52:53 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 17, 2019, 02:51:40 PM
An interchange at 276th and US 31 will be built in the coming years. There will be one at 236th soon.

Pixel 2 XL

Nice!  Do you have a link to more info?

unfortunately no, but here is a link to the 465 widening on the south side https://www.in.gov/indot/3961.htm
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 17, 2019, 03:59:39 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 17, 2019, 02:51:40 PM
An interchange at 276th and US 31 will be built in the coming years. There will be one at 236th soon.

Pixel 2 XL



236th makes sense, but why 276th?  266th goes to Arcadia so I'd think that road gets more traffic.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 17, 2019, 05:08:21 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 17, 2019, 03:59:39 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 17, 2019, 02:51:40 PM
An interchange at 276th and US 31 will be built in the coming years. There will be one at 236th soon.

Pixel 2 XL



236th makes sense, but why 276th?  266th goes to Arcadia so I'd think that road gets more traffic.
It's because Hamilton County considers 276th as the next major corridor like 146 and 236. It's part of their thoroughfare plan.

Pixel 2 XL
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 17, 2019, 07:51:48 PM
I don't see anything special about 276th Street, 266th does seem far more important, going east to Arcadia and continuing east across the rest of the county, I can very much see the next interchange being there. Likewise I could see a small exit at 296th Street (though there is a very small town right at that point.) This could see exits at 236th, 266th and 296th, neat three mile intervals in between exits and SR 28 looks like it's about four miles north of 296th as well.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 17, 2019, 08:26:37 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 17, 2019, 07:51:48 PM
I don't see anything special about 276th Street, 266th does seem far more important, going east to Arcadia and continuing east across the rest of the county, I can very much see the next interchange being there. Likewise I could see a small exit at 296th Street (though there is a very small town right at that point.) This could see exits at 236th, 266th and 296th, neat three mile intervals in between exits and SR 28 looks like it's about four miles north of 296th as well.
Unfortunately Hamilton county begs to differ, they recently upgraded 276th as well. I agree this location makes no sense to me either
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 17, 2019, 08:28:10 PM
Also 146th street in a few yrs will become an expressway, every signal from us 31 to SR 37 will be replaced with an interchange, with one metered roundabout at Oak Road. Allisonville will be first, then 37
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 18, 2019, 07:52:13 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 17, 2019, 08:26:37 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 17, 2019, 07:51:48 PM
I don't see anything special about 276th Street, 266th does seem far more important, going east to Arcadia and continuing east across the rest of the county, I can very much see the next interchange being there. Likewise I could see a small exit at 296th Street (though there is a very small town right at that point.) This could see exits at 236th, 266th and 296th, neat three mile intervals in between exits and SR 28 looks like it's about four miles north of 296th as well.
Unfortunately Hamilton county begs to differ, they recently upgraded 276th as well. I agree this location makes no sense to me either

Only thing I can figure is that the owner of the John Deere store has some pull with someone in the county government and/or INDOT.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 18, 2019, 08:05:20 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 18, 2019, 07:52:13 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 17, 2019, 08:26:37 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 17, 2019, 07:51:48 PM
I don't see anything special about 276th Street, 266th does seem far more important, going east to Arcadia and continuing east across the rest of the county, I can very much see the next interchange being there. Likewise I could see a small exit at 296th Street (though there is a very small town right at that point.) This could see exits at 236th, 266th and 296th, neat three mile intervals in between exits and SR 28 looks like it's about four miles north of 296th as well.
Unfortunately Hamilton county begs to differ, they recently upgraded 276th as well. I agree this location makes no sense to me either

Only thing I can figure is that the owner of the John Deere store has some pull with someone in the county government and/or INDOT.
There's also great harvest organics and Beck's hybrids that are at the East end of the road, that's why they upgraded it east of 31 last year.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on July 18, 2019, 09:39:44 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 17, 2019, 08:28:10 PM
Also 146th street in a few yrs will become an expressway, every signal from us 31 to SR 37 will be replaced with an interchange, with one metered roundabout at Oak Road. Allisonville will be first, then 37

http://www.youarecurrent.com/2019/07/16/in-a-jam-amid-improvements-county-seeks-additional-funds-to-upgrade-146th-street-in-carmel/

I wouldn't say "will", as only a feasibility study has been completed and funding sources haven't been determined for the vast majority of this proposed project, other than interchanges at Allisonville and 37.  If funding is found, Hazel Dell will be the first priority and they may go ahead and do preliminary engineering and environmental work ahead of time.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 18, 2019, 09:46:42 AM
I wish they'd sign this as a county highway with a shield. Also SR 32 should be 4 lanes from 31 to white River.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 18, 2019, 10:17:11 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 18, 2019, 08:05:20 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 18, 2019, 07:52:13 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 17, 2019, 08:26:37 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 17, 2019, 07:51:48 PM
I don't see anything special about 276th Street, 266th does seem far more important, going east to Arcadia and continuing east across the rest of the county, I can very much see the next interchange being there. Likewise I could see a small exit at 296th Street (though there is a very small town right at that point.) This could see exits at 236th, 266th and 296th, neat three mile intervals in between exits and SR 28 looks like it's about four miles north of 296th as well.
Unfortunately Hamilton county begs to differ, they recently upgraded 276th as well. I agree this location makes no sense to me either

Only thing I can figure is that the owner of the John Deere store has some pull with someone in the county government and/or INDOT.
There's also great harvest organics and Beck's hybrids that are at the East end of the road, that's why they upgraded it east of 31 last year.

I guess the only good thing with 276th Street, providing the new road connects to SR 19 is it can serve both Arcadia and Atlanta from a single roadway. And they can save up from having to have two new exits in the far northern part of the county, leaving only one exit north of 236th Street until Tipton County.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 24, 2019, 10:56:21 PM
This portion of this post will be dated rather quickly, but heads up to those visiting the Northwest Indiana area next week.

The ramp connecting I-80/94 westbound (and Central Avenue) to I-65 south (the flyover ramp) will close for a bridge deck overlay. The official detour calls for westbound traffic to use Broadway (exit 10) to connect to I-80/94 eastbound and double back to I-65 south.

The I-65 bridge immediately north of that interchange appears to be nearing completion, if the traffic cameras are any indication. Deck pours appear to be complete, with only guardrail pouring and mesh fencing (over the railroad portion of the bridge only) left to be done. Slated for fall completion, it appears well ahead of schedule, with the possibility of opening before the vaunted Labor Day travel weekend. Equally as important: all current restrictions will be lifted once the road reopens.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 25, 2019, 02:37:44 PM
Good news everyone!

https://www.kokomotribune.com/news/local_news/indot-purchasing-houses-along-u-s-in-tipton-co-to/article_e99f39bc-ae4b-11e9-892c-07f4a6bdbcdb.html

Indot is buying property on 31 in Tipton county. 28 up to the county line.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 25, 2019, 04:29:37 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 25, 2019, 02:37:44 PM
Good news everyone!

https://www.kokomotribune.com/news/local_news/indot-purchasing-houses-along-u-s-in-tipton-co-to/article_e99f39bc-ae4b-11e9-892c-07f4a6bdbcdb.html

Indot is buying property on 31 in Tipton county. 28 up to the county line.

That would leave about 12 miles between IN 28 and IN 38 and then there would be full freeway from Indy to Kokomo.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 25, 2019, 09:02:53 PM
Are there any interchanges planned in Tipton County between SR 28 and SR 931, out of curiosity?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 25, 2019, 09:04:10 PM
No. Division Road could get one in the far future, but as of now nope.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 31, 2019, 08:07:58 AM
I-65 in whitestown will soon be improved.  The 267 exit will be a DDI and will tie into Albert S. White Dr. better.  A new DDI at CR 550 will be built and this is where Ronald Reagan Parkway will eventually terminate into in the future.  Whitestown parkway will have the ramp from NB 65 fixed slightly to correct the deflection angle. And the 3rd lane on 65 south will be extended just south of the 865 interchange to allow for easier merging and cut down on weaving between the entrance ramp to SB 65 and the exit ramp to EB 865. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 01, 2019, 01:44:32 PM
thought this may be interesting to you all:

IMUTCD Indiana's version of the MUTCD https://www.in.gov/dot/div/contracts/design/mutcd/2011rev3MUTCD.htm
IDM Indiana design manual, Indiana's version of the AASHTO Green Book: https://www.in.gov/indot/design_manual/design_manual_2013.htm#
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 01, 2019, 10:24:52 PM
New work developments going on this month.

First, the Indiana Toll Road (with little warning) closed off the ramp to Cline Avenue (Indiana 912, exit 10) for pavement and bridge repairs, which will last until the end of the month. The official detour requires traffic to use the Lake Station interchange (exit 21) and I-80/94 to connect to and from Cline Avenue. Speaking of Lake Station...

Traffic on I-94 is reduced to two lanes just east of the Toll Road for bridge joint repair over US 20. This project is scheduled to last 10 days.

You may have also noticed no activity on the Indiana 51 bridge just north of I-80/94. INDOT explains that the project requires a redesign due to an unexpected discovery of soil erosion and shifting on the underside of the structure, which could cause major problems in the long term. When a redesign is determined, INDOT will announce when the project will resume.

Next week, southbound traffic on I-65 between US 30 and US 231 will be shifted to the northbound side for continuation of that area’s concrete restoration project. This will result in a closure of the southbound entry and exit ramps of 109th Avenue. The detour will suggest using US 30 and Indiana 53 (Broadway), though it may be quicker to use US 231 and double back.

It’s looking increasingly likely that the northbound I-65 bridge over Central Avenue and the CSX line will be open well ahead of schedule. Traffic cams today showed construction vehicles crossing the new structure, including one vehicle doing a pour for the retaining walls. I’ll predict that it will be open in time for Labor Day weekend.

EDIT: Northbound I-65 traffic is now driving on the new bridge and is no longer crossing over to the southbound bridge. All remaining work involves the removal of crossovers, striping, guardrail installation, and equipment removal.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 15, 2019, 12:10:03 PM
Down here in the Indy metro area:

465 is closed EB/NB from 65 to 70 on the southeast side.  massive delays for 70 and 65 approaching the south split.  65 from 29th to lafayette road has some concrete repairs going on. 865 is having its bridge over eagle creek replaced.  and all asphalt portions of the interstates are being resurfaced and all concrete portions patched.  It's a mess down here!    :-(
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 15, 2019, 03:28:14 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 17, 2019, 07:51:48 PM
I don't see anything special about 276th Street, 266th does seem far more important, going east to Arcadia and continuing east across the rest of the county, I can very much see the next interchange being there. Likewise I could see a small exit at 296th Street (though there is a very small town right at that point.) This could see exits at 236th, 266th and 296th, neat three mile intervals in between exits and SR 28 looks like it's about four miles north of 296th as well.

This is likely why the exit will be at 276th, with this connection, you have a road going straight across the county. https://www.hamiltoncounty.in.gov/1175/276th-St-Extension
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on August 16, 2019, 05:43:07 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 15, 2019, 12:10:03 PM
Down here in the Indy metro area:

465 is closed EB/NB from 65 to 70 on the southeast side.  massive delays for 70 and 65 approaching the south split.  65 from 29th to lafayette road has some concrete repairs going on. 865 is having its bridge over eagle creek replaced.  and all asphalt portions of the interstates are being resurfaced and all concrete portions patched.  It's a mess down here!    :-(

Adding to the mess, the 465 EB/NB closure / repair extends about a half mile north past the on ramps from 70.  The result is that the left lane of the on ramp from 70 EB to 465 NB is closed beginning in about the middle of the ramp. 

Just seems like an evil touch to put more traffic on 70 and on that ramp system, then close one of the lanes on the ramp.  The real jam is before where the on ramp from Shadeland comes up to EB - the ramp is already down to two lanes there. 

That said, once you clear the construction zone heading north on 465, it is smooth sailing, even up the hill at Fall Creek as traffic has been thinned out by the earlier jams.

I imagine my trip from Fishers to downtown will be hell after Labor Day when they close 465 SB/WB and the traffic gets diverted to 70.  On most days, westbound 70 from the east side is the main traffic congestion point on the morning commute.  Put all the cars from 465 on to 70 and I just see a lot of gridlock.  And IUPUI starts classes at the end of the month - more downtown traffic. 

I'm going to have to start leaving home earlier to be able to get from 69 to Binford before the Heritage Christian traffic jam starts or figure out some other convoluted way in to town.

(Where's the whining emoji for me).   Fight through a couple of weeks then hopefully we have a few smooth years of travel on the interstates.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 16, 2019, 08:00:46 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on August 16, 2019, 05:43:07 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 15, 2019, 12:10:03 PM
Down here in the Indy metro area:

465 is closed EB/NB from 65 to 70 on the southeast side.  massive delays for 70 and 65 approaching the south split.  65 from 29th to lafayette road has some concrete repairs going on. 865 is having its bridge over eagle creek replaced.  and all asphalt portions of the interstates are being resurfaced and all concrete portions patched.  It's a mess down here!    :-(

Adding to the mess, the 465 EB/NB closure / repair extends about a half mile north past the on ramps from 70.  The result is that the left lane of the on ramp from 70 EB to 465 NB is closed beginning in about the middle of the ramp. 

Just seems like an evil touch to put more traffic on 70 and on that ramp system, then close one of the lanes on the ramp.  The real jam is before where the on ramp from Shadeland comes up to EB - the ramp is already down to two lanes there. 

That said, once you clear the construction zone heading north on 465, it is smooth sailing, even up the hill at Fall Creek as traffic has been thinned out by the earlier jams.

I imagine my trip from Fishers to downtown will be hell after Labor Day when they close 465 SB/WB and the traffic gets diverted to 70.  On most days, westbound 70 from the east side is the main traffic congestion point on the morning commute.  Put all the cars from 465 on to 70 and I just see a lot of gridlock.  And IUPUI starts classes at the end of the month - more downtown traffic. 

I'm going to have to start leaving home earlier to be able to get from 69 to Binford before the Heritage Christian traffic jam starts or figure out some other convoluted way in to town.

(Where's the whining emoji for me).   Fight through a couple of weeks then hopefully we have a few smooth years of travel on the interstates.
That's my commute too . But from Carmel. I'll take 65 in and that's not a fun ride in the morning.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 17, 2019, 08:37:48 AM
Maybe all this gridlock will nudge people towards being more open to some kind of rail network.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on August 17, 2019, 08:44:21 AM
Not when the state legislature bans light rail.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 17, 2019, 08:51:01 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on August 17, 2019, 08:44:21 AM
Not when the state legislature bans light rail.

Maybe some of those legislators will get stuck in all this traffic and change their minds.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 17, 2019, 08:55:43 AM
No rail will happen, BRT is what is going to happen. Blue and purple line are the next two Indy go lines to be built. Until the suburbs get their heads out of their asses none of these routes will leave Marion county. Plainfield and Carmel are interested.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 24, 2019, 08:31:22 PM
Notes from Rolling Prairie:

New overhead signs are up for the soon-to-be-completed dogbone interchange at US 20 and Indiana 2. These signs (for the through road underpass) give control cities to the through routes (South Bend for Indiana 2 East, and Michigan City for US 20 West), but none for the ramps. There will likely be supplemental signs on the approaches to the roundabout to fill in those blanks (likely for New Carlisle and Laporte).

Beam installation for the new bridge will begin next week, with periodic rolling closures scheduled. The overall project is still on target for end-of-November completion.

Another related project is scheduled to begin next year. Residents from the area have concerns about traffic from New Prairie High School attempting to turn onto Indiana 2 from Cougar Road, since they're entering onto a high-speed divided highway with poor sight lines. INDOT's plan is to make Cougar Road from Indiana 2 to the school a northbound one-way street, becoming a two-way street from the school northward. Included with this plan will be a traffic light at US 20. The aim is to funnel a large portion of local traffic - especially those looking to access the divided highway portion of Indiana 2 - toward the new interchange to reduce conflict points.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 28, 2019, 01:55:38 PM
https://wsbt.com/news/local/indot-considers-replacing-us-30-through-warsaw-with-limited-access-highway

US 30 in Warsaw to get some minor safety improvements, maybe...
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Finrod on August 28, 2019, 04:06:10 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 28, 2019, 01:55:38 PM
https://wsbt.com/news/local/indot-considers-replacing-us-30-through-warsaw-with-limited-access-highway

US 30 in Warsaw to get some minor safety improvements, maybe...

They should have built it as limited access in the first place.  Indiana keeps building these new divided highways around cities without ever thinking about making them controlled-access-- and then when they become overgrown and the intersections become dangerous, they have to build a whole new one, like they did with Kokomo.  They did the same foolish thing with US 24/SR 25.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefarmerchris on August 28, 2019, 07:35:54 PM
Quote from: Finrod on August 28, 2019, 04:06:10 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 28, 2019, 01:55:38 PM
https://wsbt.com/news/local/indot-considers-replacing-us-30-through-warsaw-with-limited-access-highway

US 30 in Warsaw to get some minor safety improvements, maybe...

They should have built it as limited access in the first place.  Indiana keeps building these new divided highways around cities without ever thinking about making them controlled-access-- and then when they become overgrown and the intersections become dangerous, they have to build a whole new one, like they did with Kokomo.  They did the same foolish thing with US 24/SR 25.

There is enough ROW along US30 for freeway style improvements. Here's hoping INDOT doesn't screw this one up. It should've have been built to freeway standards years ago.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 28, 2019, 08:01:54 PM
Indot always makes up excuses like "we're saving taxpayers money" are you? Years down the road you have to do it right with a expensive freeway bypass! They're doing it now on the Lloyd...
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on August 29, 2019, 01:47:48 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 28, 2019, 08:01:54 PM
Indot always makes up excuses like "we're saving taxpayers money" are you? Years down the road you have to do it right with a expensive freeway bypass! They're doing it now on the Lloyd...
Yep.  There is nothing like redoing an intersection over, and over, and over again when the uneducated could have told them what was needed when they first proposed the road.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mgk920 on August 30, 2019, 09:23:51 PM
And US 30 is STOPSTOPSTOPSTOPSTOPSTOPSTOP the whole way across the state between Valparaiso and Fort Wayne. Ãœber-annoying does not even begin to describe it.  IMHO, it is an inexcusable situation for such a major highway.

:banghead:

Mike
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefarmerchris on August 31, 2019, 11:17:38 AM
Quote from: mgk920 on August 30, 2019, 09:23:51 PM
And US 30 is STOPSTOPSTOPSTOPSTOPSTOPSTOP the whole way across the state between Valparaiso and Fort Wayne. Ãœber-annoying does not even begin to describe it.  IMHO, it is an inexcusable situation for such a major highway.

:banghead:

Mike

I couldn't agree more. Especially between Warsaw and I-69.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on August 31, 2019, 08:52:59 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on August 30, 2019, 09:23:51 PM
And US 30 is STOPSTOPSTOPSTOPSTOPSTOPSTOP the whole way across the state between Valparaiso and Fort Wayne. Ãœber-annoying does not even begin to describe it.  IMHO, it is an inexcusable situation for such a major highway.

:banghead:

Mike

It would be great if Indiana knew ANYTHING about prioritizing signal timings for major approaches over those for minor approaches.  In most states, I call signals "signals;" but in Indiana, I call them "stoplights," because I swear every signal in Indiana is designed to get you to stop, rather than facilitate traffic movement.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on September 02, 2019, 01:19:54 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 17, 2019, 08:55:43 AM
No rail will happen, BRT is what is going to happen. Blue and purple line are the next two Indy go lines to be built. Until the suburbs get their heads out of their asses none of these routes will leave Marion county. Plainfield and Carmel are interested.
Purple Line will precede Blue Line, and both have been postponed a year from previous schedule (2021 to 2022 for Purple & 2022 to 2023 for Blue). None of these IndyGo BRT projects helps us here in the NE part of the metro one bit, but at least we're making progress as a city, if not as a region. I agree that extension of the Red Line out to Greenwood and to Carmel/Westfield both appear to be years away. And while extending BRT stations out to both Marion county lines has been funded, these Phase 2a (north)  & Phase 3a (south) projects have not yet been given estimated construction or completion dates (at least as far as I can find). Now that it's running, every other Red Line vehicle will continue on past the final existing station to the city-county borders as an interim stop-gap, but operate as "traditional local service" (stopping at all existing ground-level bus stops and without benefit of BRT features such as Traffic Signal Priority & exclusive lanes).

So don't look for mass transit to assist very much in the upcoming & near-future reconstruction of Indy's freeway system.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 02, 2019, 04:39:28 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on September 02, 2019, 01:19:54 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 17, 2019, 08:55:43 AM
No rail will happen, BRT is what is going to happen. Blue and purple line are the next two Indy go lines to be built. Until the suburbs get their heads out of their asses none of these routes will leave Marion county. Plainfield and Carmel are interested.
Purple Line will precede Blue Line, and both have been postponed a year from previous schedule (2021 to 2022 for Purple & 2022 to 2023 for Blue). None of these IndyGo BRT projects helps us here in the NE part of the metro one bit, but at least we're making progress as a city, if not as a region. I agree that extension of the Red Line out to Greenwood and to Carmel/Westfield both appear to be years away. And while extending BRT stations out to both Marion county lines has been funded, these Phase 2a (north)  & Phase 3a (south) projects have not yet been given estimated construction or completion dates (at least as far as I can find). Now that it's running, every other Red Line vehicle will continue on past the final existing station to the city-county borders as an interim stop-gap, but operate as "traditional local service" (stopping at all existing ground-level bus stops and without benefit of BRT features such as Traffic Signal Priority & exclusive lanes).

So don't look for mass transit to assist very much in the upcoming & near-future reconstruction of Indy's freeway system.

So far the red line appears to be a success.  Very happy to see indy finally getting on the mass transit program in a big way.

Future projects in the metro area:

SR 37 Fishers Begins 8/2019
465/69 NE side 2023ish
465 86th to US 31 2024ish
465/69 Southside interchange 2021ish
North Split 2020 fall or early 2021
465 southside widening from 70 to US 31 2021ish
65 whitestown 2021ish

Basically the next 5 years down here are going to be fun  :-( but it's for the best.  north split is going to be the worst from a traffic standpoint. Basically all the usual bottlenecks will be removed! interesting fact i learned: the daily backup of 65 from 21st st to the north split is caused by people trying to get from the delaware on ramp to 70 east.  the north split project removes this issue completely. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 02, 2019, 04:42:44 PM
I have obtained some maps of the proposed I-165, very interesting plans they had for that route, if i can figure it out, i will post some pictures.  if not i will just describe the exits. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on September 02, 2019, 05:28:29 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 02, 2019, 04:42:44 PM
I have obtained some maps of the proposed I-165, very interesting plans they had for that route, if i can figure it out, i will post some pictures.  if not i will just describe the exits.
If you have digital photo copies, I'd recommend uploading them to - https://imgbb.com/

To link them here, click on the dropdown for "Embed codes" and click on "BBCode full".

Then copy that code and paste it on the textbox here. It should appear once you post it.

I've used it for quite some time now and haven't had any issues, as long as the files aren't huge. If they are, it might be more complicated.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 02, 2019, 05:30:49 PM
Ok I will try that. The maps are horrible quality. It's the original unfinished eis (environmental impact study) done for the project.  Most interesting area is 38th to 46th st. It's phone book thick so it will take some time to go through.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on September 02, 2019, 05:34:51 PM
Quote from: thefarmerchris on August 28, 2019, 07:35:54 PM
There is enough ROW along US30 for freeway style improvements. Here's hoping INDOT doesn't screw this one up. It should've have been built to freeway standards years ago.
Based on the article...

QuoteBut INDOT does plan to limit some access to the highway, by eliminating as many traffic lights as possible. That includes creating through-lanes for some side streets.

"It could also include some reduced conflict intersections. Reduced conflict intersections are similar to u-turns and it could also include some interchanges,"  said Thomas.

It sounds like it'd just create an "expressway" rather than a full freeway. An expressway is where you can travel uninterrupted (i.e. no stop lights) but it isn't a full freeway. There's still RCI's, private connections, etc.

It'd still be a major improvement over the current situation.

Quote from: Finrod on August 28, 2019, 04:06:10 PM
Indiana keeps building these new divided highways around cities without ever thinking about making them controlled-access-- and then when they become overgrown and the intersections become dangerous, they have to build a whole new one, like they did with Kokomo.  They did the same foolish thing with US 24/SR 25.
I wouldn't say they -keep-. Judging how the Kokomo bypass was done, it seems new projects for bypasses will include full control of access. It's certainly a mistake they made in the past, but they don't appear to do it anymore.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on September 02, 2019, 05:35:37 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 02, 2019, 05:30:49 PM
Ok I will try that. The maps are horrible quality. It's the original unfinished eis (environmental impact study) done for the project.  Most interesting area is 38th to 46th st. It's phone book thick so it will take some time to go through.
Was it an online URL, PDF, Google Books...? Or was it a paper copy?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 02, 2019, 05:37:51 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on September 02, 2019, 05:35:37 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 02, 2019, 05:30:49 PM
Ok I will try that. The maps are horrible quality. It's the original unfinished eis (environmental impact study) done for the project.  Most interesting area is 38th to 46th st. It's phone book thick so it will take some time to go through.
Was it an online URL, PDF, Google Books...? Or was it a paper copy?

physical.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on September 02, 2019, 05:40:00 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 28, 2019, 08:01:54 PM
Indot always makes up excuses like "we're saving taxpayers money" are you?
To be fair, they also did just build a 100 mile long freeway between I-64 and Bloomington, and have and still are upgraded 45 miles of SR-37 to interstate standards, all in the last 10 years. Something I haven't seen from any state in the past 3 decades. At least $5 billion worth of taxpayer dollar.

But then again, didn't they also borrow funding from the Indiana Toll Road IIRC?

Quote from: silverback1065 on September 02, 2019, 05:37:51 PM
physical.
My recommendation would be to take a picture, in the best quality you can of it, then upload directly to the IMGBB website from your phone and post it here from your phone. It's worked for me before, at least on iPhone.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ibthebigd on September 02, 2019, 06:12:53 PM
I still wish they would try commuter trains on Nickle Plate instead of the rail to trail.

SM-G950U

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 02, 2019, 06:14:45 PM
Quote from: ibthebigd on September 02, 2019, 06:12:53 PM
I still wish they would try commuter trains on Nickle Plate instead of the rail to trail.

SM-G950U
It's fishers fault. They're desperate for their own monon trail.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on September 08, 2019, 10:16:37 PM
So why is access to Southeastern Avenue blocked from westbound I-74 at the eastern I-465 interchange?  Is INDOT trying to make congestion worse by taking out detour options?

They are certainly doing a good job of making the Indianapolis area painful with the I-465 closure, work on the northwestern part of I-465, miserably congested work on I-65 near 38th Street, and work on I-865 (with a possible closure based on a message board) at the same time.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 09, 2019, 10:13:22 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on September 08, 2019, 10:16:37 PM
So why is access to Southeastern Avenue blocked from westbound I-74 at the eastern I-465 interchange?  Is INDOT trying to make congestion worse by taking out detour options?

They are certainly doing a good job of making the Indianapolis area painful with the I-465 closure, work on the northwestern part of I-465, miserably congested work on I-65 near 38th Street, and work on I-865 (with a possible closure based on a message board) at the same time.

I just totaled my car thanks to the closure. but seriously INDOT needs to stop closing everything, they got this bright idea a few years ago and now think it's the end all be all.  i think the most annoying was when they closed the other direction and came up with the bright idea to close the left lane on the flyover from 70 eb to 465 nb. i wonder how many more crashes are happening due to these closures.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on September 09, 2019, 05:23:06 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 09, 2019, 10:13:22 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on September 08, 2019, 10:16:37 PM
So why is access to Southeastern Avenue blocked from westbound I-74 at the eastern I-465 interchange?  Is INDOT trying to make congestion worse by taking out detour options?

They are certainly doing a good job of making the Indianapolis area painful with the I-465 closure, work on the northwestern part of I-465, miserably congested work on I-65 near 38th Street, and work on I-865 (with a possible closure based on a message board) at the same time.

I just totaled my car thanks to the closure. but seriously INDOT needs to stop closing everything, they got this bright idea a few years ago and now think it's the end all be all.  i think the most annoying was when they closed the other direction and came up with the bright idea to close the left lane on the flyover from 70 eb to 465 nb. i wonder how many more crashes are happening due to these closures.
Aren't they also going to be closing SR-37 due to the upgrade to I-69?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 09, 2019, 05:24:25 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on September 09, 2019, 05:23:06 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 09, 2019, 10:13:22 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on September 08, 2019, 10:16:37 PM
So why is access to Southeastern Avenue blocked from westbound I-74 at the eastern I-465 interchange?  Is INDOT trying to make congestion worse by taking out detour options?

They are certainly doing a good job of making the Indianapolis area painful with the I-465 closure, work on the northwestern part of I-465, miserably congested work on I-65 near 38th Street, and work on I-865 (with a possible closure based on a message board) at the same time.

I just totaled my car thanks to the closure. but seriously INDOT needs to stop closing everything, they got this bright idea a few years ago and now think it's the end all be all.  i think the most annoying was when they closed the other direction and came up with the bright idea to close the left lane on the flyover from 70 eb to 465 nb. i wonder how many more crashes are happening due to these closures.
Aren't they also going to be closing SR-37 due to the upgrade to I-69?
Yes but that's more justifiable imo. Much smaller city, way less traffic, better alternative routes.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Interstate 69 Fan on September 09, 2019, 06:22:08 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 09, 2019, 05:24:25 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on September 09, 2019, 05:23:06 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 09, 2019, 10:13:22 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on September 08, 2019, 10:16:37 PM
So why is access to Southeastern Avenue blocked from westbound I-74 at the eastern I-465 interchange?  Is INDOT trying to make congestion worse by taking out detour options?

They are certainly doing a good job of making the Indianapolis area painful with the I-465 closure, work on the northwestern part of I-465, miserably congested work on I-65 near 38th Street, and work on I-865 (with a possible closure based on a message board) at the same time.

I just totaled my car thanks to the closure. but seriously INDOT needs to stop closing everything, they got this bright idea a few years ago and now think it's the end all be all.  i think the most annoying was when they closed the other direction and came up with the bright idea to close the left lane on the flyover from 70 eb to 465 nb. i wonder how many more crashes are happening due to these closures.
Aren't they also going to be closing SR-37 due to the upgrade to I-69?
Yes but that's more justifiable imo. Much smaller city, way less traffic, better alternative routes.
SR 67 northeast of Mooresville is way to packed already Pre-37 detour. Putting the detour on this road was a mistake in my book.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 10, 2019, 01:58:39 PM
I peaked at the SR 37 plans and it will still be 37 once the project is over, i was afraid they would decommission it.  The portion I'm referring to is the one in Fishers that starts today. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on September 13, 2019, 02:08:19 PM
Quote from: ibthebigd on September 02, 2019, 06:12:53 PM
I still wish they would try commuter trains on Nickle Plate instead of the rail to trail.

SM-G950U
Amen! The NE side along the NKP corridor will get screwed over with no direct mass transit alternatives to downtown Indy whatsoever now.

Quote from: silverback1065 on September 02, 2019, 06:14:45 PM
It's fishers fault. They're desperate for their own monon trail.
Exactly. Fishers screws up nearly everything they touch. While the Monon Trail is indeed nice, can you imagine if that route had been available for the new IndyGo Red Line instead of having to use College Avenue?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 13, 2019, 02:23:47 PM
After watching this red line launch, I'm sold. I think it's amazing that we finally have a good mass transit route. The green line (would have used that Nickle plate corridor) would have been perfect for commuters as a second means of transportation downtown.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 14, 2019, 09:13:50 PM
I'm just going to say it here: the construction going on around Indianapolis is too much. After spending a good part of the day driving around I think INDOT is doing too much all at once. The 465 project on the southeast side, I-65 around Lafayette Road, 465 paving around the northwest side and the northeast side. And now they want to throw in work on I-70 from Indianapolis all the way to Ohio? The highway was shut down do to emergency repairs that had to be made on the shoulder of the highway since it was being used by traffic to get around construction that we just absolutely had to get done this year.

Jeez, I'm happy that we have the money is there to do all this needed work but can't some of this wait until next year? I-465 on the southeast side of Indianapolis IMO did not have to be done immediately this year. On such a beautiful weekend here in the city they are doing their damn best to keep you at home. They are doing too much all at once. And I bet the first full weekend we will have with no construction will be when we get a foot of snow and can only go 20 MPH on the highways. Alright, I've said my bit.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on September 15, 2019, 09:43:31 AM
Don't do the work, get complaints that the roads are horrible.

Do the work, get complaints that it's too much construction.

No one's ever going to like INDOT, so they're just going to do what they do.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 15, 2019, 10:40:03 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 14, 2019, 09:13:50 PM
I'm just going to say it here: the construction going on around Indianapolis is too much. After spending a good part of the day driving around I think INDOT is doing too much all at once. The 465 project on the southeast side, I-65 around Lafayette Road, 465 paving around the northwest side and the northeast side. And now they want to throw in work on I-70 from Indianapolis all the way to Ohio? The highway was shut down do to emergency repairs that had to be made on the shoulder of the highway since it was being used by traffic to get around construction that we just absolutely had to get done this year.

Jeez, I'm happy that we have the money is there to do all this needed work but can't some of this wait until next year? I-465 on the southeast side of Indianapolis IMO did not have to be done immediately this year. On such a beautiful weekend here in the city they are doing their damn best to keep you at home. They are doing too much all at once. And I bet the first full weekend we will have with no construction will be when we get a foot of snow and can only go 20 MPH on the highways. Alright, I've said my bit.
Amen! I totaled my car in the construction zone Monday
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on September 15, 2019, 12:27:13 PM
Quote from: csw on September 15, 2019, 09:43:31 AM
Don't do the work, get complaints that the roads are horrible.

Do the work, get complaints that it's too much construction.

While there's truth to those statements, were I-465 on the northwest side and I-865 in that bad of shape their projects could not have been delayed one season until the work on I-65 northwest of downtown was completed?  Also, I still haven't heard why the ramp from WB I-74 to Southeastern Avenue needs to be closed at the same time I-465 is closed.

I recall Missouri doing a slightly better job trying to avoid working on parallel/semi-parallel routes at the same time (not that they've always succeeded).  I don't recall MoDOT working on I-44 and I-70 during the US 40 closures about 10 years ago.  Right now it also appears they are delaying bridge work on I-55 until work on I-44 is done.  INDOT would have had lane closures on I-44 and I-70 during the US 40 closure, and would have both I-44 and I-55 reduced with bridge work.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 15, 2019, 04:56:15 PM
Indot royally fucked up i-70 in Greenfield, I don't understand how they let something like that happen.  You knew traffic was to be routed on the shoulders, you couldn't come up with a good enough pavement design to allow traffic to safely travel through? Ridiculous!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 15, 2019, 09:05:11 PM
On top of everything else, US 40 in Hancock County has a current chip-seal repair going on and apparently US 40 through Greenfield has been "improved" (ie. fewer lanes.) I-74 around Shelbyville and past Greensburg also has more construction going on.

This is what happens when you pile more stuff on top of what you are already doing. That's what INDOT is, a kid piling more food on his plate when there is still plenty on. And I bet that all of these projects are spreading the construction crews out very thinly which is what's making them take so long. Two weeks to do repair work on I-465 in one direction. Maybe it's absolutely needed but I would venture a guess that if you focused more people on the project they could get it done in a week, they did to I-465 on the southwest side last year (closing one direction for a week or so.)

The paving work in the long run around the city will be nice, but they got so much going on. I-65 from I-465 to Southport, which desperately needed to be repaved, still has one lane that has not been repaved on the southbound lanes. They started this project back in May. They still need to put lane markers on the northbound lanes that has been done for more than a couple of months. I bet if they weren't already paving I-465 from I-65 on the northwest side to I-69 on the northeast side, plus I-69 for the first five miles to the north, they could have had this work already done.

Again, I don't think many are actually complaining about the work being done. It's good and it's appreciated, it's just way too much and because it's too much it's taking so much longer than it probably needs to be taking.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 15, 2019, 09:15:27 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 15, 2019, 09:05:11 PM
On top of everything else, US 40 in Hancock County has a current chip-seal repair going on and apparently US 40 through Greenfield has been "improved" (ie. fewer lanes.) I-74 around Shelbyville and past Greensburg also has more construction going on.

This is what happens when you pile more stuff on top of what you are already doing. That's what INDOT is, a kid piling more food on his plate when there is still plenty on. And I bet that all of these projects are spreading the construction crews out very thinly which is what's making them take so long. Two weeks to do repair work on I-465 in one direction. Maybe it's absolutely needed but I would venture a guess that if you focused more people on the project they could get it done in a week, they did to I-465 on the southwest side last year (closing one direction for a week or so.)

The paving work in the long run around the city will be nice, but they got so much going on. I-65 from I-465 to Southport, which desperately needed to be repaved, still has one lane that has not been repaved on the southbound lanes. They started this project back in May. They still need to put lane markers on the northbound lanes that has been done for more than a couple of months. I bet if they weren't already paving I-465 from I-65 on the northwest side to I-69 on the northeast side, plus I-69 for the first five miles to the north, they could have had this work already done.

Again, I don't think many are actually complaining about the work being done. It's good and it's appreciated, it's just way too much and because it's too much it's taking so much longer than it probably needs to be taking.
Noones complaining about the work, we're complaining about the stupid scheduling. Why the hell would you close roads and route traffic on roads that are also under construction? The only reason why they had to close 465 on the south side is because that's the oldest section of 465 with the worst interchanges. I don't understand why they won't fix those exits from the left down there! In the next 7 yrs the entire Northside will be 8 lanes wide with auxiliary lanes between each exit.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 15, 2019, 09:16:42 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 15, 2019, 09:05:11 PM
On top of everything else, US 40 in Hancock County has a current chip-seal repair going on and apparently US 40 through Greenfield has been "improved" (ie. fewer lanes.) I-74 around Shelbyville and past Greensburg also has more construction going on.

This is what happens when you pile more stuff on top of what you are already doing. That's what INDOT is, a kid piling more food on his plate when there is still plenty on. And I bet that all of these projects are spreading the construction crews out very thinly which is what's making them take so long. Two weeks to do repair work on I-465 in one direction. Maybe it's absolutely needed but I would venture a guess that if you focused more people on the project they could get it done in a week, they did to I-465 on the southwest side last year (closing one direction for a week or so.)

The paving work in the long run around the city will be nice, but they got so much going on. I-65 from I-465 to Southport, which desperately needed to be repaved, still has one lane that has not been repaved on the southbound lanes. They started this project back in May. They still need to put lane markers on the northbound lanes that has been done for more than a couple of months. I bet if they weren't already paving I-465 from I-65 on the northwest side to I-69 on the northeast side, plus I-69 for the first five miles to the north, they could have had this work already done.

Again, I don't think many are actually complaining about the work being done. It's good and it's appreciated, it's just way too much and because it's too much it's taking so much longer than it probably needs to be taking.
If you're mad now just wait until next fall. Shittier things are to come on the closure front...
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 16, 2019, 12:52:30 AM
What's next fall? There's the North Split project to go, I-69/I-465 on the northeast side and planned work on the southern part of I-465 plus the SR 37 closure in Martinsville.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 16, 2019, 06:57:15 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 16, 2019, 12:52:30 AM
What's next fall? There's the North Split project to go, I-69/I-465 on the northeast side and planned work on the southern part of I-465 plus the SR 37 closure in Martinsville.

basically that and many other planned projects in the coming years.  north split will be the worst...
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefarmerchris on September 18, 2019, 06:13:48 PM

Looks like US 30 through Warsaw may end up being bypassed i.e. Kokomo. Anyone going to this meeting tonight?

https://www.newsnowwarsaw.com/us-30-freeway-project-public-meeting-wednesday/

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 18, 2019, 06:46:26 PM
Quote from: thefarmerchris on September 18, 2019, 06:13:48 PM

Looks like US 30 through Warsaw may end up being bypassed i.e. Kokomo. Anyone going to this meeting tonight?

https://www.newsnowwarsaw.com/us-30-freeway-project-public-meeting-wednesday/

Interesting, the route bypassing to the north makes the most sense at a glance.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on September 18, 2019, 07:20:00 PM
Quote from: thefarmerchris on September 18, 2019, 06:13:48 PM

Looks like US 30 through Warsaw may end up being bypassed i.e. Kokomo. Anyone going to this meeting tonight?

https://www.newsnowwarsaw.com/us-30-freeway-project-public-meeting-wednesday/
Didn't they just say a month ago no bypass was being considered and nothing like Kokomo would be done?

https://wsbt.com/news/local/indot-considers-replacing-us-30-through-warsaw-with-limited-access-highway

Quote"Currently U.S. 30 is U.S. 30 and INDOT has no plans to build a bypass,"  said Thomas.

Thomas says a bypass would cost a billion dollars and take a decade of work before construction could even begin.




EDIT - This is per https://wsbt.com/news/local/officials-hold-public-meeting-on-options-for-proposed-freeway-on-us-30

QuoteWarsaw and Kosciusko County leaders want to hear from you Wednesday.

Officials from the city and county along with representatives from the U.S. 30 Coalition are holding a public meeting to focus on options for a proposed freeway.

Right now there are no concrete plans from INDOT to change the road. But city and county leaders want to be ready if that changes.

Warsaw's mayor says as U.S. 30 makes its way through Warsaw, it passes nine intersections and a lot of stops. He said one particular intersection has had 220 accidents over the course of nine and a half years.

That is one of the reasons people here would like to see a long term fix U.S. 30.

That is one of the reasons for this meeting Wednesday. It will be a workshop of sorts.

City and county leaders will present some of the work that is already being done to make plans. The public will be able to offer input about what plan would work best, places to put intersections, overpasses and underpasses.

Basically leaders want to know how the options might impact the community.

There are three potential options for U.S. 30 that have been laid out right now. Again this is just hypothetical at this point, as INDOT has not formally designated this as a project and there is no funding for it right now. But these are the options that have been laid out.

U.S. 30 could go around, either to the north or south or it could continue to follow the current roadbed.

Wednesday, people can comment on these options.

Warsaw's mayor says that counties and cities all along U.S. 30 are having these types of discussions because they would like to see a freeway project similar to the U.S. 31 project from South Bend to Indianapolis, designed to limit access in an effort to improve safety and traffic flow.

The mayor says the U.S. 30 Coalition is trying to get INDOT to do an environmental impact study. That would be the first step.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 19, 2019, 12:22:09 PM
if you live in the indy metro area this weekend stay home, basically every conceivable road will be under construction  :banghead:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on September 19, 2019, 12:40:08 PM
For far too long Indiana has skipped the long range scenario and has done what may work for a few years and is cheaper, but will cost big time to correct down the road.  They have done so in Evansville, Kokomo, and other areas, and apparently did the same in Warsaw.  Spend $10 million now, and in 10 years you don't have to spend $100 million to buy up property, etc.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 20, 2019, 07:57:31 AM
Lake County roads in the news:

https://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/winfield/winfield-residents-seek-answers-for-th-avenue-traffic-woes/article_f1e9d88e-ca1d-5c7b-adc3-b2a3a325511b.html

QuoteThe last option is to give the road back to the state Department of Transportation. Winfield is the only community in the county with no state roads, Councilman Dave Anderson said. However, Anderson said the state is not taking on any new roads, and before the state would agree to take it, it would have to take some other road off its list.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 20, 2019, 08:03:59 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 20, 2019, 07:57:31 AM
Lake County roads in the news:

https://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/winfield/winfield-residents-seek-answers-for-th-avenue-traffic-woes/article_f1e9d88e-ca1d-5c7b-adc3-b2a3a325511b.html

QuoteThe last option is to give the road back to the state Department of Transportation. Winfield is the only community in the county with no state roads, Councilman Dave Anderson said. However, Anderson said the state is not taking on any new roads, and before the state would agree to take it, it would have to take some other road off its list.
No they wouldn't, they have plenty of mileage.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 20, 2019, 08:07:44 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 20, 2019, 08:03:59 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 20, 2019, 07:57:31 AM
Lake County roads in the news:

https://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/winfield/winfield-residents-seek-answers-for-th-avenue-traffic-woes/article_f1e9d88e-ca1d-5c7b-adc3-b2a3a325511b.html

QuoteThe last option is to give the road back to the state Department of Transportation. Winfield is the only community in the county with no state roads, Councilman Dave Anderson said. However, Anderson said the state is not taking on any new roads, and before the state would agree to take it, it would have to take some other road off its list.
No they wouldn't, they have plenty of mileage.

It may not be a statutory mileage issue, it may be that this INDOT district just isn't willing to take on another road without giving one up.  Still, I'm struggling to remember the last time INDOT took on a road from a county.  It just doesn't seem to be something they do.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 20, 2019, 08:08:42 AM
They just don't feel like taking it over. Also that exit with 65 is going to be turned into a teardrop roundabout interchange complete with widening in the immediate area. Expect to see that in the coming yrs.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on September 20, 2019, 10:57:13 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 20, 2019, 08:08:42 AM
They just don't feel like taking it over. Also that exit with 65 is going to be turned into a teardrop roundabout interchange complete with widening in the immediate area. Expect to see that in the coming yrs.

Indiana has one of those constitutions that prohibits the legislator at the meeting from trying to pass a bill making INDOT take the road despite any objections INDOT may have?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 23, 2019, 08:15:00 AM
Southbound and westbound I-465 on the southeast side opened up last night, completeing the planned construction along that stretch. I drove through there late at night and I guess the roadway feels fine, probably the same as it did before but I'll take their word that the road's in good shape for the winter.

I noticed that all the road signs were redone, even though in my opinion they really didn't have to. While the majority of signs are still looking good I saw the northbound I-465 signs for the I-70 interchange on the east side and they do not look good. It's hard to describe without pictures but they changed a series of perfectly good road signs and...screwed up the positioning of the control destinations for the I-70 exit. The signs are probably now Indiana's leading candidate for "Worst of Road Signs."

It's a shame too since they didn't need to be changed at all. Meanwhile I-65 from I-465 to the South Split still has button copy signage that has been there for many years and despite that roadway being closed at certain points this summer they were not changed at all. Of course if you like button copy that's probably a good thing.

Meanwhile there's still lots of outstanding paving and line markings to be put on various interstates around the city but we should be done with full closures at this point.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ibthebigd on September 23, 2019, 10:22:06 AM
Did they paint the road with what lane goes to what interstate?

They did that in Lexington Ky and I like it.

SM-G950U

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 23, 2019, 06:39:47 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 23, 2019, 08:15:00 AM
Southbound and westbound I-465 on the southeast side opened up last night, completeing the planned construction along that stretch. I drove through there late at night and I guess the roadway feels fine, probably the same as it did before but I'll take their word that the road's in good shape for the winter.

I noticed that all the road signs were redone, even though in my opinion they really didn't have to. While the majority of signs are still looking good I saw the northbound I-465 signs for the I-70 interchange on the east side and they do not look good. It's hard to describe without pictures but they changed a series of perfectly good road signs and...screwed up the positioning of the control destinations for the I-70 exit. The signs are probably now Indiana's leading candidate for "Worst of Road Signs."

It's a shame too since they didn't need to be changed at all. Meanwhile I-65 from I-465 to the South Split still has button copy signage that has been there for many years and despite that roadway being closed at certain points this summer they were not changed at all. Of course if you like button copy that's probably a good thing.

Meanwhile there's still lots of outstanding paving and line markings to be put on various interstates around the city but we should be done with full closures at this point.

they didnt do the north split because that reconstruction project starts next fall. i wish they'd put us 421 on the i-74 exit 49 sign.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on September 24, 2019, 10:36:48 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 23, 2019, 08:15:00 AM
Southbound and westbound I-465 on the southeast side opened up last night, completeing the planned construction along that stretch. I drove through there late at night and I guess the roadway feels fine, probably the same as it did before but I'll take their word that the road's in good shape for the winter.

INDOT did an enormous amount of concrete patching on I-465 and the on/off ramps during the closure. And for as much as I complained about the Southeastern Ave. ramps being closed, they did amazing work on patching them and the road itself. If you have a chance to drive it during the day, you'll notice all the new concrete. It looks like they did way more on the westbound lanes than the eastbound lanes from the previous closure.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 28, 2019, 10:20:06 AM
I went ahead and took a few pictures this morning of some of the "improved" signs approaching I-70 on I-465 on the east side.

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48808156778_79e69cdb3f_k.jpg)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48808505766_f8b508e866_k.jpg)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48808646287_f3fb94dd95_k.jpg)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 28, 2019, 10:21:38 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 28, 2019, 10:20:06 AM
I went ahead and took a few pictures this morning of some of the "improved" signs approaching I-70 on I-465 on the east side.

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48808156778_79e69cdb3f_k.jpg)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48808505766_f8b508e866_k.jpg)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48808646287_f3fb94dd95_k.jpg)
They fucked those signs up !
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: MNHighwayMan on September 28, 2019, 01:38:44 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 28, 2019, 10:20:06 AM
I went ahead and took a few pictures this morning of some of the "improved" signs approaching I-70 on I-465 on the east side.

Indiana now trying to compete with Oklahoma for awfulness.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on September 28, 2019, 02:50:29 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 28, 2019, 10:20:06 AM
I went ahead and took a few pictures this morning of some of the "improved" signs approaching I-70 on I-465 on the east side.
Someone needs to be fired...  :no:

Does anybody know what "centering" is?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on September 28, 2019, 04:02:50 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on September 28, 2019, 02:50:29 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 28, 2019, 10:20:06 AM
I went ahead and took a few pictures this morning of some of the "improved" signs approaching I-70 on I-465 on the east side.
Someone needs to be fired...  :no:

Does anybody know what "centering" is?
Here in Indiana, apparently they now think that centering is a "liburl plot"!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 28, 2019, 08:29:44 PM
The reality is that the vast majority of Indiana signs are actually good. See the recent I-69 construction around Bloomington and US 31 through Carmel and Westfield. The standards are quite good all things considering. But this particular job was just done bad and ultimately just unnecessary. The only changes that were actually made was the font size of the cardinal directions and a brighter tint of yellow in the "exit only" tabs. Nothing that required messing up the rest of the sign. All the I-70 sign at the Washington Street exit needed was a newer looking I-70 shield, you did not need to change the positioning of the destinations at all. And now since the state hates having to go back and change things we probably have to look at this for the next 20 years. Ugh. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Interstate 69 Fan on September 28, 2019, 08:58:02 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 28, 2019, 10:20:06 AM
I went ahead and took a few pictures this morning of some of the "improved" signs approaching I-70 on I-465 on the east side.

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48808156778_79e69cdb3f_k.jpg)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48808505766_f8b508e866_k.jpg)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48808646287_f3fb94dd95_k.jpg)
They've done that on the south side too.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on September 28, 2019, 09:14:43 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 28, 2019, 08:29:44 PM
The reality is that the vast majority of Indiana signs are actually good. See the recent I-69 construction around Bloomington and US 31 through Carmel and Westfield. The standards are quite good all things considering. But this particular job was just done bad and ultimately just unnecessary. The only changes that were actually made was the font size of the cardinal directions and a brighter tint of yellow in the "exit only" tabs. Nothing that required messing up the rest of the sign. All the I-70 sign at the Washington Street exit needed was a newer looking I-70 shield, you did not need to change the positioning of the destinations at all. And now since the state hates having to go back and change things we probably have to look at this for the next 20 years. Ugh.

So an array of brand-new installs is not a basis for judging a state's signage quality overall LOL.  That's like if I judged a car company's performance by only looking at the cars produced just this past year.  Wow!  You mean all their 2019 models are still doing well?  Sounds like a stellar company!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on September 28, 2019, 09:28:01 PM
The centering is way off in some of those signs, but at least it follows a uniform, standard setup overall.

Here in Chesapeake, VA, they think the distance goes in the exit tab - https://www.google.com/maps/@36.7522062,-76.2774593,3a,37.5y,251.82h,86.92t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s8dTyrcscRdu32lWp0tJlyw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

This highway was recently widened from a 2-lane road into a 4-lane freeway, and most of the signs they used on it are horrendous, and definitely not uniform. Centered, but worse overall than these examples IMO.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 03, 2019, 03:59:04 PM
Anyone in the northern part of the state know anything about the SR 912 Bridge Replacement project status? 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Beltway on October 03, 2019, 04:34:12 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 03, 2019, 03:59:04 PM
Anyone in the northern part of the state know anything about the SR 912 Bridge Replacement project status? 

Substructure fully complete, and superstructure maybe 20% complete, when I rode thru the project in July.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.capital-beltway.com%2FIN-912-Cline-Avenue-Bridge.JPG&hash=0f8e7a26a8360e40aa58241d521ac1334db87cc0)

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.capital-beltway.com%2FIN-912-Cline-Avenue-Bridge-2.JPG&hash=c95573b8ab293018026a4fb51b3b111d56d8ea82)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 03, 2019, 04:35:08 PM
Quote from: Beltway on October 03, 2019, 04:34:12 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 03, 2019, 03:59:04 PM
Anyone in the northern part of the state know anything about the SR 912 Bridge Replacement project status? 

Substructure fully complete, and superstructure maybe 20%, when I rode thru the project in July.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.capital-beltway.com%2FIN-912-Cline-Avenue-Bridge.JPG&hash=0f8e7a26a8360e40aa58241d521ac1334db87cc0)
Will this be a 4 lane limited access facility?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Beltway on October 03, 2019, 04:39:15 PM
The project announcements said 2 lanes.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 03, 2019, 04:44:15 PM
Quote from: Beltway on October 03, 2019, 04:39:15 PM
The project announcements said 2 lanes.
Geeze that's crazy. But it's no longer a state road. Which is also crazy.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on October 04, 2019, 01:42:34 AM
https://www.wane.com/news/local-news/tentative-timeline-set-for-high-tech-upgrades-on-i-69-and-i-469/

Good news from INDOT for the NE side of the state! The ITS system will be installed/expanded along I-69 between S.R. 26 in Grant County (MM 256) towards the Michigan state line and along the whole length of I-469 in Allen County. To be completed by 2024 and will include closed circuit cameras at interchanges, speed and traffic volume sensors at interchanges, and dynamic message boards at various locations.

Once that is done, there will be 4 major areas with ITS system installed within the state: NW Indiana, Indianapolis, NE Indiana, and Louisville with the minor area being Seymour/Columbus.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ibthebigd on October 05, 2019, 09:10:24 AM
What is an ITS system is that cable barriers?

SM-G950U

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 05, 2019, 09:16:18 AM
Quote from: ibthebigd on October 05, 2019, 09:10:24 AM
What is an ITS system is that cable barriers?

SM-G950U
It stands for "intelligent transportation system" it's used to get travel time info and traffic camera data. Those blue "current travel time to" signs are one use of the system. Also the vms boards
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: westerninterloper on October 05, 2019, 04:00:33 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 05, 2019, 09:16:18 AM
Quote from: ibthebigd on October 05, 2019, 09:10:24 AM
What is an ITS system is that cable barriers?

SM-G950U
It stands for "intelligent transportation system" it's used to get travel time info and traffic camera data. Those blue "current travel time to" signs are one use of the system. Also the vms boards

That's good news for me, I travel I-69 and 469 regularly, and those systems are a good early warning of stopped traffic, without checking online 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 07, 2019, 01:22:17 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 03, 2019, 04:44:15 PM
Quote from: Beltway on October 03, 2019, 04:39:15 PM
The project announcements said 2 lanes.
Geeze that's crazy. But it's no longer a state road. Which is also crazy.

No longer a state road because the state is not building the bridge.  It's being financed privately and paid via tolls.  What I am assuming but haven't seen stated by either INDOT or the bridge owner, is that it will not be signed as IN 912 since INDOT doesn't sign roads they don't maintain.  So it seems as though we will have two separate IN 912 4-lane freeways linked by a two-lane, unsigned bridge.

Side note: one very weird thing about IN 912 is that, since the old bridge got demolished, the freeway is closed EB between Calumet and Riley but open WB, making it a rather unique one-way only state highway.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:25:38 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 07, 2019, 01:22:17 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 03, 2019, 04:44:15 PM
Quote from: Beltway on October 03, 2019, 04:39:15 PM
The project announcements said 2 lanes.
Geeze that's crazy. But it's no longer a state road. Which is also crazy.

No longer a state road because the state is not building the bridge.  It's being financed privately and paid via tolls.  What I am assuming but haven't seen stated by either INDOT or the bridge owner, is that it will not be signed as IN 912 since INDOT doesn't sign roads they don't maintain.  So it seems as though we will have two separate IN 912 4-lane freeways linked by a two-lane, unsigned bridge.

Side note: one very weird thing about IN 912 is that, since the old bridge got demolished, the freeway is closed EB between Calumet and Riley but open WB, making it a rather unique one-way only state highway.
912 is probably the weirdest state highway Indiana has. Honestly all of the 900 series highways are weird in their own part. 900 basically means indot really doesn't want it, but the locals refuse to take possession. 912 could have been i-x90/80/94
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Rothman on October 07, 2019, 01:25:51 PM
That whole situation sounds nuts.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 07, 2019, 01:42:48 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:25:38 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 07, 2019, 01:22:17 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 03, 2019, 04:44:15 PM
Quote from: Beltway on October 03, 2019, 04:39:15 PM
The project announcements said 2 lanes.
Geeze that's crazy. But it's no longer a state road. Which is also crazy.

No longer a state road because the state is not building the bridge.  It's being financed privately and paid via tolls.  What I am assuming but haven't seen stated by either INDOT or the bridge owner, is that it will not be signed as IN 912 since INDOT doesn't sign roads they don't maintain.  So it seems as though we will have two separate IN 912 4-lane freeways linked by a two-lane, unsigned bridge.

Side note: one very weird thing about IN 912 is that, since the old bridge got demolished, the freeway is closed EB between Calumet and Riley but open WB, making it a rather unique one-way only state highway.
912 is probably the weirdest state highway Indiana has. Honestly all of the 900 series highways are weird in their own part. 900 basically means indot really doesn't want it, but the locals refuse to take possession. 912 could have been i-x90/80/94

930, 931 and 933 are earlier routings of US 30, 31 and 33 that were bypassed within the last 30 years, and yes, INDOT would probably prefer that the local jurisdictions take them over.

912, however, has been around for a long time.  A 1958 map of Lake County shows IN 912, running from Indianapolis/129th, along 129th, Dickey, Michigan (EC), Guthrie, Cline, Michigan (H), and Kennedy until ending at Kennedy/Ridge.

I don't know the origin of choosing a 900 series for the road, but it long predates the other 900 series routes.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:45:44 PM
933 is hanging on by a thread. Its current routing after the South Bend construction is very weird and not signed well. 931 in St Joseph county is also supposed to be given over to local control (I swear I read this somewhere last yr). 931 in Kokomo I've read didn't turn over because Kokomo wanted a ton of money to Carmelize it (keystone parkway). 930 is just kind of there, indot likes to pretend it doesn't exist.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 07, 2019, 01:53:36 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:45:44 PM
933 is hanging on by a thread. Its current routing after the South Bend construction is very weird and not signed well. 931 in St Joseph county is also supposed to be given over to local control (I swear I read this somewhere last yr). 931 in Kokomo I've read didn't turn over because Kokomo wanted a ton of money to Carmelize it (keystone parkway). 930 is just kind of there, indot likes to pretend it doesn't exist.

I don't think 931 or 933 are going away anytime soon as St. Joe County and South Bend have made it clear they do not want to take over the roads.  The routing of 933 may be confusing downtown since Michigan and Main got converted to 2-way streets.  Not sure whether INDOT consolidated the routing along Michigan or if southbound still runs along Main.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:55:56 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 07, 2019, 01:53:36 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:45:44 PM
933 is hanging on by a thread. Its current routing after the South Bend construction is very weird and not signed well. 931 in St Joseph county is also supposed to be given over to local control (I swear I read this somewhere last yr). 931 in Kokomo I've read didn't turn over because Kokomo wanted a ton of money to Carmelize it (keystone parkway). 930 is just kind of there, indot likes to pretend it doesn't exist.

I don't think 931 or 933 are going away anytime soon as St. Joe County and South Bend have made it clear they do not want to take over the roads.  The routing of 933 may be confusing downtown since Michigan and Main got converted to 2-way streets.  Not sure whether INDOT consolidated the routing along Michigan or if southbound still runs along Main.
I think 933 is on main alone now. 931 up there is now an island state road. It begins and ends at a county road. I agree, I don't see them going away any time soon. Is it true that those interchanges on 933 were supposed to be a part of a proposed freeway?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 07, 2019, 02:03:59 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:55:56 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 07, 2019, 01:53:36 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:45:44 PM
933 is hanging on by a thread. Its current routing after the South Bend construction is very weird and not signed well. 931 in St Joseph county is also supposed to be given over to local control (I swear I read this somewhere last yr). 931 in Kokomo I've read didn't turn over because Kokomo wanted a ton of money to Carmelize it (keystone parkway). 930 is just kind of there, indot likes to pretend it doesn't exist.

I don't think 931 or 933 are going away anytime soon as St. Joe County and South Bend have made it clear they do not want to take over the roads.  The routing of 933 may be confusing downtown since Michigan and Main got converted to 2-way streets.  Not sure whether INDOT consolidated the routing along Michigan or if southbound still runs along Main.
I think 933 is on main alone now. 931 up there is now an island state road. It begins and ends at a county road. I agree, I don't see them going away any time soon. Is it true that those interchanges on 933 were supposed to be a part of a proposed freeway?

The Eddy/Sample interchange was the first part of a proposed inner loop.  I've seen conflicting information about whether or not the entire loop was ever expected to be freeway or just have a few interchanges.  At the NW corner, Martin Dr did get constructed to round off Chapin and Marion streets, but there's no evidence that it was designed to have an interchange at Lincoln Way.  The proposed bridge connecting Marion and Cedar streets, which would have completed the loop, never got built.  Not sure if the Sample/Chapin intersection was supposed to be an interchange but it looks like it could have been.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 02:06:47 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 07, 2019, 02:03:59 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:55:56 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 07, 2019, 01:53:36 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:45:44 PM
933 is hanging on by a thread. Its current routing after the South Bend construction is very weird and not signed well. 931 in St Joseph county is also supposed to be given over to local control (I swear I read this somewhere last yr). 931 in Kokomo I've read didn't turn over because Kokomo wanted a ton of money to Carmelize it (keystone parkway). 930 is just kind of there, indot likes to pretend it doesn't exist.

I don't think 931 or 933 are going away anytime soon as St. Joe County and South Bend have made it clear they do not want to take over the roads.  The routing of 933 may be confusing downtown since Michigan and Main got converted to 2-way streets.  Not sure whether INDOT consolidated the routing along Michigan or if southbound still runs along Main.
I think 933 is on main alone now. 931 up there is now an island state road. It begins and ends at a county road. I agree, I don't see them going away any time soon. Is it true that those interchanges on 933 were supposed to be a part of a proposed freeway?

The Eddy/Sample interchange was the first part of a proposed inner loop.  I've seen conflicting information about whether or not the entire loop was ever expected to be freeway or just have a few interchanges.  At the NW corner, Martin Dr did get constructed to round off Chapin and Marion streets, but there's no evidence that it was designed to have an interchange at Lincoln Way.  The proposed bridge connecting Marion and Cedar streets, which would have completed the loop, never got built.  Not sure if the Sample/Chapin intersection was supposed to be an interchange but it looks like it could have been.
Do you or anyone else on here have any maps or stories about this? I'd like to learn more. Interesting that a city the size of South bend would warrant an inner loop.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: edwaleni on October 07, 2019, 02:21:53 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:55:56 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 07, 2019, 01:53:36 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:45:44 PM
933 is hanging on by a thread. Its current routing after the South Bend construction is very weird and not signed well. 931 in St Joseph county is also supposed to be given over to local control (I swear I read this somewhere last yr). 931 in Kokomo I've read didn't turn over because Kokomo wanted a ton of money to Carmelize it (keystone parkway). 930 is just kind of there, indot likes to pretend it doesn't exist.

I don't think 931 or 933 are going away anytime soon as St. Joe County and South Bend have made it clear they do not want to take over the roads.  The routing of 933 may be confusing downtown since Michigan and Main got converted to 2-way streets.  Not sure whether INDOT consolidated the routing along Michigan or if southbound still runs along Main.
I think 933 is on main alone now. 931 up there is now an island state road. It begins and ends at a county road. I agree, I don't see them going away any time soon. Is it true that those interchanges on 933 were supposed to be a part of a proposed freeway?

Are you talking about the ramps off 931 (Lincolnway) to Eddy Street?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 02:22:43 PM
Quote from: edwaleni on October 07, 2019, 02:21:53 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:55:56 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 07, 2019, 01:53:36 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:45:44 PM
933 is hanging on by a thread. Its current routing after the South Bend construction is very weird and not signed well. 931 in St Joseph county is also supposed to be given over to local control (I swear I read this somewhere last yr). 931 in Kokomo I've read didn't turn over because Kokomo wanted a ton of money to Carmelize it (keystone parkway). 930 is just kind of there, indot likes to pretend it doesn't exist.

I don't think 931 or 933 are going away anytime soon as St. Joe County and South Bend have made it clear they do not want to take over the roads.  The routing of 933 may be confusing downtown since Michigan and Main got converted to 2-way streets.  Not sure whether INDOT consolidated the routing along Michigan or if southbound still runs along Main.
I think 933 is on main alone now. 931 up there is now an island state road. It begins and ends at a county road. I agree, I don't see them going away any time soon. Is it true that those interchanges on 933 were supposed to be a part of a proposed freeway?

Are you talking about the ramps off 931 (Lincolnway) to Eddy Street?
Yes on either side of the river.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 07, 2019, 02:33:04 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 02:06:47 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 07, 2019, 02:03:59 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:55:56 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 07, 2019, 01:53:36 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:45:44 PM
933 is hanging on by a thread. Its current routing after the South Bend construction is very weird and not signed well. 931 in St Joseph county is also supposed to be given over to local control (I swear I read this somewhere last yr). 931 in Kokomo I've read didn't turn over because Kokomo wanted a ton of money to Carmelize it (keystone parkway). 930 is just kind of there, indot likes to pretend it doesn't exist.

I don't think 931 or 933 are going away anytime soon as St. Joe County and South Bend have made it clear they do not want to take over the roads.  The routing of 933 may be confusing downtown since Michigan and Main got converted to 2-way streets.  Not sure whether INDOT consolidated the routing along Michigan or if southbound still runs along Main.
I think 933 is on main alone now. 931 up there is now an island state road. It begins and ends at a county road. I agree, I don't see them going away any time soon. Is it true that those interchanges on 933 were supposed to be a part of a proposed freeway?

The Eddy/Sample interchange was the first part of a proposed inner loop.  I've seen conflicting information about whether or not the entire loop was ever expected to be freeway or just have a few interchanges.  At the NW corner, Martin Dr did get constructed to round off Chapin and Marion streets, but there's no evidence that it was designed to have an interchange at Lincoln Way.  The proposed bridge connecting Marion and Cedar streets, which would have completed the loop, never got built.  Not sure if the Sample/Chapin intersection was supposed to be an interchange but it looks like it could have been.
Do you or anyone else on here have any maps or stories about this? I'd like to learn more. Interesting that a city the size of South bend would warrant an inner loop.

There was a site that had more detailed information, but it has long since been taken down or I just can't find it.  Here is the reference I can find: http://www.roadfan.com/sbnelkrd.html  It's referenced in the entry for IN 23.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: edwaleni on October 07, 2019, 02:38:14 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 02:22:43 PM
Quote from: edwaleni on October 07, 2019, 02:21:53 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:55:56 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 07, 2019, 01:53:36 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:45:44 PM
933 is hanging on by a thread. Its current routing after the South Bend construction is very weird and not signed well. 931 in St Joseph county is also supposed to be given over to local control (I swear I read this somewhere last yr). 931 in Kokomo I've read didn't turn over because Kokomo wanted a ton of money to Carmelize it (keystone parkway). 930 is just kind of there, indot likes to pretend it doesn't exist.

I don't think 931 or 933 are going away anytime soon as St. Joe County and South Bend have made it clear they do not want to take over the roads.  The routing of 933 may be confusing downtown since Michigan and Main got converted to 2-way streets.  Not sure whether INDOT consolidated the routing along Michigan or if southbound still runs along Main.
I think 933 is on main alone now. 931 up there is now an island state road. It begins and ends at a county road. I agree, I don't see them going away any time soon. Is it true that those interchanges on 933 were supposed to be a part of a proposed freeway?

Are you talking about the ramps off 931 (Lincolnway) to Eddy Street?
Yes on either side of the river.

It was called the "Innerbelt" and it was killed after the tearing down of some large, historic mansions took place.

This caused a community uproar. I think the Kizer House was saved after the public outcry to stop.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 02:43:52 PM
Quote from: edwaleni on October 07, 2019, 02:38:14 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 02:22:43 PM
Quote from: edwaleni on October 07, 2019, 02:21:53 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:55:56 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 07, 2019, 01:53:36 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:45:44 PM
933 is hanging on by a thread. Its current routing after the South Bend construction is very weird and not signed well. 931 in St Joseph county is also supposed to be given over to local control (I swear I read this somewhere last yr). 931 in Kokomo I've read didn't turn over because Kokomo wanted a ton of money to Carmelize it (keystone parkway). 930 is just kind of there, indot likes to pretend it doesn't exist.

I don't think 931 or 933 are going away anytime soon as St. Joe County and South Bend have made it clear they do not want to take over the roads.  The routing of 933 may be confusing downtown since Michigan and Main got converted to 2-way streets.  Not sure whether INDOT consolidated the routing along Michigan or if southbound still runs along Main.
I think 933 is on main alone now. 931 up there is now an island state road. It begins and ends at a county road. I agree, I don't see them going away any time soon. Is it true that those interchanges on 933 were supposed to be a part of a proposed freeway?

Are you talking about the ramps off 931 (Lincolnway) to Eddy Street?
Yes on either side of the river.

It was called the "Innerbelt" and it was killed after the tearing down of some large, historic mansions took place.

This caused a community uproar. I think the Kizer House was saved after the public outcry to stop.
A freeway revolt I support. SB is too small for an inner loop. FT Wayne had one proposed too but that got killed. Were there any maps of that?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: edwaleni on October 07, 2019, 03:06:53 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 02:43:52 PM
Quote from: edwaleni on October 07, 2019, 02:38:14 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 02:22:43 PM
Quote from: edwaleni on October 07, 2019, 02:21:53 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:55:56 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 07, 2019, 01:53:36 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 07, 2019, 01:45:44 PM
933 is hanging on by a thread. Its current routing after the South Bend construction is very weird and not signed well. 931 in St Joseph county is also supposed to be given over to local control (I swear I read this somewhere last yr). 931 in Kokomo I've read didn't turn over because Kokomo wanted a ton of money to Carmelize it (keystone parkway). 930 is just kind of there, indot likes to pretend it doesn't exist.

I don't think 931 or 933 are going away anytime soon as St. Joe County and South Bend have made it clear they do not want to take over the roads.  The routing of 933 may be confusing downtown since Michigan and Main got converted to 2-way streets.  Not sure whether INDOT consolidated the routing along Michigan or if southbound still runs along Main.
I think 933 is on main alone now. 931 up there is now an island state road. It begins and ends at a county road. I agree, I don't see them going away any time soon. Is it true that those interchanges on 933 were supposed to be a part of a proposed freeway?

Are you talking about the ramps off 931 (Lincolnway) to Eddy Street?
Yes on either side of the river.

It was called the "Innerbelt" and it was killed after the tearing down of some large, historic mansions took place.

This caused a community uproar. I think the Kizer House was saved after the public outcry to stop.
A freeway revolt I support. SB is too small for an inner loop. FT Wayne had one proposed too but that got killed. Were there any maps of that?

I was looking for some.

The Innerbelt was supposed to be bordered by Sample on the south, Chapin on the west, Martin/Marion on the north and Eddy on the east.

Basically it was to get US-31 and US-20 traffic around the city center.

US-20 on the west side is Lincolnway and on the east side McKinley (in those days)

US-31 split in 2 at Marion from the north and became Main and Michigan through downtown.

The idea as I understood it was to raise Sample at the Studebaker Plant (a source of high traffic back then) and route traffic around downtown or over the river to the east.

The Sample Street bridge (which is still standing) would get all backed up for traffic to/from Eddy & Mishawaka just before and after shift changes at Studebaker.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on October 08, 2019, 01:26:02 AM
Speed cameras in construction zones COULD be coming to Indiana, according to lawmakers

https://fox59.com/2019/10/07/lawmakers-push-to-add-speeding-cameras-in-indiana-work-zones/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on October 08, 2019, 05:23:23 PM
^ This in a state that likes to drop the speed limit for a work zone where there is nothing happening and the only evidence of the work zone is the signing  :banghead:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on October 08, 2019, 08:19:31 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on October 08, 2019, 05:23:23 PM
^ This in a state that likes to drop the speed limit for a work zone where there is nothing happening and the only evidence of the work zone is the signing  :banghead:
Speed Limit 70 mph -> Road Work Ahead -> Some cones placed on the shoulder = Speed Limit 45 mph.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on October 08, 2019, 09:49:00 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on October 08, 2019, 08:19:31 PM
Speed Limit 70 mph -> Road Work Ahead -> Some cones placed on the shoulder = Speed Limit 45 mph.

I recall one on SB I-65 this year that didn't even have the cones.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on October 09, 2019, 01:19:00 PM
They also have those signs indicating the construction speed limit is in effect if the lights are flashing.  I would sometimes see a state police car parked in a "pursuit ready" position and the flashing lights are off and no workers there (usually would be a rainy day).  I asked an Indiana State Police friend of mine about the situation and he said that they had set times that they would have to be there to watch over even if no one was working or the lights were not on.  In the instance I was describing, the speed limit was not lowered, but he still had to be there.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on October 19, 2019, 10:41:02 PM
Along with INDOT's usual weekend binge of construction I found yet another example of INDOT's fine planning in action. I noticed the ramps from northbound I-465 to both I-74 and Washington Street were closed on the southeast side. Any traffic that wanted to exit onto either exit had to use the Brookville Road exit and turn around from there. Why couldn't they have been working on those ramps when northbound I-465 was closed for two weeks?

I-65 on the south side from between Southport to I-465, which should have been repaved several years ago has been repaved at a glacial pace. Six lanes for a three-mile stretch, they started paving in May, they just got to the last lane last week and given INDOT it will probably be Thanksgiving when the lane markers are put in.

At least I-465 on the northeast side and I-69 from Exits 200 to 205 look good with the repaving.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 19, 2019, 10:43:32 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on October 19, 2019, 10:41:02 PM
Along with INDOT's usual weekend binge of construction I found yet another example of INDOT's fine planning in action. I noticed the ramps from northbound I-465 to both I-74 and Washington Street were closed on the southeast side. Any traffic that wanted to exit onto either exit had to use the Brookville Road exit and turn around from there. Why couldn't they have been working on those ramps when northbound I-465 was closed for two weeks?

I-65 on the south side from between Southport to I-465, which should have been repaved several years ago has been repaved at a glacial pace. Six lanes for a three-mile stretch, they started paving in May, they just got to the last lane last week and given INDOT it will probably be Thanksgiving when the lane markers are put in.

At least I-465 on the northeast side and I-69 from Exits 200 to 205 look good with the repaving.
Indot should win a medal for shitty planning. It will only get worse I'm afraid.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on October 20, 2019, 04:29:46 PM
Winding up construction season in Northwest Indiana...

Traffic on I-65 southbound in Crown Point is set to be moved back to the original lanes this week, which will also allow the southbound entrance and exit ramps at 109th Avenue to reopen as well. Also opening in that area this week is the 101st Avenue overpass, which includes a new structure designed to handle four lanes of traffic, versus the two lanes from the original bridge.

Also winding down further north along I-65 is the CSX/Central Avenue bridge project. Southbound traffic has all lanes open, which allows access to I-65 from all entry points (US 12/20, the Toll Road, and 15th Avenue). Some lane closures may take place for final overhead sign reinstallation. Northbound traffic still has a lane closed as crews finish median and guardrail work; the ramp from I-80/94 west to I-65 north is still closed until all work is completed enough to open both lanes. Just south of that bridge, crews recently completed bridge deck overlay work on the mainline and auxiliary ramps within the Borman interchange. The new surface is more coarse than standard concrete to allow for better traction during the winter months. This same work is currently finishing up on some parts of I-94 near Chesterton.

In Laporte County, the US 35/SR 39 bridge in Downtown Laporte is winding down, as crews are finishing up concrete guardrail pouring and fencing installation (for both decorative and safety reasons, since the bridge spans over a high traffic railroad). The bridge beams will be painted orange to match the city's high school team colors (go Slicers!).

INDOT says the dog bone interchange project for Indiana 2 and US 20 is still slated for completion by mid- to late November.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on October 20, 2019, 05:17:11 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on October 19, 2019, 10:41:02 PM
Along with INDOT's usual weekend binge of construction I found yet another example of INDOT's fine planning in action. I noticed the ramps from northbound I-465 to both I-74 and Washington Street were closed on the southeast side. Any traffic that wanted to exit onto either exit had to use the Brookville Road exit and turn around from there. Why couldn't they have been working on those ramps when northbound I-465 was closed for two weeks?

I-65 on the south side from between Southport to I-465, which should have been repaved several years ago has been repaved at a glacial pace. Six lanes for a three-mile stretch, they started paving in May, they just got to the last lane last week and given INDOT it will probably be Thanksgiving when the lane markers are put in.

At least I-465 on the northeast side and I-69 from Exits 200 to 205 look good with the repaving.

Despite saying that they would reopen Monday at 6 AM, work on I-65 on the south side was completed prior to 8 AM this (Sunday) morning. The ramps on I-465 were all open except Shadeland Ave., which suggested the US 52 detour. The closures have been a pain, but INDOT (or their contractors) do seem to be moving well.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on November 08, 2019, 11:01:04 PM
https://www.theindychannel.com/news/local-news/improvements-on-the-way-for-i-65-in-boone-county

Improvements are coming to a busy area in Boone County on I-65. INDOT was going to pay the whole thing ($50 million) for this project, BUT the USDOT awarded $16 million for this project. INDOT will now pay $34 million for this project, alongside with the USDOT's commitment of $16 million.

It calls for the following improvements:
1. A new interchange at CR 550 South (a DDI to be exact)
2. Interchange improvement at SR 267 (another DDI)
3. Reconfigure the split in the SB direction (an added lane on I-65 heading southbound, incoming APL signage)

Construction will start next year and finish in 2021.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: CtrlAltDel on November 09, 2019, 03:49:58 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on November 08, 2019, 11:01:04 PM
https://www.theindychannel.com/news/local-news/improvements-on-the-way-for-i-65-in-boone-county

Improvements are coming to a busy area in Boone County on I-65.

Here is the web site with project details.

https://www.in.gov/indot/3729.htm

Also, it's not 500 S, but 550 S where the new interchange will be located. I think it's weird though that an interchange is going there since it leads to a residential area right to the east. The plans show barricades there, though, to block off the street, but if that's what they're doing, why bother?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Finrod on November 09, 2019, 05:53:18 PM
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on November 09, 2019, 03:49:58 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on November 08, 2019, 11:01:04 PM
https://www.theindychannel.com/news/local-news/improvements-on-the-way-for-i-65-in-boone-county

Improvements are coming to a busy area in Boone County on I-65.

Here is the web site with project details.

https://www.in.gov/indot/3729.htm

Also, it's not 500 S, but 550 S where the new interchange will be located. I think it's weird though that an interchange is going there since it leads to a residential area right to the east. The plans show barricades there, though, to block off the street, but if that's what they're doing, why bother?

Maybe it's more for the industrial area to the west?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on November 09, 2019, 06:19:34 PM
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on November 09, 2019, 03:49:58 PM
The plans show barricades there, though, to block off the street, but if that's what they're doing, why bother?
It's likely to improve access to the major industrial area to the west. This proposed interchange, along with the modification & Albert White Dr realignment at the 400 E interchange, all seem to have a trend of improving access to the industrial areas on either side of I-65.

As for the proposed stub and barricades on the new interchange, I don't know where they plan to eventually extend that. My guess would be creating a new road to meet up with the stub on New Hope Blvd. That road looks more equipped to handle more traffic, though not a major load (it's still only 2-lanes) than Meadowview Dr is.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on November 09, 2019, 08:06:28 PM
That current SR 267 interchange will get very busy over the next two months with the massive Amazon warehouse so any bit of help with access on some of the other roads will likely be of help to the people in that area.

I for one am interested in hearing about southbound I-65 being six lanes at the spit with I-865. Is this a prelude to a potential six-laning of I-65 between I-865 and I-465. With all the talk about making I-65 six lanes across the state we forget that there's still several miles that are only four lanes within Marion County itself.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ilpt4u on November 09, 2019, 08:18:51 PM
Anyone got the AADT numbers for how much traffic heads towards Carmel/I-465 North Side vs heading toward Downtown and the Airport/Speedway/I-465 West Side?

If the Split is relatively equal, is 6 Lane Freeway needed between 865 and 465 West Side?

Obviously if there is a clear heavier traffic flow continuing on I-65 heading Downtown or to I-465 West Side, 6 Laning expansion will be needed, eventually
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on November 09, 2019, 08:42:43 PM
INDOT's traffic count map shows around 63,000 between Lafayette Road and I-465 and 54,000 north. Some of the traffic leaves the split onto I-465 north, but other traffic joins the highway from I-465 northwest onto I-65 north. In comparison it's around 40,000 around the newly widened part of I-65 around Lafayette and just over 30,000 north of Seymour on the stretch currently being widened to six lanes. While commuter traffic may hop onto to I-465 if they live in that area, cross-country traffic will stay on I-65. If we are going to widen I-65 due to cross-country traffic (largely from heavy truck traffic) around Seymour and Lafayette, why not northwest of Indianapolis as well?

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ibthebigd on November 09, 2019, 08:45:41 PM
What are the traffic numbers between Mount Comfort to the State Line?

SM-G950U

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on November 09, 2019, 11:22:31 PM
According to INDOT's Traffic Count Database System:

Mt. Comfort Road to SR 9: around 55,000
SR 9 to SR 109: around 42,000
SR 9 to Ohio State Line: around 35,000 to 38,000

Of course the heavy truck traffic makes that seem busier than that.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 09, 2019, 11:27:55 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on November 09, 2019, 06:19:34 PM
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on November 09, 2019, 03:49:58 PM
The plans show barricades there, though, to block off the street, but if that's what they're doing, why bother?
It's likely to improve access to the major industrial area to the west. This proposed interchange, along with the modification & Albert White Dr realignment at the 400 E interchange, all seem to have a trend of improving access to the industrial areas on either side of I-65.

As for the proposed stub and barricades on the new interchange, I don't know where they plan to eventually extend that. My guess would be creating a new road to meet up with the stub on New Hope Blvd. That road looks more equipped to handle more traffic, though not a major load (it's still only 2-lanes) than Meadowview Dr is.
I know some things about this project. For some reason whitestown plans on curving 550 north to terminate at 500 or further north. Ronald Reagan parkway will terminate onto 267 somewhere just south of the 65 interchange.  no idea when that will happen though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on November 22, 2019, 12:51:12 PM
I-65 is complete and open all the way through Lake County, with all ramp closures lifted. To recap:

Both bridges over the CSX line and Central Avenue in Gary have been completely replaced with new surface structures and bridge piers. At some points along the Borman/Ridge Road interchanges, bridges along the mainline and ramps have been overlaid with a more traction friendly surface.

From US 231 to US 30, I-65 underwent full concrete patching, which was originally part of the initial widening, but was pushed to this year due to delays in that stretch of the road. As an added bonus, the 101st Avenue bridge has been replaced with a newer structure with two additional lanes.

At some point today (November 22), the dogbone interchange at US 20 and Indiana 2 will be fully opened to traffic. INDOT, with cooperation from the Laporte County Sheriff's Office, posted a video preview of the interchange on their Facebook page. Traffic exiting to the dogbone will be given control cities as they approach the roundabouts (Laporte for Indiana 2 west, and New Carlisle for US 20 east). Just southwest of this, bridge work is wrapping up in Downtown Laporte at the US 35/SR 39 structure.

Finally, crews are looking to finish the Indiana 51 northbound bridge before winter sets in. When finished, crews will have to redo the southbound structure again to comply with the redesign (which caused the delay to the bridge project to begin with).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 22, 2019, 02:20:42 PM
Heading to South Bend next week for Thanksgiving.  May need to exit onto EB 20 to check out the dogbone rather than continuing straight onto EB 2.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 22, 2019, 02:24:33 PM
someone post pictures! (20/2 interchange)

down here, traffic has shifted onto the bridge for keystone parkway.  this will make the us 31 interchange better once complete, people detouring on 31 will go back to keystone. 96th is still a RIRO and will be until the end of the yr.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on November 24, 2019, 01:28:55 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 22, 2019, 02:24:33 PM
someone post pictures! (20/2 interchange)

I'm sure our fellow road warriors will have more on scene when they're in the area ,but in the meantime, this (https://www.facebook.com/INDOTNorthwest/photos/a.122642564535816/1851028538363868?type=3&sfns=mo) will lead you to INDOT's Facebook page, with a nice nighttime view taken via drone, just after opening. The closer roundabout is the the southern end. The video mentioned earlier is also on this page.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on November 24, 2019, 06:20:10 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 22, 2019, 02:24:33 PM
someone post pictures! (20/2 interchange)

down here, traffic has shifted onto the bridge for keystone parkway.  this will make the us 31 interchange better once complete, people detouring on 31 will go back to keystone. 96th is still a RIRO and will be until the end of the yr.

Woo hoo!  Hopefully this relieves southbound rush hour traffic on keystone! Northbound has been much better even just since they took out the stoplight.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 24, 2019, 09:39:40 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on November 24, 2019, 06:20:10 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 22, 2019, 02:24:33 PM
someone post pictures! (20/2 interchange)

down here, traffic has shifted onto the bridge for keystone parkway.  this will make the us 31 interchange better once complete, people detouring on 31 will go back to keystone. 96th is still a RIRO and will be until the end of the yr.

Woo hoo!  Hopefully this relieves southbound rush hour traffic on keystone! Northbound has been much better even just since they took out the stoplight.

drove it twice this weekend, still no surface asphalt on the road.  NB should work like a dream, SB there will be a weaving issue trying to go to WB 465 dealing with traffic from 96th trying to weave in. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on November 28, 2019, 08:47:41 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on November 24, 2019, 01:28:55 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 22, 2019, 02:24:33 PM
someone post pictures! (20/2 interchange)

I’m sure our fellow road warriors will have more on scene when they’re in the area ,but in the meantime, this (https://www.facebook.com/INDOTNorthwest/photos/a.122642564535816/1851028538363868?type=3&sfns=mo) will lead you to INDOT’s Facebook page, with a nice nighttime view taken via drone, just after opening. The closer roundabout is the the southern end. The video mentioned earlier is also on this page.

Alright, since you guys asked for it, I have a video of the drive through the interchange. It was taken today.
https://youtu.be/id7HEg9enaA
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 29, 2019, 07:37:02 AM
Didn't get photos or a video, but I drove the new 20/2 interchange Wednesday.  It's a pretty standard dogbone interchange. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on November 29, 2019, 07:55:06 AM
I'm sorry if it's been asked before. But is there any reason why US 20 can't just continue east along the four-lane expressway all the way to South Bend, with SR 2 using the two-lane highway through New Carlisle before ending northwest of South Bend at US 31? SR 2 ends at the South Bend bypass anyway and US 20 joins the bypass to around around South Bend and Elkhart. Why can't their routings be switched around between this interchange and South Bend. I figure it's always been this way, it just seems weird that the two highways even do this. What is the route number along the highway between the entrance and exit ramps at this interchange?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 29, 2019, 08:03:22 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on November 29, 2019, 07:55:06 AM
I'm sorry if it's been asked before. But is there any reason why US 20 can't just continue east along the four-lane expressway all the way to South Bend, with SR 2 using the two-lane highway through New Carlisle before ending northwest of South Bend at US 31? SR 2 ends at the South Bend bypass anyway and US 20 joins the bypass to around around South Bend and Elkhart. Why can't their routings be switched around between this interchange and South Bend. I figure it's always been this way, it just seems weird that the two highways even do this. What is the route number along the highway between the entrance and exit ramps at this interchange?

US 20 follows the route of the Old Michigan Road from South Bend to Michigan City, so that's why it existed that way originally.  Before the early 1990s extension of the US 20/31 bypass from South Bend to Elkhart, US 20 still went through South Bend and Mishawaka on Lincolnway/McKinley.  Once the bypass extension was completed, US 20 got re-routed along the bypass, which created a second intersection with IN 2.  At that point, it would have made sense to swap the routes east of Rolling Prairie, but it has never happened. 

The one thing I don't know is whether or not the people of New Carlisle take enough pride in living on a US highway that they would make some noise if the swap were seriously discussed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on November 30, 2019, 04:51:00 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 24, 2019, 09:39:40 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on November 24, 2019, 06:20:10 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 22, 2019, 02:24:33 PM
someone post pictures! (20/2 interchange)

down here, traffic has shifted onto the bridge for keystone parkway.  this will make the us 31 interchange better once complete, people detouring on 31 will go back to keystone. 96th is still a RIRO and will be until the end of the yr.

Woo hoo!  Hopefully this relieves southbound rush hour traffic on keystone! Northbound has been much better even just since they took out the stoplight.

drove it twice this weekend, still no surface asphalt on the road.  NB should work like a dream, SB there will be a weaving issue trying to go to WB 465 dealing with traffic from 96th trying to weave in.
Is the other work on 96th Street completed yet, the two roundabouts away from those at the Keystone AVENUE (screw Carmel, I refuse to call it Parkway :rolleyes:) ramps?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on December 01, 2019, 12:23:14 PM
96th and Priority Way - completed
96th and Gray - completed
96th and Hazel Dell - completed
96th and Delegates Row - under construction
96th and Haverstick - scheduled in 2020
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on December 02, 2019, 07:02:02 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on November 09, 2019, 11:22:31 PM
According to INDOT's Traffic Count Database System:

Mt. Comfort Road to SR 9: around 55,000
SR 9 to SR 109: around 42,000
SR 9 to Ohio State Line: around 35,000 to 38,000

Of course the heavy truck traffic makes that seem busier than that.

Drove back to Indy from Ohio on Saturday.   Quite the stressful drive, mostly due to that heavy truck traffic.  Truck passing truck going a few miles an hour slower takes 4 to 5 miles to complete and lots of break tapping behind them.  When one of those passes was completed, we could not see any cars in front of them - probably a couple of miles.

I agree with the earlier threads that 65 needs three lanes before 70, but Saturday reminded me why I usually take US 30 across Ohio when going between Indy and Northeast Ohio.  Last trip on 30 I had a stretch of 17 miles between Beaverdam and Delphos where I did not pass a vehicle and no vehicles passed me.  It is generally worth the extra 15-20 minutes over five and a half hours to avoid 70
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 05, 2019, 12:57:07 PM
Anyone know how the US 31/SR 18 Interchange is coming?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on December 05, 2019, 01:55:21 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 05, 2019, 12:57:07 PM
Anyone know how the US 31/SR 18 Interchange is coming?

Uh, the new interchange at SR 18 is not supposed to start construction until 2023.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 05, 2019, 02:51:42 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 05, 2019, 01:55:21 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 05, 2019, 12:57:07 PM
Anyone know how the US 31/SR 18 Interchange is coming?

Uh, the new interchange at SR 18 is not supposed to start construction until 2023.

well what the heck are they doing there now?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 05, 2019, 06:25:55 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 05, 2019, 02:51:42 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 05, 2019, 01:55:21 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 05, 2019, 12:57:07 PM
Anyone know how the US 31/SR 18 Interchange is coming?

Uh, the new interchange at SR 18 is not supposed to start construction until 2023.

well what the heck are they doing there now?

If it is what I think you're thinking of, they're just rebuilding US 31 through that area, from SR 18 south to SR 931. I know I passed through there twice in the past few months and it was down to one lane in each direction. I believe it's just a general highway reconstruction, nothing to do with the proposed interchange there yet.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on December 07, 2019, 12:14:36 AM
Today, I was driving along the northbound lanes of Keystone Parkway from I-465, and I saw a rare thing in Indiana: MONOTUBES GANTRIES along the southbound lanes of Keystone Parkway at the 96th Street interchange! Even better, they are painted black!  :hyper: :hyper: :hyper:

The only other spot that I have seen monotubes gantries in use in Indiana is at 86th and 71st Street interchanges with I-465.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 07, 2019, 10:20:55 AM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 07, 2019, 12:14:36 AM
Today, I was driving along the northbound lanes of Keystone Parkway from I-465, and I saw a rare thing in Indiana: MONOTUBES GANTRIES along the southbound lanes of Keystone Parkway at the 96th Street interchange! Even better, they are painted black!  :hyper: :hyper: :hyper:

The only other spot that I have seen monotubes gantries in use in Indiana is at 86th and 71st Street interchanges with I-465.

they're black probably because of carmel spec, all of their poles are black, even the square poles for the standard sheet signs. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JREwing78 on December 07, 2019, 11:31:04 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on November 28, 2019, 08:47:41 PM
Alright, since you guys asked for it, I have a video of the drive through the interchange. It was taken today.


A few thoughts:

- I'm mildly surprised bypasses for the W->S, N->E, E->N, and S->W movements were not built into the roundabouts. It doesn't appear to be a problem now, but might be needed later to relieve congestion.

- The side-road intersections on IN-2 east of the interchange and US-20 west of the interchange are awfully short-spaced.

- The WBD turn lane for the Junction City Restaurant is in a horrible location. They should've taken the opportunity to close access to everything all the way west to N 500 E, and built access roads to serve the homes and businesses. I would not be surprised if they continue to have nasty wrecks in that area.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: westerninterloper on December 08, 2019, 07:57:42 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 07, 2019, 12:14:36 AM
Today, I was driving along the northbound lanes of Keystone Parkway from I-465, and I saw a rare thing in Indiana: MONOTUBES GANTRIES along the southbound lanes of Keystone Parkway at the 96th Street interchange! Even better, they are painted black!  :hyper: :hyper: :hyper:

The only other spot that I have seen monotubes gantries in use in Indiana is at 86th and 71st Street interchanges with I-465.

We are getting them along I-75 in Toledo
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on December 09, 2019, 08:16:21 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on December 01, 2019, 12:23:14 PM
96th and Priority Way - completed
96th and Gray - completed
96th and Hazel Dell - completed
96th and Delegates Row - under construction
96th and Haverstick - scheduled in 2020
Many thanks!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 10, 2019, 06:20:47 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on December 09, 2019, 08:16:21 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on December 01, 2019, 12:23:14 PM
96th and Priority Way - completed
96th and Gray - completed
96th and Hazel Dell - completed
96th and Delegates Row - under construction
96th and Haverstick - scheduled in 2020
Many thanks!

check here for updates
http://carmellink.com/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 29, 2019, 06:54:45 AM
I'd thought I give a few updates on some of the projects in Central Indiana that I have observed over the past few days given some free time I have.

I'll start with Keystone and 96th, it appears to be mainly finished. I don't know if it's still something with the construction but I notice that you will still have to stop at the off-ramp onto Keystone. I would have thought that there might be some channelization so that traffic didn't have to stop coming off of 465 west toward northbound Keystone. Maybe I'm missing something. Southbound Keystone traffic passes over 96th Street and runs straight into the ramps for 465. Notably, there's a pair of one-arrow-per-lane signs directing traffic exiting to either I-465 or southbound Keystone Avenue (from 96th Street.) Signs like this are still very rare in Indiana but I think the state is going to start using them more, at least where it's applicable.

Here's a northbound view along Keystone at 96th.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49291700463_791645029f_k.jpg)

Now the southbound view with the monotube gantries mentioned earlier on this thread.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49291687628_d915bd5017_k.jpg)

And then the one-arrow-per-lane signage at the ramp for I-465 east and Keystone Avenue
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49291686293_69c8568b15_k.jpg)

Next up, I-69 has been expanded to six lanes from between Pendleton and Anderson, opening up within the past couple of weeks. This now means that I-69 is six lanes or wider for the first 26 miles north of I-465 which to me is rather incredible. Back when I went to school at Ball State I-69 was six lanes for only the first five miles. A further project rebuilt a four-lane stretch of interstate from Anderson to Daleville, a particularly pothole-prone stretch of roadway that took out many cars last winter. All of these projects have created a smooth and modern freeway all the way from Indianapolis to Anderson and Muncie. The upcoming interchange project at I-465 and I-69 is likely the last part of the upgrade of this busy corridor.

First, a shot of the new pedestrian bridge over I-69 at SR 38 in Pendleton. The interchange was rebuilt with roundabouts this past year.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49292179266_8c42806e0c_k.jpg)

Next, a view of southbound I-69 at Exit 226, the beginning of the six-lane section of I-69.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49292374892_c3501e0f6e_k.jpg)

I-69 at Exit 222.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49292177321_dfce35c623_k.jpg)

Finally, I remember I-70 being mentioned not too long ago. I drove that roadway out to Richmond yesterday. I am now very curious what exactly was done on that roadway from Indy to Ohio that necessitated the backed up traffic that a source of problems earlier this year. I don't know about the road around Richmond but across a lot of Henry County there's already plenty of potholes on the roadway going east. This could be a problem highway this coming winter.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ibthebigd on December 29, 2019, 06:58:42 AM
I feel like they are always working on I-74 from the Ohio line to Greensburg. I am hoping this last project will fix 74 for awhile.

SM-G950U

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 2trailertrucker on December 30, 2019, 12:35:04 AM
Quote from: ibthebigd on December 29, 2019, 06:58:42 AM
I feel like they are always working on I-74 from the Ohio line to Greensburg. I am hoping this last project will fix 74 for awhile.

SM-G950U



I-74 and I-64 are Indiana's forgotten interstates. The work has been needed for years due to neglect.  The problem with Indiana's cone zones are that they are not planned smartly, leading to back ups and accidents. Compared to Kentucky and Ohio (widening of I-65 & I-70 where if you drive the speed limit, you were backing up traffic) it seems that Indiana's contractors or INDOT never did this before.

It is well needed, but it could have been planned better.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 30, 2019, 07:55:31 AM
i wish indot would put the 38 shield on exit 222, since 38 does go that way now.  :banghead:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on December 30, 2019, 09:58:22 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 30, 2019, 07:55:31 AM
i wish indot would put the 38 shield on exit 222, since 38 does go that way now.  :banghead:

Exit 222 off of which Interstate?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 30, 2019, 10:23:10 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on December 30, 2019, 09:58:22 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 30, 2019, 07:55:31 AM
i wish indot would put the 38 shield on exit 222, since 38 does go that way now.  :banghead:

Exit 222 off of which Interstate?
69
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Finrod on December 30, 2019, 04:43:15 PM
INDOT does seem to be going to ridiculous lengths these days to remove state roads from going through cities.  How many more miles did they add to SR 38 just to remove it from downtown Pendleton?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Flint1979 on December 30, 2019, 06:03:02 PM
Quote from: Finrod on December 30, 2019, 04:43:15 PM
INDOT does seem to be going to ridiculous lengths these days to remove state roads from going through cities.  How many more miles did they add to SR 38 just to remove it from downtown Pendleton?
It added about 4 miles to SR-38. It's about 2 miles across Pendleton and the routing of SR-38 is about 6 miles from the starting point to the ending point.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Flint1979 on December 30, 2019, 06:04:47 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 30, 2019, 07:55:31 AM
i wish indot would put the 38 shield on exit 222, since 38 does go that way now.  :banghead:
Did they do that just to remove SR-38 from Pendleton? It looks very similar to how all the US highways go around Indianapolis instead of through it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 30, 2019, 06:13:36 PM
At least they didn't just create a gap in SR 38 like they did with SR 44 in Franklin. I was in Franklin a few days ago. They can't even have an "To SR 44" signs along Jefferson and King Streets. If you're traveling from Martinsville to Shelbvyille and relying just on route signage, good luck. And all of this just to have Franklin beautify the street through their downtown.

There is a lone SR 38 shield at the northbound approach to Exit 222 to direct cars that way around Pendleton but there may not be any for the southbound approach. They redid all the guide signs along that stretch I would think that would have given them in opportunity to add SR 38 shields at that exit on the guide signage. Also, Exit 218 continues to just have the SR 38 shield, not SR 38 West on it like it should.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 30, 2019, 07:01:45 PM
I think it was pendleton's request so they could ban trucks through downtown.  i remember seeing this on the old indiana route ends site. i miss that site  :-(
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Flint1979 on December 30, 2019, 09:20:35 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 30, 2019, 07:01:45 PM
I think it was pendleton's request so they could ban trucks through downtown.  i remember seeing this on the old indiana route ends site. i miss that site  :-(
That makes sense I was trying to find if that was the reason or not online but couldn't find out the reason.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on December 30, 2019, 10:47:14 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on December 09, 2019, 08:16:21 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on December 01, 2019, 12:23:14 PM
96th and Priority Way - completed
96th and Gray - completed
96th and Hazel Dell - completed
96th and Delegates Row - under construction
96th and Haverstick - scheduled in 2020
Many thanks!
96th and Delegates Row - roundabout is now open
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on December 30, 2019, 10:52:23 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 29, 2019, 06:54:45 AM
I'd thought I give a few updates on some of the projects in Central Indiana that I have observed over the past few days given some free time I have.

I'll start with Keystone and 96th, it appears to be mainly finished. I don't know if it's still something with the construction but I notice that you will still have to stop at the off-ramp onto Keystone. I would have thought that there might be some channelization so that traffic didn't have to stop coming off of 465 west toward northbound Keystone. Maybe I'm missing something. Southbound Keystone traffic passes over 96th Street and runs straight into the ramps for 465. Notably, there's a pair of one-arrow-per-lane signs directing traffic exiting to either I-465 or southbound Keystone Avenue (from 96th Street.) Signs like this are still very rare in Indiana but I think the state is going to start using them more, at least where it's applicable.

Here's a northbound view along Keystone at 96th.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49291700463_791645029f_k.jpg)


The 96th street roundabout interchange officially opened today (https://www.wthr.com/article/carmel-reopens-96th-street-keystone-announces-substantial-progress-roundabout) - the cover is now off the sign in the northbound quoted picture.   The covered sign was for 98th street traffic as well as westbound 96th.   To exit on 98th you have to first get off at the interchange for 96th then proceed up the ramp for northbound keystone after going through the roundabout.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on January 31, 2020, 09:23:42 AM
The 65/MLK West St. interchange will be widened slightly this year.  New signs will be posted, one will be an "arrow per lane" one on 65. Just the SB exit and entrance ramps will be affected.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 07, 2020, 12:03:01 AM
The first major road closure has been announced for Northwest Indiana, and it will affect those who travel between Valparaiso and Hebron regularly (will likely affect Winfield residents too).

Next week, Indiana 2 will be closed at the intersection with County Road 100 South (which is 109th Avenue when entering Lake County) for utility pole relocation. This will be in preparation for the longer closure set for this intersection from May to late October. When finished, the angled intersection will be replaced with a much safer roundabout.

Just further southwest, the intersection of Indiana 2 and County Road 500 West will be realigned for safety improvements and better sight lines. Currently, the roads meet at a sharp angle and is only marked by flashing lights (yellow for Indiana 2, red for 500 W), along with a high school just south of the intersection, making school traffic add to the danger.

The official detour calls for traffic to use Indiana 49 and Indiana 8 to go from Valparaiso to Hebron (and vice versa).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: pianocello on February 08, 2020, 02:14:08 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 07, 2020, 12:03:01 AM
The first major road closure has been announced for Northwest Indiana, and it will affect those who travel between Valparaiso and Hebron regularly (will likely affect Winfield residents too).

Next week, Indiana 2 will be closed at the intersection with County Road 100 South (which is 109th Avenue when entering Lake County) for utility pole relocation. This will be in preparation for the longer closure set for this intersection from May to late October. When finished, the angled intersection will be replaced with a much safer roundabout.

Just further southwest, the intersection of Indiana 2 and County Road 500 West will be realigned for safety improvements and better sight lines. Currently, the roads meet at a sharp angle and is only marked by flashing lights (yellow for Indiana 2, red for 500 W), along with a high school just south of the intersection, making school traffic add to the danger.

The official detour calls for traffic to use Indiana 49 and Indiana 8 to go from Valparaiso to Hebron (and vice versa).

Whoa, I'm surprised they were able to secure right of way at the 100S intersection, I remember there being houses pretty close to the road there. Locals aren't going to be happy about the closure, but the intersections are going to be a hell of a lot safer and easier for side street traffic to use once they're complete.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 10, 2020, 12:40:01 PM
Looks like the 469/US 24 interchange will likely become a cloverleaf, just drove the new ramp and it's very nice!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ibthebigd on February 13, 2020, 07:07:45 PM
Lilly Endowment to fund study of reconstruction options for inner loop https://www.ibj.com/articles/lilly-endowment-to-fund-study-of-reconstruction-options-for-inner-loop

Thoughts on what INDOT should do with the 65/70 Inner Loop

SM-G950U

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on February 13, 2020, 07:15:57 PM
Quote from: ibthebigd on February 13, 2020, 07:07:45 PM
Lilly Endowment to fund study of reconstruction options for inner loop https://www.ibj.com/articles/lilly-endowment-to-fund-study-of-reconstruction-options-for-inner-loop

Thoughts on what INDOT should do with the 65/70 Inner Loop

SM-G950U

This study will not involve the reconstruction of the north split that is scheduled to happen this fall.  I would rethink how 70 comes in from the south and the south split.  Fix some of the roadway connections there.  Also do something about the Virginia Ave. ramp, it enters from the left with 0 merge area!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 17, 2020, 11:19:20 PM
Quote from: pianocello on February 08, 2020, 02:14:08 PMWhoa, I'm surprised they were able to secure right of way at the 100S intersection, I remember there being houses pretty close to the road there. Locals aren't going to be happy about the closure, but the intersections are going to be a hell of a lot safer and easier for side street traffic to use once they're complete.

Due to the rough weather that transpired last week, the closure has been pushed to this Friday and will last for two weeks. I like to see a map of the roundabout, because the angle is so tight that one (if not both) of the roads have to be re-angled to make it work.

I also wouldn't be surprised if INODT decided to lengthen the 45 mph zone to just west of this future roundabout.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on February 20, 2020, 04:00:15 PM
A tanker truck carrying jet fuel overturned on the ramp from 465 south to 70 east on the east side of Indy this afternoon.  Driver was pulled from the wreckage and is reported to be in critical condition.  The ramp is closed and eastbound 70 is closed under the bridge at this time.

This tweet has pictures of the wreckage and road damage

https://twitter.com/INDOTEast/status/1230595696866320389
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on February 20, 2020, 04:16:48 PM
Story with video and more pictures

https://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/indianapolis/2020/02/20/indianapolis-traffic-tanker-fire-i-465-i-70/4821431002/

And a video from INDOT with specifics about the damage

https://twitter.com/INDOTEast/status/1230594145397493762
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ysuindy on February 22, 2020, 10:25:38 AM
https://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/transportation/2020/02/21/indianapolis-tanker-crash-how-interstate-ramp-escaped-major-damage/4830073002/

Update on jet fuel fire



Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on February 22, 2020, 06:21:35 PM
Paywall'd :(
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on February 28, 2020, 02:36:00 AM
Get ready for a LOT of construction of I-70 between the western suburbs of Indianapolis to the Ohio stateline throughout the 2020 season with crossovers and freeway mainline and ramp closures!

Also, as part of this project, two bridges along I-65 in the Indianapolis south side metro area (Keystone at MM107 and Little Buck Creek at MM 103) will be replaced.

https://fox59.com/news/heres-a-look-at-indots-interstate-construction-plans-for-2020/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Crash_It on March 04, 2020, 08:35:58 AM
Noticed some premature deterioration along SB I65 from about Crown Point to shortly past the IN2 exit. Numerous potholes forming in the right and middle lanes. This section was recently widened just last year. Is it typical of INDOT to construct roads that deteriorate so fast?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: edwaleni on March 04, 2020, 04:37:53 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on March 04, 2020, 08:35:58 AM
Is it typical of INDOT to construct roads that deteriorate so fast?

No. But it is typical for contractors to take shortcuts on their source of aggregates.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Crash_It on March 04, 2020, 08:36:09 PM
Quote from: edwaleni on March 04, 2020, 04:37:53 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on March 04, 2020, 08:35:58 AM
Is it typical of INDOT to construct roads that deteriorate so fast?

No. But it is typical for contractors to take shortcuts on their source of aggregates.


But the DOT still has to inspect the materials to ensure they're of respectable quality as well as of the project itself.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 05, 2020, 10:35:00 PM
I'm sure it's still under warranty and they will have the contractor come back and fix it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on March 09, 2020, 01:42:11 PM
Quote from: edwaleni on March 04, 2020, 04:37:53 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on March 04, 2020, 08:35:58 AM
Is it typical of INDOT to construct roads that deteriorate so fast?

No. But it is typical for contractors to take shortcuts on their source of aggregates.

Sounds like some of the "new" SR 25 around Clymers, which had to be resurfaced only a couple years after it opened because it was not done right. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JREwing78 on March 10, 2020, 11:27:40 PM
Sad news: Driver burned in jet fuel tanker crash dies
https://www.truckersnews.com/driver-burned-in-jet-fuel-tanker-crash-dies/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on March 14, 2020, 02:53:00 PM
Lots of progress has been made this winter in moving electric lines along IN 26 to accommodate the wider ROW for the upcoming highway rebuilding east of Rossville.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 14, 2020, 10:11:05 PM
Quote from: monty on March 14, 2020, 02:53:00 PM
Lots of progress has been made this winter in moving electric lines along IN 26 to accommodate the wider ROW for the upcoming highway rebuilding east of Rossville.

what project are you talking about?  haven't heard of this one.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on March 15, 2020, 07:57:37 PM
If you’ve ever driven this IN 26 corridor, you’ll find a narrow road in a narrow ROW in awful condition with terrible drainage. https://www.in.gov/indot/3948.htm
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 16, 2020, 02:33:12 PM
65 will be widened to 6 lanes from SR 32 to SR 47.  the public hearing has been cancelled due to the virus.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on March 16, 2020, 02:43:00 PM
Excellent. 6-lane all the way to Lafayette would be a very good thing.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 16, 2020, 02:44:07 PM
Quote from: jhuntin1 on March 16, 2020, 02:43:00 PM
Excellent. 6-lane all the way to Lafayette would be a very good thing.

the gap between 47 and 38 may be the shortest one left if you dont count 465 to 865
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ozarkman417 on April 08, 2020, 12:18:03 PM
Indiana highways get food trucks (https://content.govdelivery.com/bulletins/gd/INDOT-28583e8) and $126 million (http://content.govdelivery.com/bulletins/gd/INDOT-2854f3d).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 08, 2020, 12:22:21 PM
70 will be closed this month from the north split to 465 on the east side.  they pushed this up due to the traffic drop from the virus. expect it to be done by late may.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 30, 2020, 09:01:13 PM
Lots of work along I-65, I-80/94, and the Toll Road this summer, and it will really ramp up next week.

Between Broadway and Ripley, I-80/94 is currently undergoing bridge deck overlay work. All lanes will continue to stay open, but lane shifts and lowered speed limits will be in effect. East of Lake Station, I-94 will see lane closures between there and Michigan for terminal joint repair along the bridges and overpasses.

The same scope of work will be underway on I-65 between Ridge Road and US 30. To maintain three lanes of traffic in each direction, crossovers have been put into place. The innermost northbound lane will cross over into the southbound lanes, with the inversion taking place later in the project. South of 30, work to patch the concrete (which I thought they already did last year) is wrapping up in both directions.

More terminal joint and bridge overlay projects will take place along the Toll Road. The Lake Station interchange was just recently completed. Next week, the entire interchange with I-65 and US 12/20 will be closed for at least a week. Eastbound drivers looking to access these roads will be routed onto Broadway, while westbound drivers will be routed to the Lake Station interchange (though it might be slightly easier to go to Broadway instead). Drivers looking for entry to the Toll Road will be routed to the aforementioned interchanges.

Indiana 2 is still closed between Hebron and Valparaiso (roundabout work at County Road 100 S, with coinciding intersection improvement work at County Road 500 W), but the detour route is also under construction. Along with the concrete work I mentioned on I-65, US 30 is down to one lane in each direction for deep resurfacing, between Porter County Road 250 W (just west of Valparaiso) and Indiana 49. Be ready for delays as traffic slowly picks back up.

All work above is scheduled to wrap up by fall.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 18, 2020, 01:42:59 PM
As promised, photos of i-165 the highway that never was: (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200618/5e89bb1dbc96d54304a276fb1507430b.jpg)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 18, 2020, 01:43:50 PM
The southern end from the north split going north. (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200618/aabc523f728cb0fb003e406f81010f85.jpg)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 18, 2020, 01:44:39 PM
Next piece showing the area around 38th St.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200618/edef4f1c9446481501dce29ae10cc1bc.jpg)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 18, 2020, 01:45:15 PM
Kessler and 56th area.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200618/8cf8d8aed4bdcecb832ab377ed659a99.jpg)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 18, 2020, 01:45:41 PM
The 465/69/165 interchange(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200618/33c69b8e095b7ec4f562907ced7d9e00.jpg)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 18, 2020, 01:46:53 PM
This was alternative 1 from the EIS. So the document is old af, from the 70s. They even investigated turning keystone into an interstate but that died quick due to how much commercial development is along that road
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 18, 2020, 04:27:39 PM
unrelated SR 931's days are numbered in northern indiana. the random piece in st. joe county will be handed over next fall.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on June 25, 2020, 01:41:16 PM
Any idea what the work on I-70 on the west side is? They've had EB closed for a few weeks and it looks like WB will be closed in a few days. There are a few very old button copy overheads on Sam Jones Expwy for the I-70 ramp that now have CLOSED banners plastered on them, so I'm wondering if they've reached the end of their life.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 25, 2020, 01:42:38 PM
They're doing a lot of patching, deck repair and overlay, sign replacement, and drain cleaning.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: MrManlet on June 25, 2020, 01:45:48 PM
Yep I think we can kiss those button copy signs goodbye.  :-(
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on June 25, 2020, 02:50:47 PM
Good thing I got some photos of them then (albeit in very poor lighting)!

At least most of the stuff along I-65 still lives.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Rushmeister on June 26, 2020, 01:02:33 PM
Quote from: csw on June 25, 2020, 01:41:16 PM
Any idea what the work on I-70 on the west side is? They've had EB closed for a few weeks and it looks like WB will be closed in a few days. There are a few very old button copy overheads on Sam Jones Expwy for the I-70 ramp that now have CLOSED banners plastered on them, so I'm wondering if they've reached the end of their life.

Sam Jones Expressway is on my daily commute and I've often wondered the same thing about those button-copies, "How much time do they have left?"  But I also wonder who maintains them?  INDOT or the City of Indianapolis?  The answer to that question may play a large role in when the signs are retired.

PS: For some reason I still refer to the Sam Jones as "Airport Expressway".  Occasionally, I'll get an odd look for that, but that's one way you can tell who's new in town.  Other good test references are "465 Dog Leg" and "Old 100". 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 27, 2020, 10:39:56 AM
Quote from: Rushmeister on June 26, 2020, 01:02:33 PM
Quote from: csw on June 25, 2020, 01:41:16 PM
Any idea what the work on I-70 on the west side is? They've had EB closed for a few weeks and it looks like WB will be closed in a few days. There are a few very old button copy overheads on Sam Jones Expwy for the I-70 ramp that now have CLOSED banners plastered on them, so I'm wondering if they've reached the end of their life.

Sam Jones Expressway is on my daily commute and I've often wondered the same thing about those button-copies, "How much time do they have left?"  But I also wonder who maintains them?  INDOT or the City of Indianapolis?  The answer to that question may play a large role in when the signs are retired.

PS: For some reason I still refer to the Sam Jones as "Airport Expressway".  Occasionally, I'll get an odd look for that, but that's one way you can tell who's new in town.  Other good test references are "465 Dog Leg" and "Old 100".

sam jones expressway is owned by indy dpw
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on June 27, 2020, 04:15:23 PM
Weirdly it seems that the westbound signs have been replaced with non button-copy and I thought at one point they were replaced with signs using a different looking font that was installed by the city before being replaced by a more normal looking font based on a typical INDOT sign. I believe both fonts are still a variation of FHWA fonts. The Shadeland Avenue expressway uses the same kind of "different" font.

I drove eastbound 70 this morning from I-465 to the South Split and was kind of impressed with how different the road felt. I don't normally drive that way so I can't say much on a comparison with the old roadway but it actually did feel pretty smooth. It felt a lot different than what was done to I-465 on the southwest and southeast corners in their closures over the last two years.

Speaking of button copy, it seems that most of it on I-65 has gone away. There used to be plenty from County Line Road north to Downtown but the widening projects on I-65 have largely gotten rid of them. There remains a couple of them off Southport Road that are just in that perfect zone where INDOT didn't have to remove them or bother to change them. Unless the bridge over the interstate gets replaced they will likely remain. There was some button copy around Keystone and I-65 but with that bridge project underway that looks to be gone. I would have thought that the remaining button copy from I-465 north to the South Split would have been replaced when the road was repaved last year but some still remains, I suppose it's still a matter of time.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: MrManlet on June 27, 2020, 04:37:20 PM
Speaking of button copy: Spied these (https://www.google.com/maps/@41.7008937,-87.5222093,3a,52.4y,302.71h,100.39t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sVDdfxU1-2U6UCaJct1I3zg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) near the ITR on GSV.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: csw on June 27, 2020, 05:12:30 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on June 27, 2020, 04:15:23 PM
Speaking of button copy, it seems that most of it on I-65 has gone away. There used to be plenty from County Line Road north to Downtown but the widening projects on I-65 have largely gotten rid of them. There remains a couple of them off Southport Road that are just in that perfect zone where INDOT didn't have to remove them or bother to change them. Unless the bridge over the interstate gets replaced they will likely remain. There was some button copy around Keystone and I-65 but with that bridge project underway that looks to be gone. I would have thought that the remaining button copy from I-465 north to the South Split would have been replaced when the road was repaved last year but some still remains, I suppose it's still a matter of time.
Pretty much every sign between the south split and I-465 on the south side is still button copy - I just drove it a few days ago.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on June 27, 2020, 11:48:20 PM
Apologies, what I meant to say in regards to the Keystone Avenue bridge project is that the button copy will likely be gone in the future, not yet. The sign bridges at that exit are already gone with new ones probably going up when they get the bridge rebuilt.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefro on July 01, 2020, 03:46:13 PM
http://www.therepublic.com/2020/06/25/its_opening_railroad_overpass_eastbound_lanes_ready_for_traffic_friday/

The new SR46/SR11 railroad overpass in Columbus opened for Eastbound traffic about a week ago.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ibthebigd on July 01, 2020, 04:53:42 PM
Quote from: thefro on July 01, 2020, 03:46:13 PM
http://www.therepublic.com/2020/06/25/its_opening_railroad_overpass_eastbound_lanes_ready_for_traffic_friday/

The new SR46/SR11 railroad overpass in Columbus opened for Eastbound traffic about a week ago.


Now if they just build another exit on the north side of Columbus

SM-G950U

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 26, 2020, 02:25:55 PM
I was looking around at new projects being planned around Indiana and came across this interesting one. While I do not see a date mentioned as to when this may be built, INDOT is planning on building it's first continuous-flow intersection at the intersection of U.S. 31 and SR 135/Thompson Road on the south side of Indianapolis. The project would also rebuilt the off-ramp from I-465 east onto U.S. 31 south. Where it is currently a free-flowing ramp the ramp would come to a signal first before traffic can turn south onto 31, this is to help with the new traffic movements immediately to the south. Here below is a look at the new intersection. SR 135 to on the left side of the intersection with Thompson Road to the right. Just above this image is the I-465 interchange.

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50155477603_483a6d54b8_c.jpg)

And the website detailing the proposed project: https://www.in.gov/indot/4073.htm
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on July 26, 2020, 04:31:03 PM
I was excited about this until I looked at the plan. I don't see how this is going to help traffic at that intersection other than by slowing everything down.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 26, 2020, 06:12:32 PM
I don't think it will help much. I don't really think that intersection is much of a problem anyway. Maybe add another left turn lane from southbound US 31 onto Thompson Road and a second right turn lane from westbound Thompson onto US 31 and repave and touch up on the curbs and you're probably good there.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on July 26, 2020, 09:01:12 PM
I have noticed that INDOT has added two "add travel lanes" projects for I-65...

1. From Memphis, IN (Blue Lick Road) exit to SR 56 (Scottsburg) exit- estimated start in Q3 of 2023
2. From north of SR 25 exit to north of SR 43 exit in the Lafayette area- estimated start in Q2 of 2022
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 26, 2020, 09:10:20 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 26, 2020, 09:01:12 PM
I have noticed that INDOT has added two "add travel lanes" projects for I-65...

1. From Memphis, IN (Blue Lick Road) exit to SR 56 (Scottsburg) exit- estimated start in Q3 of 2023
2. From north of SR 25 exit to north of SR 43 exit in the Lafayette area- estimated start in Q2 of 2022

Slowly creeping towards getting it all done.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 26, 2020, 11:22:05 PM
I know they are doing some work at the Wabash River around Lafayette on I-65, I figured that was being done to accommodate an expansion to six lanes down the road.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on July 26, 2020, 11:31:52 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 26, 2020, 09:01:12 PM
I have noticed that INDOT has added two "add travel lanes" projects for I-65...

1. From Memphis, IN (Blue Lick Road) exit to SR 56 (Scottsburg) exit- estimated start in Q3 of 2023
2. From north of SR 25 exit to north of SR 43 exit in the Lafayette area- estimated start in Q2 of 2022

Also, INDOT will be adding lanes on I-70 between Mount Comfort Road exit to east of SR 9 (Greenfield) exit- estimated start in Q3 of 2021
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 27, 2020, 10:54:04 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 26, 2020, 02:25:55 PM
I was looking around at new projects being planned around Indiana and came across this interesting one. While I do not see a date mentioned as to when this may be built, INDOT is planning on building it's first continuous-flow intersection at the intersection of U.S. 31 and SR 135/Thompson Road on the south side of Indianapolis. The project would also rebuilt the off-ramp from I-465 east onto U.S. 31 south. Where it is currently a free-flowing ramp the ramp would come to a signal first before traffic can turn south onto 31, this is to help with the new traffic movements immediately to the south. Here below is a look at the new intersection. SR 135 to on the left side of the intersection with Thompson Road to the right. Just above this image is the I-465 interchange.

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50155477603_483a6d54b8_c.jpg)

And the website detailing the proposed project: https://www.in.gov/indot/4073.htm

Don't be so down on it without driving it first. It may work well. These things are modeled using software to vet their usefulness, so it will probably work well. I personally dont completely understand how it will work but we will see when it opens.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 3467 on July 27, 2020, 11:06:47 AM
Any other major arterial projects?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ibthebigd on July 27, 2020, 11:07:44 AM
The North Split in Indianapolis

SM-G950U

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on July 27, 2020, 10:46:13 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 26, 2020, 09:10:20 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 26, 2020, 09:01:12 PM
I have noticed that INDOT has added two "add travel lanes" projects for I-65...

1. From Memphis, IN (Blue Lick Road) exit to SR 56 (Scottsburg) exit- estimated start in Q3 of 2023
2. From north of SR 25 exit to north of SR 43 exit in the Lafayette area- estimated start in Q2 of 2022

Slowly creeping towards getting it all done.

The Indy-Louisville stretch has needed extra travel lanes. I can't recall a time I've ever set cruise on the route because of the speed-up/slow-down nature of traffic. There are two scenarios I've come across:

The first scenario comes from the split truck speed limit (70/65) coupled with trucks who want to pass each other at the least opportune of times. What you get is a situation where the trucks form a rolling roadblock at 65 mph or less, and taking up to five minutes to pass, then when the left lane clears there's a long convoy of vehicles behind them that takes awhile to come back up to speed, if they can get to speed before the next rolling roadblock.

I usually encounter this second situation on busier travel weekends when most traffic is tourist vehicles (this does NOT include spring break weekend, which is its own animal on I-65 and I-75). Here, the combination of on-ramp/off-ramp merges, roadwork, long distance travelers, and less frequent truck situations leads to dense traffic, albeit moving traffic. Traffic speed will fluctuate anywhere from 55-85 mph, neither lane is truly the fast lane, you just pick a lane and ignore the speedometer, just go as fast as the guy in front of you. Occasionally speed up and slow down or make a rare lane change (I find myself in the left lane most of the time only because the trucks are in the right lane and it's easier to see, they will typically flow with traffic but are slow to accelerate).

Adding lanes will allow the first scenario to be eased for sure, the second would stay close to the same, just with more breathing room and "Three Wide."
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on July 28, 2020, 01:59:06 AM
Get ready for a lot of construction happening on I-65 within the Boone County area for the next couple of years...

1. The interchange at Exit 133 (SR 267) will be modified (more like reconstructed) into a DDI as well as a new interchange ~a mile north of the Whitestown Parkway interchange (Exit 130) at CR 550 South, which also will be a DDI. As part of this project, minor ramp improvements will be happening at the NB Whitestown exit ramp as well as extending the third lane SB on I-65 for about three quarters of a mile at the I-865 interchange. https://www.in.gov/indot/3729.htm

This project will start this week, and the completion date is August of 2022.

2. Reconstruct and widen I-65 from north of SR 32 exit (Exit 140) to north of SR 47 exit (Exit 141). This project includes removing the NB bridge over the current left-hand exit to Lafayette Avenue (Exit 141) as well as shifting the NB lanes to run alongside the SB lanes (Phase I). The bridges over Spring Creek will be replaced in this project. The replaced SB exit to the right will NOT be part of this phase, but will be built as a separate phase (Phase II), which could happen in 2024. 
https://www.in.gov/indot/4031.htm

That should start in 2021, and that will get done by late 2022.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on August 02, 2020, 11:46:51 PM
I was driving home from Richmond to Indy along I-70 and was reminded of how nice the rest areas along that part of I-70, around Centerville and Greenfield and it got me thinking that the state needs to update their other rest areas and maybe move some around strategically. Some of this strays into fictional territory but this would be my way of making the rest of Indiana's rest areas more updated, with more parking for cars and trucks (since we advertise the number of spaces now) while still serving the public. For this exercise I am proposing primarily the construction of rest areas similar to those I mentioned earlier along I-70 east as well as I-69 north (the Pipe Creek rest areas in Delaware County,) which I will refer to as the modern style. My plan adds three more rest areas (physically) but fills in service gaps along Indiana's interstates. Of my plan I would prioritize the upgrades to I-65's rest areas as first before moving onto the others.

I-64:
-Keep the welcome center at MM 7 and the Nancy Hanks rest areas at MM 59 in their current style
-Build a new welcome center in the modern design at Lanesville for westbound I-64 at MM 115

I-65:
-Retain the rest area/welcome center near Henryville in its current design.
-Build new rest areas in the modern design near Columbus at MM 71 or 72, there looks to be open land and room for much larger rest areas in the  modern design, demolish the current ones just north of there.
-Build new rest areas a mile or two north of the current ones in Boone County, about MM 150 or 151, build in the modern design
-Demolish the rest areas at Wolcott, MM 195 and convert to truck parking lot with maybe a small parking lot for cars
-Build new rest areas around MM 215 roughly 10 miles south of the current ones at the Kankakee River. The two new pairs of rest areas at MM 150 and 215 would include more parking to compensate for the lost of the rest area at Wolcott.

I-69:
-Build a new welcome center/rest area at Exit 10 (Lynch Road,) preferably in the southeast corner of the interchange where traffic can just go straight through the intersection to access. It can be there for southbound traffic as well to serve as an Evansville welcome center. Still it would be built in a modern design but perhaps take some design cues from the Padoga Visitors Center on the Ohio Riverfront in Evansville
-Build a new rest area at Exit 72, possibly in the northwest corner of the interchange with SR 58. Build in the modern design but with fewer parking spaces to accommodate the lower traffic. Include a small slip ramp off of the I-69 southbound off-ramp to access the rest area directly. Traffic can use nearby County Road 500 East and SR 58 to get back to I-69
-Build a new rest area at Exit 134 just northwest of where Liberty Church Road meets Turkey Track Road. Liberty Church Road currently ends at that road but you could continue across to access the rest area, available for both sides of the interstate. This one I admit would be a "nice-to-have."  Like the Exit 76 rest area it could be a smaller version of the modern design.

I-70:
-Retain the welcome center just west of the Illinois line, for now, but down the road maybe build a new one a mile or east or maybe even a few miles down the road past Exit 11
-Build new rest areas around MM 61 or 62 between SR 59 and SR 267. Build in the modern design; demolish the current rest areas nearer to Plainfield

I-74:
-Build new rest areas less than a mile west of the current rest areas in Lizton, built in the modern design.


Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on August 03, 2020, 01:01:12 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on August 02, 2020, 11:46:51 PM
I was driving home from Richmond to Indy along I-70 and was reminded of how nice the rest areas along that part of I-70, around Centerville and Greenfield and it got me thinking that the state needs to update their other rest areas and maybe move some around strategically. Some of this strays into fictional territory but this would be my way of making the rest of Indiana's rest areas more updated, with more parking for cars and trucks (since we advertise the number of spaces now) while still serving the public. For this exercise I am proposing primarily the construction of rest areas similar to those I mentioned earlier along I-70 east as well as I-69 north (the Pipe Creek rest areas in Delaware County,) which I will refer to as the modern style. My plan adds three more rest areas (physically) but fills in service gaps along Indiana's interstates. Of my plan I would prioritize the upgrades to I-65's rest areas as first before moving onto the others.

I-64:
-Keep the welcome center at MM 7 and the Nancy Hanks rest areas at MM 59 in their current style
-Build a new welcome center in the modern design at Lanesville for westbound I-64 at MM 115

I-65:
-Retain the rest area/welcome center near Henryville in its current design.
-Build new rest areas in the modern design near Columbus at MM 71 or 72, there looks to be open land and room for much larger rest areas in the  modern design, demolish the current ones just north of there.
-Build new rest areas a mile or two north of the current ones in Boone County, about MM 150 or 151, build in the modern design
-Demolish the rest areas at Wolcott, MM 195 and convert to truck parking lot with maybe a small parking lot for cars
-Build new rest areas around MM 215 roughly 10 miles south of the current ones at the Kankakee River. The two new pairs of rest areas at MM 150 and 215 would include more parking to compensate for the lost of the rest area at Wolcott.

I-69:
-Build a new welcome center/rest area at Exit 10 (Lynch Road,) preferably in the southeast corner of the interchange where traffic can just go straight through the intersection to access. It can be there for southbound traffic as well to serve as an Evansville welcome center. Still it would be built in a modern design but perhaps take some design cues from the Padoga Visitors Center on the Ohio Riverfront in Evansville
-Build a new rest area at Exit 72, possibly in the northwest corner of the interchange with SR 58. Build in the modern design but with fewer parking spaces to accommodate the lower traffic. Include a small slip ramp off of the I-69 southbound off-ramp to access the rest area directly. Traffic can use nearby County Road 500 East and SR 58 to get back to I-69
-Build a new rest area at Exit 134 just northwest of where Liberty Church Road meets Turkey Track Road. Liberty Church Road currently ends at that road but you could continue across to access the rest area, available for both sides of the interstate. This one I admit would be a "nice-to-have."  Like the Exit 76 rest area it could be a smaller version of the modern design.

I-70:
-Retain the welcome center just west of the Illinois line, for now, but down the road maybe build a new one a mile or east or maybe even a few miles down the road past Exit 11
-Build new rest areas around MM 61 or 62 between SR 59 and SR 267. Build in the modern design; demolish the current rest areas nearer to Plainfield

I-74:
-Build new rest areas less than a mile west of the current rest areas in Lizton, built in the modern design.
Unfortunately Indiana wants to close up some rest areas, which I disagree big time.  For I-69, there was a rest stop that was designed somewhere near Exit 58, but was on one side and there was some sort of an overpass/underpass for the other traffic to access.  That was dropped due for cost savings.  I do like your plan for a welcome center in Evansville, but I had theorized placing it at Exit 5 on the SE corner of the interchange.  There are a couple of properties (one of which is for sale right now) that would be large enough to place a rest area/welcome center/parking lot, with enough room for semis.  There is also an access road right next to it with a traffic light for IN-662, which would make it easier for traffic to get back on the interstate.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: 2trailertrucker on August 03, 2020, 03:53:33 PM
INDOT needs to make the exits from the rest areas more safe. For example, the rest areas at West Terre Haute and Plainfield have a winding entrance to where the driver takes longer to merge at a safe speed. It takes even longer for a semi, especially when dodging the trucks parked on the ramp.

What were they thinking?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: captkirk_4 on August 04, 2020, 08:48:56 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on August 02, 2020, 11:46:51 PM
I was driving home from Richmond to Indy along I-70 and was reminded of how nice the rest areas along that part of I-70, around Centerville and Greenfield and it got me thinking that the state needs to update their other rest areas and maybe move some around strategically. Some of this strays into fictional territory but this would be my way of making the rest of Indiana's rest areas more updated, with more parking for cars and trucks (since we advertise the number of spaces now) while still serving the public. For this exercise I am proposing primarily the construction of rest areas similar to those I mentioned earlier along I-70 east as well as I-69 north (the Pipe Creek rest areas in Delaware County,) which I will refer to as the modern style. My plan adds three more rest areas (physically) but fills in service gaps along Indiana's interstates. Of my plan I would prioritize the upgrades to I-65's rest areas as first before moving onto the others.

I-64:
-Keep the welcome center at MM 7 and the Nancy Hanks rest areas at MM 59 in their current style
-Build a new welcome center in the modern design at Lanesville for westbound I-64 at MM 115

I-65:
-Retain the rest area/welcome center near Henryville in its current design.
-Build new rest areas in the modern design near Columbus at MM 71 or 72, there looks to be open land and room for much larger rest areas in the  modern design, demolish the current ones just north of there.
-Build new rest areas a mile or two north of the current ones in Boone County, about MM 150 or 151, build in the modern design
-Demolish the rest areas at Wolcott, MM 195 and convert to truck parking lot with maybe a small parking lot for cars
-Build new rest areas around MM 215 roughly 10 miles south of the current ones at the Kankakee River. The two new pairs of rest areas at MM 150 and 215 would include more parking to compensate for the lost of the rest area at Wolcott.

I-69:
-Build a new welcome center/rest area at Exit 10 (Lynch Road,) preferably in the southeast corner of the interchange where traffic can just go straight through the intersection to access. It can be there for southbound traffic as well to serve as an Evansville welcome center. Still it would be built in a modern design but perhaps take some design cues from the Padoga Visitors Center on the Ohio Riverfront in Evansville
-Build a new rest area at Exit 72, possibly in the northwest corner of the interchange with SR 58. Build in the modern design but with fewer parking spaces to accommodate the lower traffic. Include a small slip ramp off of the I-69 southbound off-ramp to access the rest area directly. Traffic can use nearby County Road 500 East and SR 58 to get back to I-69
-Build a new rest area at Exit 134 just northwest of where Liberty Church Road meets Turkey Track Road. Liberty Church Road currently ends at that road but you could continue across to access the rest area, available for both sides of the interstate. This one I admit would be a "nice-to-have."  Like the Exit 76 rest area it could be a smaller version of the modern design.

I-70:
-Retain the welcome center just west of the Illinois line, for now, but down the road maybe build a new one a mile or east or maybe even a few miles down the road past Exit 11
-Build new rest areas around MM 61 or 62 between SR 59 and SR 267. Build in the modern design; demolish the current rest areas nearer to Plainfield

I-74:
-Build new rest areas less than a mile west of the current rest areas in Lizton, built in the modern design.

Well if they could do something about the smell in those rest areas. They really stink bad, the ones in Illinois and Kentucky don't have this stench. The one in Illinois on I 74 by Farmer City should be the gold standard of what they should be, huge clean restrooms and they even have a TV running weather radar 24/7 right above the vending machines which is nice to see if you are heading into a storm.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on August 04, 2020, 10:21:08 PM
Quote from: captkirk_4 on August 04, 2020, 08:48:56 AM
Well if they could do something about the smell in those rest areas. They really stink bad, the ones in Illinois and Kentucky don't have this stench. The one in Illinois on I 74 by Farmer City should be the gold standard of what they should be, huge clean restrooms and they even have a TV running weather radar 24/7 right above the vending machines which is nice to see if you are heading into a storm.

Some of the Iowa rest areas used to be better, with a computer kiosk to get weather and other information, plus free wifi.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 16, 2020, 12:46:15 PM
Good news in Northwest Indiana.

Work on Indiana 2 between Hebron and Valparaiso has completed more than six weeks ahead of schedule. A new roundabout is now in place at County Road 100 South (109th Avenue in Crown Point), and modifications to the intersection with County Road 500 West have been made.

On 109th Avenue itself in Crown Point, a new roundabout has been constructed on Mississippi Street, just east of the I-65 interchange. This is one of multiple improvements set to be completed between Iowa Street (where a second roundabout is set to be constructed) and Broadway (widening planned between there and I-65*).

Final preparations for the major US 12/20 realignment in Gary are nearing completion. Power line reinstallation has been completed, and side project work along Lake Street north of the corridor has been progressing nicely. The plan is to start work in 2021. To refresh: when completed, the current split of US 12 and 20 will be shifted further east (the split will still be there, but the physical road currently occupied by US 12 will end at Clay Street). The new split will be east of Lake Street, with US 12 breaking away from US 20 and rejoining its original path just west of the CSX and Old Hobart Road overpasses. All of this is in preparation for the double tracking of the entire South Shore Line from Chicago to South Bend.

Bridge refurbishments are still in progress along I-65 and I-80/94. Between US 30 and Ridge Road, southbound traffic is utilizing a counter flow lane (leftmost lane in the northbound side of the highway) while crews work on the southbound bridges. Currently, all southbound entrances from US 30 are closed, with Broadway (Indiana 53) and US 231 as detour routes. On I-80/94, all lanes are open but split and merge at various points near work zones. On top of this, the Broadway and Grant Street bridges are also being repaired. All work is set to conclude in November, but is likely to be completed sooner due to the head start earlier this year.

*EDIT: By "planned,"  I guess I mean "completed."  Work to widen 109th Avenue from west of Broadway to I-65 was announced as completed ahead of schedule by the city's mayor today (8-17-20). Two lanes in each direction with left turn lanes at major conflict points.)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 16, 2020, 01:01:51 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 16, 2020, 12:46:15 PM
On 109th Avenue itself in Crown Point, a new roundabout has been constructed on Mississippi Street, just east of the I-65 interchange. This is one of multiple improvements set to be completed between Iowa Street (where a second roundabout is set to be constructed) and Broadway (widening planned between there and I-65).

109th between Boadway and Randolph would be a good candidate for promotion to state highway, along with CR 17 between the Toll Road and IN 119 in Elkhart County.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: dvferyance on August 16, 2020, 07:46:37 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 16, 2020, 01:01:51 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 16, 2020, 12:46:15 PM
On 109th Avenue itself in Crown Point, a new roundabout has been constructed on Mississippi Street, just east of the I-65 interchange. This is one of multiple improvements set to be completed between Iowa Street (where a second roundabout is set to be constructed) and Broadway (widening planned between there and I-65).

109th between Boadway and Randolph would be a good candidate for promotion to state highway, along with CR 17 between the Toll Road and IN 119 in Elkhart County.
CR 17 would make perfect sense but why stop at the toll road? It should go up to the state line so that M-217 has an Indiana counterpart. Same on the Michigan side they should bring back M-205 so IIn-19 isn't orphaned either. What was the big deal M-205 was like what a mile long? An extra mile of maintenance is not going to hurt a transportation budget on little bit.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: dvferyance on August 16, 2020, 07:48:16 PM
Quote from: Life in Paradise on August 03, 2020, 01:01:12 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on August 02, 2020, 11:46:51 PM
I was driving home from Richmond to Indy along I-70 and was reminded of how nice the rest areas along that part of I-70, around Centerville and Greenfield and it got me thinking that the state needs to update their other rest areas and maybe move some around strategically. Some of this strays into fictional territory but this would be my way of making the rest of Indiana's rest areas more updated, with more parking for cars and trucks (since we advertise the number of spaces now) while still serving the public. For this exercise I am proposing primarily the construction of rest areas similar to those I mentioned earlier along I-70 east as well as I-69 north (the Pipe Creek rest areas in Delaware County,) which I will refer to as the modern style. My plan adds three more rest areas (physically) but fills in service gaps along Indiana's interstates. Of my plan I would prioritize the upgrades to I-65's rest areas as first before moving onto the others.

I-64:
-Keep the welcome center at MM 7 and the Nancy Hanks rest areas at MM 59 in their current style
-Build a new welcome center in the modern design at Lanesville for westbound I-64 at MM 115

I-65:
-Retain the rest area/welcome center near Henryville in its current design.
-Build new rest areas in the modern design near Columbus at MM 71 or 72, there looks to be open land and room for much larger rest areas in the  modern design, demolish the current ones just north of there.
-Build new rest areas a mile or two north of the current ones in Boone County, about MM 150 or 151, build in the modern design
-Demolish the rest areas at Wolcott, MM 195 and convert to truck parking lot with maybe a small parking lot for cars
-Build new rest areas around MM 215 roughly 10 miles south of the current ones at the Kankakee River. The two new pairs of rest areas at MM 150 and 215 would include more parking to compensate for the lost of the rest area at Wolcott.

I-69:
-Build a new welcome center/rest area at Exit 10 (Lynch Road,) preferably in the southeast corner of the interchange where traffic can just go straight through the intersection to access. It can be there for southbound traffic as well to serve as an Evansville welcome center. Still it would be built in a modern design but perhaps take some design cues from the Padoga Visitors Center on the Ohio Riverfront in Evansville
-Build a new rest area at Exit 72, possibly in the northwest corner of the interchange with SR 58. Build in the modern design but with fewer parking spaces to accommodate the lower traffic. Include a small slip ramp off of the I-69 southbound off-ramp to access the rest area directly. Traffic can use nearby County Road 500 East and SR 58 to get back to I-69
-Build a new rest area at Exit 134 just northwest of where Liberty Church Road meets Turkey Track Road. Liberty Church Road currently ends at that road but you could continue across to access the rest area, available for both sides of the interstate. This one I admit would be a "nice-to-have."  Like the Exit 76 rest area it could be a smaller version of the modern design.

I-70:
-Retain the welcome center just west of the Illinois line, for now, but down the road maybe build a new one a mile or east or maybe even a few miles down the road past Exit 11
-Build new rest areas around MM 61 or 62 between SR 59 and SR 267. Build in the modern design; demolish the current rest areas nearer to Plainfield

I-74:
-Build new rest areas less than a mile west of the current rest areas in Lizton, built in the modern design.
Unfortunately Indiana wants to close up some rest areas, which I disagree big time.  For I-69, there was a rest stop that was designed somewhere near Exit 58, but was on one side and there was some sort of an overpass/underpass for the other traffic to access.  That was dropped due for cost savings.  I do like your plan for a welcome center in Evansville, but I had theorized placing it at Exit 5 on the SE corner of the interchange.  There are a couple of properties (one of which is for sale right now) that would be large enough to place a rest area/welcome center/parking lot, with enough room for semis.  There is also an access road right next to it with a traffic light for IN-662, which would make it easier for traffic to get back on the interstate.
I wish they hadn't closed the WB one on I-74 at MM23 years ago. The EB I get it not far from the welcome center about 20 miles away. The WB one should have stayed open.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefro on September 09, 2020, 01:05:28 PM
I-65 is now six lanes from Seymour to Walesboro, project to expand Walesboro to Columbus to 6 lanes should start construction in the spring.

http://www.tribtown.com/2020/09/09/indot_wraps_up_2_years_of_construction_on_interstate_65/

QuoteInterstate 65 between U.S. 50 in Seymour and State Road 58 in Walesboro has expanded to three lanes of travel in each direction.

After two and a half years of construction, the $143 million I-65 Southeast Indiana Project is mostly complete with some work continuing at the State Road 11 interchange through the end of November. That exit, Exit 55, just north of Seymour, remains closed to traffic.

A reduced speed limit of 65 mph is in place from the 54-mile-marker to the 56.5-mile-marker during that construction.

State and local government officials gathered Tuesday morning for a ribbon-cutting ceremony at the northbound weigh station near Seymour to signify the official opening of the new travel lanes, which span 14.25 miles.

QuoteThe contract for the next section of added travel lanes on I-65 from State Road 58 in Walesboro to State Road 46 in Columbus is expected to go to bid later this fall with construction beginning in the spring.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 09, 2020, 01:10:50 PM
looks like indy to louisville will be the first piece to be 6 lanes from state line to indy.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 09, 2020, 02:53:29 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 09, 2020, 01:10:50 PM
looks like indy to louisville will be the first piece to be 6 lanes from state line to indy.

Still need to do:
MM 16 (Memphis) to MM 50 (Seymour)
MM 68 (Columbus) to MM 90 (Franklin)

I do expect this to be finished before the northern half, but I also expect we're at least 10 years away from it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 09, 2020, 02:54:51 PM
That 46 bridge will likely be the last one it's going to cost a lot to widen
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 09, 2020, 03:38:24 PM
Yeah about that 46 bridge, how do you widen a literal work of art? I sure hope the bridge can keep it's architectural style.

If I recall, Memphis Road to Scottsburg (MM 16-29) is next up after the Walesboro to Columbus part gets finished. Judging by some of the bridge work along I-65 around the Wabash River in Lafayette and south toward SR 28 I would guess that widening I-65 from SR 47 north through the rest of the Lafayette area (SR 43) may not be too far down the road either.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on September 09, 2020, 07:32:30 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 09, 2020, 02:54:51 PM
That 46 bridge will likely be the last one it's going to cost a lot to widen

Along with the Flatrock River Bridge.

Quote from: tdindy88 on September 09, 2020, 03:38:24 PM
Yeah about that 46 bridge, how do you widen a literal work of art? I sure hope the bridge can keep it's architectural style.

It may not be a part of the load bearing structure but I agree that the arch should at least be there. They should build the bridge similar to US-31 at IN-32 (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.042725,-86.1350261,3a,18.7y,256.25h,91.8t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sOYDgexTvJ9aZ32eN8NUcPg!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo3.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3DOYDgexTvJ9aZ32eN8NUcPg%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D94.617744%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192) in Westfield, but with 3 lanes each way on 46 and a larger median on 65 to let the arch sit as a landmark.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on September 14, 2020, 02:23:03 PM
https://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/transportation/2020/09/10/i-70-rockville-road-changes-planned-federal-highway-funds/3460891001/

USDOT gives INDOT $27.5 million for two projects:

1. I-70 widening in Hancock County (from Mount Comfort Road to Greenfield)- construction to start in late 2021 or early 2022 at a cost of $22.5 million, and it will include:

2. US 36 widening in Avon- construction to start in mid-2021 at a cost of $5 million, and it will include:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on September 20, 2020, 04:21:07 PM
Interesting that US 36 won a grant. That section desperately needs expansion, but I'm surprised a municipal section won out over interstate sections.

Also, INDOT has updated the signs on I-465 on the southeast side to add US 421 to the I-74 exit. It must have happened in the last week or so, because I didn't notice it until Wednesday.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 20, 2020, 04:24:11 PM
Quote from: jhuntin1 on September 20, 2020, 04:21:07 PM
Interesting that US 36 won a grant. That section desperately needs expansion, but I'm surprised a municipal section won out over interstate sections.

Also, INDOT has updated the signs on I-465 on the southeast side to add US 421 to the I-74 exit. It must have happened in the last week or so, because I didn't notice it until Wednesday.
Finally!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 20, 2020, 09:37:55 PM
I was just looking up about US 421 this evening when I noticed this "interesting" thing on its Wikipedia page.

Future
US 421 will be also a freeway in Indiana from Greensburg to Versailles. US 421 freeway will go near, or pass through Napoleon, and Osgood.

Um....right.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 20, 2020, 09:40:08 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 20, 2020, 09:37:55 PM
I was just looking up about US 421 this evening when I noticed this "interesting" thing on its Wikipedia page.

Future
US 421 will be also a freeway in Indiana from Greensburg to Versailles. US 421 freeway will go near, or pass through Napoleon, and Osgood.

Um....right.
no way that's true
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Flint1979 on September 20, 2020, 09:42:08 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 20, 2020, 09:37:55 PM
I was just looking up about US 421 this evening when I noticed this "interesting" thing on its Wikipedia page.

Future
US 421 will be also a freeway in Indiana from Greensburg to Versailles. US 421 freeway will go near, or pass through Napoleon, and Osgood.

Um....right.
That one makes very little sense.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: KeithE4Phx on September 20, 2020, 11:27:04 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 20, 2020, 09:37:55 PM
I was just looking up about US 421 this evening when I noticed this "interesting" thing on its Wikipedia page.

Future
US 421 will be also a freeway in Indiana from Greensburg to Versailles. US 421 freeway will go near, or pass through Napoleon, and Osgood.

Um....right.

Freeway on 421?  Why?  It's a rural road that goes through a bunch of small towns.  Is there enough traffic to justify a freeway?

It doesn't even need to exist north of Greensburg.  It's either co-signed with other highways (notably I-74 between Greensburg and Indy), or could be replaced by the state highway numbers, such as IN 29 and 43 that it replaced in the 1950s.

Back when I was a kid in the 1960s, it was a fairly heavily traveled highway.  We drove it as part of the trip between Bloomington and the Indiana Dunes, near where my grandparents lived, because it was faster than using the out-of-the-way US 52 to 41.  But once I-65 was completed, there was no real need to take 421.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 21, 2020, 12:07:33 AM
Someone was being stupid when they wrote that, there's not even a source cited. There's not even enough traffic to justify passing lanes (and there's a few Indiana two-lane highways that could use some of those.)

I was thinking something similar about US 421 not being needed north of Greensburg too. I suppose it's kept there because a large part of it is the Michigan Road or perhaps there's a real desire to have a U.S. highway that connects Lake Michigan with the Atlantic Ocean.

As for US 421, I'd reroute it onto I-65 from Indianapolis up to West Lafayette and then have it follow SR 43 north to Reynolds and then along its normal routing from there. Eliminate SR 43 (leaving just the Southern Indiana part) and restore SR 29 along Michigan Road from Indy to Logansport, as well as allowing SR 28 and 39 to follow their own route without a U.S. highway chaperone.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 21, 2020, 07:24:32 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 21, 2020, 12:07:33 AM
Someone was being stupid when they wrote that, there's not even a source cited. There's not even enough traffic to justify passing lanes (and there's a few Indiana two-lane highways that could use some of those.)

I was thinking something similar about US 421 not being needed north of Greensburg too. I suppose it's kept there because a large part of it is the Michigan Road or perhaps there's a real desire to have a U.S. highway that connects Lake Michigan with the Atlantic Ocean.

As for US 421, I'd reroute it onto I-65 from Indianapolis up to West Lafayette and then have it follow SR 43 north to Reynolds and then along its normal routing from there. Eliminate SR 43 (leaving just the Southern Indiana part) and restore SR 29 along Michigan Road from Indy to Logansport, as well as allowing SR 28 and 39 to follow their own route without a U.S. highway chaperone.

Since so much of 421 is the old Michigan Road, I always thought that it should have continued north on 29 instead of turning west, and following 29 to Logansport and then 25 to Rochester, and end at 31.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Flint1979 on September 21, 2020, 07:51:07 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 21, 2020, 07:24:32 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 21, 2020, 12:07:33 AM
Someone was being stupid when they wrote that, there's not even a source cited. There's not even enough traffic to justify passing lanes (and there's a few Indiana two-lane highways that could use some of those.)

I was thinking something similar about US 421 not being needed north of Greensburg too. I suppose it's kept there because a large part of it is the Michigan Road or perhaps there's a real desire to have a U.S. highway that connects Lake Michigan with the Atlantic Ocean.

As for US 421, I'd reroute it onto I-65 from Indianapolis up to West Lafayette and then have it follow SR 43 north to Reynolds and then along its normal routing from there. Eliminate SR 43 (leaving just the Southern Indiana part) and restore SR 29 along Michigan Road from Indy to Logansport, as well as allowing SR 28 and 39 to follow their own route without a U.S. highway chaperone.

Since so much of 421 is the old Michigan Road, I always thought that it should have continued north on 29 instead of turning west, and following 29 to Logansport and then 25 to Rochester, and end at 31.
What would current US-421 between Frankfort and Michigan City become? That route following 29 to 25 and ending at 31 does make some sense. I don't see the need for 421 to go all the way to Michigan City.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 21, 2020, 08:08:45 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on September 21, 2020, 07:51:07 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 21, 2020, 07:24:32 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 21, 2020, 12:07:33 AM
Someone was being stupid when they wrote that, there's not even a source cited. There's not even enough traffic to justify passing lanes (and there's a few Indiana two-lane highways that could use some of those.)

I was thinking something similar about US 421 not being needed north of Greensburg too. I suppose it's kept there because a large part of it is the Michigan Road or perhaps there's a real desire to have a U.S. highway that connects Lake Michigan with the Atlantic Ocean.

As for US 421, I'd reroute it onto I-65 from Indianapolis up to West Lafayette and then have it follow SR 43 north to Reynolds and then along its normal routing from there. Eliminate SR 43 (leaving just the Southern Indiana part) and restore SR 29 along Michigan Road from Indy to Logansport, as well as allowing SR 28 and 39 to follow their own route without a U.S. highway chaperone.

Since so much of 421 is the old Michigan Road, I always thought that it should have continued north on 29 instead of turning west, and following 29 to Logansport and then 25 to Rochester, and end at 31.
What would current US-421 between Frankfort and Michigan City become? That route following 29 to 25 and ending at 31 does make some sense. I don't see the need for 421 to go all the way to Michigan City.

Boyleston-Frankfort is already IN 28, Frankfort-Monticello is already IN 39, Monticello-Reynolds is already US 24, so all you need a number for Reynolds-Michigan City and that could just be an extension of IN 43.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Flint1979 on September 21, 2020, 08:58:35 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 21, 2020, 08:08:45 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on September 21, 2020, 07:51:07 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 21, 2020, 07:24:32 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 21, 2020, 12:07:33 AM
Someone was being stupid when they wrote that, there's not even a source cited. There's not even enough traffic to justify passing lanes (and there's a few Indiana two-lane highways that could use some of those.)

I was thinking something similar about US 421 not being needed north of Greensburg too. I suppose it's kept there because a large part of it is the Michigan Road or perhaps there's a real desire to have a U.S. highway that connects Lake Michigan with the Atlantic Ocean.

As for US 421, I'd reroute it onto I-65 from Indianapolis up to West Lafayette and then have it follow SR 43 north to Reynolds and then along its normal routing from there. Eliminate SR 43 (leaving just the Southern Indiana part) and restore SR 29 along Michigan Road from Indy to Logansport, as well as allowing SR 28 and 39 to follow their own route without a U.S. highway chaperone.

Since so much of 421 is the old Michigan Road, I always thought that it should have continued north on 29 instead of turning west, and following 29 to Logansport and then 25 to Rochester, and end at 31.
What would current US-421 between Frankfort and Michigan City become? That route following 29 to 25 and ending at 31 does make some sense. I don't see the need for 421 to go all the way to Michigan City.

Boyleston-Frankfort is already IN 28, Frankfort-Monticello is already IN 39, Monticello-Reynolds is already US 24, so all you need a number for Reynolds-Michigan City and that could just be an extension of IN 43.
I think the reason that it ends in Michigan City is so that there can be a direct route between Indy and Michigan City. But an extension of IN-43 up to Michigan City and eliminating all the concurrencies makes sense. It kind of reminds me of US-412 with all the concurrencies that route has.

Regarding US-421, I was traveling in North Carolina about 8 years ago and rode on it in North Carolina which made me look up exactly where the route goes since I'm thinking this route ends in Indiana and is a spur of US-21 and only meeting that route near Winston-Salem, NC why in the heck does it go to Indiana? I wonder if there was a desire to link Lake Michigan to the Atlantic Ocean I see someone else mentioned that too.

I don't think I'd use it for a through route though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 21, 2020, 09:23:22 AM
Even disregarding the interstates, 421-29-35 is a faster route to MC compared to staying on 421. It seems that 421 is routed to give Frankfort and Delphi a US highway. There's no other apparent reason for 421 turning west at 28.

I also think 231 is routed the way it is to give Renssaelaer a US highway, as 52-41 is a faster route from Lafayette to Crown Point.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Flint1979 on September 21, 2020, 09:33:48 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 21, 2020, 09:23:22 AM
Even disregarding the interstates, 421-29-35 is a faster route to MC compared to staying on 421. It seems that 421 is routed to give Frankfort and Delphi a US highway. There's no other apparent reason for 421 turning west at 28.

I also think 231 is routed the way it is to give Renssaelaer a US highway, as 52-41 is a faster route from Lafayette to Crown Point.

Yeah if I was going Indy to MC, I think I'd take I-65 up to IN-43 then follow IN-43 into US-421. It's about 25 miles shorter than staying on I-65 and only about 5 minutes longer.

I guess it does give you the most direct route between MC and Indy for some of the route but not all of it. But to ditch I-65 all together then yeah 421-29-35 but it would take about 45 minutes longer for the same distance as taking 65-43-421.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Finrod on September 21, 2020, 06:18:14 PM
That section of US 421 from Reynolds to Michigan City?  Sure it's a shortcut if you're going up I-65 to Michigan, but you also get railroad crossings over every railroad that goes from the east coast to Chicago, and some of them (last time I went that way) are a bit rough.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on September 21, 2020, 07:09:57 PM
Been reading the previous points about US421, and yeah, I could get on board with a plan to restore US421 north of Indy to state routes (29, 39, 43).  The route designations would be more straightforward for users imo.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on September 22, 2020, 11:05:45 AM
I thought 65 was already widened up to SR 43? I haven't been up that way in awhile but I thought I heard that they had done that.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 22, 2020, 11:12:47 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on September 22, 2020, 11:05:45 AM
I thought 65 was already widened up to SR 43? I haven't been up that way in awhile but I thought I heard that they had done that.

It's done up to IN 25, and the Wabash River bridge has been under construction for a while, but there has not been any work yet north of the bridge.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on September 22, 2020, 11:23:49 AM
Ah, I must have been thinking of 25. Glad to see it creeping further north!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on September 22, 2020, 12:47:47 PM
The Wabash River bridge might just be the southern limit of the new project.  The new widening project should overlap with the current northern extent of the 6-laned section so they can take care of lane shifting changes and other construction along the periphery of the new widening.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 22, 2020, 02:46:51 PM
I wonder if the piece from 465 to 865 will be widened? i feel like that gap will go last.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Flint1979 on September 22, 2020, 08:44:04 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on September 22, 2020, 11:23:49 AM
Ah, I must have been thinking of 25. Glad to see it creeping further north!
Well it's only 3 miles between IN-25 and IN-43 considering IN-43 goes north and south and IN-25 goes on more of a diagonal.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 22, 2020, 09:05:37 PM
Speaking of I-65 widening plans I was just looking at what INDOT was planning between SR 58 and SR 46. It's obvious they are kicking the can down the road on any bridge plans with SR 46 and the Driftwood River. Northbound I-65 has the left lane end before the off-ramp from 65 to 46. They could at the very least have the far right lane just exit off onto 46. Southbound I-65 appears to pick up its third lane from the on-ramp from 46 onto 65.

As for the Lafayette area, I would imagine that SR 43 to SR 2 will be the absolute last stretch to be widened to six lanes. Everything south of Indy needs it bad and finishing up from Lebanon to Lafayette probably makes good sense, plus the stretch in Indianapolis that is still four lanes. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on September 23, 2020, 12:10:17 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 22, 2020, 02:46:51 PM
I wonder if the piece from 465 to 865 will be widened? i feel like that gap will go last.

Knowing INDOT that stretch will be four lanes for the foreseeable future. Similar to I-75 in Macon, its 6+ everywhere else in the state except between I-16 and I-475 (N).

leaning toward fictional but...

Traffic count would suggest I-865 ought to be widened with I-65 if that stretch goes to 6 lanes. Looking at AADT on the INDOT traffic counts, I-865 (30k AADT) handles more traffic than I-65 on that stretch (26k SB/22k NB). It would be far easier to widen I-865 (fewer bridges and ramps to deal with) and would allow I-865 to serve as a better relief route to 65 during bridge work. The interchange between 465 and 865 should have been modernized a long time ago (and I thought there were plans at one point).

I don't want to get too fictional so I'll end it there.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Flint1979 on September 23, 2020, 07:54:46 AM
Quote from: I-55 on September 23, 2020, 12:10:17 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 22, 2020, 02:46:51 PM
I wonder if the piece from 465 to 865 will be widened? i feel like that gap will go last.

Knowing INDOT that stretch will be four lanes for the foreseeable future. Similar to I-75 in Macon, its 6+ everywhere else in the state except between I-16 and I-475 (N).

leaning toward fictional but...

Traffic count would suggest I-865 ought to be widened with I-65 if that stretch goes to 6 lanes. Looking at AADT on the INDOT traffic counts, I-865 (30k AADT) handles more traffic than I-65 on that stretch (26k SB/22k NB). It would be far easier to widen I-865 (fewer bridges and ramps to deal with) and would allow I-865 to serve as a better relief route to 65 during bridge work. The interchange between 465 and 865 should have been modernized a long time ago (and I thought there were plans at one point).

I don't want to get too fictional so I'll end it there.
Thank God for I-475 being the through route in Macon instead of I-75.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Crash_It on September 24, 2020, 02:40:42 PM
Quote from: I-55 on July 27, 2020, 10:46:13 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 26, 2020, 09:10:20 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 26, 2020, 09:01:12 PM
I have noticed that INDOT has added two "add travel lanes" projects for I-65...

1. From Memphis, IN (Blue Lick Road) exit to SR 56 (Scottsburg) exit- estimated start in Q3 of 2023
2. From north of SR 25 exit to north of SR 43 exit in the Lafayette area- estimated start in Q2 of 2022

Slowly creeping towards getting it all done.

The Indy-Louisville stretch has needed extra travel lanes. I can't recall a time I've ever set cruise on the route because of the speed-up/slow-down nature of traffic. There are two scenarios I've come across:

The first scenario comes from the split truck speed limit (70/65) coupled with trucks who want to pass each other at the least opportune of times. What you get is a situation where the trucks form a rolling roadblock at 65 mph or less, and taking up to five minutes to pass, then when the left lane clears there's a long convoy of vehicles behind them that takes awhile to come back up to speed, if they can get to speed before the next rolling roadblock.




This happens in IL too and it's so annoying. Why in the hell do they feel the need to do this? If I were a state trooper, I would pull over and ticket every trucker that does this for impeding the normal and reasonable flow of traffic.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SEWIGuy on September 24, 2020, 02:47:01 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on September 24, 2020, 02:40:42 PM
Quote from: I-55 on July 27, 2020, 10:46:13 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 26, 2020, 09:10:20 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 26, 2020, 09:01:12 PM
I have noticed that INDOT has added two "add travel lanes" projects for I-65...

1. From Memphis, IN (Blue Lick Road) exit to SR 56 (Scottsburg) exit- estimated start in Q3 of 2023
2. From north of SR 25 exit to north of SR 43 exit in the Lafayette area- estimated start in Q2 of 2022

Slowly creeping towards getting it all done.

The Indy-Louisville stretch has needed extra travel lanes. I can't recall a time I've ever set cruise on the route because of the speed-up/slow-down nature of traffic. There are two scenarios I've come across:

The first scenario comes from the split truck speed limit (70/65) coupled with trucks who want to pass each other at the least opportune of times. What you get is a situation where the trucks form a rolling roadblock at 65 mph or less, and taking up to five minutes to pass, then when the left lane clears there's a long convoy of vehicles behind them that takes awhile to come back up to speed, if they can get to speed before the next rolling roadblock.




This happens in IL too and it's so annoying. Why in the hell do they feel the need to do this? If I were a state trooper, I would pull over and ticket every trucker that does this for impeding the normal and reasonable flow of traffic.


What they are doing is not illegal if they are passing a truck (or anything else) that is going slower in the right hand lane.

What I have been told is that trucks in those situations are not wanting to speed up to pass due to the trucking company monitoring their driving.  So they keep their cruise on and inch past.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Crash_It on September 24, 2020, 02:54:07 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on September 24, 2020, 02:47:01 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on September 24, 2020, 02:40:42 PM
Quote from: I-55 on July 27, 2020, 10:46:13 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 26, 2020, 09:10:20 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 26, 2020, 09:01:12 PM
I have noticed that INDOT has added two "add travel lanes" projects for I-65...

1. From Memphis, IN (Blue Lick Road) exit to SR 56 (Scottsburg) exit- estimated start in Q3 of 2023
2. From north of SR 25 exit to north of SR 43 exit in the Lafayette area- estimated start in Q2 of 2022

Slowly creeping towards getting it all done.

The Indy-Louisville stretch has needed extra travel lanes. I can't recall a time I've ever set cruise on the route because of the speed-up/slow-down nature of traffic. There are two scenarios I've come across:

The first scenario comes from the split truck speed limit (70/65) coupled with trucks who want to pass each other at the least opportune of times. What you get is a situation where the trucks form a rolling roadblock at 65 mph or less, and taking up to five minutes to pass, then when the left lane clears there's a long convoy of vehicles behind them that takes awhile to come back up to speed, if they can get to speed before the next rolling roadblock.




This happens in IL too and it's so annoying. Why in the hell do they feel the need to do this? If I were a state trooper, I would pull over and ticket every trucker that does this for impeding the normal and reasonable flow of traffic.


What they are doing is not illegal if they are passing a truck (or anything else) that is going slower in the right hand lane.

What I have been told is that trucks in those situations are not wanting to speed up to pass due to the trucking company monitoring their driving.  So they keep their cruise on and inch past.

But if the truck speed limit is 65 and a truck going 66 wants to pass the truck going 65..he should not have to since the limit is 65 and especially not when cars going 70 or more are specifically in that lane to pass them all.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Flint1979 on September 24, 2020, 08:08:27 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on September 24, 2020, 02:40:42 PM
Quote from: I-55 on July 27, 2020, 10:46:13 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 26, 2020, 09:10:20 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 26, 2020, 09:01:12 PM
I have noticed that INDOT has added two "add travel lanes" projects for I-65...

1. From Memphis, IN (Blue Lick Road) exit to SR 56 (Scottsburg) exit- estimated start in Q3 of 2023
2. From north of SR 25 exit to north of SR 43 exit in the Lafayette area- estimated start in Q2 of 2022

Slowly creeping towards getting it all done.

The Indy-Louisville stretch has needed extra travel lanes. I can't recall a time I've ever set cruise on the route because of the speed-up/slow-down nature of traffic. There are two scenarios I've come across:

The first scenario comes from the split truck speed limit (70/65) coupled with trucks who want to pass each other at the least opportune of times. What you get is a situation where the trucks form a rolling roadblock at 65 mph or less, and taking up to five minutes to pass, then when the left lane clears there's a long convoy of vehicles behind them that takes awhile to come back up to speed, if they can get to speed before the next rolling roadblock.




This happens in IL too and it's so annoying. Why in the hell do they feel the need to do this? If I were a state trooper, I would pull over and ticket every trucker that does this for impeding the normal and reasonable flow of traffic.
It's like that in Michigan too especially bad on the four lane stretches of I-69 and I-94. It really annoys me when they do it too. IMO they don't belong in the left lane and really don't have too much of a reason to pass someone going 2 mph slower than them.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 24, 2020, 08:09:30 PM
Why do they make the truck speed limit 5 miles lower?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: KeithE4Phx on September 24, 2020, 09:32:44 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 24, 2020, 08:09:30 PM
Why do they make the truck speed limit 5 miles lower?

To annoy both truck drivers and those of us in cars that have to pass them.  :)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 25, 2020, 07:16:10 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 24, 2020, 08:09:30 PM
Why do they make the truck speed limit 5 miles lower?

When it got introduced, I thought there was some sort of study showing that 65 mph for trucks reduced tire blowouts significantly compared to 70 mph, but I can't find anything about it now.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on September 25, 2020, 05:49:33 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 25, 2020, 07:16:10 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 24, 2020, 08:09:30 PM
Why do they make the truck speed limit 5 miles lower?

When it got introduced, I thought there was some sort of study showing that 65 mph for trucks reduced tire blowouts significantly compared to 70 mph, but I can't find anything about it now.

It's another consequence of having lawmakers determine speed limits. Set broad guidelines and let the DOT figure it out, if going to 70 is too much the DOT won't post 70, etc. There are plenty of roads in this state that could/would/should be higher if they were allowed to. I think we've mentioned them enough on this forum to know which ones they are.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 25, 2020, 08:33:47 PM
i wish legislatures and town counsels had no authority to do this. let the engineers do it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Crash_It on September 26, 2020, 05:29:10 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 24, 2020, 08:09:30 PM
Why do they make the truck speed limit 5 miles lower?


This happens where there is no rural truck speed limit... So that has nothing to do with it
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Rothman on September 26, 2020, 09:36:14 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 25, 2020, 08:33:47 PM
i wish legislatures and town counsels had no authority to do this. let the engineers do it.
Heh.  Engineers aren't as unified on what speed limits should be as you think.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 06, 2020, 11:22:01 AM
access control continues on us 31 in hamilton county. they just turned 216th st into a riro
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JREwing78 on October 06, 2020, 09:03:53 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on September 26, 2020, 05:29:10 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 24, 2020, 08:09:30 PM
Why do they make the truck speed limit 5 miles lower?

This happens where there is no rural truck speed limit... So that has nothing to do with it

To less of a degree, yes. But you clearly haven't experienced the hell that was I-94 in southern Michigan when trucks were capped at 55 mph (but cars were posted for 70). With 10,000 heavy trucks driving it every day (and 40,000 other vehicles), it was utter misery. Bumping the truck limit up to 60, then eventually 65, has improved the situation considerably.

In the 40 mile stretch of I-94 between US-131 and I-69, there were times I was able to travel the (car) speed limit for maybe 5 miles of that 40, despite perfect weather. The rest of the time I was 10-20 cars back behind a semi doing 55 1/2 passing a semi doing 55. It's a road that needed 6-laning 20 years ago, and probably won't be completed for another 30-40 years.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on October 06, 2020, 09:12:37 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 06, 2020, 11:22:01 AM
access control continues on us 31 in hamilton county. they just turned 216th st into a riro

I thought this was supposed to be a cul-de-sac per the INDOT plans. Or is that coming later?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 06, 2020, 09:30:55 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on October 06, 2020, 09:12:37 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 06, 2020, 11:22:01 AM
access control continues on us 31 in hamilton county. they just turned 216th st into a riro

I thought this was supposed to be a cul-de-sac per the INDOT plans. Or is that coming later?

must be coming later, i drove by last weekend and the median is now blocked off. this must be a temporary measure before the RIRO is constructed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on October 06, 2020, 10:56:17 PM
Interesting. That intersection will be closed as per the current US 31 plan. I’m guessing that it was shut down due to safety concerns. I’m sure the McClure’s owner isn’t happy but that is such a dangerous intersection - made worse by crossing traffic, including large trucks.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Flint1979 on October 07, 2020, 07:06:31 AM
Quote from: JREwing78 on October 06, 2020, 09:03:53 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on September 26, 2020, 05:29:10 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 24, 2020, 08:09:30 PM
Why do they make the truck speed limit 5 miles lower?

This happens where there is no rural truck speed limit... So that has nothing to do with it

To less of a degree, yes. But you clearly haven't experienced the hell that was I-94 in southern Michigan when trucks were capped at 55 mph (but cars were posted for 70). With 10,000 heavy trucks driving it every day (and 40,000 other vehicles), it was utter misery. Bumping the truck limit up to 60, then eventually 65, has improved the situation considerably.

In the 40 mile stretch of I-94 between US-131 and I-69, there were times I was able to travel the (car) speed limit for maybe 5 miles of that 40, despite perfect weather. The rest of the time I was 10-20 cars back behind a semi doing 55 1/2 passing a semi doing 55. It's a road that needed 6-laning 20 years ago, and probably won't be completed for another 30-40 years.
With the way MDOT does things I don't expect them to do anything any time soon. This is Indiana's thread but US-23 is in the same shape between Ann Arbor and Flint. I-94 is still in dire need of widening and it still does get backed up with those semi trucks. Every time I ride on it I'm wanting to get off the highway right away.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 14, 2020, 02:28:52 PM
Unfortunately we have to wait until 2022 to see this sorely needed project to begin  :(

https://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/transportation/2020/10/14/indianapolis-traffic-interstate-465-69-undergo-widening/3640409001/

This will be so much better once it's done!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 27, 2020, 12:27:39 PM
The West st. interchange with 65 is done, new signs appear to be coming soon as new foundations have been set. The added capacity at this interchange is welcome for next year when the north split will close for 2 years or however long it's planned to be under construction.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on November 07, 2020, 12:08:49 PM
This "Interstate Plans in Indianapolis" blog post may be of interest, as there is mention of a past proposal for connecting I-74 to I-65 west of downtown:  https://intransporthistory.home.blog/2020/02/27/interstate-plans-in-indianapolis/ (https://intransporthistory.home.blog/2020/02/27/interstate-plans-in-indianapolis/).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 07, 2020, 10:48:26 PM
I-74 never needed to go inside 465, the only useful section of 74 is the piece on the south east side of town. i wish 65 had shot out of 465 at where 865 is and that whole piece of 465 was more circular. if it were built that way it would be a more useful route. currently 65 from west st to 465 isn't as useful as it could have been. i also would have placed the south split further south of where it is, 70 down there and the south split destroyed that area of the city, could have been placed better. not having 69 down to the north split isn't a big deal really. traffic on 70 and 465 is fine, the only annoying section is the fall creek valley and that will be fixed in 2023 when they build the new 69 interchange on the north east side.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on November 09, 2020, 11:09:02 AM
Virtual flyover views of the I69 / I465 Northside Clearpath 465 project new interchange:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on November 17, 2020, 01:29:11 PM
I got a notification on my phone from INDOT this morning that said "I-65/I-70 North Split to begin construction within the next 3-4 weeks"... So, that means we got an official starting date!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 17, 2020, 08:07:44 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on November 17, 2020, 01:29:11 PM
I got a notification on my phone from INDOT this morning that said "I-65/I-70 North Split to begin construction within the next 3-4 weeks"... So, that means we got an official starting date!

it starts 11/30/20

https://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/INDOT/bulletins/2ab40ee

65/70 will close for 2 yrs in may
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on November 20, 2020, 06:57:22 PM
https://www.facebook.com/INDOTEast/posts/3660282500689459

First of four new interchanges along SR 37 in Fishers completed - 126th Street now officially goes over SR 37 with a dogbone roundabout interchange, which is very similar to Keystone Parkway and US 31 in Carmel, and 131st and 141st Street interchanges will be very similar to this one.

The 146th Street interchange will be constructed as a SPUI instead of a dogbone roundabout interchange like originally proposed due to the high traffic counts along that corridor.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JREwing78 on November 23, 2020, 11:02:32 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on November 20, 2020, 06:57:22 PM
https://www.facebook.com/INDOTEast/posts/3660282500689459

First of four new interchanges along SR 37 in Fishers completed - 126th Street now officially goes over SR 37 with a dogbone roundabout interchange, which is very similar to Keystone Parkway and US 31 in Carmel, and 131st and 141st Street interchanges will be very similar to this one.

I find it interesting that they chose a ground-mounted BGS instead of affixing it to the overpass.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on November 24, 2020, 07:00:57 PM
Updates on I-65 from Indianapolis to Lafayette (November 2020)

1. New sign gantries went up upon the completion of the Keystone Avenue bridge replacement project.
https://flic.kr/p/2ka9Zas (https://flic.kr/p/2ka9Zas)

2. New arrows went up at the exit 114 off-ramp heading SB which is obviously a temporary place over as they have poured concrete for the new sign gantry to go behind the existing one...
https://flic.kr/p/2ka9ZaT (https://flic.kr/p/2ka9ZaT)

https://flic.kr/p/2ka9zHg (https://flic.kr/p/2ka9zHg)

3. New gantry for the exit 115 SB off-ramp is undergoing replacement and concrete is currently poured and is being cured...

4. New SB third-lane extension at the exit 129 interchange is done and some signs are already up (two left lane ends signs) & other sign gantries are waiting to be installed and/or replaced...

5. Exit 130 NB ramp has been reconstructed and improved... waiting for new signs to go up...

6. Traffic has been shifted to the right for the new DDI interchange at MM 131 (bridge pier work in the median?)... also some work going on at the west side of the interchange...

7. Exit 133 interchange at SR 267 looks like it's going well with the traffic now being shifted into the median for some ramp work as well as some bridgework for the eastbound traffic through the interchange... retaining wall is in a work of progress with the bridge pier in the median already done.

8. Bridge deck replacement and widening at the Sugar Creek looks like it's almost done... traffic is currently being shifted to the left side of the bridge...

9. Not 100% sure on what INDOT is doing with the bridges over Mason-Colfax Road because they have SB traffic shifted over to the median...

10. The bridges over the abandoned railroad track just north of the Exit 158 interchange is completed and removed...

11. The bridges over the Lauramine Creek (mile marker 164) has its deck overlayed with the approaches being replaced, and the temporary bridge removed and dismantled in the median.

12. The NB bridge over the Wabash River has all of the line markings ready to go for a major traffic shift, and it looks like the three-laned section will now extend up to about 1500 feet north of the widened bridges... the approaches has also been replaced with concrete.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: CtrlAltDel on November 29, 2020, 02:26:13 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on November 09, 2020, 11:09:02 AM
Virtual flyover views of the I69 / I465 Northside Clearpath 465 project new interchange:


Is there going to be a connection between West I-465 and South Binford? It doesn't look like it, I don't think.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 29, 2020, 06:13:54 PM
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on November 29, 2020, 02:26:13 PM
Quote from: cjw2001 on November 09, 2020, 11:09:02 AM
Virtual flyover views of the I69 / I465 Northside Clearpath 465 project new interchange:


Is there going to be a connection between West I-465 and South Binford? It doesn't look like it, I don't think.

no and there isn't one now.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: CtrlAltDel on November 29, 2020, 07:11:18 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 29, 2020, 06:13:54 PM
there isn't one now.

No, there isn't. That bothers me.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 04, 2020, 04:34:22 PM
https://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/transportation/2020/12/04/indianapolis-traffic-interstate-465-69-interchange-project-focuses-safety/6073604002/

another article on the interchange. so excited for this to happen!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 06, 2020, 09:04:48 PM
Along with the new Super 2 bridge on Cline Avenue now finally built and scheduled for a winter opening, some projects in Northwest Indiana are already set for next season.

INDOT recently held a virtual public hearing on a interchange modification project for I-65 at 109th Avenue in Crown Point. The plan is to convert the interchange into a dogbone (a roundabout on each side of the underpass, similar to the US 20/Indiana 2 interchange at Rolling Prairie), removing the traffic lights that currently control the flow of traffic. I-65 traffic would be unaffected, but closures are likely. This is all part of a local project to widen 109th Avenue from Iowa Street (east of I-65, where another roundabout is set to be built) to Broadway.

The big one that I mentioned a few months ago is also set to begin in spring. To recap, a stretch of US 12/20 in Miller (Gary) is undergoing a major realignment, making room for the complete double-tracking of the South Shore Line from the state line to South Bend. The current split of US 12/20 will be moved 1.5 miles further east, where US 12 will split from US 20 east of Lake Street and the Miller South Shore station, heading north and rejoining the current footprint by the CSX and Old Hobart Road bridges. As part of the upcoming project, work on Lake Street has been completed, and power lines have been repositioned to accommodate the new project limits.

The old split will still be present when completed, but the spoke will end at Clay Street. Through traffic will drive on New Dunes Highway, but local interests will have access to Lake Street and the beaches using this spoke (via Clay Street and 7th or Miller Avenue). The realigned stretch will have sidewalks, crosswalks, decorative lighting, and a center turn lane. All work is slated to be finished by Winter 2021.

I actually live by the area, so I'll keep you all posted, and will likely provide pictures when major progress is made.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 11, 2020, 09:11:29 AM
I've been told the NE wrap and SE quadrant ramp are open to traffic at US 24 and I-469 in Fort Wayne, can anyone confirm this?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: westerninterloper on December 11, 2020, 09:20:50 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 11, 2020, 09:11:29 AM
I've been told the NE wrap and SE quadrant ramp are open to traffic at US 24 and I-469 in Fort Wayne, can anyone confirm this?

Both correct - i was through there last week.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 11, 2020, 09:21:47 AM
wonderful! i bet traffic flows there nicely now
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on December 11, 2020, 10:41:59 PM
Got back from college a couple weeks ago, haven't been on that side of town recently. I'll try to get an update this month if I can. Hopefully the flyover is under way.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 12, 2020, 02:44:07 PM
Quote from: I-55 on December 11, 2020, 10:41:59 PM
Got back from college a couple weeks ago, haven't been on that side of town recently. I'll try to get an update this month if I can. Hopefully the flyover is under way.

Don't think the flyover is being done anymore, I think it's a full cloverleaf now.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefarmerchris on December 12, 2020, 04:11:20 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 12, 2020, 02:44:07 PM
Quote from: I-55 on December 11, 2020, 10:41:59 PM
Got back from college a couple weeks ago, haven't been on that side of town recently. I'll try to get an update this month if I can. Hopefully the flyover is under way.

Don't think the flyover is being done anymore, I think it's a full cloverleaf now.

It's no longer showing on the INDOT construction map. It's a shame too. A flyover would do so much for traffic going south at that interchange.....
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on December 13, 2020, 01:43:33 AM
Quote from: thefarmerchris on December 12, 2020, 04:11:20 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 12, 2020, 02:44:07 PM
Quote from: I-55 on December 11, 2020, 10:41:59 PM
Got back from college a couple weeks ago, haven't been on that side of town recently. I'll try to get an update this month if I can. Hopefully the flyover is under way.

Don't think the flyover is being done anymore, I think it's a full cloverleaf now.

It's no longer showing on the INDOT construction map. It's a shame too. A flyover would do so much for traffic going south at that interchange.....

If no flyover is constructed that would leave the west side in a folded diamond. The more I think of it, it's probably going to remain this way since when I visited in August there was a new traffic light at the ramp entrance.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 13, 2020, 09:30:35 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if this is indeed the final configuration of that exit. INDOT loves doing the bare minimum. The US 20 and 31 exit in South Bend and I-65 and SR 25 interchange in Lafayette are further proof of this. And since US 24 now heads north on I-469 from the US 24 interchange they only need it to be "free-flowing" from the north, not the south. I mentioned it in a previous post but I wish INDOT did some interstates like they did up in Wisconsin along I-41. All the flyovers I saw there in Appleton and Green Bay, both cities smaller than Fort Wayne could have been nice around the Fort. But alas, INDOT will almost always do the bare minimum if they can. In fairness, the upcoming exit with US 31 and I-94 in Benton Harbor shows we aren't the only ones.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: westerninterloper on December 13, 2020, 10:45:43 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 12, 2020, 02:44:07 PM
Quote from: I-55 on December 11, 2020, 10:41:59 PM
Got back from college a couple weeks ago, haven't been on that side of town recently. I'll try to get an update this month if I can. Hopefully the flyover is under way.

Don't think the flyover is being done anymore, I think it's a full cloverleaf now.


I saw no evidence of flyover construction there.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 14, 2020, 07:39:39 AM
https://www.facebook.com/rob.mangus1/posts/10160758475323228

Not a state highway and not a route many, if any, of you are likely to find yourself on, but if you're fascinated by underpass projects here are some really good photos of one that is finishing up in Munster. 45th Street, a road that connects as far as Gary to the east and Glenwood, IL, to the west, had a jog at Calumet Ave, utilizing Calumet's at-grade railroad crossing. The town undertook the construction of an underpass for 45th Street that allowed both legs of 45th to connect at the same point at Calumet.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefarmerchris on December 14, 2020, 08:27:01 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 13, 2020, 09:30:35 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if this is indeed the final configuration of that exit. INDOT loves doing the bare minimum. The US 20 and 31 exit in South Bend and I-65 and SR 25 interchange in Lafayette are further proof of this. And since US 24 now heads north on I-469 from the US 24 interchange they only need it to be "free-flowing" from the north, not the south. I mentioned it in a previous post but I wish INDOT did some interstates like they did up in Wisconsin along I-41. All the flyovers I saw there in Appleton and Green Bay, both cities smaller than Fort Wayne could have been nice around the Fort. But alas, INDOT will almost always do the bare minimum if they can. In fairness, the upcoming exit with US 31 and I-94 in Benton Harbor shows we aren't the only ones.

I would love to see INDOT do things more like WisDOT. Cloverleafs at major junctions just aren't safe IMO. (See I69/US30)
In order for a flyover ramp to be feasible, INDOT would have to route US24 along 900 East and then onto the south side of I469. Through traffic already uses that route already, but for some odd reason INDOT moved the routing along the north side of Fort Wayne. The "free-flowing" ramps from the north side of that interchange would impact some historical property on the NW side of the current US24/I469 interchange.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: pianocello on December 14, 2020, 04:59:17 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 14, 2020, 07:39:39 AM
https://www.facebook.com/rob.mangus1/posts/10160758475323228

Not a state highway and not a route many, if any, of you are likely to find yourself on, but if you're fascinated by underpass projects here are some really good photos of one that is finishing up in Munster. 45th Street, a road that connects as far as Gary to the east and Glenwood, IL, to the west, had a jog at Calumet Ave, utilizing Calumet's at-grade railroad crossing. The town undertook the construction of an underpass for 45th Street that allowed both legs of 45th to connect at the same point at Calumet.

Looks good! I've never been there, but one of the engineers spoke about this project with our ASCE student chapter when I was at Valpo. It was still in the design phase at the time, so it's cool to see the finished product.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 14, 2020, 07:28:00 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 14, 2020, 07:39:39 AM
https://www.facebook.com/rob.mangus1/posts/10160758475323228

Not a state highway and not a route many, if any, of you are likely to find yourself on, but if you're fascinated by underpass projects here are some really good photos of one that is finishing up in Munster. 45th Street, a road that connects as far as Gary to the east and Glenwood, IL, to the west, had a jog at Calumet Ave, utilizing Calumet's at-grade railroad crossing. The town undertook the construction of an underpass for 45th Street that allowed both legs of 45th to connect at the same point at Calumet.

I've been watching this particular project with great interest. Even though it's been a while since I've driven that way, I know how notoriously bad this jog was. It was crippling during a standard rush hour evening, but add a train to the mix, and it was a complete stranglehold on the area. The underpass and reroute looks amazing and will take a LOT of the sting out of that section.

Plans are in place to grade-separate the CN tracks from Calumet Avenue not too long from now, but what's there is nice and will suffice for the interim. Nice collab between Munster, Canadian National, and INDOT.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Finrod on December 14, 2020, 11:59:22 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 13, 2020, 09:30:35 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if this is indeed the final configuration of that exit. INDOT loves doing the bare minimum. The US 20 and 31 exit in South Bend and I-65 and SR 25 interchange in Lafayette are further proof of this.

Yeah, that I-65/SR 25 area is ugly and stupid.  Also, why didn't they extend SR 225 along SR 25's old alignment so that it still connects to 25?  As it is now, 225 just ends at old 25.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 15, 2020, 12:06:50 PM
Quote from: Finrod on December 14, 2020, 11:59:22 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 13, 2020, 09:30:35 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if this is indeed the final configuration of that exit. INDOT loves doing the bare minimum. The US 20 and 31 exit in South Bend and I-65 and SR 25 interchange in Lafayette are further proof of this.

Yeah, that I-65/SR 25 area is ugly and stupid.  Also, why didn't they extend SR 225 along SR 25's old alignment so that it still connects to 25?  As it is now, 225 just ends at old 25.

because indot doesn't like to do things that make sense for continuity's sake. Look at what they did to all the highways in the lafayette area. Surprised they still wanted 225 at all honestly, especially with that weird 1 lane bridge.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on December 15, 2020, 04:35:04 PM
INDOT will be putting ramp meters and digital speed limit signs on the I-465 SE leg. Construction will start in 2022.

(https://www.in.gov/indot/files/I-465%20TSMO_ProjectLocation.jpg)

The recommended alternative is on page 12 in the PowerPoint that was released today.
https://www.in.gov/indot/files/465%20SE%20TSMO%20PIM%2020201215%20presentation.pdf
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 15, 2020, 07:50:43 PM
In other words, we don't want to widen I-465 on the southeast side to eight lanes.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on December 15, 2020, 10:05:05 PM
Quote from: thefarmerchris on December 14, 2020, 08:27:01 AM
I would love to see INDOT do things more like WisDOT. Cloverleafs at major junctions just aren't safe IMO. (See I69/US30)

Fort Wayne has 4 cloverleaf interchanges and 1 parclo. The parclo at Exit 302 is perfectly fine as is, as is the cloverleaf at 305. I totally agree that 309 has plenty of problems, mostly the amount of trucks using the loop ramps on the NB side of I-69. I drive on 30 pretty regularly and merging at that interchange isn't easy. INDOT extended the auxiliary lanes beyond the loop ramps but I've yet to see anyone use them. Exit 311 is a bit tricky since there are intersections close to the interchange on both sides. I think a good SPUI might work there, there aren't as many problems there but traffic is thick nevertheless. 312 feels overbuilt but I've never been through it at rush hour, otherwise fine as is.

Quote
In order for a flyover ramp to be feasible, INDOT would have to route US24 along 900 East and then onto the south side of I469. Through traffic already uses that route already, but for some odd reason INDOT moved the routing along the north side of Fort Wayne.

I don't know why 24 isn't on 900 yet. 1) It's shorter to go around town that way. 2) It's shorter to take 900 to 69 to get from Roanoke to Exit 302 than it is just to take 24. 3) The current routing has significantly higher traffic counts than 900 -> 469.

Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 15, 2020, 04:35:04 PM
INDOT will be putting ramp meters and digital speed limit signs on the I-465 SE leg. Construction will start in 2022.

(https://www.in.gov/indot/files/I-465%20TSMO_ProjectLocation.jpg)

The recommended alternative is on page 12 in the PowerPoint that was released today.
https://www.in.gov/indot/files/465%20SE%20TSMO%20PIM%2020201215%20presentation.pdf

Quote from: tdindy88 on December 15, 2020, 07:50:43 PM
In other words, we don't want to widen I-465 on the southeast side to eight lanes.

Which with there about to be 3 interstates on some of that stretch you'd think we'd want capacity. At least it looks like the speed limit will be above 55 for some of the day now. Hopefully this goes in on other parts of the road, I usually find myself in the upper 60s-mid 70s even at peak hours.


Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefarmerchris on December 16, 2020, 09:45:34 AM
Quote from: I-55 on December 15, 2020, 10:05:05 PM
Quote from: thefarmerchris on December 14, 2020, 08:27:01 AM
I would love to see INDOT do things more like WisDOT. Cloverleafs at major junctions just aren't safe IMO. (See I69/US30)

Fort Wayne has 4 cloverleaf interchanges and 1 parclo. The parclo at Exit 302 is perfectly fine as is, as is the cloverleaf at 305. I totally agree that 309 has plenty of problems, mostly the amount of trucks using the loop ramps on the NB side of I-69. I drive on 30 pretty regularly and merging at that interchange isn't easy. INDOT extended the auxiliary lanes beyond the loop ramps but I've yet to see anyone use them. Exit 311 is a bit tricky since there are intersections close to the interchange on both sides. I think a good SPUI might work there, there aren't as many problems there but traffic is thick nevertheless. 312 feels overbuilt but I've never been through it at rush hour, otherwise fine as is.

I've used the aux lanes at the 309. They aren't bad, but it's still not safe especially during peak times. Flyovers for 30EB/I69N and I69N/30WB should be built. Get rid of the loop ramps on the east side of the interchange.
A SPUI style interchange may work at 311, however with those intersections on both sides of the interchange being extremely congested at most hours, I don't know if that will work or not. If they did a Keystone Parkway style setup for IN-3 north of SR930 to maybe Carroll road, that may help to alleviate.....maybe a good post for fictional....

Quote
In order for a flyover ramp to be feasible, INDOT would have to route US24 along 900 East and then onto the south side of I469. Through traffic already uses that route already, but for some odd reason INDOT moved the routing along the north side of Fort Wayne.

I don't know why 24 isn't on 900 yet. 1) It's shorter to go around town that way. 2) It's shorter to take 900 to 69 to get from Roanoke to Exit 302 than it is just to take 24. 3) The current routing has significantly higher traffic counts than 900 -> 469.

You are exactly correct. Unless you are going into town, nobody goes East on 24 past 900 East. All of the trucks turn right.......possible need for a widening of that intersection.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Finrod on December 16, 2020, 05:10:57 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 15, 2020, 12:06:50 PM
because indot doesn't like to do things that make sense for continuity's sake. Look at what they did to all the highways in the lafayette area. Surprised they still wanted 225 at all honestly, especially with that weird 1 lane bridge.

Agreed re Lafayette.  The whole getting rid of state highways in cities just seems dumb.  SR 26 is discontinuous now because of it.  Personally I wonder if there's any reason Lafayette and West Lafayette couldn't sign the route that INDOT abandoned as Lafayette/West Lafayette 26.  At least then the number would be continuous and many people wouldn't even notice the change.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 16, 2020, 06:49:19 PM
Quote from: Finrod on December 16, 2020, 05:10:57 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 15, 2020, 12:06:50 PM
because indot doesn't like to do things that make sense for continuity's sake. Look at what they did to all the highways in the lafayette area. Surprised they still wanted 225 at all honestly, especially with that weird 1 lane bridge.

Agreed re Lafayette.  The whole getting rid of state highways in cities just seems dumb.  SR 26 is discontinuous now because of it.  Personally I wonder if there's any reason Lafayette and West Lafayette couldn't sign the route that INDOT abandoned as Lafayette/West Lafayette 26.  At least then the number would be continuous and many people wouldn't even notice the change.


When INDOT decommissioned 311, 403, and part of 160, Clark County signed them as County highways with the same numbers. No reason other counties/cities couldn't do the same.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on December 16, 2020, 06:53:47 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 16, 2020, 06:49:19 PM
Quote from: Finrod on December 16, 2020, 05:10:57 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 15, 2020, 12:06:50 PM
because indot doesn't like to do things that make sense for continuity's sake. Look at what they did to all the highways in the lafayette area. Surprised they still wanted 225 at all honestly, especially with that weird 1 lane bridge.

Agreed re Lafayette.  The whole getting rid of state highways in cities just seems dumb.  SR 26 is discontinuous now because of it.  Personally I wonder if there's any reason Lafayette and West Lafayette couldn't sign the route that INDOT abandoned as Lafayette/West Lafayette 26.  At least then the number would be continuous and many people wouldn't even notice the change.


When INDOT decommissioned 311, 403, and part of 160, Clark County signed them as County highways with the same numbers. No reason other counties/cities couldn't do the same.

I know Dekalb county does this as well with CR327 and CR427 (not CR27 which was numbered to fit their grid)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 16, 2020, 07:26:43 PM
Two things that need to happen, US 20 and SR 2 need to be flipped near Rolling Prairie. US 24 needs to be put on CR 900 E/Lafayette Center Road.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: PurdueBill on December 16, 2020, 11:20:15 PM
Quote from: Finrod on December 16, 2020, 05:10:57 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 15, 2020, 12:06:50 PM
because indot doesn't like to do things that make sense for continuity's sake. Look at what they did to all the highways in the lafayette area. Surprised they still wanted 225 at all honestly, especially with that weird 1 lane bridge.

Agreed re Lafayette.  The whole getting rid of state highways in cities just seems dumb.  SR 26 is discontinuous now because of it.  Personally I wonder if there's any reason Lafayette and West Lafayette couldn't sign the route that INDOT abandoned as Lafayette/West Lafayette 26.  At least then the number would be continuous and many people wouldn't even notice the change.


West Lafayette doesn't even want thru traffic using the old route of 26 as a way through town (witness the elimination of the one-way pairs and the general gridlock that prevails at times basically on purpose to slow things down); that shouldn't stop SOME route from being signed as "TO 26" or something so that people can navigate from one side of 26 to the other.  Ditto for 25.  The routing of US 52 over Teal Road to get over to the "new" 231 to cross over to the new(er) bypass is bonkers; if they hadn't let 350 South get so congested it might have been a logical route; when I first lived there in the late 90s there was literally nothing on 350 South and now it is just as congested as 26 east of town, maybe more.  The discontinuous routes at Lafayette are crazy.  I'm semi-surprised they haven't introduced discontinuities to 25 in Logansport and stuff like that too while they are at it.

The only time when driving to Lafayette from NE Ohio via US 30 and 24 and then SR 25 in the last 15 years that I didn't use CR 900 instead of staying on 24 was one time when a train was stopped across the crossing on 900 and everyone was having to turn around (and we didn't know how long the train was or what other crossings were blocked  so we went back out to 69 and up to 24; what a waste of time and distance).  There is not much reason not to have 24 use it now; INDOT has even signed 900 for the FWA airport which would be via picking up 469 and the old alignment of 24 (before the swap, the signage for the airport actually had you cut off via 900 and be back on US 24!).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on December 17, 2020, 12:22:40 AM
https://fb.watch/2qF4ZWrd5G/

Here is a video of the proposed metering and variable speed limits project on I-465 on the SE side of Indy.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ibthebigd on December 17, 2020, 05:14:04 AM
I wonder how often the lights will he active?

SM-G950U

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 17, 2020, 12:01:20 PM
didn't indot pay for the upgrades to lafayette center road ?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 17, 2020, 12:16:23 PM
the original plan was to have 26, 25, and 52 all use teal road. for some reason indot nixed that idea. i remember for a very short time before this rerouting, 25 ran on teal only, but then jumped up onto 38 ALONE, and 38 ended at 65. this was only for a few months though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefarmerchris on December 17, 2020, 01:12:58 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 17, 2020, 12:01:20 PM
didn't indot pay for the upgrades to lafayette center road ?

That is my assumption. I'd imagine the plan would be to route US24 onto 900 East once the US24/I469 interchange modification was complete.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on December 17, 2020, 05:52:23 PM
I saw on the local news tonight (WPTA) that many mayors and local leaders have been pushing for a US-30 freeway conversion across Indiana. I could not find a link to the story on their website. I did see a survey crew at 30 and Flaugh on my way to work this morning, so maybe the Allen County portion is going to be getting under way soon.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-39 on December 17, 2020, 06:13:28 PM
Quote from: I-55 on December 17, 2020, 05:52:23 PM
I saw on the local news tonight (WPTA) that many mayors and local leaders have been pushing for a US-30 freeway conversion across Indiana. I could not find a link to the story on their website. I did see a survey crew at 30 and Flaugh on my way to work this morning, so maybe the Allen County portion is going to be getting under way soon.

Not needed at all. If they won't even do US 31 from South Bend to Indianapolis, then why would they do this?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on December 17, 2020, 08:57:38 PM
https://wpta21.com/2020/12/17/elected-officials-in-ne-indiana-call-on-state-government-to-fund-conversion-of-u-s-30-into-freeway/

Quote
ALLEN COUNTY, Ind. (WPTA21) - There are encouraging signs for people excited to see a major improvement of U.S. 30 running from Fort Wayne to northwest Indiana.

Indiana's governor has joined elected officials from this area in saying upgrades to the four-lane highway should be a priority going forward.

The Mayors and Commissioners Caucus of Northeast Indiana on Thursday formally called on state government officials to figure out how to fund the conversion of 30 into a freeway.

The roughly 150-mile stretch of U.S. 30 from the Ohio state line to around Valparaiso is a major route to transport people and commercial goods.

Local officials say the road needs to move traffic more efficiently and safer.

The Indiana Department of Transportation commissioner attended a meeting of business leaders in Fort Wayne Thursday.

State Senator Liz Brown says it was brought up that INDOT is now focusing attention on a more limited Planning and Environmental Linkage Study that could speed up the start of a long process towards a major upgrade of U.S. 30 in the Hoosier state.

Brown is nervous that INDOT will eventually make less ambitious improvements and stop short of doing what, in her mind, is really needed to make the roadway all it can be.

"And they won't continue forward to make it a freeway between here and Valpo. So it is disconcerting because there are major manufacturers here who are suggesting that they will not expand in this community if something (the freeway) is not done," Brown said.

Allen County Commissioner Nelson Peters is encouraged that Governor Eric Holcomb has included making a major investment in U.S. 30 among his infrastructure improvement priorities.

"The governor just rolled out his next level agenda and right there in its infinite glory was something regarding the expansion of U-S 30, so it is now on the governor's radar," Peters said.

INDOT indicates converting U.S. 30 into a freeway would carry a price tag of at least $1-billion in construction costs alone.

I personally don't think it will be a full freeway (though I will continue to push for it) but rather shorter freeway segments and removed traffic signals in other locations.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 17, 2020, 09:07:38 PM
What is the distance from the Toll Road within which INDOT is prohibited from having new freeways? For some reason 30 miles is in my head and if that's the number then you can't upgrade anything west of US 31.

Just doing Warsaw as a stand-alone project would do wonders for the travel time and safety on 30.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on December 17, 2020, 09:19:23 PM
Quote from: I-39 on December 17, 2020, 06:13:28 PM
Quote from: I-55 on December 17, 2020, 05:52:23 PM
I saw on the local news tonight (WPTA) that many mayors and local leaders have been pushing for a US-30 freeway conversion across Indiana. I could not find a link to the story on their website. I did see a survey crew at 30 and Flaugh on my way to work this morning, so maybe the Allen County portion is going to be getting under way soon.

Not needed at all. If they won't even do US 31 from South Bend to Indianapolis, then why would they do this?

It is needed - existing US 30 has way too many stoplights.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 17, 2020, 09:22:56 PM
Thinking about a potential US 30 project. They could start out with the following:

Maybe a freeway from SR 49 in Valpo to the US 421 (along with a final freewayization of SR 49 to I-94)
Removal of stoplights around Plymouth with exits or simple grade-separation
Freeway around all of the Warsaw sprawl, perhaps stretching across all of Kosciusko County from SR 19 to SR 13
Freeway from the west side of Columbia City to I-69. Notably I believe the right-of-way already exists around SR 9 or 109 in Columbia City.
Individual exits for SR 5, SR 13, SR 19, SR 23 and SR 39. Knowing INDOT they'll want to do J-turns at all those crossings.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on December 17, 2020, 09:36:32 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 17, 2020, 09:22:56 PM
Thinking about a potential US 30 project. They could start out with the following:

Maybe a freeway from SR 49 in Valpo to the US 421 (along with a final freewayization of SR 49 to I-94)
Removal of stoplights around Plymouth with exits or simple grade-separation
Freeway around all of the Warsaw sprawl, perhaps stretching across all of Kosciusko County from SR 19 to SR 13
Freeway from the west side of Columbia City to I-69. Notably I believe the right-of-way already exists around SR 9 or 109 in Columbia City.
Individual exits for SR 5, SR 13, SR 19, SR 23 and SR 39. Knowing INDOT they'll want to do J-turns at all those crossings.

If INDOT wants free flow Pierceton and Larwill are going to be a piece of work, regardless of whether its freeway or not (no ROW and too much traffic to be left as stop sign/j-turn.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on December 18, 2020, 01:27:44 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 17, 2020, 09:07:38 PM
What is the distance from the Toll Road within which INDOT is prohibited from having new freeways? For some reason 30 miles is in my head and if that's the number then you can't upgrade anything west of US 31.

Just doing Warsaw as a stand-alone project would do wonders for the travel time and safety on 30.
I just did a Google search and read a in-depth review of the 75 year lease of the toll road.  I was amazed to find out that the actual distance that the state has a non-compete is 10 miles (five miles each side of the ITR).  Also, the multi-lane road would have to be 20 miles long within that distance for the lessee to be eligible for compensation from the state.  As a result, US30 is fair game all the way from Fort Wayne to the Illinois State Line, since it is farther than 5 miles from the toll road.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on December 18, 2020, 10:13:21 PM
Drove through the 469/24 interchange tonight. All construction is done and the ramps are as discussed earlier. The auxiliary lane for I-469N extends beyond the loop ramp in a similar fashion to I-69 Exit 309. There is space between the 469N-24E ramp and the southern loop ramp for a flyover, but there appears to be no work towards it, so at least for now the ramp is cancelled.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefarmerchris on December 19, 2020, 11:14:25 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 17, 2020, 09:22:56 PM
Thinking about a potential US 30 project. They could start out with the following:

Maybe a freeway from SR 49 in Valpo to the US 421 (along with a final freewayization of SR 49 to I-94)
Removal of stoplights around Plymouth with exits or simple grade-separation
Freeway around all of the Warsaw sprawl, perhaps stretching across all of Kosciusko County from SR 19 to SR 13
Freeway from the west side of Columbia City to I-69. Notably I believe the right-of-way already exists around SR 9 or 109 in Columbia City.
Individual exits for SR 5, SR 13, SR 19, SR 23 and SR 39. Knowing INDOT they'll want to do J-turns at all those crossings.

We are starting to go fictional at this point, but what if the Illiana was resurrected and have the freeway continue from SR49/US30 westward into Illinois like planned?
The hardest parts of this project would be the Fort Wayne to Warsaw segment. The SR9 exit should've been done by now as that is the biggest choke point between Fort Wayne and Warsaw. The right of way is there.....just do it. Also, rebuild the US30/I69 interchange to be more free-flowing.......
Finally, I could see INDOT doing J turns to save money even though interchanges would be better for traffic flow.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 19, 2020, 11:23:23 AM
Quote from: thefarmerchris on December 19, 2020, 11:14:25 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 17, 2020, 09:22:56 PM
Thinking about a potential US 30 project. They could start out with the following:

Maybe a freeway from SR 49 in Valpo to the US 421 (along with a final freewayization of SR 49 to I-94)
Removal of stoplights around Plymouth with exits or simple grade-separation
Freeway around all of the Warsaw sprawl, perhaps stretching across all of Kosciusko County from SR 19 to SR 13
Freeway from the west side of Columbia City to I-69. Notably I believe the right-of-way already exists around SR 9 or 109 in Columbia City.
Individual exits for SR 5, SR 13, SR 19, SR 23 and SR 39. Knowing INDOT they'll want to do J-turns at all those crossings.

We are starting to go fictional at this point, but what if the Illiana was resurrected and have the freeway continue from SR49/US30 westward into Illinois like planned?
The hardest parts of this project would be the Fort Wayne to Warsaw segment. The SR9 exit should've been done by now as that is the biggest choke point between Fort Wayne and Warsaw. The right of way is there.....just do it. Also, rebuild the US30/I69 interchange to be more free-flowing.......
Finally, I could see INDOT doing J turns to save money even though interchanges would be better for traffic flow.

looks like you can fit a parclo in there at us 30 and 9, problem is the proximity to sr 109.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on December 19, 2020, 11:55:07 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 19, 2020, 11:23:23 AM
looks like you can fit a parclo in there at us 30 and 9, problem is the proximity to sr 109.

Just build an overpass for SR 109 and use the frontage roads north and south of US 30 for access to businesses. It wouldn't be too different from what they're planning for I-69 around Martinsville now. Presumably Columbia City would have another exit to the west around Lincoln Highway and then one to the east at SR 205.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thefarmerchris on December 19, 2020, 04:06:02 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on December 19, 2020, 11:55:07 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on December 19, 2020, 11:23:23 AM
looks like you can fit a parclo in there at us 30 and 9, problem is the proximity to sr 109.

Just build an overpass for SR 109 and use the frontage roads north and south of US 30 for access to businesses. It wouldn't be too different from what they're planning for I-69 around Martinsville now. Presumably Columbia City would have another exit to the west around Lincoln Highway and then one to the east at SR 205.

Also reroute 109 along the north frontage road for truck traffic.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thenetwork on December 20, 2020, 01:52:11 PM
It's been 15 years since I last traveled US-30 across Indiana, but isn't the area around Merrilville/I-65 still a major slow point for cross-state travelers?  Has there ever been plans for a limited access bypass of that congested area?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on December 20, 2020, 05:06:27 PM
Quote from: thenetwork on December 20, 2020, 01:52:11 PM
It's been 15 years since I last traveled US-30 across Indiana, but isn't the area around Merrilville/I-65 still a major slow point for cross-state travelers?  Has there ever been plans for a limited access bypass of that congested area?

Extended Illiana ideas are all I've seen.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 20, 2020, 05:27:55 PM
Quote from: thenetwork on December 20, 2020, 01:52:11 PM
It's been 15 years since I last traveled US-30 across Indiana, but isn't the area around Merrilville/I-65 still a major slow point for cross-state travelers?  Has there ever been plans for a limited access bypass of that congested area?

Yes, US 30 is really slow west of Valparaiso, but depending on where you're headed there are alternatives. IN 49 north gets you to the Toll Road and I-94, and IN 2 west gets you to I-65 with far fewer stoplights.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 21, 2020, 07:47:26 AM
SR 37 will close on 1/2/21 according to a vms sign on 465 I saw yesterday.

Pixel 5

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Ryctor2018 on December 26, 2020, 02:10:02 PM
The Reporter-Times link. It's behind a paywall: https://www.hoosiertimes.com/reporter_times/traffic-surge-indot-prepares-to-close-ind-37-in-the-days-ahead/article_0642a94a-4613-11eb-b06b-2373784dd5f6.html
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on January 19, 2021, 10:04:25 PM
Nothing of major importance to report, but during a recent drive on the Indiana Toll Road, I noticed some pretty cool implementations across the stretch from the Cline Avenue east ramp to the I-94 interchange. I do not know if the features extend to the Illinois state line or go beyond the Portage barrier, but here's what I saw:

At various points, there are new overhead VMS's that include the general messages (no road rages, protect construction workers, hands free, etc.); however, if any special events or construction takes place, the signs include variable speed limit signs that activate based on the situation or what lies ahead.

Exclusively to one portion of the road: just east of the I-65-US 12/20 interchange is a sharp curve that can be taken at speed. I don't know of any accidents that happened in that area, but the ITR plans to keep it that way. In both directions is a curve ahead sign with flashing yellow lights along the edge of the curve arrow, followed by a series of chevrons that also have flashing yellow lights along their borders. The chevrons flash sequentially from front to back, in the same way the lights flash on an airport runway at night to guide the plane in.

I really hope they add more of these safety measures to other portions of the Toll Road; the curve east of Laporte (near Fail Road and US 20) would be a great place to implement the latter feature, while the South Bend-Mishawaka area would be a great area to put the former feature into action.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 03, 2021, 10:29:05 PM
A fun note:

To celebrate this year's March Madness tournament taking place entirely in Indiana (specifically, West Lafayette, Indianapolis, Bloomington, and Evansville), crews have placed specialized signing along the interstates near the area (I-70, for example, has a customized shield with the nickname "Hoosier Hoops Highway"  placed on top of it). These signs will be placed along the highways leading to the host cities throughout the duration of the Tournament.

Indiana 130 will be undergoing a series of intersection improvements between Hobart and Valparaiso. The first will involve the stretch between Porter County Roads 475 and 500. Both county roads serve as a connection between US 6 and US 30 and see steady traffic throughout the day, with Indiana 130 serving as the go-between. Instead of "runaround lanes"  at the intersections, Indiana 130 will be refitted at both intersections with dedicated left and right turn lanes while through traffic will be allowed to go through unimpeded. Preliminary work has already started, and work is expected to be completed in the fall. The same scope of work will take place at the intersection with Indiana 149 about 2.5 miles southeast.

Utility work is continuing in advance of the US 12/20 realignment project set to begin this summer. As the new US 12/20 routing continues, power lines along the South Shore Line will be shifted to make room for the new track set to be laid down in the near future. Through traffic may want to consider using I-80/94 to Indiana 51 (via I-65) during peak construction.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JoePCool14 on March 04, 2021, 10:03:16 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 03, 2021, 10:29:05 PM
A fun note:

To celebrate this year's March Madness tournament taking place entirely in Indiana (specifically, West Lafayette, Indianapolis, Bloomington, and Evansville), crews have placed specialized signing along the interstates near the area (I-70, for example, has a customized shield with the nickname "Hoosier Hoops Highway"  placed on top of it). These signs will be placed along the highways leading to the host cities throughout the duration of the Tournament.

Are there any pictures of these available? If the shields are different, that actually sounds pretty cool.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on March 04, 2021, 10:08:59 AM
There's a couple in their recent email: https://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/INDOT/bulletins/2c41519
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JoePCool14 on March 04, 2021, 10:17:07 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on March 04, 2021, 10:08:59 AM
There's a couple in their recent email: https://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/INDOT/bulletins/2c41519

Thanks, I like the look of the shield, and Hoosier Hoops Highway just rolls off the tongue too well.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: rawmustard on March 04, 2021, 01:11:15 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on January 19, 2021, 10:04:25 PM
Nothing of major importance to report, but during a recent drive on the Indiana Toll Road, I noticed some pretty cool implementations across the stretch from the Cline Avenue east ramp to the I-94 interchange. I do not know if the features extend to the Illinois state line or go beyond the Portage barrier, but here's what I saw:

At various points, there are new overhead VMS's that include the general messages (no road rages, protect construction workers, hands free, etc.); however, if any special events or construction takes place, the signs include variable speed limit signs that activate based on the situation or what lies ahead.

I saw a few of these gantries between Laporte and South Bend last night, so I would think they're along the entire system.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on March 04, 2021, 07:34:36 PM
I saw a few of those Hoosier Hoops Highway shields last night driving to work along I-65 and I-70. Honestly they're a little hard to see a night so they are certainly not reflective. They have them up on some of the light posts following various interchanges so they're also a little more to the side of the highway than a standard interstate shield. But the shields are of course temporary so whatever.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on March 04, 2021, 11:07:33 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on March 04, 2021, 07:34:36 PM
I saw a few of those Hoosier Hoops Highway shields last night driving to work along I-65 and I-70. Honestly they're a little hard to see a night so they are certainly not reflective. They have them up on some of the light posts following various interchanges so they're also a little more to the side of the highway than a standard interstate shield. But the shields are of course temporary so whatever.

Makes me wonder if they'd consider selling them after the tournament.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: pianocello on March 05, 2021, 07:55:42 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 03, 2021, 10:29:05 PM
Indiana 130 will be undergoing a series of intersection improvements between Hobart and Valparaiso. The first will involve the stretch between Porter County Roads 475 and 500. Both county roads serve as a connection between US 6 and US 30 and see steady traffic throughout the day, with Indiana 130 serving as the go-between. Instead of "runaround lanes"  at the intersections, Indiana 130 will be refitted at both intersections with dedicated left and right turn lanes while through traffic will be allowed to go through unimpeded. Preliminary work has already started, and work is expected to be completed in the fall.

Thank the Lord. This has been needed for years. Keeping the westbound "runaround lane" at the intersection with 475W when they installed the signal was a dumb decision, IMO.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on March 06, 2021, 12:23:32 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 03, 2021, 10:29:05 PM
To celebrate this year's March Madness tournament taking place entirely in Indiana (specifically, West Lafayette, Indianapolis, Bloomington, and Evansville), crews have placed specialized signing along the interstates near the area (I-70, for example, has a customized shield with the nickname "Hoosier Hoops Highway"  placed on top of it). These signs will be placed along the highways leading to the host cities throughout the duration of the Tournament.

INDOT says in their posting that some tourney games will be played in Evansville, but I can't find confirmation of that anywhere. Everything I see online indicates all NCAA games will be at West Lafayette, Bloomington, or Indy. The Big Ten and Horizon League events are scheduled for Indy as well. I wondered about the Valley tourney, since UE is in that conference, but it looks like that one is in St. Louis as usual. Correct me if I'm wrong here.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ibthebigd on March 06, 2021, 06:04:57 AM
Evansville is hosting the NCAA Division 2 Championship. Fort Wayne was supposed to host the Division 3 championship but not enough schools are participating to have a championship.

SM-G950U

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: theline on March 07, 2021, 12:53:04 AM
Quote from: ibthebigd on March 06, 2021, 06:04:57 AM
Evansville is hosting the NCAA Division 2 Championship. Fort Wayne was supposed to host the Division 3 championship but not enough schools are participating to have a championship.

SM-G950U
Boy, is my face red. I didn't even think of the D-II tourney even though my daughter is head athletic trainer at one of the (possibly) participating schools. Thanks for the info.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on March 07, 2021, 01:00:04 AM
Quote from: ibthebigd on March 06, 2021, 06:04:57 AM
Evansville is hosting the NCAA Division 2 Championship. Fort Wayne was supposed to host the Division 3 championship but not enough schools are participating to have a championship.

SM-G950U

Fort Wayne was also supposed to host a DI Women's Regional last year but that got canceled.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ibthebigd on March 07, 2021, 07:25:46 PM
The Ohio Valley Conference hosted there Championship at the Ford Center in Evansville.

SM-G950U

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on March 19, 2021, 04:40:32 PM
A major safety project is coming this year to a major/busy interchange in Fort Wayne at the I-69/Illinois Road (SR 14). Two of the loop ramps (I-69 SB to East Illinois Road and I-69 NB to West SR 14/Illinois Road) will be permanently removed/eliminated. Instead, there will be a new traffic light on the offramps as well as new turn lanes.

https://www.wane.com/traffic/overhaul-of-i-69-illinois-road-interchange-planned/

https://www.in.gov/indot/files/Improvement%20Map.pdf
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on March 19, 2021, 06:15:43 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on March 19, 2021, 04:40:32 PM
A major safety project is coming this year to a major/busy interchange in Fort Wayne at the I-69/Illinois Road (SR 14). Two of the loop ramps (I-69 SB to East Illinois Road and I-69 NB to West SR 14/Illinois Road) will be permanently removed/eliminated. Instead, there will be a new traffic light on the offramps as well as new turn lanes.

https://www.wane.com/traffic/overhaul-of-i-69-illinois-road-interchange-planned/

https://www.in.gov/indot/files/Improvement%20Map.pdf

Yay: the cloverleaf always seemed overbuilt, and getting from NB 69 to the left turn to get into Menards was always difficult if not impossible.

Nay: no more flying through that interchange eastbound at 55-60. unfortunately this doesn't fix the problem of people merging onto NB I-69 from WB Illinois Rd at 35 mph, but nothing ever will.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on March 23, 2021, 04:21:11 PM
Another season of construction is underway, and the Indiana Toll Road started yesterday on "Push 3.0" from MP 93 (east of Elkhart's exit 92) to MP 123 (2 miles east of Middlebury's exit 121). Work includes new pavement, rehabilitated bridges, and improved technologies along this stretch of corridor. Reith-Riley is closing one lane in each direction in five-six miles increments for a 24/7 operation.

https://www.facebook.com/INDIANATOLLROAD/photos/a.10150551014516446/10158092934501446/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 11:55:31 AM
on i-65 in whitestown there is a huge project underway. SR 267 interchange will become a double reverse style interchange. A new double reverse interchange will be added at i-65 and County Road 550, and it looks to be complete, minor fixes to Whitestown parkway and 865 interchanges. All new signs, and the new signs for the 865 interchange will include us 52 shields! Also they will have Whitestown Parkway as the name of exit 130 instead of the generic one thats out there now. No idea when this will be fully complete, but it's pretty far along now!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 12:19:15 PM
not having 74 inside 465 makes sense. neither direction it comes from has any major suburbs. even now noone really uses 74 west out to Illinois. if you brought in 74 on the east side it would have destroyed most of downtown in that area for no real reason.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JoePCool14 on March 30, 2021, 01:32:55 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 11:55:31 AM
on i-65 in whitestown there is a huge project underway. SR 267 interchange will become a double reverse style interchange. A new double reverse interchange will be added at i-65 and County Road 550, and it looks to be complete, minor fixes to Whitestown parkway and 865 interchanges. All new signs, and the new signs for the 865 interchange will include us 52 shields! Also they will have Whitestown Parkway as the name of exit 130 instead of the generic one thats out there now. No idea when this will be fully complete, but it's pretty far along now!

Not surprised about that rebuild. The Whitestown area has seen incredible growth over the past few years.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 02:40:30 PM
Eventually Ronald Reagan parkway will tie into 267 just south of 65, no idea where but that's the plan.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on March 30, 2021, 02:55:45 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 02:40:30 PM
Eventually Ronald Reagan parkway will tie into 267 just south of 65, no idea where but that's the plan.

It all depends on if/when Boone County decides to do their part. It could connect via 267 or it could connect via Whitestown Pkwy.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: hobsini2 on March 30, 2021, 05:10:38 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on March 30, 2021, 01:32:55 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 11:55:31 AM
on i-65 in whitestown there is a huge project underway. SR 267 interchange will become a double reverse style interchange. A new double reverse interchange will be added at i-65 and County Road 550, and it looks to be complete, minor fixes to Whitestown parkway and 865 interchanges. All new signs, and the new signs for the 865 interchange will include us 52 shields! Also they will have Whitestown Parkway as the name of exit 130 instead of the generic one thats out there now. No idea when this will be fully complete, but it's pretty far along now!

Not surprised about that rebuild. The Whitestown area has seen incredible growth over the past few years.
Any plans for I-65 having a new interchange with 86th or 82nd St? Just seems that area could use one between 865 and 71st St.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: CtrlAltDel on March 30, 2021, 05:16:16 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 11:55:31 AM
on i-65 in whitestown there is a huge project underway. SR 267 interchange will become a double reverse style interchange. A new double reverse interchange will be added at i-65 and County Road 550, and it looks to be complete, minor fixes to Whitestown parkway and 865 interchanges. All new signs, and the new signs for the 865 interchange will include us 52 shields! Also they will have Whitestown Parkway as the name of exit 130 instead of the generic one thats out there now. No idea when this will be fully complete, but it's pretty far along now!

Just in case others were confused like I was, the term in bold is also referred to as a DDI.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 05:19:57 PM
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on March 30, 2021, 05:16:16 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 11:55:31 AM
on i-65 in whitestown there is a huge project underway. SR 267 interchange will become a double reverse style interchange. A new double reverse interchange will be added at i-65 and County Road 550, and it looks to be complete, minor fixes to Whitestown parkway and 865 interchanges. All new signs, and the new signs for the 865 interchange will include us 52 shields! Also they will have Whitestown Parkway as the name of exit 130 instead of the generic one thats out there now. No idea when this will be fully complete, but it's pretty far along now!

Just in case others were confused like I was, the term in bold is also referred to as a DDI.

I intentionally said it that way. I think DDI is a stupid name  :-D. Also I doubt there would be any exits at 82nd or 86th. people would throw a fit. They tried to place one at 865 and Cooper Rd and the people in the area lost their minds.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: CtrlAltDel on March 30, 2021, 05:25:39 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 05:19:57 PM
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on March 30, 2021, 05:16:16 PM
Just in case others were confused like I was, the term in bold is also referred to as a DDI.

I intentionally said it that way. I think DDI is a stupid name  :-D.

Fair enough, although, if I were to make up my own term for it, I'd go with double crossover.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: hobsini2 on March 30, 2021, 05:37:48 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 05:19:57 PM
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on March 30, 2021, 05:16:16 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 11:55:31 AM
on i-65 in whitestown there is a huge project underway. SR 267 interchange will become a double reverse style interchange. A new double reverse interchange will be added at i-65 and County Road 550, and it looks to be complete, minor fixes to Whitestown parkway and 865 interchanges. All new signs, and the new signs for the 865 interchange will include us 52 shields! Also they will have Whitestown Parkway as the name of exit 130 instead of the generic one thats out there now. No idea when this will be fully complete, but it's pretty far along now!

Just in case others were confused like I was, the term in bold is also referred to as a DDI.

I intentionally said it that way. I think DDI is a stupid name  :-D. Also I doubt there would be any exits at 82nd or 86th. people would throw a fit. They tried to place one at 865 and Cooper Rd and the people in the area lost their minds.
Cooper Rd would be a great spot for an interchange to serve that area. Some people. Right?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 05:44:22 PM
It was zionsville residents worried that the "rural character" of their community would go away. Why anyone would expect an area that close to a major city would stay rural mystifies me. If you want "rural character" move to tipton

Pixel 5

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on March 30, 2021, 06:29:02 PM
Quote from: hobsini2 on March 30, 2021, 05:37:48 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 05:19:57 PM
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on March 30, 2021, 05:16:16 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 11:55:31 AM
on i-65 in whitestown there is a huge project underway. SR 267 interchange will become a double reverse style interchange. A new double reverse interchange will be added at i-65 and County Road 550, and it looks to be complete, minor fixes to Whitestown parkway and 865 interchanges. All new signs, and the new signs for the 865 interchange will include us 52 shields! Also they will have Whitestown Parkway as the name of exit 130 instead of the generic one thats out there now. No idea when this will be fully complete, but it's pretty far along now!

Just in case others were confused like I was, the term in bold is also referred to as a DDI.

I intentionally said it that way. I think DDI is a stupid name  :-D. Also I doubt there would be any exits at 82nd or 86th. people would throw a fit. They tried to place one at 865 and Cooper Rd and the people in the area lost their minds.
Cooper Rd would be a great spot for an interchange to serve that area. Some people. Right?

Why would an interchange at Cooper Rd be necessary? Traffic from the N and W has Whitestown Pkwy (former IN 334), traffic from the E has US 421, and traffic from the S isn't going to use 865 at all. Seems like putting an interchange somewhere just to have one.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: skluth on March 30, 2021, 06:48:57 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 05:19:57 PM
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on March 30, 2021, 05:16:16 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 11:55:31 AM
on i-65 in whitestown there is a huge project underway. SR 267 interchange will become a double reverse style interchange. A new double reverse interchange will be added at i-65 and County Road 550, and it looks to be complete, minor fixes to Whitestown parkway and 865 interchanges. All new signs, and the new signs for the 865 interchange will include us 52 shields! Also they will have Whitestown Parkway as the name of exit 130 instead of the generic one thats out there now. No idea when this will be fully complete, but it's pretty far along now!

Just in case others were confused like I was, the term in bold is also referred to as a DDI.

I intentionally said it that way. I think DDI is a stupid name  :-D. Also I doubt there would be any exits at 82nd or 86th. people would throw a fit. They tried to place one at 865 and Cooper Rd and the people in the area lost their minds.

Do you also call interstate highways by another name if they don't actually go from one state to another? Making up a stupid (and it is stupid) name to replace the standard name wastes everyone's time and just pisses people off. If that was your goal, you succeeded. Congrats on giving me a reason to ignore every future post you make.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 07:14:27 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on March 30, 2021, 06:29:02 PM
Quote from: hobsini2 on March 30, 2021, 05:37:48 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 05:19:57 PM
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on March 30, 2021, 05:16:16 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 11:55:31 AM
on i-65 in whitestown there is a huge project underway. SR 267 interchange will become a double reverse style interchange. A new double reverse interchange will be added at i-65 and County Road 550, and it looks to be complete, minor fixes to Whitestown parkway and 865 interchanges. All new signs, and the new signs for the 865 interchange will include us 52 shields! Also they will have Whitestown Parkway as the name of exit 130 instead of the generic one thats out there now. No idea when this will be fully complete, but it's pretty far along now!

Just in case others were confused like I was, the term in bold is also referred to as a DDI.

I intentionally said it that way. I think DDI is a stupid name  :-D. Also I doubt there would be any exits at 82nd or 86th. people would throw a fit. They tried to place one at 865 and Cooper Rd and the people in the area lost their minds.
Cooper Rd would be a great spot for an interchange to serve that area. Some people. Right?

Why would an interchange at Cooper Rd be necessary? Traffic from the N and W has Whitestown Pkwy (former IN 334), traffic from the E has US 421, and traffic from the S isn't going to use 865 at all. Seems like putting an interchange somewhere just to have one.
It was an idea to help the whitestown parkway interchange. That interchange is overloaded during rush hour and it was an idea to help with that

Pixel 5

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 07:17:49 PM
Quote from: skluth on March 30, 2021, 06:48:57 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 05:19:57 PM
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on March 30, 2021, 05:16:16 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 11:55:31 AM
on i-65 in whitestown there is a huge project underway. SR 267 interchange will become a double reverse style interchange. A new double reverse interchange will be added at i-65 and County Road 550, and it looks to be complete, minor fixes to Whitestown parkway and 865 interchanges. All new signs, and the new signs for the 865 interchange will include us 52 shields! Also they will have Whitestown Parkway as the name of exit 130 instead of the generic one thats out there now. No idea when this will be fully complete, but it's pretty far along now!

Just in case others were confused like I was, the term in bold is also referred to as a DDI.

I intentionally said it that way. I think DDI is a stupid name  :-D. Also I doubt there would be any exits at 82nd or 86th. people would throw a fit. They tried to place one at 865 and Cooper Rd and the people in the area lost their minds.

Do you also call interstate highways by another name if they don't actually go from one state to another? Making up a stupid (and it is stupid) name to replace the standard name wastes everyone's time and just pisses people off. If that was your goal, you succeeded. Congrats on giving me a reason to ignore every future post you make.
So does posting irrelevant and ignorant statements help? Anyway, I'll continue posting useful information to this group. I think it's best we ignore your posts as well.

Pixel 5

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 07:19:31 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on March 30, 2021, 06:29:02 PM
Quote from: hobsini2 on March 30, 2021, 05:37:48 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 05:19:57 PM
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on March 30, 2021, 05:16:16 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 11:55:31 AM
on i-65 in whitestown there is a huge project underway. SR 267 interchange will become a double reverse style interchange. A new double reverse interchange will be added at i-65 and County Road 550, and it looks to be complete, minor fixes to Whitestown parkway and 865 interchanges. All new signs, and the new signs for the 865 interchange will include us 52 shields! Also they will have Whitestown Parkway as the name of exit 130 instead of the generic one thats out there now. No idea when this will be fully complete, but it's pretty far along now!

Just in case others were confused like I was, the term in bold is also referred to as a DDI.

I intentionally said it that way. I think DDI is a stupid name  :-D. Also I doubt there would be any exits at 82nd or 86th. people would throw a fit. They tried to place one at 865 and Cooper Rd and the people in the area lost their minds.
Cooper Rd would be a great spot for an interchange to serve that area. Some people. Right?

Why would an interchange at Cooper Rd be necessary? Traffic from the N and W has Whitestown Pkwy (former IN 334), traffic from the E has US 421, and traffic from the S isn't going to use 865 at all. Seems like putting an interchange somewhere just to have one.
Honestly though i think this project will actually make that idea irrelevant. I remember looking at a map of the 550 interchange and they plan on curving the road to the north for some reason (east of 65), rather than continuing it east west.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on March 30, 2021, 11:41:44 PM
With speed limits in the Indianapolis area, is there a reason why ALL of I-465 is 55 mph? I know there are some substandard sections on the southern loop that can stay as 55 mph, but surely some other portions of the beltway can be designated at 65 mph.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on March 31, 2021, 12:05:51 AM
Quote from: SkyPesos on March 30, 2021, 11:41:44 PM
With speed limits in the Indianapolis area, is there a reason why ALL of I-465 is 55 mph? I know there are some substandard sections on the southern loop that can stay as 55 mph, but surely some other portions of the beltway can be designated at 65 mph.

I would designate 65 on everything north of I-70 except near I-865 (which should be updated to allow for a continuous 65 zone)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 31, 2021, 09:34:22 AM
Quote from: SkyPesos on March 30, 2021, 11:41:44 PM
With speed limits in the Indianapolis area, is there a reason why ALL of I-465 is 55 mph? I know there are some substandard sections on the southern loop that can stay as 55 mph, but surely some other portions of the beltway can be designated at 65 mph.

State Law says it has to be 55 in urban areas. INDOT's hands are tied. a study was done by Indystar and found 97% of people go over 55  :-D.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: skluth on March 31, 2021, 12:01:47 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 31, 2021, 09:34:22 AM
Quote from: SkyPesos on March 30, 2021, 11:41:44 PM
With speed limits in the Indianapolis area, is there a reason why ALL of I-465 is 55 mph? I know there are some substandard sections on the southern loop that can stay as 55 mph, but surely some other portions of the beltway can be designated at 65 mph.

State Law says it has to be 55 in urban areas. INDOT's hands are tied. a study was done by Indystar and found 97% of people go over 55  :-D.
It sounds like every other urban interstate where the de facto speed limit is never 55.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on March 31, 2021, 12:23:04 PM
Quote from: skluth on March 31, 2021, 12:01:47 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 31, 2021, 09:34:22 AM
Quote from: SkyPesos on March 30, 2021, 11:41:44 PM
With speed limits in the Indianapolis area, is there a reason why ALL of I-465 is 55 mph? I know there are some substandard sections on the southern loop that can stay as 55 mph, but surely some other portions of the beltway can be designated at 65 mph.

State Law says it has to be 55 in urban areas. INDOT's hands are tied. a study was done by Indystar and found 97% of people go over 55  :-D.
It sounds like every other urban interstate where the de facto speed limit is never 55.

It sounds like state law needs revised. My proposal:

Interstates/Non interstate freeways: 70/65 rural, 65 urban
4 lane divided: 65 rural

This allows limits to be increased where necessary but they don't have to. 75 mph isn't happening in Indiana anytime soon though I wouldn't mind. I know there are several segments of road that need higher speeds and several that are fine as is. I know we've had this discussion before but as long as a bulk of traffic is going 80 in a 60 this discussion is far from over.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 31, 2021, 12:29:29 PM
Quote from: I-55 on March 31, 2021, 12:23:04 PM
Quote from: skluth on March 31, 2021, 12:01:47 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 31, 2021, 09:34:22 AM
Quote from: SkyPesos on March 30, 2021, 11:41:44 PM
With speed limits in the Indianapolis area, is there a reason why ALL of I-465 is 55 mph? I know there are some substandard sections on the southern loop that can stay as 55 mph, but surely some other portions of the beltway can be designated at 65 mph.

State Law says it has to be 55 in urban areas. INDOT's hands are tied. a study was done by Indystar and found 97% of people go over 55  :-D.
It sounds like every other urban interstate where the de facto speed limit is never 55.

It sounds like state law needs revised. My proposal:

Interstates/Non interstate freeways: 70/65 rural, 65 urban
4 lane divided: 65 rural

This allows limits to be increased where necessary but they don't have to. 75 mph isn't happening in Indiana anytime soon though I wouldn't mind. I know there are several segments of road that need higher speeds and several that are fine as is. I know we've had this discussion before but as long as a bulk of traffic is going 80 in a 60 this discussion is far from over.

honestly the law should be repealed for state roads and the authority given to INDOT, they would know how to properly do it, not the state legislature.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on March 31, 2021, 12:36:06 PM
Quote from: I-55 on March 31, 2021, 12:23:04 PM
It sounds like state law needs revised. My proposal:

Interstates/Non interstate freeways: 70/65 rural, 65 urban
4 lane divided: 65 rural

This allows limits to be increased where necessary but they don't have to. 75 mph isn't happening in Indiana anytime soon though I wouldn't mind. I know there are several segments of road that need higher speeds and several that are fine as is. I know we've had this discussion before but as long as a bulk of traffic is going 80 in a 60 this discussion is far from over.
With the exception of the 65 mph truck limit, that sounds similar to what Ohio have currently, which works.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on March 31, 2021, 12:41:10 PM
Quote from: I-55 on March 31, 2021, 12:23:04 PM
Quote from: skluth on March 31, 2021, 12:01:47 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 31, 2021, 09:34:22 AM
Quote from: SkyPesos on March 30, 2021, 11:41:44 PM
With speed limits in the Indianapolis area, is there a reason why ALL of I-465 is 55 mph? I know there are some substandard sections on the southern loop that can stay as 55 mph, but surely some other portions of the beltway can be designated at 65 mph.

State Law says it has to be 55 in urban areas. INDOT's hands are tied. a study was done by Indystar and found 97% of people go over 55  :-D.
It sounds like every other urban interstate where the de facto speed limit is never 55.

It sounds like state law needs revised. My proposal:

Interstates/Non interstate freeways: 70/65 rural, 65 urban
4 lane divided: 65 rural

This allows limits to be increased where necessary but they don't have to. 75 mph isn't happening in Indiana anytime soon though I wouldn't mind. I know there are several segments of road that need higher speeds and several that are fine as is. I know we've had this discussion before but as long as a bulk of traffic is going 80 in a 60 this discussion is far from over.
I'd like to know how they got around this for Evansville I-164 (now I-69) is at 60 MPH and this area is just as urban if not more so that most of I-64 going into Louisville from the New Albany side and it is set at 55 MPH with lots of troopers to enforce it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JoePCool14 on March 31, 2021, 12:48:52 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2021, 05:44:22 PM
It was zionsville residents worried that the "rural character" of their community would go away. Why anyone would expect an area that close to a major city would stay rural mystifies me. If you want "rural character" move to tipton

cc: Residents of Long Grove, IL
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on March 31, 2021, 12:58:26 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on March 31, 2021, 12:36:06 PM
Quote from: I-55 on March 31, 2021, 12:23:04 PM
It sounds like state law needs revised. My proposal:

Interstates/Non interstate freeways: 70/65 rural, 65 urban
4 lane divided: 65 rural

This allows limits to be increased where necessary but they don't have to. 75 mph isn't happening in Indiana anytime soon though I wouldn't mind. I know there are several segments of road that need higher speeds and several that are fine as is. I know we've had this discussion before but as long as a bulk of traffic is going 80 in a 60 this discussion is far from over.
With the exception of the 65 mph truck limit, that sounds similar to what Ohio have currently, which works.

In general, it's the same except in NW Ohio. Ohio's rural 4 lane speed limit varies by region. In the NW corner of the state, its usually 65 but US-30 and US-33 are 70 for their 4 lane segments. In Appalachian Ohio, the limit is usually 60 and sometimes just 55. If there's a magic boundary I'd say its I-70 and I-71 west/north of Columbus.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on March 31, 2021, 04:09:56 PM
the new 469/24 interchange is showing up on google maps.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 01, 2021, 09:26:56 PM
https://wyrz.org/indot-enters-agreement-with-the-town-of-plainfield-and-hendricks-county-for-relinquishment-of-sr-267/

SR 267 is no more. The only section left is from 74 to 65.


Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on April 01, 2021, 09:37:30 PM
What about the section from I-70 to Mooresville? Is that still around, or at least the part in Morgan County?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 01, 2021, 09:40:22 PM
Decommissioned years ago

Pixel 5

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Interstate 69 Fan on April 02, 2021, 02:32:23 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 01, 2021, 09:26:56 PM
https://wyrz.org/indot-enters-agreement-with-the-town-of-plainfield-and-hendricks-county-for-relinquishment-of-sr-267/

SR 267 is no more. The only section left is from 74 to 65.

Even that segment won't last long - that's planned to become part of Ronald Reagan Parkway in the coming years. Sad to see it go.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on April 06, 2021, 12:44:43 PM
I went to Lafayette yesterday and noticed some things with its roads.


- Is 8-10k AADT with tons of truck traffic enough to warrant a 4 lane road? This is what I see with the 2 lane portions of Veterans Memorial Pkwy on the way to the Purdue campus, along with tons of distribution centers on the road. The portion between 9th St and Sagamore is 4 laned already though, which is a good portion of it. Would be a nice to have if the remaining 2 lane sections gets 4 laned, as that will complete the all 4-lane road access from I-65 exit 168 to the Purdue campus.

- What is US 52's routing through the area even? I thought it would use Sagamore the entire way to US 231 (as it's yellow on Google Maps), but that guess was incorrect as US 52 was concurrent with US 231 along the west side of Lafayette/West Lafayette. My second guess was that it would turn onto Veterans Memorial Pkwy to get to US 231 (since it looks like InDOT wants to turn over city streets to local control and that Veterans Memorial is a shorter routing), but that guess was wrong too.

- I would go more with the IN 25 and 26 gaps, but state route gaps are so common in Indiana that I'm not going to bother with it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 06, 2021, 12:51:45 PM
US 52 followed sagamore the whole way until they opened the bypass. Now 52 takes a dumb routing on teal road to get to 231 then follows 231 up to where the bypass ends.

Pixel 5

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on April 06, 2021, 01:04:10 PM
Veterans Memorial Parkway in Tippecanoe County falls into the same category as CR 17 in Elkhart County as a county road that got improved to the point that it carries traffic like a state highway, but the state really doesn't take over roads from counties.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Hot Rod Hootenanny on April 06, 2021, 01:27:09 PM
Quote from: I-55 on March 31, 2021, 12:58:26 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on March 31, 2021, 12:36:06 PM
Quote from: I-55 on March 31, 2021, 12:23:04 PM
It sounds like state law needs revised. My proposal:

Interstates/Non interstate freeways: 70/65 rural, 65 urban
4 lane divided: 65 rural

This allows limits to be increased where necessary but they don't have to. 75 mph isn't happening in Indiana anytime soon though I wouldn't mind. I know there are several segments of road that need higher speeds and several that are fine as is. I know we've had this discussion before but as long as a bulk of traffic is going 80 in a 60 this discussion is far from over.
With the exception of the 65 mph truck limit, that sounds similar to what Ohio have currently, which works.

In general, it's the same except in NW Ohio. Ohio's rural 4 lane speed limit varies by region. In the NW corner of the state, its usually 65 but US-30 and US-33 are 70 for their 4 lane segments. In Appalachian Ohio, the limit is usually 60 and sometimes just 55. If there's a magic boundary I'd say its I-70 and I-71 west/north of Columbus.

Except US 33 is 70 MPH around Lancaster and from Logan to Athens. The sections that have intersections is signed for 60 MPH.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on April 06, 2021, 02:17:51 PM
Quote from: Hot Rod Hootenanny on April 06, 2021, 01:27:09 PM
Quote from: I-55 on March 31, 2021, 12:58:26 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on March 31, 2021, 12:36:06 PM
Quote from: I-55 on March 31, 2021, 12:23:04 PM
It sounds like state law needs revised. My proposal:

Interstates/Non interstate freeways: 70/65 rural, 65 urban
4 lane divided: 65 rural

This allows limits to be increased where necessary but they don't have to. 75 mph isn't happening in Indiana anytime soon though I wouldn't mind. I know there are several segments of road that need higher speeds and several that are fine as is. I know we've had this discussion before but as long as a bulk of traffic is going 80 in a 60 this discussion is far from over.
With the exception of the 65 mph truck limit, that sounds similar to what Ohio have currently, which works.

In general, it's the same except in NW Ohio. Ohio's rural 4 lane speed limit varies by region. In the NW corner of the state, its usually 65 but US-30 and US-33 are 70 for their 4 lane segments. In Appalachian Ohio, the limit is usually 60 and sometimes just 55. If there's a magic boundary I'd say its I-70 and I-71 west/north of Columbus.

Except US 33 is 70 MPH around Lancaster and from Logan to Athens. The sections that have intersections is signed for 60 MPH.

I should've clarified that I was referring to 4 lane NOT meeting interstate standards, because I am well aware of 33, 35, and OH-823 having 70 mph limits on fully controlled access freeways, but 60 mph otherwise.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ibthebigd on April 07, 2021, 06:34:06 PM
https://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/transportation/2021/04/06/indianapolis-traffic-i-465-variable-speed-limits-planned-indot/6552584002/


Variable Speed Limits on I-465.

SM-G950U

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on April 07, 2021, 06:42:12 PM
Quote from: ibthebigd on April 07, 2021, 06:34:06 PM
https://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/transportation/2021/04/06/indianapolis-traffic-i-465-variable-speed-limits-planned-indot/6552584002/


Variable Speed Limits on I-465.

SM-G950U

So instead of going 70 in a 55 we'll now be going 70 in a 40. The variable speed limit should be for making the speed limit go UP instead of DOWN. Fast drivers aren't going to slow down for these, but slow drivers will speed up if the limit goes up. The idea was to reduce speed variance but I honestly think it will have a reverse effect. We all know the speed limit is far below traffic speed on this road. Heck, we were just recently talking about INCREASING the limit north of I-70

Oh, doesn't this just sound like CHEAP WAY OUT????
If you're worried about congestion, WIDEN IT!!!!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on April 07, 2021, 07:06:41 PM
I saw a Facebook video of an Indianapolis local news reporter driving 55 mph on I-465, and it looked borderline dangerous with all the other cars around driving at >70 mph. Speed limits should be going up (to at least 65 mph), not down.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 07, 2021, 09:08:54 PM
ramp meters are coming as well on 465, for some reason the SE part will get them instead of the north side. Also noone ever went 55 and they'll continue to never go 55. I go 70 and still feel like I'm the slow guy  :-D
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JoePCool14 on April 08, 2021, 04:01:44 PM
Quote from: ibthebigd on April 07, 2021, 06:34:06 PM
https://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/transportation/2021/04/06/indianapolis-traffic-i-465-variable-speed-limits-planned-indot/6552584002/


Variable Speed Limits on I-465.

SM-G950U

Stupid. Flat out stupid. If they want variable speed limit signs, at least use them right (i.e., raise the speed limit up to 70 and only drop it back down to 65, 60, or 55 when necessary).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on April 10, 2021, 08:52:52 AM
When Georgia introduced variable limits on the I-285 beltway, didn't they also raise the speed limit from 55 mph to 65 mph?

I think the variable limits here aren't going to have a positive effect unless they allow the free-flow speed to reflect actual traffic flow, so when there's little congestion, it will increase to 65 mph. Atlanta got that right.

70 mph may be ideal for the I-465 beltway, but realistically speaking, it should definitely be at least 65 mph.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 25, 2021, 05:45:57 PM
Where do I begin? Quite a bit of action in Northwest Indiana.

A series of bridge repairs and overlays are in progress or are set to begin. The main crunch points include:

I-80/94 at Indianapolis Boulevard in Hammond (ramps and mainline: as of this writing, all westbound entrance ramps are closed; use Calumet or Cline Avenue as a detour)

I-65 over the ramp to I-80/94 west in Gary (as a result, the slip ramp allowing traffic from Ridge Road to access the I-80/94 west ramp is closed)

Indiana 249 at I-94 in Portage (overnight ramp closures will be likely this week; only one lane will get by in each direction of Indiana 249 at all times, which will result in delays during peak times)

113th Avenue over I-65 in Crown Point

US 20 between Johnson Road and the Indiana 212/US 35 interchange in Michigan City

Cline Avenue between Airport Road (former Industrial Highway) and US 20 in Gary

US 30 over Indiana 49 in Valparaiso (with ramp closures)

Laporte County Road 800 North over I-94 (located between the US 20/35 interchange and the Michigan State Line)

All projects are set to be completed by mid to late summer.

Utility work continues on US 12 and 20 in Gary in preparation for the major realignment project set to begin in June. Work has shifted to the soon-to-be-former US 12 to install new utility lines, accommodating future installation of the second track along the South Shore Line. In June, US 12 will be permanently closed from the current split to just east of Lake Street, where the new split will be located and US 12 will rejoin its current path just before the CSX and Old Hobart Road bridges. All of this work should conclude in the fall.

Indiana 149 is currently closed at Lenburg Road because of intersection improvements. When finished, the cramped intersection (with no turn lanes or runarounds, resulting in frequent backups) will include turn lanes and flashing yellow arrows. This was scheduled to be completed last fall, but was delayed due to utility relocation issues. Indiana 149 will be reopened in late June; the official detour involves US 20, Indiana 49, and US 6 (though you can take I-94 from US 20 to 49 and back if you prefer).

US 231 between Broadway and I-65 in Crown Point will be undergoing resurfacing this week. At times, only one lane will be able to go by. This work will last through the summer.

Finally, INDOT will be seeking input on a future project involving the infamous section of US 20 between Indiana 39 and Fail Road in Laporte County. The proposed plan would involve installation of a center left turn lane between those two points, in a continued effort to improve safety in the accident-prone area. No timetable has yet been set for this project.

That was quite a bit to unpack. As more develops, I'll keep you all posted.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on April 25, 2021, 05:54:16 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 25, 2021, 05:45:57 PM
Finally, INDOT will be seeking input on a future project involving the infamous section of US 20 between Indiana 39 and Fail Road in Laporte County. The proposed plan would involve installation of a center left turn lane between those two points, in a continued effort to improve safety in the accident-prone area. No timetable has yet been set for this project.

I make frequent trips to South Bend/Elkhart/Goshen and this is part of the route I usually take. This section definitely needs left turn lanes.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on April 25, 2021, 06:07:42 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 25, 2021, 05:45:57 PM
Where do I begin? Quite a bit of action in Northwest Indiana.

A series of bridge repairs and overlays are in progress or are set to begin. The main crunch points include:

I-80/94 at Indianapolis Boulevard in Hammond (ramps and mainline: as of this writing, all westbound entrance ramps are closed; use Calumet or Cline Avenue as a detour)

I-65 over the ramp to I-80/94 west in Gary (as a result, the slip ramp allowing traffic from Ridge Road to access the I-80/94 west ramp is closed)

Indiana 249 at I-94 in Portage (overnight ramp closures will be likely this week; only one lane will get by in each direction of Indiana 249 at all times, which will result in delays during peak times)

113th Avenue over I-65 in Crown Point

US 20 between Johnson Road and the Indiana 212/US 35 interchange in Michigan City

Cline Avenue between Airport Road (former Industrial Highway) and US 20 in Gary

US 30 over Indiana 49 in Valparaiso (with ramp closures)

Laporte County Road 800 North over I-94 (located between the US 20/35 interchange and the Michigan State Line)

All projects are set to be completed by mid to late summer.

Utility work continues on US 12 and 20 in Gary in preparation for the major realignment project set to begin in June. Work has shifted to the soon-to-be-former US 12 to install new utility lines, accommodating future installation of the second track along the South Shore Line. In June, US 12 will be permanently closed from the current split to just east of Lake Street, where the new split will be located and US 12 will rejoin its current path just before the CSX and Old Hobart Road bridges. All of this work should conclude in the fall.

Indiana 149 is currently closed at Lenburg Road because of intersection improvements. When finished, the cramped intersection (with no turn lanes or runarounds, resulting in frequent backups) will include turn lanes and flashing yellow arrows. This was scheduled to be completed last fall, but was delayed due to utility relocation issues. Indiana 149 will be reopened in late June; the official detour involves US 20, Indiana 49, and US 6 (though you can take I-94 from US 20 to 49 and back if you prefer).

US 231 between Broadway and I-65 in Crown Point will be undergoing resurfacing this week. At times, only one lane will be able to go by. This work will last through the summer.

Finally, INDOT will be seeking input on a future project involving the infamous section of US 20 between Indiana 39 and Fail Road in Laporte County. The proposed plan would involve installation of a center left turn lane between those two points, in a continued effort to improve safety in the accident-prone area. No timetable has yet been set for this project.

That was quite a bit to unpack. As more develops, I'll keep you all posted.

In my hometown of La Porte, INDOT is currently doing some repaving on Lincolnway as well as some sidewalk ramp improvements. At the same time, they are going out and doing some "Traffic Signal Modernizations" within the city of La Porte.

Some of the intersections have been upgraded to include an FYA, and those intersections are:
-Boyd Boulevard at SR 4 (Monroe Street): all left-turning legs got upgraded to an FYA
-Weller/Truesdell Ave at US 35/SR 39 (Pine Lake Avenue): left-turns from Pine Lake Ave upgraded to FYA
-Boston Street at Lincolnway (SR 2): left turn from Lincolnway heading EB got upgraded
I expect some more intersections to receive these upgrades, so I will keep y'all posted on what's going on in the city of La Porte.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 26, 2021, 11:41:33 AM
US 20 will be widened to 5 lanes (1 center left) from where the St. Joseph Valley Parkway ends to just east of SR 13. in a few years.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 29, 2021, 03:58:55 PM
North Split will close in about 2 weeks for 1.5 yrs. As a result several exits on 465 will close for the same length to help traffic flow better. Ramp meters will also be added on some other exits too.
Exits to close include:

US 36/SR 67 ramp to SB 465

East St. to EB 465

Ramp Meters on:

Sam Jones Parkway, southbound
Kentucky Avenue, eastbound
Mann Road, eastbound
East Street, northbound/westbound
Shadeland Avenue, southbound
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on April 29, 2021, 04:08:19 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 29, 2021, 03:58:55 PM
North Split will close in about 2 weeks for 1.5 yrs. As a result several exits on 465 will close for the same length to help traffic flow better. Ramp meters will also be added on some other exits too.
Exits to close include:

US 36/SR 67 ramp to SB 465

East St. to EB 465

Ramp Meters on:

Sam Jones Parkway, southbound
Kentucky Avenue, eastbound
Mann Road, eastbound
East Street, northbound/westbound
Shadeland Avenue, southbound

Couldn't have waited until after the 500?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 29, 2021, 04:09:42 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on April 29, 2021, 04:08:19 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 29, 2021, 03:58:55 PM
North Split will close in about 2 weeks for 1.5 yrs. As a result several exits on 465 will close for the same length to help traffic flow better. Ramp meters will also be added on some other exits too.
Exits to close include:

US 36/SR 67 ramp to SB 465

East St. to EB 465

Ramp Meters on:

Sam Jones Parkway, southbound
Kentucky Avenue, eastbound
Mann Road, eastbound
East Street, northbound/westbound
Shadeland Avenue, southbound

Couldn't have waited until after the 500?

possibly, but that interchange is on its last legs. this project is badly needed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on April 29, 2021, 05:36:28 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 29, 2021, 03:58:55 PM
North Split will close in about 2 weeks for 1.5 yrs. As a result several exits on 465 will close for the same length to help traffic flow better. Ramp meters will also be added on some other exits too.
Exits to close include:

US 36/SR 67 ramp to SB 465

East St. to EB 465

Ramp Meters on:

Sam Jones Parkway, southbound
Kentucky Avenue, eastbound
Mann Road, eastbound
East Street, northbound/westbound
Shadeland Avenue, southbound
1.5 years complete closure? Seems a bit long to me for rebuilding a single system interchange. For comparison I-64 in St Louis about a decade ago was completely closed for a bit longer at 2 years, but that included 10 miles of roadway, 10 interchanges, including 1 system interchange as complex as the north split.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 29, 2021, 07:49:14 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 29, 2021, 05:36:28 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 29, 2021, 03:58:55 PM
North Split will close in about 2 weeks for 1.5 yrs. As a result several exits on 465 will close for the same length to help traffic flow better. Ramp meters will also be added on some other exits too.
Exits to close include:

US 36/SR 67 ramp to SB 465

East St. to EB 465

Ramp Meters on:

Sam Jones Parkway, southbound
Kentucky Avenue, eastbound
Mann Road, eastbound
East Street, northbound/westbound
Shadeland Avenue, southbound
1.5 years complete closure? Seems a bit long to me for rebuilding a single system interchange. For comparison I-64 in St Louis about a decade ago was completely closed for a bit longer at 2 years, but that included 10 miles of roadway, 10 interchanges, including 1 system interchange as complex as the north split.
I think the reason may be because they're building on top of existing and they're trying to keep some movements open at all times

Pixel 5

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on April 29, 2021, 07:52:36 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 29, 2021, 07:49:14 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 29, 2021, 05:36:28 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 29, 2021, 03:58:55 PM
North Split will close in about 2 weeks for 1.5 yrs. As a result several exits on 465 will close for the same length to help traffic flow better. Ramp meters will also be added on some other exits too.
Exits to close include:

US 36/SR 67 ramp to SB 465

East St. to EB 465

Ramp Meters on:

Sam Jones Parkway, southbound
Kentucky Avenue, eastbound
Mann Road, eastbound
East Street, northbound/westbound
Shadeland Avenue, southbound
1.5 years complete closure? Seems a bit long to me for rebuilding a single system interchange. For comparison I-64 in St Louis about a decade ago was completely closed for a bit longer at 2 years, but that included 10 miles of roadway, 10 interchanges, including 1 system interchange as complex as the north split.
I think the reason may be because they're building on top of existing and they're trying to keep some movements open at all times

Pixel 5
Ah ok that makes sense. From what you write earlier, I thought they're going to do a complete closure, with no movements open at all, and rebuild the whole interchange from scratch.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on April 29, 2021, 11:07:50 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 29, 2021, 07:52:36 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 29, 2021, 07:49:14 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 29, 2021, 05:36:28 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 29, 2021, 03:58:55 PM
North Split will close in about 2 weeks for 1.5 yrs. As a result several exits on 465 will close for the same length to help traffic flow better. Ramp meters will also be added on some other exits too.
Exits to close include:

US 36/SR 67 ramp to SB 465

East St. to EB 465

Ramp Meters on:

Sam Jones Parkway, southbound
Kentucky Avenue, eastbound
Mann Road, eastbound
East Street, northbound/westbound
Shadeland Avenue, southbound
1.5 years complete closure? Seems a bit long to me for rebuilding a single system interchange. For comparison I-64 in St Louis about a decade ago was completely closed for a bit longer at 2 years, but that included 10 miles of roadway, 10 interchanges, including 1 system interchange as complex as the north split.
I think the reason may be because they're building on top of existing and they're trying to keep some movements open at all times

Pixel 5
Ah ok that makes sense. From what you write earlier, I thought they're going to do a complete closure, with no movements open at all, and rebuild the whole interchange from scratch.

For that timeline I figured it would be a complete closure considering how long I-20/59 in Birmingham took.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on April 30, 2021, 11:01:09 AM
during construction you can just get to downtown but just cant drive through it. secret detour will be using west st.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSR_317 on May 09, 2021, 04:58:34 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 30, 2021, 11:01:09 AM
during construction you can just get to downtown but just cant drive through it. secret detour will be using west st.
West Street has been a parking lot during rush hours for years now. Can't imagine it will be any different once the North Split is closed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 10, 2021, 08:15:31 AM
INDOT's detour for 65 is stupid for the north split construction, no one will use it that knows the area. Why would you take 65 up to the south split, then take 70 west to get onto 465 north? just take 465 the whole way like everyone else would. who are they kidding with this?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on May 10, 2021, 08:20:11 AM
Do people actually follow the official detour signage. I imagine that a lot use a GPS or look at the route options on a map and make their own detour. And in both cases, both drivers on 65 and 70 would probably decide to use I-465 south of I-70's western junction with no regards to the detour signage.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 10, 2021, 08:26:46 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 10, 2021, 08:15:31 AM
INDOT's detour for 65 is stupid for the north split construction, no one will use it that knows the area. Why would you take 65 up to the south split, then take 70 west to get onto 465 north? just take 465 the whole way like everyone else would. who are they kidding with this?

INDOT's official detour will skip the smallest amount of the closed highway as possible. Going up to the south split misses less of 65. Like many other official detours, it's not the fastest route and people with local knowledge will use alternatives.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: trafficsignal on May 10, 2021, 09:23:06 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 10, 2021, 08:26:46 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 10, 2021, 08:15:31 AM
INDOT's detour for 65 is stupid for the north split construction, no one will use it that knows the area. Why would you take 65 up to the south split, then take 70 west to get onto 465 north? just take 465 the whole way like everyone else would. who are they kidding with this?

INDOT's official detour will skip the smallest amount of the closed highway as possible. Going up to the south split misses less of 65. Like many other official detours, it's not the fastest route and people with local knowledge will use alternatives.

They'll also overlap timeframe-wise with some of the I-69/I-465 work on the SW side , so perhaps they are detouring up to downtown to avoid the other construction area?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: FixThe74Sign on May 10, 2021, 01:32:29 PM
Quote from: trafficsignal on May 10, 2021, 09:23:06 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 10, 2021, 08:26:46 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 10, 2021, 08:15:31 AM
INDOT's detour for 65 is stupid for the north split construction, no one will use it that knows the area. Why would you take 65 up to the south split, then take 70 west to get onto 465 north? just take 465 the whole way like everyone else would. who are they kidding with this?

INDOT's official detour will skip the smallest amount of the closed highway as possible. Going up to the south split misses less of 65. Like many other official detours, it's not the fastest route and people with local knowledge will use alternatives.

They'll also overlap timeframe-wise with some of the I-69/I-465 work on the SW side , so perhaps they are detouring up to downtown to avoid the other construction area?

It won't overlap that much at all. At the very least they won't be closing lanes on 465 during North Split work. They are trying to avoid having 465, 70, and 65 traffic all use one 6 lane stretch of highway. Its kind of crazy to think about...you have a major North South interstate route, and one major East West interstate route, and a busy belt way, all using the same pavement.

Locals won't use that detour, but I think INDOT is hoping that out of towners and truckers will use it. In theory, as you approach downtown and the North Split, the HIGHWAY CLOSED signs will be way more prominent than any orange detour signs 3 miles away at the 465 interchange.

Considering the duration of this project (18 months), I wonder if it is possible for INDOT to ask Google to change how their system routes drivers around this project. I'll definitely see what Google maps says once the closure happens.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 10, 2021, 02:12:29 PM
all inside routes will soon be on 465  :-o
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: FixThe74Sign on May 10, 2021, 02:21:09 PM
"All your route belong to me"  - 465
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on May 12, 2021, 09:05:12 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 10, 2021, 02:12:29 PM
all inside routes will soon be on 465  :-o

The most INDOT thing to happen this year.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on May 12, 2021, 09:15:41 PM
With some other reroutings, it's possible to have 465/70/74/36/40 East, 65 South, 69/67 North, 52 West on the southern part of the beltway between I-69 and I-65.

Edit: I screwed this up. 52 is actually East, not west. Dang it, thought it's an opportunity for all 4 cardinal directions on a stretch of road.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JoePCool14 on May 13, 2021, 10:30:33 AM
Quote from: SkyPesos on May 12, 2021, 09:15:41 PM
With some other reroutings, it's possible to have 465/70/74/36/40 East, 65 South, 69/67 North, 52 West on the southern part of the beltway between I-69 and I-65.

Nona-concurrency with all four route directions on one stretch of road. Sounds perfect.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 26, 2021, 02:05:52 PM
In a collaborative effort between INDOT and the City of Crown Point, a major series of projects is set to begin at I-65 and 109th Avenue.

Starting June 1, the entire I-65/109th Avenue interchange will be closed to traffic, as it will be converted from two signalized intersections to a dogbone interchange, similar to what has been done to Indiana 49 and Vale Park Road in Valparaiso and Indiana 2 and US 20 in Rolling Prairie.

As part of this conversion, 109th Avenue will be widened from two to four lanes from I-65 westward to Broadway (Indiana 53); part of the widening has already been completed. Another roundabout will be built east of I-65 at Iowa Street as well. All work is scheduled for completion before Thanksgiving.

Those looking to travel on 109th Street between Broadway and points east of I-65 will be detoured via Broadway, 113th Avenue, and Mississippi Street. Those looking to enter I-65 will be encouraged to use US 231, located south of 109th Avenue.

Outside of the 109th Avenue ramps being closed, I-65 will not be affected by the work.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: pianocello on May 26, 2021, 05:25:16 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 26, 2021, 02:05:52 PM
In a collaborative effort between INDOT and the City of Crown Point, a major series of projects is set to begin at I-65 and 109th Avenue.

Starting June 1, the entire I-65/109th Avenue interchange will be closed to traffic, as it will be converted from two signalized intersections to a dogbone interchange, similar to what has been done to Indiana 49 and Vale Park Road in Valparaiso and Indiana 2 and US 20 in Rolling Prairie.

As part of this conversion, 109th Avenue will be widened from two to four lanes from I-65 westward to Broadway (Indiana 53); part of the widening has already been completed. Another roundabout will be built east of I-65 at Iowa Street as well. All work is scheduled for completion before Thanksgiving.

Those looking to travel on 109th Street between Broadway and points east of I-65 will be detoured via Broadway, 113th Avenue, and Mississippi Street. Those looking to enter I-65 will be encouraged to use US 231, located south of 109th Avenue.

Outside of the 109th Avenue ramps being closed, I-65 will not be affected by the work.

It's been a while since I've been there, but conversion to a dogbone seems to be the right choice for a quick capacity improvement. Widening 109th Ave or adding extra turn lanes clearly seems to be off the table here (https://goo.gl/maps/Xeb72aHtFXvKA97bA), and I know fewer lanes has been a selling point for INDOT in the past for dogbone interchanges (I know that was the main reason they chose that type for the Vale Park Road interchange, probably the same for Rolling Prairie as well).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 26, 2021, 06:56:20 PM
Quote from: pianocello on May 26, 2021, 05:25:16 PM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 26, 2021, 02:05:52 PM
In a collaborative effort between INDOT and the City of Crown Point, a major series of projects is set to begin at I-65 and 109th Avenue.

Starting June 1, the entire I-65/109th Avenue interchange will be closed to traffic, as it will be converted from two signalized intersections to a dogbone interchange, similar to what has been done to Indiana 49 and Vale Park Road in Valparaiso and Indiana 2 and US 20 in Rolling Prairie.

As part of this conversion, 109th Avenue will be widened from two to four lanes from I-65 westward to Broadway (Indiana 53); part of the widening has already been completed. Another roundabout will be built east of I-65 at Iowa Street as well. All work is scheduled for completion before Thanksgiving.

Those looking to travel on 109th Street between Broadway and points east of I-65 will be detoured via Broadway, 113th Avenue, and Mississippi Street. Those looking to enter I-65 will be encouraged to use US 231, located south of 109th Avenue.

Outside of the 109th Avenue ramps being closed, I-65 will not be affected by the work.

It's been a while since I've been there, but conversion to a dogbone seems to be the right choice for a quick capacity improvement. Widening 109th Ave or adding extra turn lanes clearly seems to be off the table here (https://goo.gl/maps/Xeb72aHtFXvKA97bA), and I know fewer lanes has been a selling point for INDOT in the past for dogbone interchanges (I know that was the main reason they chose that type for the Vale Park Road interchange, probably the same for Rolling Prairie as well).

This area has had a growth explosion over the past 20 years. The Broadway corridor west of I-65 with commercial development, and Winfield east of I-65 with residential development. The exit itself is fairly recent.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on May 26, 2021, 10:50:12 PM
Quote from: pianocello on May 26, 2021, 05:25:16 PM
It's been a while since I've been there, but conversion to a dogbone seems to be the right choice for a quick capacity improvement. Widening 109th Ave or adding extra turn lanes clearly seems to be off the table here (https://goo.gl/maps/Xeb72aHtFXvKA97bA), and I know fewer lanes has been a selling point for INDOT in the past for dogbone interchanges (I know that was the main reason they chose that type for the Vale Park Road interchange, probably the same for Rolling Prairie as well).

Bridge piers wouldn't have stopped Missouri (https://goo.gl/maps/QwPWdz6SbUTJdWTs8) from widening that (https://goo.gl/maps/u5TuBR88hJL5DwSz7).

Closing all of the ramps at 109th does not seem like a good idea given how badly overloaded US 30 is around I-65.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on May 27, 2021, 08:04:16 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on May 26, 2021, 10:50:12 PM
Quote from: pianocello on May 26, 2021, 05:25:16 PM
It's been a while since I've been there, but conversion to a dogbone seems to be the right choice for a quick capacity improvement. Widening 109th Ave or adding extra turn lanes clearly seems to be off the table here (https://goo.gl/maps/Xeb72aHtFXvKA97bA), and I know fewer lanes has been a selling point for INDOT in the past for dogbone interchanges (I know that was the main reason they chose that type for the Vale Park Road interchange, probably the same for Rolling Prairie as well).

Bridge piers wouldn't have stopped Missouri (https://goo.gl/maps/QwPWdz6SbUTJdWTs8) from widening that (https://goo.gl/maps/u5TuBR88hJL5DwSz7).

Closing all of the ramps at 109th does not seem like a good idea given how badly overloaded US 30 is around I-65.

the reason why 109th isn't 4 lanes under 65 is because it wasn't worth rebuilding the 65 overpass. it's a fairly recent bridge and is in very good condition. it just wasn't worth the money to do the bridge too. perhaps if 109th ave. was a state road they would have. also i believe that is exactly what they are doing with 1 of the 3 lanes around the pier.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 07, 2021, 08:32:44 PM
On or after June 10, work will formally commence on the US 12/20 realignment project in the Miller (Gary) area. US 12 will be closed from Old Hobart Road to the current split west of Clay Street. During this time, three signals along what will be Old US 12 will be removed: the signal at the split, the four way stop at Clay Street, and the signal at Lake Street.

During this time, new pavement will be built for the new split just east of Lake Street, along with a new traffic signal. Along the realigned stretch, new sidewalks will be installed, along with decorative lighting and pedestrian access points.

As previously noted, this realignment is designed to accommodate the South Shore Line double track project, spanning from Gary to Michigan City. This will also include a revamped Miller station and enhanced parking.

The official detour calls for traffic to use US 20 and Indiana 249 to connect to US 12. However, the locals can use County Line Road or Old Hobart Road to connect to US 12. Long-range drivers may want to consider using I-94 (or even the Toll Road) to skip the work zone.

The realignment is scheduled for mid-September completion.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 09, 2021, 09:43:37 PM
Another shorter-term closure is set for US 12/20 next week, but west of I-65. The CSS-SB railroad crossing (the line that goes from the yard adjacent to US 12/20 to the IHB Line just north of the South Shore Line) will be repaired and replaced. All work is scheduled to be done within that week only. The official detour calls for traffic to use I-65, I-80/94, and Broadway. However, non-truck traffic can get by using 15th Avenue.

Another intersection improvement project is in progress along Indiana 130, at Porter County Road 600 North (just east of the County Line Road intersection). While the complete details are not yet known, I do know there will be added turn lanes. The northeastern half of the intersection is currently being worked on, with CR 600 N closed east of Indiana 130. The southwestern half will be worked on later in the summer.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-39 on June 20, 2021, 12:19:56 AM
Any more updates on future I-65 widening projects?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on June 20, 2021, 02:30:56 AM
Quote from: I-39 on June 20, 2021, 12:19:56 AM
Any more updates on future I-65 widening projects?

Well there are four currently either under construction or in the planning process. I'll go over them chronologically. I do apologize if some of these you've already heard of, to my knowledge the first two are currently under construction and the second two are in the planning stages.

There's the four miles in Bartholomew County from Exit 64 to 68 that will extend the six-lane segment already existing between Exit 50 and 64. That's under construction right now.

Then there's a five or six-mile segment from just north of Exit 140 (SR 32) to Exit 147 (SR 47) in Boone County which I believe is also currently under construction. This extends the existing six-lane section in Boone County that begins at Exit 129.

In the wings then is the extension of the six lane section in Tippecanoe County from north of Exit 175 (SR 25) to three miles north of Exit 178 (SR 43) which includes the widening of the bridge over the Wabash River that's been ongoing if not complete already.

Finally there's the proposed extension of the six-lane section of I-65 through the rest of Clark County and into Scott County, from north of Exit 16 (Memphis Rd) to just south of Exit 29 (SR 56.) According to INDOT's website on the project the six-lane section will actually end a couple of miles south of Exit 29 for some reason. Not sure yet when that project will start.

It is exciting to hear about all the proposes to Indiana's interstates in making them better throughout the state. It'd be great to see more from the Scottsburg-to-Seymour section and the Lebanon-to-Lafayette section in the future, along with Columbus-to-Franklin.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-39 on June 20, 2021, 05:39:30 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on June 20, 2021, 02:30:56 AM
Quote from: I-39 on June 20, 2021, 12:19:56 AM
Any more updates on future I-65 widening projects?

Well there are four currently either under construction or in the planning process. I'll go over them chronologically. I do apologize if some of these you've already heard of, to my knowledge the first two are currently under construction and the second two are in the planning stages.

There's the four miles in Bartholomew County from Exit 64 to 68 that will extend the six-lane segment already existing between Exit 50 and 64. That's under construction right now.

Then there's a five or six-mile segment from just north of Exit 140 (SR 32) to Exit 147 (SR 47) in Boone County which I believe is also currently under construction. This extends the existing six-lane section in Boone County that begins at Exit 129.

In the wings then is the extension of the six lane section in Tippecanoe County from north of Exit 175 (SR 25) to three miles north of Exit 178 (SR 43) which includes the widening of the bridge over the Wabash River that's been ongoing if not complete already.

Finally there's the proposed extension of the six-lane section of I-65 through the rest of Clark County and into Scott County, from north of Exit 16 (Memphis Rd) to just south of Exit 29 (SR 56.) According to INDOT's website on the project the six-lane section will actually end a couple of miles south of Exit 29 for some reason. Not sure yet when that project will start.

It is exciting to hear about all the proposes to Indiana's interstates in making them better throughout the state. It'd be great to see more from the Scottsburg-to-Seymour section and the Lebanon-to-Lafayette section in the future, along with Columbus-to-Franklin.

I'm thinking they need to prioritize getting the remaining sections between Indianapolis and Louisville widened first. With Tennessee now moving forward with widening between Nashville and the Kentucky state line, it's important Indiana finishes the Indianapolis to Louisville segment so I-65 between Indianapolis and Nashville is fully 6+ lanes.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on June 20, 2021, 05:43:23 PM
This may be a selfish preference based on my location, but I prefer the Indianapolis-Chicago part widened first. But getting either segment completely widened would be an achievement.

Quote from: I-39 on June 20, 2021, 05:39:30 PM
I'm thinking they need to prioritize getting the remaining sections between Indianapolis and Louisville widened first. With Tennessee now moving forward with widening between Nashville and the Kentucky state line, it's important Indiana finishes the Indianapolis to Louisville segment so I-65 between Indianapolis and Nashville is fully 6+ lanes.
Kind of curious, is there an approximate estimate of how much NB I-65 traffic in KY dumps onto I-71 past Louisville rather than continuing on I-65 northward?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JoePCool14 on June 20, 2021, 10:44:42 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on June 20, 2021, 05:43:23 PM
This may be a selfish preference based on my location, but I prefer the Indianapolis-Chicago part widened first. But getting either segment completely widened would be an achievement.

I second the motion, but I will not deny, there's definitely some bias with me as well.  :spin:

I don't think the entire Indy-Chicago stretch needs to be three-laned. It certainly could do with it, but I'd be happy enough with getting two or three new sections of maybe five miles of three lanes, just so there's more opportunities for the road to open up and for you to really make progress around clumps of trucks and cars.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 20, 2021, 11:19:46 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on June 20, 2021, 10:44:42 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on June 20, 2021, 05:43:23 PM
This may be a selfish preference based on my location, but I prefer the Indianapolis-Chicago part widened first. But getting either segment completely widened would be an achievement.

I second the motion, but I will not deny, there's definitely some bias with me as well.  :spin:

I don't think the entire Indy-Chicago stretch needs to be three-laned. It certainly could do with it, but I'd be happy enough with getting two or three new sections of maybe five miles of three lanes, just so there's more opportunities for the road to open up and for you to really make progress around clumps of trucks and cars.

i hate 65 up to chicago. i bail out on 52 and take it to 41!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on June 21, 2021, 12:40:51 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 20, 2021, 11:19:46 PM
i hate 65 up to chicago. i bail out on 52 and take it to 41!

In my opinion this is why Louisville to Indy should be widened to six lanes first. At least from Lafayette to Northwest Indiana there is the US 52/US 41 alternative to take. Southern Indiana has a mostly two-lane US 31 that goes through every conceivable town along its routing, making I-65 the only fast way through that area. To this day I don't exactly know why Columbus to Seymour was made six lanes when it at least had two alternative highways (US 31 and SR 11) but whatever. So put me in the camp that says Louisville to Indy should be first, along with the remainder of Lebanon to Lafayette, then we can start working on six-laning the part from northern Tippecanoe County to SR 2.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 21, 2021, 12:46:53 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on June 21, 2021, 12:40:51 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 20, 2021, 11:19:46 PM
i hate 65 up to chicago. i bail out on 52 and take it to 41!

In my opinion this is why Louisville to Indy should be widened to six lanes first. At least from Lafayette to Northwest Indiana there is the US 52/US 41 alternative to take. Southern Indiana has a mostly two-lane US 31 that goes through every conceivable town along its routing, making I-65 the only fast way through that area. To this day I don't exactly know why Columbus to Seymour was made six lanes when it at least had two alternative highways (US 31 and SR 11) but whatever. So put me in the camp that says Louisville to Indy should be first, along with the remainder of Lebanon to Lafayette, then we can start working on six-laning the part from northern Tippecanoe River to SR 2.

I think it's safe to say that the area around 46 will be last. that bridge will be VERY expensive to widen.  :-D
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 21, 2021, 07:23:55 AM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on June 20, 2021, 10:44:42 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on June 20, 2021, 05:43:23 PM
This may be a selfish preference based on my location, but I prefer the Indianapolis-Chicago part widened first. But getting either segment completely widened would be an achievement.

I second the motion, but I will not deny, there's definitely some bias with me as well.  :spin:

I don't think the entire Indy-Chicago stretch needs to be three-laned. It certainly could do with it, but I'd be happy enough with getting two or three new sections of maybe five miles of three lanes, just so there's more opportunities for the road to open up and for you to really make progress around clumps of trucks and cars.

I drive 65 a lot and I can tell you the entire stretch really does need it. Yes, commuter traffic is heavier near the cities, but long haul truck traffic is heavy along the entire route. You can get stuck behind a truck going 66 in the left lane passing a truck going 65 in the right lane at any point in Indiana.

As to the order it should get done, it doesn't really matter. It all needs it, and the sooner the better.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Avalanchez71 on June 21, 2021, 03:00:12 PM
Once you add another lane you get more traffic.  More traffic means you will want more lanes.  Holding the line works.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JoePCool14 on June 21, 2021, 03:02:20 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 21, 2021, 03:00:12 PM
Once you add another lane you get more traffic.  More traffic means you will want more lanes.  Holding the line works.

I don't think that really applies for a section of rural interstate originating from the metropolitan area of one of the nation's biggest–if not THE biggest–intermodal and intramodal infrastructure hubs. (Chicago) The traffic is there regardless of adding the extra lane.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 21, 2021, 03:39:43 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 21, 2021, 03:00:12 PM
Once you add another lane you get more traffic.  More traffic means you will want more lanes.  Holding the line works.

Going from 2-3 lanes means you get a lane that trucks are not allowed to be in. That is a huge difference regardless of whether or not traffic increases.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ssummers72 on June 21, 2021, 03:43:58 PM
If I-65 is not expanded with the addition of another lane. Then, how many accidents and fatalities would there need to be to justify the addition of another lane?

I had many projects when I worked for INDOT along I-65 and I-80/94 in NW Indiana. The argument of lets just not add another lane does not work. You have I-80, 90, 94, 294 flowing from Chicago into I-65 South and I-80/90/94 to the East with no relief route. With the increase in Truck Traffic traveling between the Chicago and the markets to the Southeast, not just Indianapolis and Louisville you need to look at the larger picture as to what traffic I-65 handles.

Also, if we stick with this principal as well on I-80/94, it does not work. Just compare the Illinois side versus Indiana side when it comes to holding the line on adding a lane (4 thru lanes in Indiana versus 5 thru lanes in Illinois) in regards to traffic congestion. Indiana held the line and Illinois did not.

Not all lane additions are for the sake of just adding a lane, 9 times out of 10, it is for SAFETY. Take it from someone that has had coworkers killed due to over capacity and unsafe highways.

So, if we hold the line on not adding a lane then, where will the traffic go?

Concerned for SAFETY a former INDOT Project Manager
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-39 on June 21, 2021, 03:46:59 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 21, 2021, 03:00:12 PM
Once you add another lane you get more traffic.  More traffic means you will want more lanes.  Holding the line works.

Nope, holding the line slows movement/commerce and causes massive safety hazards. We can't all be driving on horse and buggy on dirt roads. I-65 needs to be 6+ lanes from I-80/94 in Gary to Nashville.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on June 21, 2021, 04:32:05 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 21, 2021, 03:00:12 PM
Once you add another lane you get more traffic.  More traffic means you will want more lanes.  Holding the line works.
I've used this example before, and I'll use it again.

I drove I-95 between Florida and North Carolina during a peak weekend during this past spring. Traffic was heavy on the 6 lane Georgia and Florida portions, but was moving at least 70 mph, and often times 75-85 mph. Very dense, but fast. Come into the 3rd lane drop and into 4 lane South Carolina, that dense traffic was moving between 45-60 mph, and often stop and go.

But sure, rural widening "doesn't work".

And this isn't even complaining about truck traffic. My closest equivalent personally experiencing with would be I-81. There are areas that are 6 lanes but it's mostly 4 lanes throughout. In the 4 lane areas, there's countless times with trucks micropassing for miles on end with no escape. Stuck at 62-65 mph for miles on end. Then when one does move over, you open up to 80 mph, then stuck behind the next platoon. On the 6 lane sections, this is happening all the time in the right two lanes, but the third lane is wide open and allows easy passing while trucks can do their games without interrupting car traffic. Amazing how it works.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 21, 2021, 06:56:19 PM
"holding the line" in this case is stupid

Pixel 5

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: thenetwork on June 21, 2021, 08:15:35 PM
I remember when I-71 between Cleveland and Columbus  was only 2 lanes in each direction.   Most weekends you either stayed in the right lane and averaged 45 MPH or find an opening in the left lane and *maybe* reach 55-65.

Originally, when they were slowly adding the 3-lane segments, there were originally 2 sections that were not going to be 3-laned because of the "ruralness" (one south of Medina, and one in Delaware or Morrow County).  When the "choke points" were completed, the traffic got worse. 

Didn't take long for ODOT to realize they need a full 3 lanes minimum between Cleveland and Columbus, which finally got done about 5-6 years ago.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on June 21, 2021, 08:24:12 PM
Quote from: thenetwork on June 21, 2021, 08:15:35 PM
I remember when I-71 between Cleveland and Columbus  was only 2 lanes in each direction.   Most weekends you either stayed in the right lane and averaged 45 MPH or find an opening in the left lane and *maybe* reach 55-65.

Originally, when they were slowly adding the 3-lane segments, there were originally 2 sections that were not going to be 3-laned because of the "ruralness" (one south of Medina, and one in Delaware or Morrow County).  When the "choke points" were completed, the traffic got worse. 

Didn't take long for ODOT to realize they need a full 3 lanes minimum between Cleveland and Columbus, which finally got done about 5-6 years ago.
Wow, didn't know it was that bad before the 6-laning. Makes I-71 between Cincinnati and Columbus (a drive I do every 3 months or so) look very sparse, as you can still average 65-75 mph, and sometimes even go up to 80 on the left lane, on weekends there. It looks like it can wait for about a decade before the need to 6 lane it at current traffic levels. Though it seems like ODOT is preparing for its eventual widening, with enough space for a 3rd lane in each direction on the reconstructed Jeremiah Morrow Bridge (https://www.google.com/maps/@39.4193048,-84.1038078,3a,75y,50.71h,75.47t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sBw7cJMcsp_0z2qnlOIXFNg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on June 21, 2021, 08:55:04 PM
I-95 between Richmond and Fredericksburg is on the verge of needing 8 lanes during peak periods, it definitely needs 8 lanes north of there to DC... I couldn't imagine if that stretch of I-95 was still only 2 lanes in each direction. It would be a nightmare, far worse than it is now.

I often complain about "only" having 6 lanes... but I guess it's good it's at least that!

I-64 between Richmond and Williamsburg sits at 4 lanes... it's a nightmare during peak periods and always packed (though moving at least 55-65 mph when off peak - always caught behind platoons that insist at maintaining below the 70 mph speed limit in both lanes with wide swaths of nothing in front of them) regardless of when you travel it... VDOT plans to expand the highway to 6 lanes but the only thing preventing that ~30 mile segment from beginning construction is funding.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 21, 2021, 09:43:12 PM
"preserving the ruralness" means " I don't want you to build this highway"
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 08:13:00 AM
Quote from: sprjus4 on June 21, 2021, 04:32:05 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 21, 2021, 03:00:12 PM
Once you add another lane you get more traffic.  More traffic means you will want more lanes.  Holding the line works.
I've used this example before, and I'll use it again.

I drove I-95 between Florida and North Carolina during a peak weekend during this past spring. Traffic was heavy on the 6 lane Georgia and Florida portions, but was moving at least 70 mph, and often times 75-85 mph. Very dense, but fast. Come into the 3rd lane drop and into 4 lane South Carolina, that dense traffic was moving between 45-60 mph, and often stop and go.

But sure, rural widening "doesn't work".

And this isn't even complaining about truck traffic. My closest equivalent personally experiencing with would be I-81. There are areas that are 6 lanes but it's mostly 4 lanes throughout. In the 4 lane areas, there's countless times with trucks micropassing for miles on end with no escape. Stuck at 62-65 mph for miles on end. Then when one does move over, you open up to 80 mph, then stuck behind the next platoon. On the 6 lane sections, this is happening all the time in the right two lanes, but the third lane is wide open and allows easy passing while trucks can do their games without interrupting car traffic. Amazing how it works.

80 85 MPH in VA is reckless driving, FYI.  They can take you straight to a magistrate as well.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jmacswimmer on June 22, 2021, 08:24:24 AM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 08:13:00 AM
Quote from: sprjus4 on June 21, 2021, 04:32:05 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 21, 2021, 03:00:12 PM
Once you add another lane you get more traffic.  More traffic means you will want more lanes.  Holding the line works.
I've used this example before, and I'll use it again.

I drove I-95 between Florida and North Carolina during a peak weekend during this past spring. Traffic was heavy on the 6 lane Georgia and Florida portions, but was moving at least 70 mph, and often times 75-85 mph. Very dense, but fast. Come into the 3rd lane drop and into 4 lane South Carolina, that dense traffic was moving between 45-60 mph, and often stop and go.

But sure, rural widening "doesn't work".

And this isn't even complaining about truck traffic. My closest equivalent personally experiencing with would be I-81. There are areas that are 6 lanes but it's mostly 4 lanes throughout. In the 4 lane areas, there's countless times with trucks micropassing for miles on end with no escape. Stuck at 62-65 mph for miles on end. Then when one does move over, you open up to 80 mph, then stuck behind the next platoon. On the 6 lane sections, this is happening all the time in the right two lanes, but the third lane is wide open and allows easy passing while trucks can do their games without interrupting car traffic. Amazing how it works.

80 MPH in VA is reckless driving, FYI.  They can take you straight to a magistrate as well.

Not anymore (https://landline.media/virginia-revises-reckless-driving-passing-rules/)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 09:11:55 AM
Quote from: jmacswimmer on June 22, 2021, 08:24:24 AM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 08:13:00 AM
Quote from: sprjus4 on June 21, 2021, 04:32:05 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 21, 2021, 03:00:12 PM
Once you add another lane you get more traffic.  More traffic means you will want more lanes.  Holding the line works.
I've used this example before, and I'll use it again.

I drove I-95 between Florida and North Carolina during a peak weekend during this past spring. Traffic was heavy on the 6 lane Georgia and Florida portions, but was moving at least 70 mph, and often times 75-85 mph. Very dense, but fast. Come into the 3rd lane drop and into 4 lane South Carolina, that dense traffic was moving between 45-60 mph, and often stop and go.

But sure, rural widening "doesn't work".

And this isn't even complaining about truck traffic. My closest equivalent personally experiencing with would be I-81. There are areas that are 6 lanes but it's mostly 4 lanes throughout. In the 4 lane areas, there's countless times with trucks micropassing for miles on end with no escape. Stuck at 62-65 mph for miles on end. Then when one does move over, you open up to 80 mph, then stuck behind the next platoon. On the 6 lane sections, this is happening all the time in the right two lanes, but the third lane is wide open and allows easy passing while trucks can do their games without interrupting car traffic. Amazing how it works.

80 MPH in VA is reckless driving, FYI.  They can take you straight to a magistrate as well.

Not anymore (https://landline.media/virginia-revises-reckless-driving-passing-rules/)

Thank you for the update.  I should have checked first prior to posting for an update on the law.  I know that for years they were trying to change it but the VSP lobby had a vice grip on that law.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JoePCool14 on June 22, 2021, 10:48:55 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 21, 2021, 09:43:12 PM
"preserving the ruralness" means " I don't want you to build this highway"

In most cases, yeah, it probably does. But that does bring up the way rural interstates get six-laned. Sometimes they are built with tall concrete medians which can destroy the rural feel of the highway, and understandably, this isn't really always desirable.

This discussion has been had on other threads, but where possible, driving on six-laned rural Interstates should still feel rural, not urban.

Also, we're heading back to Chicago again today on I-65, so we'll see how that goes. :spin:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 10:51:11 AM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on June 22, 2021, 10:48:55 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 21, 2021, 09:43:12 PM
"preserving the ruralness" means " I don't want you to build this highway"

In most cases, yeah, it probably does. But that does bring up the way rural interstates get six-laned. Sometimes they are built with tall concrete medians which can destroy the rural feel of the highway, and understandably, this isn't really always desirable.

This discussion has been had on other threads, but where possible, driving on six-laned rural Interstates should still feel rural, not urban.

Also, we're heading back to Chicago again today on I-65, so we'll see how that goes. :spin:

I just take US 41 in lieu of I-65.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on June 22, 2021, 11:28:57 AM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 10:51:11 AM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on June 22, 2021, 10:48:55 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 21, 2021, 09:43:12 PM
"preserving the ruralness" means " I don't want you to build this highway"

In most cases, yeah, it probably does. But that does bring up the way rural interstates get six-laned. Sometimes they are built with tall concrete medians which can destroy the rural feel of the highway, and understandably, this isn't really always desirable.

This discussion has been had on other threads, but where possible, driving on six-laned rural Interstates should still feel rural, not urban.

Also, we're heading back to Chicago again today on I-65, so we'll see how that goes. :spin:

I just take US 41 in lieu of I-65.
And then claim I-65 doesn't need widening. Maybe if you're constantly taking alternative routes to avoid the interstate traffic, it says something about the interstate.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on June 22, 2021, 11:29:20 AM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 08:13:00 AM
Quote from: sprjus4 on June 21, 2021, 04:32:05 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 21, 2021, 03:00:12 PM
Once you add another lane you get more traffic.  More traffic means you will want more lanes.  Holding the line works.
I've used this example before, and I'll use it again.

I drove I-95 between Florida and North Carolina during a peak weekend during this past spring. Traffic was heavy on the 6 lane Georgia and Florida portions, but was moving at least 70 mph, and often times 75-85 mph. Very dense, but fast. Come into the 3rd lane drop and into 4 lane South Carolina, that dense traffic was moving between 45-60 mph, and often stop and go.

But sure, rural widening "doesn't work".

And this isn't even complaining about truck traffic. My closest equivalent personally experiencing with would be I-81. There are areas that are 6 lanes but it's mostly 4 lanes throughout. In the 4 lane areas, there's countless times with trucks micropassing for miles on end with no escape. Stuck at 62-65 mph for miles on end. Then when one does move over, you open up to 80 mph, then stuck behind the next platoon. On the 6 lane sections, this is happening all the time in the right two lanes, but the third lane is wide open and allows easy passing while trucks can do their games without interrupting car traffic. Amazing how it works.

80 85 MPH in VA is reckless driving, FYI.  They can take you straight to a magistrate as well.
And your point is? I've driven 90 mph before  :-o

It's funny how you constantly dodge the information being passed in the post that would hurt any of your arguments, then cherry pick other information to get on about. You claim to have been a politician before - but won't indicate specifically what - and honestly, given this behavior, I'd believe it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 22, 2021, 12:10:52 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 21, 2021, 03:39:43 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 21, 2021, 03:00:12 PM
Once you add another lane you get more traffic.  More traffic means you will want more lanes.  Holding the line works.

Going from 2-3 lanes means you get a lane that trucks are not allowed to be in. That is a huge difference regardless of whether or not traffic increases.

The lack of a response to this statement has been noted and entered into the record as agreed to by all parties.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on June 22, 2021, 12:15:26 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 22, 2021, 12:10:52 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 21, 2021, 03:39:43 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 21, 2021, 03:00:12 PM
Once you add another lane you get more traffic.  More traffic means you will want more lanes.  Holding the line works.

Going from 2-3 lanes means you get a lane that trucks are not allowed to be in. That is a huge difference regardless of whether or not traffic increases.

The lack of a response to this statement has been noted and entered into the record as agreed to by all parties.
As well as most of the well-rounded arguments that support 6 lane widening. He can only counter scenarios, not real-life examples that have actually proven very successful.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 12:48:58 PM
The interstate system was set up for commerce and defense.  I say let the trucks have the interstate. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 12:52:48 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on June 22, 2021, 12:15:26 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 22, 2021, 12:10:52 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 21, 2021, 03:39:43 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 21, 2021, 03:00:12 PM
Once you add another lane you get more traffic.  More traffic means you will want more lanes.  Holding the line works.

Going from 2-3 lanes means you get a lane that trucks are not allowed to be in. That is a huge difference regardless of whether or not traffic increases.

The lack of a response to this statement has been noted and entered into the record as agreed to by all parties.
As well as most of the well-rounded arguments that support 6 lane widening. He can only counter scenarios, not real-life examples that have actually proven very successful.

I-24 was widened from 4 lanes to 8 lanes to Murfreesboro under the auspices of growth.  The lanes were needed to handle the capacity and the traffic flow.  Well guess what people are constantly complaining about the traffic in this corridor.  It is no better now then when it was four lanes.  Now they want more.  More lanes does not equal relief.  These capacity issues will not change until driver behavior changes.  You can't wait to merge until the last second and expect not to affect traffic.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on June 22, 2021, 12:54:41 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 12:48:58 PM
The interstate system was set up for commerce and defense.  I say let the trucks have the interstate.
If we're trying to get as much passenger cars off the interstate as we can, it would be easier to do if the country's passenger rail system is drastically better than it is currently.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 22, 2021, 01:04:01 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 12:48:58 PM
The interstate system was set up for commerce and defense.  I say let the trucks have the interstate. 

That's fine, if only trucking companies pay for them.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 22, 2021, 01:06:09 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 12:52:48 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on June 22, 2021, 12:15:26 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 22, 2021, 12:10:52 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 21, 2021, 03:39:43 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 21, 2021, 03:00:12 PM
Once you add another lane you get more traffic.  More traffic means you will want more lanes.  Holding the line works.

Going from 2-3 lanes means you get a lane that trucks are not allowed to be in. That is a huge difference regardless of whether or not traffic increases.

The lack of a response to this statement has been noted and entered into the record as agreed to by all parties.
As well as most of the well-rounded arguments that support 6 lane widening. He can only counter scenarios, not real-life examples that have actually proven very successful.

I-24 was widened from 4 lanes to 8 lanes to Murfreesboro under the auspices of growth.  The lanes were needed to handle the capacity and the traffic flow.  Well guess what people are constantly complaining about the traffic in this corridor.  It is no better now then when it was four lanes.  Now they want more.  More lanes does not equal relief.  These capacity issues will not change until driver behavior changes.  You can't wait to merge until the last second and expect not to affect traffic.

Per Wikipedia and other sources, Murfeesboro is located in the Nashville Metropolitan Area. As such, it is not rural and not relevant to the discussion of adding lanes to rural freeways.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on June 22, 2021, 01:27:46 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 22, 2021, 01:06:09 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 12:52:48 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on June 22, 2021, 12:15:26 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 22, 2021, 12:10:52 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 21, 2021, 03:39:43 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 21, 2021, 03:00:12 PM
Once you add another lane you get more traffic.  More traffic means you will want more lanes.  Holding the line works.

Going from 2-3 lanes means you get a lane that trucks are not allowed to be in. That is a huge difference regardless of whether or not traffic increases.

The lack of a response to this statement has been noted and entered into the record as agreed to by all parties.
As well as most of the well-rounded arguments that support 6 lane widening. He can only counter scenarios, not real-life examples that have actually proven very successful.

I-24 was widened from 4 lanes to 8 lanes to Murfreesboro under the auspices of growth.  The lanes were needed to handle the capacity and the traffic flow.  Well guess what people are constantly complaining about the traffic in this corridor.  It is no better now then when it was four lanes.  Now they want more.  More lanes does not equal relief.  These capacity issues will not change until driver behavior changes.  You can't wait to merge until the last second and expect not to affect traffic.

Per Wikipedia and other sources, Murfeesboro is located in the Nashville Metropolitan Area. As such, it is not rural and not relevant to the discussion of adding lanes to rural freeways.
In addition, it feeds into the induced demand fallacy. The highway got more congested because of rapid growth adding more vehicles to the highway. The highway would be far worse today if it was only 4 lanes. But they'll claim the added lanes is the only reason congestion increased, not the growth around it.

Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 12:48:58 PM
The interstate system was set up for commerce and defense.  I say let the trucks have the interstate. 
The was only part of the reason. Automobiles had been clogging city streets and rural routes that were substandard. A system of new roads were needed to handle this demand and provide city bypasses / through routes. The interstate highway system today provides just as equally a role for automobiles as it does freight and commerce. Everybody is paying gas taxes to fund these roads and expansions. It's not just the trucks.

Adding third lanes in heavy truck areas (which you're still continuing to ignore the 3rd lane argument for long distance rural corridors like I-95 that carry heavy volumes of traffic - see my Georgia and Florida example you continue to ignore) allows easier passage of trucks and can cut down on road rage, drivers attempting dangerous maneuvers to get in front of trucks, plus rolling backups, sudden slowdowns, etc. It significantly improves safety as well as reliability on the corridor. These are important factors, again, you continue to ignore and disregard. Your arguments are weak minded and don't reflect reality, and it shows every time you post.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 01:29:19 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on June 22, 2021, 01:27:46 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 22, 2021, 01:06:09 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 12:52:48 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on June 22, 2021, 12:15:26 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 22, 2021, 12:10:52 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 21, 2021, 03:39:43 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 21, 2021, 03:00:12 PM
Once you add another lane you get more traffic.  More traffic means you will want more lanes.  Holding the line works.

Going from 2-3 lanes means you get a lane that trucks are not allowed to be in. That is a huge difference regardless of whether or not traffic increases.

The lack of a response to this statement has been noted and entered into the record as agreed to by all parties.
As well as most of the well-rounded arguments that support 6 lane widening. He can only counter scenarios, not real-life examples that have actually proven very successful.

I-24 was widened from 4 lanes to 8 lanes to Murfreesboro under the auspices of growth.  The lanes were needed to handle the capacity and the traffic flow.  Well guess what people are constantly complaining about the traffic in this corridor.  It is no better now then when it was four lanes.  Now they want more.  More lanes does not equal relief.  These capacity issues will not change until driver behavior changes.  You can't wait to merge until the last second and expect not to affect traffic.

Per Wikipedia and other sources, Murfeesboro is located in the Nashville Metropolitan Area. As such, it is not rural and not relevant to the discussion of adding lanes to rural freeways.
In addition, it feeds into the induced demand fallacy. The highway got more congested because of rapid growth adding more vehicles to the highway. The highway would be far worse today if it was only 4 lanes. But they'll claim the added lanes is the only reason congestion increased, not the growth around it.

Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 12:48:58 PM
The interstate system was set up for commerce and defense.  I say let the trucks have the interstate. 
The was only part of the reason. Automobiles had been clogging city streets and rural routes that were substandard. A system of new roads were needed to handle this demand and provide city bypasses / through routes. The interstate highway system today provides just as equally a role for automobiles as it does freight and commerce. Everybody is paying gas taxes to fund these roads and expansions. It's not just the trucks.

Adding third lanes in heavy truck areas (which you're still continuing to ignore the 3rd lane argument for long distance rural corridors like I-95 that carry heavy volumes of traffic - see my Georgia and Florida example you continue to ignore) allows easier passage of trucks and can cut down on road rage, drivers attempting dangerous maneuvers to get in front of trucks, plus rolling backups, sudden slowdowns, etc. It significantly improves safety as well as reliability on the corridor. These are important factors, again, you continue to ignore and disregard. Your arguments are weak minded and don't reflect reality, and it shows every time you post.

The issue is not lane capacity it is driver behavior.  We continue to reward driver behavior with additional capacity and the expense of the tax payer.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on June 22, 2021, 01:37:57 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 01:29:19 PM
The issue is not lane capacity it is driver behavior.  We continue to reward driver behavior with additional capacity and the expense of the tax payer.
You ignored just about every piece of the post you quoted.

Having rolling backups of trucks going 60-62 mph in both lanes on a 70-75 mph highway is not acceptable. With high truck volumes, 6 lanes is warranted. Period.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 02:01:40 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on June 22, 2021, 01:37:57 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 01:29:19 PM
The issue is not lane capacity it is driver behavior.  We continue to reward driver behavior with additional capacity and the expense of the tax payer.
You ignored just about every piece of the post you quoted.

Having rolling backups of trucks going 60-62 mph in both lanes on a 70-75 mph highway is not acceptable. With high truck volumes, 6 lanes is warranted. Period.

I am speaking of a vehicle that decides to whip between two semis to shave 10 seconds off a commute.  That is the driver behavior that I am speaking of that should not be rewarded.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 22, 2021, 02:17:00 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 01:29:19 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on June 22, 2021, 01:27:46 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 22, 2021, 01:06:09 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 12:52:48 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on June 22, 2021, 12:15:26 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 22, 2021, 12:10:52 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on June 21, 2021, 03:39:43 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 21, 2021, 03:00:12 PM
Once you add another lane you get more traffic.  More traffic means you will want more lanes.  Holding the line works.

Going from 2-3 lanes means you get a lane that trucks are not allowed to be in. That is a huge difference regardless of whether or not traffic increases.

The lack of a response to this statement has been noted and entered into the record as agreed to by all parties.
As well as most of the well-rounded arguments that support 6 lane widening. He can only counter scenarios, not real-life examples that have actually proven very successful.

I-24 was widened from 4 lanes to 8 lanes to Murfreesboro under the auspices of growth.  The lanes were needed to handle the capacity and the traffic flow.  Well guess what people are constantly complaining about the traffic in this corridor.  It is no better now then when it was four lanes.  Now they want more.  More lanes does not equal relief.  These capacity issues will not change until driver behavior changes.  You can't wait to merge until the last second and expect not to affect traffic.

Per Wikipedia and other sources, Murfeesboro is located in the Nashville Metropolitan Area. As such, it is not rural and not relevant to the discussion of adding lanes to rural freeways.
In addition, it feeds into the induced demand fallacy. The highway got more congested because of rapid growth adding more vehicles to the highway. The highway would be far worse today if it was only 4 lanes. But they'll claim the added lanes is the only reason congestion increased, not the growth around it.

Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 12:48:58 PM
The interstate system was set up for commerce and defense.  I say let the trucks have the interstate. 
The was only part of the reason. Automobiles had been clogging city streets and rural routes that were substandard. A system of new roads were needed to handle this demand and provide city bypasses / through routes. The interstate highway system today provides just as equally a role for automobiles as it does freight and commerce. Everybody is paying gas taxes to fund these roads and expansions. It's not just the trucks.

Adding third lanes in heavy truck areas (which you're still continuing to ignore the 3rd lane argument for long distance rural corridors like I-95 that carry heavy volumes of traffic - see my Georgia and Florida example you continue to ignore) allows easier passage of trucks and can cut down on road rage, drivers attempting dangerous maneuvers to get in front of trucks, plus rolling backups, sudden slowdowns, etc. It significantly improves safety as well as reliability on the corridor. These are important factors, again, you continue to ignore and disregard. Your arguments are weak minded and don't reflect reality, and it shows every time you post.

The issue is not lane capacity it is driver behavior.  We continue to reward driver behavior with additional capacity and the expense of the tax payer.

You're essentially saying that 99% of the drivers should be forced to suffer longer trips just to spite the 1% who drive dangerously.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on June 22, 2021, 02:33:18 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 22, 2021, 02:01:40 PM
I am speaking of a vehicle that decides to whip between two semis to shave 10 seconds off a commute.  That is the driver behavior that I am speaking of that should not be rewarded.
I've cut between gaps before (when there's enough space to safely do so) and got ahead of a truck positioned in the left lane to sit there for 20 minutes micropassing another truck going 62.4 mph at 62.5 mph, get ahead one mile, and see a whole bunch of nothingness behind me because everyone got stuck behind those two trucks. It definitely pays off when it can be done, far more than "10 seconds".

Of course, if the infrastructure was properly built up, there would be a third lane and none of this would be an issue.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ukfan758 on June 22, 2021, 03:49:29 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on June 22, 2021, 10:48:55 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 21, 2021, 09:43:12 PM
"preserving the ruralness" means " I don't want you to build this highway"

In most cases, yeah, it probably does. But that does bring up the way rural interstates get six-laned. Sometimes they are built with tall concrete medians which can destroy the rural feel of the highway, and understandably, this isn't really always desirable.

This discussion has been had on other threads, but where possible, driving on six-laned rural Interstates should still feel rural, not urban.

Also, we're heading back to Chicago again today on I-65, so we'll see how that goes. :spin:

I'll take sacrificing "ruralness"  if it means an out of control semi truck will crash into a tall concrete barrier and stay on their side rather than plow straight through guardrail or cable barrier into oncoming traffic.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on June 22, 2021, 07:13:46 PM
Quote from: ukfan758 on June 22, 2021, 03:49:29 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on June 22, 2021, 10:48:55 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 21, 2021, 09:43:12 PM
"preserving the ruralness" means " I don't want you to build this highway"

In most cases, yeah, it probably does. But that does bring up the way rural interstates get six-laned. Sometimes they are built with tall concrete medians which can destroy the rural feel of the highway, and understandably, this isn't really always desirable.

This discussion has been had on other threads, but where possible, driving on six-laned rural Interstates should still feel rural, not urban.

Also, we're heading back to Chicago again today on I-65, so we'll see how that goes. :spin:

I'll take sacrificing "ruralness"  if it means an out of control semi truck will crash into a tall concrete barrier and stay on their side rather than plow straight through guardrail or cable barrier into oncoming traffic.

And if you want "ruralness" there are a plethora of county roads you can take instead.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSOWorld on June 22, 2021, 07:38:06 PM
the 1-laned county roads?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Avalanchez71 on June 23, 2021, 11:00:02 AM
Quote from: SSOWorld on June 22, 2021, 07:38:06 PM
the 1-laned county roads?

Is this serious?  I would prefer a road that is safe for on road vehicle travel.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: FixThe74Sign on June 23, 2021, 10:50:24 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 23, 2021, 11:00:02 AM
Quote from: SSOWorld on June 22, 2021, 07:38:06 PM
the 1-laned county roads?

Is this serious?  I would prefer a road that is safe for on road vehicle travel.

Then that would be a road that has enough capacity to allow a constant speed of travel. Not one constantly bottled up with trucks.

Also, does anyone know what working is being done on I-74 near Shelbyville? Are they finally, FINALLY going to properly redo those awful concrete sections?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on June 23, 2021, 11:11:07 PM
Agreed. Having a limited access highway that is only 4 lanes wide and carrying high truck volume creates a speed differential between cars and trucks that significantly decreases safety. Having a third lane allows those speed differentials to be split, restricts trucks to a certain portion of the roadway, and increases safety overall as well as decreasing travel times and improving reliability. These basic, proven concepts have not seemed to sit with some people though.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Avalanchez71 on June 24, 2021, 01:02:29 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on June 23, 2021, 11:11:07 PM
Agreed. Having a limited access highway that is only 4 lanes wide and carrying high truck volume creates a speed differential between cars and trucks that significantly decreases safety. Having a third lane allows those speed differentials to be split, restricts trucks to a certain portion of the roadway, and increases safety overall as well as decreasing travel times and improving reliability. These basic, proven concepts have not seemed to sit with some people though.

The third lane encourages a large speed differential which is a recipe for disaster.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on June 24, 2021, 01:27:33 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 24, 2021, 01:02:29 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on June 23, 2021, 11:11:07 PM
Agreed. Having a limited access highway that is only 4 lanes wide and carrying high truck volume creates a speed differential between cars and trucks that significantly decreases safety. Having a third lane allows those speed differentials to be split, restricts trucks to a certain portion of the roadway, and increases safety overall as well as decreasing travel times and improving reliability. These basic, proven concepts have not seemed to sit with some people though.

The third lane encourages a large speed differential which is a recipe for disaster.
I'd love to see evidence that a six lane rural interstate highway is more dangerous than a four lane interstate highway.

Hate to break it to you buddy, but the speed differential is happening no matter what. It's the conflict point when cars come upon trucks. With no passing route for a truck in the left lane, that causes the vehicles to have to drastically reduce speed in some instances, which in heavier traffic can cause overreaction, which is heavy enough, enough breaking can lead into a small rolling backup. It can also cause rear-end collisions if there is an inattentive driver, or coming over a hill upon a slow passing vehicle in the left lane, etc. With six lanes, there's an escape route and most of the time an unobstructed lane for cars to safely pass trucks in both right lanes passing each other, and with trucks prohibited from the left lane altogether, except in the few instances where that's ignored, that major speed differential doesn't exist.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 24, 2021, 02:25:01 PM
Hey everybody, instead of continuing to feed the troll, how about we all add him to our ignore lists?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on June 24, 2021, 07:54:00 PM
Didn't know that was a thing, thanks! Hopefully this thread gets back on track.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Avalanchez71 on June 24, 2021, 08:36:26 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on June 24, 2021, 01:27:33 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 24, 2021, 01:02:29 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on June 23, 2021, 11:11:07 PM
Agreed. Having a limited access highway that is only 4 lanes wide and carrying high truck volume creates a speed differential between cars and trucks that significantly decreases safety. Having a third lane allows those speed differentials to be split, restricts trucks to a certain portion of the roadway, and increases safety overall as well as decreasing travel times and improving reliability. These basic, proven concepts have not seemed to sit with some people though.

The third lane encourages a large speed differential which is a recipe for disaster.
I'd love to see evidence that a six lane rural interstate highway is more dangerous than a four lane interstate highway.

Hate to break it to you buddy, but the speed differential is happening no matter what. It's the conflict point when cars come upon trucks. With no passing route for a truck in the left lane, that causes the vehicles to have to drastically reduce speed in some instances, which in heavier traffic can cause overreaction, which is heavy enough, enough breaking can lead into a small rolling backup. It can also cause rear-end collisions if there is an inattentive driver, or coming over a hill upon a slow passing vehicle in the left lane, etc. With six lanes, there's an escape route and most of the time an unobstructed lane for cars to safely pass trucks in both right lanes passing each other, and with trucks prohibited from the left lane altogether, except in the few instances where that's ignored, that major speed differential doesn't exist.

Sure unitl you come up to the point were a self appointed lane cop decides to drive the speed limit. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Avalanchez71 on June 24, 2021, 08:37:07 PM
Are there any more US 41 Business signs still posted out in the field?  I remember seeing less and less over the years.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on June 25, 2021, 01:05:35 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 24, 2021, 08:37:07 PM
Are there any more US 41 Business signs still posted out in the field?  I remember seeing less and less over the years.
Just saw one this week in Evansville, and almost took a photo of it.  It is on northbound Fares Ave just north of Morgan Ave.  If I get out again, I'll capture it.

Or I can just post the following, and the sign still looks like this:

https://earth.google.com/web/search/North+Fares+Avenue+%26+East+Columbia+Street,+Evansville,+IN/@37.993115,-87.5427651,119.51863098a,0d,60y,353.92453748h,87.21316667t,0r/data=CigiJgokCYjZ5nbqVkNAEewRiGWdVkNAGQlgg7jJ4VXAIfvA-lkz4lXAIhoKFmJfTkVlZG1EWWtNblBGM2g2ZjNHZFEQAg
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Avalanchez71 on June 25, 2021, 01:17:55 PM
Did US 41 ever serve downtown Evansville?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: westerninterloper on June 25, 2021, 02:12:54 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 24, 2021, 08:37:07 PM
Are there any more US 41 Business signs still posted out in the field?  I remember seeing less and less over the years.
Google Maps marks North 6th Street in Vincennes as US41BUS, and there looks to be a relatively new sign posted on that street.

https://www.google.com/maps/@38.685349,-87.5132523,3a,75y,77.81h,73.31t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sUDFRhPMuKGsWLGwGQR7y7w!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

US41BUS through Terre Haute, 7th Street and Lafayette, was unsigned years ago. Not sure about Evansville.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Avalanchez71 on June 25, 2021, 02:49:48 PM
Per the AASHTO documents it looks like US 41 Business was officially designated on the old alignment on US 41 through Boswell.  I see no US 41 Business signs in Boswell.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: evvroads on June 26, 2021, 01:27:00 AM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 25, 2021, 01:17:55 PM
Did US 41 ever serve downtown Evansville?

Not directly. The old alignment of US 41 deviated west from its present alignment at Pigeon Creek. It followed Fares Ave south through the point where Fares turns into Canal St (running SW) just north of the present-day Lloyd Expy/US 41 interchange. It ran along Canal St for a couple of blocks until that curved south onto Kentucky Ave. It ran directly south on Kentucky Ave until it rejoined its present alignment south of I-69/Veterans Memorial Pkwy.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: evvroads on June 26, 2021, 01:47:00 AM
Quote from: Life in Paradise on June 25, 2021, 01:05:35 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 24, 2021, 08:37:07 PM
Are there any more US 41 Business signs still posted out in the field?  I remember seeing less and less over the years.
Just saw one this week in Evansville, and almost took a photo of it.  It is on northbound Fares Ave just north of Morgan Ave.  If I get out again, I'll capture it.

Or I can just post the following, and the sign still looks like this:

https://earth.google.com/web/search/North+Fares+Avenue+%26+East+Columbia+Street,+Evansville,+IN/@37.993115,-87.5427651,119.51863098a,0d,60y,353.92453748h,87.21316667t,0r/data=CigiJgokCYjZ5nbqVkNAEewRiGWdVkNAGQlgg7jJ4VXAIfvA-lkz4lXAIhoKFmJfTkVlZG1EWWtNblBGM2g2ZjNHZFEQAg

Also may be interesting to note (not sure how common knowledge it is)... Evansville City GIS labels Fares Ave between Maxwell Ave and just north of Diamond Ave as "Old Business 41" in addition to Fares Ave. When police and fire get dispatched to addresses along that stretch, the address given is 2000 Old Business 41 instead of 2000 N Fares Ave (like Google Maps has labeled).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on June 29, 2021, 06:31:19 PM
https://www.wane.com/traffic/construction-of-reduced-conflict-intersection-begins-july-6-on-us-30/

Starting on or after July 6, the intersection at S CR 500 E on US 30 will be converted into a Reduced-Conflict Intersection (RCI) with construction to last through early August (weather-depending).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on June 29, 2021, 08:39:55 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on June 29, 2021, 06:31:19 PM
https://www.wane.com/traffic/construction-of-reduced-conflict-intersection-begins-july-6-on-us-30/

Starting on or after July 6, the intersection at S CR 500 E on US 30 will be converted into a Reduced-Conflict Intersection (RCI) with construction to last through early August (weather-depending).

Does anyone other than INDOT call these things RCI's? Everyone else calls them J-turns!  :-D
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on June 29, 2021, 09:01:13 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 29, 2021, 08:39:55 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on June 29, 2021, 06:31:19 PM
https://www.wane.com/traffic/construction-of-reduced-conflict-intersection-begins-july-6-on-us-30/

Starting on or after July 6, the intersection at S CR 500 E on US 30 will be converted into a Reduced-Conflict Intersection (RCI) with construction to last through early August (weather-depending).

Does anyone other than INDOT call these things RCI's? Everyone else calls them J-turns!  :-D
I hear them called "Superstreets" the most often.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: triplemultiplex on July 02, 2021, 01:48:10 PM
I swear I've seen that term thrown around by WisDOT.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on July 02, 2021, 11:37:58 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on June 29, 2021, 09:01:13 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 29, 2021, 08:39:55 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on June 29, 2021, 06:31:19 PM
https://www.wane.com/traffic/construction-of-reduced-conflict-intersection-begins-july-6-on-us-30/

Starting on or after July 6, the intersection at S CR 500 E on US 30 will be converted into a Reduced-Conflict Intersection (RCI) with construction to last through early August (weather-depending).

Does anyone other than INDOT call these things RCI's? Everyone else calls them J-turns!  :-D
I hear them called "Superstreets" the most often.

The "superstreet" is probably used more in Ohio than in Indiana because J turns in OH (and MI for that matter) often occur on busy streets in urban areas, sometimes with traffic lights (notably the OH-4 bypass of Hamilton). Indiana only uses them on rural 4 lanes without traffic lights.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on July 05, 2021, 07:12:22 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on June 24, 2021, 08:37:07 PM
Are there any more US 41 Business signs still posted out in the field?  I remember seeing less and less over the years.

We have this one in North Terre Haute on Lafayette Ave that just says US 41. Before they renovated the intersection just north of it, it had a business sign above it, as you can see in older street view images.

https://goo.gl/maps/3wgNXAsEXL2G5YLR6
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: US 41 on July 05, 2021, 07:14:04 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 29, 2021, 08:39:55 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on June 29, 2021, 06:31:19 PM
https://www.wane.com/traffic/construction-of-reduced-conflict-intersection-begins-july-6-on-us-30/

Starting on or after July 6, the intersection at S CR 500 E on US 30 will be converted into a Reduced-Conflict Intersection (RCI) with construction to last through early August (weather-depending).

Does anyone other than INDOT call these things RCI's? Everyone else calls them J-turns!  :-D

I call them a Mexican U-turn aka "retorno".
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 06, 2021, 07:24:24 PM
Indiana 149 in Porter County will undergo construction throughout the entire stretch from US 12 to Indiana 130, starting next week. Full resurfacing will take place with frequent traffic flagging, which is planned to conclude in November. This includes bridge work over I-94 which is currently in progress, as well as a closure of the CSX railroad crossing just south of US 20, which is scheduled for next week. The intersection at Lenburg Road has been completed, which now includes a left turn lane and a flashing yellow arrow signal.

Crews have recently worked on ground studies for future work on a new bridge to the Port of Indiana in Burns Harbor. The bridge will be built alongside the current bridge, which will likely serve outgoing traffic, while the new span will serve incoming traffic. Bridge building work is set to begin next spring.

INDOT and Purdue University are currently conducting a study to test electric car charging lanes. While it's a long way off from construction, a test pavement area at an undisclosed location will be constructed for viability. Once objectives are satisfied, they will determine which interstate(s) will have those charging lanes. Again, this is far from finalized, but is a concept worth looking into once details are more concrete.

The following is for one of the busier local streets in Portage, but I thought I'd pass this along since this road is important for those connecting from anywhere between US 12 and the Indiana Toll Road. On top of the road work currently in progress on Indiana 249, the Willowcreek Bypass (the raised stretch of road between US 20 and the Toll Road) will undergo major road work. From July 12 to Halloween, the two bridges over the CSX railroads will be rebuilt and resurfaced. Next year, the same stretch will be resurfaced, including a small stretch between the Toll Road entrance and the Toll Road overpass.

I'm going to try and grab pictures of the current US 12/20 realignment project currently being done in Gary/Miller so I can post them here in the next few weeks. Lots of progress being made with an aggressive September completion time. What I can tell you that the former stretch of US 12 between the now-former split and Clay Street will be converted to a grassy field, and the new split has been carved out.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on July 06, 2021, 07:48:28 PM
In my hometown of La Porte, INDOT is working on replacing the '60s-'70s traffic signals with the new "INDOT" standard traffic signals within the city limits.

The following intersections that have received the wired spans are as followed: Monroe (SR 4) at Jefferson, Lincolnway at Jackson, Lincolnway at Clay, Lincolnway at Monroe (SR 4), Lincolnway at Michigan, and Lincolnway at Madison.
The other intersections that are not listed above have received the metal poles, and those are Lincolnway at Tyler, J at 1st, and J at 5th.
The remaining intersections that haven't been upgraded yet are Lincolnway at Indiana (US 35), Indiana at Jefferson, Indiana at Maple, and Indiana at Osborn.

Also, repaving SR 2 through town is almost complete with Lincolnway being fully paved on the driving lanes and J Street being paved on one lane of traffic. ADA ramps are also being improved with almost all of them being completed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 23, 2021, 07:20:25 PM
In a collaboration between IDOT and INDOT, a study will soon be underway to find methods of improving traffic flow along I-80/94 from Illinois 394 to I-65. The "FlexRoad Project"  is designed to find ways to alleviate congestion and reduce crashes along the oft-busy stretch. Potential plans being explored include hard shoulder running (opening up the shoulders to traffic during peak traffic hours), ramp metering (traffic signals along ramp entrances, designed to keep traffic in queue), variable speed limit signage, and additional VMS signage to warn drivers of congestion (similar to the system now used on the Jane Addams Tollway between O'Hare and Elgin). Public meetings will be held for further input on this upcoming project. For more information, head to www.indianaflexroad.com (http://www.indianaflexroad.com).

Along with the US 12/20 realignment project currently in progress, US 20 sees additional road work just a bit further east. Between Lake/Porter County Line Road and Clem Road in Portage, only one lane gets by in each direction, with multiple shifts. Two bridges are being refurbished in the area, with completion send for mid-fall.

Also in Porter County, I-94 will see bridge overlay work between Indiana 249 and US 20 (Burns Harbor). Only two lanes get by in each direction, which will cause delays during peak times. Plan accordingly, since most of the alternate routes (like US 20 - see above) are also facing construction projects. If you're willing to spend money, the Toll Road is a viable route.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on July 23, 2021, 10:07:37 PM
^ If they were serious about doing something to relieve congestion, they should be starting with a much wider scope (which IMHO should include another look building at least part of the Illiana) and then narrowi hings down to ITS/flex lane options.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 23, 2021, 10:25:18 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on July 23, 2021, 10:07:37 PM
^ If they were serious about doing something to relieve congestion, they should be starting with a much wider scope (which IMHO should include another look building at least part of the Illiana) and then narrowi hings down to ITS/flex lane options.

Agree with this 100 percent. The Illiana (and the endpoints set before cancellation) was the best out to get pressure off the major NWI expressways. This is a short-term solution that may cause more problems than what it's trying to solve. We'll see what input (if any) they get from the public.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JoePCool14 on July 24, 2021, 12:21:38 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 23, 2021, 07:20:25 PM
In a collaboration between IDOT and INDOT, a study will soon be underway to find methods of improving traffic flow along I-80/94 from Illinois 394 to I-65. The "FlexRoad Project"  is designed to find ways to alleviate congestion and reduce crashes along the oft-busy stretch. Potential plans being explored include hard shoulder running (opening up the shoulders to traffic during peak traffic hours), ramp metering (traffic signals along ramp entrances, designed to keep traffic in queue), variable speed limit signage, and additional VMS signage to warn drivers of congestion (similar to the system now used on the Jane Addams Tollway between O'Hare and Elgin). Public meetings will be held for further input on this upcoming project. For more information, head to www.indianaflexroad.com (http://www.indianaflexroad.com).

This really seems like band-aid fixing on top of something that's just a complete abomination. Aside from something radical like a double-decker freeway with something like 10 lanes in each direction coming along, this road's congestion will never be alleviated. The only real solution is a southern freeway bypass, but you all already know that.

Shoulder running might make an improvement, but taking away the shoulder on such a large road also sounds like a bad idea. Ramp metering should be a no-brainer on such a busy stretch of urban-like Interstate. And variable speed limits won't do a darned thing.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on July 24, 2021, 03:44:59 AM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on July 24, 2021, 12:21:38 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 23, 2021, 07:20:25 PM
In a collaboration between IDOT and INDOT, a study will soon be underway to find methods of improving traffic flow along I-80/94 from Illinois 394 to I-65. The "FlexRoad Project"  is designed to find ways to alleviate congestion and reduce crashes along the oft-busy stretch. Potential plans being explored include hard shoulder running (opening up the shoulders to traffic during peak traffic hours), ramp metering (traffic signals along ramp entrances, designed to keep traffic in queue), variable speed limit signage, and additional VMS signage to warn drivers of congestion (similar to the system now used on the Jane Addams Tollway between O'Hare and Elgin). Public meetings will be held for further input on this upcoming project. For more information, head to www.indianaflexroad.com (http://www.indianaflexroad.com).

This really seems like band-aid fixing on top of something that's just a complete abomination. Aside from something radical like a double-decker freeway with something like 10 lanes in each direction coming along, this road's congestion will never be alleviated. The only real solution is a southern freeway bypass, but you all already know that.

Shoulder running might make an improvement, but taking away the shoulder on such a large road also sounds like a bad idea. Ramp metering should be a no-brainer on such a busy stretch of urban-like Interstate. And variable speed limits won't do a darned thing.

Or how about raising the speed limit to 60-65 mph?  :hmmm:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JoePCool14 on July 24, 2021, 06:52:42 AM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 24, 2021, 03:44:59 AM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on July 24, 2021, 12:21:38 AM
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 23, 2021, 07:20:25 PM
In a collaboration between IDOT and INDOT, a study will soon be underway to find methods of improving traffic flow along I-80/94 from Illinois 394 to I-65. The "FlexRoad Project"  is designed to find ways to alleviate congestion and reduce crashes along the oft-busy stretch. Potential plans being explored include hard shoulder running (opening up the shoulders to traffic during peak traffic hours), ramp metering (traffic signals along ramp entrances, designed to keep traffic in queue), variable speed limit signage, and additional VMS signage to warn drivers of congestion (similar to the system now used on the Jane Addams Tollway between O'Hare and Elgin). Public meetings will be held for further input on this upcoming project. For more information, head to www.indianaflexroad.com (http://www.indianaflexroad.com).

This really seems like band-aid fixing on top of something that's just a complete abomination. Aside from something radical like a double-decker freeway with something like 10 lanes in each direction coming along, this road's congestion will never be alleviated. The only real solution is a southern freeway bypass, but you all already know that.

Shoulder running might make an improvement, but taking away the shoulder on such a large road also sounds like a bad idea. Ramp metering should be a no-brainer on such a busy stretch of urban-like Interstate. And variable speed limits won't do a darned thing.

Or how about raising the speed limit to 60-65 mph?  :hmmm:

I'm pretty sure most people already go that speed on that section. Well... provided there isn't any traffic.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JREwing78 on July 24, 2021, 04:01:15 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 24, 2021, 03:44:59 AM
Or how about raising the speed limit to 60-65 mph?  :hmmm:

Literally all that would do is reduce the severity of whatever speeding tickets are handed out. That 55 mph limit is universally ignored.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 24, 2021, 10:46:28 PM
Quote from: JREwing78 on July 24, 2021, 04:01:15 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 24, 2021, 03:44:59 AM
Or how about raising the speed limit to 60-65 mph?  :hmmm:

Literally all that would do is reduce the severity of whatever speeding tickets are handed out. That 55 mph limit is universally ignored.

literally NO ONE goes 55 on Indiana interstates. whenever you see 55 on an interstate in indiana, please go 70 instead.  :-D
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on July 24, 2021, 11:03:37 PM
I've seen no one go 55 mph on I-465 before. Especially in some of the repaved and straight sections, where 70-75 mph is common.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ITB on July 25, 2021, 06:00:44 PM
Came across an INDOT update/presentation detailing its major projects delivery for the next few years. It's from June 25, 2021, so it's recent. Six major projects are described:

• I-69/I-465 Northeast; interchange reconstruction
• Ohio River Crossing (ORX)
• I-465/I-895 Northwest; interchange reconstruction
• I-65; safety and efficiency improvements
• I-70; added travel lanes east of I-465 in Hancock County (Greenfield)
• I-70; added travel lanes in Wayne County (Richmond)

The update/presentation can be found here. (https://secure.in.gov/indot/files/DBE-MPD%20presentation%206-25-21%20final%20with%20questions.pdf)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on July 25, 2021, 08:55:45 PM
Quote from: ITB on July 25, 2021, 06:00:44 PM
Came across an INDOT update/presentation detailing its major projects delivery for the next few years. It's from June 25, 2021, so it's recent. Six major projects are described:

- I-69/I-465 Northeast; interchange reconstruction
- Ohio River Crossing (ORX)
- I-465/I-895 Northwest; interchange reconstruction
- I-65; safety and efficiency improvements
- I-70; added travel lanes east of I-465 in Hancock County (Greenfield)
- I-70; added travel lanes in Wayne County (Richmond)

The update/presentation can be found here. (https://secure.in.gov/indot/files/DBE-MPD%20presentation%206-25-21%20final%20with%20questions.pdf)

As long as the 465/865 interchange carries 3 lanes each way on 465 after construction.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on July 25, 2021, 08:58:47 PM
Quote from: I-55 on July 25, 2021, 08:55:45 PM
Quote from: ITB on July 25, 2021, 06:00:44 PM
Came across an INDOT update/presentation detailing its major projects delivery for the next few years. It's from June 25, 2021, so it's recent. Six major projects are described:

- I-69/I-465 Northeast; interchange reconstruction
- Ohio River Crossing (ORX)
- I-465/I-895 Northwest; interchange reconstruction
- I-65; safety and efficiency improvements
- I-70; added travel lanes east of I-465 in Hancock County (Greenfield)
- I-70; added travel lanes in Wayne County (Richmond)

The update/presentation can be found here. (https://secure.in.gov/indot/files/DBE-MPD%20presentation%206-25-21%20final%20with%20questions.pdf)

As long as the 465/865 interchange carries 3 lanes each way on 465 after construction.

Actually, it's going to be four lanes plus one to two auxiliary lanes each way.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 25, 2021, 09:00:02 PM
Quote from: ITB on July 25, 2021, 06:00:44 PM
Came across an INDOT update/presentation detailing its major projects delivery for the next few years. It's from June 25, 2021, so it's recent. Six major projects are described:

- I-69/I-465 Northeast; interchange reconstruction
- Ohio River Crossing (ORX)
- I-465/I-895 Northwest; interchange reconstruction
- I-65; safety and efficiency improvements
- I-70; added travel lanes east of I-465 in Hancock County (Greenfield)
- I-70; added travel lanes in Wayne County (Richmond)

The update/presentation can be found here. (https://secure.in.gov/indot/files/DBE-MPD%20presentation%206-25-21%20final%20with%20questions.pdf)

I can provide some further detail to some of these projects.

465 NW will widen and reconstruct 465 from 86th st to US 31, it will include 4 through lanes in each direction (plus aux lanes), the removal of the left exits for 865 and a completely new interchange for US 421. the US 31 interchange may be slightly altered too.

the 2 70 projects will be:

Mt. Comfort Rd to SR 9 6 lanes

SR 1 to Ohio 6 lanes.

I've also heard rumors about 6 laning it from Illinois to somewhere east of terre haute.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on July 25, 2021, 09:02:20 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 25, 2021, 08:58:47 PM
Quote from: I-55 on July 25, 2021, 08:55:45 PM
Quote from: ITB on July 25, 2021, 06:00:44 PM
Came across an INDOT update/presentation detailing its major projects delivery for the next few years. It's from June 25, 2021, so it's recent. Six major projects are described:

- I-69/I-465 Northeast; interchange reconstruction
- Ohio River Crossing (ORX)
- I-465/I-895 Northwest; interchange reconstruction
- I-65; safety and efficiency improvements
- I-70; added travel lanes east of I-465 in Hancock County (Greenfield)
- I-70; added travel lanes in Wayne County (Richmond)

The update/presentation can be found here. (https://secure.in.gov/indot/files/DBE-MPD%20presentation%206-25-21%20final%20with%20questions.pdf)

As long as the 465/865 interchange carries 3 lanes each way on 465 after construction.

Actually, it's going to be four lanes plus one to two auxiliary lanes each way.

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 25, 2021, 09:15:40 PM
I was interested in seeing the I-65 plans for the southern part of Indianapolis between the South Split and I-465. It doesn't say what the lane situation would be but auxiliary lanes in between the exits would certainly be welcomed there. That may also be why they haven't gotten rid of the older button copy signs along that highway.

I knew about the I-70 in Greenfield part but I had no idea about the plans for I-70 in Wayne County. That is a busy stretch of roadway (as is all of I-70.)  I was thinking at some point they'd have to make the part around Richmond from say Centerville east to the state line six lanes. So it's neat to see them actually planning on widening the interstate through the whole county. As far as the rest of I-70 in Indiana is concerned I would guess that I-70 around Terre Haute wouldn't be too far down the road either. It could easily use the extra lane from the state line to east of 40/46/641.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 25, 2021, 09:32:15 PM
i like that 465/69 will be concrete!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JoePCool14 on July 25, 2021, 10:04:16 PM
Great news about the 465/865 interchange improvements! The road to a fully 8-lane beltway continues.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: jhuntin1 on July 25, 2021, 11:26:29 PM
Great news for northwestern and northeastern Indy, but once again INDOT pays no attention to the south side of I-465. It's going to be expensive, but something has got to be done to widen it. The north split shutdown should make it obvious to anyone paying attention. I keep beating the same drum here but I drive it almost every day.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on July 26, 2021, 12:26:48 AM
I remember something on the INDOT website a year or so ago that featured plans for I-465 from I-70 to I-65 on the south side, specifically the section that was not a part of the I-69 project itself (from Mann Road to US 31.) Since then I've seen the website disappear. Now it appears under the I-69 Finish Line website and their plans. According to that site I-465 from I-70 to I-65 will be widened to eight lanes with four in each direction with some bridges reconstructed. I-465 from the new I-69 interchange to I-70 on the west side will be eight lanes with the added lane in the median of that interstate. What I'm not entirely sure is how they will do I-465 from the new I-69 interchange to I-65. The old website had plans that didn't specifically include eight mainline lanes but added auxiliary lanes in between the the exits. I've been trying to find something that specifically shows what is planned in terms of lane configuration on that stretch of roadway.

All of that said, I don't believe they are planning anything for a while on I-465 from I-65 to I-70 on the east side. INDOT wanting to install new traffic management items along that stretch of road (such as ramp meters) seems to tell me that they have no appetite for widening that highway until everything else is probably done first.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 26, 2021, 09:28:17 AM
Quote from: jhuntin1 on July 25, 2021, 11:26:29 PM
Great news for northwestern and northeastern Indy, but once again INDOT pays no attention to the south side of I-465. It's going to be expensive, but something has got to be done to widen it. The north split shutdown should make it obvious to anyone paying attention. I keep beating the same drum here but I drive it almost every day.

465 will be 8 lanes from 70 to 65 on the sw side of town as part of the new 69 interchange down there. idk why they arent just widening from 70 to 70 but they arent. the se side will see things like variable speed limits that no one will pay attention to and ramp meters.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on July 26, 2021, 05:14:01 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 26, 2021, 09:28:17 AM
Quote from: jhuntin1 on July 25, 2021, 11:26:29 PM
Great news for northwestern and northeastern Indy, but once again INDOT pays no attention to the south side of I-465. It's going to be expensive, but something has got to be done to widen it. The north split shutdown should make it obvious to anyone paying attention. I keep beating the same drum here but I drive it almost every day.

465 will be 8 lanes from 70 to 65 on the sw side of town as part of the new 69 interchange down there. idk why they arent just widening from 70 to 70 but they arent. the se side will see things like variable speed limits that no one will pay attention to and ramp meters.

Variable speed limits that only go DOWN from 55, all the way to 40 mph instead of UP. There is no situation where lowering the speed limit on 465 will ever change anything.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on July 26, 2021, 05:50:20 PM
If the variable speed limit implementation was permitted to increase to 65 mph during times of congestion free flow, I feel like it would have more success.

Retaining the artificial 55 mph speed limit will not do anything. The sign will say 40 mph, people will still go 60+ mph when it's moving.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 26, 2021, 06:56:41 PM
Quote from: JREwing78 on July 24, 2021, 04:01:15 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 24, 2021, 03:44:59 AM
Or how about raising the speed limit to 60-65 mph?  :hmmm:

Literally all that would do is reduce the severity of whatever speeding tickets are handed out. That 55 mph limit is universally ignored.

As someone who drives this road frequently and can literally see it out my window, I do think raising the speed limit would help a little bit. Not many people go the speed limit, but those that do force the faster traffic farther left by one lane, which contributes to the congesting. You end up with most of the trucks in the 2nd/3rd lanes as opposed to the 1st/2nd lanes because of those few cars that are going 50-55.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on July 26, 2021, 07:06:54 PM
Agreed. Artificially low limits create hazards between those following the limit (55 mph) and those traveling a reasonable speed (65-75 mph) for the roadway design. A more appropriate limit, likely 65 mph on an urban freeway in Indiana, would lead to more compliance.

Indiana increased a bunch of urban limits in the southern part of the state towards Louisville, all from 55 mph to 65 mph, compliance greatly increased and actual speeds did not change that much. Why can't they do that towards Chicago, the Indianapolis area, and that god-forsaken 55 mph zone on I-69 through Bloomington?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JoePCool14 on July 26, 2021, 08:16:29 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on July 26, 2021, 07:06:54 PM
Agreed. Artificially low limits create hazards between those following the limit (55 mph) and those traveling a reasonable speed (65-75 mph) for the roadway design. A more appropriate limit, likely 65 mph on an urban freeway in Indiana, would lead to more compliance.

Indiana increased a bunch of urban limits in the southern part of the state towards Louisville, all from 55 mph to 65 mph, compliance greatly increased and actual speeds did not change that much. Why can't they do that towards Chicago, the Indianapolis area, and that god-forsaken 55 mph zone on I-69 through Bloomington?

Because there are too many people who still think higher speed limits equal millions of deaths.

Speed limit increase to 65 would be great on 465.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on July 26, 2021, 09:06:41 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 26, 2021, 06:56:41 PM
Quote from: JREwing78 on July 24, 2021, 04:01:15 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 24, 2021, 03:44:59 AM
Or how about raising the speed limit to 60-65 mph?  :hmmm:

Literally all that would do is reduce the severity of whatever speeding tickets are handed out. That 55 mph limit is universally ignored.

As someone who drives this road frequently and can literally see it out my window, I do think raising the speed limit would help a little bit. Not many people go the speed limit, but those that do force the faster traffic farther left by one lane, which contributes to the congesting. You end up with most of the trucks in the 2nd/3rd lanes as opposed to the 1st/2nd lanes because of those few cars that are going 50-55.
Did you read the star article on this? 97% of people go way over 55
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on July 26, 2021, 09:48:56 PM
^ Then the one person actually doing 55 mph causes everyone to abruptly brake from 75 mph down to 50-55 mph, weave into another lane, causing more braking and a potential chain reaction of such and even worse - a potential for a rear end collision.

Driving to slow = low speed limits = bad situation.

55 mph is dangerous. Simply put. But that's what they want you to think is safe, when in fact is not. 65 mph minimum is a good medium to the actual flow of 70-75+ mph.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 27, 2021, 09:14:09 PM
Major heads up for anyone on here who frequently uses Indiana 130 between Hobart and Valparaiso:

As you may have seen, Indiana 130 and Porter County Road 600 N is undergoing an intersection modification. Work on the northern half of the intersection is nearing completion, with work on the southern half immediately following. The respective portions of CR 600 N will be closed, while Indiana 130 traffic goes through uninterrupted. When completed this fall, CR 600 N will have two separate intersections with Indiana 130, with each “end” meeting Indiana 130 at a perpendicular angle for better sight lines and traffic control. To safely facilitate the movements, Indiana 130 will be refitted with new turn lanes.

Here’s the important part that I wanted to pass along. Starting July 30, Indiana 130 will be completely closed to traffic at the intersection with Porter County Road 450 W. The intersection will be refitted with turn lanes to accommodate movements on this often busy intersection. This closure will last into the fall. This same work will likely be moved a quarter mile west to the traffic light with CR 475 W.

The official detour will involve US 6 and Indiana 149. Though locals will be able to use the network of county roads to connect between Hobart and Valparaiso, this official detour will be enforced for truck traffic.

Update from INDOT: this closure will actually take place between Cleveland Avenue in Hobart (Indiana 51 south split) and Indiana 149. Along with what I mentioned above, this will include complete resurfacing of the closed stretch, turn lanes at the intersection with Indiana 149, and arch work at Hart Ditch between CR 475 W and Indiana 149. All work should be completed by the end of September.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ITB on July 31, 2021, 03:16:01 PM

For those interested, here's some links to INDOT's research program. The program is closely aligned with Purdue University and centers around the collaborative Joint Transportation Research Program (https://engineering.purdue.edu/JTRP).

At any given time, numerous studies are either underway or are planned. Studies are wide ranging in scope and topic, and include, for example:

- Evaluation of the Potential Benefits of Implementing the AASHTO Guide Specification for the Analysis and Identification of Fracture Critical Members and System Redundant Members
- Research Support to INDOT on I-465 Southeast Variable Speed Limit and Ramp Meter Project
- Drones in Accident Reconstruction: How Drones Are Helping Make Traffic Crash Site Assessments Faster, Safer, and More Accurate
- Review of Indiana Asphalt Binders (In-Situ PG Grade Asphalt Determination)
- Comprehensive Pavement Patching Tools and Web-based Software for Pavement Condition Assessment and Visualization
- Alternate Interchange Signing Study for Indiana Highways

A comprehensive list of recent and current JTRP research projects can be accessed  here (https://engineering.purdue.edu/JTRP/Research), and a list of INDOT's research needs for FY 2022 can be found  here (https://www.in.gov/indot/files/List%20of%20INDOT%20Research%20Needs.pdf).

Purdue also hosts the annual Purdue Road School, a two week conference and expo for transportation professionals. Established in 1914, the longstanding program typically is attended by more than 3,000. The schedule for the most recent conference which took place in March 2021 can be found here (https://roadschool.purdue.edu/).

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on August 02, 2021, 07:19:14 PM
INDOT has announced that the I-65 SB rest area in Jasper County (Kankakee) at MM 231 will close for the construction of a new welcome center in the same location. The building itself (which is 40 years old) will close on or after August 4th at 4 pm CST while the parking lot will close to the public on or after August 9th. Groundbreaking of this project will happen the day after (August 10th) at 10 am CST to mark the start of construction.

The new welcome center will be fully ADA compliant, energy-efficient, and will feature modern restrooms, electronic tourism displays, public art, expanded parking, walking trails, and a natural wetlands area.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ibthebigd on August 04, 2021, 11:01:49 AM
When will the new section of I-265 be officially signed?

SM-G950U

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 04, 2021, 06:00:00 PM
Quote from: ibthebigd on August 04, 2021, 11:01:49 AM
When will the new section of I-265 be officially signed?

SM-G950U



I haven't heard anything. I don't know what the holdup would be to slapping some new signs on the roadway.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on August 06, 2021, 08:43:44 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 04, 2021, 06:00:00 PM
Quote from: ibthebigd on August 04, 2021, 11:01:49 AM
When will the new section of I-265 be officially signed?

SM-G950U



I haven't heard anything. I don't know what the holdup would be to slapping some new signs on the roadway.

Feds might not like how the exit numbering switches directions at the state line.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on August 06, 2021, 08:47:24 PM
Quote from: I-55 on August 06, 2021, 08:43:44 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 04, 2021, 06:00:00 PM
Quote from: ibthebigd on August 04, 2021, 11:01:49 AM
When will the new section of I-265 be officially signed?

SM-G950U



I haven't heard anything. I don't know what the holdup would be to slapping some new signs on the roadway.

Feds might not like how the exit numbering switches directions at the state line.
The fact that the I-265 designation AND exit number direction aren't uniform make it seem like that IN and KY didn't cooperate at all on the interstate.
Though I did attempt a combined I-265 exit list in fictional a while ago:
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 27, 2021, 08:27:39 PM
Renumbered exit numbers on I-265 in Indiana as a continuation of the exit numbers in Kentucky:
(https://i.imgur.com/A60XquC.png?1)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Interstate 69 Fan on August 06, 2021, 10:44:14 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on August 06, 2021, 08:47:24 PM
Quote from: I-55 on August 06, 2021, 08:43:44 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 04, 2021, 06:00:00 PM
Quote from: ibthebigd on August 04, 2021, 11:01:49 AM
When will the new section of I-265 be officially signed?

SM-G950U



I haven't heard anything. I don't know what the holdup would be to slapping some new signs on the roadway.

Feds might not like how the exit numbering switches directions at the state line.
The fact that the I-265 designation AND exit number direction aren't uniform make it seem like that IN and KY didn't cooperate at all on the interstate.
Though I did attempt a combined I-265 exit list in fictional a while ago:
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 27, 2021, 08:27:39 PM
Renumbered exit numbers on I-265 in Indiana as a continuation of the exit numbers in Kentucky:
(https://i.imgur.com/A60XquC.png?1)
INDOT typically doesn't carry exit numbers over from state lines, so it doesn't surprise me that they didn't here. I-275 must be an exception, maybe perhaps KY & OH added their exit numbers and carried them over, so INDOT decided to follow.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on August 07, 2021, 12:39:18 AM
Quote from: Interstate 69 Fan on August 06, 2021, 10:44:14 PM
INDOT typically doesn't carry exit numbers over from state lines, so it doesn't surprise me that they didn't here. I-275 must be an exception, maybe perhaps KY & OH added their exit numbers and carried them over, so INDOT decided to follow.
It's not just INDOT. When I-295 was extended into PA along former I-95 when the I-95/PA Turnpike connection was finished, and exits had to be renumbered on former I-95, PennDOT had the choice to continue NJ's exit numbers, which would be exits 77-86, but instead, they used their own sequence with 1-10.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on August 07, 2021, 12:39:48 AM
3di interstates, particularly beltway routes, generally carry mileage and exit numbers over.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on August 07, 2021, 03:45:12 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on August 07, 2021, 12:39:48 AM
3di interstates, particularly beltway routes, generally carry mileage and exit numbers over.

And spurs (I-155 TN/MO, I-395 CT/MA, I-195 RI/MA) usually reset.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: ran4sh on August 15, 2021, 06:55:39 PM
In the MUTCD it is only a Guidance (recommendation) statement for exit numbers on a 3di to continue across state lines. And the MUTCD does not distinguish between spur, loop, or beltway/circumferential in that statement.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on August 17, 2021, 10:36:52 AM
I was on I-65 NB up to Lafayette yesterday, and saw a yet to be installed partial APL sign (arrows are similar to this (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.5935477,-111.9028988,3a,45.8y,160.57h,100.38t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sNajxBDTww9qHfOn73y1sLA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) except it's a bit more bold) on the right side of the road in Lebanon (think it was for either IN 32 or IN 39, I forgot to take a photo because I wasn't expecting it). Are there any other examples of partial APL signage in the state, or is this the first?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: FixThe74Sign on August 17, 2021, 11:45:22 AM
I am not sure if this counts.

https://goo.gl/maps/aH6fZtHrUrC6dx4PA

Its on N 65 approaching 465 on the southside of Indy.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 17, 2021, 11:48:45 AM
is this current widening section going to permanently remove (with no replacement) the exit from the left for Lafayette Ave? I remember this was supposed to happen years ago when they widened it up to 32.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on August 17, 2021, 01:34:30 PM
Quote from: FixThe74Sign on August 17, 2021, 11:45:22 AM
I am not sure if this counts.

https://goo.gl/maps/aH6fZtHrUrC6dx4PA

Its on N 65 approaching 465 on the southside of Indy.
Nope. It looked something like my Utah example linked, with no through route section.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on August 17, 2021, 03:29:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 17, 2021, 11:48:45 AM
is this current widening section going to permanently remove (with no replacement) the exit from the left for Lafayette Ave? I remember this was supposed to happen years ago when they widened it up to 32.

Yes, the left-hand exit to Lafayette Ave from I-65 SB is permanently removed, but it will be replaced with a right-hand exit after the widening project from SR 32 to SR 47 is done (meaning that there will be a stub for a new off-ramp for Lafayette Ave on the right).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 18, 2021, 08:05:03 AM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on August 17, 2021, 03:29:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 17, 2021, 11:48:45 AM
is this current widening section going to permanently remove (with no replacement) the exit from the left for Lafayette Ave? I remember this was supposed to happen years ago when they widened it up to 32.

Yes, the left-hand exit to Lafayette Ave from I-65 SB is permanently removed, but it will be replaced with a right-hand exit after the widening project from SR 32 to SR 47 is done (meaning that there will be a stub for a new off-ramp for Lafayette Ave on the right).

hmm interesting. originally they planned on just killing that exit with no replacement at all. i would say weaving issues could happen but i bet no one really uses that ramp anyway. they probably didnt want to piss off lebanon by getting rid of it.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on August 18, 2021, 07:42:31 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on August 17, 2021, 10:36:52 AM
I was on I-65 NB up to Lafayette yesterday, and saw a yet to be installed partial APL sign (arrows are similar to this (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.5935477,-111.9028988,3a,45.8y,160.57h,100.38t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sNajxBDTww9qHfOn73y1sLA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) except it's a bit more bold) on the right side of the road in Lebanon (think it was for either IN 32 or IN 39, I forgot to take a photo because I wasn't expecting it). Are there any other examples of partial APL signage in the state, or is this the first?

There's a pair on I-65 SB at Exit 114...
https://flic.kr/p/2mhWpkx (https://flic.kr/p/2mhWpkx)

https://flic.kr/p/2mhRfaY (https://flic.kr/p/2mhRfaY)

Edit to add: here's a video from BigRigTravels.



At the 3:52:33 second mark, you can see the new sign laying on the side of the interstate...
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on August 18, 2021, 09:28:14 PM
I wonder why only Meridian Street is featured for the signage along Exit 113? That exit does also serve Illinois, Pennsylvania and Delaware Streets. To answer my own question I'm sure they just don't want to have four lines of text on the sign but I wonder if there's a better way to covey that the exit does serve more streets than just Meridian. Likewise coming from the east the sign usually stated both Pennsylvania and Meridian Streets in the past without any mention of Illinois.

Likewise it's interesting to see more APL signs in Indiana. I must say INDOT's doing a pretty good job with those. Watching the I-65 through Boone County segment also is interesting and it's different seeing the sequential exit signs being used in the median. I wonder if there's any plans of using more of them throughout Indianapolis. I-69 got them going north from I-465 a few years ago and I-465 on the north side and I-70 on the west side has some of them as well.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on August 18, 2021, 10:17:38 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on August 18, 2021, 07:42:31 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on August 17, 2021, 10:36:52 AM
I was on I-65 NB up to Lafayette yesterday, and saw a yet to be installed partial APL sign (arrows are similar to this (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.5935477,-111.9028988,3a,45.8y,160.57h,100.38t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sNajxBDTww9qHfOn73y1sLA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) except it's a bit more bold) on the right side of the road in Lebanon (think it was for either IN 32 or IN 39, I forgot to take a photo because I wasn't expecting it). Are there any other examples of partial APL signage in the state, or is this the first?

There's a pair on I-65 SB at Exit 114...
https://flic.kr/p/2mhWpkx (https://flic.kr/p/2mhWpkx)

https://flic.kr/p/2mhRfaY (https://flic.kr/p/2mhRfaY)

Edit to add: here's a video from BigRigTravels.



At the 3:52:33 second mark, you can see the new sign laying on the side of the interstate...
Looks like I'm way off for the location. The sign was for IN 267 a bit south of Lebanon  :-D

I'm wondering why the main display with the route shield and road name/control cities aren't centered to the sign, unlike the Utah examples. It seemed like they wanted to do a full APL with the main display shifted to the right a bit, but changed their mind.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on August 18, 2021, 10:21:16 PM
Unrelated to above, but any reason why the middle lane at the 865 exit from WB I-465 isn't an option lane? Especially with the traffic getting onto 865 (and eventually NB 65), it seems so inefficient forcing all the traffic shift to the single lane on the left, and the second lane reappearing after the gore point.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 18, 2021, 10:33:41 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on August 18, 2021, 09:28:14 PM
I wonder why only Meridian Street is featured for the signage along Exit 113? That exit does also serve Illinois, Pennsylvania and Delaware Streets. To answer my own question I'm sure they just don't want to have four lines of text on the sign but I wonder if there's a better way to covey that the exit does serve more streets than just Meridian. Likewise coming from the east the sign usually stated both Pennsylvania and Meridian Streets in the past without any mention of Illinois.

Likewise it's interesting to see more APL signs in Indiana. I must say INDOT's doing a pretty good job with those. Watching the I-65 through Boone County segment also is interesting and it's different seeing the sequential exit signs being used in the median. I wonder if there's any plans of using more of them throughout Indianapolis. I-69 got them going north from I-465 a few years ago and I-465 on the north side and I-70 on the west side has some of them as well.

I think it's because of which road will take you INTO downtown depending on the direction of travel, so on SB 65 Meridian would take you INTO downtown ( but this also applies to Penn so this isn't a perfect analogy) Illinois takes you out of downtown. NB 65 both Penn and Meridian take you in, but Illinois does not.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 18, 2021, 10:34:48 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on August 18, 2021, 10:21:16 PM
Unrelated to above, but any reason why the middle lane at the 865 exit from WB I-465 isn't an option lane? Especially with the traffic getting onto 865 (and eventually NB 65), it seems so inefficient forcing all the traffic shift to the single lane on the left, and the second lane reappearing after the gore point.

It's because they want that crappy loop ramp to have it's own lane  :-D. but in about 8ish yrs that entire interchange will be nice, 2 lanes coming in and out all on the right!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on August 19, 2021, 12:27:32 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 18, 2021, 10:34:48 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on August 18, 2021, 10:21:16 PM
Unrelated to above, but any reason why the middle lane at the 865 exit from WB I-465 isn't an option lane? Especially with the traffic getting onto 865 (and eventually NB 65), it seems so inefficient forcing all the traffic shift to the single lane on the left, and the second lane reappearing after the gore point.

It's because they want that crappy loop ramp to have it's own lane  :-D. but in about 8ish yrs that entire interchange will be nice, 2 lanes coming in and out all on the right!

And because they wanted I-465 to maintain its own 2 lanes through the junction without sharing. As mentioned, things will be improving anyway.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on August 20, 2021, 05:46:43 PM
The infamous 5-way intersection south of Monticello on US Route 421 and State Road 39 will be replaced with a roundabout. Construction should start in Spring 2023.

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.7299254,-86.7617131,3a,75y,312.79h,90t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s4So1VSxrViINvuQ2C5HTfQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Article: https://www.newsbug.info/monticello_herald_journal/videos/gordon-road-intersection-improvement-project-public-hearing-08-19-21/video_5ef5b271-a317-550d-a78a-b2536368b63b.html
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 23, 2021, 08:12:28 PM
The rethinkers are back, this time trying to get their plans out for any future construction downtown. I honestly support this idea, but am certain it will never happen. INDOT would never pay the money for it and Indy is permanently broke when it comes to roads. I also don't trust their cost estimate either. https://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/transportation/2021/08/23/indianapolis-traffic-i-65-70-underground-rethink-coalition-cost/8185186002/

I've heard the north leg may get reconstructed eventually, possibly up to 38th st. but I bet it's a replace in kind. I haven't heard any rumors about the south leg and split. Not a fan of the exits on that leg, that area is already below grade, could cap it like in Columbus ohio
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: webny99 on August 23, 2021, 09:35:30 PM
Random question, what is the progress on the six-laning of I-65 from north of Indy to Merrillville?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 24, 2021, 07:23:45 AM
Quote from: webny99 on August 23, 2021, 09:35:30 PM
Random question, what is the progress on the six-laning of I-65 from north of Indy to Merrillville?

I-865 to IN 32 is done.
IN 32 to IN 47 is in progress.
IN 47 to IN 38 still 4 lanes.
IN 38 to IN 25 is done.
IN 25 to IN 43 is in progress.
IN 43 to IN 2 is still 4 lanes.
IN 2 to US 30 is done.

IN 43 to IN is the longest section that's still 4 lanes with no work ongoing. Hopefully, instead of working from either end, their next section is in the middle, as that would cut down the most on the amount of time people get stuck behind trucks in the left lane.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: webny99 on August 24, 2021, 10:26:36 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 24, 2021, 07:23:45 AM
I-865 to IN 32 is done.
IN 32 to IN 47 is in progress.
IN 47 to IN 38 still 4 lanes.
IN 38 to IN 25 is done.
IN 25 to IN 43 is in progress.
IN 43 to IN 2 is still 4 lanes.
IN 2 to US 30 is done.

IN 43 to IN is the longest section that's still 4 lanes with no work ongoing. Hopefully, instead of working from either end, their next section is in the middle, as that would cut down the most on the amount of time people get stuck behind trucks in the left lane.

OK, so it's getting there other than the 60-mile stretch in the middle.

Interesting thought about doing a middle section next, although it does seem more likely based on the traffic volumes that they'll work from either end. It also might make sense to finish Lebanon to Lafayette first (which would complete everything from Indy to Lafayette) before chipping away at the final stretch.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 24, 2021, 12:02:57 PM
Quote from: webny99 on August 24, 2021, 10:26:36 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 24, 2021, 07:23:45 AM
I-865 to IN 32 is done.
IN 32 to IN 47 is in progress.
IN 47 to IN 38 still 4 lanes.
IN 38 to IN 25 is done.
IN 25 to IN 43 is in progress.
IN 43 to IN 2 is still 4 lanes.
IN 2 to US 30 is done.

IN 43 to IN is the longest section that's still 4 lanes with no work ongoing. Hopefully, instead of working from either end, their next section is in the middle, as that would cut down the most on the amount of time people get stuck behind trucks in the left lane.

OK, so it's getting there other than the 60-mile stretch in the middle.

Interesting thought about doing a middle section next, although it does seem more likely based on the traffic volumes that they'll work from either end. It also might make sense to finish Lebanon to Lafayette first (which would complete everything from Indy to Lafayette) before chipping away at the final stretch.

Yeah, I think they'll end up doing IN 47 to IN 38 next, and also probably IN 44 to IN 46 south of Indy.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: FixThe74Sign on August 24, 2021, 01:29:45 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 23, 2021, 08:12:28 PM
The rethinkers are back, this time trying to get their plans out for any future construction downtown. I honestly support this idea, but am certain it will never happen. INDOT would never pay the money for it and Indy is permanently broke when it comes to roads. I also don't trust their cost estimate either. https://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/transportation/2021/08/23/indianapolis-traffic-i-65-70-underground-rethink-coalition-cost/8185186002/

I've heard the north leg may get reconstructed eventually, possibly up to 38th st. but I bet it's a replace in kind. I haven't heard any rumors about the south leg and split. Not a fan of the exits on that leg, that area is already below grade, could cap it like in Columbus ohio

I'm not sure where they are getting the 2.3 Billion "as is" reconstruction cost since the arguably biggest and most complicated section is being redone now at only 280 million.
Title: I-70 Exit 66 Renaned
Post by: 2trailertrucker on August 25, 2021, 06:39:36 AM
The I-70 exit 66 signs are being changed To Quaker Blvd! No Plainfield from the signs I have seen getting ready to be installed.
Title: Re: I-70 Exit 66 Renaned
Post by: Interstate 69 Fan on August 25, 2021, 09:46:00 AM
Quote from: 2trailertrucker on August 25, 2021, 06:39:36 AM
The I-70 exit 66 signs are being changed To Quaker Blvd! No Plainfield from the signs I have seen getting ready to be installed.
Took INDOT long enough. They still need to change the distance sign just west of Downtown Indianapolis, still says SR 267.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on August 25, 2021, 11:33:36 AM
That stupid quirk of deleting SR267 around Plainfield screwed up my Indiana state route collection (https://flic.kr/s/aHskCcEALH)...I was supposed to have a complete collection of one photo for every state highway in Indiana, but the removal of SR267 along my route left SR267 as the one remaining hole in my collection...I eventually just got a SR267 photo along I-65 some months later lol.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Interstate 69 Fan on August 25, 2021, 06:05:48 PM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on August 25, 2021, 11:33:36 AM
That stupid quirk of deleting SR267 around Plainfield screwed up my Indiana state route collection (https://flic.kr/s/aHskCcEALH)...I was supposed to have a complete collection of one photo for every state highway in Indiana, but the removal of SR267 along my route left SR267 as the one remaining hole in my collection...I eventually just got a SR267 photo along I-65 some months later lol.
That segment may not be around for long either.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: JREwing78 on August 26, 2021, 08:25:38 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 23, 2021, 08:12:28 PM
The rethinkers are back, this time trying to get their plans out for any future construction downtown. I honestly support this idea, but am certain it will never happen. INDOT would never pay the money for it and Indy is permanently broke when it comes to roads. I also don't trust their cost estimate either. https://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/transportation/2021/08/23/indianapolis-traffic-i-65-70-underground-rethink-coalition-cost/8185186002/

Is it worth it to Indianapolis (the city) to spend the difference to move it underground? Yes, in theory, they should make up for it in tax revenue, but they're effectively gambling that their up-front investment pans out.

The folks along US-30 and US-31 waiting for upgrades will throw a fit if INDOT pleads poverty for their needs, then dumps half a billion on "cosmetic" improvements in Indianapolis.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: sprjus4 on August 26, 2021, 09:07:13 PM
^ Not to mention, widening of I-65 between Louisville and Chicago which is sorely needed.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 26, 2021, 09:10:51 PM
Quote from: JREwing78 on August 26, 2021, 08:25:38 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 23, 2021, 08:12:28 PM
The rethinkers are back, this time trying to get their plans out for any future construction downtown. I honestly support this idea, but am certain it will never happen. INDOT would never pay the money for it and Indy is permanently broke when it comes to roads. I also don't trust their cost estimate either. https://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/transportation/2021/08/23/indianapolis-traffic-i-65-70-underground-rethink-coalition-cost/8185186002/

Is it worth it to Indianapolis (the city) to spend the difference to move it underground? Yes, in theory, they should make up for it in tax revenue, but they're effectively gambling that their up-front investment pans out.

The folks along US-30 and US-31 waiting for upgrades will throw a fit if INDOT pleads poverty for their needs, then dumps half a billion on "cosmetic" improvements in Indianapolis.
Trust me Indianapolis doesn't even have the money to pay for the roads it owns. There's 0 chance they would pay for this in any part. Some of indy's roads are so bad it's honestly embarrassing.
Plus I'm not even sure you can bury the north leg and tie into what's being built now and follow green book requirements.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 27, 2021, 08:22:17 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on August 25, 2021, 11:33:36 AM
That stupid quirk of deleting SR267 around Plainfield screwed up my Indiana state route collection (https://flic.kr/s/aHskCcEALH)...I was supposed to have a complete collection of one photo for every state highway in Indiana, but the removal of SR267 along my route left SR267 as the one remaining hole in my collection...I eventually just got a SR267 photo along I-65 some months later lol.

get one of old sr 100?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: paulthemapguy on August 31, 2021, 12:57:25 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 27, 2021, 08:22:17 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on August 25, 2021, 11:33:36 AM
That stupid quirk of deleting SR267 around Plainfield screwed up my Indiana state route collection (https://flic.kr/s/aHskCcEALH)...I was supposed to have a complete collection of one photo for every state highway in Indiana, but the removal of SR267 along my route left SR267 as the one remaining hole in my collection...I eventually just got a SR267 photo along I-65 some months later lol.

get one of old sr 100?

I started the collection only about 6 years ago. The shield gallery is here, (https://flic.kr/s/aHskCcEALH) and the gallery of source photos is here (https://flic.kr/s/aHskBr2G5J).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: hockeyjohn on August 31, 2021, 03:59:31 PM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on August 31, 2021, 12:57:25 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 27, 2021, 08:22:17 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on August 25, 2021, 11:33:36 AM
That stupid quirk of deleting SR267 around Plainfield screwed up my Indiana state route collection (https://flic.kr/s/aHskCcEALH)...I was supposed to have a complete collection of one photo for every state highway in Indiana, but the removal of SR267 along my route left SR267 as the one remaining hole in my collection...I eventually just got a SR267 photo along I-65 some months later lol.

get one of old sr 100?

I started the collection only about 6 years ago. The shield gallery is here, (https://flic.kr/s/aHskCcEALH) and the gallery of source photos is here (https://flic.kr/s/aHskBr2G5J).

Fortunately you can probably still find how SR 100 was marked by Indiana in its final years.   After most of it was turned back in the 1970s, the State maintained the freeway section of Shadeland Ave. from I-465 to US-40 (Washington St.) into the 2000s.   It was un-signed except for these mile marker posts with the small, square 100 shield underneath the mile number such as this one on SB Shadeland Ave. near Brookville Rd.   This configuration is similar to how Indiana marks the mileage for roads with concurrent routings where the square shield indicates the route whose mileage is listed.   Haven't been down that way in a couple of years, but assume at least a few of them are still there.   The City of Indianapolis has generally not removed the INDOT mile marker posts when roads have been turned back unless there has been some major construction project that reconfigures the roadway.

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51416551734_367b9ca034_z.jpg)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on August 31, 2021, 04:10:17 PM
Quote from: hockeyjohn on August 31, 2021, 03:59:31 PM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on August 31, 2021, 12:57:25 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 27, 2021, 08:22:17 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on August 25, 2021, 11:33:36 AM
That stupid quirk of deleting SR267 around Plainfield screwed up my Indiana state route collection (https://flic.kr/s/aHskCcEALH)...I was supposed to have a complete collection of one photo for every state highway in Indiana, but the removal of SR267 along my route left SR267 as the one remaining hole in my collection...I eventually just got a SR267 photo along I-65 some months later lol.

get one of old sr 100?

I started the collection only about 6 years ago. The shield gallery is here, (https://flic.kr/s/aHskCcEALH) and the gallery of source photos is here (https://flic.kr/s/aHskBr2G5J).

Fortunately you can probably still find how SR 100 was marked by Indiana in its final years.   After most of it was turned back in the 1970s, the State maintained the freeway section of Shadeland Ave. from I-465 to US-40 (Washington St.) into the 2000s.   It was un-signed except for these mile marker posts with the small, square 100 shield underneath the mile number such as this one on SB Shadeland Ave. near Brookville Rd.   This configuration is similar to how Indiana marks the mileage for roads with concurrent routings where the square shield indicates the route whose mileage is listed.   Haven't been down that way in a couple of years, but assume at least a few of them are still there.   The City of Indianapolis has generally not removed the INDOT mile marker posts when roads have been turned back unless there has been some major construction project that reconfigures the roadway.

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51416551734_367b9ca034_z.jpg)
Interesting, so back when it was just the shadeland expressway it was unsigned, even on the bgs on 465?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: hockeyjohn on September 01, 2021, 10:22:07 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 31, 2021, 04:10:17 PM
Quote from: hockeyjohn on August 31, 2021, 03:59:31 PM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on August 31, 2021, 12:57:25 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 27, 2021, 08:22:17 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on August 25, 2021, 11:33:36 AM
That stupid quirk of deleting SR267 around Plainfield screwed up my Indiana state route collection (https://flic.kr/s/aHskCcEALH)...I was supposed to have a complete collection of one photo for every state highway in Indiana, but the removal of SR267 along my route left SR267 as the one remaining hole in my collection...I eventually just got a SR267 photo along I-65 some months later lol.

get one of old sr 100?

I started the collection only about 6 years ago. The shield gallery is here, (https://flic.kr/s/aHskCcEALH) and the gallery of source photos is here (https://flic.kr/s/aHskBr2G5J).

Fortunately you can probably still find how SR 100 was marked by Indiana in its final years.   After most of it was turned back in the 1970s, the State maintained the freeway section of Shadeland Ave. from I-465 to US-40 (Washington St.) into the 2000s.   It was un-signed except for these mile marker posts with the small, square 100 shield underneath the mile number such as this one on SB Shadeland Ave. near Brookville Rd.   This configuration is similar to how Indiana marks the mileage for roads with concurrent routings where the square shield indicates the route whose mileage is listed.   Haven't been down that way in a couple of years, but assume at least a few of them are still there.   The City of Indianapolis has generally not removed the INDOT mile marker posts when roads have been turned back unless there has been some major construction project that reconfigures the roadway.

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51416551734_367b9ca034_z.jpg)
Interesting, so back when it was just the shadeland expressway it was unsigned, even on the bgs on 465?

My family moved to Indianapolis in 1975, so just a few years after most of SR 100 was turned back (the photo shows part of the Indianapolis inset from the '74-'75 INDOT map).   The Shadeland Ave. freeway portion is marked 100 on the map but there were neither typical Indiana markers on the roadway nor any mention on the BGS (the blue mileage signs in the photo posted earlier did not come along until the '80s).   However, as I recall, it was obvious on the BGS where the '100' marker had been removed.   A side note, until the I-465/US-52 (Brookville Rd.) interchange was expanded to full access, the Shadeland Ave. freeway was also marked on the NB I-465 BGS as "To US-52 EAST / Brookville Rd."  US-52 was still routed around the southside of Indy along I-465 at that point and, as the map shows, I-465 NB did not provide access yet to Brookville Rd.

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51418013009_da5205c188_z_d.jpg)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 01, 2021, 03:37:07 PM
After perusing INDOT's website I have noticed a few new projects I wasnt aware of:

I-67 is apparently actually being taken seriously by INDOT and has its own website: https://midstatescorridor.com/

SR 101 is going to extended 25 miles to connect US 50 to the Markland Dam. https://www.in.gov/indot/div/projects/sr101/

The "Heavy Haul Cooridor" is still a thing in Utica

465 NW (86th to US 31) has its own site and will be having a virtual public meeting soon.

Anyone have any further details on these projects?

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 01, 2021, 04:02:07 PM
That's also the first I've heard of the SR 101 project. I agree that those counties need a boost, but man, that's some rough terrain through which to route a new road.

The Heavy Haul Corridor in Utica/Jeffersonville/Charlestown is most definitely a thing. The port down there is the second biggest in the state after Burns Harbor, and there are always big trucks going back and forth down there.

Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 01, 2021, 04:09:05 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 01, 2021, 04:02:07 PM
That's also the first I've heard of the SR 101 project. I agree that those counties need a boost, but man, that's some rough terrain through which to route a new road.

The Heavy Haul Corridor in Utica/Jeffersonville/Charlestown is most definitely a thing. The port down there is the second biggest in the state after Burns Harbor, and there are always big trucks going back and forth down there.

I really hope they just do a divided highway, I worry about ruining the environment in that part of the state for a marginally useful road (interstate being marginally useful).  I wonder if the heavy hall road will become a state road?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 01, 2021, 04:11:02 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 01, 2021, 04:09:05 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 01, 2021, 04:02:07 PM
That's also the first I've heard of the SR 101 project. I agree that those counties need a boost, but man, that's some rough terrain through which to route a new road.

The Heavy Haul Corridor in Utica/Jeffersonville/Charlestown is most definitely a thing. The port down there is the second biggest in the state after Burns Harbor, and there are always big trucks going back and forth down there.

I really hope they just do a divided highway, I worry about ruining the environment in that part of the state for a marginally useful road (interstate being marginally useful).  I wonder if the heavy hall road will become a state road?

The roadway that's already there isn't signed, and I haven't seen anything indicated that it ever will be.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 01, 2021, 04:15:13 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 01, 2021, 04:11:02 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 01, 2021, 04:09:05 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 01, 2021, 04:02:07 PM
That's also the first I've heard of the SR 101 project. I agree that those counties need a boost, but man, that's some rough terrain through which to route a new road.

The Heavy Haul Corridor in Utica/Jeffersonville/Charlestown is most definitely a thing. The port down there is the second biggest in the state after Burns Harbor, and there are always big trucks going back and forth down there.

I really hope they just do a divided highway, I worry about ruining the environment in that part of the state for a marginally useful road (interstate being marginally useful).  I wonder if the heavy hall road will become a state road?

The roadway that's already there isn't signed, and I haven't seen anything indicated that it ever will be.

does it have a name at all?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 01, 2021, 04:22:42 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 01, 2021, 04:15:13 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 01, 2021, 04:11:02 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 01, 2021, 04:09:05 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 01, 2021, 04:02:07 PM
That's also the first I've heard of the SR 101 project. I agree that those counties need a boost, but man, that's some rough terrain through which to route a new road.

The Heavy Haul Corridor in Utica/Jeffersonville/Charlestown is most definitely a thing. The port down there is the second biggest in the state after Burns Harbor, and there are always big trucks going back and forth down there.

I really hope they just do a divided highway, I worry about ruining the environment in that part of the state for a marginally useful road (interstate being marginally useful).  I wonder if the heavy hall road will become a state road?

The roadway that's already there isn't signed, and I haven't seen anything indicated that it ever will be.

does it have a name at all?

North of 265 it's called River Ridge Pkwy and south of 265 it's called Old Salem Rd. The part that's yet to be constructed will veer SW from Old Salem Rd here:

https://www.google.com/maps/@38.345966,-85.6661465,3a,75y,175.26h,68.9t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sTxI2A3NZxTcjgPM43x2Asw!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DTxI2A3NZxTcjgPM43x2Asw%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D19.308264%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192

I haven't been down there in a while so I don't know if that last segment is still in the works.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on September 01, 2021, 10:40:31 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 01, 2021, 03:37:07 PM
After perusing INDOT's website I have noticed a few new projects I wasnt aware of:

I-67 is apparently actually being taken seriously by INDOT and has its own website: https://midstatescorridor.com/

SR 101 is going to extended 25 miles to connect US 50 to the Markland Dam. https://www.in.gov/indot/div/projects/sr101/

The "Heavy Haul Cooridor" is still a thing in Utica

465 NW (86th to US 31) has its own site and will be having a virtual public meeting soon.

Anyone have any further details on these projects?



Where's the link to the 465 NW website? I'd be very interested in what that shows.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: cjw2001 on September 02, 2021, 12:43:39 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 01, 2021, 10:40:31 PM
Where's the link to the 465 NW website? I'd be very interested in what that shows.

Here is the info on the virtual meeting:

INDOT to Host Virtual Public Meeting on I-465 Northwest Project in Marion County
INDIANAPOLIS - The Indiana Department of Transportation will host a virtual public information meeting about an upcoming project on the Northwest side of I-465 in Marion County.

The meeting will take place on WebEx on Wednesday, September 8 at 6 p.m. meeting registration link  (https://lnks.gd/l/eyJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJidWxsZXRpbl9saW5rX2lkIjoxMDEsInVyaSI6ImJwMjpjbGljayIsImJ1bGxldGluX2lkIjoiMjAyMTA5MDEuNDUzMjg1NjEiLCJ1cmwiOiJodHRwczovL3BhcnNvbnMud2ViZXguY29tL213MzMwMC9teXdlYmV4L2RlZmF1bHQuZG8_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.u38qxOnUTFzbbJvR0Rc5egZwv10mY7eOuL4dctPXNZ4/s/486013599/br/111698090795-l)

The project extends on I-465 from 86th Street to U.S. 31 (Meridian St). The project will include an interchange modification at I-465 and I-865.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on September 02, 2021, 01:55:42 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on September 01, 2021, 10:40:31 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 01, 2021, 03:37:07 PM
After perusing INDOT's website I have noticed a few new projects I wasnt aware of:

I-67 is apparently actually being taken seriously by INDOT and has its own website: https://midstatescorridor.com/

SR 101 is going to extended 25 miles to connect US 50 to the Markland Dam. https://www.in.gov/indot/div/projects/sr101/

The "Heavy Haul Cooridor" is still a thing in Utica

465 NW (86th to US 31) has its own site and will be having a virtual public meeting soon.

Anyone have any further details on these projects?



Where's the link to the 465 NW website? I'd be very interested in what that shows.
https://www.in.gov/indot/projects/home/i-465-northwest-improvements-project/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: evvroads on September 02, 2021, 02:43:36 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 01, 2021, 03:37:07 PM
I-67 is apparently actually being taken seriously by INDOT and has its own website: https://midstatescorridor.com/

I wouldn't say I-67 is being taken seriously by INDOT at all. Certainly, they are taking at least semi-seriously some sort of route improvement along the US 231 corridor, but from what I understand, most (all?) of the funding for the Tier 1 EIS is being provided by this "Mid States Corridor Regional Development Authority" and not INDOT. I don't think this project would even be on INDOTs radar if not for this group. If you look at the maps on that website, you'll notice the options for route improvements range from freeway to a super 2. There is zero need for a freeway connection in that area. I think the absolute best anyone in that area can hope for is 1) maybe upgrading US 231 to an expressway (with bypasses of Huntingburg and Jasper) between I-64 and Jasper to match the portion south of I-64 and 2) upgrading US 231 to a super 2 between Jasper and I-69.

I'm (obviously) in Evansville, I have family in Spencer County, and several friends in Dubois County, so it's not like I'm one of those naysayers that think even I-69 was unnecessary. But the idea that INDOT would build a new interstate only 15-20 miles east of the least traveled portion of interstate in the state is laughable to anyone living in reality.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 02, 2021, 10:03:34 PM
Quote from: evvroads on September 02, 2021, 02:43:36 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 01, 2021, 03:37:07 PM
I-67 is apparently actually being taken seriously by INDOT and has its own website: https://midstatescorridor.com/

I wouldn't say I-67 is being taken seriously by INDOT at all. Certainly, they are taking at least semi-seriously some sort of route improvement along the US 231 corridor, but from what I understand, most (all?) of the funding for the Tier 1 EIS is being provided by this "Mid States Corridor Regional Development Authority" and not INDOT. I don't think this project would even be on INDOTs radar if not for this group. If you look at the maps on that website, you'll notice the options for route improvements range from freeway to a super 2. There is zero need for a freeway connection in that area. I think the absolute best anyone in that area can hope for is 1) maybe upgrading US 231 to an expressway (with bypasses of Huntingburg and Jasper) between I-64 and Jasper to match the portion south of I-64 and 2) upgrading US 231 to a super 2 between Jasper and I-69.

I'm (obviously) in Evansville, I have family in Spencer County, and several friends in Dubois County, so it's not like I'm one of those naysayers that think even I-69 was unnecessary. But the idea that INDOT would build a new interstate only 15-20 miles east of the least traveled portion of interstate in the state is laughable to anyone living in reality.

you make a good point  :-D
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on September 08, 2021, 04:33:20 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 02, 2021, 10:03:34 PM
Quote from: evvroads on September 02, 2021, 02:43:36 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 01, 2021, 03:37:07 PM
I-67 is apparently actually being taken seriously by INDOT and has its own website: https://midstatescorridor.com/

I wouldn't say I-67 is being taken seriously by INDOT at all. Certainly, they are taking at least semi-seriously some sort of route improvement along the US 231 corridor, but from what I understand, most (all?) of the funding for the Tier 1 EIS is being provided by this "Mid States Corridor Regional Development Authority" and not INDOT. I don't think this project would even be on INDOTs radar if not for this group. If you look at the maps on that website, you'll notice the options for route improvements range from freeway to a super 2. There is zero need for a freeway connection in that area. I think the absolute best anyone in that area can hope for is 1) maybe upgrading US 231 to an expressway (with bypasses of Huntingburg and Jasper) between I-64 and Jasper to match the portion south of I-64 and 2) upgrading US 231 to a super 2 between Jasper and I-69.

I'm (obviously) in Evansville, I have family in Spencer County, and several friends in Dubois County, so it's not like I'm one of those naysayers that think even I-69 was unnecessary. But the idea that INDOT would build a new interstate only 15-20 miles east of the least traveled portion of interstate in the state is laughable to anyone living in reality.

you make a good point  :-D

It's also worth noting that there have been several proposed iterations for I-67. Some proposals included the segment south of Indianapolis, most included the portion north of Indy, and some included both. I would assume that there is more interest in I-67 over US-31 than US-231.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: kennyshark64 on September 13, 2021, 01:27:03 PM
Quick question about the Indiana Toll Road (specifically at Exit 121/Howe).  Google Maps says the toll booth is "temporarily closed."  However, directions on Google Maps from Howe to South Bend does include the ITR.  Does anybody know the true status of this toll gate?  Thanks.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 13, 2021, 01:37:22 PM
Quote from: kennyshark64 on September 13, 2021, 01:27:03 PM
Quick question about the Indiana Toll Road (specifically at Exit 121/Howe).  Google Maps says the toll booth is "temporarily closed."  However, directions on Google Maps from Howe to South Bend does include the ITR.  Does anybody know the true status of this toll gate?  Thanks.

Some of the toll booths are no longer manned and require EZ Pass or credit card payment, but I don't think any interchanges are actually closed.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: kennyshark64 on September 13, 2021, 02:38:33 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on September 13, 2021, 01:37:22 PM
Quote from: kennyshark64 on September 13, 2021, 01:27:03 PM
Quick question about the Indiana Toll Road (specifically at Exit 121/Howe).  Google Maps says the toll booth is "temporarily closed."  However, directions on Google Maps from Howe to South Bend does include the ITR.  Does anybody know the true status of this toll gate?  Thanks.

Some of the toll booths are no longer manned and require EZ Pass or credit card payment, but I don't think any interchanges are actually closed.

Not an issue.  I'm afraid my EZ Pass is quite operational.  Thanks.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Tom958 on September 19, 2021, 08:28:33 AM
Something I stumbled upon a while back: This is a good candidate for peak Indiana. One type of metal guardrail on the bridge, a different type of metal bridge guardrail ground-mounted on the approaches, and, if you pivot to the right, standard W beam guardrail.

https://goo.gl/maps/TbhGShbjZT8FcR2C7

It's gone now. The bridge was rebuilt sometime between 2013 and 2018, with the superstructure being replaced but the bents remaining, and the old metal guardrails didn't survive.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 19, 2021, 10:04:08 AM
Quote from: Tom958 on September 19, 2021, 08:28:33 AM
Something I stumbled upon a while back: This is a good candidate for peak Indiana. One type of metal guardrail on the bridge, a different type of metal bridge guardrail ground-mounted on the approaches, and, if you pivot to the right, standard W beam guardrail.

https://goo.gl/maps/TbhGShbjZT8FcR2C7

It's gone now. The bridge was rebuilt sometime between 2013 and 2018, with the superstructure being replaced but the bents remaining, and the old metal guardrails didn't survive.

Not sure what that type of gaurdrail is called but it's very obsolete now! W-beam and thrie beam are the only 2 you see now.  :-D
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on September 19, 2021, 10:44:38 PM
I saw sign goofs on Indiana SR 2 southwest of Valparaiso in a newly-built roundabout at Heavilin Road. They have circular shields, which easily gave me vibes from Delaware!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on September 19, 2021, 11:30:52 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 19, 2021, 10:04:08 AM
Quote from: Tom958 on September 19, 2021, 08:28:33 AM
Something I stumbled upon a while back: This is a good candidate for peak Indiana. One type of metal guardrail on the bridge, a different type of metal bridge guardrail ground-mounted on the approaches, and, if you pivot to the right, standard W beam guardrail.

https://goo.gl/maps/TbhGShbjZT8FcR2C7

It's gone now. The bridge was rebuilt sometime between 2013 and 2018, with the superstructure being replaced but the bents remaining, and the old metal guardrails didn't survive.

Not sure what that type of gaurdrail is called but it's very obsolete now! W-beam and thrie beam are the only 2 you see now.  :-D

The one looks like a variation of Wyoming rail. 

EB I-70 used to have a somewhat similar guardrail transitions for the Wabash River Bridge. (https://goo.gl/maps/94vfq7Fawia8nmNa6)

Illinois used to at least occasionally use the W-beam with the flat (box?) beam beneath it as well.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: I-55 on September 27, 2021, 09:08:17 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on September 19, 2021, 10:44:38 PM
I saw sign goofs on Indiana SR 2 southwest of Valparaiso in a newly-built roundabout at Heavilin Road. They have circular shields, which easily gave me vibes from Delaware!

There are some circular SR 14 shields on traffic lights east of I-69 on Illinois Rd, used as lane references. Not the first time this has happened in Indiana.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on September 28, 2021, 09:13:06 AM
SR 49 has this ugly state shield  :-D https://www.google.com/maps/@41.6418871,-87.0625891,3a,42.9y,214.35h,84.31t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1saVuuJ7FFavadIP1UmOHd_g!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 28, 2021, 09:15:14 AM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on September 19, 2021, 10:44:38 PM
I saw sign goofs on Indiana SR 2 southwest of Valparaiso in a newly-built roundabout at Heavilin Road. They have circular shields, which easily gave me vibes from Delaware!

I don't suppose you got a picture?

I'm apparently about to have a lot of time off starting Friday, so maybe I'll go over there and get a picture.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Life in Paradise on September 28, 2021, 01:11:03 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on September 28, 2021, 09:13:06 AM
SR 49 has this ugly state shield  :-D https://www.google.com/maps/@41.6418871,-87.0625891,3a,42.9y,214.35h,84.31t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1saVuuJ7FFavadIP1UmOHd_g!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

I hope INDOT gets their money back for that sign.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on October 05, 2021, 06:21:38 PM
Speaking of roundabouts...

INDOT will be holding a public forum this week to discuss the proposal of building a roundabout at the intersection of Indiana 130 and Indiana 51 (Cleveland Avenue), located just northeast of Downtown Hobart. If/when work is done, it will be a single-lane roundabout that will also accommodate the Oak Savannah Trail that sits nearby.

The current intersection originally was a four-way stop that has since been signalized. The intersection also has a "spoke"  that allows southbound drivers looking to continue on 51 to skip the traffic light for the right turn. It is also notorious for blind sight lines for left turn drivers and high accident potential due to being unable to see drivers using makeshift runaround lanes to get past left turn traffic. IMO, the roundabout would be a marked improvement over what is currently there. More to come, if anything more materializes.

Indiana 130 is set to reopen within the next week. Resurfacing is complete; all that remains is the finishing touches of the intersections with Porter County Road 600 North, County Road 450 West, and Indiana 149.

The new US 12/20 split is almost set to be open as well. Grading and leveling is complete, and paving should be underway as early as this week. The quality-of-life improvements to the realigned section are scheduled to start next construction season, coinciding with the building of a revamped Miller Station and a second track for the South Shore Line, which will stretch from Gary to Michigan City.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Crash_It on October 10, 2021, 04:45:40 PM
Anyone have any idea why the *#@#$ I65 is so congested today through most of the state? Ruined my plans today. 
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SSOWorld on October 10, 2021, 06:52:42 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on October 10, 2021, 04:45:40 PM
Anyone have any idea why the *#@#$ I65 is so congested today through most of the state? Ruined my plans today. 
You're not the first one.  Won't be the last one.  I had HEAVY traffic from Des Plaines IL to Indy on a Friday in August.  Yes that means I-65.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on October 10, 2021, 07:44:42 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on October 10, 2021, 04:45:40 PM
Anyone have any idea why the *#@#$ I65 is so congested today through most of the state? Ruined my plans today.
There's a reason why a lot of us on this forum is calling it to be 6 laned, at least the Indy to Chicago section.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 10, 2021, 07:45:50 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on October 10, 2021, 04:45:40 PM
Anyone have any idea why the *#@#$ I65 is so congested today through most of the state? Ruined my plans today. 

Everybody drives through Indiana to avoid Illinois because it's so mountainous.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Crash_It on October 10, 2021, 08:51:00 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on October 10, 2021, 07:44:42 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on October 10, 2021, 04:45:40 PM
Anyone have any idea why the *#@#$ I65 is so congested today through most of the state? Ruined my plans today.
There's a reason why a lot of us on this forum is calling it to be 6 laned, at least the Indy to Chicago section.

Seems that more of I55 in Illinois is 6 laned than 65 through IN. I've never experienced this before of all the few times I've been to Indy this year. Next time it happens I'll probably take 31 instead or even 41.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on October 11, 2021, 12:10:51 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on October 10, 2021, 08:51:00 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on October 10, 2021, 07:44:42 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on October 10, 2021, 04:45:40 PM
Anyone have any idea why the *#@#$ I65 is so congested today through most of the state? Ruined my plans today.
There's a reason why a lot of us on this forum is calling it to be 6 laned, at least the Indy to Chicago section.

Seems that more of I55 in Illinois is 6 laned than 65 through IN. I've never experienced this before of all the few times I've been to Indy this year. Next time it happens I'll probably take 31 instead or even 41.
Us 41 to 52 is an alternative from Chicago to Indy. It's 4 laned the entire way as an added bonus.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SEWIGuy on October 11, 2021, 09:17:09 AM
Quote from: SkyPesos on October 11, 2021, 12:10:51 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on October 10, 2021, 08:51:00 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on October 10, 2021, 07:44:42 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on October 10, 2021, 04:45:40 PM
Anyone have any idea why the *#@#$ I65 is so congested today through most of the state? Ruined my plans today.
There's a reason why a lot of us on this forum is calling it to be 6 laned, at least the Indy to Chicago section.

Seems that more of I55 in Illinois is 6 laned than 65 through IN. I've never experienced this before of all the few times I've been to Indy this year. Next time it happens I'll probably take 31 instead or even 41.
Us 41 to 52 is an alternative from Chicago to Indy. It's 4 laned the entire way as an added bonus.


But is still going to take about 30 minutes longer.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Crash_It on October 11, 2021, 09:59:27 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on October 11, 2021, 09:17:09 AM
Quote from: SkyPesos on October 11, 2021, 12:10:51 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on October 10, 2021, 08:51:00 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on October 10, 2021, 07:44:42 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on October 10, 2021, 04:45:40 PM
Anyone have any idea why the *#@#$ I65 is so congested today through most of the state? Ruined my plans today.
There's a reason why a lot of us on this forum is calling it to be 6 laned, at least the Indy to Chicago section.

Seems that more of I55 in Illinois is 6 laned than 65 through IN. I've never experienced this before of all the few times I've been to Indy this year. Next time it happens I'll probably take 31 instead or even 41.
Us 41 to 52 is an alternative from Chicago to Indy. It's 4 laned the entire way as an added bonus.


But is still going to take about 30 minutes longer.

Better than the congestion on 65. Took me 6 hours to get to Indy.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: FixThe74Sign on October 11, 2021, 02:12:42 PM
INDOT is finally doing something about the truck traffic downtown during the North Split project. Weight limits are being imposed on the entrance and exit ramps.

https://northsplit.com/weight-restriction-in-place-on-i-65-i-70-exit-ramps-in-downtown-indianapolis/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 11, 2021, 02:14:39 PM
Quote from: FixThe74Sign on October 11, 2021, 02:12:42 PM
INDOT is finally doing something about the truck traffic downtown during the North Split project. Weight limits are being imposed on the entrance and exit ramps.

https://northsplit.com/weight-restriction-in-place-on-i-65-i-70-exit-ramps-in-downtown-indianapolis/

yep these signs were placed saturday night.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on October 11, 2021, 06:58:56 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on October 10, 2021, 08:51:00 PM

Seems that more of I55 in Illinois is 6 laned than 65 through IN. I've never experienced this before of all the few times I've been to Indy this year. Next time it happens I'll probably take 31 instead or even 41.

I always wondered which of these two Interstates had more miles six-laned. From a quick look at Google Maps, it looks like I-55 has about 97 miles of six lane highway accounting for 33% of the length, but I don't know if IDOT has any current widening projects making what GMaps shows out of date.

10   I-255-I-70 split
10   IL 104 - B-55/I-72W
23   MM 104 I-155
10   I-74 S. split-MM167
44   I-80-LSD

Including the two sections under construction on I-65 in Indiana, I count at least 113 miles of six-laned highway. I am not sure if there is another section under construction in Lafayette so that isn't counted. I-65 is about 262 miles in the state making 43% six lanes.

16   Ky line-Memphis
18   US 50-SR 46
33   SR 44-I-465W
17   I-865-SR 47
7   SR 38-SR 25
22   SR 2-I-90


Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 11, 2021, 07:19:35 PM
Quote from: mukade on October 11, 2021, 06:58:56 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on October 10, 2021, 08:51:00 PM

Seems that more of I55 in Illinois is 6 laned than 65 through IN. I've never experienced this before of all the few times I've been to Indy this year. Next time it happens I'll probably take 31 instead or even 41.

I always wondered which of these two Interstates had more miles six-laned. From a quick look at Google Maps, it looks like I-55 has about 97 miles of six lane highway accounting for 33% of the length, but I don't know if IDOT has any current widening projects making what GMaps shows out of date.

10   I-255-I-70 split
10   IL 104 - B-55/I-72W
23   MM 104 I-155
10   I-74 S. split-MM167
44   I-80-LSD

Including the two sections under construction on I-65 in Indiana, I count at least 113 miles of six-laned highway. I am not sure if there is another section under construction in Lafayette so that isn't counted. I-65 is about 262 miles in the state making 43% six lanes.

16   Ky line-Memphis
18   US 50-SR 46
33   SR 44-I-465W
17   I-865-SR 47
7   SR 38-SR 25
22   SR 2-I-90


IN 25-IN 43 is under construction.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on October 11, 2021, 07:40:29 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 11, 2021, 07:19:35 PM
Quote from: mukade on October 11, 2021, 06:58:56 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on October 10, 2021, 08:51:00 PM

Seems that more of I55 in Illinois is 6 laned than 65 through IN. I've never experienced this before of all the few times I've been to Indy this year. Next time it happens I'll probably take 31 instead or even 41.

I always wondered which of these two Interstates had more miles six-laned. From a quick look at Google Maps, it looks like I-55 has about 97 miles of six lane highway accounting for 33% of the length, but I don't know if IDOT has any current widening projects making what GMaps shows out of date.

10   I-255-I-70 split
10   IL 104 - B-55/I-72W
23   MM 104 I-155
10   I-74 S. split-MM167
44   I-80-LSD

Including the two sections under construction on I-65 in Indiana, I count at least 113 miles of six-laned highway. I am not sure if there is another section under construction in Lafayette so that isn't counted. I-65 is about 262 miles in the state making 43% six lanes.

16   Ky line-Memphis
18   US 50-SR 46
33   SR 44-I-465W
17   I-865-SR 47
7   SR 38-SR 25
22   SR 2-I-90


IN 25-IN 43 is under construction.

So 44.3% and 116 miles on I-65 in Indiana:

16   Ky line-Memphis
18   US 50-SR 46
33   SR 44-I-465W
17   I-865-SR 47
10   SR 38-SR 25
22   SR 2-I-90
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: westerninterloper on October 13, 2021, 06:59:02 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on October 11, 2021, 09:17:09 AM
Quote from: SkyPesos on October 11, 2021, 12:10:51 AM
Quote from: Crash_It on October 10, 2021, 08:51:00 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on October 10, 2021, 07:44:42 PM
Quote from: Crash_It on October 10, 2021, 04:45:40 PM
Anyone have any idea why the *#@#$ I65 is so congested today through most of the state? Ruined my plans today.
There's a reason why a lot of us on this forum is calling it to be 6 laned, at least the Indy to Chicago section.

Seems that more of I55 in Illinois is 6 laned than 65 through IN. I've never experienced this before of all the few times I've been to Indy this year. Next time it happens I'll probably take 31 instead or even 41.
Us 41 to 52 is an alternative from Chicago to Indy. It's 4 laned the entire way as an added bonus.


But is still going to take about 30 minutes longer.

I was surprised how much longer...I thought 41 to 63 to 74 might be comparable, but it is an hour longer (4) than I-65 (3).
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on October 13, 2021, 10:36:10 PM
Quote from: mukade on October 11, 2021, 06:58:56 PM
I always wondered which of these two Interstates had more miles six-laned. From a quick look at Google Maps, it looks like I-55 has about 97 miles of six lane highway accounting for 33% of the length, but I don't know if IDOT has any current widening projects making what GMaps shows out of date.

The only interstate widening projects actively in construction by IDOT are a section of I-57 north of Marion, some of I-74 with the Mississippi River bridge replacements, and maybe a little bit of I-90 near IL 171.  In the early planning stages are filling the gap on I-55 through Springfield, a little bit of widening on I-80 on Joliet, and maybe a small portion of I-39 between I-90 and the western interchange with US 20.

(edited due to recalling other projects after posting)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 15, 2021, 08:26:56 AM
There are a couple things that need to fall into place yet, but I'm tentatively scheduled to take a 2 night trip October 30-November 1 that would finish off the 720ish miles of the state highway system in SE and SW Indiana that I'm still missing. Been a goal of mine for about 10 years now to drive the entire state highway system and I'm almost there!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on October 22, 2021, 12:03:33 AM
From the INDOT Northwest Facebook page:

"Project Update - State Road 49 in Porter County

We never like being the bearers of bad news, so let's rip the Band-Aid off quick - the lane closures on State Road 49 north of State Road 2 in Valparaiso are here to stay through approximately July of 2022.

During the bridge deck overlay project that was set to end this month, it was discovered that the State Road 49 bridges over Evans Ave and Grand Truck Western Railroad were in much worse condition than originally thought. These unforeseen circumstances led to a change in the scope of the project, and we will now be doing total deck replacements for both bridges. Due to this change, there was not enough time left in the 2021 construction season to both design and construct the new bridge decks so that work will take place in spring/summer of 2022.

We know many people will ask "can't you open up the lanes for winter?!", but unfortunately, the answer is no due to safety concerns. The poor condition of the deteriorating bridge decks means that lane closures will need to remain in place until the full deck replacements can be completed.

Safety is at the forefront of everything we do here at INDOT so we hope you will understand why these decisions have been made (although we totally support that you don't have to like it)."
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on October 22, 2021, 01:23:24 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on October 22, 2021, 12:03:33 AM
From the INDOT Northwest Facebook page:

"Project Update - State Road 49 in Porter County

We never like being the bearers of bad news, so let's rip the Band-Aid off quick - the lane closures on State Road 49 north of State Road 2 in Valparaiso are here to stay through approximately July of 2022.

During the bridge deck overlay project that was set to end this month, it was discovered that the State Road 49 bridges over Evans Ave and Grand Truck Western Railroad were in much worse condition than originally thought. These unforeseen circumstances led to a change in the scope of the project, and we will now be doing total deck replacements for both bridges. Due to this change, there was not enough time left in the 2021 construction season to both design and construct the new bridge decks so that work will take place in spring/summer of 2022.

We know many people will ask "can't you open up the lanes for winter?!", but unfortunately, the answer is no due to safety concerns. The poor condition of the deteriorating bridge decks means that lane closures will need to remain in place until the full deck replacements can be completed.

Safety is at the forefront of everything we do here at INDOT so we hope you will understand why these decisions have been made (although we totally support that you don't have to like it)."

this is the second time i have heard something like this from indot this year regarding a bridge, are they not doing a good job at inspection ?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on October 25, 2021, 09:35:16 PM
Of course, Valparaiso is smack dab in the middle of the Lake Michigan snow belt so the huge volume of salt used might explain the cause of the premature deterioration.

On a totally different topic:

SR 26 from Rossville to west of Russiaville in Clinton and Howard Counties has been a particularly substandard and dangerous road - especially because it directly connects Lafayette to Kokomo which are only 44 miles apart and so it carries quite a bit of commuter traffic. And BTW, SR 26 here is part of the National Highway System. Recently, INDOT began upgrading the roadway, and the project is documented here (https://www.in.gov/indot/about-indot/central-office/welcome-to-the-crawfordsville-district/sr-26-road-rehabilitation-project-in-clinton-county/ (https://www.in.gov/indot/about-indot/central-office/welcome-to-the-crawfordsville-district/sr-26-road-rehabilitation-project-in-clinton-county/)).

I noticed that the INDOT "Road Restrictions & Closures" site showed SR 26 in Clinton County as open so today I took a trip up to check out what was done between SR 75 and Rossvile (going westbound). It ended up raining steadily so the part of the road that has not yet been improved had several sections with flooding up to about a foot. One part had water flowing across the road which was clearly causing erosion. At one flooded location, a car had apparently hydroplaned off the road and slid into a utility pole broadside totaling the vehicle. Further along a pickup going the opposite direction hit standing water going pretty fast to the point that it must have done damage.

At Sedalia, the improved road begins and goes to Rossville. The difference as a result of the rebuild is very dramatic and it is a welcome change. The intersection with SR 75 now has left turn lanes eliminating a major hazard there. In the next two years, the two remaining substandard sections will be rebuilt.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tosa on October 26, 2021, 01:50:42 PM
Quote from: mukade on October 25, 2021, 09:35:16 PM
Of course, Valparaiso is smack dab in the middle of the Lake Michigan snow belt so the huge volume of salt used might explain the cause of the premature deterioration.

On a totally different topic:

SR 26 from Rossville to west of Russiaville in Clinton and Howard Counties has been a particularly substandard and dangerous road - especially because it directly connects Lafayette to Kokomo which are only 44 miles apart and so it carries quite a bit of commuter traffic. And BTW, SR 26 here is part of the National Highway System. Recently, INDOT began upgrading the roadway, and the project is documented here (https://www.in.gov/indot/about-indot/central-office/welcome-to-the-crawfordsville-district/sr-26-road-rehabilitation-project-in-clinton-county/ (https://www.in.gov/indot/about-indot/central-office/welcome-to-the-crawfordsville-district/sr-26-road-rehabilitation-project-in-clinton-county/)).

I noticed that the INDOT "Road Restrictions & Closures" site showed SR 26 in Clinton County as open so today I took a trip up to check out what was done between SR 75 and Rossvile (going westbound). It ended up raining steadily so the part of the road that has not yet been improved had several sections with flooding up to about a foot. One part had water flowing across the road which was clearly causing erosion. At one flooded location, a car had apparently hydroplaned off the road and slid into a utility pole broadside totaling the vehicle. Further along a pickup going the opposite direction hit standing water going pretty fast to the point that it must have done damage.

At Sedalia, the improved road begins and goes to Rossville. The difference as a result of the rebuild is very dramatic and it is a welcome change. The intersection with SR 75 now has left turn lanes eliminating a major hazard there. In the next two years, the two remaining substandard sections will be rebuilt.

I wish SR 26 between Lafayetee and Kokomo can be widened to 4 lanes
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 26, 2021, 01:55:42 PM
Quote from: tosa on October 26, 2021, 01:50:42 PM
Quote from: mukade on October 25, 2021, 09:35:16 PM
Of course, Valparaiso is smack dab in the middle of the Lake Michigan snow belt so the huge volume of salt used might explain the cause of the premature deterioration.

On a totally different topic:

SR 26 from Rossville to west of Russiaville in Clinton and Howard Counties has been a particularly substandard and dangerous road - especially because it directly connects Lafayette to Kokomo which are only 44 miles apart and so it carries quite a bit of commuter traffic. And BTW, SR 26 here is part of the National Highway System. Recently, INDOT began upgrading the roadway, and the project is documented here (https://www.in.gov/indot/about-indot/central-office/welcome-to-the-crawfordsville-district/sr-26-road-rehabilitation-project-in-clinton-county/ (https://www.in.gov/indot/about-indot/central-office/welcome-to-the-crawfordsville-district/sr-26-road-rehabilitation-project-in-clinton-county/)).

I noticed that the INDOT "Road Restrictions & Closures" site showed SR 26 in Clinton County as open so today I took a trip up to check out what was done between SR 75 and Rossvile (going westbound). It ended up raining steadily so the part of the road that has not yet been improved had several sections with flooding up to about a foot. One part had water flowing across the road which was clearly causing erosion. At one flooded location, a car had apparently hydroplaned off the road and slid into a utility pole broadside totaling the vehicle. Further along a pickup going the opposite direction hit standing water going pretty fast to the point that it must have done damage.

At Sedalia, the improved road begins and goes to Rossville. The difference as a result of the rebuild is very dramatic and it is a welcome change. The intersection with SR 75 now has left turn lanes eliminating a major hazard there. In the next two years, the two remaining substandard sections will be rebuilt.

I wish SR 26 between Lafayetee and Kokomo can be widened to 4 lanes

I've only driven that road during non-commuting hours. Does it get that busy during commuting hours?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on October 26, 2021, 08:11:09 PM
That is one of the most boring drives in the state. Feels twice as long as it actually is
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 26, 2021, 10:24:31 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on October 26, 2021, 08:11:09 PM
That is one of the most boring drives in the state. Feels twice as long as it actually is

I've driven about 94% of the state's highways and there are plenty more boring than that.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on October 27, 2021, 12:06:58 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 26, 2021, 10:24:31 PM
Quote from: bmeiser on October 26, 2021, 08:11:09 PM
That is one of the most boring drives in the state. Feels twice as long as it actually is

I've driven about 94% of the state's highways and there are plenty more boring than that.
Touché.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: monty on October 27, 2021, 12:26:23 AM
SR 26 from Lafayette to Kokomo is bonkers during rush hour. Many Kokomo commuters to Subaru in Lafayette but certainly others going both directions.  I make this commute.  It is a narrow, bad road from west of Russiaville to Rossville. The improvements will be very welcome. Four lanes would be an overkill but the super two concept with improved passing opportunities will be awesome. This has been a very long time coming. I drive the newly completed section and it is much nicer. The worst segments yet to be tackled, save for utility work.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on October 27, 2021, 07:41:54 AM
Th scenery itself isn't particularly boring, but the road is dangerous. Those of us that have driven it multiple times have been stuck behind slow drivers and unable to pass due to hills and traffic volume. So it frequently does feel like a long drive.

In addition to serving commuters to big employers like Subaru in Lafayette and Frito-Lay in Frankfort, SR 26 is the highway that serves Purdue from points east. At the beginning and end of the week and on game days, traffic is also heavier. The least busy sections have an AADT of over 3600 and are where there are viable alternatives. I would expect volumes would rise once the project has been completed.

SR 26 across the state has generally been a poor road until recently. Over the years, it has been improved in various places, and I notice it was finally being improved (so was closed) east of Hartford City. That probably means it will be decent all the way from Lafayette to US 27, but I haven't driven the whole stretch in years. I suspect SR 26 west of Lafayette remains narrow, curvy and dangerous, but at least between US 41 and SR 55 the AADT is less than 1000.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: tdindy88 on October 27, 2021, 06:07:33 PM
I think this would be a good place to post this, I know Traffic Control may be just as good of a spot but since it's local. I saw this earlier today and thought it was pretty cool to see. The Indianapolis Star went to the Indianapolis Department of Public Works sign shop and took some pictures of some of the various street signs, including a split 65/70 interstate shield. I always thought Indy had some respectable street signs all-in-all.

https://www.indystar.com/picture-gallery/news/local/2021/10/27/indianapolis-department-of-public-works-dpw-roadway-signs-keeps-safe-how-made/5812964001/
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 01, 2021, 06:26:28 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 15, 2021, 08:26:56 AM
There are a couple things that need to fall into place yet, but I'm tentatively scheduled to take a 2 night trip October 30-November 1 that would finish off the 720ish miles of the state highway system in SE and SW Indiana that I'm still missing. Been a goal of mine for about 10 years now to drive the entire state highway system and I'm almost there!

OK, so I'm officially a little bit crazy. 33 hours and 1738 miles of driving over 3 days has netted me the final 720 miles of the Indiana state highway system I'd been missing, so I've now driven every mile of signed highway in the state.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on November 01, 2021, 11:39:06 PM
Nice work! Roughly how many miles do you think that is in total?

Also what kind of car do you drive? Hope it's comfortable!
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 02, 2021, 08:33:15 AM
Quote from: bmeiser on November 01, 2021, 11:39:06 PM
Nice work! Roughly how many miles do you think that is in total?

Also what kind of car do you drive? Hope it's comfortable!

Including Business routes, which are signed but not official state highways, it's about 11,250 miles. You can log and track your travels in Indiana and the rest of the US (and many other countries) at travelmapping.net

My current vehicle is a Mazda CX-5.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: bmeiser on November 02, 2021, 09:19:24 AM
Ah, "Zoom Zoom". Nice car.

I'll have to check that site out. My other hobby requires a lot of travel so I've probably driven a lot of state highway miles.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on November 03, 2021, 07:41:58 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on November 02, 2021, 08:33:15 AM

Including Business routes, which are signed but not official state highways, it's about 11,250 miles. You can log and track your travels in Indiana and the rest of the US (and many other countries) at travelmapping.net


Are you tracking travels on decommissioned state roads? NWI had SR 73, SR 141, SR 208, SR 330, SR 520, SR 555. South Bend/Elkhart had quite a number (SR 219, 123, 223, US 112, etc.). Back in the day when I had the HX web site, I tried to travel those former state roads as well, but there were so many iterations of these routes that it gets difficult. But if you have time on your hands, there's another project.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 03, 2021, 09:47:09 PM
Quote from: mukade on November 03, 2021, 07:41:58 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on November 02, 2021, 08:33:15 AM

Including Business routes, which are signed but not official state highways, it's about 11,250 miles. You can log and track your travels in Indiana and the rest of the US (and many other countries) at travelmapping.net


Are you tracking travels on decommissioned state roads? NWI had SR 73, SR 141, SR 208, SR 330, SR 520, SR 555. South Bend/Elkhart had quite a number (SR 219, 123, 223, US 112, etc.). Back in the day when I had the HX web site, I tried to travel those former state roads as well, but there were so many iterations of these routes that it gets difficult. But if you have time on your hands, there's another project.

I've done the former routings of 73, 79, 123, 141, 202, 313, 319, and 562 after they were decommissioned and also got 112, 131, 219, 238, 311, 334, 403, 431, 435, 443, 526 while they still existed
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 03, 2021, 10:27:01 PM
Quote from: mukade on November 03, 2021, 07:41:58 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on November 02, 2021, 08:33:15 AM

Including Business routes, which are signed but not official state highways, it's about 11,250 miles. You can log and track your travels in Indiana and the rest of the US (and many other countries) at travelmapping.net


Are you tracking travels on decommissioned state roads? NWI had SR 73, SR 141, SR 208, SR 330, SR 520, SR 555. South Bend/Elkhart had quite a number (SR 219, 123, 223, US 112, etc.). Back in the day when I had the HX web site, I tried to travel those former state roads as well, but there were so many iterations of these routes that it gets difficult. But if you have time on your hands, there's another project.
I'm pretty sure 520 still exists
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 04, 2021, 06:57:10 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 03, 2021, 10:27:01 PM
Quote from: mukade on November 03, 2021, 07:41:58 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on November 02, 2021, 08:33:15 AM

Including Business routes, which are signed but not official state highways, it's about 11,250 miles. You can log and track your travels in Indiana and the rest of the US (and many other countries) at travelmapping.net


Are you tracking travels on decommissioned state roads? NWI had SR 73, SR 141, SR 208, SR 330, SR 520, SR 555. South Bend/Elkhart had quite a number (SR 219, 123, 223, US 112, etc.). Back in the day when I had the HX web site, I tried to travel those former state roads as well, but there were so many iterations of these routes that it gets difficult. But if you have time on your hands, there's another project.
I'm pretty sure 520 still exists

Yeah that was a typo. Supposed to be 526.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on November 16, 2021, 05:34:27 PM
The new US 12/20 split in Miller (Gary) is now open.

Located just east of Lake Street and the Miller South Shore Station, eastbound drivers on US (12/)20 are informed of the new split with an oversized "JCT US 12"  sign, with another one telling drivers to turn left (assisted with a left turn lane). Oddly, there's no traffic light; instead, drivers coming from US 12 have to stop while US 20 traffic has full right of way.

Other oddities:

As mentioned above, the approach signs read "JCT US 12"  instead of "EAST US 12,"  with a left turn arrow, which can be read as US 12 (re)starting at the new split, theoretically resulting in a gap. Also, there's no signage (yet) to let drivers know Melton Road at that point is now US 12 and US 20. Hopefully, INDOT also takes down the overhead gantry at the old split (where evidence of the split is now removed, the road becoming a straightaway) soon, because a lot of uninitiated drivers think the old US 12 split is still there.

Also, at the new split, US 12 east is given the control cities of Portage and Michigan City. Although US 20 also serves Michigan City, I can understand US 12 being given that since it serves downtown and the lakefront, while US 20 is in the outskirts. However, "Ogden Dunes"  or even "Steel Mills/Port of Indiana"  would be better than "Portage,"  since it's better to STAY on US 20 for Portage interests.

In any case, it's very nicely done, with the road snaking it's way into the current US 12 footprint by the bridges. With this project completed, more work is expected to be done in the area between, with sidewalks and landscaping to be in place next year.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on November 21, 2021, 06:52:24 PM
We went on I-70 from SR 39 to I-465 on the way back from Evansville, and I saw some new signs pop up on the WB lanes. It looks like INDOT is putting up some "partial" APL signs for exit 66 (Quaker Boulevard), and it also looks like a set of full-blown APL signs will go up on the EB lanes for exit 68.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on November 21, 2021, 08:08:14 PM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on November 21, 2021, 06:52:24 PM
We went on I-70 from SR 39 to I-465 on the way back from Evansville, and I saw some new signs pop up on the WB lanes. It looks like INDOT is putting up some "partial" APL signs for exit 66 (Quaker Boulevard), and it also looks like a set of full-blown APL signs will go up on the EB lanes for exit 68.
They're doing that at a lot of locations. Here's one I found at I-65 and IN 267 last month:
(https://i.imgur.com/otNGe67.jpg)
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 22, 2021, 09:16:18 AM
Clear Path 465/69 is finally set to begin next year! It will be split into 2 contracts: contract 1 is 465 widening ignoring the 69 interchange. contract 2 is widening 69 and fixing the interchange. contract 2 will begin when north split is done by the looks of the schedule.

https://clearpath465.com/#project-map
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on November 23, 2021, 07:10:50 PM
When the US 24 freeway was built from Fort Wayne to the Ohio line, the original HMA pavement around Webster Rd had to be completely replaced before the road was opened. I took pictures of this process, and was surprised that this could happen. I read a comment from an INDOT spokesman saying something to the effect that it was just one of those things that happens.

In the November INDOT letting, it seems like this same stretch (built and opened in 2012) has to have the pavement replaced once again.

Any theories on why this could happen?

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.1114237,-84.9297313,46m/data=!3m1!1e3 (https://www.google.com/maps/@41.1114237,-84.9297313,46m/data=!3m1!1e3)[/list]
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on November 23, 2021, 08:56:34 PM
Quote from: mukade on November 23, 2021, 07:10:50 PM
When the US 24 freeway was built from Fort Wayne to the Ohio line, the original HMA pavement around Webster Rd had to be completely replaced before the road was opened. I took pictures of this process, and was surprised that this could happen. I read a comment from an INDOT spokesman saying something to the effect that it was just one of those things that happens.

In the November INDOT letting, it seems like this same stretch (built and opened in 2012) has to have the pavement replaced once again.

Any theories on why this could happen?



    • Location: ON US 24 FROM 2.61 MILES E OF I-469 TO 4.80 MILES E OF I-469
    • Engineer's Estimate: $12,030,221.05
    • County: ALLEN
    • Apparent winning bid:  $9,883,725.71 by PRIMCO LLC

    Google Maps satellite view:
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.1114237,-84.9297313,46m/data=!3m1!1e3 (https://www.google.com/maps/@41.1114237,-84.9297313,46m/data=!3m1!1e3)[/list]

My only guess is poor soils. This entire part of the state used to be a giant swamp, so the ground is likely very soft and makes the pavement fall apart due to differential settlement.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on November 23, 2021, 09:19:55 PM
I agree that is the obvious answer, but I also would have assumed that additional soil stabilization steps would have happened before the reconstruction in 2012. Making a mistake once is bad enough. I know the Kokomo and northern Indiana parts of the US 31 freeway had sections with muck pockets or peat marshes to contend with. AFAIK sufficient soil testing was done before construction began to avoid catastrophes.


Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on November 24, 2021, 03:16:48 PM
The other interesting item in the apparent bidding results from the 11/17 letting is the following:

Description: ADDED TRAVEL LANES, INTERSECTION IMPROVEMENTS, AND BRIDGE
Location: Location: ON I-65 FROM 1.33 MILES N OF SR 25 TO 0.8 MILE N OF SR 43
County: TIPPECANOE
Engineer's Estimate: None Below

Lowest bid: $102,031,682.38 for "HMA SECTION"

First, I thought this section was already under construction, but I guess it is not. Second, unless the bids are at least close to the estimate, they are all rejected. The state can either go through the process again with a special letting or they could choose to not go forward. That is not normally the case, but if all the bids are way over the INDOT estimate, it could happen. When the final results are published, we'll know.

Anyway, over $100M for about 2.5 miles of widening plus bridge work and intersection improvement seems like a lot.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on November 29, 2021, 06:51:31 PM
Update based on the official bid results that were published today for this I-65 widening project in Lafayette:

"* NO BIDS BELOW THE ENGINEER'S ESTIMATE — REJECT ALL BIDS; MAY BE READVERTISED FOR A FUTURE LETTING."
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: CtrlAltDel on November 29, 2021, 07:04:28 PM
Quote from: mukade on November 29, 2021, 06:51:31 PM
Update based on the official bid results that were published today for this I-65 widening project in Lafayette:

"* NO BIDS BELOW THE ENGINEER'S ESTIMATE — REJECT ALL BIDS; MAY BE READVERTISED FOR A FUTURE LETTING."

What was the engineer's estimate for this letting?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on November 29, 2021, 07:56:32 PM
All it says is "none Below". Official results are here (https://www.in.gov/dot/div/contracts/letting/archive/2021/nov17/20211117_Official.pdf) - see page 18.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: CtrlAltDel on November 29, 2021, 09:05:57 PM
Quote from: mukade on November 29, 2021, 07:56:32 PM
All it says is "none Below". Official results are here (https://www.in.gov/dot/div/contracts/letting/archive/2021/nov17/20211117_Official.pdf) - see page 18.

Weird.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: Revive 755 on November 29, 2021, 10:16:43 PM
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on November 29, 2021, 07:04:28 PM
What was the engineer's estimate for this letting?

If INDOT runs lettings similar to Illinois, the engineer's estimate is probably confidential and wouldn't be released outside of INDOT and any consulting firms that worked on the project.  There may be a less precise estimate available elsewhere from INDOT and/or the local metropolitan planning agency.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: mukade on December 11, 2021, 04:13:45 PM
The 2022-2026 Draft STIP was released this past week. From what I can tell with a quick review of the document, these are the Interstate widenings planned in the next four years.


The I-465 and widening will make this section eight lanes. Presumably, it will be the same for I-64 which is mainly already six lanes.

This list does not include the widenings related to the two I-465/I-69 interchanges and the current added travel lane construction underway on I-65 and I-70.
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: SkyPesos on December 11, 2021, 04:25:35 PM
Quote from: mukade on December 11, 2021, 04:13:45 PM
  • I-465 Added Travel Lanes from 1.33 mi S of I-865 (86th Street) to US 421 (is also in the 2020-2024 STIP)
Ok cool, now can INDOT make the I-865 exit from I-465 WB 2 continuous lanes, instead of dropping down to a single lane during the split, and gaining it back later on?
Title: Re: Indiana Notes
Post by: silverback1065 on December 11, 2021, 05:14:21 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on December 11, 2021, 04:25:35 PM
    Quote from: mukade on December 11, 2021, 04:13:45 PM
    • I-465 Added Travel Lanes from 1.33 mi S of I-865 (86th Street) to US 421 (is also in the 2020-2024 STIP)
    Ok cool, now can INDOT make the I-865 exit from I-465 WB 2 continuous lanes, instead of dropping down to a single lane during the split, and gaining it back later on?

    They released a concept drawing a few months ago. 465 will be 4 lanes and i think the 865 ramps will be 2 and on the right as well. [/list]
    Title: SR 37 Fishers and Noblesville upgrade
    Post by: mukade on December 12, 2021, 05:12:56 PM
    SR 37 in Fishers and Noblesville is in the process of getting upgraded. One interchange at 126th St is already open and two other interchanges are under construction. Early next year, construction on a fourth interchange at 141st St will be started.

    The SR 37 and 146th St interchange that is under construction will be a SPUI, and the other three will be dog bone roundabout interchanges.

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on December 16, 2021, 12:11:35 AM
    The interchange on I-65 at 109th Avenue in Crown Point has been reopened to traffic today!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 16, 2021, 10:18:00 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 16, 2021, 12:11:35 AM
    The interchange on I-65 at 109th Avenue in Crown Point has been reopened to traffic today!

    Converted from two signalized intersections to a dogbone interchange, this is part of a slew of improvements done to 109th Avenue between Broadway and Randolph Street.

    Another roundabout at Iowa Street.
    A dedicated left turn lane for traffic going from eastbound 109th Avenue to Colorado Street.
    Another dedicated left turn lane at Grand Boulevard, along with reduced sloping, which results in improved sight lines for traffic heading into that particular intersection.

    Just in time for Christmas. That will take a lot of pressure off of US 30 (for most drivers, that was the preferred detour for 109th Avenue between Randolph and Broadway).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SkyPesos on December 17, 2021, 07:32:36 PM
    Found a billboard on I-65 SB just south of exit 168 that says "Buc-ee's 552 miles"  on my way home today. It caught me off guard, so unfortunately, no photo of it.I have no idea what that is, but it's interesting seeing a billboard of the nearest location being hundreds of miles away.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ibthebigd on December 17, 2021, 07:35:54 PM
    It's the Cabela's or Bass Pro Shop of Convenience stores.

    They are building locations in Richmond Ky off I-75 and I think near Bowling Green on I-65

    I would love to see a location on I-65 maybe Greenwood or that dead exit north of Indianapolis

    SM-G950U

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SkyPesos on December 18, 2021, 02:37:17 PM
    Quote from: ibthebigd on December 17, 2021, 07:35:54 PM
    It's the Cabela's or Bass Pro Shop of Convenience stores.

    They are building locations in Richmond Ky off I-75 and I think near Bowling Green on I-65

    I would love to see a location on I-65 maybe Greenwood or that dead exit north of Indianapolis

    SM-G950U
    I would've thought a convenience store chain wouldn't advertise in a state far from their current operations, unless they're going to open a store in Indiana, but guess I got proved wrong.

    Also, 552 miles to the nearest location is a lot. That's about the same distance as advertising Washington DC tourism in Indianapolis.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: mukade on December 18, 2021, 03:01:46 PM
    There is this article (https://wrkr.com/bucees-indiana-billboard/) about the Buc-ee's billboard.

    But Indiana is set to have some Hy-Vee super markets according to this article (https://www.desmoinesregister.com/story/money/business/retail/2021/12/17/hyvee-expanding-midwest-tennessee-indiana-alabama-kentucky-2023/8910253002/) (not that they are even in the same category of stores).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: 2trailertrucker on December 18, 2021, 04:19:47 PM
    I saw that billboard today as well. It reminded me of the Wall Drugs signs for hundreds of miles in South Dakota!

    A Wally's opened up earlier this year in Pontiac IL off of I-55. I was impressed with the size, cleanliness and the staff were personable. It is the same concept as Buc-ee's.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 18, 2021, 05:12:18 PM
    Quote from: mukade on December 18, 2021, 03:01:46 PM
    There is this article (https://wrkr.com/bucees-indiana-billboard/) about the Buc-ee's billboard.

    But Indiana is set to have some Hy-Vee super markets according to this article (https://www.desmoinesregister.com/story/money/business/retail/2021/12/17/hyvee-expanding-midwest-tennessee-indiana-alabama-kentucky-2023/8910253002/) (not that they are even in the same category of stores).

    Kind of ridiculous. What percentage of traffic at that location is even going that far on I-65?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: 2trailertrucker on December 19, 2021, 04:01:05 AM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on December 18, 2021, 05:12:18 PM
    Quote from: mukade on December 18, 2021, 03:01:46 PM
    There is this article (https://wrkr.com/bucees-indiana-billboard/) about the Buc-ee's billboard.

    But Indiana is set to have some Hy-Vee super markets according to this article (https://www.desmoinesregister.com/story/money/business/retail/2021/12/17/hyvee-expanding-midwest-tennessee-indiana-alabama-kentucky-2023/8910253002/) (not that they are even in the same category of stores).

    Kind of ridiculous. What percentage of traffic at that location is even going that far on I-65?

    I think it is successful. After all we are talking about it.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on December 19, 2021, 09:46:44 AM
    Quote from: 2trailertrucker on December 19, 2021, 04:01:05 AM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on December 18, 2021, 05:12:18 PM
    Quote from: mukade on December 18, 2021, 03:01:46 PM
    There is this article (https://wrkr.com/bucees-indiana-billboard/) about the Buc-ee's billboard.

    But Indiana is set to have some Hy-Vee super markets according to this article (https://www.desmoinesregister.com/story/money/business/retail/2021/12/17/hyvee-expanding-midwest-tennessee-indiana-alabama-kentucky-2023/8910253002/) (not that they are even in the same category of stores).

    Kind of ridiculous. What percentage of traffic at that location is even going that far on I-65?

    I think it is successful. After all we are talking about it.
    Exactly! And I bet we will all be more likely to stop at one on our next road trip south.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JREwing78 on December 19, 2021, 11:44:08 AM
    Straight from the Wall Drug playbook. Heading west on I-90, you see the first signs advertising it in eastern Minnesota, about 500 miles away.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ran4sh on December 19, 2021, 12:10:08 PM
    The nearest Buc-ee's to that billboard is actually in Calhoun GA on I-75 (about 530 miles) so whether one's next road trip to the south is on I-65 or I-75 there is a Buc-ee's near both routes.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Rushmeister on December 20, 2021, 09:52:39 AM
    Quote from: ran4sh on December 19, 2021, 12:10:08 PM
    The nearest Buc-ee's to that billboard is actually in Calhoun GA on I-75 (about 530 miles) so whether one's next road trip to the south is on I-65 or I-75 there is a Buc-ee's near both routes.

    I'm voting for Leeds, Alabama.  My Googling puts it exactly 552 miles (give or take a smidge) from that sign.  I'm going to a Purdue basketball game tonight, so I'll be driving through there.  Gotta get a look at this thing.

    An age-old, but seldom-used, advertising gimmick.  In this case, I think it's also about the brand, not just the store's location, which is actually on I-20 east of Birmingham.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Rushmeister on December 21, 2021, 08:21:03 AM
    Quote from: Rushmeister on December 20, 2021, 09:52:39 AM
    Quote from: ran4sh on December 19, 2021, 12:10:08 PM
    The nearest Buc-ee's to that billboard is actually in Calhoun GA on I-75 (about 530 miles) so whether one's next road trip to the south is on I-65 or I-75 there is a Buc-ee's near both routes.

    I'm voting for Leeds, Alabama.  My Googling puts it exactly 552 miles (give or take a smidge) from that sign.  I'm going to a Purdue basketball game tonight, so I'll be driving through there.  Gotta get a look at this thing.

    An age-old, but seldom-used, advertising gimmick.  In this case, I think it's also about the brand, not just the store's location, which is actually on I-20 east of Birmingham.

    Duh.  If I had just clicked on the story link earlier in the thread, I could have saved myself the trouble of Googling (but it was fun, though -- love to solve puzzles, right?).  The sign, indeed, refers to the Leeds, Alabama, Buc-ee's location.

    I did see the sign late last night on my way home from West Lafayette.  My wife said, "Buc-ee's?  Never heard of it."  My reply, "Now you have.  Advertising works in mysterious ways."
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on December 21, 2021, 07:04:34 PM
    Buc-cees is worth a visit. Huge travel center. Lots of food options.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SkyPesos on December 21, 2021, 07:13:17 PM
    Quote from: monty on December 21, 2021, 07:04:34 PM
    Buc-cees is worth a visit. Huge travel center. Lots of food options.
    It's an issue when the nearest one is 552 miles on I-65, and I changed from I-65 to I-74 that night  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SSR_317 on December 26, 2021, 06:21:29 PM
    Quote from: JREwing78 on December 19, 2021, 11:44:08 AM
    Straight from the Wall Drug playbook. Heading west on I-90, you see the first signs advertising it in eastern Minnesota, about 500 miles away.
    Also, Harold's Club in Reno, NV used to have signs all over the country, giving the mileage to their establishment. Sadly, the place no longer exists, having closed in 1995 and its building was torn down in 1999.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: jhuntin1 on December 28, 2021, 10:28:20 PM
    Anyone who has driven I-65 between Lafayette and Chicago is probably familiar with the stretch between mile markers 217 and 223 where the "Road Noise" signs are posted. I had to drive up to Wisconsin and back over Christmas weekend to see the wife's family, and northbound there was a one-mile construction zone posted with no equipment present. I could see the pavement looked noticeably different, and driving over that one-mile stretch the road noise was noticeably better. Out of the construction zone, the pavement returned to normal and was the usual noisy drive. Did INDOT diamond-grind that section or do something to improve it, or was I just imagining it? If anyone knows, are they planning to do anything permanent to that stretch? 
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on December 28, 2021, 10:29:51 PM
    Quote from: jhuntin1 on December 28, 2021, 10:28:20 PM
    Anyone who has driven I-65 between Lafayette and Chicago is probably familiar with the stretch between mile markers 217 and 223 where the "Road Noise" signs are posted. I had to drive up to Wisconsin and back over Christmas weekend to see the wife's family, and northbound there was a one-mile construction zone posted with no equipment present. I could see the pavement looked noticeably different, and driving over that one-mile stretch the road noise was noticeably better. Out of the construction zone, the pavement returned to normal and was the usual noisy drive. Did INDOT diamond-grind that section or do something to improve it, or was I just imagining it? If anyone knows, are they planning to do anything permanent to that stretch?
    I've always wondered why this part of the road was noisy anyone know why?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: jhuntin1 on December 28, 2021, 10:42:17 PM
    From the look of it (passing by at 70+, mind you), it looks like the seams in the pavement were sealed somehow and either buckled upward or were placed too high to begin with.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 28, 2021, 11:14:45 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on December 28, 2021, 10:29:51 PM
    Quote from: jhuntin1 on December 28, 2021, 10:28:20 PM
    Anyone who has driven I-65 between Lafayette and Chicago is probably familiar with the stretch between mile markers 217 and 223 where the "Road Noise" signs are posted. I had to drive up to Wisconsin and back over Christmas weekend to see the wife's family, and northbound there was a one-mile construction zone posted with no equipment present. I could see the pavement looked noticeably different, and driving over that one-mile stretch the road noise was noticeably better. Out of the construction zone, the pavement returned to normal and was the usual noisy drive. Did INDOT diamond-grind that section or do something to improve it, or was I just imagining it? If anyone knows, are they planning to do anything permanent to that stretch?
    I've always wondered why this part of the road was noisy anyone know why?

    That section used to be this weird concrete with what I would describe as grooves that created weird tire noises. It got repaved a few years back.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ssummers72 on December 29, 2021, 07:48:46 AM
        Quote from: jhuntin1 on December 28, 2021, 10:28:20 PM

            Anyone who has driven I-65 between Lafayette and Chicago is probably familiar with the stretch between mile markers 217 and 223 where the "Road Noise" signs are posted. I had to drive up to Wisconsin and back over Christmas weekend to see the wife's family, and northbound there was a one-mile construction zone posted with no equipment present. I could see the pavement looked noticeably different, and driving over that one-mile stretch the road noise was noticeably better. Out of the construction zone, the pavement returned to normal and was the usual noisy drive. Did INDOT diamond-grind that section or do something to improve it, or was I just imagining it? If anyone knows, are they planning to do anything permanent to that stretch?

        I've always wondered why this part of the road was noisy anyone know why?


    That section used to be this weird concrete with what I would describe as grooves that created weird tire noises. It got repaved a few years back.

    So, the project was called a UBWC or Ultrathin Bonding Wearing Course - which is essentially a 3/8" HMA surface over PCCP. The process entails milling the PCCP surface, crack filling the joints and overlaying with the UBWC. When the contractor was milling the PCCP, they did not following the special provisions of milling at a lower rate. This led to the PCCP joints being widened out due to the faster production rate. Then, the joints were crack filled (more than the specifications required). Typically, the cracked filled joints remain open for 30 days to allow time for them to cure. The open time was less than a week for the joints before the UBWC was applied. Now, when the UBWC was applied to the crack filled PCCP, it was placed at a faster rate than the special provisions had required. This intern heated up the crack filler and it leached through the UBWC and hardened.

    Long story short, this is why the overlaid PCCP with the UBWC sounds like mini speed bumps along the entire 6 mile stretch near SR 14.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on December 29, 2021, 03:24:56 PM
    Quote from: ssummers72 on December 29, 2021, 07:48:46 AM
     
    So, the project was called a UBWC or Ultrathin Bonding Wearing Course - which is essentially a 3/8" HMA surface over PCCP. The process entails milling the PCCP surface, crack filling the joints and overlaying with the UBWC. When the contractor was milling the PCCP, they did not following the special provisions of milling at a lower rate. This led to the PCCP joints being widened out due to the faster production rate. Then, the joints were crack filled (more than the specifications required). Typically, the cracked filled joints remain open for 30 days to allow time for them to cure. The open time was less than a week for the joints before the UBWC was applied. Now, when the UBWC was applied to the crack filled PCCP, it was placed at a faster rate than the special provisions had required. This intern heated up the crack filler and it leached through the UBWC and hardened.

    Long story short, this is why the overlaid PCCP with the UBWC sounds like mini speed bumps along the entire 6 mile stretch near SR 14.

    Thanks for providing this excellent explanation!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on December 29, 2021, 04:18:36 PM

    To shift the focus of conversation, I'd like to turn to what the future holds for Indiana road and bridge mobility projects. The picture is fairly clear for the next 10 years, with several major projects now underway, to commence soon, or in planning stage, including:

    - Section 6 of I-69
    - upgrades to SR 31
    - improvements to SR 30
    - ORX crossing
    - Mid-States Corridor
    - Indy I-495 projects
    - I-65/I-70 North Split
    - SR 101 corridor, and
    - I-65 and I-70, added travel lanes and upgrades.

    The list, while not intended to be a comprehensive, provides an outline of what can be expected in the next 10 years in Indiana. By 2032, most of theses projects will be complete, or nearly so. But the outlook beyond 10 years is less clear. Besides routine maintenance and reconstruction of already built roads and bridges, as well as projects that enhance mobility and safety – added lanes, interchanges, etc. – what's next, in terms of significant corridor and bridge projects, from 2032 and onward?

    What might these upcoming projects be, and where, when, and why?


    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on December 29, 2021, 04:24:20 PM
    Quote from: ITB on December 29, 2021, 04:18:36 PM

    To shift the focus of conversation, I'd like to turn to what the future holds for Indiana road and bridge mobility projects. The picture is fairly clear for the next 10 years, with several major projects now underway, to commence soon, or in planning stage, including:

    - Section 6 of I-69
    - upgrades to SR 31
    - improvements to SR 30
    - ORX crossing
    - Mid-States Corridor
    - Indy I-495 projects
    - I-65/I-70 North Split
    - SR 101 corridor, and
    - I-65 and I-70, added travel lanes and upgrades.

    The list, while not intended to be a comprehensive, provides an outline of what can be expected in the next 10 years in Indiana. By 2032, most of theses projects will be complete, or nearly so. But the outlook beyond 10 years is less clear. Besides routine maintenance and reconstruction of already built roads and bridges, as well as projects that enhance mobility and safety – added lanes, interchanges, etc. – what's next, in terms of significant corridor and bridge projects, from 2032 and onward?

    What might these upcoming projects be, and where, when, and why?

    I think the state will want to do something with 64 in New Albany. i bet they widen it.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on December 29, 2021, 04:48:01 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on December 29, 2021, 04:24:20 PM
    Quote from: ITB on December 29, 2021, 04:18:36 PM

    To shift the focus of conversation, I'd like to turn to what the future holds for Indiana road and bridge mobility projects. The picture is fairly clear for the next 10 years, with several major projects now underway, to commence soon, or in planning stage, including:

    - Section 6 of I-69
    - upgrades to SR 31
    - improvements to SR 30
    - ORX crossing
    - Mid-States Corridor
    - Indy I-495 projects
    - I-65/I-70 North Split
    - SR 101 corridor, and
    - I-65 and I-70, added travel lanes and upgrades.

    The list, while not intended to be a comprehensive, provides an outline of what can be expected in the next 10 years in Indiana. By 2032, most of theses projects will be complete, or nearly so. But the outlook beyond 10 years is less clear. Besides routine maintenance and reconstruction of already built roads and bridges, as well as projects that enhance mobility and safety – added lanes, interchanges, etc. – what's next, in terms of significant corridor and bridge projects, from 2032 and onward?

    What might these upcoming projects be, and where, when, and why?

    I think the state will want to do something with 64 in New Albany. i bet they widen it.

    Yup, the I-64 widening project west of New Albany will probably be under construction sometime in 2024-2025.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Revive 755 on December 29, 2021, 09:44:28 PM
    Maybe a project to remove the remaining stoplight on SR 49 between the Toll Road and Valparaiso at CR 500N?

    If the growth around Crown Point continues there could be some widenings for US 231 and SR 2, if not a partial revival on the Illiana.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on December 30, 2021, 08:16:30 AM
    Quote from: Revive 755 on December 29, 2021, 09:44:28 PM
    Maybe a project to remove the remaining stoplight on SR 49 between the Toll Road and Valparaiso at CR 500N?

    If the growth around Crown Point continues there could be some widenings for US 231 and SR 2, if not a partial revival on the Illiana.

    Illiana won't ever happen until Illinois gets itself together.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Life in Paradise on December 30, 2021, 01:20:04 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 29, 2021, 04:48:01 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on December 29, 2021, 04:24:20 PM
    Quote from: ITB on December 29, 2021, 04:18:36 PM

    To shift the focus of conversation, I'd like to turn to what the future holds for Indiana road and bridge mobility projects. The picture is fairly clear for the next 10 years, with several major projects now underway, to commence soon, or in planning stage, including:

    - Section 6 of I-69
    - upgrades to SR 31
    - improvements to SR 30
    - ORX crossing
    - Mid-States Corridor
    - Indy I-495 projects
    - I-65/I-70 North Split
    - SR 101 corridor, and
    - I-65 and I-70, added travel lanes and upgrades.

    The list, while not intended to be a comprehensive, provides an outline of what can be expected in the next 10 years in Indiana. By 2032, most of theses projects will be complete, or nearly so. But the outlook beyond 10 years is less clear. Besides routine maintenance and reconstruction of already built roads and bridges, as well as projects that enhance mobility and safety – added lanes, interchanges, etc. – what's next, in terms of significant corridor and bridge projects, from 2032 and onward?

    What might these upcoming projects be, and where, when, and why?

    I think the state will want to do something with 64 in New Albany. i bet they widen it.

    Yup, the I-64 widening project west of New Albany will probably be under construction sometime in 2024-2025.
    I would agree on the I-64 widening, perhaps they also will consider widening I-265 between I-64 and I-65.  That area of road always appears heavily traveled.

    I'm not sure that the Mid-States Corridor is going to do much beyond the stretch between I-64 and Jasper.  Traffic drops off significantly after you get out of Jasper on the north side.  My play would be to go northeast from Jasper to better access the northern area of Patoka Lake, bend around French Lick and Paoli and then go up 37.  That would give some more access to tourist areas (Patoka Lake, French Lick casinos, Paoli Peaks tall hill" skiiing) and then also serve other industry that are in the Paoli area.  It also would be farther from the I-69 corridor to help the region.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on December 30, 2021, 04:50:55 PM
    Quote from: Life in Paradise on December 30, 2021, 01:20:04 PM
    I'm not sure that the Mid-States Corridor is going to do much beyond the stretch between I-64 and Jasper.  Traffic drops off significantly after you get out of Jasper on the north side.  My play would be to go northeast from Jasper to better access the northern area of Patoka Lake, bend around French Lick and Paoli and then go up 37.  That would give some more access to tourist areas (Patoka Lake, French Lick casinos, Paoli Peaks tall hill" skiiing) and then also serve other industry that are in the Paoli area.  It also would be farther from the I-69 corridor to help the region.

    That's Route O, one of the options currently under consideration. The preferred corridor will be identified when the DEIS is released early next year. Maps of the Mid-State Corridor (https://midstatescorridor.com/) project's potential corridors can be found here (https://midstatescorridor.com/project-maps/).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Life in Paradise on December 31, 2021, 02:05:23 PM
    Quote from: ITB on December 30, 2021, 04:50:55 PM
    Quote from: Life in Paradise on December 30, 2021, 01:20:04 PM
    I'm not sure that the Mid-States Corridor is going to do much beyond the stretch between I-64 and Jasper.  Traffic drops off significantly after you get out of Jasper on the north side.  My play would be to go northeast from Jasper to better access the northern area of Patoka Lake, bend around French Lick and Paoli and then go up 37.  That would give some more access to tourist areas (Patoka Lake, French Lick casinos, Paoli Peaks tall hill" skiiing) and then also serve other industry that are in the Paoli area.  It also would be farther from the I-69 corridor to help the region.

    That's Route O, one of the options currently under consideration. The preferred corridor will be identified when the DEIS is released early next year. Maps of the Mid-State Corridor (https://midstatescorridor.com/) project's potential corridors can be found here (https://midstatescorridor.com/project-maps/).
    I've seen those options.  They've been playing around with US 231 there since the 70s when they put the super two from Huntingburg to just south of Jasper, then a bit later went around some businesses/car dealerships with another super two to dump you right into the heart of Jasper.  They moved another highway to skirt the south side of town.  What has happened since?  Some businesses left one road that is no longer a state highway, and they are building places on the new  super two highway and you enter at traffic lights.  Nothing like redoing a project several times, and then looking at doing it right so that you now have to spend three to four times the amount plus the earlier expense.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on January 04, 2022, 02:31:59 AM
    Copying this from the "Freeway Entrance" signage thread, but I have found ANOTHER "Freeway Entrance" sign in Indiana! (I-69 NB onramp at S Green River Road in Evansville)

    https://www.google.com/maps/@37.9383443,-87.4927013,3a,15y,189.42h,90.21t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sNAMUDZ6YMHO9Rue8g6OZRQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on January 06, 2022, 09:33:57 AM
    SR 56 Officially no longer goes through Madison anymore, but continuity has been preserved. it multiplexes with 62 and 421 to stay in tact. SR 7 now just dies at main st, but i expect them to rid themselves of it south of 62/56 clifty dr.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on January 06, 2022, 09:44:35 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on January 06, 2022, 09:33:57 AM
    SR 56 Officially no longer goes through Madison anymore, but continuity has been preserved. it multiplexes with 62 and 421 to stay in tact. SR 7 now just dies at main st, but i expect them to rid themselves of it south of 62/56 clifty dr.

    A couple questions: Is there any press release or news article documenting this change? Has new signage been put up along 62/421 reflecting the change and has the old signage been removed? What about the very short segment of 256 between 62 and what used to be 56?

    Need this info to pass along to mapcat so he can update TravelMapping.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on January 06, 2022, 09:47:55 AM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on January 06, 2022, 09:44:35 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on January 06, 2022, 09:33:57 AM
    SR 56 Officially no longer goes through Madison anymore, but continuity has been preserved. it multiplexes with 62 and 421 to stay in tact. SR 7 now just dies at main st, but i expect them to rid themselves of it south of 62/56 clifty dr.

    A couple questions: Has new signage been put up along 62/421 reflecting the change and has the old signage been removed? What about the very short segment of 256 between 62 and what used to be 56?

    Google Maps confirms field signage has been changed to reflect this as of 11/2021. that tiny part of 256 is gone too but i suspect that piece is a secret state road. 56 is now signed along 62 and 421 and thankfully very well too, its on the bgs at the roundabout too. usually indot half asses these things. look at us 12 where it overlaps 912. 7 still just ends where it used to but i bet INDOT is desperately trying to give that away too. this happened when they completed the 421 ohio river bridge approach. that is also on google maps. Well the jct with 421 right by the bridge is poorly signed.  :banghead:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on January 07, 2022, 03:49:33 AM
    An interesting article in the January 2022 issue of Roads & Bridges reports on how INDOT and a contractor, Force Construction, utilized cutting-edge concrete tech to replace the US 52 bridge over Mud Creek in Rush County. The project, which employed an all-precast accelerated construction method using carbon nanofiber UHPC (Ultra High Performance Concrete), was the first of its kind in Indiana.

    The article can be accessed  here (https://www.roadsbridges.com/indiana-dot-completes-first-all-precast-bridge-replacement-using-carbon-nanofiber-uhpc).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: hockeyjohn on January 07, 2022, 09:59:35 AM
    INDOT's website says it will no longer print copies of its highway map but will maintain a version on-line.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on January 07, 2022, 10:06:20 AM
    Quote from: hockeyjohn on January 07, 2022, 09:59:35 AM
    INDOT's website says it will no longer print copies of its highway map but will maintain a version on-line.

    This makes me very sad.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: jhuntin1 on January 07, 2022, 12:19:21 PM
    Quote from: hockeyjohn on January 07, 2022, 09:59:35 AM
    INDOT's website says it will no longer print copies of its highway map but will maintain a version on-line.
    With smart phones and GPS being so prevalent I can understand why they made this decision, but it makes me sad that I'll never own an Indiana road map with a completed I-69 (among other projects). It's a shame that the print versions will cease entirely.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: triplemultiplex on January 07, 2022, 05:09:48 PM
    If that was my home state, I'd almost consider taking the pdf to a UPS store or whatever and have them print it out on a plotter at like 24x36.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: skluth on January 07, 2022, 06:51:33 PM
    Quote from: triplemultiplex on January 07, 2022, 05:09:48 PM
    If that was my home state, I'd almost consider taking the pdf to a UPS store or whatever and have them print it out on a plotter at like 24x36.
    I believe they've anticipated that. The INDOT site  (https://www.in.gov/indot/resources/maps/) has a link that states "View or Print a 2021 Indiana Roadway Map." (emphasis mine) Weirdly, it only prints the old front side which means the only city map on the state map is the capital.

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on January 07, 2022, 08:06:39 PM
    Quote from: skluth on January 07, 2022, 06:51:33 PM
    Quote from: triplemultiplex on January 07, 2022, 05:09:48 PM
    If that was my home state, I'd almost consider taking the pdf to a UPS store or whatever and have them print it out on a plotter at like 24x36.
    I believe they've anticipated that. The INDOT site  (https://www.in.gov/indot/resources/maps/) has a link that states "View or Print a 2021 Indiana Roadway Map." (emphasis mine) Weirdly, it only prints the old front side which means the only city map on the state map is the capital.



    The only city map the state map has had for over a decade now is Indianapolis. Indiana's been cheap when it comes to their highway map since the Daniels administration. I think it was 2009-2010 the last time city maps were included. Then they started making it a touristy kind of map with useless ads on the back and the state map on the front with just the small Indy inset instead.

    I really hate Indiana being a cheapskate sometimes. I mean, every other state around us still has a printed map so what gives with us. Oh yeah, saving money. Honest to Goodness Indiana!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SSR_317 on January 08, 2022, 04:42:32 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on January 07, 2022, 08:06:39 PM

    The only city map the state map has had for over a decade now is Indianapolis. Indiana's been cheap when it comes to their highway map since the Daniels administration. I think it was 2009-2010 the last time city maps were included. Then they started making it a touristy kind of map with useless ads on the back and the state map on the front with just the small Indy inset instead.

    I really hate Indiana being a cheapskate sometimes. I mean, every other state around us still has a printed map so what gives with us. Oh yeah, saving money. Honest to Goodness Indiana!
    Don't get me started on Mitch Daniels! To leave politics out of this, I'll just say he's now doing to Purdue University (as its current President) what he did to the entire state as Governor.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on January 08, 2022, 04:48:57 PM
    Finding creative ways to improve the campus (state) without putting the burden on students (taxpayers)? What a monster!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: mukade on January 08, 2022, 09:41:30 PM
    The INDOT letting list has the I-65 widening in Tippecanoe County that was rejected back on the schedule for the January letting. It looks like the contract is broken into eight separate items so presumably they can at least get the widening part awarded even if the interchange work slips.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Lyon Wonder on January 09, 2022, 01:43:25 AM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on January 07, 2022, 08:06:39 PM
    Quote from: skluth on January 07, 2022, 06:51:33 PM
    Quote from: triplemultiplex on January 07, 2022, 05:09:48 PM
    If that was my home state, I'd almost consider taking the pdf to a UPS store or whatever and have them print it out on a plotter at like 24x36.
    I believe they've anticipated that. The INDOT site  (https://www.in.gov/indot/resources/maps/) has a link that states "View or Print a 2021 Indiana Roadway Map." (emphasis mine) Weirdly, it only prints the old front side which means the only city map on the state map is the capital.



    The only city map the state map has had for over a decade now is Indianapolis. Indiana's been cheap when it comes to their highway map since the Daniels administration. I think it was 2009-2010 the last time city maps were included. Then they started making it a touristy kind of map with useless ads on the back and the state map on the front with just the small Indy inset instead.

    I really hate Indiana being a cheapskate sometimes. I mean, every other state around us still has a printed map so what gives with us. Oh yeah, saving money. Honest to Goodness Indiana!

    Indiana isn't alone when it comes to problems with official highway maps.  Illinois usually releases an updated official state highway map once every 2 years during July or August and the newest map should have been 2021, but IDOT didn't release a new map last year and they still have the 2019 map on the their website. 

    The quality of the 2019-20 Illinois map wasn't that great compared to the previous 2017 and earlier editions since some non-interstate roads that are supposed to be limited access freeways are marked as expressways and the city map inserts no longer show detailed interchanges and replaced them with a white square.

    https://idot.illinois.gov/transportation-system/Network-Overview/highway-system/maps
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SSR_317 on January 09, 2022, 12:42:10 PM
    Quote from: bmeiser on January 08, 2022, 04:48:57 PM
    Finding creative ways to improve the campus (state) without putting the burden on students (taxpayers)? What a monster!
    Only if turning a once great institution into a another right-wing conformity factory is an "improvement". That being said, let's agree to disagree and turn our focus back to roads & transportation.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: mukade on January 13, 2022, 05:46:49 PM
    The vast majority of the items in the INDOT letting yesterday resulted in all contractors bids being over the engineer's estimates. At least the I-65 widening project in Tippecanoe county had one bid barely below the estimate so I assume that will be awarded without a problem.

    Apparently, the engineers' estimates are not accounting for our high inflation rate so it will be interesting to see how INDOT handles things going forward.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on January 13, 2022, 05:52:00 PM
    Quote from: mukade on January 13, 2022, 05:46:49 PM
    The vast majority of the items in the INDOT letting yesterday resulted in all contractors bids being over the engineer's estimates. At least the I-65 widening project in Tippecanoe county had one bid barely below the estimate so I assume that will be awarded without a problem.

    Apparently, the engineers' estimates are not accounting for our high inflation rate so it will be interesting to see how INDOT handles things going forward.

    the 65 job sold to walsh i believe for like 99.5 mil i think  :hmmm:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: mukade on January 13, 2022, 06:31:00 PM
    Yep. This is from yesterday:

    - WALSH CONSTRUCTION COMPANY II LLC $99,415,926.33

    Engineer's Estimate listed at $99,481,491.68

    This was one from the previous letting.

    - WALSH CONSTRUCTION COMPANY II LLC $102,441,235.29 Rejected
    Title: Bye bye Michigan Left in Fishers
    Post by: mukade on February 17, 2022, 07:43:17 PM
    The Michigan left turns at the intersection of Allisonville Rd. and 96th St. on the Fishers/Indianapolis boundary will apparently be replaced by a roundabout. I can't find a link to the article, but you can find the story on the NewsBreak mobile app when you select Fishers as your location. This project would be done as a part of a new $98M mixed use/residential development.

    I think this roundabout would serve busier streets than the Olio Rd. / Southeastern Pkwy. / 136th St. roundabout in Fishers which is pretty accident-prone and often difficult to navigate.
    Title: Re: Bye bye Michigan Left in Fishers
    Post by: silverback1065 on February 17, 2022, 09:38:14 PM
    Quote from: mukade on February 17, 2022, 07:43:17 PM
    The Michigan left turns at the intersection of Allisonville Rd. and 96th St. on the Fishers/Indianapolis boundary will apparently be replaced by a roundabout. I can't find a link to the article, but you can find the story on the NewsBreak mobile app when you select Fishers as your location. This project would be done as a part of a new $98M mixed use/residential development.

    I think this roundabout would serve busier streets than the Olio Rd. / Southeastern Pkwy. / 136th St. roundabout in Fishers which is pretty accident-prone and often difficult to navigate.

    are you sure its not going to be like the roundabout interchange at 146th and allisonville (Coming soon)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: mukade on February 17, 2022, 09:53:00 PM
    It says roundabout, and there is now an article on the web (https://www.insideindianabusiness.com/articles/fishers-plans-100m-mixed-use-project).

    A while back, I thought I read that the Allisonville Rd. and 116th St intersection in Fishers might also become a roundabout (or otherwise improved).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on February 18, 2022, 08:38:53 PM
    Quote from: mukade on February 17, 2022, 09:53:00 PM
    It says roundabout, and there is now an article on the web (https://www.insideindianabusiness.com/articles/fishers-plans-100m-mixed-use-project).

    A while back, I thought I read that the Allisonville Rd. and 116th St intersection in Fishers might also become a roundabout (or otherwise improved).

    interesting, i wonder if that will actually work. i feel like there would be a lot of "bullying" of movements (when 1 movement has a very high volume in relation to another and causes the smaller movement to be bullied and back up).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: mukade on February 19, 2022, 08:45:44 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on February 18, 2022, 08:38:53 PM
    Quote from: mukade on February 17, 2022, 09:53:00 PM
    It says roundabout, and there is now an article on the web (https://www.insideindianabusiness.com/articles/fishers-plans-100m-mixed-use-project).

    A while back, I thought I read that the Allisonville Rd. and 116th St intersection in Fishers might also become a roundabout (or otherwise improved).

    interesting, i wonder if that will actually work. i feel like there would be a lot of "bullying" of movements (when 1 movement has a very high volume in relation to another and causes the smaller movement to be bullied and back up).

    That is one of the problems with the Olio Rd. roundabout. The thru route is Olio Rd. south from the roundabout, and Southeastern Pkwy. northwest from the roundabout towards I-69. Hence, 136th St. westbound can have long backups. To some extent, the same thing happens on Olio Rd. north of that roundabout, but it is less built up north.

    That roundabout also has a fifth approach from The hospital (also 136th St.), and that traffic frequently suffers from bullying.

    I think 96th St. and Allisonville Rd. traffic volumes are more balanced than the other Fishers example so the roundabout could work. I don't think the Michigan left turns at that intersection were very popular, and the fact that it was the only one in the region only made it worse.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on February 19, 2022, 02:19:01 PM
    Quote from: mukade on February 19, 2022, 08:45:44 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on February 18, 2022, 08:38:53 PM
    Quote from: mukade on February 17, 2022, 09:53:00 PM
    It says roundabout, and there is now an article on the web (https://www.insideindianabusiness.com/articles/fishers-plans-100m-mixed-use-project).

    A while back, I thought I read that the Allisonville Rd. and 116th St intersection in Fishers might also become a roundabout (or otherwise improved).

    interesting, i wonder if that will actually work. i feel like there would be a lot of "bullying" of movements (when 1 movement has a very high volume in relation to another and causes the smaller movement to be bullied and back up).

    That is one of the problems with the Olio Rd. roundabout. The thru route is Olio Rd. south from the roundabout, and Southeastern Pkwy. northwest from the roundabout towards I-69. Hence, 136th St. westbound can have long backups. To some extent, the same thing happens on Olio Rd. north of that roundabout, but it is less built up north.

    That roundabout also has a fifth approach from The hospital (also 136th St.), and that traffic frequently suffers from bullying.

    I think 96th St. and Allisonville Rd. traffic volumes are more balanced than the other Fishers example so the roundabout could work. I don't think the Michigan left turns at that intersection were very popular, and the fact that it was the only one in the region only made it worse.

    the michigan left is weird, i always drive it wrong and use the technically wrong u-turn movement  :-D. also i am sure there is a "proper" term for what i described as "bullying" but that's the only way i can describe it  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on February 19, 2022, 10:49:06 PM
    I do it "wrong" too as in I ignore the signs which tell you turn right on the road you want to turn left on and then make the U turn. I do it the way you are actually supposed to do it... as in how they do it in Michigan... which is pass the road you want to turn onto, make your U turn, and then turn right.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: mukade on February 23, 2022, 10:18:55 PM
    More on the three planned roundabouts for Allisonville Rd:

    Indy Star article: 'It's about time': Fishers does U-turn on Michigan Left; change coming to 96th St. intersection (https://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/hamilton-county/2022/02/23/fishers-indiana-traffic-does-u-turn-michigan-left-replace-roundabout-96th-street-allisonville-road/6850112001/)

    The above article also states:
    QuoteIn addition, the city is planning a roundabout at 116th Street and Allisonville...

    Current in Fishers article on 146th St interchange: Hamilton County announces timeline for $37 million Allisonville Road and 146th Street interchange project (https://www.youarecurrent.com/2022/02/13/hamilton-county-announces-timeline-for-37-million-allisonville-road-and-146th-street-interchange-project/)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on February 23, 2022, 10:24:27 PM
    interesting. I had no idea that Michigan left worked so well to improve traffic, reduced delay by 60%!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: cjw2001 on February 23, 2022, 11:18:54 PM
    Quote from: mukade on February 19, 2022, 08:45:44 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on February 18, 2022, 08:38:53 PM
    Quote from: mukade on February 17, 2022, 09:53:00 PM
    It says roundabout, and there is now an article on the web (https://www.insideindianabusiness.com/articles/fishers-plans-100m-mixed-use-project).

    A while back, I thought I read that the Allisonville Rd. and 116th St intersection in Fishers might also become a roundabout (or otherwise improved).

    interesting, i wonder if that will actually work. i feel like there would be a lot of "bullying" of movements (when 1 movement has a very high volume in relation to another and causes the smaller movement to be bullied and back up).

    That is one of the problems with the Olio Rd. roundabout. The thru route is Olio Rd. south from the roundabout, and Southeastern Pkwy. northwest from the roundabout towards I-69. Hence, 136th St. westbound can have long backups. To some extent, the same thing happens on Olio Rd. north of that roundabout, but it is less built up north.

    That roundabout also has a fifth approach from The hospital (also 136th St.), and that traffic frequently suffers from bullying.

    I think 96th St. and Allisonville Rd. traffic volumes are more balanced than the other Fishers example so the roundabout could work. I don't think the Michigan left turns at that intersection were very popular, and the fact that it was the only one in the region only made it worse.

    Looks like Fishers has plans to remove the 5th leg from the Olio Road roundabout.  https://map.fishers.in.us/arcgis/rest/services/Capital_Projects/FeatureServer/2/11/attachments/6801
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: mukade on February 24, 2022, 07:34:02 AM
    Quote from: cjw2001 on February 23, 2022, 11:18:54 PM

    Looks like Fishers has plans to remove the 5th leg from the Olio Road roundabout.  https://map.fishers.in.us/arcgis/rest/services/Capital_Projects/FeatureServer/2/11/attachments/6801


    I guess that is the best option, and it works for what is there today. If that area south of the Culver's restaurant gets developed, it will create another dangerous situation due to the traffic volume on Olio Road. Specifically, people wanting to go south from westbound 136th St would have to go through the original roundabout to make a U turn. I also wonder if they will change the right westbound lane of Southeastern Parkway to allow thru traffic to reduce the sometimes very long backups. 

    I saw that a whole bunch of new roundabout locations have been announced in the Indianapolis area.  I am surprised that some areas of the state still seem to have an aversion to them.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on February 24, 2022, 08:35:07 AM
    Quote from: mukade on February 24, 2022, 07:34:02 AM
    Quote from: cjw2001 on February 23, 2022, 11:18:54 PM

    Looks like Fishers has plans to remove the 5th leg from the Olio Road roundabout.  https://map.fishers.in.us/arcgis/rest/services/Capital_Projects/FeatureServer/2/11/attachments/6801


    I guess that is the best option, and it works for what is there today. If that area south of the Culver's restaurant gets developed, it will create another dangerous situation due to the traffic volume on Olio Road. Specifically, people wanting to go south from westbound 136th St would have to go through the original roundabout to make a U turn. I also wonder if they will change the right westbound lane of Southeastern Parkway to allow thru traffic to reduce the sometimes very long backups. 

    I saw that a whole bunch of new roundabout locations have been announced in the Indianapolis area.  I am surprised that some areas of the state still seem to have an aversion to them.

    are the one in indy all on the south side?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on February 24, 2022, 09:31:59 AM
    There's two on the far east side, at German Church Rd and 42nd and 46th Streets. As well there's one at Morris Street and Bridgeport Road on the west side. And a new one's coming up at Southeastern and English near the new justice center complex.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: cjw2001 on February 24, 2022, 03:21:23 PM
    Quote from: mukade on February 24, 2022, 07:34:02 AM
    Quote from: cjw2001 on February 23, 2022, 11:18:54 PM

    Looks like Fishers has plans to remove the 5th leg from the Olio Road roundabout.  https://map.fishers.in.us/arcgis/rest/services/Capital_Projects/FeatureServer/2/11/attachments/6801


    I guess that is the best option, and it works for what is there today. If that area south of the Culver's restaurant gets developed, it will create another dangerous situation due to the traffic volume on Olio Road. Specifically, people wanting to go south from westbound 136th St would have to go through the original roundabout to make a U turn. I also wonder if they will change the right westbound lane of Southeastern Parkway to allow thru traffic to reduce the sometimes very long backups. 

    I saw that a whole bunch of new roundabout locations have been announced in the Indianapolis area.  I am surprised that some areas of the state still seem to have an aversion to them.
    Likely the need for an occasional U turn from westbound 136th street traffic is a small price to pay for the elimination of the need to yield at 136th for southbound traffic coming from the larger roundabout.  That will help to keep traffic moving.  Also note that left turns from westbound 136th are not possible today so this is unchanged with the new design.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: cjw2001 on March 01, 2022, 01:14:35 PM
    Preliminary Clear Path 465 construction begins along I-465:  https://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/INDOT/bulletins/30cd151
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Revive 755 on March 05, 2022, 11:19:36 PM
    From recent travels:  The first roundabout on IN 2 west/south of US 30 near Valparaiso has circular shields.  The roundabout farther west on IN 2 has normal Indiana shields.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 06, 2022, 05:53:52 PM
    According to the NWI Times, the city of Hobart is exploring the concept of a new interchange at I-65 at 69th Avenue. Officials are looking to confer with federal transportation authorities and INDOT about the feasibility of having an interchange there.

    The reason behind it is the influx of industrial businesses and training offices located along Mississippi Street between 73rd and 61st Avenue. They believe the interchange would be good for direct access to I-65 from that area, as well as taking pressure off US 30 and 61st Avenue, which are currently the only outlets to access I-65 from the industrial area. With the recently completed work along 69th Avenue between Mississippi and Colorado Streets (including a new roundabout), 69th Avenue could be another viable connection to I-65...

    ...Which is why residents living along Mississippi Street and 69th Avenue are opposed to this concept. They fear (understandably so) that it would attract too much traffic to what is an otherwise quiet section of the city.

    Another problem that I see not mentioned in the article: what about I-65 itself? To make this work effectively, they would have to do a revamp of I-65 between US 30 and 61st Avenue. The 73rd Avenue overpass would have to be rebuilt, as well as the I-65 bridge over the CN Rail Line, to accommodate a continuous auxiliary lane that would have to be built to make the movements a little more fluid (one lane in each direction between US 30 and 69th, and another between 69th and 61st), especially when you consider the very short distances between the three points. You also have to keep in mind about potential ROW issues (including the nearby Merrillville High School football field).

    All of this again is exploratory, and the subject will be broached at a City Hall meeting this month.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on March 06, 2022, 08:18:01 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 06, 2022, 05:53:52 PM
    According to the NWI Times, the city of Hobart is exploring the concept of a new interchange at I-65 at 69th Avenue. Officials are looking to confer with federal transportation authorities and INDOT about the feasibility of having an interchange there.

    The reason behind it is the influx of industrial businesses and training offices located along Mississippi Street between 73rd and 61st Avenue. They believe the interchange would be good for direct access to I-65 from that area, as well as taking pressure off US 30 and 61st Avenue, which are currently the only outlets to access I-65 from the industrial area. With the recently completed work along 69th Avenue between Mississippi and Colorado Streets (including a new roundabout), 69th Avenue could be another viable connection to I-65...

    ...Which is why residents living along Mississippi Street and 69th Avenue are opposed to this concept. They fear (understandably so) that it would attract too much traffic to what is an otherwise quiet section of the city.

    Another problem that I see not mentioned in the article: what about I-65 itself? To make this work effectively, they would have to do a revamp of I-65 between US 30 and 61st Avenue. The 73rd Avenue overpass would have to be rebuilt, as well as the I-65 bridge over the CN Rail Line, to accommodate a continuous auxiliary lane that would have to be built to make the movements a little more fluid (one lane in each direction between US 30 and 69th, and another between 69th and 61st), especially when you consider the very short distances between the three points. You also have to keep in mind about potential ROW issues (including the nearby Merrillville High School football field).

    All of this again is exploratory, and the subject will be broached at a City Hall meeting this month.

    69th ave doesn't currently connect across I-65. Would this include building a new roadway along with the interchange?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 06, 2022, 09:15:05 PM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on March 06, 2022, 08:18:01 PM69th ave doesn't currently connect across I-65. Would this include building a new roadway along with the interchange?

    I was of the understanding that 69th Avenue would be built out to I-65 and terminate at the proposed interchange, since taking it any further west would infringe on the nearby football field I mentioned upthread. I wouldn't be surprised if a sound wall on the west side of the interchange would be required to mitigate the impact.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on March 08, 2022, 08:50:53 AM
     :hmmm: seems like a bad idea. reminds me of 106th st and 69 in fishers. that worked though.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on March 08, 2022, 08:53:41 AM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 06, 2022, 09:15:05 PM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on March 06, 2022, 08:18:01 PM69th ave doesn't currently connect across I-65. Would this include building a new roadway along with the interchange?

    I was of the understanding that 69th Avenue would be built out to I-65 and terminate at the proposed interchange, since taking it any further west would infringe on the nearby football field I mentioned upthread. I wouldn't be surprised if a sound wall on the west side of the interchange would be required to mitigate the impact.

    So from I-65 you'd only be able to go east and not west? If so, that doesn't sound as bad.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: mukade on March 08, 2022, 10:36:07 PM
    Why not build an interchange at 73rd Avenue? It would be cheaper, and make much more sense.

    Moreover, considering that proposed interchange on I-65 would be within Merrillville town limits, it doesn't seem like the City of Hobart could act unilaterally.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: skluth on March 09, 2022, 11:02:24 AM
    Quote from: mukade on March 08, 2022, 10:36:07 PM
    Why not build an interchange at 73rd Avenue? It would be cheaper, and make much more sense.

    Moreover, considering that proposed interchange on I-65 would be within Merrillville town limits, it doesn't seem like the City of Hobart could act unilaterally.
    I thought about a 73rd Av interchange myself. I think it's because the owners of the old homes along Mississippi between 69th and 73rd are the same people who complained about the increased traffic from the proposed 69th Av interchange. I agree it would make much more sense. But sense and NIMBYs don't mix.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on March 09, 2022, 01:09:45 PM
    It's that time of year again when we see some orange barrels on the roads!

    Here are some projects that will be underway soon in NW Indiana:

    1. Bridge replacement on I-94 east of Johnson Road. Two 11-foot lanes with two-foot shoulders will remain open in both directions. Starts on March 14th.
    2. Bridge replacement on US 20/31 at South Michigan Street. One lane each way on the WB bridge while the EB bridge gets replaced. Starts on March 14th and the whole project is expected to be completed by early December.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: mukade on March 09, 2022, 01:38:14 PM
    Quote from: skluth on March 09, 2022, 11:02:24 AM
    Quote from: mukade on March 08, 2022, 10:36:07 PM
    Why not build an interchange at 73rd Avenue? It would be cheaper, and make much more sense.

    Moreover, considering that proposed interchange on I-65 would be within Merrillville town limits, it doesn't seem like the City of Hobart could act unilaterally.
    I thought about a 73rd Av interchange myself. I think it's because the owners of the old homes along Mississippi between 69th and 73rd are the same people who complained about the increased traffic from the proposed 69th Av interchange. I agree it would make much more sense. But sense and NIMBYs don't mix.

    That should be a non-issue. There has been a considerable amount of recent new freeway construction on I-69, US 31, SR 37, etc. in Indiana that has impacted hundreds and hundreds of properties. Heck, they even built I-69 through Bloomington which is the NIMBY capital of the state.

    If it is a priority, the state or local governments can and will make it happen.

    Spending a ton of money on a new interchange only to serve one direction (as would be the case with an interchange at 69th Ave) isn't really a smart thing to do.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on March 09, 2022, 01:43:45 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on March 09, 2022, 01:09:45 PM
    It's that time of year again when we see some orange barrels on the roads!

    Here are some projects that will be underway soon in NW Indiana:

    1. Bridge replacement on I-94 east of Johnson Road. Two 11-foot lanes with two-foot shoulders will remain open in both directions. Starts on March 14th.
    2. Bridge replacement on US 20/31 at South Michigan Street. One lane each way on the WB bridge while the EB bridge gets replaced. Starts on March 14th and the whole project is expected to be completed by early December.

    Both of these are on the route to my parents' house. This year may be the time to try out alternate routes.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 09, 2022, 09:15:52 PM
    Quote from: skluth on March 09, 2022, 11:02:24 AM
    Quote from: mukade on March 08, 2022, 10:36:07 PM
    Why not build an interchange at 73rd Avenue? It would be cheaper, and make much more sense.

    Moreover, considering that proposed interchange on I-65 would be within Merrillville town limits, it doesn't seem like the City of Hobart could act unilaterally.
    I thought about a 73rd Av interchange myself. I think it's because the owners of the old homes along Mississippi between 69th and 73rd are the same people who complained about the increased traffic from the proposed 69th Av interchange. I agree it would make much more sense. But sense and NIMBYs don't mix.

    The prospect of an interchange at 73rd Avenue was actually considered a few years ago, but was abandoned (can't remember the reason why). I think it should be revisited, with modifications.

    The interchange should be partial, with a southbound exit and a northbound entrance. I think that most traffic would utilize those movements, especially those who shop or commute mostly in plazas north of US 30. Plus, it would provide relatively easy access to the industrial area with existing pavement. No need to rebuild bridges for auxiliary lanes, and not much ROW will be required for acceleration/deceleration lanes.

    Why partial? Just look at the nearby US 30 interchange. By the time you're fully merged onto I-65 northbound from US 30 west (where the acceleration lane ends), you're already at the 73rd Avenue overpass. Traffic potentially entering southbound from 73rd Avenue would have a FIGHT with traffic looking to exit to US 30, especially since the auxiliary lane starts right after the underpass. I honestly don't think it's worth redoing an entire interchange to accommodate another full interchange a couple hundred feet away. A partial interchange that would take some pressure off the northern portion of the US 30 interchange would be the most ideal solution.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: mukade on March 09, 2022, 10:46:13 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 09, 2022, 09:15:52 PM
    Quote from: skluth on March 09, 2022, 11:02:24 AM
    Quote from: mukade on March 08, 2022, 10:36:07 PM
    Why not build an interchange at 73rd Avenue? It would be cheaper, and make much more sense.

    Moreover, considering that proposed interchange on I-65 would be within Merrillville town limits, it doesn't seem like the City of Hobart could act unilaterally.
    I thought about a 73rd Av interchange myself. I think it's because the owners of the old homes along Mississippi between 69th and 73rd are the same people who complained about the increased traffic from the proposed 69th Av interchange. I agree it would make much more sense. But sense and NIMBYs don't mix.

    The prospect of an interchange at 73rd Avenue was actually considered a few years ago, but was abandoned (can't remember the reason why). I think it should be revisited, with modifications.

    The interchange should be partial, with a southbound exit and a northbound entrance. I think that most traffic would utilize those movements, especially those who shop or commute mostly in plazas north of US 30. Plus, it would provide relatively easy access to the industrial area with existing pavement. No need to rebuild bridges for auxiliary lanes, and not much ROW will be required for acceleration/deceleration lanes.

    Why partial? Just look at the nearby US 30 interchange. By the time you're fully merged onto I-65 northbound from US 30 west (where the acceleration lane ends), you're already at the 73rd Avenue overpass. Traffic potentially entering southbound from 73rd Avenue would have a FIGHT with traffic looking to exit to US 30, especially since the auxiliary lane starts right after the underpass. I honestly don't think it's worth redoing an entire interchange to accommodate another full interchange a couple hundred feet away. A partial interchange that would take some pressure off the northern portion of the US 30 interchange would be the most ideal solution.

    Yeah, that is right about the problems of 73rd Avenue being close to the US 30 interchange. I remember that from when I lived up there.

    However, I think the partial interchanges are generally suboptimal. Years ago, there were several of them around Chicago, but I think most have since become full ones. I could see two options that might work best: 1) a folded diamond interchange or 2) a dog bone interchange at 69th Ave where that road would go both east and west, To the west, it could connect back to 73rd Ave at a roundabout.

    Also, if the contention by Hobart is that a lot of light industrial and warehousing will be built there, then many of the employees would presumably come from the south as well. If only a partial interchange were built, those prospective workers would have to funnel thru the congested US 30 interchange retail area.

    The plan as stated in the article (i.e. eastbound only) has a couple of problems. First, traffic could jump on Mississippi St and go south to 73rd, but that would put a lot of additional traffic on Mississippi. Secondly, why would Merrillville consent to taking valuable property on I-65 off their tax rolls for a road that would provide far and away more benefit to another municipality?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on March 18, 2022, 11:25:59 PM
    so I took a drive up to Tipton to see what SR 19 and 28 are doing there. and the verdict is nothing. routing is exactly as it was before.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on March 19, 2022, 09:36:52 PM
    I think the transition (SR 28 near Tipton) isn't to happen until later this year. Maybe fall.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on March 19, 2022, 10:04:58 PM
    The widening project on I-65 in Tippecanoe County (from the Wabash River Bridge to nearly 2.5 miles north of SR 43 interchange (MP 180ish)) will get underway starting on/after April 1. The project cost is $99.4 million, and Walsh Construction is doing the contract. The project includes widening the Ninth Street, Prophets Rock, and the SR 43 bridges toward the middle as well as a new traffic signal at the I-65 south ramps at SR 43. Also, SR 43 will be resurfaced within the interchange area. The expected completion date is by November 30, 2023.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on March 25, 2022, 04:09:37 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on March 09, 2022, 01:09:45 PM
    It's that time of year again when we see some orange barrels on the roads!

    Here are some projects that will be underway soon in NW Indiana:

    1. Bridge replacement on I-94 east of Johnson Road. Two 11-foot lanes with two-foot shoulders will remain open in both directions. Starts on March 14th.
    2. Bridge replacement on US 20/31 at South Michigan Street. One lane each way on the WB bridge while the EB bridge gets replaced. Starts on March 14th and the whole project is expected to be completed by early December.

    Here are some more major projects that will be underway this year in NW Indiana:
    1. I-65 bridge deck overlays and concrete restoration between U.S. 30 and I-80/94
    2. I-80/94 concrete restoration between Illinois State Line and S.R. 912
    3. US 30 resurfacing between S.R. 17 and S.R. 19
    4. New roundabout at U.S. 6 and S.R. 2 in Westville. Will be replacing a 4-way stop. Two-phase construction schedule in which phase 1 will close the north and west legs of the intersection. The detour for the first phase will be as followed: US 421, US 6, SR 2, SR 49, and vice versa. Phase 2 will close the south and east legs of the intersection. The detour for the second phase will be as followed: US 421, SR 2, US 6, SR 49, and vice versa.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JoePCool14 on March 25, 2022, 04:52:50 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on March 25, 2022, 04:09:37 PM
    2. I-80/94 concrete restoration between Illinois State Line and S.R. 912

    Oh joy, can't wait for the Borman to suck even more than usual.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Revive 755 on March 25, 2022, 11:26:39 PM
    Quote from: JoePCool14 on March 25, 2022, 04:52:50 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on March 25, 2022, 04:09:37 PM
    2. I-80/94 concrete restoration between Illinois State Line and S.R. 912

    Oh joy, can't wait for the Borman to suck even more than usual.

    Seems it is becoming usual for some sort of construction on the Borman every year.  I thought INDOT just did a lot of work on the Borman west of I-65?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on March 26, 2022, 09:44:09 AM
    Quote from: Revive 755 on March 25, 2022, 11:26:39 PM
    Quote from: JoePCool14 on March 25, 2022, 04:52:50 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on March 25, 2022, 04:09:37 PM
    2. I-80/94 concrete restoration between Illinois State Line and S.R. 912

    Oh joy, can't wait for the Borman to suck even more than usual.

    Seems it is becoming usual for some sort of construction on the Borman every year.  I thought INDOT just did a lot of work on the Borman west of I-65?

    Last summer they did work on a lot of the bridges.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on March 29, 2022, 10:31:31 AM
    Read this morning about a potential idea of decommissioning more Indiana state highways, this time in Johnson County.

    https://dailyjournal.net/2022/03/29/county-considers-indot-agreement-for-smith-valley-road-project/

    The idea would decommission SR 44 from the Morgan County line east to the junction with SR 144 west of Franklin (with the part from there east to I-65 already decommissioned several years back.) Also, the remaining part of SR 144 in Johnson County from SR 135 in Bargersville to Franklin would be relinquished. And finally SR 252 from SR 135 in Trafalgar to US 31 in Edinburgh would be relinquished.

    All of this would help fund the widening of Smith Valley Road from the interchange with I-69 east to Morgantown Road, which isn't that long of a stretch of road. If they were to do this I'd might want Smith Valley to be widened all the way to SR 135 at least. The SR 144 and 252 decommissioning I could live with, but that SR 44 one might be weird starting right at the county line. It would make the already ridiculous gap in the way seem more strange, might as well get rid of the rest of the road west to I-69.

    But none of this is agreed upon yet, it's just an idea that INDOT is floating around with Johnson County.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Life in Paradise on March 29, 2022, 12:54:53 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on March 29, 2022, 10:31:31 AM
    Read this morning about a potential idea of decommissioning more Indiana state highways, this time in Johnson County.

    https://dailyjournal.net/2022/03/29/county-considers-indot-agreement-for-smith-valley-road-project/

    The idea would decommission SR 44 from the Morgan County line east to the junction with SR 144 west of Franklin (with the part from there east to I-65 already decommissioned several years back.) Also, the remaining part of SR 144 in Johnson County from SR 135 in Bargersville to Franklin would be relinquished. And finally SR 252 from SR 135 in Trafalgar to US 31 in Edinburgh would be relinquished.

    All of this would help fund the widening of Smith Valley Road from the interchange with I-69 east to Morgantown Road, which isn't that long of a stretch of road. If they were to do this I'd might want Smith Valley to be widened all the way to SR 135 at least. The SR 144 and 252 decommissioning I could live with, but that SR 44 one might be weird starting right at the county line. It would make the already ridiculous gap in the way seem more strange, might as well get rid of the rest of the road west to I-69.

    But none of this is agreed upon yet, it's just an idea that INDOT is floating around with Johnson Count.
    I'm really against a lot of these relinquishments since they get rid of a route.  I know that there is one reason or another for some of these (trade off with INDOT for some other work) or so weight/truck limits can be imposed.  I really wish that we could have a compromise where the route would still be marked, but it could be marked as a county route with the same number.  Down here in Warrick County, we have a former state highway that has not been state maintained for as long as I've lived here (30+ years), and it's official name is Old SR 261.  It's not the same thing as having the route sign, but at least it helps newcomers.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on March 29, 2022, 03:27:41 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 16, 2020, 12:46:15 PM
    Good news in Northwest Indiana.

    Work on Indiana 2 between Hebron and Valparaiso has completed more than six weeks ahead of schedule. A new roundabout is now in place at County Road 100 South (109th Avenue in Crown Point), and modifications to the intersection with County Road 500 West have been made.


    I can't remember where I read it and can't find it now, but I remember someone posting that the SR 2 shields at the new roundabout were errors (circular, perhaps). I drove through there today and the shields at that roundabout looked normal to me. Perhaps they got replaced?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on March 30, 2022, 12:01:52 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on March 29, 2022, 10:31:31 AM
    Read this morning about a potential idea of decommissioning more Indiana state highways, this time in Johnson County.

    https://dailyjournal.net/2022/03/29/county-considers-indot-agreement-for-smith-valley-road-project/

    The idea would decommission SR 44 from the Morgan County line east to the junction with SR 144 west of Franklin (with the part from there east to I-65 already decommissioned several years back.) Also, the remaining part of SR 144 in Johnson County from SR 135 in Bargersville to Franklin would be relinquished. And finally SR 252 from SR 135 in Trafalgar to US 31 in Edinburgh would be relinquished.

    All of this would help fund the widening of Smith Valley Road from the interchange with I-69 east to Morgantown Road, which isn't that long of a stretch of road. If they were to do this I'd might want Smith Valley to be widened all the way to SR 135 at least. The SR 144 and 252 decommissioning I could live with, but that SR 44 one might be weird starting right at the county line. It would make the already ridiculous gap in the way seem more strange, might as well get rid of the rest of the road west to I-69.

    But none of this is agreed upon yet, it's just an idea that INDOT is floating around with Johnson County.

    144 should be completely removed. and if they do this just kill that whole portion of 44 from 69 to 144.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: CtrlAltDel on March 30, 2022, 01:52:40 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on March 19, 2022, 10:04:58 PM
    The widening project on I-65 in Tippecanoe County (from the Wabash River Bridge to nearly 2.5 miles north of SR 43 interchange (MP 180ish)) will get underway starting on/after April 1.

    Does that mean that the bridge is finally done?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on March 30, 2022, 02:22:18 PM
    Quote from: CtrlAltDel on March 30, 2022, 01:52:40 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on March 19, 2022, 10:04:58 PM
    The widening project on I-65 in Tippecanoe County (from the Wabash River Bridge to nearly 2.5 miles north of SR 43 interchange (MP 180ish)) will get underway starting on/after April 1.

    Does that mean that the bridge is finally done?

    It was finished sometime last year.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Revive 755 on March 30, 2022, 10:44:24 PM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on March 29, 2022, 03:27:41 PM
    I can't remember where I read it and can't find it now, but I remember someone posting that the SR 2 shields at the new roundabout were errors (circular, perhaps). I drove through there today and the shields at that roundabout looked normal to me. Perhaps they got replaced?

    I think it was the other new roundabout on SR 2?

    Quote from: Revive 755 on March 05, 2022, 11:19:36 PM
    From recent travels:  The first roundabout on IN 2 west/south of US 30 near Valparaiso has circular shields.  The roundabout farther west on IN 2 has normal Indiana shields.

    EDIT:
    And now SR 2 is closed against right after US 30, making it harder to get back to that roundabout  :ded:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on March 30, 2022, 11:19:05 PM
    Quote from: Revive 755 on March 30, 2022, 10:44:24 PM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on March 29, 2022, 03:27:41 PM
    I can't remember where I read it and can't find it now, but I remember someone posting that the SR 2 shields at the new roundabout were errors (circular, perhaps). I drove through there today and the shields at that roundabout looked normal to me. Perhaps they got replaced?

    I think it was the other new roundabout on SR 2?

    Quote from: Revive 755 on March 05, 2022, 11:19:36 PM
    From recent travels:  The first roundabout on IN 2 west/south of US 30 near Valparaiso has circular shields.  The roundabout farther west on IN 2 has normal Indiana shields.

    I didn't go through that one. I'll have to go back. I'd love to get a photo of it before it gets fixed.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: I-55 on March 31, 2022, 01:59:38 PM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on March 30, 2022, 11:19:05 PM
    Quote from: Revive 755 on March 30, 2022, 10:44:24 PM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on March 29, 2022, 03:27:41 PM
    I can't remember where I read it and can't find it now, but I remember someone posting that the SR 2 shields at the new roundabout were errors (circular, perhaps). I drove through there today and the shields at that roundabout looked normal to me. Perhaps they got replaced?

    I think it was the other new roundabout on SR 2?

    Quote from: Revive 755 on March 05, 2022, 11:19:36 PM
    From recent travels:  The first roundabout on IN 2 west/south of US 30 near Valparaiso has circular shields.  The roundabout farther west on IN 2 has normal Indiana shields.

    I didn't go through that one. I'll have to go back. I'd love to get a photo of it before it gets fixed.

    Last time I was in Fort Wayne there were still circle shields along Illinois Rd just east of the IN-14 interchange.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: I-55 on April 25, 2022, 02:17:52 AM
    Noticed several "ALT I-65 Detour" signs popping up like weeds on IN-25 from US-421 to Lafayette. Anyone know what kind of progression is happening on the widening/bridge projects that led to this?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on April 27, 2022, 09:00:38 AM
    https://www.wrtv.com/news/move-over-roundabouts-a-displaced-left-turn-intersection-is-coming-to-indianapolis

    Displaced left turn intersection coming to US 31/Thompson Rd. Anybody have experience with one of these?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on April 27, 2022, 09:01:34 AM
    Nope but Evansville is getting a ton on the Lloyd
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on April 27, 2022, 09:32:57 AM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on April 27, 2022, 09:00:38 AM
    https://www.wrtv.com/news/move-over-roundabouts-a-displaced-left-turn-intersection-is-coming-to-indianapolis

    Displaced left turn intersection coming to US 31/Thompson Rd. Anybody have experience with one of these?

    No. But I experience this intersection a lot. I don't know...it may work. Don't know about the Lloyd though, those intersections should be grade-separated.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on April 27, 2022, 10:28:24 AM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on April 27, 2022, 09:00:38 AM
    https://www.wrtv.com/news/move-over-roundabouts-a-displaced-left-turn-intersection-is-coming-to-indianapolis

    Displaced left turn intersection coming to US 31/Thompson Rd. Anybody have experience with one of these?

    I agree with the guy they interviewed. Southsiders don't like change. This is going to be a mess for awhile. I can see people from the south taking Epler and from the north taking Hanna instead to avoid this intersection altogether.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: skluth on April 27, 2022, 01:14:43 PM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on April 27, 2022, 09:00:38 AM
    https://www.wrtv.com/news/move-over-roundabouts-a-displaced-left-turn-intersection-is-coming-to-indianapolis

    Displaced left turn intersection coming to US 31/Thompson Rd. Anybody have experience with one of these?

    Yes. I used this one (https://www.google.com/maps/@38.5040715,-90.4570978,530m/data=!3m1!1e3?hl=en) regularly when I lived in St Louis as the left turn into Gravois Bluffs goes to the back area of a popular shopping center. It works quite well though it does look weird.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JoePCool14 on April 27, 2022, 01:59:33 PM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on April 27, 2022, 09:00:38 AM
    https://www.wrtv.com/news/move-over-roundabouts-a-displaced-left-turn-intersection-is-coming-to-indianapolis

    Displaced left turn intersection coming to US 31/Thompson Rd. Anybody have experience with one of these?

    A CFI in Indiana. Sounds like a doozy and seems like that might be a lot for that location.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: jhuntin1 on April 27, 2022, 02:31:57 PM
    The problem with the intersection of Thompson Rd/IN-135 and US-31 is that a lot of traffic joins southbound US-31 from I-465 east. Many cars then cut across three lanes of traffic to get to the left-turn lane for eastbound Thompson Rd. I think they tried to fix that with the signaled intersection, but the other issue is that the line of cars to turn left often overflows into the left lane, creating more of a hazard. I have no idea if this will alleviate the issue. INDOT has certainly been willing to try alternative traffic control methods, so I hope this has the intended effect.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on April 27, 2022, 09:10:49 PM
    Quote from: jhuntin1 on April 27, 2022, 02:31:57 PM
    The problem with the intersection of Thompson Rd/IN-135 and US-31 is that a lot of traffic joins southbound US-31 from I-465 east. Many cars then cut across three lanes of traffic to get to the left-turn lane for eastbound Thompson Rd. I think they tried to fix that with the signaled intersection, but the other issue is that the line of cars to turn left often overflows into the left lane, creating more of a hazard. I have no idea if this will alleviate the issue. INDOT has certainly been willing to try alternative traffic control methods, so I hope this has the intended effect.

    A double left turn lane from SR 31 to eastbound Thompson could do wonders there as well. Hell that probably what they should have done in the first place. I have gotten home from work taking 465 to 31 south and have now avoided the far left lane specifically because of the overflowing from the left turn lane. I just hope whatever displaced left turn they do construct will be long enough to hold the traffic on it because I don't think it's two lanes.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on April 29, 2022, 11:53:00 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2022, 12:01:52 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on March 29, 2022, 10:31:31 AM
    Read this morning about a potential idea of decommissioning more Indiana state highways, this time in Johnson County.

    https://dailyjournal.net/2022/03/29/county-considers-indot-agreement-for-smith-valley-road-project/

    The idea would decommission SR 44 from the Morgan County line east to the junction with SR 144 west of Franklin (with the part from there east to I-65 already decommissioned several years back.) Also, the remaining part of SR 144 in Johnson County from SR 135 in Bargersville to Franklin would be relinquished. And finally SR 252 from SR 135 in Trafalgar to US 31 in Edinburgh would be relinquished.

    All of this would help fund the widening of Smith Valley Road from the interchange with I-69 east to Morgantown Road, which isn't that long of a stretch of road. If they were to do this I'd might want Smith Valley to be widened all the way to SR 135 at least. The SR 144 and 252 decommissioning I could live with, but that SR 44 one might be weird starting right at the county line. It would make the already ridiculous gap in the way seem more strange, might as well get rid of the rest of the road west to I-69.

    But none of this is agreed upon yet, it's just an idea that INDOT is floating around with Johnson County.

    144 should be completely removed. and if they do this just kill that whole portion of 44 from 69 to 144.

    https://dailyjournal.net/2022/04/29/road-relinquishment-proposal-dead-for-now/

    And it's apparently dead (for now)...
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: dvferyance on May 02, 2022, 03:20:05 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on April 29, 2022, 11:53:00 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on March 30, 2022, 12:01:52 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on March 29, 2022, 10:31:31 AM
    Read this morning about a potential idea of decommissioning more Indiana state highways, this time in Johnson County.

    https://dailyjournal.net/2022/03/29/county-considers-indot-agreement-for-smith-valley-road-project/

    The idea would decommission SR 44 from the Morgan County line east to the junction with SR 144 west of Franklin (with the part from there east to I-65 already decommissioned several years back.) Also, the remaining part of SR 144 in Johnson County from SR 135 in Bargersville to Franklin would be relinquished. And finally SR 252 from SR 135 in Trafalgar to US 31 in Edinburgh would be relinquished.

    All of this would help fund the widening of Smith Valley Road from the interchange with I-69 east to Morgantown Road, which isn't that long of a stretch of road. If they were to do this I'd might want Smith Valley to be widened all the way to SR 135 at least. The SR 144 and 252 decommissioning I could live with, but that SR 44 one might be weird starting right at the county line. It would make the already ridiculous gap in the way seem more strange, might as well get rid of the rest of the road west to I-69.

    But none of this is agreed upon yet, it's just an idea that INDOT is floating around with Johnson County.

    144 should be completely removed. and if they do this just kill that whole portion of 44 from 69 to 144.

    https://dailyjournal.net/2022/04/29/road-relinquishment-proposal-dead-for-now/

    And it's apparently dead (for now)...
    That's good.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on May 02, 2022, 03:57:16 PM
    i get the feeling that if indot could have its way it would only maintain interstates and the freeway portions of us highways  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: RoadWarrior56 on May 03, 2022, 06:32:27 AM
    As somebody who started his career at the old Indiana State Highway Commission (predecessor name to INDOT), the post above this one applied when I was there in the late 1970's and early 1980's - relinquish as many roads as possible.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 03, 2022, 08:05:12 AM
    As a roadgeek it's frustrating to see so many routes get split in two or disappear altogether.

    From a practical standpoint, if this is what's necessary to keep the major roads up to date and in good condition, then it's worth it.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Life in Paradise on May 03, 2022, 12:58:12 PM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on May 03, 2022, 08:05:12 AM
    As a roadgeek it's frustrating to see so many routes get split in two or disappear altogether.

    From a practical standpoint, if this is what's necessary to keep the major roads up to date and in good condition, then it's worth it.
    The problem is that in almost every case the relinquished road remains, and someone has to maintain it.  In Indianapolis, all state/US highways were turned over to the city/county within I-465 and they are having a terrible time trying to keep up with the maintenance.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 03, 2022, 01:20:40 PM
    Quote from: Life in Paradise on May 03, 2022, 12:58:12 PM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on May 03, 2022, 08:05:12 AM
    As a roadgeek it's frustrating to see so many routes get split in two or disappear altogether.

    From a practical standpoint, if this is what's necessary to keep the major roads up to date and in good condition, then it's worth it.
    The problem is that in almost every case the relinquished road remains, and someone has to maintain it.  In Indianapolis, all state/US highways were turned over to the city/county within I-465 and they are having a terrible time trying to keep up with the maintenance.

    Indy might be an exception. That was an awful lot of mileage to turn over to the city/county. At a minimum, it would have been nice for INDOT to keep 31 and 40.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Life in Paradise on May 04, 2022, 01:02:27 PM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on May 03, 2022, 01:20:40 PM
    Quote from: Life in Paradise on May 03, 2022, 12:58:12 PM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on May 03, 2022, 08:05:12 AM
    As a roadgeek it's frustrating to see so many routes get split in two or disappear altogether.

    From a practical standpoint, if this is what's necessary to keep the major roads up to date and in good condition, then it's worth it.
    The problem is that in almost every case the relinquished road remains, and someone has to maintain it.  In Indianapolis, all state/US highways were turned over to the city/county within I-465 and they are having a terrible time trying to keep up with the maintenance.

    Indy might be an exception. That was an awful lot of mileage to turn over to the city/county. At a minimum, it would have been nice for INDOT to keep 31 and 40.
    I agree that Indy went too far.  It would have still been nice to say that two US highways went street level into the downtown center of the state capitol rather than up on elevated  interstate freeways.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: dvferyance on May 04, 2022, 07:26:20 PM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on May 03, 2022, 01:20:40 PM
    Quote from: Life in Paradise on May 03, 2022, 12:58:12 PM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on May 03, 2022, 08:05:12 AM
    As a roadgeek it's frustrating to see so many routes get split in two or disappear altogether.

    From a practical standpoint, if this is what's necessary to keep the major roads up to date and in good condition, then it's worth it.
    The problem is that in almost every case the relinquished road remains, and someone has to maintain it.  In Indianapolis, all state/US highways were turned over to the city/county within I-465 and they are having a terrible time trying to keep up with the maintenance.

    Indy might be an exception. That was an awful lot of mileage to turn over to the city/county. At a minimum, it would have been nice for INDOT to keep 31 and 40.
    I agree and I also don't like these split routes either like Hwy 26 in Lafyette and Hwy 44 in Franklin. At least sign the route through town so it's not split up.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on May 05, 2022, 07:43:30 PM
    https://cbs4indy.com/news/indot-to-add-an-extra-lane-to-i-70-between-mount-comfort-and-greenfield/

    It's about time that the stretch of I-70 between Mt. Comfort and Greenfield gets expanded to three lanes each way.

    Once this project gets done, another section of I-70 east of Indy (between IN State Road 1 and the Ohio state line) will be widened to three lanes each way. 
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on May 06, 2022, 10:56:03 PM
    Interesting approach by INDOT on SR 32 from Westfield to Noblesville: INDOT is coming to you with a blank slate for the SR 32 corridor and wants your feedback! We will be presenting existing data that shows what problems we're seeing, but nothing beats first hand knowledge from the community. Please come and share what you're seeing along the corridor and what is important to you for the future of SR 32!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on May 07, 2022, 10:57:52 AM
    Quote from: monty on May 06, 2022, 10:56:03 PM
    Interesting approach by INDOT on SR 32 from Westfield to Noblesville: INDOT is coming to you with a blank slate for the SR 32 corridor and wants your feedback! We will be presenting existing data that shows what problems we're seeing, but nothing beats first hand knowledge from the community. Please come and share what you're seeing along the corridor and what is important to you for the future of SR 32!

    Widen to 5 lanes, 2 lanes in each direction with room for a 5 turn lane, maybe not the 2 way type but just wide enough for turns. sidewalks on both sides too. have LA R/W to prevent any more new signals and drive cuts.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 07, 2022, 11:05:03 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on May 07, 2022, 10:57:52 AM
    Quote from: monty on May 06, 2022, 10:56:03 PM
    Interesting approach by INDOT on SR 32 from Westfield to Noblesville: INDOT is coming to you with a blank slate for the SR 32 corridor and wants your feedback! We will be presenting existing data that shows what problems we're seeing, but nothing beats first hand knowledge from the community. Please come and share what you're seeing along the corridor and what is important to you for the future of SR 32!

    Widen to 5 lanes, 2 lanes in each direction with room for a 5 turn lane, maybe not the 2 way type but just wide enough for turns. sidewalks on both sides too. have LA R/W to prevent any more new signals and drive cuts.

    That's going to require taking a lot of houses, but to be honest if I lived in one of those, I'd be happy to have a guaranteed buyer and to get out of that mess.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 12, 2022, 10:45:26 PM
    Concrete restoration and bridge deck overlay projects will take place throughout various portions of I-65 and I-80/94 for the next two construction seasons. The areas to look out for most prominently will be the Ridge Road and 35th Avenue overpasses on I-65 (which could result in bottlenecks for traffic exiting to/entering from I-80/94), as well as I-80/94 between Cline Avenue and the Illinois State Line.

    Plenty of action set to begin (or already underway) on the surface streets as well.

    US 6 is down to one lane in each direction between Willowcreek Road and Indiana 149 in the Portage/South Haven areas. The outer lanes are currently closed for sidewalk and curb repair, followed by resurfacing of those lanes. The inner lanes and center turn lane will then close for resurfacing. All work is scheduled to be done by the end of August.

    With the South Shore Line Double Track project ramping up, streets close to or crossing the tracks will be affected.

    The recently-realigned stretch of US 12/20 is down to one lane from the new split to just west of Lake Street. A new station with additional parking spaces is under construction, along with new sidewalks and pavement at the Lake Street intersection. This project is scheduled to last at least through summer.

    The stretch of 11th Street where trains ran on the street (from Chicago Street to Michigan Boulevard) is closed. Most streets will be allowed to cross 11th Street (including Franklin Street, but not Chicago Street), but closures will rotate throughout the year. When completed, the two South Shore tracks will run between 10th and 11th Streets, with station services available along 11th Street.

    The big closure will be on US 12, along the Porter-LaPorte County Line. The South Shore Crossing is currently closed for the next two weeks to allow the addition of the second track at the crossing. Through traffic beyond Michigan City will be detoured via Indiana 520, US 20 (which itself is under construction along the detour area - more below), and Indiana 212; the inverse applies to those coming from Michigan.

    US 20 is under construction for bridge deck replacement and overlay at the Amtrak overpass located just east of Indiana 520. Traffic is down to one lane in each direction, with the outer lanes being constructed, followed by the inner lanes. Work is to be completed this fall.

    US 20 will also see lane restrictions at the I-94 underpass just east of the Lake-Porter County Line. One lane will be closed in each direction to allow for painters to work the beams on the I-94 bridge. Traffic on I-94 itself will be shifted inside to overlay the outer lanes, then outside to overlay the inner lanes. Outside of the necessary lane closures to prepare the lane shifts, all lanes will remain open to traffic throughout the duration of this summer project.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JoePCool14 on May 13, 2022, 10:39:23 AM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 12, 2022, 10:45:26 PM
    Concrete restoration and bridge deck overlay projects will take place throughout various portions of I-65 and I-80/94 for the next two construction seasons. The areas to look out for most prominently will be the Ridge Road and 35th Avenue overpasses on I-65 (which could result in bottlenecks for traffic exiting to/entering from I-80/94), as well as I-80/94 between Cline Avenue and the Illinois State Line.es. Outside of the necessary lane closures to prepare the lane shifts, all lanes will remain open to traffic throughout the duration of this summer project.

    I hope they aren't planning on starting that within the next week. We're supposed to be making a trip down to the Indy area later next week from Chicagoland.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on May 19, 2022, 01:43:34 PM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on May 07, 2022, 11:05:03 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on May 07, 2022, 10:57:52 AM
    Quote from: monty on May 06, 2022, 10:56:03 PM
    Interesting approach by INDOT on SR 32 from Westfield to Noblesville: INDOT is coming to you with a blank slate for the SR 32 corridor and wants your feedback! We will be presenting existing data that shows what problems we're seeing, but nothing beats first hand knowledge from the community. Please come and share what you're seeing along the corridor and what is important to you for the future of SR 32!

    Widen to 5 lanes, 2 lanes in each direction with room for a 5 turn lane, maybe not the 2 way type but just wide enough for turns. sidewalks on both sides too. have LA R/W to prevent any more new signals and drive cuts.

    That's going to require taking a lot of houses, but to be honest if I lived in one of those, I'd be happy to have a guaranteed buyer and to get out of that mess.

    probably will happen regardless, land in that area is very ripe for development! i saw in the news that noblesville is putting a large mixed use development along the cooridor. the widening is very much needed. INDOT does a great job of seeing issues before they become big traffic problems. good to see 32 on their radar. it may be very expensive, i saw in the news the downtown westfield project has expensive r/w.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 19, 2022, 08:16:44 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on May 12, 2022, 10:45:26 PM
    The big closure will be on US 12, along the Porter-LaPorte County Line. The South Shore Crossing is currently closed for the next two weeks to allow the addition of the second track at the crossing. Through traffic beyond Michigan City will be detoured via Indiana 520, US 20 (which itself is under construction along the detour area - more below), and Indiana 212; the inverse applies to those coming from Michigan.

    US 20 is under construction for bridge deck replacement and overlay at the Amtrak overpass located just east of Indiana 520. Traffic is down to one lane in each direction, with the outer lanes being constructed, followed by the inner lanes. Work is to be completed this fall.

    That changed fast...

    INDOT has announced that Indiana 212 will be closed starting on or after May 23 for two box culvert replacements. This project will last through late June.

    Since Indiana 212 was originally part of the above mentioned detour for US 12 (which is scheduled to reopen at the end of next week), a new detour for both routes will be put into place. Thru traffic will be detoured further along US 20 to nearby I-94, heading into Michigan to pick up US 12. From there, those heading toward Three Oaks and Niles can continue on US 12 eastbound, while those needing access to areas between Michigan City and New Buffalo (or looking to return to areas near Indiana 212) can double back westbound on US 12. This detour will remain in place for Indiana 212 after US 12 reopens.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Nacho on May 20, 2022, 05:38:35 PM
    Quote from: RoadWarrior56 on May 03, 2022, 06:32:27 AM
    As somebody who started his career at the old Indiana State Highway Commission (predecessor name to INDOT), the post above this one applied when I was there in the late 1970's and early 1980's - relinquish as many roads as possible.

    I get annoyed when the relinquishment results in a less logical routing, such as US 50 through Bedford being moved to follow SR 37 instead of Mitchell Rd. to 16th St.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on May 21, 2022, 03:25:37 PM
    Quote from: Nacho on May 20, 2022, 05:38:35 PM
    Quote from: RoadWarrior56 on May 03, 2022, 06:32:27 AM
    As somebody who started his career at the old Indiana State Highway Commission (predecessor name to INDOT), the post above this one applied when I was there in the late 1970's and early 1980's - relinquish as many roads as possible.

    I get annoyed when the relinquishment results in a less logical routing, such as US 50 through Bedford being moved to follow SR 37 instead of Mitchell Rd. to 16th St.

    US 52 being routed onto Teal Road and down 4th Street and former 25 to get to the "new" 231 is another nutty one.  Probably less mileage overall on the books than its previous routing on the "bypass" Sagamore Parkway, but it is not a route meant for thru truck traffic or if people are bypassing an incident on 65 following 52.  Why sign such wacky routes?  (25 and 26 also being discontinuous now is another gripe I have moaned about many times before.)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Hobart on May 22, 2022, 12:27:22 PM
    Indiana-related question that's not worth it's own thread (hopefully this is appropriate).

    I noticed that the toll road has no toll barrier at the Buchanan Street exit. How do they handle it if I enter the tollway at the Gary Road exit, which has toll barriers?

    Will I not be charged anything because there's nobody to accept my ticket at the Buchanan Street exit, or will I be charged the full length of the tollway because I don't have a ticket?

    I have an I-Pass, but I'm not sure if this allows them to realize I get on and off at Buchanan Street and charge me appropriately.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ilpt4u on May 22, 2022, 12:34:07 PM
    ^^^^^^^^^^^The ITR Closed Ticket System starts, EB, in Portage after the Willowcreek Rd exit, well after I-80 joins the Toll Road. West of Lake Station, the ITR is more like ISTHA Toll Roads, with an Open system, so not all exits have toll points, and some exits have it for only one direction
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 22, 2022, 12:54:18 PM
    Quote from: Hobart on May 22, 2022, 12:27:22 PM
    Indiana-related question that's not worth it's own thread (hopefully this is appropriate).

    I noticed that the toll road has no toll barrier at the Buchanan Street exit. How do they handle it if I enter the tollway at the Gary Road exit, which has toll barriers?

    Will I not be charged anything because there's nobody to accept my ticket at the Buchanan Street exit, or will I be charged the full length of the tollway because I don't have a ticket?

    I have an I-Pass, but I'm not sure if this allows them to realize I get on and off at Buchanan Street and charge me appropriately.

    There's no toll to enter at Buchanan St (Grant St). There is a toll booth at the Gary Rd (Cline Ave) exit but it's a fixed toll not dependent on where you get on. As noted above, the ticket system is only in effect east of the Portage exit.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: dvferyance on May 24, 2022, 06:34:16 PM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on May 22, 2022, 12:54:18 PM
    Quote from: Hobart on May 22, 2022, 12:27:22 PM
    Indiana-related question that's not worth it's own thread (hopefully this is appropriate).

    I noticed that the toll road has no toll barrier at the Buchanan Street exit. How do they handle it if I enter the tollway at the Gary Road exit, which has toll barriers?

    Will I not be charged anything because there's nobody to accept my ticket at the Buchanan Street exit, or will I be charged the full length of the tollway because I don't have a ticket?

    I have an I-Pass, but I'm not sure if this allows them to realize I get on and off at Buchanan Street and charge me appropriately.

    There's no toll to enter at Buchanan St (Grant St). There is a toll booth at the Gary Rd (Cline Ave) exit but it's a fixed toll not dependent on where you get on. As noted above, the ticket system is only in effect east of the Portage exit.
    There is also no toll if you exit at I-65 going WB.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on May 24, 2022, 06:41:53 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on March 25, 2022, 04:09:37 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on March 09, 2022, 01:09:45 PM
    It's that time of year again when we see some orange barrels on the roads!

    Here are some projects that will be underway soon in NW Indiana:

    1. Bridge replacement on I-94 east of Johnson Road. Two 11-foot lanes with two-foot shoulders will remain open in both directions. Starts on March 14th.
    2. Bridge replacement on US 20/31 at South Michigan Street. One lane each way on the WB bridge while the EB bridge gets replaced. Starts on March 14th and the whole project is expected to be completed by early December.

    4. New roundabout at U.S. 6 and S.R. 2 in Westville. Will be replacing a 4-way stop. Two-phase construction schedule in which phase 1 will close the north and west legs of the intersection. The detour for the first phase will be as followed: US 421, US 6, SR 2, SR 49, and vice versa. Phase 2 will close the south and east legs of the intersection. The detour for the second phase will be as followed: US 421, SR 2, US 6, SR 49, and vice versa.

    Roundabout construction at U.S. 6 and S.R. 2 in Westville will begin construction on or after May 31st.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 24, 2022, 07:13:23 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on May 24, 2022, 06:41:53 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on March 25, 2022, 04:09:37 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on March 09, 2022, 01:09:45 PM
    It's that time of year again when we see some orange barrels on the roads!

    Here are some projects that will be underway soon in NW Indiana:

    1. Bridge replacement on I-94 east of Johnson Road. Two 11-foot lanes with two-foot shoulders will remain open in both directions. Starts on March 14th.
    2. Bridge replacement on US 20/31 at South Michigan Street. One lane each way on the WB bridge while the EB bridge gets replaced. Starts on March 14th and the whole project is expected to be completed by early December.

    4. New roundabout at U.S. 6 and S.R. 2 in Westville. Will be replacing a 4-way stop. Two-phase construction schedule in which phase 1 will close the north and west legs of the intersection. The detour for the first phase will be as followed: US 421, US 6, SR 2, SR 49, and vice versa. Phase 2 will close the south and east legs of the intersection. The detour for the second phase will be as followed: US 421, SR 2, US 6, SR 49, and vice versa.

    Roundabout construction at U.S. 6 and S.R. 2 in Westville will begin construction on or after May 31st.

    The last two times I went through that intersection, a second car tailed the first through the intersection to avoid waiting his turn to go.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: roadman65 on May 26, 2022, 08:12:14 AM
    https://goo.gl/maps/58iXXShQqJSbSMni7
    I of course expect that INDOT would sign US 421 on a supplemental, but give out no info on the overheads for Downtown Indy I wouldn't expect. The I-65 and I-70 interchanges now have control cities at their junctions with I-74/465.  So why not include them here as well?


    https://goo.gl/maps/KcwKuBMeiYtL6PdDA
    Hey they even here included US 52 east now on the guide with I-865 at of latest.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on May 26, 2022, 08:20:44 AM
    Quote from: roadman65 on May 26, 2022, 08:12:14 AM
    https://goo.gl/maps/58iXXShQqJSbSMni7
    I of course expect that INDOT would sign US 421 on a supplemental, but give out no info on the overheads for Downtown Indy I wouldn't expect. The I-65 and I-70 interchanges now have control cities at their junctions with I-74/465.  So why not include them here as well?

    :hmmm: are you saying mention downtown indy on the southeastern av sign?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: roadman65 on May 26, 2022, 08:36:42 AM
    No, I would say use it for I-465 north as that goes to I-70 for more quicker trip.


    I'm still up in the air about Binford Blvd being used on I-69 south at I-465, but unaware of the traffic situations of that part of Indy.  Here you're close to I-70 that Southeast Avenue would be longer per say.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 26, 2022, 08:39:30 AM
    Quote from: roadman65 on May 26, 2022, 08:36:42 AM
    No, I would say use it for I-465 north as that goes to I-70 for more quicker trip.


    I'm still up in the air about Binford Blvd being used on I-69 south at I-465, but unaware of the traffic situations of that part of Indy.  Here you're close to I-70 that Southeast Avenue would be longer per say.

    Binford Blvd and Southeastern Ave are signed because that's where the road goes if you continue on. It's not suggesting those roads as routes to downtown. Same with Crawfordsville Rd on the west side.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: roadman65 on May 26, 2022, 08:41:30 AM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on May 26, 2022, 08:39:30 AM
    Quote from: roadman65 on May 26, 2022, 08:36:42 AM
    No, I would say use it for I-465 north as that goes to I-70 for more quicker trip.


    I'm still up in the air about Binford Blvd being used on I-69 south at I-465, but unaware of the traffic situations of that part of Indy.  Here you're close to I-70 that Southeast Avenue would be longer per say.

    Binford Blvd and Southeastern Ave are signed because that's where the road goes if you continue on. It's not suggesting those roads as routes to downtown. Same with Crawfordsville Rd on the west side.

    My 2008 photos show Indy as a control city on I-69 south for Binford when that used to be its southern terminus.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on May 26, 2022, 08:41:45 AM
    Quote from: cabiness42 on May 26, 2022, 08:36:59 AM
    Quote from: roadman65 on May 26, 2022, 08:12:14 AM
    https://goo.gl/maps/58iXXShQqJSbSMni7
    I of course expect that INDOT would sign US 421 on a supplemental, but give out no info on the overheads for Downtown Indy I wouldn't expect. The I-65 and I-70 interchanges now have control cities at their junctions with I-74/465.  So why not include them here as well?


    https://goo.gl/maps/KcwKuBMeiYtL6PdDA
    Hey they even here included US 52 east now on the guide with I-865 at of latest.



    There is some inconsistency with how INDOT signs or doesn't sign control cities along I-465, but I don't know that anybody other than roadgeeks really cares.

    i think this will be fixed though eventually. seems like the new signs are going by a different signing method. and we all know theyre going to have to replace all the signs on the south east and east sides of town so those may all follow the way they look on the south side. but who knows.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: roadman65 on May 26, 2022, 08:44:46 AM
    https://goo.gl/maps/Smbe8yagcjCBb4Nz8

    Last year Binford was still signed for Indianapolis.  Yes when SR 37 upgrades are done these will have to go and include I-69 south where SR 37 is on this assembly and possibly include Evansville.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on May 26, 2022, 12:15:33 PM
    Quote from: roadman65 on May 26, 2022, 08:44:46 AM
    https://goo.gl/maps/Smbe8yagcjCBb4Nz8

    Last year Binford was still signed for Indianapolis.  Yes when SR 37 upgrades are done these will have to go and include I-69 south where SR 37 is on this assembly and possibly include Evansville.

    37 will be decommissioned in between the 69 splits. all the sign renderings they release omit 37 and the new martinsville section lacks 37
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on May 26, 2022, 01:12:02 PM
    Quote from: roadman65 on May 26, 2022, 08:12:14 AM
    https://goo.gl/maps/58iXXShQqJSbSMni7
    I of course expect that INDOT would sign US 421 on a supplemental, but give out no info on the overheads for Downtown Indy I wouldn't expect. The I-65 and I-70 interchanges now have control cities at their junctions with I-74/465.  So why not include them here as well?


    https://goo.gl/maps/KcwKuBMeiYtL6PdDA
    Hey they even here included US 52 east now on the guide with I-865 at of latest.

    The northbound APL sign across the road includes 52 as well, which never used to be acknowledged on the road itself on any BGSs (but was on interchange BGSs on intersecting roads and was on shield assemblies).

    The old button copy southbound signs for now-865 used to include 52 (465 EAST <BR> 52 EAST) but when 865 came along, INDOT actually found button copy letters to add TO so that they read 865 EAST <BR> TO <BR> 465 EAST, moving the 465 shield down and eliminating 52.  (The first generation of "new" signs copied what was on the button copy for messages; if you look at old enough street view you can see the button copy TO.  I have a pic of the assembly from 1997 without the TO and the old shields kicking around.)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on June 14, 2022, 09:18:48 PM
    SR 9 no longer goes through downtown Shelbyville. it now follows SR 44 East to I-74 rides 74 west to its old alignment. it is signed very well and on all of the BGS. but for some reason they made new 74 signs on 44 that show I-74 West SR 9 North, but forgot to add US 421 North to that sign. Looks like maybe Shelbyville requested this to take trucks out of their downtown? they are reconstructing that portion and removed the square.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: 74/171FAN on June 14, 2022, 10:34:21 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on June 14, 2022, 09:18:48 PM
    SR 9 no longer goes through downtown Shelbyville. it now follows SR 44 East to I-74 rides 74 west to its old alignment. it is signed very well and on all of the BGS. but for some reason they made new 74 signs on 44 that show I-74 West SR 9 North, but forgot to add US 421 North to that sign. Looks like maybe Shelbyville requested this to take trucks out of their downtown? they are reconstructing that portion and removed the square.

    So IN 9 basically follows IN 9 TRUCK now?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on June 15, 2022, 08:37:19 AM
    Quote from: 74/171FAN on June 14, 2022, 10:34:21 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on June 14, 2022, 09:18:48 PM
    SR 9 no longer goes through downtown Shelbyville. it now follows SR 44 East to I-74 rides 74 west to its old alignment. it is signed very well and on all of the BGS. but for some reason they made new 74 signs on 44 that show I-74 West SR 9 North, but forgot to add US 421 North to that sign. Looks like maybe Shelbyville requested this to take trucks out of their downtown? they are reconstructing that portion and removed the square.

    So IN 9 basically follows IN 9 TRUCK now?



    Correct
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 15, 2022, 02:45:41 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on June 15, 2022, 08:37:19 AM
    Quote from: 74/171FAN on June 14, 2022, 10:34:21 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on June 14, 2022, 09:18:48 PM
    SR 9 no longer goes through downtown Shelbyville. it now follows SR 44 East to I-74 rides 74 west to its old alignment. it is signed very well and on all of the BGS. but for some reason they made new 74 signs on 44 that show I-74 West SR 9 North, but forgot to add US 421 North to that sign. Looks like maybe Shelbyville requested this to take trucks out of their downtown? they are reconstructing that portion and removed the square.

    So IN 9 basically follows IN 9 TRUCK now?



    Correct

    Just to clarify, coming from the north, does SR 9 follow I-74 for one exit or does it continue south to SR 44 and then go east to TRK 9?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on June 15, 2022, 02:56:01 PM
    My description was for northbound. so if you were on NB SR 9 entering Shelbyville this is the route:

    SR 9 joins SR 44 now and turns right at Broadway, they're both co-signed over to I-74. SR 9 joins I-74 West to the old SR 9 exit and SR 9 goes north on its old alignment from there. and the reverse for SB.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: 74/171FAN on June 22, 2022, 05:53:22 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on June 15, 2022, 02:56:01 PM
    My description was for northbound. so if you were on NB SR 9 entering Shelbyville this is the route:

    SR 9 joins SR 44 now and turns right at Broadway, they're both co-signed over to I-74. SR 9 joins I-74 West to the old SR 9 exit and SR 9 goes north on its old alignment from there. and the reverse for SB.

    Ok, I did not recognize earlier that IN 9 TRUCK had two sections.  So does the part of IN 9 TRUCK south of Broadway still exists as-is for now?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on June 29, 2022, 09:18:43 PM
    https://wimsradio.com/2022/06/29/indot-to-lower-semi-speed-limit-on-indiana-49-in-chesterton-create-median-turnarounds-for-law-enforcement/

    INDOT lowered the speed limit for trucks from 50 mph to 40 mph in Chesterton, and they will also be making three turnarounds in the median for the police department between the Toll Road and Porter Avenue.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 01, 2022, 11:23:54 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on June 29, 2022, 09:18:43 PM
    https://wimsradio.com/2022/06/29/indot-to-lower-semi-speed-limit-on-indiana-49-in-chesterton-create-median-turnarounds-for-law-enforcement/

    INDOT lowered the speed limit for trucks from 50 mph to 40 mph in Chesterton, and they will also be making three turnarounds in the median for the police department between the Toll Road and Porter Avenue.

    So will it be the 50/40 speed limit split, or is it a hard 40 for all traffic? Just curious.

    There has been quite a rash of accidents on Indiana 49 between I-94 and the Toll Road (with a good chunk of them stemming from trucks coming in too hot on the loop ramps on the I-94 interchange). I hope this is the start of police cracking down on that area.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: sprjus4 on July 01, 2022, 11:26:12 AM
    ^ The truck speed limit will be reduced from 50 mph to 40 mph.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on July 01, 2022, 12:18:10 PM
    Quote from: sprjus4 on July 01, 2022, 11:26:12 AM
    ^ The truck speed limit will be reduced from 50 mph to 40 mph.

    So it will likely say "Speed Limit 50, Trucks 40."  Thank you for the clarification.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on July 12, 2022, 02:00:14 AM
    https://www.thestarpress.com/story/news/local/2022/07/11/indot-road-muncie-bypass-riggin-road-left-turns/7819300001/

    INDOT is looking at removing left turns onto and off of Riggins Road on the Muncie Bypass (US 35/IN SR 67).

    Here's where the proposed project is happening: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.2357969,-85.3519061,16z
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on July 13, 2022, 08:02:18 AM
    does this mean the whole bypass has only 1 signal left? all the rest are RIRO's?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on July 14, 2022, 12:34:14 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on July 13, 2022, 08:02:18 AM
    does this mean the whole bypass has only 1 signal left? all the rest are RIRO's?

    There would be two signals left. One at McGallard Road and one at Cowan Road on the south side. There's also a railroad crossing at-grade that does interupt the bypass traffic from time to time.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ibthebigd on July 14, 2022, 06:51:17 PM
    Wasn't there talk of an interchange at McGallard Road at one time

    SM-G996U

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on July 14, 2022, 08:03:07 PM
    For such a nice bypass, it's always been hard to swallow why the stoplight at McGallard and the busy NS RR at grade crossing?  Especially when other railways and less important roadways have overpasses and interchanges.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on July 15, 2022, 10:09:13 PM
    INDOT has announced today that the SR 225 bridge (built in 1910) over the Wabash River near Battle Ground will remain closed until a bridge rehabilitation project starts in July 2024, which is two years away.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on July 17, 2022, 08:07:54 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 15, 2022, 10:09:13 PM
    INDOT has announced today that the SR 225 bridge (built in 1910) over the Wabash River near Battle Ground will remain closed until a bridge rehabilitation project starts in July 2024, which is two years away.

    wait what? why is it closed?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on July 17, 2022, 09:14:24 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on July 17, 2022, 08:07:54 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 15, 2022, 10:09:13 PM
    INDOT has announced today that the SR 225 bridge (built in 1910) over the Wabash River near Battle Ground will remain closed until a bridge rehabilitation project starts in July 2024, which is two years away.

    wait what? why is it closed?

    Appears the bridge was damaged due to vehicles over the 12 ton limit using the bridge as a detour when a crash involving a Greyhound bus, which resulted in a fatality, closed I-65. According to BridgeHunter.com, the one-lane Jewettsport Ford Bridge was rehabilitated in 1989.

    https://bridgehunter.com/in/tippecanoe/29150/

    https://www.jconline.com/story/news/2021/06/15/indiana-225-bridge-wabash-river-closed/7707349002/

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on July 17, 2022, 10:04:32 PM

    Along sections of I-69 in Monroe County, crack seal already has been put down on the longitudinal joint seam between the lanes, as well as in the joint between the right lane and the shoulder. This stretch of road is less than four years old. Unfortunately, this is not a new issue in the asphalt industry. The problem of longitudinal joint cracking is well known but, apparently, no definitive, cost-effective solution as yet has been found.

    Poking around the internet I came across a small report (https://engineering.purdue.edu/NCSC/library/Longitudinal%20Joint%20in%20Asphalt%20Pavement.pdf) uploaded by a Purdue University library (no author, no institution, no date) that looks at longitudinal joint cracking, and puts forward several steps to help tackle the issue. One step mentioned is to apply a thick coat of rubberized asphalt sealant to the semi-cold or cold side of the joint. The report states that field research has "demonstrated that the use of hot-poured, rubberized asphalt sealer as a tack coat (about 1/8 inch or 3 mm thick) on the face of the first paved lane produced the most durable longitudinal joints," compared to a thin tack sealant application.

    I'm wondering. Has INDOT tried using a rubberized asphalt sealant on longitudinal joints in the past? If so, what were the results? And, if not, does it have any plans to consider doing so? Also, some other state transportation agency may have experimented with this type of joint sealant. Does anyone know? Anyone have anything to add on this? Feedback?


    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ysuindy on July 18, 2022, 10:22:22 AM
    Local authorities want to extend the "new" US 231 beyond Sagamore Parkway directly north to I-65

    https://davebangert.substack.com/p/a-plan-for-commercial-growth-a-new?r=2fe&s=w&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web

    It would seem this would be a long way off

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on July 18, 2022, 01:13:35 PM
    Quote from: ysuindy on July 18, 2022, 10:22:22 AM
    Local authorities want to extend the "new" US 231 beyond Sagamore Parkway directly north to I-65

    https://davebangert.substack.com/p/a-plan-for-commercial-growth-a-new?r=2fe&s=w&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web

    It would seem this would be a long way off



    Would 231 then go up 65 to meet its old self?  INDOT has had no problem making discontinuous segments of state roads but they have not done the same with US highways. 

    It would be a boon for football game day traffic to/from the north to have the dual carriageway 231 go up to 65, although it isn't usually that bad as you get further away.  If they want to have the new road go straight north from where it meets 52 today, they will be threading right by Meijer and have to buy out townhomes and stuff unless they threaded around them.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on July 19, 2022, 01:45:48 AM
    Wonder if they could just straighten out and upgrade 250w / Morehouse Rd / 500w and then build an interchange at 65?

    Pixel 6

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 19, 2022, 07:01:12 AM
    Quote from: bmeiser on July 19, 2022, 01:45:48 AM
    Wonder if they could just straighten out and upgrade 250w / Morehouse Rd / 500w and then build an interchange at 65?

    Pixel 6


    Or is there a way to curve the road around and have it meet up with 43 at that interchange and not have to build a new one?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tosa on July 19, 2022, 12:24:02 PM
    I think the preferred route of 231 extension will not only work as a direct interstate connection for Purdue, but it will also serve (I believe) as part of the future beltway of Greater Lafayette. If INDOT just wants to give Purdue better interstate access, widening the currently 231 would be much cheaper, less land to acquire, no new interchange.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tosa on July 19, 2022, 12:33:40 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on July 19, 2022, 07:01:12 AM
    Quote from: bmeiser on July 19, 2022, 01:45:48 AM
    Wonder if they could just straighten out and upgrade 250w / Morehouse Rd / 500w and then build an interchange at 65?

    Pixel 6


    Or is there a way to curve the road around and have it meet up with 43 at that interchange and not have to build a new one?

    Not a good idea. The only way for the corridor to meet 43 interchange is to go west somewhere between 500 and 600N, but that area is already developed. It is almost impossible to find vacant land to build a 4 line road.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on July 19, 2022, 01:43:55 PM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on July 18, 2022, 01:13:35 PM
    Quote from: ysuindy on July 18, 2022, 10:22:22 AM
    Local authorities want to extend the "new" US 231 beyond Sagamore Parkway directly north to I-65

    https://davebangert.substack.com/p/a-plan-for-commercial-growth-a-new?r=2fe&s=w&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web

    It would seem this would be a long way off



    Would 231 then go up 65 to meet its old self?  INDOT has had no problem making discontinuous segments of state roads but they have not done the same with US highways. 

    It would be a boon for football game day traffic to/from the north to have the dual carriageway 231 go up to 65, although it isn't usually that bad as you get further away.  If they want to have the new road go straight north from where it meets 52 today, they will be threading right by Meijer and have to buy out townhomes and stuff unless they threaded around them.

    INDOT is not allowed to have gaps in US highways. the Feds wouldn't allow it. yes there are a few technical gaps around the country but the feds have them in their books as continuous. I believe 2 technical gaps exist in colorado. 
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on July 19, 2022, 01:47:16 PM
    The way the bypass just ends at a right angle with sagamore suggests that is their plan. just probably either didnt have the money or traffic to justify it. hopefully they eventually do it, they could sign all the routes continuously in the area. 231 would just be cosigned with 65 between exit 193 and whatever exit the bypass would be.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: I-55 on July 19, 2022, 10:26:04 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on July 19, 2022, 01:47:16 PM
    The way the bypass just ends at a right angle with sagamore suggests that is their plan. just probably either didnt have the money or traffic to justify it. hopefully they eventually do it, they could sign all the routes continuously in the area. 231 would just be cosigned with 65 between exit 193 and whatever exit the bypass would be.

    I could totally see this turning into my senior design project in a couple years. Would really benefit the area as Sagamore can back up from Schuyler all the way past the river on gamedays and weekends. Our connection to I-65 north is really poor, as River Rd isn't a good option because it's hard to get to and 231 is far out of town.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Revive 755 on July 19, 2022, 11:12:43 PM
    The "Planning and Environmental Linkage" (PEL) Report is online for the Borman flex lane study:  https://www.indianaflexroad.com/8094flexroad/pelstudy (https://www.indianaflexroad.com/8094flexroad/pelstudy)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on July 20, 2022, 11:21:27 PM
    https://www.tribstar.com/news/local_news/indot-presents-plans-for-north-clinton-street-redo/article_f40e61db-0906-59e5-b3cd-fb26f13d8e90.html

    https://www.in.gov/indot/files/Des-1500146-US-41-Design-Plans.pdf

    Here's a plan sheet on the bridge removal on Clinton Street (OLD US 41) north of Terre Haute. J-Turns will be installed at the intersection with Quinn Avenue, and RIRO will be on NB US 41.

    https://www.google.com/maps/@39.5688543,-87.3707612,3a,75y,52.13h,90t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1scxJe0rSx0G2BASwJ8pvnSA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on July 21, 2022, 09:48:50 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 20, 2022, 11:21:27 PM
    https://www.tribstar.com/news/local_news/indot-presents-plans-for-north-clinton-street-redo/article_f40e61db-0906-59e5-b3cd-fb26f13d8e90.html

    https://www.in.gov/indot/files/Des-1500146-US-41-Design-Plans.pdf

    Here's a plan sheet on the bridge removal on Clinton Street (OLD US 41) north of Terre Haute. J-Turns will be installed at the intersection with Quinn Avenue, and RIRO will be on NB US 41.

    https://www.google.com/maps/@39.5688543,-87.3707612,3a,75y,52.13h,90t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1scxJe0rSx0G2BASwJ8pvnSA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

    :hmmm: i wonder what made that interchange dangerous?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tosa on July 22, 2022, 10:50:48 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on July 21, 2022, 09:48:50 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 20, 2022, 11:21:27 PM
    https://www.tribstar.com/news/local_news/indot-presents-plans-for-north-clinton-street-redo/article_f40e61db-0906-59e5-b3cd-fb26f13d8e90.html

    https://www.in.gov/indot/files/Des-1500146-US-41-Design-Plans.pdf

    Here's a plan sheet on the bridge removal on Clinton Street (OLD US 41) north of Terre Haute. J-Turns will be installed at the intersection with Quinn Avenue, and RIRO will be on NB US 41.

    https://www.google.com/maps/@39.5688543,-87.3707612,3a,75y,52.13h,90t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1scxJe0rSx0G2BASwJ8pvnSA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

    :hmmm: i wonder what made that interchange dangerous?

    I guess the bridge is approaching its age limit but they don't have money to rebuild it?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: jnewkirk77 on July 23, 2022, 09:22:33 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on July 21, 2022, 09:48:50 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 20, 2022, 11:21:27 PM
    https://www.tribstar.com/news/local_news/indot-presents-plans-for-north-clinton-street-redo/article_f40e61db-0906-59e5-b3cd-fb26f13d8e90.html

    https://www.in.gov/indot/files/Des-1500146-US-41-Design-Plans.pdf

    Here's a plan sheet on the bridge removal on Clinton Street (OLD US 41) north of Terre Haute. J-Turns will be installed at the intersection with Quinn Avenue, and RIRO will be on NB US 41.

    https://www.google.com/maps/@39.5688543,-87.3707612,3a,75y,52.13h,90t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1scxJe0rSx0G2BASwJ8pvnSA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

    :hmmm: i wonder what made that interchange dangerous?

    The nearby intersections see a fair number of wrecks - there's an elementary school that's in the vicinity. And as far as the overpass itself, it has a clearance of 14' (maybe an inch or 2 more), which is lower than they want.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on July 28, 2022, 09:37:23 PM
    https://wsbt.com/news/local/breaking-indiana-toll-road-near-cr-17-exit-in-elkhart-experiencing-traffic-backups

    The Indiana Toll Road is currently closed eastbound from US 31 (exit 72) to IN SR 15 (exit 101) due to a washout at MP 96 (Elkhart east exit).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 28, 2022, 09:45:43 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 28, 2022, 09:37:23 PM
    https://wsbt.com/news/local/breaking-indiana-toll-road-near-cr-17-exit-in-elkhart-experiencing-traffic-backups

    The Indiana Toll Road is currently closed eastbound from US 31 (exit 72) to IN SR 15 (exit 101) due to a washout at MP 96 (Elkhart east exit).

    I saw that. Very weird place to have a washout.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: edwaleni on July 29, 2022, 01:45:03 PM
    Quote from: ITB on July 17, 2022, 09:14:24 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on July 17, 2022, 08:07:54 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 15, 2022, 10:09:13 PM
    INDOT has announced today that the SR 225 bridge (built in 1910) over the Wabash River near Battle Ground will remain closed until a bridge rehabilitation project starts in July 2024, which is two years away.

    wait what? why is it closed?

    Appears the bridge was damaged due to vehicles over the 12 ton limit using the bridge as a detour when a crash involving a Greyhound bus, which resulted in a fatality, closed I-65. According to BridgeHunter.com, the one-lane Jewettsport Ford Bridge was rehabilitated in 1989.

    https://bridgehunter.com/in/tippecanoe/29150/

    https://www.jconline.com/story/news/2021/06/15/indiana-225-bridge-wabash-river-closed/7707349002/

    These issues seem to be happening more often with semi-truck drivers attempting to cross weight restricted bridges to avoid long waits.

    Is it because we have more weight restricted bridges in the national inventory, (due to deferred spending), or is it because of new truck driver time limits?

    Seems I am seeing more irrational over weight collapses in the last few years. Some are on YouTube showing a clear overweight taking a huge risk.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: triplemultiplex on July 29, 2022, 02:57:10 PM
    I'd attribute that to truckers using consumer-grade GPS navigation rather than those GPS units that specialize in navigating large, commercial vehicles.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: edwaleni on July 29, 2022, 04:05:31 PM
    Quote from: triplemultiplex on July 29, 2022, 02:57:10 PM
    I'd attribute that to truckers using consumer-grade GPS navigation rather than those GPS units that specialize in navigating large, commercial vehicles.

    Makes sense, but the question begs in this case, if using a consumer grade GPS, the signs at the bridge usually state pretty clearly what the limit is. So would the trucker not know how much the GW of their load is?

    I mean interstates (most) have scales to support their weight restrictions. The driver has to know ( I would think) before they hitch their load, how much they are pulling.

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Alps on July 29, 2022, 04:20:35 PM
    Quote from: edwaleni on July 29, 2022, 04:05:31 PM
    Quote from: triplemultiplex on July 29, 2022, 02:57:10 PM
    I'd attribute that to truckers using consumer-grade GPS navigation rather than those GPS units that specialize in navigating large, commercial vehicles.

    Makes sense, but the question begs in this case, if using a consumer grade GPS, the signs at the bridge usually state pretty clearly what the limit is. So would the trucker not know how much the GW of their load is?

    I mean interstates (most) have scales to support their weight restrictions. The driver has to know ( I would think) before they hitch their load, how much they are pulling.


    the driver just doesn't even care
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JREwing78 on July 30, 2022, 03:36:06 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 15, 2022, 10:09:13 PM
    INDOT has announced today that the SR 225 bridge (built in 1910) over the Wabash River near Battle Ground will remain closed until a bridge rehabilitation project starts in July 2024, which is two years away.

    This begs the question - why bother reopening the bridge to vehicle traffic at all? It's a perfect highlight for a non-motorized path alongside SR 225.

    I realize the locals fought to keep the bridge open, and a new-build bridge is expensive, but reopening this bridge to vehicle traffic is folly. The only way they could guarantee a bus or semi doesn't use it is to put up a 8' tall crash beam on the approach to each side, which would detract from the bridge's appearance.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: triplemultiplex on August 01, 2022, 01:16:24 PM
    No offense to anyone who drives truck for a living, but that's a profession that's not exactly known its geniuses.  It never surprises me when truckers make boneheaded moves like running into low overpasses or trying to cross bridges that can't handle their weight.  Don't get me wrong, regular car drivers are idiots as well; bigger idiots in most cases.  But they're not supposed professionals.  Trucking gets their drivers from the same pool of shlubs we all came from, so picture the 2 or 3 biggest dingbats at your work.  That same bell curve applies to truckers.  Except at the low end of their bell curve, tons of vehicle crash into things instead of your spreadsheet getting messed up.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Rothman on August 01, 2022, 01:52:07 PM
    Quote from: triplemultiplex on August 01, 2022, 01:16:24 PM
    No offense to anyone who drives truck for a living, but that's a profession that's not exactly known its geniuses.  It never surprises me when truckers make boneheaded moves like running into low overpasses or trying to cross bridges that can't handle their weight.  Don't get me wrong, regular car drivers are idiots as well; bigger idiots in most cases.  But they're not supposed professionals.  Trucking gets their drivers from the same pool of shlubs we all came from, so picture the 2 or 3 biggest dingbats at your work.  That same bell curve applies to truckers.  Except at the low end of their bell curve, tons of vehicle crash into things instead of your spreadsheet getting messed up.
    Not all truckers are created equal.  My feeling is that those schmucks hitting low overpasses or running overweight over bridges are either from small outfits running by the seat of their pants or Swift.

    There are a whole lot of professional truckers out there that know what they're doing on the road.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ran4sh on August 01, 2022, 04:38:57 PM
    Quote from: triplemultiplex on August 01, 2022, 01:16:24 PM
    No offense to anyone who drives truck for a living, but that's a profession that's not exactly known its geniuses.  It never surprises me when truckers make boneheaded moves like running into low overpasses or trying to cross bridges that can't handle their weight.  Don't get me wrong, regular car drivers are idiots as well; bigger idiots in most cases.  But they're not supposed professionals.  Trucking gets their drivers from the same pool of shlubs we all came from, so picture the 2 or 3 biggest dingbats at your work.  That same bell curve applies to truckers.  Except at the low end of their bell curve, tons of vehicle crash into things instead of your spreadsheet getting messed up.

    In some cases the information on weight limits is inaccurate or unavailable even when the driver is using a proper GPS. I know someone who drives a truck with a company-provided GPS, which is set to the correct truck weight of 80000 lb, yet it still routes the truck onto some bridges that I know have lower weight limits.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 01, 2022, 08:02:20 PM
    INDOT has released the Planning and Environment Linkages (PEL) Study Report for the proposed I-80/94 Flex Road Project. You can read it here, (https://www.indianaflexroad.com/8094flexroad/pelstudy) but here are some of the main talking points.

    There are four "packages"  being considered for this project:

    Package 1: Dynamic Shoulder Lanes, Event Management, improved VMS signage, and interchange improvements
    Package 2: Package 1 plus ramp metering
    Package 3: Package 1 plus variable speed limit signage (per lane), dynamic lane controls, and queue warnings (think of the Smart Lane System on the Jane Addams Tollway for the last two - same idea)
    Package 4: All of the Above

    This appears to be a joint collaboration with IDOT, since the study limits are set between I-65 and the I-294/IL-394 interchanges.

    One major highlight of the report includes a proposal to reconfigure the Broadway interchange. The proposal would call for the ramp from northbound Broadway to eastbound I-80/94 to be removed; instead, northbound traffic would turn left onto the existing loop ramp to merge onto I-80/94 eastbound.

    Theoretically, this would be the result: by the time eastbound traffic passes Grant Street, the far right lane would become "exit only"  for I-65, with the second lane from the right becoming an option lane (keep straight or exit right). With the reconfigured Broadway ramp, a third lane for I-65 would be created (two exit only lanes, plus one option) using the existing shoulder. A new inner lane would be created near the Broadway interchange to keep four lanes of I-80/94 through traffic past I-65 to where the road currently reduces to three lanes.

    The study says the current configuration from Grant Street to I-65 creates a bottleneck because traffic looking to exit to I-65 southbound has to wait for for the Broadway merge before exit lanes are made available, causing mainline slowdowns. The proposed reconfiguration would allow exiting traffic to maintain speed without a need for changing lanes, while allowing Broadway traffic looking to stay on I-80/94 eastbound time to make it (at least) to the option lane.

    There are more aspects to this project, and work is still a ways off, but at least we have an idea of what it will entail.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 01, 2022, 08:18:46 PM
    I'm just glad they've ruled out taking more ROW and forcing me to move.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Joe The Dragon on August 01, 2022, 09:03:58 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 01, 2022, 08:02:20 PM
    INDOT has released the Planning and Environment Linkages (PEL) Study Report for the proposed I-80/94 Flex Road Project. You can read it here, (https://www.indianaflexroad.com/8094flexroad/pelstudy) but here are some of the main talking points.

    There are four "packages"  being considered for this project:

    Package 1: Dynamic Shoulder Lanes, Event Management, improved VMS signage, and interchange improvements
    Package 2: Package 1 plus ramp metering
    Package 3: Package 1 plus variable speed limit signage (per lane), dynamic lane controls, and queue warnings (think of the Smart Lane System on the Jane Addams Tollway for the last two - same idea)
    Package 4: All of the Above

    This appears to be a joint collaboration with IDOT, since the study limits are set between I-65 and the I-294/IL-394 interchanges.


    and not the tollway on the tollway parts?
    Dynamic Shoulder Lanes should use the same system as will be installed on I-294 and in place on I-90

    halsted st to I-80 can maybe use one aux lane (add one lane) to make 5 main on I-294 under halsted st
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 01, 2022, 09:38:22 PM
    Quote from: Joe The Dragon on August 01, 2022, 09:03:58 PM
    and not the tollway on the tollway parts?
    Dynamic Shoulder Lanes should use the same system as will be installed on I-294 and in place on I-90

    halsted st to I-80 can maybe use one aux lane (add one lane) to make 5 main on I-294 under halsted st

    The Tollway is under a completely different jurisdiction (ISTHA).

    The only way five lanes would ever work between Halsted and I-80/94 would be to remove the Lincoln Oasis and to work a deal with CN Railways to replace their overpass. I don't see either of those scenarios happening anytime soon.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Joe The Dragon on August 01, 2022, 09:52:56 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 01, 2022, 09:38:22 PM
    Quote from: Joe The Dragon on August 01, 2022, 09:03:58 PM
    and not the tollway on the tollway parts?
    Dynamic Shoulder Lanes should use the same system as will be installed on I-294 and in place on I-90

    halsted st to I-80 can maybe use one aux lane (add one lane) to make 5 main on I-294 under halsted st

    The Tollway is under a completely different jurisdiction (ISTHA).

    The only way five lanes would ever work between Halsted and I-80/94 would be to remove the Lincoln Oasis and to work a deal with CN Railways to replace their overpass. I don't see either of those scenarios happening anytime soon.
    It is 5 lanes now. Form I-80 to Halsted Maybe add one more as flex or drop the shoulders for that one part.

    Just need to CN Railways to replace their overpass to get an lane from Halsted to the Lincoln Oasis.

    and get rid of the Lincoln Oasis overpass to go 5 lanes each way.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JoePCool14 on August 03, 2022, 12:14:40 PM
    I hesitate to see any of those improvements making a sufficient impact on the Borman. The best thing in my eyes would be the creation of truck-free express lanes, even reversible lanes if possible. The shear volume of trucks really ruins that road. That's not going to happen though given the lack of ROW. Ramp meters might help cut down on delays at the start and end, but I don't usually see much traffic merging on aside from the other highways. And using the shoulder as a flex lane doesn't sit well with me.

    Obviously, we know here what the true best solution is, but we'll all probably be dead in the grave before that happens.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: hobsini2 on August 03, 2022, 12:35:05 PM
    I'm with Joe on this. Even a reversible express with 2 lanes from Bishop Ford to the ITR should help with traffic. Access to the express lanes should be at Bishop Ford, IN 912 Cline Ave, I-65 and the ITR.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 03, 2022, 12:40:15 PM
    Without expanding the ROW, reversible lanes would take away from the permanent travel lanes, and there's enough traffic going both directions during rush hour that makes that a bad idea.

    I don't see there being any more they can do than what they're proposing. The only thing that's going to help is an additional route, whether it be the Illiana or something else.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: hobsini2 on August 03, 2022, 12:43:28 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on August 03, 2022, 12:40:15 PM
    Without expanding the ROW, reversible lanes would take away from the permanent travel lanes, and there's enough traffic going both directions during rush hour that makes that a bad idea.

    I don't see there being any more they can do than what they're proposing. The only thing that's going to help is an additional route, whether it be the Illiana or something else.

    Optimally, I would love the Illiana to exist. Should have been built 20 years ago at the very least between 57 and 65.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 03, 2022, 12:47:51 PM
    Quote from: hobsini2 on August 03, 2022, 12:43:28 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on August 03, 2022, 12:40:15 PM
    Without expanding the ROW, reversible lanes would take away from the permanent travel lanes, and there's enough traffic going both directions during rush hour that makes that a bad idea.

    I don't see there being any more they can do than what they're proposing. The only thing that's going to help is an additional route, whether it be the Illiana or something else.

    Optimally, I would love the Illiana to exist. Should have been built 20 years ago at the very least between 57 and 65.

    Or at least between 65 and 394.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: triplemultiplex on August 03, 2022, 02:49:58 PM
    The Illiana should have been conceived from the start as an x80 'bypass'.  All tollway and 3x3 the whole way.  And start construction c. 1990.

    But alas...

    Now if one wants to really add capacity to the Borman, you're talking about elevating some lanes above the entire thing, probably. The kind of thing one sees in Texas.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on August 03, 2022, 04:14:41 PM
    Earlier today all lanes of I-65 southbound were closed at SR 18 in Tippecanoe County (https://www.jconline.com/story/news/local/2022/08/03/i-65-southbound-closed-wednesday-north-of-lafayette-exits/65390505007/) due to a huge pothole. The hole was the size of car hood. It's being called a pothole in new reports, but it may have been a sinkhole. Emergency repairs were, of course, quickly undertaken, and were expected to take eight to 10 hours to complete. Wow. What a mess.

    Edit: The INDOT alert states the pothole was on a bridge deck. The specific location involved was not noted, but it could be the bridge over Rayman Ditch, just south of SR 18. So it wasn't a sinkhole, and was more likely a structural failure.

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52261289428_133c974382_b.jpg)
    INDOT Trafficwise Camera Image


    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SEWIGuy on August 03, 2022, 04:22:20 PM
    Quote from: triplemultiplex on August 03, 2022, 02:49:58 PM
    The Illiana should have been conceived from the start as an x80 'bypass'.  All tollway and 3x3 the whole way.  And start construction c. 1990.

    But alas...

    Now if one wants to really add capacity to the Borman, you're talking about elevating some lanes above the entire thing, probably. The kind of thing one sees in Texas.


    It seems to me the biggest problem with the Borman is that you have a bunch of local traffic "mixing" with a bunch of through traffic that just needs to get around the bottom of the lake to head elsewhere. If that is indeed the case, the only way I could see Illiana having a significant enough impact is if it becomes a truly I-80 bypass - maybe even going to I-94 in Michigan. But I-57 to I-65 I don't think would have been much help.

    I just was on the Borman twice this past week going from the Chicago area south. Would I have taken I-57 to Illiana to I-65 instead of the Tri-State to the Borman to I-65 even if it meant sitting in traffic?  I doubt it.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on August 03, 2022, 09:12:02 PM
    they could pull a texas and place extra lanes above mainline on a bridge  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: skluth on August 04, 2022, 01:01:00 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 03, 2022, 09:12:02 PM
    they could pull a texas and place extra lanes above mainline on a bridge  :-D

    Silly as that sounds, an elevated four-lane through bridge from where I-80 joins the Tri-State to the I-65 interchange would do wonders for traffic. Twenty miles of elevated bridge would be expensive, but it takes no land and doesn't require any access between the endpoints but emergency access points.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: hobsini2 on August 04, 2022, 02:06:36 PM
    Quote from: skluth on August 04, 2022, 01:01:00 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 03, 2022, 09:12:02 PM
    they could pull a texas and place extra lanes above mainline on a bridge  :-D

    Silly as that sounds, an elevated four-lane through bridge from where I-80 joins the Tri-State to the I-65 interchange would do wonders for traffic. Twenty miles of elevated bridge would be expensive, but it takes no land and doesn't require any access between the endpoints but emergency access points.
    The only thing is that you would have to raise those bridges really high due to the fly over ramps at Calumet Ave, Indianapolis Blvd and Cline Ave.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: I-55 on August 04, 2022, 10:20:42 PM
    Quote from: SEWIGuy on August 03, 2022, 04:22:20 PM
    Quote from: triplemultiplex on August 03, 2022, 02:49:58 PM
    The Illiana should have been conceived from the start as an x80 'bypass'.  All tollway and 3x3 the whole way.  And start construction c. 1990.

    But alas...

    Now if one wants to really add capacity to the Borman, you're talking about elevating some lanes above the entire thing, probably. The kind of thing one sees in Texas.


    It seems to me the biggest problem with the Borman is that you have a bunch of local traffic "mixing" with a bunch of through traffic that just needs to get around the bottom of the lake to head elsewhere. If that is indeed the case, the only way I could see Illiana having a significant enough impact is if it becomes a truly I-80 bypass - maybe even going to I-94 in Michigan. But I-57 to I-65 I don't think would have been much help.

    I just was on the Borman twice this past week going from the Chicago area south. Would I have taken I-57 to Illiana to I-65 instead of the Tri-State to the Borman to I-65 even if it meant sitting in traffic?  I doubt it.

    Extending I-355 down to meet that wouldn't be a shabby idea itself. Then you're providing a bypass for all thru traffic not using I-94, and you'd probably see the Borman ease up a little bit, maybe enough to allow ROW to be converted to reversible express lanes for peak hours.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on August 08, 2022, 11:33:17 PM

    This afternoon, in Hamilton County, a truck trailer caught fire on northbound I-69 about a mile past the I-69/SR 37 interchange. The incident resulted in the complete closure of both the northbound and southbound lanes for a while. The southbound lanes were reopened after about 20 minutes, but the northbound remained closed much longer, producing a monumental backup. Apparently, the fire was very hot as sections of the trailer melted. A dumpster and an mid-sized excavator with a bucket grapple were trucked in to deal with the mess. Most of the shipment, it seems, was able to be recovered. It appears, as well, the trucker was able to detach the cab before the fire expanded to it.

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52273728635_c86e49dac5_h.jpg)
    INDOT Trafficwise Camera
    Just after the fire was extinguished.

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52273500409_5b7bf694ca_h.jpg)
    INDOT Trafficwise Camera
    Cleaning up the mess. The truck's remaining cargo is in the foreground.

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52273262078_712abb20bf_h.jpg)
    INDOT Trafficwise Camera
    The backup on the northbound lanes.

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52272268372_26801381a3_h.jpg)
    INDOT Trafficwise Camera
    Another perspective of the backup.
     
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: triplemultiplex on August 10, 2022, 11:45:27 AM
    Interesting. Based on the first image, it seems like the cargo itself is what caught fire, not anything to do with the trailer (like a reefer motor blowing up or something.)

    Good thing there are 3 lanes in each direction here otherwise they'd have been shut down for longer, I imagine.  Enough room for traffic to squeeze past with the extra room.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ran4sh on August 10, 2022, 05:51:08 PM
    Yes, that's a thing in truck transportation. I know some truck drivers and they say they're trained that, in case of the trailer or cargo being on fire, pull over and if possible, quickly disconnect the trailer from the tractor, to save the tractor. Trailers are a lot less expensive to replace than if the whole truck caught on fire
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on August 11, 2022, 01:25:55 PM
    Uh-oh....INDOT sign refacing aka "overlay sign panel work".  Odds that the sign legend will have any top margin?

    https://www.facebook.com/INDOTEast/posts/pfbid0gXguQhBoLRPgsgMLWYyg5yamewaJMMCAfZAyGrLyv8VziHcNG18E8o2jfgkrdU9l
    https://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/INDOT/bulletins/327a630?fbclid=IwAR3OJikWicfgJIY2DhUNH2-nNhQL7Qe3P8LaItdvyrGYSQGJbcxQ8vu3zzY
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on August 11, 2022, 01:30:00 PM
    i find that when signs are refaced, they always have these weird massive gaps.  :-D not sure why, maybe they aren't following the plans?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on August 11, 2022, 02:11:51 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 11, 2022, 01:30:00 PM
    i find that when signs are refaced, they always have these weird massive gaps.  :-D not sure why, maybe they aren't following the plans?

    The worst I've seen is on I-469.  It was forgivable when they removed US 24 from the sign and it left extra space.  It is not forgivable that the refacing job moved the I-69 shield even further up on the sign away from other legend.  (This is a clear example of where new sign panels are really called for.)
    https://goo.gl/maps/8L7MUb4AbtAEbQYG8
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on August 11, 2022, 03:53:16 PM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on August 11, 2022, 02:11:51 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 11, 2022, 01:30:00 PM
    i find that when signs are refaced, they always have these weird massive gaps.  :-D not sure why, maybe they aren't following the plans?

    The worst I've seen is on I-469.  It was forgivable when they removed US 24 from the sign and it left extra space.  It is not forgivable that the refacing job moved the I-69 shield even further up on the sign away from other legend.  (This is a clear example of where new sign panels are really called for.)
    https://goo.gl/maps/8L7MUb4AbtAEbQYG8

    this one would make you angrier  :-D https://www.google.com/maps/@40.992372,-85.2681015,3a,15y,113.62h,99.54t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s0IInfY-N0FLEgM2NBGiHIw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

    i did notice this sign is wrong: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.9568315,-85.2942839,3a,75y,31.33h,85.67t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sdN3OjEcD4bGsIJyl27ISYQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 US 24 doesn't travel down here anymore.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JoePCool14 on August 11, 2022, 06:30:12 PM
    If only INDOT would just stop doing these cheap overlays. Or at least not do them when the contents or design of the sign is changing significantly like with the I-469 example.

    I'd also like them to replace the old tiny exit tabs with ones with proper vertical spacing on the legend.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: thefarmerchris on August 12, 2022, 12:13:12 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 11, 2022, 03:53:16 PM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on August 11, 2022, 02:11:51 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 11, 2022, 01:30:00 PM
    i find that when signs are refaced, they always have these weird massive gaps.  :-D not sure why, maybe they aren't following the plans?

    The worst I've seen is on I-469.  It was forgivable when they removed US 24 from the sign and it left extra space.  It is not forgivable that the refacing job moved the I-69 shield even further up on the sign away from other legend.  (This is a clear example of where new sign panels are really called for.)
    https://goo.gl/maps/8L7MUb4AbtAEbQYG8

    this one would make you angrier  :-D https://www.google.com/maps/@40.992372,-85.2681015,3a,15y,113.62h,99.54t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s0IInfY-N0FLEgM2NBGiHIw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

    i did notice this sign is wrong: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.9568315,-85.2942839,3a,75y,31.33h,85.67t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sdN3OjEcD4bGsIJyl27ISYQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 US 24 doesn't travel down here anymore.

    I'm utterly shocked INDOT even replaces signs up in Fort Wayne. Most of them are so in need of replacement and/or not consistent.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: jhuntin1 on August 12, 2022, 03:57:26 PM
    INDOT renamed the "Greenwood" exit on I-65 (Exit 99) to "Main St" last week. Worthsville Rd. also serves Greenwood, so that may be the reason for the change. They overlaid a long green panel on the original signs, so there is lots of bright green space on the sides that show over the older signs. I don't know if we'll ever see a Greenwood - Next 2 Exits (could be 3 if they count County Line Rd.).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on August 13, 2022, 04:24:07 AM
    Looks like INDOT is testing orange lines in their construction zones, as seen here on I-65 near Sellersburg: https://www.google.com/maps/@38.3836229,-85.7596501,3a,15y,347.52h,86.67t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sB6pi1sAS2EV8038-oD50CQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

    EDIT: Also found the ITR testing orange lines on one of their bridge painting projects back in June 2022: https://www.google.com/maps/@41.7223561,-86.2698136,3a,75y,82.53h,86.84t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sFpHwRpkUgpJRMOilCyiBiA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Ted$8roadFan on August 13, 2022, 07:32:16 AM
    Quote from: thefarmerchris on August 12, 2022, 12:13:12 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 11, 2022, 03:53:16 PM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on August 11, 2022, 02:11:51 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 11, 2022, 01:30:00 PM
    i find that when signs are refaced, they always have these weird massive gaps.  :-D not sure why, maybe they aren't following the plans?

    The worst I've seen is on I-469.  It was forgivable when they removed US 24 from the sign and it left extra space.  It is not forgivable that the refacing job moved the I-69 shield even further up on the sign away from other legend.  (This is a clear example of where new sign panels are really called for.)
    https://goo.gl/maps/8L7MUb4AbtAEbQYG8

    this one would make you angrier  :-D https://www.google.com/maps/@40.992372,-85.2681015,3a,15y,113.62h,99.54t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s0IInfY-N0FLEgM2NBGiHIw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

    i did notice this sign is wrong: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.9568315,-85.2942839,3a,75y,31.33h,85.67t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sdN3OjEcD4bGsIJyl27ISYQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 US 24 doesn't travel down here anymore.

    I'm utterly shocked INDOT even replaces signs up in Fort Wayne. Most of them are so in need of replacement and/or not consistent.

    When I first drove through Fort Wayne years ago, I always wondered why the state never seemed to use controlcities on I-469 (e.g. US 24 East - Toledo). Guess some things haven't changed.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: hobsini2 on August 13, 2022, 02:37:14 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 11, 2022, 03:53:16 PM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on August 11, 2022, 02:11:51 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 11, 2022, 01:30:00 PM
    i find that when signs are refaced, they always have these weird massive gaps.  :-D not sure why, maybe they aren't following the plans?

    The worst I've seen is on I-469.  It was forgivable when they removed US 24 from the sign and it left extra space.  It is not forgivable that the refacing job moved the I-69 shield even further up on the sign away from other legend.  (This is a clear example of where new sign panels are really called for.)
    https://goo.gl/maps/8L7MUb4AbtAEbQYG8

    this one would make you angrier  :-D https://www.google.com/maps/@40.992372,-85.2681015,3a,15y,113.62h,99.54t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s0IInfY-N0FLEgM2NBGiHIw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

    i did notice this sign is wrong: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.9568315,-85.2942839,3a,75y,31.33h,85.67t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sdN3OjEcD4bGsIJyl27ISYQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 US 24 doesn't travel down here anymore.

    PurdueBill, it would have been better if INDOT had centered the 69 shield.
    Silverback, I think that greenspace may be for if and when they move US 27 onto I-69 instead of going through Ft Wayne.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: I-55 on August 13, 2022, 07:52:07 PM
    Quote from: hobsini2 on August 13, 2022, 02:37:14 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 11, 2022, 03:53:16 PM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on August 11, 2022, 02:11:51 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 11, 2022, 01:30:00 PM
    i find that when signs are refaced, they always have these weird massive gaps.  :-D not sure why, maybe they aren't following the plans?

    The worst I've seen is on I-469.  It was forgivable when they removed US 24 from the sign and it left extra space.  It is not forgivable that the refacing job moved the I-69 shield even further up on the sign away from other legend.  (This is a clear example of where new sign panels are really called for.)
    https://goo.gl/maps/8L7MUb4AbtAEbQYG8

    this one would make you angrier  :-D https://www.google.com/maps/@40.992372,-85.2681015,3a,15y,113.62h,99.54t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s0IInfY-N0FLEgM2NBGiHIw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

    i did notice this sign is wrong: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.9568315,-85.2942839,3a,75y,31.33h,85.67t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sdN3OjEcD4bGsIJyl27ISYQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 US 24 doesn't travel down here anymore.

    PurdueBill, it would have been better if INDOT had centered the 69 shield.
    Silverback, I think that greenspace may be for if and when they move US 27 onto I-69 instead of going through Ft Wayne.

    If US 27 ever got removed thru FW it would probably just be truncated to 469. INDOT would love to hand over 27 to Fort Wayne but the city can't afford to maintain it right now and hasn't assumed control.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on August 13, 2022, 10:38:44 PM
    Quote from: I-55 on August 13, 2022, 07:52:07 PM
    Quote from: hobsini2 on August 13, 2022, 02:37:14 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 11, 2022, 03:53:16 PM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on August 11, 2022, 02:11:51 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 11, 2022, 01:30:00 PM
    i find that when signs are refaced, they always have these weird massive gaps.  :-D not sure why, maybe they aren't following the plans?

    The worst I've seen is on I-469.  It was forgivable when they removed US 24 from the sign and it left extra space.  It is not forgivable that the refacing job moved the I-69 shield even further up on the sign away from other legend.  (This is a clear example of where new sign panels are really called for.)
    https://goo.gl/maps/8L7MUb4AbtAEbQYG8

    this one would make you angrier  :-D https://www.google.com/maps/@40.992372,-85.2681015,3a,15y,113.62h,99.54t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s0IInfY-N0FLEgM2NBGiHIw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

    i did notice this sign is wrong: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.9568315,-85.2942839,3a,75y,31.33h,85.67t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sdN3OjEcD4bGsIJyl27ISYQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 US 24 doesn't travel down here anymore.

    PurdueBill, it would have been better if INDOT had centered the 69 shield.
    Silverback, I think that greenspace may be for if and when they move US 27 onto I-69 instead of going through Ft Wayne.

    If US 27 ever got removed thru FW it would probably just be truncated to 469. INDOT would love to hand over 27 to Fort Wayne but the city can't afford to maintain it right now and hasn't assumed control.

    27 will never do that. they would just end it at 469.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on August 13, 2022, 10:39:25 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on August 13, 2022, 04:24:07 AM
    Looks like INDOT is testing orange stripes in their construction zones, as seen here on I-65 near Sellersburg: https://www.google.com/maps/@38.3836229,-85.7596501,3a,15y,347.52h,86.67t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sB6pi1sAS2EV8038-oD50CQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

    they are also on 65 just south of us 52. very noticeable i like them.  :)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on August 14, 2022, 12:58:13 AM
    Quote from: hobsini2 on August 13, 2022, 02:37:14 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 11, 2022, 03:53:16 PM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on August 11, 2022, 02:11:51 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 11, 2022, 01:30:00 PM
    i find that when signs are refaced, they always have these weird massive gaps.  :-D not sure why, maybe they aren't following the plans?

    The worst I've seen is on I-469.  It was forgivable when they removed US 24 from the sign and it left extra space.  It is not forgivable that the refacing job moved the I-69 shield even further up on the sign away from other legend.  (This is a clear example of where new sign panels are really called for.)
    https://goo.gl/maps/8L7MUb4AbtAEbQYG8

    this one would make you angrier  :-D https://www.google.com/maps/@40.992372,-85.2681015,3a,15y,113.62h,99.54t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s0IInfY-N0FLEgM2NBGiHIw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

    i did notice this sign is wrong: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.9568315,-85.2942839,3a,75y,31.33h,85.67t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sdN3OjEcD4bGsIJyl27ISYQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 US 24 doesn't travel down here anymore.

    PurdueBill, it would have been better if INDOT had centered the 69 shield.
    Silverback, I think that greenspace may be for if and when they move US 27 onto I-69 instead of going through Ft Wayne.

    On both signs, it is leftover space from when US 24 was moved from going around the south end of 469 to going around the north end (which is silly now that 900N/Laf. Ctr. Rd. is widened; 24 probably should have been routed onto that).  There are/were vestiges of 27 appearing on BGSs around Fort Wayne north of where it was eliminated, but these are not those.

    The same goof of 24 WEST appearing with 69 NORTH as at Lower Huntington Road appears on the ramp from Laf. Ctr. Rd. EB to 69, but only at the ramp split.

    The 69 shield was never centered--it is INDOT's thing to line the shields up vertically usually.  If you go to older street view of the sign at Exit 0, you can see how the three shields lined up above each other.
    https://goo.gl/maps/kNrSZcspRtyQdu2a6
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on August 14, 2022, 05:59:21 AM
    Quote from: jhuntin1 on August 12, 2022, 03:57:26 PM
    INDOT renamed the "Greenwood" exit on I-65 (Exit 99) to "Main St" last week. Worthsville Rd. also serves Greenwood, so that may be the reason for the change. They overlaid a long green panel on the original signs, so there is lots of bright green space on the sides that show over the older signs. I don't know if we'll ever see a Greenwood - Next 2 Exits (could be 3 if they count County Line Rd.).

    That's some major OCD-ing going on with INDOT. I bet having Greenwood signed on Exit 99 wasn't a problem until the Worthsville Road exit was built. Until then, street names were used to Exit 101 (County Line Road) and then community names were used south from there in Johnson County. But once Exit 97 was built there was an imbalance. Exit 103 (street name,) Exit 101 (street name,) Exit 99 (city name!) Exit 97 (street name) and then Exit 95 (city name.) Well we can't have that, the line must be drawn somewhere and now it has to be between Exits 95 and 97. At least Main Street in Greenwood is known as Main Street, but I do hope some sign is put up acknowledging the existance of a city of over 55,000 in northern Johnson County.

    Speaking of shifting road signs I was on I-74 heading to Brownsburg last week when I passed Exit 68 which is signed for the Ronald Reagan Parkway. I remember that when this exit was first built it was signed for Ronald Reagan Parkway and then later on they changed it for Clermont and Bronwsburg. And now it's back to Ronald Reagan Parkway.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: I-55 on August 14, 2022, 06:34:10 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 13, 2022, 10:38:44 PM
    Quote from: I-55 on August 13, 2022, 07:52:07 PM
    Quote from: hobsini2 on August 13, 2022, 02:37:14 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 11, 2022, 03:53:16 PM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on August 11, 2022, 02:11:51 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 11, 2022, 01:30:00 PM
    i find that when signs are refaced, they always have these weird massive gaps.  :-D not sure why, maybe they aren't following the plans?

    The worst I've seen is on I-469.  It was forgivable when they removed US 24 from the sign and it left extra space.  It is not forgivable that the refacing job moved the I-69 shield even further up on the sign away from other legend.  (This is a clear example of where new sign panels are really called for.)
    https://goo.gl/maps/8L7MUb4AbtAEbQYG8

    this one would make you angrier  :-D https://www.google.com/maps/@40.992372,-85.2681015,3a,15y,113.62h,99.54t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s0IInfY-N0FLEgM2NBGiHIw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

    i did notice this sign is wrong: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.9568315,-85.2942839,3a,75y,31.33h,85.67t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sdN3OjEcD4bGsIJyl27ISYQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 US 24 doesn't travel down here anymore.

    PurdueBill, it would have been better if INDOT had centered the 69 shield.
    Silverback, I think that greenspace may be for if and when they move US 27 onto I-69 instead of going through Ft Wayne.

    If US 27 ever got removed thru FW it would probably just be truncated to 469. INDOT would love to hand over 27 to Fort Wayne but the city can't afford to maintain it right now and hasn't assumed control.

    27 will never do that. they would just end it at 469.

    If INDOT turns 27 over to the city it would be decommissioned wherever INDOT surrenders maintenance responsibilities.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 14, 2022, 06:40:54 PM
    A couple of local notes to bring to attention:

    The ramp connecting Ridge Road to I-65 south will close starting this week, lasting through September. This will be on top of the other Ridge Road closures already in place, as well as inaccessibility from 61st Avenue in both directions. The detour, believe it or not, requires drivers to drive south on Broadway all the way to US 231 to access I-65 southbound.

    The City of Hobart is planning to convert the Canadian National railroad crossing at Colorado Street - near 69th Avenue - into an overpass. This will require a complete closure of the road, likely to start before the end of the year and lasting 12-18 months. The plan is to shift the road 75 feet to the west to tie it into the recently completed roundabout at 69th Avenue, while providing a multi-use lane on top of the two driving lanes. The railroad crossing is known to cause massive backups due to high train traffic, including the high likelihood of stopped trains due to switching into the nearby siding. This will be a massive step toward alleviating that.

    When completed, this will be the second major road in the Merrillville-Hobart area to have a bridge over the CN railroad, providing easy travel between US 30 and 61st Avenue and a viable alternative to I-65 and Indiana 51 for local commuting. The current overpass carrying Mississippi Street was opened in 2004. During the closure, that overpass, along with 61st and 69th Avenue, will serve as the detour route once the closure starts.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on August 14, 2022, 06:51:27 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 14, 2022, 06:40:54 PM
    A couple of local notes to bring to attention:

    The ramp connecting Ridge Road to I-65 south will close starting this week, lasting through September. This will be on top of the other Ridge Road closures already in place, as well as inaccessibility from 61st Avenue in both directions. The detour, believe it or not, requires drivers to drive south on Broadway all the way to US 231 to access I-65 southbound.

    The City of Hobart is planning to convert the Canadian National railroad crossing at Colorado Street - near 69th Avenue - into an overpass. This will require a complete closure of the road, likely to start before the end of the year and lasting 12-18 months. The plan is to shift the road 75 feet to the west to tie it into the recently completed roundabout at 69th Avenue, while providing a multi-use lane on top of the two driving lanes. The railroad crossing is known to cause massive backups due to high train traffic, including the high likelihood of stopped trains due to switching into the nearby siding. This will be a massive step toward alleviating that.

    When completed, this will be the second major road in the Merrillville-Hobart area to have a bridge over the CN railroad, providing easy travel between US 30 and 61st Avenue and a viable alternative to I-65 and Indiana 51 for local commuting. The current overpass carrying Mississippi Street was opened in 2004. During the closure, that overpass, along with 61st and 69th Avenue, will serve as the detour route once the closure starts.

    what are they doing to the ridge road ramp?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 14, 2022, 07:50:29 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 14, 2022, 06:51:27 PMwhat are they doing to the ridge road ramp?

    Concrete restoration work. Same thing they're doing to the mainline, along with restoration of the barrier separating the Ridge Road C/D ramps from I-65.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: pianocello on August 15, 2022, 07:19:29 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 14, 2022, 06:40:54 PM
    The ramp connecting Ridge Road to I-65 south will close starting this week, lasting through September. This will be on top of the other Ridge Road closures already in place, as well as inaccessibility from 61st Avenue in both directions. The detour, believe it or not, requires drivers to drive south on Broadway all the way to US 231 to access I-65 southbound.

    I get that INDOT made this detour because they don't want to "officially" add more traffic onto US 30, but that's what's going to end up happening. Brace yourselves, this one's gonna be a mess while those two on-ramps are closed.

    People could go from Ridge Rd up to I-80/94, but during certain parts of the day that's not much better.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 18, 2022, 09:05:07 AM
    https://www.lakeshorepublicradio.org/2022-08-11/latest-raise-grants-include-17-million-for-ridge-road-complete-streets-project

    So this project doesn't involve a state highway, but I thought I'd note it here anyway. Munster received a $17 million RAISE grant to complete a complete redesign of Ridge road from Columbia Ave west to the state line.

    Ridge Road is the main east-west thoroughfare through Munster, and carried US before it was rerouted onto I-80/94. It is currently a four lane main arterial with a continuous left turn lane. Ridge Road is the source of a high number of traffic accidents.

    The project will reduce the road to a two lane road with a median and intermittent left turn lanes, adding bike lanes, wider sidewalks and outdoor seating areas for restaurants.

    This project coincides with the Westlake extension of the South Shore passenger rail line, which will have a station at Ridge/Manor. The goal is to create a walkable district surrounding the station for both the residents of the higher-density residential area and also those commuting to/from the South Shore Station.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on August 18, 2022, 09:12:35 AM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on August 18, 2022, 09:05:07 AM
    https://www.lakeshorepublicradio.org/2022-08-11/latest-raise-grants-include-17-million-for-ridge-road-complete-streets-project

    So this project doesn't involve a state highway, but I thought I'd note it here anyway. Munster received a $17 million RAISE grant to complete a complete redesign of Ridge road from Columbia Ave west to the state line.

    Ridge Road is the main east-west thoroughfare through Munster, and carried US before it was rerouted onto I-80/94. It is currently a four lane main arterial with a continuous left turn lane. Ridge Road is the source of a high number of traffic accidents.

    The project will reduce the road to a two lane road with a median and intermittent left turn lanes, adding bike lanes, wider sidewalks and outdoor seating areas for restaurants.

    This project coincides with the Westlake extension of the South Shore passenger rail line, which will have a station at Ridge/Manor. The goal is to create a walkable district surrounding the station for both the residents of the higher-density residential area and also those commuting to/from the South Shore Station.

    very cool. that will make the corridor much nicer for the area.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 21, 2022, 11:56:23 AM
    Major Heads Up:

    For the next few weeks up to the end of September, ALL entrances to I-65 southbound between US 12/20 and US 30 will be closed, the exceptions being the entrances from I-90 and I-80/94.

    This is done in an effort to lighten traffic counts in advance of the current work zone between I-80/94 and US 30. When the project advances far enough to realign southbound traffic to the original lane configuration, the ramps will reopen.

    The detour, as stated above, asks from traffic to use Indiana 53 (Broadway) from US 12/20 to US 231. If you're a local and not a trucker, there are MUCH better alternatives (Indiana 51 to I-80/94 west, for example).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: US 41 on August 21, 2022, 12:49:00 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on July 20, 2022, 11:21:27 PM
    https://www.tribstar.com/news/local_news/indot-presents-plans-for-north-clinton-street-redo/article_f40e61db-0906-59e5-b3cd-fb26f13d8e90.html

    https://www.in.gov/indot/files/Des-1500146-US-41-Design-Plans.pdf

    Here's a plan sheet on the bridge removal on Clinton Street (OLD US 41) north of Terre Haute. J-Turns will be installed at the intersection with Quinn Avenue, and RIRO will be on NB US 41.

    https://www.google.com/maps/@39.5688543,-87.3707612,3a,75y,52.13h,90t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1scxJe0rSx0G2BASwJ8pvnSA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

    Thanks for sharing. I live only a few miles from there and was wondering what they were going to do. I'm just glad it won't involve a stop light. I'd prefer that they just rebuild the bridge, stick a caution light up at Evans, and maybe lower the speed limit to 40 or 45 through there, but it is what it is.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on September 06, 2022, 01:16:43 AM

    There was a tragic incident Saturday, September 3, 2022, on State Road 32 in Hamilton County near Noblesville where a bridge replacement project was underway. It happened just after midnight when a car, apparently traveling at a high rate of speed, plowed through a "road closed" sign that blocked the road. It then went airborne where the bridge over Stony Creek had been removed and crashed into the western abutment. A man and his four-year-old son died.

    https://www.wrtv.com/news/public-safety/father-4-year-old-son-die-in-fiery-crash-after-plummeting-into-creek-in-hamilton-county
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on September 12, 2022, 11:05:24 PM
    SR 37 in Fishers - new interchanges open: https://www.wishtv.com/news/local-news/fishers-celebrates-opening-of-146th-and-131st-street-interchanges/
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 13, 2022, 07:19:18 AM
    I drove US 20 east of Elkhart for the first time in a long time Sunday. It was previously widened to 4 lanes from CR 17 to SR 15. It's now being widened from SR 15 to CR 35. Grading work looks to be nearly complete. According to INDOT's website https://www.in.gov/indot/about-indot/central-office/welcome-to-the-fort-wayne-district/us-20-added-travel-lanes-in-elkhart-county/, construction should be fully complete in 2024.

    This is helpful as US 20 sees a lot of shunpiking truck traffic.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on September 13, 2022, 08:21:19 AM
    Quote from: monty on September 12, 2022, 11:05:24 PM
    SR 37 in Fishers - new interchanges open: https://www.wishtv.com/news/local-news/fishers-celebrates-opening-of-146th-and-131st-street-interchanges/

    and the project is done for now. 1 signal will remain at 141st for the foreseeable future.  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: cjw2001 on September 16, 2022, 03:30:46 PM
    Just discovered that the state of Indiana has reconfigured the merge from the I 465 ramps to US 31 on the north side of Indianapolis to have two dedicated lanes from the I 465 ramps onto US 31.   Traffic from Meridian street now has to merge down to a single lane to make room for the new configuration.    This should help with the daily backups of traffic on these ramps (not to mention the semi truck that maliciously tried to run me over under the old configuration when merging last week).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on September 17, 2022, 12:06:57 PM
    Quote from: cjw2001 on September 16, 2022, 03:30:46 PM
    Just discovered that the state of Indiana has reconfigured the merge from the I 465 ramps to US 31 on the north side of Indianapolis to have two dedicated lanes from the I 465 ramps onto US 31.   Traffic from Meridian street now has to merge down to a single lane to make room for the new configuration.    This should help with the daily backups of traffic on these ramps (not to mention the semi truck that maliciously tried to run me over under the old configuration when merging last week).

    This is wonderful! that was a horrible merge!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on September 17, 2022, 08:52:54 PM
    That's a good move! Wish INDOT could also allow two lanes from SB US 31 to WB I465 for the same reason. But 465 probably doesn't have the capacity to accept them yet.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on September 18, 2022, 05:30:50 PM
    It looks like INDOT has released some design plans for redoing the Michigan Avenue bridge and the interchange on the south side of IN 912.

    https://www.in.gov/indot/files/3_CE4_1703011_released_PIPLANS.pdf
    https://www.in.gov/indot/files/2_CE4_1703011_released_PI_GRAPHICS.pdf

    At or around the same time, they are going to replace the pavement on the ramps and a section of the mainline. The exit from SR 912 eastbound to Michigan Avenue (Ramp 4A) will close for good, and they are going to remove the pavement.
    https://www.in.gov/indot/files/CE1_1800067_released_PI2of3_App_B_plans.pdf
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on September 18, 2022, 07:24:31 PM
    Quote from: monty on September 17, 2022, 08:52:54 PM
    That's a good move! Wish INDOT could also allow two lanes from SB US 31 to WB I465 for the same reason. But 465 probably doesn't have the capacity to accept them yet.

    i'm sure they'll do something like that in the future. aren't they redoing 465 on that side of town eventually? i remember seeing something in the news about a public meeting for something on 465 over there.  :hmmm:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: cjw2001 on September 18, 2022, 08:48:02 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on September 18, 2022, 07:24:31 PM
    Quote from: monty on September 17, 2022, 08:52:54 PM
    That's a good move! Wish INDOT could also allow two lanes from SB US 31 to WB I465 for the same reason. But 465 probably doesn't have the capacity to accept them yet.

    i'm sure they'll do something like that in the future. aren't they redoing 465 on that side of town eventually? i remember seeing something in the news about a public meeting for something on 465 over there.  :hmmm:

    see https://www.in.gov/indot/projects/home/i-465-northwest-improvements-project/
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on September 18, 2022, 08:52:09 PM
    ah yes that's it! maybe they'll fix it as part of that job.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on September 19, 2022, 05:32:44 PM
    I don't think this has been mentioned yet on here but I found out about this over the weekend.

    https://i65safetyandefficiency.com/

    I hate the name of this project, but it sounds pretty cool nonetheless. It's the widening of I-65 between the South Split and I-465 in Indianapolis. The project calls for an extra lane to be added on the inside shoulder of the highway along with some bridge work on a few of the overpasses/underpasses.

    I'm guessing the four lanes will split evenly at the South Split with two lanes to I-65 north and two to I-70 west. Likewise the two lanes coming from the north and the west will come together to form the four lanes southbound. The on ramp from Morris Street heading south can be an auxiliary lane to Raymond St. With plans to widen the bridge over Pleasant Run I would guess that to be the plan. At the south end I'm guessing the rightmost of the four lanes will exit off onto I-465.

    The project will sadly probably eliminate an inside shoulder that's well-used by state troopers between Raymond and Keystone. It will also probably be the end of some of the only remaining button-copy signage left in the city.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 19, 2022, 07:25:03 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on September 19, 2022, 05:32:44 PM
    I don't think this has been mentioned yet on here but I found out about this over the weekend.

    https://i65safetyandefficiency.com/

    I hate the name of this project, but it sounds pretty cool nonetheless. It's the widening of I-65 between the South Split and I-465 in Indianapolis. The project calls for an extra lane to be added on the inside shoulder of the highway along with some bridge work on a few of the overpasses/underpasses.

    I'm guessing the four lanes will split evenly at the South Split with two lanes to I-65 north and two to I-70 west. Likewise the two lanes coming from the north and the west will come together to form the four lanes southbound. The on ramp from Morris Street heading south can be an auxiliary lane to Raymond St. With plans to widen the bridge over Pleasant Run I would guess that to be the plan. At the south end I'm guessing the rightmost of the four lanes will exit off onto I-465.

    The project will sadly probably eliminate an inside shoulder that's well-used by state troopers between Raymond and Keystone. It will also probably be the end of some of the only remaining button-copy signage left in the city.

    I don't recall ever being on this segment of I-65 during rush hour, so I wouldn't know how badly that extra lane is needed.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on September 19, 2022, 08:22:37 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on September 19, 2022, 05:32:44 PM
    I don't think this has been mentioned yet on here but I found out about this over the weekend.

    https://i65safetyandefficiency.com/

    I hate the name of this project, but it sounds pretty cool nonetheless. It's the widening of I-65 between the South Split and I-465 in Indianapolis. The project calls for an extra lane to be added on the inside shoulder of the highway along with some bridge work on a few of the overpasses/underpasses.

    I'm guessing the four lanes will split evenly at the South Split with two lanes to I-65 north and two to I-70 west. Likewise the two lanes coming from the north and the west will come together to form the four lanes southbound. The on ramp from Morris Street heading south can be an auxiliary lane to Raymond St. With plans to widen the bridge over Pleasant Run I would guess that to be the plan. At the south end I'm guessing the rightmost of the four lanes will exit off onto I-465.

    The project will sadly probably eliminate an inside shoulder that's well-used by state troopers between Raymond and Keystone. It will also probably be the end of some of the only remaining button-copy signage left in the city.

    ya that is a terrible name  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on September 19, 2022, 10:47:01 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on September 19, 2022, 05:32:44 PM
    I don't think this has been mentioned yet on here but I found out about this over the weekend.

    https://i65safetyandefficiency.com/

    I hate the name of this project, but it sounds pretty cool nonetheless. It's the widening of I-65 between the South Split and I-465 in Indianapolis. The project calls for an extra lane to be added on the inside shoulder of the highway along with some bridge work on a few of the overpasses/underpasses.

    I'm guessing the four lanes will split evenly at the South Split with two lanes to I-65 north and two to I-70 west. Likewise the two lanes coming from the north and the west will come together to form the four lanes southbound. The on ramp from Morris Street heading south can be an auxiliary lane to Raymond St. With plans to widen the bridge over Pleasant Run I would guess that to be the plan. At the south end I'm guessing the rightmost of the four lanes will exit off onto I-465.

    The project will sadly probably eliminate an inside shoulder that's well-used by state troopers between Raymond and Keystone. It will also probably be the end of some of the only remaining button-copy signage left in the city.

    Saying the name of this specific project is really hard for me to comprehend since I will call this the "I-65 widening project between the I-465 interchange and the South Split interchange".
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: sbeaver44 on September 20, 2022, 12:08:52 AM
    Indiana Toll Road exit from US 131 has no functional overhead EZPass reader, so you have to hand your EZPass to the attendant.

    Yesterday, at the I-90 State Line tolls into Chicago, lots of EZPass or gate malfunctions caused a huge backup.

    I'm from PA – is this normal?  I see on the Google Maps reviews of the Westpoint booth it seems to be a recurring problem.

    What's going on with the Toll Road?

    Also, ORT would be pretty cool at a mainline plaza...
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ilpt4u on September 20, 2022, 12:17:21 AM
    Quote from: sbeaver44 on September 20, 2022, 12:08:52 AM
    Indiana Toll Road exit from US 131 has no functional overhead EZPass reader, so you have to hand your EZPass to the attendant.

    Yesterday, at the I-90 State Line tolls into Chicago, lots of EZPass or gate malfunctions caused a huge backup.

    I'm from PA – is this normal?  I see on the Google Maps reviews of the Westpoint booth it seems to be a recurring problem.

    What's going on with the Toll Road?

    Also, ORT would be pretty cool at a mainline plaza...
    Wonder how that one works if you have the License Plate Mounted EZPass/I-Pass?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Rothman on September 20, 2022, 07:01:31 AM
    Quote from: sbeaver44 on September 20, 2022, 12:08:52 AM
    Indiana Toll Road exit from US 131 has no functional overhead EZPass reader, so you have to hand your EZPass to the attendant.

    Yesterday, at the I-90 State Line tolls into Chicago, lots of EZPass or gate malfunctions caused a huge backup.

    I'm from PA – is this normal?  I see on the Google Maps reviews of the Westpoint booth it seems to be a recurring problem.

    What's going on with the Toll Road?

    Also, ORT would be pretty cool at a mainline plaza...
    Sounds like what happens when a state turns over a toll facility to a private operator:  The private business milks it for profit and keeps their expenses to a minimum to the detriment of the traveling public.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: FixThe74Sign on September 20, 2022, 04:14:07 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on September 19, 2022, 07:25:03 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on September 19, 2022, 05:32:44 PM
    I don't think this has been mentioned yet on here but I found out about this over the weekend.

    https://i65safetyandefficiency.com/

    I hate the name of this project, but it sounds pretty cool nonetheless. It's the widening of I-65 between the South Split and I-465 in Indianapolis. The project calls for an extra lane to be added on the inside shoulder of the highway along with some bridge work on a few of the overpasses/underpasses.

    I'm guessing the four lanes will split evenly at the South Split with two lanes to I-65 north and two to I-70 west. Likewise the two lanes coming from the north and the west will come together to form the four lanes southbound. The on ramp from Morris Street heading south can be an auxiliary lane to Raymond St. With plans to widen the bridge over Pleasant Run I would guess that to be the plan. At the south end I'm guessing the rightmost of the four lanes will exit off onto I-465.

    The project will sadly probably eliminate an inside shoulder that's well-used by state troopers between Raymond and Keystone. It will also probably be the end of some of the only remaining button-copy signage left in the city.

    I don't recall ever being on this segment of I-65 during rush hour, so I wouldn't know how badly that extra lane is needed.

    That name is awful, but if they called it something like "65 widening project" the anti-highway people (aka RETHINK) will jump all over this...but I think they will anyway.

    Before the North Split project, northbound 65 would backup before the South Split during the morning rush, but mainly due to people jockeying to get into the correct lane before the split.

    Personally, I would have 3 right lanes split off to 65 with the right most lane turning into the Washington St off ramp and the 2 left lanes continue onto 70 west. Also, I would add PROPER signage indicating the 2nd to left lane will go both ways. Currently, unsuspecting drivers do not know the middle lane will take them both directions until they are at the gore point. Also, signage to indicate the Meridian St exit at the South Split would also be nice.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on September 20, 2022, 04:16:47 PM
    Quote from: FixThe74Sign on September 20, 2022, 04:14:07 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on September 19, 2022, 07:25:03 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on September 19, 2022, 05:32:44 PM
    I don't think this has been mentioned yet on here but I found out about this over the weekend.

    https://i65safetyandefficiency.com/

    I hate the name of this project, but it sounds pretty cool nonetheless. It's the widening of I-65 between the South Split and I-465 in Indianapolis. The project calls for an extra lane to be added on the inside shoulder of the highway along with some bridge work on a few of the overpasses/underpasses.

    I'm guessing the four lanes will split evenly at the South Split with two lanes to I-65 north and two to I-70 west. Likewise the two lanes coming from the north and the west will come together to form the four lanes southbound. The on ramp from Morris Street heading south can be an auxiliary lane to Raymond St. With plans to widen the bridge over Pleasant Run I would guess that to be the plan. At the south end I'm guessing the rightmost of the four lanes will exit off onto I-465.

    The project will sadly probably eliminate an inside shoulder that's well-used by state troopers between Raymond and Keystone. It will also probably be the end of some of the only remaining button-copy signage left in the city.

    I don't recall ever being on this segment of I-65 during rush hour, so I wouldn't know how badly that extra lane is needed.

    That name is awful, but if they called it something like "65 widening project" the anti-highway people (aka RETHINK) will jump all over this...but I think they will anyway.

    Before the North Split project, northbound 65 would backup before the South Split during the morning rush, but mainly due to people jockeying to get into the correct lane before the split.

    Personally, I would have 3 right lanes split off to 65 with the right most lane turning into the Washington St off ramp and the 2 left lanes continue onto 70 west. Also, I would add PROPER signage indicating the 2nd to left lane will go both ways. Currently, unsuspecting drivers do not know the middle lane will take them both directions until they are at the gore point. Also, signage to indicate the Meridian St exit at the South Split would also be nice.

    i'm not sure why they changed the name of that exit from mccarty to meridian. that road the highway dumps you onto is madison ave. maybe theyll put up new signs. the signs at the split are very old.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: FixThe74Sign on September 20, 2022, 04:56:39 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on September 20, 2022, 04:16:47 PM



    i'm not sure why they changed the name of that exit from mccarty to meridian. that road the highway dumps you onto is madison ave. maybe theyll put up new signs. the signs at the split are very old.

    That was done before the Superbowl. The link of thinking was Meridian St was one of the most important streets in the city and wanted to make it easy for people to find it.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JoePCool14 on September 20, 2022, 06:45:02 PM
    Quote from: Rothman on September 20, 2022, 07:01:31 AM
    Quote from: sbeaver44 on September 20, 2022, 12:08:52 AM
    Indiana Toll Road exit from US 131 has no functional overhead EZPass reader, so you have to hand your EZPass to the attendant.

    Yesterday, at the I-90 State Line tolls into Chicago, lots of EZPass or gate malfunctions caused a huge backup.

    I'm from PA – is this normal?  I see on the Google Maps reviews of the Westpoint booth it seems to be a recurring problem.

    What's going on with the Toll Road?

    Also, ORT would be pretty cool at a mainline plaza...
    Sounds like what happens when a state turns over a toll facility to a private operator:  The private business milks it for profit and keeps their expenses to a minimum to the detriment of the traveling public.

    At some point though, it sure would be nice for the state to step in and mandate updates somehow. I was on the ITR and Skyway for the first time in years a few weekends ago, and it's antiquated how the system is run. It's not even like a 15 MPH but keep moving thing. You have to completely stop and wait for a gate. It's less safe and more inefficient.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on September 21, 2022, 12:08:48 PM
    Quote from: sbeaver44 on September 20, 2022, 12:08:52 AM
    Indiana Toll Road exit from US 131 has no functional overhead EZPass reader, so you have to hand your EZPass to the attendant.

    Yesterday, at the I-90 State Line tolls into Chicago, lots of EZPass or gate malfunctions caused a huge backup.

    I'm from PA – is this normal?  I see on the Google Maps reviews of the Westpoint booth it seems to be a recurring problem.

    What's going on with the Toll Road?

    Also, ORT would be pretty cool at a mainline plaza...

    In 2011, at yes, US 131/SR 13, getting back on they had an attendant out handing out tickets because "the E-ZPass reader isn't working".  Of course, sitting in line and paying instead of using E-ZPass later, and then getting dinged for a toll from the Ohio line to the Skyway because it still read it exiting despite hiding it and their assurances that it would not read, and fighting for months with MassPike (my E-ZPass provider) to get it credited....yep, it's nothing new--that very exit has had problems before.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on September 21, 2022, 12:11:02 PM
    ooo looks like the mods pinned this thread! good idea.  :clap:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: cjw2001 on September 21, 2022, 07:10:46 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on September 17, 2022, 12:06:57 PM
    Quote from: cjw2001 on September 16, 2022, 03:30:46 PM
    Just discovered that the state of Indiana has reconfigured the merge from the I 465 ramps to US 31 on the north side of Indianapolis to have two dedicated lanes from the I 465 ramps onto US 31.   Traffic from Meridian street now has to merge down to a single lane to make room for the new configuration.    This should help with the daily backups of traffic on these ramps (not to mention the semi truck that maliciously tried to run me over under the old configuration when merging last week).

    This is wonderful! that was a horrible merge!
    Drove through this interchange today on the way home from Costco.   It is soooooo nice to be able to get onto US 31 without the stress of having to merge with the opposing I465 ramp beforehand.  Traffic is flowing smoothly with the new configuration.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on September 22, 2022, 01:30:59 PM
    Quote from: cjw2001 on September 21, 2022, 07:10:46 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on September 17, 2022, 12:06:57 PM
    Quote from: cjw2001 on September 16, 2022, 03:30:46 PM
    Just discovered that the state of Indiana has reconfigured the merge from the I 465 ramps to US 31 on the north side of Indianapolis to have two dedicated lanes from the I 465 ramps onto US 31.   Traffic from Meridian street now has to merge down to a single lane to make room for the new configuration.    This should help with the daily backups of traffic on these ramps (not to mention the semi truck that maliciously tried to run me over under the old configuration when merging last week).

    This is wonderful! that was a horrible merge!
    Drove through this interchange today on the way home from Costco.   It is soooooo nice to be able to get onto US 31 without the stress of having to merge with the opposing I465 ramp beforehand.  Traffic is flowing smoothly with the new configuration.

    :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SSR_317 on September 24, 2022, 12:03:49 PM
    Quote from: FixThe74Sign on September 20, 2022, 04:56:39 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on September 20, 2022, 04:16:47 PM



    i'm not sure why they changed the name of that exit from mccarty to meridian. that road the highway dumps you onto is madison ave. maybe theyll put up new signs. the signs at the split are very old.

    That was done before the Superbowl. The link of thinking was Meridian St was one of the most important streets in the city and wanted to make it easy for people to find it.
    Well if you head north far enough on Madison Ave it becomes Meridian St (at South St). McCarty St was and is the first E-W intersection at the north terminus of the ramp, with Madison Ave being the through (NB) movement there.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on September 24, 2022, 12:14:41 PM
    Quote from: SSR_317 on September 24, 2022, 12:03:49 PM
    Quote from: FixThe74Sign on September 20, 2022, 04:56:39 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on September 20, 2022, 04:16:47 PM



    i'm not sure why they changed the name of that exit from mccarty to meridian. that road the highway dumps you onto is madison ave. maybe theyll put up new signs. the signs at the split are very old.

    That was done before the Superbowl. The link of thinking was Meridian St was one of the most important streets in the city and wanted to make it easy for people to find it.
    Well if you head north far enough on Madison Ave it becomes Meridian St (at South St). McCarty St was and is the first E-W intersection at the north terminus of the ramp, with Madison Ave being the through (NB) movement there.

    The best way to sign this would be

    MADISON AVE

    TO MERIDIAN ST
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on October 24, 2022, 11:04:25 PM
    https://fox59.com/video/indot-looking-for-community-feedback-to-help-address-improvements-along-parts-of-i-465/8100675/

    https://cbs4indy.com/indiana-news/indot-seeks-community-input-for-i-465-improvements/

    INDOT is seeking community feedback on a section of I-465 between 86th Street (Exit 23) and US 31/Meridian Street (Exit 31).

    Oh, and here is the presentation from the meeting:
    https://www.in.gov/indot/projects/files/20221013-I-465_CAC-Meeting-Presentation.pdf

    Construction is not expected to begin until 2024.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on October 25, 2022, 08:09:35 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on October 24, 2022, 11:04:25 PM
    https://fox59.com/video/indot-looking-for-community-feedback-to-help-address-improvements-along-parts-of-i-465/8100675/

    https://cbs4indy.com/indiana-news/indot-seeks-community-input-for-i-465-improvements/

    INDOT is seeking community feedback on a section of I-465 between 86th Street (Exit 23) and US 31/Meridian Street (Exit 31).

    Oh, and here is the presentation from the meeting:
    https://www.in.gov/indot/projects/files/20221013-I-465_CAC-Meeting-Presentation.pdf

    Construction is not expected to begin until 2024.

    So happy to see this happen  :clap: hate this stretch of 465  :banghead: smashed my car on this stretch and nearly lost a loved one. very dangerous! I also see they aren't signing US 52 at the 865 interchange  :-/
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on October 25, 2022, 05:24:27 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on October 25, 2022, 08:09:35 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on October 24, 2022, 11:04:25 PM
    https://fox59.com/video/indot-looking-for-community-feedback-to-help-address-improvements-along-parts-of-i-465/8100675/

    https://cbs4indy.com/indiana-news/indot-seeks-community-input-for-i-465-improvements/

    INDOT is seeking community feedback on a section of I-465 between 86th Street (Exit 23) and US 31/Meridian Street (Exit 31).

    Oh, and here is the presentation from the meeting:
    https://www.in.gov/indot/projects/files/20221013-I-465_CAC-Meeting-Presentation.pdf

    Construction is not expected to begin until 2024.

    So happy to see this happen  :clap: hate this stretch of 465  :banghead: smashed my car on this stretch and nearly lost a loved one. very dangerous! I also see they aren't signing US 52 at the 865 interchange  :-/

    US 52 isn't signed at the 865 interchange currently. Hell, getting on at Brookville Rd on the south side currently there's no mention of where to take US 52 once you get onto I-465.

    Otherwise, I love this project. This is a stretch of road that seriously needs some love and it looks like INDOT is doing this one properly. it seems that the US 31 interchange is going to be configured in a way similar to the current plans for the I-465/I-69 interchange a few miles to the east. It appears that access to 106th Street will be via the Meridian Street ramp with US 31 north traffic bypassing that exit altogether, similar to 82nd Street being "bypassed" by the new 465 to 69 movements in the Clearpath project.

    Also of notice to me, US 31 will just get the control city of Kokomo, removing Westfield. Although I would still prefer South Bend I'm fine with Kokomo. What I didn't care too much for was including Westfield when you miss the much larger Carmel. Hopefully both Carmel and Westfield will get supplemental signage, possibly a mention for both Exits 31 and 33.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: cjw2001 on October 25, 2022, 05:55:19 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on October 25, 2022, 05:24:27 PM
    Also of notice to me, US 31 will just get the control city of Kokomo, removing Westfield. Although I would still prefer South Bend I'm fine with Kokomo. What I didn't care too much for was including Westfield when you miss the much larger Carmel. Hopefully both Carmel and Westfield will get supplemental signage, possibly a mention for both Exits 31 and 33.
    Carmel would not be appropriate as a control city for the exit as you are already in Carmel.  Control cities would be a destination further down the road not the city you are already in.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on October 25, 2022, 07:48:58 PM
    so the only non 8 lane section of 465 will be the SE side of town. I think INDOT will do that when they get the money. in the mean time that stretch will get indiana's 1st set of ramp meters and variable speed limits. the meters should help but we all know noone follows the speed limit on 465  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on October 26, 2022, 06:55:41 PM
    If memory serves correct, some of that SE I465 quadrant was initially the only four lane part of the original build. I think it was between I74 and the curve back west on the south side.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on October 26, 2022, 07:37:00 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on October 25, 2022, 07:48:58 PM
    so the only non 8 lane section of 465 will be the SE side of town. I think INDOT will do that when they get the money. in the mean time that stretch will get indiana's 1st set of ramp meters and variable speed limits. the meters should help but we all know noone follows the speed limit on 465  :-D

    Keep the North Split closed forever, that will keep traffic along that stretch below the speed limit.

    However, I thought the ramp metering and stuff was supposed to be done this year. It's also interesting that before the North Split project there were plans for temporary meters at Mann Rd and Kentucky Ave and even a couple of planned ramp closures along I-465 for the duration of the project. Interestingly none of that was ever done.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on October 27, 2022, 08:08:38 AM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on October 26, 2022, 07:37:00 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on October 25, 2022, 07:48:58 PM
    so the only non 8 lane section of 465 will be the SE side of town. I think INDOT will do that when they get the money. in the mean time that stretch will get indiana's 1st set of ramp meters and variable speed limits. the meters should help but we all know noone follows the speed limit on 465  :-D

    Keep the North Split closed forever, that will keep traffic along that stretch below the speed limit.

    However, I thought the ramp metering and stuff was supposed to be done this year. It's also interesting that before the North Split project there were plans for temporary meters at Mann Rd and Kentucky Ave and even a couple of planned ramp closures along I-465 for the duration of the project. Interestingly none of that was ever done.

    Ya I remember they said 36/67 to 465 sb would close and 31nb to 465/74 wb would close. never happened. and it's supposed to happen according to that presentation they had. they still have 2 months to do it!  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: westerninterloper on October 27, 2022, 06:30:15 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on October 26, 2022, 07:37:00 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on October 25, 2022, 07:48:58 PM
    so the only non 8 lane section of 465 will be the SE side of town. I think INDOT will do that when they get the money. in the mean time that stretch will get indiana's 1st set of ramp meters and variable speed limits. the meters should help but we all know noone follows the speed limit on 465  :-D

    Keep the North Split closed forever, that will keep traffic along that stretch below the speed limit.

    However, I thought the ramp metering and stuff was supposed to be done this year. It's also interesting that before the North Split project there were plans for temporary meters at Mann Rd and Kentucky Ave and even a couple of planned ramp closures along I-465 for the duration of the project. Interestingly none of that was ever done.

    I'd make the incoming downtown interstates boulevards and reroute through traffic around 465.

    Cut off I-70 eastbound at West Street;
    Cut off I-65 northbound after Raymond;
    Cut off I-70 westbound after Hillside; and
    Cut off I-65 South at West Street.

    Essentially, make a downtown loop of boulevards like West Street within the footprint of the interstate inner loop, and restore the street grid on the leftover land.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on October 27, 2022, 07:48:37 PM
    Quote from: westerninterloper on October 27, 2022, 06:30:15 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on October 26, 2022, 07:37:00 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on October 25, 2022, 07:48:58 PM
    so the only non 8 lane section of 465 will be the SE side of town. I think INDOT will do that when they get the money. in the mean time that stretch will get indiana's 1st set of ramp meters and variable speed limits. the meters should help but we all know noone follows the speed limit on 465  :-D

    Keep the North Split closed forever, that will keep traffic along that stretch below the speed limit.

    However, I thought the ramp metering and stuff was supposed to be done this year. It's also interesting that before the North Split project there were plans for temporary meters at Mann Rd and Kentucky Ave and even a couple of planned ramp closures along I-465 for the duration of the project. Interestingly none of that was ever done.

    I'd make the incoming downtown interstates boulevards and reroute through traffic around 465.

    Cut off I-70 eastbound at West Street;
    Cut off I-65 northbound after Raymond;
    Cut off I-70 westbound after Hillside; and
    Cut off I-65 South at West Street.

    Essentially, make a downtown loop of boulevards like West Street within the footprint of the interstate inner loop, and restore the street grid on the leftover land.

    We can already see that this is a very bad idea.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JoePCool14 on October 28, 2022, 08:43:38 AM
    Quote from: westerninterloper on October 27, 2022, 06:30:15 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on October 26, 2022, 07:37:00 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on October 25, 2022, 07:48:58 PM
    so the only non 8 lane section of 465 will be the SE side of town. I think INDOT will do that when they get the money. in the mean time that stretch will get indiana's 1st set of ramp meters and variable speed limits. the meters should help but we all know noone follows the speed limit on 465  :-D

    Keep the North Split closed forever, that will keep traffic along that stretch below the speed limit.

    However, I thought the ramp metering and stuff was supposed to be done this year. It's also interesting that before the North Split project there were plans for temporary meters at Mann Rd and Kentucky Ave and even a couple of planned ramp closures along I-465 for the duration of the project. Interestingly none of that was ever done.

    I'd make the incoming downtown interstates boulevards and reroute through traffic around 465.

    Cut off I-70 eastbound at West Street;
    Cut off I-65 northbound after Raymond;
    Cut off I-70 westbound after Hillside; and
    Cut off I-65 South at West Street.

    Essentially, make a downtown loop of boulevards like West Street within the footprint of the interstate inner loop, and restore the street grid on the leftover land.

    That's some urbanist thinking right there. No thank you.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on October 28, 2022, 09:26:34 AM
    I do support them cleaning up the south leg. the roads could be connected better down there. A cap would be nice in the south split area and you could add shops and a few x-streets. win win but alas, money is the limiting factor. one can dream!  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 28, 2022, 09:36:25 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on October 28, 2022, 09:26:34 AM
    I do support them cleaning up the south leg. the roads could be connected better down there. A cap would be nice in the south split area and you could add shops and a few x-streets. win win but alas, money is the limiting factor. one can dream!  :-D

    I don't know if anybody else watches a show called "Good Bones," but it's an Indy based show where a mother and daughter team flip houses. They started in Fountain Square but they've moved onto Bates-Hendricks and Old Southside so it seems that those neighborhoods are trending upwards and could benefit from better connection to downtown.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on October 28, 2022, 09:38:50 AM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on October 28, 2022, 09:36:25 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on October 28, 2022, 09:26:34 AM
    I do support them cleaning up the south leg. the roads could be connected better down there. A cap would be nice in the south split area and you could add shops and a few x-streets. win win but alas, money is the limiting factor. one can dream!  :-D

    I don't know if anybody else watches a show called "Good Bones," but it's an Indy based show where a mother and daughter team flip houses. They started in Fountain Square but they've moved onto Bates-Hendricks and Old Southside so it seems that those neighborhoods are trending upwards and could benefit from better connection to downtown.

    Definitely. I am sure something will be done to address this whenever they decide to fix that area, the locals are already starting to talk to INDOT about it and INDOT has already reached out I think I some article on this.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on October 28, 2022, 02:34:49 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on October 28, 2022, 09:36:25 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on October 28, 2022, 09:26:34 AM
    I do support them cleaning up the south leg. the roads could be connected better down there. A cap would be nice in the south split area and you could add shops and a few x-streets. win win but alas, money is the limiting factor. one can dream!  :-D

    I don't know if anybody else watches a show called "Good Bones," but it's an Indy based show where a mother and daughter team flip houses. They started in Fountain Square but they've moved onto Bates-Hendricks and Old Southside so it seems that those neighborhoods are trending upwards and could benefit from better connection to downtown.

    I was watching that show one time in a dentist's office and they were rebuilding some home along "Capitol Street." I kept on wanting to scream at the TV, it's Capitol AVENUE! I know it's minor...but they live here, they should know better.

    Pretty cool exposure for the city though and the near South side is an interesting part of the city. Improvements to the southern part of the interstates around downtown are certainly not a bad idea. But closing off that highway? We are approaching Month #18 of the experiment that proves why that is a bad idea.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SSR_317 on October 30, 2022, 04:15:59 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on October 24, 2022, 11:04:25 PM
    https://fox59.com/video/indot-looking-for-community-feedback-to-help-address-improvements-along-parts-of-i-465/8100675/

    https://cbs4indy.com/indiana-news/indot-seeks-community-input-for-i-465-improvements/

    INDOT is seeking community feedback on a section of I-465 between 86th Street (Exit 23) and US 31/Meridian Street (Exit 31).

    Oh, and here is the presentation from the meeting:
    https://www.in.gov/indot/projects/files/20221013-I-465_CAC-Meeting-Presentation.pdf

    Construction is not expected to begin until 2024.
    I see they don't plan to correct the MAJOR MISTAKE they made when the converted US 31 into a freeway in that they only built the SB 31 to Clockwise (EB here) I-465 ramp to carry only one lane. This ramp represents the "through movement" of US 31 SB, and if you get behind a slow-moving semi, you're totally screwed! Of course, you're screwed anyway if you go this way (especially during rush hour) for the next few years as the I-465/I-69 Clear Path rebuild will snarl traffic even further a few miles to the east in the Castleton area. But this project, which will not begin until that Clear Path project is (hopefully) wrapping up, would be an EXCELLENT chance to correct the mistake that was made by INDOT being penny-wise but pound-foolish on the design and construction of that SB US 31 free-flow ramp.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: wh15395 on November 01, 2022, 12:10:34 AM
    Quote from: SSR_317 on October 30, 2022, 04:15:59 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on October 24, 2022, 11:04:25 PM
    https://fox59.com/video/indot-looking-for-community-feedback-to-help-address-improvements-along-parts-of-i-465/8100675/

    https://cbs4indy.com/indiana-news/indot-seeks-community-input-for-i-465-improvements/

    INDOT is seeking community feedback on a section of I-465 between 86th Street (Exit 23) and US 31/Meridian Street (Exit 31).

    Oh, and here is the presentation from the meeting:
    https://www.in.gov/indot/projects/files/20221013-I-465_CAC-Meeting-Presentation.pdf

    Construction is not expected to begin until 2024.
    I see they don't plan to correct the MAJOR MISTAKE they made when the converted US 31 into a freeway in that they only built the SB 31 to Clockwise (EB here) I-465 ramp to carry only one lane. This ramp represents the "through movement" of US 31 SB, and if you get behind a slow-moving semi, you're totally screwed! Of course, you're screwed anyway if you go this way (especially during rush hour) for the next few years as the I-465/I-69 Clear Path rebuild will snarl traffic even further a few miles to the east in the Castleton area. But this project, which will not begin until that Clear Path project is (hopefully) wrapping up, would be an EXCELLENT chance to correct the mistake that was made by INDOT being penny-wise but pound-foolish on the design and construction of that SB US 31 free-flow ramp.

    I seriously never understood why they did that. I haven't lived in the area for a while, but I drove that ramp a few times after it was built. I got stuck behind trucks or slow drivers all the time. I couldn't grasp how INDOT could build that ramp with one lane.

    I understand cost is an issue, but I also don't see why they didn't redo all of 465 from 865 to 69 when they did the Meridian/US 31-Allisionville project. Might as well tear the whole Northside up at the same time, right?  It has to be more expensive to do all these projects in segments, and way more inconvenient for motorists. The NW and NE sides have been a mess during rush hour for a long time. They've also been the fastest growing cities in the metro area for a while, so it's not like any of this couldn't be predicted.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on November 01, 2022, 08:25:13 AM
    Quote from: wh15395 on November 01, 2022, 12:10:34 AM
    Quote from: SSR_317 on October 30, 2022, 04:15:59 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on October 24, 2022, 11:04:25 PM
    https://fox59.com/video/indot-looking-for-community-feedback-to-help-address-improvements-along-parts-of-i-465/8100675/

    https://cbs4indy.com/indiana-news/indot-seeks-community-input-for-i-465-improvements/

    INDOT is seeking community feedback on a section of I-465 between 86th Street (Exit 23) and US 31/Meridian Street (Exit 31).

    Oh, and here is the presentation from the meeting:
    https://www.in.gov/indot/projects/files/20221013-I-465_CAC-Meeting-Presentation.pdf

    Construction is not expected to begin until 2024.
    I see they don't plan to correct the MAJOR MISTAKE they made when the converted US 31 into a freeway in that they only built the SB 31 to Clockwise (EB here) I-465 ramp to carry only one lane. This ramp represents the "through movement" of US 31 SB, and if you get behind a slow-moving semi, you're totally screwed! Of course, you're screwed anyway if you go this way (especially during rush hour) for the next few years as the I-465/I-69 Clear Path rebuild will snarl traffic even further a few miles to the east in the Castleton area. But this project, which will not begin until that Clear Path project is (hopefully) wrapping up, would be an EXCELLENT chance to correct the mistake that was made by INDOT being penny-wise but pound-foolish on the design and construction of that SB US 31 free-flow ramp.

    I seriously never understood why they did that. I haven't lived in the area for a while, but I drove that ramp a few times after it was built. I got stuck behind trucks or slow drivers all the time. I couldn't grasp how INDOT could build that ramp with one lane.

    I understand cost is an issue, but I also don't see why they didn't redo all of 465 from 865 to 69 when they did the Meridian/US 31-Allisionville project. Might as well tear the whole Northside up at the same time, right?  It has to be more expensive to do all these projects in segments, and way more inconvenient for motorists. The NW and NE sides have been a mess during rush hour for a long time. They've also been the fastest growing cities in the metro area for a while, so it's not like any of this couldn't be predicted.

    I remember INDOT announcing on tv years ago the drop of the 69 interchange when they redid 465 from 31-alisonville. it was due to cost. it must have happened late in the game too because the BGS in the allisonville area had 82nd st as a destination on the exit 37 signs. the allisonville signs had the "exit only" tab covered up too. back then INDOT had much less funding I believe this was before the gas tax increase.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: XamotCGC on November 03, 2022, 04:39:28 AM
    Is Paoli pike in New Albany(Floyd County) old US 150?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 03, 2022, 07:11:29 AM
    Quote from: XamotCGC on November 03, 2022, 04:39:28 AM
    Is Paoli pike in New Albany(Floyd County) old US 150?

    Yes, Paoli Pike/State St was the original routing of US 150.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: dlovechio on November 10, 2022, 02:20:55 PM
    Quote from: sbeaver44 on September 20, 2022, 12:08:52 AM
    Indiana Toll Road exit from US 131 has no functional overhead EZPass reader, so you have to hand your EZPass to the attendant.

    Yesterday, at the I-90 State Line tolls into Chicago, lots of EZPass or gate malfunctions caused a huge backup.

    I'm from PA – is this normal?  I see on the Google Maps reviews of the Westpoint booth it seems to be a recurring problem.

    What's going on with the Toll Road?

    Also, ORT would be pretty cool at a mainline plaza...

    This is very normal, as someone who lives in South Bend and travels on the toll road frequently, we are very behind compared to other states like Illinois or  PA and MA with ORT on I90. We know someone who works for the ITR and he said the technology is old and that they don't even sell parts anymore to replace/fix the equipment, so they have to go on ebay.  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 10, 2022, 03:18:33 PM
    Quote from: dlovechio on November 10, 2022, 02:20:55 PM
    Quote from: sbeaver44 on September 20, 2022, 12:08:52 AM
    Indiana Toll Road exit from US 131 has no functional overhead EZPass reader, so you have to hand your EZPass to the attendant.

    Yesterday, at the I-90 State Line tolls into Chicago, lots of EZPass or gate malfunctions caused a huge backup.

    I'm from PA – is this normal?  I see on the Google Maps reviews of the Westpoint booth it seems to be a recurring problem.

    What's going on with the Toll Road?

    Also, ORT would be pretty cool at a mainline plaza...

    This is very normal, as someone who lives in South Bend and travels on the toll road frequently, we are very behind compared to other states like Illinois or  PA and MA with ORT on I90. We know someone who works for the ITR and he said the technology is old and that they don't even sell parts anymore to replace/fix the equipment, so they have to go on ebay.  :-D

    Welcome to AA Roads and the Indiana thread!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JoePCool14 on November 11, 2022, 12:33:31 PM
    Quote from: dlovechio on November 10, 2022, 02:20:55 PM
    Quote from: sbeaver44 on September 20, 2022, 12:08:52 AM
    Indiana Toll Road exit from US 131 has no functional overhead EZPass reader, so you have to hand your EZPass to the attendant.

    Yesterday, at the I-90 State Line tolls into Chicago, lots of EZPass or gate malfunctions caused a huge backup.

    I'm from PA – is this normal?  I see on the Google Maps reviews of the Westpoint booth it seems to be a recurring problem.

    What's going on with the Toll Road?

    Also, ORT would be pretty cool at a mainline plaza...

    This is very normal, as someone who lives in South Bend and travels on the toll road frequently, we are very behind compared to other states like Illinois or  PA and MA with ORT on I90. We know someone who works for the ITR and he said the technology is old and that they don't even sell parts anymore to replace/fix the equipment, so they have to go on ebay.  :-D

    That's incredible. I'm guessing nothing with change with the situation either, unless they are forced to.

    Could the Indiana state government pass something to force them into ORT?

    (Also, a warm welcome to the AARoads Forum from Illinois!)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on November 12, 2022, 01:04:53 PM
    Since it was all snowy outside today I'm staying home and looking at different road plans. I took a look at the plans today over the new I-465/I-69 interchange on the northeast side and was curious with how they were planning on signing things along that corridor. No real big surprises but certainly a lot of large one-arrow-per-lane signs. At least the one thing with Indiana is they don't do a bad job on these. With this combined with the future plans for I-465 on the northwest side there's going to a lot of these large signs on the north end of 465 in the future. Also with these plans, Hello Evansville! I-69 gets signed for I-465 and Evansville is the control city from the northeast side of Indianapolis. Which is fair since Fort Wayne will be signed at the junction on the southwest side.

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52495054304_7e750ac5c5_b.jpg)

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52494767571_b39c1be3f2_b.jpg)

    This makes me wonder if the in the future we'll be seeing both Fort Wayne and Evansville at the east side I-70 interchange with I-465 going by current trends. Likewise on the south side with both 69 and 74 combined will we see dual controls, Peoria and Evansville for the westbound and Cincinnati and Fort Wayne for the eastbound.

    More importantly for some people, the north end of I-465 is going to be wide and impressive when all of this is done.

    But not to worry, not all is perfect, here's a scan of a planned new sign at I-69 and I-469 on the north side of Fort Wayne (I guess they're planning some lane work up there.)

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52495271850_103592f874_w.jpg)

    Nice seeing the Lansing (ControlCityFreak was mentioning a lack of pull-throughs on I-69 in Fort Wayne) but the I-469/US 24-30 sign lacks any new control city.

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Alps on November 12, 2022, 07:16:07 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on November 12, 2022, 01:04:53 PM
    But not to worry, not all is perfect, here's a scan of a planned new sign at I-69 and I-469 on the north side of Fort Wayne (I guess they're planning some lane work up there.)

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52495271850_103592f874_w.jpg)

    Nice seeing the Lansing (ControlCityFreak was mentioning a lack of pull-throughs on I-69 in Fort Wayne) but the I-469/US 24-30 sign lacks any new control city.


    they could plan some font size work too
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Ted$8roadFan on November 13, 2022, 06:47:05 AM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on November 12, 2022, 01:04:53 PM
    Since it was all snowy outside today I'm staying home and looking at different road plans. I took a look at the plans today over the new I-465/I-69 interchange on the northeast side and was curious with how they were planning on signing things along that corridor. No real big surprises but certainly a lot of large one-arrow-per-lane signs. At least the one thing with Indiana is they don't do a bad job on these. With this combined with the future plans for I-465 on the northwest side there's going to a lot of these large signs on the north end of 465 in the future. Also with these plans, Hello Evansville! I-69 gets signed for I-465 and Evansville is the control city from the northeast side of Indianapolis. Which is fair since Fort Wayne will be signed at the junction on the southwest side.

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52495054304_7e750ac5c5_b.jpg)

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52494767571_b39c1be3f2_b.jpg)

    This makes me wonder if the in the future we'll be seeing both Fort Wayne and Evansville at the east side I-70 interchange with I-465 going by current trends. Likewise on the south side with both 69 and 74 combined will we see dual controls, Peoria and Evansville for the westbound and Cincinnati and Fort Wayne for the eastbound.

    More importantly for some people, the north end of I-465 is going to be wide and impressive when all of this is done.

    But not to worry, not all is perfect, here's a scan of a planned new sign at I-69 and I-469 on the north side of Fort Wayne (I guess they're planning some lane work up there.)

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52495271850_103592f874_w.jpg)

    Nice seeing the Lansing (ControlCityFreak was mentioning a lack of pull-throughs on I-69 in Fort Wayne) but the I-469/US 24-30 sign lacks any new control city.

    No control city on I-469?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on November 13, 2022, 09:40:51 AM
    Quote from: Alps on November 12, 2022, 07:16:07 PM
    they could plan some font size work too

    Yeah, occasionally the font's a little wonky. You see this a few times in Indiana but most signs are like the I-69/I-465 ones shown above.

    Quote from: Ted$8roadFan on November 13, 2022, 06:47:05 AM
    No control city on I-469?

    There's never been one. Though it's been argued by some (myself included) that Toledo would be a good fit, or at least Ohio. In Fort Wayne for some reason INDOT isn't interested in signing any of that.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JREwing78 on November 13, 2022, 03:05:49 PM

    Quote from: tdindy88 on November 13, 2022, 09:40:51 AM
    Quote from: Ted$8roadFan on November 13, 2022, 06:47:05 AM
    No control city on I-469?

    There's never been one. Though it's been argued by some (myself included) that Toledo would be a good fit, or at least Ohio. In Fort Wayne for some reason INDOT isn't interested in signing any of that.

    Ideally, I-469 would show both Toledo and Lima as control cities, but at least mentioning Toledo would be helpful.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: amroad17 on November 14, 2022, 04:07:36 AM
    Quote from: JREwing78 on November 13, 2022, 03:05:49 PM

    Quote from: tdindy88 on November 13, 2022, 09:40:51 AM
    Quote from: Ted$8roadFan on November 13, 2022, 06:47:05 AM
    No control city on I-469?

    There's never been one. Though it's been argued by some (myself included) that Toledo would be a good fit, or at least Ohio. In Fort Wayne for some reason INDOT isn't interested in signing any of that.

    Ideally, I-469 would show both Toledo and Lima as control cities, but at least mentioning Toledo would be helpful.
    I could see Toledo posted on an auxiliary sign for Exit 315 on I-69 NB.  The lack of a control city on the main sign is not a new thing for motorists in the Ft. Wayne area.

    Where the control cities need to be posted are at the I-469/US 24 (21) and I-469/US 30 (19) interchanges.  Ever since I-469 (before that, IN 469) opened, US 24 and US 30 have not had control cities posted.  It felt as if there was an abyss east of Ft. Wayne.  US 24 should have Toledo posted and US 30 should have either Van Wert or Lima posted.  There should also be a post interchange mileage sign on both US 24 and US 30 posting the distances to Defiance and Toledo (for US 24) and to Van Wert and Lima (for US 30). 

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on November 14, 2022, 07:56:23 AM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on November 13, 2022, 09:40:51 AM
    Quote from: Alps on November 12, 2022, 07:16:07 PM
    they could plan some font size work too

    Yeah, occasionally the font's a little wonky. You see this a few times in Indiana but most signs are like the I-69/I-465 ones shown above.

    Quote from: Ted$8roadFan on November 13, 2022, 06:47:05 AM
    No control city on I-469?

    There's never been one. Though it's been argued by some (myself included) that Toledo would be a good fit, or at least Ohio. In Fort Wayne for some reason INDOT isn't interested in signing any of that.

    the us 24 exit should say toledo and detroit but it says nothing  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JoePCool14 on November 14, 2022, 09:58:52 AM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on November 12, 2022, 01:04:53 PM
    Since it was all snowy outside today I'm staying home and looking at different road plans. I took a look at the plans today over the new I-465/I-69 interchange on the northeast side and was curious with how they were planning on signing things along that corridor. No real big surprises but certainly a lot of large one-arrow-per-lane signs. At least the one thing with Indiana is they don't do a bad job on these. With this combined with the future plans for I-465 on the northwest side there's going to a lot of these large signs on the north end of 465 in the future. Also with these plans, Hello Evansville! I-69 gets signed for I-465 and Evansville is the control city from the northeast side of Indianapolis. Which is fair since Fort Wayne will be signed at the junction on the southwest side.

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52495054304_7e750ac5c5_b.jpg)

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52494767571_b39c1be3f2_b.jpg)

    This makes me wonder if the in the future we'll be seeing both Fort Wayne and Evansville at the east side I-70 interchange with I-465 going by current trends. Likewise on the south side with both 69 and 74 combined will we see dual controls, Peoria and Evansville for the westbound and Cincinnati and Fort Wayne for the eastbound.

    More importantly for some people, the north end of I-465 is going to be wide and impressive when all of this is done.

    But not to worry, not all is perfect, here's a scan of a planned new sign at I-69 and I-469 on the north side of Fort Wayne (I guess they're planning some lane work up there.)

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52495271850_103592f874_w.jpg)

    Nice seeing the Lansing (ControlCityFreak was mentioning a lack of pull-throughs on I-69 in Fort Wayne) but the I-469/US 24-30 sign lacks any new control city.

    Of course the 3/4ths error makes another appearance. :pan: Again, it goes to show how it needs to be rewritten for 2023. Looking beyond that, there's a few oddities in the 465 plans. Stay Right instead of Keep Right. Incorrect amount of yellow for the second 37A sign. Copious amounts of white/green space on some of the signs. Overall, they look good, but I wish 465 had controls posted.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on November 14, 2022, 12:52:55 PM
    Quote from: JoePCool14 on November 14, 2022, 09:58:52 AM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on November 12, 2022, 01:04:53 PM
    Since it was all snowy outside today I'm staying home and looking at different road plans. I took a look at the plans today over the new I-465/I-69 interchange on the northeast side and was curious with how they were planning on signing things along that corridor. No real big surprises but certainly a lot of large one-arrow-per-lane signs. At least the one thing with Indiana is they don't do a bad job on these. With this combined with the future plans for I-465 on the northwest side there's going to a lot of these large signs on the north end of 465 in the future. Also with these plans, Hello Evansville! I-69 gets signed for I-465 and Evansville is the control city from the northeast side of Indianapolis. Which is fair since Fort Wayne will be signed at the junction on the southwest side.

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52495054304_7e750ac5c5_b.jpg)

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52494767571_b39c1be3f2_b.jpg)

    This makes me wonder if the in the future we'll be seeing both Fort Wayne and Evansville at the east side I-70 interchange with I-465 going by current trends. Likewise on the south side with both 69 and 74 combined will we see dual controls, Peoria and Evansville for the westbound and Cincinnati and Fort Wayne for the eastbound.

    More importantly for some people, the north end of I-465 is going to be wide and impressive when all of this is done.

    But not to worry, not all is perfect, here's a scan of a planned new sign at I-69 and I-469 on the north side of Fort Wayne (I guess they're planning some lane work up there.)

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52495271850_103592f874_w.jpg)

    Nice seeing the Lansing (ControlCityFreak was mentioning a lack of pull-throughs on I-69 in Fort Wayne) but the I-469/US 24-30 sign lacks any new control city.

    Of course the 3/4ths error makes another appearance. :pan: Again, it goes to show how it needs to be rewritten for 2023. Looking beyond that, there's a few oddities in the 465 plans. Stay Right instead of Keep Right. Incorrect amount of yellow for the second 37A sign. Copious amounts of white/green space on some of the signs. Overall, they look good, but I wish 465 had controls posted.

    what's the 3/4ths error?  :hmmm:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JoePCool14 on November 14, 2022, 01:03:03 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on November 14, 2022, 12:52:55 PM
    what's the 3/4ths error?  :hmmm:

    It's the Error that makes Signs look like This

    Engineers read the phrase in the MUTCD that states that lowercase letters should be 3/4ths the size of uppercase letters, and then instead of letting the font do what it's already designed to do, change the font size of lowercase letters, which results in 3/4ths times 3/4ths (double 3/4ths).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on December 01, 2022, 03:04:27 PM
    Anybody have any idea when the CR 550 / I-65 exit is going to open in Boone County? I found an article stating "by November", but that didn't happen. I haven't seen anything going on over there lately and it looks pretty much complete. I mainly just want to use the bridge so I don't have to go up to the crazy 267 interchange.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: hockeyjohn on December 01, 2022, 03:57:31 PM
    The SR 37 intersection with 141st Street in Fishers will be temporarily converted into a RIRO configuration until an interchange is built at some yet to be determined date.   https://37thrives.com/updates/ (https://37thrives.com/updates/)

    Now if INDOT will do something about the strange, short three-lane situations that have been created between 135th and 141st Streets.   It's hard to succinctly describe the situation, but long story short, going northbound the left lane ends after 135th Street replaced by a continuing merging lane from 135th Street effectively requiring all through traffic to have to shift right one lane.   Southbound is basically the opposite with all through traffic having to shift one lane left.   The signage for both situations is terrible and I'm surprised this hasn't caused a number of accidents.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on December 01, 2022, 09:11:00 PM
    Quote from: bmeiser on December 01, 2022, 03:04:27 PM
    Anybody have any idea when the CR 550 / I-65 exit is going to open in Boone County? I found an article stating "by November", but that didn't happen. I haven't seen anything going on over there lately and it looks pretty much complete. I mainly just want to use the bridge so I don't have to go up to the crazy 267 interchange.

    hate to break it to you, but it's literally the exact same interchange design  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on December 01, 2022, 09:13:13 PM
    Quote from: hockeyjohn on December 01, 2022, 03:57:31 PM
    The SR 37 intersection with 141st Street in Fishers will be temporarily converted into a RIRO configuration until an interchange is built at some yet to be determined date.   https://37thrives.com/updates/ (https://37thrives.com/updates/)

    Now if INDOT will do something about the strange, short three-lane situations that have been created between 135th and 141st Streets.   It's hard to succinctly describe the situation, but long story short, going northbound the left lane ends after 135th Street replaced by a continuing merging lane from 135th Street effectively requiring all through traffic to have to shift right one lane.   Southbound is basically the opposite with all through traffic having to shift one lane left.   The signage for both situations is terrible and I'm surprised this hasn't caused a number of accidents.

    Fishers did this project. INDOT gave them control until the job was done. the lane config is dumb af and poorly signed too. they need to do something about that.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on December 02, 2022, 12:03:32 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on December 01, 2022, 09:11:00 PM
    Quote from: bmeiser on December 01, 2022, 03:04:27 PM
    Anybody have any idea when the CR 550 / I-65 exit is going to open in Boone County? I found an article stating "by November", but that didn't happen. I haven't seen anything going on over there lately and it looks pretty much complete. I mainly just want to use the bridge so I don't have to go up to the crazy 267 interchange.

    hate to break it to you, but it's literally the exact same interchange design  :-D
    Well by "crazy" I meant "crazy busy". I don't mind the DDI. I just want a quicker route to work!

    Pixel 6

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on December 02, 2022, 08:46:57 AM
    I saw some map in the past, I believe it was a future map of whitestown, it had RR Pkwy somehow tying into 267 near 65 and 550 doing this weird reverse curve north. so i guess thats the future plans for that area
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on December 02, 2022, 10:00:58 AM
    Yeah I know there's definitely rumors of extending Ronald Regan up to 65 but no set plans. It would be nice, though!

    Would be interested to see that map if you could find it.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on December 03, 2022, 07:41:17 PM
    Quote from: bmeiser on December 02, 2022, 10:00:58 AM
    Yeah I know there's definitely rumors of extending Ronald Regan up to 65 but no set plans. It would be nice, though!

    Would be interested to see that map if you could find it.

    There's a couple of schematics featuring a proposed Ronald Reagan Pkwy. extension in the 2022 Whitestown Comprehensive Plan (https://whitestown.in.gov/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/Whitestown-Comprehensive-Plan-2022_08.01.22.pdf). Check out pages 48 and 58.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: XamotCGC on December 04, 2022, 12:29:49 AM
    Why isn't Muncie a control city on I 69?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on December 04, 2022, 12:34:54 AM
    Quote from: XamotCGC on December 04, 2022, 12:29:49 AM
    Why isn't Muncie a control city on I 69?

    Absolutely no reason to do so. Indiana doesn't do mid-sized cities for controls on interstates, one of the things it does very well. Fort Wayne is the best choice by far. Also, Muncie is roughly ten miles off the interstate, you don't even notice Muncie when you're on I-69, so there's more or a reason to not have it as a control city.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Flint1979 on December 04, 2022, 07:31:35 AM
    Seriously Toledo and Lima on I-469? If anything the control cities should be Lansing and Indianapolis.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on December 04, 2022, 09:29:07 AM
    Quote from: ITB on December 03, 2022, 07:41:17 PM
    Quote from: bmeiser on December 02, 2022, 10:00:58 AM
    Yeah I know there's definitely rumors of extending Ronald Regan up to 65 but no set plans. It would be nice, though!

    Would be interested to see that map if you could find it.

    There's a couple of schematics featuring a proposed Ronald Reagan Pkwy. extension in the 2022 Whitestown Comprehensive Plan (https://whitestown.in.gov/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/Whitestown-Comprehensive-Plan-2022_08.01.22.pdf). Check out pages 48 and 58.
    Wow, this is pretty awesome. Thank you for finding that!

    Pixel 6

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: pianocello on December 04, 2022, 02:54:03 PM
    Quote from: Flint1979 on December 04, 2022, 07:31:35 AM
    Seriously Toledo and Lima on I-469? If anything the control cities should be Lansing and Indianapolis.

    Pretty sure I-469's purpose is to serve E-W traffic around Fort Wayne, not N-S.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: amroad17 on December 04, 2022, 08:17:00 PM
    Quote from: pianocello on December 04, 2022, 02:54:03 PM
    Quote from: Flint1979 on December 04, 2022, 07:31:35 AM
    Seriously Toledo and Lima on I-469? If anything the control cities should be Lansing and Indianapolis.

    Pretty sure I-469's purpose is to serve E-W traffic around Fort Wayne, not N-S.
    I-469 does not need control cities.  Maybe there could be auxiliary signs NB on I-69 posting Toledo both at Exit 296 and at Exit 315.  As I stated in a prior post, Toledo should be posted at the US 24 interchange and Lima or Van Wert should be posted at the US 30 interchange.

    As an aside, I believe Ft. Wayne should be posted at the US 24/I-475 interchange in Maumee, OH.

    Originally, in the late 1980's, I-469 was simply constructed as a US 24 bypass of Ft. Wayne as it ran from US 24 to I-69 southwest of Ft. Wayne.  It was signed just as US 24, then had US 33 and IN 469 added a few years later.

    Unfortunately, Indiana routed US 24 north on I-69 back to its original routing.  What should have happened was Indiana should have upgraded Lafayette Center Road from I-69 to US 24 in Roanoke before the businesses west of I-69 sprung up.  It could have been constructed the way it is currently.  Then US 24 could have been routed along Lafayette Center and Indiana wouldn't have to change the routing to around the north and west of Ft. Wayne as they did some years ago.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on December 04, 2022, 11:51:31 PM
    https://www.i65us52improvement.com/

    INDOT has made a website for the I-65/US 52 interchange improvement project north of Lebanon. The public meeting is scheduled at the Lebanon High School on December 15, 2022, at 5 pm EST.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on December 05, 2022, 10:58:44 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 04, 2022, 11:51:31 PM
    https://www.i65us52improvement.com/

    INDOT has made a website for the I-65/US 52 interchange improvement project north of Lebanon. The public meeting is scheduled at the Lebanon High School on December 15, 2022, at 5 pm EST.

    interesting. never even heard of this project. i do remember indot saying a new interchange would be built between 52 and 47. didn't know they would also be doing something to this one too.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on December 05, 2022, 08:14:21 PM
    Quote from: amroad17 on December 04, 2022, 08:17:00 PM
    Quote from: pianocello on December 04, 2022, 02:54:03 PM
    Quote from: Flint1979 on December 04, 2022, 07:31:35 AM
    Seriously Toledo and Lima on I-469? If anything the control cities should be Lansing and Indianapolis.

    Pretty sure I-469's purpose is to serve E-W traffic around Fort Wayne, not N-S.
    I-469 does not need control cities.  Maybe there could be auxiliary signs NB on I-69 posting Toledo both at Exit 296 and at Exit 315.  As I stated in a prior post, Toledo should be posted at the US 24 interchange and Lima or Van Wert should be posted at the US 30 interchange.

    As an aside, I believe Ft. Wayne should be posted at the US 24/I-475 interchange in Maumee, OH.

    Originally, in the late 1980's, I-469 was simply constructed as a US 24 bypass of Ft. Wayne as it ran from US 24 to I-69 southwest of Ft. Wayne.  It was signed just as US 24, then had US 33 and IN 469 added a few years later.

    Unfortunately, Indiana routed US 24 north on I-69 back to its original routing.  What should have happened was Indiana should have upgraded Lafayette Center Road from I-69 to US 24 in Roanoke before the businesses west of I-69 sprung up.  It could have been constructed the way it is currently.  Then US 24 could have been routed along Lafayette Center and Indiana wouldn't have to change the routing to around the north and west of Ft. Wayne as they did some years ago.

    It was very weird that they rerouted US 24 when they did, when the Lafayette Center Road project was about to start and it was known that the new road would be 55-mph 4-lane feeding right into/off of 469.  Driving out through there fairly frequently coming from US 30 and then going to US 24 westbound, I would never follow the signed route of 24, and it seems like most people don't either.

    It is interesting that even back when US 24 eastbound came up to Roanoke and through it up to I-69, then ran south down to 469 and then eastbound, INDOT signed the turn onto the old CR 900/Lafayette Center as the way to the FWA airport.  Doing so then would put you back on US 24 in a few miles.  Might as well route 24 itself onto it now that the railroad overpass is done and the road is widened!


    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tosa on December 06, 2022, 11:17:21 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 04, 2022, 11:51:31 PM
    https://www.i65us52improvement.com/

    INDOT has made a website for the I-65/US 52 interchange improvement project north of Lebanon. The public meeting is scheduled at the Lebanon High School on December 15, 2022, at 5 pm EST.

    "The proposed project includes the improvement of the I-65/US 52 interchange, which may result in the relocation of the interchange to the north."  
    It seems the new interchange will be at 65/300N.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: jnewkirk77 on December 08, 2022, 10:20:16 PM
    Quote from: tosa on December 06, 2022, 11:17:21 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 04, 2022, 11:51:31 PM
    https://www.i65us52improvement.com/

    INDOT has made a website for the I-65/US 52 interchange improvement project north of Lebanon. The public meeting is scheduled at the Lebanon High School on December 15, 2022, at 5 pm EST.

    "The proposed project includes the improvement of the I-65/US 52 interchange, which may result in the relocation of the interchange to the north."  
    It seems the new interchange will be at 65/300N.

    There are several alternatives under consideration; 300N is just one. They're also looking at 250N, and three points which would be north of 300N.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on December 09, 2022, 12:18:36 AM
    In the realms of INDOT, they have started to put new signs on the rerouting of SR 28 to go onto US 31 into Howard County, following SR 26 and SR 19 back into Tipton County on the east side of Tipton. 23 miles added to that routing, and it's so INDOT!  :banghead:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 09, 2022, 07:27:04 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 09, 2022, 12:18:36 AM
    In the realms of INDOT, they have started to put new signs on the rerouting of SR 28 to go onto US 31 into Howard County, following SR 26 and SR 19 back into Tipton County on the east side of Tipton. 23 miles added to that routing, and it's so INDOT!  :banghead:

    Wait, I thought it was going to route on CR 500 W and Division Rd.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on December 09, 2022, 09:25:42 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 09, 2022, 12:18:36 AM
    In the realms of INDOT, they have started to put new signs on the rerouting of SR 28 to go onto US 31 into Howard County, following SR 26 and SR 19 back into Tipton County on the east side of Tipton. 23 miles added to that routing, and it's so INDOT!  :banghead:

    :-D  Wow that's so INDOT  It could be worse, they could have just placed a gap which is what I thought they would do.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: hockeyjohn on December 09, 2022, 02:15:43 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 09, 2022, 12:18:36 AM
    In the realms of INDOT, they have started to put new signs on the rerouting of SR 28 to go onto US 31 into Howard County, following SR 26 and SR 19 back into Tipton County on the east side of Tipton. 23 miles added to that routing, and it's so INDOT!  :banghead:

    Even though the re-routing is along existing state maintained highways, does this 23-mile addition count against the mileage limit imposed by the state legislature on INDOT?    If yes, it makes this even more puzzling.   

    I wish the concept of a highway network would return to Indiana where state roads would begin and end at state roads or at least be signed as such in cases where a local jurisdiction takes over a short section of roadway.    In the case of Tipton, "28" could have been signed in some way along the existing roadway (SR 28, To SR 28, 28 without Indiana on the sign, etc.) while posting the Truck 28 onto Division Rd or whatever.    There are similar situations in Kokomo and Franklin where this concept could be used.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NE2 on December 09, 2022, 02:22:04 PM
    Quote from: hockeyjohn on December 09, 2022, 02:15:43 PM
    Even though the re-routing is along existing state maintained highways, does this 23-mile addition count against the mileage limit imposed by the state legislature on INDOT?    If yes, it makes this even more puzzling.   
    Why would it? It's a limit on state maintained mileage, with no mention of how it's signed.

    QuoteThe state highway system shall be designated by the department. The total extent of the state highway system may not exceed twelve thousand (12,000) miles. The state highway system consists of the principal arterial highways in Indiana and includes the following:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on December 09, 2022, 03:18:08 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on December 09, 2022, 07:27:04 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 09, 2022, 12:18:36 AM
    In the realms of INDOT, they have started to put new signs on the rerouting of SR 28 to go onto US 31 into Howard County, following SR 26 and SR 19 back into Tipton County on the east side of Tipton. 23 miles added to that routing, and it's so INDOT!  :banghead:

    Wait, I thought it was going to route on CR 500 W and Division Rd.

    Division Road will become the standard East-West county truck route for said truck traffic (instead of existing SR 28) to skirt the city of Tipton’s new downtown “no through truck” policy. This is part of the relinquishment deal with the city and county.  INDOT is not going to take control of Division Road.

    If you’re southbound on US 31 from Kokomo and intend to go east from Tipton on SR 28, it makes sense to hop off at SR 26 and then south on SR 19. That’d be the shortest route.

    SR 19 will also be realigned from the east side of Tipton. It will go south on Ash Street and then west on Park Road to the current alignment. Formerly the county’s Tipton bypass. INDOT just installed a four way stop at Main and Park for this.

    I suppose INDOT is at least signing both routes as continuous.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: hockeyjohn on December 10, 2022, 01:31:46 PM
    Quote from: NE2 on December 09, 2022, 02:22:04 PM
    Quote from: hockeyjohn on December 09, 2022, 02:15:43 PM
    Even though the re-routing is along existing state maintained highways, does this 23-mile addition count against the mileage limit imposed by the state legislature on INDOT?    If yes, it makes this even more puzzling.   
    Why would it? It's a limit on state maintained mileage, with no mention of how it's signed.

    QuoteThe state highway system shall be designated by the department. The total extent of the state highway system may not exceed twelve thousand (12,000) miles. The state highway system consists of the principal arterial highways in Indiana and includes the following:

    I thought I read once that each route's mileage in a multiplex was counted toward the mileage limit in Indiana, but the statute does not indicate that.   Glad to be wrong as doing so would be a real head scratcher.

    https://iga.in.gov/legislative/laws/2016/ic/titles/008/articles/023/chapters/004/ (https://iga.in.gov/legislative/laws/2016/ic/titles/008/articles/023/chapters/004/)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on December 10, 2022, 02:08:50 PM
    Drove through Tipton after noon. Exited US 31 Northbound onto SR 28 East. Saw no new signage. Moved over to SR 19 and Park Road. Saw new signs at the new four way stop routing SR 19 onto Park Road.  At the SR 19 & 28 junction at the stoplight at the east side of Tipton, new route markers indicating 28 E to turn east and 19 straight ahead north. 

    Then at Division Road and SR 19 saw a new sign indicating "Truck 28"   to turn west and reassurance Truck 28 shield west of 19. 

    I snapped a couple of pictures. Not sure how to upload them from my iPhone.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on December 10, 2022, 05:01:43 PM
    What do the Truck 28 shields look like, are they like the state highway shields.

    I do appreciate that they aren't splitting up SR 28 but anyone traveling from Frankfort to Elwood surly isn't going to travel up to Howard County to travel that routing.

    I wonder why SR 28 got to keep its continuous routing and not SR 26. They could have just routed that onto US 52 on the south side of Lafayette and used SR 38 to connect back to I-65.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on December 10, 2022, 07:10:42 PM
    The shields look like state shields, including directional tags, i.e. West.

    On southbound 19 approaching, there is the Indiana 28 shield with "Trucks"  above and directional arrows below pointing west and south.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: I-55 on December 10, 2022, 07:24:56 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on December 10, 2022, 05:01:43 PM
    I wonder why SR 28 got to keep its continuous routing and not SR 26. They could have just routed that onto US 52 on the south side of Lafayette and used SR 38 to connect back to I-65.

    The argument that state routes should be continuous only matters if a decent portion of traffic is continuing from one segment to another. SR 37 doesn't need to be signed over state routes from Marion to the northeast side of Fort Wayne because most people aren't traveling both segments on their trip. SR 26 isn't used much to travel through Lafayette as much as it is to get to Lafayette. 28 is different because a significant portion of traffic would continue to utilize both segments of the discontinuous route. Functionally 37 and 26 are different routes, but 28 is a single route.

    I think 28 should use Division Rd, but if not just leave the old route as CR 28 or something like that to signal a continuity. No one is going to follow the 28 routing all the way up to Kokomo.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on December 10, 2022, 08:46:42 PM
    There are a lot of trucks flowing east and west on 28 through the region. It would be interesting to see how many actually turn onto US 31. I suspect it's a small percentage. It is a grain corridor, lots of industry in Frankfort (notably Frito Lay) and lots of Red Gold freight originating in Elwood-Orestes.  I suspect 2/3 of the SR 28 trucks end up accessing I65 and I69 via SR28, with those heading north.

    Only Chrysler at Tipton likely routes regular trucks to their Kokomo plants but a lot of them also head up I69.

    Red Gold bulk loads that originate in fields to the north travel down US 31 to SR 26 to SR 19 to SR 28.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 10, 2022, 08:52:02 PM
    Having 28 routed all the way up to the southern edge of Kokomo makes no sense. Nobody is going to follow that route.

    I get towns like Tipton not wanting a bunch of through traffic, especially truck traffic, but if you have to reroute that far you might as well make it discontinuous.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: I-55 on December 10, 2022, 09:24:55 PM
    If there's a decent reason INDOT wouldn't want to use Division Rd it may be to avoid having to build another interchange off US 31. IIRC there was discussion but there are no plans for an interchange there (correct me if I'm wrong). If Tipton Park wasn't where it was there'd be a logical bypass route to the south but obviously can't build there now. Routings like these make it feel like INDOT is starting to gerrymander their state highways.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on December 10, 2022, 11:03:18 PM
    I think they'll get around to building that Division Road interchange, especially if there's still a stoplight there. I imagine the ProPel US 31 studies will get to the eventual conclusion that an interchange there is a good idea.

    One more point on this reroute. Since it seems that Division Road is being "signed" as Truck SR 28 that would mean that the truck bypass of a state highway is better routed than the actual state highway itself. That seems so wrong.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on December 11, 2022, 02:39:44 PM
    "I think they'll get around to building that Division Road interchange, especially if there's still a stoplight there. I imagine the ProPel US 31 studies will get to the eventual conclusion that an interchange there is a good idea."

    Having Division Road formally acting as Truck SR 28 seemingly will aid the development of an interchange with US 31.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on December 12, 2022, 10:57:22 AM
    26 and 25 were both supposed to be routed around lafayette continously using Teal Road and SR 38. there was a newspaper article showing it. For some reason INDOT didnt end up doing it and just signed the highway they had to keep continuous US 52.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 12, 2022, 11:03:10 AM
    Before I submit this to TravelMapping to have them update, I want to make sure this is correct:

    IN 19 now routes along Park Rd and Ash St instead of Main St and Jefferson St

    IN 28 now routes along US 31, IN 26 and IN 19 instead of connecting directly from US 31 to IN 19

    Truck 28 now exists from US 31 along Division Rd and IN 19 to Jefferson St
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on December 12, 2022, 12:34:17 PM
    Before I submit this to TravelMapping to have them update, I want to make sure this is correct:

    IN 19 now routes along Park Rd and Ash St instead of Main St and Jefferson St
    Yes

    IN 28 now routes along US 31, IN 26 and IN 19 instead of connecting directly from US 31 to IN 19
    I can't confirm but this is accurate with other posts.

    Truck 28 now exists from US 31 along Division Rd and IN 19 to Jefferson St
    Yes
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on December 12, 2022, 12:45:17 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on December 12, 2022, 10:57:22 AM
    26 and 25 were both supposed to be routed around lafayette continously using Teal Road and SR 38. there was a newspaper article showing it. For some reason INDOT didnt end up doing it and just signed the highway they had to keep continuous US 52.

    About 15 years ago they did have 25 run down 38 to 65, with the BGSs modified to include 25 at Exit 168 and a small sign saying "For 25 North use Exit 175".  That only lasted a couple years and then was changed to the gap in 25, which makes no sense. 

    If they had planned ahead better, they could have run 52 across CR 350S (now Veterans Memorial) to the "new" 231 or something instead of using Teal Road.  25 years ago, 350S was out in the sticks; I could ride my bike on it and only see a few cars.  The sprawl out to there has been amazing, but it still would have been a more capable road than Teal to get 52 over to 231.

    If West Lafayette wanted thru traffic out by removing 26, it worked...it is brutal taking State Street through town most of the time anymore.  Although using Harrison/Williams/Tapawingo to get around it isn't always as bad. 
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on December 12, 2022, 04:23:56 PM
    Quote from: bmeiser on December 01, 2022, 03:04:27 PM
    Anybody have any idea when the CR 550 / I-65 exit is going to open in Boone County? I found an article stating "by November", but that didn't happen. I haven't seen anything going on over there lately and it looks pretty much complete. I mainly just want to use the bridge so I don't have to go up to the crazy 267 interchange.

    "after May of 2023"  :-(

    https://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/INDOT/bulletins/33c32f0

    I did notice that both lanes on the 267 bridge were open this morning and I was able to zoom past 3 slow dump trucks, so that helps some...
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on December 12, 2022, 08:33:30 PM
    https://revivei70.com/

    20+ miles widening project on I-70 in Wayne County to begin construction in late 2024.

    Improvements include:
    One lane added in each direction between Cambridge City and Richmond for a total of three travel lanes in each direction (new lanes added to existing grass median)

    Two key interchanges (I-70 and US 40 interchange and the I-70 and US 35/Williamsburg Pike interchange) modified to improve safety and mobility

    All 40 bridges in the project area widened to accommodate additional travel lanes

    Additional bridge improvements including complete replacements, deck replacements, deck overlays and painting
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on December 12, 2022, 09:26:03 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 12, 2022, 08:33:30 PM
    https://revivei70.com/

    20+ miles widening project on I-70 in Wayne County to begin construction in late 2024.

    Improvements include:
    One lane added in each direction between Cambridge City and Richmond for a total of three travel lanes in each direction (new lanes added to existing grass median)

    Two key interchanges (I-70 and US 40 interchange and the I-70 and US 35/Williamsburg Pike interchange) modified to improve safety and mobility

    All 40 bridges in the project area widened to accommodate additional travel lanes

    Additional bridge improvements including complete replacements, deck replacements, deck overlays and painting

    Back in 2000-2001 Ohio rebuilt their westernmost 20 miles of I-70 and widened the bridges to 3 lanes but built the road as the same 2 lanes...wonder if Indiana widening the adjoining 20 miles might make ODOT think about it some more?  Hmm.

    I wonder if the US 40 interchange will become one exit each direction instead of an A-B.  If so, will it be the end of the Exit 156B westbound ramp where you decelerate in Ohio, just go into Indiana at the gore, and merge onto US 40 in Ohio?  Would kinda be a bummer.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on December 13, 2022, 05:10:39 AM
    I'm curious about what the US 35 interchange might look like, it's a bit of a weird design and could certainly use some updating. As for I-70 into Ohio, I was thinking it might not be a terrible idea to keep the six lanes eastward to the US 35 interchange east of the state line. That would be up to Ohio though.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: I-55 on December 13, 2022, 01:18:47 PM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on December 12, 2022, 12:45:17 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on December 12, 2022, 10:57:22 AM
    26 and 25 were both supposed to be routed around lafayette continously using Teal Road and SR 38. there was a newspaper article showing it. For some reason INDOT didnt end up doing it and just signed the highway they had to keep continuous US 52.

    About 15 years ago they did have 25 run down 38 to 65, with the BGSs modified to include 25 at Exit 168 and a small sign saying "For 25 North use Exit 175".  That only lasted a couple years and then was changed to the gap in 25, which makes no sense. 

    If they had planned ahead better, they could have run 52 across CR 350S (now Veterans Memorial) to the "new" 231 or something instead of using Teal Road.  25 years ago, 350S was out in the sticks; I could ride my bike on it and only see a few cars.  The sprawl out to there has been amazing, but it still would have been a more capable road than Teal to get 52 over to 231.

    If West Lafayette wanted thru traffic out by removing 26, it worked...it is brutal taking State Street through town most of the time anymore.  Although using Harrison/Williams/Tapawingo to get around it isn't always as bad.

    US 52 only follows Teal because it was always under state maintenance. When the time came to move 52 over to 231 INDOT just kept what they had and changed the signs. Had Teal not been a state route I think there's no question it gets routed on Veterans. INDOT is also rebuilding 52 almost completely from 231 to Sagamore, adding more city friendly elements (curbs, sidewalks, updated traffic signals).

    Harrison/Williams/Tapawingo is my preferred route since (on campus alone) I usually get stopped at 3+ lights for pedestrians to cross (either 13 or 20 second timers). Purdue really wanted 26 turned over so they could diet it and add bike and pedestrian paths. Besides, who wants a 4 lane undivided state route bisecting campus? INDOT of course is always happy to shed inventory resulting in a mutual benefit to both parties.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on December 13, 2022, 01:52:58 PM
    Quote from: I-55 on December 13, 2022, 01:18:47 PM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on December 12, 2022, 12:45:17 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on December 12, 2022, 10:57:22 AM
    26 and 25 were both supposed to be routed around lafayette continously using Teal Road and SR 38. there was a newspaper article showing it. For some reason INDOT didnt end up doing it and just signed the highway they had to keep continuous US 52.

    About 15 years ago they did have 25 run down 38 to 65, with the BGSs modified to include 25 at Exit 168 and a small sign saying "For 25 North use Exit 175".  That only lasted a couple years and then was changed to the gap in 25, which makes no sense. 

    If they had planned ahead better, they could have run 52 across CR 350S (now Veterans Memorial) to the "new" 231 or something instead of using Teal Road.  25 years ago, 350S was out in the sticks; I could ride my bike on it and only see a few cars.  The sprawl out to there has been amazing, but it still would have been a more capable road than Teal to get 52 over to 231.

    If West Lafayette wanted thru traffic out by removing 26, it worked...it is brutal taking State Street through town most of the time anymore.  Although using Harrison/Williams/Tapawingo to get around it isn't always as bad.

    US 52 only follows Teal because it was always under state maintenance. When the time came to move 52 over to 231 INDOT just kept what they had and changed the signs. Had Teal not been a state route I think there's no question it gets routed on Veterans. INDOT is also rebuilding 52 almost completely from 231 to Sagamore, adding more city friendly elements (curbs, sidewalks, updated traffic signals).

    Harrison/Williams/Tapawingo is my preferred route since (on campus alone) I usually get stopped at 3+ lights for pedestrians to cross (either 13 or 20 second timers). Purdue really wanted 26 turned over so they could diet it and add bike and pedestrian paths. Besides, who wants a 4 lane undivided state route bisecting campus? INDOT of course is always happy to shed inventory resulting in a mutual benefit to both parties.

    INDOT is doing this as part of the maintenance agreement for giving away sagamore. originally 52 was to stay as it was back then. for some reason INDOT changed their minds and gave it away. They plan on redoing the 4th and Teal intersection and reconstruct Teal from there to sagamore. saw it in the news a few years ago.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on December 13, 2022, 03:14:46 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on December 13, 2022, 01:52:58 PM
    Quote from: I-55 on December 13, 2022, 01:18:47 PM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on December 12, 2022, 12:45:17 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on December 12, 2022, 10:57:22 AM
    26 and 25 were both supposed to be routed around lafayette continously using Teal Road and SR 38. there was a newspaper article showing it. For some reason INDOT didnt end up doing it and just signed the highway they had to keep continuous US 52.

    About 15 years ago they did have 25 run down 38 to 65, with the BGSs modified to include 25 at Exit 168 and a small sign saying "For 25 North use Exit 175".  That only lasted a couple years and then was changed to the gap in 25, which makes no sense. 

    If they had planned ahead better, they could have run 52 across CR 350S (now Veterans Memorial) to the "new" 231 or something instead of using Teal Road.  25 years ago, 350S was out in the sticks; I could ride my bike on it and only see a few cars.  The sprawl out to there has been amazing, but it still would have been a more capable road than Teal to get 52 over to 231.

    If West Lafayette wanted thru traffic out by removing 26, it worked...it is brutal taking State Street through town most of the time anymore.  Although using Harrison/Williams/Tapawingo to get around it isn't always as bad.

    US 52 only follows Teal because it was always under state maintenance. When the time came to move 52 over to 231 INDOT just kept what they had and changed the signs. Had Teal not been a state route I think there's no question it gets routed on Veterans. INDOT is also rebuilding 52 almost completely from 231 to Sagamore, adding more city friendly elements (curbs, sidewalks, updated traffic signals).

    Harrison/Williams/Tapawingo is my preferred route since (on campus alone) I usually get stopped at 3+ lights for pedestrians to cross (either 13 or 20 second timers). Purdue really wanted 26 turned over so they could diet it and add bike and pedestrian paths. Besides, who wants a 4 lane undivided state route bisecting campus? INDOT of course is always happy to shed inventory resulting in a mutual benefit to both parties.

    INDOT is doing this as part of the maintenance agreement for giving away sagamore. originally 52 was to stay as it was back then. for some reason INDOT changed their minds and gave it away. They plan on redoing the 4th and Teal intersection and reconstruct Teal from there to sagamore. saw it in the news a few years ago.

    Reconstructed or not, it won't help Teal going right by the fairgrounds, Jeff High School, the commercial strip, etc.  and the way that going westbound, you go back somewhat to the south and then northward again.  INDOT's weird thing with handing back roads sometimes doesn't always make a lot of sense.
    They resurfaced Cherry Lane (former SR 126) before handing it over to West Lafayette but did a crappy job--I'm surprised the city didn't make them come back and redo it.  Of course, West Lafayette has been all too happy to take down INDOT's signals and poles in order to have fancier ones.  South Bend took INDOT's leftovers and painted them black and they look fine!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on December 14, 2022, 08:03:59 PM
    Saw additional signage on US 31 northbound tonight at SR 28 with the notice of no through trucks through Tipton. Observed Truck 28 East signs NB and SB on US 31 guiding east on Division Road.

    No SR 28 shields on US 31 between SR 28 & SR 26. Official routing for SR 28 east of US 31 is on SR 26 east and then south on SR 19 to Tipton. I suspect the SR28 relocation signs are all erected but just my guess. SR 28 signs erected at the JCT of SR 19 & SR 26.  No additional SR 28 shields on the new route along SR 26 or SR 19 either (outside the junctions).

    Thus, for now, SR 28 is not signed as a continuous route, but in reality, the directionals are the shortest and best routes to the east side of Tipton if you're driving a truck.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: westerninterloper on December 14, 2022, 08:31:25 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 12, 2022, 08:33:30 PM
    https://revivei70.com/

    20+ miles widening project on I-70 in Wayne County to begin construction in late 2024.

    Improvements include:
    One lane added in each direction between Cambridge City and Richmond for a total of three travel lanes in each direction (new lanes added to existing grass median)

    Two key interchanges (I-70 and US 40 interchange and the I-70 and US 35/Williamsburg Pike interchange) modified to improve safety and mobility

    All 40 bridges in the project area widened to accommodate additional travel lanes

    Additional bridge improvements including complete replacements, deck replacements, deck overlays and painting

    Hallelujah for this. That stretch of I-70 is old, narrow and dangerous. Is this the start of a 6-lane rebuild of I-70 across Indiana?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on December 14, 2022, 11:35:04 PM
    Quote from: westerninterloper on December 14, 2022, 08:31:25 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 12, 2022, 08:33:30 PM
    https://revivei70.com/

    20+ miles widening project on I-70 in Wayne County to begin construction in late 2024.

    Improvements include:
    One lane added in each direction between Cambridge City and Richmond for a total of three travel lanes in each direction (new lanes added to existing grass median)

    Two key interchanges (I-70 and US 40 interchange and the I-70 and US 35/Williamsburg Pike interchange) modified to improve safety and mobility

    All 40 bridges in the project area widened to accommodate additional travel lanes

    Additional bridge improvements including complete replacements, deck replacements, deck overlays and painting

    Hallelujah for this. That stretch of I-70 is old, narrow and dangerous. Is this the start of a 6-lane rebuild of I-70 across Indiana?

    Yes, but it's going to be a slow process... the only section that is currently being widened as of right now is the stretch in Hancock County (between Mt. Comfort Road (Exit 96) to east of SR 9 in Greenfield (Exit 104)). The only other section on I-70 that is planned/funded to be widened in a few years is the stretch west of Indy in Hendricks County (between Quaker Boulevard (Exit 66) and west of SR 39 (Exit 59)).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on December 15, 2022, 08:12:55 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 14, 2022, 11:35:04 PM
    Quote from: westerninterloper on December 14, 2022, 08:31:25 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 12, 2022, 08:33:30 PM
    https://revivei70.com/

    20+ miles widening project on I-70 in Wayne County to begin construction in late 2024.

    Improvements include:
    One lane added in each direction between Cambridge City and Richmond for a total of three travel lanes in each direction (new lanes added to existing grass median)

    Two key interchanges (I-70 and US 40 interchange and the I-70 and US 35/Williamsburg Pike interchange) modified to improve safety and mobility

    All 40 bridges in the project area widened to accommodate additional travel lanes

    Additional bridge improvements including complete replacements, deck replacements, deck overlays and painting

    Hallelujah for this. That stretch of I-70 is old, narrow and dangerous. Is this the start of a 6-lane rebuild of I-70 across Indiana?

    Yes, but it's going to be a slow process... the only section that is currently being widened as of right now is the stretch in Hancock County (between Mt. Comfort Road (Exit 96) to east of SR 9 in Greenfield (Exit 104)). The only other section on I-70 that is planned/funded to be widened in a few years is the stretch west of Indy in Hendricks County (between Quaker Boulevard (Exit 66) and west of SR 39 (Exit 59)).

    this project will widen 70 from SR 1 to the state line right?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SkyPesos on December 20, 2022, 07:02:28 AM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on December 12, 2022, 12:45:17 PM
    ...State Street....
    Mitch Daniels Boulevard* :bigass:

    dw, I dislike the new name too.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on December 20, 2022, 08:40:19 AM
    Quote from: SkyPesos on December 20, 2022, 07:02:28 AM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on December 12, 2022, 12:45:17 PM
    ...State Street....
    Mitch Daniels Boulevard* :bigass:

    dw, I dislike the new name too.

    hey he was a great president for purdue!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 23, 2022, 01:42:00 PM
    As of 1pm ET/Noon CT, the follow counties were under travel warnings: LaPorte, Miami, Wabash, Huntington, Wells, Adams, Tipton, Grant, Blackford, Jay, Randolph, Henry, Rush, Union and Jennings.

    North-South roads are bad statewide. In NW Indiana, numerous accidents on both I-65 and I-94 have various sections of each road shut down.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SSR_317 on December 23, 2022, 02:32:34 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on December 20, 2022, 08:40:19 AM
    Quote from: SkyPesos on December 20, 2022, 07:02:28 AM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on December 12, 2022, 12:45:17 PM
    ...State Street....
    Mitch Daniels Boulevard* :bigass:

    dw, I dislike the new name too.

    hey he was a great president for purdue!
    Yes, he was, IF you like the Koch Brothers' takeover (and dumbing down) of higher education. But I digress into politics.

    Personally, I have a problem with renaming ANY street, road, highway, or freeway for a still-living person. I believe it should be FUTURE generations who honor the truly worthy with such designations, not current ones, as those decisions more often than not end up being politically motivated. Not saying they couldn't be in the future, but it's much less likely once sufficient time has passed.

    BTW, prime example, is that ridiculous "Interstate" 99 in PA still named after Bud Schuster? If so, why?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 23, 2022, 08:11:21 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on December 23, 2022, 01:42:00 PM
    As of 1pm ET/Noon CT, the follow counties were under travel warnings: LaPorte, Miami, Wabash, Huntington, Wells, Adams, Tipton, Grant, Blackford, Jay, Randolph, Henry, Rush, Union and Jennings.

    North-South roads are bad statewide. In NW Indiana, numerous accidents on both I-65 and I-94 have various sections of each road shut down.

    8pm ET/7pm CT updated list:

    Jasper, LaPorte, St Joseph, Starke, Puaski, White
    Lagrange
    Miami, Wabash, Huntington, Wells, Adams, Tipton, Grant, Blackford, Jay, Delaware, Randolph, Henry, Rush, Union, Decatur, Franklin, Jennings
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: roadman65 on January 04, 2023, 12:45:07 PM
    https://goo.gl/maps/96FGt5Eod9hVAkDp6
    I am noticing that US 35 gets notoriety here even though it begins at a later point on US 20.

    I'm guessing IN 212 was once an extension of US 35 when it ended at US 12 and the signs here aren't updated.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on January 04, 2023, 12:50:00 PM
    Quote from: roadman65 on January 04, 2023, 12:45:07 PM
    https://goo.gl/maps/96FGt5Eod9hVAkDp6
    I am noticing that US 35 gets notoriety here even though it begins at a later point on US 20.

    I'm guessing IN 212 was once an extension of US 35 when it ended at US 12 and the signs here aren't updated.

    That was never US 35. It followed Michigan Ave to US 12.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: roadman65 on January 04, 2023, 12:56:38 PM
    So basically it relinquished control of the US route to the city north of US 20.

    I'm guessing US 421 once intersected US 12 as well.


    I see in the GSV images that US 35 SB shields were formally present here to support the fact Michigan Blvd once was.

    https://goo.gl/maps/UJ7QwH5SAKYhqAGo8

    https://goo.gl/maps/JUdGTzALxpS6mrYu6
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on January 04, 2023, 07:50:36 PM
    Quote from: roadman65 on January 04, 2023, 12:56:38 PM
    So basically it relinquished control of the US route to the city north of US 20.

    I'm guessing US 421 once intersected US 12 as well.


    I see in the GSV images that US 35 SB shields were formally present here to support the fact Michigan Blvd once was.

    https://goo.gl/maps/UJ7QwH5SAKYhqAGo8

    https://goo.gl/maps/JUdGTzALxpS6mrYu6

    you are correct, both us 421 and 35 once went to us 12. It would have been interesting for them to instead reroute 35 onto 212 up to 12.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on January 04, 2023, 08:39:53 PM
    US 35 has been truncated even further. The new terminus is at the junction with US 20 just east of the I-94 interchange.

    The "US 35 NORTH"  portion of the Michigan City exit signs have been greened out on both directions of I-94, something I immediately noticed when I came back from New Buffalo just before Christmas.

    Also, an "END US 35"  sign is at the US 20 intersection to further bring the point home.

    I don't know if they greened out all US 35 references at the Indiana 212/US 20 exchange, but US 35 no longer reaches Michigan City.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on January 05, 2023, 08:10:35 AM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on January 04, 2023, 08:39:53 PM
    US 35 has been truncated even further. The new terminus is at the junction with US 20 just east of the I-94 interchange.

    The "US 35 NORTH"  portion of the Michigan City exit signs have been greened out on both directions of I-94, something I immediately noticed when I came back from New Buffalo just before Christmas.

    Also, an "END US 35"  sign is at the US 20 intersection to further bring the point home.

    I don't know if they greened out all US 35 references at the Indiana 212/US 20 exchange, but US 35 no longer reaches Michigan City.

    so this is out of date?  :hmmm: https://www.google.com/maps/@41.6887959,-86.812432,3a,25y,44.19h,93.41t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sAT4MfgfHEbilL8-x70_1lA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: zzcarp on January 05, 2023, 11:03:32 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on January 05, 2023, 08:10:35 AM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on January 04, 2023, 08:39:53 PM
    US 35 has been truncated even further. The new terminus is at the junction with US 20 just east of the I-94 interchange.

    The "US 35 NORTH"  portion of the Michigan City exit signs have been greened out on both directions of I-94, something I immediately noticed when I came back from New Buffalo just before Christmas.

    Also, an "END US 35"  sign is at the US 20 intersection to further bring the point home.

    I don't know if they greened out all US 35 references at the Indiana 212/US 20 exchange, but US 35 no longer reaches Michigan City.

    so this is out of date?  :hmmm: https://www.google.com/maps/@41.6887959,-86.812432,3a,25y,44.19h,93.41t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sAT4MfgfHEbilL8-x70_1lA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

    No. It's just a guide sign as US 35 begins at the very next intersection east of the I-94 interchange with US 20.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: sprjus4 on January 12, 2023, 10:21:16 AM
    QuoteU.S. highways

    A separate speed limit bill in the House would increase the speed limit on certain U.S. highways in the state.

    Sponsored by Rep. Dave Heine, R-Fort Wayne, the bill would increase the speed limit on stretches of U.S. 24, 25, and 30 from 55 mph to 70 mph. As written, the change would apply to cars and large trucks.

    Affected stretches of highway:

    U.S. 24 between Huntington and Logansport.
    U.S. 25 between Lafayette and Logansport.
    U.S. 24 from the Ohio border to the Interstate 469 interchange.
    U.S. 30 from the Ohio border to the Interstate 469 interchange.
    Heine's bill, HB1077, is in the House Roads and Transportation Committee.

    https://landline.media/indiana-bill-would-eliminate-speed-limit-differential/

    While I'm not opposed to increasing the speed on non-limited-access highways to 70 mph, this is definitely bias to Fort Wayne.

    All of those highways feed into and out of Fort Wayne. What about other four lane highways in the state that can easily handle a 70 mph speed limit? In addition, reading the bill, it adds a specific provision for these highways to be 70 mph. But freeway portions of routes such as US-31 are still limited at 65 mph.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Life in Paradise on January 12, 2023, 12:27:55 PM
    Quote from: sprjus4 on January 12, 2023, 10:21:16 AM
    QuoteU.S. highways

    A separate speed limit bill in the House would increase the speed limit on certain U.S. highways in the state.

    Sponsored by Rep. Dave Heine, R-Fort Wayne, the bill would increase the speed limit on stretches of U.S. 24, 25, and 30 from 55 mph to 70 mph. As written, the change would apply to cars and large trucks.

    Affected stretches of highway:

    U.S. 24 between Huntington and Logansport.
    U.S. 25 between Lafayette and Logansport.
    U.S. 24 from the Ohio border to the Interstate 469 interchange.
    U.S. 30 from the Ohio border to the Interstate 469 interchange.
    Heine's bill, HB1077, is in the House Roads and Transportation Committee.

    https://landline.media/indiana-bill-would-eliminate-speed-limit-differential/

    While I'm not opposed to increasing the speed on non-limited-access highways to 70 mph, this is definitely bias to Fort Wayne.

    All of those highways feed into and out of Fort Wayne. What about other four lane highways in the state that can easily handle a 70 mph speed limit? In addition, reading the bill, it adds a specific provision for these highways to be 70 mph. But freeway portions of routes such as US-31 are still limited at 65 mph.

    I wouldn't be surprised for there to be amendments to that bill adding more highways if the bill gets any traction at all.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Kniwt on January 12, 2023, 01:21:28 PM
    The Tribune-Star in Terre Haute reports on INDOT's plans to rebuild the I-74 / IN 63 interchange.
    https://www.tribstar.com/news/indot-sets-indiana-63-public-hearing-for-jan-25/article_ddbf1858-9293-11ed-9f8a-f3101a8d4308.html

    QuoteThe Indiana Department of Transportation will hold a public hearing Jan. 25 the American Legion, 922 W. Ferry Street, Cayuga. Doors open at 5:30 p.m.; a formal presentation begins at 6 p.m.

    This hearing will focus on improving safety and reducing the number of crashes on a segment of Indiana 63 near the Beef House Restaurant & Dinner Theater and the intersection of East County Road 1650N  in Highland Township.

    The proposed, preferred alternative is to construct a new reduced conflict intersection (median opening) Indiana 63 about 390 ft. north of the gas station drive to the truck plaza.

    This would eliminate the existing median opening across from the north gas station drive. This project would also extend and raise the splitter islands at 1650 North.

    New pavement markings, advanced street directional signs, and upgraded lighting will also be installed, along with one stormwater pipe in the grass median at the north end of the project limits.

    (https://bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com/tribstar.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/9/e6/9e60b21e-9295-11ed-92a0-cb01731c7388/63c0344a502cb.image.png?resize=750%2C629)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: thefarmerchris on January 12, 2023, 01:29:03 PM
    Quote from: Life in Paradise on January 12, 2023, 12:27:55 PM
    Quote from: sprjus4 on January 12, 2023, 10:21:16 AM
    QuoteU.S. highways

    A separate speed limit bill in the House would increase the speed limit on certain U.S. highways in the state.

    Sponsored by Rep. Dave Heine, R-Fort Wayne, the bill would increase the speed limit on stretches of U.S. 24, 25, and 30 from 55 mph to 70 mph. As written, the change would apply to cars and large trucks.

    Affected stretches of highway:

    U.S. 24 between Huntington and Logansport.
    U.S. 25 between Lafayette and Logansport.
    U.S. 24 from the Ohio border to the Interstate 469 interchange.
    U.S. 30 from the Ohio border to the Interstate 469 interchange.
    Heine's bill, HB1077, is in the House Roads and Transportation Committee.

    https://landline.media/indiana-bill-would-eliminate-speed-limit-differential/

    While I'm not opposed to increasing the speed on non-limited-access highways to 70 mph, this is definitely bias to Fort Wayne.

    All of those highways feed into and out of Fort Wayne. What about other four lane highways in the state that can easily handle a 70 mph speed limit? In addition, reading the bill, it adds a specific provision for these highways to be 70 mph. But freeway portions of routes such as US-31 are still limited at 65 mph.

    I wouldn't be surprised for there to be amendments to that bill adding more highways if the bill gets any traction at all.

    The 4 highways listed already average around 70 mph on those stretches. I do agree though, there are more stretches around the state that could benefit. US30 west of Ft. Wayne could easily go up to 65 or 70. 70 for sure west of Warsaw to Valpo.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: sprjus4 on January 12, 2023, 02:15:27 PM
    Quote from: Life in Paradise on January 12, 2023, 12:27:55 PM
    Quote from: sprjus4 on January 12, 2023, 10:21:16 AM
    QuoteU.S. highways

    A separate speed limit bill in the House would increase the speed limit on certain U.S. highways in the state.

    Sponsored by Rep. Dave Heine, R-Fort Wayne, the bill would increase the speed limit on stretches of U.S. 24, 25, and 30 from 55 mph to 70 mph. As written, the change would apply to cars and large trucks.

    Affected stretches of highway:

    U.S. 24 between Huntington and Logansport.
    U.S. 25 between Lafayette and Logansport.
    U.S. 24 from the Ohio border to the Interstate 469 interchange.
    U.S. 30 from the Ohio border to the Interstate 469 interchange.
    Heine's bill, HB1077, is in the House Roads and Transportation Committee.

    https://landline.media/indiana-bill-would-eliminate-speed-limit-differential/

    While I'm not opposed to increasing the speed on non-limited-access highways to 70 mph, this is definitely bias to Fort Wayne.

    All of those highways feed into and out of Fort Wayne. What about other four lane highways in the state that can easily handle a 70 mph speed limit? In addition, reading the bill, it adds a specific provision for these highways to be 70 mph. But freeway portions of routes such as US-31 are still limited at 65 mph.

    I wouldn't be surprised for there to be amendments to that bill adding more highways if the bill gets any traction at all.
    I agree. I feel like at least all freeways should be permitted for 70 mph.

    It sort of reminds me of Virginia's 60 mph on non-limited-access highways law that specifies segments of highway. It has similarly been significantly expanded upon since its inception to include more segments.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on January 12, 2023, 03:11:01 PM
    I'm not sure law makers know anything about speed limits. leave that to the engineers and traffic engineers  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: zzcarp on January 12, 2023, 03:41:02 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on January 12, 2023, 03:11:01 PM
    I'm not sure law makers know anything about speed limits. leave that to the engineers and traffic engineers  :-D

    They probably don't, but when maximum speed limits are written into law, it is a political matter. Engineers, especially government employees, aren't going to push the envelope against a statute.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on January 12, 2023, 10:12:37 PM
    If this bill moves forward, the result will be a statewide impact on all like Indiana highways.  My opinion is that most four lane highways should qualify for plus 5 mph over their current limits. I doubt rural interstates will increase to over 70 mph though. The safety lobby will have a hard time convincing against such a raise. As mentioned, most “improved” four-lane divided highways are built to a higher standard than their actual posted limits. For example, the newer northern US 31 segments are built to 70 mph design standards but are signed for only 65.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on January 13, 2023, 08:22:11 AM
    all new interstates are designed at 70 mph. either way people will go 70 anyway  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: thenetwork on January 13, 2023, 10:30:07 PM
    Quote from: sprjus4 on January 12, 2023, 10:21:16 AM
    QuoteU.S. highways

    A separate speed limit bill in the House would increase the speed limit on certain U.S. highways in the state.

    Sponsored by Rep. Dave Heine, R-Fort Wayne, the bill would increase the speed limit on stretches of U.S. 24, 25, and 30 from 55 mph to 70 mph. As written, the change would apply to cars and large trucks.

    Affected stretches of highway:

    U.S. 24 between Huntington and Logansport.
    U.S. 25 between Lafayette and Logansport.
    U.S. 24 from the Ohio border to the Interstate 469 interchange.
    U.S. 30 from the Ohio border to the Interstate 469 interchange.
    Heine's bill, HB1077, is in the House Roads and Transportation Committee.

    https://landline.media/indiana-bill-would-eliminate-speed-limit-differential/

    While I'm not opposed to increasing the speed on non-limited-access highways to 70 mph, this is definitely bias to Fort Wayne.

    All of those highways feed into and out of Fort Wayne. What about other four lane highways in the state that can easily handle a 70 mph speed limit? In addition, reading the bill, it adds a specific provision for these highways to be 70 mph. But freeway portions of routes such as US-31 are still limited at 65 mph.

    US-25???  That highway never entered Indiana.  That route was once through Ohio.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on January 13, 2023, 11:09:08 PM
    Indiana State Road 25
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: hobsini2 on January 14, 2023, 10:56:03 AM
    Just my opinion but these are the stretches in Indiana that I would make a 70 zone. Obviously slower zones in higher volume areas.
    US 24 - Ind 25/Ind 29 Logansport to Ind 9 Huntington except at Peru (60), Wabash (60)
    US 24 - I-469 Ft Wayne to Ohio Line
    US 30 - Ind 49 Valparaiso to I-69 Ft Wayne except at Wanatah (65), Plymouth (65), Warsaw (60), Columbia City (65)
    US 30 - I-469 Ft Wayne to Ohio Line
    US 31 - Keystone Ave Carmel to US 20 South Bend except at Rochester (65)
    US 41 - I-64 north of Evansville to Ind 641 Terre Haute except at Vincennes (60), Oaktown (65), Carlisle (65), Sullivan (65), Shelburn (65), Farmersburg (65)
    US 41 - Ind 63 Carbondale to US 52 Earl Park except at Ind 26 (65)
    US 41 - Iroquois River north of Kentland to Ind 2 west of Lowell
    US 50/150 - US 41 Vincennes to I-69 Washington except at Washington (60)
    US 52 - US 41 Earl Park to US 231 Montmorenci except at Fowler (60)
    US 231 - Kentucky Line to I-64 Dale except at Dale (60)
    Indiana 25 - I-65 Lafayette to US 24/Ind 29 Logansport
    Indiana 37 - I-69 Bloomington to Ind 58 Avoca except at Bloomington (60)
    Indiana 63 - Sanford Rd Terre Haute to US 41 near Carbondale except at Clinton (60), Cayuga (65) and I-74 to US 136 at Foster (60)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on January 14, 2023, 05:06:38 PM
    Any non-divided highways (like super two's) in Indiana worthy of a speed limit boost? 
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on January 14, 2023, 07:40:42 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on January 13, 2023, 11:09:08 PM
    Indiana State Road 25

    They have "U.S. Highway 25" written in the bill...it will have to be corrected before they can do anything with it.

    Driving US 30 in from Ohio to 469, then over Lafayette Center Road to US 24 and SR 25 down to Lafayette, I will vouch for 30, 24, and 25 all needing to be increased.  24 may be the most uphill battle with the signals at Huntington, Wabash, and Peru and the intersection at Logansport at US 35--but they can reduce the limit as needed approaching those.  The speed limit of 60 is frustratingly low on sections like the recently-built SR 25 near Lafayette.
    Ohio has the similarly designed dual carriageways like US 30 from Mansfield to the Indiana line at 70 mph now; no reason Indiana can't do at least 65.  Dropping from 70 to 60 crossing into Indiana on 30 on a road of the same quality is crazy. 
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on January 15, 2023, 10:49:21 AM
    Hope you don't mind me changing the subject as this speed limit stuff is a good discussion but I just saw something recently that I wanted to address involving Indiana and INDOT.

    The Crawfordsville District website has a link to an upcoming rebuild of the Sugar Creek Welcome Center along I-70 eastbound near Terre Haute. It looks like they will have an all new welcome center with extra parking for trucks and stuff. It all looks very good and would be better facility welcoming those along I-70 into the state. But that's not what caught my interest. They also mentioned the state's upcoming welcome center and rest area plan and while I had seen mentions of it before and I know I've talked about it in the past I was able to see what they're actually planning now and I'm not a big fan.

    In short, all the Welcome Centers are going to be rebuilt, which is great, I went to the one at Pigeon Creek along I-69 last year and it looked good. What isn't good will be the elimination of nearly all rest areas from the interstates to the general motoring public.

    This map shows the general plan.
    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52628986843_41e9bbb746_o.png)

    While the welcome centers will stay most of the rest areas along I-64, I-65, I-70 and I-74 will be converted to truck parking areas ONLY. My impression is that these will not be available for cars at all. Also they will have small restroom facilities at these truck parking areas for truckers. Additional parking for trucks is a very good idea but what about those of us driving cars? I guess they really want us to get off at an exit and use the facilities there and help spur the local economy while we're at it.

    So here's a rundown of what's planned on the highways.
    I-64 will have the eastbound welcome center and that's it.
    I-65 will have one welcome center in each direction and that's it. After Henryville no more rest areas along I-65 in the state. Heading south from Kankakee the next "rest area" will be past Louisville, Kentucky! Also the Wolcott rest area is going bye-bye completely.
    I-70's a little better, there will at least be one full-service rest area still in Greenfield.
    I-74 will have a welcome center in each direction and that's it.
    I-94 has a welcome center at Michigan City but nothing's changed on that route.

    I-69 looks to have it a little better. First of all, this is the first I've seen of a planned welcome center around Evansville, probably off one of the exits. If they did this right they could also make it into an Evansville welcome center for southbound I-69 traffic. There's also a planned rest area near the Crane area, probably around the US 231 exit. In addition there's going to be a planned truck parking area around Martinsville. All of this plus the current rest areas north of Muncie and the welcome center/rest area pair north of Fort Wayne. I wonder why I-69 gets a better collection of rest services than I-65's going to get? Obviously the dearth of traveler services south of Indy mean that rest areas and truck parking facilities will actually be needed. I guess the free market economy doesn't work everywhere in this state as services are still pretty sparse south of Bloomington.

    I can get the plans for I-70 and I-74, with the shape of the state and the welcome centers and such I'm almost fine with those. But I-65 I don't like. If I needed to use the bathroom heading north from Indianapolis to Chicago I will NOW have to get off at an exit! And heading south toward Louisville it's the same thing. God I hate this state sometimes. The main benefit to INDOT of course is that they don't have to maintain as many buildings as possible. Why can every other state around us maintain basic rest facilities without it ruining them so much but we have, just have to, eliminate as much as possible to save money?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Rothman on January 15, 2023, 10:58:08 AM
    Rest areas are a known money-suck for DOTs, since the same funding competes for highway and bridge projects.  And, with more and more trucks on the road, it's little surprise that DOTs are picking and choosing which centers to renovate and which ones to demolish and turn into truck parking.

    Car drivers aren't under the same regulations as truckers.  Truckers are required to stop every so many hours.  Therefore, cars are seen as more flexible than trucks in that regard.

    However, I know in NY, there's been considerable concern to not have truck parking in the same vicinity as private truck stops, not only because the State would be in competition with the truck stop unfairly, but because the State doesn't want to assume the cost of the parking that can be provided privately -- again, it's a money-suck.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on January 15, 2023, 11:05:12 AM
    I can't remember the last time I used a rest area in Indiana. If I need to use the restroom, I'd rather also get gas or something to eat that isn't out of a vending machine. If I just need to pull off to address something in the car, an exit ramp shoulder fills that need. I'd rather that money go elsewhere, personally. I might be in the minority, though.

    Pixel 7

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: skluth on January 15, 2023, 11:07:21 AM
    It's also relatively easy for car drivers to pull into a restaurant (or Walmart or Target or Costco) and use the facilities. This is what I do normally as many interstate rest stops are often significantly less sanitary than those run by businesses. Not typically a problem when standing, but not so appealing if you need to sit. And this doesn't even get into whether TP is available in rest stop stalls.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: hobsini2 on January 15, 2023, 01:49:51 PM
    Other than Welcome Centers to get travel info issued by the state, rest areas should only be along stretches where there is a big gap between exits. Something like more than 15 miles. Otherwise, the general public can easily exit and find a local business. The Oases on the Toll Road makes a ton of sense. Not so much on the freeways.

    Also, I am no fan of the current setup for the Lake County Welcome Center for I-80/94 so this is where I would move it and how it is diagramed. This would allow the driver to be directly on the highway instead of exiting off at Kennedy as it currently is.
    New Lake County Welcome Center diagram: https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=1aIOnKoe-O5NBCFY6apGANMw803VtMF8&usp=sharing

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on January 15, 2023, 02:11:13 PM
    Quote from: hobsini2 on January 15, 2023, 01:49:51 PM
    Other than Welcome Centers to get travel info issued by the state, rest areas should only be along stretches where there is a big gap between exits. Something like more than 15 miles. Otherwise, the general public can easily exit and find a local business. The Oases on the Toll Road makes a ton of sense. Not so much on the freeways.

    Also, I am no fan of the current setup for the Lake County Welcome Center for I-80/94 so this is where I would move it and how it is diagramed. This would allow the driver to be directly on the highway instead of exiting off at Kennedy as it currently is.
    New Lake County Welcome Center diagram: https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=1aIOnKoe-O5NBCFY6apGANMw803VtMF8&usp=sharing



    Holy crap! That would be an awesome idea for the Borman Expressway.

    I guess people are fine with less rest areas? Sorry for ranting on that earlier. I guess I just like not having to get off at an exit for a restroom break. I have no problem stopping a gas station for a drink or somewhere for a bit to eat. My experience with Walmarts and the traffic they generate is that I'd rather avoid those places unless I was buying something specifically there.

    When I visit a friend up in Fort Wayne I will generally get a drink at some gas station on my way out of town and then make a pitstop at the rest areas near Muncie for the restroom. After that I can generally head straight for my home without any more stops. I guess I just like doing that sort of thing.

    Back on New Years Day my father and I drove down to Evansville and he needed the restroom so we got off at the Countrymark station off the US 231 exit near Crane. Only the gas station was closed. I mean it was Sunday and a holiday, but completely closed? So we had to drive eight miles north to Bloomfield to use the gas station (I had suggested carrying on to Washington but he couldn't wait that long.) But INDOT is planning something along that stretch of roadway so they must know how sparse services are along that stretch.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: hobsini2 on January 15, 2023, 02:31:04 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on January 15, 2023, 02:11:13 PM
    Quote from: hobsini2 on January 15, 2023, 01:49:51 PM
    Other than Welcome Centers to get travel info issued by the state, rest areas should only be along stretches where there is a big gap between exits. Something like more than 15 miles. Otherwise, the general public can easily exit and find a local business. The Oases on the Toll Road makes a ton of sense. Not so much on the freeways.

    Also, I am no fan of the current setup for the Lake County Welcome Center for I-80/94 so this is where I would move it and how it is diagramed. This would allow the driver to be directly on the highway instead of exiting off at Kennedy as it currently is.
    New Lake County Welcome Center diagram: https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=1aIOnKoe-O5NBCFY6apGANMw803VtMF8&usp=sharing



    Holy crap! That would be an awesome idea for the Borman Expressway.

    I guess people are fine with less rest areas? Sorry for ranting on that earlier. I guess I just like not having to get off at an exit for a restroom break. I have no problem stopping a gas station for a drink or somewhere for a bit to eat. My experience with Walmarts and the traffic they generate is that I'd rather avoid those places unless I was buying something specifically there.

    When I visit a friend up in Fort Wayne I will generally get a drink at some gas station on my way out of town and then make a pitstop at the rest areas near Muncie for the restroom. After that I can generally head straight for my home without any more stops. I guess I just like doing that sort of thing.

    Back on New Years Day my father and I drove down to Evansville and he needed the restroom so we got off at the Countrymark station off the US 231 exit near Crane. Only the gas station was closed. I mean it was Sunday and a holiday, but completely closed? So we had to drive eight miles north to Bloomfield to use the gas station (I had suggested carrying on to Washington but he couldn't wait that long.) But INDOT is planning something along that stretch of roadway so they must know how sparse services are along that stretch.

    Yeah that stretch of 69 between I-64 and Bloomington does need at least one rest area if not 2 due to the lack of towns.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on January 15, 2023, 08:41:51 PM
    Honestly, I am okay with what INDOT is planning on doing with the rest areas... And yes, I do agree that there should be more truck parking on the interstates!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Life in Paradise on January 16, 2023, 10:57:54 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on January 15, 2023, 08:41:51 PM
    Honestly, I am okay with what INDOT is planning on doing with the rest areas... And yes, I do agree that there should be more truck parking on the interstates!
    I'm of the opposite opinion.  If I'm driving along the interstate, I would rather pull into a rest area than get off at an exit.  I look at it as a service that the state can provide, especially in those cases that they already have the land purchased.  It would also be a good place to put some of those charging stations that the states are supposed to be installing and make some money back over time.  I've hated the fact that they closed the I-64 welcome center near Lanesville (west of the Louisville KY metro). 
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: FixThe74Sign on January 16, 2023, 11:27:49 AM
    Put me in the camp of pro rest stops. They tore down the rest stop on 74 Eastbound near the Ohio border last year, and I've noticed lots of trucks parking at the SR 101 exit overnight, resulting in shoulder damage and trash everywhere. And that rest stop was only 10 years old or so...

    I also like using rest stops if I need a quick bathroom break, as I know it's an easy in and easy out, and I generally don't have to gamble and hope I picked a good gas station.

    At least they are going to re-do the Welcome Centers. I know Indiana generally isn't prime road trip country, but I like how the states out West usually have a nice welcome center where you can take a picture of a welcome sign to document your trip.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: skluth on January 16, 2023, 11:54:17 AM
    I understand the desire for a quick break at an interstate rest stop but that means the state needs to keep them sanitary which doesn't always happen. Most of you are also approaching this from a male viewpoint, that is your rest stop needs only require a urinal instead of a clean toilet with toilet paper. Those with families, especially with female members of the family, will know you can't just pull off at any exit and expect them to use any old toilet.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on January 16, 2023, 12:34:03 PM
    Quote from: skluth on January 16, 2023, 11:54:17 AM
    I understand the desire for a quick break at an interstate rest stop but that means the state needs to keep them sanitary which doesn't always happen. Most of you are also approaching this from a male viewpoint, that is your rest stop needs only require a urinal instead of a clean toilet with toilet paper. Those with families, especially with female members of the family, will know you can't just pull off at any exit and expect them to use any old toilet.
    Exactly right. My wife would only use the restroom at a rest stop if it were a dire emergency. We tend to stop at truck stops as they seem to keep their bathrooms the cleanest, especially Love's.

    Now if we had rest stops like Ontario with food courts, small shops, and gas that would be a different story.

    Pixel 7

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes.
    Post by: ITB on January 16, 2023, 01:31:03 PM

    According to the map posted above, there are currently nine Welcome Centers and three Rest Stops. When the I-69 facilities are built, the total will jump to 10 and four, respectively. Just four Rest Stops. Not a large number by any measure, but one has to wonder why can't INDOT devote some temporary parking at the Rest Stops for non-truck vehicles. Perhaps there's a legitimate explanation, but it escapes me.

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: thenetwork on January 16, 2023, 01:33:01 PM
    A lot of the interstate Rest Areas have been improving to add "alternative" rooms when the main Men's or Women's room is closed for cleaning, which I see as a big plus compared to getting off an exit and finding a public restroom, only to find a sign on the door saying, Temporarily Closed For Cleaning" or "Out of order".

    Very rarely have I seen an open state-owned rest area that doesn't have an alternative for a closed Men's or Women's restroom.  It may be a single-seater Unisex or Family bathroom, but it is still an alternative.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on January 16, 2023, 01:50:38 PM

    On another topic, INDOT will be hosting meetings (one in-person, one virtual) later this month on the expansion of I-70 and associated interchange and bridge improvements in Wayne County. The in-person meeting will take place January 23, 2023, on the IU East campus in Richmond. The announcement can be accessed here. (https://www.richmondindiana.gov/news/revive-i70-1-2023)

    Of note, the announcement states construction is anticipated to commence in the Fall of 2024, with a completion date dependent on "project development, construction phasing and future funding."
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on January 17, 2023, 08:18:28 AM
    the SR 37 Project in Fishers has gotten better. they restriped the lanes going southbound to line up correctly and warned you of the right lane being exit only. they have turn 141st into a 1st for me at seeing at least, a signalized RIRO. fishers says that the 141st interchange is still on schedule to be built later this year or early next. this appears to be an ok bandaid in the interim
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on January 17, 2023, 08:49:36 AM
    indot has closed the 56th st ramp to 465 nb for a year to alleviate weaving issues and to give construction workers room to work on clear path.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on January 17, 2023, 03:48:58 PM
    Quote from: FixThe74Sign on January 16, 2023, 11:27:49 AM
    Put me in the camp of pro rest stops. They tore down the rest stop on 74 Eastbound near the Ohio border last year, and I've noticed lots of trucks parking at the SR 101 exit overnight, resulting in shoulder damage and trash everywhere. And that rest stop was only 10 years old or so...

    I also like using rest stops if I need a quick bathroom break, as I know it's an easy in and easy out, and I generally don't have to gamble and hope I picked a good gas station.

    At least they are going to re-do the Welcome Centers. I know Indiana generally isn't prime road trip country, but I like how the states out West usually have a nice welcome center where you can take a picture of a welcome sign to document your trip.

    Rest Areas are important as private businesses come and go, change their hours, etc. and while the services off a highway may have restrooms, it isn't really their job to provide them to every traveler including those who buy nothing but have to "go". 
    Driving semi-frequently from NE Ohio to Lafayette, IN via I-71, US 30, I-469, US 24, and IN 25, it is amazing the difference between Ohio and Indiana in rest areas.  On US 30 in Ohio alone, you have 4 rest areas between Mansfield and the Indiana line.  Plus another on I-71.  It has really made a difference when many times, due to necessity, I am making the trip late at night and some businesses are closed mostly overnight that used to be open then.  I used to use the Owens store (now Kroger) in Huntington as a de facto rest area (to use the restroom, walk/stretch a minute before the final 90 minutes of the westbound trip) but they are no longer open 24 hours.  There are fast food and gas places that aren't open overnight either--the new Casey's stations in Huntington and Peru close by 12am if not earlier.  I suppose you could pull in to the Hampton Inn in Wabash and beg to use the restroom or something.  At least Ohio has a number of rest areas and they are well-maintained.  The first sign entering Ohio on US 30 EB from Indiana is "Rest Area 9 miles" so they must be aware that people coming in from Indiana may need it!  :P
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: dvferyance on January 31, 2023, 09:07:57 PM
    I use Fair Oaks Farms at Exit 220 as my rest stop on I-65 through Indaina. It's not far from the Walcott Rest Area so I am perfectly fine with that one going away. They have got some great ice cream it's a stop I would highly recommend while traveling through there. And it's an easy exit not much traffic.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on February 11, 2023, 06:49:49 PM
    https://www.wthr.com/video/news/local/indiana-lawmakers-to-discuss-future-of-bill-on-worksite-speed-control/531-1b4eb8e5-9ad3-47b5-a6f5-f4fcfb822ce7

    Worksite speed cameras could be coming to Indiana...
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: westerninterloper on February 12, 2023, 03:50:09 PM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on January 17, 2023, 03:48:58 PM
    Quote from: FixThe74Sign on January 16, 2023, 11:27:49 AM
    Put me in the camp of pro rest stops. They tore down the rest stop on 74 Eastbound near the Ohio border last year, and I've noticed lots of trucks parking at the SR 101 exit overnight, resulting in shoulder damage and trash everywhere. And that rest stop was only 10 years old or so...

    I also like using rest stops if I need a quick bathroom break, as I know it's an easy in and easy out, and I generally don't have to gamble and hope I picked a good gas station.

    At least they are going to re-do the Welcome Centers. I know Indiana generally isn't prime road trip country, but I like how the states out West usually have a nice welcome center where you can take a picture of a welcome sign to document your trip.

    Rest Areas are important as private businesses come and go, change their hours, etc. and while the services off a highway may have restrooms, it isn't really their job to provide them to every traveler including those who buy nothing but have to "go". 
    Driving semi-frequently from NE Ohio to Lafayette, IN via I-71, US 30, I-469, US 24, and IN 25, it is amazing the difference between Ohio and Indiana in rest areas.  On US 30 in Ohio alone, you have 4 rest areas between Mansfield and the Indiana line.  Plus another on I-71.  It has really made a difference when many times, due to necessity, I am making the trip late at night and some businesses are closed mostly overnight that used to be open then.  I used to use the Owens store (now Kroger) in Huntington as a de facto rest area (to use the restroom, walk/stretch a minute before the final 90 minutes of the westbound trip) but they are no longer open 24 hours.  There are fast food and gas places that aren't open overnight either--the new Casey's stations in Huntington and Peru close by 12am if not earlier.  I suppose you could pull in to the Hampton Inn in Wabash and beg to use the restroom or something.  At least Ohio has a number of rest areas and they are well-maintained.  The first sign entering Ohio on US 30 EB from Indiana is "Rest Area 9 miles" so they must be aware that people coming in from Indiana may need it!  :P

    I drive a lot between Ohio and Indiana and notice those differences too. When I was growing up in indiana, there were about twice as many rest areas, many of them small picnic areas, as there are now. Indiana has slowly rebuilt better rest areas (I-69 between FtW and Indy), but still has several that are old (I 70 west of Indy) and stretches where there are none (I-69 between Indy and Evansville).

    The new Indiana Toll Road rest stops are an improvement, but can't compare to the Ohio Turnpike rest areas, which I think have to be the best in the country.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: 2trailertrucker on February 15, 2023, 04:56:23 AM
    Quote from: westerninterloper on February 12, 2023, 03:50:09 PM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on January 17, 2023, 03:48:58 PM
    Quote from: FixThe74Sign on January 16, 2023, 11:27:49 AM
    Put me in the camp of pro rest stops. They tore down the rest stop on 74 Eastbound near the Ohio border last year, and I've noticed lots of trucks parking at the SR 101 exit overnight, resulting in shoulder damage and trash everywhere. And that rest stop was only 10 years old or so...

    I also like using rest stops if I need a quick bathroom break, as I know it's an easy in and easy out, and I generally don't have to gamble and hope I picked a good gas station.

    At least they are going to re-do the Welcome Centers. I know Indiana generally isn't prime road trip country, but I like how the states out West usually have a nice welcome center where you can take a picture of a welcome sign to document your trip.

    Rest Areas are important as private businesses come and go, change their hours, etc. and while the services off a highway may have restrooms, it isn't really their job to provide them to every traveler including those who buy nothing but have to "go". 
    Driving semi-frequently from NE Ohio to Lafayette, IN via I-71, US 30, I-469, US 24, and IN 25, it is amazing the difference between Ohio and Indiana in rest areas.  On US 30 in Ohio alone, you have 4 rest areas between Mansfield and the Indiana line.  Plus another on I-71.  It has really made a difference when many times, due to necessity, I am making the trip late at night and some businesses are closed mostly overnight that used to be open then.  I used to use the Owens store (now Kroger) in Huntington as a de facto rest area (to use the restroom, walk/stretch a minute before the final 90 minutes of the westbound trip) but they are no longer open 24 hours.  There are fast food and gas places that aren't open overnight either--the new Casey's stations in Huntington and Peru close by 12am if not earlier.  I suppose you could pull in to the Hampton Inn in Wabash and beg to use the restroom or something.  At least Ohio has a number of rest areas and they are well-maintained.  The first sign entering Ohio on US 30 EB from Indiana is "Rest Area 9 miles" so they must be aware that people coming in from Indiana may need it!  :P

    I drive a lot between Ohio and Indiana and notice those differences too. When I was growing up in indiana, there were about twice as many rest areas, many of them small picnic areas, as there are now. Indiana has slowly rebuilt better rest areas (I-69 between FtW and Indy), but still has several that are old (I 70 west of Indy) and stretches where there are none (I-69 between Indy and Evansville).

    The new Indiana Toll Road rest stops are an improvement, but can't compare to the Ohio Turnpike rest areas, which I think have to be the best in the country.

    Indiana has closed several rest areas in the past few years. Going so far as tear down the buildings and the roads, and burying it in dirt. With the severe lack of truck parking, and the state is not broke, you would think they would make them truck parking areas at the least.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on February 15, 2023, 04:11:31 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on February 11, 2023, 06:49:49 PM
    https://www.wthr.com/video/news/local/indiana-lawmakers-to-discuss-future-of-bill-on-worksite-speed-control/531-1b4eb8e5-9ad3-47b5-a6f5-f4fcfb822ce7

    Worksite speed cameras could be coming to Indiana...

    it's impossible to do the construction speed limit. if you try, everyone around you tries to run you off the road  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on February 15, 2023, 04:49:38 PM
    Quote from: 2trailertrucker on February 15, 2023, 04:56:23 AM
    Indiana has closed several rest areas in the past few years. Going so far as tear down the buildings and the roads, and burying it in dirt. With the severe lack of truck parking, and the state is not broke, you would think they would make them truck parking areas at the least.

    INDOT does have a plan to more than double the amount of truck parking over the next 10 years. It's part of the state's upgrade of it rest areas and welcome centers, plus the building of two new truck parking facilities on I-69 — one in Martinsville, the other near Crane.

    According to a Truckers News article (https://www.truckersnews.com/news/article/15114054/indiana-rest-area-project-will-more-than-double-interstate-truck-parking), published August 23, 2021, the upgrade of the Pigeon Creek Welcome Center near Angola has already been completed, and work was starting on the Kankakee rest area on Interstate 65 in Jasper County.

    Also, this summer, according to a news report (https://www.kokomotribune.com/indiana/news/work-on-new-i-70-32m-welcome-center-starts-this-summer/article_6ba3f8f0-208b-5cf2-b389-1a27a974b139.html), construction is expected to commence on the Clear Creek Welcome Center and Rest Area (https://www.in.gov/indot/about-indot/central-office/welcome-to-the-crawfordsville-district/clear-creek-welcome-center/) in Vigo County.

    Edit: grammar
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: sprjus4 on February 15, 2023, 11:19:25 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on February 15, 2023, 04:11:31 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on February 11, 2023, 06:49:49 PM
    https://www.wthr.com/video/news/local/indiana-lawmakers-to-discuss-future-of-bill-on-worksite-speed-control/531-1b4eb8e5-9ad3-47b5-a6f5-f4fcfb822ce7

    Worksite speed cameras could be coming to Indiana...

    it's impossible to do the construction speed limit. if you try, everyone around you tries to run you off the road  :-D
    What is up with Indiana's obsession with 45 mph work zones? Would 55 mph hurt too much?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on February 21, 2023, 11:23:06 AM
    I was bored Saturday and drove the new route of 28. The signage is meh, just enough to get you around Tipton. for some reason the last exit sign for 26 wasn't changed to show 28 on it. Also along the way on 26 and 19, 28 isn't cosigned, but the jogs are signed. I did notice that division road is signed as Truck 28 but only at the ends with 31 and 19. man it would have been great for that to just be 28, but I am assuming cost was the factor there. Someone earlier said the new routing was way out of the way, I don't agree, didn't feel like that at all to me driving it. 19 is now signed on the little bypass in Tipton and that seems to work pretty well. all in all it seems to be working well.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on February 21, 2023, 07:33:35 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on February 21, 2023, 11:23:06 AM
    I was bored Saturday and drove the new route of 28. The signage is meh, just enough to get you around Tipton. for some reason the last exit sign for 26 wasn't changed to show 28 on it. Also along the way on 26 and 19, 28 isn't cosigned, but the jogs are signed. I did notice that division road is signed as Truck 28 but only at the ends with 31 and 19. man it would have been great for that to just be 28, but I am assuming cost was the factor there. Someone earlier said the new routing was way out of the way, I don't agree, didn't feel like that at all to me driving it. 19 is now signed on the little bypass in Tipton and that seems to work pretty well. all in all it seems to be working well.
    The newly placed "28"  and "19"  signage seems adequate to show the new routes and the routes are logical. I am disappointed the new concurrency segments lack signage. Easily, there could be at least a dozen more signs / shields erected to just meet the normal standard of JCT and reassurance placements. I caught in the Tipton Tribune that there are INDOT plans to install a roundabout at IN 19, Park Road, and Main Street. City and County officials are working on their side of the equation - Division Road truck route designation and downtown signals vs stop signs are in debate (and under study).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SSR_317 on February 23, 2023, 11:15:56 AM
    Quote from: sprjus4 on February 15, 2023, 11:19:25 PM
    What is up with Indiana's obsession with 45 mph work zones? Would 55 mph hurt too much?
    I think it's because we Hoosiers tend to automatically add (at least) 10 MPH to all posted speed limits when we're behind the wheel. So they post the work zones at 45, hoping people will slow down to 55.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on March 07, 2023, 04:12:41 PM
    the ramp meters INDOT promised us are almost here. East side exits on 465 from 65 to 70 (SE Side of town) have pedestal poles installed, I wonder when they will go online.  :hmmm: saw this in the news last year and it looks like it's finally going to happen.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: The Ghostbuster on March 07, 2023, 08:48:32 PM
    How common are ramp meters in Indiana? There are some on the Beltline here in Madison, and in southeast Wisconsin they are everywhere.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 07, 2023, 09:04:58 PM
    Quote from: The Ghostbuster on March 07, 2023, 08:48:32 PM
    How common are ramp meters in Indiana? There are some on the Beltline here in Madison, and in southeast Wisconsin they are everywhere.

    Not common at all. I think that section of I-465 will be the first to have them installed in the state. I know there's talk of putting them on I-80/94 between I-294 and I-65 in the future, but that is still in the study phase.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on March 08, 2023, 07:19:28 AM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 07, 2023, 09:04:58 PM
    Quote from: The Ghostbuster on March 07, 2023, 08:48:32 PM
    How common are ramp meters in Indiana? There are some on the Beltline here in Madison, and in southeast Wisconsin they are everywhere.

    Not common at all. I think that section of I-465 will be the first to have them installed in the state. I know there's talk of putting them on I-80/94 between I-294 and I-65 in the future, but that is still in the study phase.

    I'm pretty sure these are the first.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ysuindy on March 10, 2023, 03:51:55 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on January 17, 2023, 08:18:28 AM
    the SR 37 Project in Fishers has gotten better. they restriped the lanes going southbound to line up correctly and warned you of the right lane being exit only. they have turn 141st into a 1st for me at seeing at least, a signalized RIRO. fishers says that the 141st interchange is still on schedule to be built later this year or early next. this appears to be an ok bandaid in the interim

    I noticed last week that all the construction signs, barrels and lower speed limits have been removed from the SR 27 project in Fishers.  This should continue until they start work on the 141st interchange.

    There are green mile marker signs installed every one tenth of a mile.  On the shoulders where possible, in the median when it occurs at an underpass.

    There are "freeway ends" signs where the ramp to northbound 37 from 146th ends.   There is a rogue orange construction ends sign up the near Greenfield Avenue, which is actually the first access to 37 after the "freeway ends" signs.

    The morning commute is often interesting trying to merge in to traffic on 37.  The ramps are not that long and having just a half mile between the 131st and 126th ramps makes for a short merge zone, particularly with the people who hug the right lane because they are exiting farther down the road.  I haven't had to go up and down the 126th street ramps yet, but I bet it happens sometime.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SSR_317 on March 11, 2023, 10:01:46 AM
    Quote from: ysuindy on March 10, 2023, 03:51:55 PM

    ...

    The morning commute is often interesting trying to merge in to traffic on 37.  The ramps are not that long and having just a half mile between the 131st and 126th ramps makes for a short merge zone, particularly with the people who hug the right lane because they are exiting farther down the road.  I haven't had to go up and down the 126th street ramps yet, but I bet it happens sometime.
    This is what occurs when the state lets local entities do their own thing rather than enforcing standards on them. Same thing occurred on Keystone Avenue when the state relinquished S.R. 431 to the city of Carmel. They promptly turned it into a sub-standard freeway, designed & built as cheaply as possible, which they now call "Keystone Parkway".
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on March 11, 2023, 11:06:41 AM
    Quote from: SSR_317 on March 11, 2023, 10:01:46 AM
    Quote from: ysuindy on March 10, 2023, 03:51:55 PM

    ...

    The morning commute is often interesting trying to merge in to traffic on 37.  The ramps are not that long and having just a half mile between the 131st and 126th ramps makes for a short merge zone, particularly with the people who hug the right lane because they are exiting farther down the road.  I haven't had to go up and down the 126th street ramps yet, but I bet it happens sometime.
    This is what occurs when the state lets local entities do their own thing rather than enforcing standards on them. Same thing occurred on Keystone Avenue when the state relinquished S.R. 431 to the city of Carmel. They promptly turned it into a sub-standard freeway, designed & built as cheaply as possible, which they now call "Keystone Parkway".

    they have to have had to follow INDOT standards for 37 since INDOT will retake control of the road once the project finishes. Keystone is not a state road so Carmel could do whatever they wanted to it.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on March 14, 2023, 11:02:24 PM
    https://www.nwitimes.com/business/transportation/indiana-highway-speed-camera-enforcement-heading-for-final-approval/article_d6890c4e-b5a7-5e83-a21d-85d79c1be02c.html

    We are one step closer to getting speed cameras in construction zones in Indiana as the Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Transportation voted 8-1 to advance House-approved speed camera legislation to the full Senate for a decision – possibly as soon as next week – on sending House Bill 1015 to Republican Gov. Eric Holcomb to be signed into law.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 18, 2023, 04:10:56 PM
    Back to work on Northwest Indiana expressways.

    Traffic on I-80/94 in both directions have already been shifted to the outside as work to finish concrete restoration between I-65 and Cline Avenue. The bigger concern will be on I-65.

    Starting next week, two sections of I-65 will be under construction for more concrete restoration. The first section targets the area between 61st Avenue and I-80/94.

    Work will start to shift the northbound lanes to the outside shoulder, with both shoulders closed in that direction. After said shift, southbound lanes will be moved to the inside, with the farthest left lane crossing over into the northbound side (the counter flow). Southbound access to and from Ridge Road (including the slip ramp from the I-80/94 east to I-65 south connector) will be closed off until completion, which is set for early- to mid-June.

    The more challenging section involves the area between 73rd and 137th Avenues (for reference, from just north of US 30 to just south of US 231). Next week, both directions will be down to two lanes, after which northbound traffic will be shifted into the southbound lanes to allow crews to do full restoration on the northbound side. As a result, the ramp from US 231 to I-65 north, as well as the northbound exit and entry ramps at 109th Avenue will be closed. All work there is set for August completion.

    Detours for impacted ramp closures will likely involve Indiana 53 (southbound from Ridge to US 30, and northbound from US 231/109th Avenue to US 30).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: TempoNick on March 28, 2023, 02:36:34 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 06, 2022, 05:53:52 PM
    Officials are looking to confer with federal transportation authorities and INDOT about the feasibility of having an interchange there.

    I thought the days when federal officials had a say about what happens with interstates was something from a bygone era. What do the feds know about Indiana's needs? When they built i-670 here in Columbus local officials were telling them we needed four lanes in each direction. They insisted on three.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on March 28, 2023, 02:40:02 PM
    Quote from: TempoNick on March 28, 2023, 02:36:34 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 06, 2022, 05:53:52 PM
    Officials are looking to confer with federal transportation authorities and INDOT about the feasibility of having an interchange there.

    I thought the days when federal officials had a say about what happens with interstates was something from a bygone era. What do the feds know about Indiana's needs? When they built i-670 here in Columbus local officials were telling them we needed four lanes in each direction. They insisted on three.

    I believe the feds are always involved in interstate matters that involve a major change, especially when it's an interchange being added or modified.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on April 07, 2023, 10:35:30 PM
    Wanted to check to make sure this wasn't previously mentioned first.

    The Indiana Toll Road is currently undergoing the Northwest Indiana Bridge Rehabilitation Project, with a focus on the bridges near the West Point Toll Plaza (at the Illinois State Line) and the Cline Avenue exit near the Gary-Chicago Airport.

    At West Point: I-90 in both directions will be reduced to one lane (two lanes between Cline Avenue and the toll barrier). While the Indianapolis Boulevard exit will be open westbound, eastbound access to the Indiana Toll Road from Indianapolis Boulevard will be closed. Local traffic using 108th Avenue will be rerouted around the underpass. Those looking to enter the Toll Road from the state line will be required to drive down to Calumet Avenue (US 41), where access to the Toll Road will be available.

    At Cline Avenue (Exit 10), all entry and exit ramps are closed. Westbound traffic is asked to use Cline Avenue to Indiana 312 west, then to US 41 north where westbound access is available. (If you're willing to pay to cross the Cline Avenue bridge, this is the much quicker route). Eastbound traffic is asked to use Cline Avenue south to US 12/20 east (5th Avenue), driving through downtown Gary to reach the Toll Road at entry 17. Toll Road traffic looking to exit to Cline Avenue will be asked to use US 12/20 west (via exit 17 westbound) or Calumet Avenue south to Indiana 312 east (eastbound, though it would be quicker to use exit 3 - Cline Avenue eastbound - if you're willing to pay the bridge toll). This project is expected to last through the summer.

    On the Toll Road itself, the non-EZPass lanes will have the automated machines refitted to accept Apple and Google Pay (ramps included), along with updates to the EZPass readers themselves. The Elkhart, Elkhart East, Angola (I-69), and Eastgate plazas have already been refitted. More to come.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on April 12, 2023, 01:40:56 AM
    https://www.newsbug.info/news/national/indiana/plan-for-indiana-speed-camera-enforcement-headed-to-governors-desk/article_d9ab5fee-3b62-50cb-8806-4afc3b9873d5.html

    The speed cameras for work zones are heading to the governor's desk for his signature...  :clap:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on April 14, 2023, 09:55:15 PM
    are they going to close 465 in between 70 and 65 on the sw side? I see they have installed detour signs all along 70 from the south split out to 465. and I see big orange signs showing something happening to 465 west of 65 on sb 465 on the east side.  :hmmm:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: pianocello on April 14, 2023, 11:34:14 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on April 14, 2023, 09:55:15 PM
    are they going to close 465 in between 70 and 65 on the sw side? I see they have installed detour signs all along 70 from the south split out to 465. and I see big orange signs showing something happening to 465 west of 65 on sb 465 on the east side.  :hmmm:

    It won't be closed entirely, but they're adding a lane in each direction as part of the I-69 project IIRC. Part of that is bringing at least one direction of 465 down to 1 lane for a couple days at a time, which could be what that big orange sign is.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: sprjus4 on April 14, 2023, 11:37:55 PM
    Or overnight closures possibly?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: pianocello on April 14, 2023, 11:44:28 PM
    ^Maybe in the future, but everything that's been announced up to now is planning to keep at least lane open on I-465, according to the  latest update (https://i69finishline.com/on-track-project-update-april-10-2023/).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on April 15, 2023, 01:32:47 AM
    I travel this highway every day and I've too seen those orange signs. I think they are just generic warnings about the construction along that stretch of road. Basically the signs will offer a general detour route around the construction as an alternative route around that part of 465. They are probably waiting until the North Split project is over though before they're unveiled. I would imagine INDOT would want to be keeping traffic ON I-65 and I-70 through the city instead of taking the bypass around the city, basically the complete opposite of what they've been encouraging the last almost two years. That's likely what's prompting the signs, they're going from encouraging/forcing traffic to stay on 465 to encouraging them not to take 465.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Revive 755 on April 15, 2023, 10:39:25 PM
    From recent travels:

    * There's still a circular state route marker on WB IN 2 for the first roundabout west of US 30. (https://goo.gl/maps/DsXXeGHJrtESqxPB8)

    * There's a real interesting setup on the eastbound Borman to maintain a fourth through lane through one of the interchanges using the auxiliary lanes.  There is an extremely steep change in cross slope and a variation of 'all lanes' signage.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: TempoNick on April 16, 2023, 02:41:17 PM
    This one in Worthington, Ohio, has been there a long time.


    https://maps.app.goo.gl/D9Sz43VhnsD3k45j8
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: 74/171FAN on April 16, 2023, 06:42:18 PM
    Quote from: TempoNick on April 16, 2023, 02:41:17 PM
    This one in Worthington, Ohio, has been there a long time.


    https://maps.app.goo.gl/D9Sz43VhnsD3k45j8

    And was covered on yesterday's Columbus Meet. 
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: TempoNick on April 16, 2023, 08:12:47 PM
    Quote from: 74/171FAN on April 16, 2023, 06:42:18 PM
    Quote from: TempoNick on April 16, 2023, 02:41:17 PM
    This one in Worthington, Ohio, has been there a long time.


    https://maps.app.goo.gl/D9Sz43VhnsD3k45j8

    And was covered on yesterday's Columbus Meet.

    What is that? Did you guys meet in person or something?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Rothman on April 16, 2023, 08:15:21 PM
    Quote from: TempoNick on April 16, 2023, 08:12:47 PM
    Quote from: 74/171FAN on April 16, 2023, 06:42:18 PM
    Quote from: TempoNick on April 16, 2023, 02:41:17 PM
    This one in Worthington, Ohio, has been there a long time.


    https://maps.app.goo.gl/D9Sz43VhnsD3k45j8

    And was covered on yesterday's Columbus Meet.

    What is that? Did you guys meet in person or something?
    Yes, they did.  When you see a meet-up thread, that's exactly what they mean.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on April 17, 2023, 08:03:08 PM
    So it looks like the new exit at CR 300 N will replace the existing US 52 interchange and will have 52 be rerouted to this new exit to get back onto its old alignment.

    https://iedc.in.gov/leap-lebanon

    Check that link for a map. Kind of weird if you ask me, but I think it's to provide a full access interchange which the current one does not do.

    SR 32 will also be realigned to be way south of where it is now.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tosa on April 18, 2023, 08:17:39 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on April 17, 2023, 08:03:08 PM
    So it looks like the new exit at CR 300 N will replace the existing US 52 interchange and will have 52 be rerouted to this new exit to get back onto its old alignment.

    https://iedc.in.gov/leap-lebanon

    Check that link for a map. Kind of weird if you ask me, but I think it's to provide a full access interchange which the current one does not do.

    SR 32 will also be realigned to be way south of where it is now.

    The map shows the current NB entrance and SB exit ramps will be kept. It doesn't make sense to me, why not remove all the ramps and build an overpass?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on April 18, 2023, 08:19:24 AM
    Quote from: tosa on April 18, 2023, 08:17:39 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on April 17, 2023, 08:03:08 PM
    So it looks like the new exit at CR 300 N will replace the existing US 52 interchange and will have 52 be rerouted to this new exit to get back onto its old alignment.

    https://iedc.in.gov/leap-lebanon

    Check that link for a map. Kind of weird if you ask me, but I think it's to provide a full access interchange which the current one does not do.

    SR 32 will also be realigned to be way south of where it is now.

    i think it's an error, it looks like the old road will just dead end. they already got rid of the old lafayette ave. ramps recently and those are still showing up.

    The map shows the current NB entrance and SB exit ramps will be kept. It doesn't make sense to me, why not remove all the ramps and build an overpass?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on April 18, 2023, 08:23:06 AM
    This is a site marketing the new warehouse district. I wouldn't take their maps as gospel.

    Pixel 7

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on April 18, 2023, 11:42:09 AM
    Quote from: bmeiser on April 18, 2023, 08:23:06 AM
    This is a site marketing the new warehouse district. I wouldn't take their maps as gospel.

    Pixel 7

    As with any major development like the LEAP district, designs and plans tend to change and be modified over time as the process moves forward. Will the final result be what is planned today? Maybe. Maybe not. It's to be expected.

    The organization behind the LEAP district's creation is the Indiana Economic Development Corporation (IEDC), the state's large public private partnership entrusted with spurring economic development. Construction of the last section of I-69, Section 6, for instance, was placed under the IEDC to facilitate funding mechanisms.

    https://www.iedc.in.gov/

    Edit: typo
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on April 18, 2023, 11:53:39 AM

    Haven't seen this mentioned yet. Last week INDOT officially awarded the construction contract to extend Ronald Reagan Parkway from CR 600N to CR 750N in Hendricks County. White Construction of Clinton, IN, which submitted the winning bid of $37,940,000, will be the lead contractor. Construction is likely to get underway sometime this summer, if not earlier.

    The updated official results of INDOT's March 15, 2023 lettings can be found  here. (https://www.in.gov/dot/div/contracts/letting/archive/2023/mar15/20230315_Officials.pdf)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on April 18, 2023, 12:15:43 PM
    geeze that's pricey! I wonder if it's because it has a rail bridge on it  :hmmm:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: jnewkirk77 on April 20, 2023, 12:00:44 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on April 17, 2023, 08:03:08 PM
    So it looks like the new exit at CR 300 N will replace the existing US 52 interchange and will have 52 be rerouted to this new exit to get back onto its old alignment.

    https://iedc.in.gov/leap-lebanon

    Check that link for a map. Kind of weird if you ask me, but I think it's to provide a full access interchange which the current one does not do.

    SR 32 will also be realigned to be way south of where it is now.

    That map is a flat-out mess

    The final decision hasn't yet been made on where 52 is going to tie into 65 yet. That's coming this summer.  And none of the options that were shown to the public look anything like this.

    And as far as 32 goes, the S-curve (shown as being between CRs 400W and 500W) is actually between 250W and 325W.  I don't know of any plans for any changes to that ... and there's really no need for there to be.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on April 21, 2023, 09:28:59 AM
    Anyone that uses 465 on the SE side regularly notice if the ramp meters are complete? I assume they wouldn't be functioning yet because I would expect a massive media blitz about them and how they work.  :hmmm: Over a month ago I noticed some on the US 40 exit being installed.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tosa on April 21, 2023, 04:07:33 PM
    Quote from: ITB on April 18, 2023, 11:53:39 AM

    Haven't seen this mentioned yet. Last week INDOT officially awarded the construction contract to extend Ronald Reagan Parkway from CR 600N to CR 750N in Hendricks County. White Construction of Clinton, IN, which submitted the winning bid of $37,940,000, will be the lead contractor. Construction is likely to get underway sometime this summer, if not earlier.

    The updated official results of INDOT's March 15, 2023 lettings can be found  here. (https://www.in.gov/dot/div/contracts/letting/archive/2023/mar15/20230315_Officials.pdf)

    Wow, the length is less than 1.5 miles (measured in Google Earth), but the project costs almost $40M? The I-469 is more than 30 miles but the cost was only $341M (2021 equivalent, Wikipedia). What are they going to build there?

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: jnewkirk77 on April 21, 2023, 06:40:24 PM
    Quote from: tosa on April 21, 2023, 04:07:33 PM
    Quote from: ITB on April 18, 2023, 11:53:39 AM

    Haven't seen this mentioned yet. Last week INDOT officially awarded the construction contract to extend Ronald Reagan Parkway from CR 600N to CR 750N in Hendricks County. White Construction of Clinton, IN, which submitted the winning bid of $37,940,000, will be the lead contractor. Construction is likely to get underway sometime this summer, if not earlier.

    The updated official results of INDOT's March 15, 2023 lettings can be found  here. (https://www.in.gov/dot/div/contracts/letting/archive/2023/mar15/20230315_Officials.pdf)

    Wow, the length is less than 1.5 miles (measured in Google Earth), but the project costs almost $40M? The I-469 is more than 30 miles but the cost was only $341M (2021 equivalent, Wikipedia). What are they going to build there?

    If memory serves, they're going to build a railroad overpass, so that alone is a pretty big chunk.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on April 21, 2023, 08:34:45 PM
    ya it has to be the rail bridge. rail bridges have to be minimum 23.5' above the tracks, so that requires a TON of earthwork to raise the road to get over the tracks!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: jhuntin1 on April 22, 2023, 01:58:10 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on April 21, 2023, 09:28:59 AM
    Anyone that uses 465 on the SE side regularly notice if the ramp meters are complete? I assume they wouldn't be functioning yet because I would expect a massive media blitz about them and how they work.  :hmmm: Over a month ago I noticed some on the US 40 exit being installed.
    They're not ready yet. The vertical poles are up for most of them, at least at Southeastern Ave. and Emerson Ave., and I've seen them work on electrical wiring. I don't think they'll be ready before the end of summer.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on April 25, 2023, 08:04:11 PM
    Good news everyone! Both directions of 65 will open Sunday 4/30/23 through the north split! Only thing left is the C/D. I can confirm this by reading the posted signage on the VMS boards on 65s.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on April 26, 2023, 02:53:00 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on April 25, 2023, 08:04:11 PM
    Good news everyone! Both directions of 65 will open Sunday 4/30/23 through the north split! Only thing left is the C/D. I can confirm this by reading the posted signage on the VMS boards on 65s.


    That's great news. INDOT, in my opinion, was feeling the heat from the Indy politicos, the mayor, and so on, to get this project done! And now, finally, that moment has nearly arrived.

    As for the Ronald Reagan Parkway, I came across an news article that provides perspective on the road's history and its future extension to Boone County. Access the article here. (https://www.therepublicannewspaper.com/news/plans-to-extend-ronald-reagan-parkway-continue/article_86c14146-a276-11ed-85b4-4f52b9d6232b.html)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Interstate 69 Fan on April 26, 2023, 03:19:59 PM
    Quote from: ITB on April 26, 2023, 02:53:00 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on April 25, 2023, 08:04:11 PM
    Good news everyone! Both directions of 65 will open Sunday 4/30/23 through the north split! Only thing left is the C/D. I can confirm this by reading the posted signage on the VMS boards on 65s.


    That's great news. INDOT, in my opinion, was feeling the heat from the Indy politicos, the mayor, and so on, to get this project done! And now, finally, that moment has nearly arrived.

    As for the Ronald Reagan Parkway, I came across an news article that provides perspective on the road's history and its future extension to Boone County. Access the article here. (https://www.therepublicannewspaper.com/news/plans-to-extend-ronald-reagan-parkway-continue/article_86c14146-a276-11ed-85b4-4f52b9d6232b.html)
    Crazy to think one day RR Pkwy will extend from I-65 on the northwest side to basically I-69 on the southern side. First steps to a 2nd loop around the city perhaps? I doubt it unfortunately, though.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on April 26, 2023, 09:16:23 PM
    Quote from: Interstate 69 Fan on April 26, 2023, 03:19:59 PM
    Quote from: ITB on April 26, 2023, 02:53:00 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on April 25, 2023, 08:04:11 PM
    Good news everyone! Both directions of 65 will open Sunday 4/30/23 through the north split! Only thing left is the C/D. I can confirm this by reading the posted signage on the VMS boards on 65s.


    That's great news. INDOT, in my opinion, was feeling the heat from the Indy politicos, the mayor, and so on, to get this project done! And now, finally, that moment has nearly arrived.

    As for the Ronald Reagan Parkway, I came across an news article that provides perspective on the road's history and its future extension to Boone County. Access the article here. (https://www.therepublicannewspaper.com/news/plans-to-extend-ronald-reagan-parkway-continue/article_86c14146-a276-11ed-85b4-4f52b9d6232b.html)
    Crazy to think one day RR Pkwy will extend from I-65 on the northwest side to basically I-69 on the southern side. First steps to a 2nd loop around the city perhaps? I doubt it unfortunately, though.

    The donut counties are doing a "Secret Outer Loop" 146th St, Mt Comfort Road, RR Pkwy, and Worthsville Road. They all sort of connect, or at least will eventually indirectly.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ibthebigd on April 27, 2023, 04:40:30 AM
    A decent 4 Lane road from I-74 to Greenwood would be nice.

    Especially for people trying to avoid the toll bridges in Louisville and going thru Cincinnati isn't much farther

    SM-G996U

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on April 27, 2023, 05:29:06 AM
    It won't be perfect though. RR Pkwy connects with Ameriplex Parkway which currently ends at SR 67. Plans are in place to extend it toward Southport Road which could lead into a connection with I-69. But there is no way that Southport can be widened east of there. Worthsville Road is several miles south of there and will have no connection to Ameriplex or RR Pkwy. Likewise I don't think there's much interest in Mt. Comfort Road south of I-70 and especially south of New Palestine, so any connection around that southeast corner is non-existent.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on April 27, 2023, 04:13:51 PM
    RR Pkwy is supposed to tie into 267 eventually. I remember seeing a planning map years ago showing this. When this happens you will have an at grade road from 69 to 70. Southport Rd/Ameriplex Pkwy/RR Pkwy/Albert S. White/ 146th/Mt. Comfort Rd. maybe London Road will be upgraded one day. If RR Pkwy does ever make it to 267 I bet INDOT will decommission 267.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on April 27, 2023, 06:52:19 PM
    Quote from: ibthebigd on April 27, 2023, 04:40:30 AM
    A decent 4 Lane road from I-74 to Greenwood would be nice.

    Especially for people trying to avoid the toll bridges in Louisville and going thru Cincinnati isn't much farther

    SM-G996U



    That would basically be the County Road 400 North corridor in Shelby County. It nearly connects with Worthsville Road. Of course it is currently a two-lane road.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: jhuntin1 on April 28, 2023, 10:01:22 AM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on April 27, 2023, 06:52:19 PM
    Quote from: ibthebigd on April 27, 2023, 04:40:30 AM
    A decent 4 Lane road from I-74 to Greenwood would be nice.

    Especially for people trying to avoid the toll bridges in Louisville and going thru Cincinnati isn't much farther

    SM-G996U


    That would basically be the County Road 400 North corridor in Shelby County. It nearly connects with Worthsville Road. Of course it is currently a two-lane road.

    Rocklane Road (Main St. in Greenwood) also nearly connects with County Road 400 North, and it's what I use to get to I-74. The traffic on those roads is light enough that four lanes is not necessary. CR400N is the Fairland exit with the horse track/casino.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on April 28, 2023, 04:00:51 PM
    On another matter, Heidelberg Materials announced (https://finance.yahoo.com/news/heidelberg-materials-announces-first-clinker-120000645.html) earlier this week that its expanded, state-of-the-art cement plant in Mitchell, Indiana, has started production. The complex is now the second largest cement facility in the U.S. Some of the plant's new parts were so big and heavy, they were transported by barge (https://www.wfyi.org/news/articles/indiana-port-readies-to-handle-big-cargo-for-cement-plant) on the Mississippi and Ohio rivers, then trucked to Mitchell under escort.

    It's expected the new facility, which has a production capacity four times the old, we help alleviate the concrete industry's cement supply constraints.

    Mitchell (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitchell,_Indiana) is located in Lawrence County about 80 miles south of Indianapolis. The city is known for its annual Persimmon Festival (http://persimmonfestival.org/), which celebrates all things American persimmon, particularly Persimmon Pudding (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persimmon_pudding), considered by many to be Indiana's signature dessert, though the Sugar Cream Pie also contends.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: skluth on April 28, 2023, 06:41:57 PM
    Quote from: ITB on April 28, 2023, 04:00:51 PM
    though the Sugar Cream Pie also contends.

    Good news on the cement plant. I just had to comment on Sugar Cream Pie. I've never heard of it before but it can't be from Indiana. Sugar Cream Pie has to be the most Southern-sounding dessert name I've ever heard.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: KeithE4Phx on April 28, 2023, 08:04:34 PM
    Quote from: skluth on April 28, 2023, 06:41:57 PM
    Quote from: ITB on April 28, 2023, 04:00:51 PM
    though the Sugar Cream Pie also contends.

    Good news on the cement plant. I just had to comment on Sugar Cream Pie. I've never heard of it before but it can't be from Indiana. Sugar Cream Pie has to be the most Southern-sounding dessert name I've ever heard.

    It's similar to custard pie, and it most definitely from Indiana.  As are all things Persimmon.  We had a Persimmon tree, as did many of our neighbors when I was growing up in Bloomington.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on April 28, 2023, 08:05:36 PM
    Quote from: KeithE4Phx on April 28, 2023, 08:04:34 PM
    Quote from: skluth on April 28, 2023, 06:41:57 PM
    Quote from: ITB on April 28, 2023, 04:00:51 PM
    though the Sugar Cream Pie also contends.

    Good news on the cement plant. I just had to comment on Sugar Cream Pie. I've never heard of it before but it can't be from Indiana. Sugar Cream Pie has to be the most Southern-sounding dessert name I've ever heard.

    It's similar to custard pie, and it most definitely from Indiana.  As are all things Persimmon.  We had a Persimmon tree, as did many of our neighbors when I was growing up in Bloomington.

    Persimmon is a southern Indiana thing. Nobody up here has heard of it.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: KeithE4Phx on April 28, 2023, 08:18:49 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on April 28, 2023, 08:05:36 PM
    Quote from: KeithE4Phx on April 28, 2023, 08:04:34 PM
    Quote from: skluth on April 28, 2023, 06:41:57 PM
    Quote from: ITB on April 28, 2023, 04:00:51 PM
    though the Sugar Cream Pie also contends.

    Good news on the cement plant. I just had to comment on Sugar Cream Pie. I've never heard of it before but it can't be from Indiana. Sugar Cream Pie has to be the most Southern-sounding dessert name I've ever heard.

    It's similar to custard pie, and it most definitely from Indiana.  As are all things Persimmon.  We had a Persimmon tree, as did many of our neighbors when I was growing up in Bloomington.

    Persimmon is a southern Indiana thing. Nobody up here has heard of it.

    That's because Lake and Porter Counties are more Chicago than Indiana.  My dad's family is from Hammond and I had relatives all over Lake County and the Indiana Dunes, so I'm familiar with the area.  Nobody appreciates a real Chicago hot dog or a good Italian Beef more than I do.  :)

    I'm not sure if Persimmons even grow north of Indianapolis, or how far south they go.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on April 28, 2023, 08:20:35 PM
    Quote from: KeithE4Phx on April 28, 2023, 08:18:49 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on April 28, 2023, 08:05:36 PM
    Quote from: KeithE4Phx on April 28, 2023, 08:04:34 PM
    Quote from: skluth on April 28, 2023, 06:41:57 PM
    Quote from: ITB on April 28, 2023, 04:00:51 PM
    though the Sugar Cream Pie also contends.

    Good news on the cement plant. I just had to comment on Sugar Cream Pie. I've never heard of it before but it can't be from Indiana. Sugar Cream Pie has to be the most Southern-sounding dessert name I've ever heard.

    It's similar to custard pie, and it most definitely from Indiana.  As are all things Persimmon.  We had a Persimmon tree, as did many of our neighbors when I was growing up in Bloomington.

    Persimmon is a southern Indiana thing. Nobody up here has heard of it.

    That's because Lake and Porter Counties are more Chicago than Indiana.  My dad's family is from Hammond and I had relatives all over Lake County and the Indiana Dunes, so I'm familiar with the area.  Nobody appreciates a real Chicago hot dog or a good Italian Beef more than I do.  :)

    I'm not sure if Persimmons even grow north of Indianapolis, or how far south they go.

    I grew up near South Bend, and spent a lot of time in Fort Wayne, and nobody over there has heard of it either.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Rothman on April 28, 2023, 09:26:54 PM
    When I lived in IN in the late 1970s, they called  green peppers mangoes (Bloomington and points south).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: KeithE4Phx on April 28, 2023, 09:46:38 PM
    Quote from: Rothman on April 28, 2023, 09:26:54 PM
    When I lived in IN in the late 1970s, they called  green peppers mangoes (Bloomington and points south).

    I never heard green peppers called anything but green peppers in all my years in Bloomington.  Or anywhere else in the country for that matter.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Rothman on April 28, 2023, 10:49:29 PM
    Quote from: KeithE4Phx on April 28, 2023, 09:46:38 PM
    Quote from: Rothman on April 28, 2023, 09:26:54 PM
    When I lived in IN in the late 1970s, they called  green peppers mangoes (Bloomington and points south).

    I never heard green peppers called anything but green peppers in all my years in Bloomington.  Or anywhere else in the country for that matter.
    Let me Google that for you, then.

    https://www.cincinnati.com/story/entertainment/2020/02/25/green-peppers-mangoes/4868299002/

    One of my mother's favorite stories was going to a farmer's market and not buying green peppers because they were called mangoes and she didn't want mangoes. :D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: KeithE4Phx on April 28, 2023, 11:11:57 PM
    Quote from: Rothman on April 28, 2023, 10:49:29 PM
    Quote from: KeithE4Phx on April 28, 2023, 09:46:38 PM
    Quote from: Rothman on April 28, 2023, 09:26:54 PM
    When I lived in IN in the late 1970s, they called  green peppers mangoes (Bloomington and points south).

    I never heard green peppers called anything but green peppers in all my years in Bloomington.  Or anywhere else in the country for that matter.
    Let me Google that for you, then.

    https://www.cincinnati.com/story/entertainment/2020/02/25/green-peppers-mangoes/4868299002/

    One of my mother's favorite stories was going to a farmer's market and not buying green peppers because they were called mangoes and she didn't want mangoes. :D

    OK, that comes from a part of the United States that thinks that chili belongs on top of spaghetti, and that a can of Skyline is something that resembles chili.  ;-)  :pan:  :D  :)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Rothman on April 28, 2023, 11:32:31 PM
    Quote from: KeithE4Phx on April 28, 2023, 11:11:57 PM
    Quote from: Rothman on April 28, 2023, 10:49:29 PM
    Quote from: KeithE4Phx on April 28, 2023, 09:46:38 PM
    Quote from: Rothman on April 28, 2023, 09:26:54 PM
    When I lived in IN in the late 1970s, they called  green peppers mangoes (Bloomington and points south).

    I never heard green peppers called anything but green peppers in all my years in Bloomington.  Or anywhere else in the country for that matter.
    Let me Google that for you, then.

    https://www.cincinnati.com/story/entertainment/2020/02/25/green-peppers-mangoes/4868299002/

    One of my mother's favorite stories was going to a farmer's market and not buying green peppers because they were called mangoes and she didn't want mangoes. :D

    OK, that comes from a part of the United States that thinks that chili belongs on top of spaghetti, and that a can of Skyline is something that resembles chili.  ;-)  :pan:  :D  :)
    Read the article...
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on April 28, 2023, 11:45:29 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on April 28, 2023, 08:20:35 PM
    Quote from: KeithE4Phx on April 28, 2023, 08:18:49 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on April 28, 2023, 08:05:36 PM
    Quote from: KeithE4Phx on April 28, 2023, 08:04:34 PM
    Quote from: skluth on April 28, 2023, 06:41:57 PM
    Quote from: ITB on April 28, 2023, 04:00:51 PM
    though the Sugar Cream Pie also contends.

    Good news on the cement plant. I just had to comment on Sugar Cream Pie. I've never heard of it before but it can't be from Indiana. Sugar Cream Pie has to be the most Southern-sounding dessert name I've ever heard.

    It's similar to custard pie, and it most definitely from Indiana.  As are all things Persimmon.  We had a Persimmon tree, as did many of our neighbors when I was growing up in Bloomington.

    Persimmon is a southern Indiana thing. Nobody up here has heard of it.

    That's because Lake and Porter Counties are more Chicago than Indiana.  My dad's family is from Hammond and I had relatives all over Lake County and the Indiana Dunes, so I'm familiar with the area.  Nobody appreciates a real Chicago hot dog or a good Italian Beef more than I do.  :)

    I'm not sure if Persimmons even grow north of Indianapolis, or how far south they go.

    I grew up near South Bend, and spent a lot of time in Fort Wayne, and nobody over there has heard of it either.

    To be sure, Persimmon Pudding is more well known in southern Indiana than in the northern areas of the state. The American persimmon tree is native to southern Indiana, particularly in Orange and Lawrence counties. The trees are also found in North Carolina and, to a lesser extent, in Kentucky and Tennessee.

    In Indiana, Persimmon Pudding is traditionally made with American persimmons, though other varieties such as Hachiya or Fuyu can be used. However, making the necessary persimmon pulp ingredient from actual persimmons is laborious, and the results can be mixed. You see, the persimmons must be ripe. Very ripe! Unripe persimmons can be very astringent and are virtually uneatable. There's a workaround, however, at least in Indiana, and that's already processed persimmon pulp! Sold frozen the pulp can usually be found in specialty markets in Bloomington and other stores further south, as well as on some farms, such as here (https://indianapolisorchard.com/farmfresh/indiana-persimmon-pulp/), here, (https://maplegrovemarket.com/store/persimmon-pulp) and here. (https://whitelandorchard.com/) It's possible, too, pulp might be found in select stores in the Indianapolis area.

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52854985939_33c75ed549_b.jpg)

    Persimmon Pudding has a long history in Indiana. It's been around since pioneer days. Recipes for Pudding go back at least  150 years. (https://www.indystar.com/story/life/2017/11/19/famous-persimmon-pudding-recipe-150-years-old/872775001/) On the internet, dozens of recipes for Persimmon Pudding can be found, such as on this website. (https://www.allrecipes.com/search?q=persimmon+pudding) The one catch to making Persimmon Pudding is that one really needs the already processed persimmon pulp. That can usually be found in Indiana without too much trouble. Elsewhere in the country, except for perhaps North Carolina and select locations in KY and TN, good luck finding it!

    In Indiana, Persimmon Pudding is served as a dessert. It's a Thanksgiving favorite for many, and its popularity typically extends throughout the holiday season. The dessert is usually served with either whipped cream or vanilla ice cream. Persimmon Pudding is not really pudding-like, as it's texture is soft but firm, and a piece sliced as square stays square. Sometimes it's prepared to be more cake-like, but that is not common.

    Whether one lives in Indiana or is just passing through, if interested in having Persimmon Pudding on the table next Thanksgiving be sure to track down a pint or two of frozen persimmon pulp well in advance of the holiday season. In some places, it tends to sell out.


    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on April 29, 2023, 08:16:12 AM
    Not sure if anyone saw this, but it refers to the conversation about the "secret" outer loop around Indianapolis. Hamilton County looks to build an interchange at 146th Street and Hazel Dell Pkwy in the next few years.

    https://fox59.com/indiana-news/it-gives-me-peace-of-mind-hamilton-county-intersection-will-see-new-safety-upgrades/

    This comes on the heels of an upcoming project to build an interchange, similar in style to the proposed 146th/Hazel Dell one at 146th Street and Allisonville Road. It is amazing to see just how much Hamilton County has grown in the past few decades that now arterials are getting some interchanges built. With I-69, US 31 and SR 37 now all with multiple exits along with Keystone Pkwy that one county has quite a sophisticated highway system. I wonder how much longer it is before Hamilton County becomes 3rd in the state in population behind only Marion and Lake.

    Anyways, sorry to bother the pie discussion.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: westerninterloper on April 29, 2023, 10:29:27 PM
    Quote from: ITB on April 28, 2023, 11:45:29 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on April 28, 2023, 08:20:35 PM
    Quote from: KeithE4Phx on April 28, 2023, 08:18:49 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on April 28, 2023, 08:05:36 PM
    Quote from: KeithE4Phx on April 28, 2023, 08:04:34 PM
    Quote from: skluth on April 28, 2023, 06:41:57 PM
    Quote from: ITB on April 28, 2023, 04:00:51 PM
    though the Sugar Cream Pie also contends.

    Good news on the cement plant. I just had to comment on Sugar Cream Pie. I've never heard of it before but it can't be from Indiana. Sugar Cream Pie has to be the most Southern-sounding dessert name I've ever heard.

    It's similar to custard pie, and it most definitely from Indiana.  As are all things Persimmon.  We had a Persimmon tree, as did many of our neighbors when I was growing up in Bloomington.

    Persimmon is a southern Indiana thing. Nobody up here has heard of it.

    That's because Lake and Porter Counties are more Chicago than Indiana.  My dad's family is from Hammond and I had relatives all over Lake County and the Indiana Dunes, so I'm familiar with the area.  Nobody appreciates a real Chicago hot dog or a good Italian Beef more than I do.  :)

    I'm not sure if Persimmons even grow north of Indianapolis, or how far south they go.

    I grew up near South Bend, and spent a lot of time in Fort Wayne, and nobody over there has heard of it either.

    To be sure, Persimmon Pudding is more well known in southern Indiana than in the northern areas of the state. The American persimmon tree is native to southern Indiana, particularly in Orange and Lawrence counties. The trees are also found in North Carolina and, to a lesser extent, in Kentucky and Tennessee.

    In Indiana, Persimmon Pudding is traditionally made with American persimmons, though other varieties such as Hachiya or Fuyu can be used. However, making the necessary persimmon pulp ingredient from actual persimmons is laborious, and the results can be mixed. You see, the persimmons must be ripe. Very ripe! Unripe persimmons can be very astringent and are virtually uneatable. There's a workaround, however, at least in Indiana, and that's already processed persimmon pulp! Sold frozen the pulp can usually be found in specialty markets in Bloomington and other stores further south, as well as on some farms, such as here (https://indianapolisorchard.com/farmfresh/indiana-persimmon-pulp/), here, (https://maplegrovemarket.com/store/persimmon-pulp) and here. (https://whitelandorchard.com/) It's possible, too, pulp might be found in select stores in the Indianapolis area.

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52854985939_33c75ed549_b.jpg)

    Persimmon Pudding has a long history in Indiana. It's been around since pioneer days. Recipes for Pudding go back at least  150 years. (https://www.indystar.com/story/life/2017/11/19/famous-persimmon-pudding-recipe-150-years-old/872775001/) On the internet, dozens of recipes for Persimmon Pudding can be found, such as on this website. (https://www.allrecipes.com/search?q=persimmon+pudding) The one catch to making Persimmon Pudding is that one really needs the already processed persimmon pulp. That can usually be found in Indiana without too much trouble. Elsewhere in the country, except for perhaps North Carolina and select locations in KY and TN, good luck finding it!

    In Indiana, Persimmon Pudding is served as a dessert. It's a Thanksgiving favorite for many, and its popularity typically extends throughout the holiday season. The dessert is usually served with either whipped cream or vanilla ice cream. Persimmon Pudding is not really pudding-like, as it's texture is soft but firm, and a piece sliced as square stays square. Sometimes it's prepared to be more cake-like, but that is not common.

    Whether one lives in Indiana or is just passing through, if interested in having Persimmon Pudding on the table next Thanksgiving be sure to track down a pint or two of frozen persimmon pulp well in advance of the holiday season. In some places, it tends to sell out.

    Thanks for all that about persimmons. I grew up in Terre Haute, my family is all from Vincennes, and I spent ten years in school in Bloomington - my grandmothers from Knox County called green peppers mangoes as I recall, but we didn't eat persimmons; I think those are more in South Central and far southern Indiana, where the influence from North Carolina is stronger. There's more German and Catholic influence in SW Indiana than in Bloomington and points south, it shows in the dialect, foodways, etc etc. Northern Indiana is much more Yankee, Protestant, with Germans, and later Catholic populations from Southern and Eastern Europe, not so much Germany and France like SW Indiana. Indiana north of US 36 has a different culture from points south.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: cjw2001 on May 08, 2023, 01:17:46 PM
    INDOT just announced full unidirectional closures of I 465 on the southwest side during June and July.  Eastbound closure in June and Westbound in July.

    https://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/INDOT/bulletins/35944ca

    https://i69finishline.com/i465construction/
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on May 08, 2023, 01:46:46 PM
    I knew it!  That explains the big orange signs all over the place!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on May 08, 2023, 04:14:17 PM
    Oh dear God, my commute is going to royally suck this summer. I-70 eastbound is backed up toward Holt Road with 465 open on the southwest side. Detouring all that traffic, plus the I-70 traffic is going to be a nightmare.

    All I'm saying is that they better get A LOT done during this construction.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tosa on May 10, 2023, 09:48:23 AM
    You should feel lucky 465 is only going to be closed for 3 wks. If it's not in Indy, the closure will definitely last for at least a year :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on May 10, 2023, 03:29:14 PM
    Starting on or after June 1, INDOT will be shutting down two rest areas for a two-year reconstruction project. They are:


    The Clear Creek Welcome Center will be getting an Indianapolis Motor Speedway theme (exhibits featuring IMS, local and regional racing history), a children's play area, an adult recreation & walking path, and a dog park. There will be 150 trucks and cars parking spaces as well as trucker restroom facilities and improved vending options & tourism-related information.

    The Lebanon Rest Area will be converted into a truck-only rest area with trucker restroom facilities as well as 75 parking spaces for trucks.

    As far as the schedule goes from INDOT with the rest area renovations:
    FY 2025- I-65 NB & SB (MM 195), I-74 WB (MM 57), I-70 EB & WB (MM 64), I-70 WB (MM 143), I-65 NB & SB (MM 73 & MM 71), I-64 EB & WB (MM 59), I-65 NB & SB (MM 22)
    FY 2026- I-74 EB (MM 1)
    FY 2028- I-74 EB (MM 57), I-69 somewhere in Evansville
    FY 2030- I-94 WB (MM 43), two new rest areas on I-69 between Evansville and Indianapolis, I-74 WB (MM 151)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on May 10, 2023, 08:24:43 PM
    I am resisting the urge to complain about the soon severe lack of auto-useful rest areas in this state. But when I was down in Evansville a couple of weeks ago I saw that their visitor center along the Ohio River has closed. So, if they do it right, a new welcome center along I-69 in the Evansville area could also double as a general visitor center for Evansville for traffic coming from the north.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Life in Paradise on May 11, 2023, 12:55:07 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on May 10, 2023, 08:24:43 PM
    I am resisting the urge to complain about the soon severe lack of auto-useful rest areas in this state. But when I was down in Evansville a couple of weeks ago I saw that their visitor center along the Ohio River has closed. So, if they do it right, a new welcome center along I-69 in the Evansville area could also double as a general visitor center for Evansville for traffic coming from the north.
    I can give them a perfect site for a rest area/welcome center that could also serve S/B traffic and is located at an existing interchange, would have its own stoplight assisted access point and would only require a couple of property owners to sell their land.  SE corner of Exit 5. Some of it is just sitting there right now as unused/non-built land.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on May 19, 2023, 04:40:11 PM
    Saw this this morning, but Indiana is about to change its entrance signage along the highways into the state. For nearly as long as I've been alive the signs have always stayed the same with the red outline of the state on the blue sign plus the words "Welcome to Indiana" and "Crossroads of America." They weren't the most impressive signs out there but they were always very serviceable. Adding the stuff about Lincoln's Boyhood Home and Benjamin Harrison was a bit more dubious.

    The new sign is a darker shade of blue, looks like its a license plate, and has the words "More to Discover In Indiana." with "IN Indiana" written a certain way. I've seen this on newer tourism stuff so I know they're trying to incorporate that into the signage here. Also they included the year the state was admitted into the union.

    This link talks about the new sign and shows the older sign as well: https://wkdq.com/new-highway-signs-unveiled-to-welcome-visitors-to-indiana/

    And the signs should be up on the interstates real quick too, like before Memorial Day weekend so those entering the state for the 500 will be able to view them. Personally I'm mixed on this new sign. It doesn't look too bad or busy, I guess it works. But I'm not real big on "More to Discover." The "IN Indiana" stuff is more clever and I like how they have the state outline in the name itself, but "More to Discover" sounds to generic. Not when compared to "Pure Michigan" or "Unbridled Spirit" for Kentucky. It's typical of this state to never try something real bold and defining that knocks it out of the park, just "More to Discover." And on top of all of that, I think they missed a huge opportunity that is simply way too obvious. The signs should be saying "Back Home Again IN Indiana." That would be something that conjures up images of the state and the 500 and since they were announcing this at the Speedway it could have worked even better. Also, I don't get what mentioning 1816 does. We're the 19th State in the Union, 1816 would have been nice to mention for the Bicentennial but since that's over I don't think it's information that anyone passing through the state is ever going to care about.

    But for now I guess there will be "more" for us to discover.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SEWIGuy on May 19, 2023, 05:00:40 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on May 19, 2023, 04:40:11 PM
    Saw this this morning, but Indiana is about to change its entrance signage along the highways into the state. For nearly as long as I've been alive the signs have always stayed the same with the red outline of the state on the blue sign plus the words "Welcome to Indiana" and "Crossroads of America." They weren't the most impressive signs out there but they were always very serviceable. Adding the stuff about Lincoln's Boyhood Home and Benjamin Harrison was a bit more dubious.

    The new sign is a darker shade of blue, looks like its a license plate, and has the words "More to Discover In Indiana." with "IN Indiana" written a certain way. I've seen this on newer tourism stuff so I know they're trying to incorporate that into the signage here. Also they included the year the state was admitted into the union.

    This link talks about the new sign and shows the older sign as well: https://wkdq.com/new-highway-signs-unveiled-to-welcome-visitors-to-indiana/

    And the signs should be up on the interstates real quick too, like before Memorial Day weekend so those entering the state for the 500 will be able to view them. Personally I'm mixed on this new sign. It doesn't look too bad or busy, I guess it works. But I'm not real big on "More to Discover." The "IN Indiana" stuff is more clever and I like how they have the state outline in the name itself, but "More to Discover" sounds to generic. Not when compared to "Pure Michigan" or "Unbridled Spirit" for Kentucky. It's typical of this state to never try something real bold and defining that knocks it out of the park, just "More to Discover." And on top of all of that, I think they missed a huge opportunity that is simply way too obvious. The signs should be saying "Back Home Again IN Indiana." That would be something that conjures up images of the state and the 500 and since they were announcing this at the Speedway it could have worked even better. Also, I don't get what mentioning 1816 does. We're the 19th State in the Union, 1816 would have been nice to mention for the Bicentennial but since that's over I don't think it's information that anyone passing through the state is ever going to care about.

    But for now I guess there will be "more" for us to discover.


    I think the slogan is a little dull, but the signage is more modern looking and matches their current campaign. I would also get rid of the year and put the web address there instead.

    https://www.visitindiana.com/
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: cjw2001 on May 19, 2023, 09:40:10 PM
    Since construction has started at 146th Street and Allisonville Road I was checking out the highway department web site (https://hamiltoncounty.in.gov/1238/146th-St-Allisonville-Rd-Interchange) for the project and came across this rendering of the new interchange:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lfFIutNWKvs
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: 74/171FAN on May 20, 2023, 07:48:55 PM
    I believe this sign is an error now due to IN 267 being relinquished south of I-74.  (https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=10218771878248557&set=a.10218771940010101)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on May 20, 2023, 09:18:10 PM
    Quote from: 74/171FAN on May 20, 2023, 07:48:55 PM
    I believe this sign is an error now due to IN 267 being relinquished south of I-74.  (https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=10218771878248557&set=a.10218771940010101)

    It is. It should probably read Quaker Blvd now. It should honestly read Plainfield but they changed the signage at Exit 66 to just mention Quaker Blvd. There's another sign on I-65 south of Downtown that had Greenwood on it, but the exit's been changed to Main St.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on May 20, 2023, 10:01:39 PM
    I think the design of the sign is great, other than the state being in the D. I don't have a problem with the date at the bottom but I do think they missed an opportunity with having "Back Home Again" instead of More to Discover"

    Pixel 7

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SEWIGuy on May 20, 2023, 10:51:36 PM
    Quote from: bmeiser on May 20, 2023, 10:01:39 PM
    I think the design of the sign is great, other than the state being in the D. I don't have a problem with the date at the bottom but I do think they missed an opportunity with having "Back Home Again" instead of More to Discover"

    What does "Back Home Again"  mean to people who don't make Indiana their home?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on May 22, 2023, 01:12:19 AM
    It's a slogan. Intended to make people that aren't from the state feel welcome, as if they were home.

    Pixel 7

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: skluth on May 22, 2023, 11:17:09 AM
    Quote from: bmeiser on May 22, 2023, 01:12:19 AM
    It's a slogan. Intended to make people that aren't from the state feel welcome, as if they were home.

    Pixel 7

    If that's the case, I just find that weird and nonsensicle
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: hobsini2 on May 22, 2023, 01:22:10 PM
    Quote from: skluth on May 22, 2023, 11:17:09 AM
    Quote from: bmeiser on May 22, 2023, 01:12:19 AM
    It's a slogan. Intended to make people that aren't from the state feel welcome, as if they were home.

    Pixel 7

    If that's the case, I just find that weird and nonsensicle
    They could go back to "Wander in Indiana"
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: CtrlAltDel on May 22, 2023, 01:49:03 PM
    I would get rid of the date as well, and somehow add in the phrase "Welcome to."
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on May 22, 2023, 03:35:29 PM
    Quote from: CtrlAltDel on May 22, 2023, 01:49:03 PM
    I would get rid of the date as well, and somehow add in the phrase "Welcome to."

    Yep!!  I don't get the new generation of state signs that don't say Welcome or Entering or anything like that.  Ohio's current ones (which just came out fairly recently) are similar with "Ohio: find it here" as the then-current state tourism logo--which is now gone in favor of a return to "The Heart of It All" (so will they change the signs? probably not).  The old "Massachusetts Welcomes You" type message seems to be clearest.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on May 22, 2023, 04:12:52 PM
    How many people will see a slogan on a sign and decide to increase or decrease the amount of time they spend in the state because of it?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: CtrlAltDel on May 22, 2023, 10:25:50 PM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on May 22, 2023, 03:35:29 PM
    Quote from: CtrlAltDel on May 22, 2023, 01:49:03 PM
    I would get rid of the date as well, and somehow add in the phrase "Welcome to."

    Yep!!  I don't get the new generation of state signs that don't say Welcome or Entering or anything like that.  Ohio's current ones (which just came out fairly recently) are similar with "Ohio: find it here" as the then-current state tourism logo--which is now gone in favor of a return to "The Heart of It All" (so will they change the signs? probably not).  The old "Massachusetts Welcomes You" type message seems to be clearest.

    Yeah, it's all about the marketing and not any sort of, even perfunctory, greeting.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: skluth on May 23, 2023, 10:44:36 AM
    Quote from: CtrlAltDel on May 22, 2023, 10:25:50 PM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on May 22, 2023, 03:35:29 PM
    Quote from: CtrlAltDel on May 22, 2023, 01:49:03 PM
    I would get rid of the date as well, and somehow add in the phrase "Welcome to."

    Yep!!  I don't get the new generation of state signs that don't say Welcome or Entering or anything like that.  Ohio's current ones (which just came out fairly recently) are similar with "Ohio: find it here" as the then-current state tourism logo--which is now gone in favor of a return to "The Heart of It All" (so will they change the signs? probably not).  The old "Massachusetts Welcomes You" type message seems to be clearest.

    Yeah, it's all about the marketing and not any sort of, even perfunctory, greeting.

    Worse. It's marketing by committee.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on May 25, 2023, 05:53:43 PM
    I know this isn't the best sampling size, but judging by the comments on all six of INDOT's districts Facebook pages, plus the ones on various media sites around Indianapolis, the public overwhelming hate the new design. Seeing what they look like out in the field, they look even worse. And on some of the signs they keep the stupid Benjamin Harrison and Lincoln's Boyhood stuff too. So much unnecessary stuff! I don't know the possibility of doing so but I kind of hope they bring back the old signs. And if they just HAVE to have this tourism slogan stuff, get rid of the Harrison and Lincoln stuff at the bottom and have a smaller sign with the "More to Discover In Indiana" stuff at the bottom as an appendix to the larger Welcome to Indiana sign.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on May 25, 2023, 06:29:01 PM
    the crossroads of america is fine with me  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on May 26, 2023, 03:23:43 PM
    https://www.insideindianabusiness.com/articles/indot-renovating-black-river-welcome-center

    "INDOT renovating Black River Welcome Center

    POSEY COUNTY, Ind. - The Indiana Department of Transportation said Thursday it will close the Black River Welcome Center on eastbound I-64 in Posey County for reconstruction. The closure, set to begin next week, is expected to last about two years.

    The new center will add many features beyond the typical restroom and snack stop, according to INDOT.

    The building will feature characteristics of a log cabin resembling President Abraham Lincoln's childhood home with exhibits of the area's history. There will be two new restroom facilities for truck drivers, including four individual ADA-accessible restrooms per building.

    The parking capacity will also increase, with 75 spaces for semi-trucks and 55 spaces for cars. Outside of the center there will be a children's playground, adult recreation area with a walking trail and a dog park.

    Crews will fully demolish the existing building before beginning the reconstruction. The new facility is expected to open in 2025.

    INDOT did not disclose its financial investment in the project. The Black River Welcome Center is located about 33 miles northwest of Evansville.

    The project is part of a 10-year plan by INDOT to improve Indiana's 26 rest areas and welcome centers. When complete, the project will add more than 1,100 semitrailer parking spaces statewide.

    Earlier this week, INDOT broke ground on a $58.5 million reconstruction of the Clear Creek Welcome Center near Terre Haute, which will pay homage to the state's racing history."
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on May 27, 2023, 02:28:08 AM

    J Turns coming to SR 37 in Monroe County

    To improve the SR 37/Dillman Road intersection in southern Monroe County, INDOT is moving forward with a plan that features J turns. The plan is to eliminate left turns from Dillman Road to SR 37, and, instead, create two J turns on SR 37. The project is anticipated to be let in the fall, with construction getting underway in the spring of 2024.

    An article about the project, which includes a schematic, can be accessed here (https://news.yahoo.com/yearlong-construction-project-coming-ind-001359452.html).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on May 27, 2023, 05:09:26 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on May 26, 2023, 03:23:43 PM
    https://www.insideindianabusiness.com/articles/indot-renovating-black-river-welcome-center

    "INDOT renovating Black River Welcome Center

    POSEY COUNTY, Ind. - The Indiana Department of Transportation said Thursday it will close the Black River Welcome Center on eastbound I-64 in Posey County for reconstruction. The closure, set to begin next week, is expected to last about two years.

    The new center will add many features beyond the typical restroom and snack stop, according to INDOT.

    The building will feature characteristics of a log cabin resembling President Abraham Lincoln's childhood home with exhibits of the area's history. There will be two new restroom facilities for truck drivers, including four individual ADA-accessible restrooms per building.

    The parking capacity will also increase, with 75 spaces for semi-trucks and 55 spaces for cars. Outside of the center there will be a children's playground, adult recreation area with a walking trail and a dog park.

    Crews will fully demolish the existing building before beginning the reconstruction. The new facility is expected to open in 2025.

    INDOT did not disclose its financial investment in the project. The Black River Welcome Center is located about 33 miles northwest of Evansville.

    The project is part of a 10-year plan by INDOT to improve Indiana's 26 rest areas and welcome centers. When complete, the project will add more than 1,100 semitrailer parking spaces statewide.

    Earlier this week, INDOT broke ground on a $58.5 million reconstruction of the Clear Creek Welcome Center near Terre Haute, which will pay homage to the state's racing history."

    Hopefully this nice looking welcome center will include signage telling motorists that it will be roughly 140 miles until the next rest area, unless they drive a big rig.

    It sounds like they should have also kept the welcome center on I-64 westbound west of New Albany. They could have made that one fancy too. Do drivers coming into Indiana but utilizing I-64 west from Louisville deserve nothing? But if you're coming from Illinois then yes?

    And north of Henryville on I-65, no rest areas for non truck-driving motorists for the rest of I-65's northbound existence. I guess with that plan you'll have no other choice than to find "more to discover in Indiana."

    Finally, just a curious thought, but by the fancy new welcome center on I-65 around the Kankakee River. It looks like a good idea, but aren't there already welcome centers along the Borman Expressway and I-94 in Michigan City. At least that Kankakee River Welcome Center could come with the wonderful sign "Next Rest Area 255 Miles!"
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: pianocello on May 27, 2023, 08:46:26 AM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on May 27, 2023, 05:09:26 AM
    Hopefully this nice looking welcome center will include signage telling motorists that it will be roughly 140 miles until the next rest area, unless they drive a big rig.

    I'm confused (https://goo.gl/maps/hyWTJM3C6Sz65DL27)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on May 27, 2023, 09:08:19 AM
    Quote from: pianocello on May 27, 2023, 08:46:26 AM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on May 27, 2023, 05:09:26 AM
    Hopefully this nice looking welcome center will include signage telling motorists that it will be roughly 140 miles until the next rest area, unless they drive a big rig.

    I'm confused (https://goo.gl/maps/hyWTJM3C6Sz65DL27)

    I was slightly in error on that one. The eastbound I-64 rest area is slated to be closed around 2025 as INDOT's plan of modernizing the rest areas is having less of them to modernize. So semi drivers will also have to wait 140 miles before the next rest area. The westbound one at that location will become just truck parking. Which means westbound travelers along I-64, who don't drive semis, will have no rest areas in Indiana. That's about 184 miles between rest areas in the future.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on May 29, 2023, 06:27:36 PM
    https://improvetomove32.com/landing/

    Project website to improve Indiana SR 32 between Westfield and Noblesville from a two-lane road to a four-lane road with a curbed median. Between the US 31 interchange in Westfield and downtown Noblesville, there will be 11 roundabouts once all of these projects get done.

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on May 30, 2023, 08:13:35 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on May 29, 2023, 06:27:36 PM
    https://improvetomove32.com/landing/

    Project website to improve Indiana SR 32 between Westfield and Noblesville from a two-lane road to a four-lane road with a curbed median. Between the US 31 interchange in Westfield and downtown Noblesville, there will be 11 roundabouts once all of these projects get done.

    I'm confused, this looks like a road in Carmel  :-D this has to cost a pretty penny!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: cjw2001 on May 30, 2023, 08:32:21 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on May 30, 2023, 08:13:35 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on May 29, 2023, 06:27:36 PM
    https://improvetomove32.com/landing/

    Project website to improve Indiana SR 32 between Westfield and Noblesville from a two-lane road to a four-lane road with a curbed median. Between the US 31 interchange in Westfield and downtown Noblesville, there will be 11 roundabouts once all of these projects get done.

    I'm confused, this looks like a road in Carmel  :-D this has to cost a pretty penny!
    The project presentation (https://improvetomove32.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/Public-Information-Meeting-Slideshow.DES-2000158.Final_.pdf) says $80.5 million for the roundabout plan vs $80.2 million for traffic signals.   Sounds like the roundabout plan is a no brainer to me.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on May 30, 2023, 02:27:12 PM
    Quote from: cjw2001 on May 30, 2023, 08:32:21 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on May 30, 2023, 08:13:35 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on May 29, 2023, 06:27:36 PM
    https://improvetomove32.com/landing/

    Project website to improve Indiana SR 32 between Westfield and Noblesville from a two-lane road to a four-lane road with a curbed median. Between the US 31 interchange in Westfield and downtown Noblesville, there will be 11 roundabouts once all of these projects get done.

    I'm confused, this looks like a road in Carmel  :-D this has to cost a pretty penny!
    The project presentation (https://improvetomove32.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/Public-Information-Meeting-Slideshow.DES-2000158.Final_.pdf) says $80.5 million for the roundabout plan vs $80.2 million for traffic signals.   Sounds like the roundabout plan is a no brainer to me.

    Ah, I didn't see the presentation link, that does make sense.  :clap:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on June 01, 2023, 10:50:44 AM
    so that 465 closure is going to be a month  :wow: starts this friday and ends 6/21. INDOT says this will allow 100 crews to build bridges and drainage. sounds like A TON of work will be done along this corridor. hopefully 0 rain occurs  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SSR_317 on June 01, 2023, 01:21:01 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on June 01, 2023, 10:50:44 AM
    so that 465 closure is going to be a month  :wow: starts this friday and ends 6/21. INDOT says this will allow 100 crews to build bridges and drainage. sounds like A TON of work will be done along this corridor. hopefully 0 rain occurs  :-D
    Well, with last autumn's drought seemingly back here in Indy & central IN, looks like they should have plenty of dry weather to get everything done with minimal weather delays. Stay hydrated, road workers!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on June 09, 2023, 10:02:28 AM
    So I noticed a lot of changes have happened in Harrison County.

    1) SR 337 now just ends at the southern town limit in Corydon
    2) SR 11 now ends at the junction of what used to be SR 337
    3) SR 111 now ends at SR 211

    SR 337's days have to be numbered. the southern portion of it serves no purpose, well neither portion serves a purpose really.

    :hmmm: Any other decommissionings around the state?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on June 09, 2023, 10:12:40 AM
    You can't maintain the state's budget surplus if you have to maintain all these highways after all.

    So, what is the routing of SR 11 then? SR 337 still exists south of Corydon too? And if SR 111 ends at SR 211, couldn't SR 111 just subsume SR 211 west to SR 11? Also, does this mean SR 337 has three sections now?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on June 09, 2023, 10:21:25 AM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on June 09, 2023, 10:12:40 AM
    You can't maintain the state's budget surplus if you have to maintain all these highways after all.

    So, what is the routing of SR 11 then? SR 337 still exists south of Corydon too? And if SR 111 ends at SR 211, couldn't SR 111 just subsume SR 211 west to SR 11? Also, does this mean SR 337 has three sections now?

    No 337 has 2 sections still, SR 337 now ends at Carl Street on the south side of Corydon it no longer goes further south. SR 11 ends at where SR 337 used to end, this may sound confusing after reading my 1st sentence but basically SR 337 used to end at SR 11, well now SR 11 ends at that point and that junction is OLD SR 337 for more context this is at Melview Road. And yes 211 should become 111 but I bet they won't change that due to addresses being confusing (the same reason why SR 46 still overlaps the new routing of US 40 for addresses only).

    Personally I think SR 11, 211, and 111 should all be completely deleted in their entirety. They never went anywhere to begin with. 
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 09, 2023, 10:25:36 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on June 09, 2023, 10:21:25 AM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on June 09, 2023, 10:12:40 AM
    You can't maintain the state's budget surplus if you have to maintain all these highways after all.

    So, what is the routing of SR 11 then? SR 337 still exists south of Corydon too? And if SR 111 ends at SR 211, couldn't SR 111 just subsume SR 211 west to SR 11? Also, does this mean SR 337 has three sections now?

    No 337 has 2 sections still, SR 337 now ends at Carl Street on the south side of Corydon it no longer goes further south. SR 11 ends at where SR 337 used to end, this may sound confusing after reading my 1st sentence but basically SR 337 used to end at SR 11, well now SR 11 ends at that point and that junction is OLD SR 337 for more context this is at Melview Road. And yes 211 should become 111 but I bet they won't change that due to addresses being confusing (the same reason why SR 46 still overlaps the new routing of US 40 for addresses only).

    Personally I think SR 11, 211, and 111 should all be completely deleted in their entirety. They never went anywhere to begin with. 

    If nothing else, 111 will still need to be a state highway between the casino and the New Albany city limits.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on June 09, 2023, 10:40:51 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on June 09, 2023, 10:21:25 AM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on June 09, 2023, 10:12:40 AM
    You can't maintain the state's budget surplus if you have to maintain all these highways after all.

    So, what is the routing of SR 11 then? SR 337 still exists south of Corydon too? And if SR 111 ends at SR 211, couldn't SR 111 just subsume SR 211 west to SR 11? Also, does this mean SR 337 has three sections now?

    No 337 has 2 sections still, SR 337 now ends at Carl Street on the south side of Corydon it no longer goes further south. SR 11 ends at where SR 337 used to end, this may sound confusing after reading my 1st sentence but basically SR 337 used to end at SR 11, well now SR 11 ends at that point and that junction is OLD SR 337 for more context this is at Melview Road. And yes 211 should become 111 but I bet they won't change that due to addresses being confusing (the same reason why SR 46 still overlaps the new routing of US 40 for addresses only).

    Personally I think SR 11, 211, and 111 should all be completely deleted in their entirety. They never went anywhere to begin with. 

    Woah, so they kept the routing of SR 337 through Corydon? That doesn't sound like INDOT at all. Why not truncate it to SR 62, or SR 135?

    Just my opinion, but I don't have an issue with SR 11 going all the way to SR 135, it looks alright on the map. And leave SR 111 down to the casino or SR 211. The rest can go though.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on June 09, 2023, 10:59:49 AM
    my guess is they offered the road to Corydon and Corydon refused, hence the weird ending. And I wouldn't put it past them killing 111 outright in the future not sure the casino matters to them enough to keep the road down there  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: jnewkirk77 on June 09, 2023, 05:12:55 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on June 09, 2023, 10:02:28 AM
    So I noticed a lot of changes have happened in Harrison County.

    1) SR 337 now just ends at the southern town limit in Corydon
    2) SR 11 now ends at the junction of what used to be SR 337
    3) SR 111 now ends at SR 211

    SR 337's days have to be numbered. the southern portion of it serves no purpose, well neither portion serves a purpose really.

    :hmmm: Any other decommissionings around the state?

    Here's what's happening with SR 11: https://www.sr11extension.com/

    The idea is to improve east-west connectivity across southern Harrison County.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on June 09, 2023, 05:44:35 PM
    Quote from: jnewkirk77 on June 09, 2023, 05:12:55 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on June 09, 2023, 10:02:28 AM
    So I noticed a lot of changes have happened in Harrison County.

    1) SR 337 now just ends at the southern town limit in Corydon
    2) SR 11 now ends at the junction of what used to be SR 337
    3) SR 111 now ends at SR 211

    SR 337's days have to be numbered. the southern portion of it serves no purpose, well neither portion serves a purpose really.

    :hmmm: Any other decommissionings around the state?

    Here's what's happening with SR 11: https://www.sr11extension.com/

    The idea is to improve east-west connectivity across southern Harrison County.

    :-o o wow! I didn't know about this! thanks for posting this, so I guess they gave away that portion of 11 to build this new portion of 11.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: jnewkirk77 on June 10, 2023, 04:22:31 PM
    Glad to share!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 10, 2023, 11:35:28 PM
    Starting this week and through the rest of June, driving on northbound I-65 in Lake County will be difficult.

    As access to I-65 southbound from US 12/20 and 15th Avenue will be restored (with three lanes of I-65 southbound opened to traffic), I-65 northbound will be reduced to two lanes from mile 256 to 259. In that work zone, the left lane will be shifted into the southbound side while the right lane will be pushed to the outside shoulder. In an effort to minimize delays and reduce queues, the entrance ramps from US 30, 61st Avenue, and Ridge Road will all be closed.

    As a result, I-65 northbound in Lake County will only be accessible from Indiana 2 in Lowell, 109th Avenue in Crown Point, and I-80/94 in Gary. (The entrance from US 231 in Crown Point is closed due to a separate concrete restoration project currently in progress.) The official detour will be Indiana 53 to I-80/94, though locals could use 109th to enter I-65 northbound or use Indiana 51 to avoid it entirely.

    One road that won't be available to locals as the summer progresses will be Colorado Street in Merrillville and Hobart. A while ago upthread, I mentioned Hobart's plans to convert the CN Railroad crossing north of the 69th Avenue roundabout to an overpass. Plans are still in the works, with the possibility of work starting within a few weeks. The project is expected to last up to 18 months.

    In a much more immediate time frame, intersection improvement work at US 30 will be starting within days. Along with the intersection proper, a portion of Colorado will be closed from half a mile south of US 30 to about a quarter of a mile north. Along with new turn lanes and a full resurfacing and substructure replacement, work will also include leveling out the road for better sight lines. Work is to last until the holiday shopping season. Traffic will be required to use Mississippi Street and 61st Avenue as a detour.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on June 11, 2023, 01:50:32 AM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 10, 2023, 11:35:28 PM
    Starting this week and through the rest of June, driving on northbound I-65 in Lake County will be difficult.

    As access to I-65 southbound from US 12/20 and 15th Avenue will be restored (with three lanes of I-65 southbound opened to traffic), I-65 northbound will be reduced to two lanes from mile 256 to 259. In that work zone, the left lane will be shifted into the southbound side while the right lane will be pushed to the outside shoulder. In an effort to minimize delays and reduce queues, the entrance ramps from US 30, 61st Avenue, and Ridge Road will all be closed.

    As a result, I-65 northbound in Lake County will only be accessible from Indiana 2 in Lowell, 109th Avenue in Crown Point, and I-80/94 in Gary. (The entrance from US 231 in Crown Point is closed due to a separate concrete restoration project currently in progress.) The official detour will be Indiana 53 to I-80/94, though locals could use 109th to enter I-65 northbound or use Indiana 51 to avoid it entirely.

    One road that won't be available to locals as the summer progresses will be Colorado Street in Merrillville and Hobart. A while ago upthread, I mentioned Hobart's plans to convert the CN Railroad crossing north of the 69th Avenue roundabout to an overpass. Plans are still in the works, with the possibility of work starting within a few weeks. The project is expected to last up to 18 months.

    In a much more immediate time frame, intersection improvement work at US 30 will be starting within days. Along with the intersection proper, a portion of Colorado will be closed from half a mile south of US 30 to about a quarter of a mile north. Along with new turn lanes and a full resurfacing and substructure replacement, work will also include leveling out the road for better sight lines. Work is to last until the holiday shopping season. Traffic will be required to use Mississippi Street and 61st Avenue as a detour.

    Lake County is always a mess to get around at this time of the year lol...
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 11, 2023, 09:42:06 AM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 10, 2023, 11:35:28 PM
    Starting this week and through the rest of June, driving on northbound I-65 in Lake County will be difficult.

    As access to I-65 southbound from US 12/20 and 15th Avenue will be restored (with three lanes of I-65 southbound opened to traffic), I-65 northbound will be reduced to two lanes from mile 256 to 259. In that work zone, the left lane will be shifted into the southbound side while the right lane will be pushed to the outside shoulder. In an effort to minimize delays and reduce queues, the entrance ramps from US 30, 61st Avenue, and Ridge Road will all be closed.

    As a result, I-65 northbound in Lake County will only be accessible from Indiana 2 in Lowell, 109th Avenue in Crown Point, and I-80/94 in Gary. (The entrance from US 231 in Crown Point is closed due to a separate concrete restoration project currently in progress.) The official detour will be Indiana 53 to I-80/94, though locals could use 109th to enter I-65 northbound or use Indiana 51 to avoid it entirely.

    One road that won't be available to locals as the summer progresses will be Colorado Street in Merrillville and Hobart. A while ago upthread, I mentioned Hobart's plans to convert the CN Railroad crossing north of the 69th Avenue roundabout to an overpass. Plans are still in the works, with the possibility of work starting within a few weeks. The project is expected to last up to 18 months.

    In a much more immediate time frame, intersection improvement work at US 30 will be starting within days. Along with the intersection proper, a portion of Colorado will be closed from half a mile south of US 30 to about a quarter of a mile north. Along with new turn lanes and a full resurfacing and substructure replacement, work will also include leveling out the road for better sight lines. Work is to last until the holiday shopping season. Traffic will be required to use Mississippi Street and 61st Avenue as a detour.

    In case anybody is thinking about using Ridge Road as an alternate route to a clogged Borman, Ridge is going to be down to one lane each way at Manor Avenue in Munster for three months beginning Monday 6/12, for  installation of South Shore Tracks.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on June 11, 2023, 12:35:49 PM
    never ceases to amaze me how much construction Indiana has for the size and population it has  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 11, 2023, 03:58:37 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on June 11, 2023, 12:35:49 PM
    never ceases to amaze me how much construction Indiana has for the size and population it has  :-D

    You have to take into consideration its geographical location and importance.

    While Indiana is relatively small in population and size, the amount of traffic from the outside is pretty high, seeing that a large portion of Great Lakes and Midwest traffic has to go through the state to get where they're going.

    Our roads have been taking a beating. Sucks that it's "Everything, Everywhere, All at Once,"  but it has to be done.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on June 12, 2023, 08:32:41 AM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on June 11, 2023, 03:58:37 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on June 11, 2023, 12:35:49 PM
    never ceases to amaze me how much construction Indiana has for the size and population it has  :-D

    You have to take into consideration its geographical location and importance.

    While Indiana is relatively small in population and size, the amount of traffic from the outside is pretty high, seeing that a large portion of Great Lakes and Midwest traffic has to go through the state to get where they're going.

    Our roads have been taking a beating. Sucks that it's "Everything, Everywhere, All at Once,"  but it has to be done.

    I drive a lot in Illinois, Michigan. Their roads are terrible. The constant construction is a trade-off for having nice roads.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on June 12, 2023, 02:17:45 PM
    Browsing, I came across a couple of regional transportation plans — one for Evansville MPO (http://www.evansvillempo.com/Docs/MTP/MTP_2050/MTP_2050.pdf), the other for Hancock County (https://hancockin.gov/DocumentCenter/View/688/Future-Hancock-Thoroughfare-Plan_Adopted-1323). Might be of interest to some.

    Also, found a study for a new connector road in Plainfield (https://projectmeetingonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/PlainfieldIN-I-70-to-US-40-Corridor-Study.pdf) in Hendricks County that will link US 40 to I-70. Aside from the study, which identified and recommended a preferred route, there's not much else to be found about this project.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: royo6022 on June 12, 2023, 11:18:23 PM
    Quote from: skluth on May 22, 2023, 11:17:09 AM
    Quote from: bmeiser on May 22, 2023, 01:12:19 AM
    It's a slogan. Intended to make people that aren't from the state feel welcome, as if they were home.

    Pixel 7

    If that's the case, I just find that weird and nonsensicle

    Better than "Home means Nevada"
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: hobsini2 on June 16, 2023, 11:58:40 AM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on May 22, 2023, 04:12:52 PM
    How many people will see a slogan on a sign and decide to increase or decrease the amount of time they spend in the state because of it?
    It depends. I still have a bumper sticker (unused) from the early 1980s that had "Escape to Wisconsin". That slogan was great for the tourism boom.
    But I agree Welcome signs should not have slogans.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: skluth on June 16, 2023, 03:55:30 PM
    Quote from: hobsini2 on June 16, 2023, 11:58:40 AM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on May 22, 2023, 04:12:52 PM
    How many people will see a slogan on a sign and decide to increase or decrease the amount of time they spend in the state because of it?
    It depends. I still have a bumper sticker (unused) from the early 1980s that had "Escape to Wisconsin". That slogan was great for the tourism boom.
    But I agree Welcome signs should not have slogans.

    I think half my friends trimmed those bumper stickers to read "CAPE SCONSI" before putting them on their cars
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on June 21, 2023, 02:45:36 PM
    just curious, who built the Sam Jones Expressway and why? was it INDOT or Indy? Was it always supposed to just be from the old airport to 70?  :hmmm: It seems to serve no purpose anymore and arguably never really did, was this what was left of a larger expressway?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on June 21, 2023, 05:24:41 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on June 21, 2023, 02:45:36 PM
    just curious, who built the Sam Jones Expressway and why? was it INDOT or Indy? Was it always supposed to just be from the old airport to 70?  :hmmm: It seems to serve no purpose anymore and arguably never really did, was this what was left of a larger expressway?

    I believe the city built it and have maintained it ever since. If I understand it correctly I think they wanted to make all of Raymond Street an expressway at one point but only got the part from the airport terminal to I-70 built to "freeway" standards. The rest just became an widened road.

    As it was built it was designed to be the main connection from the terminal to downtown, an all-freeway route utilizing the Airport Expressway and I-70. I imagine this was heavily used when the old terminal was on the east side of the airport. Nowadays the expressway still connects with Raymond Street which is a busy industrial route through the Indianapolis' southwest side. It's also pretty well-used by west side commuters who use I-70 from downtown to connect with I-465 on the west side. Now west of I-465 there isn't much need for the roadway but it's only a small bit connecting to High School Road. To say this roadway never had any purpose or no longer has purpose is simply incorrect.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: The Ghostbuster on June 21, 2023, 06:35:02 PM
    Here is some information on Sam Jones, if anyone is interested: https://historicindianapolis.com/whats-in-a-name-sam-jones-expressway/. I assume the Sam Jones Expressway designation ends at S. Tibbs Ave. because that is where the Airport Expressway designation ended as well.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on June 21, 2023, 10:06:33 PM
    On June 1st, the city of Muncie and INDOT agreed on the relinquishment of SR 32 between the western city limits to the Muncie Bypass... INDOT will still complete all of the programmed projects through FY 2027. So yeah, they are pulling a Lafayette/Kokomo move here!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on June 22, 2023, 05:11:49 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on June 21, 2023, 10:06:33 PM
    On June 1st, the city of Muncie and INDOT agreed on the relinquishment of SR 32 between the western city limits to the Muncie Bypass... INDOT will still complete all of the programmed projects through FY 2027. So yeah, they are pulling a Lafayette/Kokomo move here!

    Ugg! Another highway that runs from state line to state line, now divided. There's an easy fix to this one too. They could reroute SR 32 along SR 67 from I-69 east along the southern Muncie bypass to the SR 32 interchange and continue the route east from there. And they could get rid of even more state-maintained routing between Daleville and Yorktown.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on June 22, 2023, 08:17:32 AM
    if theyre doing that in muncie, why are they keeping the westfield and noblesville section? It won't surprise me that in a few years, every city in indiana will have a random gap in highway coverage, making it impossible to figure out how to get through the city without gps.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on June 24, 2023, 05:36:44 PM
    INDOT is out of control with the gaps in numbered routes.  Rerouting 32 around Muncie would be like they first did 20 years ago for 25 around Lafayette, having it join 65 coming in from the north and then going down to the SR 38 exit and following 38 back over to 52 to rejoin its old self.  That only lasted a few years and then it was discontinued in favor of an END 25 sign at each "end" (at 65 on the north and at 231 on the south) and now they have done similar to 26. 

    One shouldn't need GPS just to follow numbered routes; the route shouldn't just randomly end and then begin again.  The way that they post END assemblies when the route picks back up on the other side of town, with no posting of how to get there, is so stupid. 
    I know that they are following strict mileage caps and stuff but that in itself is stupid to have to deal with.  They ought to be able to do like is done in Massachusetts, Ohio, and many other places where a state numbered route can travel on city/town/county roads, with navigation being the reason for route numbers.  Indicating ownership or maintenance responsibility is not what signed route numbers are really for.  (If they were, the federal government would be responsible for US and Interstate routes, which it isn't.)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on June 27, 2023, 02:19:07 AM
    BREAKING NEWS: INDOT will be rolling out speed cameras in four work zones starting on July 1st...  :clap:

    https://www.14news.com/2023/06/27/indot-rolling-out-speed-camera-program/
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tosa on June 28, 2023, 11:35:24 AM
    The I-65 Diverging Diamond Interchange (DDI) at County Road 550 is now OPEN.

    https://www.facebook.com/100069113798332/posts/pfbid0Zf6dyqPU4E2pG21t4sYeZxFKCyRBpHTD1TDrRbmQR44cZUdx4jZXScDSpgGckcibl/?mibextid=cr9u03
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on June 28, 2023, 11:41:50 AM
    I've been using it! It's a nice alternative to 267, but the road east of the interchange is closed so you have to take the frontage road up to a road that cuts through a warehouse park to 500 S to go east. Not ideal right now but will be nice once that is rebuilt to curve north to 500, based on Whitestown's thoroughfare plan: https://whitestown.in.gov/wp-content/uploads/2021/12/Whitestown_Thoroughfare_Plan_2020_12.24.2020.pdf
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on June 28, 2023, 11:47:15 AM
    I wonder why they didn't just make another east west thoroughfare out of 550 that would take pressure off of whitestown parkway and albert s white
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on June 28, 2023, 11:52:53 AM
    Because it runs directly into a neighborhood east of 65.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on June 28, 2023, 11:57:31 AM
    Quote from: bmeiser on June 28, 2023, 11:52:53 AM
    Because it runs directly into a neighborhood east of 65.

    yes, but all of this was planned prior to that neighborhood existing.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on June 28, 2023, 12:11:48 PM
    Albert S White (or Albert South White, as Google calls it) was built to be widened to 4 lanes in the future and it is nowhere near needing that extra capacity yet. So they must have not projected a need for a third thoroughfare over the need to put people places, opting instead to route traffic up to ASW and the 146th street corridor.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Revive 755 on June 28, 2023, 09:25:23 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on June 27, 2023, 02:19:07 AM
    BREAKING NEWS: INDOT will be rolling out speed cameras in four work zones starting on July 1st...  :clap:

    I take it you haven't been through that wonderful work zone on US 41 that has the normal 60 mph speed limit down to 35, with lanes wider than normal and head to head traffic?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: roadman65 on July 04, 2023, 06:57:57 PM
    https://goo.gl/maps/ESTMRa6CsWDiQNuD9
    What's with the Downtown Only orangeout?

    I see it was only in 2021, but now removed. Did they have I-65 closed in 2021?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SkyPesos on July 04, 2023, 07:05:50 PM
    Quote from: roadman65 on July 04, 2023, 06:57:57 PM
    https://goo.gl/maps/ESTMRa6CsWDiQNuD9
    What's with the Downtown Only orangeout?

    I see it was only in 2021, but now removed. Did they have I-65 closed in 2021?
    North Split reconstruction project
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on July 04, 2023, 08:52:46 PM
    Quote from: roadman65 on July 04, 2023, 06:57:57 PM
    https://goo.gl/maps/ESTMRa6CsWDiQNuD9
    What's with the Downtown Only orangeout?

    I see it was only in 2021, but now removed. Did they have I-65 closed in 2021?

    both 65 and 70 were closed for 2 years
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: cjw2001 on July 04, 2023, 09:23:07 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on July 04, 2023, 08:52:46 PM
    Quote from: roadman65 on July 04, 2023, 06:57:57 PM
    https://goo.gl/maps/ESTMRa6CsWDiQNuD9
    What's with the Downtown Only orangeout?

    I see it was only in 2021, but now removed. Did they have I-65 closed in 2021?

    both 65 and 70 were closed for 2 years
    https://northsplit.com/schedule/

    https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=27307.0
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on July 25, 2023, 08:35:13 AM

    The new Kankakee Welcome Center in Jasper County is nearing completion. Looks impressive. Read more about it here (https://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/new-34-7-million-kankakee-welcome-center-aims-to-wow-with-wind-turbine-blades-bison/article_379c5030-277b-11ee-b511-b7ef7c71161e.html) and here (https://indianacapitalchronicle.com/2023/06/14/is-this-the-fanciest-rest-stop-indianas-ever-had/).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on July 25, 2023, 02:23:54 PM

    Ever hear of the Indiana Vehicle Fuel Dashboard (https://www.in.gov/oed/resources-and-information-center/vehicle-fuel-dashboard/)? Probably not. It's a website brought to you by the Indiana Department of Energy to provide information about the types of fuel used by Indiana registered vehicles. The dashboard allows users to search under specific vehicle fuel types, such as electric, hybrid, and, of course, gasoline. Results can also be filtered by county and by vehicle type.

    As alternative fuel vehicles, particularly electric, are increasingly adopted nationwide, the dashboard provides hard numbers on the changes occurring in Indiana. Updated weekly, the dashboard has statistics going back to 2018.

    Access the Indiana Vehicle Fuel Dashboard here (https://www.in.gov/oed/resources-and-information-center/vehicle-fuel-dashboard/) and at the above link.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on July 30, 2023, 11:45:25 AM
    Is there any interest between Indiana or Kentucky to just completely replace the Sherman Minton Bridge? It seems to always have problems, why not just replace it eventually? besides the cost obviously, what are other reasons why they haven't considered this?  :hmmm: I heard they are closing it again for emergency repairs.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ibthebigd on July 30, 2023, 12:42:26 PM
    Or Route I-64 onto I-265 permanently and make Sherman-Minton a 3 Digit

    SM-G996U

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 30, 2023, 01:05:38 PM
    Quote from: ibthebigd on July 30, 2023, 12:42:26 PM
    Or Route I-64 onto I-265 permanently and make Sherman-Minton a 3 Digit

    SM-G996U



    I-265 is only 4 lanes and not capable of carrying I-64 traffic long term, and there are several spots where widening it would be extremely difficult if not impossible.

    Whether by repair or replacement, there needs to be a functional western bridge.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ilpt4u on July 30, 2023, 02:58:34 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on July 30, 2023, 01:05:38 PM
    I-265 is only 4 lanes and not capable of carrying I-64 traffic long term, and there are several spots where widening it would be extremely difficult if not impossible.

    Whether by repair or replacement, there needs to be a functional western bridge.
    Both the East End Bridge and the twin tunnel tubes look wide enough to carry 3 lanes each way, with narrow shoulders on the bridge and no shoulders in the tunnel.

    Are there HC restrictions on the KY-841 soon-to-be I-265 tunnel?

    That said, a western bridge to New Albany is a good thing, but could not the current bridge with much lighter daily AADT/load and potentially a single deck be less trouble maintenance-wise?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: The Ghostbuster on July 30, 2023, 03:00:40 PM
    Rerouting Interstate 64 onto Interstate 265 was part of that 8664 website that proposed removing Interstate 64 between Interstate 264 and Interstate 65, which would have renumbered the rest of 64 west of 265 as Interstate 364. The proposal was always a pipe dream, and didn't go anywhere.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 30, 2023, 03:04:55 PM
    Quote from: ilpt4u on July 30, 2023, 02:58:34 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on July 30, 2023, 01:05:38 PM
    I-265 is only 4 lanes and not capable of carrying I-64 traffic long term, and there are several spots where widening it would be extremely difficult if not impossible.

    Whether by repair or replacement, there needs to be a functional western bridge.
    Both the East End Bridge and the twin tunnel tubes look wide enough to carry 3 lanes each way, with narrow shoulders on the bridge and no shoulders in the tunnel.

    Are there HC restrictions on the KY-841 soon-to-be I-265 tunnel?

    That said, a western bridge to New Albany is a good thing, but could not the current bridge with much lighter daily AADT/load and potentially a single deck be less trouble maintenance-wise?

    I'm talking about I-265 between I-64 and I-65. There are so many homes and businesses along there that would be very, very expensive to buy out in order to widen.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ilpt4u on July 30, 2023, 03:07:09 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on July 30, 2023, 03:04:55 PM
    Quote from: ilpt4u on July 30, 2023, 02:58:34 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on July 30, 2023, 01:05:38 PM
    I-265 is only 4 lanes and not capable of carrying I-64 traffic long term, and there are several spots where widening it would be extremely difficult if not impossible.

    Whether by repair or replacement, there needs to be a functional western bridge.
    Both the East End Bridge and the twin tunnel tubes look wide enough to carry 3 lanes each way, with narrow shoulders on the bridge and no shoulders in the tunnel.

    Are there HC restrictions on the KY-841 soon-to-be I-265 tunnel?

    That said, a western bridge to New Albany is a good thing, but could not the current bridge with much lighter daily AADT/load and potentially a single deck be less trouble maintenance-wise?
    I'm talking about I-265 between I-64 and I-65. There are so many homes and businesses along there that would be very, very expensive to buy out in order to widen.
    Assuming in Indiana:
    Is there not enough room in the median to build an inside 3rd lane and jersey barrier?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on July 30, 2023, 05:32:00 PM
    Quote from: ilpt4u on July 30, 2023, 03:07:09 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on July 30, 2023, 03:04:55 PM
    Quote from: ilpt4u on July 30, 2023, 02:58:34 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on July 30, 2023, 01:05:38 PM
    I-265 is only 4 lanes and not capable of carrying I-64 traffic long term, and there are several spots where widening it would be extremely difficult if not impossible.

    Whether by repair or replacement, there needs to be a functional western bridge.
    Both the East End Bridge and the twin tunnel tubes look wide enough to carry 3 lanes each way, with narrow shoulders on the bridge and no shoulders in the tunnel.

    Are there HC restrictions on the KY-841 soon-to-be I-265 tunnel?

    That said, a western bridge to New Albany is a good thing, but could not the current bridge with much lighter daily AADT/load and potentially a single deck be less trouble maintenance-wise?
    I'm talking about I-265 between I-64 and I-65. There are so many homes and businesses along there that would be very, very expensive to buy out in order to widen.
    Assuming in Indiana:
    Is there not enough room in the median to build an inside 3rd lane and jersey barrier?

    I would say that there's definitely room to build a third lane.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on August 03, 2023, 12:54:49 AM
    https://www.wrtv.com/news/local-news/hamilton-county-farm-market-being-forced-to-move-as-indot-claims-eminent-domain-on-land

    The owner of the business off of US 31 at 256th Street in Hamilton County is not happy as INDOT will be taking over this property via eminent domain.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on August 03, 2023, 01:42:09 AM
    On Monday in Henry County, a Google Maps Street View vehicle was involved in police pursuit (https://fox59.com/news/indycrime/google-street-view-car-leads-indiana-police-on-100-mph-chase-crashes-into-creek/) after the driver failed to pull over after being clocked on US 36 going "well over" 100 in a 55 mph zone. Police chased the vehicle into Madison County where the driver lost control and crashed. No injuries were reported.



    Edit: Swapped out video due to the first not having sound.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: The Ghostbuster on August 03, 2023, 12:10:21 PM
    There is nothing stupider than running from the police. Why the hell was that driver going well over 100 MPH? Did they think they were on a German Autobahn?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: mgk920 on August 03, 2023, 01:01:39 PM
    Quote from: ITB on August 03, 2023, 01:42:09 AM
    On Monday in Henry County, a Google Maps Street View vehicle was involved in police pursuit (https://fox59.com/news/indycrime/google-street-view-car-leads-indiana-police-on-100-mph-chase-crashes-into-creek/) after the driver failed to pull over after being clocked on US 36 going "well over" 100 in a 55 mph zone. Police chased the vehicle into Madison County where the driver lost control and crashed. No injuries were reported.

    Poor car . . .   :no:

    Mike
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Life in Paradise on August 03, 2023, 01:02:24 PM
    Quote from: The Ghostbuster on August 03, 2023, 12:10:21 PM
    There is nothing stupider than running from the police. Why the hell was that driver going well over 100 MPH? Did they think they were on a German Autobahn?
    Next question I have is:  Was the car still taking pictures during the chase?  Would love to see those and see the faces blurred without software!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: triplemultiplex on August 04, 2023, 11:00:34 AM
    Quote from: Life in Paradise on August 03, 2023, 01:02:24 PM
    Next question I have is:  Was the car still taking pictures during the chase?  Would love to see those and see the faces blurred without software!

    I had the same thought; especially the part where the idiot winds up in the ditch.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: The Ghostbuster on August 04, 2023, 12:03:07 PM
    Whoever was being the wheel hopefully never works updating Google Maps' Street View again.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on August 06, 2023, 03:03:09 PM

    Indiana's ambition to attract investment from the semi-conductor industry is detailed in a major New York Times' article (https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/06/technology/indiana-chips-act.html) that appeared today.

    Considering how large the LEAP Innovation District is planned to be, and the potential linkage of companies that locate there to Purdue University, it seems obvious that I-65 between Lebanon and Lafayette will become increasingly important. Will we soon see a major push to widen I-65 in its entirety to three lanes in each direction between the two cities?

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 06, 2023, 05:57:46 PM
    Quote from: ITB on August 06, 2023, 03:03:09 PM

    Indiana's ambition to attract investment from the semi-conductor industry is detailed in a major New York Times' article (https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/06/technology/indiana-chips-act.html) that appeared today.

    Considering how large the LEAP Innovation District is planned to be, and the potential linkage of companies that locate there to Purdue University, it seems obvious that I-65 between Lebanon and Lafayette will become increasingly important. Will we soon see a major push to widen I-65 in its entirety to three lanes in each direction between the two cities?



    It would be cost prohibitive to do the section between I-465 and I-865, but other than that, there will only be 22 miles left, between IN 47 and IN 38, left to do. My guess is that segment gets done within the next 4-6 years.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: sprjus4 on August 06, 2023, 08:09:40 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on July 30, 2023, 03:04:55 PM
    Quote from: ilpt4u on July 30, 2023, 02:58:34 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on July 30, 2023, 01:05:38 PM
    I-265 is only 4 lanes and not capable of carrying I-64 traffic long term, and there are several spots where widening it would be extremely difficult if not impossible.

    Whether by repair or replacement, there needs to be a functional western bridge.
    Both the East End Bridge and the twin tunnel tubes look wide enough to carry 3 lanes each way, with narrow shoulders on the bridge and no shoulders in the tunnel.

    Are there HC restrictions on the KY-841 soon-to-be I-265 tunnel?

    That said, a western bridge to New Albany is a good thing, but could not the current bridge with much lighter daily AADT/load and potentially a single deck be less trouble maintenance-wise?

    I'm talking about I-265 between I-64 and I-65. There are so many homes and businesses along there that would be very, very expensive to buy out in order to widen.
    That stretch of I-265 has a 60 ft median - there is more than enough room to construct a third lane and 10 ft paved shoulder in either direction and still have 16 ft of grass still left in the middle.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: sprjus4 on August 06, 2023, 08:11:48 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on August 03, 2023, 12:54:49 AM
    https://www.wrtv.com/news/local-news/hamilton-county-farm-market-being-forced-to-move-as-indot-claims-eminent-domain-on-land

    The owner of the business off of US 31 at 256th Street in Hamilton County is not happy as INDOT will be taking over this property via eminent domain.
    I don't blame him... that article shows a rendering of the proposed cul-de-sac... are they not able to construct the cul-de-sac to the south instead over that gravel lot, and spare his business?

    Or construct the cul-de-sac just east of the property over farmland? INDOT claiming there's no alternative that doesn't relocate his property is... BS. They can easily retain his business while constructing the cul-de-sac and controlling access on US-31.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Revive 755 on August 06, 2023, 10:15:56 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on August 06, 2023, 05:57:46 PM
    It would be cost prohibitive to do the section between I-465 and I-865, but other than that, there will only be 22 miles left, between IN 47 and IN 38, left to do. My guess is that segment gets done within the next 4-6 years.

    I-865 to I-465 (Exit 123) has a decent sized grass median that could easily handling adding one more lane each way, if not two in many spots.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JREwing78 on August 06, 2023, 11:33:46 PM
    Quote from: sprjus4 on August 06, 2023, 08:11:48 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on August 03, 2023, 12:54:49 AM
    https://www.wrtv.com/news/local-news/hamilton-county-farm-market-being-forced-to-move-as-indot-claims-eminent-domain-on-land

    The owner of the business off of US 31 at 256th Street in Hamilton County is not happy as INDOT will be taking over this property via eminent domain.
    I don't blame him... that article shows a rendering of the proposed cul-de-sac... are they not able to construct the cul-de-sac to the south instead over that gravel lot, and spare his business?

    Or construct the cul-de-sac just east of the property over farmland? INDOT claiming there's no alternative that doesn't relocate his property is... BS. They can easily retain his business while constructing the cul-de-sac and controlling access on US-31.

    Then what? Still not giving him direct access to his business from US-31, which is the real issue he's upset about. He needs to move to the exit at 236th St or 276th St. Hopefully he and his lawyers are smart enough to get InDOT to cough up some of the expenses invovled in rebuilding at a different location.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on August 07, 2023, 08:29:19 AM
    i don't get that either, it looks like access can be easily maintained.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on August 07, 2023, 06:05:24 PM
    You have to feel for a guy who has devoted so many years to a business. It's an unfortunate situation. And yet the die was cast a few years back when the decision was made to end 256th Street at cul-de-sacs, instead of constructing an overpass or an interchange. The business, even if allowed to stay, is likely to struggle to remain viable. The best thing to do now is to relocate and to squeeze as much money as possible out of INDOT to assist with that.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on August 07, 2023, 06:18:16 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on August 06, 2023, 05:57:46 PM
    Quote from: ITB on August 06, 2023, 03:03:09 PM

    Indiana's ambition to attract investment from the semi-conductor industry is detailed in a major New York Times' article (https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/06/technology/indiana-chips-act.html) that appeared today.

    Considering how large the LEAP Innovation District is planned to be, and the potential linkage of companies that locate there to Purdue University, it seems obvious that I-65 between Lebanon and Lafayette will become increasingly important. Will we soon see a major push to widen I-65 in its entirety to three lanes in each direction between the two cities?



    It would be cost prohibitive to do the section between I-465 and I-865, but other than that, there will only be 22 miles left, between IN 47 and IN 38, left to do. My guess is that segment gets done within the next 4-6 years.

    I think the widening of I-65 between SR 47 and SR 38 is going to move to the forefront. Maybe not this year or next, but soon forthcoming. It's a largely rural stretch, with only one interchange, at SR 28, so it won't be outrageously expensive. Even so, at roughly $30 million a mile in present dollars, it's a $600 to 650 million project. Five years from now, it will probably be upwards of $750 million.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on August 09, 2023, 09:02:49 PM
    https://revivei70.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/08/Revive-I-70_PIM2_Presentation.pdf

    I dug through the presentation slides on the I-70 Revive project in the Richmond area, and here's the gists of it:

    1. There are three separate contracts on this 20-mile stretch of I-70
    2. Contract 1 includes rebuilding and widening I-70 for nine miles to three lanes in each direction with a concrete barrier and a wide 14-foot left shoulder.
    3. Interchange improvements will be happening at the US 35 (exit 149) and the US 40 (exit 156).
    a. The US 35 (exit 149) interchange improvement includes a C-D lane for westbound traffic exiting from I-70 as well as extending the acceleration lane for entering traffic to I-70 eastbound.
    b. The US 40 (exit 156) interchange improvement includes rebuilding the B4 parclo interchange to a diamond interchange with roundabouts.
    4. 41 bridges are planned to be improved, with 6 bridges being fully replaced, 15 bridges getting a major rehab, 14 bridges getting a deck overlay, and 6 bridges getting preventive maintenance.

    The letting on Contract 1 will be expected to be let in early 2024, with construction to be expected to begin in late 2024.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Plutonic Panda on August 10, 2023, 02:22:12 AM
    It seems like this is just for section 1. is it safe to assume the other sections will be widened as well?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tosa on August 10, 2023, 04:53:24 PM
    Quote from: ITB on August 07, 2023, 06:18:16 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on August 06, 2023, 05:57:46 PM
    Quote from: ITB on August 06, 2023, 03:03:09 PM

    Indiana's ambition to attract investment from the semi-conductor industry is detailed in a major New York Times' article (https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/06/technology/indiana-chips-act.html) that appeared today.

    Considering how large the LEAP Innovation District is planned to be, and the potential linkage of companies that locate there to Purdue University, it seems obvious that I-65 between Lebanon and Lafayette will become increasingly important. Will we soon see a major push to widen I-65 in its entirety to three lanes in each direction between the two cities?



    It would be cost prohibitive to do the section between I-465 and I-865, but other than that, there will only be 22 miles left, between IN 47 and IN 38, left to do. My guess is that segment gets done within the next 4-6 years.

    I think the widening of I-65 between SR 47 and SR 38 is going to move to the forefront. Maybe not this year or next, but soon forthcoming. It's a largely rural stretch, with only one interchange, at SR 28, so it won't be outrageously expensive. Even so, at roughly $30 million a mile in present dollars, it's a $600 to 650 million project. Five years from now, it will probably be upwards of $750 million.

    Even if INDOT widens the whole stretch of I-65 from Lafayette to Indy to three lanes, Purdue still sort of ends up feeling a bit disconnected from the interstate highway. It's not like those other big Midwestern universities, where they're conveniently close to the highways. Here, after you hop off I-65, you've got this whole drive through Lafayette before you can even reach the campus. So, maybe it wouldn't hurt for them to consider a shortcut — like a direct route connecting US 231 to I-65, south of Lafayette.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on August 10, 2023, 06:56:01 PM
    Quote from: Plutonic Panda on August 10, 2023, 02:22:12 AM
    It seems like this is just for section 1. is it safe to assume the other sections will be widened as well?

    I would not be surprised if the other two sections include adding a third lane each way...
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: hobsini2 on August 11, 2023, 11:47:16 AM
    Quote from: tosa on August 10, 2023, 04:53:24 PM
    Quote from: ITB on August 07, 2023, 06:18:16 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on August 06, 2023, 05:57:46 PM
    Quote from: ITB on August 06, 2023, 03:03:09 PM

    Indiana's ambition to attract investment from the semi-conductor industry is detailed in a major New York Times' article (https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/06/technology/indiana-chips-act.html) that appeared today.

    Considering how large the LEAP Innovation District is planned to be, and the potential linkage of companies that locate there to Purdue University, it seems obvious that I-65 between Lebanon and Lafayette will become increasingly important. Will we soon see a major push to widen I-65 in its entirety to three lanes in each direction between the two cities?



    It would be cost prohibitive to do the section between I-465 and I-865, but other than that, there will only be 22 miles left, between IN 47 and IN 38, left to do. My guess is that segment gets done within the next 4-6 years.

    I think the widening of I-65 between SR 47 and SR 38 is going to move to the forefront. Maybe not this year or next, but soon forthcoming. It's a largely rural stretch, with only one interchange, at SR 28, so it won't be outrageously expensive. Even so, at roughly $30 million a mile in present dollars, it's a $600 to 650 million project. Five years from now, it will probably be upwards of $750 million.

    Even if INDOT widens the whole stretch of I-65 from Lafayette to Indy to three lanes, Purdue still sort of ends up feeling a bit disconnected from the interstate highway. It's not like those other big Midwestern universities, where they're conveniently close to the highways. Here, after you hop off I-65, you've got this whole drive through Lafayette before you can even reach the campus. So, maybe it wouldn't hurt for them to consider a shortcut — like a direct route connecting US 231 to I-65, south of Lafayette.

    Getting to Camp Randall in Madison is not that easy either. After exiting the Belt Line (12-18) at John Nolen, you go up to North Shore Dr (151), then west to where it becomes Regent St to get to the stadium directly. We usually park off Broom & Johnson then walk the 9 blocks to the stadium.

    Sorry for the tangent.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tosa on August 11, 2023, 02:40:19 PM
    Quote from: hobsini2 on August 11, 2023, 11:47:16 AM
    Quote from: tosa on August 10, 2023, 04:53:24 PM
    Quote from: ITB on August 07, 2023, 06:18:16 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on August 06, 2023, 05:57:46 PM
    Quote from: ITB on August 06, 2023, 03:03:09 PM

    Indiana's ambition to attract investment from the semi-conductor industry is detailed in a major New York Times' article (https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/06/technology/indiana-chips-act.html) that appeared today.

    Considering how large the LEAP Innovation District is planned to be, and the potential linkage of companies that locate there to Purdue University, it seems obvious that I-65 between Lebanon and Lafayette will become increasingly important. Will we soon see a major push to widen I-65 in its entirety to three lanes in each direction between the two cities?



    It would be cost prohibitive to do the section between I-465 and I-865, but other than that, there will only be 22 miles left, between IN 47 and IN 38, left to do. My guess is that segment gets done within the next 4-6 years.

    I think the widening of I-65 between SR 47 and SR 38 is going to move to the forefront. Maybe not this year or next, but soon forthcoming. It's a largely rural stretch, with only one interchange, at SR 28, so it won't be outrageously expensive. Even so, at roughly $30 million a mile in present dollars, it's a $600 to 650 million project. Five years from now, it will probably be upwards of $750 million.

    Even if INDOT widens the whole stretch of I-65 from Lafayette to Indy to three lanes, Purdue still sort of ends up feeling a bit disconnected from the interstate highway. It's not like those other big Midwestern universities, where they're conveniently close to the highways. Here, after you hop off I-65, you've got this whole drive through Lafayette before you can even reach the campus. So, maybe it wouldn't hurt for them to consider a shortcut — like a direct route connecting US 231 to I-65, south of Lafayette.

    Getting to Camp Randall in Madison is not that easy either. After exiting the Belt Line (12-18) at John Nolen, you go up to North Shore Dr (151), then west to where it becomes Regent St to get to the stadium directly. We usually park off Broom & Johnson then walk the 9 blocks to the stadium.

    Sorry for the tangent.

    According to Google Maps, the trip from Camp Randall to the freeway entrance at John Nolen spans about 3.4 miles, which takes roughly 9 minutes to drive. Plus, the entire route is on a road with at least 4 lanes. Now, when we look at Purdue, the distance from Ross-Ade to the I-65 entrance on IN-26 is about 6 miles, taking around 20 minutes to drive, and portions of the route have just one lane in each direction. It's pretty clear that being a Badgers fan comes with some transportation luck.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on August 12, 2023, 10:28:03 PM
    I think eventually they are going to extend the 231 bypass up to 65.  :hmmm:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Revive 755 on August 12, 2023, 10:29:49 PM
    Quote from: JoePCool14 on February 01, 2023, 07:49:11 AM
    Chicago tends to do that. Every Interstate in or out of the area is very busy with trucks. I-65, which of course feeds into I-80/94, being a prime example.

    Though based on IDOT's ADT map, I-88 has a much lower volume of trucks from about the western IL 56 interchange near Sugar Grove to the DeKalb area where the truck volume seems to pick back up.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: hobsini2 on August 13, 2023, 07:17:31 PM
    Quote from: Revive 755 on August 12, 2023, 10:29:49 PM
    Quote from: JoePCool14 on February 01, 2023, 07:49:11 AM
    Chicago tends to do that. Every Interstate in or out of the area is very busy with trucks. I-65, which of course feeds into I-80/94, being a prime example.

    Though based on IDOT's ADT map, I-88 has a much lower volume of trucks from about the western IL 56 interchange near Sugar Grove to the DeKalb area where the truck volume seems to pick back up.
    Well there maybe a good reason for that. If one is going from say Moline to the south side of Elgin, I could see one using 88 to Peace Rd and then 38 East to Randall Rd over I-39 to I-90.
    Google maps even suggest doing so via 88, 39, 64 and Plank Rd, 20 or 88, Peace Rd, Barber Greene Rd, County Line Rd, Ramm Rd, 47, Plato Rd, Muirhead Rd, Russell Rd, 20.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on August 13, 2023, 09:41:35 PM
    Quote from: tosa on August 11, 2023, 02:40:19 PM
    Quote from: hobsini2 on August 11, 2023, 11:47:16 AM
    Quote from: tosa on August 10, 2023, 04:53:24 PM
    Quote from: ITB on August 07, 2023, 06:18:16 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on August 06, 2023, 05:57:46 PM
    Quote from: ITB on August 06, 2023, 03:03:09 PM

    Indiana's ambition to attract investment from the semi-conductor industry is detailed in a major New York Times' article (https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/06/technology/indiana-chips-act.html) that appeared today.

    Considering how large the LEAP Innovation District is planned to be, and the potential linkage of companies that locate there to Purdue University, it seems obvious that I-65 between Lebanon and Lafayette will become increasingly important. Will we soon see a major push to widen I-65 in its entirety to three lanes in each direction between the two cities?



    It would be cost prohibitive to do the section between I-465 and I-865, but other than that, there will only be 22 miles left, between IN 47 and IN 38, left to do. My guess is that segment gets done within the next 4-6 years.

    I think the widening of I-65 between SR 47 and SR 38 is going to move to the forefront. Maybe not this year or next, but soon forthcoming. It's a largely rural stretch, with only one interchange, at SR 28, so it won't be outrageously expensive. Even so, at roughly $30 million a mile in present dollars, it's a $600 to 650 million project. Five years from now, it will probably be upwards of $750 million.

    Even if INDOT widens the whole stretch of I-65 from Lafayette to Indy to three lanes, Purdue still sort of ends up feeling a bit disconnected from the interstate highway. It's not like those other big Midwestern universities, where they're conveniently close to the highways. Here, after you hop off I-65, you've got this whole drive through Lafayette before you can even reach the campus. So, maybe it wouldn't hurt for them to consider a shortcut — like a direct route connecting US 231 to I-65, south of Lafayette.

    Getting to Camp Randall in Madison is not that easy either. After exiting the Belt Line (12-18) at John Nolen, you go up to North Shore Dr (151), then west to where it becomes Regent St to get to the stadium directly. We usually park off Broom & Johnson then walk the 9 blocks to the stadium.

    Sorry for the tangent.

    According to Google Maps, the trip from Camp Randall to the freeway entrance at John Nolen spans about 3.4 miles, which takes roughly 9 minutes to drive. Plus, the entire route is on a road with at least 4 lanes. Now, when we look at Purdue, the distance from Ross-Ade to the I-65 entrance on IN-26 is about 6 miles, taking around 20 minutes to drive, and portions of the route have just one lane in each direction. It's pretty clear that being a Badgers fan comes with some transportation luck.


    INDOT missed the boat on the rerouting of US 52 and also on what would have been a more easily advertised route to Purdue from I-65.  Veterans Memorial Parkway, formerly CR 350S and 475E, connects to IN 38 (actually extending all the way up to IN 26 by Meijer) and makes a reasonable bypass around the south side of Lafayette to reach Purdue from I-65 NB (exit at SR 38, go west, left on Veterans Memorial, right on US 231 and up to the west side of the campus (or turn on River Road, at where 231 used to curve onto it, to get to West Lafayette proper).  This would be reasonable except development went wild on 350S such that it is congested and slow a lot of the time--but still it makes a lot more sense than taking the US 52 routing across Teal Road which brings you back down to US 231 anyway.  Why INDOT didn't route 52 across 350S I will never understand.  Advertising taking 38 to Veterans Memorial to 231 may not be worth it as Veterans Memorial gets so congested, but building a parallel bypass seems like something that may not be worth it with routes already available.

    Getting to IU used to be terrible with the signals and so forth on 37, and access from 37 to the campus slow, but I-69 will improve that.  Notre Dame has it made as far as Interstate access.  The road that they built across the tailgating White Lot leads right to straight across from the Toll Road entrance, a boon for access on game days as well as in general.  Parking near the stadium one year and in the White Lot several other years (as a visiting fan) before that road was built, the postgame traffic was much more sketchy.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tosa on August 14, 2023, 08:37:55 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 12, 2023, 10:28:03 PM
    I think eventually they are going to extend the 231 bypass up to 65.  :hmmm:

    This project has actually been on the table for more than ten years, but INDOT has never really put the funding into it. And it's meant to extend US 231 northward, so it doesn't exactly address the Purdue-to-Indy highway link.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tosa on August 14, 2023, 10:15:45 AM
    Quote from: PurdueBill on August 13, 2023, 09:41:35 PM
    Quote from: tosa on August 11, 2023, 02:40:19 PM
    Quote from: hobsini2 on August 11, 2023, 11:47:16 AM
    Quote from: tosa on August 10, 2023, 04:53:24 PM
    Quote from: ITB on August 07, 2023, 06:18:16 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on August 06, 2023, 05:57:46 PM
    Quote from: ITB on August 06, 2023, 03:03:09 PM

    Indiana's ambition to attract investment from the semi-conductor industry is detailed in a major New York Times' article (https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/06/technology/indiana-chips-act.html) that appeared today.

    Considering how large the LEAP Innovation District is planned to be, and the potential linkage of companies that locate there to Purdue University, it seems obvious that I-65 between Lebanon and Lafayette will become increasingly important. Will we soon see a major push to widen I-65 in its entirety to three lanes in each direction between the two cities?



    It would be cost prohibitive to do the section between I-465 and I-865, but other than that, there will only be 22 miles left, between IN 47 and IN 38, left to do. My guess is that segment gets done within the next 4-6 years.

    I think the widening of I-65 between SR 47 and SR 38 is going to move to the forefront. Maybe not this year or next, but soon forthcoming. It's a largely rural stretch, with only one interchange, at SR 28, so it won't be outrageously expensive. Even so, at roughly $30 million a mile in present dollars, it's a $600 to 650 million project. Five years from now, it will probably be upwards of $750 million.

    Even if INDOT widens the whole stretch of I-65 from Lafayette to Indy to three lanes, Purdue still sort of ends up feeling a bit disconnected from the interstate highway. It's not like those other big Midwestern universities, where they're conveniently close to the highways. Here, after you hop off I-65, you've got this whole drive through Lafayette before you can even reach the campus. So, maybe it wouldn't hurt for them to consider a shortcut — like a direct route connecting US 231 to I-65, south of Lafayette.

    Getting to Camp Randall in Madison is not that easy either. After exiting the Belt Line (12-18) at John Nolen, you go up to North Shore Dr (151), then west to where it becomes Regent St to get to the stadium directly. We usually park off Broom & Johnson then walk the 9 blocks to the stadium.

    Sorry for the tangent.

    According to Google Maps, the trip from Camp Randall to the freeway entrance at John Nolen spans about 3.4 miles, which takes roughly 9 minutes to drive. Plus, the entire route is on a road with at least 4 lanes. Now, when we look at Purdue, the distance from Ross-Ade to the I-65 entrance on IN-26 is about 6 miles, taking around 20 minutes to drive, and portions of the route have just one lane in each direction. It's pretty clear that being a Badgers fan comes with some transportation luck.


    INDOT missed the boat on the rerouting of US 52 and also on what would have been a more easily advertised route to Purdue from I-65.  Veterans Memorial Parkway, formerly CR 350S and 475E, connects to IN 38 (actually extending all the way up to IN 26 by Meijer) and makes a reasonable bypass around the south side of Lafayette to reach Purdue from I-65 NB (exit at SR 38, go west, left on Veterans Memorial, right on US 231 and up to the west side of the campus (or turn on River Road, at where 231 used to curve onto it, to get to West Lafayette proper).  This would be reasonable except development went wild on 350S such that it is congested and slow a lot of the time--but still it makes a lot more sense than taking the US 52 routing across Teal Road which brings you back down to US 231 anyway.  Why INDOT didn't route 52 across 350S I will never understand.  Advertising taking 38 to Veterans Memorial to 231 may not be worth it as Veterans Memorial gets so congested, but building a parallel bypass seems like something that may not be worth it with routes already available.

    Getting to IU used to be terrible with the signals and so forth on 37, and access from 37 to the campus slow, but I-69 will improve that.  Notre Dame has it made as far as Interstate access.  The road that they built across the tailgating White Lot leads right to straight across from the Toll Road entrance, a boon for access on game days as well as in general.  Parking near the stadium one year and in the White Lot several other years (as a visiting fan) before that road was built, the postgame traffic was much more sketchy.

    I think INDOT really focused on redirecting US 52 onto the new 231 stretch that curves around Purdue's campus. But, here's the thing: Veterans Memorial actually falls under Lafayette's jurisdiction, and the only road they officially own in that zone is Teal Road. So, for them, it was just easier to designate Teal as the new 52 instead of getting into negotiations with the city to take over VMR.

    Now, talking about using VMR as the connection route, like you mentioned, there have been a lot of big developments along that route, making it supercrowded. Plus, almost half of it needs to be widened to four lanes, which includes putting in a whole new railroad overpass — a pricey affair. And even if VMR gets expanded all the way to four lanes, the road still wouldn't make for a speedy corridor from Purdue to I-65. The heavy congestion, all those traffic lights, that tight right turn onto 38, and even the left turn onto the I-65 entrance ramp would all slow things down.

    So, my idea is something like the 231 extension up north. What if they built a fresh road that goes through that undeveloped southern area, keeping intersections and stop lights to a minimum? And to top it off, a new interchange in between the IN-28 and 38 interchanges, could connect it straight to I-65.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: I-55 on August 14, 2023, 03:34:45 PM
    Quote from: tosa on August 14, 2023, 10:15:45 AM
    I think INDOT really focused on redirecting US 52 onto the new 231 stretch that curves around Purdue's campus. But, here's the thing: Veterans Memorial actually falls under Lafayette's jurisdiction, and the only road they officially own in that zone is Teal Road. So, for them, it was just easier to designate Teal as the new 52 instead of getting into negotiations with the city to take over VMR.

    The fact most people miss is that Teal Rd used to be the alignment of SR 25 prior to truncating routes outside the city. When US 231 was completed, they simply kept US 52 on a route they already owned. Not to mention they would've turned over 2.5 miles of four lane highway (Sagamore Pky) to the city as well as potentially the same distance along SR 38 if it were to follow VMR.

    Quote
    Now, talking about using VMR as the connection route, like you mentioned, there have been a lot of big developments along that route, making it supercrowded. Plus, almost half of it needs to be widened to four lanes, which includes putting in a whole new railroad overpass — a pricey affair. And even if VMR gets expanded all the way to four lanes, the road still wouldn't make for a speedy corridor from Purdue to I-65. The heavy congestion, all those traffic lights, that tight right turn onto 38, and even the left turn onto the I-65 entrance ramp would all slow things down.

    Due to the extra length of going around the south side of town, any fast route would need to be at least 55 mph to be any bit effective. Coming from the south, if you stay on I-65, the best way is without a doubt South Street, as you travel NW at 65 mph and have less city street to navigate. Coming from 52 is different, but the only parts of campus where taking 52 is quicker to Indy than I-65 are within 500' of the US 231 bypass. Anything else tries to put you on the interstate via either South Street or Main Street to SR 38 (and this applies to almost all of WL for that matter too).

    Quote
    So, my idea is something like the 231 extension up north. What if they built a fresh road that goes through that undeveloped southern area, keeping intersections and stop lights to a minimum? And to top it off, a new interchange in between the IN-28 and 38 interchanges, could connect it straight to I-65.

    A bypass extension that swings by Harrison HS and ties into I-65 would be my dream senior design project this year. This would also take a lot of load off of the Sagamore Pky bridge (at least while River Rd is closed) and eventually some of the 2-lane routes on the north side of town.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on August 14, 2023, 04:45:19 PM
    Quote from: I-55 on August 14, 2023, 03:34:45 PM
    Quote from: tosa on August 14, 2023, 10:15:45 AM
    I think INDOT really focused on redirecting US 52 onto the new 231 stretch that curves around Purdue's campus. But, here's the thing: Veterans Memorial actually falls under Lafayette's jurisdiction, and the only road they officially own in that zone is Teal Road. So, for them, it was just easier to designate Teal as the new 52 instead of getting into negotiations with the city to take over VMR.

    The fact most people miss is that Teal Rd used to be the alignment of SR 25 prior to truncating routes outside the city. When US 231 was completed, they simply kept US 52 on a route they already owned. Not to mention they would've turned over 2.5 miles of four lane highway (Sagamore Pky) to the city as well as potentially the same distance along SR 38 if it were to follow VMR.

    Quote
    Now, talking about using VMR as the connection route, like you mentioned, there have been a lot of big developments along that route, making it supercrowded. Plus, almost half of it needs to be widened to four lanes, which includes putting in a whole new railroad overpass — a pricey affair. And even if VMR gets expanded all the way to four lanes, the road still wouldn't make for a speedy corridor from Purdue to I-65. The heavy congestion, all those traffic lights, that tight right turn onto 38, and even the left turn onto the I-65 entrance ramp would all slow things down.

    Due to the extra length of going around the south side of town, any fast route would need to be at least 55 mph to be any bit effective. Coming from the south, if you stay on I-65, the best way is without a doubt South Street, as you travel NW at 65 mph and have less city street to navigate. Coming from 52 is different, but the only parts of campus where taking 52 is quicker to Indy than I-65 are within 500' of the US 231 bypass. Anything else tries to put you on the interstate via either South Street or Main Street to SR 38 (and this applies to almost all of WL for that matter too).

    Quote
    So, my idea is something like the 231 extension up north. What if they built a fresh road that goes through that undeveloped southern area, keeping intersections and stop lights to a minimum? And to top it off, a new interchange in between the IN-28 and 38 interchanges, could connect it straight to I-65.

    A bypass extension that swings by Harrison HS and ties into I-65 would be my dream senior design project this year. This would also take a lot of load off of the Sagamore Pky bridge (at least while River Rd is closed) and eventually some of the 2-lane routes on the north side of town.

    Indeed, Teal was previously 25 (as it was when I lived there) so it was easier to keep under INDOT's control, but Lordy is it silly to route 52 over it.  No one would actually follow 52 as signed unless they were bound to follow signed state/US routes.  Veterans Memorial used to be out in the county; 350S was once a two-lane county road that moved fast.  In no time, with Lafayette annexing to the south and sprawl extending down there, Veterans Memorial became as congested as Sagamore and 26 (I mean, now South Street). 

    An advantage of coming in via 231 despite the longer distance during lower-traffic times where Veterans actually moves along is not having to deal with the very slow State Street in West Lafayette.  While the city wanted to get rid of thru traffic with the deletion of 26 through there, they almost overdid it to where the traffic hardly moves at any time of day--it's like they are saying "go away!"  38 to Main Street dumps you onto Columbia Street just as South Street would, which is fine unless you need to go up State Street to Purdue which stinks now.  Union Street and Harrison Bridge are still better as far as moving; when I lived on the south side of Lafayette in the late 90s I would take 18th Street to Union and over the Harrison Bridge, which moved much better and still seems to.
    (A windswept day with flurries in December 2000, I was on the Harrison Bridge as they stopped traffic for a few minutes so a crane parked on the eastbound side and a bucket truck could position the horizontal part of the sign bridge for the River Road exit from the westbound side...it was amazing watching them do that in the wind, and I wish back then I had a camera on me at all times.)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on August 14, 2023, 08:01:29 PM

    Eventually, at some point a major bypass on the south side of Lafayette will be needed. The Greater Lafayette region has been growing steadily and is now one of Indiana's economic bright spots. While the entire area is seeing growth, development seems more concentrated on the north side of West Lafayette, and on the south side of Lafayette. And, now, with Purdue positioned to play a major factor in the LEAP Innovation District, growth is only likely to accelerate.

    Preferably, to me at least, a southern bypass would be a limited access highway, having only two or three intersections (roundabouts?) between I-65 and US 231. Taking future growth into consideration, it seems the interchange at I-65 is best placed well south of the SR 38 interchange, perhaps as far south as County Road 900S. As such, the bypass would curve in a northwesterly direction toward 231 and West Lafayette.

    If built, this bypass would probably quickly become the preferred route for travelers from the Indianapolis region to West Lafayette. Bear in mind, too, the movers and shakers of Greater Lafayette, and particularly Purdue, are striving to bring back commercial air service to Purdue University Airport. Since US231/US52 is the main road providing access to the airport, a southern bypass would further enhance airport connectivity, particularly from points south. And, as any airport planner will tell you, better access to the airport is, well, important.

    It seems it's only a matter of time, not an if, before a push emerges for a southern bypass around Lafayette.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: The Ghostbuster on August 14, 2023, 09:35:37 PM
    I believe the US 52/US 231 Lafayette Bypass should have had a direct connection to Interstate 65 to begin with, like the IN 25 expressway does. Maybe US 52 should have remained on Sagamore Pkwy. since Teal Rd. is a narrow two-lane roadway that is unupgradable.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 14, 2023, 10:37:22 PM
    Big heads up for any of you regularly traveling from NW Indiana to Chicago.

    Starting as early as September 5, and lasting up to three weeks, the ramp connecting I-65 north to I-80/94 west in Gary will be CLOSED to traffic as one of the final steps of the ongoing concrete restoration project. The scope and intensity of work was enough for INDOT to justify a full closure, versus keeping one lane open for traffic. They felt this was the safest and quickest way to get the work done in a smaller time window.

    With that said, the official detour calls for I-65 northbound traffic to head to US 12/20 west and return to I-80/94 west via Cline. If you're willing to spend a decent chunk of change and heading to Chicago, it may be best to use the Indiana Toll Road/Chicago Skyway, even with the bridge restoration work still in progress west of Cline.

    Any of you coming from Indianapolis-Lafayette should strongly consider using US 24 west to I-57 for Chicago and points west, since there will be major backups on the arterials in the immediate area.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on August 15, 2023, 12:15:49 AM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 14, 2023, 10:37:22 PM
    Big heads up for any of you regularly traveling from NW Indiana to Chicago.

    Starting as early as September 5, and lasting up to three weeks, the ramp connecting I-65 north to I-80/94 west in Gary will be CLOSED to traffic as one of the final steps of the ongoing concrete restoration project. The scope and intensity of work was enough for INDOT to justify a full closure, versus keeping one lane open for traffic. They felt this was the safest and quickest way to get the work done in a smaller time window.

    With that said, the official detour calls for I-65 northbound traffic to head to US 12/20 west and return to I-80/94 west via Cline. If you're willing to spend a decent chunk of change and heading to Chicago, it may be best to use the Indiana Toll Road/Chicago Skyway, even with the bridge restoration work still in progress west of Cline.

    Any of you coming from Indianapolis-Lafayette should strongly consider using US 24 west to I-57 for Chicago and points west, since there will be major backups on the arterials in the immediate area.

    Definitely a good move by INDOT!  :clap:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tosa on August 15, 2023, 08:53:20 AM
    My big dream for the Lafayette bypass would be an interstate 665 (since 265, 465, and 865 are already taken in Indiana) that stretches across the southern, western, and northern parts of Greater Lafayette. Back when they were initially planning the new 231, I recall there was a consideration for an elevated section with interchanges at 25, 26, and 52. However, that idea was eventually dropped, likely due to cost and challenges in connecting the areas that the road would have separated.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: 74/171FAN on August 15, 2023, 08:55:35 AM
    ^I-655 would have to be part of a very long Illiana Tollway.   :-D  (yes, I understand that it is a typo for I-665)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tosa on August 15, 2023, 09:37:44 AM
    Quote from: 74/171FAN on August 15, 2023, 08:55:35 AM
    ^I-655 would have to be part of a very long Illiana Tollway.   :-D  (yes, I understand that it is a typo for I-665)

    Ah, my bad. :banghead:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on August 15, 2023, 01:12:56 PM
    I believe there is a state law that says all bypasses must be limited access now. this appears to be mostly true as all the bypasses I have seen INDOT do in the past few years have been or have had very limited access points. i wish 52 stayed where it was. originally though teal was supposed to be 52/26/25, but this was dropped and only 52 remains.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Revive 755 on August 15, 2023, 10:09:32 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 14, 2023, 10:37:22 PM
    Any of you coming from Indianapolis-Lafayette should strongly consider using US 24 west to I-57 for Chicago and points west, since there will be major backups on the arterials in the immediate area.

    Maybe if there is nothing messing up I-57 around Kankakee.  Given the lack of good alternates around Kankakee I would try using US 41 and some east-west roadways a little farther north than US  24.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on August 16, 2023, 07:17:52 AM
    Quote from: Revive 755 on August 15, 2023, 10:09:32 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 14, 2023, 10:37:22 PM
    Any of you coming from Indianapolis-Lafayette should strongly consider using US 24 west to I-57 for Chicago and points west, since there will be major backups on the arterials in the immediate area.

    Maybe if there is nothing messing up I-57 around Kankakee.  Given the lack of good alternates around Kankakee I would try using US 41 and some east-west roadways a little farther north than US  24.

    I've found the best Indy-Chicago alternative to be 74 -> 41 -> 109th Ave -> Calumet Ave -> 101st Ave/Exchange Ave -> 394
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SSR_317 on August 21, 2023, 02:36:26 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 15, 2023, 01:12:56 PM
    I believe there is a state law that says all bypasses must be limited access now. this appears to be mostly true as all the bypasses I have seen INDOT do in the past few years have been or have had very limited access points. i wish 52 stayed where it was. originally though teal was supposed to be 52/26/25, but this was dropped and only 52 remains.
    That requirement stemmed from the US 30 Bypass debacle in Fort Wayne. When originally built along the Beuter Road and California Road alignments in the 1950s, the Bypass (later named Coliseum Boulevard) was not built with full access control. Speculation back then was the politicians had bought up all the land on either side and stood to profit massively from development, which was inevitable. And they wanted direct access to those properties from the new road. Of course that roadway quickly became busier than the thru-town routing of US 30 that it replaced. When I-469 was built nearer the end of the century, it became the REAL (if a bit out-of-the way) bypass of the Summit City. But INDOT finally learned its lesson and started building all new bypasses with full access control.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on August 29, 2023, 10:56:46 PM
    https://i65safetyandefficiency.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/08/I-65-Safety-and-Efficiency_Presentation.pdf

    Here's an update on the I-65 Safety and Efficiency project south of Indy between I-465 and I-70.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on August 29, 2023, 11:16:24 PM
    Quote from: tosa on April 18, 2023, 08:17:39 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on April 17, 2023, 08:03:08 PM
    So it looks like the new exit at CR 300 N will replace the existing US 52 interchange and will have 52 be rerouted to this new exit to get back onto its old alignment.

    https://iedc.in.gov/leap-lebanon

    Check that link for a map. Kind of weird if you ask me, but I think it's to provide a full access interchange which the current one does not do.

    SR 32 will also be realigned to be way south of where it is now.

    The map shows the current NB entrance and SB exit ramps will be kept. It doesn't make sense to me, why not remove all the ramps and build an overpass?

    https://www.52at65.com/public-involvement

    And the new interchange will be...  :-o a DIVERGING DIAMOND (DDI)! Also, has INDOT built a green T intersection somewhere in the state?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on August 30, 2023, 08:09:27 AM
    INDOT Loves diverging diamonds  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on August 30, 2023, 09:50:43 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on August 30, 2023, 08:09:27 AM
    INDOT Loves diverging diamonds  :-D
    And roundabouts too!  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ilpt4u on August 30, 2023, 12:52:07 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on August 29, 2023, 11:16:24 PM
    Quote from: tosa on April 18, 2023, 08:17:39 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on April 17, 2023, 08:03:08 PM
    So it looks like the new exit at CR 300 N will replace the existing US 52 interchange and will have 52 be rerouted to this new exit to get back onto its old alignment.

    https://iedc.in.gov/leap-lebanon

    Check that link for a map. Kind of weird if you ask me, but I think it's to provide a full access interchange which the current one does not do.

    SR 32 will also be realigned to be way south of where it is now.

    The map shows the current NB entrance and SB exit ramps will be kept. It doesn't make sense to me, why not remove all the ramps and build an overpass?

    https://www.52at65.com/public-involvement

    And the new interchange will be...  :-o a DIVERGING DIAMOND (DDI)! Also, has INDOT built a green T intersection somewhere in the state?
    Don't know if they have built/opened one, but they made a Facebook post about them back in July: https://www.facebook.com/100064643293491/posts/649481747216596
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 01, 2023, 09:04:37 PM
    With construction work suspended for the Labor Day Weekend, here's where we stand with ongoing projects in NW Indiana...

    Work on I-65 between I-80/94 and 61st Avenue is wrapping up on the mainline, but two major ramps are currently or will be affected for the next few weeks. As mentioned above, work on the ramp from I-65 north to I-80/94 westbound begins as early as this Tuesday, resulting in a complete closure of the ramp for three weeks. I erred when I mentioned the official detour last time I mentioned this; the actual detour requires traffic to use US 12/20 EAST to Indiana 51 south, entering I-80/94 west from that interchange. I still contend that the Toll Road will be faster to Chicago if you have money in the till, or if you're coming from a long range, find a faraway entry point into the city, whether it's I-57 or US 41.

    Unrelated to this project, the ramp from I-65 south to I-80/94 west is closed for emergency repairs to the Mechanically Stabilized Earth wall adjacent to the ramp. No date is set for reopen, but INDOT vows to get the ramp opened as quickly as possible.

    I-65 from US 231 to US 30 remains under construction. No southbound entry to I-65 from 109th Avenue or southbound exit to US 231, but all other movements are open.

    On I-80/94, work continues between Cline Avenue and I-65, with two chute "express"  lanes (no exit until I-65 northbound/Central Avenue) and two "local"  lanes configured for eastbound traffic. When completed, traffic will be driving on diamond ground concrete.

    One thing that you may have noticed on the completed sections of these freeways: INDOT has adopted the practice of adding black stripes to the white stripes in the driving lanes, which will enhance safety during rainy conditions. Also, they have fully embraced the practice of using shortened dashed lines to warn of a terminiating/exiting lane.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on September 03, 2023, 08:53:07 PM
    Drove 32 through Muncie and noticed some things:

    SR 32 is still signed through Muncie, as soon as you hit the Welcome to Muncie Sign it says "END SR 32" but driving the old route all the signs now have a "TO" plate slapped above it. I like this, you can still easily follow 32 through the city as originally signed.

    Unsure why the Muncie bypass is still 55 mph and not at least 60 mph.

    Anyone know when the muncie bypass was built?  :hmmm:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ibthebigd on September 03, 2023, 08:55:13 PM
    The Muncie Bypass needs an exit at McGalliard Rd

    SM-G996U

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on September 04, 2023, 08:44:32 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on September 03, 2023, 08:53:07 PM

    Unsure why the Muncie bypass is still 55 mph and not at least 60 mph.

    Anyone know when the muncie bypass was built?  :hmmm:

    It started in the 1970s according to AARoads website on the bypass, which I researched for. I don't remember seeing an exact date but it is probably somewhere.

    As for the 55 MPH speed limit? Probably the same reason I-465 is at 55, it probably considers the Muncie Bypass as "urban."

    Quote from: ibthebigd on September 03, 2023, 08:55:13 PM
    The Muncie Bypass needs an exit at McGalliard Rd
    SM-G996U

    While that would be nice, don't hold your breath. Muncie is not a growing community and the east side has seen even less growth. INDOT probably has no appetite for building an exit there unless Delaware County were to help. Another spot that would be perfect for an exit would be the Cowan Road intersection on the southwest side of the bypass, but again, no money or immediate need for one there. The space is set aside however.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: I-55 on September 05, 2023, 04:38:59 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on September 04, 2023, 08:44:32 AM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on September 03, 2023, 08:53:07 PM

    Unsure why the Muncie bypass is still 55 mph and not at least 60 mph.

    Anyone know when the muncie bypass was built?  :hmmm:

    It started in the 1970s according to AARoads website on the bypass, which I researched for. I don't remember seeing an exact date but it is probably somewhere.

    As for the 55 MPH speed limit? Probably the same reason I-465 is at 55, it probably considers the Muncie Bypass as "urban."

    Quote from: ibthebigd on September 03, 2023, 08:55:13 PM
    The Muncie Bypass needs an exit at McGalliard Rd
    SM-G996U

    While that would be nice, don't hold your breath. Muncie is not a growing community and the east side has seen even less growth. INDOT probably has no appetite for building an exit there unless Delaware County were to help. Another spot that would be perfect for an exit would be the Cowan Road intersection on the southwest side of the bypass, but again, no money or immediate need for one there. The space is set aside however.

    Indiana law does not allow anything above 55 on a road without a median or barrier, which the portion west of Old SR 67 lacks either. Since there are traffic lights, railroad grade crossings, and no highway on the end of the bypass, INDOT probably kept it at 55 for consistency.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on September 07, 2023, 02:27:57 AM
    https://www.wthr.com/article/traffic/traffic-news/pavement-repairs-to-cause-delays-on-interstate-465-on-northeast-side/531-902d5709-2a21-4dab-aaf8-528db67c04b5

    This will be a mess on I-465 in the northeast side of Indy...  :pan:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: XamotCGC on September 07, 2023, 02:38:57 PM
    what they do to turn hwy 37 that runs between indianapolis and Bloomington to interstate 69 as what kind of upgrades?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ilpt4u on September 07, 2023, 02:41:30 PM
    Quote from: XamotCGC on September 07, 2023, 02:38:57 PM
    what they do to turn hwy 37 that runs between indianapolis and Bloomington to interstate 69 as what kind of upgrades?
    See this thread:
    https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=4855.0
    It has been detailing the entire process of both the new terrain and upgraded 37 portions of I-69
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on September 10, 2023, 12:36:28 AM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 01, 2023, 09:04:37 PM

    One thing that you may have noticed on the completed sections of these freeways: INDOT has adopted the practice of adding black stripes to the white stripes in the driving lanes, which will enhance safety during rainy conditions. Also, they have fully embraced the practice of using shortened dashed lines to warn of a terminiating/exiting lane.

    https://www.in.gov/dot/div/contracts/standards/drawings/sep23/800e/e800%20combined%20pdfs/E808-DLIM.pdf

    I guess that INDOT went through a massive revision on line markings (dotted line markings and markings on narrow bridges) as of September 2023...

    https://www.in.gov/dot/div/contracts/standards/drawings/sep23/sep.htm
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 11, 2023, 04:02:56 PM
    This week, concrete restoration work on I-80/94 eastbound will enter the final phase, with the eastbound lanes shifted over to the left while work on the right lanes and outer shoulder commences.

    The innermost lane will be in its current location, as a counter flow lane on the westbound side, with no ramp access until Central Avenue/I-65 North. The second lane will also be in its current location, but the two right lanes (and the occasional auxiliary lane) will shift over to join that second lane. This configuration will remain in place until the end of October.

    Ramp closures will be taking place in staggered intervals during this time for repairs. Part one will close the ramp to both directions of Cline Avenue, as well as the eastbound entrance from Burr Street. Once one of those ramps open, the eastbound entrances and exits to both Grant Street and Broadway will close. Each respective closure will last two to three weeks.

    This work coincides with all other restrictions currently in place along nearby I-65, with all work set to conclude in November.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: The Ghostbuster on September 12, 2023, 03:04:14 PM
    Yikes!: https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2023/09/12/wheel-flies-off-truck-kills-woman-interstate-70-indianapolis/70830470007/.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on September 13, 2023, 09:57:50 AM

    Yesterday, a TV news report took a closer look (https://fox59.com/news/indot-gives-closeup-look-of-i-465-clear-path-project/) at the status of the I-465 "Clear Path" project. According to the story, INDOT states the project is about 25% complete.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 14, 2023, 10:13:33 PM
    Effective today (9-14-23), INDOT has put a new detour into place for the closed ramp from I-65 north to I-80/94 west ramp in Gary.

    Traffic will now be directed to the I-80/94 east C/D ramp, then will use the Central Avenue interchange to "slingshot"  back onto the I-80/94/65 C/D ramp, where traffic will be allowed to enter I-80/94 west.

    To facilitate the above movement, the portion of Central Avenue between the two ramps will be closed to through traffic, including all ramp access. Local traffic using Central Avenue will likely be detoured via MLK Drive, 15th Avenue and Clay Street.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: rte66man on September 15, 2023, 08:16:08 AM
    ROD Issued for Mid-States Corridor Project

    https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/FR-2023-09-15/pdf/2023-19810.pdf

    Selected sections are quoted below:
    Quote
    DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION
    Federal Highway Administration
    Notice of Final Federal Agency Actions on the Mid-States Corridor Project in Indiana

    AGENCY: Federal Highway Administration (FHWA), DOT.

    ACTION: Notice of limitation on claims for judicial review of actions by FHWA and other Federal agencies.

    SUMMARY: This notice announces final actions taken by FHWA and the United States Fish and Wildlife Service
    (USFWS) relating to the proposed MidStates Corridor Project in southern Indiana. The public is advised that
    FHWA issued a Record of Decision (ROD) which concludes the Tier 1 MidStates Corridor Project studies. The ROD
    is combined with the Mid-States Corridor Project Tier 1 Final Environmental Impact Statement (EIS)
    prepared by FHWA and the Indiana Department of Transportation (INDOT).

    SUPPLEMENTARY INFORMATION: Notice is hereby given that FHWA has approved the Tier 1 Final Environmental Impact
    Statement (FEIS) for the Mid-States Corridor Project and issued the combined FEIS/ROD on September 15, 2023.

    This FEIS and ROD identified Refined Alternative P as the Selected Alternative.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Life in Paradise on September 15, 2023, 12:34:12 PM
    Quote from: rte66man on September 15, 2023, 08:16:08 AM
    ROD Issued for Mid-States Corridor Project

    https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/FR-2023-09-15/pdf/2023-19810.pdf

    Selected sections are quoted below:
    Quote
    DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION
    Federal Highway Administration
    Notice of Final Federal Agency Actions on the Mid-States Corridor Project in Indiana

    AGENCY: Federal Highway Administration (FHWA), DOT.

    ACTION: Notice of limitation on claims for judicial review of actions by FHWA and other Federal agencies.

    SUMMARY: This notice announces final actions taken by FHWA and the United States Fish and Wildlife Service
    (USFWS) relating to the proposed MidStates Corridor Project in southern Indiana. The public is advised that
    FHWA issued a Record of Decision (ROD) which concludes the Tier 1 MidStates Corridor Project studies. The ROD
    is combined with the Mid-States Corridor Project Tier 1 Final Environmental Impact Statement (EIS)
    prepared by FHWA and the Indiana Department of Transportation (INDOT).

    SUPPLEMENTARY INFORMATION: Notice is hereby given that FHWA has approved the Tier 1 Final Environmental Impact
    Statement (FEIS) for the Mid-States Corridor Project and issued the combined FEIS/ROD on September 15, 2023.

    This FEIS and ROD identified Refined Alternative P as the Selected Alternative.
    I'm getting to the point of agreeing with some of the locals that the project is not needed especially after looking at what they selected.  However, the are does need a bypass of Jasper to the commercial/manufacturing area and a bypass of Huntingburg with a four lane down to I-64.  That has been needed for over 40 years and all that has been done is two sections of super two highways of US 231 to drop off in the business section of Jasper and Huntingburg, and a super two around the south side of Jasper to veer IN 162 from going in town.  These solved minor problems, but all the while the towns have been developing and now some of the land that could have been easily used for the routing is now subdivisions and off limits.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: The Ghostbuster on September 15, 2023, 12:42:28 PM
    When the Mid-States Corridor project is eventually constructed, would any of you utilize the improved US 231 corridor on a regular basis?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on September 15, 2023, 10:06:05 PM
    this only makes sense as a super 2 or divided at grade highway. interstate through here would be insane.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: jnewkirk77 on September 15, 2023, 11:58:07 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on September 15, 2023, 10:06:05 PM
    this only makes sense as a super 2 or divided at grade highway. interstate through here would be insane.

    I think they're shooting for a super 2 for the most part, with passing lanes as needed. Not sure about the bypass(es).

    Also ... somewhere along the line Gov. Holcomb proposed some spot improvements for the existing 231, but I don't know what/where those are.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SSR_317 on September 23, 2023, 01:41:41 PM
    Quote from: ITB on September 13, 2023, 09:57:50 AM

    Yesterday, a TV news report took a closer look (https://fox59.com/news/indot-gives-closeup-look-of-i-465-clear-path-project/) at the status of the I-465 "Clear Path" project. According to the story, INDOT states the project is about 25% complete.
    This project is nearly in my back yard, but the information about it has been WOEFULLY LACKING, both from the contractors and from INDOT. The project website to date has been a bad joke and is a total embarrassment to our state! Both the I-69 Finish Line project and the recently completed I-65/I-70 North Split rebuild project have had MUCH more information available online and their websites featured regular, timely updates (including weekly drone flyover footage in the case of the North Split). Whomever is in charge of public relations/information for this "Clear Path" project should be fired immediately, IMHO!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on September 23, 2023, 10:10:49 PM
    I think all major projects in Indiana should get drone flyovers. those were so cool for north split. I will say clear path news is very lacking. I don't know anything about that project other than the layouts and lane configs. they posted those a while ago.

    :hmmm: anyone have any idea what is going on on 65 between 465 and 865 on the west side? traffic backs up there a lot now and signs say avoid the area. what's going on over there?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SEWIGuy on September 23, 2023, 10:20:42 PM
    Quote from: SSR_317 on September 23, 2023, 01:41:41 PM
    Quote from: ITB on September 13, 2023, 09:57:50 AM

    Yesterday, a TV news report took a closer look (https://fox59.com/news/indot-gives-closeup-look-of-i-465-clear-path-project/) at the status of the I-465 "Clear Path" project. According to the story, INDOT states the project is about 25% complete.
    This project is nearly in my back yard, but the information about it has been WOEFULLY LACKING, both from the contractors and from INDOT. The project website to date has been a bad joke and is a total embarrassment to our state! Both the I-69 Finish Line project and the recently completed I-65/I-70 North Split rebuild project have had MUCH more information available online and their websites featured regular, timely updates (including weekly drone flyover footage in the case of the North Split). Whomever is in charge of public relations/information for this "Clear Path" project should be fired immediately, IMHO!

    🙄🙄🙄
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: cjw2001 on September 24, 2023, 12:10:25 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on September 23, 2023, 10:10:49 PM
    I think all major projects in Indiana should get drone flyovers. those were so cool for north split. I will say clear path news is very lacking. I don't know anything about that project other than the layouts and lane configs. they posted those a while ago.

    :hmmm: anyone have any idea what is going on on 65 between 465 and 865 on the west side? traffic backs up there a lot now and signs say avoid the area. what's going on over there?
    https://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/INDOT/bulletins/370feb3
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 25, 2023, 09:39:19 PM
    As promised, exactly three weeks to the day, crews are set to reopen the I-65 north to I-80/94 west ramp after intensive concrete repair. The I-65 south to I-80/94 west ramp reopened the previous week. After tomorrow, the northbound entrance from Ridge Road will reopen, and full access to Central Avenue will be restored.

    However, a series of ramp closures will be taking place for winterization. High friction surface treatment will take place on seven ramps along I-80/94 and I-65:

    I-80/94 east to both directions of Calumet Avenue (staggered closures, north first, then south)
    I-80/94 east to Burr Street north
    I-80/94 east to Indiana 152 North (Indianapolis Boulevard)
    I-80/94 east to Kennedy Avenue northbound
    I-65 south to Ridge Road
    I-65 south to US 231 (to coincide with the current closure due to the concrete restoration project, both works will be completed upon opening)

    These ramps share one common theme: exiting from a high speed corridor to a ramp requiring a drop in speed of at least 20 mph. The closures are staggered, with work expected to start this week and lasting through mid-October, weather permitting.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JREwing78 on September 29, 2023, 05:19:11 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 25, 2023, 09:39:19 PM
    However, a series of ramp closures will be taking place for winterization. High friction surface treatment will take place on seven ramps along I-80/94 and I-65:

    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on September 25, 2023, 09:39:19 PM
    These ramps share one common theme: exiting from a high speed corridor to a ramp requiring a drop in speed of at least 20 mph.

    Being just off Lake Michigan and prone to wicked lake effect snow showers, this friction treatment is certainly welcome.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: vdeane on October 02, 2023, 09:14:58 PM
    Has anyone ever had their E-ZPass fail to read on the Indiana Toll Road before?  I think I had that happen when driving home from the Peoria roadmeet.  When I got to Westpoint, the light stayed red and never turned green in the E-ZPass lane.  After a few seconds of this, I just went, not knowing what to do (the gate arm was either up or non-existent; I don't know if I even realized that the ITR had gate arms until I got to Portage).  My ticket system toll from Portage to Eastpoint posted to my E-ZPass account a week ago, so now I'm worried that I'm going to be stuck with a violation notice or something.  It's weird, in all the years I've had an E-ZPass account, I've never had an issue with my transponder being read before.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Rothman on October 02, 2023, 09:30:00 PM
    Quote from: vdeane on October 02, 2023, 09:14:58 PM
    Has anyone ever had their E-ZPass fail to read on the Indiana Toll Road before?  I think I had that happen when driving home from the Peoria roadmeet.  When I got to Westpoint, the light stayed red and never turned green in the E-ZPass lane.  After a few seconds of this, I just went, not knowing what to do (the gate arm was either up or non-existent; I don't know if I even realized that the ITR had gate arms until I got to Portage).  My ticket system toll from Portage to Eastpoint posted to my E-ZPass account a week ago, so now I'm worried that I'm going to be stuck with a violation notice or something.  It's weird, in all the years I've had an E-ZPass account, I've never had an issue with my transponder being read before.
    Nope.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Revive 755 on October 02, 2023, 09:41:43 PM
    Quote from: vdeane on October 02, 2023, 09:14:58 PM
    Has anyone ever had their E-ZPass fail to read on the Indiana Toll Road before?

    The toll plazas on the Indiana Toll Road seem to have issues in general - I'm recalling a stuck gate at a toll plaza making it on one of WBBM's traffic reports.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: zzcarp on October 03, 2023, 12:39:13 PM
    Quote from: Revive 755 on October 02, 2023, 09:41:43 PM
    Quote from: vdeane on October 02, 2023, 09:14:58 PM
    Has anyone ever had their E-ZPass fail to read on the Indiana Toll Road before?

    The toll plazas on the Indiana Toll Road seem to have issues in general - I'm recalling a stuck gate at a toll plaza making it on one of WBBM's traffic reports.

    I was once stuck trying to enter at the IN-933 interchange by South Bend. Eventually (with several cars stacked behind me), I just pushed the ticket button to get a printed one. My transponder read correctly exiting the ticket system at the Portage toll plaza, so I never needed the ticket, and I was only charged for my trip, not the max toll.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on October 03, 2023, 04:18:35 PM
    Random question for the NW Indiana posters. Why does Chase street not cross the Little Calumet River? I notice it's a 4 lane road when it crosses 80/94 but then a few thousand feet south it just dies before it crosses, only to pick back up again a few miles south of that. Did it ever cross in the past? Street view shows a block wall at either end of the road.  :hmmm:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 03, 2023, 06:15:36 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on October 03, 2023, 04:18:35 PM
    Random question for the NW Indiana posters. Why does Chase street not cross the Little Calumet River? I notice it's a 4 lane road when it crosses 80/94 but then a few thousand feet south it just dies before it crosses, only to pick back up again a few miles south of that. Did it ever cross in the past? Street view shows a block wall at either end of the road.  :hmmm:

    I've not lived here all that long, so I don't know. My guess would be that it used to, but the bridge deteriorated and the city of Gary decided not to spend the money to replace it.

    nwi navigator has lived up here longer, so perhaps he knows for sure.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 03, 2023, 06:16:48 PM
    Quote from: zzcarp on October 03, 2023, 12:39:13 PM
    Quote from: Revive 755 on October 02, 2023, 09:41:43 PM
    Quote from: vdeane on October 02, 2023, 09:14:58 PM
    Has anyone ever had their E-ZPass fail to read on the Indiana Toll Road before?

    The toll plazas on the Indiana Toll Road seem to have issues in general - I'm recalling a stuck gate at a toll plaza making it on one of WBBM's traffic reports.

    I was once stuck trying to enter at the IN-933 interchange by South Bend. Eventually (with several cars stacked behind me), I just pushed the ticket button to get a printed one. My transponder read correctly exiting the ticket system at the Portage toll plaza, so I never needed the ticket, and I was only charged for my trip, not the max toll.

    I never have, but I've often seen cars stuck in the EZ-Pass lane so it may very well be a regular occurrence.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on October 11, 2023, 06:43:47 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on October 03, 2023, 06:15:36 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on October 03, 2023, 04:18:35 PM
    Random question for the NW Indiana posters. Why does Chase street not cross the Little Calumet River? I notice it's a 4 lane road when it crosses 80/94 but then a few thousand feet south it just dies before it crosses, only to pick back up again a few miles south of that. Did it ever cross in the past? Street view shows a block wall at either end of the road.  :hmmm:

    I've not lived here all that long, so I don't know. My guess would be that it used to, but the bridge deteriorated and the city of Gary decided not to spend the money to replace it.

    nwi navigator has lived up here longer, so perhaps he knows for sure.

    You rang? Allow me to answer.

    Chase Street didn't necessarily have a bridge across the Little Calumet River. (EDIT: there WAS a bridge, my mistake, but the following remains true.) That section sat along an elevated surface that allowed the river to channel under. Unfortunately, because it was mostly under maintenance by the City of Gary, the condition of the road deteriorated to the point where that section was completely warped and caused unsafely bumpy rides. It didn't help that section was prone to flooding due to swelling river banks (heavy rains, melting snow, or the combination of both).

    Sadly, the unsafe conditions proved to be deadly. In early 2009, a couple went missing after a night out, and evidence pointed to their last known whereabouts being around that section of Chase Street. Their vehicle was found submerged in the cold waters of the Little Calumet, along with them not too far from where it crashed. Icy conditions (the road was rarely treated during the winter), along with the bumpy terrain, were said to be the cause of the tragedy. Weeks later, the road would be closed, and it ultimately became permanent.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: theline on October 12, 2023, 03:12:34 AM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on October 03, 2023, 06:16:48 PM
    Quote from: zzcarp on October 03, 2023, 12:39:13 PM
    Quote from: Revive 755 on October 02, 2023, 09:41:43 PM
    Quote from: vdeane on October 02, 2023, 09:14:58 PM
    Has anyone ever had their E-ZPass fail to read on the Indiana Toll Road before?

    The toll plazas on the Indiana Toll Road seem to have issues in general - I'm recalling a stuck gate at a toll plaza making it on one of WBBM's traffic reports.

    I was once stuck trying to enter at the IN-933 interchange by South Bend. Eventually (with several cars stacked behind me), I just pushed the ticket button to get a printed one. My transponder read correctly exiting the ticket system at the Portage toll plaza, so I never needed the ticket, and I was only charged for my trip, not the max toll.

    I never have, but I've often seen cars stuck in the EZ-Pass lane so it may very well be a regular occurrence.
    I've had my transponder fail to read twice, both when I entering the ITR. I went ahead and took a ticket. Luckily, I was exiting the road where there was an attendant. I presented my transponder and ticket at both locations, and the attendant was able to fix things. I discussed it with the second attendant, and he confirmed that the failure was not unusual.  :rolleyes:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Rothman on October 12, 2023, 07:05:25 AM
    Quote from: theline on October 12, 2023, 03:12:34 AM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on October 03, 2023, 06:16:48 PM
    Quote from: zzcarp on October 03, 2023, 12:39:13 PM
    Quote from: Revive 755 on October 02, 2023, 09:41:43 PM
    Quote from: vdeane on October 02, 2023, 09:14:58 PM
    Has anyone ever had their E-ZPass fail to read on the Indiana Toll Road before?

    The toll plazas on the Indiana Toll Road seem to have issues in general - I'm recalling a stuck gate at a toll plaza making it on one of WBBM's traffic reports.

    I was once stuck trying to enter at the IN-933 interchange by South Bend. Eventually (with several cars stacked behind me), I just pushed the ticket button to get a printed one. My transponder read correctly exiting the ticket system at the Portage toll plaza, so I never needed the ticket, and I was only charged for my trip, not the max toll.

    I never have, but I've often seen cars stuck in the EZ-Pass lane so it may very well be a regular occurrence.
    I've had my transponder fail to read twice, both when I entering the ITR. I went ahead and took a ticket. Luckily, I was exiting the road where there was an attendant. I presented my transponder and ticket at both locations, and the attendant was able to fix things. I discussed it with the second attendant, and he confirmed that the failure was not unusual.  :rolleyes:
    I saw a couple's transponder fail on the ITR this past weekend, but they pulled all the way up to the gate before pulling it out of somewhere and holding it up to their windshield.

    Mine was taped to the dash of my rental and I had no issues.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: vdeane on October 12, 2023, 12:41:18 PM
    Quote from: theline on October 12, 2023, 03:12:34 AM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on October 03, 2023, 06:16:48 PM
    Quote from: zzcarp on October 03, 2023, 12:39:13 PM
    Quote from: Revive 755 on October 02, 2023, 09:41:43 PM
    Quote from: vdeane on October 02, 2023, 09:14:58 PM
    Has anyone ever had their E-ZPass fail to read on the Indiana Toll Road before?

    The toll plazas on the Indiana Toll Road seem to have issues in general - I'm recalling a stuck gate at a toll plaza making it on one of WBBM's traffic reports.

    I was once stuck trying to enter at the IN-933 interchange by South Bend. Eventually (with several cars stacked behind me), I just pushed the ticket button to get a printed one. My transponder read correctly exiting the ticket system at the Portage toll plaza, so I never needed the ticket, and I was only charged for my trip, not the max toll.

    I never have, but I've often seen cars stuck in the EZ-Pass lane so it may very well be a regular occurrence.
    I've had my transponder fail to read twice, both when I entering the ITR. I went ahead and took a ticket. Luckily, I was exiting the road where there was an attendant. I presented my transponder and ticket at both locations, and the attendant was able to fix things. I discussed it with the second attendant, and he confirmed that the failure was not unusual.  :rolleyes:
    So what happens if fails at Westpoint and there's no ticket to use to straighten things out?  I tried contacting the ITR, but they were less than helpful (they mentioned an exit read and reconciling with the ticket, which makes no sense since Westpoint isn't on the ticket system; I think they got confused with the Portage-Eastpoint transaction that correctly posted), and I'm worried I'm going to be stuck paying a violation or something.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JREwing78 on October 12, 2023, 03:52:02 PM
    I've encountered a similar problem on the Toll Road. Literally detached the E-Z Pass transponder and waved it around, and got nothing. Finally had to press the call button and get them to let me out. Haven't had a problem since.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: cjw2001 on October 12, 2023, 04:19:12 PM
    Quote from: SSR_317 on September 23, 2023, 01:41:41 PM
    Quote from: ITB on September 13, 2023, 09:57:50 AM

    Yesterday, a TV news report took a closer look (https://fox59.com/news/indot-gives-closeup-look-of-i-465-clear-path-project/) at the status of the I-465 "Clear Path" project. According to the story, INDOT states the project is about 25% complete.
    This project is nearly in my back yard, but the information about it has been WOEFULLY LACKING, both from the contractors and from INDOT. The project website to date has been a bad joke and is a total embarrassment to our state! Both the I-69 Finish Line project and the recently completed I-65/I-70 North Split rebuild project have had MUCH more information available online and their websites featured regular, timely updates (including weekly drone flyover footage in the case of the North Split). Whomever is in charge of public relations/information for this "Clear Path" project should be fired immediately, IMHO!

    Finally a small update https://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/INDOT/bulletins/3753e43
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on October 13, 2023, 10:08:02 PM
    At some point next week, concrete restoration on I-65 will enter its final phase.

    Crews will work to restore southbound I-65 traffic to its normal configuration, with the left lane remaining closed for median wall rebuild. Upon completion of reconfiguration, all ramp restrictions at 109th Avenue and US 231 will be lifted.

    During this time, the temporary barrier wall along northbound I-65 will be removed as crews re-stripe the northbound lanes to their normal configuration.

    Concrete restoration on I-80/94 is also entering its final weeks, as crews finish patching and diamond grinding the outside lanes. Ramps closed for repair as of this post:

    The eastbound entrance from Burr Street
    Eastbound entrance and exit ramps at Grant Street and Broadway

    Much like I-65, this project is on track for completion by the end of October.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: roadman65 on October 24, 2023, 03:50:42 PM
    What is going to be accomplished by the Clear Path Project on I-69 and I-465 at Binford Blvd?

    I see the PDF from INDOT show relocated ramps accomplishing the same thing as the only difference is that the I-69 SB to I-465 SB ( Future I-69 SB through movement) will be shifted over some, but still the same turbine ramp.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: cjw2001 on October 24, 2023, 04:20:15 PM
    Quote from: roadman65 on October 24, 2023, 03:50:42 PM
    What is going to be accomplished by the Clear Path Project on I-69 and I-465 at Binford Blvd?

    I see the PDF from INDOT show relocated ramps accomplishing the same thing as the only difference is that the I-69 SB to I-465 SB ( Future I-69 SB through movement) will be shifted over some, but still the same turbine ramp.

    From INDOT's web site (https://clearpath465.com/faqs/):

    QuoteThe Clear Path 465 project includes:


    • Reconstruction of I-465 and I-69 to include added lanes
    • Reconstruction of the I-465/I-69 interchange and additional lanes on two interchange ramps, including a new direct-connect ramp from eastbound I-465 to northbound I-69
    • Reconstruction of the I-69/82nd Street interchange
    • Separation of I-69 traffic from local traffic entering and exiting at 82nd Street and Binford Boulevard by using concrete barrier, dedicated ramps and collector-distributor lanes
    • Addition of auxiliary lanes between interchanges for entering and exiting traffic
    • Modifications to the ramps at Allisonville Road to connect with additional I-465 lanes
    • Reconstruction and added lanes on Binford Boulevard from south of 75th Street to I-465
    • Construction of 14 new bridges
    • Rehabilitation and widening of two bridges
    • Preventive maintenance work on the Allisonville Road bridge over I-465
    • Maintenance work on the approaches to the I-465 bridges over the White River
    • Reconstruction of E. 71st Street near I-465
    • Reconstruction of the south end of Castleton Road
    • Noise barrier installation in several locations throughout the project limits

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on October 24, 2023, 04:21:40 PM
    Quote from: roadman65 on October 24, 2023, 03:50:42 PM
    What is going to be accomplished by the Clear Path Project on I-69 and I-465 at Binford Blvd?

    I see the PDF from INDOT show relocated ramps accomplishing the same thing as the only difference is that the I-69 SB to I-465 SB ( Future I-69 SB through movement) will be shifted over some, but still the same turbine ramp.

    the entire interchange is being redone. Here are some highlights:

    1) Completely separate movements for binford, 69, and 82nd
    2) Ramp from 465 EB to 69 NB to be a 2 lane fly under ramp
    3) 465 NB to 69 NB will be 3 lanes wide
    4) SB Binford will be realigned west of where it is now and a signal will be installed with the ramp from 465 EB to SB Binford (to allow those ramp travelers to get over to the left lane to make a left at 75th
    5) The death loop that currently takes you from 465 EB to 69 NB will remain and only take you to 82nd
    6) mainline 465 will be 4 lanes wide with i believe 2 aux lanes in each direction from white river to 56th
    7) when this project completes SR 37 will be decommissioned from the 37/69 split in fishers to the 69/37 split in Bloomington
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on October 24, 2023, 10:37:14 PM
    The Kankakee Welcome Center on I-65 Southbound is officially open.

    The facility is rebuilt with art and stylings dedicated to the NW Indiana area, an outdoor play area for children, and a full parking area devoted to trucks.

    Also happening this week: traffic on I-80/94 eastbound will be repositioned to its normal configuration, with work to start tomorrow, October 25 at 8pm. Work will conclude with median repair and rebuild, restoring the barrier wall where it was torn down for crossovers/chute lanes. All ramp restrictions will be lifted upon completion of reconfiguration. I-80/94 westbound will stay in its temporary configuration until median repairs are complete.

    The South Shore Double Track project reaches a major milestone, also on October 25. Rail service will resume between Dune Park (Chesterton) and Michigan City, with busing service continuing between Dune Park and Gary. The road most affected will be 11th Street near downtown Michigan City. The trains originally did street runs in the middle of 11th Street. Now, 11th Street is an eastbound-only one-way street, with the new tracks running alongside the road. Most cross streets will dead-end on each side of 11th, with Wabash and Franklin Streets being notable exceptions.

    Colorado Street is nearing completion at US 30, with the likelihood of reopening just in time for Thanksgiving. Along with new pavement and a median to control entry and exit points for surrounding businesses, the intersection will include new turn lanes on Colorado Street, along with TWO left turn lanes for traffic turning from southbound Colorado to US 30 east.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on October 27, 2023, 01:50:15 PM
    looks like 252 no longer exists between 65 and 9.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on October 27, 2023, 02:29:43 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on October 27, 2023, 01:50:15 PM
    looks like 252 no longer exists between 65 and 9.

    I submitted this to TM for updating.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Plutonic Panda on October 27, 2023, 02:36:33 PM
    Here's an article about the new truck, parking and welcome center. It looks very nice. We need more of these everywhere.

    https://cdllife.com/2023/i-65-rest-area-project-brings-225-truck-parking-spaces-to-indiana/?utm_source=cbo-cdllife-kevel&utm_campaign=recommended-widget
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Ted$8roadFan on October 28, 2023, 09:58:20 AM
    Quote from: Plutonic Panda on October 27, 2023, 02:36:33 PM
    Here's an article about the new truck, parking and welcome center. It looks very nice. We need more of these everywhere.

    https://cdllife.com/2023/i-65-rest-area-project-brings-225-truck-parking-spaces-to-indiana/?utm_source=cbo-cdllife-kevel&utm_campaign=recommended-widget

    Indeed.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: kennyshark64 on October 30, 2023, 12:38:59 PM
    Circling back to the issues with EZPass, in the 10.5 years I've had mine (yes, I know I'm due for a replacement), I've only had it not work once (at an exit).  Still performed great for me this past weekend in Indiana (exits 72, 77, 121 & 144), not to mention in other states over the years (OH, PA, NJ).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on November 14, 2023, 07:18:46 PM
    the ramp meters on the SE side of town on 465 will be fully operational by the end of the year. this will also include variable speed limit assemblies that no-one will follow  :-D Every exit on the SE side between 65 and 70 (not counting 74) will have them.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on November 14, 2023, 08:10:59 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on November 14, 2023, 07:18:46 PM
    the ramp meters on the SE side of town on 465 will be fully operational by the end of the year. this will also include variable speed limit assemblies that no-one will follow  :-D Every exit on the SE side between 65 and 70 (not counting 74) will have them.

    https://www.wrtv.com/news/local-news/ramp-metering-traffic-signals-variable-speed-limits-coming-to-i-465

    I believe that there is going to be a lot of confusion over this new system, especially since it has never been used in Indiana!
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: cjw2001 on November 15, 2023, 05:30:18 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on November 14, 2023, 08:10:59 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on November 14, 2023, 07:18:46 PM
    the ramp meters on the SE side of town on 465 will be fully operational by the end of the year. this will also include variable speed limit assemblies that no-one will follow  :-D Every exit on the SE side between 65 and 70 (not counting 74) will have them.

    https://www.wrtv.com/news/local-news/ramp-metering-traffic-signals-variable-speed-limits-coming-to-i-465

    I believe that there is going to be a lot of confusion over this new system, especially since it has never been used in Indiana!
    It's not like anyone has had to stop at a red light before.... it won't take long for people to adjust.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on November 15, 2023, 08:08:48 PM
    Quote from: cjw2001 on November 15, 2023, 05:30:18 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on November 14, 2023, 08:10:59 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on November 14, 2023, 07:18:46 PM
    the ramp meters on the SE side of town on 465 will be fully operational by the end of the year. this will also include variable speed limit assemblies that no-one will follow  :-D Every exit on the SE side between 65 and 70 (not counting 74) will have them.

    https://www.wrtv.com/news/local-news/ramp-metering-traffic-signals-variable-speed-limits-coming-to-i-465

    I believe that there is going to be a lot of confusion over this new system, especially since it has never been used in Indiana!
    It's not like anyone has had to stop at a red light before.... it won't take long for people to adjust.

    this operates very differently than simply a red light  :-D but I think it will get figured out pretty fast.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on November 16, 2023, 04:50:46 PM

    "INDOT faces fiscal cliff without road funding changes" (https://indianacapitalchronicle.com/2023/11/16/indot-faces-fiscal-cliff-without-road-funding-changes/)

    INDOT and state legislators are increasingly concerned the transition to alternative-fuel vehicles will harm the budget in upcoming years. As a result, they're looking for possible answers.


    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on November 16, 2023, 04:54:40 PM
    Quote from: ITB on November 16, 2023, 04:50:46 PM

    "INDOT faces fiscal cliff without road funding changes" (https://indianacapitalchronicle.com/2023/11/16/indot-faces-fiscal-cliff-without-road-funding-changes/)

    INDOT and state legislators are increasingly concerned the transition to alternative-fuel vehicles will harm the budget in upcoming years. As a result, they're looking for possible answers.


    It's almost as if decades of pandering to voters by cutting income and property taxes is harming infrastructure.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on November 17, 2023, 12:10:45 PM

    On the INDOT TrafficWise website (https://511in.org/@-87.86316,40.03112,7?show=incidents,normalCameras), the real-time messages on the state's Dynamic Message Signs, as well as Time Travel Signs, are viewable.

    Check it out here (https://511in.org/list/signs).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Life in Paradise on November 17, 2023, 01:00:54 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on November 16, 2023, 04:54:40 PM
    Quote from: ITB on November 16, 2023, 04:50:46 PM

    "INDOT faces fiscal cliff without road funding changes" (https://indianacapitalchronicle.com/2023/11/16/indot-faces-fiscal-cliff-without-road-funding-changes/)

    INDOT and state legislators are increasingly concerned the transition to alternative-fuel vehicles will harm the budget in upcoming years. As a result, they're looking for possible answers.

    It's more of an advance notice of what could be a big problem.  What they should have done when they started the hybrid/electric registration charge is to make sure that the majority of those funds went towards replacing gas tax funding, which is the way its sold to the public.  A comparison to me would be for state governments taxing tobacco products to discourage usage and fund healthcare, and then complaining when there is not enough to fund the healthcare because usage is down.

    It's almost as if decades of pandering to voters by cutting income and property taxes is harming infrastructure.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 01, 2023, 10:03:58 PM
    Work on I-65 and I-80/94 has officially wrapped up in Northwest Indiana. All lanes and ramps have been repaired and reopened.

    Further downstate, work remains on the I-65 bridges over and south of Indiana 43 in Lafayette. The third lane being built is otherwise striped for use but not yet opened (likely won't be until the bridges are completed).

    With the exception of some work at the US 52 merge, all three lanes of I-65 southbound are open from just north of Indiana 47 to the south end of the work zone near Indiana 32. As you know, the old left-handed ramp to Lafayette Avenue no longer stands, and northbound traffic has been graded down to remove the old overpass. Strangely, a stub of the old C/D ramp (originally designed for those merging from Lafayette Avenue northbound - a merge that also no longer exists) still remains at the US 52 west exit. Crews have removed the temporary median barrier from I-65 northbound and will work to stripe the final configuration next week.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on December 02, 2023, 07:59:05 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 01, 2023, 10:03:58 PM
    Work on I-65 and I-80/94 has officially wrapped up in Northwest Indiana. All lanes and ramps have been repaired and reopened.

    Further downstate, work remains on the I-65 bridges over and south of Indiana 43 in Lafayette. The third lane being built is otherwise striped for use but not yet opened (likely won't be until the bridges are completed).

    With the exception of some work at the US 52 merge, all three lanes of I-65 southbound are open from just north of Indiana 47 to the south end of the work zone near Indiana 32. As you know, the old left-handed ramp to Lafayette Avenue no longer stands, and northbound traffic has been graded down to remove the old overpass. Strangely, a stub of the old C/D ramp (originally designed for those merging from Lafayette Avenue northbound - a merge that also no longer exists) still remains at the US 52 west exit. Crews have removed the temporary median barrier from I-65 northbound and will work to stripe the final configuration next week.

    My guess it that is staying that way because that entire interchange will be removed soon. and US 52 will leave 65 at the new exit at 300s, they'll probably remove it when that new exit opens.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Moose on December 04, 2023, 10:47:36 PM
    I-465 to I-65 ramp closure tonight.

    https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=852571200202237&set=a.516173620508665
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on December 11, 2023, 09:47:05 PM
    https://www.14news.com/video/2023/12/08/indot-nancy-hanks-rest-stop-area-set-close-2025/

    More rest areas to close in Indiana (for cars)- Nancy Hanks on Interstate 64 in 2025.

    Eastbound- closed and removed for good
    Westbound- demolished and converted into truck parking
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Life in Paradise on December 13, 2023, 12:27:47 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 11, 2023, 09:47:05 PM
    https://www.14news.com/video/2023/12/08/indot-nancy-hanks-rest-stop-area-set-close-2025/

    More rest areas to close in Indiana (for cars)- Nancy Hanks on Interstate 64 in 2025.

    Eastbound- closed and removed for good
    Westbound- demolished and converted into truck parking
    As an Indiana resident I am fully opposed to these closures of rest areas, and feel that this is very short sighted and not public friendly.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on December 13, 2023, 06:43:58 PM
    Quote from: Life in Paradise on December 13, 2023, 12:27:47 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 11, 2023, 09:47:05 PM
    https://www.14news.com/video/2023/12/08/indot-nancy-hanks-rest-stop-area-set-close-2025/

    More rest areas to close in Indiana (for cars)- Nancy Hanks on Interstate 64 in 2025.

    Eastbound- closed and removed for good
    Westbound- demolished and converted into truck parking
    As an Indiana resident I am fully opposed to these closures of rest areas, and feel that this is very short sighted and not public friendly.

    Of course it's very short sighted and not public friendly. Indiana isn't concerned about those things, they just want one less thing that they have to spend money on maintaining. I hate it that Indiana acts like it's so freaking poor it can't maintain a rest area, yet they have enough of a surplus to give us $125 checks from time to time.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: cjw2001 on December 13, 2023, 07:28:44 PM
    Quote from: tdindy88 on December 13, 2023, 06:43:58 PM
    Quote from: Life in Paradise on December 13, 2023, 12:27:47 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on December 11, 2023, 09:47:05 PM
    https://www.14news.com/video/2023/12/08/indot-nancy-hanks-rest-stop-area-set-close-2025/

    More rest areas to close in Indiana (for cars)- Nancy Hanks on Interstate 64 in 2025.

    Eastbound- closed and removed for good
    Westbound- demolished and converted into truck parking
    As an Indiana resident I am fully opposed to these closures of rest areas, and feel that this is very short sighted and not public friendly.

    Of course it's very short sighted and not public friendly. Indiana isn't concerned about those things, they just want one less thing that they have to spend money on maintaining. I hate it that Indiana acts like it's so freaking poor it can't maintain a rest area, yet they have enough of a surplus to give us $125 checks from time to time.
    INDOT announced that they will be spending $600 million over 10 years on rest areas: 

    https://www.wthr.com/article/news/local/indot-has-600-million-plan-to-add-truck-parking-improve-21-rest-parks-department-of-transportation/531-ceb024a8-a6b6-4abf-84d3-a80089c6f4ed

    https://fox59.com/video/indot-investing-600-million-in-rest-stops-amid-truck-parking-shortage/9251535/

    https://www.in.gov/indot/files/Rest-Area-and-Welcome-Center-Improvement-Plan.pdf?utm_medium=email&utm_source=govdelivery
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on December 16, 2023, 01:38:06 PM
    Fun story with Indiana twist - most loathsome highways: 📸 Look at this post on Facebook https://www.mywabashvalley.com/news/indiana-news/indiana-home-to-2-of-americas-most-loathed-highways/?utm_campaign=socialflow&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=referral&fbclid=IwAR08fxjczRjQJKe8r9EMy5GdGmYDgJQDTzV-WjBYnlUe4MzUqqwM6nEIz_A_aem_Ac1NnY-A7SK-Hju_-bNze28uZqkRANsamIQahxhpwaQv7lod7fu-1juxciisJP4gZcw
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 16, 2023, 01:53:20 PM
    Quote from: monty on December 16, 2023, 01:38:06 PM
    Fun story with Indiana twist - most loathsome highways: 📸 Look at this post on Facebook https://www.mywabashvalley.com/news/indiana-news/indiana-home-to-2-of-americas-most-loathed-highways/?utm_campaign=socialflow&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=referral&fbclid=IwAR08fxjczRjQJKe8r9EMy5GdGmYDgJQDTzV-WjBYnlUe4MzUqqwM6nEIz_A_aem_Ac1NnY-A7SK-Hju_-bNze28uZqkRANsamIQahxhpwaQv7lod7fu-1juxciisJP4gZcw

    Agreed on I-65 between Chicago and Indy. We pretty much use US 41 and I-74 to avoid it. They can't get that stretch of I-65 6-laned fast enough.
    Title: Discussions on New I-65 Exit in Lafayette
    Post by: mukade on December 16, 2023, 06:03:44 PM
    "The Lafayette Redevelopment Commissioners approved a contract for the design plans on a new I-65 exit in Lafayette. The exit would allow drivers to get off the interstate at McCarty Lane..."

    https://www.wlfi.com/news/local/discussions-on-new-i-65-exit-in-lafayette/article_f9f44190-9ad7-11ee-a1d8-77be43d1dbbf.html (https://www.wlfi.com/news/local/discussions-on-new-i-65-exit-in-lafayette/article_f9f44190-9ad7-11ee-a1d8-77be43d1dbbf.html)



    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: mgk920 on December 17, 2023, 12:50:59 PM
    Quote from: monty on December 16, 2023, 01:38:06 PM
    Fun story with Indiana twist - most loathsome highways: 📸 Look at this post on Facebook https://www.mywabashvalley.com/news/indiana-news/indiana-home-to-2-of-americas-most-loathed-highways/?utm_campaign=socialflow&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=referral&fbclid=IwAR08fxjczRjQJKe8r9EMy5GdGmYDgJQDTzV-WjBYnlUe4MzUqqwM6nEIz_A_aem_Ac1NnY-A7SK-Hju_-bNze28uZqkRANsamIQahxhpwaQv7lod7fu-1juxciisJP4gZcw

    Not US 30 across the state, with the constant STOPSTOPTOPSTOPSTOP at its intersections?  Thus, I call bogus on that list!

    Mike
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on December 17, 2023, 01:25:58 PM
    Quote from: mukade on December 16, 2023, 06:03:44 PM
    "The Lafayette Redevelopment Commissioners approved a contract for the design plans on a new I-65 exit in Lafayette. The exit would allow drivers to get off the interstate at McCarty Lane..."

    https://www.wlfi.com/news/local/discussions-on-new-i-65-exit-in-lafayette/article_f9f44190-9ad7-11ee-a1d8-77be43d1dbbf.html (https://www.wlfi.com/news/local/discussions-on-new-i-65-exit-in-lafayette/article_f9f44190-9ad7-11ee-a1d8-77be43d1dbbf.html)


    Pretty close to the SR 26 exit, but I guess it would take some of the load off of the 26 exit from traffic going to places served by McCarty.  The sprawl around Lafayette has been amazing the last 30 years.  When I was at Purdue, there was basically nothing in places that are completely built up now and have been for over 15 years now even. 
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: PurdueBill on December 17, 2023, 01:27:12 PM
    Quote from: monty on December 16, 2023, 01:38:06 PM
    Fun story with Indiana twist - most loathsome highways: 📸 Look at this post on Facebook https://www.mywabashvalley.com/news/indiana-news/indiana-home-to-2-of-americas-most-loathed-highways/?utm_campaign=socialflow&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=referral&fbclid=IwAR08fxjczRjQJKe8r9EMy5GdGmYDgJQDTzV-WjBYnlUe4MzUqqwM6nEIz_A_aem_Ac1NnY-A7SK-Hju_-bNze28uZqkRANsamIQahxhpwaQv7lod7fu-1juxciisJP4gZcw

    I'm surprised I-70 between the Ohio line and Indy is not on there.  I detest that much more than 65 between Indy and Gary. 
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on December 18, 2023, 12:39:13 AM
    https://www.wthitv.com/news/top-stories/indot-had-a-busy-year-in-2023-but-expect-more-projects-in-the-new-year/article_be9f8e92-9af0-11ee-a764-a75cfefbb3ce.html

    "Next year, INDOT will replace the twin bridges at Robinson and Sidenbender Roads on I-70 with arch tunnels."

    These pair of bridges are located in the Terre Haute area...

    https://www.google.com/maps/@39.4393977,-87.5176541,3a,75y,25.38h,88.7t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sD_OBzqFNMh-xLXGo9pY6ew!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

    https://www.google.com/maps/@39.4308185,-87.374999,3a,75y,98.36h,95.22t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sy9oNT-Zv6TvYrSM2QyXbUw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Rothman on December 18, 2023, 06:45:49 AM
    Touting a Taj Mahal rest area/visitor center would not go over well in NY, since it's assumed those funds could go into preserving the system.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Terry Shea on December 19, 2023, 12:08:35 AM
    Quote from: monty on December 16, 2023, 01:38:06 PM
    Fun story with Indiana twist - most loathsome highways: 📸 Look at this post on Facebook https://www.mywabashvalley.com/news/indiana-news/indiana-home-to-2-of-americas-most-loathed-highways/?utm_campaign=socialflow&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=referral&fbclid=IwAR08fxjczRjQJKe8r9EMy5GdGmYDgJQDTzV-WjBYnlUe4MzUqqwM6nEIz_A_aem_Ac1NnY-A7SK-Hju_-bNze28uZqkRANsamIQahxhpwaQv7lod7fu-1juxciisJP4gZcw
    Well, we have 50 states and this is a list of 100 highways, or 2 highways per state on average.  When you consider that Indiana is in the upper third in population, 2 listings seems fairly tame.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: KelleyCook on December 20, 2023, 01:26:08 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 01, 2023, 10:03:58 PM
    As you know, the old left-handed ramp to Lafayette Avenue no longer stands, and northbound traffic has been graded down to remove the old overpass. Strangely, a stub of the old C/D ramp (originally designed for those merging from Lafayette Avenue northbound - a merge that also no longer exists) still remains at the US 52 west exit.

    Does this mean that this proposed flyover was never built https://www.in.gov/indot/files/Additional%20Materials%20-%20Proposed%20Lafayette%20Avenue%20Flyover%20Ramp.pdf ? Meaning you now just can't access Lafayette Ave from SB I-65 ?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on December 20, 2023, 01:33:43 PM
    Correct. At least not yet.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Genghixiani on December 20, 2023, 02:09:43 PM
    I know this is WAY off topic, but who else remembers when the IN-13 IN-38 crossing roughly halfway between Lapel and I-69 was closed for 2-3 weeks, and IN-32 was closed for a bridge for 6-7 Months left of Fishersburg, forcing everyone having to use IN-13 or IN-38?

    Just me? Okay. :D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on December 20, 2023, 02:44:36 PM
    Quote from: KelleyCook on December 20, 2023, 01:26:08 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on December 01, 2023, 10:03:58 PM
    As you know, the old left-handed ramp to Lafayette Avenue no longer stands, and northbound traffic has been graded down to remove the old overpass. Strangely, a stub of the old C/D ramp (originally designed for those merging from Lafayette Avenue northbound - a merge that also no longer exists) still remains at the US 52 west exit.

    Does this mean that this proposed flyover was never built https://www.in.gov/indot/files/Additional%20Materials%20-%20Proposed%20Lafayette%20Avenue%20Flyover%20Ramp.pdf ? Meaning you now just can't access Lafayette Ave from SB I-65 ?

    That is probably dead, especially with the new 52 exit being built immediately north of it.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: KelleyCook on December 20, 2023, 06:41:08 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on December 20, 2023, 02:44:36 PM
    That is probably dead, especially with the new 52 exit being built immediately north of it.

    Oh I see now. Things Have Changed (namely Eli Lilly)

    ...and so now the entire current US-52 intersection is going away in favor of this.


    (https://static.wixstatic.com/media/8ec4b1_80d3dac950e7472da33935c4061afa2b~mv2.jpg)

    https://www.52at65.com


    Thanks
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on December 21, 2023, 10:10:38 PM
    https://wimsradio.com/2023/12/18/gov-holcomb-indot-announce-127m-mega-grant-for-flexroad-project-in-northwest-indiana/

    Gov. Holcomb, INDOT announce $127M MEGA grant for FlexRoad project in northwest Indiana
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: monty on December 28, 2023, 05:28:21 PM
    Some very preliminary planning regarding a new I65 interchange north of West Lafayette to connect to existing US 231 to form a street level western loop. https://www.wlfi.com/news/local/wabash-tippecanoe-township-residents-skeptical-of-u-s-231-extension/article_f89d171a-a0e3-11ee-ac83-4b511160da29.html
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: I-55 on December 28, 2023, 09:26:31 PM
    Quote from: monty on December 28, 2023, 05:28:21 PM
    Some very preliminary planning regarding a new I65 interchange north of West Lafayette to connect to existing US 231 to form a street level western loop. https://www.wlfi.com/news/local/wabash-tippecanoe-township-residents-skeptical-of-u-s-231-extension/article_f89d171a-a0e3-11ee-ac83-4b511160da29.html

    I've been looking forward to this...

    Would certainly address the rapid northward expansion of West Lafayette as well as improve mobility from Purdue to I-65 north.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: boilerup25 on December 28, 2023, 10:04:39 PM
    Quote from: monty on December 28, 2023, 05:28:21 PM
    Some very preliminary planning regarding a new I65 interchange north of West Lafayette to connect to existing US 231 to form a street level western loop. https://www.wlfi.com/news/local/wabash-tippecanoe-township-residents-skeptical-of-u-s-231-extension/article_f89d171a-a0e3-11ee-ac83-4b511160da29.html

    I'm a current Boilermaker, and I'll definitely be glad for an extension of the new US 231 bypass alignment to I-65. I'm surprised that the 231 bypass wasn't built all the way to I-65 when it was first built in the early 2010s, especially considering that (re-) connecting with I-65 from the bypass is via an underpowered, two lane US 231. This extension is much-needed for multiple reasons such as better connecting Purdue with Chicago and its major airport, the growth of the Purdue campus and community, as well as to facilitate flow to and from I-65 on Purdue game days (they already sign I-65 from Ross-Ade stadium and sign routes for football traffic). I have a feeling that when this extension is built, River Road (former IN 43) and Sagamore Parkway (former US 52) will see some much-needed relief.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on December 28, 2023, 10:58:05 PM
    I find it interesting that the road goes further than 65 too, I wonder where it will end?  :hmmm: I also wonder if the old 231 will become a county road.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: boilerup25 on December 28, 2023, 11:24:27 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on December 28, 2023, 10:58:05 PM
    I find it interesting that the road goes further than 65 too, I wonder where it will end?  :hmmm: I also wonder if the old 231 will become a county road.

    The new alignment of the US 231 bypass will drop US 231 off at I-65 (and US 231 follows I-65 north to its current alignment), but the roadway will extend to IN 43 just south of Brookston. This is where the new bypass alignment ends. I saw this information in some older Tippecanoe County documents detailing the northern extension of the US 231 bypass. I also assume that the old US 231 alignment will become a county route, very likely County Route 850 West because it already has an "S 850 W" naming convention (unless the road is given a name, like Montmorenci Road, Moore Street, or another name).

    My big question I have is this - What do you think will be the designation for the "231 bypass" between the I-65 junction (where US 231 leaves) and the IN 43 junction? I assume this new alignment will have an IN x43 designation, or will become the IN 43 mainline and the old IN 43 will either receive an IN x43 designation or be relinquished - which begs this question: If IN 43 is relinquished on its old alignment in favor of being placed on the bypass, then what will happen to IN 225 which will be completely orphaned from the Indiana State Highway system? (IN 225 no longer connects to IN 25 ever since IN 25 was moved onto the Hoosier Heartland Highway, and it only connects to the rest of the state highway system via IN 43)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 29, 2023, 08:33:24 AM
    Quote from: boilerup25 on December 28, 2023, 11:24:27 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on December 28, 2023, 10:58:05 PM
    I find it interesting that the road goes further than 65 too, I wonder where it will end?  :hmmm: I also wonder if the old 231 will become a county road.

    The new alignment of the US 231 bypass will drop US 231 off at I-65 (and US 231 follows I-65 north to its current alignment), but the roadway will extend to IN 43 just south of Brookston. This is where the new bypass alignment ends. I saw this information in some older Tippecanoe County documents detailing the northern extension of the US 231 bypass. I also assume that the old US 231 alignment will become a county route, very likely County Route 850 West because it already has an "S 850 W" naming convention (unless the road is given a name, like Montmorenci Road, Moore Street, or another name).

    My big question I have is this - What do you think will be the designation for the "231 bypass" between the I-65 junction (where US 231 leaves) and the IN 43 junction? I assume this new alignment will have an IN x43 designation, or will become the IN 43 mainline and the old IN 43 will either receive an IN x43 designation or be relinquished - which begs this question: If IN 43 is relinquished on its old alignment in favor of being placed on the bypass, then what will happen to IN 225 which will be completely orphaned from the Indiana State Highway system? (IN 225 no longer connects to IN 25 ever since IN 25 was moved onto the Hoosier Heartland Highway, and it only connects to the rest of the state highway system via IN 43)

    I didn't look through the document thoroughly enough to find any discussion of funding, but if the county is funding this project and not INDOT, then this won't be a state highway. If the county wants INDOT to take over the route after they build it, INDOT is going to want the county to take back other roadway in return, so perhaps this becomes a new routing of 231 that follows 65 up to Wolcott and the existing 231 becomes a county road.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: boilerup25 on December 29, 2023, 01:25:29 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on December 29, 2023, 08:33:24 AM
    Quote from: boilerup25 on December 28, 2023, 11:24:27 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on December 28, 2023, 10:58:05 PM
    I find it interesting that the road goes further than 65 too, I wonder where it will end?  :hmmm: I also wonder if the old 231 will become a county road.

    The new alignment of the US 231 bypass will drop US 231 off at I-65 (and US 231 follows I-65 north to its current alignment), but the roadway will extend to IN 43 just south of Brookston. This is where the new bypass alignment ends. I saw this information in some older Tippecanoe County documents detailing the northern extension of the US 231 bypass. I also assume that the old US 231 alignment will become a county route, very likely County Route 850 West because it already has an "S 850 W" naming convention (unless the road is given a name, like Montmorenci Road, Moore Street, or another name).

    My big question I have is this - What do you think will be the designation for the "231 bypass" between the I-65 junction (where US 231 leaves) and the IN 43 junction? I assume this new alignment will have an IN x43 designation, or will become the IN 43 mainline and the old IN 43 will either receive an IN x43 designation or be relinquished - which begs this question: If IN 43 is relinquished on its old alignment in favor of being placed on the bypass, then what will happen to IN 225 which will be completely orphaned from the Indiana State Highway system? (IN 225 no longer connects to IN 25 ever since IN 25 was moved onto the Hoosier Heartland Highway, and it only connects to the rest of the state highway system via IN 43)

    I didn't look through the document thoroughly enough to find any discussion of funding, but if the county is funding this project and not INDOT, then this won't be a state highway. If the county wants INDOT to take over the route after they build it, INDOT is going to want the county to take back other roadway in return, so perhaps this becomes a new routing of 231 that follows 65 up to Wolcott and the existing 231 becomes a county road.

    I also don't know too much about the funding of this project, however, based on what I have seen in the documents, the documents explicitly state that the new roadway is intended to be a new routing of US 231. Here is where I found the documents:

    https://www.tippecanoe.in.gov/684/US-231 - New US 231 alignment in Tippecanoe County Study
    https://www.tippecanoe.in.gov/DocumentCenter/View/7057/Route-Map--US-52-to-I-65 - Route Map from US 52 to I-65 (This is the one showing the new alignment)

    Even if Tippecanoe County is funding this project, it seems very likely that they will turn over the new roadway to INDOT.

    Relevant quotes from the Route Map from US 52 to I-65 document regarding what will happen to existing US 231 and whether the new roadway will officially be a state highway/US 231:
    "The programming of this project is dependant on available funding, future growth in White County and execution of appropriate relinquishment agreements with Tippecanoe County and White County" (Tippecanoe County Government) - This is relevant to the fate of old US 231 (and maybe the fate of IN 43 if IN 43 is realigned onto a potential extension of the 231 bypass?)
    "Future growth north of Lafayette drives the need for a new terrain alignment, which will extend US 231 northward from US 52 to I65. The Lafayette MPO has suggested that the alignment be extended to SR 43." (Tippecanoe County Government) - This details that the new alignment will be for US 231, and states that the end of the new alignment beyond I-65 will be at IN 43.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 29, 2023, 01:31:13 PM
    Quote from: boilerup25 on December 29, 2023, 01:25:29 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on December 29, 2023, 08:33:24 AM
    Quote from: boilerup25 on December 28, 2023, 11:24:27 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on December 28, 2023, 10:58:05 PM
    I find it interesting that the road goes further than 65 too, I wonder where it will end?  :hmmm: I also wonder if the old 231 will become a county road.

    The new alignment of the US 231 bypass will drop US 231 off at I-65 (and US 231 follows I-65 north to its current alignment), but the roadway will extend to IN 43 just south of Brookston. This is where the new bypass alignment ends. I saw this information in some older Tippecanoe County documents detailing the northern extension of the US 231 bypass. I also assume that the old US 231 alignment will become a county route, very likely County Route 850 West because it already has an "S 850 W" naming convention (unless the road is given a name, like Montmorenci Road, Moore Street, or another name).

    My big question I have is this - What do you think will be the designation for the "231 bypass" between the I-65 junction (where US 231 leaves) and the IN 43 junction? I assume this new alignment will have an IN x43 designation, or will become the IN 43 mainline and the old IN 43 will either receive an IN x43 designation or be relinquished - which begs this question: If IN 43 is relinquished on its old alignment in favor of being placed on the bypass, then what will happen to IN 225 which will be completely orphaned from the Indiana State Highway system? (IN 225 no longer connects to IN 25 ever since IN 25 was moved onto the Hoosier Heartland Highway, and it only connects to the rest of the state highway system via IN 43)

    I didn't look through the document thoroughly enough to find any discussion of funding, but if the county is funding this project and not INDOT, then this won't be a state highway. If the county wants INDOT to take over the route after they build it, INDOT is going to want the county to take back other roadway in return, so perhaps this becomes a new routing of 231 that follows 65 up to Wolcott and the existing 231 becomes a county road.

    I also don't know too much about the funding of this project, however, based on what I have seen in the documents, the documents explicitly state that the new roadway is intended to be a new routing of US 231. Here is where I found the documents:

    https://www.tippecanoe.in.gov/684/US-231 - New US 231 alignment in Tippecanoe County Study
    https://www.tippecanoe.in.gov/DocumentCenter/View/7057/Route-Map--US-52-to-I-65 - Route Map from US 52 to I-65 (This is the one showing the new alignment)

    Even if Tippecanoe County is funding this project, it seems very likely that they will turn over the new roadway to INDOT.

    Relevant quotes from the Route Map from US 52 to I-65 document regarding what will happen to existing US 231 and whether the new roadway will officially be a state highway/US 231:
    "The programming of this project is dependant on available funding, future growth in White County and execution of appropriate relinquishment agreements with Tippecanoe County and White County" (Tippecanoe County Government) - This is relevant to the fate of old US 231 (and maybe the fate of IN 43 if IN 43 is realigned onto a potential extension of the 231 bypass?)
    "Future growth north of Lafayette drives the need for a new terrain alignment, which will extend US 231 northward from US 52 to I65. The Lafayette MPO has suggested that the alignment be extended to SR 43." (Tippecanoe County Government) - This details that the new alignment will be for US 231, and states that the end of the new alignment beyond I-65 will be at IN 43.

    If the new road is going to be US 231, then I imagine 231 follows I-65 all the way up to the northern of the three interchanges US 231 currently has.

    Some or all of the existing 231 may be turned back to the counties, or perhaps just the part south of IN 18 with the rest reverting back to its original IN 53 designation.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: boilerup25 on December 29, 2023, 01:47:27 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on December 29, 2023, 01:31:13 PM
    Quote from: boilerup25 on December 29, 2023, 01:25:29 PM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on December 29, 2023, 08:33:24 AM
    Quote from: boilerup25 on December 28, 2023, 11:24:27 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on December 28, 2023, 10:58:05 PM
    I find it interesting that the road goes further than 65 too, I wonder where it will end?  :hmmm: I also wonder if the old 231 will become a county road.

    The new alignment of the US 231 bypass will drop US 231 off at I-65 (and US 231 follows I-65 north to its current alignment), but the roadway will extend to IN 43 just south of Brookston. This is where the new bypass alignment ends. I saw this information in some older Tippecanoe County documents detailing the northern extension of the US 231 bypass. I also assume that the old US 231 alignment will become a county route, very likely County Route 850 West because it already has an "S 850 W" naming convention (unless the road is given a name, like Montmorenci Road, Moore Street, or another name).

    My big question I have is this - What do you think will be the designation for the "231 bypass" between the I-65 junction (where US 231 leaves) and the IN 43 junction? I assume this new alignment will have an IN x43 designation, or will become the IN 43 mainline and the old IN 43 will either receive an IN x43 designation or be relinquished - which begs this question: If IN 43 is relinquished on its old alignment in favor of being placed on the bypass, then what will happen to IN 225 which will be completely orphaned from the Indiana State Highway system? (IN 225 no longer connects to IN 25 ever since IN 25 was moved onto the Hoosier Heartland Highway, and it only connects to the rest of the state highway system via IN 43)

    I didn't look through the document thoroughly enough to find any discussion of funding, but if the county is funding this project and not INDOT, then this won't be a state highway. If the county wants INDOT to take over the route after they build it, INDOT is going to want the county to take back other roadway in return, so perhaps this becomes a new routing of 231 that follows 65 up to Wolcott and the existing 231 becomes a county road.

    I also don't know too much about the funding of this project, however, based on what I have seen in the documents, the documents explicitly state that the new roadway is intended to be a new routing of US 231. Here is where I found the documents:

    https://www.tippecanoe.in.gov/684/US-231 - New US 231 alignment in Tippecanoe County Study
    https://www.tippecanoe.in.gov/DocumentCenter/View/7057/Route-Map--US-52-to-I-65 - Route Map from US 52 to I-65 (This is the one showing the new alignment)

    Even if Tippecanoe County is funding this project, it seems very likely that they will turn over the new roadway to INDOT.

    Relevant quotes from the Route Map from US 52 to I-65 document regarding what will happen to existing US 231 and whether the new roadway will officially be a state highway/US 231:
    "The programming of this project is dependant on available funding, future growth in White County and execution of appropriate relinquishment agreements with Tippecanoe County and White County" (Tippecanoe County Government) - This is relevant to the fate of old US 231 (and maybe the fate of IN 43 if IN 43 is realigned onto a potential extension of the 231 bypass?)
    "Future growth north of Lafayette drives the need for a new terrain alignment, which will extend US 231 northward from US 52 to I65. The Lafayette MPO has suggested that the alignment be extended to SR 43." (Tippecanoe County Government) - This details that the new alignment will be for US 231, and states that the end of the new alignment beyond I-65 will be at IN 43.

    If the new road is going to be US 231, then I imagine 231 follows I-65 all the way up to the northern of the three interchanges US 231 currently has.

    Some or all of the existing 231 may be turned back to the counties, or perhaps just the part south of IN 18 with the rest reverting back to its original IN 53 designation.

    This is the most likely situation - US 231 will follow I-65 after leaving the new West Lafayette bypass alignment. However, neither of us know which junction US 231 will leave I-65 on, whether it be the southern, middle, or northern junction. US 231 departing I-65 at the northernmost junction near IN 53 will allow for an IN 53 extension all the way down to Montmorenci (unless other portions of 231 are relinquished) without leaving a large gap in the IN 53 designation.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: mukade on December 29, 2023, 07:13:31 PM
    Quote from: boilerup25 on December 29, 2023, 01:47:27 PM
    This is the most likely situation - US 231 will follow I-65 after leaving the new West Lafayette bypass alignment. However, neither of us know which junction US 231 will leave I-65 on, whether it be the southern, middle, or northern junction. US 231 departing I-65 at the northernmost junction near IN 53 will allow for an IN 53 extension all the way down to Montmorenci (unless other portions of 231 are relinquished) without leaving a large gap in the IN 53 designation.

    I generally agree, but with a twist. Acknowledging that this gets into fantasy highways, US 231 could continue to SR 43 and then go all the way up to Michigan City. North of Lafayette, there is no value to US 231 on its current routing, and it would be better to restore original SR 8 and SR 53 designations supplemented with "I-65 emergency detour" signage (that is the actual value). Similarly, there is no value to US 421 north of Greensburg, so extending US 231 to Michigan City would give the US 231 designation a purpose north of Lafayette while keeping  a N-S US highway in Michigan City.

    The alternative is to simply truncate US 231 at the potential new I-65 interchange. I agree SR 53 (and SR 8) can replace US 231 north of Lafayette in any case.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: tdindy88 on December 30, 2023, 10:11:26 AM
    Swinging things back to the other side of the Hoosier State, I was looking through some road plans for upcoming projects and saw something very interesting. As you may know they are building the last loop needed to turn the I-469 and US 24 interchange into a full cloverleaf (Exit 21.) I was very happy to see that they were adding Toledo as a control city for US 24 east along I-469. Rose Avenue remains the control for the westbound road. I know this had been discussed in the past so it was nice to see INDOT finally putting Toledo up on I-469.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on December 30, 2023, 10:24:06 AM
    Quote from: mukade on December 29, 2023, 07:13:31 PM
    Quote from: boilerup25 on December 29, 2023, 01:47:27 PM
    This is the most likely situation - US 231 will follow I-65 after leaving the new West Lafayette bypass alignment. However, neither of us know which junction US 231 will leave I-65 on, whether it be the southern, middle, or northern junction. US 231 departing I-65 at the northernmost junction near IN 53 will allow for an IN 53 extension all the way down to Montmorenci (unless other portions of 231 are relinquished) without leaving a large gap in the IN 53 designation.

    I generally agree, but with a twist. Acknowledging that this gets into fantasy highways, US 231 could continue to SR 43 and then go all the way up to Michigan City. North of Lafayette, there is no value to US 231 on its current routing, and it would be better to restore original SR 8 and SR 53 designations supplemented with "I-65 emergency detour" signage (that is the actual value). Similarly, there is no value to US 421 north of Greensburg, so extending US 231 to Michigan City would give the US 231 designation a purpose north of Lafayette while keeping  a N-S US highway in Michigan City.

    The alternative is to simply truncate US 231 at the potential new I-65 interchange. I agree SR 53 (and SR 8) can replace US 231 north of Lafayette in any case.


    I always thought 421 should have continued to follow the Old Michigan Road up to Rochester, and 231 should have gone north from West Lafayette to Michigan City. Very unlikely they do that now though.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Life in Paradise on January 01, 2024, 10:47:54 AM
    Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on December 30, 2023, 10:24:06 AM
    Quote from: mukade on December 29, 2023, 07:13:31 PM
    Quote from: boilerup25 on December 29, 2023, 01:47:27 PM
    This is the most likely situation - US 231 will follow I-65 after leaving the new West Lafayette bypass alignment. However, neither of us know which junction US 231 will leave I-65 on, whether it be the southern, middle, or northern junction. US 231 departing I-65 at the northernmost junction near IN 53 will allow for an IN 53 extension all the way down to Montmorenci (unless other portions of 231 are relinquished) without leaving a large gap in the IN 53 designation.

    I generally agree, but with a twist. Acknowledging that this gets into fantasy highways, US 231 could continue to SR 43 and then go all the way up to Michigan City. North of Lafayette, there is no value to US 231 on its current routing, and it would be better to restore original SR 8 and SR 53 designations supplemented with "I-65 emergency detour" signage (that is the actual value). Similarly, there is no value to US 421 north of Greensburg, so extending US 231 to Michigan City would give the US 231 designation a purpose north of Lafayette while keeping  a N-S US highway in Michigan City.

    The alternative is to simply truncate US 231 at the potential new I-65 interchange. I agree SR 53 (and SR 8) can replace US 231 north of Lafayette in any case.


    I always thought 421 should have continued to follow the Old Michigan Road up to Rochester, and 231 should have gone north from West Lafayette to Michigan City. Very unlikely they do that now though.
    In looking at the map from afar, I've always wondered why US 421 took those turns and then went up straight to Michigan City rather than following at least the straight path up to Logansport and then perhaps veer slightly west along what is currently US 35's path to Michigan City.  US 231's path from afar would  make it seem like going straight north along US 421's current route straight to Michigan City is right in line with the path all through Indiana down to Owensboro, KY.  I do know that 231 was extended at different times to end up near Crown Point, but the other just looked right.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on January 01, 2024, 11:59:44 AM
    us 421 shouldn't exist north of 74, it's route has always been strange even before the interstate era.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SEWIGuy on January 01, 2024, 12:05:06 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on January 01, 2024, 11:59:44 AM
    us 421 shouldn't exist north of 74, it's route has always been strange even before the interstate era.


    I once took that route from Valpo to Indy just because I had time to kill, and yeah...it's a strange route that is no better than a county highway in stretches.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Moose on January 02, 2024, 10:22:24 PM
    Yes, even between the two "Endpoints" Michigan City and Indianapolis, another route is faster.. US 421, IN 29, US 35

    Or if you include interstates. 65 to the exit just north of Lafayette, then just head due north.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: sprjus4 on January 12, 2024, 10:22:43 PM
    https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1308/details

    New bill proposed that would increase the speed limit on rural interstate highways to 75 mph.

    Honestly, I'd rather them increase the speed limit on wide open four lane divided highways to 65 mph or 70 mph, up from the current 60 mph.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Revive 755 on January 12, 2024, 10:34:35 PM
    Looks like there may also be a bill to ban future construction of J-turns:  https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1129/details (https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1129/details)

    EDIT:  There's also a bill to allow speed cameras and school bus stop arm cameras:  https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1280/details (https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1280/details)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on January 12, 2024, 11:02:07 PM
    Quote from: sprjus4 on January 12, 2024, 10:22:43 PM
    https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1308/details

    New bill proposed that would increase the speed limit on rural interstate highways to 75 mph.

    Honestly, I'd rather them increase the speed limit on wide open four lane divided highways to 65 mph or 70 mph, up from the current 60 mph.

    https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1055/details

    Another attempt at a bill on elimination of lower speed limit for trucks, raising it from 65 mph to 70 mph.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ilpt4u on January 12, 2024, 11:17:23 PM
    Quote from: sprjus4 on January 12, 2024, 10:22:43 PM
    https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1308/details

    New bill proposed that would increase the speed limit on rural interstate highways to 75 mph.

    Honestly, I'd rather them increase the speed limit on wide open four lane divided highways to 65 mph or 70 mph, up from the current 60 mph.
    That has always surprised me a bit about the Hoosier state. They went for 70 on interstates well before the Prairie state neighbor, but Illinois is fine with rural 65 mph divided highways.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on January 12, 2024, 11:23:21 PM
    Another interesting bill for INDOT: https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1366/details

    Lane expansion of I-70. Requires the Indiana department of transportation to take action necessary to construct one or more additional lanes of traffic across the state for: (1) eastbound; and (2) westbound; Interstate Highway 70 in areas of Interstate Highway 70 where there are four lanes of traffic.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JREwing78 on January 14, 2024, 12:01:47 AM
    Quote from: Revive 755 on January 12, 2024, 10:34:35 PM
    Looks like there may also be a bill to ban future construction of J-turns:  https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1129/details (https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1129/details)

    Rep. Manning is from Logansport, so he's got a dog in this hunt. It's not immediately clear if this is a tactic to force InDOT to focus future improvements on freeway conversion, or if he and other locals have some kind of genuine opposition to the existence of J-turns.

    Obviously the ultimate goal is full freeway, but InDOT can use J-turns to limit carnage in the meantime, since InDOT clearly doesn't have the funds to bring the section south of US-24 up to full freeway standards before the end of the decade. What I'd hate to see is InDOT having to put up new stoplights or otherwise delay safety improvements because the legislature kneecapped their ability to make interim safety improvements.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JREwing78 on January 14, 2024, 12:08:29 AM
    Quote from: sprjus4 on January 12, 2024, 10:22:43 PM
    https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1308/details (https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1308/details)

    New bill proposed that would increase the speed limit on rural interstate highways to 75 mph.

    Honestly, I'd rather them increase the speed limit on wide open four lane divided highways to 65 mph or 70 mph, up from the current 60 mph.

    I'm not going to say no to a bump in speed limit to 75 on the Interstates. Maybe that helps nudge Michigan into making a 75 mph speed limit more universal on its freeway segments?

    However, yes, bumping divided highways to 65 mph would be more helpful, as well as applying the Interstate-level speed limit to non-Interstate freeways (like the US-31 freeway segments south of South Bend).

    The 55 mph speed limit on I-80/94 west of the Toll Road is completely silly. You drive that slow and you're impeding traffic.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: bmeiser on January 14, 2024, 08:41:20 AM


    Quote from: JREwing78 on January 14, 2024, 12:08:29 AM
    The 55 mph speed limit on I-80/94 west of the Toll Road is completely silly. You drive that slow and you're impeding traffic.

    Same with 465.

    Pixel 7

    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: sprjus4 on January 14, 2024, 12:12:39 PM
    Quote from: JREwing78 on January 14, 2024, 12:08:29 AM
    Quote from: sprjus4 on January 12, 2024, 10:22:43 PM
    https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1308/details (https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1308/details)

    New bill proposed that would increase the speed limit on rural interstate highways to 75 mph.

    Honestly, I'd rather them increase the speed limit on wide open four lane divided highways to 65 mph or 70 mph, up from the current 60 mph.

    I'm not going to say no to a bump in speed limit to 75 on the Interstates. Maybe that helps nudge Michigan into making a 75 mph speed limit more universal on its freeway segments?

    However, yes, bumping divided highways to 65 mph would be more helpful, as well as applying the Interstate-level speed limit to non-Interstate freeways (like the US-31 freeway segments south of South Bend).

    The 55 mph speed limit on I-80/94 west of the Toll Road is completely silly. You drive that slow and you're impeding traffic.
    Agreed with all points. I believe there was a bill last year to increase certain divided highways (non freeway) to 70 mph, but it did not pass. That obviously would've included the freeway segments.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: SSR_317 on January 14, 2024, 06:21:41 PM
    Our arrogant Republican super-majority in the Indiana General ASSembly has little better to do than to try and micromanage transportation policy. One legislator from here in Indianapolis has even filed a bill to outlaw the creation and existence of "Bus Only" lanes on roadways because, in his infinite wisdom, they "discourage" the use of private automobiles by making traffic worse. Shaking my head at such ridiculous demigods and the ignorant fools who elect them and keep them in office.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on January 14, 2024, 09:49:08 PM
    Quote from: SSR_317 on January 14, 2024, 06:21:41 PM
    Our arrogant Republican super-majority in the Indiana General ASSembly has little better to do than to try and micromanage transportation policy. One legislator from here in Indianapolis has even filed a bill to outlaw the creation and existence of "Bus Only" lanes on roadways because, in his infinite wisdom, they "discourage" the use of private automobiles by making traffic worse. Shaking my head at such ridiculous demigods and the ignorant fools who elect them and keep them in office.

    I hate getting political here but I completely agree. Let INDOT and Indianapolis DPW determine what is best here. This arrogant senator doesn't have a clue of what he is talking about. So much for "small government"  :banghead:
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: triplemultiplex on January 15, 2024, 11:42:32 AM
    Quote from: Revive 755 on January 12, 2024, 10:34:35 PM
    Looks like there may also be a bill to ban future construction of J-turns:  https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1129/details (https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1129/details)

    Yuck.  Stupid politicians telling engineers how to do their jobs.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: 74/171FAN on January 26, 2024, 06:58:45 AM
    Is IN 39 on a four-lane ROW here?  (https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=10219529558310085&set=a.10219529679833123)

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53488382226_a02c8cebc1_c.jpg)


    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: rawmustard on January 26, 2024, 10:21:57 AM
    Quote from: 74/171FAN on January 26, 2024, 06:58:45 AM
    Is IN 39 on a four-lane ROW here?  (https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=10219529558310085&set=a.10219529679833123)

    *snip image*

    Yes, quite a few overpasses in Indiana were built with expansion in mind.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: NWI_Irish96 on January 26, 2024, 10:52:55 AM
    Quote from: rawmustard on January 26, 2024, 10:21:57 AM
    Quote from: 74/171FAN on January 26, 2024, 06:58:45 AM
    Is IN 39 on a four-lane ROW here?  (https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=10219529558310085&set=a.10219529679833123)

    *snip image*

    Yes, quite a few overpasses in Indiana were built with expansion in mind.

    IN 23 under the Toll Road is one that was built that way and eventually did expand to 4 lanes.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on February 04, 2024, 10:12:47 PM
    Quote from: triplemultiplex on January 15, 2024, 11:42:32 AM
    Quote from: Revive 755 on January 12, 2024, 10:34:35 PM
    Looks like there may also be a bill to ban future construction of J-turns:  https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1129/details (https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1129/details)

    Yuck.  Stupid politicians telling engineers how to do their jobs.

    This bill is dead on arrival...
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: TempoNick on February 04, 2024, 10:29:11 PM
    Quote from: triplemultiplex on January 15, 2024, 11:42:32 AM
    Quote from: Revive 755 on January 12, 2024, 10:34:35 PM
    Looks like there may also be a bill to ban future construction of J-turns:  https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1129/details (https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2024/bills/house/1129/details)

    Yuck.  Stupid politicians telling engineers how to do their jobs.

    If they are anything like engineers in Ohio, they have a tendency to put the speed limit too low. As somebody who goes to South Dakota on occasion, their speed limit is 80. I've driven 80 miles an hour and not completely comfortable because the road beds are so high from the ground on I-90, at least of Sioux Falls. One wrong twitch on the steering wheel, a blowout or a deer playing chicken and it seems like it's a long way down that ditch to careen.

    75 is okay on rural interstates with relatively flat land like Ohio and Indiana that don't have a lot of congestion. I drive that speed anyway. What they really need is virtual speed limits. 75, then kick the speed down five mph once the road sensors sense too much traffic. Of course, that will put a crimp in their ticket writing businesses since they're going to have to have proof that the speed limit was what they said it was.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on February 27, 2024, 12:58:31 AM
    Looking at the March 13th letting, there is a project to replace the Ripley Street (SR 51) bridge over I-80/94 in Lake Station. As part of that project, the interchange itself (exit 15) will go from a cloverleaf to a Parclo A-4, meaning that there will be two new traffic signals on SR 51. Oh, and the exit numbers will change in both directions (I-94 WB- from exits 16 and 15 to just 15 & I-94 EB- from exits 15A-B and 16 to 15A and 15B) as well as new and improved signage on I-94.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: 74/171FAN on February 27, 2024, 06:54:44 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on February 27, 2024, 12:58:31 AM
    Looking at the March 13th letting, there is a project to replace the Ripley Street (SR 51) bridge over I-80/94 in Lake Station. As part of that project, the interchange itself (exit 15) will go from a cloverleaf to a Parclo A-4, meaning that there will be two new traffic signals on SR 51. Oh, and the exit numbers will change in both directions (I-94 WB- from exits 16 and 15 to just 15 & I-94 EB- from exits 15A-B and 16 to 15A and 15B) as well as new and improved signage on I-94.

    So is the exit number where I-80 leaves I-94 to go onto the Indiana Toll Road changing?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on February 27, 2024, 03:09:42 PM
    Quote from: 74/171FAN on February 27, 2024, 06:54:44 AM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on February 27, 2024, 12:58:31 AM
    Looking at the March 13th letting, there is a project to replace the Ripley Street (SR 51) bridge over I-80/94 in Lake Station. As part of that project, the interchange itself (exit 15) will go from a cloverleaf to a Parclo A-4, meaning that there will be two new traffic signals on SR 51. Oh, and the exit numbers will change in both directions (I-94 WB- from exits 16 and 15 to just 15 & I-94 EB- from exits 15A-B and 16 to 15A and 15B) as well as new and improved signage on I-94.

    So is the exit number where I-80 leaves I-94 to go onto the Indiana Toll Road changing?

    :nod: The exit number to the Toll Road will switch to exit 15B eastbound and exit 15 westbound...
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on February 27, 2024, 06:10:39 PM
    any links to the plans or a drawing?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on February 27, 2024, 07:18:23 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on February 27, 2024, 12:58:31 AM
    Looking at the March 13th letting, there is a project to replace the Ripley Street (SR 51) bridge over I-80/94 in Lake Station. As part of that project, the interchange itself (exit 15) will go from a cloverleaf to a Parclo A-4, meaning that there will be two new traffic signals on SR 51. Oh, and the exit numbers will change in both directions (I-94 WB- from exits 16 and 15 to just 15 & I-94 EB- from exits 15A-B and 16 to 15A and 15B) as well as new and improved signage on I-94.

    Even if it isn't the full vision of what the entire Toll Road/Indiana 51 interchange reconstruction originally was, I can already see the benefits of converting the Ripley Street cloverleaf.

    It would eliminate the conflicts between traffic entering I-80/94 westbound from the Toll Road AND Ripley Street northbound, and traffic on I-80/94 westbound looking to exit southbound on Ripley Street. A massive struggle during rush hour that can affect the through lanes. It can also create safer and longer acceleration lanes if they build this A4 parclo in the same style as Grant Street and Broadway (C/D style before all traffic merges on the mainline).

    As long as they do a C/D eastbound, it can filter out traffic entering the Toll Road from I-80/94 eastbound and traffic entering from Ripley Street Southbound.

    The existing ramp from I-94 west to the Toll Road/Ripley Street north can simply be resurfaced and altered to accommodate extra lanes at the end of the ramp, which can save some time and money.

    I'm curious to see when this project will take place.

    Moving on...

    Colorado Street is now closed at the Canadian National Railroad crossing just north of the 69th Avenue roundabout, as work begins to convert the at-grade crossing to an overpass. The closure is in place until June 2025. Local traffic can use 69th Avenue to Mississippi Street and 61st Avenue to detour (inverse order for the opposite direction). Indiana 51 would be another viable alternative, but...

    Indiana 51 will be closed to repair the Deep River bridge (located between 61st Avenue and US 30), due to be reopen in August. I-65 between US 30 and I-80/94 will be the detour for this closure, as well as the next one...

    The intersection at Indiana 51 and Indiana 130 (south split at Cleveland Street in Hobart) will soon be closed as the lighted intersection will be converted to a single-lane roundabout. Work is set to be completed by this fall.

    The South Shore Double Track project is nearing its end. The section between Gary and Dune Park is open to test trains as they test track integrity for speed and traffic density. If all goes well, the line will be open to revenue traffic in May, just in time for summer travel.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: cjw2001 on March 06, 2024, 07:14:35 PM
    According to a story posted on the WISH TV website INDOT will soon be issuing an RFP for improvements to the I 465 and US 31 North interchange including added east/west capacity and other improvements (likely median cable barrier) up to 116th street.

    The Interchange Modification Project for US-31 and I-465 in Hamilton County includes the modification of the I-465/US-31 north interchange, seven bridge deck overlays, and related work on US 31 from I-465 to 116th Street in Carmel.  The project will increase capacity for west to north and east to north movements to create better traffic flow and enhance safety. (https://www.wishtv.com/news/local-news/indot-planning-major-construction-project-for-i-465-and-us-31-on-north-side/)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on March 06, 2024, 07:41:58 PM
    Quote from: cjw2001 on March 06, 2024, 07:14:35 PM
    According to a story posted on the WISH TV website INDOT will soon be issuing an RFP for improvements to the I 465 and US 31 North interchange including added east/west capacity and other improvements (likely median cable barrier) up to 116th street.

    The Interchange Modification Project for US-31 and I-465 in Hamilton County includes the modification of the I-465/US-31 north interchange, seven bridge deck overlays, and related work on US 31 from I-465 to 116th Street in Carmel.  The project will increase capacity for west to north and east to north movements to create better traffic flow and enhance safety. (https://www.wishtv.com/news/local-news/indot-planning-major-construction-project-for-i-465-and-us-31-on-north-side/)

    That interchange is undersized for the traffic. It's crazy how fast that happened, this exit isn't very old.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: cjw2001 on March 06, 2024, 09:02:26 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on March 06, 2024, 07:41:58 PM
    Quote from: cjw2001 on March 06, 2024, 07:14:35 PM
    According to a story posted on the WISH TV website INDOT will soon be issuing an RFP for improvements to the I 465 and US 31 North interchange including added east/west capacity and other improvements (likely median cable barrier) up to 116th street.

    The Interchange Modification Project for US-31 and I-465 in Hamilton County includes the modification of the I-465/US-31 north interchange, seven bridge deck overlays, and related work on US 31 from I-465 to 116th Street in Carmel.  The project will increase capacity for west to north and east to north movements to create better traffic flow and enhance safety. (https://www.wishtv.com/news/local-news/indot-planning-major-construction-project-for-i-465-and-us-31-on-north-side/)

    That interchange is undersized for the traffic. It's crazy how fast that happened, this exit isn't very old.
    I've always felt that the congestion had more to do with the lack of lanes on 465 to the west -- it is going to backup regardless of the number of lanes on the ramp if there is no capacity on 465 after the merge.  That said it never made sense for that to be a single lane ramp to 465 westbound.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: michiganguy123 on March 06, 2024, 09:18:14 PM
    Quote from: cjw2001 on March 06, 2024, 07:14:35 PM
    According to a story posted on the WISH TV website INDOT will soon be issuing an RFP for improvements to the I 465 and US 31 North interchange including added east/west capacity and other improvements (likely median cable barrier) up to 116th street.

    The Interchange Modification Project for US-31 and I-465 in Hamilton County includes the modification of the I-465/US-31 north interchange, seven bridge deck overlays, and related work on US 31 from I-465 to 116th Street in Carmel.  The project will increase capacity for west to north and east to north movements to create better traffic flow and enhance safety. (https://www.wishtv.com/news/local-news/indot-planning-major-construction-project-for-i-465-and-us-31-on-north-side/)

    I think the northbound ramp on keystone ave is crazier, pretty much all 31 traffic is routed onto keystone for the east side of indianapolis and i-65. Probably not a great idea to have a traffic light there instead of a free flow ramp.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: boilerup25 on March 07, 2024, 10:44:06 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on March 06, 2024, 07:41:58 PM
    Quote from: cjw2001 on March 06, 2024, 07:14:35 PM
    According to a story posted on the WISH TV website INDOT will soon be issuing an RFP for improvements to the I 465 and US 31 North interchange including added east/west capacity and other improvements (likely median cable barrier) up to 116th street.

    The Interchange Modification Project for US-31 and I-465 in Hamilton County includes the modification of the I-465/US-31 north interchange, seven bridge deck overlays, and related work on US 31 from I-465 to 116th Street in Carmel.  The project will increase capacity for west to north and east to north movements to create better traffic flow and enhance safety. (https://www.wishtv.com/news/local-news/indot-planning-major-construction-project-for-i-465-and-us-31-on-north-side/)

    That interchange is undersized for the traffic. It's crazy how fast that happened, this exit isn't very old.

    Same here, but I can also partially understand some of the undersizing, especially with (mostly free-flow) Keystone Avenue/Keystone Parkway functioning as a parallel US 31, or a long connector between I-465 to/from the east and US 31 to/from the north (but with some intermediate interchanges). Somewhat reminds me of I-865 and its purpose as a connector road.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Moose on March 08, 2024, 06:35:23 PM
    Sherman Minton bridge complaints with stuff falling on cars.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ObEfE2UbPWk
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: 74/171FAN on March 08, 2024, 06:50:11 PM
    Well that bridge is closed now. (https://www.wave3.com/2024/03/08/immediate-total-closure-ordered-sherman-minton-bridge/)
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JMoses24 on March 09, 2024, 02:38:05 PM
    Quote from: 74/171FAN on March 08, 2024, 06:50:11 PM
    Well that bridge is closed now. (https://www.wave3.com/2024/03/08/immediate-total-closure-ordered-sherman-minton-bridge/)

    And with that, you have only part of one free crossing left between Louisville and Southern Indiana (the Second Street aka the Clark Memorial Bridge carrying US 31 has been down to a single lane southbound (https://www.whas11.com/article/traffic/replacement-steel-clark-memorial-bridge-timeline-repairs-traffic-impacts-louisville-kentucky-indiana/417-165a1dc7-22da-4f26-8e7e-d6f2b928b138) since a truck crashed there last week).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on March 09, 2024, 07:53:25 PM
    Quote from: cjw2001 on March 06, 2024, 09:02:26 PM
    Quote from: silverback1065 on March 06, 2024, 07:41:58 PM
    Quote from: cjw2001 on March 06, 2024, 07:14:35 PM
    According to a story posted on the WISH TV website INDOT will soon be issuing an RFP for improvements to the I 465 and US 31 North interchange including added east/west capacity and other improvements (likely median cable barrier) up to 116th street.

    The Interchange Modification Project for US-31 and I-465 in Hamilton County includes the modification of the I-465/US-31 north interchange, seven bridge deck overlays, and related work on US 31 from I-465 to 116th Street in Carmel.  The project will increase capacity for west to north and east to north movements to create better traffic flow and enhance safety. (https://www.wishtv.com/news/local-news/indot-planning-major-construction-project-for-i-465-and-us-31-on-north-side/)

    That interchange is undersized for the traffic. It's crazy how fast that happened, this exit isn't very old.
    I've always felt that the congestion had more to do with the lack of lanes on 465 to the west -- it is going to backup regardless of the number of lanes on the ramp if there is no capacity on 465 after the merge.  That said it never made sense for that to be a single lane ramp to 465 westbound.

    It is and it will be fixed as well as an already announced separate project. they will be widening 465 to 8 lanes with aux lanes from 86th to 31 and redoing the 865 interchange.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JoePCool14 on March 10, 2024, 07:59:51 PM
    Quote from: 74/171FAN on January 26, 2024, 06:58:45 AM
    Is IN 39 on a four-lane ROW here?  (https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=10219529558310085&set=a.10219529679833123)

    (https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53488382226_a02c8cebc1_c.jpg)

    Funnily enough, I think I just drove under that overpass today. Naively, I thought they built that for farmer access. Could that actually be why? Or is that just a useful byproduct?
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JREwing78 on March 11, 2024, 08:10:22 PM
    That section of IN 39 was the main connecting road between I-94 in Michigan and the Toll Road for nearly 10 years (Aug 1963 to Nov. 1972). It is possible that InDOT had plans on the books to add NBD lanes to IN 39 about the time this railroad overpass was constructed.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on March 15, 2024, 07:51:31 AM

    Although this is now old news, it may be interest to some. Last year INDOT tried twice to let Contract R -41529-B, which was the contract to build added travel lanes on I-65 in Scott County. Both times, however, the bids were rejected as they were above the engineer's estimate. There was only one bidder for each letting, a joint venture of E & B Paving and Milestone Contractors LP. The first attempt to let the contract (https://www.in.gov/indot/doing-business-with-indot/files/20230927_Officials.pdf) was on September 27, 2023, but the Joint Venture's bid of $333,450,000 was, as already noted, rejected. Two months later, on December 6, 2023, INDOT tried again, only to again receive a single bid from the JV, this time for $333,500,000. It took INDOT more than a month to decide but, ultimately, that bid, too, was rejected (https://www.in.gov/indot/doing-business-with-indot/files/20231206_Official-Tab-A.pdf).

    And that's where things stand right now, at least from a public standpoint. How INDOT will proceed is hard to say. Maybe as a first step, they'll bring in an outside cost consultant to reevaluate the project's estimated cost. Or perhaps they'll break up the project into smaller sections, allowing mid-sized companies to put together bids. That the initial contract did not draw more interest most certainly caused angst at INDOT. Having trouble awarding a $300,000,000 contract is, to be sure, a little unusual. No doubt they want the added travel lanes built. But first they need to figure out a way to get the contract or contracts awarded.


    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on March 15, 2024, 08:13:43 AM
    it seems pretty clear that the indy to louisville route will be done first. not many gaps left compared to indy to chicago.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 21, 2024, 08:22:41 PM
    One last round: concrete restoration on I-65 is in its final phase, as work to finish the right lanes and the outer shoulder is in progress from US 30 to US 231. This phase is set to end mid-April and will conclude the concrete restoration project that has lasted four years. No more work is needed on I-80/94.

    EDIT: because of the road work on I-65, the ramps from US 30 east and west to I-65 south are closed, as well as the northbound exit to US 30. No other closures are in place. Official detour requires US 30, Indiana 53, and US 231, though passenger cars can use 109th Avenue.

    Two major resurfacing projects are set to begin on US 30 and Indiana 2. On US 30, work will take place from Taft Street (Indiana 55) to just west of Ripley Street (Indiana 51). Part one will take place from Indiana 55 to I-65, lasting until mid-May. Part two will start right after, going from Mississippi Street to Indiana 51. All lane closures will be during the overnight hours.

    On Indiana 2, work will take place between the US 20 interchange and Laporte-St. Joseph County Line Road.

    In both projects, work will include patching, milling, resurfacing, and (for US 30) traffic signal loops. Shoulder closures will also be in place for improved drainage. Both projects are scheduled for completion in November.

    The south split intersection of US 6 and US 421 in Westville will be closed April 1 for roundabout conversion. The project is scheduled for completion in late September. The official detour calls for traffic to use Indiana 2, Indiana 49, US 30, and Indiana 39 (the latter route for US 6 traffic).
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Great Lakes Roads on March 22, 2024, 04:14:30 AM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 21, 2024, 08:22:41 PM

    The south split intersection of US 6 and US 421 in Westville will be closed April 1 for roundabout conversion. The project is scheduled for completion in late September. The official detour calls for traffic to use Indiana 2, Indiana 49, US 30, and Indiana 39 (the latter route for US 6 traffic).

    People on the INDOT Northwest's Facebook page are bickering about the roundabout's location and the long detour around the construction site... There was also a comment on who is contracted to do the work (Rieth-Riley), and it's hilarious to read the comments on the said post!  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 22, 2024, 07:13:23 PM
    Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on March 22, 2024, 04:14:30 AM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 21, 2024, 08:22:41 PM

    The south split intersection of US 6 and US 421 in Westville will be closed April 1 for roundabout conversion. The project is scheduled for completion in late September. The official detour calls for traffic to use Indiana 2, Indiana 49, US 30, and Indiana 39 (the latter route for US 6 traffic).

    People on the INDOT Northwest's Facebook page are bickering about the roundabout's location and the long detour around the construction site... There was also a comment on who is contracted to do the work (Rieth-Riley), and it's hilarious to read the comments on the said post!  :-D

    I feel so bad for the person (or people) charged with running that page. Every time they announce something or talk about something non-construction related, the same usual sweats come on and bicker, along with many others who have no idea how construction works. I mean, a little research would help them realize these detours are designed to primarily guide truck traffic. Anyone who's a passenger car driver can find local workarounds.

    Their mindset basically is "Fix your roads...but not like THAT." Sometimes, I think social media was a mistake.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: JREwing78 on March 22, 2024, 10:47:40 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 22, 2024, 07:13:23 PM
    Sometimes, I think social media was a mistake.

    It's certainly given folks with no knowledge the impression that they can have an intelligent conversation like experts.

    Except, they're too ignorant to realize their ignorance.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 23, 2024, 06:20:20 PM
    Quote from: JREwing78 on March 22, 2024, 10:47:40 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 22, 2024, 07:13:23 PM
    Sometimes, I think social media was a mistake.

    It's certainly given folks with no knowledge the impression that they can have an intelligent conversation like experts.

    Except, they're too ignorant to realize their ignorance.

    Absolutely spot on.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: silverback1065 on March 23, 2024, 06:50:31 PM
    Quote from: JREwing78 on March 22, 2024, 10:47:40 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 22, 2024, 07:13:23 PM
    Sometimes, I think social media was a mistake.

    It's certainly given folks with no knowledge the impression that they can have an intelligent conversation like experts.

    Except, they're too ignorant to realize their ignorance.

    you could say that about politicians too  :-D
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: Plutonic Panda on March 23, 2024, 06:59:57 PM
    Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on March 22, 2024, 07:13:23 PM
    Sometimes, I think social media was a mistake.
    The constitution isn't perfect but I agree with most of it and think it's a pretty damn good rule of law. The first amendment is no exception but I have never been so conflicted on an issue like free speech given the way social media and online anonymity is used and how it can be abused.
    Title: Re: Indiana Notes
    Post by: ITB on March 27, 2024, 02:39:25 PM

    In letting news, INDOT has rescheduled the letting of the first contract (R-43375) of its Revive I-70 program. This is the project to improve and add lanes to I-70 in Wayne County. The contract was originally planned to be let today, March 27, but is now scheduled for April 17th.

    The letting of the contract to improve and add lanes to I-65 in Scott County is back on INDOT's 18 month letting list. The contract (R-41529) is now scheduled to be let March 12, 2025. This is the contract INDOT attempted to let late last year and again earlier this year. Both times the sole bid received was rejected as it came in significantly over the engineer's estimate.

    In Hamilton County, the contract (B-42397) to upgrade US 31 to a limited access, free flow facility is now scheduled for November 14, 2024. If memory serves, this contact was originally planned to be let in May, so it's been pushed back six months.