Indiana Notes

[US 41]

Why does the Salem Bypass not intersect with IN-160?

I have no idea, it makes SR 160 end at a city street too. Like SR 61 does in Vincennes. I also have no idea why they didn't make it go north of SR 60, the highway routings around there are all messed up.

So SR 60 in Salem is now decommissioned? Are there any other changes in Salem?

[tdindy88]

I believe SR 60 was simply rerouted onto the bypass around the town center of Salem and north to the current concurrency with SR 56 on the north side of town.

[silverback1065]

135 was rerouted too

[NWI_Irish96]

Why does the Salem Bypass not intersect with IN-160?

I was just in Salem yesterday, specifically for the purpose of clinching IN 160 (very pretty drive between Salem and Henryville BTW).  IN 160 was not rerouted or truncated when IN 60 and 135 were rereouted onto the new bypass, so IN 160 does end at what used to be IN 60 but is now just a city street.  There is a substantial elevation difference between the two roads where the new bypass crosses over 160, and my guess is that 160 just isn't used enough to justify an interchange.  Extending 160 further into Salem defeats the purpose of rerouting state highways onto the bypass and there isn't any feasible way I see to have 160 link up with the other highways.  It's probably going to have to continue as is, ending at a city street.

[NWI_Irish96]

Why is exit 79b signed as meridian street? It doesn't even take you to meridian St, it takes you to Madison ave. It used to say Mccarty St (why did they change it?) which is just as accurate as saying Madison ave. But meridian St? Not even close! Meridian St is 2 blocks west. I guess it's getting too technical but this exit doesn't even intersect meridian St in anyway it feeds directly into Madison avenue and Mccarty St.

Are there any other exits like this?

They changed it before the super bowl, the exit takes you (eventually) to Meridian, and they presumed people knew all the action was focused on Meridian St. and wanted the signage to direct them that way (even for longterm tourism guidance, Meridian St is much more helpful than Madison Ave or McCarty).

I've always thought it should say:

Madison Ave.
TO Meridian St.

like it does once you are on the ramp. 

[silverback1065]

Why does the Salem Bypass not intersect with IN-160?

I was just in Salem yesterday, specifically for the purpose of clinching IN 160 (very pretty drive between Salem and Henryville BTW).  IN 160 was not rerouted or truncated when IN 60 and 135 were rereouted onto the new bypass, so IN 160 does end at what used to be IN 60 but is now just a city street.  There is a substantial elevation difference between the two roads where the new bypass crosses over 160, and my guess is that 160 just isn't used enough to justify an interchange.  Extending 160 further into Salem defeats the purpose of rerouting state highways onto the bypass and there isn't any feasible way I see to have 160 link up with the other highways.  It's probably going to have to continue as is, ending at a city street.

Is this bypass going to always be 2 lanes or are their future plans to make it a divided highway? Also they could end it at the bridge like they do SR 61 in Vincennes.

[US 41]

Why does the Salem Bypass not intersect with IN-160?

I was just in Salem yesterday, specifically for the purpose of clinching IN 160 (very pretty drive between Salem and Henryville BTW).  IN 160 was not rerouted or truncated when IN 60 and 135 were rereouted onto the new bypass, so IN 160 does end at what used to be IN 60 but is now just a city street.  There is a substantial elevation difference between the two roads where the new bypass crosses over 160, and my guess is that 160 just isn't used enough to justify an interchange.  Extending 160 further into Salem defeats the purpose of rerouting state highways onto the bypass and there isn't any feasible way I see to have 160 link up with the other highways.  It's probably going to have to continue as is, ending at a city street.

What INDOT should do is just have 160 run east on the former 60 to the Salem Bypass. It is only 0.6 miles. Of course it won't happen because it's INDOT.

What they should really do is stop decommissioning highways. Or maybe INDOT should just decommission every state highway besides interstates and a few major state / US highways in the state since those are the only ones that matter in their eyes. I'm about sick of INDOT decommissioning highways. They've basically ruined our state highway network. Nothing like driving 8 miles out of the way whenever the old route is 6 miles shorter just so INDOT can get rid of a few miles. A few people in INDOT need fired and / or find a new career. This is getting ridiculous. State highways should not just end at a city street or at a town's city limit. You really can't extend 160 by 0.6 miles INDOT. Pathetic.

[mukade]

I am not a fan of all the in-city INDOT decommissionings (especially ones with illogical endings), but realistically, how much does it matter?
- In exchange for the turning back of roads, INDOT provides funding for more road improvements than would otherwise occur
- INDOT funds a good chunk of local street improvements irrespective of state highway status
- City streets are marked much better than they were in days past (larger, higher, reflective signs) so anyone should be able to find their way around a city.
- I would say most people use GPS and turn by turn on their phones nowadays so why does having a marked highway matter? It is funny that the Google Maps guys really dislike the decommissionings, but their product was a significant breakthrough that changed the way people get around. Google Maps certainly does not religiously route you on state highways.

I just wonder if it is merely nostalgia from people like me or if there is some objective reason why it does not make sense.

[PurdueBill]

Shouldn't have to get your own GPS or be looking at your phone to follow the route that the signs adequately did before.  Indiana's rationale and laws regarding route numbers on non-state-maintained roads are goofy.  Do it like Massachusetts or Ohio or something and allow state routes to be posted over non-state-maintained roadways in cities/towns if needed, for the sake of being able to navigate.  Getting from 25 on one side of town to 25 on the other shouldn't involve getting out a phone and looking at it or having to be told to follow Schuyler to Sagamore to Teal to 4th or whatever.  It was 25 before; why not let it be 25 still?

38 ending at Sagamore Parkway just feet from where 52 turns onto Teal, the two now never meeting and there being not even a TO 52 (left) sign at the end of 38, is absurd.  If nothing else, 38 could at least legally turn left to meet 52--but that would add several feet so it can't be done.  Give me a break!

[US 41]

In other news SR 446, 48, and 45 in Monroe County will remain under INDOT control. Monroe County rejected INDOT's offer. Does anyone know if SR 45 has been reopened between Beanblossom and Needmore and why it is (was) closed?

[NWI_Irish96]

Why does the Salem Bypass not intersect with IN-160?

I was just in Salem yesterday, specifically for the purpose of clinching IN 160 (very pretty drive between Salem and Henryville BTW).  IN 160 was not rerouted or truncated when IN 60 and 135 were rereouted onto the new bypass, so IN 160 does end at what used to be IN 60 but is now just a city street.  There is a substantial elevation difference between the two roads where the new bypass crosses over 160, and my guess is that 160 just isn't used enough to justify an interchange.  Extending 160 further into Salem defeats the purpose of rerouting state highways onto the bypass and there isn't any feasible way I see to have 160 link up with the other highways.  It's probably going to have to continue as is, ending at a city street.

What INDOT should do is just have 160 run east on the former 60 to the Salem Bypass. It is only 0.6 miles. Of course it won't happen because it's INDOT.

What they should really do is stop decommissioning highways. Or maybe INDOT should just decommission every state highway besides interstates and a few major state / US highways in the state since those are the only ones that matter in their eyes. I'm about sick of INDOT decommissioning highways. They've basically ruined our state highway network. Nothing like driving 8 miles out of the way whenever the old route is 6 miles shorter just so INDOT can get rid of a few miles. A few people in INDOT need fired and / or find a new career. This is getting ridiculous. State highways should not just end at a city street or at a town's city limit. You really can't extend 160 by 0.6 miles INDOT. Pathetic.

Having 160 turn back east there doesn't really make sense.  If you are traveling west on 160, you're likely headed to Salem, so having 160 turn directly away from Salem would cause more confusion than just having it end where it is. 

[thefro]

http://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/johnson-county/2015/11/23/diverging-diamond-interchange-greenwood-only-second-indiana/76099658/

Think roundabouts are confusing? Wait until a new diverging diamond interchange on I-65 opens this week in Greenwood.

The new highway overpass at Worthsville Road is the first diverging diamond interchange in Central Indiana and only the second in the state.

Drivers should stay alert as traffic switches sides along the new bridge to allow vehicles to turn directly onto I-65 without having to cross the path of oncoming traffic.

The  $16.1 million diverging diamond interchange might take some getting used to, but Indiana Department of Transportation spokesman Harry Maginity said everyone will be fine as long as they stay in their proper lanes and pay attention.

"There will be plenty of signs and lights directing cars," he said.

Driving lanes get shuffled for a short distance, Maginity said, but "the stoplight at the end of the bridge is where all that gets corrected."

[NWI_Irish96]

INDOT was originally going to do a DDI at the new I-265/IN 62/Port Rd interchange in Jeffersonville but changed it to roundabouts, which is causing problems with the large amount of truck traffic.

[silverback1065]

This really annoys me about media when they talk about new roadway features, it's the media's job to educate the public on these matters! Don't just say it's confusing, teach people how it works. Honestly it's way less confusing imo than a roundabout if it was your first time seeing it. People will get used to it eventually.

Nexus 6P

[2trailertrucker]

Here is a piece by WXIN with video

http://fox59.com/2015/11/23/indot-greenwood-cut-ribbon-on-first-diverging-diamond-interchange-in-central-indiana/

[monty]

Any thoughts about INDOT's proposed "J-Turns?" http://www.pharostribune.com/news/local_news/article_e3d09a59-80b2-5bb6-a4db-1a40bb0e32cd.html

[tdindy88]

They're planning a couple along US 231 in Spencer County at SR 62 and SR 68, I think.

[jnewkirk77]

They're planning a couple along US 231 in Spencer County at SR 62 and SR 68, I think.

That's what the plan was, but after holding public meetings on it, all of a sudden Vincennes District clammed up and they're no longer discussing anything about the intersections.  It's weird.

[mukade]

Back to DDIs:

Indiana's first diverging diamond interchange at I-69 and SR 1 in Fort Wayne was honored with an engineering award Tuesday...

Fort Wayne diverging diamond interchange honored with engineering award (21Alive)

My daughter who lives in Fort Wayne sent me the URL, but she said she hates driving through the interchange on DuPont Road. I don't see the issue, personally. I believe the next Indiana DDI will be at Campus Parkway on I-69.

[captkirk_4]

Shouldn't have to get your own GPS or be looking at your phone to follow the route that the signs adequately did before.  Indiana's rationale and laws regarding route numbers on non-state-maintained roads are goofy.  Do it like Massachusetts or Ohio or something and allow state routes to be posted over non-state-maintained roadways in cities/towns if needed, for the sake of being able to navigate.  Getting from 25 on one side of town to 25 on the other shouldn't involve getting out a phone and looking at it or having to be told to follow Schuyler to Sagamore to Teal to 4th or whatever.  It was 25 before; why not let it be 25 still?

38 ending at Sagamore Parkway just feet from where 52 turns onto Teal, the two now never meeting and there being not even a TO 52 (left) sign at the end of 38, is absurd.  If nothing else, 38 could at least legally turn left to meet 52--but that would add several feet so it can't be done.  Give me a break!

Coming back to Central Illinois from Michigan I wanted to avoid the horrendous bottleneck and traffic Jam of I80/90/94 along the lake so I checked out the US24 to Hoosier Heartland Highway from Ft Wayne and made good time until all of a sudden this major NE/SW route came to a DEAD STOP in the middle of Lafayette ending on unmarked urban streets. No signs how to get to the SW corner of town and head on down to I74. Lafayette is completely lacking an adequate way to get from the circle at the end of the Hoosier Heartland Highway to I74. No bypass of this traffic signal laden city, no diagonal highways heading towards Danville.

[silverback1065]

Shouldn't have to get your own GPS or be looking at your phone to follow the route that the signs adequately did before.  Indiana's rationale and laws regarding route numbers on non-state-maintained roads are goofy.  Do it like Massachusetts or Ohio or something and allow state routes to be posted over non-state-maintained roadways in cities/towns if needed, for the sake of being able to navigate.  Getting from 25 on one side of town to 25 on the other shouldn't involve getting out a phone and looking at it or having to be told to follow Schuyler to Sagamore to Teal to 4th or whatever.  It was 25 before; why not let it be 25 still?

38 ending at Sagamore Parkway just feet from where 52 turns onto Teal, the two now never meeting and there being not even a TO 52 (left) sign at the end of 38, is absurd.  If nothing else, 38 could at least legally turn left to meet 52--but that would add several feet so it can't be done.  Give me a break!

Coming back to Central Illinois from Michigan I wanted to avoid the horrendous bottleneck and traffic Jam of I80/90/94 along the lake so I checked out the US24 to Hoosier Heartland Highway from Ft Wayne and made good time until all of a sudden this major NE/SW route came to a DEAD STOP in the middle of Lafayette ending on unmarked urban streets. No signs how to get to the SW corner of town and head on down to I74. Lafayette is completely lacking an adequate way to get from the circle at the end of the Hoosier Heartland Highway to I74. No bypass of this traffic signal laden city, no diagonal highways heading towards Danville.

You can thank INDOT for that, it used to be signed through lafayette, but INDOT wanted to fuck that up, so they did.

[silverback1065]

Worthsville Rd is open today, anyone been down there yet?

[tdindy88]

Shouldn't have to get your own GPS or be looking at your phone to follow the route that the signs adequately did before.  Indiana's rationale and laws regarding route numbers on non-state-maintained roads are goofy.  Do it like Massachusetts or Ohio or something and allow state routes to be posted over non-state-maintained roadways in cities/towns if needed, for the sake of being able to navigate.  Getting from 25 on one side of town to 25 on the other shouldn't involve getting out a phone and looking at it or having to be told to follow Schuyler to Sagamore to Teal to 4th or whatever.  It was 25 before; why not let it be 25 still?

38 ending at Sagamore Parkway just feet from where 52 turns onto Teal, the two now never meeting and there being not even a TO 52 (left) sign at the end of 38, is absurd.  If nothing else, 38 could at least legally turn left to meet 52--but that would add several feet so it can't be done.  Give me a break!

Coming back to Central Illinois from Michigan I wanted to avoid the horrendous bottleneck and traffic Jam of I80/90/94 along the lake so I checked out the US24 to Hoosier Heartland Highway from Ft Wayne and made good time until all of a sudden this major NE/SW route came to a DEAD STOP in the middle of Lafayette ending on unmarked urban streets. No signs how to get to the SW corner of town and head on down to I74. Lafayette is completely lacking an adequate way to get from the circle at the end of the Hoosier Heartland Highway to I74. No bypass of this traffic signal laden city, no diagonal highways heading towards Danville.

You can thank INDOT for that, it used to be signed through lafayette, but INDOT wanted to fuck that up, so they did.

Shouldn't have to get your own GPS or be looking at your phone to follow the route that the signs adequately did before.  Indiana's rationale and laws regarding route numbers on non-state-maintained roads are goofy.  Do it like Massachusetts or Ohio or something and allow state routes to be posted over non-state-maintained roadways in cities/towns if needed, for the sake of being able to navigate.  Getting from 25 on one side of town to 25 on the other shouldn't involve getting out a phone and looking at it or having to be told to follow Schuyler to Sagamore to Teal to 4th or whatever.  It was 25 before; why not let it be 25 still?

38 ending at Sagamore Parkway just feet from where 52 turns onto Teal, the two now never meeting and there being not even a TO 52 (left) sign at the end of 38, is absurd.  If nothing else, 38 could at least legally turn left to meet 52--but that would add several feet so it can't be done.  Give me a break!

Coming back to Central Illinois from Michigan I wanted to avoid the horrendous bottleneck and traffic Jam of I80/90/94 along the lake so I checked out the US24 to Hoosier Heartland Highway from Ft Wayne and made good time until all of a sudden this major NE/SW route came to a DEAD STOP in the middle of Lafayette ending on unmarked urban streets. No signs how to get to the SW corner of town and head on down to I74. Lafayette is completely lacking an adequate way to get from the circle at the end of the Hoosier Heartland Highway to I74. No bypass of this traffic signal laden city, no diagonal highways heading towards Danville.

Lafayette at the very least should have "TO SR 25" and "TO US 231" signs installed, I know they have the emergency detour signs for I-65 there for Sagamore Parkway. INDOT must assume that most traffic traveling southwest to Lafayette end there or go onto I-65 and not travel further south and west. Otherwise they would give a damn about that particular movement of travel. That and they probably assume that you have typed in Danville on your phone and just followed that.

[tdindy88]

Well you were asking about the diverging diamond interchange in Greenwood, so here's some pictures. Of course there's still some additional construction going on along Worthsville Road, which is being converted into a four-lane boulevard from I-65 to US 31. I was surprised to see some of that still ongoing despite the road being closed for about two years at this point.

[Big John]

^^ Using a No Right Turn and No Left Turn signs on the same post instead of a No Turns sign?