Indiana Notes

[billtm]

Does anyone have a list of recently decommissioned state roads in Indiana. I have just noticed that they have removed the SR-32 shields from the BGS overhead signs along I-65 which signals that SR-32 may have been decommissioned in that area but have not found any news reports about that.

I noticed that they were missing northbound but they still had the sheild on the southbound BGS. I went by there a couple weeks ago. So maybe they took down the southbound shields later?

[Indyroads]

no just verified that the 32 shields remain on the SB approaching 3 BGS's seems it may be just the NB exit BGS that is missing the route 32 marker. although there isn't a SR-32 reassurance marker WB of I-65 until you get about 5 miles west of town just past 500W.

[silverback1065]

no just verified that the 32 shields remain on the SB approaching 3 BGS's seems it may be just the NB exit BGS that is missing the route 32 marker. although there isn't a SR-32 reassurance marker WB of I-65 until you get about 5 miles west of town just past 500W.

I wondered the same thing today driving to Chicago, I'm almost certain the northbound bgs's say SR 32, just that the last of the 3 bgs's telling you of the exit is missing the 32 shield.  I think it just fell off.  There are so many BGS's blown over or damaged around the state.  If you look at INDOT's roadway inventory, it still says it's their road: https://gis.in.gov/apps/DOT/RoadwayInventory/ I'm not sure how much they update it, but that's where I go to see what they decommission. 

[silverback1065]

I drove it, and SR does still exist as it always has been, it is just horribly signed, all the signs must have been knocked down due to weather.

[monty]

Observed INDOT installing what appears to be a left turn signal from SR 28 westbound to US 31 southbound this morning.  this will aid traffic heading south from the Tipton Transmission plant until the new interchange is built.

[mukade]

The Hamilton County Board of Commissioners is pushing a solution – nine new roundabouts on Ind. 37 – to keep traffic moving. They also are considering purchasing the highway from Indiana Department of Transportation as part of a $243 million road improvement deal.

Negotiations with INDOT have not started yet, but commissioners have launched a series of meetings with the Fishers and Noblesville councils to gain support for the plan.

Hamilton County pushes for 9 roundabouts on Ind. 37 (Indy Star)

[silverback1065]

The Hamilton County Board of Commissioners is pushing a solution – nine new roundabouts on Ind. 37 – to keep traffic moving. They also are considering purchasing the highway from Indiana Department of Transportation as part of a $243 million road improvement deal.

Negotiations with INDOT have not started yet, but commissioners have launched a series of meetings with the Fishers and Noblesville councils to gain support for the plan.

Hamilton County pushes for 9 roundabouts on Ind. 37 (Indy Star)

I like the idea, but don't like the idea of them taking on maintenance of SR 37, I think the people raising concerns about that are right, I don't see them being able to afford it in the future when major repairs are needed.  It makes no sense why they added to the problem by adding a new road and light at 135th street, they complain about the traffic lights, and turn around and add another one?  I know it's just one light, but seriously?  Was it really necessary?  I really feel like that whole area was poorly planned.

[trafficsignal]

The Hamilton County Board of Commissioners is pushing a solution – nine new roundabouts on Ind. 37 – to keep traffic moving. They also are considering purchasing the highway from Indiana Department of Transportation as part of a $243 million road improvement deal.

Negotiations with INDOT have not started yet, but commissioners have launched a series of meetings with the Fishers and Noblesville councils to gain support for the plan.

Hamilton County pushes for 9 roundabouts on Ind. 37 (Indy Star)

I like the idea, but don't like the idea of them taking on maintenance of SR 37, I think the people raising concerns about that are right, I don't see them being able to afford it in the future when major repairs are needed.  It makes no sense why they added to the problem by adding a new road and light at 135th street, they complain about the traffic lights, and turn around and add another one?  I know it's just one light, but seriously?  Was it really necessary?  I really feel like that whole area was poorly planned.

In theory, its there to reduce delays for the adjacent signals (that the internal network connects to) when the additional development happens.  In practice, the developer has an easier job selling prospects when there is a signal in front of their outlot.  The only people that lose are the commuters that are heading past the site, but even then INDOT has done a lot of work in coordinating the signals to maintain platoons through the system.

Adding a lane (as some of those quoted in the article suggested) would help for a while, but eventually several of the intersections would need to become interchanges anyway.  Might as well do it now while its cheaper and leave room for the added lane in the future.

Final thought - I see no need to transfer ownership from INDOT.  Carmel did it to get a pot of money to do their prefered option, but with 3 entities sharing costs they could just throw a ton of money at INDOT to do the interchanges the way they want.

[silverback1065]

Good insite

[ysuindy]

In addition to the roundabout interchanges under discussion for 37, there was an article last week (at the corner of Allisonville Road and 146th Street)  (edited to add the info in the previous set of parentheses).

Cost estimated at $22 million.  Hamilton County, Noblesville and Fishers would be involved.

No time frame given.

I'm adding a link below, but it is a pay site - doubt the link works for a non-subscriber, but maybe ...

http://thetimes24-7.com/main.asp?Search=1&ArticleID=40110&SectionID=1&SubSectionID=1&S=1

A portion of the article:

"There is no definite plan at this point," said Brad Davis, director of the Hamilton County Highway Department. "(The study) showed that because of the growth and increased traffic flow in that area, something needed to be done."

He painted a visual picture of the future interchange. "What would happen is 146th Street would actually dip down and go underneath Allisonville Road. Drivers would just have to get off on the ramp to go to Allisonville."

Davis said the cost of the project is estimated to be between $22 and $23 million after construction, right-of-way acquisitions, engineering fees and construction inspections.

"The interchange would take a little bit of additional property that we would have to buy," Davis said. "That's where we're at now."

[silverback1065]

In addition to the roundabout interchanges under discussion for 37, there was an article last week

Cost estimated at $22 million.  Hamilton County, Noblesville and Fishers would be involved.

No time frame given.

I'm adding a link below, but it is a pay site - doubt the link works for a non-subscriber, but maybe ...

http://thetimes24-7.com/main.asp?Search=1&ArticleID=40110&SectionID=1&SubSectionID=1&S=1

A portion of the article:

"There is no definite plan at this point," said Brad Davis, director of the Hamilton County Highway Department. "(The study) showed that because of the growth and increased traffic flow in that area, something needed to be done."

He painted a visual picture of the future interchange. "What would happen is 146th Street would actually dip down and go underneath Allisonville Road. Drivers would just have to get off on the ramp to go to Allisonville."

Davis said the cost of the project is estimated to be between $22 and $23 million after construction, right-of-way acquisitions, engineering fees and construction inspections.

"The interchange would take a little bit of additional property that we would have to buy," Davis said. "That's where we're at now."

So is SR 37 going to be decommissioned?

[ysuindy]

Ugh - somehow a portion of my post got erased before I hit post....      Operator Error

The article is talking about a roundabout at the corner of Allisonville Road (old State Route 37) and 146th Street - this is about a mile or so west of current 37.  I saw nothing about decommissioning 37.

Let me try to edit my original post so no one else is confused by my stupidity...

[NWI_Irish96]

In addition to the roundabout interchanges under discussion for 37, there was an article last week (at the corner of Allisonville Road and 146th Street)  (edited to add the info in the previous set of parentheses).

Cost estimated at $22 million.  Hamilton County, Noblesville and Fishers would be involved.

No time frame given.

I'm adding a link below, but it is a pay site - doubt the link works for a non-subscriber, but maybe ...

http://thetimes24-7.com/main.asp?Search=1&ArticleID=40110&SectionID=1&SubSectionID=1&S=1

A portion of the article:

"There is no definite plan at this point," said Brad Davis, director of the Hamilton County Highway Department. "(The study) showed that because of the growth and increased traffic flow in that area, something needed to be done."

He painted a visual picture of the future interchange. "What would happen is 146th Street would actually dip down and go underneath Allisonville Road. Drivers would just have to get off on the ramp to go to Allisonville."

Davis said the cost of the project is estimated to be between $22 and $23 million after construction, right-of-way acquisitions, engineering fees and construction inspections.

"The interchange would take a little bit of additional property that we would have to buy," Davis said. "That's where we're at now."

With all the growth the area has seen and with 146th being the only E-W road between 116th and 32 that crosses the White River, 146th really could stand to get the Keystone treatment from 31 all the way over to 69, or at least to 37.

[tdindy88]

146th Street has typically been viewed as the mythical northern leg of the outer Indianapolis beltway, along with Olio/Mt. Comfort Road, RR Pkwy and Worthsville Rd/SR 144, vaguely speaking of course. Despite that, I highly doubt we'll see the Keystone treatment done to that road in the near future, SR 37 will be done first. But to the question further up, the topic of decommissioning that part of SR 37 has been brought up before. Presumably to do this roundabout work that is what would have to happen, unless the state is willing to pay for all of this.

[trafficsignal]

SR 37 should definitely be done first - I know the first time this was presented to the County it was suggested that SR 37 could be rerouted up I-69 to SR 13, then cosigned until they split in Elwood (they're already cosigned for 6+ miles in that area).  That could work, although SR 13 thru Lapel is not very fun as a through route.

The County has already begun preliminary investigations, knowing a 4-lane 146th Street won't work too far into the future - I've seen a queue extending from Allisonville to Hazel Dell (2.5+ miles) just due to volumes (no crashes).  It'll either need another through lane for the length or some alternative intersection designs to work in the future, since there doesn't seem to be any slowdown in the development.

[NWI_Irish96]

SR 37 should definitely be done first - I know the first time this was presented to the County it was suggested that SR 37 could be rerouted up I-69 to SR 13, then cosigned until they split in Elwood (they're already cosigned for 6+ miles in that area).  That could work, although SR 13 thru Lapel is not very fun as a through route.

The County has already begun preliminary investigations, knowing a 4-lane 146th Street won't work too far into the future - I've seen a queue extending from Allisonville to Hazel Dell (2.5+ miles) just due to volumes (no crashes).  It'll either need another through lane for the length or some alternative intersection designs to work in the future, since there doesn't seem to be any slowdown in the development.

I've actually developed a partially unnumbered workaround to getting NE of Indy without going through either Noblesville or Lapel.  I get off I-69 at Exit 210 and use Olio Rd and one other road whose name escapes me right now, to get up to 32 and then over to 13. 

[silverback1065]

can't they just build another bridge over the white river?

[NWI_Irish96]

can't they just build another bridge over the white river?

Along the White River between 116th and 32 there are two golf courses and Conner Prairie, so no, they really couldn't build another bridge. 

[silverback1065]

You're right I forgot about that. They should imminent domain the golf courses haha but wishful thinking.

[silverback1065]

But in all seriousness if you look at a map they could put bridges at 126th and 141st none of the golf courses cross where the road would go

[trafficsignal]

126th would be good, but it looks like it'd run through a park in Carmel, plus the backyards of $1 million+ homes in Fishers, so it'd be tough to buy the land and to persuade politicians to proceed.  141st doesn't connect to anything of consequence and is so close to 146th it probably wouldn't do much good.  There aren't any more good options for drawing regional traffic, although something between SR 32 & 146th would be helpful, maybe around 161st?

[silverback1065]

126th would be good, but it looks like it'd run through a park in Carmel, plus the backyards of $1 million+ homes in Fishers, so it'd be tough to buy the land and to persuade politicians to proceed.  141st doesn't connect to anything of consequence and is so close to 146th it probably wouldn't do much good.  There aren't any more good options for drawing regional traffic, although something between SR 32 & 146th would be helpful, maybe around 161st?

they need to do something that's for sure, they can't carmelize (keystone pkwy) everything! Does anyone agree with me and saying that whole area wasn't very well planned in a transportation sense?  With the Whitestown/Zionsville area now growing, I hope they build better roads in that area before it's too late!

[billtm]

161st looks like the best alternative to me. I would carmelize that before its too late! Even though there are alot of neighborhood entrances to get rid of, a mine to pave over, and some neighborhoods near 37 to bulldoze, it would be the next logical corridor after 146th.

[mukade]

The 2015 Roadway Map is out. These are the changes I noticed at first glance:
- I-164 is gone in favor of I-69
- US 24 Fort to Port is shown as a freeway
- US 31 Kokomo is shown as a freeway
- SR 750 is shown, but without a route number
- SR 267 middle section is gone
- SR 60 and SR 135 follow the new bypass in Salem
- SR 126, SR 443, and SR 526 are gone
- Old Michigan Road and Lincoln Highway are shown in green

Errors and omissions:
- US 31 South Bend still shown as under construction
- SR 25 thru Lafayette shows the old route thru town (it is now decommissioned)

The only city map, again, is the Indy one.

[silverback1065]

The 2015 Roadway Map is out. These are the changes I noticed at first glance:
- I-164 is gone in favor of I-69
- US 24 Fort to Port is shown as a freeway
- US 31 Kokomo is shown as a freeway
- SR 750 is shown, but without a route number
- SR 267 middle section is gone
- SR 60 and SR 135 follow the new bypass in Salem
- SR 126, SR 443, and SR 526 are gone
- Old Michigan Road and Lincoln Highway are shown in green

Errors and omissions:
- US 31 South Bend still shown as under construction
- SR 25 thru Lafayette shows the old route thru town (it is now decommissioned)

The only city map, again, is the Indy one.

Are they going to continue that bypass to meet 135 north of salem, or is this it?