New Jersey

[jeffandnicole]

^ I was on 295 yesterday in that area, but heading north instead, so I didn't get to see it. Good thing I didn't, I would've gouged my eyes out.

Also, A 2.7m job to rehabilitate the Trenton Makes bridge is set to start in March this year.

Mis-leading headline.  Does any newspaper bother printing proper headlines anymore??

The construction is for the approach roads to the bridge.  The work is necessary - the roadways are in bad shape.  Any bets on if they'll remove the forever flashing signal on the NJ side??

I didn't think the work would be involving the bridge - it's a steel graded bridge - no repaving needed there - and the bridge itself was rehabbed just a few years ago.

[odditude]

^ I was on 295 yesterday in that area, but heading north instead, so I didn't get to see it. Good thing I didn't, I would've gouged my eyes out.

Also, A 2.7m job to rehabilitate the Trenton Makes bridge is set to start in March this year.

Mis-leading headline.  Does any newspaper bother printing proper headlines anymore??

The construction is for the approach roads to the bridge.  The work is necessary - the roadways are in bad shape.  Any bets on if they'll remove the forever flashing signal on the NJ side??

I didn't think the work would be involving the bridge - it's a steel graded bridge - no repaving needed there - and the bridge itself was rehabbed just a few years ago.

you're not thinking of the Calhoun St bridge, are you?

[jeffandnicole]

^ I was on 295 yesterday in that area, but heading north instead, so I didn't get to see it. Good thing I didn't, I would've gouged my eyes out.

Also, A 2.7m job to rehabilitate the Trenton Makes bridge is set to start in March this year.

Mis-leading headline.  Does any newspaper bother printing proper headlines anymore??

The construction is for the approach roads to the bridge.  The work is necessary - the roadways are in bad shape.  Any bets on if they'll remove the forever flashing signal on the NJ side??

I didn't think the work would be involving the bridge - it's a steel graded bridge - no repaving needed there - and the bridge itself was rehabbed just a few years ago.

you're not thinking of the Calhoun St bridge, are you?

The Calhoun was worked on as well. The benefit of the Trenton Makes was they could shift traffic to one side of the bridge, so they didn't have to shut it down completely. 

Looking back, it looks like this is what I remember...although it appears to be more for painting and rehab of the Ped walkway and 'Trenton Makes' sign: https://www.drjtbc.org/default.aspx?pageid=181

[NJRoadfan]

Think its awfully coincidental that bridges are being closed while there is a debate about raising the state gas tax?

Nah, just politics as usual.

Now a PAC has popped up running ads on heavy rotation on the radio and on TV.

http://politickernj.com/2015/02/forward-nj-releases-radio-and-digital-ads-with-ttf-in-mind/

[PHLBOS]

Think its awfully coincidental that bridges are being closed while there is a debate about raising the state gas tax?

Nah, just politics as usual.

Now a PAC has popped up running ads on heavy rotation on the radio and on TV.

http://politickernj.com/2015/02/forward-nj-releases-radio-and-digital-ads-with-ttf-in-mind/

Similar happened across the Delaware last year; a whole bunch of ALTERNATE TRUCK detour routes were established on many routes in the Keystone State and SEPTA threatened to shut off over half of its Regional rail system within a 3-to-5 year period if the cap on wholesale gas taxes wasn't lifted or repealed.  Then-Gov. Corbett blinked, the cap was eliminated and the rest is history.

[Alps]

Think its awfully coincidental that bridges are being closed while there is a debate about raising the state gas tax?

Nah, just politics as usual.

Now a PAC has popped up running ads on heavy rotation on the radio and on TV.

http://politickernj.com/2015/02/forward-nj-releases-radio-and-digital-ads-with-ttf-in-mind/

I can tell you this much - these bridges are legitimately in need of repair to be safely reopened, and there legitimately isn't the money to do it.

[storm2k]

Think its awfully coincidental that bridges are being closed while there is a debate about raising the state gas tax?

Nah, just politics as usual.

Now a PAC has popped up running ads on heavy rotation on the radio and on TV.

http://politickernj.com/2015/02/forward-nj-releases-radio-and-digital-ads-with-ttf-in-mind/

The whole thing about the TTF being out of money within the next six months? No one is making that up. Years of mismanagement by politicians on both sides of the aisle and issuing a massive ton of debt without increasing funds to pay for it all have left us in this position. The TTF used to be a model for how to pay for transportation infrastructure projects. Now it's so broke that the state won't be able to pay for any road projects at all, and one of the main culprits is that no governor has wanted to go near the gas tax for 26 years. Time is up and years of kicking the can down the proverbial road have come back to haunt the state.

Let me put it simply. When you have a Republican governor with eyes towards the White House putting out feelers that he would be ok with a tax increase, when any tax increase is a complete anathema to the hardliners of his party that he needs to win over to win primaries, then you have the real deal. The last thing Christie wants is to have a tax increase on his record, but the question becomes, which is worse? For him to stand behind a gas tax increase that can put the fund back on some sort of stable footing, or watch as a bridge collapses because the state didn't have the money to fix the damn thing because of political stupidity? The last thing this is is politics as usual.

[Zeffy]

I can tell you this much - these bridges are legitimately in need of repair to be safely reopened, and there legitimately isn't the money to do it.

Pretty much. Christie will tout about how he has "made a real change" in Camden, yet all you need to do to see the problems our state faces is look at our roads and especially our bridges. Christie needs to actually start doing shit in the state he was elected (twice) in before he considers trying to run the entire damn country. Of course, he'll dump millions into trying to save Atlantic City, as well as go meet with the Prime Minister of England because apparently the TTF doesn't matter.

[roadman65]

I have not lived in New Jersey for a long time, but even when I lived there back in the 1980's it had the problems then as well.  I do not think that anything will change, no matter who runs it.   

It saddens me a little that nothing can be done, as New Jersey is a great state and has not expanded much for a state of its population size.   

[Zeffy]

One Bergen County Lawmaker wants to End County Government in New Jersey

Basically, the law calls for New Jersey to pretty much become like Connecticut in the regard that counties aren't government entities anymore. The proposal could save up to $2b for the state if it went through.

However, one big issue with that is... what about the COUNTY road system? It's a major part of our state highway system, and as the name implies, the roads are maintained by - you guessed it - the counties. Getting rid of the county government would mean you have to transfer the maintenance to a local municipality. That could become problematic in areas where there is already a shortfall of funds (not that we much funds for roads anyway). A lot of county roadways (especially 5xx ones) are still major arterials throughout the state. Depending on other municipalities to maintain them isn't exactly a great idea when they have to maintain all of the other roads in their municipality as well.

Of course, another option is to gradually eliminate the local government in each municipality (of which New Jersey has 565) and let the county handle everything instead (basically how Camden handles policing except on a much much larger scale). Again though, how much can the county handle doing everything by itself?

It saddens me a little that nothing can be done, as New Jersey is a great state and has not expanded much for a state of its population size.   

Yup, but no matter what, I'll stick by New Jersey until the very end.

[Alps]

One Bergen County Lawmaker wants to End County Government in New Jersey

Basically, the law calls for New Jersey to pretty much become like Connecticut in the regard that counties aren't government entities anymore. The proposal could save up to $2b for the state if it went through.

However, one big issue with that is... what about the COUNTY road system? It's a major part of our state highway system, and as the name implies, the roads are maintained by - you guessed it - the counties. Getting rid of the county government would mean you have to transfer the maintenance to a local municipality. That could become problematic in areas where there is already a shortfall of funds (not that we much funds for roads anyway). A lot of county roadways (especially 5xx ones) are still major arterials throughout the state. Depending on other municipalities to maintain them isn't exactly a great idea when they have to maintain all of the other roads in their municipality as well.

Of course, another option is to gradually eliminate the local government in each municipality (of which New Jersey has 565) and let the county handle everything instead (basically how Camden handles policing except on a much much larger scale). Again though, how much can the county handle doing everything by itself?

It saddens me a little that nothing can be done, as New Jersey is a great state and has not expanded much for a state of its population size.   

Yup, but no matter what, I'll stick by New Jersey until the very end.

You can save a ton more money by municipal consolidation than you will by eliminating counties. Counties are strong in NJ and they handle a lot of services, from roads to public works to police, that would be a significant structural and functional change for the next levels down and up if they disbanded. It won't fly.

[J Route Z]

Chester Township and Chester Borough should be one town.
Freehold Twp and Freehold Boro should be one town.
Princeton is now one town.

[Alps]

Chester Township and Chester Borough should be one town.
Freehold Twp and Freehold Boro should be one town.
Princeton is now one town.

If we started going into "should be one town" we'd run out of characters per post. There are 566 municipalities and at least 100 of them could easily be consolidated.

[jeffandnicole]

Most people's opinions sound like this: "Consolidate every town but mine".

There's 607 school districts (yes, in a state that only has 566 municipalities). Consolidation has been mentioned there too. It usually sounds like this: "Consolidate every school district but mine".

Thus, the actual consolidation that takes place is minimal.

Next topic: Why are my taxes so high?

[TXtoNJ]

I agree with wrapping all the municipalities up into one county government. Think it's the only way you could even start revitalizing the Delaware River cities.

[roadman65]

Chester Township and Chester Borough should be one town.
Freehold Twp and Freehold Boro should be one town.
Princeton is now one town.

Pilesgrove and Woodstown should be one as Morristown and Morris Township should be one town.

Then Metuchen and Edison should merge as Bridgewater and Somerville.  Then in Warren County both Washington Boro and Washington Township should be one.

[Zeffy]

I agree with wrapping all the municipalities up into one county government. Think it's the only way you could even start revitalizing the Delaware River cities.

Or the Passaic River cities. Newark and Paterson are just as big of a mess as Trenton and Camden are.

[jeffandnicole]

What did Alps just say?

Please, let's not turn this into a "Fictional Consolidated New Jersey Towns" thread.  You'll get thousands of opinions as to who should merge with who, and it's never going to happen.

[Zeffy]

What did Alps just say?

Please, let's not turn this into a "Fictional Consolidated New Jersey Towns" thread.  You'll get thousands of opinions as to who should merge with who, and it's never going to happen.

Yes, instead, let's discuss what wonderful products we would buy from the NJTA should they acquire a license for their logos.

[signalman]

In large, municipal consolidation will not happen.  A few may, but far more that should merge won't for one reason or another.  Because New Jersey.  Personally, I'm in favor of it.  The town that I live in should be merged with it's borough counterpart.  They were the same municipality until 1899 when the borough broke off from the township.

[jeffandnicole]

The town I'm in surrounds another town.  That town merged police forces with another town.  The two towns aren't connected, and require traveling thru my town to reach each other.

[Pete from Boston]

What did Alps just say?

Please, let's not turn this into a "Fictional Consolidated New Jersey Towns" thread.  You'll get thousands of opinions as to who should merge with who, and it's never going to happen.

Yes, instead, let's discuss what wonderful products we would buy from the NJTA should they acquire a license for their logos.

I don't get how these are not in the public domain.  Is this nonsense some part of the Turnpike being a "quasi-public corporation"? 

[Pete from Boston]

In large, municipal consolidation will not happen.  A few may, but far more that should merge won't for one reason or another.  Because New Jersey.  Personally, I'm in favor of it.  The town that I live in should be merged with it's borough counterpart.  They were the same municipality until 1899 when the borough broke off from the township.

Where I grew up in New Jersey, there was extreme territoriality over tiny boroughs whose only distinguishing factor was that their scant few farmers there in the 1890s had different ideas as to how to use their tax dollars.  A few generations and many subdivisions later, it was as if these 2- and 3-square mile areas were built on distinct sets of principles, each with a special and unique tradition unlike any around it.

In reality, they mostly shared one characteristic–disgust over very, very high property taxes, so high that they helped greatly change the local demographic by flushing out lower- and middle-income folks.  The irony seems lost on people who continue to fight bitterly against the consolidation of  inefficient, duplicative municipal services they can't afford. 

But memory is short in these places, because once people retire they can't afford to stay, and a new batch of suckers takes their place to continue the territorial fight anew.

[roadman65]

Yeah, that is why a lot of people here in Florida from New Jersey.  Heck, my friend lives in Sewaren, NJ and would love to leave New Jersey, but his wife does not want to go.  Otherwise he would be joining me down here.

[NE2]

What did Alps just say?

Please, let's not turn this into a "Fictional Consolidated New Jersey Towns" thread.  You'll get thousands of opinions as to who should merge with who, and it's never going to happen.

Yes, instead, let's discuss what wonderful products we would buy from the NJTA should they acquire a license for their logos.

I don't get how these are not in the public domain.  Is this nonsense some part of the Turnpike being a "quasi-public corporation"? 

Only works of the *federal* government (and a few states) are automatically PD. But given that these were 'published' on the road without a copyright notice for many years before 1989 (when said notice became optional), there's a very good case for their being PD.

But they're also trademarked. I have no idea how this applies to use in situations where endorsement is not implied (e.g. shirts, mugs, bumper stickers).