Major I-70 Closure in Colorado

[kphoger]

If I-70 had been constructed with less attention to preserving the natural environment along the corridor, if its path were more typical rather than a double-decker configuration–I wonder if some other event years ago would have already done this much damage, and people would instead have proposed that it should have been built like ... well, like what it actually is.

Everyone likes to pin the blame for a natural disaster causing damage to manmade infrastructure.  Isn't it also possible that the thing was actually designed and constructed quite well, but that sometimes nature just overcomes our best designs?

[HighwayStar]

If I-70 had been constructed with less attention to preserving the natural environment along the corridor, if its path were more typical rather than a double-decker configuration–I wonder if some other event years ago would have already done this much damage, and people would instead have proposed that it should have been built like ... well, like what it actually is.

Everyone likes to pin the blame for a natural disaster causing damage to manmade infrastructure.  Isn't it also possible that the thing was actually designed and constructed quite well, but that sometimes nature just overcomes our best designs?

Nope, that is not how engineering works. The current design was not built with serving as a corridor in mind so much as minimizing the footprint of the project.  Things that are designed and constructed well don't fail with these kind of consequences.
We need more of Yanosuke Hirai's philosophy in our engineering.

[US 89]

I want to know how many people drive through Glenwood Canyon and rather than marveling at the impressive scenery, instead go "Wow, what terrible engineering, surely this freeway could have been designed to ruin the natural landscape more."

[kphoger]

I want to know how many people drive through Glenwood Canyon and rather than marveling at the impressive scenery ...

The second-to-last time I drove through Glenwood Canyon, I didn't marvel at the scenery.

It was about midnight at the time...

[triplemultiplex]

Man, that video was impressive.  It would have probably looked cool spilling over that cliff portion way up the slide path. 
Glenwood Canyon is always going to be one of those places we humans wrestle with the elements to keep a transportation link open.  Just like I-40 on the NC/TN border.  Only hyper-expensive tunnels would provide a permanent solution.

And my suspicion proved correct, the failure occurred over a portion built in that ridiculous double deck configuration.

I don't see how the configuration of the roadway is relevant. The mass movement event would have taken out any highway.

[HighwayStar]

Man, that video was impressive.  It would have probably looked cool spilling over that cliff portion way up the slide path. 
Glenwood Canyon is always going to be one of those places we humans wrestle with the elements to keep a transportation link open.  Just like I-40 on the NC/TN border.  Only hyper-expensive tunnels would provide a permanent solution.

And my suspicion proved correct, the failure occurred over a portion built in that ridiculous double deck configuration.

I don't see how the configuration of the roadway is relevant. The mass movement event would have taken out any highway.

"The mass movement event would have taken out any highway."
False. It would have taken out any highway that was not built with high standards of engineering. A properly built highway, with a wider right of way and no viaducts, would have held.

[hbelkins]

Man, that video was impressive.  It would have probably looked cool spilling over that cliff portion way up the slide path. 
Glenwood Canyon is always going to be one of those places we humans wrestle with the elements to keep a transportation link open.  Just like I-40 on the NC/TN border.  Only hyper-expensive tunnels would provide a permanent solution.

And my suspicion proved correct, the failure occurred over a portion built in that ridiculous double deck configuration.

I don't see how the configuration of the roadway is relevant. The mass movement event would have taken out any highway.

"The mass movement event would have taken out any highway."
False. It would have taken out any highway that was not built with high standards of engineering. A properly built highway, with a wider right of way and no viaducts, would have held.

Looked to me like the upper deck got covered in debris and the lower deck had some pavement washed away. It certainly didn't knock the viaduct off its piers the way that truck impact did the bridge on I-16 in Georgia recently.

And I'd be willing to bet a good chunk of money that this road was designed with the highest engineering standards. This wasn't some hastily-thrown-together plan. It's not like a typical cross section that can be built using standard drawings.

[Scott5114]

Build a highway with the highest engineering standards possible.

Dump several thousand tons of shit on it, making it impassible.

Someone on the internet criticizes your engineering standards for somehow not keeping the road open even though there's several thousand tons of shit on it.

[zzcarp]

I-70 wouldn't have been constructed through the canyon with any less attention to preserving the natural environment, period. The Aspenites/environmentalists/John Denver fought tooth and nail against even constructing the reduced footprint I-70 (which was, for the most part, built over or adjacent to the previous US 6 alignment). It took at least twenty-eight years of studies, planning, and civil engineering innovations to get the freeway constructed at all. And, for the most part, it has functioned well.

Where the failure is in my view is the lack of planning for redundancy in the system. There simply aren't good parallel routes (especially for commercial traffic).

Long haul truckers can avoid the closure using I-80. But the western slope is supplied by Denver, and severing that link is causing the supply chain to break. Truckers could travel from Denver to Grand Junction and back in one day before the closures. Adding the three hours (minimum) detour and it becomes a two day trip due to federal limitations on length of driving days for truckers. Add to that the general truck driver shortage and you have a perfect storm of problems causing supply shortages from fuel to food on the western slope.

[hbelkins]

I traveled westbound on that segment in 1991. It was before the freeway was constructed, but I don't have much memory of what it was like.

My Amtrak trip a few years ago was supposed to go through that area in the daylight, but because of the holdup in Omaha, it was pitch black dark when we went through, so I didn't get to see the canyon. I'm hoping they can get it opened by later this month but I'm not really too optimistic.

Which direction provides the best views, eastbound or westbound?

[kphoger]

Which direction provides the best views, eastbound or westbound?

It depends on what you want.  If you want to see the scenery, then travel the upper deck.  If you enjoy seeing the viaduct as part of the scenery, then travel the lower deck.  Personally, I prefer the lower deck.

[triplemultiplex]

"The mass movement event would have taken out any highway."
False. It would have taken out any highway that was not built with high standards of engineering. A properly built highway, with a wider right of way and no viaducts, would have held.

Trying to envision the amount of right of way needed to divert that volume of material in that type of steep terrain.
Perhaps you should elaborate on your vision of a 'properly engineered' Glenwood Canyon Freeway.

[Flint1979]

That's one area of I-70 where US-40 isn't useful as an alternate route.

[cpzilliacus]

Which direction provides the best views, eastbound or westbound?

IMO eastbound - but - ideally starting from as far west as you can, like perhaps Green River in Utah (and it will take several hours from there to the tunnel complex at the Continental Divide).  That is probably 5 hours if the freeway is not blocked through Glenwood Canyon as it is now.

[JayhawkCO]

That's one area of I-70 where US-40 isn't useful as an alternate route.

I mean, part of it IS the alternate route recommended by CDOT right now.  Still way the hell out of the way, but I digress.

Chris

[cpzilliacus]

Closure information from CDOT:

https://twitter.com/ColoradoDOT/status/1421978755170410501

(8/1) I-70 through Glenwood Canyon will continue to be closed due to extreme damage from the latest round of flooding Saturday night (7/31). Motorists advised to take northern alternate route (see map), and trucks traveling through take I-80. Go to COtrip.org.

[thenetwork]

There is a lot of traffic now using US-50 now that they suspended work in the major construction area east of Montrose.  It looks like US-40 and US-50 is evenly splitting up I-70 traffic as I have been on both this week as well as traveling on CO-82 East of Aspen.  Despite 82 being the shortest mileage detour along marked routes, I would NOT recommend it if you are unfamiliar with mountain driving conditions. 

Eastbound, its likely more people are using US-50 as a detour as there is about the same amount of 4-lane mileage to Montrose as there is staying on I-70 to Rifle (+/‐ 60 miles), albeit at slightly slower speeds.

[hbelkins]

"The mass movement event would have taken out any highway."
False. It would have taken out any highway that was not built with high standards of engineering. A properly built highway, with a wider right of way and no viaducts, would have held.

Trying to envision the amount of right of way needed to divert that volume of material in that type of steep terrain.
Perhaps you should elaborate on your vision of a 'properly engineered' Glenwood Canyon Freeway.

Given the amount of natural soil and rock that washed down, I hate to think how a waste area resulting from massive blasting for a different style of route would have held up.

[Flint1979]

That's one area of I-70 where US-40 isn't useful as an alternate route.

I mean, part of it IS the alternate route recommended by CDOT right now.  Still way the hell out of the way, but I digress.

Chris

It's turned about an hour drive into about a four hour drive. US-40 is like 60 miles north of I-70 in that area that's the bad thing about trying to navigate around it.

[HighwayStar]

"The mass movement event would have taken out any highway."
False. It would have taken out any highway that was not built with high standards of engineering. A properly built highway, with a wider right of way and no viaducts, would have held.

Trying to envision the amount of right of way needed to divert that volume of material in that type of steep terrain.
Perhaps you should elaborate on your vision of a 'properly engineered' Glenwood Canyon Freeway.

Given the amount of natural soil and rock that washed down, I hate to think how a waste area resulting from massive blasting for a different style of route would have held up.

Well obviously you would not put that in the damn gully.

[ClassicHasClass]

That's one area of I-70 where US-40 isn't useful as an alternate route.

It's because it's basically replacing US 6 there.

[hbelkins]

"The mass movement event would have taken out any highway."
False. It would have taken out any highway that was not built with high standards of engineering. A properly built highway, with a wider right of way and no viaducts, would have held.

Trying to envision the amount of right of way needed to divert that volume of material in that type of steep terrain.
Perhaps you should elaborate on your vision of a 'properly engineered' Glenwood Canyon Freeway.

Given the amount of natural soil and rock that washed down, I hate to think how a waste area resulting from massive blasting for a different style of route would have held up.

Well obviously you would not put that in the damn gully.

Two things:

1.) -- Usually that is exactly where waste areas go. They fill in gullies, gulches, and gaps between hills/mountains, etc., with the blasting and excavation debris ("excess yardage") that isn't used for roadway fill elsewhere.

2.) -- Even if they hadn't filed in that particular gully, they might have used another for the waste area that could have washed down onto the road.

[renegade]

Well obviously you would not put that in the damn gully.

You sure aren't going to build it along the ridge, either.  Do you have another idea?

[ilpt4u]

Well obviously you would not put that in the damn gully.

You sure aren't going to build it along the ridge, either.  Do you have another idea?

Clearly, the answer is thru/under the mountain, with lots of $$$$$$$$$$ attached to achieve such a feat

Full Disclosure: I have not traveled on I-70 in Colorado, except maybe a little in Downtown Denver - never out in the mountains, certainly

[Kniwt]

CBS Denver reports that a Greyhound bus with 21 passengers aboard tried to use one of the unpaved alternates ... and, of course, got stuck.
https://denver.cbslocal.com/2021/08/07/greyhound-bus-garfield-county-stuck-road/

A Greyhound bus driver found themselves and 21 passengers in a tough, and potentially dangerous, situation on Friday night at around 6 p.m. As a way to get around the ongoing Interstate 70 closure, the driver drove on Coffee Pot Springs Road and later got stuck.

The Garfield County Sheriff's Office says the dirt and gravel road is used to access the White River National Forest. They say four-wheel and all-terrain vehicles use the road.

... First responders and two transport vans drove to the bus which was about 22 miles up the road. Officials say one of the passengers was an older woman with heart conditions.

As a storm threatened their rescue, crews managed to get everyone and their luggage back down to Interstate 70 about six hours later.

"Catastrophe was avoided this time. Travelers are advised not to follow GPS mapping in an attempt to circumvent the I-70 closure through Glenwood Canyon. Backcountry roads are unpredictable and can be treacherous or deadly for the unprepared traveler,"  the sheriff's office stated in a news release on Saturday.

Forest Service page for Coffee Pot Springs Road: https://www.fs.usda.gov/recarea/whiteriver/recarea/?recid=41263

Coffee Pot Road #600 is an improved gravel road that winds its way from the Deep Creek confluence with the Colorado River, up the south edge of the Flattops for about 30 miles to Deep Lake. It offers beautiful scenery and views. The first 10 miles of this road is exceptionally windy and narrow. Defensive driving is a must due to the drop-off edges, sharp blind curves and parts of the road not wide enough to accommodate two vehicles.