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Ohio

Started by iBallasticwolf2, August 29, 2015, 08:18:14 PM

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SkyPesos

Anyone know what these blue mile markers on the WB US 50 trumpet ramp off the Ohio River bridge onto the concurrency with OH 7/32 is for? It's in the Mile 5 range, which is strange as I'm pretty sure that US 50 is in the MM 200s at that point. Also it's posted every 0.1 mile on a ramp; ODOT normally does neither of those things with the blue mile markers, with the exception of 0.1 intervals in the Cincinnati area.


okroads

Quote from: SkyPesos on May 20, 2021, 09:16:35 AM
Anyone know what these blue mile markers on the WB US 50 trumpet ramp off the Ohio River bridge onto the concurrency with OH 7/32 is for? It's in the Mile 5 range, which is strange as I'm pretty sure that US 50 is in the MM 200s at that point. Also it's posted every 0.1 mile on a ramp; ODOT normally does neither of those things with the blue mile markers, with the exception of 0.1 intervals in the Cincinnati area.

That is based off of US 50's mileage in Washington County only instead of the entire state.

GCrites

Like the old white square signs you used to see on state routes. Used to use those to count down how long it would take to get somewhere when I was bored in the car as a kid.

Hot Rod Hootenanny

So, ODOT has put up an online survey concerning traveling US 23 in Delaware County.
https://publicinput.com/23connect?fbclid=IwAR2hTcA41UnsdrJwHo5bWofS0LvRI40WEmvuJFxAZb4f66Zg2C_iNeiRG7k
Be honest, or skew the results (surfing isn't getting enough love from ODOT).
Please, don't sue Alex & Andy over what I wrote above

SkyPesos

I'm not sure how seriously ODOT takes the agrees on the comments, but this one worded my suggestion pretty well.


chaparral

Are there any plans to improve the Toledo to Columbus route? I 75 - US 68/OH 15 - US 23 works well until about Waldo, and then it all goes straight down the drain. A Super-2 from Waldo to a new I 71 exit at OH 521 would definitely improve matters, but for long-distance travelers it would be even better to run it through New Albany to I-70 or even all the way down to US 33 at Canal Winchester.

SkyPesos

Quote from: chaparral on May 21, 2021, 04:25:59 PM
Are there any plans to improve the Toledo to Columbus route? I 75 - US 68/OH 15 - US 23 works well until about Waldo, and then it all goes straight down the drain. A Super-2 from Waldo to a new I 71 exit at OH 521 would definitely improve matters, but for long-distance travelers it would be even better to run it through New Albany to I-70 or even all the way down to US 33 at Canal Winchester.
That is what the survey linked above is about.

tigerwings


SkyPesos

Quote from: okroads on May 20, 2021, 12:04:59 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on May 20, 2021, 09:16:35 AM
Anyone know what these blue mile markers on the WB US 50 trumpet ramp off the Ohio River bridge onto the concurrency with OH 7/32 is for? It's in the Mile 5 range, which is strange as I'm pretty sure that US 50 is in the MM 200s at that point. Also it's posted every 0.1 mile on a ramp; ODOT normally does neither of those things with the blue mile markers, with the exception of 0.1 intervals in the Cincinnati area.

That is based off of US 50's mileage in Washington County only instead of the entire state.
Considering that those are the new mile markers with the wider width, and full cardinal direction name instead of an abbreviation, installed sometime in the last 8 years, kind of surprising that they still went with county based mile markers at that point. When OH 126 got its mile markers replaced, it switched from county mile markers starting at the Butler-Hamilton line to the state line at IN.

EDIT: Actually, OH 126's mile markers history is interesting.
- Old style mile marker (2015), MM 19 (County-based)
- New style mile marker (2016), MM 19 (County-based)
- New style mile marker (2017), MM 32 (State-based)
So the second one lasted for less than a year, before it was replaced by a similar one with mileage from the state line.

okroads

Quote from: SkyPesos on May 22, 2021, 12:38:28 AM
Quote from: okroads on May 20, 2021, 12:04:59 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on May 20, 2021, 09:16:35 AM
Anyone know what these blue mile markers on the WB US 50 trumpet ramp off the Ohio River bridge onto the concurrency with OH 7/32 is for? It's in the Mile 5 range, which is strange as I'm pretty sure that US 50 is in the MM 200s at that point. Also it's posted every 0.1 mile on a ramp; ODOT normally does neither of those things with the blue mile markers, with the exception of 0.1 intervals in the Cincinnati area.

That is based off of US 50's mileage in Washington County only instead of the entire state.
Considering that those are the new mile markers with the wider width, and full cardinal direction name instead of an abbreviation, installed sometime in the last 8 years, kind of surprising that they still went with county based mile markers at that point. When OH 126 got its mile markers replaced, it switched from county mile markers starting at the Butler-Hamilton line to the state line at IN.

EDIT: Actually, OH 126's mile markers history is interesting.
- Old style mile marker (2015), MM 19 (County-based)
- New style mile marker (2016), MM 19 (County-based)
- New style mile marker (2017), MM 32 (State-based)
So the second one lasted for less than a year, before it was replaced by a similar one with mileage from the state line.

It is surprising considering recent trends but there is another similar situation. US 68 in Clark County (near Springfield) had exit numbers added last year, but the numbers were based on the county's mileage instead of US 68's overall Ohio mileage.

TempoNick

Mile markers start counting from the southern or western terminus of a road. At least when it comes to the interstate markers, a more valuable number would be something telling you how many more miles you have to go to the eastern or northern terminus. Maybe the top can say Mile X and the bottom miles to the other terminus number can show a negative number or an omega symbol or something like that.

When I'm driving, I always like to know how much longer I have until I get to the next state and I can only do that going westbound or southbound.

TempoNick

Quote from: SkyPesos on April 26, 2021, 07:06:22 PM
Crossposted from the Ranking State Border Crossings thread. Either ODOT made an error below, or Wintersville/Steubenville really is a much larger city than I initially thought.
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 26, 2021, 02:28:05 PM
Quote from: webny99 on April 26, 2021, 01:06:22 PM
I'm not sure about using volume data to rank the crossings. It makes sense to a certain extent, but then you have cases like NY 303 at the NJ line being almost twice as busy as I-86 at the PA line. Yet no one would argue that NY 303 is the more important crossing.
The numbers I got for Ohio are mostly reasonable, so I went with it. Most used crossings at major metro areas like Cincinnati and Toledo. Most interstates are above 4 lane US routes. The only one that's puzzling to me is US 22's 32k AADT at the WV border. US 22 is a freeway at that point, but Steubenville isn't that large of a city, and the 4 lane section dead ends at Cadiz on the Ohio side, though continues all the way as a 4 lane to I-376 on the east. The AADT number would've made more sense to me if it connected to I-70 at Cambridge as a freeway, as that would make a neat Columbus-Pittsburgh freeway corridor, except it doesn't.

2019 AADT of US 22 from Cambridge to WV Border
East of I-77 junction - 5.8k
Concurrency with OH 800 - 2.8k
West of US 250 junctions - 3k
Concurrency with US 250 - 8.5k
East of US 250 junctions - 8.7k
Concurrency with OH 151 - 10.5k
East of OH 151 eastern junction - 11.4k
East of OH 152 junction - 10k
West of OH 43 junction - 10.2k
East of OH 43 junction - 15.8k
West of John Scott Hwy junction - 18k
Between John Scott Hwy and OH 7 - 29k
Concurrency with OH 7 - 33.8k
WV Border - 32k

Actually, a lot of the local roads numbers near Steubenville seem high too, even with 2020 numbers. Especially the 20k on OH 43. Most of the busiest arterials in Cincinnati and Columbus don't even reach that high.


So roughly 150,000 cars a day cross state borders in that part of the state. That's a lot.

skluth

Quote from: TempoNick on May 24, 2021, 05:09:51 PM
Mile markers start counting from the southern or western terminus of a road. At least when it comes to the interstate markers, a more valuable number would be something telling you how many more miles you have to go to the eastern or northern terminus. Maybe the top can say Mile X and the bottom miles to the other terminus number can show a negative number or an omega symbol or something like that.

When I'm driving, I always like to know how much longer I have until I get to the next state and I can only do that going westbound or southbound.

Your preference is from your personal driving situation. When I lived in St Louis, I did know how many more miles I needed to get home as I crossed Illinois on I-55, I-64, and I-70. Mile markers from the other direction may matter to you but that's more a function of your location than anything. XY coordinates traditionally start in the lower left or southwest corner. Unless you learned to draw coordinates in junior high using graph paper different from the rest of us.

thenetwork

Quote from: TempoNick on May 24, 2021, 05:09:51 PM
Mile markers start counting from the southern or western terminus of a road. At least when it comes to the interstate markers, a more valuable number would be something telling you how many more miles you have to go to the eastern or northern terminus. Maybe the top can say Mile X and the bottom miles to the other terminus number can show a negative number or an omega symbol or something like that.

US-491 in Utah bucks that trend (despite listing it as a N/S route), but at least US-491 in Colorado follows the proper mileage markings.

PurdueBill

Quote from: thenetwork on May 31, 2021, 07:21:11 PM
US-491 in Utah bucks that trend (despite listing it as a N/S route), but at least US-491 in Colorado follows the proper mileage markings.

Is that from its origin as US 666?  Utah did have 491 posted east-west but changed it to north-south like the rest of the route in other states.  The western end became the northern end (so in theory all the mile markers would have to be moved so 0 is at the Colorado line instead of at the US 191 intersection).

In Ohio, I-680 is a notable route that has mileage increasing as you go south; it was done so that Mile 0 was at I-80, its parent.  As you go south away from I-80, the mile markers increase--an exception but reasonable.

TempoNick

Quote from: skluth on May 31, 2021, 01:19:30 PM

Your preference is from your personal driving situation. When I lived in St Louis, I did know how many more miles I needed to get home as I crossed Illinois on I-55, I-64, and I-70. Mile markers from the other direction may matter to you but that's more a function of your location than anything. XY coordinates traditionally start in the lower left or southwest corner. Unless you learned to draw coordinates in junior high using graph paper different from the rest of us.

In other words, even though they could be useful in the opposite direction (when they currently aren't) you don't to change them for no reason other than to be a jerk? Great reason.

skluth

Quote from: TempoNick on June 01, 2021, 12:51:58 AM
Quote from: skluth on May 31, 2021, 01:19:30 PM

Your preference is from your personal driving situation. When I lived in St Louis, I did know how many more miles I needed to get home as I crossed Illinois on I-55, I-64, and I-70. Mile markers from the other direction may matter to you but that's more a function of your location than anything. XY coordinates traditionally start in the lower left or southwest corner. Unless you learned to draw coordinates in junior high using graph paper different from the rest of us.

In other words, even though they could be useful in the opposite direction (when they currently aren't) you don't to change them for no reason other than to be a jerk? Great reason.

No. It's about standardization. States only want one set of mile markers and the standard location for the starting point is the lower left or SW corner. That it's inconvenient for you personally is just a function of the system. I had the same issue as you on Missouri interstates when I was driving across Missouri back to St Louis. It's immature to call someone a jerk just for explaining the system and you not liking the answer.

Buck87

I've noticed that Scioto County has gone to the standard blue pentagon for their county route signs. Gone are the unique orange, black and white county outline signs that I really liked. 

LM-Q620


GCrites

I'm sure this has been covered before, but why are county roads in some counties all named (such as in Franklin and Pickaway Counties) with possibly a county road number added to the end of the name blade but other counties e.g. in Appalachian Ohio only given numbers and get only numbered County Road/Route signs. In addition, county roads in these areas are given "secret names" that aren't much of a secret to locals. And if they do get official names they have both the first and last names of the person (especially present in District 9). It would make more sense if this was all the same at the state level like in WV... well sort of, since WV has state split routes rather than county roads. I know that some ODOT districts do things differently than others but these are county things. Is it just traditional/vernacular?

Bitmapped

Quote from: GCrites80s on June 01, 2021, 09:14:22 PM
I'm sure this has been covered before, but why are county roads in some counties all named (such as in Franklin and Pickaway Counties) with possibly a county road number added to the end of the name blade but other counties e.g. in Appalachian Ohio only given numbers and get only numbered County Road/Route signs. In addition, county roads in these areas are given "secret names" that aren't much of a secret to locals. And if they do get official names they have both the first and last names of the person (especially present in District 9). It would make more sense if this was all the same at the state level like in WV... well sort of, since WV has state split routes rather than county roads. I know that some ODOT districts do things differently than others but these are county things. Is it just traditional/vernacular?

There are two things in play here - whether the road has a name or just a number, and how they are signed. My experience has been that in NW Ohio, many counties have just numbers. (Some, like Seneca, had names previously but ditched them in favor of numbers.) In the most of the rest of the state, including Appalachia, there are normally names and numbers. This is a county-level decision.

Different counties have their own styles for signing their road names and numbers, both in terms of shields and blades, on their own signage. Stark County, until about a decade ago, only signed names. Since then, they've started adding some blue pentagon shields at intersections.  Some poorer area, like Monroe County, historically only used shields even though their routes had numbers, but with the advent of E911, you generally see road name blades as well.

ODOT's own signage practices for intersections along 4-lane divided highways tends to vary. Historically, they would just say County Road XX or Township Road XX. In the last 20 years, it's tended to flip more towards Road Name or Road Name XX on signage, but that's not entirely consistent. It seems to vary on age of signage and district.

GCrites

Quote from: Bitmapped on June 06, 2021, 11:33:03 AM

Different counties have their own styles for signing their road names and numbers, both in terms of shields and blades, on their own signage. Stark County, until about a decade ago, only signed names. Since then, they've started adding some blue pentagon shields at intersections.  Some poorer area, like Monroe County, historically only used shields even though their routes had numbers, but with the advent of E911, you generally see road name blades as well.


Monroe County is another one of those where on older maps and signs there was just a route number that the locals seldom used since they knew the "secret name" of the road. So when sign blades were added and address numbers given (instead of RR#2 or whatever, that was my grandparents' old address before 911) the names the locals used were put on the blades. Even though 911 happened around the late '80s there, it would take some time before all the named sign blades were in place... late '90s or even later. Like for example, I never knew Pfalzgraf Ridge Road (https://www.google.com/maps/place/Township+Hwy+156,+Adams+Township,+OH/@39.7593671,-81.002311,16z/data=!4m5!3m4!1s0x88361ad094d16e07:0xf9a5295a1e8389a3!8m2!3d39.7614249!4d-80.995745) was called that until a visit in 2007 since it just had a route number before that. You can't enter the name in to Google maps. You have to use the Township Highway number (156) but Maps will display the name on the map. That's my middle name so of course I found it interesting. It was certainly named after a relative.

Harvestman

It appears that, back when Marge Schott roamed the earth, these signs near Cincinnati's Western Hills Viaduct had some extra shields that were removed over time.  Anyone happen to know what they were?



SkyPesos

Those look old enough that it was probably there when US 25 existed in Ohio. Though US 25 was mostly concurrent with US 42 up to Sharonville, where it split on the left to continue on Reading Rd, eventually becoming Cincinnati-Dayton Rd.

Hot Rod Hootenanny

Quote from: Harvestman on June 11, 2021, 11:42:07 PM
It appears that, back when Marge Schott roamed the earth, these signs near Cincinnati's Western Hills Viaduct had some extra shields that were removed over time.  Anyone happen to know what they were?

Oh 4, US 52, US 27, or US 127 (babe!). All of them are (were) routed near I-75 in that area.
Please, don't sue Alex & Andy over what I wrote above

westerninterloper

Quote from: Harvestman on June 11, 2021, 11:42:07 PM
It appears that, back when Marge Schott roamed the earth, these signs near Cincinnati's Western Hills Viaduct had some extra shields that were removed over time.  Anyone happen to know what they were?




There are similar-era signs in West Toledo, with the shields removed, where US 23, 24 and 25 converged then branched off into Michigan.
Nostalgia: Indiana's State Religion



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