Third Infantry Division Highway ("I-3")

[Buummu]

I am sorry, but I dont want I-3 built... if they want I-3 built.. they should have done that somewhere in the Western U.S. or somewhere in Florida... this does not line up. Besides the U.S. routes are mostly 4 laned...


However, i do support I-77 extension to I-75

[Alps]

I am sorry, but I dont want I-3 built... if they want I-3 built.. they should have done that somewhere in the Western U.S. or somewhere in Florida... this does not line up. Besides the U.S. routes are mostly 4 laned...


However, i do support I-77 extension to I-75

You've violated several rules with that post, not the least being that I-3 would never be in Florida. Think about it. Also note that the Third Infantry Division Highway is not being called I-3 in these posts. If it were built, it could well be I-18.

[Daniel Fiddler]

I personally oppose I - 3, both the designation and the route north of Augusta.  I can only think of two routes north of Augusta I'd support:

(1) North to Lavonia, then following my proposal for I - 24 east extension to Chatsworth, then following near US 411 to Maryville then US 129 to Knoxville

(2) Northeast to Greenville and then Fletcher, then multiplexing with I - 26 and I - 40.

I oppose this highway for three reasons:

(1)  Impact on the Great Smoky Mountains National Park on some of the proposed routes

(2) the fact it does not fit the grid (I - 3 makes absolutely no sense)

(3) the reason they are choosing I - 3 is to basically glorify the Iraq war, which is a war I never did approve of us going into.  I'd MUCH rather the interstate be named for Dale Earnhardt than some military division involved in the Iraq war.

Personally, of these, I like the Greenville and Fletcher route best north of Augusta.  The segments from Augusta to Lavonia and from Chatsworth to Maryville don't seem like they'd have much traffic.  (The Lavonia to Chatsworth and Maryville to Knoxville however would).  Name it something SENSIBLE, if no 2DI's exist, make it a 3DI, it's not THAT long that it requires a 2DI.  Or make it two 3DI's.  Or name it the _________ Turnpike, and make it toll.  Personally, I'd name the section south of Augusta I - 77 (multiplexing I -20 with I - 77), and name the section to Fletcher I - 520

[froggie]

I can think of a fourth:

(4) No real documented need for an Interstate in this corridor.

BTW, Daniel, regarding your #3:  you (and numerous others) may well be against the Iraq War.  But the 3rd Infantry Division has a long and storied history dating back to WW1, with numerous actions in the European Theater during WW2.

[Grzrd]

The EWG has posted its costing estimates:

http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/planning/section_1927/3rd_infantry_highway/expert_working_group/fourth_meeting_minutes.cfm

Of interest, they included a no-build, signage only option that would cost less than $500,000.  The interstate-class estimates for the various routes range from $4.2 billion to $6.1 billion.

Here's a link to descriptions of the corridors: http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/planning/section_1927/3rd_infantry_highway/design_levels/dl04.cfm#ca

Here's a Savannah newspaper's report on the study:

http://savannahnow.com/news/2011-05-17/new-savannah-knoxville-highway-think-decades-and-billions

No real documented need for an Interstate in this corridor.

... [John] Mettille, project manager for ICF International, was the highway administration's chief spokesman during the briefing.
He stressed that, so far, the study team has not even identified a need for the project or any way to pay for it ....

I can even agree to a new Savannah - Augusta interstate.

Also, GDOT does not appear too interested ... EXCEPT for the Savannah-Augusta segment:

Last year, Georgia's Department of Transportation, which has trouble funding even the top of its wish list, said it didn't consider the proposal a high priority.
Stephanie Mayfield, a spokeswoman for Gov. Nathan Deal, noted his support for a $140 million road project to speed up trucking of cargo in and out of the port.
"In these tough budget times,"  she added, "we have limited options for building new infrastructure, but the Savannah-to-Augusta portion ... enjoys support in both cities and offers a logical route for commerce and travelers."

[Daniel Fiddler]

I can agree to a signage only option.  I can even agree to a new Savannah - Augusta interstate.

[hbelkins]

This just happens to be another idea from the Watson Bros., by the way.

Who are the Watson Bros.?

BTW, I was scanning thru channels on XM on my way to work this morning and caught a blurb on the RoadDog Trucking channel about this proposed Knoxville-to-Port of Savannah route, but darned if I can't remember what it was they said about it.

[english si]

Would SC be interested in an Interstate from Clinton (I-26/I-385 sort of area) to Augusta to extend it to somewhere where Knoxville is easily got to?

[Lyle]

I think an Interstate-grade highway between Savannah and Augusta would be a great idea. I have relatives who often travel between Southeast Florida and Augusta for business, and I believe a highway like this would be very useful for them. They currently go through South Carolina!

[NE2]

Tell your relatives to use the Savannah River Parkway: http://www.dot.state.ga.us/informationcenter/programs/roadimprovement/GRIP/Documents/Facts/SavannahRiverParkwayFactSheet.pdf

[wriddle082]

Tell your relatives to use the Savannah River Parkway: http://www.dot.state.ga.us/informationcenter/programs/roadimprovement/GRIP/Documents/Facts/SavannahRiverParkwayFactSheet.pdf

A few drawbacks to the Savannah River Pkwy. as it stands now:

* Traffic lights between Garden City/Port of Savannah area and I-95 really tie up traffic during rush hour
* Very few, if any, grade separations with other major US or state routes
* Maximum speed limit on pretty much all of the roadway is 55, and that's something I've noticed about GA lately; I've only been on maybe (2) rural four lane highways with speed limits set at 65 (US 1 between Blythe and Wrens, and US 84 between Jesup and Ludowici)

Of course the Garden City traffic lights can be avoided by taking I-16 west to US 25 north just south of Statesboro, but that adds a few miles.

[Lyle]

Tell your relatives to use the Savannah River Parkway: http://www.dot.state.ga.us/informationcenter/programs/roadimprovement/GRIP/Documents/Facts/SavannahRiverParkwayFactSheet.pdf

Is the Savannah River Parkway well signed?

[NE2]

As US 25 and SR 21, presumably.

[Grzrd]

EWG has posted Alternative Corridors Suggested By The Public:

http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/planning/section_1927/3rd_infantry_highway/design_levels/altcorridors_lg.cfm

Since we have a lot of active participants in the Fictional Highways forum, I am curious as to whether anyone in this forum suggested any of the posted alternatives?

[Daniel Fiddler]

I personally did not, neither of those routes are what I'd choose, at least not exactly.

I'm in favor of an I - 24 extension from Chattanooga to Myrtle Beach, multiplexing with I - 75 until north of Dalton, then cutting a new route to near Chatsworth, Ellijay, Dahlonega, and Toccoa before multiplexing with I - 85 near Lavonia, then a few miles past Anderson cutting a new route to I - 385, then multiplexing with I - 385 and I - 26 to Columbia, then multiplexing with I - 77 around the south side of the city and then multiplexing with Hwy 378 until near I - 95, then cutting a new route to Myrtle Beach.

I also do support a Savannah - Augusta - Greenville route.  But it does not exactly mirror either of the public's routes.

[Grzrd]

The EWG has submitted its Report to Congress. The Executive Summary states that "fatal flaws" killed the northern portion of Corridor B and entirety of Corridors C and D.

I read through those minutes a bit.  One option, not mentioned yet on this forum but suggested by two people in the working group (including the NCDOT rep) is for a No Build/signage option that would only post signs along the corridor honoring the Third Infantray Division.  Which, when one boils it down, meets the purpose without spending huge amounts of scarce (and about-to-be-scarcer) transportation dollars on a roadway with dubious benefit and likely opposition (especially in the mountains).

Although the EWG did present the "western alternative" to Congress, in reading the Conclusion in the Executive Summary, I think froggie called it that the "signage only" alternative is the only thing, if anything, that will result from this study:

Conclusions
A new or improved corridor between Savannah, Augusta, and Knoxville has not been identified in any State DOT or MPO long-range plan.
A new highway corridor from Savannah to Knoxville would result in significant costs, both financial and environmental. This Southern Appalachian region contains a dense mixture of small mountain communities, sensitive environmental resources, and federally managed lands.
Analysis suggests corridors located farther west face fewer environmental and terrain challenges than corridors located in the center or eastern portions of the Study Area. However, significant resources impacts are likely to result from any alternative.
Numerous members of the public have expressed their opposition to this corridor concept and to other new highways proposed in the region.

There is disappointment in Augusta and disappointment in Savannah.

[NE2]

Yeah, it was pretty obvious that they weren't going to put a high-speed highway across the Smokies on US 129 or US 441.

[bugo]

I also would not mind an associated feasibility study of extending I-77 southward from Columbia to link with the Savannah-Augusta portion of the proposed road.

I'll second that one.  US-321, while it has a high speed limit (55mph), has way too many little towns along it.  Plus this would also help relieve traffic on I-95/I-26 by cutting the distance between Savannah and Columbia in half.

55 is a high speed limit?

[CarolinaPaladin]

I notice much debate about the need for the Third Infantry Division Highway from Savannah, Georgia to Knoxville, Tennessee.

An intrastate freeway in Georgia linking Toccoa, Lavonia, Athens, Augusta, and Savannah is pretty much in the making.

US-25 from Augusta to the South Carolina/North Carolina state line is a boulevard with five grade-separated interchanges in Greenwood, Ware Shoals and above Travelers Rest.  It is an intrastate freeway up from the state line to I-26.

The problem several people have is a new interstate highway going up through northeast Georgia to Knoxville or Chattanooga, Tennessee  Residing in upstate South Carolina, I would welcome any improvements to commute to one of my favorite cities, Chattanooga, without dealing with the Atlanta metropolitan area.    Many in northeast Georgia want to see improvements made, but are blinded by NIMBY mindsets.  Revisiting and reviving the northern arc highway would be beneficial.