Changing Control Cities

[kphoger]

It's not patently false.  Drivers going to Baltimore simply follow signs for Baltimore.  Then they arrive at their destination.

[NWI_Irish96]

If you're at the I-68/I-70 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Baltimore? I-70 East
If you're at the I-70/I-81 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Baltimore? I-70 East
If you're at the I-70/I-270 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Baltimore? I-70 East

That's why Baltimore is signed for I-70 East. Doesn't matter if it goes past Baltimore, ends in Baltimore, or ends before Baltimore. Baltimore traffic takes I-70 East to get there.

[Roadgeekteen]

From a motorist who wants to get somewhere standpoint? Its a disgrace.

That parking lot isn't stopping anyone from getting somewhere.

Yep, there's the summary of this conversation.

And we are done here.

That parking lot isn't stopping anyone from getting somewhere. This is patently false, if you look at where the road was supposed to go its obvious that the parking lot prevents you from going to Baltimore as intended. And the argument that you "could always get there via some other roads" misses the point.

If you're at the I-68/I-70 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Baltimore? I-70 East
If you're at the I-70/I-81 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Baltimore? I-70 East
If you're at the I-70/I-270 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Baltimore? I-70 East

That's why Baltimore is signed for I-70 East. Doesn't matter if it goes past Baltimore, ends in Baltimore, or ends before Baltimore. Baltimore traffic takes I-70 East to get there.

[HighwayStar]

From a motorist who wants to get somewhere standpoint? Its a disgrace.

That parking lot isn't stopping anyone from getting somewhere.

Yep, there's the summary of this conversation.

And we are done here.

That parking lot isn't stopping anyone from getting somewhere. This is patently false, if you look at where the road was supposed to go its obvious that the parking lot prevents you from going to Baltimore as intended. And the argument that you "could always get there via some other roads" misses the point.

If you're at the I-68/I-70 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Baltimore? I-70 East
If you're at the I-70/I-81 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Baltimore? I-70 East
If you're at the I-70/I-270 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Baltimore? I-70 East

That's why Baltimore is signed for I-70 East. Doesn't matter if it goes past Baltimore, ends in Baltimore, or ends before Baltimore. Baltimore traffic takes I-70 East to get there.

If you're at the I-68/I-70 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Baltimore? I-70 East
If you're at the I-70/I-81 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Baltimore? I-70 East
If you're at the I-70/I-270 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Baltimore? I-70 East

What you fail to point out with all of these is that I-70 WILL NOT get you to Baltimore, you will have to use a combination of other routes in order to accomplish that.
If you're at the I-68/I-70 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Harrisburg? I-70 East
If you're at the I-68/I-70 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Washington? I-70 East
But does I-70 actually reach either city? Nope. And it never reaches Baltimore either.
Now we can have a clap.

[Roadgeekteen]

From a motorist who wants to get somewhere standpoint? Its a disgrace.

That parking lot isn't stopping anyone from getting somewhere.

Yep, there's the summary of this conversation.

And we are done here.

That parking lot isn't stopping anyone from getting somewhere. This is patently false, if you look at where the road was supposed to go its obvious that the parking lot prevents you from going to Baltimore as intended. And the argument that you "could always get there via some other roads" misses the point.

If you're at the I-68/I-70 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Baltimore? I-70 East
If you're at the I-70/I-81 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Baltimore? I-70 East
If you're at the I-70/I-270 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Baltimore? I-70 East

That's why Baltimore is signed for I-70 East. Doesn't matter if it goes past Baltimore, ends in Baltimore, or ends before Baltimore. Baltimore traffic takes I-70 East to get there.

If you're at the I-68/I-70 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Baltimore? I-70 East
If you're at the I-70/I-81 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Baltimore? I-70 East
If you're at the I-70/I-270 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Baltimore? I-70 East

What you fail to point out with all of these is that I-70 WILL NOT get you to Baltimore, you will have to use a combination of other routes in order to accomplish that.
If you're at the I-68/I-70 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Harrisburg? I-70 East
If you're at the I-68/I-70 interchange, what's the fastest way to get to Washington? I-70 East
But does I-70 actually reach either city? Nope. And it never reaches Baltimore either.
Now we can have a clap.

Sure, we could sign Washington. In fact, I do think that Washington could be added onto some signs on I-70 west of Fredrick.

[kphoger]

Because, apparently, we can convince people of our arguments by using lots of smileys...

BALTIMORE is perfectly appropriate, even with I-70's strange endpoint.

[nwi_navigator_1181]

I was gonna lay low in this thread, but living near an interstate that takes it a level further than this "argument,"  I gotta throw my two cents in the bag.

I-65 North from Indianapolis to just before its terminus is given Chicago. As many of us here know, I-65 doesn't get anywhere close to Chicago, ending about 20 miles short of the metro area. However, it serves its purpose:

It does feed into interstates that do go into the city, and are appropriately given that city as a control (I-80/94 and I-90). Hell, drivers are warned of this a few miles before the fact.

I-70 IN Baltimore does the same thing. It doesn't reach the control destination, but leads you into interstates that do and are signed appropriately.

I-24 west in Kentucky (St. Louis).
I-15 south in Las Vegas (Los Angeles).
I-355 north in Illinois (Rockford).
I-69 south in northern and central Indiana, for now (Indianapolis).

They all do the same thing that HighwayStar is harping about.

Control cities are used as references , and are not always "end all, be alls."  It's not a "disgrace;"  it's been the rule since well before most of us were born. It may not be in your image, but that's how it works now and will work in the future.

So just chill, "˜til the next episode.

[Roadgeekteen]

I was gonna lay low in this thread, but living near an interstate that takes it a level further than this "argument,"  I gotta throw my two cents in the bag.

I-65 North from Indianapolis to just before its terminus is given Chicago. As many of us here know, I-65 doesn't get anywhere close to Chicago, ending about 20 miles short of the metro area. However, it serves its purpose:

It does feed into interstates that do go into the city, and are appropriately given that city as a control (I-80/94 and I-90). Hell, drivers are warned of this a few miles before the fact.

I-70 IN Baltimore does the same thing. It doesn't reach the control destination, but leads you into interstates that do and are signed appropriately.

I-24 west in Kentucky (St. Louis).
I-15 south in Las Vegas (Los Angeles).
I-355 north in Illinois (Rockford).
I-69 south in northern and central Indiana, for now (Indianapolis).

They all do the same thing that HighwayStar is harping about.

Control cities are used as references , and are not always "end all, be alls."  It's not a "disgrace;"  it's been the rule since well before most of us were born. It may not be in your image, but that's how it works now and will work in the future.

So just chill, "˜til the next episode.

Maybe Highwaystar just doesn't like Park and Rides.

[sprjus4]

Here's another - I-40 doesn't even enter Wilmington, NC. It dumps you onto US-117 north of the city.

[Scott5114]

I can't believe that, for once, I'm actually hoping for NE2 to show up and make a irreverent shitpost that derails the discussion at hand.

[hotdogPi]

I can't believe that, for once, I'm actually hoping for NE2 to show up and make a irreverent shitpost that derails the discussion at hand.

I once tried to lock a thread by mentioning DST. (Due to hostile feedback, I'm not doing it again.)

[jmacswimmer]

Sure, we could sign Washington. In fact, I do think that Washington could be added onto some signs on I-70 west of Frederick.

It already is in several locations:

-Breezewood: PennDOT lists both Bmore & DC on the signs above the great intersection. PTC signage used to list both, but after recent sign replacements only Bmore is listed on the main signs with DC relegated to an auxiliary ground-mounted sign.

-Between Hagerstown & Frederick, EB post-interchange mileage signs use a local town at the next exit on top, Frederick in the middle, and alternate between Bmore & DC on the bottom. (EDIT: And here's one with both Bmore & DC!)

-At exit 48 (signed as the main EB Frederick exit despite no longer being the fastest way to downtown), the pull-thru for 70 lists both Bmore & DC.

[NWI_Irish96]

What you fail to point out with all of these is that I-70 WILL NOT get you to Baltimore, you will have to use a combination of other routes in order to accomplish that.

That doesn't matter. Baltimore is a common destination for people in central Maryland. I-70 East is the road they get on to go toward Baltimore. Then you have those other routes signed for Baltimore to get people the rest of the way.

When EB I-70 splits with US 40 at Albeth Heights, signing I-70 for Woodlawn and US 40 for Baltimore because US 40 goes there and Baltimore doesn't would lead to a lot of people wasting time taking a surface road all the way into Baltimore from there.

[Roadgeekteen]

Sure, we could sign Washington. In fact, I do think that Washington could be added onto some signs on I-70 west of Frederick.

It already is in several locations:

-Breezewood: PennDOT lists both Bmore & DC on the signs above the great intersection. PTC signage used to list both, but after recent sign replacements only Bmore is listed on the main signs with DC relegated to an auxiliary ground-mounted sign.

-Between Hagerstown & Frederick, EB post-interchange mileage signs use a local town at the next exit on top, Frederick in the middle, and alternate between Bmore & DC on the bottom.

-At exit 48 (signed as the main EB Frederick exit despite no longer being the fastest way to downtown), the pull-thru for 70 lists both Bmore & DC.

(Will edit in some GMSV links later)

Yes, I think DC should be on signs with two control cities. And I-70 doesn't even enter metro DC.

[Scott5114]

I can't believe that, for once, I'm actually hoping for NE2 to show up and make a irreverent shitpost that derails the discussion at hand.

I once tried to lock a thread by mentioning DST. (Due to hostile feedback, I'm not doing it again.)

That's one for the ol' admin toolbox.

[SkyPesos]

I can't believe that, for once, I'm actually hoping for NE2 to show up and make a irreverent shitpost that derails the discussion at hand.

I once tried to lock a thread by mentioning DST. (Due to hostile feedback, I'm not doing it again.)

That's one for the ol' admin toolbox.

The 'Remove Topic' button may be worth pressing at this point as we've been stuck on the Baltimore topic since page 2 of the thread. We're now on page 5, and I'm not sure if we'll move on from it.

[webny99]

... we've been stuck on the Baltimore topic since page 2 of the thread, and we're now on page 5.

Page 5 for us, but page 10 for most users. 

[Roadgeekteen]

I can't believe that, for once, I'm actually hoping for NE2 to show up and make a irreverent shitpost that derails the discussion at hand.

I once tried to lock a thread by mentioning DST. (Due to hostile feedback, I'm not doing it again.)

That's one for the ol' admin toolbox.

The 'Remove Topic' button may be worth pressing at this point as we've been stuck on the Baltimore topic since page 2 of the thread. We're now on page 5, and I'm not sure if we'll move on from it.

Some people have tried to get back on topic, and we should. We just need Highwaystar to go away or for us to start ignoring him. Also, I don't like when topics are removed as it's interesting to read old AAroads posts that were drama-filled.

[nwi_navigator_1181]

I-65 south in Kentucky does vary from exit to exit between Bowling Green and Nashville once you get past Elizabethtown. They even do it on the distance signs (Nashville falls off until you get within 20 miles or so of Bowling Green).

I-80 west goes from Chicago (on the Ohio Turnpike/ITR), to Des Moines (leaving the Indiana Toll Road in Lake Station), back to Chicago (because of its multiplex with I-94), then finally to the more vague Iowa until crossing the Mississippi River and getting the Des Moines control back. This doesn't even include the Illinois practice of assigning secondary controls on the non-interstate interchanges.

[empirestate]

I can't believe that, for once, I'm actually hoping for NE2 to show up and make a irreverent shitpost that derails the discussion at hand.

I once tried to lock a thread by mentioning DST. (Due to hostile feedback, I'm not doing it again.)

That's one for the ol' admin toolbox.

The 'Remove Topic' button may be worth pressing at this point as we've been stuck on the Baltimore topic since page 2 of the thread. We're now on page 5, and I'm not sure if we'll move on from it.

Some people have tried to get back on topic, and we should. We just need Highwaystar to go away or for us to start ignoring him. Also, I don't like when topics are removed as it's interesting to read old AAroads posts that were drama-filled.

Generally, it's considered very bad form to resurrect a ten-year old thread anyway, especially if you haven't contributed anything substantially new. I'm not entirely sure where that convention comes from, as it doesn't seem to really hurt anything, but I am a bit surprised it hasn't yet been invoked as a reason to kill this one.

[HighwayStar]

I can't believe that, for once, I'm actually hoping for NE2 to show up and make a irreverent shitpost that derails the discussion at hand.

I once tried to lock a thread by mentioning DST. (Due to hostile feedback, I'm not doing it again.)

That's one for the ol' admin toolbox.

The 'Remove Topic' button may be worth pressing at this point as we've been stuck on the Baltimore topic since page 2 of the thread. We're now on page 5, and I'm not sure if we'll move on from it.

Some people have tried to get back on topic, and we should. We just need Highwaystar to go away or for us to start ignoring him. Also, I don't like when topics are removed as it's interesting to read old AAroads posts that were drama-filled.

My point is entirely germane to the topic "Changing Control Cities", that is why I brought it up. If you have other examples by all means contribute them, but don't pretend that discussing the case of Baltimore/DC is off topic.

[Roadgeekteen]

I can't believe that, for once, I'm actually hoping for NE2 to show up and make a irreverent shitpost that derails the discussion at hand.

I once tried to lock a thread by mentioning DST. (Due to hostile feedback, I'm not doing it again.)

That's one for the ol' admin toolbox.

The 'Remove Topic' button may be worth pressing at this point as we've been stuck on the Baltimore topic since page 2 of the thread. We're now on page 5, and I'm not sure if we'll move on from it.

Some people have tried to get back on topic, and we should. We just need Highwaystar to go away or for us to start ignoring him. Also, I don't like when topics are removed as it's interesting to read old AAroads posts that were drama-filled.

My point is entirely germane to the topic "Changing Control Cities", that is why I brought it up. If you have other examples by all means contribute them, but don't pretend that discussing the case of Baltimore/DC is off topic.

You have argued for pages and pages your point. At some point, just give up.

[HighwayStar]

I can't believe that, for once, I'm actually hoping for NE2 to show up and make a irreverent shitpost that derails the discussion at hand.

I once tried to lock a thread by mentioning DST. (Due to hostile feedback, I'm not doing it again.)

That's one for the ol' admin toolbox.

The 'Remove Topic' button may be worth pressing at this point as we've been stuck on the Baltimore topic since page 2 of the thread. We're now on page 5, and I'm not sure if we'll move on from it.

Some people have tried to get back on topic, and we should. We just need Highwaystar to go away or for us to start ignoring him. Also, I don't like when topics are removed as it's interesting to read old AAroads posts that were drama-filled.

My point is entirely germane to the topic "Changing Control Cities", that is why I brought it up. If you have other examples by all means contribute them, but don't pretend that discussing the case of Baltimore/DC is off topic.

You have argued for pages and pages your point. At some point, just give up.

You are free to just agree with me you know 

[sprjus4]

I can't believe that, for once, I'm actually hoping for NE2 to show up and make a irreverent shitpost that derails the discussion at hand.

I once tried to lock a thread by mentioning DST. (Due to hostile feedback, I'm not doing it again.)

That's one for the ol' admin toolbox.

The 'Remove Topic' button may be worth pressing at this point as we've been stuck on the Baltimore topic since page 2 of the thread. We're now on page 5, and I'm not sure if we'll move on from it.

Some people have tried to get back on topic, and we should. We just need Highwaystar to go away or for us to start ignoring him. Also, I don't like when topics are removed as it's interesting to read old AAroads posts that were drama-filled.

My point is entirely germane to the topic "Changing Control Cities", that is why I brought it up. If you have other examples by all means contribute them, but don't pretend that discussing the case of Baltimore/DC is off topic.

You have argued for pages and pages your point. At some point, just give up.

You are free to just agree with me you know 

I don't think anyone here does... your opinion on the Baltimore situation is truly unique.

[HighwayStar]

I can't believe that, for once, I'm actually hoping for NE2 to show up and make a irreverent shitpost that derails the discussion at hand.

I once tried to lock a thread by mentioning DST. (Due to hostile feedback, I'm not doing it again.)

That's one for the ol' admin toolbox.

The 'Remove Topic' button may be worth pressing at this point as we've been stuck on the Baltimore topic since page 2 of the thread. We're now on page 5, and I'm not sure if we'll move on from it.

Some people have tried to get back on topic, and we should. We just need Highwaystar to go away or for us to start ignoring him. Also, I don't like when topics are removed as it's interesting to read old AAroads posts that were drama-filled.

My point is entirely germane to the topic "Changing Control Cities", that is why I brought it up. If you have other examples by all means contribute them, but don't pretend that discussing the case of Baltimore/DC is off topic.

You have argued for pages and pages your point. At some point, just give up.

You are free to just agree with me you know 

I don't think anyone here does... your opinion on the Baltimore situation is truly unique.

Well every coalition starts with some guy in a bar I guess.