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[The Ghostbuster]

There was once a proposal to extend the Garden State Parkway northward to the Palisades Interstate Parkway (the New Jersey Turnpike was also once proposed to connect with the New York State Thruway). Both extensions were likely as impossible then as they would be now, although old road proposals fascinate me deeply (and I doubt I'm alone with that fascination on the AARoads Forum). Assuming such extensions overcame all obstacles (about as likely as FritzOwl giving up naming every road an Interstate), how do all of you think these extensions would have been utilized, and would they do much to reduce congestion in the areas where they would have ran?

[famartin]

There was once a proposal to extend the Garden State Parkway northward to the Palisades Interstate Parkway (the New Jersey Turnpike was also once proposed to connect with the New York State Thruway). Both extensions were likely as impossible then as they would be now, although old road proposals fascinate me deeply (and I doubt I'm alone with that fascination on the AARoads Forum). Assuming such extensions overcame all obstacles (about as likely as FritzOwl giving up naming every road an Interstate), how do all of you think these extensions would have been utilized, and would they do much to reduce congestion in the areas where they would have ran?

This might need to be moved to another thread or something, but I suspect the turnpike extension would get far more use than the Parkway one, given the frequent backups at the GWB.

[roadman65]

The area that lies between Teaneck and the NY State Line I believe is more upper middle class if I’m not mistaken?  Is that why it never got built in the first place? It seems those with money stopped the Somerset Freeway and if that was the class here, I’m sure it was redone.

[famartin]

The area that lies between Teaneck and the NY State Line I believe is more upper middle class if I’m not mistaken?  Is that why it never got built in the first place? It seems those with money stopped the Somerset Freeway and if that was the class here, I’m sure it was redone.

Yes, the portion of Bergen County north of Englewood is pretty upscale.  If you drive along 501, 502 and 505, you get a good feel for the area, and there was little chance of plowing a major highway thru there.

[Alps]

There was once a proposal to extend the Garden State Parkway northward to the Palisades Interstate Parkway (the New Jersey Turnpike was also once proposed to connect with the New York State Thruway). Both extensions were likely as impossible then as they would be now, although old road proposals fascinate me deeply (and I doubt I'm alone with that fascination on the AARoads Forum). Assuming such extensions overcame all obstacles (about as likely as FritzOwl giving up naming every road an Interstate), how do all of you think these extensions would have been utilized, and would they do much to reduce congestion in the areas where they would have ran?

Parkway to PIP would take pressure off the existing merge into 87S/287E and the cloverleaf at PIP, which is currently a major bottleneck (in both directions even!). Turnpike to Thruway would be nice, but would add traffic to the Turnpike and take it off the Parkway, so while you'd help Essex County somewhat you would also be hurting the West/East Alignments and they'd need to be even wider even sooner.

[storm2k]

From Larry Higgs at nj.com: Garden State Parkway to go all E-ZPass, while paying cash may remain an option on the N.J. Turnpike

Pretty terrible headline, but the gist is:

The New Jersey Turnpike Authority, which runs both highways, followed the lead of the Atlantic City Expressway, after the Turnpike board voted unanimously Tuesday to award a $914 million contract to bring all-electronic, cashless toll collection to the toll roads.

The board of commissioners awarded a contract to TransCore, LP of Nashville to design install, maintain and run an all-electronic toll collection system for eight years.

There were mentions in their ten year plan that AET was in the works. Contract is very expensive, but I guess they plan to do all new infrastructure for this. We'll have to see what comes of it once more details emerge.

[roadman65]

Here is the thing. Your collecting tolls to pay off bonds.  Then add more money to the debt. 

Why not let the residents who live in the state decide? Put it on the ballot and let NJ vote on it?

[Rothman]

Here is the thing. Your collecting tolls to pay off bonds.  Then add more money to the debt. 

Why not let the residents who live in the state decide? Put it on the ballot and let NJ vote on it?

Since when are public authorities accountable to the public?

[roadman65]

Here is the thing. Your collecting tolls to pay off bonds.  Then add more money to the debt. 

Why not let the residents who live in the state decide? Put it on the ballot and let NJ vote on it?

Since when are public authorities accountable to the public?

Well I’m saying that in this matter it should be.  It’s the users who get inconvenienced.

[Rothman]

Here is the thing. Your collecting tolls to pay off bonds.  Then add more money to the debt. 

Why not let the residents who live in the state decide? Put it on the ballot and let NJ vote on it?

Since when are public authorities accountable to the public?

Well I’m saying that in this matter it should be.  It’s the users who get inconvenienced.

Going cashless is a convenience.

[jeffandnicole]

Here is the thing. Your collecting tolls to pay off bonds.  Then add more money to the debt. 

Why not let the residents who live in the state decide? Put it on the ballot and let NJ vote on it?

The time for these questions to be raised was during the public comment period held a while back, which included many proposals including the elimination of cash payments. 

Ballot questions are for State questions, not authority and agency questions. 

Well I’m saying that in this matter it should be.  It’s the users who get inconvenienced.

Everyone cares about different things.  Why "in this matter"?  Why not every other matter?

While it's a large dollar amount here, the only ones that are affected are those that utilize the toll road.  It's not a tax that everyone in NJ has to pay, or a debt that all taxpayers need to be accountable for.

 

[The Ghostbuster]

I like that the mile 124 service area is named after the lead singer of one of my favorite bands, Bon Jovi. I wonder if they play nothing but Bon Jovi music at that service area? You can never listen to Livin' On A Prayer too many times IMHO.

[DrSmith]

Going cashless reminded me of back when Donald DiFrancesco was governor for the final year or so of Gov Whitman's term and part of his plan to run for governor was around eliminating Parkway tolls. Here's an old press release on it. https://www.nj.gov/transportation/about/press/2001/080901.shtm

If I remember correctly, part of his idea was to not collect tolls on Memorial Day or one of the big summer holidays because of the congestion at the plazas and the overtime for collectors. The toll collectors said it's a work day with triple time or something for the holiday so we're working even if it is to stand there and wave people through. So the waiving of tolls for even a day didn't happen as it didn't make financial sense to pay the salaries without the revenue.

Now maybe AET on the parkway. At least on the parkway you can do it one barrier at a time as you don't have a whole ticket system you have to turn on all at once.

[storm2k]

I like that the mile 124 service area is named after the lead singer of one of my favorite bands, Bon Jovi. I wonder if they play nothing but Bon Jovi music at that service area? You can never listen to Livin' On A Prayer too many times IMHO.

They don't. It's just the name. Service Area is the exact same, other than they put some things up about famous New Jersyians. In fact, JBJ/Cheesquake is getting a bit long in the tooth, they haven't done any major changes to it since the late 80s/early 90s.

[roadman65]

Here is the thing. Your collecting tolls to pay off bonds.  Then add more money to the debt. 

Why not let the residents who live in the state decide? Put it on the ballot and let NJ vote on it?

Since when are public authorities accountable to the public?

Well I’m saying that in this matter it should be.  It’s the users who get inconvenienced.

Going cashless is a convenience.

Not to many. Many folks are weary of government forcing society to be automated. Just like phone trees. Poll the average persons and many want the old fashioned human being instead of press one for this and two for another.

[famartin]

Here is the thing. Your collecting tolls to pay off bonds.  Then add more money to the debt. 

Why not let the residents who live in the state decide? Put it on the ballot and let NJ vote on it?

Since when are public authorities accountable to the public?

Well I’m saying that in this matter it should be.  It’s the users who get inconvenienced.

Going cashless is a convenience.

Not to many. Many folks are weary of government forcing society to be automated. Just like phone trees. Poll the average persons and many want the old fashioned human being instead of press one for this and two for another.

Cashless is a convenience, but also a way to make the money you are paying more invisible so you don’t actively detest it as much as you probably should. Not to mention it’s cheaper for them. So, more a win for the toll roads, not the people.

[roadman65]

Here is the thing. Your collecting tolls to pay off bonds.  Then add more money to the debt. 

Why not let the residents who live in the state decide? Put it on the ballot and let NJ vote on it?

Since when are public authorities accountable to the public?

Well I’m saying that in this matter it should be.  It’s the users who get inconvenienced.

Going cashless is a convenience.

Not to many. Many folks are weary of government forcing society to be automated. Just like phone trees. Poll the average persons and many want the old fashioned human being instead of press one for this and two for another.

Cashless is a convenience, but also a way to make the money you are paying more invisible so you don’t actively detest it as much as you probably should. Not to mention it’s cheaper for them. So, more a win for the toll roads, not the people.

Exactly.  And over the years it’s been why people get overly political in elections, because people want the majority of the people to decide rather than politicians in which our world is become.

To wait on a bill in the mail is an inconvenience to many as it comes unexpectedly and many don’t pay attention to signs and the road these days.

I worked as a toll collector for years and many Floridians don’t want to use even transponders.  Many like the cash thing we as society have always had for whatever reasons.  When Polk Parkway went cashless two weeks ago, many voiced their concerns about being forced to pay by plate and said it is el stinko.

[Rothman]

That's why you link an account and don't have to worry about paying bills by mail.

[roadman65]

That's why you link an account and don't have to worry about paying bills by mail.

Many people aren’t that sophisticated. Plus many people don’t like progress either and believe our Democracy is gone as upper class seem to be making decisions for everybody. 

You forgot about why people argue at election time. People want power to the people brought back and the Left agrees it’s the Right that’s gone astray while the Right thinks it’s the Left.  This rule is non partisan of course, but if you put the question on the ballot I’m sure people of the majority would want tolls kept and not to cyber world.

[Rothman]

That's why you link an account and don't have to worry about paying bills by mail.

Many people aren’t that sophisticated. Plus many people don’t like progress either and believe our Democracy is gone as upper class seem to be making decisions for everybody. 

You forgot about why people argue at election time. People want power to the people brought back and the Left agrees it’s the Right that’s gone astray while the Right thinks it’s the Left.  This rule is non partisan of course, but if you put the question on the ballot I’m sure people of the majority would want tolls kept and not to cyber world.

Nah, the majority of people in this country have to deal with toll roads and therefore they prefer cashless tolls.

[jeffandnicole]

Oops...

https://www.nj.com/news/2022/10/drivers-using-e-zpass-overcharged-at-parkway-toll-plaza-after-equipment-malfunction.html

People driving cars were mistakenly processed as driving trucks and charged the higher rate after a cable tie on the gantry at the Great Egg Harbor toll plaza in Somers Point snapped, a spokesman for the New Jersey Turnpike Authority said. The cable sagged and partially obscured a sensor used to determine vehicle classification.

As a result, an average of 4,000 drivers per day, or about 23% of the vehicles that pass through the plaza, were charged $3.92 (or $3.72 during off-peak) instead of $1.96, officials said.

[plain]

Doesn't say in the article but I assume the snapped cable has been fixed.

Hopefully nobody had a very low balance (under $3) when passing through the plaza.

[odditude]

Oops...

https://www.nj.com/news/2022/10/drivers-using-e-zpass-overcharged-at-parkway-toll-plaza-after-equipment-malfunction.html

People driving cars were mistakenly processed as driving trucks and charged the higher rate after a cable tie on the gantry at the Great Egg Harbor toll plaza in Somers Point snapped, a spokesman for the New Jersey Turnpike Authority said. The cable sagged and partially obscured a sensor used to determine vehicle classification.

As a result, an average of 4,000 drivers per day, or about 23% of the vehicles that pass through the plaza, were charged $3.92 (or $3.72 during off-peak) instead of $1.96, officials said.

welp, that's one of the more expensive zipties ever....

[storm2k]

(also in the NJ Turnpike thread)

From nj.com: Brace yourself, drivers. Turnpike and Parkway tolls are going up for the 3rd year in a row.

The New Jersey Turnpike Authority, which runs both highways, adopted a $2.5 billion 2023 budget — which calls for a 3% toll increase starting Jan. 1 in a budget that increased by 7.4% over 2022.

Officials blamed the increase on “pressures on discretionary travel and costs due to an inflation rate of 8.3%, a level not seen in 40 years.”

Per the article, tolls will be 2.02 for E-ZPass and 2.10 for cars at the two way tolls.

[jeffandnicole]

Per the article, tolls will be 2.02 for E-ZPass and 2.10 for cars at the two way tolls.

You meant the 1 way tolls.