New York

[D-Dey65]

What really needs to be a full freeway on Long Island is Nichols Road, the way that highway is set up, is very dangerous with the surprise traffic lights that show up around curves. The intersections already are designed that there is enough room to make overpasses and there are "service roads" in the section around Centerreach.

Oh, you know I've wanted that too. Between Suffolk CR 16 and NY 25. they need partial interchanges for Suffolk County Community College. Between NY 25 and NY 347, the need to use the "service roads" for a partial interchange with Hawkins and Wireless Road (northbound) and Mark Tree Road (southbound), North of NY 347, interchanges at Oxhead Road, and the entrance of Stony Brook University. Everything else should either wind up on frontage roads, bridges with no access or dead end streets.

Excuse me while I laugh hysterically at the thought this would ever happen in any universe ever on Long Island in 2022 or 2052 or 2092 or 2142.

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahano.

They can grab the land for it and use part of it for new lanes as well as a new interchange with NY 27A.

[Rothman]

347 will be a neverending project.

[D-Dey65]

347 will be a neverending project.

Sad, isn't it? They should've just upgraded the road the way they wanted to in the 1960's and 1970's. Hence the decal below all my posts which reads "NEW YORK STATE ROUTE 347; EXPRESSWAY NOW!"

[Rothman]

347 will be a neverending project.

Sad, isn't it? They should've just upgraded the road the way they wanted to in the 1960's and 1970's. Hence the decal below all my posts which reads "NEW YORK STATE ROUTE 347; EXPRESSWAY NOW!"

I mean, what's crazy are the projects that are on the books of NYSDOT's active capital program just over the course of my own career and the goals just are never achieved with incredibly slow delivery and then weirdo local issues.  My window has been only 20 years of a multi-decade trainwreck.

And yet, $10 says within the next month or so, Region 10 will inevitably say on a statewide call, "We need to talk about 347 again, MO..."

[Roadgeek Adam]

And nothing will happen again.

I've said this a billion times to the people who give me the stink eye for opposing the Rye-Oyster Bay Bridge. I'm opposed to wasting taxpayer money on stuff that's never going to happen. No one in Nassau or Westchester (or Suffolk) will ever support a new bridge or the land it would take to extend NY 135 to the bridge. We're in a situation where there's a better chance freeways like the 231 Deer Park get taken out more than anything gets built. Just not worth NYSDOT's time. Not worth our taxpayer money. As is we have enough stuff to replace and rebuild just to maintain a healthy road system.

[MultiMillionMiler]

Not so sure about that. They didn't even rule out a New Haven - Shoreham Sound Link at the time they were proposing it. A Rye-Oyster Bay Bridge is not needed in my opinion. Any other sound links other than Orient Point- East Lyme seem like a waste of resources. I never got their logic of extending I-287 into Long Island. Even the current cross-weschester doesn't make much sense as I-287.

[Roadgeek Adam]

Not so sure about that. They didn't even rule out a New Haven - Shoreham Sound Link at the time they were proposing it. A Rye-Oyster Bay Bridge is not needed in my opinion. Any other sound links other than Orient Point- East Lyme seem like a waste of resources. I never got their logic of extending I-287 into Long Island. Even the current cross-weschester doesn't make much sense as I-287.

LOL. You really think the people in the richest areas of the Peconics are going to support a bridge from Orient Point? There's a better chance I go to Plum Island and get hosed by staffers. Long Island is not getting a 3rd bridge in our lifetimes and I would oppose each one as being a waste of resources.

[Rothman]

Not so sure about that. They didn't even rule out a New Haven - Shoreham Sound Link at the time they were proposing it. A Rye-Oyster Bay Bridge is not needed in my opinion. Any other sound links other than Orient Point- East Lyme seem like a waste of resources. I never got their logic of extending I-287 into Long Island. Even the current cross-weschester doesn't make much sense as I-287.

Not so sure about that. They didn't even rule out a New Haven - Shoreham Sound Link at the time they were proposing it. A Rye-Oyster Bay Bridge is not needed in my opinion. Any other sound links other than Orient Point- East Lyme seem like a waste of resources. I never got their logic of extending I-287 into Long Island. Even the current cross-weschester doesn't make much sense as I-287.

LOL. You really think the people in the richest areas of the Peconics are going to support a bridge from Orient Point? There's a better chance I go to Plum Island and get hosed by staffers. Long Island is not getting a 3rd bridge in our lifetimes and I would oppose each one as being a waste of resources.

Trying to reconcile his post with the post he's responding to makes his point quite obfuscated, indeed.

[Duke87]

Even the current cross-weschester doesn't make much sense as I-287.

...you do realize that the Cross Westchester was I-287 first, dating back to the 1950s, and that I-287 in New Jersey wasn't finished until 1993, yes?

[MultiMillionMiler]

I was agreeing with the person above me that a Rye-Oyster Bay Bridge isn't needed. An Orient Point bridge is needed however, because having to drive from Riverhead to Rhode Island would be insane without it. A central Sound Link would be most beneficial to people who happen to live in the center of Long Island who just so happened to be going to somewhere in Central Connecticut. Not worth a 6 lane 20 mile tunnel. 287 still doesn't make sense as it is an east west road. It should have became Interstate 82.

[Roadgeek Adam]

I was agreeing with the person above me that a Rye-Oyster Bay Bridge isn't needed. An Orient Point bridge is needed however, because having to drive from Riverhead to Rhode Island would be insane without it. A central Sound Link would be most beneficial to people who happen to live in the center of Long Island who just so happened to be going to somewhere in Central Connecticut. Not worth a 6 lane 20 mile tunnel. 287 still doesn't make sense as it is an east west road. It should have became Interstate 82.

The majority of people who live in that area can afford the ferry from Orient Point to New London. They also wouldn't want the extra traffic a bridge would produce. They have the money to keep politicians happy. It's not going to happen and there's no point in wasting taxpayer money on a cockamamie concept. The original Orient Point to Watch Hill bridge was an absurdity produced in studies a long time ago. It's too late to build anything. Every single part of Long Island east of Hempstead will oppose some sound link anywhere.

[Duke87]

I was agreeing with the person above me that a Rye-Oyster Bay Bridge isn't needed. An Orient Point bridge is needed however, because having to drive from Riverhead to Rhode Island would be insane without it. A central Sound Link would be most beneficial to people who happen to live in the center of Long Island who just so happened to be going to somewhere in Central Connecticut.

The flaw in this thinking is that land doesn't generate traffic, people do. And, well, most of the people in Long Island live closer to the western end of it. The further east you put a new crossing, the less use it would get.

287 still doesn't make sense as it is an east west road. It should have became Interstate 82.

And I-287 being an east-west road breaks zero rules. The odd/even thing doesn't apply to 3dis.

[MultiMillionMiler]

I know it doesn't. But the shape of I-287 is illogical. Thats why I said it should be I-82. The Orient-Watch hill Bridge has got to be the least logical proposal I have ever heard. Why bother building 22+ miles over several tiny islands when you can just go directly over the sound north to CT? A north fork extension of the L.I.E would open suffolk country to more massive development. Given the low level of traffic anyway in both areas, it probably wouldn't get intolerable. It would also relieve traffic on I-95 in CT as it would be a bypass of New Haven to NYC. Of all the sound links proposed, the Orient-New London one is the most logical, and the New Haven-Shoreham one is the least logical, as it would be infeasible. Also, the last two statements about traffic contradict each other.

[Duke87]

The Orient-Watch hill Bridge has got to be the least logical proposal I have ever heard. Why bother building 22+ miles over several tiny islands when you can just go directly over the sound north to CT?

This is an excellent point and yeah is part of why that proposal is silly.

Also, the last two statements about traffic contradict each other.

Explain. What two statements are you referring to and where is the contradiction?

[Roadgeek Adam]

I'm going to bullet point the reasons your post is illogical:

1. The Orient Point-Watch Hill Bridge would've been 25 miles all over water.
2. An alternate proposal did exist to bring it to Connecticut (at Groton Long Point) instead of Watch Hill, RI. Here are the projected drivership for said bridge.
3. The reason there is low level of traffic is because of the lack of development and people in the Peconic forks would prefer it stay that way to keep the undesirables out. (Undesirables in their mind: anyone not rich or white.)
4. These people have political connections. They will ensure the bridges are never built. Money talks. We could build a Sound bridge anywhere from Orient Point to Sands Point. There's rich people all over the north shore who would sink this.
5. This bridge nowadays would be unable to ever make a profit most likely.

[MultiMillionMiler]

The Orient-Watch hill Bridge has got to be the least logical proposal I have ever heard. Why bother building 22+ miles over several tiny islands when you can just go directly over the sound north to CT?

This is an excellent point and yeah is part of why that proposal is silly.

Also, the last two statements about traffic contradict each other.

Explain. What two statements are you referring to and where is the contradiction?

One post saying the bridge would generate too much traffic, and the other saying due to being that far east, less traffic would use it.

[Roadgeek Adam]

My post was that it would generate more traffic compared to what exists now. His point was that the traffic projections at an Orient Point bridge would not generate as much traffic as a western sound bridge would.

[Rothman]

Let's not turn the general NY thread into another MMM thread.  Perhaps the discussion over sound crossings could be separated out?

[cockroachking]

Let's not turn the general NY thread into another MMM thread.  Perhaps the discussion over sound crossings could be separated out?

Agreed. anyone with any knowledge of NY would know that a Long Island Sound Crossing, needed or not, is fictional for the time being.

[Plutonic Panda]

Let's not turn the general NY thread into another MMM thread.  Perhaps the discussion over sound crossings could be separated out?

Agreed. anyone with any knowledge of NY would know that a Long Island Sound Crossing, needed or not, is fictional for the time being.

True and it's a sad state when Europe can build several mega projects like this at once but the US can't.

[kalvado]

Let's not turn the general NY thread into another MMM thread.  Perhaps the discussion over sound crossings could be separated out?

Agreed. anyone with any knowledge of NY would know that a Long Island Sound Crossing, needed or not, is fictional for the time being.

True and it's a sad state when Europe can build several mega projects like this at once but the US can't.

Well, NY managed to build a new Tappan Zee aka Daddy's bridge.
Sad that such bridge becomes a megaproject, though - looks like that was much less of a deal 100 years ago

[webny99]

I-390 SB between the Thruway (Exit 12) and NY 15/251 (Exit 11) was shut down today due to a tractor trailer fire and subsequent investigation.
https://13wham.com/news/local/tractor-trailer-fire-closes-portion-of-390-south-in-rush



Local news indicated the closure could be a while, so I took an extended detour on my commute home to check out the situation. Here's a brief report:

On 390 SB, I hit traffic just past Exit 14 as traffic exiting at Hylan Dr (Exit 13) was backed up onto the mainline, while the mainline was visibly stopped dead up ahead. I exited and waited about 3 cycles to turn left onto Hylan, which was mostly clear because traffic was only coming off 390 about 12-15 cars at a time. Then right on Calkins, then a left on Middle Rd which was also backed up, but fortunately had a green arrow. I then followed Middle Rd all the way down to NY 251. There was a string of traffic behind me but clear ahead, although it was still a slog with congestion at the NY 253 intersection, several all way stops, and a 40 mph limit the whole way.

From Exit 11, I took NY 15 NB back towards Rochester. I could see the incident from the 390 overpass, although not clearly since it was dusk. NY 15 SB was the primary detour option, so unsurprisingly it was much busier than Middle Rd. Oncoming traffic was steady all the way to the lane drop at Erie Station, which was backed up a bit. The four lane section of 15 was very busy but moving well. I then took NY 253 back to I-390 which was surprisingly clear, I realized that was because traffic was only coming off 390 single file in a steady drizzle, and some of that was going straight to get on the Thruway. I guess they couldn't force a closure at the Thruway exit for detouring reasons, so they closed it at NY 253 instead and let Thruway traffic figure it out. Hopefully no one entered from NY 253 expecting to take 390 SB - if they did, they'd have to pull an illegal U-turn somewhere or take a very long detour via the Thruway!

From there I got back on 390 NB, noting that SB traffic was still backed up past Hylan. I hit a bit of the usual traffic on 590 NB approaching the Can of Worms but otherwise made it back without incident. Hopefully it's reopened by tomorrow because it's a gnarly situation for anyone heading south out of Rochester - and as long as it's closed, anyone heading for the Thruway should take I-490 if they can.

[mariethefoxy]

Another Long Island question, on 495 at exit 49, I noticed half of the super tall streetlights were removed and standard lights installed around the cloverleaf loops on the eastbound side. One is left on the eastbound side just past the loops. Are they planning to remove all of them? It seems like those are more efficient, less bulbs and more light but probably other concerns I'm not aware of. The lights like that by exits 53 and 62 are still there.

[D-Dey65]

The Orient-Watch hill Bridge has got to be the least logical proposal I have ever heard. Why bother building 22+ miles over several tiny islands when you can just go directly over the sound north to CT?

The proposed East Marion-Old Saybrook Bridge would've been shorter.

A north fork extension of the L.I.E would open suffolk country to more massive development.

I've seen plenty of development going on there even without the North Fork extension of the L.I.E.

[D-Dey65]

New topic, specifically the US 6/202/NY 22 overlap in Brewster;

What sign was next to the US 202 sign at this sign tree?
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.3942949,-73.6070717,3a,75y,44.58h,94.12t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1ssAbMzQXakL-Az_KgNlvZGA!2e0!5s20220901T000000!7i16384!8i8192?hl=en
Because even the oldest GSV captures show a blank space.