The opposite of the dead malls thread.
Pretty much most malls with some "luxury" department or brand store like Saks, Apple or Tiffanys, actual restaurants besides a food court, or provide some attraction outside of shopping, like Easton in Columbus have a Lego Discovery Center, and we all know about the theme park in the Mall of America.
The Mall at Short Hills in Millburn, NJ.
Outlet malls and lifestyle centers seem to be doing the best in the Northwest, along with a few traditional malls that have diversified their offerings a bit. A few with notes:
University Village - constantly under redevelopment but now has a healthy amount of housing surrounding it and a small walkable footprint out of what was once a bunch of parking lots
Bellevue Square - anchors the west side of Downtown Bellevue, which is still growing and is set to see some Amazon action soon
Seattle Premium Outlets - always busy thanks to the casino traffic, but has managed to do well despite losing almost all of its most lucrative market (Canadians)
Alderwood - finally adding some housing and hotel rooms on the mall property itself
One to watch in the near future is Northgate, which has been mostly demolished and will reopen with light rail at its front door.
^^^
To add more to Seattle...
Southcenter Mall, Tukwila: the largest shopping center in the Pacific Northwest lives up to its name and is far from quiet. Food court is finally busy again and the multiple corridors have plenty of activity. AMC Cinema on the upper floor is open again too.
Tacoma Mall: not exactly "thriving" but certainly does well enough. Most activity is in the middle 80% of the main single corridor, although Nordstrom gets enough activity at the western end to stay busy.
WestShore Plaza in Tampa.
St Johns Town Center in Jacksonville.
Tysons Corner Center in Fairfax County, Virginia. Tysons II across the way was reasonably busy both times I went there earlier this year, too.
Not Destiny USA. Some major losses over the pandemic.
Christiana Mall in Delaware continues to do well.
The Cherry Hill Mall, along with the lesser known Deptford Mall, both in NJ, also continue to do fairly well.
In Cincinnati, Kenwood is by far the most successful mall in the area, with the luxury brand stores I mentioned above along with its placement in a rich suburb. Florence Mall is the second traditional indoor mall that's going ok. The rest in the area (Northgate, Eastgate, Tri-County, etc) are dying. There's also Liberty Center in West Chester, which is a lifestyle center, and where Tri-County Mall's Dillard's moved to. For outlets, there's Cincinnati Premium Outlets about 5 miles north of Liberty Center.
In Columbus, I mentioned Easton above already, with its Lego Discovery Center. There's also Polaris that I think is about equally thriving as Easton, with Von Maur and Saks as some of the department stores. Both malls have a Costco nearby, and Polaris have an Ikea nearby. I'm unsure on Tuttle's current status, it has two empty anchors, though is far from "dead". Columbus have two Tangar outlet malls nearby, one at I-71 and US 36 near Delaware, other at I-71 and US 35 near Jeffersonville. I haven't been to the Delaware one before, though I heard it's doing better than the Jeffersonville one.
In St Louis, the most successful ones are Galleria, Frontenac and West County. I'm unsure about South County, but from the looks of it, it's doing ok too. There's two outlet malls in the Chesterfield area (which I heard were the reason for Chesterfield Mall's death): St Louis Premium Outlets and Chesterfield Outlets, though I'm unsure which one is more successful.
For Detroit the only ones I think are doing well are Somerset Collection in Troy and Twelve Oaks Mall in Novi. All the other ones seem to be dying especially Eastland Center.
Sooner Mall in Norman is doing well so far as I know (I don't buy the sort of things sold in malls very often). It helps that it's not a very big mall and it's the only one around for some miles. It used to be that if you needed something Sooner Mall didn't have, you would go up to Crossroads Mall in south OKC. Crossroads closed a decade ago (and was dead for longer than that) and now the next-nearest mall is Penn Square on OKC's northwest side.
I think there's probably a market for one big mall, and a few smaller feeder malls, to live in each metro area.
Yorktown Center in Chicagoland (https://goo.gl/maps/u7BwDsE1cgxCGfAE7) is doing well.
Woodfield Mall in Schaumburg (https://goo.gl/maps/veEoMNUnsVdiB3qn6) seems to have had some losses during the pandemic but is still a good ways from the dying category.
Crabtree Valley Mall.
Seems like most malls in the Greater Toronto Area are doing fine.
These include:
Yorkdale
Eaton Centre
Sherway Gardens
Scarborough Town Centre
Square One
Vaughan Mills
Promenade
etc.etc.
Quote from: andrepoiy on June 06, 2021, 07:43:01 PM
Seems like most malls in the Greater Toronto Area are doing fine.
These include:
Yorkdale
Eaton Centre
Sherway Gardens
Scarborough Town Centre
Square One
Vaughan Mills
Promenade
etc.etc.
Canadian malls seem to be doing better than ones in similar sized American metro areas in general. Like Vancouver's metro area population is about the same as my home city of Cincinnati's (surprised Vancouver's was that low, thought it was at least 3.5 mil), and just off the top of my head, there's Metrotown, Richmond, Pacific Centre, probably one of the malls in Surrey or Langley, and Oakridge (under redevelopment) for thriving malls in the area, more than the 1-2 thriving malls in US metros with a similar population.
Quote from: SkyPesos on June 06, 2021, 10:31:30 AM
In St Louis, the most successful ones are Galleria, Frontenac and West County. I'm unsure about South County, but from the looks of it, it's doing ok too. There's two outlet malls in the Chesterfield area (which I heard were the reason for Chesterfield Mall's death): St Louis Premium Outlets and Chesterfield Outlets, though I'm unsure which one is more successful.
South County is somewhere between thriving and dead. There are a good number of vacancies but it is far from what Chesterfield has become.
Eastview Mall in Victor, NY is still doing fairly well, at least a lot better than the other malls in this area.
Come to think of it, I started a very similar thread a while back:
https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=22917.0
Florida Mall in Orlando, Florida. Being in a tourist area between the Airport and I Drive, it has clientele. Though the area around it is sketchy, the visitors overseas and from South America don't care and the parking lot does offer a buffer from life outside it to hinder it.
Short Pump Town Center is Richmond's most successful mall currently.
Quote from: Bruce on June 06, 2021, 04:03:01 AM
Outlet malls and lifestyle centers seem to be doing the best in the Northwest, along with a few traditional malls that have diversified their offerings a bit. A few with notes:
University Village - constantly under redevelopment but now has a healthy amount of housing surrounding it and a small walkable footprint out of what was once a bunch of parking lots
Bellevue Square - anchors the west side of Downtown Bellevue, which is still growing and is set to see some Amazon action soon
Seattle Premium Outlets - always busy thanks to the casino traffic, but has managed to do well despite losing almost all of its most lucrative market (Canadians)
Alderwood - finally adding some housing and hotel rooms on the mall property itself
One to watch in the near future is Northgate, which has been mostly demolished and will reopen with light rail at its front door.
I'd echo this. The big indoor malls that thrived in the 80s seem to be dying, while outdoor "promenades" are the ones that are attracting the higher end retailers.
Here in Bend, OR we have the Old Mill District, which is along the river, and is an outdoor promenade with retailers like REI and Lululemon, along with a lot of nice restaurants.
In the Portland area, there's Bridgeport Village and the Streets of Tanasbourne (outdoor) that seems to be doing great. Not too far away is Washington Square which is indoors and hanging in there. Last I checked, Lloyd Center is not too long for this world.
Mall of America (obviously)
Southdale in Edina
Ridgedale in Minnetonka
Northtown in Blaine
Quote from: SkyPesos on June 06, 2021, 07:49:04 PM
Quote from: andrepoiy on June 06, 2021, 07:43:01 PM
Seems like most malls in the Greater Toronto Area are doing fine.
These include:
Yorkdale
Eaton Centre
Sherway Gardens
Scarborough Town Centre
Square One
Vaughan Mills
Promenade
etc.etc.
Canadian malls seem to be doing better than ones in similar sized American metro areas in general. Like Vancouver's metro area population is about the same as my home city of Cincinnati's (surprised Vancouver's was that low, thought it was at least 3.5 mil), and just off the top of my head, there's Metrotown, Richmond, Pacific Centre, probably one of the malls in Surrey or Langley, and Oakridge (under redevelopment) for thriving malls in the area, more than the 1-2 thriving malls in US metros with a similar population.
By a mile, the most underperforming shopping centre in Metro Vancouver is the Tsawwassen outlets, off Hwy 17 in Delta. It's this gigantic shopping center (Mills mall, IIRC) but every time I went in there, it was always dead. It's quite a long walk around it, honestly. Lansdowne is also not very busy, but then it is highly centered on the Chinese population of Richmond so you don't see as diverse of demographics.
One of the main advantages Vancouver has is the exceptional transit access. Outside of downtown, Lansdowne, Metrotown, Brentwood, Coquitlam, the YVR Designer Outlets, Oakridge, Richmond Centre, New West, and Central City all exist at SkyTrain stations. All have plenty of parking too, so they end up appealing to just about everyone.
Boise Towne Square is a traditional indoor mall in Boise that's doing just fine. The Village at Meridian is an outdoor "lifestyle center" that also seems to be doing very well.
On the contrary, Karcher Mall has been a prime candidate for the "Dead Malls" thread for many years now. Though they've done some major remodeling there so I'm not really sure what it looks like now (I think it's less of a mall and more of a strip mall now).
Nampa Gateway Center is also barely hanging on, and that one never was thriving. It's similar in design to The Village in Meridian (outdoor), but worse, and everyone is willing to just drive to Meridian so Gateway Center has no real market. JC Penney is still open but I don't know if that will last (Macys closed a few years ago; both stores have Boise Towne Square locations people can visit if they need), and that's the only notable retail presence. The Regal Edwards Theater is the only major draw there, and I see that sticking around, but not much else.
Also, the Boise Outlet Mall is a literal complete ghost town, so not all outlet malls are doing well as suggested earlier in this thread. It's also in a weird location on the outskirts of town to be fair.
The current state of malls seems to be, metro areas can support maybe 1-3 successful malls (depending on the size), but that number is like 50% of what it was 20 years ago. So half the malls are doing okay, and the other half are basically dead. People will just drive a little farther if they have to to get to the non-dead ones.
Smaller cities' malls (eg. Twin Falls) are just barely hanging on and aren't really financially viable, except the only competition there is Target and Walmart, as cities like that don't support a large enough market for a mall anymore.
In the Grand Rapids area, both RiverTown and Woodland seem to be doing fairly decent. Several years ago, RiverTown was far and away the better mall. Now, Woodland has closed the gap, if it hasn't passed RiverTown by now. Over the last several years, Woodland has added Von Maur and Cheesecake Factory among other additions.
In the Philippines I seen malls in the San Fernando/Angeles City,/Clark areas get crowded. In Manila I seen malls get huge crowds. But my sample was biased given that I went there in 2019 around the New Years week timeframe.
The major mall chains in that country are Ayala, Robinsons and SM. In these cases the malls get viewed in the same way here in America we think of Wal-Mart, Amazon and Target are today as Big Box outlets.
Quote from: bing101 on June 26, 2021, 05:34:04 PM
In the Philippines I seen malls in the San Fernando/Angeles City,/Clark areas get crowded. In Manila I seen malls get huge crowds. But my sample was biased given that I went there in 2019 around the New Years week timeframe.
The major mall chains in that country are Ayala, Robinsons and SM. In these cases the malls get viewed in the same way here in America we think of Wal-Mart, Amazon and Target are today as Big Box operations.
Aren't malls in East Asia in general much more common and much more visited than their US counterparts? Like I see a mall about every 2-3 subway stations in cities like Singapore, Shanghai and Hong Kong. Though something worth noting is that most malls in Asia I visited have a supermarket as one of its anchors, and a whole floor for restaurants, which may contribute to foot traffic compared to a generic "˜fast food' food court as the main dining option in US malls.
Quote from: SkyPesos on June 26, 2021, 05:39:39 PM
Quote from: bing101 on June 26, 2021, 05:34:04 PM
In the Philippines I seen malls in the San Fernando/Angeles City,/Clark areas get crowded. In Manila I seen malls get huge crowds. But my sample was biased given that I went there in 2019 around the New Years week timeframe.
The major mall chains in that country are Ayala, Robinsons and SM. In these cases the malls get viewed in the same way here in America we think of Wal-Mart, Amazon and Target are today as Big Box operations.
Aren't malls in East Asia in general much more common and much more visited than their US counterparts? Like I see a mall about every 2-3 subway stations in cities like Singapore, Shanghai and Hong Kong. Though something worth noting is that most malls in Asia I visited have a supermarket as one of its anchors, and a whole floor for restaurants, which may contribute to foot traffic compared to a generic "˜fast food' food court as the main dining option in US malls.
I knew of malls having higher visitor/customer counts in the Philippines but that was pre-pandemic. Also I knew of two rival malls in the Philippines that is across the street from each other in San Fernando, Pampanga near North Luzon Expressway. Yes there are supermarkets in the malls too in the case of the Philippines and they carry the name of the mall owners such as Robinsons Supermarkets, SM Supermarket. From what I can gather Malls in the Philippines are big box operations.
Quote from: ftballfan on June 07, 2021, 09:15:18 PM
In the Grand Rapids area, both RiverTown and Woodland seem to be doing fairly decent. Several years ago, RiverTown was far and away the better mall. Now, Woodland has closed the gap, if it hasn't passed RiverTown by now. Over the last several years, Woodland has added Von Maur and Cheesecake Factory among other additions.
I made a comment on it in the Dead Malls thread too but Detroit is losing another mall, Eastland is a goner.
Makes me wonder how the Holyoke Mall is surviving in MA.
Quote from: Flint1979 on June 26, 2021, 09:22:40 PM
Quote from: ftballfan on June 07, 2021, 09:15:18 PM
In the Grand Rapids area, both RiverTown and Woodland seem to be doing fairly decent. Several years ago, RiverTown was far and away the better mall. Now, Woodland has closed the gap, if it hasn't passed RiverTown by now. Over the last several years, Woodland has added Von Maur and Cheesecake Factory among other additions.
I made a comment on it in the Dead Malls thread too but Detroit is losing another mall, Eastland is a goner.
Of Detroit metro area malls, the following seem to be doing decent:
Briarwood
Fairlane
Great Lakes Crossing
Lakeside
Macomb
Partridge Creek (despite having no traditional anchors; outdoor mall)
Somerset
Southland
Twelve Oaks
From what I've seen the one's that are doing the best are
Somerset, 12 Oaks, Lakeside, Southland
I was in Westland about two weeks ago and only went in there so I could go through the Sears store one last time before it closes forever and I walked out into the mall and it had a very low population with several vacant storefronts it seems to be doing about the same as Northland did in it's last few years but it's doing better than Eastland.
Somerset is fine even though there are some vacancies I don't see that one going anywhere.
Last time I was in the area around Lakeside was also about two weeks ago and it seems like that whole corridor along M-59 is doing fine.
12 Oaks is about the same as Somerset.
Now Oakland Mall is doing so-so I haven't been in there in awhile so I haven't had a good idea of how it's going.
Macomb Mall seems to be doing better than it was.
Fairlane is another one I haven't been to in awhile but last time I was there it was ok. I think that was last summer if I remember right.
Southland is fine. Out of all the directional land malls in Detroit this one is doing the best. Northland is gone, Eastland is dead, Westland is on it's way down.
As far as the Milwaukee area malls go at was at Southridge last week. And I will say it's still doing fine. Does as some vacancies but almost all malls do have some. It would be nice if they can get at least some of the fmr Kohl's space filled. As far as Brookfield Square goes not doing as well. Most of the mall is still doing ok although it has seen better days but the food court is over half vacant and that is not good. The loss of Boston Store back in 2018 did hurt this mall a bit. Haven't been to Mayfair in a while but as far as I know that mall is still doing well despite a shooting there last fall. Miraculously everyone shot survived.
Quote from: Rothman on June 26, 2021, 09:28:19 PM
Makes me wonder how the Holyoke Mall at Ingleside is surviving in MA.
Title corrected.
Around here, I would say that the Huntington Mall (WV) is doing very well. It clearly has a future, while the other malls in the Tri-State region and certainly Charleston's crime infested Town Center are soon to be goners. Those collapses just make the H-Mall's service area bigger
The mall has well over a 95% occupancy rate, and all the traditional stores, unlike a lot of malls that fill up with lesser type stores that can now afford the lower rent. Dealt with its Sears problem very well. Sold the space to the school board which will move the vocational high school into the space, which already has an auto shop and beauty shop and is three times the size of the current building.
Quote from: SP Cook on July 22, 2021, 10:14:38 AM
Around here, I would say that the Huntington Mall (WV) is doing very well. It clearly has a future, while the other malls in the Tri-State region and certainly Charleston's crime infested Town Center are soon to be goners. Those collapses just make the H-Mall's service area bigger
The mall has well over a 95% occupancy rate, and all the traditional stores, unlike a lot of malls that fill up with lesser type stores that can now afford the lower rent. Dealt with its Sears problem very well. Sold the space to the school board which will move the vocational high school into the space, which already has an auto shop and beauty shop and is three times the size of the current building.
That's certainly an innovative way to deal with that vacancy.
Across the Big Sandy, Ashland Town Center seems to be doing OK. Kyova, on the other hand, didn't do well at all. Saw a news headline earlier this week that renovations are getting started on that facility, but I neglected to read the story to see what's going to become of the property. I presume it was a WSAZ story that got picked up by WYMT's social media folks.
(Emily Bennett, the new reporter/anchor at WSAZ, was in Hazard two years prior and is a friend of mine. Had several interviews with her, including a bunch remotely during the last year, but got to see her in person at an event the last week she was in Hazard. She's originally from Pennsylvania so this gets her a little closer to home. She's also getting married pretty soon, if the ceremony hasn't already taken place.)
The KYOVA Mall is supposedly being reworked as the "Camp Landing Entertainment District" . Which is supposed to be a combination of hotel, indoor amusement park, farmer's market, "upscale" residential area, a distillery (Ashland is well east of the pure limestone water needed to make proper whisky) and "niche retail" . All framed around a "convention center" .
All government $$, of course. I'm doubtful.
Quote from: SP Cook on July 22, 2021, 03:03:21 PM
The KYOVA Mall is supposedly being reworked as the "Camp Landing Entertainment District" . Which is supposed to be a combination of hotel, indoor amusement park, farmer's market, "upscale" residential area, a distillery (Ashland is well east of the pure limestone water needed to make proper whisky) and "niche retail" . All framed around a "convention center" .
All government $$, of course. I'm doubtful.
Well...American Rescue Plan federal funding and then bonds, it looks like.
Every major development demands subsidies.
If any mall had go-karts.
The Galleria in Houston and Brazos Mall in Lake Jackson are doing really well (at least prior to the pandemic). The Brazos Mall recently got rid of its Sears anchor and redesigned that space into a HomeGoods, TJMaxx, Ulta, and Ashley Furniture. They also added an Urban Air trampoline park around the back and did some sprucing up around the place.
Woah here is an active mall in the Philippines as of this posting. The clip is outside of Christmas and New Years timeframe and yes supermarkets are inside these malls
Here in the KC area (Overland Park), Oak Park Mall is doing pretty well.
City Creek in downtown SLC has always had plenty of people every time I've been there.
Scottsdale Fashion Square in Scottsdale, AZ
Quote from: US 89 on September 11, 2021, 06:07:41 PM
City Creek in downtown SLC has always had plenty of people every time I've been there.
Hm. I do wonder how it's doing financially, since it was initially propped up by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
Jordan Creek Town Center in West Des Moines and Coral Ridge in Coralville are the 2 Iowa malls which are thriving, although I am only taking my coworkers word for it for Coral Ridge.
The Richmond Mall in Kentucky, opened in the late 1980s (or possibly early 90s) is about dead.
Meanwhile, an open-air shopping center (Richmond Center) opened not too far away in recent years. It's basically a strip mall with a bunch of separate structures scattered about. It's not walkable at all; you pretty much have to drive from store to store. Some of the stores that used to be in Richmond Mall are now in Richmond Center (JC Penney and a cineplex) and other stores similar to those in the mall are in the new shopping center (JoAnn's Fabrics was in the mall; Michael's is in the new center). Why it's more desirable to spread things out like that is beyond me.
Quote from: Rothman on June 06, 2021, 08:45:43 AM
Not Destiny USA. Some major losses over the pandemic.
How dare you diss my Destiny?! :colorful: :colorful:
Quote from: snowc on September 12, 2021, 04:00:25 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 06, 2021, 08:45:43 AM
Not Destiny USA. Some major losses over the pandemic.
How dare you diss my Destiny?! :colorful: :colorful:
Just walked through it yesterday. Although a lot of stores seem to be open, they are opening a trampoline gym...see also: Shoppingtown for what is in there now. :D
Quote from: CoreySamson on July 22, 2021, 05:04:13 PM
The Galleria in Houston and Brazos Mall in Lake Jackson are doing really well (at least prior to the pandemic). The Brazos Mall recently got rid of its Sears anchor and redesigned that space into a HomeGoods, TJMaxx, Ulta, and Ashley Furniture. They also added an Urban Air trampoline park around the back and did some sprucing up around the place.
Memorial City mall and the Woodlands mall are too.
The last time I was at Gulfgate it looked busier than I would have expected it to have been.
Quote from: hbelkins on September 12, 2021, 03:45:52 PM
The Richmond Mall in Kentucky, opened in the late 1980s (or possibly early 90s) is about dead.
Meanwhile, an open-air shopping center (Richmond Center) opened not too far away in recent years. It's basically a strip mall with a bunch of separate structures scattered about. It's not walkable at all; you pretty much have to drive from store to store. Some of the stores that used to be in Richmond Mall are now in Richmond Center (JC Penney and a cineplex) and other stores similar to those in the mall are in the new shopping center (JoAnn's Fabrics was in the mall; Michael's is in the new center). Why it's more desirable to spread things out like that is beyond me.
Sadly this is the way things are trending. Having each store visible from the road and "closer" to parking (even if it actually requires more walking across unpleasant parking deserts) is more attractive to retailers than a spot in an enclosed mall. A walkable mall is one of the sole decent placemakers in a suburb, so the death of them shows just how far gone we are when it comes to walkability.
Quote from: Rothman on September 12, 2021, 04:05:17 PM
Quote from: snowc on September 12, 2021, 04:00:25 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 06, 2021, 08:45:43 AM
Not Destiny USA. Some major losses over the pandemic.
How dare you diss my Destiny?! :colorful: :colorful:
Just walked through it yesterday. Although a lot of stores seem to be open, they are opening a trampoline gym...see also: Shoppingtown for what is in there now. :D
The last time I was in there was in 2019.
Now its closed. :wow: :pan:
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