Michigan Notes

[roadman65]

https://maps.app.goo.gl/6mQZc2DzRfBwnuWN9
Why is there this stub on the Michigan side of the Ambassador Bridge?

I've been told that the stubborn owner of the bridge has no plans to add another parallel span to it at all hence the Geordie Howe Bridge need. So why is it built?

[Flint1979]

https://maps.app.goo.gl/6mQZc2DzRfBwnuWN9
Why is there this stub on the Michigan side of the Ambassador Bridge?

I've been told that the stubborn owner of the bridge has no plans to add another parallel span to it at all hence the Geordie Howe Bridge need. So why is it built?

It was intended to be the starting point for a second span. The problem with where the bridge is located is that on the Windsor side you are thrown right into overcrowded streets in Windsor and have to stop at traffic lights. When the Gordie Howe Bridge opens you'll be able to get right onto the 401 freeway. The owner of the bridge died about 3 years ago, I believe his kids are in control of his company now. Manuel Moroun was not well liked in Detroit at all.

[roadman65]

I also see that you can't get directly onto I-75 SB from the Ambassador Bridge either. Once you pay the toll you're forced onto either I-75 NB or I-96 WB or a side street to the Welcome Center.

[Flint1979]

I also see that you can't get directly onto I-75 SB from the Ambassador Bridge either. Once you pay the toll you're forced onto either I-75 NB or I-96 WB or a side street to the Welcome Center.

Stay to the left after clearing customs, that's the SB I-75 ramp. It's the ramp that does a circle basically turning around.

[JREwing78]

https://maps.app.goo.gl/6mQZc2DzRfBwnuWN9
Why is there this stub on the Michigan side of the Ambassador Bridge?

I've been told that the stubborn owner of the bridge has no plans to add another parallel span to it at all hence the Geordie Howe Bridge need. So why is it built?

It was intended to be the starting point for a second span. The problem with where the bridge is located is that on the Windsor side you are thrown right into overcrowded streets in Windsor and have to stop at traffic lights. When the Gordie Howe Bridge opens you'll be able to get right onto the 401 freeway. The owner of the bridge died about 3 years ago, I believe his kids are in control of his company now. Manuel Moroun was not well liked in Detroit at all.

Also, Canada had a condition that they had to tear down the Ambassador once the replacement was constructed and open to traffic. Mouron wanted it to be a twin span, and he wasn't going to dump the money in a 2nd span if he couldn't use it as he intended.

As little as they liked him in Detroit, they liked him even less in Canada.

[wanderer2575]

I also see that you can't get directly onto I-75 SB from the Ambassador Bridge either. Once you pay the toll you're forced onto either I-75 NB or I-96 WB or a side street to the Welcome Center.

Stay to the left after clearing customs, that's the SB I-75 ramp. It's the ramp that does a circle basically turning around.

Although truckers cannot get directly onto nbd I-75 after passing through their separate customs inspection station.  Their only options are I-96 or sbd I-75.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/u3VrCCdZM7DWg4jS7

[JREwing78]

Some notes from a recent weekend trip to Michigan:
- 55 mph speed limits in the U.P. are mind-numbingly slow. The section of 65 mph limits on US-2 make the drive less tedious.

- A friend posted a picture from Sunday afternoon of at least 3 miles of backed-up EBD traffic on US-2 outside St. Ignace, waiting to get across the Mackinac Bridge. Not sure what was the holdup there; in theory they should be able to have 5 toll collection agents handling SBD traffic. The bridge itself was not backed up or closed or anything like that. The interchange construction at US-2 and I-75 shouldn't have been a factor, as even squeezed down to one lane w/ I-75 it shouldn't have hampered the toll booth's ability to move cars through. It's just weird.

- US-127 south of M-57 is looking good from the recent repaving, bridge work, and installation of J-turns in the median. There is no longer any cross traffic; it's now either right-turning traffic or traffic turning at the crossover points. Ditto the repaving and safety enhancement work on US-127 between Mason and Leslie.

The J-turn thing is becoming more common in Michigan, instead of the traditional Michigan left that allows cross traffic or right-turns. US-2/41 between Escanaba and Rapid River has them (aside from the two signalized intersections in Gladstone). Bus I-69 (Saginaw Rd) on the divided section between East Lansing and I-69 in Haslett has them. Recent work on M-99 between Lansing and Eaton Rapids converted several crossroads into J-turns (but did not modify existing two-way crossovers between the intersections). Presumably MDOT will also convert the 4-lane divided section of US-127 north of M-57 when that section gets fresh pavement.

- We're within a week or so of I-94 construction in Kalamazoo wrapping up. All 6 lanes are open west of Sprinkle Rd, and the Portage Rd exit is simply missing signage (overhead and otherwise). That will be worthwhile relief.

- US-131 between Schoolcraft and Three Rivers is also getting a repave and J-turn treatment. It will probably be done by the onset of winter. Unclear if at that point they'll elect to bump the speed limit to 65; my guess is that with all the driveways in Moore Park and the relatively short distances involved that they'll just leave it at 55. But they may surprise us.

[afguy]

MDOT has launched a study of the 8 Mile/I-75 Interchange on the Detroit/Hazel Park border. If I were a betting man, I have a feeling MDOT will tear down the current 8 Mile bridge over I-75 and rebuild it as a traditional interchange.

MDOT is undertaking a feasibility study, also known as an early preliminary engineering (EPE) study, for the I-75/M-102 (8 Mile Road) interchange in the cities of Detroit and Hazel Park. The existing interchange contains aging infrastructure built in 1969. Since it was originally built, traffic patterns and land uses have changed. MDOT is evaluating the interchange to improve the transportation system, connectivity, and aesthetics; reduce long-term maintenance costs; and complement the I-75 modernization project north of 8 Mile Road.

The outcome of this study will enable MDOT, in partnership with the local communities, to enhance safety, improve design and mobility, and plan for future transportation needs and changing travel behaviors through this unique area.

https://www.michigan.gov/mdot/projects-studies/studies/feasibility-studies/i-75-m-102-study

[Great Lakes Roads]

MDOT has launched a study of the 8 Mile/I-75 Interchange on the Detroit/Hazel Park border. If I were a betting man, I have a feeling MDOT will tear down the current 8 Mile bridge over I-75 and rebuild it as a traditional interchange.

MDOT is undertaking a feasibility study, also known as an early preliminary engineering (EPE) study, for the I-75/M-102 (8 Mile Road) interchange in the cities of Detroit and Hazel Park. The existing interchange contains aging infrastructure built in 1969. Since it was originally built, traffic patterns and land uses have changed. MDOT is evaluating the interchange to improve the transportation system, connectivity, and aesthetics; reduce long-term maintenance costs; and complement the I-75 modernization project north of 8 Mile Road.

The outcome of this study will enable MDOT, in partnership with the local communities, to enhance safety, improve design and mobility, and plan for future transportation needs and changing travel behaviors through this unique area.

https://www.michigan.gov/mdot/projects-studies/studies/feasibility-studies/i-75-m-102-study

Also, MDOT could add a 4th lane each way through the interchange on I-75...

[Flint1979]

Some notes from a recent weekend trip to Michigan:
- 55 mph speed limits in the U.P. are mind-numbingly slow. The section of 65 mph limits on US-2 make the drive less tedious.

- A friend posted a picture from Sunday afternoon of at least 3 miles of backed-up EBD traffic on US-2 outside St. Ignace, waiting to get across the Mackinac Bridge. Not sure what was the holdup there; in theory they should be able to have 5 toll collection agents handling SBD traffic. The bridge itself was not backed up or closed or anything like that. The interchange construction at US-2 and I-75 shouldn't have been a factor, as even squeezed down to one lane w/ I-75 it shouldn't have hampered the toll booth's ability to move cars through. It's just weird.

- US-127 south of M-57 is looking good from the recent repaving, bridge work, and installation of J-turns in the median. There is no longer any cross traffic; it's now either right-turning traffic or traffic turning at the crossover points. Ditto the repaving and safety enhancement work on US-127 between Mason and Leslie.

The J-turn thing is becoming more common in Michigan, instead of the traditional Michigan left that allows cross traffic or right-turns. US-2/41 between Escanaba and Rapid River has them (aside from the two signalized intersections in Gladstone). Bus I-69 (Saginaw Rd) on the divided section between East Lansing and I-69 in Haslett has them. Recent work on M-99 between Lansing and Eaton Rapids converted several crossroads into J-turns (but did not modify existing two-way crossovers between the intersections). Presumably MDOT will also convert the 4-lane divided section of US-127 north of M-57 when that section gets fresh pavement.

- We're within a week or so of I-94 construction in Kalamazoo wrapping up. All 6 lanes are open west of Sprinkle Rd, and the Portage Rd exit is simply missing signage (overhead and otherwise). That will be worthwhile relief.

- US-131 between Schoolcraft and Three Rivers is also getting a repave and J-turn treatment. It will probably be done by the onset of winter. Unclear if at that point they'll elect to bump the speed limit to 65; my guess is that with all the driveways in Moore Park and the relatively short distances involved that they'll just leave it at 55. But they may surprise us.

The 55 mph in the U.P. are insanely slow I agree. When I was up at my place in Cedarville last week I drove to Sault Ste. Marie and on M-129 I was doing 70-75 mph, there was no traffic and the speed limit was 55 I didn't care though.

The holdup on the Mackinac Bridge is that they are doing construction and have lane closures. I drove across it twice last week and it took me about 15 minutes to get across and traffic came to a stand still, this was on Tuesday afternoon. Also exit 344 has ramp closures.

[GaryV]

The 55 mph in the U.P. are insanely slow I agree. When I was up at my place in Cedarville last week I drove to Sault Ste. Marie and on M-129 I was doing 70-75 mph, there was no traffic and the speed limit was 55 I didn't care though.

When Michigan increased the 55 mph, all the roads were supposed to get engineering studies to prove 65 was safe. Which is kind of unneeded, since most of them were at 65 mph before Nixon made us all go 55. Still, they had to do some studies to determine where no passing zones were needed for the higher speeds, I can see that.

But M-129? It's straight as an arrow. 70-75 is certainly safe there, just like it is in the Seney Stretch on M-28.

[Flint1979]

The 55 mph in the U.P. are insanely slow I agree. When I was up at my place in Cedarville last week I drove to Sault Ste. Marie and on M-129 I was doing 70-75 mph, there was no traffic and the speed limit was 55 I didn't care though.

When Michigan increased the 55 mph, all the roads were supposed to get engineering studies to prove 65 was safe. Which is kind of unneeded, since most of them were at 65 mph before Nixon made us all go 55. Still, they had to do some studies to determine where no passing zones were needed for the higher speeds, I can see that.

But M-129? It's straight as an arrow. 70-75 is certainly safe there, just like it is in the Seney Stretch on M-28.

That's true. I had no problem doing 70-75 on M-129, I did about the same on the Seney Stretch last time I was on that stretch of M-28. I have heard that cops sit in the Seney Stretch at times though so you might have to watch it a little bit. Other than driving through Pickford you can do 75 on M-129 just fine like you said it's straight as an arrow. It's actually Meridian Road on the U.P. side as it continues from the Lower Peninsula.

The only curve is at the eastern terminus of M-28 where M-129 does that S curve but other than that it's straight.

[roadman65]

Speaking of Michigan Speed Limits, is I-75 in the UP the only 75 mph freeway in the entire state?

[GaryV]

Speaking of Michigan Speed Limits, is I-75 in the UP the only 75 mph freeway in the entire state?

I-75 north of Bay City, most (or maybe all) of US-10, parts of I-69, US-131 north of GR. Maybe more.

[NWI_Irish96]

Speaking of Michigan Speed Limits, is I-75 in the UP the only 75 mph freeway in the entire state?

I-75 north of Bay City, most (or maybe all) of US-10, parts of I-69, US-131 north of GR. Maybe more.

Some of US 127 as well.

[Flint1979]

Speaking of Michigan Speed Limits, is I-75 in the UP the only 75 mph freeway in the entire state?

No. I-75 is 75 mph north of MM 164 except for the areas before, on and after the Mackinac Bridge where it slows down to 60 mph in Mackinaw City, then 45 mph for the bridge, then 60 mph again in St. Ignace before resuming 75 mph. Also I-69 is 75 mph between East Lansing and Swartz Creek and again from the Lapeer/Genesee County line to Port Huron, in between it's 70 mph. Also US-10, US-127 and US-131 are 75 mph.

[Flint1979]

Speaking of Michigan Speed Limits, is I-75 in the UP the only 75 mph freeway in the entire state?

I-75 north of Bay City, most (or maybe all) of US-10, parts of I-69, US-131 north of GR. Maybe more.

US-10 west of Farwell is a two lane road and slows down to 55 mph.

[JREwing78]

The 55 mph in the U.P. are insanely slow I agree. When I was up at my place in Cedarville last week I drove to Sault Ste. Marie and on M-129 I was doing 70-75 mph, there was no traffic and the speed limit was 55 I didn't care though.

When Michigan increased the 55 mph, all the roads were supposed to get engineering studies to prove 65 was safe. Which is kind of unneeded, since most of them were at 65 mph before Nixon made us all go 55. Still, they had to do some studies to determine where no passing zones were needed for the higher speeds, I can see that.

But M-129? It's straight as an arrow. 70-75 is certainly safe there, just like it is in the Seney Stretch on M-28.

Full list of roads that saw speed limit increases in 2017/2018:
https://www.michigan.gov/mdot/-/media/Project/Websites/MDOT/Travel/Safety/Road-User/Speed-Limits/Speed-Limit-Increases-List.pdf?rev=b37c29cba2b149a6899b19af2aabcd12

The design standards that drove which routes got the increases were not consistent; some routes were selected based on (lack of) traffic; others seem to have been specifically selected based on traffic levels. I would be less frustrated with Michigan if they came up with a rule - say, no 65mph limits on 2-lanes south of Clare, or a requirement for full 10' paved shoulders and rumble strips, or a requirement for fewer than 10 driveways or access points per mile.

Technically, both M-28 and US-45 in Bruce Crossing have a 65 mph speed limit. In "town", with sidewalks right up against a curb and on-street parking! (There's an advisory speed limit of 45 posted on the northern approach on US-45). If that qualifies for a 65 mph speed limit, pretty much anywhere in Michigan qualifies!

[GaryV]

Speaking of Michigan Speed Limits, is I-75 in the UP the only 75 mph freeway in the entire state?

I-75 north of Bay City, most (or maybe all) of US-10, parts of I-69, US-131 north of GR. Maybe more.

US-10 west of Farwell is a two lane road and slows down to 55 mph.

roadman wanted to know about 75mph freeways

[Plutonic Panda]

HOV are coming to Michigan particularly I-75:

https://www.freep.com/story/news/politics/2023/10/10/whitmer-signs-bills-to-authorize-carpool-lanes/71122428007/

[Flint1979]

Speaking of Michigan Speed Limits, is I-75 in the UP the only 75 mph freeway in the entire state?

I-75 north of Bay City, most (or maybe all) of US-10, parts of I-69, US-131 north of GR. Maybe more.

US-10 west of Farwell is a two lane road and slows down to 55 mph.

roadman wanted to know about 75mph freeways

I gotcha. If you were referring to the freeway part of US-10 then yes the whole thing is 75 mph.

[Flint1979]

I think if we were giving out awards for straight as an arrow state highways then M-117 would win.

[wanderer2575]

HOV are coming to Michigan particularly I-75:

https://www.freep.com/story/news/politics/2023/10/10/whitmer-signs-bills-to-authorize-carpool-lanes/71122428007/

I was surprised when I first read this.  I didn't know legislation was needed at all, and then that it passed only now.  The I-75 Oakland County reconstruction project started nearly a decade ago, and the HOV lanes during rush hours have been touted since day one.  Other than waiting for completion of the whole project, I guess this is the reason the new lanes haven't been opened on the completed sections but instead have been painted out.  Maybe the theory was that if opened at first for all traffic full-time, dialing them back to HOV use would be tougher for motorists to swallow.

[wanderer2575]

MDOT will be letting a contract for reconstruction of BL I-75 (Square Lake Road) between M-1 (Woodward Avenue) and the GTW Railroad overpass west of Opdyke Road, a portion of sbd BL-I-75 east of Opdyke Road, and the nbd and sbd Opdyke Road ramps to nbd BL I-75 (wbd Square Lake Road) in Pontiac.  The letting is #2311 016, letting date 11/03/2023, item #016.

I mention this because there was discussion back in April in this thread about whether the grade separation at Opdyke Road was still necessary and even maybe a roundabout or two should go there.  Also, MDOT at one point was considering removing the ramp from Square Lake Road to the ebd I-75 connector to eliminate weave/merge concerns.  The plans show the reconstruction will keep all alignments as they are now.  If I'm reading them right, the plans also show all the new construction will be with concrete curb and asphalt pavement instead of the (poor condition) concrete pavement that currently exists.  Interesting because when the corresponding portion of nbd BL I-75 east of Opdyke Road was reconstructed several years ago, that was done with concrete pavement.

Google Maps:  https://maps.app.goo.gl/cqFdXjBK4Ejx1j697

[afguy]

Hopefully MDOT ignores Ann Arbor...US-23 should have been widened decades ago.

Ann Arbor voices opposition to widening U.S. 23 highway

In a resolution approved unanimously Monday night, Oct. 16, City Council called on MDOT to implement a highway design that does not include adding any new lanes or other actions that would increase private vehicle traffic volumes.

The city also wants to make sure MDOT gives close attention to the mobility needs of people walking, biking and riding buses, citing a goal to reduce driving in the city by 50% by 2030 as part of the city's quest to reduce carbon emissions. MDOT announced earlier this year it was launching a major study for the U.S. 23 corridor between M-14 and I-94 with plans to replace bridges and possibly widen the highway, saying it carries about 70,000 vehicles on a typical weekday and there's traffic congestion, including backups at exit ramps. The agency has been reviewing several alternatives to go from two to three lanes in each direction, including flex lanes similar to what exists on U.S. 23 north of Ann Arbor to relieve congestion during peak hours, high-occupancy vehicle lanes to promote carpooling, and other options.

MDOT has indicated it plans to finalize a design in 2025 for construction in 2026 through 2028.

The project represents "a generational $250 million investment" in rebuilding 1960s-era stretches of U.S. 23, council stated in its resolution, calling on MDOT to prioritize safe connections at several U.S. 23 crossing points that were designed decades ago for high-speed motor vehicle movement without accommodations for people walking and biking.

"Really what we're asking of MDOT is for them to take this reconstruction as an opportunity to connect what has been divided and create safe, accessible options for people walking, biking and rolling to cross this freeway," said Council Member Dharma Akmon, D-4th Ward.

https://www.mlive.com/news/ann-arbor/2023/10/ann-arbor-voices-opposition-to-widening-us-23-highway.html