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U.S. 301 toll road project in Delaware

Started by Alex, March 22, 2009, 11:21:28 AM

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Alex4897

Quote from: NJRoadfan on December 03, 2015, 03:55:49 PM
Anyone care to guess what DE will number the spur to the Summit Point Bridge while we are at it?

US 301 spur if anything at all. I could see it being signed as "TO 301" and "TO 896" for south / northbound traffic respectively.
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cpzilliacus

#76
Quote from: Alex4897 on December 03, 2015, 07:46:28 PM
Quote from: NJRoadfan on December 03, 2015, 03:55:49 PM
Anyone care to guess what DE will number the spur to the Summit Point Bridge while we are at it?

US 301 spur if anything at all. I could see it being signed as "TO 301" and "TO 896" for south / northbound traffic respectively.

Won't DelDOT have to sign Alternate U.S. 301 somewhere when they get the "new" (and tolled) U.S. 301 completed?

Do you remember U.S. 301 North and U.S. 301 South in Delaware?

Response by Alex4897 at 9:21 PM 12/9 below, this was done to move US 301 Project info to the new topic
-Mark


Quote from: cpzilliacus on December 03, 2015, 08:47:35 PM
Quote from: Alex4897 on December 03, 2015, 07:46:28 PM
US 301 spur if anything at all. I could see it being signed as "TO 301" and "TO 896" for south / northbound traffic respectively.
Won't DelDOT have to sign Alternate U.S. 301 somewhere when they get the "new" (and tolled) U.S. 301 completed?

Do you remember U.S. 301 North and U.S. 301 South in Delaware?

Not personally, I wasn't around for that but I am aware of the history lol


Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

cpzilliacus

IMO, this deserves its own subject thread now.

I saw work getting started on the U.S. 301 toll road project last weekend. 

Silt fences and other preliminary work is starting along U.S. 301 north of the Delaware 299 intersection.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

The Ghostbuster

Could you provide some specifics on this toll road project? What are the two terminuses? Where is the general route? How far away is it from existing US 301? When might it be completed?

Alex4897

Quote from: The Ghostbuster on December 10, 2015, 04:41:50 PM
Could you provide some specifics on this toll road project? What are the two terminuses? Where is the general route? How far away is it from existing US 301? When might it be completed?

http://www.deldot.gov/information/projects/us301/
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Alex

Quote from: Alex4897 on December 10, 2015, 05:52:39 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on December 10, 2015, 04:41:50 PM
Could you provide some specifics on this toll road project? What are the two terminuses? Where is the general route? How far away is it from existing US 301? When might it be completed?

http://www.deldot.gov/information/projects/us301/

Work is slated to start next month and run through December 2018. Additional contracts on the project should be awarded by year's end. Only the contract for the northernmost segment has been awarded so far otherwise.

Mapmikey

Quote from: cpzilliacus on December 03, 2015, 08:47:35 PM
Quote from: Alex4897 on December 03, 2015, 07:46:28 PM
Quote from: NJRoadfan on December 03, 2015, 03:55:49 PM
Anyone care to guess what DE will number the spur to the Summit Point Bridge while we are at it?

US 301 spur if anything at all. I could see it being signed as "TO 301" and "TO 896" for south / northbound traffic respectively.

Won't DelDOT have to sign Alternate U.S. 301 somewhere when they get the "new" (and tolled) U.S. 301 completed?

Do you remember U.S. 301 North and U.S. 301 South in Delaware?

According to this - http://www.deldot.gov/information/projects/us301/pdfs/Section_4BC_Roll_Maps_9-6-2011_1.pdf - it will be 301 SPUR

Mike

TheOneKEA

This project is definitely going to make a big difference in the usage of US 301 as a bypass of I-95. I'll be interested in how traffic counts change on US 301 in Maryland as segments of this project are constructed and open up to traffic.

Are there any indications about what desgination will be assigned to the former US 301 mainline? Will it be replaced with a US Business route designation or will it become a state highway? The project page doesn't have any prominent info on this ropic.

Also, Section 3 extends into MD, presumably to eliminate the existing dual carriageway ending. One of the maps and the contract info claims that the contract ends at the state line but it's somewhat ambiguous; this map clearly shows the new dual carriageway segment that will be built in MD. Will that section be built by a DelDOT-selected contractor or an MDOT SHA-selected contractor?

Alps

Quote from: TheOneKEA on December 10, 2015, 09:28:55 PMthis map clearly shows the new dual carriageway segment that will be built in MD. Will that section be built by a DelDOT-selected contractor or an MDOT SHA-selected contractor?
I would imagine, for simplicity, DelDOT has a deal worked out with MdSHA where they can do the work on the MD side of the border, as long as they pay for it and meet MD standards.

TheOneKEA

Quote from: Alps on December 10, 2015, 09:56:11 PM
Quote from: TheOneKEA on December 10, 2015, 09:28:55 PMthis map clearly shows the new dual carriageway segment that will be built in MD. Will that section be built by a DelDOT-selected contractor or an MDOT SHA-selected contractor?
I would imagine, for simplicity, DelDOT has a deal worked out with MdSHA where they can do the work on the MD side of the border, as long as they pay for it and meet MD standards.

That makes sense, but I haven't seen that done before for a project that wasn't also being built by SHA (such as the Wilson Bridge). I'll have to head up there this winter and see if SHA posts one of their Billy Bollard work zone signs or if there's a DelDOT work zone sign instead.

froggie

Quote from: TheOneKEAThis project is definitely going to make a big difference in the usage of US 301 as a bypass of I-95.

Until those using it as such hit the hell that is the Bay Bridge, especially on summer weekends...

NJRoadfan

Last summer I used US-301 North on a Sunday morning as an I-95 bypass. The Bay Bridge and 50/301 freeway was busy, but moving without a problem.

froggie

You weren't heading west.  Or after about 10am.

Once completed, I would expect this to lengthen the delay times at the Bay Bridge.

NJRoadfan

It was likely before 10am, I hit a small backup at the eastern end of the bridge for some reason. Odd because it was right were the road widened to 4 lanes!

Even with the new road in Delaware, the tolls are significantly cheaper than taking I-95 northbound.

ARMOURERERIC

Quote from: froggie on December 11, 2015, 10:29:41 AM
You weren't heading west.  Or after about 10am.

Once completed, I would expect this to lengthen the delay times at the Bay Bridge.

Could this make a 3rd span an economic no-brainer.

TheOneKEA

Quote from: ARMOURERERIC on December 11, 2015, 11:51:15 AM
Quote from: froggie on December 11, 2015, 10:29:41 AM
You weren't heading west.  Or after about 10am.

Once completed, I would expect this to lengthen the delay times at the Bay Bridge.

Could this make a 3rd span an economic no-brainer.

I doubt a third span of the Bay Bridge could be paid for by any means other than an Act of Congress. If the Governor Nice Bridge replacement will cost $1.5 billion a third span at the Bay Bridge will likely cost twice that much. I woukd be amazed if the MdTA could fund both projects.

1995hoo

The environmental concerns with the Chesapeake, which is a very troubled estuary, would further increase the cost, likely by a substantial amount.
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commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

froggie

...and this would be at the same time that MdTA is trying to pay back the bonds used to build both the ICC and the I-95 ETL's northeast of Baltimore (roughly $2B total attributable to MdTA between the two projects).

Duke87

Quote from: froggie on December 11, 2015, 10:29:41 AM
You weren't heading west.  Or after about 10am.

Once completed, I would expect this to lengthen the delay times at the Bay Bridge.

The fair point is that the effectiveness of US 301 as a bypass route is dependent on timing.

If you're traveling on a summer weekend in the direction of beachgoing traffic, then yeah, you really don't want to do this.

If you are seeking to avoid I-95 because of weekday rush hour, because of travel for Thanksgiving or Christmas, because of winter weather, or even just because you really are sick of being on I-95, it can work decently.
If you always take the same road, you will never see anything new.

Henry

Quote from: Duke87 on December 11, 2015, 09:46:51 PM
Quote from: froggie on December 11, 2015, 10:29:41 AM
You weren't heading west.  Or after about 10am.

Once completed, I would expect this to lengthen the delay times at the Bay Bridge.

The fair point is that the effectiveness of US 301 as a bypass route is dependent on timing.

If you're traveling on a summer weekend in the direction of beachgoing traffic, then yeah, you really don't want to do this.

If you are seeking to avoid I-95 because of weekday rush hour, because of travel for Thanksgiving or Christmas, because of winter weather, or even just because you really are sick of being on I-95, it can work decently.
Agreed, especially with the last two statements. The majority of summer beach traffic would be going to either Rehoboth Beach or Ocean City, so this wouldn't work anyway. However, I can definitely see this highway take the pressure off I-95 if done right. Perhaps we'll see in three years from now.
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cpzilliacus

Quote from: froggie on December 11, 2015, 01:51:11 PM
...and this would be at the same time that MdTA is trying to pay back the bonds used to build both the ICC and the I-95 ETL's northeast of Baltimore (roughly $2B total attributable to MdTA between the two projects).

According to the Washington Post (here), the MdTA is  now collecting more revenue that it needs to maintain and operate Md. 200 and pay back the bonds that were issued to build it.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

froggie

However, they still have those bonds to pay off.  So until they get several years down that road (pun intended), it'll be a crimp on their bonding capacity.

cpzilliacus

Quote from: Alps on December 10, 2015, 09:56:11 PM
Quote from: TheOneKEA on December 10, 2015, 09:28:55 PMthis map clearly shows the new dual carriageway segment that will be built in MD. Will that section be built by a DelDOT-selected contractor or an MDOT SHA-selected contractor?
I would imagine, for simplicity, DelDOT has a deal worked out with MdSHA where they can do the work on the MD side of the border, as long as they pay for it and meet MD standards.

In a similar situation, MdTA's project planning documents for the replacement of the U.S. 301 Gov. Harry W. Nice Memorial Bridge has them reconstructing some of the approach on the Virginia side of the crossing to VDOT standards to meet-up with the new four lane structure starting at the Virginia shoreline.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

cpzilliacus

Quote from: froggie on December 14, 2015, 11:39:09 AM
However, they still have those bonds to pay off.  So until they get several years down that road (pun intended), it'll be a crimp on their bonding capacity.

MdTA's bonding capacity is set by state statute, not by the "natural" ability of the authority to pay back bondholders and keep everything well-maintained out of toll revenues.  Not the only time that the Maryland General Assembly has interfered with MdTA's finances (they were required by the legislature to remove the JFK Highway ramp tolls after the Northeast Expressway [as the JFK was originally named] bonds were paid-off in the early 1980's).
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

froggie

Quote from: cpzilliacus on December 14, 2015, 04:49:10 PM
Quote from: froggie on December 14, 2015, 11:39:09 AM
However, they still have those bonds to pay off.  So until they get several years down that road (pun intended), it'll be a crimp on their bonding capacity.

MdTA's bonding capacity is set by state statute, not by the "natural" ability of the authority to pay back bondholders and keep everything well-maintained out of toll revenues.  Not the only time that the Maryland General Assembly has interfered with MdTA's finances (they were required by the legislature to remove the JFK Highway ramp tolls after the Northeast Expressway [as the JFK was originally named] bonds were paid-off in the early 1980's).

Which just reinforces my comment even more.  Before MdTA can go off on another big project, they have to pay down some of the ICC and I-95 ETL, lest they hit their statutory bonding cap.



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