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New York

Started by Alex, August 18, 2009, 12:34:57 AM

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Beltway

Quote from: seicer on June 15, 2018, 12:40:23 PM
Quote from: Beltway on June 15, 2018, 12:04:14 PM
The part with the US-219 overlap was rehabbed and is excellent.  That is the only part I use.
What about US-219 south of I-86 to PA?  Old concrete pavement probably from the 1960s and in terrible condition, very bumpy.  When are they going to rehab that?
I-86 / NY 17 was built in 1980-1987 in the Salamanca area, whose construction was held up for years by the Senecas (for a variety of reasons). That pavement failed fairly quickly and was rehabilitated some two years ago after the project was delayed by the Senecas.

US 219 south of I-86 was twinned around the same time, so that concrete pavement is of the same age of I-86.

Well, still it is horrendous and needs major rebab and resurfacing.  What are they waiting for - Hell to freeze over?

Pennsylvania did a major rebab and resurfacing and replacement of bridge decks on the 10-mile US-219 Bradford Expressway about 5 years ago.  I believe it was originally built in the 1970s.  It was in likewise poor condition and in some places the pavement was completely replaced.  Now it is in very fine condition.
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)


seicer

#3726
If it was anything like rehabilitating I-86 by Salamanca or even constructing it decades ago, it's probably a tall order. (e.g. http://www.salamancapress.com/news/senecas-state-continue-to-battle-over-i--work/article_4a23530e-dce4-11e1-992f-001a4bcf887a.html ; It's even over trivial matters, like reference numbers: http://www.salamancapress.com/news/new-york-state-dot-crews-replace-mile-markers-with-signs/article_372368a0-bd73-11e7-94ec-d7ce264572c4.html)

It's partly the reason why the Thruway's pavement is in such horrible shape (with a lowered speed limit, even) through the reservation west of Buffalo. It's to the point that the Seneca refuses to acknowledge the Thruway and its legality, and where a cigarette shop owner is constructing (with no success) his own ramp to the interstate.

It's also why the US 219 freeway is stalled south of Springville to I-86. Some 22 miles of the alignment goes through the Seneca lands.

vdeane

22 miles?  I thought it was just a mile or so near the NY 17 interchange.  The reservation is pretty narrow; basically just a mile or two on either side along NY 17.  More like new freeway construction isn't a priority in NY right now.  This is probably why some have advocated to build the NY 17 interchange next, since it will be the most difficult part to build because of the reservation; they probably think that getting that part out of the way will make the state more likely to fill in the gap.

Quote from: seicer on June 14, 2018, 10:37:10 PM
As for the southernmost section, it was just rehabilitated. And by that, they just chunked out the worst aspects of it and replaced it with asphalt instead of doing full-depth concrete repairs, and then diamond grinded the whole thing. It is FAR smoother than before but still very much uneven. I've not seen pavement repairs done in such a manner, where asphalt is used instead of concrete for such repairs.
The Thruway does that between 44 and 45.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

webny99

Quote from: cl94 on June 15, 2018, 12:06:46 PM
Everything through Seneca land has been rehabbed within the past few years. I was on it last year and it was smooth.

Yep, I can confirm that, having driven I-86 from NY 36 to Allegany last October.
With the rehab complete, it's a really decent road from Exit 21 to Exit 23; lots of character and scenery; possibly even one of my favorite segments of I-86!

seicer

US 219's freeway will terminate where the US 219 interchange is now, it seems. I haven't read all of this document yet on it.

vdeane

I found the 22 mile figure.  That number is actually for I-86, not US 219.  Looks like the reason it was to end at Snake Run Road was to minimize the impact to the remainder of the corridor until final approval could be given to the small portion in the Seneca Nation.  My understanding is that a new interchange was to be built on I-86 (though still a diamond).
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

Buffaboy

Quote from: Beltway on June 15, 2018, 03:14:41 PM
Quote from: seicer on June 15, 2018, 12:40:23 PM
Quote from: Beltway on June 15, 2018, 12:04:14 PM
The part with the US-219 overlap was rehabbed and is excellent.  That is the only part I use.
What about US-219 south of I-86 to PA?  Old concrete pavement probably from the 1960s and in terrible condition, very bumpy.  When are they going to rehab that?
I-86 / NY 17 was built in 1980-1987 in the Salamanca area, whose construction was held up for years by the Senecas (for a variety of reasons). That pavement failed fairly quickly and was rehabilitated some two years ago after the project was delayed by the Senecas.

US 219 south of I-86 was twinned around the same time, so that concrete pavement is of the same age of I-86.

Well, still it is horrendous and needs major rebab and resurfacing.  What are they waiting for - Hell to freeze over?

Pennsylvania did a major rebab and resurfacing and replacement of bridge decks on the 10-mile US-219 Bradford Expressway about 5 years ago.  I believe it was originally built in the 1970s.  It was in likewise poor condition and in some places the pavement was completely replaced.  Now it is in very fine condition.

The Bradford Expressway is 10 miles? That doesn't sound right.
What's not to like about highways and bridges, intersections and interchanges, rails and planes?

My Wikipedia county SVG maps: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Buffaboy

Mr_Northside

Quote from: Buffaboy on June 22, 2018, 03:49:59 PM
The Bradford Expressway is 10 miles? That doesn't sound right.

True.   It looks to be about 5.5 miles.

https://goo.gl/maps/UKTdDmVes2U2

I don't have opinions anymore. All I know is that no one is better than anyone else, and everyone is the best at everything

vdeane

Maybe they're adding together both carriageways?
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

Beltway

Quote from: Mr_Northside on June 22, 2018, 04:37:45 PM
Quote from: Buffaboy on June 22, 2018, 03:49:59 PM
The Bradford Expressway is 10 miles? That doesn't sound right.
True.   It looks to be about 5.5 miles.
https://goo.gl/maps/UKTdDmVes2U2

My point was that they did a nice job on the rehab.
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

02 Park Ave

The current (2018) highway map issued by PENNDOT shows the Bradford to be ~5.5 miles in length.
C-o-H

J N Winkler

Quote from: Michael on September 27, 2017, 06:55:55 PMJN, where did you find the archived plans?  I only saw the current plans.

Apologies for the very late answer:  the archive is at the same place as the current plans.  883 projects are now available, all the way back to 2015-04-09.

I've fine-tuned my downloader still further since the revision discussed upthread still required one findstr call per project to determine whether it was blocked out.  One refinement includes a subroutine that does a simple date test to exclude all projects with bid opening earlier than the first day of the last month; at this point (late in the current month, so about fifty days away from cutoff date) this cuts the 883 projects down to about 50.  Time to confect a list of URLs to download is about the same, but the time gap between completion of the URL list and start of download (when checking old projects against the blockout list happens) should be shorter since only ~50 projects are being checked, not all 883.
"It is necessary to spend a hundred lire now to save a thousand lire later."--Piero Puricelli, explaining the need for a first-class road system to Benito Mussolini

Mccojm

#3737
Reported by newsday that governor cuomo and NYSDOT are no longer pursuing a cross sound bridge or tunnel between Long Island and westchester or Connecticut. I'd say they realized the $50B price tag was ridiculous to even fathom when our roads are crumbling and there's so many other priorities that could use funding first

https://www.newsday.com/long-island/long-island-sound-tunnel-state-dot-1.19476581
My expressed thoughts do not reflect those of NYSDOT, other associated agencies or firms.  Do not take anything I say as official unless it is released by said agencies.

NYSDOT R10 Long Island construction Group since 2013.

Beltway

Quote from: Mccojm on June 28, 2018, 10:37:29 PM
Reported by newsday that governor cuomo and NYSDOT are no longer pursuing a cross sound bridge or tunnel between Long Island and westchester or Connecticut. I'd say they realized the $50B price tag was ridiculous to even fathom when our roads are crumbling and there's so many other priorities that could use funding first
https://www.newsday.com/long-island/long-island-sound-tunnel-state-dot-1.19476581

Proposed a few months ago and now suddenly canceled?  Baalloooohhh-NEY!

That just proves my previous assessment that the $55 billion cost was a ridiculously over-pumped figure designed to kill the project before it even barely started.
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

seicer

...politics too. Cuomo is running for governor and has presidential aspirations.

Rothman

Duh.

The study was just to appease another recent upswell for the idea.

It wasn't taken seriously before the study, during or after.  And, in the end, it became just another mechanism to line a contractor's pockets with cash.

A total waste all around that is a good example of the drawbacks of American democracy:  A small group of vocal rich idiots can cause tax dollars to be totally wasted through their disproportionate influence to the detriment of the entire society.

(personal opinion emphasized)
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

seicer

And is another example of why these types of projects can cost $55 billion. Or why any project in that region can seemingly cost 3 to 4 times as much as anywhere else: politics and "studies."

Rothman

Well, I don't think the study has much to do with the tunnel's actual cost.

It was more of a waste in terms of it studying what was obvious to a whole lot of people.

Studies can be quite defensible in how to resolve complex issues with transportation infrastructure.

(personal opinion emphasized)
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

Beltway

How in-depth was this "study"?  Is it posted online? 

Or was it just a back-of-an-envelope thing intended to appease someone?
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

seicer

I'm curious as to how it would cost $55 billion. Would the CBBT be anywhere near that cost in both the original construction dollars inflated for today's prices - and if the project was begun today instead of decades ago?

Mccojm

#3745
Quote from: seicer on June 29, 2018, 08:49:48 AM
And is another example of why these types of projects can cost $55 billion. Or why any project in that region can seemingly cost 3 to 4 times as much as anywhere else: politics and "studies."

Everything costs more here due to the government red tape, the costs of everything is higher from materials to transporting good to closing roads and labor unions that negotiate high wages for their workers (not against unions but it does add significant costs and time to projects as witnessed first hand such as a OE needs to be on site to turn on a generator at 7am and off at 330pm and sit in their vehicle sleeping all day getting paid full wage because they "claimed"  that equipment and other tradesmen cannot operate it.) its just a fact of life here

We all know the $55B price tag was just a conservative arbitrary number that would most likely get blown way out of the water like the tappan zee bridge or mta ESA project. Idk where cuomo thinks the money is coming from between the new tappan zee Bridge, the refurbishment of LaGuardia airport costing billions, the multiple lirr/may projects including ESA, 2nd ave subway, adding tracks on mainline w/ grade elimination, and now a $1.5B AirTrain for LaGuardia airport. When he announced this tunnel everyone just laughed

Also, this project was never going to happen with the opposition of residents in oyster bay with lots of money and political influence as well as enrinmental road blocks. The other option out of Kings park at north end of sunken meadow pkwy was a pipe dream too, you'd have to completely revamp the pkwy to interstate standards from I495 north to the new bridge/tunnel as well as deal with environmental issues there being you have sunken meadow state park and very popular beach front there.
My expressed thoughts do not reflect those of NYSDOT, other associated agencies or firms.  Do not take anything I say as official unless it is released by said agencies.

NYSDOT R10 Long Island construction Group since 2013.

SignBridge

The only way we could afford the price tag for this project would be with mostly Federal funding. I agree it's regrettable that a small number of affluent North Shore residents can politically stop a much needed project like this. Shame on them for being so shortsighted.

Personally I would rather see a bridge than a tunnel. Probably be less expensive to build and could easily be made aesthetically pleasing. And would be more interesting to drive. Can you imagine how boring the ride through such a long tunnel would be?

Rothman

The idea that this crossing is needed is poppycock.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

Alps

Quote from: Rothman on June 29, 2018, 09:41:07 PM
The idea that this crossing is needed is poppycock.

I happen to agree - the Throgs/Whitestone combo are adequate for western LI compared to many of the other regional roads. A crossing closer to I-91 would make much more sense.

vdeane

The only thing is, NYC is basically perpetual gridlock, at least during the day.  Even worse if the MTA decides to close a lane on every single one of their bridges at the same time.  Long Island has no good way to bypass this.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.



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