Virginia

[Mapmikey]

What 50+ years will do to modern Interstate highway bridges.  Those were opened in 1965 and photos thereof were on some of the VDH recruiting brochures back then, picturesque bridges on a sag vertical curve with interesting girder designs and hammerhead pier designs.

Here are pictures from its opening day in Nov 1965 (WSTS screen shots):

[Beltway]

What 50+ years will do to modern Interstate highway bridges.  Those were opened in 1965 and photos thereof were on some of the VDH recruiting brochures back then, picturesque bridges on a sag vertical curve with interesting girder designs and hammerhead pier designs.

Here are pictures from its opening day in Nov 1965 (WSTS screen shots):
http://www.vahighways.com/81newriver.jpg
http://www.vahighways.com/81newriver2.jpg
http://www.vahighways.com/81newriver3.jpg

Yes, that is what I remember from the VDH recruiting brochure, with the bulb-shaped girders where they rest on the bearing seats.

I wonder if they widened the bridge to put a right shoulder on it.
The girders look different today --
http://www.southwesttimes.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/I-81-bridge-New-River-web.jpg

The parapets were replaced, they have a Jersey Barrier shape today, whereas originally they had a barrier curb and a vertical wall.

It is definitely the same bridge in each photo, verified by the VA-232 bridge and roadway in the background.

[74/171FAN]

Construction at the I-95/VA 3 interchange is going to begin June 26th.  (from Fredericksburg.com)

[LM117]

I noticed that one of the GOP candidates for governor, Frank Wagner, is still pushing for upgrading US-58 to an interstate. Apparently, he sees I-87 as a threat to southside VA.

http://www.martinsvillebulletin.com/news/five-questions-virginia-governor-s-race/article_6079aeb8-4d6f-11e7-a900-5fb019268592.html

1. In every election, the economy comes up as a major concern. But when voters go through a candidate's economic plan, they often don't see how it would help them. Please give specific examples of how your plan would benefit places like Martinsville, Henry and Patrick counties.

Frank Wagner- What we've been doing in the General Assembly is treating symptoms of a bad economy down here. We haven't come down here and cured the disease. The disease is gonna take an investment in infrastructure. You have to upgrade Route 58 to interstate quality. If we don't do that, North Carolina will just rip us up. They're already proposing a highway parallel to 58, coming up to the city of Chesapeake. If they do that, all the economic development won't be here, it'll be in North Carolina. You need connectivity, you've got to have the highway infrastructure. We also need to straighten out 220 and get started on Interstate 73. Now we can't get a bill in four years, we can't even get a permit, but you can get I-73 to where it can't be stopped. We also need more technical courses and diplomas at New College Institute, to increase K-12 funding with a bigger emphasis on career technical education and to look at creating an inland port in Pittsylvania County. We also need free trade zones here. What that does is reduce the tariffs and things like that to attract overseas investment.

[Jmiles32]

Construction at the I-95/VA 3 interchange is going to begin June 26th.  (from Fredericksburg.com)

IMO a flyover would be better from VA-3 eastbound to I-95 northbound. VA-3 has enough traffic lights already as it is. However this would have increased costs significantly and as a result caused the project to not score well in Virginia's new Smart Scale program.

All in all glad to see VDOT is at least doing something to fix the troublesome interchange and would much rather have this design then another more expensive one; which could have likely ended up similar to Northbound Rappahannock River Crossing project problem and not gotten any funding. Hopefully VDOT will be able to save some extra money on this project​ so they can then expedite planning and construction on a new I-95 interchange (likely a diamond or DDI) at Harrison Road, a few miles south, which I bet also helps relieve Exit 130 tremendously.

[Jmiles32]

I noticed that one of the GOP candidates for governor, Frank Wagner, is still pushing for upgrading US-58 to an interstate. Apparently, he sees I-87 as a threat to southside VA.

http://www.martinsvillebulletin.com/news/five-questions-virginia-governor-s-race/article_6079aeb8-4d6f-11e7-a900-5fb019268592.html

1. In every election, the economy comes up as a major concern. But when voters go through a candidate's economic plan, they often don't see how it would help them. Please give specific examples of how your plan would benefit places like Martinsville, Henry and Patrick counties.

Frank Wagner- What we've been doing in the General Assembly is treating symptoms of a bad economy down here. We haven't come down here and cured the disease. The disease is gonna take an investment in infrastructure. You have to upgrade Route 58 to interstate quality. If we don't do that, North Carolina will just rip us up. They're already proposing a highway parallel to 58, coming up to the city of Chesapeake. If they do that, all the economic development won't be here, it'll be in North Carolina. You need connectivity, you've got to have the highway infrastructure. We also need to straighten out 220 and get started on Interstate 73. Now we can't get a bill in four years, we can't even get a permit, but you can get I-73 to where it can't be stopped. We also need more technical courses and diplomas at New College Institute, to increase K-12 funding with a bigger emphasis on career technical education and to look at creating an inland port in Pittsylvania County. We also need free trade zones here. What that does is reduce the tariffs and things like that to attract overseas investment.

Wagner is definitely the infastucture candidate, no doubt about it. Not only does he want to turn much of US-58 in Virginia into an interstate ( I-58 kinda has a nice ring to it), he also wants to...
- Finish widening I-64 between Norfolk and Richmond
- Widen I-81 either around the Roanoke area or throughout the entire state
- Build the Coalfields expressway
- Build I-73
- Move past building Express Toll Lanes
- Build 2 new inland ports in Southside and Southwest Virginia

Not sure how just a gas tax increase would pay for all this, but as a roadgeek I'm definitely interested. At this point I'm actually surprised he hasn't mentioned​ turning US-29 south of I-66 into an interstate.

[amroad17]

The only section of US 58 that would need to be an interstate highway would be from South Hill at I-85 to Bowers Hill in Chesapeake.
Maybe from Danville to Bowers Hill at the most.  Some sections could be upgraded on the spot, however, there are many sections that would have to be built on new terrain.

This would be something to see if it became reality.  US 58 transitioning to I-58 and then back to US 58 again.  Not sure if this has been done before...I'm sorry, US 41/I-41/US 41. 

Fictional territory here...

If this ever became reality, would I-58 replace I-264?  Then VA 44 could be used to replace US 58 from Bowers Hill to Va. Beach. 

[LM117]

I noticed that one of the GOP candidates for governor, Frank Wagner, is still pushing for upgrading US-58 to an interstate. Apparently, he sees I-87 as a threat to southside VA.

http://www.martinsvillebulletin.com/news/five-questions-virginia-governor-s-race/article_6079aeb8-4d6f-11e7-a900-5fb019268592.html

1. In every election, the economy comes up as a major concern. But when voters go through a candidate's economic plan, they often don't see how it would help them. Please give specific examples of how your plan would benefit places like Martinsville, Henry and Patrick counties.

Frank Wagner- What we've been doing in the General Assembly is treating symptoms of a bad economy down here. We haven't come down here and cured the disease. The disease is gonna take an investment in infrastructure. You have to upgrade Route 58 to interstate quality. If we don't do that, North Carolina will just rip us up. They're already proposing a highway parallel to 58, coming up to the city of Chesapeake. If they do that, all the economic development won't be here, it'll be in North Carolina. You need connectivity, you've got to have the highway infrastructure. We also need to straighten out 220 and get started on Interstate 73. Now we can't get a bill in four years, we can't even get a permit, but you can get I-73 to where it can't be stopped. We also need more technical courses and diplomas at New College Institute, to increase K-12 funding with a bigger emphasis on career technical education and to look at creating an inland port in Pittsylvania County. We also need free trade zones here. What that does is reduce the tariffs and things like that to attract overseas investment.

Wagner is definitely the infastucture candidate, no doubt about it. Not only does he want to turn much of US-58 in Virginia into an interstate ( I-58 kinda has a nice ring to it), he also wants to...
- Finish widening I-64 between Norfolk and Richmond
- Widen I-81 either around the Roanoke area or throughout the entire state
- Build the Coalfields expressway
- Build I-73
- Move past building Express Toll Lanes
- Build 2 new inland ports in Southside and Southwest Virginia

Not sure how just a gas tax increase would pay for all this, but as a roadgeek I'm definitely interested. At this point I'm actually surprised he hasn't mentioned​ turning US-29 south of I-66 into an interstate.

He probably hasn't mentioned US-29 because of the strong opposition it would bring, particulary from the Charlottesville area. On the other hand, Lynchburg and Danville would be very happy about it. Those two cities already blame Charlottesville for being a bottleneck.

[LM117]

The only section of US 58 that would need to be an interstate highway would be from South Hill at I-85 to Bowers Hill in Chesapeake.
Maybe from Danville to Bowers Hill at the most.  Some sections could be upgraded on the spot, however, there are many sections that would have to be built on new terrain.

This would be something to see if it became reality.  US 58 transitioning to I-58 and then back to US 58 again.  Not sure if this has been done before...I'm sorry, US 41/I-41/US 41. 

Fictional territory here...

If this ever became reality, would I-58 replace I-264?  Then VA 44 could be used to replace US 58 from Bowers Hill to Va. Beach. 

Based on Wagner's answer about helping Henry County, he'll probably want the interstate to begin at I-77. He wouldn't have much support otherwise. The area already feels like they've been neglected in favor of other parts of the state, so I highly doubt he would begin the interstate at I-85 and leave out the rest of southside VA.

If US-58 ever does become an interstate, which is unlikely IMO, I also think it should take over I-264. Not mention that I-87 could easily take over I-464, so that would eliminate two I-x64's.

Either way, upgrading US-58 would not be easy and there would probably be opposition from some of the small speed traps towns that would be bypassed by the interstate.

[cpzilliacus]

If US-58 ever does become an interstate, which is unlikely IMO, I also think it should take over I-264. Not mention that I-87 could easily take over I-464, so that would eliminate two I-x64's.

IMO, an upgraded U.S. 58 does not need to be an Interstate. An expressway-type road (like the West Virginia ADHS corridors like Corridors G and H) would be fine.

[plain]

I agree to an extent with both amroad17 and cpzilliacus on the US 58 thing.

If there was ever a time when US 58 is upgraded to an interstate then from South Hill eastward would be just fine. Anything west of South Hill would be absolutely ridiculous. I seriously doubt an interstate corridor along southern Virginia would help boost the fortunes of the cities/towns Wagner is trying to target.

But if US 58 never becomes an interstate then the least the state can do is build a bypass of Brodnax and upgrade or bypass the section between the Franklin Bypass and the Suffolk Bypass.

Aslo a folded diamond interchange could be built at LaCrosse... this would at least eliminate 1 of the 3 traffic signals on 58 between I-85 and I-95.

[amroad17]

US 58 is sort of like US 48, OH 32, or US 35 between Emporia and Courtland now.

If this endeavor became reality, this freeway would probably have to be signed with an I-number if the 90/10 method is used.  I wouldn't care if this was signed as US 58 instead of having an I-58.  Then, possibly, VDOT could sign the old US 58 portions as VA 44--even if they are discontinuous (ala MD 144 on the old US 40 alignments).

[Beltway]

US 58 is sort of like US 48, OH 32, or US 35 between Emporia and Courtland now.

US-58 between I-95 and I-64/I-264/I-464 -- 35% of the distance is limited access.  30% of the distance is full freeway.

There is a connect-the-bypasses project in study that would make a seamless freeway between the Courtland and Franklin bypasses.  The current interchange project at the east end of the Courtland Bypass would accommodate that.  The west end of the Franklin Bypass was built with right-of-way for a future interchange, and that would be built under this proposal.  A new alignment would be built to the north of the existing nonlimited-access highway.  I surmise that at about 2.5 miles in length that this project is modest enough in cost that it may be built in the near future.  This would be a worthwhile project.

This US-58 6-lane widening project is in the Six-Year Program for 2021 advertisement --

Route 58/Holland Road Improvements
The 3.1 mile widening project will provide an additional travel lane both east and west bound from Route 58/13/32 bypass to approximately 0.7mile west of Manning Bridge Road. There will be intersection and traffic signal upgrades. The project will also include a separated bikeway or multi-use path to accommodate pedestrians and bicyclists along the corridor. The City of Suffolk will administer all roles with state oversight.
http://www.virginiadot.org/projects/hamptonroads/route_58-holland_road_improvements.asp

[Jmiles32]

http://www.roanoke.com/opinion/editorials/editorial-wagner-talks-southwest-virginia/article_99c33412-9d3b-5921-afef-430ee7242162.html

If nothing else, Wagner is asking questions other candidates aren't. Such as this one: "Why isn't there more economic growth around Interstate 77?"  he asks. He's mystified why Wytheville doesn't have more going on where I-77 and I-81 intersect. "That's the only place where I've seen two interstate criss-cross and not have economic activity,"  Wagner says. He wants to know why, and says as governor he'd try to find out why – and fix it.

I found this statement to be very intriguing and am wondering
A. Is this statement valid?
B. If it is valid, then why?

[1995hoo]

I voted for Wagner even though I knew he wouldn't win. He was the only one with anything worthwhile to say about transportation, and I think there's something valid to the idea that if you want transportation improvements you have to be willing to pay for them. That's not a popular statement with many voters, but it's correct.

[LM117]

I voted for Wagner even though I knew he wouldn't win. He was the only one with anything worthwhile to say about transportation, and I think there's something valid to the idea that if you want transportation improvements you have to be willing to pay for them. That's not a popular statement with many voters, but it's correct.

Indeed. It was refreshing to hear. Oh well, it was good while it lasted. Back to the status quo.

[kkt]

Hey, it's the thought police!

I think it's the Thought Police's plainclothes Snark Division.

[cpzilliacus]

I voted for Wagner even though I knew he wouldn't win. He was the only one with anything worthwhile to say about transportation, and I think there's something valid to the idea that if you want transportation improvements you have to be willing to pay for them. That's not a popular statement with many voters, but it's correct.

I presume that the  Democratic nominee, Lt. Gov. Ralph Northham, knows something about expensive  infrastructure by personal experience, given he is a native of  Accomack County, and getting to "mainland" Virginia by road requires crossing the Chesapeake Bay via the CBBT - or heading north into Maryland and then across the WPL [Bay] Bridge.

It is reasonable to assume that he made the crossing quite a few times during his college years (his online bio says he  was a cadet at the Virginia Military  Institute in Lexington).

[AlexandriaVA]

I voted for Wagner even though I knew he wouldn't win. He was the only one with anything worthwhile to say about transportation, and I think there's something valid to the idea that if you want transportation improvements you have to be willing to pay for them. That's not a popular statement with many voters, but it's correct.

I heard radio ads from him the days leading up to Primary Day talking about improvements to, by name, highways, Metro and VRE. These ads almost certainly were targeted to the NOVA market. I was curiously surprised to hear a Republican gubnatorial hopeful talk so highly of infrastructure; probably reflects the ever-growing political influence of NOVA.

Mr. Stewart's radio spots were, by any measure, much more short on policy agendae.

[LM117]

I voted for Wagner even though I knew he wouldn't win. He was the only one with anything worthwhile to say about transportation, and I think there's something valid to the idea that if you want transportation improvements you have to be willing to pay for them. That's not a popular statement with many voters, but it's correct.

I heard radio ads from him the days leading up to Primary Day talking about improvements to, by name, highways, Metro and VRE. These ads almost certainly were targeted to the NOVA market. I was curiously surprised to hear a Republican gubnatorial hopeful talk so highly of infrastructure; probably reflects the ever-growing political influence of NOVA.

What impressed me with Wagner is that he not only addressed NOVA and the toll issues there, but unlike other candidates, he realized that other areas of the state beyond the 3 metro areas have infrastructure needs as well and addressed them too. I'm not saying I-shields need to start popping up everywhere, but it would've been nice to have a governor that looked after the rest of us as well.

[plain]

US 58 is sort of like US 48, OH 32, or US 35 between Emporia and Courtland now.

US-58 between I-95 and I-64/I-264/I-464 -- 35% of the distance is limited access.  30% of the distance is full freeway.

There is a connect-the-bypasses project in study that would make a seamless freeway between the Courtland and Franklin bypasses.  The current interchange project at the east end of the Courtland Bypass would accommodate that.  The west end of the Franklin Bypass was built with right-of-way for a future interchange, and that would be built under this proposal.  A new alignment would be built to the north of the existing nonlimited-access highway.  I surmise that at about 2.5 miles in length that this project is modest enough in cost that it may be built in the near future.  This would be a worthwhile project.

This US-58 6-lane widening project is in the Six-Year Program for 2021 advertisement --

Route 58/Holland Road Improvements
The 3.1 mile widening project will provide an additional travel lane both east and west bound from Route 58/13/32 bypass to approximately 0.7mile west of Manning Bridge Road. There will be intersection and traffic signal upgrades. The project will also include a separated bikeway or multi-use path to accommodate pedestrians and bicyclists along the corridor. The City of Suffolk will administer all roles with state oversight.
http://www.virginiadot.org/projects/hamptonroads/route_58-holland_road_improvements.asp

I definitely dig their plan for the section between the Courtland and Franklin bypasses and agree that it's a worthwhile project.

But I'm frowning upon that 6-laning of Holland Rd... I don't think that's going to cut it. There's already many homes and businesses in that 3 mile stretch with more to come so just simply widening that stretch will only provide a very temporary relief. There needs to be grade separation somewhere in the mix. Now that I've gone back and looked at the satellite image just to the north of that area again, there seems to be ample room for 2-lane carriageways on each side of the railroad tracks there (except at that distribution center at Kenyon Rd). This is where a new limited access highway could be routed, begining from the Suffolk bypass going westward, then eventually moving away from said railroad just before Kenyon Rd to eventually rejoin US 58 west of the development (and proposed 6 laned section) in question. I know, I'm just wishful thinking I guess, but I believe the state (or Suffolk) really should act in securing some ROW somewhere before this area turns into another US 29 Charlottesville situation.

[Beltway]

This US-58 6-lane widening project is in the Six-Year Program for 2021 advertisement --
Route 58/Holland Road Improvements
The 3.1 mile widening project will provide an additional travel lane both east and west bound from Route 58/13/32 bypass to approximately 0.7mile west of Manning Bridge Road. There will be intersection and traffic signal upgrades. The project will also include a separated bikeway or multi-use path to accommodate pedestrians and bicyclists along the corridor. The City of Suffolk will administer all roles with state oversight.
http://www.virginiadot.org/projects/hamptonroads/route_58-holland_road_improvements.asp

I definitely dig their plan for the section between the Courtland and Franklin bypasses and agree that it's a worthwhile project.

But I'm frowning upon that 6-laning of Holland Rd... I don't think that's going to cut it. There's already many homes and businesses in that 3 mile stretch with more to come so just simply widening that stretch will only provide a very temporary relief. There needs to be grade separation somewhere in the mix. Now that I've gone back and looked at the satellite image just to the north of that area again, there seems to be ample room for 2-lane carriageways on each side of the railroad tracks there (except at that distribution center at Kenyon Rd). This is where a new limited access highway could be routed, begining from the Suffolk bypass going westward, then eventually moving away from said railroad just before Kenyon Rd to eventually rejoin US 58 west of the development (and proposed 6 laned section) in question. I know, I'm just wishful thinking I guess, but I believe the state (or Suffolk) really should act in securing some ROW somewhere before this area turns into another US 29 Charlottesville situation.

The 3.1 mile widening project will include access management controls, and I believe that it will be a very substantial traffic improvement.

That said I do support studying a bypass extension that would connect the Holland Bypass and the Suffolk Bypass.

[amroad17]

If a freeway it built to connect the Suffolk Bypass to the Holland Bypass, the current end at the US 13 split would have to be reconfigured.  The freeway would have to run north of current US 58.  The tie-in at Holland would not be difficult to do. 

It would be nice if the Franklin-Courtland section was built.  It wouldn't seem to be a tremendous undertaking.

If this was ever completed, do you believe AASHTO would approve a 2di (I-58) or would they make it a 3di (I-595)?  I guess it would depend on how Virginia would submit the application.  If they submitted one having I-58 (assumption/example) go all the way to Va. Beach and supplanting I-264 (or following the Chesapeake/Va. Beach section of the Hampton Roads Beltway and then going to Va. Beach), then I believe AASHTO would approve a 2di.

As for the above paragraph, another fictional thought...

Have I-64 supplant I-264 from the Norfolk interchange to where I-264 currently ends in Va. Beach.  Have I-58 follow the southern loop of the HR Beltway to the current I-64/I-264 interchange in Norfolk.  This would get rid of the wrong direction I-64 to Bowers Hill (even though this is a rather interesting interstate novelty--which I dealt with and got used to, living 22 years in Chesapeake).

[plain]

Given the development just west of the US 58/13/58 BUS junction it would be nearly impossible to freeway Holland Rd in that area... a freeway would have to be on an entirely new ROW.

The only way I see an interstate ever being designated on US 58 is if it was interstate quality to at least I-95 (much better if it was to I-85 though as we discussed). And then it would most likely be a 2di. Anything less than that would be meh, given Virginia's history with interstate designations. Hell I'm still surprised about I-264 being allowed to get extended over VA 44's routing

[Beltway]

Given the development just west of the US 58/13/58 BUS junction it would be nearly impossible to freeway Holland Rd in that area... a freeway would have to be on an entirely new ROW.

The only way I see an interstate ever being designated on US 58 is if it was interstate quality to at least I-95 (much better if it was to I-85 though as we discussed). And then it would most likely be a 2di. Anything less than that would be meh, given Virginia's history with interstate designations. Hell I'm still surprised about I-264 being allowed to get extended over VA 44's routing

Virginia did get some relatively short but vital urban Interstate mileage additions to the original 1956 and 1968 Interstate system allocations.

I-664 between I-64/I-264 at Bowers Hill, and 2 miles north of south shore of Hampton Roads -- 11 miles.

I-264 Downtown Tunnel / Berkley Bridge expansion, parallel tunnel and parallel bridge, interchange upgrades -- 2.2 miles.

I-295 extension from Varina in Henrico County to I-95 south of Petersburg -- 16 miles.