News:

Thank you for your patience during the Forum downtime while we upgraded the software. Welcome back and see this thread for some new features and other changes to the forum.

Main Menu

I-495 and I-270 Managed Lanes

Started by davewiecking, July 11, 2018, 11:41:26 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Beltway

Quote from: sprjus4 on October 23, 2019, 04:28:56 PM
Quote from: Beltway on October 23, 2019, 04:00:24 PM
I've only rarely needed the HOT lanes at those times, the GP traffic is generally near full highway speed even if it gets really heavy at times.  But the HOT lanes do decent business at those times, a much more peaceful ride not having to deal with all that frequent interchange traffic along the way.
Just stick to the left lane and you avoid all of the interchanges. It's worked for me most times without interruption. It's only the right lane and maybe middle lane that gets impacted.
Can't just stay in the left lane if someone behind is overtaking, not unless want to risk a road rage incident, even if the probability is rather low.  Then sometimes a slow driver gets in the left lane and I want to get around.

The "even if it gets really heavy at times" often applies to all lanes.
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)


Beltway

Quote from: Jmiles32 on October 22, 2019, 01:40:55 PM
Here is an interactive map that MDOT released in order to help the public find which properties would be affected by this massive project: https://rkk.maps.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html?id=9c67313b31eb46fea59f0b14c7e6bf38
40 miles of upgraded Beltway ... that is going to be -expensive-.

Adding one lane each way or adding two lanes each way?
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

sprjus4

Quote from: Beltway on October 23, 2019, 04:49:37 PM
Can't just stay in the left lane if someone behind is overtaking, not unless want to risk a road rage incident, even if the probability is rather low.  Then sometimes a slow driver gets in the left lane and I want to get around.
When I'm in the left lane, I simply maintain the speed of the person in front of me without tailgating. If it's in heavy traffic and someone wants to overtake, they aren't going to get far. And most times when I'm in the left lane maintaining the speed of the person in front of me, we're generally traveling faster than the other two lanes. I'm not going to slow way down get over, just for them to get a whooping one car ahead.

Beltway

Quote from: sprjus4 on October 23, 2019, 05:03:44 PM
Quote from: Beltway on October 23, 2019, 04:49:37 PM
Can't just stay in the left lane if someone behind is overtaking, not unless want to risk a road rage incident, even if the probability is rather low.  Then sometimes a slow driver gets in the left lane and I want to get around.
When I'm in the left lane, I simply maintain the speed of the person in front of me without tailgating. If it's in heavy traffic and someone wants to overtake, they aren't going to get far. And most times when I'm in the left lane maintaining the speed of the person in front of me, we're generally traveling faster than the other two lanes. I'm not going to slow way down get over, just for them to get a whooping one car ahead.

That depends on how fast I am willing to go as to whether I will stay in the left lane.  With my speeds I tend more toward the other lanes.
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

sprjus4

#154
Quote from: Beltway on October 23, 2019, 04:56:46 PM
Quote from: Jmiles32 on October 22, 2019, 01:40:55 PM
Here is an interactive map that MDOT released in order to help the public find which properties would be affected by this massive project: https://rkk.maps.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html?id=9c67313b31eb46fea59f0b14c7e6bf38
40 miles of upgraded Beltway ... that is going to be -expensive-.

Adding one lane each way or adding two lanes each way?
Both alternatives are considered. Under the layers list, the symbol in the top right corner with three squares on top of each other, you can check one alternative at a time and see each.

The alternatives are -

Alternative 5 - 1 HO/T lane each way on both facilities.
Alternative 8 - 2 ETL lanes each way on I-495, 1 ETL and 1 HOV lane each way on I-270
Alternative 9 - 2 HO/T lanes each way on both facilities.
Alternative 10 - 2 ETL lanes each way on both facilities, plus an additional HOV lane each way on I-270.
Alternative 13B - 2 HO/T lanes each way on I-495, a 2-lane reversible HO/T facility on I-270.
Alternative 13C - 2 ETL lanes each way on I-495, a 2-lane reversible ETL facility, plus an additional HOV lane each way on I-270.

ETL implies tolls for all vehicle, and HO/T as is well known implies tolls for SOV and HOV-2, and free for HOV 3+.

IMO, Alternative 9 is the best alternative and would tie seamlessly with Transurban's lanes.




Whoever made the map chose a bad color to use for the relocated general purpose lanes & re-designed GP interchanges - it's a thin black line that can be hard to see. That's where the general purpose lanes would be relocated out to make room for the HO/T / ETL lanes.

sprjus4

One thing I don't care for in the proposal is the concept to eliminate the Local-Thru setup on I-270 in favor of tolled "thru" / Express lanes.

If they want HO/T lanes through there, don't mess with the existing layout, expand it outwards and squeeze them in, or don't build it at all. 2 Local + 3 Thru + 2 HO/T each way is the way to go, not 5 GP + 2 HO/T. If room is an issue, then elevate them. Not a foreign concept, though RE/T groups and NIMBY may complain.

Beltway

Quote from: sprjus4 on October 23, 2019, 05:15:39 PM
Quote from: Beltway on October 23, 2019, 04:56:46 PM
40 miles of upgraded Beltway ... that is going to be -expensive-.
Adding one lane each way or adding two lanes each way?
Both alternatives are considered. Under the layers list, the symbol in the top right corner with three squares on top of each other, you can check one alternative at a time and see each.
The alternatives are -
Alternative 5 - 1 HO/T lane each way on both facilities.
Alternative 8 - 2 ETL lanes each way on I-495, 1 ETL and 1 HOV lane each way on I-270
Alternative 9 - 2 HO/T lanes each way on both facilities.
I see there would be a large noise footprint that would impact hundreds of houses. 

Just to connect VA to I-270 Spur would probably cost over $1 billion for #9.

Hard to imagine how much all the rest would cost.

I would recommend moving as fast as possible on VA to I-270 Spur.
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

famartin

Quote from: sprjus4 on October 23, 2019, 05:03:44 PM
Quote from: Beltway on October 23, 2019, 04:49:37 PM
Can't just stay in the left lane if someone behind is overtaking, not unless want to risk a road rage incident, even if the probability is rather low.  Then sometimes a slow driver gets in the left lane and I want to get around.
When I'm in the left lane, I simply maintain the speed of the person in front of me without tailgating.

Well we know why you get speeding tickets now  :-D

sprjus4

#158
Quote from: famartin on October 24, 2019, 10:30:39 AM
Quote from: sprjus4 on October 23, 2019, 05:03:44 PM
Quote from: Beltway on October 23, 2019, 04:49:37 PM
Can't just stay in the left lane if someone behind is overtaking, not unless want to risk a road rage incident, even if the probability is rather low.  Then sometimes a slow driver gets in the left lane and I want to get around.
When I'm in the left lane, I simply maintain the speed of the person in front of me without tailgating.

Well we know why you get speeding tickets now  :-D
Never gotten a ticket for that. The few times I've gotten tickets were mostly on wide open highway and usually only 10-15 over (i.e. 70 - 75 mph on a 60 mph highway, or 65 - 70 mph on a 55 mph highway, both in rural areas with high design quality that can reasonably be 70 mph and would be in certain states). I'm not some reckless driver who drives insane speeds. These were the few "exceptions" and in reality they're not that unreasonable. Usually I'll drive 5 - 10 mph over max, or in some states like Texas where speed limits are appropriately set, I generally will only go 2-5 mph over.

When I maintain, it's usually in heavier traffic so with everybody in the left lane doing 65 - 70 mph in a 55 mph zone with condensed traffic, the odds of getting stopped are low.

lepidopteran

Quote from: Jmiles32 on October 22, 2019, 01:40:55 PM
Here is an interactive map that MDOT released in order to help the public find which properties would be affected by this massive project: https://rkk.maps.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html?id=9c67313b31eb46fea59f0b14c7e6bf38
Wow!  A few observations.

  • There are a LOT of stormwater-mitigation ponds added, especially in the unused spaces between ramps.  I think these are required now for new highways (and other larger paved areas such as parking lots), particularly in areas with concerns about water quality -- in this case the Chesapeake Bay.  Though ironically, some of these ponds are in locations that have become mini-forests.
  • It looks like Pennsylvania Ave. is being converted from a full cloverleaf to a diamond.  And both Colesville Rd. and University Blvd. will have their remaining parclo loops replaced with missing diamond moves. (Is that wise, or even up to Interstate code, with them being so close together?) As would Georgia Ave.
  • For the I-95 interchange, a loop ramp is added from the park-and-ride/weigh station to the outer loop.  Not sure why.
  • The ramp to the Greenbelt Metro looks like it will be replaced.  But they also added the movement to/from the south, a project that's been on the drawing board for a while now.
  • There are some interchanges that could use improvement, but are not marked as such.  There doesn't seem to be anything in the works about the tight weave between US-50 and Route 450.  C/D lanes might help, but I think a braid is in order there.  Also, at the B/W Parkway, while the HO/T lanes get flyovers, the full cloverleaf for the main lanes is staying put!  Again, there does appear to be room for C/D lanes.

VTGoose

Quote from: sprjus4 on October 23, 2019, 05:03:44 PM
Quote from: Beltway on October 23, 2019, 04:49:37 PM
Can't just stay in the left lane if someone behind is overtaking, not unless want to risk a road rage incident, even if the probability is rather low.  Then sometimes a slow driver gets in the left lane and I want to get around.
When I'm in the left lane, I simply maintain the speed of the person in front of me without tailgating. If it's in heavy traffic and someone wants to overtake, they aren't going to get far. . . . I'm not going to slow way down get over, just for them to get a whooping one car ahead.

You know that and I know that, as do many other people. But there are those who don't get it and who in their mind believe they must go faster than everyone else (those DIG! -- Damn, I'm Good drivers) and anyone who doesn't move over for them is a left-lane blocker. You can't fix stupid.
"Get in the fast lane, grandma!  The bingo game is ready to roll!"

jeffandnicole

Quote from: VTGoose on October 25, 2019, 09:18:07 AM
Quote from: sprjus4 on October 23, 2019, 05:03:44 PM
Quote from: Beltway on October 23, 2019, 04:49:37 PM
Can't just stay in the left lane if someone behind is overtaking, not unless want to risk a road rage incident, even if the probability is rather low.  Then sometimes a slow driver gets in the left lane and I want to get around.
When I'm in the left lane, I simply maintain the speed of the person in front of me without tailgating. If it's in heavy traffic and someone wants to overtake, they aren't going to get far. . . . I'm not going to slow way down get over, just for them to get a whooping one car ahead.

You know that and I know that, as do many other people. But there are those who don't get it and who in their mind believe they must go faster than everyone else (those DIG! -- Damn, I'm Good drivers) and anyone who doesn't move over for them is a left-lane blocker. You can't fix stupid.


Well, if that person behind you managed to have enough room to merge over, pass, then merge back in, then guess what - the car sitting in the left lane was a left lane blocker.

And if multiple people manage to do the same thing, then you are truly a left lane blocker, and should have their license taken away.  Because at that point, they truly believe that it's their road, and they'll drive however they see fit.  They have no problem breaking one law - the speed limit - because they feel like they can drive at a speed they feel comfortable with.  At the same time, they'll stay in the left lane and feel that anyone passing them to get ahead of them is being an aggressive driver, when in fact they're often breaking a second law - failure to keep right.

VTGoose

#162
Quote from: jeffandnicole on October 25, 2019, 09:23:28 AM
Quote from: VTGoose on October 25, 2019, 09:18:07 AM
Quote from: sprjus4 on October 23, 2019, 05:03:44 PM
Quote from: Beltway on October 23, 2019, 04:49:37 PM
Can't just stay in the left lane if someone behind is overtaking, not unless want to risk a road rage incident, even if the probability is rather low.  Then sometimes a slow driver gets in the left lane and I want to get around.
When I'm in the left lane, I simply maintain the speed of the person in front of me without tailgating. If it's in heavy traffic and someone wants to overtake, they aren't going to get far. . . . I'm not going to slow way down get over, just for them to get a whooping one car ahead.

You know that and I know that, as do many other people. But there are those who don't get it and who in their mind believe they must go faster than everyone else (those DIG! -- Damn, I'm Good drivers) and anyone who doesn't move over for them is a left-lane blocker. You can't fix stupid.


Well, if that person behind you managed to have enough room to merge over, pass, then merge back in, then guess what - the car sitting in the left lane was a left lane blocker.

And if multiple people manage to do the same thing, then you are truly a left lane blocker, and should have their license taken away.  Because at that point, they truly believe that it's their road, and they'll drive however they see fit.  They have no problem breaking one law - the speed limit - because they feel like they can drive at a speed they feel comfortable with.  At the same time, they'll stay in the left lane and feel that anyone passing them to get ahead of them is being an aggressive driver, when in fact they're often breaking a second law - failure to keep right.

You missed the point -- the driver was traveling in the left lane, going faster than the traffic in the right two lanes, and maintaining the same speed as the car in front of him (at a safe distance -- and the front car probably had others ahead of him going the same speed). DIG! driver thinks he should go faster than everyone else, not that there is anywhere to go due to the line of traffic in the left lane. In that case, everyone is a Left Lane Blocker. The DIG! driver just needs to suck it up and stay in the same traffic as everyone else -- but the DIG! mentality says they have to be ahead of everyone else and will do whatever it takes to make it happen, such as weaving in and out of traffic and cutting off other drivers to force their way into a lane.
"Get in the fast lane, grandma!  The bingo game is ready to roll!"

sprjus4

Quote from: jeffandnicole on October 25, 2019, 09:23:28 AM
Quote from: VTGoose on October 25, 2019, 09:18:07 AM
Quote from: sprjus4 on October 23, 2019, 05:03:44 PM
Quote from: Beltway on October 23, 2019, 04:49:37 PM
Can't just stay in the left lane if someone behind is overtaking, not unless want to risk a road rage incident, even if the probability is rather low.  Then sometimes a slow driver gets in the left lane and I want to get around.
When I'm in the left lane, I simply maintain the speed of the person in front of me without tailgating. If it's in heavy traffic and someone wants to overtake, they aren't going to get far. . . . I'm not going to slow way down get over, just for them to get a whooping one car ahead.

You know that and I know that, as do many other people. But there are those who don't get it and who in their mind believe they must go faster than everyone else (those DIG! -- Damn, I'm Good drivers) and anyone who doesn't move over for them is a left-lane blocker. You can't fix stupid.


Well, if that person behind you managed to have enough room to merge over, pass, then merge back in, then guess what - the car sitting in the left lane was a left lane blocker.

And if multiple people manage to do the same thing, then you are truly a left lane blocker, and should have their license taken away.  Because at that point, they truly believe that it's their road, and they'll drive however they see fit.  They have no problem breaking one law - the speed limit - because they feel like they can drive at a speed they feel comfortable with.  At the same time, they'll stay in the left lane and feel that anyone passing them to get ahead of them is being an aggressive driver, when in fact they're often breaking a second law - failure to keep right.
First off, my initial comment was essentially what VTGoose just said - if you're in the left lane going the same speed as the people in front you in, in condensed traffic, still moving faster than the right two lanes.

And for the record, if I'm on a four-lane highway, and I'm in the left lane doing 65 mph and the person in the right lane is doing 62-63 mph and I'm approaching to make a pass and I'm already in the left lane, I'm going to maintain that. I'm not going to jump over to the right for 3 seconds to let one car (or more then I get trapped in the right lane) then back to the left. If somebody wants to gun it around me recklessly in the right lane as I'm approaching in the left lane passing somebody on the right, that's -there- problem.

If the right lane is blatantly clear though for a distance, I'll get over and stay right unless passing. But there's a lot of times in medium traffic that maintaining left is necessary to car after car after truck after car, etc. in the right lane, and while I'm legally passing, people still think they can fly up and force me (essentially they tailgate, flash, etc.) out of the lane and to slow way down to the speed of the people in the right lane to appease them. I'm not going to play that game. When my pass is complete, I'll get over when I can easily do so without decreasing -my- speed.

There's also been instances where I'll move over to the left if a car / truck is pulled over, and there's always that one car that comes up out of nowhere and passes to the right despite there being a stopped vehicle and my only reason for being over was for their safety and the fact I was going to get right back over.

People these days can be extremely impatient. Sure, if you're clear, do what you want, but don't get mad because other people want to pass at a slower speed then you do, especially if they're already speeding while passing which is most frequent.

Micro-passing is something I can't stand though, and never do it unless neccasary (I.E. the entire row of cars in the left lane is micro-passing the entire row of cars in the right lane, etc.)

BrianP

Enough with this off topic crap. 

A Transportation Q&A: Rahn Talks I-270, Partnerships, Growth and More

Rahn just keeps sidestepping the question about the American Legion bridge and the part of the beltway from there to I-270.

QuoteBB: There have been concerns expressed about widening the southern section of I-270 without also doing the same to adjacent stretch of I-495 between the so-called "western spur"  and the American Legion Bridge. Is adding that in this first phase potentially on the table?

Rahn: The governor's direction to us was to focus on 270. I understand there's a desire for connections elsewhere. I work for the governor. (smiles)

BB: Do you share the concerns of county officials that widening I-270 without doing the same to the western portion of the Beltway in Montgomery County could aggravate congestion?

Rahn: So, I'm not going to contradict the governor. I've been doing these jobs long enough. I've learned that's not good for your employment status. (laughs)
It sounds like they're even going to do the northern part of I-270 before the beltway.  That section of the beltway would probably be the highest revenue section of HOT lane in the state since it has the worst congestion problem.  So I'm surprised they are proposing it this way.  I wonder if they feel that doing that section of the beltway would exacerbate the congestion problem on the adjacent part of the beltway to I-95.  So they want to do that whole section of the beltway together.  Maybe they want/need to have another company expand the beltway than the one that expands I-270.

sprjus4

Quote from: BrianP on October 25, 2019, 04:43:11 PM
Enough with this off topic crap. 

A Transportation Q&A: Rahn Talks I-270, Partnerships, Growth and More

Rahn just keeps sidestepping the question about the American Legion bridge and the part of the beltway from there to I-270.

QuoteBB: There have been concerns expressed about widening the southern section of I-270 without also doing the same to adjacent stretch of I-495 between the so-called "western spur"  and the American Legion Bridge. Is adding that in this first phase potentially on the table?

Rahn: The governor's direction to us was to focus on 270. I understand there's a desire for connections elsewhere. I work for the governor. (smiles)

BB: Do you share the concerns of county officials that widening I-270 without doing the same to the western portion of the Beltway in Montgomery County could aggravate congestion?

Rahn: So, I'm not going to contradict the governor. I've been doing these jobs long enough. I've learned that's not good for your employment status. (laughs)
It sounds like they're even going to do the northern part of I-270 before the beltway.  That section of the beltway would probably be the highest revenue section of HOT lane in the state since it has the worst congestion problem.  So I'm surprised they are proposing it this way.  I wonder if they feel that doing that section of the beltway would exacerbate the congestion problem on the adjacent part of the beltway to I-95.  So they want to do that whole section of the beltway together.  Maybe they want/need to have another company expand the beltway than the one that expands I-270.
It was to reduce on impacts, as I-270 would have a lot less (under the current stupid IMO design) than I-495.

I-270's plan is to take the existing Local-Thru roadway, tear it up, make it one combined roadway (bad mistake IMO, but probably just to increase congestion & incentivise more drivers to pay up), and use the existing R/W fully to make a GP + HO/T setup.

If they want to build it properly, keep the Local-Thru Roadway, and widen out the footprint to accommodate everything, or build the HO/T lanes as an elevated facility overtop the existing GP lanes.

Beltway

#166
Quote from: BrianP on October 25, 2019, 04:43:11 PM
It sounds like they're even going to do the northern part of I-270 before the beltway.  That section of the beltway would probably be the highest revenue section of HOT lane in the state since it has the worst congestion problem. 
I-495 from VA to I-270 Spur would be the obvious best place to start, because of that congestion, and the fact that it would tie into the VA I-495 12-lane cross-section with a 4-2-2-4 lane configuration.  MSHA will have to decide whether to have one or two managed lanes added each way.

The southern crossing at WWB will be constrained by the fact that there is one managed lane each way built and reserved for future use, two lanes are not possible.  Even that lane could be taken by rail transit, but I would object to that due to the low demand for rail, and the ability for the managed lanes to accommodate bus transit.
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

sprjus4

Quote from: Beltway on October 25, 2019, 04:58:13 PM
The southern crossing at WWB will be constrained by the fact that there is one managed lane each way build and reserved for future use, two lanes are not possible.
Transurban can widen it by a lane each way.

Beltway

Quote from: sprjus4 on October 25, 2019, 04:58:56 PM
Quote from: Beltway on October 25, 2019, 04:58:13 PM
The southern crossing at WWB will be constrained by the fact that there is one managed lane each way build and reserved for future use, two lanes are not possible.
Transurban can widen it by a lane each way.
I don't think so.  The inner roadways have three 12-foot lanes, a 10-foot right shoulder, and a 6-foot left shoulder. 

That is 52 feet.  Painting it for 4 lanes would leave very little lateral clearance, and I would definitely oppose that.  The WWB needs the full right shoulders.
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

sprjus4

#169
Quote from: Beltway on October 25, 2019, 05:03:25 PM
Painting it
-Widen- it.

Even with the third stealth lane built in, you'd think they'd also provide a full outside shoulder along with it, not only 6 ft. The other overpasses along the project area feature a full stealth lane and full left shoulder, but the main bridge only has 6 ft.

IMO, if they wanted to go full out, 3 Thru + 2 Local + 2 HO/T each way. That would necessitate widening the bridges by 2 lanes each way.

froggie

^ Widening drawbridges isn't exactly easy or straightforward.  You'd have to replace the entire drawspan on both sides in both directions.  Or did you forget the Wilson Bridge is still a drawbridge?

sprjus4

Quote from: froggie on October 25, 2019, 05:07:48 PM
^ Widening drawbridges isn't exactly easy or straightforward.  You'd have to replace the entire drawspan on both sides in both directions.  Or did you forget the Wilson Bridge is still a drawbridge?
Fully aware it's a drawbridge, but personal insult (you seem to resort to those a lot) disregarded. It may not be easy, but it's possible, especially if VDOT and Transurban want to maintain their lanes across the bridge with a full setup.

Maybe pull a I-270 and eliminate the Local-Thru and just have 4 GP lanes then pull a I-95 and squeeze in 2 HO/T lanes with 11 foot lanes. To clarify, I would -not- recommend this, at least not eliminating the Local-Thru, but if I-270 is any indication, once HO/T lanes are put forth, who cares about Local-Thru, the Thru become the HO/T lanes and cost $$$ now.

froggie

Not intended as an insult...making sure you didn't overlook the primary complication at that location.  You and Scott hurl enough insults at each other as it is.

Stephane Dumas

Quote from: Jmiles32 on October 22, 2019, 01:40:55 PM
Here is an interactive map that MDOT released in order to help the public find which properties would be affected by this massive project: https://rkk.maps.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html?id=9c67313b31eb46fea59f0b14c7e6bf38

MD-5/Pennsylvania Avenue (full access)
MD-5/Branch Avenue (half access for now)
End of express toll lanes

Little mistake, Pennsylvania Av. is MD-4. ^^;

Beltway

Quote from: sprjus4 on October 25, 2019, 05:05:41 PM
Quote from: Beltway on October 25, 2019, 05:03:25 PM
Painting it
-Widen- it.
Even with the third stealth lane built in, you'd think they'd also provide a full outside shoulder along with it, not only 6 ft. The other overpasses along the project area feature a full stealth lane and full left shoulder, but the main bridge only has 6 ft.
IMO, if they wanted to go full out, 3 Thru + 2 Local + 2 HO/T each way. That would necessitate widening the bridges by 2 lanes each way.
There were compromises with local citizens groups that arrived at a 12-lane bridge, when alternatives from 8 lanes to 16 lanes were considered.  A 16-lane bridge would require 16-lane approaches and Alexandria would not agree to that.  Originally 10-foot left shoulders were planned but part of the compromises was to reduce the width of the bridge.  It is a monster of a bridge as it is.

Take a look at the design of the bridge, that would be rather tough to widen.

http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)



Opinions expressed here on belong solely to the poster and do not represent or reflect the opinions or beliefs of AARoads, its creators and/or associates.