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Author Topic: Strange habits you have  (Read 58959 times)

texaskdog

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Re: Strange habits you have
« Reply #400 on: May 26, 2021, 09:06:08 PM »

While I think education is important, the school system sorely lacks things they need to be teaching.  Public Speaking, budgeting, fixing a car, applying for jobs, etc.  People rip on watching TV but I watch a lot of things that educate and read a lot of books.  I choose to learn and learned little in school.

 

To me, those are not things schools should be teaching. Parents, in between working themselves, should be teaching those skills to their children. I should not be sent off at 18, 19, etc with no concept of budgeting just because I didn't take "BUDG 101".

The last one is a bit troubling, especially: schools should be about providing the knowledge and skills necessary to maintain and succeed at a job, not apply for a job.

Why shouldn't schools prepare kids for life in the world???  Why is driving a car something you have to learn after school when 98% of us do it?    How about basic self defense?  If parents can teach us those things they could also teach us other things.  If school does not prepare us for life what's the point?
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texaskdog

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Re: Strange habits you have
« Reply #401 on: May 26, 2021, 09:07:40 PM »

While I think education is important, the school system sorely lacks things they need to be teaching.  Public Speaking, budgeting, fixing a car, applying for jobs, etc.  People rip on watching TV but I watch a lot of things that educate and read a lot of books.  I choose to learn and learned little in school.

To me, those are not things schools should be teaching. Parents, in between working themselves, should be teaching those skills to their children. I should not be sent off at 18, 19, etc with no concept of budgeting just because I didn't take "BUDG 101".

The last one is a bit troubling, especially: schools should be about providing the knowledge and skills necessary to maintain and succeed at a job, not apply for a job.

Back in the day basic skills like home finance were part of home ec classes. Mine didn't really cover it—they mostly taught cooking, sewing, and abstinence-only sex ed.

I think a basic financial literacy class would probably serve the public better than one of the advanced calculus or trig classes. Cut one of those and make Finance mandatory to graduate instead. But of course it serves the big corporations better if nobody knows how interest works or how to avoid going into debt, so that's the real reason we don't teach that in school.

Applying for a job would be a kind of pointless class to teach. You can teach basic resume-writing skills as part of an English class, but the actual procedure for applying for jobs varies so much from company to company, and any more you don't even get an interview without your resume and/or cover letter scoring highly on whatever sort of algorithm the company uses to "grade" resumes. There's no good way to teach any of that.

I'm 52 and still not good at writing a resume or even good places to start applying for jobs.  I've fallen into every job I've ever had. 
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Roadgeekteen

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Re: Strange habits you have
« Reply #402 on: May 26, 2021, 09:36:39 PM »

While I think education is important, the school system sorely lacks things they need to be teaching.  Public Speaking, budgeting, fixing a car, applying for jobs, etc.  People rip on watching TV but I watch a lot of things that educate and read a lot of books.  I choose to learn and learned little in school.

 

To me, those are not things schools should be teaching. Parents, in between working themselves, should be teaching those skills to their children. I should not be sent off at 18, 19, etc with no concept of budgeting just because I didn't take "BUDG 101".

The last one is a bit troubling, especially: schools should be about providing the knowledge and skills necessary to maintain and succeed at a job, not apply for a job.

Why shouldn't schools prepare kids for life in the world???  Why is driving a car something you have to learn after school when 98% of us do it?    How about basic self defense?  If parents can teach us those things they could also teach us other things.  If school does not prepare us for life what's the point?
I was learning self-defense in gym class when covid shut the world down causing the unit to be cancelled.

texaskdog

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Re: Strange habits you have
« Reply #403 on: May 26, 2021, 11:07:30 PM »

While I think education is important, the school system sorely lacks things they need to be teaching.  Public Speaking, budgeting, fixing a car, applying for jobs, etc.  People rip on watching TV but I watch a lot of things that educate and read a lot of books.  I choose to learn and learned little in school.

 

To me, those are not things schools should be teaching. Parents, in between working themselves, should be teaching those skills to their children. I should not be sent off at 18, 19, etc with no concept of budgeting just because I didn't take "BUDG 101".

The last one is a bit troubling, especially: schools should be about providing the knowledge and skills necessary to maintain and succeed at a job, not apply for a job.

Why shouldn't schools prepare kids for life in the world???  Why is driving a car something you have to learn after school when 98% of us do it?    How about basic self defense?  If parents can teach us those things they could also teach us other things.  If school does not prepare us for life what's the point?
I was learning self-defense in gym class when covid shut the world down causing the unit to be cancelled.

FEAR of Covid shut the world down :P
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Roadgeekteen

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Re: Strange habits you have
« Reply #404 on: May 26, 2021, 11:31:56 PM »

While I think education is important, the school system sorely lacks things they need to be teaching.  Public Speaking, budgeting, fixing a car, applying for jobs, etc.  People rip on watching TV but I watch a lot of things that educate and read a lot of books.  I choose to learn and learned little in school.

 

To me, those are not things schools should be teaching. Parents, in between working themselves, should be teaching those skills to their children. I should not be sent off at 18, 19, etc with no concept of budgeting just because I didn't take "BUDG 101".

The last one is a bit troubling, especially: schools should be about providing the knowledge and skills necessary to maintain and succeed at a job, not apply for a job.

Why shouldn't schools prepare kids for life in the world???  Why is driving a car something you have to learn after school when 98% of us do it?    How about basic self defense?  If parents can teach us those things they could also teach us other things.  If school does not prepare us for life what's the point?
I was learning self-defense in gym class when covid shut the world down causing the unit to be cancelled.

FEAR of Covid shut the world down :P
Didn't learn self defense against covid.

Scott5114

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Re: Strange habits you have
« Reply #405 on: May 27, 2021, 02:23:54 AM »

I'm 52 and still not good at writing a resume or even good places to start applying for jobs.  I've fallen into every job I've ever had. 

A class probably wouldn't do you much good other than on the resume front. The places companies post jobs varies from industry to industry or even city to city as various job-posting websites add features and get more or less popular. If you know of a specific company you want to work at they usually have a Careers page on their website. If you just want to apply for everything that's available you'll have to check some combination of Monster, Indeed, ZipRecruiter, LinkedIn, or even Facebook to find everything. It's not like the old days when it's all on the classifieds job page.
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jakeroot

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Re: Strange habits you have
« Reply #406 on: May 27, 2021, 03:33:03 AM »

While I think education is important, the school system sorely lacks things they need to be teaching.  Public Speaking, budgeting, fixing a car, applying for jobs, etc.  People rip on watching TV but I watch a lot of things that educate and read a lot of books.  I choose to learn and learned little in school.

To me, those are not things schools should be teaching. Parents, in between working themselves, should be teaching those skills to their children. I should not be sent off at 18, 19, etc with no concept of budgeting just because I didn't take "BUDG 101".

The last one is a bit troubling, especially: schools should be about providing the knowledge and skills necessary to maintain and succeed at a job, not apply for a job.

Why shouldn't schools prepare kids for life in the world???  Why is driving a car something you have to learn after school when 98% of us do it?    How about basic self defense?  If parents can teach us those things they could also teach us other things.  If school does not prepare us for life what's the point?

I guess your view of "life in the world" is slightly different than my own. The way I see it, schools provide you with lots of knowledge in many different areas (human science courses included!) but the real world is not just fixing cars and defending one's self. Schools assist in teaching you what you want to do in life, and provide you with the knowledge and skills to go and work in an infinite number of fields, or even to continue into an undergrad, grad, or doctorate degree. School is not just teaching you basic life skills like car repair and budgeting. After all, those things are for people with jobs, and you need knowledge and skills to get a job, and a bunch of home-ec courses won't get you those things.

I'm not saying that courses like self-defense or car repair are worthless (they might come in handy but honestly, probably not, especially the latter given how unfriendly modern cars are to non-technicians), but I do think those are things that parents can teach their kids, and going to school should be about learning skills and developing knowledge that I don't think every parent possesses.
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jakeroot

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Re: Strange habits you have
« Reply #407 on: May 27, 2021, 03:36:31 AM »

Back in the day basic skills like home finance were part of home ec classes. Mine didn't really cover it—they mostly taught cooking, sewing, and abstinence-only sex ed.

I think a basic financial literacy class would probably serve the public better than one of the advanced calculus or trig classes. Cut one of those and make Finance mandatory to graduate instead. But of course it serves the big corporations better if nobody knows how interest works or how to avoid going into debt, so that's the real reason we don't teach that in school.

Applying for a job would be a kind of pointless class to teach. You can teach basic resume-writing skills as part of an English class, but the actual procedure for applying for jobs varies so much from company to company, and any more you don't even get an interview without your resume and/or cover letter scoring highly on whatever sort of algorithm the company uses to "grade" resumes. There's no good way to teach any of that.

Hmm, abstinence-only sex ed is definitely not the way of the game around here! I learned quite a lot in 5th grade.

A basic finance course may not be useless, but could it possibly be stretched out over ten weeks or whatever? I just don't see how it can't be rolled into any other home-ec courses (three weeks sex ed, four weeks budgeting, two weeks defensive driving, etc). Advanced calc or trig usually isn't a requirement for graduation (the furthest I went was pre-calc), but I think basic geometry and algebra are quite helpful whether we realize it or not; physics is particularly important when it comes to maneuvering a vehicle!
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jemacedo9

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Re: Strange habits you have
« Reply #408 on: May 27, 2021, 08:08:11 AM »

While I think education is important, the school system sorely lacks things they need to be teaching.  Public Speaking, budgeting, fixing a car, applying for jobs, etc.  People rip on watching TV but I watch a lot of things that educate and read a lot of books.  I choose to learn and learned little in school.

To me, those are not things schools should be teaching. Parents, in between working themselves, should be teaching those skills to their children. I should not be sent off at 18, 19, etc with no concept of budgeting just because I didn't take "BUDG 101".

The last one is a bit troubling, especially: schools should be about providing the knowledge and skills necessary to maintain and succeed at a job, not apply for a job.

Why shouldn't schools prepare kids for life in the world???  Why is driving a car something you have to learn after school when 98% of us do it?    How about basic self defense?  If parents can teach us those things they could also teach us other things.  If school does not prepare us for life what's the point?

I guess your view of "life in the world" is slightly different than my own. The way I see it, schools provide you with lots of knowledge in many different areas (human science courses included!) but the real world is not just fixing cars and defending one's self. Schools assist in teaching you what you want to do in life, and provide you with the knowledge and skills to go and work in an infinite number of fields, or even to continue into an undergrad, grad, or doctorate degree. School is not just teaching you basic life skills like car repair and budgeting. After all, those things are for people with jobs, and you need knowledge and skills to get a job, and a bunch of home-ec courses won't get you those things.

I'm not saying that courses like self-defense or car repair are worthless (they might come in handy but honestly, probably not, especially the latter given how unfriendly modern cars are to non-technicians), but I do think those are things that parents can teach their kids, and going to school should be about learning skills and developing knowledge that I don't think every parent possesses.
Why does it have to be one or the other? 

Why not both "knowledge of different areas" AND "real world skills"?

And what happens when parents don't teach their kids those things that you say they should?  Because many don't.  And that's not the kid's fault. They just get left to fend for themselves?  Is it a bad thing to make sure it's covered somehow?
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Roadgeekteen

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Re: Strange habits you have
« Reply #409 on: May 27, 2021, 10:22:49 AM »

Back in the day basic skills like home finance were part of home ec classes. Mine didn't really cover it—they mostly taught cooking, sewing, and abstinence-only sex ed.

I think a basic financial literacy class would probably serve the public better than one of the advanced calculus or trig classes. Cut one of those and make Finance mandatory to graduate instead. But of course it serves the big corporations better if nobody knows how interest works or how to avoid going into debt, so that's the real reason we don't teach that in school.

Applying for a job would be a kind of pointless class to teach. You can teach basic resume-writing skills as part of an English class, but the actual procedure for applying for jobs varies so much from company to company, and any more you don't even get an interview without your resume and/or cover letter scoring highly on whatever sort of algorithm the company uses to "grade" resumes. There's no good way to teach any of that.

Hmm, abstinence-only sex ed is definitely not the way of the game around here! I learned quite a lot in 5th grade.

A basic finance course may not be useless, but could it possibly be stretched out over ten weeks or whatever? I just don't see how it can't be rolled into any other home-ec courses (three weeks sex ed, four weeks budgeting, two weeks defensive driving, etc). Advanced calc or trig usually isn't a requirement for graduation (the furthest I went was pre-calc), but I think basic geometry and algebra are quite helpful whether we realize it or not; physics is particularly important when it comes to maneuvering a vehicle!
I had a condom demonstration in 9th grade.

jakeroot

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Re: Strange habits you have
« Reply #410 on: May 27, 2021, 01:04:27 PM »

While I think education is important, the school system sorely lacks things they need to be teaching.  Public Speaking, budgeting, fixing a car, applying for jobs, etc.  People rip on watching TV but I watch a lot of things that educate and read a lot of books.  I choose to learn and learned little in school.

To me, those are not things schools should be teaching. Parents, in between working themselves, should be teaching those skills to their children. I should not be sent off at 18, 19, etc with no concept of budgeting just because I didn't take "BUDG 101".

The last one is a bit troubling, especially: schools should be about providing the knowledge and skills necessary to maintain and succeed at a job, not apply for a job.

Why shouldn't schools prepare kids for life in the world???  Why is driving a car something you have to learn after school when 98% of us do it?    How about basic self defense?  If parents can teach us those things they could also teach us other things.  If school does not prepare us for life what's the point?

I guess your view of "life in the world" is slightly different than my own. The way I see it, schools provide you with lots of knowledge in many different areas (human science courses included!) but the real world is not just fixing cars and defending one's self. Schools assist in teaching you what you want to do in life, and provide you with the knowledge and skills to go and work in an infinite number of fields, or even to continue into an undergrad, grad, or doctorate degree. School is not just teaching you basic life skills like car repair and budgeting. After all, those things are for people with jobs, and you need knowledge and skills to get a job, and a bunch of home-ec courses won't get you those things.

I'm not saying that courses like self-defense or car repair are worthless (they might come in handy but honestly, probably not, especially the latter given how unfriendly modern cars are to non-technicians), but I do think those are things that parents can teach their kids, and going to school should be about learning skills and developing knowledge that I don't think every parent possesses.

Why does it have to be one or the other? 

Why not both "knowledge of different areas" AND "real world skills"?

And what happens when parents don't teach their kids those things that you say they should?  Because many don't.  And that's not the kid's fault. They just get left to fend for themselves?  Is it a bad thing to make sure it's covered somehow?

I guess I'm not getting my point across quite well.

I don't view those things as mutually exclusive: knowledge of different areas are real world skills in the sense that they provide you with the foundation to go and build on whichever piece of knowledge you found most interesting. Schools provide a wealth of knowledge across different areas to help provide a basic foundation of knowledge and skills to their students, so that they can go and take on the world in whatever manner they deem appropriate.

I think the issue we are seeing in this thread is general distaste for schools because schools didn't teach them exactly how to do everything. Therefore, schools are just a money pit, swindling tax payers out of their hard-earned dollars and hypnotizing students to become mindless robots. I'm not saying schools, right now, are perfect. But they shouldn't become these trade academies focused entirely on basic life skills that most students should either innately know, or should be taught through seeing-and-doing just at home. If they aren't, they're quickly realize how important chequebook balancing is once they're living in a tent, I suspect.

Should home-ec courses remain? Sure, and if they don't teach something about the concept of money, that might be wise to consider as part of the curriculum. But don't tell me that we have to, say, replace a chemistry course with budgeting. Students take dozens of courses throughout their middle and high school years, and it doesn't need to all be about budgeting and car repair.
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texaskdog

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Re: Strange habits you have
« Reply #411 on: May 27, 2021, 01:30:56 PM »

While I think education is important, the school system sorely lacks things they need to be teaching.  Public Speaking, budgeting, fixing a car, applying for jobs, etc.  People rip on watching TV but I watch a lot of things that educate and read a lot of books.  I choose to learn and learned little in school.

To me, those are not things schools should be teaching. Parents, in between working themselves, should be teaching those skills to their children. I should not be sent off at 18, 19, etc with no concept of budgeting just because I didn't take "BUDG 101".

The last one is a bit troubling, especially: schools should be about providing the knowledge and skills necessary to maintain and succeed at a job, not apply for a job.

Why shouldn't schools prepare kids for life in the world???  Why is driving a car something you have to learn after school when 98% of us do it?    How about basic self defense?  If parents can teach us those things they could also teach us other things.  If school does not prepare us for life what's the point?

I guess your view of "life in the world" is slightly different than my own. The way I see it, schools provide you with lots of knowledge in many different areas (human science courses included!) but the real world is not just fixing cars and defending one's self. Schools assist in teaching you what you want to do in life, and provide you with the knowledge and skills to go and work in an infinite number of fields, or even to continue into an undergrad, grad, or doctorate degree. School is not just teaching you basic life skills like car repair and budgeting. After all, those things are for people with jobs, and you need knowledge and skills to get a job, and a bunch of home-ec courses won't get you those things.

I'm not saying that courses like self-defense or car repair are worthless (they might come in handy but honestly, probably not, especially the latter given how unfriendly modern cars are to non-technicians), but I do think those are things that parents can teach their kids, and going to school should be about learning skills and developing knowledge that I don't think every parent possesses.

Parents can teach their kids math and history too.  Using that argument, why go to school at all?  Kids can be taught how to cook, why home ec?  Kids can be told to go out and play, why phy ed? 
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J N Winkler

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Re: Strange habits you have
« Reply #412 on: May 27, 2021, 01:34:32 PM »

Why shouldn't schools prepare kids for life in the world???  Why is driving a car something you have to learn after school when 98% of us do it?    How about basic self defense?  If parents can teach us those things they could also teach us other things.  If school does not prepare us for life what's the point?

Curriculum offerings at schools are often driven by budget considerations.  For example, the Wichita public schools used to offer driver education and had partnerships with local auto dealerships to supply dual-control vehicles.  But all of the teacher positions for this course were eliminated in a budget crunch in 2010, when the effects of the Great Recession hit Kansas.

I never took it, but when I was going to high school, people one or two years ahead of me reported taking a "Parent and Child" elective which went into detail on sex (including a rather graphic film that showed bleeding from a ruptured hymen), childbirth, how to care for an infant, and so on.  For some of them, that information became relevant almost immediately when they started their families while still in their teens.

Hmm, abstinence-only sex ed is definitely not the way of the game around here! I learned quite a lot in 5th grade.

There might be generational and cultural as well as regional dimensions to this--for example, I've not seen much about abstinence-only sex education, outside of families that rely heavily on James Dobson's Focus on the Family materials, since the Bush II administration.

A basic finance course may not be useless, but could it possibly be stretched out over ten weeks or whatever? I just don't see how it can't be rolled into any other home-ec courses (three weeks sex ed, four weeks budgeting, two weeks defensive driving, etc.).

As with any class, the length will depend on the scope of the material covered and the depth of the coverage.  I would contend that a personal finance course is unlikely to make a difference in students' lives unless it focuses on risk management.  That means it has to include elements of the following:

Law--Your financial obligations are determined partly by the legal framework in which you operate.  Ideally, a high-school student should emerge with a basic understanding of contracts, personal bankruptcy (including which types of debt are considered non-dischargeable), divorce, and child support obligations, all of which have the potential in early adulthood to set a pattern for his or her financial life that persists for decades afterward.

Behavioral economics--Rational decision-making about money is about much more than computing dollar-and-cent amounts.  A person should have a thorough understanding of the forms cognitive bias can take and how to counter it, as it will otherwise affect perception of the risks and rewards attaching to a particular set of options.  At minimum, he or she should be able to see when myopic choice is in play and see through sales tactics.

Being an adult--or, as millennials and Generation Z call it, "adulting"--is partly about making difficult choices under imperfect information.  For example, most of us have to judge whether we can achieve financial stability with a spouse or other life partner despite living in a society where it is considered grossly impolite to discuss money in an overt way (e.g., by asking "How much do you make?").  A high-school finance course will not solve all of the problems we face in interacting with late-stage capitalism, but it will at least give us a leg up in terms of assessing our choices with a clear eye.
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Roadgeekteen

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Re: Strange habits you have
« Reply #413 on: May 27, 2021, 03:17:04 PM »

While I think education is important, the school system sorely lacks things they need to be teaching.  Public Speaking, budgeting, fixing a car, applying for jobs, etc.  People rip on watching TV but I watch a lot of things that educate and read a lot of books.  I choose to learn and learned little in school.

To me, those are not things schools should be teaching. Parents, in between working themselves, should be teaching those skills to their children. I should not be sent off at 18, 19, etc with no concept of budgeting just because I didn't take "BUDG 101".

The last one is a bit troubling, especially: schools should be about providing the knowledge and skills necessary to maintain and succeed at a job, not apply for a job.

Why shouldn't schools prepare kids for life in the world???  Why is driving a car something you have to learn after school when 98% of us do it?    How about basic self defense?  If parents can teach us those things they could also teach us other things.  If school does not prepare us for life what's the point?

I guess your view of "life in the world" is slightly different than my own. The way I see it, schools provide you with lots of knowledge in many different areas (human science courses included!) but the real world is not just fixing cars and defending one's self. Schools assist in teaching you what you want to do in life, and provide you with the knowledge and skills to go and work in an infinite number of fields, or even to continue into an undergrad, grad, or doctorate degree. School is not just teaching you basic life skills like car repair and budgeting. After all, those things are for people with jobs, and you need knowledge and skills to get a job, and a bunch of home-ec courses won't get you those things.

I'm not saying that courses like self-defense or car repair are worthless (they might come in handy but honestly, probably not, especially the latter given how unfriendly modern cars are to non-technicians), but I do think those are things that parents can teach their kids, and going to school should be about learning skills and developing knowledge that I don't think every parent possesses.

Why does it have to be one or the other? 

Why not both "knowledge of different areas" AND "real world skills"?

And what happens when parents don't teach their kids those things that you say they should?  Because many don't.  And that's not the kid's fault. They just get left to fend for themselves?  Is it a bad thing to make sure it's covered somehow?

I guess I'm not getting my point across quite well.

I don't view those things as mutually exclusive: knowledge of different areas are real world skills in the sense that they provide you with the foundation to go and build on whichever piece of knowledge you found most interesting. Schools provide a wealth of knowledge across different areas to help provide a basic foundation of knowledge and skills to their students, so that they can go and take on the world in whatever manner they deem appropriate.

I think the issue we are seeing in this thread is general distaste for schools because schools didn't teach them exactly how to do everything. Therefore, schools are just a money pit, swindling tax payers out of their hard-earned dollars and hypnotizing students to become mindless robots. I'm not saying schools, right now, are perfect. But they shouldn't become these trade academies focused entirely on basic life skills that most students should either innately know, or should be taught through seeing-and-doing just at home. If they aren't, they're quickly realize how important chequebook balancing is once they're living in a tent, I suspect.

Should home-ec courses remain? Sure, and if they don't teach something about the concept of money, that might be wise to consider as part of the curriculum. But don't tell me that we have to, say, replace a chemistry course with budgeting. Students take dozens of courses throughout their middle and high school years, and it doesn't need to all be about budgeting and car repair.
We have a Personal Finance course at my high school but not everyone takes it.

Scott5114

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Re: Strange habits you have
« Reply #414 on: May 27, 2021, 03:44:58 PM »

Behavioral economics--Rational decision-making about money is about much more than computing dollar-and-cent amounts.  A person should have a thorough understanding of the forms cognitive bias can take and how to counter it, as it will otherwise affect perception of the risks and rewards attaching to a particular set of options.  At minimum, he or she should be able to see when myopic choice is in play and see through sales tactics.

I think it would be rather constructive if schools taught an "anti-marketing" course in the context of a critical thinking or personal finance class. It was not until I was 29 and took a sales course that examined marketing from the business's perspective that I was able to really grasp how modern marketing works and what psychological tactics are put in play to try to separate a consumer from their money.

But of course, marketing is a multi-billion dollar industry, meaning there are powerful interests that would be livid if the state were to use its resources to inoculate the general public against its tactics.
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LilianaUwU

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Re: Strange habits you have
« Reply #415 on: May 28, 2021, 11:54:03 AM »

I often put powdered parmesan cheese on some foods it usually doesn't belong on.
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Re: Strange habits you have
« Reply #416 on: May 28, 2021, 04:14:37 PM »

I trim my toenails with a box knife.

And none of you are surprised.
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