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Author Topic: I-69 in TN  (Read 168102 times)

GreenLanternCorps

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #350 on: February 07, 2019, 10:01:55 AM »

I just found this somewhat dated (Fall 2017) aerial footage of the construction of I-69 from south of TN 22 to south of US 51.


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abqtraveler

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #351 on: March 02, 2019, 04:21:51 PM »

Some more good news:  according to TDOT's Bid Letting site, the construction contract for Section 5 of SIU-7 of I-69 is scheduled to be let on March 29, 2019.  According to the Notice to Contractors, construction on this section, which includes the northernmost portion of the Union City Bypass between TN-21 and US-51 (north of U.C.) is scheduled for completion on or before September 30, 2022.  Here's the link to the Notice to Contractors for the March 29th bid letting.

https://www.tn.gov/content/dam/tn/tdot/construction/2019_bid_lettings/march_29_2019_letting/March_29_2019_Notice_to_Contractors.pdf
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GreenLanternCorps

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #352 on: March 03, 2019, 03:05:41 PM »

Some more good news:  according to TDOT's Bid Letting site, the construction contract for Section 5 of SIU-7 of I-69 is scheduled to be let on March 29, 2019.  According to the Notice to Contractors, construction on this section, which includes the northernmost portion of the Union City Bypass between TN-21 and US-51 (north of U.C.) is scheduled for completion on or before September 30, 2022.  Here's the link to the Notice to Contractors for the March 29th bid letting.

https://www.tn.gov/content/dam/tn/tdot/construction/2019_bid_lettings/march_29_2019_letting/March_29_2019_Notice_to_Contractors.pdf


Once that construction starts they can finally stop calling it a freeway to nowhere (as in the video above).

From the schedule further up this thread it looks like they plan to pave sections 3 and 4 by 2022 and get the whole  Union City bypass open by then.  The only question is how long it will take to get sections 1 and 2 done and I-69 open from I-155 to Fulton.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2019, 03:12:57 PM by GreenLanternCorps »
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GreenLanternCorps

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #353 on: March 30, 2019, 05:35:54 PM »

Some more good news:  according to TDOT's Bid Letting site, the construction contract for Section 5 of SIU-7 of I-69 is scheduled to be let on March 29, 2019.  According to the Notice to Contractors, construction on this section, which includes the northernmost portion of the Union City Bypass between TN-21 and US-51 (north of U.C.) is scheduled for completion on or before September 30, 2022.  Here's the link to the Notice to Contractors for the March 29th bid letting.

https://www.tn.gov/content/dam/tn/tdot/construction/2019_bid_lettings/march_29_2019_letting/March_29_2019_Notice_to_Contractors.pdf

Four bids on the project:

https://www.tn.gov/content/dam/tn/tdot/construction/2019_bid_lettings/march_29_2019_letting/March%2029%20Apparent%20Low.pdf

Alphabetical by county.  I-69 is on page 12

Unlike Section 4 (completed in 2012) and Section 3 (under construction). This project includes paving. 

« Last Edit: March 30, 2019, 05:42:46 PM by GreenLanternCorps »
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mvak36

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #354 on: April 21, 2019, 09:06:00 AM »

TDOT released their Transportation Improvement Plan for 2020-2022. Here are the projects listed on there for I-69:

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GreenLanternCorps

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #355 on: April 22, 2019, 10:10:53 AM »

TDOT released their Transportation Improvement Plan for 2020-2022. Here are the projects listed on there for I-69:



The paving for the existing segments of I-69 I expected, but nice to see it will be started next year.  The Rogers Rd in Kentucky to SR3 segment is confusing.  I can find a Rogers Road in Tennessee that intersects US 45/51 (aka TN 3)  but not one in Kentucky...   Also not sure what "PE" stands for.
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Gordon

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #356 on: April 22, 2019, 10:26:13 AM »

PE stands for Preliminary Engineering.
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GreenLanternCorps

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #357 on: April 22, 2019, 10:20:56 PM »

PE stands for Preliminary Engineering.

Thanks
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rte66man

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #358 on: April 24, 2019, 08:56:32 PM »

TDOT released their Transportation Improvement Plan for 2020-2022. Here are the projects listed on there for I-69:



I understand you have to pave sometime but it seems to me they would have been better off grading a connection to 51 north of Union City before paving anything.  All they will have is a road serving local interests. 
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GreenLanternCorps

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #359 on: April 25, 2019, 08:03:22 AM »

TDOT released their Transportation Improvement Plan for 2020-2022. Here are the projects listed on there for I-69:



I understand you have to pave sometime but it seems to me they would have been better off grading a connection to 51 north of Union City before paving anything.  All they will have is a road serving local interests.

Section 5 of SIU 7  (TN 21 to US 51) was awarded on March 29th.  That project includes paving, so by 2023 or 2023, the entire Union City bypass portion will be complete. 
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rte66man

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #360 on: April 26, 2019, 08:05:38 PM »

TDOT released their Transportation Improvement Plan for 2020-2022. Here are the projects listed on there for I-69:



I understand you have to pave sometime but it seems to me they would have been better off grading a connection to 51 north of Union City before paving anything.  All they will have is a road serving local interests.

Section 5 of SIU 7  (TN 21 to US 51) was awarded on March 29th.  That project includes paving, so by 2023 or 2023, the entire Union City bypass portion will be complete. 

Glad to hear that but that means there is a 2-3 year gap between pavings. 
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triplemultiplex

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #361 on: May 11, 2019, 09:16:41 PM »

So 13 years to build like 6 miles of rural freeway?  Or is it 14 years?  (Earth movement is first visible on Google Earth c. 2010.)  Round of applause for TnDOT. /sarcasm

This shit's taking so long, they're going to have to replace the pavement that's already in place before it even opens.  :rolleyes:
That means like, what, 2030 to get the rest of the bypass around Troy complete?  Because 2023 only gets it to a temporary end at US 51 south of UC.   :crazy:
What a joke.

I was driving around Union City this past week for work and observed first hand the glacial progress being made.  I could see some of the survey markers north of town on US 51 where I-69 will curve away from the existing freeway north of town.  Ground yet to be turned up there.  Meanwhile the interchange at TN 5 is done, but it's been idle so long, there's grass growing up between the concrete ramps and their asphalt shoulders.

This is all because TN isn't "allowed" to borrow money to build things, am I remembering that correctly?  They have to pay as they go which means it takes forever and inevitably costs way more.  That is not responsible government.  It's the opposite.  More cost, less benefit.
« Last Edit: May 12, 2019, 10:54:35 PM by triplemultiplex »
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rte66man

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #362 on: May 12, 2019, 12:51:43 PM »

So 13 years to build like 6 miles of rural freeway?  Or is it 14 years?  (Earth movement is first visible on Google Earth c. 2010.)  Round of applause for TnDOT. /sarcasm

This shit's taking so long, they're going to have to replace the pavement that's already in place before it even opens.  :rolleyes:
That means like, what, 2030 to get the rest of the bypass around Troy complete?  Because 2023 only gets it to a temporary end at US 51 south of UC.   :crazy:
What a joke.

I was driving around Union City this past week for work and observed first hand the glacial progress being made.  I could see some of the survey markers north of town on US 51 where I-69 will curve away from the existing freeway north of town.  Ground yet to be turned up there.  Meanwhile the interchange at TN 21 is mostly done save for some more pavement on 21, but it's been idle so long, there's grass growing up between the concrete ramps and their asphalt shoulders.

My point exactly. Take the pavement $$$ and use to to expedite the grading and drainage. Then pave the whole thing at one time. 
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The Ghostbuster

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #363 on: May 13, 2019, 04:52:28 PM »

What is traffic like on existing US 51 between Memphis and Interstate 155? Was the Tennessee DOT right to suspend work on that portion of future 69 (such as that segment will not need to be constructed in the foreseeable future)? Or does the existing US 51 corridor warrant an Interstate upgrade, meaning 69 should be constructed sooner, rather that later (or perhaps much later)?
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Avalanchez71

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #364 on: May 14, 2019, 11:17:40 AM »

So 13 years to build like 6 miles of rural freeway?  Or is it 14 years?  (Earth movement is first visible on Google Earth c. 2010.)  Round of applause for TnDOT. /sarcasm

This shit's taking so long, they're going to have to replace the pavement that's already in place before it even opens.  :rolleyes:
That means like, what, 2030 to get the rest of the bypass around Troy complete?  Because 2023 only gets it to a temporary end at US 51 south of UC.   :crazy:
What a joke.

I was driving around Union City this past week for work and observed first hand the glacial progress being made.  I could see some of the survey markers north of town on US 51 where I-69 will curve away from the existing freeway north of town.  Ground yet to be turned up there.  Meanwhile the interchange at TN 5 is done, but it's been idle so long, there's grass growing up between the concrete ramps and their asphalt shoulders.

This is all because TN isn't "allowed" to borrow money to build things, am I remembering that correctly?  They have to pay as they go which means it takes forever and inevitably costs way more.  That is not responsible government.  It's the opposite.  More cost, less benefit.
That is correct Tennessee is a pay as you go state.  Road bonds are taken out but they have the funds to pay them off.  The bonds cannot be issued for any future debt.
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GreenLanternCorps

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #365 on: June 29, 2019, 07:29:58 AM »

So 13 years to build like 6 miles of rural freeway?  Or is it 14 years?  (Earth movement is first visible on Google Earth c. 2010.)  Round of applause for TnDOT. /sarcasm

This shit's taking so long, they're going to have to replace the pavement that's already in place before it even opens.  :rolleyes:
That means like, what, 2030 to get the rest of the bypass around Troy complete?  Because 2023 only gets it to a temporary end at US 51 south of UC.   :crazy:
What a joke.

I was driving around Union City this past week for work and observed first hand the glacial progress being made.  I could see some of the survey markers north of town on US 51 where I-69 will curve away from the existing freeway north of town.  Ground yet to be turned up there.  Meanwhile the interchange at TN 5 is done, but it's been idle so long, there's grass growing up between the concrete ramps and their asphalt shoulders.

This is all because TN isn't "allowed" to borrow money to build things, am I remembering that correctly?  They have to pay as they go which means it takes forever and inevitably costs way more.  That is not responsible government.  It's the opposite.  More cost, less benefit.

Since you are occasionally in the Union City area, do you know if actual construction has started yet?  From the TN DOT website I saw that the bid was awarded to a Ford Construction Company out of Dyersburg, but cannot find anything about actual construction.  Not sure how long it takes from a bid being awarded to the time the work starts.
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abqtraveler

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #366 on: June 30, 2019, 03:19:05 PM »

So 13 years to build like 6 miles of rural freeway?  Or is it 14 years?  (Earth movement is first visible on Google Earth c. 2010.)  Round of applause for TnDOT. /sarcasm

This shit's taking so long, they're going to have to replace the pavement that's already in place before it even opens.  :rolleyes:
That means like, what, 2030 to get the rest of the bypass around Troy complete?  Because 2023 only gets it to a temporary end at US 51 south of UC.   :crazy:
What a joke.

I was driving around Union City this past week for work and observed first hand the glacial progress being made.  I could see some of the survey markers north of town on US 51 where I-69 will curve away from the existing freeway north of town.  Ground yet to be turned up there.  Meanwhile the interchange at TN 5 is done, but it's been idle so long, there's grass growing up between the concrete ramps and their asphalt shoulders.

This is all because TN isn't "allowed" to borrow money to build things, am I remembering that correctly?  They have to pay as they go which means it takes forever and inevitably costs way more.  That is not responsible government.  It's the opposite.  More cost, less benefit.

Since you are occasionally in the Union City area, do you know if actual construction has started yet?  From the TN DOT website I saw that the bid was awarded to a Ford Construction Company out of Dyersburg, but cannot find anything about actual construction.  Not sure how long it takes from a bid being awarded to the time the work starts.

Tennessee is one of those states that doesn't borrow money to build or maintain its roads. A few years back, Tennessee and Mississippi both enacted legislation allowing toll roads in both states. They talked about tolling sections of I-69 in each state to finance its construction, but from what I see, nothing ever came of that concept. So I-69 will continue to move along at glacial speed in Tennessee, while Mississippi is so broke right now that it can't even afford to maintain the roads it has, let alone build another interstate. But another aspect to consider in Tennessee is that the western part of the state has long been neglected in favor of Nashville and points east. Ptojects in eastern and middle Tennessee seem to get fast-tracked, while it takes 30+ years to complete the outer beltway around Memphis.
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Rothman

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #367 on: June 30, 2019, 03:50:55 PM »

Since Tennessee's program is "debt free," it does make me wonder about federal funding, which is a reimbursement program.  I wonder if TDOT and the other two states that do not use bonds are shooting themselves in the foot, since it seems that you could leverage the federal reimbursement to expand your program to some extent (i.e., let some fed funds pay off borrowed funds).

Also makes me wonder if they already are playing that game with first instance funding and are just putting on a simpler presentation to the public.
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wdcrft63

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #368 on: July 05, 2019, 06:56:00 PM »

Since Tennessee's program is "debt free," it does make me wonder about federal funding, which is a reimbursement program.  I wonder if TDOT and the other two states that do not use bonds are shooting themselves in the foot, since it seems that you could leverage the federal reimbursement to expand your program to some extent (i.e., let some fed funds pay off borrowed funds).

Also makes me wonder if they already are playing that game with first instance funding and are just putting on a simpler presentation to the public.
Tennessee's gas tax (26.4¢/gallon) is higher than most southern states, but overall the state budget is constrained by a lack of a general income tax. Nothing wrong with low taxes and low debt, except it means doing without some services.
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hbelkins

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #369 on: July 06, 2019, 08:58:41 PM »

Since Tennessee's program is "debt free," it does make me wonder about federal funding, which is a reimbursement program.  I wonder if TDOT and the other two states that do not use bonds are shooting themselves in the foot, since it seems that you could leverage the federal reimbursement to expand your program to some extent (i.e., let some fed funds pay off borrowed funds).

Also makes me wonder if they already are playing that game with first instance funding and are just putting on a simpler presentation to the public.

For one thing, it makes it easier to move state projects without onerous federal requirements if they're 100-percent state funded. That's why US 23 got finished in Tennessee long before it did in North Carolina.

Tennessee's gas tax (26.4¢/gallon) is higher than most southern states, but overall the state budget is constrained by a lack of a general income tax. Nothing wrong with low taxes and low debt, except it means doing without some services.

Doubtful that gas taxes (road fund) and income taxes (general fund) are intermingled.
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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #370 on: July 06, 2019, 09:24:18 PM »

Tennessee's gas tax (26.4¢/gallon) is higher than most southern states, but overall the state budget is constrained by a lack of a general income tax. Nothing wrong with low taxes and low debt, except it means doing without some services.

Doubtful that gas taxes (road fund) and income taxes (general fund) are intermingled.
That varies by state. There is a reason IL voters approved a “lock box” state constitutional amendment for gas taxes to be constitutionally dedicated to road/transportation spending

Then again, IL is not exactly the beacon for state fiscal responsibility, either

TN keeping state debt low is at least a fiscally sound way to operate.
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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #371 on: July 13, 2019, 10:17:34 PM »

Tennessee's gas tax (26.4¢/gallon) is higher than most southern states, but overall the state budget is constrained by a lack of a general income tax. Nothing wrong with low taxes and low debt, except it means doing without some services.

Doubtful that gas taxes (road fund) and income taxes (general fund) are intermingled.
That varies by state. There is a reason IL voters approved a “lock box” state constitutional amendment for gas taxes to be constitutionally dedicated to road/transportation spending

Then again, IL is not exactly the beacon for state fiscal responsibility, either

TN keeping state debt low is at least a fiscally sound way to operate.

There is some goodness to the pay-as-you go approach that Tennessee (and many other states, including out here in New Mexico) that have adopted in that these states don't have to worry about mounting debt later on down the line that eats into the state's ability to finance more road construction and maintenance projects as debt service gets paid before any projects can be covered.  Connecticut is going through that problem right now that over the past 30 or so years since the removal of tolls from that state. Lawmakers and officials in Connecticut believed for way too long that they could just keep borrowing money to finance road construction and maintenance, but it's important to bear in mind is that the bill will come due eventually.  And just like when someone runs up a balance on their credit card, once a state has a huge debt load like Connecticut's, it gets really hard to pay it down while continuing to find money to maintain the road network that's already there.  And so Connecticut is facing the hard conversation that no one there wants to have...bringing back tolls.

Back in Tennessee, the pay-as-you-go model is not without its own challenges, as the state has more projects that it can afford to finance at any given time.  So the powers that be in Tennessee end up having to rack and stack all of the state's road needs and then draw a line.  The projects that are above the line get funded and built, while those that don't make the cut this go-around get pushed off another year.  For I-69, is nowhere close to being dead in Tennessee, but its development and construction will move at glacial speed unless lawmakers there are willing to site down, have the hard conversations, and make the tough decisions to generate new revenue streams to finance more projects that are currently not making the cut.  Indexing the fuel tax to the price of fuel (with a "floor"), mileage taxes on electric or hybrid vehicles, or tolls on certain highways are options worth exploring IMHO.

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Bobby5280

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #372 on: July 14, 2019, 03:42:05 AM »

The folks in Tennessee, as well as other states like Arkansas, Texas, Louisiana and Kentucky who have significant segments of I-69 left to build could always fall back on the toll road option. Getting things done via gasoline taxes will likely take multiple decades or even a freaking century to complete. The current situation is pretty terrible.
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MikeTheActuary

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #373 on: July 14, 2019, 01:38:50 PM »

The folks in Tennessee, as well as other states like Arkansas, Texas, Louisiana and Kentucky who have significant segments of I-69 left to build could always fall back on the toll road option. Getting things done via gasoline taxes will likely take multiple decades or even a freaking century to complete. The current situation is pretty terrible.

I don't know that it's terrible as much as it's unclear that there is a great enough need for I-69 to some of the states you've mentioned to create a desire to invest in new construction or upgrading existing facilities.

For example, in Tennessee, if there weren't a push for I-69, wouldn't US 51 in its current state...perhaps with an extra bypass or two...meet the foreseeable need (especially given the proximity to I-55, especially if I-55 could be upgraded from 4-6 lanes)?
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abqtraveler

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Re: I-69 in TN
« Reply #374 on: July 14, 2019, 03:32:17 PM »

The folks in Tennessee, as well as other states like Arkansas, Texas, Louisiana and Kentucky who have significant segments of I-69 left to build could always fall back on the toll road option. Getting things done via gasoline taxes will likely take multiple decades or even a freaking century to complete. The current situation is pretty terrible.

I don't know that it's terrible as much as it's unclear that there is a great enough need for I-69 to some of the states you've mentioned to create a desire to invest in new construction or upgrading existing facilities.

For example, in Tennessee, if there weren't a push for I-69, wouldn't US 51 in its current state...perhaps with an extra bypass or two...meet the foreseeable need (especially given the proximity to I-55, especially if I-55 could be upgraded from 4-6 lanes)?

If any part of SIU-8 should be built sooner rather than later, the bypass around Dyersburg should go first, as Dyersburg is the largest city along SIU-8 and has the most congestion, traffic lights, etc.  With the completion of I-269 around Memphis, priority should also be given to the last piece of SIU-9 that remains to be built: roughly 9-mile segment starting where TN-300 currently ends at US-51 and ending in Millington with the new interchange with I-269, which includes a short extension of I-269/TN-385 to said interchange. It's be a very long time since I've seen any update on the TN-300 to Millington section.
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2-d Interstates traveled:  4, 5, 8, 10, 15, 20, 24, 25, 27, 29, 35, 37, 39, 40, 41, 43, 45, 49, 55, 57, 64, 65, 66, 69, 70, 71, 74, 75, 76(E), 77, 78, 81, 83, 85, 87(N), 89, 90, 91, 93, 94, 95

2-d Interstates Clinched:  12, 22, 30, 44, 59, 80, 84(E), 86(E), 238, H1, H2, H3, H201

 


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