Palm Springs area roads

[mrsman]

I know there's not much travel going on right now. But Palm Springs has completely closed a couple blocks of Palm Canyon Drive through downtown for the rest of the year for restaurants to have outdoor dining, as indoor dining is not allowed for the time being. The closure has been in effect for a couple weeks, but it may actually be useful now that it's no longer 120° at sunset. Map of the affected area.

There had been a closure every Thursday evening for Villagefest from Amado to Ramon until March. No word on when that might return.

Seems to make sense and it seems to be in concert with minimizing traffic on Palm Canyon anyway.  If they followed my idea that I posted in January, to localize PC then doing something like this makes total sense.  It would make some sense to make the arrangement permanent, divert all thru traffic to Indian Canyoun and let Palm Canyon be a completely localized business oriented street.  Close it or parts of it to cars to encourage more al fresco dining.  Divert all traffic to Indian Canyon or to encourage traffic to take the new routing for CA-111.

It seems to me that it would be best to direct thru traffic over to the 2-way Indian Canyon and leave Palm Canyon as a 2-way street that discourages thru traffic.  To the extent feasible, traffic should be minimized on PC, perhaps with the addition of bike lanes and the like.

The final block south of Ramon, of PC should probably still be one-way southbound, in order to not create conflicts at the 5-way intersection at Cam. Parocela.

EDITED TO ADD:

I did a little more internet research on this to find out that the project is now complete.  The design they chose leave PC as a 3 lane SB street, and converts IC to a 2-way street, with 2 lanes NB, 1 lane SB, and a left turn lane.  While this is not what I would have done, I can see the wisdom of this.  For all intents and purposes, especially for timing of the signals should local authorities so desire, you still have a 1-way couplet for traffic driving through.  Yes, IC is now 2-way, so you have to watch out at left turns, but unless PC is closed for a street fair, there will be very little SB traffic on it.  This configuration should help calm traffic and maintain on-street parking.

Anybody in the area should let us know their opinions, but in my mind this seems like a well thought out plan.  Hopefully, it will achieve its goals.

After this, I believe PC should be narrowed in the area to 2 lanes instead of 3, but kept one-way SB.

[skluth]

Bump thanks to lots of road closures from local flooding. The following are currently closed.

• Indian Canyon from Tramview to Palm Springs Station Road (just south of I-10)
• Gene Autry from Interstate 10 to east Via Escuela
• Araby Dr through the wash area
• Vista Chino from Gene Autry to Cathedral City Limits.
• Elm Street from Bonita Ave to Adele Ave in Cabazon.
• Seminole Drive east of Morongo Casino to Main Street.

Both Indian Canyon and Gene Autry being closed means the only way into Palm Springs from I-10 is via CA 111 unless you come in using a roundabout way from the east via Ramon and streets further south. The holidays could mean these roads will be closed for a few days.

There are also problems around Yucaipa with mudflows in the burn scars from last year's El Dorado fire (the one in a city park started by an idiot for a baby gender reveal).

[RZF]

Is the flooding due to a lack of preparation for rain in general in the Coachella Valley? It seems as if a lot of road mileage in the area is closed.

[Max Rockatansky]

Is the flooding due to a lack of preparation for rain in general in the Coachella Valley? It seems as if a lot of road mileage in the area is closed.

In desert regions it is common for roads to be designed to not handle 20-100 year flood events.  When you think about it makes sense since the features needed to act as mitigation are objectively a bad cost/benefit investment.  Example; it is common to see things like concrete fords of flood zones in most desert as opposed to a proper bridge. 

[skluth]

Is the flooding due to a lack of preparation for rain in general in the Coachella Valley? It seems as if a lot of road mileage in the area is closed.

In desert regions it is common for roads to be designed to not handle 20-100 year flood events.  When you think about it makes sense since the features needed to act as mitigation are objectively a bad cost/benefit investment.  Example; it is common to see things like concrete fords of flood zones in most desert as opposed to a proper bridge.

Many local roads are built in the washes. It's not normally a problem when it rains, just when we get a lot of rain. A couple inches of rain were reported in the pass from this storm which is massive for the area. Vista Chino Bridge construction is expected to start soon and is budgeted for $95M; it will cross about 2300' over the normally dry Whitewater River. To build similar bridges over the Whitewater River Wash on Indian Canyon and Gene Autry would require over 1.5 miles of bridge for each. The current Palm Springs mayor is pushing for a bridge on Indian Canyon, the main road from I-10 to Desert Regional Hospital and the Palm Springs CBD.

It's far more common for roads here to be blocked by blowing sand over roads from the winds which blow through the pass. That happens at least a half dozen times every year.

[skluth]

I-10 Delays This Week Between Beaumont, Coachella Valley

BEAUMONT, CA – Nighttime road work and associated lane and ramp closures are scheduled to continue this week along Interstate 10 between Beaumont and the Coachella Valley.

Crews have been gradually making improvements to nearly 20 miles of freeway between Beaumont and Highway 111 near Palm Springs as part of the I-10 Pavement Rehabilitation Project, also called the I-10 Tune-Up, for more than a year and a half.

Alternating lane and ramp closures that started Sunday will continue through Thursday from 7 p.m. to 6 a.m. each day westbound along the entire length of the project and eastbound between Beaumont and Banning.

The eastbound Sunset Avenue off-ramp that closed Thursday will reopen on Sunday. Caltrans recommends the use of Highland Springs Avenue, Beaumont Avenue or 22 Street as detours.

No weekday lane closures are planned during daytime hours, though crews will continue working during the day at various points along the thoroughfare this week.

The I-10 Tune-Up includes replacing guardrails, repaving outside lanes and replacing slabs in inside lanes and upgrading various on- and off-ramps to comply with the Americans with Disabilities Act.

The $210 million project is primarily funded by the state gas tax and the remainder through federal funds as well as some funding from the state, according to Caltrans.

Work is scheduled to be completed by the end of 2022.

Caltrans has set up a website for project-specific updates at i10tuneup.com.

[skluth]

The new 66th Avenue viaduct over the Union Pacific railroad tracks in Mecca will open next Monday. It can be seen under construction in the current Google Maps imagery. It's much needed as long trains frequently delay traffic going in and out of the community, including emergency vehicles. Very happy to see this being opened.

[ClassicHasClass]

Too bad it never got any of those improvements when it was CA 195.

[Max Rockatansky]

Too bad it never got any of those improvements when it was CA 195.

Or when it was US 60-70.  There is a surprising amount of highway corridors that ran through Mecca and Box Canyon.

[pderocco]

Since CA-111 had been recently rerouted onto 66th Ave to end at CA-86, I wonder if they're actually going to put signage for it at two intersections now. Or if they'll just let people figure it out with their smart phones. Caltrans seems to get more and more lax about route signs with each passing year.

[djsekani]

The new 66th Avenue viaduct over the Union Pacific railroad tracks in Mecca will open next Monday. It can be seen under construction in the current Google Maps imagery. It's much needed as long trains frequently delay traffic going in and out of the community, including emergency vehicles. Very happy to see this being opened.

I used to work in that area about ten years ago, the train crossings all along Grapefruit Boulevard drove me mad.

[Plutonic Panda]

Is there any hope the 111 will be expanded to be a consistent three lanes each way from south Palm Springs to at least Coachella? The number of lanes is so inconsistent and I think at least part of that is the reason behind the aggressive driving I've observed on that road. People always drive recklessly on the six lane portions to pass everyone before it narrows back to 4 lanes.

Seems to me then the road should be narrowed to four lanes. If there's too much traffic congestion that would be created as a result then the entire thing is warranted for six lanes. I drive this road fairly regularly and see how bad the traffic can get in certain spots especially in between cathedral city and rancho mirage.

[Max Rockatansky]

Considering how much of 111 is relinquished, no.

[skluth]

Is there any hope the 111 will be expanded to be a consistent three lanes each way from south Palm Springs to at least Coachella? The number of lanes is so inconsistent and I think at least part of that is the reason behind the aggressive driving I've observed on that road. People always drive recklessly on the six lane portions to pass everyone before it narrows back to 4 lanes.

Seems to me then the road should be narrowed to four lanes. If there's too much traffic congestion that would be created as a result then the entire thing is warranted for six lanes. I drive this road fairly regularly and see how bad the traffic can get in certain spots especially in between cathedral city and rancho mirage.

Highly doubtful. Most of 111 through the valley has been relinquished by the state except for in Palm Springs and Coachella, so it would be up to the cities to collectively do so. I don't think it's that slow and overcrowded except going through Cathedral City, both downtown and by the Target/ Trader Joe's. I usually use other streets to go east-west. Dinah Shore is pretty good going from Palm Springs to Palm Desert, Gerald Ford moves even better but only goes from CC to Palm Desert, Country Club is great from Rancho Mirage to Bermuda Dunes, and Fred Waring moves through Palm Desert to Indio far faster than 111 while only about a half mile to the north. The fastest way between downtown Palm Springs and El Paseo in Palm Desert is to take Ramon to I-10 then take the first exit (Monterrey) south to El Paseo. Taking 111 is for tourists.

[Plutonic Panda]

111 should still be improved regardless, IMO. I wasn't aware that much of it has been relinquished.

[Occidental Tourist]

Since CA-111 had been recently rerouted onto 66th Ave to end at CA-86, I wonder if they're actually going to put signage for it at two intersections now. Or if they'll just let people figure it out with their smart phones. Caltrans seems to get more and more lax about route signs with each passing year.

Drove it today.  They have posted all the mast arm blades to show 111 leaving Grapefruit Blvd at Lincoln Street, going southwest to 66th Ave, and turning west on 66th Ave to CA 86.  Further there is signage on 66th Ave at the intersection with 86 showing that 111 north is concurrent with 86 north.

Edit: I forgot, there are also reassurance shields for a 86/111 concurrence on the expressway north of 66th Ave.  Here's a pic I took:

[Max Rockatansky]

Amusingly CA 111 is listed on the 66th Avenue street blade:

https://flic.kr/p/2hoLGAo

And signage directing 111 traffic onto 66th from Mecca did exist in 2019:

https://flic.kr/p/2hoLGFU

[Occidental Tourist]

Also, on 66th Avenue heading west from Grapefruit Ave to 86, there is a 111 south reassurance shield posted.  It should be posted as 111 north.

[pderocco]

Since CA-111 had been recently rerouted onto 66th Ave to end at CA-86, I wonder if they're actually going to put signage for it at two intersections now. Or if they'll just let people figure it out with their smart phones. Caltrans seems to get more and more lax about route signs with each passing year.

Drove it today.  They have posted all the mast arm blades to show 111 leaving Grapefruit Blvd at Lincoln Street, going southwest to 66th Ave, and turning west on 66th Ave to CA 86.  Further there is signage on 66th Ave at the intersection with 86 showing that 111 north is concurrent with 86 north.

Edit: I forgot, there are also reassurance shields for a 86/111 concurrence on the expressway north of 66th Ave.  Here's a pic I took:

I don't get it. I thought this southern part was supposed to end at the intersection of 66th and CA-86.

[Max Rockatansky]

The relinquishment agreements stipulate continuation signage from the Caltrans maintained segments.  That's why Caltrans still signs the multiplex on 86.  Granted, I know this isn't really honored by the Coachella Valley cities 111 was relinquished to.

[pderocco]

The relinquishment agreements stipulate continuation signage from the Caltrans maintained segments.  That's why Caltrans still signs the multiplex on 86.  Granted, I know this isn't really honored by the Coachella Valley cities 111 was relinquished to.

How often do these relinquished segments get signed with "TO" prefixes? The only one I can think of off-hand is the former route 1 in southern Santa Monica, where they actually added "TO" signs above each route sign along Lincoln Blvd. Seems like a stupid waste of time.

[Max Rockatansky]

The relinquishment agreements stipulate continuation signage from the Caltrans maintained segments.  That's why Caltrans still signs the multiplex on 86.  Granted, I know this isn't really honored by the Coachella Valley cities 111 was relinquished to.

How often do these relinquished segments get signed with "TO" prefixes? The only one I can think of off-hand is the former route 1 in southern Santa Monica, where they actually added "TO" signs above each route sign along Lincoln Blvd. Seems like a stupid waste of time.

Off the top of my head TO CA 178 is signed from CA 99 east towards CA 204.  Some others like CA 187 effectively are still signed despite being fully relinquished.