Minnesota state route 65

[agentsteel53]

as far as I know, this was never US-65, but was it ever considered?  (same way CA had CA-95 and 195, and AZ had AZ-95 in anticipation of US-95 being extended)

it follows a very logical corridor for what US-65 could take, especially before the elimination of the north end in favor of I-35.  in fact, my 1942 map shows the two 65s very close to being chained together.

[NE2]

"Steve has a 1934 Minnesota state highway map that shows US 65 extending northward to US 210 at McGregor (now MN 210). Apparently there are other maps from the same year that indicate US 2 at Swan River was the northern terminus. However, it's unlikely that the route was ever actually signed north of the Twin Cities, and even if it was, it only lasted for about a year."
http://www.usends.com/60-69/065/065.html

The same thing happened with US 218/MN 218.

[agentsteel53]

thanks for the info!

why the AASHO lack of enthusiasm for signing US-65 along the MN-65 corridor?  not enough cities/towns/traffic to serve?  today, MN-65 appears to be a comparatively minor route, taking lots of 90 degree turns (implying it wasn't important enough for curve-straightening upgrades) but I do not know if that was the case in the 20s-30s-40s.

[Mdcastle]

MN 65 appears to always have been a secondary route to the north woods, and it takes a long time through areas that aren't particularly important to get places that can be traveled to faster by other routes. I have a map from about 1934, and 10, 53/61, and 169 are all paved heading to the north while MN 65 is mostly gravel north of MN 27. Granted other US highways were gravel at the time, particularly in the SW, but it does give an idea of the status. Going back farther, in the mid 1920s the other roads were all "improved" while what became 65 had significant "dirt" sections.

I don't know what you mean by "almost chained together". They touched each other, meeting at 3rd and Washington, from the begining of the number to 1980. I'm old enough to remember some dark green spots where the US 65 shields had been pulled down of I-35W.

[agentsteel53]

I don't know what you mean by "almost chained together". They touched each other, meeting at 3rd and Washington, from the begining of the number to 1980. I'm old enough to remember some dark green spots where the US 65 shields had been pulled down of I-35W.

I couldn't resolve that level of detail on my map - wasn't sure if they ended at each other, or just came close.

as far as I know, there are no surviving US-65 shields north of the terminus.  there was, in October 2009 anyway, a single '57 spec I-35 shield in Geneva on old 65.

also, I believe all the old 61 shields are gone... we'll find out for sure tomorrow!

[bugo]

Parts of MN 65 were gravel up until the '80s or '90s.

[DandyDan]

It would seem like MN 65 would be a logical continuation of US 65, but once you are past the Twin Cities area, the only two cities over 1,000 population on MN 65 are Cambridge, which isn't that far north of the Twin Cities area, and Mora, which isn't all that far north of Cambridge.  Nashwauk probably had at least 1,000 population during the Iron Range's peak years.  But there is basically nothing north of Mora.  Also, MN 65 is too close to I-35 (formerly US 61), which goes to Duluth, which counts as somewhere, and it's too close to US 169, which I believe is the favored route of Twin Cities residents going up north for fishing and boating, not to mention the fact Mille Lacs Lake is right off of US 169.  Add that to the fact that MN doesn't like to sign US routes to interstates and it is reasonable to see why MN 65 is not part of US 65.

[Mdcastle]

There were three US 61 shields at least that lasted well into the MN 61 era- Ely, County 3, and the back exit to the Thompson Hill rest area. The first two I confirmed gone with Google Street View

[NE2]

the back exit to the Thompson Hill rest area

from http://www.okroads.com/guides/mn/i35.html

Still there in 2009: http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ll=46.729744,-92.203632&spn=0.006707,0.016512&gl=us&t=k&z=17&layer=c&cbll=46.729744,-92.203632&panoid=_Y-XlXldSXjv2NckFdte7g&cbp=12,294.23,,1,-9.82

[The High Plains Traveler]

thanks for the info!

why the AASHO lack of enthusiasm for signing US-65 along the MN-65 corridor?  not enough cities/towns/traffic to serve?  today, MN-65 appears to be a comparatively minor route, taking lots of 90 degree turns (implying it wasn't important enough for curve-straightening upgrades) but I do not know if that was the case in the 20s-30s-40s.

The original 1927 routing for U.S. 65 took it to St. Paul, along what is now MN-3 from Faribault. In 1934, it changed routing at Farmington and went west and north along MN-50 (that road is now Dakota CSAH 50), entering Minneapolis along Lyndale Avenue. As noted above, for one year (1934-35) it extended north from downtown Minneapolis to the northern part of the state, and this is the route now designated MN-65. Upon construction of I-35W, U.S. 65 was routed along the freeway and exited downtown onto 4th and 5th Avenues. It ended at Washington Avenue and at that point became MN-65. This is how it was marked when I moved to Minneapolis in 1977.

The removal of the segment along I-35/35W and extension of MN-65 south to I-35W took place, I would guess, late 1980s. Now, MN-65 ends at its original south terminus (3rd Avenue and Washington Avenue) and 4th and 5th Avenues are city streets only. Thus, you won't see a MN-65 marker at the downtown exit on I-35W, though the freeway-like offramp had MN-65 2/10-mileposts the last time I was there.

[Molandfreak]

I, for one, think it would still be cool if U.S. 65 were signed all the way up there. MN Dot would do the "65 follow 35" thing, but beyond that it's still important regionally and unbypassed all the way up to U.S. 2, and I still would sign it to U.S. 71 as an alternate International Falls route (people from Grand Rapids and the surrounding area still view it as a shortcut) and cosign with 71 north of there

[Mdcastle]

the back exit to the Thompson Hill rest area

from http://www.okroads.com/guides/mn/i35.html

Still there in 2009: http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ll=46.729744,-92.203632&spn=0.006707,0.016512&gl=us&t=k&z=17&layer=c&cbll=46.729744,-92.203632&panoid=_Y-XlXldSXjv2NckFdte7g&cbp=12,294.23,,1,-9.82

Note the state name in the I-shield and the old design for Skyline Parkway Scenic Byway too. I haven't been to the area since they changed the design.

[The High Plains Traveler]

I, for one, think it would still be cool if U.S. 65 were signed all the way up there. MN Dot would do the "65 follow 35" thing, but beyond that it's still important regionally and unbypassed all the way up to U.S. 2, and I still would sign it to U.S. 71 as an alternate International Falls route (people from Grand Rapids and the surrounding area still view it as a shortcut) and cosign with 71 north of there

MN-65 north of Nashwauk, through the Nett Lake Reservation, is a pretty remote and sparsely-traveled road. Part of it was gravel until a few years ago. I think the ADT is in the 100 range - hardly a candidate for a U.S. route.

[Molandfreak]

I, for one, think it would still be cool if U.S. 65 were signed all the way up there. MN Dot would do the "65 follow 35" thing, but beyond that it's still important regionally and unbypassed all the way up to U.S. 2, and I still would sign it to U.S. 71 as an alternate International Falls route (people from Grand Rapids and the surrounding area still view it as a shortcut) and cosign with 71 north of there

MN-65 north of Nashwauk, through the Nett Lake Reservation, is a pretty remote and sparsely-traveled road. Part of it was gravel until a few years ago. I think the ADT is in the 100 range - hardly a candidate for a U.S. route.

That's why I said that it was important up until U.S. 2. MN 6 is a better way to get up to 71 because it doesn't meander as much.

[triplemultiplex]

Shouldn't this thread be titled "Minnesota Trunk Highway 65"?

[agentsteel53]

Shouldn't this thread be titled "Minnesota Trunk Highway 65"?

probably.  I call everything of that classification "state highway", regardless of which state and what name they may have for it.

[froggie]

The removal of the segment along I-35/35W and extension of MN-65 south to I-35W took place, I would guess, late 1980s.

I believe it was 1980, based on MnDOT documents.  The "dark green spots" on guide signage that Monte referred to earlier existed in the early-to-mid 80s, until a sign replacement project (either 1985 or 1987, don't remember which) took them out, and coincidentally added exit numbers to I-35W between I-494 and downtown.

As for MN 65 further north, ADT is as low as 45 in segments north of MN 1, in part why it stayed gravel for so long...the last gravel segment was paved in 2000.  By most accounts, it shouldn't even be a state highway north of MN 1, let alone a US route.

[kphoger]

Shouldn't this thread be titled "Minnesota Trunk Highway 65"?

probably.  I call everything of that classification "state highway", regardless of which state and what name they may have for it.

Possibly.  Then again, Interstates are also officially part of Minnesota's trunk highway system, but even the nitpickiest roadgeek wouldn't say I-94 ought to be called Trunk Highway 94.

[texaskdog]

"Steve has a 1934 Minnesota state highway map that shows US 65 extending northward to US 210 at McGregor (now MN 210). Apparently there are other maps from the same year that indicate US 2 at Swan River was the northern terminus. However, it's unlikely that the route was ever actually signed north of the Twin Cities, and even if it was, it only lasted for about a year."
http://www.usends.com/60-69/065/065.html

The same thing happened with US 218/MN 218.

Steve being me....I do have this map.  I'd be happy to try & hunt down a scanner if anyone wants to see it.  Of course I wasn't there to actually see it signed.

We used to take this road to the cabin every year.  Once I-35 increased over 55 MPH there was little need to.  It's not a very important road, with 169 on the other side too.

[The High Plains Traveler]

"Steve has a 1934 Minnesota state highway map that shows US 65 extending northward to US 210 at McGregor (now MN 210). Apparently there are other maps from the same year that indicate US 2 at Swan River was the northern terminus. However, it's unlikely that the route was ever actually signed north of the Twin Cities, and even if it was, it only lasted for about a year."
http://www.usends.com/60-69/065/065.html

The same thing happened with US 218/MN 218.

Steve being me....I do have this map.  I'd be happy to try & hunt down a scanner if anyone wants to see it.  Of course I wasn't there to actually see it signed.

We used to take this road to the cabin every year.  Once I-35 increased over 55 MPH there was little need to.  It's not a very important road, with 169 on the other side too.

Me also being Steve - who has provided some historic information to Dale in the past - it's interesting that I also have this map.

[agentsteel53]

sorry, but one of you is gonna have to be known as Alan from now on...

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/OneSteveLimit

[Alps]

Well, I think I win this battle.

[The High Plains Traveler]

I think I was "Steve" first.

[Alps]

I think I was "Steve" first.

Not here you weren't.

[TheHighwayMan3561]

the back exit to the Thompson Hill rest area

from http://www.okroads.com/guides/mn/i35.html

Still there in 2009: http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ll=46.729744,-92.203632&spn=0.006707,0.016512&gl=us&t=k&z=17&layer=c&cbll=46.729744,-92.203632&panoid=_Y-XlXldSXjv2NckFdte7g&cbp=12,294.23,,1,-9.82

Note the state name in the I-shield and the old design for Skyline Parkway Scenic Byway too. I haven't been to the area since they changed the design.

Unfortunately I can confirm that these signs have been replaced as of 2011. Most likely a casualty of the I-35 Mega Project.